Discussion on birds

[meager storm]

First post here, don't know how to do this/:
I dont know how much this has been discussed but
I've noticed there are a lot of birds this era
The bird sounds at the end of paladin strait, possibly in the background of vignette,
The photo with the vultures,
Birds flying around the towers in dema,
Plus the bird under all the notes of lyrics
Do the birds mean anything ?
There have also been themes about birds in previous albums like Isle of flightless birds

I also tried last night find out if the bourbaki group had anything to do about birds, in that search i found an anology on how some mathmaticians are birds, frogs or beavers
Andre Weil was catogorised as a bird
(Don't know how relevant this is but wanted to search it up since so much of the lore has been tied up to the Bourbaki group or Andre Weil)
I don't personally have many theories on what this all could mean but i'm interested to hear if anyone has any theories on what birds could represent

I just feel like birds have been repeated too much to mean nothing

Someone also pointed out that in one of the new photos we can see 9 birds (vultures? ) fly around the towers and then in the photo of the towers burning we can only see 8
Does the birds represent the bishops in any way?
Are the birds we hear in the end paladin strait the same birds that are flying around the towers?
Source for the Andre Weil thing:
https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/LcxNFGjPjKAm7wZvs/draft-three-intellectual-temperaments-birds-frogs-and )

[mint night]

so ive seen some people say that the vultures are a sort of minion to the bishops so the nine reduced to eight would make sense given the death of keons. i dont remember where i saw the theory but it was a while ago but i have seen something that said it was possible that the vultures are seizable vessels for the bishops to use to spy outside of dema, given the vultures following tyler and clifford's yellow eyes like the bishops'

the vultures themselves also just have general lore relevance as far as their relationship to the glorious gone and the imagery surrounding them (especially during the trench era)

[meager storm]

This makes a lot of sense, that the bishops are using the vultures. I wonder if we will see the vultures again in the paladin strait video

[restive fable]

idk if anyone's said this but the missing wall looks like it really is missing, actually. maybe the birds are depicted mid flight not because they're fleeing necessarily but because they'd normally be sitting on the wall?

[mint night]

looking at the clancy letters we know that he has called dema a sort of "home" even if it doesnt feel how home is supposed to feel. we know that his "house is the one where the vultures are perched on the roof" (from Pet Cheetah). so it would make sense for the vultures to perch on top of the walls of dema or at the top of the center towers. this especially makes sense since it's been said that the glorious gone involves the vultures consuming the body and if i remember correctly the glorious gone takes place within the inner circle of dema atop the highest tower

[restive fable]

realized after seeing the thumbnail from your reply that they're actually sitting on the tops of the towers themselves in the pic. must've misremembered

[raven lantern]

I think the the vultures are the banditos or some sort of parallel. This pic just looks too similar to the vulture pic.

https://www.reddit.com/r/twentyonepilots/s/tOgWGhadGi

[west bay]

Holy shit what if the banditos are the "flightless birds" on the "isle" of trench. Making trench the

Isle of flightless birds

[still brook]

while vultures were used in zoroastrianism for excarnation, don't forget this from the bandito experience
vialism is a hijacked religion, similar in most aspects to zoroastrianism, but not in every one. zoroastrians discarded the bodies, the bishops use them as available vessels.

[restive fable]

Talking a little about birds in the simone weil thread

[meager storm]

I will check that out

[restive fable]

"not today don't feed me to the vultures i am a vulture who feeds on pain" hmm always thought this line was about the banditos but maybe it's from the perspective of him becoming a bishop

that seems obvious now 😭

nvm shrewd makes more sense, feeds on pain can have multiple implications

[raven lantern]

But why not both? If it’s a cycle it might have more than two stages. How would it feel to be one of the “chosen” 9 that has started to question the religion after lifting people up into it? How would it feel to be a musician who has grown so popular he’s no longer “one of us” but doubts he’s really that much better than us? Is he on the outside at that point? At first he was benefitting from folks who had felt the same pain as he was writing about- they became fans because they saw themselves in his writing. And he was feeding on their pain. But at the same time the fans “banditos” are feeding on his pain. I keep thinking about how living in a big house with security detail would be like living on an island. Which is what he thought he wanted. Same way a bishop would have wanted to have been chosen.

[restive fable]

you actually sparked a thought, maybe the decomposition factor/"expiration date" for the bodies used is involved in the song rather than a "not yet" sort of thing from NATN

[raven lantern]

Read this one as if you were a bishop who sees himself in the banditos. And wants to recruit them to better, more pure religion inside the walls of dema after he’s cast out the impurities that hijacked it. And if the banditos have a torchbearer, what better way to find them than to follow their torches. And maybe that’s what there are so many false torchbearers.

[restive fable]

geez

if you have more on this lmk bc it's interesting

[raven lantern]

I think the dmaorg posts are out of order. There are 25 posts. This one is dated with a 25.

The html code shows 5 classes of formatting for the posts. But the formatting isn’t that different. There’s no rhyme or reason for how they’re formatted with those classes

There are some letters that are hand written and signed, some that are typed and signed and some that are typed and not signed. I don’t think the typed, unsigned letters are from Clancy.

[restive fable]

that makes sense, at least because it's never been clear to me why it switches up, but rereading bc i tbh forgot which ones are written

so far i have to agree that's a solid theory

after he’s cast out the impurities

[raven lantern]

All of the posts that mention vultures are divclass 3. So is the pic with Weil

[restive fable]

does this imply the other bishops as well?

i noticed one letter says "we"

(we must go lower etc)

[raven lantern]

Not sure - i posted this on Reddit with the breakdown. https://www.reddit.com/r/twentyonepilots/s/uZJye0lixh

[restive fable]

you did say one that considers themselves part of the banditos though

i'll check it out

do you cover why some of the typed letters are signed?

[raven lantern]

He just says “they tried to tell us we were different. But the fire that burns inside of me is the same one I’ve found on the hilltops of Trench.”

No i have no idea why some are. Also one isn’t actually signed but it says “signed- Clancy” in type.

[restive fable]

thinking on it but yeah

[pliant isle]

I remember hearing the bird cries in Vignette and being pleasantly surprised we got another callback to Levitate after Overcompensate. Overcompensate had the lyrical references to Levitate while I’ve always heard the kind of two-note siren that plays during Levitate to be a vulture cry. That sound is so haunting, beautiful, and twisted and I love it.

Obviously Levitate also talks about vultures in the lyrics

[sinful lantern]

also birds in the bottom right (or center I forget without looking at it) circle on the blurryface album cover has birds on it

[mint night]

yeah thats the goner birds. theyre swallows if im not mistaken

heres the symbolism for swallows and im gonna go listen to some of their noises to see if they couold possibly be the birds in paladin strait because if thats the case im heavily leaning on the swallows being symbolism for the good in tyler/clancy's life aka josh/torchbearer

it does sound like some of the birds in paladin strait could be swallows

also note that they are common/abundant in ohio

[low spear]

just wanted to add on with all the birds in the cravings (sv) mv there were birds engraved on the gun and also they were shooting clay pigeons

[meager storm]

In the mv we can see many vultures flying around trench same with the photo of the birds sitting on a wall, but in the digital remains photos with dema there are specifically 9/8 vultures (same amount as bishops)
Do the vultures around dema have any specific purpose?

Also do we have any theory on how the vultures will play a role in the paladin mv, with one of bishops seizing a vulture and all

[green orbit]

source on them shooting clay pigeons ? i dont remembet that

[low spear]

end of the video when they use the bullet, theyre shooting at a clay pidgeon its like a red disc the other guy shot up in the air

this

[green orbit]

im so confused

in what way is that a clay pigeon

[meager storm]

Found this

Apparently the things he's shooting are called "clay pigeons"

Since this is bird related
We apparently know the mv will be 5.24 long, asumably because the bird sounds are cut out, why do we think they would cut out the bird sounds? Kinda uncommon for the song itself to include parts that aren't in the video, would make more sense if it was the opposite

[pearl mango]

actually yes, and did not see any thing, excep that classes are named as numbers and not names

[pearl mango]

courious, there are only 8 piggeons instad of 9

[meager storm]

In first photo there are 9 and then in the second with the fire are 8. This could be related to keons death

Birds during the countdown

[gilded star]

I think the bird image in the bottom of the journals in digital remains are magpies. And I used a bird call identifier app on the birdsong in the gap on Paladin Strait and one of them was identified as a Red-Eyed Vireo which seemed very interesting.

The bird/magpie is on pages:
21 Silver weighted sun (Overcompensate)
32 Next Semester
46 Backslide
54 Midwest Indigo
65 Drag Path (in negative)
70 Vignette
100 Oldies Station
111 ATROFD

[low spear]

yeah some of the clique found the book, ill see if i can find it but its got a magpie on the bottom of each page the sides are dyed red its from an italian? company and has some maths in it | magpies are commonly called pies and coincidentally the bourbaki group disproved pi (math symbol)

cant find the link but ik its on amazon

[meager storm]

Oo thanks for this, been trying to find the book

[raven hinge]

#1245651123260493865 message dis

the guy again in here

[meager storm]

Kinda interesting how the banditos use the vultures as a symbol and the bishops use them to spy on the banditos.
Seems like the vultures mean something for both sides

[raven hinge]

@meager storm symbol for banditos meaning, if you didn't see. Just sayin

[meager storm]

"The vultures above are our symbol of turning death into life" reminds me of the paladin strait mv in general. Just in ps it would be more the bishops symbol of turning death into life idk still honestly tryna catch up with all the trench lore

[raven lantern]

Birds in formation fly over at 1:05 in paladin strait.

[floral goblet]

I bought these exact notebooks at a Marshall’s and was like why do these look familiar

I just thought they were nice and then I realized I bought the Tyler notebooks lmao

[raven lantern]

It’s bieffe brand- someone on Reddit let me know.

[floral goblet]

Ah nice!

[frigid estuary]

There was 21 vultures in the video and they was being controlled or "piloted"

[meager storm]

Just adding more on birds
"Your soul knows good and evil, your soul knows both sides
And it's time you pick your battle, and I promise you this is mine" from isle of flightless birds sounds a lot like the vultures right, maybe the vultures will have to pick their battle

[meager storm]

"Surveillance is outside, we see when you arrive
Ride or die, my son " from no chances
The surveillance is probably the vultures. The bishops used the vultures to see when the banditos arrived in the paladin strait also in general use them to spy on the banditos it seems

[surreal bison]

I always thought of it as bishops interrogating banditos…maybe that’s why those two people from the end of Nico and the niners and the outside are now dead because they wouldn’t talk…It’s like a whole different voice too like it switches between perspectives” How did you get the location? Put together pieces?
They say they sell the information in those terms of agreement
We spend some weekends on the grind
Surveillance is outside, we see when you arrive
Ride or die, my son” but I don’t know what they are referring to when they say terms of agreement…so maybe I don’t understand fully

[green orbit]

those two people from natn arent dead tho ? they became banditos

[meager storm]

The paladin strait mv is very isle of flightless birds coded like most the lyrcs fit(more than the lyrics to ps so to say)

[stone oracle]

I haven’t seen this discussed yet but I was looking at my vinyl and noticed how the Y in CLANCY is the same as the birds
Probably just a cool design choice but with Tyler you can’t rule anything out

And the Y also connects clancy to itself in the repeating reverse pattern

[west bay]

I just realized, that we have reached the climax of the story

And as we see it gave the demons (the bishops and the neon gravestone "zombies") and angels (banditos and clancy) a purpose

[upper wren]

Y is the 25th letter, the one before the last one. It’s asking “why?” and we will hear the ultimate answer after the battle dust settles. The birds singing is such a peaceful moment. I think it’s supposed to be the cathartic goal.

[raven lantern]

The just realized the vulture gif on the dmaorg site had the file name “I” which is a homophone for “eye.” Clever.

[marble pendant]

maybe there is more lost media from the music video, the birds chirping doesn’t seem right because we don’t get to see how the banditos win/lose much in the very end