#graduate-applications

1 messages · Page 18 of 1

wind plinth
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while i was compiling my list of schools to apply to i made a point to avoid places requiring the GRE.. only for two of them to start requiring it this year bleak

outer reef
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is that not just a phd program

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if you’re guaranteed to get into the phd after the masters

cosmic magnet
scarlet barn
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Does anyone know whether or not research classes and research are measured equally when it comes to research experience?

mossy niche
scarlet barn
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Versus research in an actual research group

mossy niche
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that just sounds like research

scarlet barn
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I mean I guess? Im just kind of worried about whether or not grad committees with judge harshly where my research is coming from

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Im at an R1 but it’s been hard to get into a group where a prof had time for undergrads

mossy niche
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you aren't supposed to join a group unless you're a really strong undergrad

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more often its just individual with profs

scarlet barn
smoky jetty
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research labs / groups are uncommon in math

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whereas in engineering and the sciences, formal groups and labs are quite ubiquitous

raven sun
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Even if there is a research group it might be very loosely defined like. Eg in my case there is an “optional” (the advisor wants everyone to go but won’t care too much if people miss) once a week meeting where we have lunch and talk about what we’ve all been working on. But collaborations are negotiated individually and not everyone is working with another person in the group

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(And frankly I cannot imagine an undergrad being a part of this working group)

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This is very unlike other STEM subjects

smoky jetty
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in my undergrad, one of my mentors ran a good working group for his research area (algebraic combinatorics)

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and there was an associated seminar for the group (open to anyone) and frequently afterwards there would be group discussion on math and other stuff

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as an undergrad it was really nice to be able to sit in and I learned alot of math by listening and asking questions (he encouraged undergrads to come and try to learn stuff)

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but I have never heard of any other similar thing

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which is a shame but also it seems hard to pull off

scarlet barn
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but Im wanting to go into theory and math phys

scarlet barn
shell kindle
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Depends on the institution

main marlin
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I'M STRESSED

peak socket
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Do you know of any software for Windows that solves mathematical problems? If so, what are they?

tacit lark
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Probably not. Also, i wouldnt focus on graduating early. Focus on doing a good phd.

empty oak
tacit lark
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Not sure why it would make doing a phd harder.

smoky jetty
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I will say I know people here at the phd program I am in who did a masters before coming and and who did not do a masters before coming here

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and it seems like in either case they will take 5-6 years to do the PhD

tacit lark
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Same here

rocky dome
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Of course depends if you are in US or Europe or elsewhere

paper granite
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This is the standard thing to do in the UK so I wouldn’t see why it would make it harder or easier. Everywhere has a slightly different system but I don’t see why it would make a huge difference anywhere

sonic rover
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Are there fields/sub fields in pure math that have disproportionately more/less PhD applicants compared to open positions. I am trying to get a rough idea about fields that are relatively more/less competitive to get into grad schools. And I am not really concerned about post docs.

urban raft
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I know a few people who speedran quals cuz they already knew things, either from being a very strong undergrad or doing a masters. But if your goal is academia there isn't really a benefit to graduating earlier

smoky jetty
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do you not care what field you study?

sonic rover
# smoky jetty do you not care what field you study?

To a good extent, yes. I want to specialize in algebra I think. I have taken some courses in combi and algebra, and I like most of them. I am basically at a point where I am to specialize in a certain subfield (maybe polynomial methods in combinatotics, representation theory, but idk) . I would want to avoid fields that are extremely competitive.

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And I do not, atleast atm, want to go into academia. I am going to do the PhD almost entirely because I like studying maths. But if I can get into a more "prestigious" or whatever uni, I'll be probably more employable.

outer reef
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that would have to be done early on in university, when choosing courses to take/professors to talk to/summer programs to do/...

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(and isn't really worth doing imo)

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i think the competitiveness of admissions for a given field at a given university is very hard to gauge, and anyway the optimal way to pitch your application to a given school is purely a function of their faculty's research interests & willingness to advise you

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also imho from the standpoint of enjoying your phd, working in competitive areas can be a lot of fun even if you dont want to continue in academia

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bc there will be a lot of exciting activity, conferences, other students to talk to, etc., not to mention that many people will be interested in your work

sonic rover
sonic rover
outer reef
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what i said might only be true in the US

sonic rover
main aspen
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What should an academic cv look like?
Like what should it include/leave out?

smoky jetty
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DMed you my CV, anyone else who wants to see it is welcome to DM me

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My current CV is very close in formatting and content to whatever I applied to grad school with

paper granite
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Also a lot of academics will have their CV on their website, you can look at what they have

cosmic magnet
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There are a lot of good templates on Github!

main aspen
paper granite
main aspen
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I've got a handful now, fortunately enough to give me a good idea

visual lagoon
main aspen
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The examples I'm working off are all in the range of "just about to start PhD" to "just finishing first year of PhD"

paper granite
paper granite
viral idol
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Any advice for writing a personal statement for PhD apps?

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I know that it's supposed to be more about research interests and what I'm good at than personal stories, but I'm not quite sure how to structure it

quiet stag
gentle basin
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math/music double major here (as a result have had little to no time to pursue math research opportunities during my undergrad, certainly nothing substantial or publishable); how should i generally approach my statement of purpose without it sounding like i'm trying to weasel my way out of not having much experience?

quiet stag
mossy niche
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they want to see you really are committed to doing math

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so just focus on what you did do

viral idol
gentle basin
viral idol
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Also, most of the math I know is from self-studying, not from coursework. I go to a small liberal arts college and there isn't a good course selection here so my transcript will be relatively weak. Is there any way to overcome this in my application?

quiet stag
viral idol
quiet stag
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I think that's great! The DGS at my undergrad institution told me to submit if and only if your score is ≥ 800

shell kindle
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What percentile

paper granite
outer reef
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the fact that you self-studied i mean

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ideally you would have done a reading course with a prof and gotten a letter from them

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you can also demonstrate knowledge of a topic by showing you studied stuff that comes “after,” like if you self-studied point-set topology and subsequently studied differential geometry (as evidenced by a rec letter), it’d be implicit that you had indeed learned point-set topology

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just generally having your rec letter(s) highlight your preparation for graduate studies in ways that implicitly address any gaps in your transcript would be good

spring portal
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Have a small weird query about CV formatting. Along with my degree, I have also been taking courses from a different uni (around 18 including present courses). Though I generally submit the non-degree transcript under additional docs, I never explicitly mentioned about me taking non-degree courses on CV. Do you people think it is okay to include a line about this in my CV under education or should I not include it?

quiet stag
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Yes, especially if the courses are advanced math courses

spring portal
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i got stuff like measure theory, galois theory, comm alg on non-degree joe_bonk

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Thanks btw lovethat

teal gorge
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Does the McGill MSc program have rolling admissions? The information isn't available online as far as I can tell

floral grove
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are yall familiar with anyone who transitioned to Graphics Programming research from a Math background?

whole tartan
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How are you guys preparing for GRE. If anyone has taken the test in past, how did you prepare?

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Any suggestions would be really helpful

gentle basin
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drill practice tests

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same goes for literally any other test of this flavor

wind plinth
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in the paragraph of my statement of purpose where I talk about why I want to be in a certain program, is it worth mentioning the fact that I like the city it happens to be located in?

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(I have a much stronger reason for applying, but like,, would they appreciate me saying something nice about the city too or should i not bother and keep my word count down hahaha)

remote radish
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I think It is generally not recommended, only if it ties into your reasons for applying like access to industry hubs. Focus primarily on academic, professional, and program-specific. Make your word count carefully.

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Good luck on your letter !

delicate scroll
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Chat what would applying to Chinese schools as an American look like?

wheat grove
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me when i procrastinated all summer and now I have to lock in for grad apps

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:/

quiet stag
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You still have a few months left. You've got this

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(assuming you're applying in the US; idk what application timelines are like elsewhere)

slim wigeon
wheat grove
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so applications will open in like half a month ish for most schools here iirc

spring portal
# slim wigeon this but for japanese schools

Japanese schools are a big pain. A lot of beaurocracy. Many even require general GRE while it has been abolished or kept as not required in most other places. Lots of documents are needed while the deadlines are often very short. Many require you to take tests in person in Japan while some might ask you to send notarized documents through post or in-person. You will also need to pay for a PhD unless you get a scholarship (MEXT, departmental or university).

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Deadlines for many schools are usually in May or June, so you might already be late for quite a few.

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You will also need supervisor approval in many places before proceeding with the application, so you need to mail few profs and see who can take you in.

tight viper
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Hi, i am from singapore and planning to apply for a phd program in mathematics. I don't want to do a Master's before the PHD so my options seem quite limited to either staying in Singapore or applying to programs in the US. In singapore, the PhD only takes 4 years while in the US, its around 6 and I find it very hard to justify applying to the US but I wanted to hear what others think. Would going for a shorter program in a less prestigious institution make sense to you?

tacit lark
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I get not wanting to move abroad. But, it isnt ideal and what you should do depends on your goals.

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Doing a shorter phd doesn’t help you. It’s less time to do research.

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Yea

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Probably reasonably common

tacit lark
tight viper
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would you all think there is a large difference in terms of opportunity?

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oh i see, im surprised

tacit lark
shell kindle
tight viper
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just trying to understand abit more

tacit lark
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If you want to go into industry it could make sense to graduate early. Thats why it depends on your goals.

tight viper
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i see, it seems like doing a longer phd is a good idea. I originally thought that maybe finishing earlier might give me more options and singapore is my home country so life would naturally be abit easier for me there

tacit lark
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Once again thats why i said it could make sense

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I know a few people that graduate after 4 just bc they had jobs lined up.

mossy niche
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i think the avg for us phd is higher than 5

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its around 6 at my institution

sand knoll
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What's the appeal of grad school? Isn't the AI just gonna learn it all for us anyway?

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It feels like there's a wave of compaction coming, fewer students and more experts, or more expert students at the bleeding edge, directing AI learners?

gentle basin
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it has no actual "knowledge"

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it's just clumsily trying to probabilistically predict the next word in the sentence

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which is uh

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not conducive to anything mathematically coherent

shell kindle
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Doing math and having something else do math for you are not the same

viral idol
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Writing a personal statement is fun because every time I look up examples it's something like "During my 5th REU that summer I had the wonderful opportunity to collaborate with Terrence Tao and Srinivasa Ramanujan on a major unsolved problem in inverse motivic inter-universal Teichmuller theory" and I still have no idea what I'm supposed to write

tacit lark
gentle basin
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felt 😭 i have nothing by comparison

mossy niche
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i didnt remember anything i did that summer nor did i perform particularly well

gentle basin
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the one i went to was too short for me to get anything substantial done and i was fumbling around in the dark with no prior experience

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do i even list it

tacit lark
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Yea

wheat grove
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i got no clue where to even begin

smoky jetty
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@wheat grove @viral idol

I make no promises it's a good statement but I can send you my statement if you want just DM me (this offer goes for any and all people in this channel). I got rejected from some schools but also got into a few so it can't be all bad I think? But also Google personal statements, there are plenty out there for you to get a rough outline of.

quiet stag
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^ same here!

smoky jetty
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Either it is or isn't serious and in any case it doesn't deserve any attention

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(Also those who DMed me I see it I'm just not at my laptop rn so I can't send stuff)

abstract mortar
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Hello guys, I'm looking for someone who study at UniTo, because I'm interested in applying to the PhD program next year.

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I'd like to know some details about the application and how it is to live in Italy, since I will be an international student

shell kindle
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Turin?

abstract mortar
glacial pendant
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would it be appropriate to email the listed email address for grad admissions comms about whether the math program at the university is a good fit for students with interest in probability alongside more pure areas of math

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particularly, i dont wanna do a stats program because i am interested in areas of math that i wouldnt get to study as a part of that

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but i would ideally like to do a math program that allows me to do a good amount of probability (which i think is most programs, but some programs i understand house their probability in a stats dept)

tough pewter
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Does having a 4yr UG + 3 yr masters create a negative impact on my grad applications especially for the very top unis even if I have done lots of grad level courses/reading projects? As far as I have seen, everyone got into PhD immediately after a bachelor's in these top unis [say the top 10 math departments in US]. I don't have much hopes from these unis though.

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Also, how much do they care about unrelated upper undergrad/grad level courses if let's say I am applying for commutative algebra but I have courses in analytical number theory and pde.

smoky jetty
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then your standards for admission are higher

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i.e. they expect you to have used those 3 years productively

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so if you did alot of grad courses, reading projects, maybe a masters thesis, good letters, a paper, whatever

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should be ok

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if you just spent 3 years twiddling your thumbs doing little more than passing classes then it may not be ok

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this is what I was told when debating the same thing when I was applying to grad schools

mossy niche
tough pewter
tough pewter
main aspen
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How do you deal with the case when one of the people you may ask to write you a letter of recommendation is also someone you will be applying to do a PhD with?

shell kindle
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They will recuse themselves from consideration of your application

main aspen
mossy niche
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i think the european answer is that they already know if they will take you as a student and it comes down to whether they can get funding for you

teal gorge
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Can you indicate in your application that you have interest in working with more than one faculty member? I don't mean co-supervision, I mean that you do not indicate exactly one faculty member. From an adcom's perspective, does it indicate your mind is not sufficiently made up if the faculty members are in different fields?

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Context: this is for applications to a canadian MSc

cosmic magnet
quiet stag
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i listed like 4 different profs when i applied to my current institution

teal gorge
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Cool, thanks

grand pewter
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im not applying to grad school till next year but i noticed that UCSD doesnt require the GRE anymore, just recommends the subject test. kinda hype

gentle basin
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"recommended" is basically a euphemism for "required to be competitive" no?

mossy niche
gentle basin
mossy niche
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i know someone who was a final candidate for a top 10 mgre requiring school without submitting for example

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those are very rare

gentle basin
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elevates me from zero chance to … zero chance

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let’s go

grand pewter
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if im to do it at lal

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all

gentle basin
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general GRE is worse than useless in providing any useful info to an admissions committee lmao

wind plinth
shell kindle
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If you do bad at general GRE math section then that is a big red flag

ionic valley
shell kindle
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On the general gre math section?

mossy niche
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perfect

gentle basin
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arguably easier than SAT math

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if you’re not acing that section consistently then that’s a major problem

paper granite
shell kindle
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Yeah

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If you aren't getting close to perfect scores on general gre math, that's a red flag

ionic valley
quiet stag
ionic valley
shell kindle
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Oh for the subject test, some schools (the obvious suspects) wants 80+ percentile

ionic valley
shell kindle
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Yes well, it is what it is

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Fortunately it's a lot less widely required than in the past

mossy niche
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since so fewer people take the mgre these days, you'll need around 850+ to break 80 percentile

tacit lark
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That makes sense

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Most of the people that would do bad just decide not to take it.

glacial pendant
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liek uc berkeley says 50 percentile or higher and i know that's a lie

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the wait to get GRE scores is so agonizing 😭

shell kindle
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Berkeley Harvard mit Stanford

glacial pendant
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Ah i see

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I remember hearing that some of those want higher than 90/95

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Particularly Harvard

mossy niche
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they want people for which the math gre is "not too hard" in the sense that 95 percentile is completely reasonable, easy even

glacial pendant
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I’m curious how you all know this

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In general it feels like there’s such a lack of transparency for PhD applications, whereas there’s CDS and tons of info out there for undergrad admissions

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Also how do people stop worrying abt grad admissions stuff 🙏 I’m going through it feeling stressed all the time

quiet stag
mossy niche
viral idol
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If I did summer research freshman year that didn't result in any new discoveries should I still mention this in my personal essay?

cosmic magnet
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Yes, undergraduate research rarely leads to to new discoveries. It's something important to talk about and definitely worth mentioning if it helped you solidify your intent to apply to grad programs

viral idol
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Ok

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How would I talk about such a project then?

limber zephyr
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I'm planning to apply to graduate schools next year (not this year), so have some time to prepare. I have a good amount of natural talent, but have been beset by mental health challenges that have dragged my grade quite far down (3.24 GPA, but it might improve to 3.5 or so if a petition to retroactively withdraw from one quarter goes through) and caused me to take quite a while to graduate (my tenth year is coming up).

I'm still hoping to apply to some top schools, especially MIT, since this is where a lot of research I'm interested in is happening (complexity theory).

I've been able to secure good recommendations in the past, but it's been a while and I think for reasons I won't go into most of those recommenders would not write as well about me again. Still, I have one from an REU six years ago, and another that I'm writing a paper with now who isn't at a very prestigious college but would probably write a more recent/positive letter. I also have a year to prepare and find a professor to potentially write a third letter (not sure if more is better or what the cap to letters is?).

I'm also willing to put a lot of effort into anything that would help my cause. I've found myself becoming very high functioning and self-motivated once my mental health struggles were conquered, so it's fine if something involves a lot of work like having to learn a new subject on my own, but I don't have much time and want to be as competitive as possible, so I'm wondering what the best way for me to do this would be?

quiet stag
# limber zephyr I'm planning to apply to graduate schools next year (not this year), so have som...

In the US, pretty much every program will ask for 3 letters. Several may allow for a fourth, but 3 is the number to go for

Another thing I'll recommend is to discuss your extenuating circumstances on your application to help explain your grades, but framing everything as "medical complications" over mental health challenges

As for the last question, have you asked your advisors/current professors/recommender for their advice?

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Also, I feel like this might be a case where a strong GRE math subject score (see the discussion from yesterday) would be really helpful

inner grove
limber zephyr
tacit lark
foggy prism
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do people email prof they want to work with for the school they are applying?

shell kindle
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They do if they have valuable things to say

foggy prism
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i know some people who just email profs saying they are interested in certain topics when theyve just read the abstract of couple of the profs paper. Dunno if thats helpful

shell kindle
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No that isn't

cosmic magnet
worthy peak
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For Applied Math profs in countries where direct PhD is rare

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What (if anything) should I infer from the fact that most of the previous masters students a prof has advised have gone into industry (I think without going to a PhD program)

mossy niche
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seems normal for applied math

smoky jetty
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i.e. you'd only apply to work with them or maybe one other person

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doesn't hurt to ask directly something along the lines of "I want to go into academia. Do students of yours end up going into good academic positions if they want to?"

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idk there's probably a better phrasing

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but profs are chill in my experience about this kind of question

blissful crystal
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question, i have 2 probably strong rec letters (one from a prof I was doign research with) and a third letter that i was originally gonna get from a prof i did an REU with, but tbh that reu wasnt very productive and im worried that letter is pretty mid. Even more evidence is that a teammate in the same REU submitted that same prof's rec letter to an REU this past cycle and they gave him feedback saying the letter "wasn't doing him any favors". I doubt the letter is saying bad things, but its probably not saying anything excellent either. Should I try and work closely with a professor this quarter that im taking grad topology with to see if he can write me a letter, or should I stick with the reu letter? Im also wondering if its too weird if I attended an reu but dont submit that letter. any thoughts or opinions

inner grove
# blissful crystal question, i have 2 probably strong rec letters (one from a prof I was doign rese...

You have a lot of reason to be skeptical about the REU letter. If possible you can ask if they can confidently write you a strong letter. If they answer no, or have some hesitation then you have your answer.

An instructor that you take graduate course work is in a great position to speak to your ability to succeed in graduate coursework (which is a big part of graduate school!) If you already have a good letter from an REU mentor, then that letter will speak for your research ability/potential. I wouldn't worry about not having two research letters.

main aspen
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What is the etiquette/expectation wrt emailing professors who you might want to work with before applying for PhD in Canada?

worthy peak
main aspen
worthy peak
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except for some professors who explicitly say not to it seems like most are open to getting emails from students ahead of the deparmental applications coming in

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or they even prefer it

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at least from what I heard

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(actually I just heard back from a prof in my masters search)

worthy peak
unkempt willow
blissful crystal
rigid veldt
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that is generally useful, but you also need to identity funding sources

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the university should have some, and there might be some external ones via scholarship schemes and the like

undone yacht
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I would think that is extremely rare. It would not matter if people had funding, it would typically just be a time sink for me. Personally I have never heard about such a thing. I do occasionally accept people doing a undergraduate thesis, then I get compensated with 1% of teaching (not really worth it).

Maybe this is a thing at other places?

main aspen
worthy peak
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how do you tell if you're cut out for pure maths. i'm mostly looking at departments/profs doing applied research but do think about pure research sometimes (most likely in quasi-applied analysis fields like probability/stochastic processes/pdes/numerical analysis/calculus of variations)

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thing is i've struggled in most of the pure math courses ive taken

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there are various grant-funded positions that you can apply for with a professor (or sometimes the department already has a quota they can fill and has their own internal application)

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and yes emailing a prof also works

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sometimes your school will have its own hiring platforms which will include RA positions for undergraduates (mine does)

worthy peak
blissful crystal
# undone yacht I would think that is extremely rare. It would not matter if people had funding,...

in the US there are things called REUs (research experiences for undergraduates) where professors do exactly this; i.e., they think of unsolved problems that can be attacked by smart undergraduates. In official NSF programs they are given grants for their efforts but at good research universities many professors are up to work with undergraduates. As an example, i research under a professor as an undergraduate and he does not get paid for it

undone yacht
blissful crystal
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REUs are yes, but for me ive been working with my professor for almost 2 years

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also nowadays top US universities honestly expect undergraduate research from competitive applicants

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either that or like other exceptional things

undone yacht
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(Sweden)

blissful crystal
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ah yea makes sense, in the US as im sure u know undergrads can go straight to phd but its definitely difficult, way easier to go ms then phd

coral fjord
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scrolling back and I'm a ug in this situation (ie british) looking to apply to US universities. do you think the research component of my integrated master's gives me a shot at us unis?

paper granite
coral fjord
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I'm wondering if they'll see me like a productive ug or a msci who did very little

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from the former pov I look decent and from the latter compared to people who do years of paper writing etc i look pretty bad

tacit lark
smoky jetty
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for math there are 3 things I would say

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1: Look at REUs (this is the most obvious answer)

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2: profs you've taken classes with an enjoyed, ask them to do some directed reading where you read through a textbook or something under them

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this is probably more valuable mathematically to you than a toy UG research project and you can still get a good letter out of this

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3: if you have skills such as programming or whatever that can apply to other sciences / applied areas, maybe look for UG research in those areas

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I did UG research in control theory in the aerospace department and it was alot of programming and graph theory stuff

spring flint
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I’m taking GRE there you go

main aspen
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How do I deal with feeling like I need to do some more reading around the interests of people I’m applying to for PhDs (and especially the ones I want to work with more so - note this is in a Europe context where you’re applying to the supervisor from the start) with the fact that I kinda feel like I might be burning out a bit?
Like it feels like “if I don’t do enough reading I’m less likely to get the PhD so [insert all my brain’s catastrophising around not getting a PhD]” so I can’t not
But also if I keep doing so, I’ll burn out even before term starts?

shell kindle
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Usually the summer between undergrad and phd is spent recovering from burn out

main aspen
shell kindle
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Ah

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Will you have the next summer off

main aspen
rocky dome
main aspen
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That message feels fairly tone deaf given my original message

fresh kindle
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So I’d lean more towards avoiding it

main aspen
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Yeah
I especially know with term coming up
But also PhDs
But term
Etc

fresh kindle
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Good luck

foggy prism
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does anyone feel like the princeton review 4th edition gre subject practice test harder than the actual gre?

mossy niche
foggy prism
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im cooked

blissful crystal
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the older practice tests are easier than the modern gre

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idk why they dont give us more new gre tests

gentle basin
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to leave students in the dark and extort more cash from them

blissful crystal
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also is lame some schools still take it

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skillset hardly overlaps at all with research

foggy prism
foggy prism
blissful crystal
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literally

foggy prism
blissful crystal
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is there a way to access that practice test without buying princeton review

cosmic magnet
hexed timber
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i am going to my associates degree in like 8 months, is it just math i need to do, if not tell my what it is i need to do

foggy prism
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they write up their solution too

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and a note

#

those are a better representation of the actual exam than the princeton review 4th edition (cracking the gre subject math). Based on my experience with an actual gre, princeton much more difficult for some reasonopencry

blissful crystal
#

even the older practice exams?

gentle basin
#

older practice exams trend easier

limber zephyr
#

Funny to see his name mentioned

spring warren
#

bro wth

#

can i send research papers in here?

empty oak
spring warren
#

i thought it was graduate level applications of math lol

late rose
shell kindle
foggy prism
spring warren
#

its many fields

late rose
floral grove
#

anyone here from TIFR Mumbai or ICTS?

visual lagoon
torn wigeon
#

i just finished undergrad and am looking for some advice for applying to grad school. is anyone around willing to answer a few questions?

weary acorn
#

Might be easier to just ask your questions

#

Then if people can answer they can just do it and ping ya

torn wigeon
#

fair enough

#

i am interested in theoretical physics, but not sure if that is what mathematical physics is for, or if i should apply to a physics program

#

put it like this: i can apply to a mathematical physics program this fall, as i just graduated with a pure mathematics degree. if i wanted to apply to a physics program, i would need to take some physics courses first and i wouldn’t be able to apply until next fall

#

however, i want the problems and content to be more of a physics flavor than a pure mathematics flavor. so if mathematical physics is highly divorced from the physics, i may be less interested in it

foggy prism
#

What are some schools that are good in Model theory and Algebra and Number theory (both alg and analytic)? Not limited to any region.

void horizon
tacit lark
#

maybe cambridge

#

or university illinois chicago

foggy prism
#

anymore in europe? they might be a bit easier to get in KEK

tacit lark
#

im just basing these suggestions based off of julia wolf at cambridge and caroline terry at uic

foggy prism
tacit lark
#

i figured but im not sure what schools are "good" in all three of those areas. Take a look yourself and decide whether they're "good"

foggy prism
#

yeah im doing that rn but also want some input from others.

urban raft
glacial pendant
#

Do y'all have any thoughts on schools that care a lot about math GRE subject test scores? I got a score that should be a benefit to pretty much any school I apply to, but I imagine some schools weight it more heavily than others

#

I have heard that UCLA cares about mGRE scores through one of the professor's websites, but other than that I don't have much insight, and most material online is for the converse case

tacit lark
native solstice
#

Anyone here's who's doing a PhD in Paris-Saclay? I'm slightly confused about the requirements to get in for a PhD. It seems like they want me to have a thesis topic and a professor before I send in the application? So am I supposed to just contact professors directly for this?

urban raft
native solstice
#

M2 being a 2 year masters?

urban raft
#

So in France a masters is 2 years, but you can do the two years separately

#

Called M1 and M2 resp

#

so to get into an M2 you need to have done one year of masters

dire brook
#

(I don't know about Paris-Saclay specifically, also I'm not in maths, but if the application form says you need a supervisor then that's probably it. In any case applying directly to professors is not uncommon)

native solstice
#

I see, thank you!

hidden sleet
#

Is it a very bad look to not have a letter from a prof you worked with? I did a short summer project with a prof and we published something out of it, and he has given me a soft rejection for a letter.

limber zephyr
#

I don't have much in the way of advice, but I think it would be relevant to also mention whether you have other letters.

#

I would guess that if so, it shouldn't be a big deal, but others will have better judgement having been through the graduate application process

#

Also, I don't know if it matters too much whether it is "bad" now if they have already rejected you - what more is there to do?

hidden sleet
hidden sleet
#

But no other publications

limber zephyr
limber zephyr
#

Oh I read that they didn't publish anything, wow yeah that is surprising now that I read it again

hidden sleet
#

Ah I'm not sure if it's a good idea to give the exact wording of the email

#

I can tell you on dm though

mossy niche
#

maybe the prof is, say, a postdoc and thinks the letter is not worth much

hidden sleet
#

No he isn't a postdoc, but he does have a reputation for being a bit strict in terms of who he writes for and how many letters he writes

tacit lark
tacit lark
outer reef
hidden sleet
hidden sleet
#

Is there an emotional support group for grad apps

tacit lark
#

Maybe a discussion channel

tacit lark
#

so

#

its hard to make any conclusion without more details. There are situations where what your friend did is stupid and others where it makes sense.

#

i dont know how to draw that conclusion from your original statement. I assumed you were making a statement about the competitiveness of grad school and people doing things that are somewhat superficial to maximize probability to get into a good grad school rather than out of interest.

glacial pendant
#

colleges send out spammy emails to every student who attends one of their events right

#

or rather, the colleges that do it, do it universally

shell kindle
#

Usually not for graduate admissions

glacial pendant
#

i see

#

there are a few universities who have been sending me emails but they're also like... hard to get into so i don't really want to take it too seriously

#

uchicago sends me some stuff post-getting a fee waiver from them and uc berkeley keeps sending me stuff after one of their admissions events

shell kindle
#

Oh yeah they do that

glacial pendant
#

also im not clear on whether getting a fee waiver from them is a good sign, since they say its "competitive" and i also didnt actually check off any of their given programs

shell kindle
#

U Chicago just wants to boost their applicant count to reduce admission rates, even for phd programs for whatever reason

glacial pendant
#

sad!

#

they should accept me

#

in my unbiased opinion ofc

vast gate
#

i have no research, awards, or independent study
i want to research and teach foundational logic in the future, but im genuinely at a loss on what i should do

obviously berkeley and harvard have good logic, but no way in hell im getting in there
this leaves like bloomington, notre dame, iowa

but i really doubt ill make it there

#

any school that actually teaches this stuff seems completely outside of my reach at this point

#

im also at a nobody undergrad school lol, none of my professors can vouch for my logic knowledge

#

first, can i actually get into schools like iu bloomington, notre dame, iowa, etc?
what schools have what im looking for that i can actually get into

#

second, what can i actually do right now to try to get into a logic school?
im taking both gre in october, and i cant get a glowing letter about my logic self-study, but i can get good letters
how much would these letters even matter tho, if i dont have any concrete statements like "this student can study on his own, and do research"

#

because literally every single professor in my math department i spoke with didnt even want to look at the self study cause they 'dont know anything about it'

#

i can send my self study to the colleges, sure

#

maybe write it out in sop

#

idk, its hard to consider all at this and not think im genuinely ngmi

blissful crystal
#

u should probably consider masters programs

#

they are easier to get into and as long as u take advantage of the 2 years u can have a better cv for phd apps

vast gate
#

ill look into masters

#

ive heard there are not many masters in logic that actually fund

#

do you think theyll particularly care about my self-study?

#

a lot of the professors told me to email anyone i can find online and just pray someone reads it

blissful crystal
#

by self-study u mean you have been working through a textbook or something? yea i mean its probably a good thing to say it in an sop if nothing else but yes a letter from a professor corroborating that u truly did self-study and know it well will be much more impactful

vast gate
#

yeah to the textbook

blissful crystal
#

but the point of masters programs is as far as im aware its much more possible to get into one as long as u have good grades and u took advanced classes

#

and you could maybe aim for schools that have a professor in logic

vast gate
#

i made the mistake of going to nobody college lol

#

the only prof i took with this was undergrad intro proofs

#

and he didnt even like it lol

vast gate
#

theyre all referring me to each other lol

#

even the department head didnt want to read it

#

i mean it makes sense, its all very fragile and specific, you have to be incredibly careful, how do you write a letter for a student if you cant verify it

blissful crystal
#

what are they reading?

vast gate
#

i did model and proof theory of propositions and predicates

#

like algebraic provability logics etc

#

im going off gabbay and guenthered's handbook

blissful crystal
#

so are you asking them to check ur answers or something

vast gate
#

im asking them to read it or check or literally anything

blissful crystal
#

i see, yea if they arent like well-versed in the subject already then that would be a hassle. Unfortunate that nobody is willing to help though

vast gate
#

right

#

but then i doubt they will even mention it in their letters

blissful crystal
#

still, mentioning it on an application to a master program may be enough along with good grades and coursework n such

limber zephyr
#

I don't think self study, unless it was actively performed under a prof, is usually mentioned by a prof on a letter

#

Like, you sort of just have to accept it's for your own longterm learning there's not a good way to have it "verified"

vast gate
#

but idk what else to do, the only thing they offer here is intro proofs for undergrads

limber zephyr
#

You're at a 2 year uni?..

vast gate
vast gate
limber zephyr
#

You should still mention the self study and the specific subject

blissful crystal
#

u mean that was ur only "logic" class?

limber zephyr
#

Is this not the US?.. what do you mean by "the only thing"

blissful crystal
#

surely not ur only proofs class

vast gate
#

uh

#

the only thing related to logic here is that course

limber zephyr
#

I've been to absolute bottom of the barrel unis, there is so standardization and they all have to teach certain things, even if very poorly

vast gate
#

they have graph theory too but thats different

blissful crystal
#

so they dont have real analysis, abstract algebra, etc..?

limber zephyr
#

Why do you need a logic course?

#

Specifically I mean

vast gate
#

foundational logic

limber zephyr
#

Mathematical logic is just one field

vast gate
#

right, its just my particular passion

blissful crystal
#

did u take other upperdivision math courses?

limber zephyr
#

Yes so it's unfortunate your uni is like that but in terms of graduate applications (not so sure about Europe) they're not going to look for whether you've specialized already

#

You can just look to do your study of logic at graduate school

vast gate
#

wdym upper div exactly

blissful crystal
#

as long as u took other difficult math classes and did well in them that may be enough for certain masters programs, which as they said will hopefully be enough to allow u to study what u want

vast gate
#

i took a few which are upper divs for my undergrad degree

limber zephyr
#

I've been to a nobody college, there is no grad program there

vast gate
#

its a 4 year city uni

limber zephyr
#

You mentioned graduate courses

vast gate
#

i never took actual grad credits

#

but matrix theory was literally taught with the 6000 course

limber zephyr
#

I mean, is there a logic grad sequence

vast gate
#

i havent had time to fit grads cause i made the silly choice of double majoring

#

so im maxing out my schedule for requirements only lol

limber zephyr
#

I mean, if you don't have the time to study it why are you upset about that in the first place

#

Sorry I joined in the middle maybe I should scroll and see the question

vast gate
#

im not upset at it

#

i just self study in my free time

#

i just think its highly relevant that i havent taken anything besides that intro proofs course wrt this topic, and im trying to get into an actual program on it

#

like that definitely doesnt look good, if i had to guess

limber zephyr
#

Okay yeah from what I read it seems it's already been answered, you don't need to study logic now to get into a good program to study logic. But you do need to verifiably study something, so you should be taking grad math courses if you really want a good chance at teaching logic in the future

#

Also choose something the profs at your school do know about, learn that, and ask them to vouch for you on it in rec letters

#

That's at least for American system (idk if you've responded yet with whether you're in America), non-American is very different

vast gate
#

im already a senior, ive literally never had time to fit grad level courses in my schedule because i hit the maximum allowed hours almost every semester

#

i can ask to do more hours, but i think i would die

limber zephyr
#

Sounds like infernic's advice was good then

vast gate
#

ill look into masters programs

#

do you think i can reasonably find a funded program knowing this?

limber zephyr
#

No

vast gate
#

right

limber zephyr
#

Does it need to be funded?

vast gate
#

its like $100k for a masters

#

i dont have that money

limber zephyr
#

Maybe partial funding, I just know full funding is much less likely

vast gate
#

i figured so

limber zephyr
#

I'm not super familiar with financials, others will be much more helpful with that

vast gate
#

lol

#

is there anything i can do at this point?

limber zephyr
#

All I know is that if you're already worried about being a weak candidate funding is probably less likely

vast gate
#

maybe blow the gre out of the water

limber zephyr
#

Are you applying this fall?

vast gate
#

yes

#

by december

limber zephyr
#

Maybe if you'd asked a semester or two ago I could say something more, but I think what infernic offered is the best advice so far.

For the rec letters just make sure they are good; they don't have to be profs that you did self study or research under, and it doesn't have to be logic stuff.

If you can fit in some sort of program or build a relationship with a prof from any field that would be great, but it does seem hard to do in 2 months.

vast gate
#

thats bleak

limber zephyr
#

Depends on if you can afford the masters because that at least buys you two years

#

I guess the word "buy" here is really pulling weight 😂😅

#

But I don't know much about financials, hopefully someone else will have better news

blissful crystal
#

if you really would like to be a logician, then it may be smart to consider the option where u go into industry and save up money for a masters later

vast gate
#

true

#

maybe just go be an engineer

blissful crystal
#

because even if u could get into a meh funded phd program right now, a not so good phd will block u from ever getting a job as a researcher

limber zephyr
#

"Wait, having money and still getting to use my brain is a pretty good deal, even if everyone around me thinks pi=3"

blissful crystal
#

yea i mean and u can always study logic on ur own time too

vast gate
#

right

blissful crystal
#

until you can save the money for a masters program from which u can get into a good phd ideally

vast gate
#

i was just really wanting to do research and teach it as well

blissful crystal
#

something like that anyway

blissful crystal
#

and not many spots

vast gate
#

ig ill just try to apply to good programs and go engi if i dont get in

#

save for a masters

#

could i do independent research and leverage that while im outside college?

limber zephyr
#

If you haven't published anything before, publishing independently is basically impossible

#

Even if you have it's very hard

vast gate
#

yeah it was worth asking

blissful crystal
#

yea its hard to even think of a question to research

#

much less solve it

vast gate
#

thinking of questions is some peoples jobs lol

blissful crystal
#

but u may be able to contact professors and sit in on grad classes at some school or do an independent study with a professor, youd probably have to cold email a lot tho

#

if ur lucky theyll write u a letter

vast gate
#

thanks for the advice

blissful crystal
#

its definitely possible, just gonna have to be persistent and stuff. good luck tiny_potato we all need it

glacial pendant
# vast gate thanks for the advice

On masters I’m pretty sure you can get some covered by TAing but I would look into this more

Also if u have the money to apply or have fee waivers it doesn’t hurt to try applying to some schools which have nice logic programs! You can mention in your application that your program does not have much for logic but that you were super excited by it so you studied it on your own and are excited to go to a program with a robust logic dept

vast gate
#

oh im definitely applying lol

vast gate
tacit lark
#

yes theyre saying it is possible to get some funding by being a TA during the masters

cosmic magnet
tacit lark
cosmic magnet
#

Academic or industry research? I've heard that it would block you from academic positions since prestige is a pretty big factor

tacit lark
#

I guess it depends what you mean by industry research. Being a researcher at most of the big tech research labs is as prestigious as being in academia.

#

Its not like there is just tons of math adjacent research being done in industry.

cosmic magnet
tacit lark
#

im not familiar with government labs

shell kindle
#

Networking is a lot more important for getting a job at government labs

#

But also having research that aligns with current national funding priorities

mossy niche
#

this is probably the best way to get into the lab itself

cosmic magnet
tacit lark
#

makes sense when you live in a society

glacial pendant
#

But also compounds inequity which isn’t fun

tacit lark
#

You can say that no matter what

#

If it wasnt based on networking just exams people would say thats unfair to people with test anxiety etc

mossy niche
#

i have both test anxiety and social anxiety

#

jover

gentle basin
#

ucsd is not taking any phd applicants this year bleak

blissful crystal
#

dude im so sad abt that

gentle basin
#

I don’t think it’s only ucsd that’s gonna have to do so this year

blissful crystal
#

website says they accepted too many people last year

gentle basin
#

just a matter of time before more schools announce similarly

blissful crystal
#

but still definitely is related to funding issues

#

its ok guys dont fret because in 2027 phds will be completely eliminated

gentle basin
#

“we fully expect to resume admissions in 2027” and other lies to tell yourself when going to sleep at night

blissful crystal
#

i mean whats the point man i cant js wait a year 😭

#

so lame

mossy niche
#

i hope my institution takes students, they skipped a year recently

#

funding is not looking good

blissful crystal
#

it was hard already, this is just tragic

mossy niche
#

ucsd took too many students aprtially because so many trickled down from the smaller cohorts across the board

#

now the trickling continues

tame sundial
#

europe gonna be flooded with american international students in like 3 years i swear

mossy niche
#

most american phd aspirants arent strong enough for a european phd when they graduate

tame sundial
#

in europe you have to have a masters before a phd iirc

cosmic magnet
outer reef
#

it’s just one school

#

this has happened in many recent application cycles

#

maybe things will get worse but seems super premature

#

math departments will have money to hire TAs even without NSF funding

cosmic magnet
hidden sleet
blissful crystal
#

has to be within the last 2 days cuz i checked a couple days ago

#

sad, i had already looked at the professors i wanted to work with

gentle basin
#

just hours ago

inner grove
blissful crystal
#

thats hella money though

inner grove
#

Yeah, I didn't do a MS/MA at a UC for that reason. CSUs were much cheaper, but had more limited research opportunities. It was difficult in going from the MS to PhD at a CSU, whereas for UCs that offer the MS/MA, it seems that if you do well, then it's not so difficult to move to the PhD program.

#

But ofc there are no guarantees

cosmic magnet
#

I think they got hit pretty hard with federal funding for them being cut completely this year

tame sundial
#

How the hell do you even get into princeton

tacit lark
#

Be good

#

I dont know enough Princeton people to say. The people ik there are what you might expect: top student at top ug with good research experience and other accolades like imo.

mossy niche
#

preferably be a child genius or publish in a top journal

vast gate
#

in turn, youll need 36 act, 4.0 gpa from highschool, and many ap courses for ivy undergrad

tacit lark
#

You dont have to but thats not enough. You still have to be a top student at the ivy

vast gate
#

right

tame sundial
#

I dont go to an ivy but my school has some pretty good mathematicians

#

Top 50 school i think

#

At least in math

vast gate
#

top 50 maybe

#

still a hard ask

#

plus they look at your gpa and courses down to high school

tame sundial
tame sundial
tacit lark
shell kindle
tame sundial
#

Seems ridiculous that they'd do that

shell kindle
#

But irrelevant to this channel

shell kindle
vast gate
tacit lark
tacit lark
vast gate
#

oh i see, i apologize then

quiet stag
#

Yeah, none of the Ivies ask for high school data

tacit lark
#

I think i may have had to upload transcripts of college courses i took in high school

vast gate
#

maybe thats what she meant idrk

tame sundial
#

Honestly its not that i want to get into any specific ivy

#

Itd just be cool to be doing frontier research in an area of math i love

vast gate
#

at least from what ive been told

mossy niche
#

your high school stats stop mattering around the time you step onto your college campus

tame sundial
#

But princeton being the best math school and all its interesting to think about what it takes to be competitive for it

#

I mean its probably 90% a lottery but still

mossy niche
#

i feel like princeton is much less a lottery than other places

#

you probably know if youre getting an offer

lost geyser
#

every second u spend thinking abt how to optimise getting into [school] is time u culd spend doing smth productive

tame sundial
#

But it was just a quick curiosity of mine

vast gate
tame sundial
mossy niche
#

i think they would just not offer the spot

#

save the money for future years

vast gate
#

maybe

#

if they arent completely panicking from the lack of applicants

lost geyser
#

our place is kinda screwed

#

cause it sent out acceptances in early jan + committed to not cancelling

#

so we had like twice? as many this yr than usuals

#

so i strongly beliebe there wont be a lot of spots for this yr

mossy niche
#

i think places like ucsd are being nice

#

they could still have an application process and just admit 1 student

lost geyser
#

it makes sense ngl

lost geyser
#

the answer is we dont know bc theres not enough reliable datasets

#

ppl give u anecdotes

sage harbor
#

Should I write my personal statement/statement of purpose in the same style as when i did it for undergrad?

#

I’m just worried about sounding robotic if I just go down the list of things they want

tacit lark
#

probably not

#

there are examples online

gentle basin
#

this is not undergrad admissions where you try to sob story your way in

rocky dome
gentle basin
#

true

#

but for a grad statement focus on why you’re interested in grad school and how your experiences have informed your interest etc

wind plinth
#

UT Austin wants the GENERAL GRE and the math is optional!?!?!?!?!?
im going insane. i only registered for math subject gre, because at the time that i registered to take it UT's requirements for this year hadn't updated and they didnt even require it at all, only berkeley and irvine did out of the schools im applying to and they wanted the subject test. if im applying to UT, i have to submit scores by their deadline right? so then I have to take it like... soon with minimal prep 😭
i mean i hear the general is pretty easy both on the math and non-math questions but like. that's just additional stress i have to go through and money i have to spend. grrrrrrrrr

shell kindle
#

Woe

#

Kind of a red flag low key

wind plinth
mossy niche
#

ut austin will be losing out on a lot of talent, then

outer reef
#

that is unfortunate

#

it might still be worth taking it just for UT, depending on where else youre applying and how strongly you’d consider attending if accepted

#

i took general gre for just 1 place i applied, where i was very interested in attending

#

didnt get in but i dont regret taking it at all

outer reef
#

also i thought mgre started losing popularity during pandemic

wind plinth
#

ASU is also requiring it and i was considering them at some point

outer reef
#

the test is really easy

#

assuming some english ability and familiarity with sat/act style questions

#

you might want to review some of the writing prompts

#

i glanced through them the night before i took it to get a sense for how the essay part of the test would go

#

maybe just do a few practice problems to build confidence

lost seal
#

Hey

lost seal
#

I am international and idk what I'm doing

gentle basin
#

general is worse than useless at giving any actual useful info to an admissions committee

#

if they're requiring the general over the subject then that raises serious questions about what their priorities are

hidden sleet
hidden sleet
# hidden sleet bruh

One of the points in their "Main criteria" literally said (and still says) "Performance on the Mathematics Subject GRE, and (less importantly) on the general GRE."

fossil depot
#

Shot in the dark but is anyone here currently in or is applying to U of T math grad programs?

wind plinth
#

wait how the hell did they pull that off

#

ah. so even though strictly speaking they had an incomplete application their reserach experience was so good they got in just off of that

#

well
i wish i had that problem lmao

#

i do have some research experience but it's nothing exceptional

#

i did my undergrad at a very bad school but i got a masters (in statistics) from a T25 in the US (but i want to do a math phd not stats)

#

yeah

#

ye

#

well and it looks like you can essentially take the general gre whenever, its not like the math one where there are only a handful of dates in the year and you have to register for one

#

xd

wind plinth
#

grfp solicitation says you have to be a first year grad student in your first grad program to be eligible... so if i have master's im SOL??

tacit lark
#

it would seem so

wind plinth
#

🫠

outer reef
#

hasnt that always been true

#

wait does that mean they killed the 2nd year eligibility

tacit lark
outer reef
#

there are already exams for gauging english proficiency lol

#

gre general isnt going to do anything wrt that

#

im pretty sure no math department would ask for it if given the choice

#

it’s occasionally required some places bc the university imposed general GRE as an admission requirement for all of their graduate programs

nova hare
#

So how are PhD applicants in general going

#

I know last year there were way less acceptances because of the funding cuts

#

(U.S.)

#

Will it be the same this cycle then?

tacit lark
#

probably will be the same. Doesn't seem like things are really better. The NSF didn't go away.

nova hare
#

Darn

blissful crystal
#

yea this cycle is probably so cooked

pallid geode
#

I want to ask one of my professors who taught a course that I really liked and did well in for a letter of recommendation but I don’t think he knows me that well. I spoke to him a couple times though. Is this socially acceptable and the right move or not ?

smoky jetty
#

I think this is the socially acceptable way to ask "can you write a letter + do you think it is a good idea for you to write a letter for me"

#

it's not great that they don't know you that well, hence why I asked question 1

pallid geode
#

thank you that is good advice

#

I don't think I know anyone better that is in a field I'm interested in sadly kind of sucks im trying to get to know people but not sure how to in a way thats not vapid

#

just got to do what I can

pallid geode
smoky jetty
#

My 3 letters were
1: math prof from REU I did
2: I did some applied graph theory stuff with a guy in aerospace, got a letter from them
3: I was a TA for a course in the CS department, got a letter from that prof

#

In a pure math program, no interest in applied math or graph theory either

pallid geode
#

Ok good to know

#

Going to think about who I can ask

outer reef
#

different math topic or something besides math?

pallid geode
#

sorry i think its a mistranslation

#

i think the proper english term is area

#

or discipline

outer reef
#

all of these are vague

#

and my clarifying question applies equally to all of them

#

i think as long as theyre mathematicians it’s fine

pallid geode
#

I am interested in abelian varieties this person is doing research on abelian varieties this is what I meant

outer reef
#

they can be nonmathematicians too but there are more ways for such letters to be bad

pallid geode
#

Oh I see the confusion

pallid geode
outer reef
#

what course did you take with this prof?

pallid geode
#

a course on elliptic curves

smoky jetty
#

do not restrict yourself to solely seeking letters from your specific research interest in math

outer reef
#

generally you should get letters from people from whom you learned advanced material and also formed a semblance of a relationship with them

pallid geode
#

I see

outer reef
#

ignore my horrible grammar

pallid geode
#

that makes sense I wasnt aware

outer reef
#

also not all your letters have to be outstanding

#

ideally some of them will be from profs who know you well and can give substantive evidence of your preparation for graduate school beyond your transcript

#

but it’s also ok for some to be more like “did well in my class”

#

you can also talk to letter writers who dont know you as well about your application to give them more to say

smoky jetty
outer reef
#

yeah the first two seem fine

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the third seems quite suboptimal

#

but idk what being a TA entailed

pallid geode
#

I don't know know any proffesors well beyond talking after class and I'm not sure how I can get to know people well ahah kind of a psycho thing to type im not a robot i swear

smoky jetty
pallid geode
outer reef
#

oh wow

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fair enough

smoky jetty
#

so he knew me very very well

gentle basin
#

need to get my statement of purpose drafted and revised a bit before i can show it to my reference writers shiver

smoky jetty
#

but we never did research or anything together (he only taught, no research)

outer reef
#

thats good then

smoky jetty
#

but I wager it was a good letter

#

but my point is that you don't have to only look at profs who do your area of interest

pallid geode
#

yes thank you

#

I am going to think about who to approach and try to get to know people somehow

outer reef
#

going to office hours or doing reading courses is a good way

pallid geode
#

Two people have adviced me to send out emails to people whose research I find interesting in order to find phd positions (eu). What would be a good way to phrase such an email? Feels like asking for a PhD position is not usefull and possibly socially undesirable.

outer reef
#

you may as well ask people if they can write strong letters

#

socially undesirable?

#

isnt that how it works in europe?

pallid geode
#

I wish I knew

outer reef
#

are you not european

pallid geode
#

Yes

outer reef
#

idk exactly how it works but some people on this server certainly will

#

but if you got that advice it might be good lol

#

you could ask people you know to forward you the emails they sent when in your position

pallid geode
#

Yes you are right it just feels kind of weird to write such an email.

undone yacht
pallid geode
#

Good to know

undone yacht
# pallid geode Good to know

And here Ph.D. positions are most often just a normal job application for a specific project (there are alo other types, but less so) then you just contact the person hiring if you want to in advance

pallid geode
undone yacht
#

yes

pallid geode
#

ok good

undone yacht
pallid geode
#

ty

undone yacht
#

(you need a masters)

pallid geode
#

Yea Im in masters degree rn

smoky jetty
#

This is also common in basically every field in the US

#

If not more common than UG -> masters -> PhD

undone yacht
#

👍 it is technically possible, but I think it is pretty rare, personally never met anybody. like you say maybe for more applied fields

smoky jetty
#

What's common in CS is people who work in industry getting a course-based masters

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Thesis based masters is quite rare

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Yes very common for people in math to go UG to PhD

#

Here PhD is longer, you get the masters “on the way”

#

Your first 2 years of phd in US are mostly reading and courses

#

Oh uh, maybe? I didn’t do one

#

UG thesis is like 50/50

#

I think

#

Probably less tbh

mossy niche
#

most fields feels like 2nd year start researching mostly

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exception is alggeo

#

yes

#

at my institution, they isually graduate in 4

tacit lark
#

yes it common to go straight to phd. Seems more common than not unless you're an international student.

mossy niche
#

but funding is guaranteed for 5 and you can stay longer if you want

#

where did you pull these numbers

#

those teaching numbers are criminal

#

some profs want 80 hour work weeks from their students, dont work with them

#

they say this to justify paying you

#

its never 15 hours unless its finals week or something

#

i feel like 10 hours is a high upper bound

outer reef
#

it depends very strongly on the university and the course instructor

smoky jetty
#

I work 55 hours a week on average according to my time tracking stuff

#

This counts teaching, self study, courses, seminars, meetings

#

Sometimes that grows to 60 sometimes that's closer to 40

outer reef
#

usually more like 12-15

outer reef
smoky jetty
#

Yea my teaching takes 12-13 hours a week

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And I'm pretty efficient with my prep and grading

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(maybe this is why no one comes to my office hours 😭)

glacial pendant
limber zephyr
#

All the schools I've been at have have had no option for undergrad "thesis", it's definitely not common

tacit lark
#

It depends what you mean by common. Its certainly not 50/50 but its definitely common.

#

Many schools offer them

limber zephyr
#

In the US? I've been to 3 separate schools with no mention of them, so assumed they weren't. Do you have an estimate on the percentage that offer.

wheat grove
#

should I write short articles summarizing summer research results/what I learned and post them somewhere?

#

just so in grad apps they can link to that

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I did do summer research during my undergrad, though I didnt end up publishing

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two of them were more learning than trying to solve a problem and the third we're still messing around a bit

glacial pendant
#

That sounds like a great idea! If your advisors are up for it, you could ask them to take a look too and see whether they think this portrays your work in the best light

#

But also I guess it’s worth considering that some schools explicitly say they won’t read attached papers and some have space for you to attach work

gaunt quarry
#

Hey all, I am planning a 1 year masters in stats and data analytics, and after some convos with my advisor it seems as though I need to decide most of my workload and what I want to take up. I have a bcs in comp sci and came here to ask if anyone has advice about interesting problems and areas to look into considering my background + the masters, some areas i should research deeper and other things you might want to share that could be helpful. Thanks in advance!

abstract mortar
#

Which channel should I look for people who are interested in participating in an event (more specifically CIMPA School)?

raw quail
#

It's a big thing in US honors programs and liberal arts colleges.

#

Idk about outside the US

lone vessel
#

depends on the honors program and the university

limber zephyr
#

I remember at ASU you had to do a thesis to graduate in the honors program, but you could also just not do the honors program and it was only a small number of people who did the honors program anyways

limber zephyr
# gaunt quarry Hey all, I am planning a 1 year masters in stats and data analytics, and after s...

I'm not qualified to actually help, but for the people who are qualified it might help to specify European/American system. If you're asking about "problems to look into" then I'm guessing you're also doing a masters with a thesis, but one year feels far too short for that to me (again not really qualified to speak about this though). I don't know if you should expect to do much research but maybe in an applied area like data analytics it's different.

#

Also, what are you hoping to do after the master's?

gaunt quarry
limber zephyr
#

Okay that makes a lot more sense then

gaunt quarry
limber zephyr
#

In the US it is not very common to go into masters knowing what you want, but that also makes me even less qualified

#

I'm curious enough to ask about things at least I suppose

gaunt quarry
#

that's totally fair

limber zephyr
#

So you're doing the 4-1 at your school? That narrows it down at least to professors there I assume?

gaunt quarry
#

correct

limber zephyr
#

I think it makes sense then to try to find something that aligns with the research of faculty at your school then

#

Have you looked at recent papers by people there?

gaunt quarry
#

that is a great idea actually, I should definitely see that, haven't yet

limber zephyr
#

Sometimes I'm able to offer good advice, at least that's a more universal thing that's not restricted to the American system

#

But maybe another person here will have further comments that are more helpful to the specific situation or to correct anything incorrect I have said

gaunt quarry
#

however, for stats and data analytics, the number of students enrolling in that program is very small, so doubt I'd find exact papers on that, but exploring surrounding areas should provide me with some guidance

gaunt quarry
#

I'll have a look at papers first thing in the morning

wispy sage
#

Would a 160 verbal, 166 quantitative, 3.5 writing score on the GRE be a positive on an application for most math Master's programs where score reporting is optional? Or should I not report?

tacit lark
#

im not sure

#

i dont think US masters programs are very competitive so probably

spring isle
#

I studied Applied Mathematics as an undergraduate and am now studying art as a graduate student. I would like to study math as a PhD student.

I'm thinking about how to find letters of recommendation for my graduate school application (I want to get a PhD in pure math). I need one more letter. I'm also wondering whether any mathematicians would be willing to regularly meet with me regarding the thesis for my current art degree, which will either be based on proof assistants/interactive theorem proving or based on the work of Tom Head (I haven't solidified my decision yet).

I could take a year off between my current Master's degree in art and the next PhD application cycle, but I'm not sure what I would do within that time frame. I would need to secure funding for any possible Master's or post-bacc program completed during that time period.

Do you guys have any advice? People are generally encouraging me to apply this cycle, which is interesting. I think my application is weak, though.

shell kindle
#

Who are your current letter writers?

spring isle
shell kindle
#

Are they the ones encouraging you to apply this cycle

spring isle
#

My undergraduate research was unfortunately in data science and not math. Hm, I haven’t asked them whether I should apply honestly…

shell kindle
#

Ok so it's your current drp mentor?

#

Who is a faculty member and not a grad student right

spring isle
#

I talk to a ton of people about my application, all the time. One PhD student and one professor I talked to encouraged me to apply this cycle. My DRP mentor is absolutely a grad student, I didn’t know that was a bad thing.

shell kindle
#

Ok a grad student writing a letter of rec for a phd program is not great in all honesty

spring isle
#

I see. Well, then I’m really out of letters.

shell kindle
#

This is really quite tricky

#

Hmmmmm

shell kindle
spring isle
#

Obvious attempts, on my part, to gain research experience have been unsuccessful- research experiences enable you to build relationships with mathematicians who might write letters for you! However, I did not succeed doing that.

spring isle
shell kindle
#

Ok

#

Hmmmm

spring isle
#

I am open to a break that would beef up my application, so to speak, but I’m not in the place to do an unfunded Master’s or something.

shell kindle
#

Ok the only benefit of a break in my mind is that you can get a letter from whoever will supervise your thesis

spring isle
#

Essentially my opinion as well. I don’t mind strengthening my skills or just being in school forever, without any end in sight, so another Master’s wouldn’t really bother me. I only found one funded Master’s in math, sadly (from a school I would want to attend).

shell kindle
#

Funded masters in math tend to be somewhat rare

spring isle
#

I think that’s true.

tacit lark
#

i know of a funded masters at clemson university

spring isle
#

Hm… if tuition is the only barrier, I might be able to do a Master’s in math. There are kind of more funding options than I initially thought, but I have to do more research. Would that be helpful for my PhD application, though? My end goal is to do research and become a math professor at a research university.

shell kindle
#

Yes it would be helpful

tacit lark
main storm
#

In canada masters are funded

cosmic magnet
spring isle
#

I want to, ultimately, become a math professor at a specific Ivy League school I have in mind. My bachelor’s degree is from a different Ivy (but I got bad grades), my Master’s is from a less selective but decently respected school, and I can see that my current options for the next school look terrible. Essentially, I would be attending schools with worse and worse academic rankings over time.

During my undergraduate studies, I got bad grades because of long-running personal issues that only subsided once I had graduated.

I wonder if, at this point, I could genuinely just go back to school to get a B.S. in pure math (instead of Applied Math) and stack up REUs. If I weren’t teaching math, I don’t know what else I would want to do with my life. I want to be able to become a professor, even if it takes me more time than the average person.

A problem - some schools actually don’t let people with a preexisting B.S. go back to school and get another one at their institution. This might be an exception to the rule, though.

gentle basin
#

i don't think going for a second bachelor's is worth it?

#

note also that getting faculty positions at the ivies is insanely competitive (and elsewhere due to the fucked state of academia in the US)

#

be realistic in your expectations

spring isle
gentle basin
#

if anything do a MS instead

#

a second BS is just a waste of time and money retreading shit you’ve already seen before

mossy niche
inner grove
# spring isle I want to, ultimately, become a math professor at a specific Ivy League school I...

There are people from outside of top 50 institutions in math PhD that get postdocs at Ivy leagues, or their like. I'd say if you're looking to pursue mathematics further, and you already have a MS degree, the options are to get another MS degree or to move forward with a PhD.

It's great to have a goal in mind, but life happens. At the end of the day, it's about learning and doing mathematics. Having an ivy league undergraduate is a huge accomplishment, even with subpar grades. And pushing forward towards a MS shows a lot of tenacity. Keeping going forward into a PhD program, and who knows where you'll land afterwards. Good research is done outside of ivy leagues. Who knows when or where you'll end up in your longer term career, or what results you'll prove; but it's clear getting hung up on prestige or going back to fix things is a step backwards, not forwards.

brittle bobcat
#

Guys, I have a quick question. As a student studying mathematics in an online degree program, how can I secure letters of recommendation from professors? What I mean is, since there aren’t many professors in my math department—and they usually don’t interact much with undergraduates—how can I forge meaningful connections within academia?

I’m asking because I want to apply to REUs as an international student living outside the US, which means the competition is going to be, well, insane. Presumably, letters of recommendation are meant to show my “ranking” within my cohort, which is why they need to come from professors (not just lecturers), and why I’ll need several of them.

I did contact one professor in my department to ask if he’d be open to supervising an independent learning project, but he said he’s too busy with PhD supervision. I’m not sure what the best next step is…

main storm
#

Grad / research stipend and ta work

spring isle
# main storm Grad / research stipend and ta work

I’m finding it difficult to research this directly on websites belonging to Canadian universities. I would definitely like to know more. Do international students get the grad/research stipend + TA work opportunities?

shell kindle
#

Not unexpected

#

Can’t tell if this application cycle or last application cycle will be more brutal

tacit lark
#

makes sense given the situation at harvard

glacial pendant
#

how are you determining this? not trying to be snarky im genuinely curious

gentle basin
#

these are among the schools that have been hit the hardest by drumpf’s bullshit

vast gate
#

how necessary are letters anyways

#

most of my upper division courses were taken under two professors, one died, the other retired

#

i only have one professor left that ive taken upper div under

#

i did research with my diff eq prof, but that kicked my ass on top of school, and i think she thinks im lazy now

#

also, the work i did wasnt good, and didnt make it on the paper, so i dont even have my name on it

#

im trying to get into a school with a good logic program, but the only ones with actual programs are very competitive

#

other than that i take my gre in less than two weeks

#

im hoping i can get in on that, but im not sure

#

i got a C in matrix theory and upper stats, so its looking rough
ive taken 6 upper division math courses

#

my gpa is a 3.6, im a double major

#

i need an honest call, like lets say i do well on the gre, maybe top percentile

#

what do you guys think my shot is at actually getting into a good grad logic program

blissful crystal
#

then gpa and coursework

vast gate
#

even with a double major? like theres no way in hell i can do research on top of constant 20 hour weeks

blissful crystal
#

obviously rough outline but idk, if you wanna get a rough idea of your chances (i guess) u can go to mathematicsgre.com to see what it looks like to get into top programs

#

cuz some people will post what theyve done and what schools they got into, obvously doesnt show letters of rec or sop but yk

vast gate
#

i tried and got a C in matrix theory and stats, because i was too busy learning what the hell a spectra of a diff eq is than studying

blissful crystal
#

🤷‍♂️

#

school is hard man

#

for everyone so

#

js do ur best on the apps and idk, only apply to schools you would go to but also apply realistically

vast gate
#

thats kind of where im stuck, i could get into like my unis grad programs, but i want to do logic, and im looking at like iu blooming at the easiest entry

#

is it just over for me

blissful crystal
#

i mean try looking at other lower tier schools if your concerned about ur app

#

surely some lower tier schools have at least one logic prof, thats all you need to be ur advisor lol

vast gate
#

i see

#

how deadly are those two Cs anyways

blissful crystal
#

but i mean sure shotgun apply to higher tier unis too ofc, reaches are a thing and maybe u get lucky yk

vast gate
#

matrix theory - my algebra credit
and stats

#

i took the other stats and got an A

#

both grad level

blissful crystal
#

idk ive heard gpa after like 3.5-3.6 dont matter that much

#

but also at the same time if you look at the people who got into top programs they be having 3.8+ anyways

#

but that could js be correlation like students who have those kinda gpas have all the other stuff u need too yk

vast gate
#

but this entire channel says otherwise, so im not really sure what to think

blissful crystal
#

i mean you look at the people who got into the top programs and they typically have at least one REU, or research experience at their uni

vast gate
#

right, but top is like harvard etc

blissful crystal
#

ye true

vast gate
#

i know im not getting in there

blissful crystal
#

well they have everything there

vast gate
#

i wish i could

#

their logic program for their undergrads looks great

blissful crystal
#

research signals that your not just talking out of ur ass that you want to do higher math yk

#

but things like independent readings or taking grad classes can show that too

#

yk not just doing the bare minimum basically

vast gate
#

they wouldnt be more sympathetic with a double major?

#

i think i would die if i had to do independent readings on top of everything else

#

and im only partially joking

blissful crystal
#

i mean it will help sure but idk how much yk

vast gate
#

i see

blissful crystal
#

like for me i work part time job

#

could i have done more if i didnt have to work? ye

#

but it is what it is yk, i did my best

vast gate
#

i guess the plan remains the same then

#

maybe a good gre will be convincing idk

blissful crystal
#

idk use ur sop to leverage ur strengths whatever those are

#

i think for gre the main thing it does is if u came from no name school it shows ur education was at the level of good schools

#

so yes that would help but yk gotta leverage ur other stuff

vast gate
#

i see

#

ill try my best

blissful crystal
#

good luck

tacit lark
vast gate
#

nothing other than self-study

tacit lark
#

id say your odds are not great

#

especially bc you don't seem to have strong letters to make up for other parts of your app.

#

idrk what top logic programs are but id say your odds arent great for top 50-40 phd programs.

#

just my honest opinion based on my experience and people ik

vast gate
#

top logic is like harvard

#

def not getting in there

#

the most realistic are schools like iu bloomington, and even then im not sure

#

ive yet to find a school with a lower bar for entry with an actual logic program and a sequence in provability

glacial arch
#

does anyone know how strongly upward trends are actually considered, my overall is like a 3.5 (between cc and uni) but my first bit at university was relatively rough. I took a fairly long break and have only been getting A's so far. fwiw the classes that I did relatively poorly in were all lower div my upper div math gpa is like 3.85.

shell kindle
#

You should write convincingly about it in your personal statement

#

Different schools will look upon trends differently but it's generally a positive

glacial arch
#

okay word I've been trying to figure out how to weave it in w/o it being like a sob story

#

or rather without it feeling like im trying to tell a sob story

shell kindle
#

Emphasize the personal growth

glacial arch
#

I do think like professionally I have put in a lot of legwork outside of just coming back and doing well in classes, like in the same span of the trajectory I also got a preprint + developed strong bonds w faculty

#

I think narratively building around that and how it's impacted my ability to take those actions is probably my best bet

tacit lark
ionic valley
worthy peak
#

I'm feeling kind of pessimistic about my chances now. Grades just aren't there and research experience is in a different field. Could have a better chance in e.g. engineering, but IDK. Anyway I'm probably aiming for a research masters as opposed to direct PhD which might help but who knows especially with the current funding environment in the US

inner grove
worthy peak
#

Also curious, in the "academic culture" of math and adjacent fields are grades or relationshp with profs more important

inner grove
#

e.g. if I wanted to go into Physics, then enrolling in a MS degree in physics might be a good idea, especially if an employer will help cover the cost

tame sundial
#

considering thats what leads to good letters