book-recommendations

[marble solar]

Will draw them into the literature themselves

[static crest]

also the exercises in that book are especially lackluster

[quick hornet]

actually the proof of stokes' theorem of differential forms is hellish right?

like for such a clean statement

[marble solar]

It's not hellish

[quick hornet]

arent there like 3 cases to consider each spanning 2 pages or something

[marble solar]

It takes a bit of work

[hollow peak]

there are some wonky things with corners I believe

[marble solar]

You have to use partitions of unity and some absolute summability results that are a pain

Also corners are bad

[quick hornet]

depending on the support of \omega

yeah

[static crest]

I'd assume that the prof's lectures are probably going to be important if you're using that textbook @fossil island, and maybe the prof also gives external psets

or such

if you plan on self studying a lot, I don't think it's the greatest

seems fine as a supplementary text

[fossil island]

ill just read lang

[static crest]

also some of the notation is different from d&f, for example

so if you do use external resources

make sure to use the class's notation

[fossil island]

thanks for the info

[gray gazelle]

all manifolds are compact

OR

all forms are compactly supported

manifolds with corners 🤮

ouch, cut myself on my manifold

[static crest]

lmfao

[valid moth]

edgy manifold

[marble solar]

it's ok corners are sets of measure zero

So integrals just work

something something, so do derivatives

[ripe granite]

funnily enough something similar was also one of the main motivations for birational geometry

people wanted to compute integrals over stuff

replacing the thing with something birational to it doesnt change the integral

as the map is an iso outside some measure zero set

[valid moth]

nice

[marble solar]

birational geometry looks scary

[drifting elm]

practice

[hearty steppe]

What does birational mean

[sudden kindle]

Rational but bi

It's like how bijections are jections but bi

[gray gazelle]

[ripe granite]

a rational map is roughly a map that is defined on some dense open subset of the domain

the usual example is stereographic projection of the circle onto the line

the map is defined everywhere on the circle outside one point

a birational map is a map with a rational inverse map

so the two spaces are "almost" isomorphic

again the circle and the real line is an example

with the map being the usual map you see when one-point compactifying the line

[frail horizon]

Any book suggestions to learn all the way from basic ODEs, to advanced PDEs?

[gray gazelle]

not that i have read it, but when i was comparing books i recall hale's ODE as an ODE book for people who have a background in undergraduate analysis

although, i don't know whether you are looking for differential equations books for math majors or for engineering majors

[crystal kraken]

Here

[gray gazelle]

[crystal kraken]

[gray gazelle]

[crystal kraken]

What did you mean by that?

[gray gazelle]

what do you think

[drifting elm]

maybe he was talking about smooth branes?

[gray gazelle]

i was talking about you

[sudden kindle]

[drifting elm]

I am not a book

[crystal kraken]

i don't really care

[drifting elm]

https://www.amazon.com/Dirichlet-Branes-Symmetry-Mathematics-Monographs/dp/0821838482

[gray gazelle]

as for an actual explanation of what i meant of that

at some point people kept misspelling my discord name

and out of slight annoyance i deployed the term "smoothbrain"

'tis all

[prisma snow]

That's not v nice tera

[gray gazelle]

so?

[prisma snow]

It's not nice to not be nice

[warped cedar]

It's nice to not be not nice

[gray gazelle]

it's not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not nice to be not not nice

[crystal kraken]

I am a person with low self esteem and those kind of things make me feel reluctant to talk here. People can be really mean sometimes. But i don't care now

[prisma snow]

Awww

Fuck you

[warped cedar]

Styx we love you it's ok (ugly)

[crystal kraken]

You won't have to see me for a week now

[prisma snow]

Mission accomplished

[static crest]

another huge w

[shrewd rampart]

I've been working on the first chapter of Spivak calculus for a while now, enjoying it but find myself needing to look at the solutions too often. Feeling a bit dumb. Is there an easier book I can try that might allow me to build up to it?

[marble solar]

So here's a few things

[sage python]

What's your priority here?

[marble solar]

Spivak's exercises are known for being difficult

You don't have to do every single one of them

[sage python]

Like, most of the eventual material of Spivak is calculus, right? And there are easier ways to learn calculus, at the expense of learning how to do proofs

[marble solar]

Just try a good healthy amount, maybe find an online outline with assigned readings and problems and just do those

It's fine to look at solutions if you don't have access to people that can help if you've thought about it for a while

After considering all that, if you still feel that you're not getting what you'd like out of Spivak's Calculus you can try other variants

like Apostol's calculus

Or you can go a notch down to Thomas' Calculus

[sage python]

So they won't help much with chapter 1. If you just wanna learn calculus and proofs aren't a priority then pick up whatever

[marble solar]

or stewart's etc. I agree with dami here

[sage python]

If you wanna learn proofs then the answer is to just power through

I might say that since you're on discord, asking for help here might be a better alternative to looking up solutions

Since people here who know the stuff can kinda hint you through things

So perhaps you might get a hint and boom the rest of the idea reveals itself and you come up with it, maybe a given problem is just too hard and you need a full walkthrough

[shrewd rampart]

I do want to learn proofs and am really enjoying the tools I'm learning, but it feels strange that I can only answer the most basic questions I feel

[marble solar]

That's ok

Spivak's Calculus is meant to be a book you keep coming back to

As you learn more

[sage python]

That's to be expected honestly

[marble solar]

You "level up"

[sage python]

I honestly Googled things a lot in undergrad

[marble solar]

I had an absolute refusal to do any such thing in undergrad, and all it did was hinder my learning

[sage python]

As long as you make sure to understand the solution and learn stuff from them (e.g. in hindsight this was a good idea to try because XYZ) you'll learn still

[marble solar]

In grad school, I look shit up all the time

[sage python]

So yeah don't feel too guilty for needing help, it's par for the course. And again maybe asking here is better than looking up solutions online since if you read the whole thing you read it, here you might hit a key point and recreate the rest yourself

So I don't think you need to abandon Spivak yet

[shrewd rampart]

That's reassuring, thanks folks. I'll keep at it and come here for questions more often 👍

[sage python]

Good luck fam

[static crest]

mse is a very good resource indeed, as long as you're not just copying solutions down, it's fine to use it

if I do have to search up something on google, then I try to personally justify every step of a solution I find

[marble solar]

Another thing that I do is look for the key step that I'm stuck at. Write down what that is and try to recreate it

[static crest]

ya, I often don't search up the problem itself, but a side result instead

which I could maybe use to solve a question

[timber mesa]

tbh attempting the exercises earnestly and then looking up the solutions is neither wrong nor a sign of you being dumb lol, how else are you gonna check your understanding

[mossy flume]

I googled shit for my HWs

If it was a couple hours of attempting a problem and I got no further

And if office hours were too far away

[rustic bison]

Hi all.

[marble solar]

#❓how-to-get-help

[rustic bison]

Im looking for a very intro level book about

1. computability
2. general recursive functions (aka \mu-recursive functions)
3. primitive recursive functions

i have books from springer, but they require some extensive programming background, and i limped through one C++ class. My math backing is in much stronger foundation.

So I was hoping for a recommendation that was way more maths friendly.

I’m a noob

I just want a maths book that will explain compatibility for a maths-centric noob

NICE

Is \mu-recursive related to the peano axiom for induction?

Ouch

Sure! Ill take other option too.

Im just getting my feet wet

Ohh. Tyty

Can I get a view of the ToC?

NICE. TYVM.

Ty all the same

[flint forge]

soares book turing computability is also very good

[gray gazelle]

[rustic bison]

tyvm

[gray gazelle]

Any geometry textbook recommendations?

[ripe granite]

hartshorne

jk depends on what kind of geometry

[gray gazelle]

Euclidean, sorry. I should have been more specific.

[valid moth]

elements

[crimson pagoda]

Still hartshorne

but the Euclidean geometry one

[marble solar]

Lol

[hearty steppe]

That looks like a book for kindergartners

[sturdy wagon]

does anyone know this? ^^^

[valid moth]

math grad student in your life that's lost purpose and direction in life? fret not, here's a great xmas gift:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/1465481737/ref=sspa_dk_detail_4?psc=1&pd_rd_i=1465481737&pd_rd_w=g6CO6&pf_rd_p=7d37a48b-2b1a-4373-8c1a-bdcc5da66be9&pd_rd_wg=8MGTI&pf_rd_r=S6BEXDG3320A871AD55R&pd_rd_r=810abc58-3020-43b6-a6d1-5d01761d3755&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUExMURaMklKWlhTMENWJmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwNzAzOTI4MVRCTE81WVNZR04yRCZlbmNyeXB0ZWRBZElkPUEwMjM5MTgwMzVURVZLOVdBMjkzNyZ3aWRnZXROYW1lPXNwX2RldGFpbCZhY3Rpb249Y2xpY2tSZWRpcmVjdCZkb05vdExvZ0NsaWNrPXRydWU=

[quick hornet]

why was that asked in #book-recommendations

not archsys' thing, the thing before it

[sturdy wagon]

book

[valid moth]

so many things wrong here i'm not sure where to start lol

[quick hornet]

understood thanks

[valid moth]

1. is that a live test
2. that's not a book
3. even if that were a book that's not what this channel is for lmao
4. 

[quick hornet]

5. think about it

[timber mesa]

6. especially

[obsidian valley]

you could put the constitution into a book

[hasty turret]

Please don't

[drifting elm]

https://www.amazon.com/Visual-Group-Theory-Problem-Book/dp/088385757X/

I had a bad experience with this book

there is almost nothing in it

the pictures are mostly graph theory but without actually using graph theory terminology

the author makes up new words to describe things that already exist in abstract algebra

I think even for a noob this book will teach stuff that needs to be unlearned later when abstract algebra gets really abstract

[karmic thorn]

The book is on group theory though.

[drifting elm]

yeah so it should be about caley tables not caley diagrams

that is my preference

I don't think putting so many graphs in the book accomplished anything good

[gray gazelle]

[drifting elm]

there were so many famous examples in the pictures but the paragraphs were skipping so much

the introduction of infinite groups was basically one sentence about peano axioms in the first chapter but left as an excercise. then throughout the book it references chapter 1 for inf groups which is one sentence on inf groups.

it would be better to leave it out and introduce it properly

[gray gazelle]

[sudden granite]

@gray gazelle

[gray gazelle]

here

[sudden granite]

hi its loading

not sure why its taking so long

i have 250+mbps

[gray gazelle]

the book is huge right

[sudden granite]

75%done

[gray gazelle]

you have nitro right

[sudden granite]

no i dont

[gray gazelle]

took me 10 secs to download

[sudden granite]

upload speed is the issue

for me

[gray gazelle]

yea

thousand pages of pre calc wtf

[sudden granite]

yeah

[drifting elm]

someday you will be ready

[sudden granite]

whats the best way to digest math texts

[hasty turret]

Read

[sudden granite]

should i be highlighting, making notes, and doing every problem in the book

i dont really know

[sage python]

That doesn't sound healthy

[sudden granite]

it is

i said "read" instead of "digest:

[sage python]

I prefer to eat food tbh

Maybe springer's not too bad

[ripe granite]

smells good fo sho

[sudden granite]

my original msg said read

but moonbears was trying to be funny

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/268882317391429632/785727935050809354/771287728305471528.gif

[marble solar]

me?

[gray gazelle]

-D-

[marble solar]

Don't bully us.

[gray gazelle]

XD

[hasty turret]

After reading a theorem (and its proof), Prove it on your own. Try to deduce why the necessary details are necessary.

[sudden granite]

ok

[hasty turret]

Do the problems,go back and think again

[sudden granite]

thanks

[drifting elm]

why do you need proofs for precalc tho

[sudden granite]

you need proofs for everything

[drifting elm]

🤡

[gray gazelle]

you need proofs to cook food to stay alive

[marble solar]

heat equation has a maximum principle - the burnt brownies are always the corner ones

[gray gazelle]

For a moment I thought of the electro analogy lol

Electric field is inversely proportional to surface area thing

[drifting elm]

except religion

[timber mesa]

you need proofs for grant money

[sudden granite]

can i get grant money for proving the associative property

[drifting elm]

associative property of what

you need a group

[sudden granite]

huh

[gray gazelle]

huh

so beautiful

[obsidian valley]

huh

YOURE a group

[sudden granite]

ur mom is a group

[gray gazelle]

just wait until 0000 learns about semigroups

[daring reef]

does anyone have a nice pdf of baby rudin, preferrably with chapters

[gray gazelle]

[static crest]

ah yes, unital magma

trivial

[static crest]

someone should make one of these, but it's a graph for everything from a magma up to a field

[gray gazelle]

🤢

[quick hornet]

i have never heard of a fucking loop

wtf

[static crest]

doubt most of those are used much

a group that isn't associative

[quick hornet]

oh yeah only like 3 of them are actually used

[static crest]

like how often would that even show up

[quick hornet]

group monoid and very rarely magma

saying "x forms a monoid" is often a very convenient observation

or at least a succinct way to state facts

since invertibility is in a certain sense the "hardest" part of the group axioms to satisfy

in that it "forces" groups to take on their symmetrical structure

whereas associative operations with idetnity pop up all the times - most notably as functions/morphisms

[static crest]

is there like a notion of a commutative or abelian monoid

or does that not show up much either

[quick hornet]

sure, take N

under + or *

[static crest]

oh true

[sage python]

I've never seen magmas irl tbh

Group and monoid yeah. I guess also semigroup in that a dynamical system can be thought of as a semigroup action on a space but

I think if you just add a formal identity to a semigroup you get a monoid anyway so lol

[ripe granite]

unital magmas turn up in topology

"H-spaces"

[molten wave]

you know what's a power move

this diagram is a commutative diagram in the category of adjunctions on Cat

[gray gazelle]

[valid moth]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/771287728305471528.gif?v=1

[cinder trail]

can someone suggest a good book on dynamical systems?

[timber mesa]

Robinson's "Dynamical Systems: Stability, Symbolic Dynamics, and Chaos", Katok-Hasselblatt's "A first course in dynamics" or for a more elementary background Devaney's "An Introduction to Chaotic Dynamical Systems".

neither of these cover ergodic theory iirc, in that case you can read Brin-Stuck

[rustic bison]

what does "nice" mean in this context?

i have a pdf of rudin....i wouldn't personally call it "nice". but it's defo functional.

it does the job.

[red stream]

any good economics books?

[obsidian valley]

Possibly.

Not necessarily, though.

[daring reef]

I have a PDF as well, but it's basically just a bare-bones scan of the book

I guess "nice" as in the PDF has bookmarked chapters or something

although I guess I can do that myself

[timber mesa]

you can make these yourself though it's a bit of a pain

(in terms of time investment, not that it's hard)

huh I wasn't aware of that being a British thing, but yes I usually do use it in that sense

[inner vapor]

Any recommendations for books on stochastic processes? Preferably something that isn't too time demanding for self study (I'm not looking for hardcore proofs to everything) - something introductory on senior undergrad/first year grad. I haven't studied measure theory but I'm well versed in probability and intro stats.

I briefly took a look at "An Introduction to Stochastic Modelling" by Karlin and Taylor, but I was also recommended "A First Course in Stochastic Processes" by Karlin and Taylor. Can anyone vouch for these or have their own personal pref to another book?

thanks 🙂

[marble solar]

Evans has a book

Seems interesting

I am partial to Evans, since his books seem to be quite good in general

[blissful pike]

@cinder trail you may enjoy this: http://www.math.hawaii.edu/~grw/Classes/2009-2010/2009Fall/Math442_1/439notes.pdf

[cinder trail]

Peace, big thanks yall @timber mesa & @gray gazelle

[cinder trail]

My brother, much appreciated

[blissful pike]

Oh thx to sweeten the pot check out this: https://maths-magic.ac.uk/courses

[gray gazelle]

i speed-read a few chapters of intro to stochastic modeling by karlin and taylor when i was self-studying stochastic processes, i guess i will say it seemed like a fine alright book

[gray gazelle]

I'm about to finish College Algebra by Blitzer, and is Graphical Approach to Algebra and Trigonometty by Lial, Hornsby, and Rockswald any good for trig, or should I get something else?

[prisma snow]

Stop

[undone ermine]

Any good book that focuses on stats? Mainly about Discrete Random Variables/Continuous/Cumulative?

[wooden sparrow]

Calculus by Apostol has integration before differentiation. Is that going to be a problem?

[drifting elm]

at what level of experience?

how mathy do you want it?

cumulative is the integral of the normal distribution with respect to time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumulative_distribution_function

[young mulch]

Can someone recommend an introductory book for algebraic topology that provides solutions to the exercises?

[limber hollow]

I heard algebraic topology by Allen Hatcher is supposed to be good

but I've never read it

[young mulch]

Hmm I would like something with solutions so I can check my work

[hybrid kestrel]

HELLO everone !!! can someone pls send me AOPS introduction geometry book

[drifting elm]

nope

[hybrid kestrel]

pls i need it urgently as being from a country where a dollar is rated very high its around 4.5k in my country's currency pls help me i need it very much

[stray veldt]

is it not on libgen

[drifting elm]

it is expensive in america also

[hasty turret]

Just get evan chen or smt

[drifting elm]

do you have chegg in your country?

you can rent a book for $13 a month

[silver herald]

Why buy something expensive when the internet exists smh

[charred carbon]

Can someone please tell whether AOPS Calculus book is good for learning the subject first time? By the way, I have done the Precalculus book with some (😅 ) difficulty

[drifting elm]

larson precalclus

after that you can use anything

but make sure you know all of algebra and trigonometry before you go into calc 1

[gray gazelle]

yeah, make sure you know your galois theory well before you do calc 1

[hybrid kestrel]

so u tell whether these books u can provide from a web on the so called internet

[gray gazelle]

look up "libgen."

[hybrid kestrel]

whats smt btw?

[gray gazelle]

shin megami tensei

:^)

Something

[gray gazelle]

something

[hybrid kestrel]

ig i checked but i did not find anything

[gray gazelle]

[karmic thorn]

If you can't find AoPS, switch to different books. They're not the only books for HS comp.math.

[hybrid kestrel]

btw iss there any relevant source to practice for amc 8 pls justify the relevant sources

[karmic thorn]

As suggested, books by Evan Chen are neat.

[karmic thorn]

AoPS website.

[gray gazelle]

Aops community > aops books

aops community will belittle you to suicide over a minor typo though

aops books are for like first timers

[hybrid kestrel]

i know it bro but the thing is their cirriculum is really fantastic

[karmic thorn]

It has a repository of all previous AMC questions, with multiple solutions.

[karmic thorn]

Did you do a typo on their website, Terra?

[gray gazelle]

no

i've just heard bad stories

and, in my classic style, i am exaggerating

[hybrid kestrel]

i need something which covers basic that is from amc 8 level to amc 10 and ig egmo iss really tougher that that and includes theory also

[karmic thorn]

Never engaged with the community, I just used it briefly for the problems.

[gray gazelle]

about to join the symplectic geometry lecture

i feel like a child

among adults

grad course

[karmic thorn]

Symplectic geometry is a grad class, I suppose?

I see.

[gray gazelle]

well, the lecture actually started 20 minutes ago, i got caught up with some nonsense

[gray gazelle]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/268882317391429632/785727935050809354/771287728305471528.gif

[hybrid kestrel]

anyone?

[gray gazelle]

what is amc 10 level like

[hybrid kestrel]

ig indian prmo exam level

[gray gazelle]

i didnt use any book specifically for prmo

[hasty turret]

https://artofproblemsolving.com/wiki/index.php/2021_AMC_10A_Problems/Problem_2

[gray gazelle]

somehow, i missed nothing by joining late

[karmic thorn]

Nice.

[hybrid kestrel]

means u r already pro at it

[gray gazelle]

no

not really

[hybrid kestrel]

being in 8th its really difficult for me

though

[hasty turret]

amc 10 is pretty easy

It's like "x+1=2, find x"

[gray gazelle]

lol

[karmic thorn]

@hybrid kestrel Challenge and Thrill of Pre College Mathematics is a good book you can get for a much more reasonable price, and might be good at what you're aiming for.

[gray gazelle]

i saw 2020's problems

[hybrid kestrel]

hmm

[gray gazelle]

its literally this

[gray gazelle]

.

[hybrid kestrel]

but i feel i dont have that proof wrting skills the books expects!!

[hybrid kestrel]

bro which country?

[gray gazelle]

India

[karmic thorn]

The book assumes almost no familiarity with writing proofs.

[hasty turret]

Ok, Why is that relevant?

[gray gazelle]

have you checked Paul Zeitz book

[karmic thorn]

Good one NPnell!

Zeitz is an excellent book.

[hybrid kestrel]

bcz indians have literally sh*t in their cirriculum

ok so just one advice

[karmic thorn]

No one is suggesting you books for Indian curriculum.

[gray gazelle]

You can also use Titu Andreescu's problem books along with it

hey lmao my TA for riemannian geometry last semester is in this class

[hybrid kestrel]

i am too much aligned to it

[karmic thorn]

LMAO

[gray gazelle]

which imo is better than AOPS books

[hybrid kestrel]

ta?

[gray gazelle]

teaching assistant

[karmic thorn]

Teaching Assistant.

[gray gazelle]

the guy who graded my homework

[hybrid kestrel]

ohh

[gray gazelle]

why is it funny tho

[karmic thorn]

Well

[gray gazelle]

i honestly didnt understand

[karmic thorn]

Someone who's grading you in a sem would usually not be sitting in the same class as you the next sem

[gray gazelle]

not when you're an undergraduate

uh oh wait i misread TTera's text

lmao

[hybrid kestrel]

so can anyone tell me being an indian from what levels do i have to start problem solving because i find it bit difficult to do ijso stage-1 math problems or the nsejs level math problems all i dont know may be lack in some concepts aur due to lack of practice so any recommendations?

[gray gazelle]

good luck TTera, time to flex

go with zeitz or challenges nd thrills

[karmic thorn]

Just start with something like Challenge and Thrill of Pre-College Mathematics. Do loads of problems, and change your perspective of looking at problems as something which have a set recipe for being solved everytime. You need to get used to dealing with more open ended problems than the ones you encounter in school curriculum.

[hybrid kestrel]

hmm fine

[gray gazelle]

this is not suitable for him

[hybrid kestrel]

but ig i am oriented and better at grades of problem solving like first achieving to solve all nsejs level problems so is there any exam in country similar to that level of math

[hasty turret]

Titu's lemma guy?

[karmic thorn]

Don't study according to levels.

[hybrid kestrel]

also i damn get demotivated on not able to solve problems so upgrading each time myself by level

that's it

[karmic thorn]

Get used to not getting all answers immediately.

It takes time and patience to learn maths beyond a certain point.

Proof writing especially can be a frustrating endeavour in the beginning(I'm still in that phase).

[hybrid kestrel]

then i might be a noob

[karmic thorn]

You gotta keep revisiting the things you don't understand completely.

[gray gazelle]

youre in 8th..chill out a bit

[karmic thorn]

No. Everyone studying maths faces the same trouble of not getting everything in one go.

[gray gazelle]

You cannot just jump straight into solving Olympiad papers without building problem solving skills first

[charred carbon]

No, only the mortals do

[hybrid kestrel]

thing is next would be my last year for math olympiad so planning something rock solid to atleast get me upto imotc

[hybrid kestrel]

that's what i mean

[gray gazelle]

you just said you are in 8th ?

[hasty turret]

Are you Indian or murican?

[gray gazelle]

even in murica, 9th is not the limit ?

[hybrid kestrel]

because by the time i am in 10th i would be more focused towards boards than towards olympiads not by choice but by my ...

[gray gazelle]

smh

[karmic thorn]

Smh

[hybrid kestrel]

board>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> math olympiad = thinking of people in india

[gray gazelle]

i mean, it wont take much effort to get decent grades in 10th

most of it is cramming

[hasty turret]

Just study one week before the exam

[karmic thorn]

No one gives a shit about your grade 10 marksheet. It's a proof of birth at best.

[gray gazelle]

i misread your username as ultrashukla

[charred carbon]

And just to be clear, by exams, he means Pre Boards

[gray gazelle]

why are you..

[gray gazelle]

is that serious

2 weeks

best

cuz theres history too

[karmic thorn]

@hybrid kestrel Just start with one book, and see where you go.

Don't plan too far ahead in future yet.

[hasty turret]

What?

[gray gazelle]

[charred carbon]

@karmic thorn True, just read the Bible if you getting bored of maths

[karmic thorn]

Olympiads require significantly more effort and patience than standard school exams.

[quick hornet]

And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about.
Book of 1 Kings, 7:23

[charred carbon]

What do you all feel is harder? JEE Advanced Math or PRMO? Please don't say they have different syllabus

[hasty turret]

JEE Advanced is BS lengthy

[gray gazelle]

Also they need not be compared

[hasty turret]

PRMO is completely random, containing a few rmo questions

Both are BS,at the end of the day

[gray gazelle]

true

[hybrid kestrel]

people from other countries dont know how painful it is and this is system is most prevalent and successfully implemented in bihar ,india

[gray gazelle]

Only the brotherhood shall remain meaningful

[charred carbon]

Has anyone of you ever heard of Aryabhatta math competition?

[hybrid kestrel]

yeah

a silly one

[gray gazelle]

Yea bs comp for small kids

[hybrid kestrel]

server crashes frequently

[charred carbon]

Oh, I think your one is different.

[karmic thorn]

Screw comp math. Be based and start learning real math.

[hybrid kestrel]

so is it really ok to start with c and t bcz i have done geo till only class 10th level ?

[karmic thorn]

Yep.

[hybrid kestrel]

and algebra?

[charred carbon]

True, my uncle also tells me to focus on mainly bills and accounts as it will help me later

[hybrid kestrel]

pearson iit foundation
?

[gray gazelle]

no

It's bs

Prolly c and t only

[hybrid kestrel]

algebra also???

[gray gazelle]

Yes?

[hybrid kestrel]

u dont prefer hall and knight?

[charred carbon]

Gelfand is brilliant, try that

[gray gazelle]

Start from the beginning

Smh

[karmic thorn]

By real math, I meant pure math at the undergrad level and beyond. Not arithmetic.

[hasty turret]

What's c and t?

[gray gazelle]

challenges and thrill

[hasty turret]

[gray gazelle]

lol

[hasty turret]

I have that book,but I never used it

[karmic thorn]

Yes, I've heard good things about Gelfand.

[gray gazelle]

I've read a few parts of it tbh

[karmic thorn]

Lang is neat too.

[hybrid kestrel]

😆

[charred carbon]

Guess my humor is getting rusty

[karmic thorn]

Same, ||like the countless other books I have.||

[hybrid kestrel]

can u send the pdf pls

[gray gazelle]

it's a good text for intro

[charred carbon]

It is available on google

[gray gazelle]

I seem to have an obsession with collecting books

[charred carbon]

And ofc you call always search at the holy place Libgen

[karmic thorn]

Same.

Gotta catch 'em all.

[charred carbon]

True, I even have a book on Algebraic geometry even though I don't know what it means

[gray gazelle]

it's just funky geometry

[hasty turret]

/algebra

The physics server's kek just feels too strong

[charred carbon]

What does kekw mean? Sorry, I am new here

[hybrid kestrel]

link pls

[karmic thorn]

[gray gazelle]

#old-network

[inner vapor]

Thanks! I ended up deciding on that one and it seems like a good fit.

[red stream]

Any beef with these boys

[fossil island]

its c++

already a joke

[red stream]

just an algorithm analysis book

they gotta choose some language to put the code in

[gray gazelle]

Can you elaborate.

[fossil island]

python forever

[gray gazelle]

Python has its limitations.

[hollow current]

just do pure C

[fossil island]

oh of course. i just like to be naively for python and ignore all of its flaws

[static crest]

not really, but you can study algorithms agnostic from any programming language

[red stream]

python for an undergraduate textbook would be a bit confusing in several ways

either they would have to teach the undergrads how to write pythonic code or they would have to write the code in an unpythonic manner, teaching the students python in the wrong way

@static crest yea you could, i wish they would to be fair, but the class is project based so has to have some sort of established language or software

they more than likely use C++ because theres a ton of demonstrations they can use with library

since the class is mostly about analyzing algorithms not necessarily building them from the ground up

[solid laurel]

What I cannot create I do not understand

[red stream]

you can quote feynman all you want however the majority of software engineers cannot create the algorithms they use on a daily basis efficiently from the ground up yet understand them and use them properly all the same lol

not to mention, this is a junior level class we have a class on algorithm design as well

so why would they teach it again

[solid laurel]

yet understand them and use them properly all the same lol
As a software engineer, I doubt it, a lot

[red stream]

as a software engieer, i dont, at all :3

being a software engineer doesnt give you some inherent authority here lol

[solid laurel]

I did not pretend that

[hollow current]

do all software engineers understand electric circuits at a good level?

[red stream]

yea dude to be a software engineer you must undertand how to chemically manufacture transistors from the ground up

or you do not understand digital logic

[silver herald]

https://tenor.com/view/doubt-intensifies-gif-14242619

[solid laurel]

Digital logic is more about maths

Transistors are the material support to use it

[red stream]

that uses the abstract concept of a transistor as a gate to understand

we dont know how to build this transistor, or at least the majority of us dont

[hollow current]

who said that if you are real software company you should create also your hardware?

[red stream]

yet we can understand it and use it just fine

[gray gazelle]

no

[solid laurel]

Because I do not use transistors myself (well, I do, but not for software engineering)

[red stream]

yea you do

if you write software you use transistors

[silver herald]

You really don't need to understand Digital Design with transistors if you wanted to work purely as a software engineer.

But it depends on the niche as well. Embedded Systems Devs. use transistor logic on a day to day basis

[red stream]

you use the logic they allow you to create

[solid laurel]

But when applying an algorithm or using a data structure, being able to understand it, know how it is made, at least in rough lines, is pretty important to not fuck up

[red stream]

which is part of analysis

but you dont have to be able to design it from the ground up

[solid laurel]

I did not assert this

[hollow current]

my point was that it is not always important to know algorithm up to each single line

understand

[red stream]

id bet heavily in you not understanding every library and algorithm you use on a daily basis, if you're a software engineer

[hollow current]

but not like "oh i know radix sort fro A to Z"

[silver herald]

You are correct.

[red stream]

abstraction is your friend

[silver herald]

Getting the overall idea is just good enough

[red stream]

if a junior engineer spent 3 days trying to understand some trivial search algorithm we use rather than work on the product

we'd have a talk about efficiency

[hollow current]

i mean even the whole point of methods is to create function into which you just put input and get output and once it is implemented you do not care about what is inside

[silver herald]

Err.....

Most of the job is technically just search an algorithm from the web and just implement it. A junior engineer is not going to create a new algorithm out of thin air

[solid laurel]

once it is implemented you do not care about what is inside
@hollow current well, until you do, by the law of leaky abstractions

[red stream]

yea your point is in my favor @silver herald

you dont need to understand how to create something to use it efficiently and properly

especially now a days, when things are optimized to the best level possible

[solid laurel]

A junior engineer is not going to create a new algorithm out of thin air
@silver herald almost nobody does, but understanding how it is made is pretty important to being able to pick the right data structures to solve the right problems, at least in non-trivial software

[red stream]

a simple sorting algorithm becomes a lot less simple

anyways my point is that a textbook that teaches analysis of algorithm and purposely leaves out design is fine

[prisma snow]

Lies. You can't do arithmetic until you have done constructions for the natural numbers through to the real numbers.

[silver herald]

TBH, I think we should swtich channels to #chill or #discussion now

[red stream]

of course everyone interested in the field should take a design course

[silk quartz]

The real world issue here is choosing the right level of abstraction.

[solid laurel]

Best level optimization always require you to dive deep into the mud, as every use case will, at some scale, require specific optimization, specific data structures, specific algorithms, parametrization, etc.

[silk quartz]

I probably don't need to know the details about how fftw works to use it to perform fourier transforms.

[solid laurel]

Fortunately you do not always need best level optimization, but as a software engineer, your job is being able to dive into it when required

[silk quartz]

Eh. Maybe. I doubt most software engineers can dive very deeply into convex optimization. I know I can't.

Not without a lot of time and study, at least.

[solid laurel]

That's right, most SWE I know can't as well

[silver herald]

I want to see Software Engineers trying to stumble across LQR Control and Simulated Annealing Optimisers lol

[solid laurel]

Not without a lot of time and study, at least.
A lot of time and study... like in university ? 😏

[silk quartz]

I mean, I ran across a "Simplicial Homology Global Optimizer" method in scipy for work a few months ago.

No idea what that was about.

[solid laurel]

It optimizes globaly

[silk quartz]

And honestly, even the -much- simpler Trust Region methods were just barely comprehensible at a high level.

[silver herald]

More motivation for me to tackle parts of pure math

[silk quartz]

Simulated annealing seems pretty straightforward, conceptually.

Anyway, the point is that there's a lot of depth to ... honestly, just about everything.

I mean, we've been doing workarounds for a floating point operation bug in Windows that shows up for certain numpy operations lately.

I'm not tracing that back to source.

[silver herald]

Floating Point is hell

[gray gazelle]

Hah, I guess the downside to working at Microsoft is using windows

[marble solar]

I think the real downside is C#

[silk quartz]

I don't really see it as a downside, and not all of my colleagues use Windows.

[marble solar]

Microsoft has a good reputation of treating employees well unlike another Seattle Area company

||Flashes back to spouse up to 4 am every night scrambling||

[silk quartz]

What -is- cool about working at MS, is that every now and then, you can nudge one of the other teams.

[gray gazelle]

Nudge?

[silk quartz]

Like, we'll run into something that a MS tool doesn't implement, and the question, "Do we know anyone who works over in X?" comes up.

[gray gazelle]

Oh lol

[silk quartz]

And it's a serious question.

[marble solar]

Seems to be a big issue at big tech

My spouse's entire job is just running around Amazon helping other teams fix their issues

Everyone on her team does this. So everyone on her team is working different projects with different teams

[silk quartz]

Firefighter. That seems like it could be fun for a short while.

But also exhausting.

[marble solar]

Every two weeks or so she's switching to a new task with new tools with fast deadlines

She's about to hit her 6 month review

[silk quartz]

There's definitely an energy to that kind of work.

And with my ADHD, I've often wondered if that's the sort of thing I would be good at.

[gray gazelle]

Yeah, I have to say I don't like always switching tools and this sort of nonsense

[marble solar]

She seems to be thriving in the environment for now, most of her team have 3+ years of experience except for her and another newbie

Looks like amazon is a sink or swim company

[silk quartz]

Glad to hear it. Wish her the best.

[marble solar]

Eventually when we want to start a family we'll move to a chiller pace of life lol

[storm sleet]

C# really isn't the worst

its far better than java

And nowhere near as good as C++

Comparison to haskell is a waste of time, because haskell is on another astral plane

[marble solar]

The issue is who is using C#

[storm sleet]

Microsoft is a problematic company sure

C# being cross platform in .NET 5 is a good thing i think

fully cross platform i mean

[marble solar]

I'll pretend I know how to program and agree

[static crest]

half the coding wage slaves in existence

(the other half use java of course)

[hearty steppe]

The only thing C# has going for it is how easily coupled it is to .NET. If your working in .NET, programming feels very lazy. All the scaffolding you need is available for you within reason. You’ll have to pay for certain services and if you want to conveniently utilize .NET fully, you’ll have to pay at some point to have access to content that demonstrates the complexities in the most commoditized way I’ve ever witnessed ever in software engineering. Like it’s so water downed commoditized like recent EA game titles. You have to pay to know the ins and outs well enough to do anything decent in .NET and C# is useless outside of it (although useful in Unity but who the fuck learns C# just to code in Unity?)

[storm sleet]

Personally, I've enjoyed some of the metaprogramming you can do in .NET 8 and soon 9

They're starting to embrace more functional aspects and good pattern matching

If they add good sum types to the language, all bets are off

Only real thing I dislike about C# is having a runtime

[hearty steppe]

I mean the .NET framework works well but it enables lazy coding habits and on top of that, you have to pay to utilize the parts of the framework that matter for your needs.

Sure AWS has services you have to pay for to utilize to degrees .NET and Azure does, but like... with AWS things feel a lot more modular. Surprisingly also in Azure they are more modular, which begs the question to why .NET is so weirdly coupled together with ridiculous dependencies on each aspect of it at times.

[storm sleet]

Personally I'm a Rust/C++/Haskell guy, so in only one of those is laziness something I focus on

Most of the time I program, I focus on writing code thats fun and interesting to look at, rather than the fastest, which is in most cases bad

but I do enjoy fast, optimized code

[plucky rose]

(although useful in Unity but who the fuck learns C# just to code in Unity?)
cough

[sudden granite]

Please don't judge me and @limber hollow, we just want to develop a game.

[limber hollow]

Can we get a noot noot for Ruby on Rails?

[sudden granite]

This is not the appropriate place to post memes and information on Computer Science.

[limber hollow]

I totally agree. The discussion seemed to drift in this direction, and I'd like to transfer over to #discussion .

[gray gazelle]

[smoky surge]

[sudden granite]

Do not sully us.

[static crest]

[hasty turret]

[crystal kraken]

[gray gazelle]

[worldly basalt]

[gray gazelle]

[sudden granite]

This is spam.

[gray gazelle]

we get it, you want honorable

[sudden granite]

Use the appropriate channel #discussion.

This is a development.

[timber mesa]

that's some very interesting books indeed

[sudden granite]

#chill is my favorite book.

[timber mesa]

cool mine's #❓how-to-get-help

[broken meadow]

J J J

[karmic thorn]

Sully algebra. 😌

[sudden granite]

Sully analysis is my favorite course.

[inner sentinel]

How bad or good is snider fundamentals of complex analysis?

[valid moth]

narasimhan

[inner sentinel]

Agree

No idea what that means but agree

[gray gazelle]

it's the author of a book

[inner sentinel]

Oh ok

I’m a fool then

[turbid cypress]

What's an Anti recommendation?

[gray gazelle]

"this book sucks"

e.g. d&f

[turbid cypress]

Hm I was thinking of doing d and f.

Looks like a lot of hate.

What would be an alternative?

[gray gazelle]

it's actually a decent book

just, gets shit on for being extremely verbose

[sage python]

It's good it's just written for a 5 year old

[turbid cypress]

Is it good for self study?

As in can I get far enough?

[gray gazelle]

proofs so easy a sperm cell could grasp them

[turbid cypress]

On my own.

[sage python]

Which makes it very boring/long but fairly smooth

[turbid cypress]

What about artin?

Not sure which book I should go on with.

[marble solar]

Just don't learn Algebra

[gray gazelle]

#❓how-to-get-help

[hasty turret]

Algebra is not just sylow

[gray gazelle]

it's so fucking funny to me how the cat pet looks sped up on my phone

#❓how-to-get-help

[sage python]

@turbid cypress Artin is a good entry point

[turbid cypress]

Ah nice, how does it compare to D and F?

[sage python]

confirm

Sorry I was out what's up?

[hasty eagle]

Purge complete.

[sage python]

Karthik: So D&F is pretty easy too but I think Artin's good at telling you why algebra is cool

[turbid cypress]

Lol nice, I need that motivation to study on my own. I guess I shall stick to Artin.
Thanks!

[ripe granite]

Weibel's homological algebra book has so many errors smh

There was an exercise that asks to show that Ext^1_Z(Z[1/p], Z) is iso to the prufer p group

this implies that there are torsion elements in Hom(Z[1/p], Q/Z)

a friend and I spent wayy too long on the problem to try to figure out wtf was wrong with our argument

Weibel + errata list at hand is good

[dapper root]

Errors make you stronger

they're a feature

[ripe granite]

[hollow current]

errata to something

@fast portal hi may i suggest reading #❓how-to-get-help #rules and #get-advanced-access and then enjoying burying the light

[prisma snow]

Yall, I read #❓how-to-get-help but it didn't answer my question. Who do I talk to to get Yohan banned?

Thanks

[quick hornet]

just venmo me $500 and it'll be done within 3-5 business days

[prisma snow]

Finally, and an extra 500 for honourable?

[quick hornet]

ah you see, those transactions have to take place under-the-table

tax reasons

[prisma snow]

DM me the details. We don't want everyone knowing.

[quick hornet]

send me a letter containing a gift card with $700 cash instead, but label it discreetly

[prisma snow]

Got it.

[quick hornet]

write "happy birthday!" on the front

no one will suspect a thing

[prisma snow]

Keep acting like this and I won't even have to pay

[gray gazelle]

#book-recommendations

[prisma snow]

Good idea to minimod a mod

[silver herald]

Even the Joker was more sane than this - https://youtu.be/G56VgsLfKY4

[sage python]

Isn't the list of errata to Weibel just all of Weibel?

[wide saffron]

Are there any solutions to pugh's real mathematical analysis?
It would be surprising to be "no". Im asking for proof checking, less for "have solutions to check when I get stuck".

[gray gazelle]

i feel like there wouldn't be due to the ludicrous number of problems

a cursory search on google doesn't reveal much, as expected (other than a sketchy link i wouldn't click)

what you should get from this is, the solution manual is your 🧠

[timber mesa]

finding a Pugh solutions manual would be like finding the holy grail

for one it'd solve the like 4 *** problems that not even Pugh knows how to solve

[gray gazelle]

poem

there are no correct answers to the poem question

[karmic thorn]

How does Pugh's book compare to Tao's?

[gray gazelle]

my analysis class is using pugh, i like its exercises

that's all i can say

[karmic thorn]

I see.

[karmic thorn]

[flint forge]

the worst car ever js oarked next to me hoky shit

its like a fucking

modded prius

w the loudest engine ive ever heard

and extra floodlights that are fucking blinding

[karmic thorn]

Uh why #book-recommendations Max? XD

[flint forge]

oh i switched channels w/o noticing

[karmic thorn]

Lmao

[gray gazelle]

[karmic thorn]

What's more intriguing than folding the paper in half is that it is problem #117.

[timber mesa]

I've only skimmed through both but Tao's seems like a standard textbook that goes over the standard topics (some not covered in Pugh's I think), while Pugh feels half like a commentary on analysis and half like a textbook which is pretty good. They probably complement each other well, esp. since Pugh has a ton of interesting exercises

[gray gazelle]

it's a problem about the baker transformation, ted

which is an interesting example in dynamics iirc

[karmic thorn]

Oh, I see.

[timber mesa]

the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baker's_map? yep

[gray gazelle]

the full one

[karmic thorn]

Nice. I'd probably take a look at Pugh once I've covered Analysis I, I guess.

[gray gazelle]

of course derivada would know

[karmic thorn]

Derivada, the Dynamic.

[timber mesa]

I never realized the dynamics Pugh is the same as the textbook Pugh until like last month

[gray gazelle]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pugh's_closing_lemma ?

idk i just looked up pugh dynamics lol

ah, it is him

charles pugh

[timber mesa]

yeah that's probably his most famous result

it was his PhD thesis

[wide saffron]

That's the impression I got as well 😂

I suppose then Ill work through it and ask questions when I get stuck for too long

[gray gazelle]

make sure to do the poem problem

if it's for a class, share with them

[wide saffron]

I recall there was one about reading flatland. Is the poem one in the first set of exercises? 😂

Btw love the cat petting thing. It's so satisfying.

[gray gazelle]

https://images-ext-2.discordapp.net/external/haUc0h69ouDjhpNbgudyblotNaoQa4fRkqJhaBxeqio/https/media.discordapp.net/attachments/268882317391429632/799769127567753226/ezgif-7-c7d6b8d6ef40.gif

the flatland exercise is chapter 1

this one's chapter 2

im taking a class out of this book, i think it'd be hilarious if the prof assigned one of these

[wide saffron]

The poem is brilliant 🤣🤣
Rhyme is 1-2 and 2-3, idk what it's called (paired?)

Does your class have a public link? Id like to see a selection of recommended exercises

[gray gazelle]

it does not, but here's a past course website http://www.math.toronto.edu/mpugh/Teaching/Mat357/mat357.html

[karmic thorn]

The exercise is hilarious, but why is the question tally not stopping.

[gray gazelle]

that's the last one that section lol

well there are a few more "prelim problems"

[karmic thorn]

Ah 😌

[gray gazelle]

i'm going to embark on this multi-page long proof in lee, now

[karmic thorn]

Good luck. The smooth manifolds course I enrolled for released the first week of lectures too.

[wide saffron]

Thanks, good luck!

[gray gazelle]

ty

[flint forge]

pugh is great

gave a great lecture to my grad class

[gray gazelle]

i changed my mind, that multi-page long proof was actually very easy

was he your instructor?

[flint forge]

no he was a guest

[gray gazelle]

ic

[flint forge]

he doesnt work at uchi

[marble solar]

Pugh is at Cal

[sage python]

Oh yeah I forgot Pugh does dynamics

[pearl imp]

is Apostol harder or Spivak?
On the same note, for someone completed a numerical calc book, what's best next? Apostol or Spivak?

numerical calc book like Thomas/Larson/Stewart

[static crest]

apostol isn't really that good for self learning

imo

[pearl imp]

what about Spivak?

[static crest]

it's a classic

I would rec spivak

[stray kite]

anyone have any good recommendations for a lin alg textbook?

[stray kite]

thx

[hearty steppe]

Lmao I use a Different linear algebra book by the same people

[gray gazelle]

imagine having the name insel

[valid moth]

that's pretty ironic

considering that is a preexisting bloodline

i.e. insels having kids

[gray gazelle]

[pine igloo]

Hello
What books would you recommend about the philosophy of mathematics?

[valid moth]

@obsidian valley

#foundations #❓how-to-get-help

[obsidian valley]

For an overview, S. Shapiros Philosophy of Math books are common and excerpts I’ve read are good. I like Linnebo Phil of Math as well, it’s a bit newer. I’ve read excerpts from Resniks “Frege and the Philosophy of Math” that I really liked. Try to get some essay collections as well, there’s one from Benacerraf and Putnam that’s good. For other reading you can find Ultra on here and ask them, they’ll probably say stuff like Penelopes Believing The Axioms, and Quine. They are alot more well read than me, lol.

[pine igloo]

thanks Jesse

well I want to read about the subject, since I found that I'm into the foundations of mathematics, I'm currently studying set theory
basically any book about the philosophy of mathematics I care about

Thanks.

[warped cedar]

Chaos theory book recommendations?

[misty girder]

Why?

@static crest

[timber mesa]

the usual one is Strogatz' but I haven't actually read it

[warped cedar]

Yeah I thought about Strogatz

seems like a lot of peoples suggestion

[timber mesa]

I mean I've skimmed through it some and it seems good, I think it's aimed at scientists and engineers

the ones I've actually read are actually intro to dynamical systems in general and don't regard applications as much. These are R. Devaney's "Introduction to Chaotic Dynamical Systems" (it's written in a very elementary manner assuming only calc) and C. Robinson's Dynamical Systems

Katok-Hassenblatt's "A first course in dynamics" is another oft-suggested one

[timber mesa]

Strogatz is the only one I know that treats applications well though

[warped cedar]

thanks

[karmic thorn]

Would like book recommendations for the layperson, who want to get an overview of pure maths as a discipline.

[marble solar]

how much math do you know?

There's a paper on the arxiv called "On proofs and progress" by Bill Thurston

[karmic thorn]

I'm asking for someone else, they're still in HS and would like to get a glimpse of advanced mathematics.

(I've already fallen in the trap of majoring in maths XD)

[sudden kindle]

anything by Martin Gardner is good

[karmic thorn]

Oh yeah! Gardner's books would be good.

Any specific titles you'd recommend?

[sudden kindle]

My Best Mathematical and Logic Puzzles (Dover Recreational Math) A

[karmic thorn]

Thanks!

[sudden kindle]

LMAO

This is so random

[karmic thorn]

LOL

Brown bear

Right?

Since it must've been the north pole

Or maybe not

[broken meadow]

What

[sudden kindle]

north pole is definitely one place that satisfies this

are there others?

[karmic thorn]

Isn't a sphere symmetric everywhere though

[broken meadow]

the placement of the pole is arbitrary

lmao

[sudden kindle]

but cardinal directions are not symmetric

[broken meadow]

or is it

right yeah how does this work

[karmic thorn]

But yeah, the notions of north, south, east means we're fixing poles.

Once we do that, north pole is the unique answer, I guess.

[sudden kindle]

can you think of other places tho

[gray gazelle]

i mean, other places where brown bears are found

?

[karmic thorn]

I don't think it should work for south pole? How do you even walk south of south pole to begin with? XD

[gray gazelle]

lol

[karmic thorn]

Please do @sweet lotus .

Nice.

[gray gazelle]

and use coriolis effect

[sudden kindle]

oooh

[karmic thorn]

Would think more about it. Thanks!

[sudden kindle]

thats a very good hint

im still trying to figure out what the answe is

but i have a feeling for the gimmick

no literally opened Gardner's book for the first time and saw this riddle

[karmic thorn]

Gardner's book has rational answers as far as I've seen. I hate "logical" puzzles which are just wordplay or bs answers.

My first instinct was that the explorer was the bear itself lmao.

[hasty turret]

What about bs ones? Like mensa

[karmic thorn]

I don't like the ones where you could fit in a 1000 different scenarios which make more sense than the given solution.

[karmic thorn]

Lmao.

I still don't get the islanders puzzle solution by induction.

I'm of the view it should be all the islanders surviving.

I do, but I don't see why the 2 person case is supposed to generalise.

With 2 people, one would immediately know that they're being referred to. With 100, you're assured there are like 49 more.

Yeah, I'm on the 50/50 or 500/500 one, the ones I saw on MSE.

JDH did some transfinite generalisation of this problem on MO

Yes.

Okay.

Yes

Oh

Makes sense

They'll all end up dying.

For 5?

The induction seems to be making more sense

Yeppp, I think so

Both blue eyed people die on day 2, right? Since they don't witness the other dying, they kill themselves?

I'm talking about 2/2 case

Yes

How do the green eyed people realise their eye colour?

Owww, neat.

I'll try n=6 now.

Day 1, no body dies.

Sure

[sudden kindle]

when you walk 10 miles east, are you walking along a line of lattitude, or are you walking along a geodesic with the initial tangent vector pointing east?

[karmic thorn]

Oops, it was Cheryl's birthday problem

https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/1241197/a-transfinite-epistemic-logic-puzzle-what-numbers-did-cheryl-give-to-albert-and/1241940

[sudden kindle]

no theyre not

lines of lattitude are not geodesics

[karmic thorn]

They are the geodesic if two points lie on the same latitude, not in general, I guess?

It wouldn't even make sense to use the latitude as a point joining two arbitrary points anyway. Nvm.

Ah, okay. I loved the original birthday problem because I could solve it on my own. XD

I think I'm still stuck on n=6 case, Ultra.

I'll probably continue this in #discussion

Yes

The same happens on day 2?

OWWW

Nice!

This seems to reinforce the argument by induction too. The 3 people case depends on the 2 people case.

Thanks a tonne!

But

Does this mean all 6 will die on the same day?

Oh, okay.

I'm still a bit unconvinced: the thought process of the blue eyed people does not differ from that of the green eyed people, since they're all oblivious of their eye colour. Why does this discrepancy arise, then?

Is it because the blue eyed sees two other blue eyed

Ah okay

This puzzle is so unsettling, the visitor introduces no new information and yet triggers a catastrophe.

Shouldn't the islanders themselves realise what the visitor said and annihilate themselves(or not exist to begin with)?

The Islanders Problem.

Hmmmm, I think what the visitor said was "There exists a blue eyed person", and this was already known to all islanders. That the domino effect of dying started only after the visitor said so is a bit baffling.

And it was known to all islanders that every other islander knows that there exists a blue eyed person.

So the common knowledge was present all along.

This does sound more convincing.

Yes, that is what it is.

It's more of a realisation or deduction, I guess.

[hybrid kestrel]

ahh how was everyone's the so called IOQM :/

[flint forge]

?

[gray gazelle]

🤨

[valid moth]

international olympiad in quantum mechanics

[gray gazelle]

[gray gazelle]

Easy

[static crest]

trivial

actually

[gray gazelle]

[split heath]

Is it against discord terms of service to ask for a PDF (offline) copy of a book I can already access online? The book I'm searching for is is "Introduction To Number Theory - Richard Michael Hill". Our Number Theory online lectures are only 5 minutes per lecture for some reason and we aren't provided with lecture notes :/.

[hasty turret]

Just libgen

[split heath]

Cheers

[hushed sequoia]

Just libgen
against discord terms of service
yes. but uh, we don't really talk about that :monkaS:

why is monkas broken

bruh

[marble solar]

works just fine

[hushed sequoia]

mobile discord is wack, then

[hearty steppe]

it was a little finicky a bit lately

[golden salmon]

hey im in need of a good book for thiscourse outline

please @ me

[flint forge]

whats your profs book title

its best just to use their book

look for it on l*bgen

[golden salmon]

not there

but it's ABCs of Calculus

i was able to do it for the calculus 1

but not for calculus 3

yeah so im in need of a book that contains that information

[karmic thorn]

Thomas' Calculus/Stewart should be fine.

[golden salmon]

you got a link with that

[karmic thorn]

Just a moment

[golden salmon]

http://www.i-element.org/PDF/M01.pdf

this

[karmic thorn]

Yeah, this.

Not sure which edition is the latest.

You could check on Libgen.

[golden salmon]

check waht

For ABCs of calculus?

couldnt find anythign for that one

[karmic thorn]

Thomas'/Stewart's.

[golden salmon]

is there one thats for multivariable calculus

cause thats a big book

[karmic thorn]

Just consult the relevant portion.

You don't have to work through single var if you're comfortable with it.

Or you could check out Apostol's Calculus Vol. 2.

It's devoted to multivar iirc.

[wooden sparrow]

depends if they just want calculus the usual computational way

[golden salmon]

ok thanks

[prisma snow]

It's on libgen for me?