serious-discussion

[bright hill]

[errant ridge]

Nicee

[arctic grove]

ryc doesnt want his secrets leaked

like how he is a furry online

[bright hill]

but I already know all of ryc's secrets

[deep mango]

🤨

[tall badge]

ryc doesnt want to expose his brother to the server culture

[bronze wedge]

(also has some very specific thoughts on advisors but anyway...)

[arctic grove]

[errant ridge]

Lol wdym?

[deep mango]

Why would I invite my brother to this server

That would be so weird

[errant ridge]

[deep mango]

Anyway he's not like, a rudin reader

[bright hill]

ryc just doesn't want his brother to find out he's a mod

[arctic grove]

i would never invite any of my brothers, sisters, cousins, relatives, or friends or something, none of them here

lol

[bright hill]

[deep mango]

He's just getting A's in the higher level hs math classes

[bronze wedge]

He was like "don't choose this person or this person, and do choose this or that person"

[arctic grove]

based

[deep mango]

My brother is a computer nerd he would probably think that's cool

[errant ridge]

I was barely passing my hs math classes

[brittle socket]

What if he decided to join this server by himself

[bright hill]

lol

so he doesn't know?

lmao

[errant ridge]

[deep mango]

Then he would never know it was me

[arctic grove]

coz u were too busy doing diff geo

[errant ridge]

I wish

[arctic grove]

i would make sure he would know

[deep mango]

And how would you do that?

[severe schooner]

I meant by instead of liking someone younger than you, its someone older than you.

[errant ridge]

he's in your walls remember?

[arctic grove]

by doxxing the ever living shit out of you

i see u all day long ryc

not in a creepy way

[deep mango]

Wtf

[arctic grove]

obviously

So everyeone

Rycs real name is

Dumbass

[errant ridge]

sounds like what a person looking in a creepy would say

[bronze wedge]

RYC

[arctic grove]

his parents thought it would be funny

and it just kinda stuck around

[arctic grove]

Just a coincidence!

[brittle socket]

Screenshotted, peak math discord

[errant ridge]

RYC stands for Ryan Y. Campbell

Lol jk

[deep mango]

[errant ridge]

[bright hill]

dis like the no homo meme lmao

[arctic grove]

but u are my friend

😭

[arctic grove]

[deep mango]

Yeah sure... wouldn't you like that

[arctic grove]

fuck you mean!

[errant ridge]

Oof

[bright hill]

"I'll fucking murder you and then eat your liver"
"not in a creepy way tho :)"

[arctic grove]

😌

[errant ridge]

shyshu destroyed

[arctic grove]

ryc just sucks tbh

[errant ridge]

shyshu want the nuclear launch codes?

[arctic grove]

yes please

[errant ridge]

alright sent

[arctic grove]

launch them to 420 street, 69th avenue, NYC.

[errant ridge]

[deep mango]

Could not be further from a real address

[arctic grove]

i wont know i dont live in america

unless....

[errant ridge]

guys im gonna become stu

[arctic grove]

i am american

[errant ridge]

bye!

,iam stu

[fathom swallow]

Gave you the studying! selfrole.

[arctic grove]

and hence know what addresses are impossible

[brittle socket]

[bright hill]

neam is stu

[arctic grove]

[arctic grove]

i read that as neam is stew

and was like wtf

[bright hill]

lol

[arctic grove]

ryc a big bully!

he always bully me!

modssssssssssssss punish him!

[deep mango]

huh

that's strange

[arctic grove]

by mods i meant mniip

[deep mango]

i seem to recall you calling me a dumbass, saying i suck, saying you will pummel me...

[brittle socket]

[arctic grove]

i will what

what was that last one

[bright hill]

wait

wtf

[deep mango]

pummel means beat up

[arctic grove]

and i didnt call u a dumbass!

it was a joke

[arctic grove]

oh

lmao

[bronze wedge]

[bright hill]

where is :akko_lewd:???

[arctic grove]

when did i say that tho

[bright hill]

ryc??

[arctic grove]

i never said i would beat u up

[deep mango]

Wow... What did you think i meant

[bright hill]

explain????

[deep mango]

Wtf

[arctic grove]

its the start of the weeb erasure

[deep mango]

I personally deleted it

[arctic grove]

no weeb shit no more!

[arctic grove]

based as fuck ngl

[bright hill]

[arctic grove]

gonna spare u from ur cousin now

[deep mango]

Wat

From why

What

[arctic grove]

dwai....

[bright hill]

lmao

[bronze wedge]

Algebra fans<<<Weebs<<<probability enjoyers

[deep mango]

Wow thats gross. My cousin???

[arctic grove]

u got the order the wrong way

[bright hill]

shyshy sucking at threatening is peak culture

[arctic grove]

i meant i wont doxx ur secrets to ur cousin

[deep mango]

Oh

[arctic grove]

i dont suck at threatening!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bright hill]

oh yeah?

threaten me

[brittle socket]

This channel is peak math discord

[deep mango]

:akko_lewd:

[arctic grove]

oh...

ummm

uhhh

you

you suck!

[deep mango]

Dont do it

[arctic grove]

i will

beat you with a copy of aluffi!

[deep mango]

Wow

[arctic grove]

is that threatening

idk if it is

[deep mango]

Darq is definitely into that

[bright hill]

that's not threatening

[brittle socket]

[bright hill]

that's just an insult

[arctic grove]

[arctic grove]

i was doing both

smh

[bright hill]

[tall badge]

ill give u helper when u least expect it

[arctic grove]

darq is an aluffi simp now

very sad

[deep mango]

It is sad

[bright hill]

[arctic grove]

thats such a badass threat holy fucking shit

[bright hill]

wtf

please no

[golden pendant]

ryc why do you prefer discussion 2 over discussion

dont deny

[deep mango]

I was looking through some screencaps the other day, and I have one where darq is green

[arctic grove]

LMAO

that was an interesting time

[bright hill]

roketto, please don't give ryc ideas

[deep mango]

Well cause people sometimes try to have serious conversations in discussion, so I want them to have room to do that

[brittle socket]

How many billion years ago was that lol, I seem to have a faint recollection of that

[brittle socket]

Implies discussion is serious and totally not #chill2.0

[bright hill]

I am green now

[deep mango]

I deleted the screenshot unfortunately

[bright hill]

[tall badge]

@bright hill ha did u think id wait a day or two before assigning it?

[deep mango]

I only keep around a few math discord screenshots that still make me laugh every time

[bright hill]

roketto

you meanie

[deep mango]

Omg hahahah

[brittle socket]

[bright hill]

[arctic grove]

lmao

idek

[deep mango]

Shyshu is staying mighty quiet about this

[bright hill]

wait

[deep mango]

Could it be because he relates

[bright hill]

I can .close again!

hahahahaha

[arctic grove]

😭

[brittle socket]

I recall it now
(because DarQ is now green)

[bright hill]

time to commit some evil

[arctic grove]

helper was horrible

[tall badge]

enjoy as much as u can before the pings roll in

[arctic grove]

Darq deserves this role, coz of his crimes against humanity (read: becoming an HSCT)

[brave hollow]

what is a HSCT?

[bright hill]

high school category theorist lol

[tulip wind]

i need help

[tall badge]

oh i thought it was haematopoietic stem cell transplantation

[brave hollow]

why is that a crime against humanity?

[arctic grove]

did u google that

[bright hill]

you googled that, didn't you?

lol

[tulip wind]

how do i do this

[arctic grove]

just coz i wanted it to be one

[brave hollow]

you don't :chad:

[tall badge]

yes i genuinely suspected darq of being a stem cell

[brittle socket]

:cringe:

[bronze wedge]

Hp special convergence theorem

[brittle socket]

lmao what

[tall badge]

still in his infancy so to speak

[brave hollow]

this one makes sense, thanks for the answer

[deep mango]

No memory errors

😭

What the fuck is this problem????

[arctic grove]

what happened ryc

why are u going crazy

[deep mango]

I cant diagnose what the problem with my computer ks

Ive tried every fix

And every diagnostic

[arctic grove]

what happened to ur computer?

[bronze wedge]

(by Hp I mean martingale hardy space)

[arctic grove]

where is the issue coming from?

[brave hollow]

thanks for the clarification

[deep mango]

Idk, but every few days it goes into a bluescreen loop with errors that indicate a memory issue. A bluescreen viewer app told me the program the faults are coming from, which is a memory management kernel

So either it's a driver issue or a piece of hardware is bad, or there's some really arcane problem

Well I updated all the drivers

And the hardware seems to be working perfectly

[brittle socket]

pain

[deep mango]

And ive already tried to fix all the weird interactions that people have found online

So its just something

Totally fucked up

[brittle socket]

Bring it to a computer shop or someone? Like a friend who knows computers well

[deep mango]

It seems to activate when im playing games or something, so im guessing it's literally just an issue when I max out memory usage

[arctic grove]

go to a help center

[deep mango]

I will now

But i wanted to figure it iut

[arctic grove]

have u tried increasing vram?

that might help

[deep mango]

I haven't

hmm

idk how to do that

[arctic grove]

Google it lol

[deep mango]

ugh i have to go to bios

rghhhhh

[arctic grove]

no u dont

search this

[deep mango]

registry editor

[arctic grove]

go here

go to advanced tab and then change it to something thats more than what u currently have

[deep mango]

uhhh

ok

[brittle socket]

This is a random comment but I haven't seen a really wholesome moment in this discord in a long time lol

[fair mural]

not exactly wholesome just helping someone

[brittle socket]

Not saying shyshu helping ryc is particularly wholesome

[alpine kindle]

#970671127154286703 is very wholesome

i assume you have missed it

[brittle socket]

Its literally just "mice"

[brittle socket]

That was literally a random comment about not seeing a really whole moment here in a long time (not related to any msg here previously)

[deep mango]

no it is not! shyshu is just trying to make my computer worse so that i'll give up, get a new one, and send this to him

[alpine kindle]

it's the best channel in the server

[brittle socket]

[brittle socket]

nmice

[arctic grove]

What

What the hell

[deep mango]

Did not increase vram. Nice try

Now im updating even more drivers

16 more to update

Idk if i need to restart for each one or if i can do a bunch and then restart

[arctic grove]

Why not

[arctic grove]

U can restart for all of them together

[deep mango]

I did a google search...

[arctic grove]

So?

[deep mango]

They said its best to restart after each one

Just to be safe

[arctic grove]

I download many drivers at once

[deep mango]

So you are a LIAR!

[arctic grove]

I mean

Fuck you mean

Ryc u are so rude

[deep mango]

I am rude to those who attempt to swindle me!

[arctic grove]

Fuck you i am never helping u again

[deep mango]

Wow

[arctic grove]

What the hell will I get out of swindling u

[deep mango]

Grass was hoping for a wholesome moment

[arctic grove]

And u shat on it

[deep mango]

And this is what you do

[arctic grove]

Shame on u ruc

[deep mango]

Me???

[arctic grove]

Ryc

Yes u

Fuck u

[deep mango]

My laptop clearly

[arctic grove]

Like u will actually send it

[deep mango]

Oh god this driver is a gig

Wtf

[arctic grove]

And i will buy a better laptop when I get into uni

So idec

So much for being a friend with a mod....

[arctic grove]

Wut

Oh a gigabyte

Not that much

But if all of them are that big

[deep mango]

Thats a lot for a driver!

[arctic grove]

It would be a bit annoying

[deep mango]

Most of them are like

100kb

[arctic grove]

Depends on the kind of driver

Graphic drivers can go high af

[deep mango]

Yeah these are two graphics drivers

That are both that big

[arctic grove]

Even my Intel graphic ones are like a gig or more all the time

[deep mango]

Sobbwhy

[arctic grove]

Understandably so

[deep mango]

I need to download them separately cause this app has a throttled download speed

[arctic grove]

Oof

Sad

Have fun

[deep mango]

[arctic grove]

Or atleast try having fun

[deep mango]

Jeez

[errant ridge]

ngl the math server has the best emojis

[deep mango]

The gradual switch from pepe / weeb emojis to our own set has been nice

[errant ridge]

[eager reef]

[brittle socket]

No I wasn't hoping for a wholesome moment

I was just literally randomly commenting that I haven't seen one here in a long time

[errant ridge]

grass you're awesome

[brittle socket]

[errant ridge]

there you go, another wholesome moment

[errant ridge]

now that you've had your wholesome moment, I take it back

you're not awesome

Lol jk

[storm sage]

yoooo that's cool

[old fox]

if body scales measure your weight, why did he say "in common parlance, weight refers to mass?"

https://youtu.be/57gKnA94Doc?t=75

[storm sage]

we usually use weight and mass interchangeably in everyday speech

but in physics, they are different things

[old fox]

yes I mean in physics

[deep mango]

Uh huh... Sure...

[storm sage]

that's all he meant

[deep mango]

Here's a little lesson for you grass

[old fox]

body scales measure your weight but in the video he shows a body scale and said that in everyday speech weight refers to mass

[deep mango]

This server is not cute or wholesome! It's a den of villainy, lies, and vicious infighting

It's even run by an undergound mafia

[eager reef]

It's me

i am the underground mafia

[old fox]

there's no point saying that if scales measure your weight

[deep mango]

And yet you stareeyebrows

[eager reef]

for leaking my secret?

[deep mango]

I dont remember if timo was in the kanga gang

[errant ridge]

I knew it, mniip is part of the italian mafia

[eager reef]

lmao i remember that

I wasn't i think

[old fox]

body scales rely on gravity so it measures your weight, not mass

[eager reef]

I wasnt really active during that time here

[zealous garden]

there is no italian mafia in the server

[deep mango]

[errant ridge]

there is no war in bang se

[zealous garden]

I'm glad we've come to an understanding, you have a good day now and I hope you find that information on curvilinear coordinates you want

[errant ridge]

yes I'm hoping to find a book on it

[errant ridge]

ryc do you know any books on calculus of functions f : R^n -> R^m that's computationally oriented but also rigorous, but uses curvilinear coordinates for the whole thing instead of rectangular coordinates

[deep mango]

I dont even know what curvilinear coodinates are

[errant ridge]

like polar, cylindrical, spherical

[deep mango]

Is that not like what calculus on manifolds spivak is

[errant ridge]

is it?

let me check

no it just uses cartesian coordinates

I guess I'm doomed to a life of unrigorous curvilinear coords

[zealous garden]

a curvilinear coordinate system assigns a basis to each point

[errant ridge]

the basis isn't constant, it's like a vector field, different at every point

I don't understand it one bit.....yet

[eager reef]

assigns each point a basis of what?

of R^n?

[errant ridge]

a curvilinear basis

[eager reef]

of what

or is curvilinear basis some different thing

[zealous garden]

the space

[eager reef]

and not a basis in LA sense

[zealous garden]

we assign a linearly independent spanning set of vectors to each point

[errant ridge]

I'm actually not sure how it connects to LA basis

[zealous garden]

these vectors form a basis for the space we address with our curvilinear coordinate system

this is basis as you are familiar with, but we use many different ones put together

[eager reef]

reading the wikipedia article on it rn

never seen that before

[errant ridge]

yea only physicist use it

[zealous garden]

using it is also more complicated

[eager reef]

and i've done diff geo

seems like a niche thing

[errant ridge]

since some problems are more easier to solve in certain curvilinear coords

[eager reef]

if ryc hasn't heard of it either

[errant ridge]

[eager reef]

well yeah i know polar and cylindrical coordinates

[errant ridge]

as far as I know it's only prevalent in physics

[eager reef]

from multivar analysis

[zealous garden]

spherical cords ftw

[errant ridge]

only for certain problems

[eager reef]

but not the general principle of curvi whatever

[errant ridge]

so how do polar coords basis work?

like how do you represent a point (2, 1) in terms of the basis vectors in polar coordinates

in cartesian coords you can do 2i + j (or 2 \hat{x} + \hat{y})

but in polar coords how

[open aspen]

Well. You can just use the change of basis forumlae

Or just think about it a bit

What's the distance from the origin to that point? That's your r

Whats the angle? You can find this using pythagorean identities

You know all the edge lengths of the triangle, that completely determines its angles

That gives you theta and viola

You can also use this to recover your change of basis from Euclidean to Polar more generally

[zealous garden]

viola is an instrument

[open aspen]

So true

Voila

[zealous garden]

I have a viola

[open aspen]

Can you play it?

[zealous garden]

no, it needs strings and perhaps a bridge

[fair mural]

@zealous garden i love your about me

[odd narwhal]

then do you really have a viola

[zealous garden]

I appreciate this

[zealous garden]

yes, I also have 3 basses and 2 guitars

[fair mural]

i can take some of your noodles if you have way too many

[zealous garden]

some of those need stuff too

no sir

I have so many, not too many

[fair mural]

[storm sage]

do violists play violas or viols

[zealous garden]

good question

the good ones play both

[errant ridge]

they play violence

[arctic grove]

Doom Eternal theme intensifies

[errant ridge]

[neat lintel]

im kind of an internet hater....

[arctic grove]

Yet here you are

[little saffron]

Im in highschool and I need to write an extended essay due in 2 years time about a topic regarding space (I chose physics as my subject for the essay, and I like space). Does anyone know of anything interesting regarding space that could be subject of a 4000 word essay and easy enough for a 16 year old to understand?

it could be anything from space travel, to the dyson sphere, to whatever. It just needs to be interesting and there needs to be enough existing material on it to produce an extended essay

ping me if you have anything pls

[river moon]

history of some rocket or history of some engine family, e. g. shuttle and it's payloads, zenit or Energia, engine families like RL-10, RD-170/180/190, exotic stuff like soviet MAKS program, space probes like Ulysses, Chandra, Juno or Cassini

but whatever topic from these you pick you'll have to dig deep and read a lot of PDF files, look for various resources and such to collect the full story

[frozen merlin]

due in 2 years

[errant ridge]

let's go! spreading some RO knowledge in the math server

[errant ridge]

you could write about the life cycle of a star

like how giant gas clouds (nebula) compress to form proto stars and planetary disks and then fusion starts at their core

and then how they fuse hydrogen to helium

[little saffron]

Im sorry I forgot to add an important detail. The essay needs to take the form of a question. Kind of like a research paper. As an example of what I mean, my friend chose biology and chose to do his on insects. His question is "Would insects help nourish humanity in the next 50 years?" or whatever something along those lines. And the history of something is more of a history oriented topic, so yeah.

[errant ridge]

and then oxygem and neon

and then finally it goes supernova

and turns into a neutron star or a black hole depending on the mass of the star

that's a cool topic no?

[little saffron]

yeah stars are cool asf but I need to turn it into a question of some sort

[errant ridge]

"where do the metals use come from?"

[frozen merlin]

is this epq?

[errant ridge]

supernovas and from the cores of the stars

like the oxygen in your body was once at the core of a star how cool is that

[river moon]

well there's tons of questions you can come up with while reading, like "are space planes viable?" or "why rockets use multiple stages/chemical engines/etc?"

[little saffron]

It needs to be like an open-ended type of question, sort of like the example I gave with the insects. One that was used in the past was "How would humans make the switch from Earth to Mars?" or something like that, but Im not allowed to do something thats already been done.

[little saffron]

Yeah the first one is something that would be ok to use

[errant ridge]

they are in stock ksp

[little saffron]

what is that

[frozen merlin]

it stands for "extended project qualification" which is a thing in the uk which sounds very very similar to what you describe

[little saffron]

Im doing the Swiss Maturité. Im in the equivalent of year 12 I think for the uk system

[chilly hull]

ive been busy doing something else so i cant do much math this week

the agony

[frozen merlin]

oh cool

[little saffron]

nah not cool this is ass

[errant ridge]

[errant ridge]

did u finish learning calc 2?

[frozen merlin]

but yeah the similarity is such that you can probably google "epq questions for space" and get some ideas from people who've been in very similar positions to you (the question needs to be open ended, ~6000 words, etc)

[little saffron]

woah

yo this could save me ong

[errant ridge]

[chilly hull]

@errant ridge almost

[errant ridge]

nice

[chilly hull]

just need to do parametric/polar stuff and series

[errant ridge]

onto calc 3 !!

[chilly hull]

and then i am free

[errant ridge]

ooh okay

[chilly hull]

im delaying calc 3

[frozen merlin]

to be honest, looking at some of the forum posts, this might not be very helpful lol

[chilly hull]

until i do linear algebra

[frozen merlin]

but maybe you can find something good

[chilly hull]

and start analysis

[errant ridge]

nice

yea lin alg before calc 3 is good

[chilly hull]

im also starting statistics

so much to do

-analysis
-linalg
-statistics

once i finish linear alg onto calc 3

[errant ridge]

statistics =

[chilly hull]

calc based statistics

[errant ridge]

calc in R^n =

[chilly hull]

[errant ridge]

all of statistics =

[chilly hull]

uh

odes/pdes

[errant ridge]

[chilly hull]

i have to do some homework

and deal with a couple issues

[errant ridge]

[chilly hull]

but i should be back on track around next week

hopefully

[errant ridge]

Nice

[chilly hull]

whose cat is this

it is cute

[errant ridge]

it's no one's

it's a free cat

cat king

[chilly hull]

incredible

[zealous garden]

curvilinear coordinates

[little saffron]

yeah an EPQ is basically what I have to do. Thank you so much for telling me about all this. These "EPQ ideas" websites are a huge help, and I couldn't have known about them if it weren't for what you told me

[frozen merlin]

glad it was helpful 🙂

[zealous garden]

@errant ridge I found some curvilinear coords stuff

[untold sapphire]

eeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[zealous garden]

all those e's boi

euler's formula in full abuse

[brittle socket]

Never said it was

[odd narwhal]

You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy

[tender tulip]

WHAT

[dapper badge]

pacman

[zealous garden]

lmfao

[tender tulip]

basically the “mandelbrot set” for e^z

e^z_n + c = z_(n+1)

[dapper badge]

sounds cool

i like the pictures

[dapper badge]

patrick

[tender tulip]

literally only 15 desmos lines

https://www.desmos.com/calculator/rivb4f3u3b

[dapper badge]

kinda looks like squidward arm

[zealous garden]

fractals are fun

[dapper badge]

patrick off a perc

[tender tulip]

what the actual fuck

[frozen merlin]

is this the current state of desmos

I feel old

[little vine]

Is Mandelbrot set measurable

[pure sun]

yes; it is closed

[little vine]

Cool

[bronze wedge]

(pretty much every set you can write down is Lebesgue measurable)

[little vine]

Ahh good to know

I just started learning about Lebesgue measure

[open aspen]

@brittle socket do you just have a bunch of screenshots saved to your computer? Lol

[brittle socket]

Y e s

[open aspen]

You're committed to the memes. I like that

[brittle socket]

I just like to keep some interesting screenshots around lol

[errant ridge]

do a surface integral over one

[open aspen]

w h a t

[errant ridge]

[terse flax]

Ez

Contour moment

[errant ridge]

[next schooner]

Do you mean like doing an integral over a Julia set

Or a path integral along, like, a hilbert curve

[errant ridge]

im not 100% what exactly is a julia set

i meant like a surface integral of a scalar field over S, where S is a fractal (or yk the insides of a fractal)

[next schooner]

Nothing wrong with that as far as I can see

Lebesgue integrals are marvelous tools

[errant ridge]

time to donate all my riemann integrals to highschool students and replace them with lebesgue integrals

[zealous garden]

Bet

How many dimensions you want it G

[errant ridge]

cardinality of R

[zealous garden]

Curvilinear coordinates?

[errant ridge]

yup

[zealous garden]

Gotchu boss, I'll let the chef know and I'll be right back with your order

[errant ridge]

[neat lintel]

i think being able to pull the lever shows that you can make decisions in face hard choice and pressure

[errant ridge]

no, being able to dual track drift shows that you're amazing

[severe swallow]

does anybody else think this problem isn't remotely suited for 8th graders, or is there some really cheap trick here

all solutions I've seen so far involve some uglier case distinctions and longer chains of reasoning

[errant ridge]

yea imo just a bad problem

[dry night]

What are the mathematics one might see in computational neuroscience?

I've seen a bit of circuit theory and systems of ODEs, but other than that, I'm wondering how much deeper it might go

[stoic ice]

who is smart here?

what is circuit theory

you mean like electrical circuits?

that's a theory now?

the more you know

[frail lagoon]

lol

[bright hill]

ladies and gents

we found it

[fading tusk]

its finally here

[bright hill]

use of inasmuch in the wild

[fading tusk]

is that a mod in mse ?

[bright hill]

no clue

I don't use mse a lot tbh

I should

[tender tulip]

i know in group theory we can have the idea of the direct produxt

Which we can take the direct product of any set of groups (up to iso)

but what about the free product

[zealous garden]

what is free

[bronze wedge]

nothing is free in life

[pure sun]

yes

you can take the free product of any set of groups

and get another group

[zealous garden]

what is, the free product

[pure sun]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_product

[fair mural]

the expensive product

[bronze wedge]

"I can't afford the norm topology" - words spoken by financially insecure Hilbert spaces

[meager sonnet]

dear liberals, how will you afford all these "free" products

[wooden flax]

my life changed when i leaned universal properties

[bronze wedge]

Grothendieck doesn't want you to know this!

[jovial ember]

https://tenor.com/view/carnage-venom-venom-let-there-be-carnage-lean-carnage-carnage-lean-gif-24709803

[wooden flax]

Turning into shamrock I see

[jovial ember]

I’ve been posting this gif for aaagggeeeessss

Often in response to shamrock leanposting

[wooden flax]

Lmao yeah

[jovial ember]

But also because I did lean stuff this last quarter

[wooden flax]

Makes sense

[jovial ember]

SUCKED

[wooden flax]

Oh cool

Lol

[jovial ember]

God lean is so bad I hate it

[wooden flax]

Lean is 🤢

How does sham do it

[jovial ember]

It’s not for me

If others wanna do it cool, and I think it’s neat to prove something hard

But it’s just like, I don’t want to use my time on it

Also it would require me to actually understand like, the type theory

[wooden flax]

Lean just takes out the laziness of doing math

Yeah

[jovial ember]

To do it right I think you have to not be a mathematician

Like, being a mathematician who just picked it up and learned a few tactics

Because you just run up against really stupid crap you don’t understand

[wooden flax]

Lean dosent feel like doing math

[jovial ember]

It felt like what happens when you write code that’s bad

And just spirals out of control

[wooden flax]

We should teach middle schoolers lean and have them verify proofs

[jovial ember]

So true

There’s also a weird phenomenon like

One of the grad students doing the project also was doing a DRP with a kid on it

Who wasn’t very proficient in math itself

So he said that somehow lean sort of like, guided the kid

[wooden flax]

Huh

[jovial ember]

Like, the kid would produce a proof of a statement

[wooden flax]

That’s interesting

[jovial ember]

But not understand the math

Because like you just advance the goal

And you see oh it wants this

[wooden flax]

Makes it a game kinda

[jovial ember]

I use a rewrite here

And they would like chop away at the goal

Without understanding the math really

Ofc this doesn’t work

For anything that’s not really easy

[wooden flax]

Yeah because you need someone else’s mechanics

[jovial ember]

But this is a potential downside to the cray hypothetical where you teach proofs via lean

Where ppl don’t learn how to prove things

They just learn to make the🎉 pop up

Very odd

[wooden flax]

Lol

[jovial ember]

How much have you leaned?

[wooden flax]

Very little, just the basics

[jovial ember]

@shell roost bro we’re lean posting

[wooden flax]

Watched a couple videos and read some documents on it

Can’t do very much with it

[jovial ember]

Did you do natural number game or whatever

[wooden flax]

Ya

[jovial ember]

Yee

I did a project at school where we basically tried to prove Hilbert’s Basis theorem

Which we… mostly did?

[shell roost]

Hello

[wooden flax]

Lol cool

[jovial ember]

Read up a little bit

Idk if you agree with what I said

But that phenomenon was something Vas was telling me he felt

[shell roost]

I feel it

[jovial ember]

I thought it was really weird!

[shell roost]

Sometimes I lose like an hour of work bc I didn't think through a goal

And I just followed my nose

[jovial ember]

Huh, but Vas was saying just following your nose like

Sometimes meant solving it without understanding the math

I guess I wasn’t clear what point I meant since I actually made two

[shell roost]

I don't think that's wrong

But sometimes it can mean not solving it also

[jovial ember]

Okay fair

But the stuff you did you at least knew how to solve mathematically right?

[shell roost]

Yeah

And sometimes I step back and draw out a plan of like my next 5 steps

but sometimes I just focus on solving subgoals

[wooden flax]

Oh also sham today I found out that you are @brittle socketmian. on Twitter

[shell roost]

And then at the end remember why I had those goals in the first case

yes

It's in my discord bio

[wooden flax]

Been reading your posts for so long without knowing it’s you

Lol

[shell roost]

hahaha

[jovial ember]

What about me

[shell roost]

I like poasting

[jovial ember]

Did you know who I am

[brittle socket]

what?

[jovial ember]

It’s probably really hard to know

Oof

[shell roost]

I'm @brittle socketmannian

[jovial ember]

RIP

[brittle socket]

Oh lol

Exposed

[wooden flax]

Sorry grass 😞

[wooden flax]

No definitely not

[jovial ember]

😦

[wooden flax]

You do remind me of this one imbecile named “monke” though

[jovial ember]

MONKE

[wooden flax]

With like a kch at the front

[shell roost]

Also I've been doing it for roughly as long as I've been writing proofs (if not slightly longer), which I think gives me a different perspective

[jovial ember]

OH YEAH

Shamrock built diff

[brittle socket]

Speaking of that, one day I will be able to make the joke that Im learning biology when I get to the point of studying the grassmannian . One day... Probably a few years more till I can read Lee Smooth Manifolds tho

[jovial ember]

Lmao

[shell roost]

it's good stuff

[wooden flax]

Wtf leans been around that lomg?

[shell roost]

I'm talking about 5 or 6 years ago

I just finished college

[jovial ember]

Bro

[wooden flax]

Yea

[jovial ember]

I wrote my first proof like almost 4 years ago

That feels short and long

[shell roost]

Very true

Also yeah

[wooden flax]

My first like baby proof was around like 1.5 years ago maybe

[shell roost]

The version of lean people mostly use is Lean 3

[wooden flax]

Feels longer though

[shell roost]

Although lean 4 is in development

[jovial ember]

Why did you 3

[shell roost]

to emphasize

[jovial ember]

was that for emphasis

Ah okay

[shell roost]

bc it's not weird that it's over 5 years old if it's on the 3rd (4th) major version

[jovial ember]

What were you using?

In HS

[shell roost]

I think lean 3, but it might have been lean 2 at the very early start

I know I used the lean hott mode before they dropped support

[jovial ember]

Oh lmao

[shell roost]

I have some formalized exercises from the hott book in my githib in lean

[jovial ember]

I remember you said some stuff about that

[shell roost]

Yeah so I imagine that was lean 2?

[jovial ember]

Did anyone else at your HS do this sort of stuff

[shell roost]

No lol

the person with the closest interests was Tommy (who was not at my high school)

Like the night we met we talked abiut rust lol

[jovial ember]

He was at the lasaga cat school right?

[shell roost]

Yep

[jovial ember]

Rust

Lol

[shell roost]

Rust

I went to a Haskell user's group meeting too (monthly?)

but that was like, actual adult programmers

[jovial ember]

What did you ever do in Haskell anyway?

[shell roost]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[jovial ember]

Like did you ever make a program anyone used

[shell roost]

It's lost to the ages

no definitely not

[jovial ember]

Or did you just tuck around and do whatever

[shell roost]

Just fuck around on personal projects

The only things I remember at this point are a basic web scraping thing and a polynomial integrator/differentiator

I thought it was so cool when I made the second one in calc class

[jovial ember]

Lmfao

One of my first programs

[shell roost]

I mean I definitely did more than that

[jovial ember]

Like

[shell roost]

But this is what I remember

[jovial ember]

#1 quadratic formula

#2 radical simplifier

[shell roost]

hahaha

[jovial ember]

All on a TI-84

Like in class they were like

Write sqrts in simplest form

[shell roost]

Nice

[jovial ember]

And I went “I can program that”

The quadratic formula was useful

I don’t think I ever actually used the radical one

Lmfao

[shell roost]

Oh another thing I did in Haskell: local programming competitions

[jovial ember]

Do they just tell you to make a program that does X

[shell roost]

I think I switched to a different language for those eventually though

[jovial ember]

And you make it the fastest or some shit

[shell roost]

The problems are kind of like math competition ones

Except with input data

[jovial ember]

Oh

[shell roost]

So it's a cute little story about how this stuff needs to be figured out

[jovial ember]

So is an example like

[shell roost]

And there's no explicit time requirements, there's just feasibility

[jovial ember]

Idk one of my combo problems I had to program

Like one was to find the n-th number of blah blah

[shell roost]

I can try to dig up an example

[jovial ember]

So I did math to figure out what it would be

And it was recursive

So I wrote a program to compute it

[shell roost]

From a 2013 competition

I don't think I did this one, it was a practice thing?

But it was in my google drive

[summer crypt]

could you guys help me with an academic essay? I've written it already but it feels like missing out on the forest for the trees

I want to add more information but the word limit is just 550 words!

it feels like I can't do anything

the subject is "Find the connection between mathematics and the arts"

and I've written about mathematically modelling Psychology

but the word count just doesn't let me elaborate

ugh

people have said that it's too "formulaic" or "rigid" and that they "can't see any art in it"

but again, I've shown it to only non math people

the deadline is just in a few hours

[open aspen]

how are you justifying psychology as an art?

sounds like you make 2.5 majors claims

1. Connection between math and psychology
2. Connection between psychology and the arts
   2.5) this connection is transitive

might simply be too much for a 550 essay

[summer crypt]

I'm not

I'm just assuming that psychology is seen as an art

In the introductory paragraph, I've mentioned music, philosophy, games like chess and go, sociology, etc and their relation to mathematical concepts

but have expanded on psychology

[open aspen]

you've addressed way too many topics for such a short essay

you're gonna need to pick one or two if you really want to elaborate

stating without proof 10 claims is significantly worse than stating and proving 1

try narrowing your focus and exploring the details more

[summer crypt]

oh, for proofs I'm just citing research papers

[open aspen]

that's sorta weak

[summer crypt]

they won't be baseless claims

[summer crypt]

That's what the guidelines have told to do

[open aspen]

really? It told you to make no original arguments but instead to regurgitate information you find online?

or did it say to back your claims with sources

[summer crypt]

well, you can't really express your own opinion on such a vast subject in that short a word count

Previous winners have all cited their claims

Line after line

[open aspen]

sad

well, it seems like you know what to do then

I still would assume fewer claims with more depth would be better

[summer crypt]

I don't, could you PLEASE go through the essay?

[open aspen]

no lol

[summer crypt]

😔.

[open aspen]

if you have any ideas you want to discuss ill help but I'm not trynna proof read some random essay lol

sorry

[summer crypt]

That's understandable

[novel gazelle]

hi everyone, I'm applying to unis of cali as a transfer undergrad, goal is master/phd in optimization, first major is comp sci, alternative major is applied math. I want to ask is this order appropriate? should i switch applied math to pure math?

[river moon]

well if your goal is optimization then it's difficult to decide whether applied or pure math is more suitable

[novel gazelle]

i was wondering because pure math would help with mathematical maturity more than applied math?

[river moon]

I've studied optimization for like half a year straight, covered way more material than is usually taught in any optimization course and I haven't really used any concepts that would classify as "pure math" e. g. group theory, number theory, algebraic geometry, etc

pure math can be more helpful for like discrete optimization because the problems are more fundamental and are closer to things like number theory, but still I haven't noticed much pure math there either

[novel gazelle]

oh

[river moon]

there certainly is research going on that uses very complicated ideas from pure math to develop optimization theory, but you'd have to be a researcher yourself to understand them

[novel gazelle]

@@ i guess I should pick applied math as a practical side also

[open flower]

hi, not sure where to ask this but anyway
I'm 14 years old, and I'm really interested in mathematics. Mainly I've just grown my mathematical knowledge by watching random videos on youtube, but that doesn't seem very efficient. But I couldn't find a structured course anywhere online. Not sure how to go about it. Any suggestions are appreciated!

Also if anyone knows where I can find problems like those featured on channels like 3b1b, that would be great. I can't find them anywhere

[brittle socket]

Read a book on a topic you're interested on

Seems like you got your interest in math from pop math so I'd say just keep in mind that learning math requires you to potentially (and frequently [of course if you're doing something simpler first there would be less of such cases]) stare at questions or even a single definition for hours. I have even heard loch say he spent an entire week but still couldn't solve some hw.

Math is not a spectator sport, you'll need to learn by practicing

As for what book, you can look in #book-recommendations once you decided the topic you want to do

[open flower]

that is actually what i want to do tbh

ive just never found the right resources

maybe ive never looked in the right places

[brittle socket]

Wait what do you "actually want to do"

[open flower]

staring at problems

racking my brain on one particular thing

[brittle socket]

Oh and might I add, its probably better for you to finish your syllabus first since those can be foundational for other math

[brittle socket]

Mmm i see

[open flower]

by syllabus do you mean school syllabus? cause i completed that pretty long ago

[brittle socket]

Yes

Including like all the other highschool stuff from the next few grades?

If your hs knowledge is solid, you could try something like Friedberg, Insel, Spence for Linear Algebra. But for a hs student, it might still be a difficult read. For example, it starts out with a defintion that would most likely be rather abstract and hard to wrap your head around for ppl who aren't a little bit familiar with slightly more abstact stuff

With that said, it would be good if you say what your interests are (and the prerequisites you have or are missing) for that topic

[open flower]

not completely but i've done some bits of it

[brittle socket]

What topics in math interests you?

[open flower]

i haven't really discovered my interests yet but i know im definitely interested in the more abstract sections of math

like complex analysis

[brittle socket]

Ah i see

Classic

[open flower]

yep

calculus is also really interesting but i haven't done enough of it

[brittle socket]

Yeah even if you managed to finish the entirety of your hs syllabus, real and complex analysis will still slap you around a lot if you're not familiar with proof-based math, from what I've heard. Though still some time before i reach anal myself haha

[open flower]

that makes sense

so basically i just need to buy a book on a topic im interested in?

and just do that rigorously

[brittle socket]

If you have the necessary prereqs, sure. But for a normal highschooler, rigorous mathematics will probably have a steep learning curve. So if its too difficult, you might want to take a step back

I guess you could try proving some stuff first I suppose? Like in Spivaks' Calculus, the first 2 chapters are nice ways to hone your prove techniques (he even introduces induction without assuming the reader knows what it is). And those first 2 chapters do not require anything more than hs algebra. If you know what's a polynomial, what qualifies as a rational / irrational number, you should be fine. Though be warned, its would probably be a difficult read.

You could also use loch's summary of proof techniques first

#proofs-and-logic message

[brittle socket]

If you feel that the exercises here are way too hard, and you want to take a step back towards something more managable, you could ask for some intro to proof book recs in #book-recommendations

[open flower]

thanks a lot man

i'll check these out

https://theswissbay.ch/pdf/Gentoomen Library/Maths/Calculus/Michael Spivak - Calculus.pdf

is this what you're referring to?

because this seems right up my alley

[brittle socket]

Yeah seems about right

[brittle socket]

Nice! Hope you have fun
Feel the pain hehe

If you're stuck and really want a hint, feel free to ask around here. As long as you ask it in the correct channels. (though try to do the problems yourself as much as possible to get the most out of them)

For chapters 1-2, it'll fit in #proofs-and-logic

[open flower]

yeah alright, thanks a lot

you're a great man fr

i've always wanted to talk to people like you lmfao

never found a proper community

until now

[lavish kayak]

It can be pretty dry at times

Don't push yourself so hard you hate it

[brittle socket]

np : )

[fringe needle]

So i might not care too much about applications of math while im working with it but it's good to know where you came from and how useful what youre doing could be. Anyone know some good resources to get an idea of applications of various specific areas of math within other areas of math or outside the discipline?

or better, some kind of methodic way to figure out applications of a particular field that doesnt just consist in searching "applications of X"

[fading zealot]

Is 0 the first even number or the zeroth even number?

[mint canopy]

"Is 0 a natural" type question

fwiw, it typically doesn't matter, and if it does, then just define it properly

I like thinking of it as the 0th since I would like the nth even number to be 2n.

[tender tulip]

0 is congruent to 2 mod 2, so it IS even

[sacred forge]

0 should be a natural writing N/{0} or Z_+ is easier than trying to write something like Z/Z_-

[tender tulip]

Any odd number is of the form:
2q + 1, where q is some number, but in this case q is 0

[mint canopy]

This wasn't the question...

[tender tulip]

I was getting there

we can order the even numbers by essentially dividing them by 2

so 1 2 3 4 and so on correspond to 2 4 6 8

and yes, 0 would be the first if you're considering the general natural numbers (which depending on the context can and cannot include 0)

[sacred forge]

if 0 is not a natural number then 2-2 is undefined in the natural numbers

which is weird

[tender tulip]

the natural numbers are not a group under addition. A monoid with zero, yes

so "negation" isn't defined unless you have integers ig

[sacred forge]

im still getting familiar with this abstract algebra terminology

[bright hill]

there's no reason to mention monoids here

besides, they specifically said "if 0 is not a natural number"

in that case the natural numbers aren't even a monoid

sigh

[mint canopy]

[bright hill]

depends on whether you're CSer or normal

but it shouldn't matter

haha

[fading zealot]

I mean… only CSers ask questions like these
Which includes myself

[bright hill]

I dunno

[storm sage]

Hmmm

[bright hill]

prolly the 0th even number

[storm sage]

No matter if you think 0 is natural or not

0 is the least natural number!

Hahahahahahaha

[bright hill]

sully

[bright hill]

coz if you want to number all the natural numbers

saying 0 is the first would mean 1 is the second

which is just weird

I think 0th is correct

[storm sage]

do the natural numbers start at 17 or 18

[mint canopy]

This is the question we need to be asking

[bright hill]

well, nothing wrong with googling "applications of X"

[mint canopy]

I think they start at 18, because 18 is even

[bright hill]

but you can also ask in #math-discussion lmao

[mint canopy]

Also people under 18 are not adults, and I don't want to be doing math with kiddie numbers like "two" or "five"

real goo goo ga ga behaviour, you know?

[storm sage]

True!

[alpine kindle]

they start at -1

which is clearly equal to 18

[dull coyote]

Is an empty set convex? I know the definition required two points within the set, and that a set with a single point is convex but have no idea how it would

[mint canopy]

Yes, it is convex by the typical definition

[neat lintel]

Hey sup

[mint canopy]

This is what's known as "vacuous truth"

If there are no elements of the set, then any fact is true about the elements of the set.

As for the set with a single point, the only pair of points you can have is both points being that single point, and the line between these "points" goes nowhere new, hence it is convex.

[fair mural]

i knew this was gonna be the case and i don’t even know what convex means lol

empty set moment

[bright hill]

empty set too op man

[eager reef]

the number of times the empty set has cost me points

[mint canopy]

Every element of the empty set is a nontrivial solution to the zeta function 🧠

Pls help find one so I can get monies thank you

[eager reef]

just look at this channel occasionally

we get people who've solved the riemann hypothesis every 2 weeks or so

[mint canopy]

We do get some funny buggers

[surreal sapphire]

just use Li's criterion to compute a counterexample

[lavish kayak]

I remember a professor saying "the hardest part about solving the reimann hypothesis is getting someone to read your proof"

[bright hill]

that's why I'll be posting the proof in #chill when I finally solve the RH

coz

you know

to give credibility and stuff

[vivid halo]

I mean if someone solves RH they probably won't call the paper SOLUTION TO RH

[zealous garden]

turn it into a tangential problem, solve that and name the paper after it, then at the end offhandedly mention that the solution to RH is a corollary

[bright hill]

proof of this corollary is left as an exercises for the reader

[dense belfry]

proves 0=1
At end offhandedly mentions RH is a corollary

[next dew]

Say you have a dataset of n points.
Is there any value in over fitting with a polynomial as a means to estimate the function?

By that, I mean, take the derivative of the points n-1 times, so you are left with a single value, and then integrate to get a polynomial with n terms.

Hmm, could use a test dataset and use the last n values until n values provide a higher fit of the dataset while performing worse on the test dataset

[storm sage]

Over-fitting will usually interpolate/extrapolate badly

Usually you want the "simplest" model for the data

[next dew]

Makes sense

For other functions, like an exponential. You would have to use the last two points to form an equation and integrate from there, right?

I've never tried to fit data without Excel, but I would like to program a regression algorithm now. Something much more extensive than excel. I think I have the idea down.
Seems like you just take a set of equations and integrate n-1 values to get the model error to a point before it causes more error in the test set

Makes more sense to start with less values and go up though

[river moon]

there's no point in fitting the data exactly if you have more than 7 data points - that'll just produce an interpolating polynomial of degree 6 or higher and that'll oscillate like crazy

approximating polynomials that aren't required to pass through all points are better behaved for larger data sets since you can fit like a 4th degree polynomial to a couple hundred points

and there's also splines which construct a different 2nd or 3rd degree polynomial for each 3 or 4 points

[next dew]

Yes, I understand that now

Splines? Those good for estivation?

[river moon]

well they're better than bold interpolation for large data sets

whether they're applicable for what you describe as "estimation" - well who knows, that needs to be more clearly defined

[next dew]

For like prediction of the weather

[river moon]

then any kind of interpolation is completely useless to you including splines, trying to extrapolate a function which interpolates your data will lead to significant errors

[storm sage]

Btw there are ways to formalize this using either information theory or Bayesian inference

[next dew]

What makes you so sure?