📺 House of the Dragon S2

[torn valve]

HAVE FEELINGS THO

because listen to what says

[sour pulsar]

I did say he loved Joffrey, but only because he was basically like her. A psycho

[torn valve]

"I love you, but you aren't serious people"

[sour pulsar]

My point is that he his love for his kids wasn’t genuine. The kids wouldn’t have been so mentally fucked up if Logan actually cared about them.

[torn valve]

You can have feelings for someone

[sour pulsar]

Logan also made his kids fight each other to see how tough they’re to replace him. That’s sociopathic

[torn valve]

But not the tools to express it

Or treat them well

Two things can be true at once.

I don't think Martins intenet with cersei was to make her this cackling villian who hates her children.

[sour pulsar]

Hell, he only showed any love to Kendall or Roman when they behaved like him. Trying to be killers. He sees them as tools.

[torn valve]

The actor that PLAYED HIM doesn't agree

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6WRS9HoVZ0

[sour pulsar]

She didn’t hate her children, but didn’t exactly truly care about them like a mother would. Tyrion was more like a parental figure to Tommen and Myrcella.

[torn valve]

Hold on

one thing at a time

Logan's actor

Says himself

"He loved his kids" The guy who played him for 2 years, made all those creative decisions in his performance, said so.

Don, emotions are complicated, escpailly the ones we can't see but we feel.

And these kind of storys should not be looked at with such a narrow lens.

[sour pulsar]

If he really loved his children, then the kids would’ve turned out normal. Of course Brian Cox will defend his character.

Actors say many things about their characters

Doesn’t change what’s happening in the show or movie

[torn valve]

So the actor that played him doesn't understand his own characters motives

Ok bud

Do you want me to get a statment from the creators?

And tbh I don't think he's defensive of Logan, he's voiced hatred for what his charatcer represents

So I don't by "He's saving face for the fiction character he's playing"

[sour pulsar]

I don’t think Brian Cox meant that Logan truly loved his children like a normal person would. You can clearly see it in the show that he only cares if they’re useful to him or not.

[sour pulsar]

Brian Cox himself have stated that he’s a bit like Logan in certain aspects.

[torn valve]

Ok dude this sounds like cope

he legit said it

Does he need to spell it out further?

"HE-HE DIDN'T SYA THAT-" yes he did

[sour pulsar]

I don’t care what they say. The show says otherwise.

[torn valve]

The actor knows the character better then you bruh

And tbh I don't think you understand the show or ASOIAF

Because if you think the writters, with how neuanced the script is sat down and said "CERSIE HATES HER KIDS SHES PURE EVIL" You're mistaken

[sour pulsar]

The actor who often defended the character doesn’t contradict the show. I’m going by what was portrayed in the show and clearly Logan Roy didn’t genuinely love them. Gonna say it again. He only shows some sort of care if they were useful to him.

[torn valve]

Hold on Don

[sour pulsar]

Sure, moron

[torn valve]

Let me apologize

WOAH WOAH

Let me Apologize

Let's descalate

I'm sorry

I came off as rude

And condesending

And thats not ok

Can you forgive me?

[sour pulsar]

Stop misquoting me. I didn’t say Cersei was pure evil or hated her children. I said she didn’t genuinely care about them like what a normal mother would.

[torn valve]

WOAH DON

WOAAAHH

Easy there.

[sour pulsar]

Also, dude why do you type like that lol

[torn valve]

Idk, it's a bad habbit

Like I prob need to stop, it's also because of the size of my keyboard makes me reach for the enter button

People do know this is lore accuarate right?

Like Valaryia is base on Greece with alot of sexual experimentation

[humble plover]

They don’t care about lore they care about gay people being “forced down their throats”

[sour pulsar]

It’s not lore accurate that Rhaenyra was sexual with Mysaria, plus it’s even more crazy she did that after the latter narrated her abuse story.

I don’t think anybody criticised Laenor and Jeyne Arryn, did they?

And ASOIAF series in general do have homosexual characters. Not exactly the point and apparently it was Emma D’Arcy’s idea to do that scene. IMO very unnecessary and I don’t understand why they have to make these changes.

[humble plover]

That’s not true

For someone who talks about things being “objective”, get your facts right

[sour pulsar]

What’s not true?

[humble plover]

That it was Emma D’Arcy’s idea to “do that scene”

[sour pulsar]

It was. Scroll up

This one

[humble plover]

The scene as it was written was for them to almost kiss, then be interrupted. D’Arcy asked Condal before filming if it could be an actual kiss before being interrupted.

And Condal added that extra line into the script

They were going to nearly kiss either way

Read what people involved have actually said next time lol

[sour pulsar]

Can’t you fucking read? Emma D’Arcy suggested how the scene should play out

[humble plover]

There’s no need to be aggressive.

[humble plover]

This is literally what they say happened in the article that was linked lol

[sour pulsar]

She and writers were involved with many conversations. It doesn’t debunk anything what I’ve said.

[humble plover]

*They

[sour pulsar]

Meaning she was indeed involved

[humble plover]

Emma uses they/them pronouns

Just fyi

[sour pulsar]

Idc

[humble plover]

It’s just respect innit

[sour pulsar]

Ok so what’s your point, really. Are you agreeing or disagreeing

[humble plover]

With what?

[sour pulsar]

Emma D’Arcy being involved with the scene

[humble plover]

What you said was that it was Emma D’Arcy’s idea for them to do the scene, which it wasn’t. The scene already existed, and in the one written they were going to almost kiss before being interrupted.

The meaning doesn’t change either way

[humble plover]

They were involved, but that’s not what you said

“Apparently it was Emma D’Arcy’s idea to do that scene”

This is the quote I disagreed with, cos it’s untrue

I’m bored of you now so babble away, I’m going back to work

[sour pulsar]

D’Arcy was involved with the kiss scene and that’s pretty much what I meant to say. In the same link it says D’Arcy played it out as a kiss. Initially it wasn’t scripted that way.

[torn valve]

Dude they use they/them pronouns

Don't be a dick.

[sour pulsar]

You’re the one who’s being a dick. Don’t force others with the woke crap and this is exactly what I’m talking about. If you want to refer her as such then good for you.

[humble plover]

It doesn’t hurt you to be decent lol

You can be polite to someone else at no cost to yourself

[sour pulsar]

I’m not gonna be polite to someone who forces their views. If you want use those pronouns, go ahead. No one’s stopping you.

[sour pulsar]

It’s not indecent to refer a woman as “her”? Don’t play the morality police here and that too with someone you don’t even know.

[humble plover]

It’s about being respectful

Do you what you want, no one’s forcing anything

It’s just unpleasant

[sour pulsar]

Then you should also respect other people’s views. Also no it’s not unpleasant because you think so.

[humble plover]

It’s their body, their identity. It doesn’t concern you, and they’ve certainly never thought about you

But it does you no harm to be nice

[sour pulsar]

That doesn’t make you nice, sorry.

[sour pulsar]

You clearly are with the “Muh please be nice and it doesn’t do any harm”.

People who say this tend to be the fakest and most vile folks I’ve met.

[humble plover]

It makes you nice to respect someone’s inoffensive, inconsequential wishes

If someone here used they/them pronouns would you respect those?

[sour pulsar]

It is offensive if you’re trying force your view on others. I don’t even care if you use the pronouns like I’ve stated above. Just that I do not follow it.

[sour pulsar]

You could address them as you like. That’s your view.

[humble plover]

I asked you what you’d do

[sour pulsar]

You already know the answer lol. Why even ask? I literally mentioned above that I wouldn’t.

[humble plover]

Was just checking

[sour pulsar]

Checking for what? Either ways I wouldn’t even interact with users who’s gonna ask me to mention by their pronouns. I would say nothing and ignore.

[torn valve]

“Woke crap” Brother touch grass

Like actually

[sour pulsar]

A dude on discord telling me to touch grass. How ironic

[torn valve]

You’re the one flipping out about pronouns

It’s not hard it really isn’t.

[sour pulsar]

You’re the one who’s mad about it lol. Forcing someone to use the said pronouns.

I literally have no issues if you do so. Just don’t ask others.

[torn valve]

Brother, pronouns aren’t something you decide.

It’s up to the person

It really isn’t hard bro

[sour pulsar]

Don’t call me “brother”. Also, no I don’t give a crap. Already explained myself before.

[sour pulsar]

It’s hard for you to understand that I have different views.

[torn valve]

Mods won’t like it dude

[torn valve]

One ping, and I can get you muted

It’s not hard

They/them

You use it all the time.

[sour pulsar]

Lol

The fact you want someone to get muted for this is crazy. Exactly the cancel culture people talk about.

I think you’re the one who needs to touch grass and learn to respect other’s views.

[torn valve]

You can have different views and respect someone else’s pronouns

It’s not hard bro

[humble plover]

Let it go for now - he’s a very, very angry guy

[sour pulsar]

No you can’t when it’s imposed. Also, I won’t address such people if they do so.

[humble plover]

I wish the biggest issue in my life was someone “imposing” that I call them by their preferred pronouns

Sounds so peaceful

[sour pulsar]

You’re making it an issue, when it was unnecessary to make this a discussion. Could’ve just ignored it instead of bringing up the pronouns.

[torn valve]

Grow up

Like fr

[sour pulsar]

No you should grow up. Especially when you try to get people silenced for no reason.

You and the other user made this a big issue. Not me. I literally have no problems if you believe in the pronoun stuff or want to address people with “they/them” etc.

[torn valve]

“Believe in the pronoun stuff” everyone has pronouns

[sour pulsar]

You clearly know what I’m talking about

Anyways, I’m not interested arguing with this any further. It’s annoying.

[hearty blade]

They're not a woman so, yes, it is indecent

[cerulean glacier]

I stopped caring bout what Donnie felt after my man fanboyed over a vanilla marvel hollywood ending with jon Snow as king

https://tenor.com/view/skeleton-scared-afraid-dead-fan-gif-23609857

[hearty blade]

Jon technically did become king though

[sour pulsar]

Fanboyed
Marvel ending
Says the Greens fanboy

All I did say was it’s better than Bran being a king.

[torn valve]

Beetle I mean it makes sense like….what do you think Jon just fell out of a coconut tree?

HAHAHAHA

[hearty blade]

I think he's happier as the King North of the Wall than if he were ruling Westeros

[torn valve]

True

[pale vigil]

just watched the newest episode

better than the previos one but still sooooo much stalling and dragging

HBO pls double the budget for the next season

[cunning fox]

That kid was incredible

The one who schooled Daemon

And fuck was the CG impeccable

[rich bay]

Loved this episode. As a non book reader I was wondering why we were following Ulf and Hugh but now we know the answer. Dragons are really mysterious and you never know whom they bond with as we saw in this episode, really interesting. That whole Vermithor scene was fantastic. Also, didn't expect Jace to behave like that but of course he has been taught about importance of dragons since he was a child and now he sees commoners riding them.

So, Rhaenyra now has 7 dragonriders including that of Daemon and Jace, giving her a huge advantage over Aemond who has Vhagar and two small dragons of Haleana and Daeron. Gonna be interesting how she's gonna press her advantage.

Daemon and the Riverlords scene was great as well, Oscar Tully seems like a good Lord with a sense of justice and Daemon gained their support by killing Wilhelm Blackwood. Not much happened during Alicent scene.

[humble plover]

Great episode

The time flew by

[sour pulsar]

So we saw Vermithor and Silverwing with Hugh and Ulf as the riders. What about Nettles and Sheepstealer?

I guess Rhaena is gonna be the rider of Sheepstealer which we saw in the Vale of Arryn.

They removed Nettles character from the show.

Aegon have become like his father.

[sour pulsar]

||In the book, it was Jace’s idea to have the bastards become dragonriders.||

[cerulean glacier]

Fucking actually

1 more ep to season end

This shit looks like mid season plot wise

[rich bay]

In the show as well, Jace did suggest non Targrayens should be allowed to ride dragons but they should be high born like Steffon Darklyn

[torn valve]

An advantage….for now…..

“Life is not a song” - Littlefinger

[torn valve]

And do people not see how like.....iresponsible Rhaenyra was in this episode

At the very least

20 people we're just lored into a dragons den and brutally murdered so 2 complete strangers can get a hold of some of the most powerful creatures in asoaif lore

Like bruh

At least we know Adam of Hull and he's has vouchers

These people were merely picked because of there genetics, not actual chharactistice (THIS WILL BIT HER IN THE ASS HARD LATER)

(really FUCKING HARD)

We've seen what happens when Aemond a guy who rode Vhagher for 10+ years at that point accidently got Lucarcys killed...

How’s it gonna play out having these complete strangers ride dragons for, the course of a couple weeks?

[hearty blade]

It does thin out the amount of dragonseeds who might challenge her claim to the throne

[torn valve]

Kinda fucked up….

Good point tho

But that would make it worst wouldn’t it?

[hearty blade]

She's also shown not to care much about the smallfolk and has no problem with them becoming collateral damage

She only sent to food to King's Landing last episode because Mysaria told her it'd be a good PR move

[torn valve]

I’m sure when those people who lived return to kings landing they won’t spread the tales of how they were almost killed

It’ll be fine

[rich bay]

This is some fancy dress for someone who has no gold.. love this character

[humble plover]

Yes that’s on purpose

Condal himself said on the podcast that she’s developing a Messiah Complex

A lot of the imagery in this episode reflects that

She then stops the guards from helping

She doesn’t see smallfolk as people, and that’ll be her undoing

[torn valve]

……

Oh my sweet summer child

[tiny marsh]

Is this Kings Landing?

[torn valve]

Nope

Shouldn’t be

Actually it might be

Daemond pulls a trick on Ameond

Not gonna spoil what it is.

[humble plover]

Through context you kinda have lol

But also nah it’s a castle in the Riverlands

[tiny marsh]

Oh that

Yeah I didn't think it was KL

Also book fans, you think we might get the gullet next episode?

Because Otto is with the ||Triarchy|| and then you've got multiple shots of the Velaryon fleet

[torn valve]

i thought it was sthr storm lands in the next episdoe

[torn valve]

If so it's waaaayy to soon

WAYYYY TO SOON

They need to save that for season 3

[tiny marsh]

I mean in terms of the books it should have been today or next week

It's after rooks rest

And before Daeron joins the war

[humble plover]

I mean

They probably need to end on something

[torn valve]

Seige of Kingslanding

[humble plover]

You think?

I’m going back and forth

I really hope so

[torn valve]

Yeah it happens before the gull

[humble plover]

It doesn’t

[torn valve]

And everythings in place

HOLD UP

HOLLDDD ON

[humble plover]

They might change the order to put the Fall first

But I’m pretty sure Gullet comes first in the book

[torn valve]

GOD DAMMIT

You're right

idk how I forgot

I'm stupid

Forgive me please

[tiny marsh]

Yeah it goes rooks rest, gullet, honeywine,3 minor battles and then KL

Honeywine is happening next week

Because Daeron was in the trailer joining the war

If they end this season with honeywine and the 3 minor battles, then they're going to have a massive start to s3

Weird choice to not end on either the gullet or kl

[humble plover]

All the pieces are in place to end on KL

If they don’t, it’s only down to budget imo

Cos ||Larys is set to evacuate Aegon, the Dragonseeds are ready, Cole is en route to Harrenhal, Aemond is restless and Daemon is about to return to Rhaenyra||

There’s nothing else that needs to happen

So it’s either S2E8 or like S3E1 lol

[torn valve]

So…..I could be right?

I’m not….stupid?

[humble plover]

I want you to be

[torn valve]

: D

[humble plover]

Nah fam

[cunning fox]

What’s the name of the next big battle

I’m guessing 8 will have one

[cerulean glacier]

The giving 2 dragons to randoms part I get but

For a queen, those 20 or so people weren't really of consequence in terms of political maneuvering or military strategy

https://tenor.com/view/sacrifice-shrek-gif-22057024

Literally just random civillians/npc in grand scheme of things

In our world its fucked up beyond belief but I prefer Rhaenyra being a little more tactful and cruel instead of that boring ass white knight we had

Anyway its a good show/season but the 8ep format reallyyyyyyyy hurt the pacing and plot imo

I really liked this episode but the ending felt like it was a mid season finale

In GoT even the small talking scenes had alot of consequences and moved the plot heavily like; Tywin telling Tyrion he's gonna marry Sansa, Cat letting Jaimie go, Theon deciding to attack Winterfell etc.

HotD dialogue scenes don't really go anywhere; Rhaenyra slapping Celtigar or kissing Mysaria or talking to her council didn't move the pieces on the board at all, it was just "I want Aemond" and that Jace scene where he brought up recruiting more riders, or her argument with Daemon, that's like 3-4 scenes in total

Alicent straight up had nothing to do this season

Daemon's arc is cool and fine, but him tripping balls an entire season is fucked up

Aegon/Aemond scenes moved with alot more consequence and they really stood out this season

[rich bay]

I'm hearing HoTD is gonna be at least 4 to 5 seasons and with the shallow material they have, they can't move at break neck speed and focusing more on characters and stuff. I'm totally fine with that. I don't want things rushed.

[cerulean glacier]

4-5 Seasons is way too much for the amount of source material they have

The show writers are absolutely inferior to GRRM in a way that doesn't feel healthy for the characters, very hollywood-disney sort of changes

I think they just need more episodes within the season

3-4 Seasons but 2-4 more episodes each season would be good imo

[rich bay]

I disagree

[sour pulsar]

Yeah 4 seasons is more than enough

[weak spoke]

Aemonds gonna be so jealous

[sour pulsar]

https://fxtwitter.com/westerosies/status/1817742731042582899?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

[torn valve]

Gonna let you know rn

100% wrong

The survivors of this will talk

And it’s not gonna be good

[torn valve]

But why tho

She’s no more ethical at that point then Cristin Cole or anyone else in this story who’s ok with killing innocents to get there way.

[torn valve]

…….

Again, no this will come back to bite her

And if that’s the approach she has when it comes to human life, then all this shit about wanting to spare the civilian population from a bloody war is bullshit if she only cares about the lives that serve her endgame.

[cerulean glacier]

Which is based

Its cooler than reluctant Rhaenyra we've had so far

[cerulean glacier]

I would hope so

|| In FnB Hugh and Ulf turn sides cause they're psychos, but they're more human in the show so it'd be interesting to see where it goes ||

In any event, the aristocracy don't suffer much penalties for abusing small numbers of smallfolk there isn't much intelligence lost in abusing innocent civillians within reason

Grrm's work is cool in that everyone is a villain to some extent save the bystander civillians

[cerulean glacier]

Giving them dragons comes back to bite her, sacrificing a bunch of them to a furnance didn't

[cerulean glacier]

I mean it is all kind of bullshit, Rhaenys if she really cared about actual people she'd have killed the greens then and there but she slaughtered thousands of them and let the greens go

Because in westeros, smallfolk aren't seen or treated as real people by the nobility

That's kind of the point of Dany's whole story, other main characters are playing the game or pursuing justice against things done against themselves, but Dany is there to break the wheel

[torn valve]

I think it’s gonna be one of the things that’ll come back during the riots

[torn valve]

Very true

And sadly Rhanerya is no better then the greens or anyone else

[cerulean glacier]

Aight complete nerd no lifer moment of mine but

Small little gripe, not big deal

Is how the show writers made Daemon want the crown

Its not really his thing

He's like a lowkey Joker shoehorn, he antagonized his brother, greens and later Rhaenyra because he didn't want the crown

Meant to be the anarchist of the time, a hatred of authority, an unending rebellious teen phase

[humble plover]

I prefer this version I think

It’s an adaptation, it’s allowed to be different and in this case I think it makes for a richer character

[cerulean glacier]

Definitely different in aura and feel

They kept in him being an evil guy which is the important part

[torn valve]

I’m sorry what?

Dude everything he did in season one was to try and get it

Everything he’s done was out of envy of his want for power.

Like tbh, I can’t see a counter argument to why he doesn’t want it.

[cerulean glacier]

Idk what you’re responding to

[torn valve]

The idea of him not wanting the crown

Like I don’t agree with that take.

[cerulean glacier]

That’s source material he’s always wanted it in the show

[torn valve]

OHHHH

My mistake my mistake

I apologize

[cerulean glacier]

Yeah I mean he’s a decent character in the show just totally different from the books

He’s called the rogue prince for a reason, also show Daemon wanting the crown let’s us have him have the acid trip therapy session in harrenhal which is cool

[torn valve]

I mean, I’ve read fire and blood

I’ve read the lore

And idk, I mean I get the whole idea of taking everything in asoiaf with a grain of salt (which people ironically have taken that to the opposite extreme)

But I always thought he wanted it

[cerulean glacier]

I really liked him being just an unremorseful asshole in the books lol

[torn valve]

Ik but

That’s from the perspective of a guy who wasn’t there and didn’t seem to think highly of him.

[cerulean glacier]

Yeah but it’s more reading between the lines and what grrm says about him

Also knowing his writing style

Like book deviations are ok cause it’s meant to be open ended but some stuff isn’t like Nettles existing lol

The thing with the crown envy is that if he did actually want it he would uh just outright try to take it

Him marrying Rhaenyra was more being a pedo groomer than trynna be king

|| it’s like when he kills aemond in vhagar, it was something meant impossible, but he does so anyway; even at the cost of his life ||

Book spoiler ^

[sour pulsar]

After reading the leak for the finale. Yikes

[tiny marsh]

Rn idek if I want to watch the finale

Those leaks sound atrocious

If the finale is purely setting up what's to come then the season overall is really disappointing imo

Because there has been very few pay offs so far and it really doesn't feel like we've moved forwards in the story in the last 3 episodes

[sour pulsar]

Especially the Alicent one. Wtf were they thinking?

[pale vigil]

we knew about than even before the leaks..... two major episodes (4 and 8) in season of 8 episodes

HBO wtf is wrong with you ?

[rich bay]

https://youtu.be/Otw2LuO6lnI?si=QJRXEU3KKI63oQOt

[rich bay]

I'm absolutely expecting that to happen and I'm fine with it, I like that the show isn't being rushed and we are getting at minimum another 2 seasons too I feel. So why rush things?

[cerulean glacier]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Otw2LuO6lnI

"We could gotten a big muscly thug for Daemon, but that would have been boring" 😩 😭

https://tenor.com/view/godfather-crying-gif-18008061555047477193

[humble plover]

That’s the one that makes the most sense lol

||Of course she’d flip||

[humble plover]

Episodes 1, 2, 4 and 7 were all pretty ‘major’

Unless by major you just mean ‘battle’

[pale vigil]

all 8 episodes should feel and be good like episode 4 and I presume episode 8

[humble plover]

That’s just not realistic

Episode 8 isn’t a battle

So let that dream go now

[pale vigil]

if it was 10 episodes season, then they would be OK

[humble plover]

If they killed off one lead and incinerated another in every episode

[pale vigil]

it doesn't have to be a battl3

[humble plover]

The show wouldn’t last long

Episode 1 - Blood & Cheese
Episode 2 - Otto gets banished, Cole seizes power, Daemon and Rhaenyra have their long overdue showdown, the twins battle to death

Episode 4 - speaks for itself

Episode 7 - the Dragonseed massacre, Rhaenyra’s messiah complex comes to the fore

Those are all ‘major’ episodes

I don’t know what else you really want

Aegon can’t be nearly killed every week, he’s not Team Rocket

[torn valve]

Remember guys if it doesn’t have action every other episode it’s a bad show.

Like, people forget this is a political thriller, not an action patched anime.

[cunning fox]

I think we’ll get some kind of battle in episode 8 even if it’s minor

I’ve just hated the Daemon Harrenhal hallucination shit this season felt like stalling and a waste of time

[pale vigil]

Like I said, I don't expect every episode to have battles and non stop action

I'm just disappointed that we have soooooo much stalling and dragging in every episode except the major ones in terms of their significance to the plot and storyline and NOT because they have battles and action

[rich bay]

The only that's bit dragging for me this season is Daemon scene and that's about it

Also the show is based on a book that was very fast paced and it was basically a history lesson.. so if someone wants that pace then this show isn't for you I believe. You can't just rush things.

[tiny marsh]

Imo this episode should definitely have one of two next big battles in

Both of them (one more than the other) have been set up this season

And they'd both be a fitting end of the season

The drama has been great this season but I feel like if this finale ends with different factions preparing to go fight then it will feel a bit anti climactic imo

[rich bay]

Personally I wouldn't mind if there's no big action scene and this finale is a further set up to another season

[cunning fox]

Ok

Why the fuck wasn’t there a massive battle

It’s obviously gonna be S3 Ep 1

But why could they extend this season to 10 episodes instead of giving us blue balls

The ending just felt like an annoying cliffhanger instead of a satisfying pay off

Like Season 1 finale felt way more complete

[tiny marsh]

It's so fucking annoying

This didn't feel like a finale at all until that final montage

[cunning fox]

It felt like episode 8 of a 10 ep season

Then 9 is the big battle 10 is the aftermath

[tiny marsh]

Best part of the episode was the quick glimpse at the man

[pale vigil]

FINALLY normal pacing but too bad it is SEASON FINALE episode which doesn't feel like it until the end montage

I don't know why HBO didn't give bigger budget for Season 2 so it can be 10 episodes with more content

this ending of the season is another setup like the end of the first season

[tiny marsh]

Worried TLOU 2 will suffer the same fate

That has been shortened too

The teaser looked brilliant though

7 episodes in s2 😭

[pale vigil]

Season 1 being setup for the wider and bigger conflict was good and normal thing to do

but giving us minimal progress in Season 2 is literally crime against humanity - essentially 1 battle while the rest of the season is waiting for armies to assemble and start marching while Rhaenyra and Alicent are crying and bitching about how life and / or reality is bad and disappointing

my finale episode rating 7.5/10

Season 2 overall rating: 6/10

[fickle kiln]

Yeah didn’t like a finale. Felt like another filler episode

I didn’t read the book. But a lot of these characters I don’t care about

[pale vigil]

if it was penultimate episode, it would be 9/10

but it isn't.... it's season finale... 7.5/10 rating is me being generous because I love ASOIAF universe

[fickle kiln]

funny part is they end the episode with a “monologue” showing everyone being prepared for a giant war.. but I already know it ain’t gonna happen until like EP 4 of Season 3

[pale vigil]

yeah.....lol

[fickle kiln]

anyhow that’s not really a problem (for me at least), just a thought based on the pacing so far lmao

but yea idk some of the characters felt like they had no development at all, been the same since the end of S1

[sour pulsar]

Looks boring. https://fxtwitter.com/discussingfilm/status/1820258796012216653?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

[sour pulsar]

Wtf was that finale? Too much deviation from the novel

Daemon sees the future through weirdwood tree. He’s aware of his fate(it’s implied he’s three eyed raven) and the fact Black Targaryen bloodline thrives, eventually serving Rhaenyra again.

Does Helaena have the sight? She can perceive the future(knows Aemond will die in Battle above the Gods Eye) and contemporary events(is aware Aemond is the one who tried to kill Aegon).

Alicent is a traitorous scumbag who sold out her own sons, just so that she and her daughter could live. Completely different from F&B.

The show is too slow paced. They could’ve adapted the fall of King’s landing this season and that also seems pointless after Alicent’s treachery.

||Also Sunfyre is dead in the show tf? Rhaenyra in the book was killed by Sunfyre who burnt and ate her. Guess she’s not dying in a brutal manner because the idiots in charge of the show don’t want any harm to their precious Queen.||

This finale proved one thing to me. Sara Hess should never be involved in the series again and Miguel Sapochnik should be brought back instead. There is too much bias for the Blacks and the Greens are portrayed as evil and incompetent traitors. Such a black and white portrayal of two factions.

[cerulean glacier]

Did we see Robert?

[cerulean glacier]

What? See this why people bash you over things, you just have tangential knowledge about whats going on

|| The Three-Eyed Raven is Brynden Rivers, a Targ bastard ||

Anyway, season finale:

https://tenor.com/view/edp-i-mean-its-all-right-gif-26702511

On its own it'd be very good, the closing scene with the music and montage was very well done but

It didnt' warrant the 8 episodes and filler scenes in earlier season

[sour pulsar]

I said it’s implied in the show. I’m well aware Brynden Rivers is Bloodraven in the lore.

[cerulean glacier]

Its very good on its own but 2years for 8 episodes without a solid conclusion wasnt it

Ill also add the cinematography and camera work improved 10x in hotd, HBO seemed to have invested alot more

[sour pulsar]

“People bash you”
The only one who bashed is you. Your knowledge is absolutely pathetic and you misconstrue what I state. Reading comprehension is something you lack.

[cerulean glacier]

The RhaenyraxAlicent scene I enjoyed but it felt more like a personal marriage drama than a war meeting

[sour pulsar]

The fact you think it’s good just shows your taste

[cerulean glacier]

Idk what to tell you fam, you get in arguments all the time, really uninspired stuff too usually related to women then get butt hurt

[sour pulsar]

I get into arguments with morons

[cerulean glacier]

Yeah but you're not criticing it over how kino it is, just "diff from books = bad" i do agree the source is superior but you dont really elaborate

On how or why itd be richer in dramatic script

[sour pulsar]

I elaborated why it’s terrible. The source material is indeed superior because it has a more complex take on the situation and the characters are more interesting. Whereas the writers of the show has some sort of bias with a particular faction which has degraded the entire dance of the dragon arc. What even is the point of watching this show?

[cerulean glacier]

I don't mind the bias, cause greens are cooler/more entertaining this way lol

My issue is by writing the blacks as good guys, alot of their cast is just lame; like Jace wasn't doing anything until later, Baela is basically an NPC

Daemon and Rhaenyra are just 🆗

But I'm happy with the direction they're going with Rhaenyra, she's becoming more blood thirsty and stalin-like

[sour pulsar]

You don’t mind the bias because you don’t understand ASOIAF and I like how you accuse me of it because I said Bran Stark being the King was a terrible decision and it’s Marvel type writing if Jon Snow becomes the Lord of Seven Kingdoms in a more ruthless manner?

[cerulean glacier]

Ready to sacrifice lives, the seeds and now the soldiers she wants to burn to make an example

[sour pulsar]

“Really uninspired stuff too usually related to women”
Uh?

[cerulean glacier]

Don't worry about it

[sour pulsar]

Spit it out. If you’re accusing me of something then don’t mince your words.

[cerulean glacier]

I ain't interested enough sry

[sour pulsar]

So you admit it was a lie?

[cerulean glacier]

Also maybe drop it, talk bout the show instead of having a random argument

No I don't but I don't see you being able to comprehend an argument

Like the others here we can argue and disagree but idk come to some sorta conclusion, you're a dead end

[sour pulsar]

You literally accused me of something and then say let’s drop it lol

[cerulean glacier]

But yeah lets drop it before the mods take concern

[sour pulsar]

Says the illiterate. You don’t even seem educated enough to have a conversation with me.

[sour pulsar]

Meh she won’t even be killed in the same manner like in the books. Wouldn’t even be surprised if they don’t kill her.

[humble plover]

Not their choice

Apparently

[humble plover]

Just to say - the finale was a misstep, but all the blaming of Sara Hess is giving huge Criston Cole energy

It’s like r/freefolk found out a woman was in the writer’s room and immediately assumed she was the problem lol

It’s comically blind sexism

[sour pulsar]

Sara Hess deserves to be blamed for the finale and the worst episodes were written by her.

[humble plover]

Do you know how writer’s rooms work?

I assume you don’t lol

[sour pulsar]

That’s irrelevant to my point when she’s one of the major producer and writer of this show.

[humble plover]

Do you know how writers rooms work yes or no?

[sour pulsar]

I know what it is, but Sara Hess is one of the decision makers. She deserves to be blamed for some of the decisions that have been made regarding the show.

[humble plover]

Ok so you don’t

Instead of being stubborn you could’ve just googled it lmao

[humble plover]

Why is she the one who you blame?

[sour pulsar]

I know what it is. She needs to blamed because it was her decision to make these drastic choices.

[humble plover]

Do you know how writers rooms work yes or no?

I’ll keep asking every time you demonstrate that you don’t

You’re speaking with the utmost confidence on something you clearly know nothing about

[sour pulsar]

Stop parroting like an idiot and I’ve already said that I know what it is.

[humble plover]

But you don’t do you

[sour pulsar]

But I do, dumbass

[cerulean glacier]

That moment when Ruby and I are in agreement

[humble plover]

You wouldn’t have embarrassed yourself by saying this if you did

How do you know which “drastic choices” were made by her?

(The answer is you don’t btw)

Cos that’s not how writer’s rooms work

[sour pulsar]

Please tell me who wrote the episode? I’m well aware there are other writers, but the main writer decides

[humble plover]

No they don’t lol

Do you know how writers rooms work yes or no?

[sour pulsar]

And that’s exactly how writers’ room works

[humble plover]

It literally isn’t you could google this instead of doubling down on your mistake

Idk why you’re insisting on this

[sour pulsar]

Yes they do. I think you don’t know what you’re talking about.

[humble plover]

So you think whichever writer is assigned a given episode gets to make all the big decisions about it?

[sour pulsar]

You’re literally insisting that Sara Hess doesn’t make any major decision which is fallacious. An executive producer is pretty much second in command after the showrunner who runs the writers’ room.

[sour pulsar]

She isn’t just some writer though.

[humble plover]

How it actually works - the entire writing team meets in a room daily for months to block out the entire season, beat for beat in a collaborative, brainstorming space. They decide what happens in each episode, when and how. Everything is mapped out by committee, and then for the sake of on-screen credit and payment, the writers divide up scripting duties.

Not story duties lol

Imagine if they could just make up what they wanted per episode lmao

What kind of show would that be

[cerulean glacier]

Speaking of which, I looked it up; it was the higher ups who could be blamed for my critiques this season

[humble plover]

No, you’re saying you know which decisions were hers

And you don’t

[humble plover]

It was

[sour pulsar]

Are you dense or something? The one who decides in the end is the showrunner and the executive producers

[humble plover]

So why is it Hess at fault and not the others?

[cerulean glacier]

The originaly plan was to stick to the 10ep format, which imo would have saved this season by the bucket load

[humble plover]

Why are you specifically blaming her?

[humble plover]

Ye they had their last two episodes cut and had to retroactively make this a finale. Total shame

[sour pulsar]

Because she has specifically stated before that she doesn’t like some aspects of the source material.

[cerulean glacier]

Those would-be leaks for the last 2 episodes of the season, would have made it so heavy.
|| Would also tie in super well with how Rhaenyra was getting more cold and the last son for a son line ||

[humble plover]

Which aspects bud

[humble plover]

100%

I think this is gonna be pointed out as the main example of why the two season gaps don’t work

[cerulean glacier]

I'm prolly get crucified for this but I just can't, Matt ain't him my boy so goofy looking 😭 #NotMyDaemon

Also the end music score with that Dune-like singing lady went so hard

[humble plover]

Just to get it out on time after two years, they’ve had to axe two episodes, and it’ll be another two years till we get the climax of this season

The TV industry is very broken

The Boys, Stranger Things etc are all in the same boat

Something needs to change

Even Bridgerton is now doing two years gaps - it’s bizarre

[cerulean glacier]

I mean in theory they could have done 10ep year after year, its not like the actors, writers or post production aren't capable of it; its all down to the poor planning, lack of commitment, changes in decisions after they already made one etc. by the higher ups, the business people

[humble plover]

Nah it’s not any of that to be fair

I do think it’s down to the scale being completely unfeasible

It looks great but on this scale it’s more comparable to doing eight films

[sour pulsar]

Don’t call me “bud”. Aspects like favouring the blacks over the Greens, hate the fact Daemon and Cregan Stark are fan favourites, Rhaenys killing innocent people during Aegon’s coronation and also just flying off after threatening the Hightowers in Ep 9 S1, which didn’t even make sense etc

[cerulean glacier]

I'll take 2-3 year breaks if you gimme more episodes, just good scenes and plot-driven dialogue n shit since CGI and set building with budget is a concern

[humble plover]

Don’t call me an idiot, a dumbass and dense then you angry little boy

It’s a TV show

Your temper is pitiful

[cerulean glacier]

Also...
https://tenor.com/view/breaking-bad-awkward-gif-20874314

[sour pulsar]

I don’t know what they did with this character. Is it even Daemon Targaryen?

[sour pulsar]

Sorry, grandma.

[cerulean glacier]

Well he's def different from the books, but I liked his arc generally

[humble plover]

There’s also some very clear glaring cast schedule issues - in both seasons, Matt Smith has clearly had quite limited availability. In Season 1 they worked around it by giving him just a handful of scenes per episode (with exceptions of 3, 4 and 7), while in S2 they isolated him on a soundstage where they could shoot all his stuff together

[humble plover]

Poor little baby didn’t get his cool dragon man

[cerulean glacier]

Like he's a show-original character, and a decent one at that but I just can't buy homie's look lmao

[sour pulsar]

I have a dragon and it’s treason to talk shit about your king.

[cerulean glacier]

Yeah here's the thing, I felt like Smith was a hollywood moment; "yo lets get Dr Who for one of these big characters"

[humble plover]

I think I’m gonna go talk about HotD elsewhere cos Don is really bumming me out

Much too angry to have a conversation

[cerulean glacier]

Which introduces that scheduling issue you pointed out

[humble plover]

Agreed, and I like him in the role

Stunt casting is always risky

[cerulean glacier]

They could have found a really strong actor but less known like Darcy or the green boys

[sour pulsar]

I’m nice to well behaved people.

[humble plover]

No you aren’t lmao

I’ve seen everyone walking on eggshells around you

You’re vitriolic and ignorant

[cerulean glacier]

Rhaenyra, Aegon, Aemond are like goat castings for their characters and they were def out of their league for GoT's successor show, even GoT cast was like that originally

[sour pulsar]

I am, but you’re not well behaved like many in this thread. Such people tend to piss me off.

[humble plover]

The Aegon casting has done such wonders for that character

Very impressive young actor

[cerulean glacier]

Coulda just gotten someone just as good but less known for Daemon, im sure the actor woulda really appreciated it too

[humble plover]

What was my bad behaviour sir, apart from pointing out you had made a mistake?

[humble plover]

Stunt casting helps to sell the show I guess - Smith and Olivia Cooke were all over the S1 marketing for this reason

Emma D’Arcy wasn’t as much

Now they are obvs

[sour pulsar]

Except that wasn’t a mistake. It’s an objective fact that writers room is run by the showrunner and executive producers.

[humble plover]

Ok bud

[sour pulsar]

Another behaviour I couldn’t tolerate from you was your insistence that I used the wrong pronoun which turned out to be a weird argument IMO.

[humble plover]

Whatever you say buddy

[cerulean glacier]

Yeah but idk, none of the Greats have really came from stunt casting, usually the other way around.

huh

messages are being blocked for slurs? idk why

[sour pulsar]

I think Matt Smith is another great performer in the show. The issue is the writing for Daemon.

[humble plover]

Oh that’s weird, I dunno what was flagged there

[sour pulsar]

Paddy Considine’s performance as Viserys is still unmatched though.

[cerulean glacier]

aint interested in talking wich u donnie

https://tenor.com/view/xd-meme-funny-emoji-gif-15406750

[humble plover]

It’s a funny one isn’t it - you use big names to sell the show, but it’s nearly always the newer actors who become breakouts, cos they’re more likely to surprise you

Millie Bobby Brown in Stranger Things, Antony Starr in The Boys etc

Not the stunt castings, but their characters feel the most original and exciting

[cerulean glacier]

I feel like its also unintentionally makes a stronger vetting process, if you're a big name the name carries you into the show whereas if you're smaller you need to get in by your own merits

[humble plover]

100%

Emma D’Arcy leading the biggest show on Earth is suuuuch a huge jump for their career, and clearly one they earned by being among the best of the best

Same goes for Aegon and Aemond as you said

[sour pulsar]

Glad because I don’t like to talk to idiots.

[cerulean glacier]

Its not like they're bad actors either, just they're more used to or better fit for a different enviroment, like Smith im sure was amazing for DrWho or Willy Wonka types of shows but less so for a more gorey dark enviroment like hotd

[humble plover]

Then stop king lol

[humble plover]

Smith was a breakout in Dr Who largely cos he was so unknown, and came from nowhere to do something radically different to Tennant et al

[sour pulsar]

This person was the one who initiated the conversation replying to my comment. Got mad because I rekt him.

[cerulean glacier]

Don Cringe

[humble plover]

I think Smith is really good as Daemon to be clear, but it’s probably the most ‘traditional’ of the lead roles

[sour pulsar]

Sharkpunk ass muppet.

[humble plover]

The troubled, wannabe Hamlet rogue prince

He’s a fan favourite early on cos he’s the most straightforward chaotic guy

[cerulean glacier]

Also thing I really like about the asoiaf shows is that they cast from stage actors, Dance for Tywin, whats his name for Simon strong, Olenna, were all stage/play actors first

Which fits really well for the medieval drama sorta show that got/hotd is

[humble plover]

But as it goes on I think he very deliberately becomes overshadowed by more complicated performances like Considine, D’Arcy etc

[humble plover]

Simon Russell Beale yeah - he was brilliant this season

And so important to making Harrenhal work

Smith needed a stage-worthy scene partner there

[cerulean glacier]

He was def better in season 1 but I felt it was more because he was the sole archetype; most of the cast were the goodie two shoes and he was the black sheep

but his presence isnt as strong with Aemond, Larys, Aegon etc.in the stage

[humble plover]

Ye and as it gets muddier, the ‘smallness’ of Daemon as a character gets more obvious

He’s closer to Robert Baratheon than Cersei or Daenerys

[cerulean glacier]

Im surprised how fast they made me do a 180 on Ulf

He was kinda cool, then 1 scene later he's a shitface lmao

It ain't outta character but felt like it could have been done a little more organically

[sour pulsar]

Funny because in the book, he’s a very important character. I hope they don’t mess up from S3 onwards.

I didn’t like the fact they stretched the entire Harrenhal story throughout this season and it would’ve been cool if fall of King’s landing was the finale. Maybe 10 episodes instead of 8.

[humble plover]

I liked this in the sense that it addresses how impulsive and reckless the Red Sowing actually was

Rhaenyra does not know these guys

[cerulean glacier]

Yeah they addressed that right next scene

Was a huge relief Alyn and Corlys finally broke the tension too

[humble plover]

Playing Ulf as a harmless comedy drunk till now was smart cos you do underestimate how dangerous he could be with a dragon

Also quick shoutout to Djawadi’s incredible score at the end

That final track - yowza

[delicate summit]

isn't that robert baratheon during his rebellion

[sour pulsar]

Admiral Lohar in the show is Racallio Ryndoon from the book. Don’t know who that actor is, but probably one of the worst performance I’ve seen in the series so far along with Mysaria, Jacaerys and Baela.

[sour pulsar]

Wonder how involved GRRM was in second season? https://x.com/screentime/status/1820414452539244867?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

ScreenTime (@screentime) on X

George R.R. Martin says 'HOUSE OF THE DRAGON' will need four full seasons of 10 episodes each to do justice to the 'Dance of the Dragons'

Season 3 has been greenlit, and the script is currently being written

Twitter · Aug 5, 2024, 11:00 AM

[cunning fox]

You’re gonna make the poor guy break bad

[sour pulsar]

I like how that user thought she had something with that question. Typical clueless woke liberal.

[humble plover]

I still don’t think you know how writers rooms work

[sour pulsar]

Please don’t lecture me again with your rubbish. The fact you wasn’t aware that there is a hierarchy in writers’ room proves it.

[cerulean glacier]

https://i.redd.it/gdkfwi7wjn1b1.gif

[sour pulsar]

Why are you even replying? Like piss off

[cerulean glacier]

https://i.redd.it/gdkfwi7wjn1b1.gif

[sour pulsar]

https://tenor.com/view/dumb-huh-stupid-idiot-gif-5042504

[hearty blade]

How old are you

[rich bay]

Watched the finale and I thought it was really good for what it was. Would I have preferred this season to be 10 episodes and the finale having a big battle scene?? Yes but even without any action, I really enjoyed it. This finale certainly does a great job as a setup for another season and ya it sucks we may have to wait for 2 years for another season.

So many things happened though.
I think Aemond trying to force Helena to join him in battle convinced Alicent to go to Rhaenyra but I didn't expect her to agree to killing Aegon. Btw, who captured Otto?? Is it Larys or was he captured by a rival Reach house?? Larys is quite smart with him stashing his gold in Iron bank of Braavos and now going with Aegon there.

Don't know I feel about this Lohar character yet, that's a large fleet though. The weakest part of this season was Daemon's scenes at Harrenhal and it seems the vision of white walkers finally convinced him to support Rhaenyra as he believes only she can unite the realm, didn't expect some GoT shots there. Also, is that stag creature we saw Children of the forest or Green men ??

I like how a NY times critic put it regarding Criston Cole, he's gone full on Rust Cohle from true detective season 1 with his nihilistic talk.

Overall, really enjoyed this season. Season 2 was more of a set up season and hence season 3 could be even amazing with many action scenes.

[tiny marsh]

I believe the stag creature was Robert or some Baratheon omen

Or it was the green men

[sour pulsar]

I think Otto being captured was a future event

||In the novel, Otto was executed during the fall of King’s Landing.||

[sour pulsar]

Always have a laugh when Rhaena’s actress looks dumbstruck 💀

[cunning fox]

I kinda want the sheep dragon to burn her to a crisp it would be hilarious

[sour pulsar]

https://tenor.com/view/salman-khan-lol-laugh-gif-12122081

[humble plover]

https://tenor.com/view/ser-criston-ser-criston-cole-house-of-the-dragon-fabien-frankel-gif-26759343

[sour pulsar]

https://tenor.com/view/the-boys-billy-butcher-cry-about-it-gif-26287697

[humble plover]

https://tenor.com/view/ser-criston-ser-criston-cole-house-of-the-dragon-fabien-frankel-gif-26759343

[rich bay]

I don't think it was a vision though

So ya maybe green men

[cerulean glacier]

Yall got fav outfits in the show?

Aemond's green trench suit and Rhaenyra's black coat-robe with the black gloves goes so hard

[sour pulsar]

Do y’all think after the dance the show will cover Aegon’s conquest and reign, Sons of the Dragon, Ascension of Jaehaerys I and his reign?

[tiny marsh]

Aegon's conquest is one of the 7 shows in early development

[torn valve]

Are they seriously doing this dumd ass shit with Alicent

[sour pulsar]

https://fxtwitter.com/culturecrave/status/1820496517968642383?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

[torn valve]

YOU COULD END THE WAR

IF YOU TOOK HER HOSTAGE

WHY IS SHE LETTING HER GO

WTF

THEY OUTNUMBER THEM WITH DRAGONS

AND IF THEY HAVE HER-

Wtf man

[humble plover]

IMDb is for incels lol

[humble plover]

Doubtful Aemond would’ve cared

[hearty blade]

Also the finale was definitely not that bad

[torn valve]

Not true at all

Lore wise

Character wise

• most the hightowers would car

[humble plover]

How about in the literal finale wise lol

[hearty blade]

Like, it might've not been an ideal finale but it was still a very good episode of television

[torn valve]

?

Letting her go sure wasn't

Letting her writting wise was dumb as hell

[humble plover]

Rhaenyra loves Alicent, who was trying to escape with her and her daughter’s life

[torn valve]

Her going there makes no sense

[humble plover]

Sometimes I swear y’all don’t want characters you just want Wiki paragraphs lol

[torn valve]

Not at this point.

[torn valve]

How is this an intresting charatcer?

"Oh I'm honroable so ima let you go sis instead of attempting to end a brutal war"

[sour pulsar]

The finale was pretty mid. Not exactly very good television.

[torn valve]

Makes no sesnse for ehr to be there or go there.

At all

[humble plover]

I’d give my opinion but as soon as CrisDon Cole starts getting involved it’s not worth my time

[torn valve]

Infact this whole thing were Rhanerya is this flawless leader is super boring

[torn valve]

......

What does that have to do with this?

[humble plover]

I think making bad tactical decisions due to established character flaws is more interesting than being a perfect strategist

Every time

[torn valve]

Strongly disagree

Martin writes characters not perfect robots

[humble plover]

Exactly

[torn valve]

They make flaws

They make mistakes

[humble plover]

Exactly

What are you disagreeing with

[torn valve]

They are privy to the best and worst parts of themselfs

[humble plover]

Yes

Did you misread me

[torn valve]

But heres the thing

I think at this point there isn't much character reasoning for her to let her go.

At all

[humble plover]

Rhaenyra has an established blind spot for Alicent

She does love her

[torn valve]

Still?

[humble plover]

We saw in Ep3 when she risked her life recklessly to make peace

[sour pulsar]

Yet you still bother to reply? What even is your problem lol

[humble plover]

That was only a short while ago

[torn valve]

Like at this point the tragetory f this shit ids going flat

The scene of the septs should have been the end of there friendship.

And there carying it on here.

[humble plover]

Why? It wasn’t a fight or even a disagreement lol

It was basically a peace talk

If anything it reopened the channel

[torn valve]

That ended in shambles

[humble plover]

Hardly

[torn valve]

HARDLY?

[humble plover]

Rhaenyra was permitted to leave peacefully lol

Alicent learned Viserys didn’t choose Aegon

It was quite successful

[torn valve]

I have a feeling you only liked this because you like the idea of them being in a relationship.

[humble plover]

They’re not in a relationship

[sour pulsar]

Yeah, I don’t understand why they had Alicent meet her again prior the fall.

[torn valve]

Which is fine, but this isn't Bridgerton

[humble plover]

I don’t particularly want them to be

Don’t make assumptions lol

[torn valve]

Well idk why your defending this so hard.

It doesn't make alot of sense and it's redundent

[humble plover]

Idk why you’re so angry?

[torn valve]

They alreayd made this point.

I ain't angry, I'm simply making an argument..

[humble plover]

You’re a bit angry

[torn valve]

Don't make assumptions

[humble plover]

Touché

The finale has a lot of issues, particularly around Daemon

But Rhaenyra and Alicent’s friendship is the spine of the series

It’s the key to this whole adaptation

[torn valve]

And I think it's being drawn out.

[humble plover]

Then the adaptation might not be for you

But it’s the main arc of the whole show

So it’s going nowhere

[torn valve]

It's not an arc if it's a line

And after the things they've done

[humble plover]

True but luckily this one isn’t a line

[humble plover]

Cos of this

They’ve fallen out, waged wars etc

[torn valve]

But they still wanna talk peace right?

[humble plover]

The finale is a brief moment of clarity between them

[torn valve]

They sitl wanna be friends

[humble plover]

Sure cos it’s not just a line

[torn valve]

Even after it's been carrifed

[humble plover]

If you had your way, it’d be “they fall out and aren’t friends, the end”

That’s not an arc

That’s a line

[torn valve]

I'm saying that the tragetory of there friendship is a bit drawn out.

It's drawn out imo

[humble plover]

The nuance is in the fact that falling out is rarely an ending

[humble plover]

Then the adaptation might not be for you

Which is a shame but it’s ok

[torn valve]

Stop saying that.

[humble plover]

There are plenty of other shows lol

[torn valve]

Like actually, lmao

[humble plover]

The show has never been coy about the fact that it’s about Rhaenyra and Alicent

You might think drawn out, but it has always been the core of the show - those two characters and the shifting tensions between them

If you don’t like it, you still have the book

But that’s what this story is doing

[torn valve]

It can still be the core and not be over redudent.

[humble plover]

What does over redudent mean

[torn valve]

You're acitng as if my critcisms de prioritize there friendship.

[humble plover]

Ironically the word ‘over’ is a bit redundant there

[torn valve]

Ok?

What's the have to do with the arugment itself?

[humble plover]

Nothing

[torn valve]

Like df

[humble plover]

Just chat innit

[torn valve]

I mean yeah

But

Still

Big hands tiny keyboard

Anyway, I think they should have hard her take her prisoner

As a mark of the end of there relationship and a turning point of Rhaneryas character

[sour pulsar]

Why do you think so?

[humble plover]

I think in general there’s an interesting thing that’s happened with Internet aged fandoms where if an artist’s work isn’t to their interest, it’s labelled “wrong” instead of “not for me”

There have never been more shows out there

[torn valve]

So there is no bad writting?

Only prefrences.

[humble plover]

There is bad writing

[torn valve]

Don't agree with that.

[humble plover]

But that’s very different to “I want a different story”

[torn valve]

Ok well, in my opinion, this was kinda silly.

It's not subtancely different.

[humble plover]

Totally fair

[torn valve]

Then stop calling it purely a prefrence thing.

As if that vindicates it of my criticism.

I don't hate the show.

[humble plover]

I think there is bad writing in the finale - Daemon’s prophecies of Daenerys are very weak, and make his journey less interesting

He’s now just a Dany zealot

It’s very forced

[torn valve]

What was weak about them?

[humble plover]

But the Rhaenyra/Alicent scene isn’t ’bad writing’ cos the choice makes sense for both of them as they’ve been characterised over the past two seasons

Imo

Even if I don’t like the choice they made, I do believe they’d make it

[torn valve]

What's that mean?

[humble plover]

It cheapens this show to make the characters aware of Daenerys and of GoT

Makes this feel less consequential

It’s also very Marvel

[torn valve]

Cause it is....

[humble plover]

Basically a Deadpool cameo lol

[torn valve]

This war...all this death, is truley for nothing.

[humble plover]

It shouldn’t feel that way to the characters

They shouldn’t know they’re doomed

That takes away their agency, and dilutes their motivations

[torn valve]

Alot of this is happening because they know they are subject to some sort of doom.

[humble plover]

That’s the problem

They shouldn’t know

[torn valve]

Viserys named Rhaerya because of the prophecies he saw in the writtings

That's one of the themes in asoiaf

The dangers of prophecy, dreams, and visions.

[humble plover]

It’s more interesting for us to know that they’re all doomed and watch them obliviously continue down that path

[torn valve]

The trick is THEY THINK they know whats going to happen

[humble plover]

It’s like a car crash in slow motion

[torn valve]

And act upon something that is not entirely based on true fact.

thats the entire point of this franchise

[humble plover]

Except that doesn’t work here does it

Cos we know

[torn valve]

if you don't like it "Then it's not for you"

Welp I guess it ain't for you

[humble plover]

In GoT we don’t know which prophecies, if any, are real

[torn valve]

Neither do they.

[humble plover]

And we don’t know when they’ll come to pass or how

[sour pulsar]

The fact Sunfyre is dead after Rook’s Rest Battle is crazy. https://x.com/westerosies/status/1820493030832660626?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

westerosies (@westerosies) on X

Sunfyre in #HouseOfTheDragon.

Twitter · Aug 5, 2024, 4:12 PM

[humble plover]

Exactly

[torn valve]

Wait what

[torn valve]

BUT THEY BELEIVE

They do

And that's the trick

BELEIVEING YOUR RIGHT

[sour pulsar]

Aegon states that Sunfyre is dead in the finale.

[torn valve]

Like Alicent BELIEVED it was her Aegon

[humble plover]

Maybe I haven’t been clear so let me finish.

In GoT, the audience and the characters only have belief to go on. In HotD, the audience know the ending, so it’s not based on belief anymore

We know the prophecy isn’t wrong

They’re not potentially being misled by belief

They’re right

[torn valve]

tbh, if that bothers you enough to make it unintresting, that's' a prefrence. Maybe the show ain't for you.

Because we see this all the time.

In prequels.

It's the very nature of them.

[humble plover]

I think it makes the show less interesting to tell the characters their endings

Aemond and Daemon now both know they’ll die at the God’s Eye

[torn valve]

Well... This lore is already written

And known

[humble plover]

That makes it less interesting to get them there

[torn valve]

Idk what you want them to do.

[humble plover]

I don’t want the characters to know their endings for the sake of teasing them to the audience

[sour pulsar]

https://x.com/westerosies/status/1820311961784996071?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

westerosies (@westerosies) on X

What we saw in Daemon’s vision:
#HouseOfTheDragon

• Brynden Rivers, the Three-Eyed Raven
• A White Walker and Wights
• A dead dragon
• Bloody corpses
• Daemon drowning
• The red comet and Daenerys with her dragons
• Rhaenyra on the Iron Throne
• Helaena Targaryen

Twitter · Aug 5, 2024, 4:12 AM

[torn valve]

A think it makes it more tragic

To see it, and try to run from it, only to see it swallow you whole.

So it's not nesscaily about if it'll happen BUT how.

That's how most prequels work.

In revenge of the sith we know Anakin isn't gonna save people, we know he turns into Vader

BUT THE HOW

Of how he gets there is where the meat of the story lies.

[humble plover]

But he doesn’t

That’s the point

[torn valve]

To an extent

he knows

Padme will die

He doesn't have the specifs

[humble plover]

The meat of the story is watching his good intentions become corrupt

[torn valve]

And the film follows him trying to avoid that fate

[humble plover]

Yeah and it transforms him, but I don’t think that’s comparable here

[torn valve]

And tbh Ruby they don't know fully whats going happen

NOW I'LL SAY THIS

[torn valve]

Why not?

[humble plover]

This is fair

[torn valve]

Like

IF HELENA HAD SAID

[sour pulsar]

Iirc doesn’t Anakin see a vision that he’s Darth Vader in the future? https://youtu.be/-jPVUl693JU?si=M2KYKVkEGJd-9a9z

[torn valve]

"You'll be consumed by a blue eye, and full into it's internal abyss"

[humble plover]

That’s not in the movie tho is it

[torn valve]

And was more cryptic

They I think it would be better

SO IN THAT SENSE

[humble plover]

That’s a cartoon made later by fans

[torn valve]

Yeah I think a slight change in dialogue

could fix it

[sour pulsar]

Clone Wars is canon to ROTS

[humble plover]

Yeah I’ll buy this

You make some good points Frame

[humble plover]

That’s nice but in terms of the story Lucas was telling with Revenge

It’s a later appendage

It’s not what he was doing with the movie

I’m very uninterested in the idea of canon

A story stands on its own

[tiny marsh]

I guarantee the showrunner is going to reveal they shot a kissing scene between Rhaenyra and Alicent

[sour pulsar]

My bad. The vision was erased later.

[tiny marsh]

Alicent at Dragonstone leaked a year ago

And the original leak said they kissed

[humble plover]

I’d be surprised, I don’t think that’d fit this particular scene

They’ll save that for a later season

S3 finale, ten minutes before the Battle of the Gullet

[sour pulsar]

💀

I thought the finale was leaked recently

I miss the quality of GOT S1-6. HOTD S1 came somewhat close. https://youtu.be/uvX4k_3Cmvs?si=uvA3aV8A74KapTtK

[humble plover]

HotD S1 > GoT for me

GoT S1 and S4 are the only real competition

HotD S2 isn’t near that level sadly, though I enjoyed plenty of it

[sour pulsar]

All seasons from 1-6? Would say HOTD S1 is arguably better than S6, but the latter had more epic moments. Like the Battle of Bastards

S2 was S7-S8 territory at times, which is why I fear about the next season onwards. Don’t know what happened to the writers.

[humble plover]

S2 was never S8 territory

The finale slips to S7 territory

The bulk of the season is comfortably S2/S3 quality for me

[sour pulsar]

IMO the finale was S8 level tier.

[humble plover]

The finale would be fine if there was another episode

It’s comparable to ending S6 on Episode 8

Right before BotB

Not terrible in isolation, but a disappointment for what was promised

[sour pulsar]

Not saying all episodes were, some kinda the last two seasons level of GOT. I think S2 was too slow paced.

Daemon’s mindfuckery arc should’ve been shorter. Forget about the fall. Wish we got Battle of the Gullet at least.

Have to wait 2 more years for another season

Such a well made video. https://youtu.be/V8AUJ4WhIlw?si=CZzVxp5zam7mwFoO

[warped dew]

https://variety.com/2024/tv/news/house-of-the-dragon-end-season-4-1236095543/

[cerulean glacier]

On Rhaenyra doing the nun suit to meet Alicent, it's a little ridiculous hollywood-type but I didn't mind it too much

Was cool to see something

New in the show

The thing I didn't like was how they brought up

Alicent misinterpreting Viserys' last words, I didn't really like that from s1

Cause it was:

1. Lazy? Uninspired? A trope?
2. Took away from the characters' agency in their role in the war

So I'm glad they laid that to rest, they did the same with Daemon confronting Rhaenys about not just killing the greens then and there

The original coronation was just that, a coronation

But Miguel Sapochnik insisted they add something visually bombastic to the scene

Which was cool visuals but added glaring plot holes

[sour pulsar]

Let’s see if S3 is an improvement over this season.

[cerulean glacier]

Alright anyway after reading the previous opinions here's my 2 cents:

1. I'm with both Ruby and Framer;
   Alicent and Rhaenyra being the respective matriarchs and driving force between the respective factions, medieval feudal wars being driven predominantly by personal reasons of the aristocrats is core to the show. Its like on their ads/posters and also the two are the faces of each faction.
   Where I diverge is I don't think it necesserily needs to be about their friendship rather their relationship, I think adding more reluctance and greyness would help alot, where they're not exactly driven by their better natures to cooperate, atleast not at this point.

I do think its important to get interactions between the two but it needs to avoid repetition of the same scene, if anyone's watched Better Call Saul, it has the same guilts as that. Its a show about personal transformation but it kept hitting the same beats ad nauseum and it became repetitive until the last season felt really rushed.

Alicent didn't have much plot impact or influence over the war until the last scene with her, Rhaenyra was repeatedly having the same scenes with her council etc.

I'm certain the writing could have been much stronger if the dialogue was improved to show constant and more apparent change, its only an 8ep season with them having minutes to showcase the plot, so it def needed to move faster

Or atleast have more dimensions to it

2. Sunfyre || isn't dead just because someone said it, thats very surface level to put it lightly. Aegon would believe that and in the source material Sunfyre makes a miraculous journey to dragonstone, narratively they're going to make Aegon believe he's dead and then have an emotional scene where he appears; that much is obvious for script writing purposes ||

3. Rhaenyra taking Alicent hostage would make strategic sense, but as someone pointed out making blunders for emotional reasons is understandable, like how Robb Stark managed to get himself and his men killed at the red wedding

Also Alicent already has value being free because she promised to open the gates

4. Helaena spoiling Aemond's death was a giant bruh moment, it removed agency from the character and also highkey spoiled the audience, like idk how that made it past post-production

Daemon somewhat knowing his death and accepting it is a giant divergence to how he viewed his final moments in the source material, but he's already a totally different person in the show

Hotd is 10x better in terms of cinematography, visual design and camera work; HBO invested alot more heavily into polishing HOTD, whereas GoT's S1-S4 writing was better, but thats only because its GRRM's primary story with HOTD and the upcoming Dunc & Egg being tertiarily storylines to supplement GoT

But S2 HOTD got gutted hard by the executives

Possible S3 spoilers:
|| So if you read behind the scenes stuff, you'll find that Jacerys' death at the Battle of the Gullet at the hands of the triarchy navy was supposed to happen this season, its made much more appearent when you take into account how Rhaenyra is much crueler and says "a son for a son" something she vehemently opposed with Blood and Cheese. Its the second time she's lost a son, and also a driver for Alicent's guilt now that both the bastards she hated so much have been murdered and why she would have came to Dragonstone. Also how Rhaenyra was in Harrenhall with Daemon to talk about taking KL then back at Dragonstone again fast travel teleporting all over the place. Also why Jace was so heavily featured this season to build up his death. In S1 we had the Daemon vs. Triarchy then Aemond vs. Luke, 2 big budget visual sequences, which was also supposed to happen in S2 Rook's Rest + Gullet, then the final showing of the land armies arriving to set up the slog-fest war to come. ||

|| It also would have added more weight on multiple scales with Rhaenyra uttering "a son for a son", as mentioned she wasn't the kind of person to demand an eye for an eye with Luke, but after losing yet another she's beginning to faulter. It isn't just a son either, she lost her first born and heir and now demands Alicent do the same ||

|| Anyway I imagine the original plan was to end the season with Jace dying in a cool visual spectacle and Rhaenyra and Daemon conquering KL. In the books Aemond goes to Harrenhal to challenge Daemon believing he's there, but Daemon is described "more snake than dragon" (Real cool that show Caraxes' design pays homage to this) and secretly flies to KL without any dragons to resist him and Rhaenyra, Aemond is now incapable of returning to KL because he can't challenge Daemon with a bastard army of dragons. You can see this all being laid out real well in S2 with how Aemond is literally telling Helaena he's gonna do that but also Rhaenyra meeting Daemon at Harrenhall to tell him the news that KL is up for grabs ||

|| S2 ends with the same musical number and scenes as we had but the last panel being Rhaenyra on the Iron Throne ||

[tiny marsh]

I thought from the beginning this season would end with her on the throne and the music stops when she cuts herself

[cerulean glacier]

|| There's an absolute shitfest of reasons why this didn't pan out because:

1. Writer's strike? This only affects why some scenes felt a little off or pacing was slow.
2. HBO new management after a series of failed shows and projects lost alot of revenue across the years and now have a change in business strategy where they're more conservative with spending, its a trickle down punishment in that after GoT's shit ending, among other reasons like them not having as much heavy hitting shows anymore, TV generally being on the decline and having to rely on streaming services which generate less ad revenue, etc. etc. or maybe even pursuing a tax write off allowed the showrunners only 8 episodes or told them to cut the big scenes for budget reasons.
3. Discovery and HBO had a merger, the former is alot more fast paced and concerned with stock valuation; like how Boeing merged with the military plane company and ended up making planes which doors blow out to clutch their purses or video games selling loot boxes etc.

2 and 3 being the major reasons for production quality loss ||

[tiny marsh]

Ep8 should have been the gullet

Then there should be 2 more episodes

Ep9 being the fallout and you could easily have Alicent at Dragonstone

Then 10 being KL

We were so close to a near perfect season

[torn valve]

How do you know

[tiny marsh]

If they can't afford to do more than 1 battle in S2

And they've confirmed that 4 will be the last season

How the fuck they going to do all this

Gullet, ||fall of kingslanding||, Butchers Ball, Tumbleton 1, battle above the godseye, ||storming of the dragon pit||, Tumbleton 2 and Battle of the Kingsroad

These aren't even all the battles left in the dance, they're just ones that have to happen on screen

[cerulean glacier]

I don’t but HBO has done major budget cuts to all their projects, re structured their strategy

[torn valve]

Oh really?

[cerulean glacier]

And the Showrunners intentionally or not said they went with 8ep

While taking into consideration the budget concerns

Among other things

[tiny marsh]

Both TLOU and HoTD have less episodes because of that

[torn valve]

Dang

[cerulean glacier]

Not show spoilers, but yeah I said what I vaguely know about what’s going on behind the scenes

[rich bay]

We don't need to see every battle though, HoTD is more than just action imo.

[tiny marsh]

Those are all battles very important to the story though

All contain massive deaths or massive consequences

There are other less important battles we don't need to see

[rich bay]

Then just like Rook's rest I'm sure we will see them.. still 2 seasons left for those.

I'm glad it is ending at 4 seasons as that means you don't stretch out the show too long

[humble plover]

Pretty easy to split in half

S3 ||opens with the Gullet and Fall, then Butcher’s Ball marks the high point for the Blacks, before we end the season on the Two Betrayers at Tumbleton||

S4 can easily fit the rest into eight episodes

[torn valve]

Criston Cole’s speech at the end was soul crushing tbh

He’s starting to realize that he’s in many ways a servant to beasts he can hardly comprehend

[sour pulsar]

https://x.com/culturecrave/status/1820580057318150319?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

Culture Crave 🍿 (@CultureCrave) on X

#HouseOfTheDragon showrunner Ryan Condal says showing Daenerys in the vision doesn't confirm she is The Prince That Was Promised

"We are not trying to make any kind of specific interpretation of a prophecy that has yet to be revealed by its author. That is George’s space to

Twitter · Aug 5, 2024, 9:58 PM

[delicate summit]

except George is never finishing winds of winter

[sour pulsar]

Dude is probably multi tasking. Working on the main series and side stories.

We don’t even know whether A Dream of Spring is the final book in ASOIAF.

[sour pulsar]

https://fxtwitter.com/westerosies/status/1820574671785369630?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

[cerulean glacier]

https://tenor.com/view/oof-disappointed-facepalm-reaction-vicente-del-bosque-gif-17817343

[humble plover]

That’d be good

[sour pulsar]

https://fxtwitter.com/culturecrave/status/1820903204143636942?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

https://x.com/culturecrave/status/1820904415689343087?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

Culture Crave 🍿 (@CultureCrave) on X

#HouseOfTheDragon S2 finale is now at 48% on Rotten Tomatoes — based on 21 reviews 🟢

The lowest-rated episode in the series

Twitter · Aug 6, 2024, 7:26 PM

[cerulean glacier]

The actors in general seem to have much better understandings of how to present their characters

[cunning fox]

Again, they should burn her to a crisp

She’s such an annoying and irrelevant character

[cerulean glacier]

I have a feeling they removed Nettles

Because it would make Rhaenyra look bad

[humble plover]

Dunno why y’all think they’re protective of Rhaenyra

Not two episodes ago she had 30 innocents burned to a crisp for science

She’s frequently demonstrated apathy for her subjects, going right back to early S1

Her entitlement to rule a people she knows or cares nothing about is gonna be her undoing

[cerulean glacier]

Yeah but it was the only redeeming scene among a plethora

A lot of viewers also didn’t like what they did with alicent in the end

Because it was presented as if she was making the right decision or siding with the good guys; and for what? “Many will die” which wasn’t something she had ever cared for nor should as a noble

And kill her three sons in the process all so she can go to Thailand for vacation

[sour pulsar]

https://www.reddit.com/r/freefolk/s/35IFkYsMsn

[sour pulsar]

https://tenor.com/view/joker-everything-burns-heath-ledger-gif-14007886