career-advice

[muted kraken]

I don't know if you guys might help me or not but I'm kinda having trouble creating a cover letter for a Database Admin job role where they didn't really give little to no requirements nor any kind of person specification 😦 The job salary also depends on my years of experience in the Engineering job field lol But haven't got any related job experience other than working on a small mini DB project in my 1st year of Uni

If you have work experience, mention it on the application form
The job salary depends on your years of experience in the engineering job field
The priority is for the applicants who reside in England.
It is also possible to accept applicants who do not have experience in the field.
Priority in recruitment is for applicants under the age of 45 years
If you want to join the company’s team, please fill out the application form. ```
How can I write a cover letter showing how I'll easily be able to fit in with the team and be willing to learn new things straightaway... after all I'm curious and compassionate person, well that's who I am in two words 😆

[minor lynx]

Hello overyone, im fairly new around here. I wanted to ask for your opinion. im 26 and doing a carreer change away from running my own busines and sales. I've consulted in business automation and integration, which required a minimal amount of coding but I was exposed to it.. I want to become a developer... but I'm undecided if i should just teach myself with online resources, do a boot camp, or go back to college.

So far I've made good progress laerning on online resources like codeacademy, but I trully dont know what employers are looking for. I heard many just want you to have the technical knowledge & portfolio to back it up... what would you guys recommend?

[orchid ivy]

@minor lynx , it really depends what you want to do and where you want to work. some places will require at least a bachelors in computer science or related field. i also pivoted from business to development. but i went back to school because i wasn't comfortable with teaching myself and i knew i would be open to more opportunities because of the school's career development/network

[minor lynx]

honestly, blockchain techonology really intreagues me, and is the first thing i plan to dive into as soon as i am more comfortable creating... but its a growing field so i understand the limitations. working somewhere like google or facebook wouldnt hurt either lol.

thank you for your response btw 🙂

[summer roost]

I'd definitely recommend doing at least a bootcamp, possibly going back to college for another degree. Degrees help to show employers that you're serious and able to commit to learning something in a way that self-teaching doesn't

and they both open up internship opportunities to you that would be unavailable, or at least less accessible, otherwise.

[minor lynx]

biggest thing that keeps me way is the expense, Covid was a catylist for this carreer change and cost with uni can be outrageous. But thank you, I just need other people to tell me what i dont want to believe i have to do i think. The cost, and fluff they add.

[summer roost]

bootcamps are a lot cheaper than universities

what country are you in?

[minor lynx]

US based, they have a few here, but I wasnt impressed with their project samples, at least the ones I looked at. and they are manlty focused on web design, which im not particularly excited about.

[summer roost]

you will probably learn something useful from them despite that - even if it's just learning some tools that employers would want you to know, and learning some areas that the bootcamp covered superficially that you want to go into more depth on.

Yeah, they do often focus on web development - though to be fair, that's probably the easiest specialization to break into without a degree

[minor lynx]

thats fair enough. do you think an online degree would suffice or would do they judge you by the program or school?

[summer roost]

every degree has been an online degree for the last year - I think there's much less stigma against it than there used to be

and I think any degree is better than no degree. You don't need maximum prestige, just something that shows that you're committed and have skin in the game, basically

[orchid ivy]

larger firms have what they call target schools, so yes they'll judge. but like @summer roost said, a degree helps. and as long as you have impressive projects and know your stuff, you will impress potential employers.

[summer roost]

I work at a larger firm, and we do have target schools - but they're more about where we invest our resources in terms of trying to recruit people

they're not really related to what happens once a resume lands on our desks

I mean, name recognition is always good, but it's not the end-all be-all.

[minor lynx]

its difficult to justify the cost, and time. just looking at the local community college their associates curriculum has some much wasted money on it.

I just have a problem with academia, but i hear where you guys are coming from. Thank you. good thing is ive done some of this stuff already to suffice half of the curriculum.

[orchid ivy]

good luck with your studies 🙂 changing careers is difficult, but also exciting and rewarding.

[summer roost]

The interesting thing is that Computer Science is not very related to software development as a profession. In fact, I'd go so far as to say it's fairly unrelated. People prefer to see a degree, and a CS degree is the most common one, but it's not terribly related to the job beyond the fact that most people in the job have one.

If any schools around you offer Software Engineering curricula, they might be more up your alley, if you're more interested in the practice than the theory.

[minor lynx]

do you guys think age is an issue in the hiring process. i feel being 26 in the industry is ancient to be applying for internships.

[orchid ivy]

lol. no. i was 28 when i interned.

[restive arrow]

Hey, no I dont think. I think it’s just about taking initiative

I’m 18. I have no experience. I just got an intern as junior security consultant, but I’m still working towards a CS degree as well

[summer roost]

That makes it more likely that you get the internship, honestly - more experience for the same pay? What employer wouldn't jump at that, heh

[restive arrow]

Do you guys think it’s possible to interchange between cyber sec and software development?

[summer roost]

yes, certainly

[orchid ivy]

also, pretty sure that would be discrimination. you would have to check statutory laws.

[minor lynx]

i ask because of things i heard in the past lol

[summer roost]

Your age becomes a protected category once you're 40 years old in the US.

[orchid ivy]

yeah. at the federal level. but NYS Human Rights Law protects 18 and over.

#knowyourrights ^^

[summer roost]

TIL, good to know.

[cloud burrow]

Hi everyone! I need your input on this. I have only started learning Python around March this year. I am able to understand simple concepts and try them from time to time.

Currently, I will be working with a client to transition their database reports to automated Python. I have not seen their data yet but right now, I am deeply overwhelmed. I guess it's the putting everything together that scares me? I can understand strings, variables, integers, for/while loops etc but I can't seem to picture how everything will be arranged. I have been learning thru online and have slowed down so I won't be overloaded with concepts but I can't seem to shake that I will not be able to deliver.

Also, this is a shift of career for me. My prior line of work and degree is totally different from where I am right now. Any tips on what I should focus on? The amount of info available is HUGE.

[minor lynx]

if you dont mind me asking what type of projects do you work on?

[orchid ivy]

i'm at a bank. i work on proprietary apps.

[summer roost]

I'm at a big FinTech firm, working on our Python Infrastructure team. We're broadly responsible for maintaining the health of the Python ecosystem in the company, and do stuff that's all over the place.

[minor lynx]

im doing the CS course on code academy online. Their CS 102 is specifically about Data Structures & Algorithms. That may help? While consulting i met a guy that taught me alot, he basicaly didnt code almost anything himself... but outsourced it... depending on your time table... & security needs of the project. that may be the option.

On that note, What do you guys think of the CS course on code academy, its kinda like a codecamp, and they give a certification.. but not sure how much weight that actually has.

[orchid ivy]

if you do not have any database experience, i would highly recommend shadowing someone who can do the work. or like @minor lynx said, to outsource.

@summer roost , is your team hiring? lol jkjkjk

[minor lynx]

fitting name mr godly

[summer roost]

I give approximately no weight to certificates, honestly. I have no way of knowing which ones are worthwhile and which aren't, so I'm forced to assume they're all worthless and make candidates prove otherwise in the interview.

[minor lynx]

all i need is to land interview. ill compulsively obssess over learning as much as possible and being able to answer questions. 😆

[orchid ivy]

you have to hustle. i would spend hours studying and networking. it's definitely not easy.

[summer roost]

the biggest trick to that is just apply to lots and lots of jobs.

[orchid ivy]

your chances of getting hired are better if the recruiter knows you or you can get a referral

[minor lynx]

but thank you, i assumed so. This code academy thing didnt really have hopes for giving me actual validity... but the knowledge its teaching me is pretty good. and not fluff.. which i love.

[minor lynx]

whats the best way to meet receuiters? 👀

[polar mesa]

job fair

[cloud burrow]

Thanks everyone! I will look into those

[orchid ivy]

lord, with the pandemic, it's very difficult. but keep an eye out for any virtual recruiting events.

[minor lynx]

im happy to say, most programmers ive met online have been nothing but encouraging and helpful. You guys didnt fail to meet the same expierence. THANKS 🙂

[orchid ivy]

you can also get involved with organizations like girls who code, lgbtqia tech communities, etc.

always happy to help 🙂

[summer roost]

meeting other programmers, at conferences, user groups, meetups, things like that, is a good way to find out where other people are working, whether they like it or not, whether they're hiring...

and having someone say "hey I talked to this guy for a while and he seems to really know his stuff" is a good way to get past some of the HR filtering.

[minor lynx]

sadly im not a girl, though my alphabet soup landing is still up in the air 🤔 . I'll look into those things options too. thank you.

[summer roost]

girls who code is fine with male mentors

[orchid ivy]

you can still be an ally.

[summer roost]

I've heard good things about BlackGirlsCode, too.

[minor lynx]

how true is it that once you've learned on language the rest become much easier? im getting the hang of python basics. but i know i have much to learn.

[orchid ivy]

once you learn the basics, you will pick up other languages quickly. you'll learn to spot the similarities when you become familiar with semantics and syntax.

[summer roost]

There's a few different major types of languages, and once you learn one program that uses a particular paradigm, it's easier to learn another that uses the same paradigm.

Learning about classes and object oriented programming is hard no matter what language you're learning it in, but once you know one OOP language, you'll have a much easier time picking up the next one.

that is, it's a concept that people struggle to learn, but once you know the concept you can pick up the way that concept is used in many languages.

[minor lynx]

lol nvm answered my own question. python is considered an object oriented language right?

[summer roost]

yep.

[minor lynx]

https://tenor.com/view/dance-ayeee-music-dancing-beat-gif-15124757

here i am mastering OOPs 😆

[summer roost]

Python is more object oriented than most object oriented languages, actually. In Python everything is an object.

Most OOP languages have primitives that are not objects. Python doesn't.

[minor lynx]

honestly, i've found the python syntax very easy to understand and follow so far. I have some experience with Wixcode & javascript but python makes sense to me so much more

[summer roost]

JavaScript is also weird, even among other OOP languages. JavaScript uses what's called "prototypical inheritance", rather than "class based inheritance"

[minor lynx]

just showing you guys what ive been learning. This is pretty basic concept review problem. but this is how its pacing it.

[severe cradle]

does advanced CS require a lot of Math

[vapid jay]

requires a lot of logic, i would say

[chrome rover]

^

[minor lynx]

What sushil said.

[summer roost]

depends on what you mean by "advanced", also. Machine Learning is basically all math.

As is cryptography

but a specialization like Operating Systems requires essentially no math

[vapid jay]

@short iris This channel isn't for recruitment, sorry.

[short iris]

okay sorry

[plush galleon]

Where does it come from?

[plush galleon]

You can't recruit on this server

[short iris]

Got it !

[agile palm]

how to get ntry level job in python

[vapid jay]

hello! if there is anybody to make python projects together I'm here!
if you think positive just let me know!

here is my GitHub page : https://github.com/armagangok

[vapid jay]

:0

i would choose OS dev, but, i hate design relatdd work, so i will go with ML and Ai

[lament pawn]

Hi
I want to rewrite my resume does using a template from Google Docs look like i'm not taking any effort?

[merry adder]

You can check out novoresume.

[tight perch]

what is internship

[compact walrus]

hmm

[minor lynx]

It's from the Code Cademy CS COURSE

[minor lynx]

Is there a channel where people can recruit? I'd be interested in the opportunities

[bleak violet]

Can someone suggest some good python courses (online)

[vapid jay]

No, we don't allow for recruitment in the server since it'd be tough for us to be able to ensure that scam offers aren't posted - there are two links in the channel description for job opportunities though!

[vapid jay]

That's not on topic for this channel, but feel free to run !resources in #bot-commands to get a curated list

[bleak violet]

Thanks

[static patio]

hey i need a heklp

[vapid jay]

not here, #❓｜how-to-get-help

[wide rose]

hi

I am pretty good in python and still learning django but I need to training on my skills there's a group or smth can help me?

[vapid jay]

Ive made several APIs and ive reached a state where i think i have learnt the intermediate stuff

question is, how much do i need for a potential future job

[minor lynx]

Making APIs is intermediate? 💀😭🤣... I thought being able to work with apis was intermediate

[vapid jay]

I mean Ive been coding py for 4 years it seems pretty easy

[lucid vapor]

The best way to train your skills is to make a production app, something someone can actually use. I'm not sure of a group, but you can always ask for help or chat about Django in #web-development.

[vapid jay]

so making an API is hard? well then idk what else to learn, currently connecting my api to an android app and make it cross platform

[minor lynx]

What is Django?

[vapid jay]

web framework

[odd parcel]

What's time for you?

something that's limit your career / your life?

[lucid vapor]

It's a very powerful web framework that follows the model–template–views architectural pattern (I think that's what it's called). It has a template language, allows you to interact with databases using an ORM, authentication, and other very useful tools.

[vale canyon]

Hello, I've just came here.

[vapid jay]

hi

[minor lynx]

Hi

[minor lynx]

I'll be looking into it tonight, I looked at their website site, and looks really cool. Specially since I hate front end.

[vapid jay]

I just Started a project on object Detection(YOLO)... Can you please recommend a few study materials or research papers to help me with that?

[night spear]

i want to work at apple

[civic ingot]

guys how to disable readers mode and enabling warnings

[heady tree]

What's python project should be done?

I am a just a beginner with only basics knowledge of python.

[toxic ore]

you can start with image processing

using python opencv library

[heady tree]

Okay thank you!

[toxic ore]

it's basic but very useful for understanding concept of blurring image by using matrix

[toxic ore]

😄

[ember wind]

Is learning python alone more difficult than in uni?

[meager pond]

Hi everyone, I'm new to the server and relatively new to Python and programming (Started about a month ago).

I'm really interested in artificial intelligence development. So I thought I'd start learning Python programming first and then move on to machine learning. But I don't want to skip anything along the way.

I was hoping to get advice from an expert to draw a roadmap from point (Python Beginner) to (ML Developer) including learning materials and exercises.

Thanks in advance

P.S. I'd also like to mention I have no background in data science and a relatively poor background in lin algebra, statistics and calculus (Not sure if that affects anything)
Also I'm not sure if this is the correct channel

[unborn belfry]

where to find other peoples code???

[unborn belfry]

bro is machine learning used in apps/websites or robots(sophia the robot)???????

[meager pond]

yeah i think some apps use artificial intelligence. almost certain sophia the robot does

[gusty carbon]

https://github.com

[meager pond]

Thanks for the information.

[trim osprey]

Advice for someone hoping to enter data science field who is a fresher and relatively new to programming

[whole nest]

Any telugu guy's

[vapid jay]

Howdy fellers. So quick tldr about me. I got my bachelors in CS but didn't really bother to learn any code, at the time I wasn't motivated. I started learning python seriously a couple days ago. Doing some online learning stuff, watching courses on youtube. Im hoping to get some sort of python dev job. What is a good way to learn?

[urban geode]

@vapid jay start by picking up the basics, get comfortable with them, create some projects that put what you know to use in a context that's useful to you

[vapid jay]

ok ty

[outer dragon]

Hey guys. I have a question. I've been a truck driver for the past 7 years or so. How do you guys feel I should handle that on my resume when applying for dev positions? I feel like it reflects poorly on me because people make assumptions about the personality characteristics of truck drivers, be it consciously or subconsciously. I've currently been leaving it off my resume entirely and only focusing on my programming experience. I don't really have enough programming experience either, so my resume ends up looking like I don't have much to show.

[summer roost]

Don't leave it off your resume. You don't have to put as many bullet points for that job as you do for the ones that you think are more relevant for the posting, but leaving it off the resume entirely isn't good. Lots of people switch careers, and good companies are looking for candidates from diverse backgrounds with different points of view - for the right company, that history will be an asset.

[outer dragon]

Hmm. Interesting perspective. Thank you

[orchid ivy]

if you can come up with substantial bulletpoints that demonstrate how those skills are transferrable, keep it on your resume.

[outer dragon]

I have tried before but it ends up sounding so contrived

[summer roost]

and interviewing a bunch of people who all have basically the same background gets kinda boring. You might get some interviews just based on having an interesting backstory, and sounding like an interesting person to talk to 🙂

[outer dragon]

There isn't much skill crossover between trucking and programming to be honest lol. But I will take your advice and I will put it on my resume in a limited fashion

[orchid ivy]

if you'd like, i can review your resume 🙂

[outer dragon]

I will let you, but I know I'm not where I need to be as a programmer yet, so my portfolio is thin

[summer roost]

I expect that it would sound forced. I wouldn't worry about demonstrating transferable skills, honestly - just demonstrating that you were gainfully employed for 7 years is better than having a 7 year gap, or 7 years of sparse history, or whatever. Some things that might carry over are dealing with schedules and the need to meet deadlines, I guess.

[outer dragon]

Ability to sit in one spot for 14 hours at a time lol

Gilly, If I send you my resume I'm going to be fully doxxing myself

[orchid ivy]

yes, but you also need to operate the truck and navigation equipment in alignment with company safety, DOT, and local traffic standards and regualtions

you can redact your personal info. lol. and only share your resume if you're comfortable

[outer dragon]

Ok I'll have to figure out how to black out sections on a pdf lol. I'm good at computers don't worry

[summer roost]

and keep focus and not zone out! But I think that's hard to sell on a resume, even though it's actually a valuable skill

[outer dragon]

Driving a truck is more zoning out than you'd think lol

[orchid ivy]

lol we're trying to help you here XD

[summer roost]

you've got some part of your brain that's still on and paying attention, even though it may not be taking much conscious effort

and the ability to do a repetitive task for a long time and make few mistakes is a valuable skill for a developer.

[cursive swift]

(btw) sry to interrupt but @outer dragon if ur name means tone deaf i love it, its funny

[outer dragon]

Yeah!

It's a joke, my irl name is Tony, and I play music but poorly

[tardy coyote]

Hey all,

I'm looking for some career advice.

I'm currently a contractor for one of the faang companies, but I have some historical tie with another startup.

The startup really wants me for full time, and they're willing to match whatever the faang company will offer their engineers.

The reason why I bring this up is because back on the startup, I was the only Data/ML engineer that built everything and I didn't like the burden.

I'm wondering how would you guys feel in this situation.

[orchid ivy]

it depends on what you want. if you think you'll have the opportunity to grow and learn a lot more in the startup, then i'd take it.

[summer roost]

I was the only Data/ML engineer that built everything and I didn't like the burden.
I think that's a normal situation at a start-up - the smaller they are, the more likely that they don't have any redudancy, and that one person has lots and lots of different responsibilities.

[summer roost]

Why did you leave the startup? If it was for more money, then going back to them for more money seems reasonable. If it was because you were overburdened, then going back doesn't seem reasonable, because there's no reason to believe you'd be any less overburdened.

[tardy coyote]

Hello,

I didn't necessarily leave but they didn't have funds at the time. So then I took a contracting job to put food on the table while parking my time with them as an advisor.

I believe they have acquired funds from fundraising recently, and now they're looking to hire.

I think you raise a huge point because after I wrote my message I started thinking about how it was a bit rough to be the only person on the team and if I do want to go back that would be the biggest concern as opposed to the compensation. You're also right, it is normal and expected for a startup. And now I need to weigh between growing experience vs staying at a big company.

Personally my career goal is to become a principal engineer, one thing I'm worried about is if I do go back and things don't turn out well, for example if the startup fails, will it be possible to spin that into a positive experience in the future?

Also thank you so much for responding.

[summer roost]

one thing I'm worried about is if I do go back and things don't turn out well, for example if the startup fails, will it be possible to spin that into a positive experience in the future?
Most startups fail - around 90% fail within 5 years, I believe is the statistic. It won't reflect poorly on you, no one will think that the startup failing is your personal fault. You'll put on the resume what you learned from and took away from the job, and you'll move on with your career.

[tardy coyote]

That's what I'm thinking too. If I do go back onboard, I'm looking to try my best to make them succeed but if that doesn't turn out well then I'll just tell others that I have tried my best.

[placid rock]

Anyone know the best way to learn python?

[clear belfry]

codecademy or udemy is free

doesnt get full fledged but its pretty easyi

idk bout udemy but codecademy has a pro subscription thats worth it

python 2 is free to learn but 3 is sadly Pro member only...

also wuts the best software for python (IDLE, pyCharm or something else?)

[eager summit]

https://www.py4e.com/lessons Really great spot to start out imo. It's free and if you do well in the course, you could go and earn certs from coursera for this exact course.

[unkempt olive]

Thanks. I also heard Learn Python The hardway is a really good resource. There's a free resource on udacity as well

[vapid jay]

I prefer Visual Studio Code (if you're talking about softwares like those?)

[sour nacelle]

I usually use Visual Code Studio but if its just for python I use IDLE.

[swift tulip]

anyone here who is doing computer science or finance with main degree in Physics???

[muted mountain]

My degree is Chemistry .

[swift tulip]

ok

[muted mountain]

Why phisics?

[swift tulip]

because i'm doing physics

[muted mountain]

Oh.

[swift tulip]

can we talk in dm pls?

[muted mountain]

Sure

[worthy violet]

Hey everyone! I got a job as a data analyst using python and sql! I’ve been a DA for 4 years but it’s mainly been excel reporting. I am leaving a cushiony and boring job for something new and exciting (15% more pay too)! I’m scared out of my mind though because you never know how your manager is until you begin working. I hope they’re somewhat flexible! Wish me luck 🙂

Oh, and my python was all self taught if it gives anyone hope. SQL and tableau mostly too

[normal harness]

Attaboy thanks for sharing!!!

[worthy violet]

Thanks buddy! I am really scared because my last job gave 4 weeks PTO a year, and this job only 2 weeks, but it's totally remote so maybe I can still travel and vacation that way lol! I haven't worked remote too much :p

[plush galleon]

I guess your 2-hours research was deeper than my own

I programmed more than 100 hours with Java outside of my courses and even if I don't like it, the main problem with your statement is that you didn't test C# and you are experiencing confirmation bias

[unborn belfry]

hi guys.
i finally completed my high school today.
So for uni im taking computer science engineering(ml/ai).
but i also wanna be a robotics engineering(building robots).
is it possible to somehow mix both of them?

[regal nova]

dm me if interested in my status

[inner fox]

Has anyone here completed gsoc with a python project?

[near ocean]

gsoc?

[inner fox]

Google summer of code

[real ocean]

hi can someone please help me with my hw?

[primal sandal]

Has anyone here given the AP Exam for Computer Science A? I'm considering to take it

[dreamy minnow]

Should I move on from python? Can you make a living from python?

[unreal orchid]

Yeah 👀

[dreamy minnow]

It seem to easy to do it as a job. LUL

[primal sandal]

Anyone?

[dreamy minnow]

haven't passed middle school yet so cant help you with that.

[primal sandal]

Yeah, you can def make a living from it, but I think it's better if you know more languages

[primal sandal]

Oh okay, I heard about AP exams for the first time today -_-

[dreamy minnow]

although it can certainly get hard if you go deeper thats what she/he said i had to i'm sorry

[summer roost]

It will definitely be helpful to learn more languages, but there are some jobs that require only Python If you also know HTML/CSS/JavaScript, it opens up full stack web development to you. If you also know a backend language like Java or C# or C or C++, it opens up a wider variety of backend jobs to you

[plucky nymph]

Guys im looking to get a job in the field, and I was wondering if DevOps is the type of position with the most hiring right now? It seems to have a lot of openings everywhere I look.

I'm just trying to determine what things I need to learn so I can focus on those

for the best chance of getting a job in the field

[summer roost]

what kind of job do you want in the field? A DevOps job and a Software Engineering job are pretty different. Software Engineering focuses more on building new applications, DevOps focuses more on deploying and monitoring existing applications.

[plucky nymph]

I don't know yet. I've been teaching myself how to code for the past few months and feel like I have a great grasp on Python and a decent understanding of JavaScript. But my understanding is that it is more competitive to get a software engineering job than a DevOps job because many people can code but not as many know the inner workings of Docker/Kubernetes/Cloud Services?

[marsh wind]

I'd recommend to look and evaluate job postings in area you plan to work in. Demand for software engineering is high pretty much everywhere but so is supply. DevOps can be a bit more of a coin toss I believe, depending on location...

[plucky nymph]

Honestly I was hoping to work remote

Actually that's kind of a requirement unless I can find something local

Funny actually I just looked at an opening for Goodreads as a software engineer and it lists DevOps as preferred qualifications

[marsh wind]

Well still worth checking remote job listing... Idk if there are many full devops full remote positions.
Many companies like their devs to do some devops since it saves $ of hiring separate person. And might not be even needed depending of their operations scale.

[summer roost]

that happens sometimes - the boundaries between DevOps and Software Engineering are fuzzy, and sometimes companies want an SE that does a bit of DevOps, or a DevOp that does a bit of SE. That should give you a hint that the job is probably more ops-y than the average SE job.

[marsh wind]

And it always helps if dev can do some small things alone while devops might be busy setting up new projects pipelines for example and etc

[summer roost]

There's also companies that don't officially have both DevOps and SE as a role - instead they only have SE's, some of whom mostly do ops.

[marsh wind]

Our company which is about 20 people working on dev side and has smth like 3 ongoing bigger products and few things in prototype or experimental phases has single cloud eng/devops guy. So it's kinda must that at least a person per projects knows some devops

P. S. Should be me in my team but I still didn't have time to learn more devops 😂

[summer roost]

In companies without devops, the "ops" people and the "development" people are on the same team reporting to the same manager, and work more closely together than they would if they were separate teams with separate management chains.

[marsh wind]

In ideal world tho a team would have aside from devs one devops and one QA and one UI/UX at least all under same manager

[plucky nymph]

Alright well I will keep working on software development projects and teach myself devops subjects on the side so I can keep my options open

seems like there are many remote openings in both roles

[vernal spade]

anyone know what i should start with to get into software development

[terse saddle]

i kinda had the same question i wanted to know where the best place to start learning is

i started using a website a while ago but it didn't really help and i'm back to where im started

[gritty scaffold]

Don't know if you're still here, but what I find an effective way to learn

Is to learn a few core fundamentals about programming in general, without worrying too much about language. Nothing super complicated and if you're motivated, it's maybe an hour or so of effort before diving into a language

But look into the fundamentals of data types like the differences between an integer and a floating point value and what the limitations of both are. Then how a program is composed. That is, what a loop is and why you might want to be repeating instructions and the basics of conditional statements

From there, it should be relatively easy to grasp python and the rationale as to why you are doing what you are doing

As these concepts are universal* across most programming languages

*Programming languages that you will typically encounter early on like C, C++, Python, JavaScript, Java, Swift and so on.

It might just be me, but I find a lot of tutorials I take a look at for people wanting to learn are too focused on having people make things immediately without necessarily explaining the fundamentals and why they are fundamental.

But either way, you will be fine and it's not as daunting as it may look

[teal wolf]

Im using a website called udacity to learn and it teaches about arithmetic operators and variables is this needed?

[gritty scaffold]

Absolutely

I have never used udacity, but I believe it's a good resource

But a firm understanding of variables and how to effectively use them will be huge in you writing software

One last piece of advice I have, well two but they're related is to never copy and paste code samples when doing tutorials or reading books. Always read what you're working from and then write it in yourself. The understanding you will gain will be a lot deeper. Then when you have successfully finished an exercise, I always suggest people then try a new exercise of their own invention and try and use the concept they just learned in a way that is newish from what the book said just to check you understand it

[teal wolf]

What are the main stuff I need. Variables, Integers, Floats, Booleans, Strings, Loops etc?

[cursive swift]

not to interrupt, but for when the above question is answered, how would I go about making a resume? would a correctly formatted google doc work? I tried google, but everyone in the results just wants you to use their website and give them money, im in hs and don't need any extensive resume but I just thought I might make smthn before I apply for a job

[vapid jay]

depends on the job your dealing with , its a good practice knowing as much as you can , thats what a programmer does

[gritty scaffold]

@teal wolf That will give you most of what you need! I feel like if you at least quickly read up on the idea of what each of these things are before starting a tutorial on a specific language and understand what they are, you should be able to breeze through most tutorials

As none of these things are Python specific, if you decide a little later on that Python isn't for you, you will be able to easily transfer that knowledge to some other language.

That is not to say that just going in blind to a tutorial won't teach you these things early on. It probably will. I just have found when people have asked for advice on learning to program from scratch, getting a quick wee grasp of these core concepts first makes the learning process a lot less frustrating

But ultimately, whatever you feel fits your motivation level and learning capabilities best is what you should do!

I say "Less frustrating." Perhaps "less opaque" might be a better choice of words

[quick sentinel]

hiii

[vapid jay]

@quick sentinel We're not a platform to look for jobs. However, there are two links pinned in the channel description that you could take a look at

[quick sentinel]

give me the link

[charred crest]

@quick sentinel see there is a "Pin" on this channel, click and you will get the links.

[vapid jay]

https://www.python.org/jobs/ and https://www.pythonjobshq.com/

[quick sentinel]

@vapid jay you have to wait in this kind of job request, I need a job now, with a group of people, and I'm in dire need of money !

[wicked granite]

I wanna be a gaymer when I grow up

[quick sentinel]

@wicked granite nice, not me

@chrome hamlet yes unfotunately, but that's not an excuse

ok so well

[vapid jay]

@quick sentinel Sorry about your situation, but I just told you that our platform isn't for recruitment. Please follow the rules.

[quick sentinel]

@vapid jay ok sry

[teal wolf]

Thanks for the advice!!

[gritty scaffold]

@teal wolf You're welcome!

[regal venture]

I'm in a hiring event that just started with Bank of America and I'm so nervous.

this is just the "welcome" session and it's still scary....

[main bridge]

I'm mechanical engineering freshly graduated...i'm shifting my career towards computer science.
Please guide me through.

[regal venture]

uggggh I hate ice breakers - we have to introduce ourselves and explain whether we'd rather live in space or on a submarine.

right? and what does it have to do with being a developer anyway

[main bridge]

@frigid tulip i've started learning python using online resources. What more could be directed to be effective

[regal venture]

also, they have us giving our names and pronouns, and one dude just said he doesn't "use any pronouns". Um. Yes. Yes, you do.

[regal venture]

I would recommend using a service like HackerRank where you can get badges etc for completing challenges and tests

[main bridge]

@frigid tulip for sure I'll be persuing master in CS.

@frigid tulip something related to serve and connectivity.

[regal venture]

I was told a master's in CS is for theory - if you want to understand the science of computers and programming

they said if I want to /do/ programming that's the wrong track

[hardy silo]

you have a lot of undergrad cs info to get caught up on then... you basically will need to learn everything they teach in your undergrad of cs or else you wont be prepared for them to build upon it for the masters

[hardy silo]

this tho, getting the masters in cs probably isnt the best call if all you want to do is go and be a software engineer. just learn to code or attend some short bootcamp or something and you'll be fine

[regal venture]

it was good advice for me, because I just want to be left alone to code. I hate theory. I know I had to learn enough to understand how my code works, but beyond that I'm just not interested.

[autumn horizon]

Do employers look at/care for these skill badges on your LinkedIn Profile?

[shadow moss]

Depends on employer but I would imagine most don’t care.

[cursive swift]

does anyone have any advice for this?

[near ocean]

You can pay people to fix up a resume for you that would probably pass most of the automated checks companies have in place nowadays

Or you can find a simple, professional looking template and use that
Edit: ms docs are okay but i would go for pdfs 100% of the time

[cursive swift]

do you have any template that you would recommend

[near ocean]

Not really, this depends on your country mostly
I wrote mine in word and then exported to pdf, my gf grabbed a template from overleaf and used latex to write hers

[cursive swift]

ok ty

[regal venture]

OpenOffice lets you edit like a Word document and then save to PDF, and it's free - in case you don't have Word/Office

with a PDF you have total control over what your resume looks like, and it also prevents recruiters/headhunters from taking and editing your resume before they pass it along to their clients (apparently this happens more than you'd think)

[near ocean]

I cant confirm this ^ but whenever a recruiter explicitly asks you not to use a pdf you should worry

[river imp]

Are the skill certifications on LinkedIn meaningful to a recruiter?

[vestal widget]

Spring Boot or .net core career-wise for a junior dev? (I asked this before, but now other people might see the question again)

[hasty harness]

Check

[hardy silo]

they dont even check your employment history lol, i doubt they'd check skill certs

id would get senior positions from recruiters like "wow you have such a great record, youd be perfect for this senior frontend position we have" meanwhile ive never touched html/css at all until a month or so ago 🙄

maybe some are are better and do their research but most of them just spam as many people as they can

[wide rose]

I am pretty good in python and still learning django but I need to training on my skills there's a group or smth can help me?

[lucid vapor]

I would suggest you attempt to make a real world app using Django and keep adding new features to it as you keep learning.

Not something simple like a to do app, but something people could actually use. Apps like that can actually be extended and teach you very well.

[lavish geyser]

spring boot possibly has a few more openings but .net core is shiny new growing tech. both have a ton of jobs overall tho

[smoky quest]

It depends.
That said, the market typically hires software engineers, not Spring Boot Engineers.

[vestal widget]

Sure? 🧐

[vestal widget]

yeah..

[lavish geyser]

?

[vestal widget]

That it’s the new shiny thing..
Btw, which one is less windows centric? 🧐

[lavish geyser]

.net core is absolutely the new and shiny thing

which one is less windows centric? 🧐
both are equally cross platform

[noble loom]

After a few years of self-taught programming, ive just landed a job for Junior Software Engineer! Im 17, and this is my first job. Any advice?

[vestal widget]

Sadly this kind of jobs are very rare 😦 but that’d be a dream job

[lavish geyser]

Those are rare in your area? Where i am .Net jobs are by far the most common

Im a .Net core dev myself for work and it’s def a great stack to work in 😅

[vestal widget]

Would you mind checking the possibilities of me by yourself as well? I mean, for this country: Hungary and capital city: Budapest
Perhaphs on linkedin, or whatever
I might have seen it wrong

My biggest concern is that i can’t develop on mac. Because lots of places require wpf, wcf beside net core which is windows centric..

[vestal widget]

I like the net core stack as well, just like the spring one, tho with .net core there is a lot less magic happening, which is great😀

[main sleet]

Ask lots of questions! Don’t be afraid to discuss things and voice your opinion as new starters tend to think differently to people who have been at the company for a while and can’t think out of the box

[wide rose]

who just starting django here?

[smoky quest]

As a counter point, where I am located, there is no .net job or even people spending time with it. It's all java.
It doesn't mean the platform is bad either.
It comes down to your location, the type of software and company you will work with and the ecosystem they are tied to

However technologies change all the time. In 10 years, you may use neither. So I would recommend to focus on the skills and experience rather than a specific language.
Picking up a language/framework is the easiest part imho.

[dry sapphire]

it depends on how similar the language/framework are to what you’ve done in the past, too

[smoky quest]

Not really. I do assume a basic level of competence for engineers though

[dry sapphire]

someone who works with Scala/F# will find it easier to pick up Haskell than someone who has only done Python

the idioms you’re used to matter

[smoky quest]

This has not been my experience or the experience of the people I have worked with or hired

If the concepts of the language are stopping you, I also believe you have bigger problems

[dry sapphire]

okay, so you’re saying the opposite is true?

dev A, only works with C systems programming, procedural style, preprocessor macros, explicit for/do while, goto

…and dev B, hardcore on the FP, pattern matching, immutable data, recursion, monad transformers and all that category theory

both will find it equally easy to pick up F# or something in the ML family

[smoky quest]

So you are trying to construct the worst case scenario to prove that it's impossible to know more than one programming language?

[dry sapphire]

I have literally no idea where I said that

[smoky quest]

No one has been arguing all the paths are equals

[dry sapphire]

all I said is that what you’ve learnt before is relevant to how easy it is to learn stuff in the future

do you disagree with that?

[smoky quest]

that's a tautology

[dry sapphire]

how is it a tautology

[mystic bear]

u guys have funny names

[smoky quest]

it does fit the definition of a tautology

[dry sapphire]

transferability of skills and knowledge is not a given

[mystic bear]

imho, idioms do matter. i've always preferred OOP since I started with it and functional programming makes sense, I just prefer to get the same work done in OOP

[smoky quest]

Note that the point is not whether you care or not, but whether you would be unable to adapt

Obviously, there are many factors at play. But I find it ridiculous to extrapolate to haskell when the root message is "don't bet your 40+years career on a single language/framework"

[mystic bear]

ah yeah, we can adapt. adapting a new python API is simpler than adapting a new idiom

[dry sapphire]

and nobody said you wouldn’t, just that it might be HARDER or easier

[smoky quest]

so we all agree. Great

[dry sapphire]

the corollary of which is “breadth is important”

[smoky quest]

somewhat. There is also the concept of T shape engineers

[mystic bear]

what is my shape

[smoky quest]

so you should be careful where you apply breadth or depth

[dry sapphire]

that’s what most people should aim for IMO

[dry sapphire]

probably not T, if you have to ask 😔

[smoky quest]

T shape means you have a lot surface level knowledge but a few topics where you specialize

actually, surface is for some definition of surface. It's more about the contrast with the deep parts

[river crow]

is there anyone available for me to pair with on a leetcode problem mock interview style?

also is this the right channel for this request?

[vestal widget]

Yeah, here is maybe 60%java and 40% net core 😖

[smoky quest]

We do tons of scala at $DAY_JOB and we hire python/java/.net developers all the time. They have no issue picking it up. We do however look for skills related to the domain

15-20years ago, a lot of these jobs were in perl/php. ~10 years ago, a lot of them are in ruby. Technologies change all the time and the specific language used at a job won't have as much impact on one's career as the actual work and opportunities around it

(on a non-language but technology related, look at Apache Hadoop. It was so hot 10 years ago but hardly mentioned anymore)

[vestal widget]

Yeah fine, and what are those skills if you don’t mind mentioning some?

[smoky quest]

it depends on the role. For the scala part, it's mostly backend at scale

[carmine vortex]

how do i add and run python with code in visual studio code

[dusky sleet]

Hello everybody 🙂 I have been studying Natural Language Processing and I had an idea to create a little curriculum analyzer! Where You can import your resume in pdf and paste a job opportunity and I'm gonna give you a score of similarity and a word cloud with the main keywords in your resume. I'm using BERT models to analyze your score.

http://cafemaismais.com/

The system process:

• Covert your pdf to txt
• Clean resume data and job description data( stopwords and other annoying things on text)
• Check the similarity and word cloud
• Give you the results

The application is working just with English information because I'm using pre-trained models.

I'm really curious about your feedback 🙂

[slim falcon]

https://code.visualstudio.com/

[vestal widget]

and what does a kind of job require? what does "backend at scale" mean more specifically? I'm really interested in it. What architecture does it mean etc

[inner fox]

Anyone here who has completed GSoC in python?

[raven bobcat]

How can I earn by doing nothing ?

[vapid jay]

hi

[wise pier]

@raven bobcat spoiler: you can't

[vapid jay]

Hi everyone

I'm studying 8th standard I've learnt python

which lang can I jump next

[wise pier]

@dusky sleet sounds cool. I'll try it out later

[vapid jay]

lemme know pls

Dhruv can u tell me

no

All python r waste no one is answering

all python waste

[vestal widget]

start learning Java or c#

[raven bobcat]

:-:

That's why I hate spoilers

[wise pier]

no need to insult if noone is active here at the time

[warm latch]

skip to english ooof

[wild gust]

lol

[void stirrup]

In my opnion u should go deep down into python frames and libs. After that is good to know OO so i recommend java or c#

[warm latch]

do u recommend php

[void stirrup]

No, i recommend JavaScript Instead php

[warm latch]

why

[void stirrup]

Strong active community

[warm latch]

i still think python is better cause u can dive into nlp and machine learning and ai

[void stirrup]

and JS frammeworks like angular, react and libs like vue

[warm latch]

and its the most recognized

[void stirrup]

of course. I recommend JS if u going to work with web, and u still can do the backend on python instead of node and front in some JS frame. Where i live they don't use PHP or python in web, they prefer JS and c# instead

[warm latch]

yeah

[jolly sundial]

hi,i just wanted to know if a bachelor in computer science (bsc ) could apply for software engineer position at twitter?

[warm latch]

js is more popular

[young smelt]

[raven bobcat]

Tkinter or discord which library should I learn ?

[young smelt]

@raven bobcat Have you learned basics of python?

[raven bobcat]

Yeah

[young smelt]

What have you covered in that?

[raven bobcat]

Nothing I am lazy ;-;

[young smelt]

Well, could you please share it what have you covered. I am asking to you for your benefits!

[raven bobcat]

Hmmm

[young smelt]

@raven bobcat re-read it i have edited

[raven bobcat]

What you mean by covered, i am bad at english so plz layman terms

[young smelt]

I mean, like lists and strings and all that? If so, share what you have covered?

Don't just jump with big projects if you don't have basics strong

[raven bobcat]

Nothing never heard of them :-:

[young smelt]

oh, then you are just starting out right?

[raven bobcat]

Ig yeah :3

[young smelt]

oh great!

!resources go with the autmating boring stuff with python linked in resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

https://pythondiscord.com/pages/resources

[raven bobcat]

Wait are you an indian ?

[viral geode]

hi i need to send 50 messages to talk

[young smelt]

yes nice guess

[raven bobcat]

Hmm

[viral geode]

soooo hi

[void stirrup]

u can apply without the bachelor, if u have the skills that they want to.

[young smelt]

No need to spam if you want 50 messages to talk, just talk in offtopic channel(No spam) or #python-discussion if you want

[violet raven]

any good resources to learn core AWS concepts? Suggestions are really appreciated

[void stirrup]

Try to find some resources on freecodecamp.org

[tawny glen]

Hallo

[violet raven]

okay, thanks.

[jolly sundial]

Oh okay ,tysm

[surreal meteor]

Hi everyone! I was wondering if anyone could share their freelancing experience as a Data Scientist or anything really that involved data? Not sure if it's the best place to ask but I'll take my chances :) Thanks!

[sage widget]

Anyone here who was/is in a hard science field (physics/math)?

[trail saffron]

Any suggestions on what data science courses to take for someone with intermediate Python experience? For context, I have a business background and I am looking to become the data guy in my team.

I have narrowed down the list to:
[ ] Python for Data Science, AI & Development (Coursera)
[ ] Introduction to Data Science in Python (DataCamp)
[ ] Programming for Data Science with Python (Udacity)

[smoky quest]

It's about backend services able to handle high volumes of data. Sometimes it's more direct (ex: mobile apps from many many many users interacting with your services) or sometimes slightly more about the throughput (ex: streaming processing of incoming data).
Career-wise, it's pretty rewarding and interesting. There is also a lot of demand, at least in us west coast.

Some books which might help:

• https://microservices.io/book This is completely about java but still remains very applicable to python (I also do now know any equivalent book in python). It does a good job at covering the different patterns and parts of a typicall backend architecture.
• https://www.amazon.com/Designing-Data-Intensive-Applications-Reliable-Maintainable/dp/1449373321/ - This is an in-depth look at backend services

[raven bobcat]

Techno blade will kill me ;-;

[quaint bison]

hello everyone
well can anyone tell
is python a good choice for CP
actually I have done basic part (probably, lol 😅
just haven't much confidence 🥲🥲)

[near ocean]

Its ok for any selfrespecting competition not imposing the same restrictions it does to c/c++ to python

[quaint bison]

ohhh

but some say like
python is slow as compared to c/cpp/java
& also it's easy for understanding dsa

[near ocean]

Yea it is generally slower but thats why you should find comps that dont compare cpp speed to python

[quaint bison]

can u suggest some or websites

[near ocean]

The usual hackerrank, leetcode types
Codeforces, cses.fi, google's competitions

[quaint bison]

umm hmm

well thanks
I will check it out

[steel umbra]

Hey guys
I need to know if a degree is necessary to be hired by a company

Like if I'm awesome at python with loads of projects to show for it but no certificates or degrees whatsoever

Ik the answer is no but I need to make sure

[quaint bison]

well idk much about this
but yeh companies like FAANG
doesn't see degrees they see skills
but I m not sure about this 😅

[vestal widget]

Thanks man! I decided to go for the java path now.. 2 reasons for that: less frequently windows centric, more job opportunities with new stack(spring boot). And i like these decoratorish coding, easy to read for me😀

And i’ll take a look at that book as well! Appreciate it

[steel umbra]

Thanks

Anyone else?

Kind of a crucial moment for me right now and I need all the help I can get

It will help me a lot

I will be very great full for it

[limber rampart]

I think unless you ask about a specific position, region or company the answer will be "a degree is not necessary, but it helps"

[near ocean]

A degree is necessary, professionals without degrees are exceptions not the rule
Theyre exceptions because theyre exceptional

[vapid jay]

Hi

[floral plover]

Good day manager, I am Mary Ann valeña im free lance worker .I can grind 150-200slp per day.
this wold be such a blessing for my family,i dont have work now. and i am a soloparent of 2kids.thank you and gobless po

[hardy topaz]

May I know the number of messages I sent?

ups wrong channel sorry

[smoky quest]

That's a great choice! Good luck!

[smoky quest]

Not having degrees is not impossible but sure makes it very difficult. There are so many candidates with degrees out there. Also if you are that great, why couldn't you have a degree?

[balmy thicket]

Guys how to learn python lmao

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/784863956916895774.png?v=1&size=40

[near ocean]

By not posting emojis in a careers channel and reading through !resources, use it in #bot-commands

[vapid jay]

watch couple of tutorials or read a book then start making as many projects you can

[fluid fern]

for those who have graduated college, any tips for a soon to graduate student on what i should be prepping for after college?
I have a few internships/CO-OPs under my belt, particularly in UI-UX and back-end programming I wasn't really a fan of the work as it turned out to be the same thing every day, bug fixing with a sprinkle of create a new thing to increase the scope of said abomination.
I have a few self projects such as maintaining a discord bot for a server and running my own homelab for storage and to create vms which i can connect to even when im out of the local network.
besides finding a job

[near ocean]

Get an internship or you'll probably struggle

[fluid fern]

anything else? i'll edit my post to be a bit more clear i should have specified what i've done already

is there anything else I should work on though besides mass applying and such? I sometimes feel like what i put on my resume is insufficient and would like to know what I should put on it to increase my chances of being noticed and such

I have in the past but my resume has changed dramatically since then and tbh, I wasn't satisfied with the response which they said "looks good keep it up", I'm assuming its due to them not having any knowledge in the field so they gave a rather vague answer.

On the subject of job searching I suppose I'll see how it goes. I do wish sometimes that they can explain why I wasn't accepted lol but that is a far cry

[steel umbra]

The education system in my country is really bad, you really learn nothing of value here... At the same time it's tough, long and time consuming

[vapid jay]

[steel umbra]

Believe me not 5 pages go by and I already find like 20 typos in the books

English isn't good either, does the opposite of promote creativity

There's really no upside to learning here other than the degree itself

Even the concepts are messed up

I can't learn programming in a system like this
Anyway

So it's like a small percentage of people who get hired without degrees? I have a college and highschool degree but nothing more

[smoky quest]

I would flip the question around: what's the situation in your country? What's the ratio of people with or without degree in your country?

What I can tell you is that in the US, I just put an ad for a job at the end of last week and I already have ~25 candidates, most of which with degrees (I didn't check all of them yet).
We also used to hire people from all over the world (all visa processing have stopped since covid). All of them had degrees as it makes visa application possible, if not easier

Besides the purely pragmatic question of finding a job, going through a degree has also other advantages:

• It helps you create your first professional network. This is one of the most underrated benefit of degrees.
• There things you know you don't know and things you don't know you don't know. Going to school will still force you to learn things you wouldn't want or know otherwise
• Your compensation will be higher. Without a degree, many employers will use that as an excuse to low ball you or hinder your career progress

[iron plinth]

Hey guys, I had a couple of questions about the data analytics field if you don;t mind me asking?

how easy would you consider it to be switch to this field of work if they have a non-technical background? Do you happen to know many people who have non-technical backgrounds who have entered this line of work?

anyone here?

[smoky quest]

it depends on how far away you were from the target skills.
If you were a statistician, it would be easier than if you were a librarian.

It's all about building confidence of your skills with the interviewers. That could be degrees, certifications, work experience or others.

[iron plinth]

Great, thank you for the response

[mystic bear]

data analytics makes me think of a few things too: data science, google analytics, SQL, SEO

[iron plinth]

I don't have a technical background and had have never used python until a month ago

in the field, it is a common occurence for people to come from non-technical backgrounds?

[smoky quest]

not really

What I have seen the most is re-conversions to web dev, especially with bootcamps

But data analytics has a higher bar

[iron plinth]

I think my main motivation to switch to it is due to wanting a career change

[smoky quest]

What made you settle on data analytics?

[iron plinth]

it seemed like an interesting field to get into, it seems to be all over the place in job boards etc

that and it seems the possibilities of where to work seem vast

not sure if thats all the right assumptions

[smoky quest]

I would suggest to explore the different areas yourself at home first

That will enable you to see what you like or do not like. Being in high demand is not necessarily what is best for you or something you will enjoy doing every day for years

[haughty forge]

Wanted to follow up on this since i'm interested in breaking into the field as well .

Are bootcamps necessary at this point to develop the initial skills that hiring managers are looking for? I've worked in previous developer positions (Research assistant for Computational Chemistry group) and have worked with Developers to improve products but I still don't think i necessarily have the experience/knowledge to find myself being considered a strong candidate for even entry level positions

[smoky quest]

There are also jobs that are in high demand because they are seen as lower class (qa, ops, data preparation)

[iron plinth]

fair enough, definitely something to think about

[smoky quest]

When someone hires you, they take a risk. They also don't want to be blamed for hiring the wrong person who didn't even have the right skills or experience.
Hiring the wrong person can also be quite disruptive. So the rule of thumb is it's better to pass on someone who might have been good than hire someone who seemed ok and then disrupt the team/company.
To that end, it's all about demonstrating you have the right stuff. Be it experience, school or bootcamps.
Schools and bootcamps do have the advantage to also have build a network with companies and bootcamps need to make sure you find a job so they can keep their placement statistics up so they can hire more students at the next cycle.
So it's hard to say either way for your specific case as it depends very much on your experience and how recent it was

[mystic bear]

I agree strongly with this. In my experience, I enjoy python for generic data processing, migrations, and pipelining datas. Lots of fun ways to get into this at home

[smoky quest]

The presence of a certification/degree is not about ensuring the highest quality. It's about ensuring the minimum quality

[dry sapphire]

I was a law student and I became a data scientist

[iron plinth]

how challenging was the switch for you?

[dry sapphire]

not super

but ultimately it comes down to two things: how talented are you, and how hardworking are you?

[iron plinth]

you mind elaborating?

[dry sapphire]

more of one means you can be less of the other, and too little of either means you are defo hard stuck

[dry sapphire]

dissatisfied with job, quit, joined bootcamp, got hired, basically. feel free to ask more specific questions

[iron plinth]

oh ok. I've enrolled in a certificate course with a local university that focuses on data analytics and big data

[dry sapphire]

IMO, such programmes do little more than build foundational knowledge and (maybe) help you network

so it was for my bootcamp

[iron plinth]

how long did it take you to become comfortable using software such as python, etc

[dry sapphire]

I really like coding, so not long @ all I guess?

[iron plinth]

yeah. I was debating about learning on my own pace or enrolling in a certificate program

[iron plinth]

that's awesome

[dry sapphire]

it’s not a bad thing though! it can give you structure, which will probably be important (it’s easy to feel overwhelmed)

[iron plinth]

how was the interview process when looking for jobs? Did the interviews involve a lot of code-heavy questioning?

[dry sapphire]

like it’s not that you’re incapable of learning by yourself, but rather that having a path to follow decreases the amount of mental bandwidth required

[iron plinth]

great, OK

[dry sapphire]

some did? I’m not super good at leetcode type questions, but I can generally do okay. because I originally applied for DS-type positions, the interviews focused a lot on stats/ML

experiment design, how models work and are evaluated, software architecture, coding practices etc.

if you wanna do anything analytics related stats type questions will be common I believe

[iron plinth]

good point, OK

[dry sapphire]

YMMV by country (I’m not in the US)

[iron plinth]

how would you get yourself prepared for those types of interviews?

[iron plinth]

no worries, I'm not in the US

[dry sapphire]

hm it depends. personally I don’t really explicitly prepare? I would say as long as you have a good understanding of the principles underlying DA/DS/ML you should be fine

[smoky quest]

there are websites. For coding, there is leetcode or codingame.
There are also books.
You can also look at websites like glassdoor for example of questions

[iron plinth]

good to know, thanks!

[dry sapphire]

e.g. “what is overfitting and how do you identify it”, “give a simple example of a problem that cannot be solved by a linear classifier”, “what is a confidence interval” etc.

[iron plinth]

for sure. I guess I would have to some research on the types of common questions asked

[dry sapphire]

that’s for DA/DS at entry level

[iron plinth]

right, ok

[dry sapphire]

for SWE type roles, you are unlikely to be asked high level architecture questions

[iron plinth]

what would SWE stand for?

[haughty forge]

@dry sapphire What did you display for the coding projects for DS/ML positions? I had a mentor mention that something like 4 simple SQL projects would be a good start

[dry sapphire]

software engineer

[iron plinth]

got it, thanks

[dry sapphire]

uh…my bootcamp projects but honestly they kinda sucked?

[iron plinth]

how long would you say it took you before you felt confident with things such as python programming?

[dry sapphire]

something original would really be nice. again YMMV, but I personally would not hold it against a candidate without personal projects if they had other ways to demonstrate ability

[dry sapphire]

maybe 3-4 months? I was answering questions on SO by then

but everyone goes at different rates, so just work in the way that makes you comfortable

and I was kinda also DE/MLE @ my first job so I had to learn Scala

data engineer, machine learning engineer

[iron plinth]

nice, ok

[dry sapphire]

the thing is…a lot of DA/DS is not about writing good code (though that is important to me as an SWE), but about knowing what code to write (from a business perspective)

a purer SWE often has BAs and PMs and POs and other members of the alphabet soup to lessen that burden

coding is not sufficient as a DA in particular. you must know how to tell a story.

[iron plinth]

right, ok

I feel I have strong communication skills, but the coding is what I really need to work at

or were you referring more about data visualization?

[dry sapphire]

okay it’s a multi step process

understanding the business problem, assessing data scope and quality, knowing what insights to draw, actually doing that with code, possibly automating the process so others can view relevant metrics (dashboarding), conceptualising and giving executive presentations

all these are things you may do as a DA/DS, though of course scopes differ between countries and roles

[iron plinth]

definitely, thanks for the inof

info

Is a Master's degree worthwhile?

[haughty forge]

With that in mind, do you have any data sets in mind that would be worth exploring to start telling those stories?

[dry sapphire]

I don’t have one, but I would like to get one for fun

IME it does matter. for me the hardest part of job applications is the resume screen, and having a Master’s helps a lot with that (or just get referred/scouted)

[dry sapphire]

not really, sorry. @ this point I’m more a pure SWE than anything but if I had the inclination to do a data project I’d find my own data

prepared datasets generally aren’t impressive beyond entry level because everyone has done the same thing and because you can’t exhibit skill at dealing with real world data, which is often rather messy

[iron plinth]

I know I might have asked previously, but have you encounterd a lot of people working in the field with a non-technical background?

[dry sapphire]

define non technical

[iron plinth]

non-technical meaning without previous experience in python, programming, etc

[dry sapphire]

as devs? or DA/DS?

[iron plinth]

I'm keeing a master's degree in mind, I've just seen posts by people online saying it's not worth it etc, but I guess that depends on the person and situation

[iron plinth]

yea, was asking as it related to DA/DS

[smoky quest]

If you can, I would recommend to do it.
I know there is a high upfront cost in the US. I do believe however that the salaries gain later make up for it

[iron plinth]

interesting, ok

good to know

[dry sapphire]

a fair number! business acumen is important in such positions, and so is diversity

[fluid fern]

i've heard the opposite, i guess it depends

[iron plinth]

I suppose the more qualified the better

[smoky quest]

As an example, someone with a ms is the equivalent of 5 years of work xp in the target domain in a lot of companies, including where I have worked

so starting salary is higher as well as the title

[iron plinth]

right, OK

so having one definitely puts you more on the radar for hiring

[dry sapphire]

and the theory can be really helpful

[smoky quest]

definitely! You can see the difference.

[dry sapphire]

ESPECIALLY for DS roles, I’d say; if you intend to become, for example, an MLE, being conversant with advanced data structures would be a big plus

I myself am interested but I really wanna do a master’s in person but with COVID…😔

[smoky quest]

That's applicable to most roles. It helps with the way one approach or phrase problems

Obviously, there are exceptions and I would refrain from making a too broad generalization. But I do see a difference

[iron plinth]

I think in person is ideal. I find online learning to be just 'ok'. I don't find it as amazing or life-changing as maybe some people thought it would be once it really started

[dry sapphire]

okay my experience is that data side stuff is seen as “just another domain” by transitioning devs, whereas proper software engineering is more commonly thought of as “leave it to the DEs etc.” by some DSes

[iron plinth]

I think it's been particularily unhelpful for young kids. Where I'm at, they've closed schools for a while, which hasn't led to exactly great results for school-aged children

[dry sapphire]

it’s not. I’ve taught DS and it really decreases engagement IMO

[fluid fern]

what exactly are DEs and DSs?

[dry sapphire]

data engineer, data scientist

[smoky quest]

I am referring to the level of abstractions people reach for. Ex: starting straight with some code VS thinking a bit at the higher level about how it relates to the system and stuff

[dry sapphire]

broadly speaking, data engineers build data pipelines, and data scientists figure out business value from reasonably well processed data

[smoky quest]

and then there is the whole model deployment and feedback collection and updates*

[fluid fern]

inb4 we have fullstack machine learning engineer just like we have full stack web developer

[dry sapphire]

well, you could have a fullstack web dev who specialises in ML (I was one @ a previous place which I left during probation)

[iron plinth]

is ML a particularly difficult field to learn?

[dry sapphire]

how important is the conferring university IYO?

[iron plinth]

or I should say subject to learn?

[dry sapphire]

that depends on breadth, depth AND your individual aptitude and proclivities.

[fluid fern]

i find it personally mind boggling when attempting to self learn it. Concepts are funky if you dont have any knowledge in linear algebra

[iron plinth]

wow, OK

in a less heavy question, how easy did you guys find it to learn SQL when compared to Python?

[dry sapphire]

anyone can from tensorflow import keras, but it’s one step beyond that to understand data preparation, statistical inference, and basic modelling, one step beyond that to identify overfitting and design experiments, one step beyond that to read papers, manually backpropagate, andunderstand SVM optimisation…and so on.

[smoky quest]

The university doesn't matter that much. We have tons of people who graduated outside of the US, so no one knows if the university X of Guatemala is the best one or the worst one and no one is gonna check.
Obviously you have the super famous ones like MIT/Stanford, but the level of the candidates isn't better than anywhere else. Where they shine is the professional network and access to connected people they confer

[fluid fern]

its like comparing apples to oranges
if anything SQL is probably more simpler to understand, at least to me

[dry sapphire]

huh, that’s interesting. here it really matters where you come from

[mystic bear]

Learn SQL.

[iron plinth]

I didn't know that. I always thought there would be a higher preference for US-based educational background?

[dry sapphire]

I personally don’t use SQL much, and when I do it’s abstracted through like an ORM, but I can still write reasonably good raw SQL as long as it’s not too complex

[iron plinth]

it seems a lot of job postings mention wanting an SQL-heavy background

[smoky quest]

It's faster to hire a US based person. But beyond that, it's already quite difficult to find good candidates so companies will put up with it

[dry sapphire]

it’s defo useful! I would reco

[fluid fern]

yeah, still doesn't help when i read the paper regarding transformers and then my face looks like this
https://puu.sh/HNnQB/668435237c.png

[dry sapphire]

some papers are written poorly tbh

[mystic bear]

SQL isn't going anywhere, and it's going to be nearly ubiquitous for "data" scenarios

[smoky quest]

Also it's easy to transfert VISAs if you are already in the US

[iron plinth]

thats great to know

[smoky quest]

at least pre-covid*

[fluid fern]

i guess, what are your thoughts about it? I was referring to the paper which introduced transformers, Attention Is All You Need

[iron plinth]

right. the Visa part makes things tricky

[dry sapphire]

yup, the seminal one

[iron plinth]

definitely seems like that

is R a valuable skill to have?

[dry sapphire]

I thought it wasn’t too bad

[dry sapphire]

the industry here is more or less off R for entry level positions. it has its niche, but…

[iron plinth]

I know everything is math-based but R seems particularly math-focused based on what I've got from it

[dry sapphire]

R is specialised for doing stats stuff, basically

[iron plinth]

right, ok

Would knowing Python, SQL and a data visualization program such as Tableau put me in a good place for the future?

[dry sapphire]

for a basic DA position, I’d say so

[fluid fern]

made jack sense in terms of how they decided to feed forward into another multiheaded attention block from the output embedding, and i still to this day wish i knew how they knew to do that

[iron plinth]

more advanced would include things such as ML, Hadoop?

[fluid fern]

i wasnt referring specifically to his videos, i was referring to what comes after that, which is learning the models we have now, which have been tried and tested, on how they work and how they were developed

[iron plinth]

thanks for the talk guys, it's been helpful!

[mystic bear]

Another note from my perspective: data visualization is almost always a JavaScript effort on a webpage. You load some data from an API and pop it onto a graph or something.

so... it's a fairly separate problem class. i find it hard!!! lol but there are some great JS frameworks out there

[robust frigate]

am i allowed to ask for a backend dev on here for a part time project to work on?

[gusty carbon]

this channel is not for recruitment

[robust frigate]

which one is

[gusty carbon]

this is not really the server to post memes in, unless they're related to the current conversation, and talking to your self does not count as a conversation

[vapid jay]

@robust frigate Alright, let's not. Those aren't adding anything of value to this channel.

[robust frigate]

sorry for starting trouble

where do i go to find cofounders? is there some server for that?

[buoyant seal]

something like this place perhaps https://www.upwork.com/

[robust frigate]

kinda

[buoyant seal]

LinkedIn as far as I know is used for that too

I also receive offers in Telegram as the most quickest way, they are channels which send recruiting posts

I did not see recruitments in discord yet. (with exception of devops people in devops server)

[robust frigate]

ya discord servers hate when people advertise jobs, no idea why

i mean, its promoting our job market

[buoyant seal]

because those are very often offers to fool people
it is hard to verify them in discord

current server is dedicated to help for programmers
and is not wishing to have responsibility for a lot of scammers in recruitment channels
it would take additional moderating power to process at least

other platforms and places usually offer more opportunities for double checking the offers

[robust frigate]

ya i guess those other websites are the way to go

[steel umbra]

@smoky quest you mentioned that a degree makes visa application possible... What about a work permit?

Also can't he just do the job online?

[smoky quest]

That's basically the same thing.

[smoky quest]

Let say I am a nice company in the US. Why would I pay you a US salary if you aren't in the US? I would pay you based on your local salary.
Furthermore, the point of emigrating to another country is also to emigrate there. Which besides the cultural aspect, also opens up the doors to the local job markets and opportunities (ex: silicon valley can only be experienced in the silicon valley)

[steel umbra]

Some people actually fall for paying you based on their own currency (even if it's not much in their own country, it'll be a lot in mine)

Yea fair you wouldn't pay a US salary but you'll still hire me right?

I just realized that question is a bit ridiculous

[smoky quest]

It depends. Hiring someone in another country implies ensuring having a tax id there, paying the relevant tax and payroll stuff. It also means being aware of the employment laws over there. None of these are easy so not necessarily worth it for a single person

Then there are timezones differences, which may make communication more difficult. Being remote on the same day time is one thing. Being remote on anything >4h difference would require specific practices

[steel umbra]

Yea that's not worth it for one guy

[smoky quest]

that's also why you see a lot of people going to the US for studying. It makes a lot of things easier

[steel umbra]

Makes sense why you need a degree

Then what about freelancing?

[smoky quest]

it's more of a two birds one stone story

[smoky quest]

what about it?

[steel umbra]

Paying someone based on the work they do rather than monthly has gotta make things easier right?

[smoky quest]

In which context?

like fiver for people outside of the country?

[steel umbra]

Yea

[smoky quest]

ah yes

but not such a great deal for you. There are a lot of low ball offers from countries with lower cost of life

[steel umbra]

Beyond ahead of your competition is the name of the game right?

Let's say I have more to offer than them... Then?

[smoky quest]

yeah. It depends on how you sell yourself among other things

[icy berry]

we dont allow advertisement on our server

[lofty trellis]

Is there any internship opportunity available?

[steel umbra]

So it can work?@smoky quest

[marsh wind]

what do you mean? There are thousands around the world. But we do not allow recruitement here

[upbeat fable]

anyone switch from php web dev to python?

[weary flower]

Hey everyone..wanted a piece of advice
I have recently started building upon data science and am currently experimenting with tableau
So wanted to know how should I get better at it? As in some projects which I can work on or what do you'll suggest..?

[quaint lily]

What jobs use python

[dense mesa]

Computer scientists, data scientists, engineers, physicists

[quaint lily]

Anything without maths sceince?

[marsh wind]

backend web dev

[quaint lily]

Kk

Thanks for the help!

[fading hound]

#help-chestnut this is a portal

[raw anchor]

@raw anchor

[near ocean]

This isnt a meme channel

[wanton pendant]

hi

[stone vortex]

hi

[vapid niche]

hi

[vapid jay]

!ban 678758178179252272 Troll

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @amber path permanently.

[vapid niche]

why??

[smoky quest]

There are people doing freelancing.
But I don't understand your question and how it relates to that. Are you talking about freelancing without having any degree? Or something else?

[serene sequoia]

im new to the server, what is going on in voice?

[haughty forge]

Is being active on Kaggle a must for breaking into the DS field?

[patent lava]

what is a good 2 month project for fullstack developer starting job search
I'm looking for something that will make me seem like a competitive candidate, (and hopefully help train me to practice the skills that would make me become one )

[odd garden]

Probably not but you should do it if it interests you. Might be better to find specific companies and look into what they are looking for.

[near ocean]

Pick a social media platform and build a clone i guess

[fallow frost]

yo im a high school junior goin into senior year

just trynna figure out what cs field i wanna get into, ik theres cybersec, data scince, AI, machine learning, just wanted to get ur guys opinion on what i should pursue

[vapid jay]

same

[smoky quest]

Play with them at home and see what you like or do not like

[fallow frost]

oh word

[haughty forge]

Data science can be paired with other Natural sciences if you have any affinity towards those

[vapid jay]

where do i get help on python? please tell me

[fallow frost]

one thing i care about is money and also the avalaibilty of jobs, not really trynna get in a field where its overly competitive and i have to worry everday about getting laid off

[smoky quest]

there will always be money in these fields

[fallow frost]

i hear data science pays the most out of all these, by a lot

[smoky quest]

not really. It's also very competitive and it depends a lot on how good you are

most people who care about money aren't the best ones either

[haughty forge]

You have to either be a Subject Matter Expert(SME) for that Data position or you have to have a lot years of Exp/PhD .

[fallow frost]

ohh ok got it

is cybersec competitive? i talked to this high ranking cisco guy once and he told me theres a shitload of jobs and it at a point where they take anyone

[smoky quest]

if you are good, you shouldn't have to worry about competition

If you go in more niche areas, there are typically reasons for it to make them less attractive

[fallow frost]

yea thats def true but theres always someone better then u yk lol

[smoky quest]

That does not invalidate the premise

[vapid jay]

this kind of sounds dumb but

how does python contribute to web development?

[fallow frost]

back end im guessing

do Qa/testing jobs pay good?

[smoky quest]

avoid these. They are considered as second class engineers

(which is an example of area with less competition but also less attractive)

[fallow frost]

oh rip lol

[loud reef]

Can making a discord bot be a career?

I’m just curious.

[ocean mango]

probably not because i dont think ppl would pay enough for you to live off just that

[loud reef]

yeah

[ocean mango]

but maybe you could earn some money as just a hobby

[vapid jay]

you could earn a bit of cash but you probably can't make a career out of it

[loud reef]

ah ok

[weary flower]

What would one suggest to get better at Tableau?

[tawdry fiber]

I am gonna buy a laptop for college and I need help deciding the graphics card

[weary flower]

Depends on the field that you would want to pursue
Like if you are interested in game dev or so then minimum 4 gb graphic card for 2d game dev and min 8gb for a 3d game dev

[final mortar]

Guys i am a computer science major and i want continue my studies through ethical hacking. Is my choice advantageous in this field?

[fickle tide]

#editors-ides is the place to ask

[gray anvil]

Fly high yes get in no, can confirm, am in cybersec now

Well, cloud sec, but you get the idea. Competency is hard to come by though

[steel umbra]

Yes I was relating to freelancing without a degree, if we're ahead of our competition and have the projects to show for it... Can we get foreign clients?

[spice musk]

Sure you can, generally clients don’t ask your to show your academic qualifications

[twilit sun]

hi

[lusty roost]

I had one of the worst experiences in my technical test around two weeks ago

I was overly confident of my knowledge and experience that I basically did zero preparation.
It was a four-hour test to create an Odoo module. I spent two hours on small errors and had basically zero time to finish the entire thing, which to be honest, was not that of a difficult test. I really felt horrible afterwards, and I have nobody but myself to blame. I might have lost an opportunity, but I surely learned a lesson

[dapper pagoda]

What’s an odoo module?

[dusky tangle]

It's ok my friend. I have experienced such but the main thing to keep in the test is the confident you had before starting the test. If you don't, you may start panicking or even blame yourself for it which will make you lose time and energy to continue the task.

[lusty roost]

Odoo is an open source ERP system. A module is basically a small app or components in the system

[wind hinge]

Guys, its summer and I want to find ajob related to python, i dont have real working experience, is there any advice for me?

[green comet]

that's a good idea but i meant helping me know what these fields include so i can decide

[floral light]

I wanna go to hfarm in europe and get an ib diploma its a 2yr program and im 18...i just feel age is not on my side after that I'll still go to a university and study a 5yr course ...electronic and telecommunications engineering whats ur say on this

[fleet basin]

hey, so i wanted to know what i should do after completion of the very basics of python.
So can u guys advice me on roads ahead which can possibly secure me a job.
I genuinely want to know what are the possibility ahead and what should i do cause i have no idea and i don't know anyone in the field either.

and also i would love if u can give good resources which can help

[vapid jay]

hey guys, so i know the basics of python, can do a little bit of socket prgramming,, can use multiple files, and turn my programs to .exe etc. i was wondering if anyone knows any good ways to make money with basic programming skills outside of a job? i was thinking fiverr etc but just wondering if you guys can think of anything else

[green comet]

hi , i am a high school student who will be completing HS this year . I have been learning python on my own and i will probably continue learning python on my own so i need suggestions on the different applications of python , i personally am interested in AI and machine learning . If someone can help me in deciding how to go for these , thanks! . Mention me if you answer

[vapid jay]

for machine learning first learn the numpy module, i heard it was one of the core ones for machine learning and have just began learning how to use it

[green comet]

thank you

[vapid jay]

also ask in #data-science-and-ml as this is a relevant topic for that channel

[green comet]

idts i should ask it rn cause i only know basics of python rn i just wanted to know what with to go next, and i think that's done ,thank you though

[timid sentinel]

should i look for jobs in us about ML engineering

[smoky quest]

why not?

[timid sentinel]

I mean I live in europe

and it is hard to work remote bcs as a beginner and to get a working visa is also hard

[vernal spade]

could someone help me out i want to become a software engineer i know the basics of python but im not sure what to do next

[timid sentinel]

you should ask yourself what you wanna do with programming(ML, web development, etc.)

[vapid jay]

help me

[smoky quest]

Right now visa processing is such a mess that most US companies don't hire people on visa

But what's the worst that could happen if you still look? Worst case: nothing; best case: you find a company

[timid sentinel]

yeah thats the problem

[timid sentinel]

yeah youre right

[timid sentinel]

I hope I can find some where I can work remotely

[vernal spade]

i wanna do ML and software

[somber acorn]

i dont know what i want to do because i dont know most of them can some one explain to me?

[smoky quest]

Explain what?

[fallow frost]

buddy mind rephrasing that for me lmao

[gilded swan]

what are some easy internships to get?? Im currently a freshman and plan to apply to some next year

[smoky quest]

Looking for easy internships is also a red flag.
Internships can be a great help in starting your career

[gilded swan]

i dont want an easy one but like an easy one to get if that makes sense

So an internship where its easy to get the interview or where its easy to actually get in

[honest obsidian]

The advice I received is to build a LinkedIn and either ask the people you know if they know any opportunities or seek out alumni from your school on their and ask if they know anything after you do an informational interview

[rustic bluff]

I almost have my CS degree and I'm struggling to decide what to put on the top of my resume. I'm currently working a couple part time jobs. One is marketing and the other is a long-term wordpress contract. However, I only work about 5 hours per week doing wordpress. I made a website for my marketing job and maintain the site. Which job should I put at the top of my resume?

[golden tundra]

Figure out what job duties you'll be listing under each job and then on whatever job you're applying for, put the one that's got the more relevant duties at the top.

Also, in a more general sense, I'd recommend figuring out which one has the more technical-sounding and impressive bullet points.

There's nothing that says you have to list the number of hours you worked, so if you've done cooler things with the Wordpress site over the course of your long term contract than you have your marketing website, the contract may be more to your advantage to have higher up

[rustic bluff]

Thanks! I am working on it now.

[spare hedge]

Hey Fellas,
I am going to start a new career at a consulting firm. I am looking to make a roadmap of my career with the current profile as Analyst in Business Intelligence field

A week back I read a post which suggested to develop the skills that are related to the core technical stack

For a BI career, I beleive there is lot more than Data warehousing stuff

[timid sentinel]

Then you should learn basic python and then advanced Mathematics and start building basic projects

[tight spoke]

by advanced maths, you mean Bsc honors in maths kinda stuff ?

[oblique cargo]

what are the skillset that i would need to become a data scientist in india

[crimson bloom]

@inland swan you should look into a career with python

[tidal jackal]

I have no interest in codeine

[hot jackal]

I’ve recently begun to learn Python to get a job. I was wondering if there exist opportunities for novice programmers to work for free to gain experience?

[floral light]

Any advice?

[iron sedge]

Hello

[vapid jay]

Hi, as probably everyone here, I'm also here interested in learning python as I want to transition to BI/DA in a year or so. Where's a good place to start? Codecademy?

[vapid jay]

read automate the boring stuff with python

[vapid jay]

Thanks Axis!

[vapid jay]

👍

[final sierra]

when a job description mentions Experience: Git/Github . is that essentially asking if you have repositorys and push pull requests uploaded? in a sense lighting up your additions like a christmas tree to show that you have projects to show for your experience ?

[hollow flame]

I mean if you have nothing on your github then yea

Just have projects on there you can show off

[final sierra]

sounds legit! thanks skelmis

[wooden glade]

well hello there

kinda new here, hopefully I'll learn a few things here and maybe even help others learn as well

I'm learning python for the eventual goal of making a career change into software engineering

I know it's a long and arduous process, as its not just scripting and youre a full blown dev.

[gilded swan]

What field do you work in now?

[wooden glade]

I work in infrastructure engineering

Stuff like sewerage, stormwater networks, potable water and irrigation networks in urban areas

[gilded swan]

Why the career change?

[wooden glade]

i don't like this field

and the fields of mechanical engineering that I want to get into are confined to a few places that I have to fly to so that I can actually work in them

[wooden siren]

Does python really have a future in the coding world?

[lyric inlet]

What do you think is the most challenging thing about building a start-up??........ let's have a discussion about this should we??

[wooden siren]

Getting the right mindset and the right people imo.

[cloud snow]

i just started class 11 so what are the future careers in python

[thorn pine]

It's the #2 programming language and has been on a steady March uphill for a while. There's definitely a future. In my observations, the two biggest tracks for python careers are in data science and web development.

[indigo tiger]

The 5 most important things in a startup are: team, team, team, traction, market, idea in that order.

I have experience in startups, been in accelerators, pitched, gained investment, built prototypes, setup manufacturing ect. The most important thing is having the right people on the team. This is a really hard thing to know, especially when you don't know who the right people are! That comes with experience and my advice to any new entrepreneurs would be this:

Find a kickass startup with people who have done this before, have been successful and get involved. You can tell they know what they are doing by checking how fast the company is growing, check the founders and see if they have any successful exits, if the company has participated in accelerators like Techstars or Y-Combinator (and others), look for media and press releases around them, check if the company has successfully raised funds, who is on their board of directors/board of advisors. This will give you an idea of if they know what they are doing or not.

Then figure out how you can get involved, ask for advice from their founders. Founders usually give other aspiring founders time because everyone has been in your position, but be very deliberate with your questions. Dont ask "how do I start", ask something like "when starting to build a team, where are the first places that you would look if you were in my position". One thing I have learned is when you ask for advice, you get opportunities. When you ask for opportunities, you get advice. The same thing can be said for raising money.

Get involved in a good startup community, if you live in the USA, there are great communities in NYC, Philly, Boston, California, Texas, Colorado and others.

Lastly, you'll meet a ton of people who act like they know what they are doing, but they will do nothing but slow you down. Always look for the people with proven success. You can take a gamble on someone but be slow to hire, fast to fire.

[vapid jay]

@gray spindle This channel isn't for recruitment, please don't ask that again and consider re-reading our rules once again.

[trail saffron]

Any structured approach for someone with business background looking to build a data scientist/analyst skillset?

[gilded swan]

Are there any job fairs for tech happening in Illinois soon?

[lyric inlet]

Yeah......but sometimes it might not be the most challenging thing to do......take marketing for instance

[delicate bane]

The 5 most important things in a startup are: team, team, team, traction, market, idea in that order.
hate to be that guy but thats 6 things 🏃

[lyric inlet]

Wow...... that's so true
I also think the biggest challenge of an entrepreneur is
Abandoning another career. If you're going to dedicate yourself to starting and nurturing a business to success, it's going to be nearly impossible to simultaneously manage another career. ...Financing. ...Teambuilding. ...
Being the visionary. ...Dealing with the unknown. ...Loneliness. ...Rule-making. ...Decision-making.

[indigo tiger]

Solid co founders can help with that. No doubt it will be a ton of work but if you are in a position where you have a dayjob that you need to do, with the intention of leaving it if the startup takes off, balancing the load with good cofounders can be a good way to do that. Team team team is the most important part.

[lyric inlet]

That's so right......do you think the reason why 90% of startups fail..... is cause of timing.

[vagrant crypt]

Atleast can i get any referrals or way to find best job portals so that I can boost up my career and skills and focus on the company JD

[icy vault]

is a degree in cs needed to get a job?

[near ocean]

no but actually yes

[ashen elk]

what's you startup idea BTW, if you don't mind me asking?

[arctic vector]

I was looking in data science and ML boot-camps. What are some good boot camps for Python and ML?

Note: I am looking for my first job in this field and I am a noob

[lyric inlet]

It's a project store.....just like playstore but instead allows users to browse and download various projects and templates developed for different programming languages. It also offers code snippets, libraries as well as tutorial videos.

Here's a shots..... of the application. Displaying the code snippets aspect of the application.

I have more than one startup idea....

[ashen elk]

Whatever you would try to build, most startups would already have implemented - you would need an actual out-of-the-box idea and funding to get seed investements

Just making "add-on" features to existing products does not count as innovation to investors

[vapid jay]

@earnest dagger please do not advertise/recruit on this server

[tepid grail]

what't the best way you can earn money as a geek teen ?

[vapid jay]

go to linkedin, search for jobs in the field you'd like to work (could be IT or something else), see their requirements and start learning them today. You'll get an idea of what the job market wants and is in demand. Also work on "soft skills", which you can prove by being a part of clubs or team sports. I know this doesn't answer the question of "how can I make money today" - but spending teen years on skills you might use in your later years, would probably make you more money in the long run.

[tepid grail]

tysm

[fleet mural]

Do hr really cares about degree? What if the skills are great but doesn't have a cs degree? Thoughts

[vapid jay]

IMO, big and conservative companies, which are more strict - care, because: it's just a way to filter candidates from thousands of applications, and because most of them have degrees they can't process a reality in which you have the same skills as them but didn't have a degree. This isn't a dish, it's really how I see it - unfair as it is

however, getting a degree has more benefits than the technical part... is proves you are capable of enduring a lot of bs, it allows you to get contacts, form connections, get some maturity, prove you can move to a new place and survive there... these are things ppl don't often take in account

[spark cedar]

interesting perspective

I'm a bit confused on whether to go into the path of software eng or data science. I've been learning about ML for the past 4-5 months, have some knowledge in Pytorch, but I also want to be able to build stuff and not just work with databases because ultimately my goal is for entrepreneurship. do you have any advice on which path would make the most sense to pursue given that my end goal is entrepreneurship?

[fleet mural]

Thnx btw can bunch of certifications from known colleges or big tech companies do offer courses.....like coursera certifications does that kind of stuff may be a good factor to get job...coz I don't have cs degree !

Coz it's the nly alternate way for me to do show em skills and certifications short courses...coz ending up in college for another 4 yrs would kill time I guess

[vapid jay]

I've done a couple of those certifications myself... let's be real, some are not that hard 🙂

I'd say the most valuable is easily demonstrable project experience

[unkempt lichen]

right there with you! currently learning python and I'm a mechanical engineer working in the construction industry

[vapid jay]

thinking in terms of job market, and how can you make the decision on the HR-end easy to make is what I usually concern about. Having certifications/degrees is better than not having I guess. I think, people with good sense hire for talent and skills - but trust me: there is a HUGE lack of good sense in business (coming from a Business background)

[wicked pier]

How to create a portfolio without any social media (not even LinkedIn)?

[vapid jay]

I cant decide between cybersecurity and artificial intelligence development, whats the future for each field?

[west crown]

timing aka oppurtunity

[west crown]

i would tell you to go with cybersecurity... but you should decide finally only what you feel good about...

[vapid jay]

well my goal is entrepreneurship

so ai startups are more common?

[wooden glade]

Nice meeting another guy who's in the same position as I am!

Hopefully we'll reach a level where we're employable in this field

[unkempt lichen]

That's the plan! I'm currently working through Udemy's "Complete Python Bootcamp: from Zero to Hero" pretty good so far.

What direction do you want to take your python skills in the future? I'm still unsure of Data Science vs SWE

[wooden glade]

I honestly don't know, my plan right now is to develop a specific app I'm thinking of for a long time that requires multiple fields of programming to develop, eg. web scraping, data science, databases stuff, computational linguistics, and software enterprise development. This will require a few grand things to learn, but right now I'm only tackling the web scraping part with python

Right now I'm reading dusty's object oriented python book, and I'm planning on finishing it in a month or so

Procrastination, perfectionism, and self-doubt are major obstacles in learning programming and CS theory stuff that's for sure! And those are especially deadly if you work and don't have a lot of time to study.

[tepid grail]

what's angellist ?

i mean aaaaaa
what stuff you need to use it ?

[vapid jay]

Is it really necessary to be a good coder to launch a startup though?
I feel that once you have a good idea you can get funding for it and then hire people without having to learn by yourself every single aspect of what you need to create, which seems to be a lot

[desert moat]

I guess it's easier to find funding if you have something to show, a prototype maybe or a pilot project of some sort.

[vapid jay]

true

[timid sentinel]

anybody a ML engineer in the US

[gilded swan]

People who are software developers. Where do you work and how has your salary changed over the years?

[terse shadow]

hi

[smoky quest]

it's useful but not a guarantee of success

Everyone has ideas. That is never the problem.
The problem is in the execution

[dry sapphire]

then you'd need to be very good @ finding people and managing them

[trail saffron]

Anyone here got a recommendation on courses to become a data scientist / analyst?

[gray anvil]

As in paid bootcamps or free online resources

If its paid, can't recommend general assembly enough. Excellent use of 3 months

[tribal canopy]

I tried the foundational data science course of IBM, have completed it just a month ago, found it decent to start with.

[buoyant seal]

How perfectionism can be an obstacle? Is not it part of motivation?

[buoyant seal]

Reach at least a level to identify good coders reliably. To be able making code reviews on your own.

[near ocean]

Perfectionism to the point youre not making progress unless its perfect progress is bad and counterproductive

[buoyant seal]

You are making it to extreme level.
Good perfectionism is an important attribute of a good coder in my opinion.

He should review his own work too

[near ocean]

Perfectionism is rarely a positive character trait

[buoyant seal]

Absurd, nonsense.

I guess the best answer here would be... Good coder should be selectable perfectionist at least
.
There are cases which should be life-death important to correct.

While some parts could be not

A matter of setting good priorities

[near ocean]

No offense but it sounds like you've never had a job

[buoyant seal]

Same opinion I have about you.
https://www.quora.com/Are-good-programmers-perfectionists/answers/7512117
Something like that sounds perfect in my opinion

[near ocean]

That just sounds like proper prioritisation and pragmatism
Theres no such thing as selective perfectionism lmao

[pulsar drum]

Sounds like you two are just disagreeing on the term used to express an idea you both agree with

[smoky quest]

The seniority or how many jobs one have shouldn't have an impact on their arguments. It only makes the disagreement more personal and reduces the chances to get to an understanding

[buoyant seal]

Sounds right.
I had a senior in our company, who was completely lacking in all skills a proper developer should have.
He was even dishonest enough to sabotage the work, by demanding from lower ranked devs diverting their time to work on a project not related to the current work in a working time.

He spent eleven years working in one government related bank. Which did not do good to him in my opinion. Government structures are dead ends for programmers, where I am.

[smoky quest]

it's fine to disagree, but arguments should stand on their own. It is also better to elevate the discussion rather than regress to your mom

[buoyant seal]

Giggles. Point taken.

[trail nexus]

💩

[buoyant seal]

Anyway, whatever the proper name for that.

But perfectionism drives me to find, learn better tools to make my job more efficiently.

Considering that I learn in my free time, while applying at the job, It makes it quite perfect to polish skills quite fast.

If it was not for that, we would have much more poor situation. Good tools save a lot of time.

[storm compass]

I'm a 14 year old (almost 15) trying to learn some programming and work in Software Engineering in the future. I learned some Python basics a few years ago and I am currently trying to expand my knowledge in both Python and C++. I am also going to take AP Comp Sci next year in 10th grade which is Java based. What steps should I take to strengthen my programming abilities and prepare for a future job in software engineering?

Sorry for the kind of dumb question lol, I'm just curious as to what you guys recommend

[buoyant seal]

since you are in the beginning... I guess the best thing would be recommending to learn universal things.
which would work great in any language or any software related profession

• Learn git. Preferably at console interface level (but find good GUI for yourself too)
• Data structures and Algorithms
• Learn how how to work with multi threading
• OOP, Design patterns.
• Learn how to test code.
• add probably SQL to here just in case.

[storm compass]

thanks so much! i'll be sure to do those 🙂

[buoyant seal]

hmm, most of things tbh you learn in university.
getting a degree in computer science will help a lot.
but the quality of degree depends on the country you are in

[storm compass]

I'm in the US specifically California

[buoyant seal]

oh, then high chances you will be able to get highest quality education if you will attend university

third world countries usually have it harder

[storm compass]

yeah i'm lucky

[golden tundra]

I'm actually going to go in the totally opposite direction from Darkwind. Like Darkwind said, you'll cover a lot of the concepts later in your education, and quite frankly, by the time you're graduating from college (assuming you attend one and a 4 year institute, graduating when you're around 22), the programming scene is going to have changed enough that some of the skills advice for someone looking for their first job might be inapplicable by then.
So my advice is to get a head start on learning the more general skills you'll need as a software dev

[buoyant seal]

did I not mention the most general skills?

but the point is... you will learn them in university anyway probably

[golden tundra]

Which is to say: working with others on coding projects (writing pieces of code and not the entire project and fitting your pieces into a grander whole), learning to read other people's code, learning to translate specs and ideas into actual programming.

Darkwind, the reason I say more general is because I wonder if, for example, 7-8 years from now, data structures and algorithms will have fallen in popularity in coding interviews, for instance (I expect you'd still have to know them, but they might not be as crucial for nailing interviews as they tend to be now)
Or maybe if git will have fallen out of fashion by then

[tribal canopy]

I live in India, and I believe that the university that I am studying in doesn't provide up to the mark education, I am currently in my 1st year CS Bachelors in Technology, so...could you recommend some external sources to hone my skills? Or maybe something on which I have to focus more? I have started programming a year ago.

[storm compass]

I've already started doing some of that, worked on some discord bots in python and worked with a friend on a JS bot as well

Obvi have to do more tho, thanks everyone for the advice

[golden tundra]

That's definitely a good start, but I'd suggest looking bigger scale (maybe some open source projects)
When I started professional dev work, one of the hardest things for me was dealing with an overwhelmingly big codebase where there was no way I was going to know the whole thing

[storm compass]

Got it, I'll look into that, thanks again 🙂

[buoyant seal]

what did you learn so far in one year, and which language(s) you used?

[tribal canopy]

I have learned C and now a beginner in Python

[buoyant seal]

what did you learn in C?

[tribal canopy]

I have learned about the data structures, algorithms, I think I have an intermediate knowledge on C. I am actually unsure at which level I am in. I learned C through Edx courses when i was in my highschool via Dartmouth.

[buoyant seal]

I am unsure if I can give the right advice tbh regarding education
because I discovered... that students have really different learning speed from already graduates

plus there is a matter of learning in the right order probably

2d year of education should be having materials regarding OOP

[buoyant seal]

if anything will be lacking, I mentioned above it
I can say that my university was missing...

we were not teached Control Version tools (like git) at all. Which I disagree.

[tribal canopy]

we are learning Python in the 1st year and in 2nd year we are going to be introduced to procedural programming languages like C

[buoyant seal]

and we had only really generic OOP.
we did not get any grasp in university of SOLID principles or design patterns.

[tribal canopy]

So should i learn git ?

[buoyant seal]

yeah, this is currently like most basic thing any junior should have

since you are in third world country...
...probably you should learn how to work with Linux while you have time in university

[tribal canopy]

Thank you for the suggestion, I will try to learn them as well.

[buoyant seal]

get yourself familiar how to operate with linux servers, which have only console interface available for you

it is just a bit big field, which if you will need later, you will have no time to learn after that
than earlier you get used to Linux, then better

[tribal canopy]

will do 🙂

[buoyant seal]

and my general advice, whatever you are learning in University.
get a book in parallel from some company like O'Reilly (with checking in advance that it has really good ratings) about same subject
and learn on your own as well

Cryptography for example was teached awfully in my university too

[tribal canopy]

Yes , i almost always rely on self study

[little shale]

hey,can anyone tell me do i need to ace data structures and algorithm to get a AI internship

[tribal canopy]

Thank you so much, for your advice . I will check out books too. 🙂

[violet gate]

I need help I want to learn coding in Python any links for sites that offer free python courses

[buoyant seal]

recommending to start with this book
I am, and all known to me beginners were really happy from this book

[violet gate]

Let me find it though I have ideas on python but I'm looking forward to lethal and sharpen them

[little shale]

can someone help

[mystic bear]

Sure

[north epoch]

CISCO is giving free Python Course with Certificate. Is sending link allowed here?

[runic apex]

A good start would be MIT OpenCourseware --> 6.0001 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming in Python

[quiet yew]

Hy guys

[violet gate]

Hey

[quiet yew]

I want to be and ethical hacker and I'm in 12 th ryt now

So for being and ethical hacker it's very important that u need to learn languages and I don't have any knowledge about python and c++ and all so can anyone guide me through with this and can help me.

[green comet]

Is it only python courses you need? I can recommend you a good book if you can do it from there

[violet gate]

Let me reach You

[austere widget]

Is it really worth it going for coding career , please explain your pros and cons

[buoyant seal]

depends on your love to code, to tinker with software, constantly learning new things and messing with computers in general, if yes, totally worthy
if not, probably not that

we are happy when we do what we like 😉

[austere widget]

Thanks for answering

[tepid grail]

i like coding but i have bugs

[acoustic tartan]

For a career in aerospace engineering, I heard CS is a very important subject to take, is that true ?

[fiery viper]

It would be helpful, but I disagree with it being important.

[acoustic tartan]

ok

[buoyant seal]

brohoof
everyone has bugs.
we learn how to find and eliminate them easier.
or how to make them in a way, that would take less time to fix them later.

[lean linden]

hello everyone

[wooden epoch]

Hello french people ?

[charred anchor]

Thanks

[charred anchor]

Can you share the link with me?

[lyric inlet]

Hey

[worthy portal]

Hi everyone. I just joined the server. I want to become a programmer and i also want to make a LUA executor for fivem and mod menu for fivem. I dont know where to start and im not good at programming. I know a little in python but not much at all. Could someone please help me?

[lyric inlet]

What do you think is the secret ingredient to a great business pitch?

[north epoch]

https://futureskillsprime.edcast.com/pathways/programming-essentials-in-python-by-cisco/cards/11619

[cyan crow]

hello i am thinking about taking computer science

i am currently studying electrical engineering and i am third year

my plan is to do it after my electrical engineer bachelor

my problem is that i am a D student even when i try i am a D student

very depressing, i have tried my best to work hard but i am still a D student. i have watched all the gurus when it comes to how to perform in school but i feel like i am still failing, but at the same time i need to study because its kind of an addiction

[mystic bear]

Courses can be hard. Don't let it discourage you if you are passionate to write some code 🙂

[cyan crow]

@mystic bear i like learning and i want to perform at school but getting Ds is very depressing. i am taking up alot of subjects from previous semesters and still failing. i believe the reason for failing is me and how i never used to study before in high school to now study everyday. another reason is that i waste my weekends by drinking and then got depressed. i feel like university is a mental battle too. A mental battle that i am not good for

[mystic bear]

Well, I don't feel confident giving you specific, personal advice regarding your ability to Ace any given course. Except for maybe some programming specifics 🙂

In this world IMHO it is too easy to encounter mental health issues, so understand that this is happening for many people

and then, don't compare yourself to folks who appear to be outstanding.
Doing your best, and knowing that your are doing your best, is really the best you can do in any case

Have realistic goals for your self. Knowing yourself, you can make personal accomplishments that are unrelated to a grade in a system surrounded by peers

Yeah man nature is brutal and it's depressing. You'll find your way and maybe it wont be magically changing to ace courses. Also yeah sorry but I am Not a fan of booze. I've seen folks damage their lives including my own, too much, from booze. So that's easy. If booze is creating problems then stop drinking. Drastic measures for some folks appear to be necessary

In my personal life, finding Quiet Space for only myself has been helpful, but it's clear that folks with other personalities may thrive as socialites

[ornate ginkgo]

Im kinda new to python, and I mean kinda. Im barely know pygame, and I barely know django, and turtle. Any Suggestion on where to go