career-advice

[delicate bane]

thats ULTRA competitive. gl

it also pays much more than average

[hearty island]

there are challenges on kaggle

to create projects based on data sets

[delicate bane]

my last interviewer told me many beginning DS underestimate business sense/value

so im going to try to work on that area too

add it to the never-ending bucket list

[hearty island]

i'm gonna git gud at python first before i do machine learning

[vapid jay]

no cause i like business a lot but i dont have a good programming skills so im trying to learn within the next 6 months , to hopefully have good understanding before i finish college

[delicate bane]

i was recommended this book https://www.amazon.com/Competing-Age-AI-Leadership-Algorithms-ebook/dp/B07MWCTNSD

[vapid jay]

sounds good

[delicate bane]

but how good is good enough bc you will forever be doing that if you dont set a limit for yourself

[hearty island]

everyone's gonna get mad again but

until i can do leetcode hard questions

[delicate bane]

oh no

[hearty island]

jk jk jk

i'm not obsessed guys

[delicate bane]

might as well apply for SWE jobs at faang

at that point

ok

good

[hearty island]

until i feel like i can start solid projects

[ocean ledge]

i feel like most people trying to go into "ML" would benefit being a swe first

unless you have a fairly special skillset

[delicate bane]

probably, especially if they want to do ML engineering over Data Science

or even data engineering

[hearty island]

if i can't create projects does that mean i'm not meant for coding

[vapid jay]

if you do programming nothing is good enough you will keep learning forever but it isnt that bad if u luv it

[hearty island]

i don't think that but some people told me so

i don't know what to do with data sets other than clean them, graph them, and run models

[vapid jay]

what is SWE

[hearty island]

all my projects look identical

[delicate bane]

what if you get trapped in the swe pipeline tho

[ocean ledge]

that's fine

[delicate bane]

[hearty island]

i like the pepe the frog meme

funnie

[pulsar drum]

software engineer

[marsh wind]

there are some poeple who has mindset for ML/DS but not for SWE 🙂 but yeah overall there is I think a running issue where DS/ML guy lack on good coding side

[delicate bane]

inb4 devops

[ocean ledge]

if you have a mindset for ML but not engineering, you better have a very special skillset

[marsh wind]

yeah that's kind of people I ment

[hearty island]

should ML people be able to do leetcode hard questions?

just a question

[vapid jay]

doing software eng is hard ,llike to relief my brain

[delicate bane]

ML Engineers maybe. less so for DS i think @hearty island

[ocean ledge]

not really-- but if your coding skills are weak i expect to see some lift on your core mathematical skills

[marsh wind]

not really imo.

[delicate bane]

yeah isnt it more important to be able to tweak ML algorithms on the math side?

[marsh wind]

imo understanding of SQL/DBs, data structures and architerctures can be much better than lettcode hard

[hearty island]

what can you do w datasets other than clean, graph, and train models on them

that's all i can think

[delicate bane]

deploy them. MLOps

[hearty island]

deploy them??????

[ocean ledge]

i wouldn't hire anyone who doesn't have knowledge in distsys, for example

[delicate bane]

have them automate their own training

[hearty island]

hgh

https://tenor.com/view/huh-confused-gif-14430852

[marsh wind]

distsys?

[delicate bane]

apache spark most popular you think?

[exotic urchin]

hi

[ocean ledge]

spark is a big one

[delicate bane]

cool bc i was planning on going all-in on that one

[exotic urchin]

im new to coding python

[hearty island]

welcome

[ocean ledge]

but just in general, if you don't understand even older mapreduce paradigms, it'll be a stretch

[hearty island]

WTH IS THAT

[vapid jay]

do use pycharm guys ?

[marsh wind]

don't think of that just yet

[hearty island]

jupyter notebook

[delicate bane]

sometimes. i also use jupyter

[vapid jay]

it is the cloud based ?

[delicate bane]

necessary for working with big data

[ocean ledge]

thats what i think minimally you need to get into the ml space for real

[delicate bane]

like a must

[ocean ledge]

not really for data analysts/sci

actual ml is fairly engineering focused, but you also need some decent math skills to inform on model development

[delicate bane]

google colab is

[ocean ledge]

e.g. no one has datasets that actually satisfy the requirements for linear regression (who the hell has constant variance?) so what deviance do you use for the loss function?

[vapid jay]

yes i use it as well

[jolly furnace]

apparently colab lets u use a gpu?

[delicate bane]

google colab is a cloud-based jupyter notebook

[delicate bane]

what deviance

[marsh wind]

and TPUs too

[paper mauve]

does anybody use datalore

[hearty island]

what is constant variance

pls

i need to read the statistics book

[ocean ledge]

we're currently setting it up on-prem, but it's kinda a pain and doesn't seem to have THAT much of a lift over jhub + labextensions

[vapid jay]

how did install juptyerlab through conda

[ocean ledge]

move to #python-discussion or something with python questions

[hearty island]

yeah

this is here for me to complain about my career

[ocean ledge]

just go for a swe job, then pivot to ml-focus years down the line

it'll make your job search infinitely easier

[hearty island]

i mean

i am already hooked on leetcode so

.....

[mortal wedge]

Nice

[hearty island]

better not keep saying that before y'all crucify me

and say that leetcode is not enough for coding skills

[near ocean]

Nobody is gonna crucify you my guy, but youre just hurting yourself obsessing over it

[delicate bane]

yeah better to use that time to learn about distributed systems

[hearty island]

is there a book that can teach me better problem solving skills w code

does that even exist

[near ocean]

Youre not taught problem solving imho, its something you develop by attempting to solve problems

[hearty island]

Ok then That’s what I’m doing

and it’s not obsessing if I do other stuff

[vapid jay]

#python-discussion

[slim violet]

How to Solve it. By George Póyla. It's a ~heuristic approach to problem solving, argueably THE book.

[hearty island]

Thanks dude

You guys are great

[hearty island]

omg it's hella boring

i'm gonna fall asleep reading it

[ocean ledge]

yeah polya is a pretty boring read

[vapid jay]

hi

you know c programming?

[hearty island]

python only server

[astral harness]

gotcha!

[iron gazelle]

hmm ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[delicate bane]

whats the difference between a Chief Technology Officer and a Chief Data Officer

companies dont seem to be good at differentiating the two

[severe laurel]

Maybe a reflection of the fact that data science is still a rather poorly defined area

I wouldn't expect to see a Chief Data Officer show up in the C-Suite until the company was sufficiently well developed to allow for that sort of specialization

[tranquil heart]

is this official

[fluid comet]

Can someone please help me out, I want to get started to write a research paper

[jaunty mist]

Anyone who is preparing to be data scientist?

What should I study to become one?

[vital badge]

Coursera - Andrew NG

1. machine learning

2. neural networks

3. sequence to sequence

3 is optional

but go on Coursera its a genius Andrew Ng (professor at Standford)

[ocean ledge]

learn math-- its literally a basic requirement to be able to understand the lingo and research in the field

[manic fossil]

hey fellow

i'm new to python i need place in a company where to start python

i have very limited number of days and really need a source to learn python

i would be happy if anyone help me with these things

[delicate bane]

[manic fossil]

ya

[vapid jay]

is there a channel to shocase personal work?

[vapid jay]

not problem solving specifically, but there is a book on algos + datastructures called "Grokking Algorithms" that I started reading and I think it's good. But really if you want to get good at problem solving, go on codewars, go on leetcode etc. and literally try the problem. Stuck for 5 mins? Check the answer. Just continue until you can start to see patterns and how you start to chip away at a question.

[ocean ledge]

why do you have a limited number of days? define that number

[manic fossil]

3 months

[timid mirage]

make your own site?

[jaunty mist]

@ocean ledge what maths should I cover for ml?

[timid mirage]

addition to LSTRCNN

most of ML is just gradient descent + linear regression

[night zealot]

Yeah same here iam in my 3rd year and I got like 3 months max I guess
I want to learn python too

[jaunty mist]

@night zealot me too I on my third year and has like 3.5 months

[night zealot]

Iam not even CS so you can guess iam in a really bad state 😂

[jaunty mist]

Oh then why are you studying python in college??

[night zealot]

Iam from India , so core jobs are scarce

[jaunty mist]

I am also from India but I am from cs department

[night zealot]

Iam also in a dilemma of whether I should focus on python or my core because iam bad at both

[night zealot]

Which state man

[jaunty mist]

T.N

[night zealot]

Kerala

Neighbors 😂

[jaunty mist]

[night zealot]

Seems like we are in the same boat

[vapid jay]

i created a simple page add put it on the internet, it's machine learning application

[jaunty mist]

I think so

[tall isle]

hey everyone

[timid mirage]

so?

[night zealot]

Hey so anyone here who does open source projects for blender

[night zealot]

Hey

[jaunty mist]

@tall isle hi

[vapid jay]

it's spamfilter application

[tall isle]

im a 2nd year CS student rn, do you guys think that certification for python, java, any programming language worth it to get an internship?

[jaunty mist]

@tall isle which country?

[timid mirage]

Nope.

[tall isle]

USA

[jaunty mist]

U need to do projects

[vapid jay]

so is there like a channel where people can post their projects and maybe get recommendations or comments

[jaunty mist]

Or u need a really good resume

[timid mirage]

Twitter/linkedIn

[tall isle]

jk

[timid mirage]

People don't have time to validate your project. They want to make money.

[tall isle]

yea

[timid mirage]

Go make a youtube tutorial on it if people want to know

[tall isle]

i feel that

so i dont know what to do tbh

[jaunty mist]

Or u get internship at a small scale company by recommendation

[tall isle]

I haven't landed an interview yet either tbf

[timid mirage]

Hot

[jaunty mist]

@timid mirage ?

[timid mirage]

@timid mirage ?

Oh, that was a question. Yeah, go make friends at meetups and build cool junk

easiest way to get a quality role. Be interesting and do things that make people think

[night zealot]

So I have a doubt which should I deep learning or machine learning iam kinda lost

[jaunty mist]

Ml first

Then u can get into deeplearning

[night zealot]

Ohh I was planning to learn it from sentdex

Is there any prerequisites

Is knowledge of numpy panda compulsory?

[jaunty mist]

Yes for ml

[night zealot]

Sheesh it's gonna be tough to learn it in 3 months

[jaunty mist]

Almost impossible

[night zealot]

Yep I don't think I even like ML , its just the hype that made me look into it

[jaunty mist]

U also need to learn math concepts before starting ml

[night zealot]

I like AR more but don't know if it has any scope in india

[night zealot]

Yeah I heard that too 🙂

[timid mirage]

Are there video games in India? The game boy hit Japan, Europe, and America hard and fast.

Eventually VR/AR will be hot in India. Just wait for chip prices to level out in production

[night zealot]

Video game is niche in India even game developers are finding it hard

[timid mirage]

as a career yeah

but eventually it will catch up as a culture

kids who play games end up as game devs

[night zealot]

I hope so , it's the only tech that interests me the rest of the stuff seems to be overwhelming to me

[jaunty mist]

U will loose money by being a game dev don't even consider it as an option

[timid mirage]

It's the best gateway drug

[night zealot]

Oh there are a lot of gamers in India and developers too , but there not much studios that's the issue

[night zealot]

Where are you from

[timid mirage]

US, Mi

[night zealot]

Michigan?

[timid mirage]

ye

[night zealot]

Haa nice

So a CS major?

[timid mirage]

no actually, studied information systems

[night zealot]

Oh not familiar with that stream

[timid mirage]

BS + 7 years Professionally programming

[night zealot]

Oh nice

[jaunty mist]

Ok

[night zealot]

Hey here anyone that does open source project for blender or any other sites

Iam planning to learn python so I can contribute to blender

[timid mirage]

@night zealot what's stopping you from just doing it instead of talking about it?

[night zealot]

I already started , iam 4 star in hackerrank

But I have no idea how to make patches and make an adon so that's why iam asking

[timid mirage]

you mean git commits?

[night zealot]

Yeah kinda , it is mainly bug reports ,updating modifiers etc

[timid mirage]

@night zealot https://www.atlassian.com/git/tutorials/comparing-workflows/gitflow-workflow#:~:text=Gitflow Workflow is a Git,designed around the project release.

[night zealot]

Its a 3d software and they mainly update the tools in the software through open sourcing

@timid mirage thanks for the link 👍

[timid mirage]

Blender is a great tool. I'll hit you up for cad models if you know how

[manic fossil]

I want to be through🥶🥺

[timid mirage]

but starting on git branching will help you make a PR to patch some bug/feature add to blender

[manic fossil]

In India there is less number of py job more number of competition

[night zealot]

Yeah I do some modelling not that great ones tho

[timid mirage]

then I'll push you into CI/CD, TDD, and all of DevOps, mawhaha

[night zealot]

You from India too? , Which has more job opportunities

[manic fossil]

Java

[timid mirage]

gag

[night zealot]

Haa I didn't get the acronyms 😬

[manic fossil]

C++ as first lang so u can clear technical round easily

[night zealot]

😂 well I think I should learn c++ too along with some python

[manic fossil]

Yaa that’s best

[night zealot]

Which year ? Are you CS

[timid mirage]

continuous integration and deployment, test driven development

[manic fossil]

Be strong in C++ so u can clear 2 round

[night zealot]

Haa I don't know what that jobs do , but thanks for explaining

[manic fossil]

Yas CSE and 4th

[night zealot]

Which state

[timid mirage]

If you want to be good at development, you'll need to learn this

[manic fossil]

TN an U??

[timid mirage]

eventually

[night zealot]

Kerala

[night zealot]

Noted

[manic fossil]

South Indians

[timid mirage]

basically, TDD is for people who suck. But that's a good thing.

You want to build something? Write a test first

get the test to pass

pytest + assert are amazing

[night zealot]

Ohh I see

[timid mirage]

it'll be necessary to understand what they do if you want to work for FANG

[true harness]

that's a pretty wild accusation lol

[timid mirage]

plus you'll write better stuff

[timid mirage]

it's true

people suck

people forget things and break shit

TDD makes it a smaller feedback cycle to catch human error faster without flow interruption

not everyone can think about every level of the stack at all times. Those people are crazy savants

meanwhile I'm a dumb monkey with a keyboard, I make red light go green and drink coffee

Even Alan Turing did TDD/Agile.

🙂

like, Turing + Test seem to go together

[ocean ledge]

theres so much edge in this room i gotta be careful

[near ocean]

[ocean ledge]

not really-- if you have a solid grasp of the mathematics behind it, basic ML is like a weekend project

[jaunty mist]

@ocean ledge where can I learn all these??

Maths

[hearty island]

Who the hell summoned me

[jaunty mist]

@chrome hamlet how do you know all these stuffs??

[timid mirage]

Pythagoras?

[jaunty mist]

?

[timid mirage]

Old dude. Basically it's what you get at uni/high school/bootcamps

[jaunty mist]

Ok

[timid mirage]

Khan academy too

@jaunty mist, do you know linear regression?

[jaunty mist]

No

[timid mirage]

Ok, so you need to take some math classes

[jaunty mist]

Yeah that's why I am asking where can I learn all these effectively

I see lots and lots courses and options idk which one to pick

[timid mirage]

https://www.khanacademy.org/math

Free is good.

[jaunty mist]

Ok

[timid mirage]

Good luck!

You can always count on mathematicians to add to the conversation

[hearty island]

@vapid jay yeah that’s what I’m doing but these guys are like omg no you’re obsessing over leetcode or what bs

but since when did I care what people think

[true harness]

your interviewer?

[vapid jay]

what's wrong with leetcode? 😄

i would say it's a pretty good thing to obsess about. it gives you good understanding of problem solving & algos.

which is arguably more useful than obsessing than a python game library

[hearty island]

Other than my interviewer and my parents lol

I can’t even do leetcode yet

Just doing hackerrank

It’s easier

[vapid jay]

i often muck up on time restrictions and I never know how to give the time complexity of my code especially when it's complex

it takes a lot of time

[hearty island]

check back w me over 6 months and we’ll see how much I progressed

I haven’t even fully finished a coding class past an intro to coding

[shadow moss]

Because Algos do not make better programmer, they are just done because Google does it and everyone copies them

[hearty island]

Ok

But you need them to get through the interview at least

[vapid jay]

I agree! I can't see myself using binary trees and whatnot, they do make for some cool problems & problem-solving though.

[shadow moss]

Not all companies use them

[hearty island]

aim for FAANG and you’ll get one of the good ones anyways

[shadow moss]

do Leetcode if you want FAANG interview but so many don't use them because they found it doesn't work

[hearty island]

Don’t worry I’m gonna be doing projects too

[shadow moss]

Or you will aim for FAANG and end up drifting in space

[hearty island]

!projects

[inner wren]

Kindling Projects

The Kindling projects page on Ned Batchelder's website contains a list of projects and ideas programmers can tackle to build their skills and knowledge.

[hearty island]

this stuff

[vapid jay]

we have a faangsexual over here

[hearty island]

No

I actually wanna do healthcare stuff and somehow use machine learning

I just don’t know enough to be helpful yet

It’s not recommended to jump into ML without math & data structures/algorithms

Bc trust me I tried

😐

[vapid jay]

for ML you only need a handful of algos, and since python is a high level language you will end up using arrays most of the time without ever having to worry about the theory behind it... I doubt you're using linked lists for ml...

& in that case leetcode wont be a big help

[hearty island]

i had an interview for ML and they asked leetcode questionsw

CUNA Mutual Group

not fun

[vapid jay]

ouch

[hearty island]

i got an internship w textron but that was for business analyst

and i'm not even sure if textron has their business analysts code

it may just be excel

anyways i can't even go bc it's in georgia and my mom won't let me

[vapid jay]

you're under 18?

[hearty island]

i'm 19

but my mom doesn't want me to go bc of COVID

which is understandable

why can't they make the damn thing remote

makes me so mad

[ebon sun]

You could find another remote internship.

[hearty island]

no

i'm not good enough

not yet

sasuke

[ebon sun]

How good is your maths btw @hearty island ?

[hearty island]

https://tenor.com/view/umm-um-ummm-ummok-puppet-gif-17038634

i have a lot to work on

[ebon sun]

By that I mean, what math classes have you completed?

[hearty island]

calc 1

and business stats

[ebon sun]

Oh damn, and you don't think your maths are good enough?

[hearty island]

no

😦

[ebon sun]

I'm taking pre-calc this semester, after a 11-12 year break from maths.

[hearty island]

i'm learning algorithms and data structures first

and then i'm doing math

[drowsy cosmos]

Hello

About what?

You want make a team?

[hearty island]

a team...

for what?

[drowsy cosmos]

Good. What do you want to do?

Guys do you know how to implement python projet in website ?

[hearty island]

#web-development @drowsy cosmos

[drowsy cosmos]

Thanks

[somber cloud]

bro

can some one help me pls

[hearty island]

ok

with what

[drowsy cosmos]

About what?

[somber cloud]

about

install opencv on anaconda

for some reason I have tried multiple ways and it hasn't worked

[drowsy cosmos]

You can do it in google colab

[somber cloud]

what do u mean

[drowsy cosmos]

Search in internet what is google colab

You will find your solutions

[somber cloud]

ok

thanks

@drowsy cosmos

the google colab doesn't really work for me

[drowsy cosmos]

Why? Is not it computational power enough for you?

[somber cloud]

yeah

its a really big project

[drowsy cosmos]

I am beginner I do there.

[somber cloud]

oh okay thanks though

[drowsy cosmos]

I will do deep fake project later. I don't know it can be work or not.

[somber cloud]

have fun with that

[drowsy cosmos]

Are you in kaggle?

[somber cloud]

yeah

y

[drowsy cosmos]

Okay gimme link

[somber cloud]

link for what

[drowsy cosmos]

Your kaggle profile

[somber cloud]

ok

https://www.kaggle.com/natygebremedhin

I don't use kaggle

much

I just use it to get data

[drowsy cosmos]

Okay

[delicate bane]

@hearty island i found this really good resource by this ML Engineer i follow https://whimsical.com/machine-learning-roadmap-2020-CA7f3ykvXpnJ9Az32vYXva

its daunting at first but at least its all the resources you could ever need in one place

some real treasures hidden in there

[hearty island]

boio what is this

[delicate bane]

a mind map

tbh the most intense mind map ive ever seen

[hearty island]

could've just done it as a google doc

[delicate bane]

i didnt make it

[hearty island]

what is the right side even

this is too big for my smol brain

[delicate bane]

the right side are the different ML techniques/processes

the left side are the resources

[hearty island]

yeah i figured that oiut

[delicate bane]

ok. well i tried. gl dude

[hearty island]

thanks

[delicate bane]

[hearty island]

pls marketing is so boring

i just spend the entire time on general

[mossy latch]

the entry level market is fucked

sigh

[ocean ledge]

yes it is, but if you're actually good you'll find a place in it

don't give up

[hearty island]

keep working

[mossy latch]

Its hard to find a place when the applicants are in the 500s

[hearty island]

yeah

[mossy latch]

plus I just have an Associates/BTEC bc of last year pandemic fucked me up real bad

[hearty island]

do you know your stuff well?

[mossy latch]

I had technical interviews which took a month and coding shit but its really just who notices your shit first

at least on Indeed

then they end up going with a person who has a PHD

[hearty island]

yes

it's always the phds lol

[mossy latch]

I see them crying on recruitinghell so thats not the problem

the problem is that higher level people go down on the lower level jobs

so its a catch 22

[hearty island]

yes

what do you want to do? swe? ML?

video games?

[mossy latch]

Data Analysis/SWE

they are really different but I like both

heck I cant even land a simple Helpdesk job

[hearty island]

anything coding related is always crazy competitive

[mossy latch]

because muh 700 applications

yeah that is true

[hearty island]

this may sound stupid but try getting a position teaching kids how to code

[mossy latch]

I just dont know what else to do

[hearty island]

and then you can keep looking around while making money

idk just an idea

[ocean ledge]

not gonna like, when we opened up our entry-level data science position

we got ~300 applications on the first day

[mossy latch]

thats what im talking about lol

[hearty island]

how do you get into the field without an in

[mossy latch]

yeah well Im trying to get "some" job even warehouse but its fucking hard

[ocean ledge]

and the candidates that passed our phone screen has pretty insane credentials

[hearty island]

yeah i'm gonna be screwed lol

F

[ocean ledge]

like, one has a phd in cell biology from the top med school in china, with an extra masters in stats during his postdoc in the US

[hearty island]

maybe i can beg pastafish for a job

kidding

[ocean ledge]

you know, for shits and giggles

[hearty island]

A PHD???

oh god

i'm gonna cry

[ocean ledge]

none of our applicants are referrals though, so there's that 😛

[hearty island]

i see

hey this doesn't work

i'm doing therapy

i don't care

[ocean ledge]

our last data science intern had an MBA from a top 5 school in the us

so yeah... it's competitive

[hearty island]

lol

no one is gonna hire from my college

[ocean ledge]

what college

[hearty island]

hofstra

[ocean ledge]

please don't say pace

[hearty island]

F

[ocean ledge]

oh

[hearty island]

what's wrong with pace

[ocean ledge]

pace is pay to win

[mossy latch]

yeah i have college too even with an Associates

its ugh

F

I guess there is onlyfans

[ocean ledge]

it'll probably pay more

[hearty island]

pls and then my parents are like

focus on your classes

how is marketing gonna get me a DS job

what is marketing gonna teach me algorithms????

hofstra is a garbage school nothing can change my mind

[ocean ledge]

ultimately, what school you went to doesn't matter

[timid mirage]

^ yee

actually no

It doesn't matter on your ability to produce code

[hearty island]

ok well if i don't significantly improve in 2 years i'm gonna be living w my parents until i'm 30

and that's not ok

[ocean ledge]

though, i will say that someone with a phd from a top school is gonna be a lot more visible than just hofstra

[timid mirage]

but a major swatch of american employers discriminate based off of that system anyway.

[hearty island]

i only have 2 years

i'm big scared

[jolly furnace]

wow hofstra is private

[hearty island]

yes but it's shit

the CS profs are garbage at hofstra

but tbf cs profs in general are pretty awful

[mossy latch]

they usually suck

I learn more from MIT youtube than I learned from my uni

[hearty island]

they are profs bc they could not crack it in the industry

that's what my friend told me

[ocean ledge]

well, no

it's much harder to be a university professor than it is to work in the industry

[timid mirage]

I don't think it's that easy

so here is a problem

[ocean ledge]

however, the role of a professor is research for the university, not teaching

[timid mirage]

how many devs were on Earth in 1940?

[golden tundra]

To be a good professor, you have to be good at explaining at lower levels than you understand

[ocean ledge]

they just kinda are "forced" to teach as part of their role

[golden tundra]

Which can be complicated

Like, one of my students showed me her homework once (from a new professor), and I went oh, no
I could easily see how it was confusing to a newbie

Since it did a lot of conventions like giving local variables the same name as the params of the function they're passed into

[hearty island]

anyways only 2 years I’m big scared

I’m doing everything I can to get a job

[timid mirage]

You're here

That's a good start. Network with your local devs and get some eyes on your resume/side projects

fyi I worked for $9.50/hr for 2 years starting out

[ocean ledge]

land an internship, that's a first step

[timid mirage]

^ many companies are given grants to hire interns/new grads within 2 years

[golden tundra]

But for someone who's trying to understand how parameters work
Them having the same name is just confusing about whether they're the same thing

[hearty island]

I’m trying to get good so I can land one next year

[timid mirage]

big companies get massive tax breaks for hiring...Noobs

[hearty island]

I don’t wanna repeat or flex I did get one at textron but I can’t go

So it basically doesn’t count tbh

[timid mirage]

how are the rules for sharing linkedin profiles here?

[hearty island]

um

I wouldn’t

Just DM it

[silent elk]

sounds criminal

[timid mirage]

Doing C#/SQL server with 0 experience? It was a total gift for my career. Sure the pay was shit but it was the 2 years entry door opening

[hearty island]

?

data science/ ML is becoming a very congested and competitive field

[timid mirage]

^ because it's full of fraud

Data scientists are the DJs of the IT industry

either you're the hottest shit no one has ever heard or a charlatan

[hearty island]

Oh

[timid mirage]

^ great book

[hearty island]

Ever since they called data science the sexy job it’s been spammed w so many people

[silent elk]

Depends on your age and location, but really $9.50 for two years sounds really really exploitative

We paid our high school interns $15/hr back in 2014

[ocean ledge]

ehh, lets not be hyperbolic here

there's plenty of decent data scientists doing good work out there

it's highly lauded because, surprise, applied statistical/mathematical theory to real problems is surprisingly difficult and subtle without proper tools

[ocean ledge]

that's because that is really really exploitative, unless we're talking the 70s

[timid mirage]

This was in 2013-2015

It was a low paying job yeah, borderline exploitive. However, being able to say I have two years industry experience working full time + paying for school changed my life

Plus the dev team was great. We got margs at the college bar and went straight back to the office

Not often, but some of the best teammates I ever had

[hearty island]

Ok quick guys

What are some problems that we can solve with code

[bold pagoda]

math

[hearty island]

but mathway already exists

[bold pagoda]

automation and data storage

u can automate stuff

[hearty island]

like what

[bold pagoda]

anything

[mossy latch]

Well lets look at easy things

emails

data entry

[timid mirage]

To code, the problem of, and solution to most of all problems

[hearty island]

Huh

[ocean ledge]

i think we pay our interns ~40-45/hr

[timid mirage]

Holy shit, nice

[bold pagoda]

that is alot

[hearty island]

Textron was gonna give 25 an hour

[ocean ledge]

but we also hire like... 1 a year

so i dunno

[bold pagoda]

i want to work for u

[hearty island]

then apply

[ocean ledge]

maybe we should drop the pay but hire more?

i don't know whats better for the industry

[hearty island]

yeah I give up

I can’t think of what to code

Rip

[timid mirage]

It depends what the goal is.

[bold pagoda]

@hearty island a program that when u open up google chrome pops up a picture of a turtle

[ocean ledge]

internships shouldn't have an expectation that they create anything of real value

they're just there to learn

[bold pagoda]

that is alot for interns

[hearty island]

but how is that useful @bold pagoda

[bold pagoda]

its not

[timid mirage]

Really the company is paying for that talent to be created in the first place

If they're smart they try real hard to keep them

[hearty island]

yeah but they want interns to have impactful projects

Nothing I have solves anything

[timid mirage]

^ most of the internet is pure bullshit

[bold pagoda]

oh

[timid mirage]

make dumb things, who cares

[bold pagoda]

find a project to do online

[timid mirage]

I'll pay you $50 if you can create a github/lab repo that's just a website with a button that makes a noise on click in django

you want purpose? Make $$.

plus you're hosting it. Make sure to scoop up those free gcp credits

[hearty island]

I can’t think of dumb things either

[mossy latch]

I dont know what others would pay $$ for , thats the real problem

[hearty island]

The best thing you can do is keep doing projects

maybe try networking w some other people on the server or other servers

[mossy latch]

true

[hearty island]

most tech companies don’t really accept people who have an in

it’s not very corporate of them

That’s what I heard don’t crucify me

but it is worth it to try

[mossy latch]

imagine being an outgoing person who networks well 😭

[hearty island]

well

I tried that

Nothing really happened I had a couple of informational interviews but they were like sorry we’re not looking for interns

so I said ok 😐

[ocean ledge]

again, not true-- referrals are one of the better signals for hiring, since they've been "vetted" by another existing employee. more often than not, they get bumped to a good position on "the Stack"

there is a lot of luck involved in trying to GET an interview-- but once you have one, skill tends to be the dominant metric

[strange rock]

true

[hearty island]

Well ain’t no one referring me

[hearty island]

Yet

[peak halo]

I reformatted my resume in a way that ended up giving me a lot more space to work with. I'm wondering if I should have some non-itemized text at the top that details my experience with linguistics before studying computer science and my general approach to programming.

[latent grove]

what is a good job

[west abyss]

is Data Science oversaturated?

is it a bad idea for newbies? I am a mechanical engineer looking to get into DS cause it sounds interesting.

[outer junco]

the only really "difficult" starting part of data science is the math

if you know the math the rest is relatively simple

its mainly linear algebra, statistics, and calculus

[delicate bane]

sounds good if you have an interest in NLP maybe

[peak halo]

ya nlp is my thing

[delicate bane]

considering doing a minor in computational linguistics

also you should do that then bud; will be an interesting thing for interviewers to talk about with you

[dark lintel]

Hi

Hi, I'm the guy who had the interview with the CEO today. He sent me an email with some questions and the last one was "Can you share a rough range of compensation you're looking for?"

What is an acceptable range?

Junior engineer, data analytics. San Francisco, Well funded and established start-up. 30 employees approx, most of them work remotely. I live in Latin America....

I've got no job experience in the field

[main yacht]

are you mr.beast of coding?

[delicate bane]

idk the answer but maybe start on places like glassdoor and look for the equivalent positions in SF and the average salary there?

i mean thats where id start if i was in your shoes

[edgy jacinth]

I'm learning Python but not so good at math - what type of career should I focus on?

I'm also learning SQL/mySQL with it

[hearty island]

If you’re learning SQL too you might want to try data science

[edgy jacinth]

I find SQL fun although Python's a bit of a challenge as a first time coder, thanks!

[feral flume]

Where do you start to learn Python?

[hearty island]

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

https://pythondiscord.com/pages/resources

[feral flume]

thank you!

[marsh wind]

Back end web dev, testing automation

[delicate bane]

how come the more i read about data engineering, the more it sounds like a different flavor of data science? just with more big data tools?

[silent elk]

If youre expected to move to SF, ask for at least >$100k

[dark lintel]

Not really, It's remote

[graceful nymph]

what do you think is the best way to get a career in data science? I care more about cost and having work then speed.

[timid mirage]

Get a BS in comp sci at a decent university.

[graceful nymph]

ok

[silent elk]

May I ask why they’re interested in hiring you? Is it a contract, or are would you be considered an employee?

[remote wraith]

Hiii

[dark lintel]

idk tbh

[silent elk]

well, ask him that first

[rain stratus]

I

[vapid jay]

Is there a proper career guide available for focusing our career in IoT ?
like where to start and what to learn

[silent elk]

If you want to do embedded programming , a degree in Computer engineering would help if you’re pre-university

[vapid jay]

I'm in 2nd year of Computer Sci & Eng

[silent elk]

what do you mean by career in IoT?

[timid mirage]

1. Buy 20 Pi's
2. Kube them
3. ???
4. Tech Crunch article for $$$

/s but really build cool things and share them.

[vapid jay]

Like focusing on IoT only
rather than going for data science or web development

[silent elk]

you can take classes which focus on “low level stuff” like operating systems , device driver development, computer architecture etc

[vapid jay]

isn't it a practical thing ?/

[silent elk]

typically that stuff is associated with electrical /computer engineering programs rather than CS

[vapid jay]

is there anything we should learn something before starting this type of course ?

[timid mirage]

It helps to make something useful

[vapid jay]

I'm done with my C programming n HTML-CSS

[strange rock]

C and Assembly Language

[vapid jay]

okie

[vapid jay]

advance c ?

[timid mirage]

Just know you don't need permission to build something. Just take the tools and make something

[silent elk]

The prerequisite courses should teach you everything you need

[timid mirage]

Like yeah c isn't great for websites, but if you tried to do it yourself you'll know why at the end

The is the why people pay big money for

It's about when to and not to use a tool

[vapid jay]

okayyy,
before going trying out the practical i should know something in theory portion

[timid mirage]

Entry devs can get stuck behind "well I need to do it right before I attempt"

it's a trap. Catch yourself if you feel it's blocking you

[chilly kindle]

@patent bluff

[vapid jay]

looks like i'm motivated towards it🔥

[rain stratus]

Q

[patent bluff]

ayo what

[lucid totem]

lol

[foggy agate]

Best Coding Bootcamp?

[hearty island]

uh i wouldn't use those

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

https://pythondiscord.com/pages/resources

[foggy agate]

But I wanna earn 200K a year

and in 2 weeks I'll be an AWS Solutions Architect Associate

[timid mirage]

You're not making 200K a year off a bootcamp

That's crazy high expectations

Maybe start at 40-60K and once you get to 5+ years of experience maybe.

[foggy agate]

bro, CodeSmith gets 125K median in NYC with just bootcamp, I'll have that and AWS certificate, a guy here is offering that even more in Dallas area

[timid mirage]

Are you in NY?

Are you in Dallas?

[foggy agate]

no but i'll move there for bootcamp bro

yup

Dallas

[timid mirage]

Everything is remote right now

Nobody is going to pay for a noobie for relocation

[foggy agate]

97% yes

no i'll have to bear that expense, good thing os you don't have to pay a dime for bootcamp till you make money

[timid mirage]

Sorry, autocorrect

[foggy agate]

that's 18,500$

[timid mirage]

But they will take that out of your paycheck IF you cut it

[foggy agate]

yup

[timid mirage]

What's the success rate of your bootcamp?

30%

[foggy agate]

95%

[timid mirage]

Bullshit

[foggy agate]

Codesmith, Google it

App Academy, Gloogle it

[timid mirage]

Why does codesmith need to be honest to you

[foggy agate]

Hack Reactor, Google it

[timid mirage]

Just because they say it's 90%+ doesn't make it true

[foggy agate]

Codesmith doesn't need to be honest but they've been audited byoutside agencies that need to be honest

[timid mirage]

Ah

[foggy agate]

https://codesmith.io

[timid mirage]

So that 90% number is from the auditors?

[foggy agate]

yup

[timid mirage]

The link you sent is from the company

Not the grading agency

[foggy agate]

i was thinking that or Metis/NYC DATA science Bootcamp for DAta science

on switchup I read its audited by CIRR

[timid mirage]

Fyi, 95% if a fun number

It means you could have 20 people

1 of them didn't get a job

[foggy agate]

THAT'S good ain't it?

[timid mirage]

Sample size of 20?

That's nothing

[foggy agate]

nope, alteast 300 + students

with reviews etc

[timid mirage]

Universities of 10K+ have worse than a 50% graduation rate

[foggy agate]

I've been to superb universities but bang for buck in this case is unbelievable bro

in fact I went to unviersity that created you r favorite language Java lolz

[timid mirage]

Codesmith is an influencer program and a scam

[foggy agate]

problem was i went for MBA not java

how do you come up with this scam idea? Any facts or you're just throwing it out there?

[timid mirage]

This model of scam has been getting more popular and changes name every few months

Some company pays for a sample set of already skilled devs to take this camp

They may even pay the devs

[foggy agate]

Your welcome, https://www.switchup.org/bootcamps/codesmith

95

%

lol, that makes zero sense

[timid mirage]

Real fair graders here

Everything is awesome.gif

[foggy agate]

if you look closer, those are 29 reviewers, 34 reviewers,

this is 300

little bit of a difference, no?

sample size, et al.?

[timid mirage]

Ok, can you share 3 linkedin profiles with devs who did this and have a job after two years?

Not that you should post that

[foggy agate]

the page i linked you has 15 devs pictures names etc and details of where they work on it

look it up

[timid mirage]

Coding bootcamps are natorious snake oil factories that scam students all the time

[hearty island]

^

[foggy agate]

i think you're kinda skeptical person probably?

[hearty island]

i think i could learn more on this server than coding bootcamps

[timid mirage]

That's a good thing

[hearty island]

you have to be sus

[timid mirage]

If you're about to drop 💯 k ask some good questions

[foggy agate]

@hearty island but what about when they force you 800 hours of courseworks bring in companies and help you in life changing ways. with resumes etc

nah. bruh, drop like 18k not 100k lolz

[timid mirage]

So 18K isn't a lot of money?

[foggy agate]

plus if you don't get ajob they don't get paid

its not 100k

[hearty island]

wow you must be dummy rich if you can drop 18k like no big deal

[foggy agate]

I went to Carnegie Mellon University where I dropped 100k per year for my MBA

I KNOW the difference

[timid mirage]

Then why the duck do you need bootcamps on your resume?

[foggy agate]

@hearty island are you cray cray, broke as a joke bro

[hearty island]

i'm in college...

[foggy agate]

b/c I didn't learn Java Python at CMU, i will at the boot camp

that helped me get a 120k job, this propels it 60% higher

this is a different field than one i did my MBA in

and eventually my plan is to start a Hedge Fund, so I figured learning coding and data science would be superb skills to have

[timid mirage]

Maybe read a book? Follow documentation and make something?

Pragmatic programmer + python (depends what you want to do) + clean code

[foggy agate]

well i'm doing that @timid mirage but books don't make you into perfect coder as I'm obv not a prodigy

[timid mirage]

Done

[timid mirage]

Bootcamp won't make you a perfect coder

Only experience does that

[foggy agate]

i'm reading Donald KNuth, vol. 1, and intro to Algos & data structures by Cormen for a Codility quiz i gotta crack by Sunday

[timid mirage]

You can't cheat effort

[foggy agate]

@timid mirage I must bro, got only one chance at this thang called life

not cheating effort but 800 hours isn't suffice to learn programming?

i thin kit should be significant

heck at least for a 200k job, then I can earn enough money in 5 years start my HF, and become Wall Street's biggest pimp et. al.

I can trade stocks better than GOD almighty himself (I think) and still no Hedge Fund will hire me

[timid mirage]

How many houses do you need to build to master a hammer?

[foggy agate]

from 2009 to 2016 i earned 20% yoy per year

on stock market, crushing the 13% yoy of S&P 500, did anyone offer me 500k to work for their HF? NOPE, they said go to Harvard Stanford and Wharton so fk them meThinks

[timid mirage]

ok Diamond hands

bootcamps/scams only work on desperate people trying to learn

[foggy agate]

@timid mirage finance me $50 million for a HF, and I'll make you forever rich, heck even $5 million and you never have to work a day again, that's a guarantee for anyone on here btw, no tjust you

[timid mirage]

take it as you may

[near ocean]

Careers is extra cringey this fine evening

[hearty island]

it's more cringey than me ranting about struggling w hackerrank

[timid mirage]

Sorry @near ocean. It's in good faith

[near ocean]

Lmao

I thought you liked leetcode

[hearty island]

i can't do leetcode it's too hard for me

hackerrank is easier

[foggy agate]

algoexpert.io is good too I've heard, though i think he sourced most of his probs from leetcode

[near ocean]

Algoexpert costs like 80$ tho

Or something like that

[foggy agate]

true, education costs bruh

[near ocean]

Its not education its a scam

[foggy agate]

I paid $100K a year for an MBA where I learned how to network with humans

[timid mirage]

truly an impressive investment

[hearty island]

awkwardly sits as a business major at Hofstra

[near ocean]

No offense but mbas are also scams

[hearty island]

yes they are

[foggy agate]

@timid mirage your lovely snark can be kinesthetically sensed by my heart strings

[timid mirage]

nooo

really?

[hearty island]

it's awful they have me writing these bullshit essays that make me so mad

[foggy agate]

@near ocean they're not scams, they're 100k a year glorified networks, call it what it is please

[near ocean]

Theres literally no reason you should get an MBA unless your workplace offers you a raise for one

[hearty island]

well tbf i'm getting a BBA

still pretty bullshit ngl

[foggy agate]

@near ocean wrong MBAs CAN BE LIFE CHANGING ALSO, depends how versatile you are with it

[near ocean]

Why dude, do you have a business you need managing?

[foggy agate]

@near ocean for career changers, you're absolutely incorrect

ppl go from software engineers to freaking consultants lawyerrs to investment bankers

[hearty island]

@near ocean couldn't cut it in CS

😦

[near ocean]

Why not man

Just study harder

[hearty island]

.....

i was at office hours every day pls

[foggy agate]

@hearty island no worries, I failed intro to Comp Sci, plan to be a developer, got AWS solutions architect license in 2 weeks, will make 200k a year, look it up its all doable

[hearty island]

3/4 of my class switched their major

[near ocean]

To what

[hearty island]

business

[foggy agate]

asian studies

😄

[hearty island]

IT

IT makes money tho once you get into the senior positions

[near ocean]

CS to IT?

Thats weird

[hearty island]

why is that weird

[near ocean]

Its like a downgrade imho

[foggy agate]

guys MBAs make the most $, after lawyers

[hearty island]

yeah i agree but kids can't handle the heat

[foggy agate]

so either lie and become a professional liar, do biz and become an investment banker, consultant, or go community college and learn welding

[timid mirage]

oh like Elon?

Gates?

Jobs?

[near ocean]

Jobs wasnt a tech guy tho

[foggy agate]

then learn to swim, becomea an underwater welder, and kill the universe making $400k a year

@timid mirage they were coders privileged dudes whose dads paid them to learn computers when they were 6 years old

little bit different, but what do i know

[timid mirage]

yup. And they didn't do mbas

[foggy agate]

Elon Musk is my favorite human on the planet, and I made tons of money on Tesla

but Elon Musk is wrong on MBAs

cuz I did it

and now I'm smarter than him 😛

[near ocean]

Ok can we get less low effort shitposting here tho

[timid mirage]

so you made your money off of a guy who didn't get an mba?

weird

[near ocean]

Its not offtopic

[timid mirage]

fair

I'm just answering questions

[foggy agate]

@timid mirage you think Wall Street is filled with MBAs? You must be smoking the expensive hookahs bro

[timid mirage]

with a minimal amount of sass

[hearty island]

his initial question was something about bootcamps

[foggy agate]

I made money off of ppl that built successful companies, as I invested in them, read about 45 books on finance in 2009, economy recovered, i made some $$, The End'

but I missed out on BTC like an idiot

[timid mirage]

I can afford the nice hookah having not attended an MBA program

[hearty island]

i don't smoke

[torpid totem]

hey im just here cause im trying to learn python as quickly as possible but i end up playing runescape :/

lmfao

[hearty island]

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

https://pythondiscord.com/pages/resources

[timid mirage]

Runescape is bae

[torpid totem]

yeah dont worry i got that

[foggy agate]

if you coders had invested $50 in BTC back in 2008, you'd have $100 million networths but you guys were behind

[torpid totem]

i just do something for 10 mins then play runescape bahahahahaha

[hearty island]

yeah that's all i'm here for @torpid totem

[foggy agate]

@torpid totem what's runescape bruh?

[torpid totem]

shit idk

its life

[foggy agate]

I play wordsplay.net, chess.com

[torpid totem]

a simulation

[hearty island]

can we focus on careers pls

[foggy agate]

is it like that stupid minebuilding game?

@hearty island may we not?

[hearty island]

this is for careers if you wanna go off topic go into the off topic channel

[foggy agate]

everything doesn't have to be about money you know

[torpid totem]

lol if there's a random topic channel we can move there

[foggy agate]

lol

0.085 $ for 2008 BTC, now we got snow in tx, worldwide pandemics, nobody working at a store, AI starting to drive cars and I'm fixing to take over the stock market for a second time, j/s

[hearty island]

kek

i'm not applying for internships until i can do leetcode questions

which means hella practice

[near ocean]

dont do that

apply anyway

what do you have to lose

[hearty island]

my time

jeez i only have this summer to prepare for interviews next fall

i'm big scared

[near ocean]

youre not losing your time

youre gaining experience interviewing

[hearty island]

how i can't even get past the initial coding problem

[true harness]

and also, you might actually get an internship

[hearty island]

okie

[torpid totem]

bro apply to ups

im honestly a garbage programmer, i understand a bare minimum of concepts and couldnt really tell you how to code much more than a hello world program lmfao

[hearty island]

me too dude

me too

[torpid totem]

no coding question, just basic behavior interview questions

[near ocean]

theres more to an interview than the technical stuff

[torpid totem]

like they wanna get to know you

[hearty island]

i can speak well

[torpid totem]

yeah lol thats where i fly well

[hearty island]

like i've done a lot of behavioral interviews

[torpid totem]

im a HELLA social dude irl

[hearty island]

me too

[torpid totem]

but not a tech guy as much as i wanna be

[hearty island]

i can't stop talking

although after i code i go silent for a while

re boot

@torpid totem you can become a tech guy if you put the work in

[torpid totem]

you right you right

[hearty island]

so you mean like a coding internship for UPS?

it would have to be in NY or remote tho i can't travel during a pandemic

[sudden shadow]

hey can someone give me advice please. I want to be a software engineer or do something related to computers but I can’t afford classes in college because it’s so expensive here. I’m 15 and will be going to college in a few years and idk what to do, should I start with learning python by myself? i just want an enjoyable good paying job

[near ocean]

nothing bad could come from starting early

just make sure you dont drop your school stuff for it

[foggy agate]

@torpid totem System.println ("Hello World") String: Args { wait did i mess that up?

i think i did

[sudden shadow]

my school has a computer science class, should I take that?

what do you even do in computer science,

[near ocean]

high school CS stuff is garbage at worst, meh at best

i wouldnt say avoid it, but maths/physics/chem are better options IMHO

[foggy agate]

dude you're 15 and taking career advice? Y not party a bit, smoke some blunts, screw some chics, live it up, and when you're 16 think again?

[near ocean]

bro, really

[vapid jay]

guys help

so

I want to become a doctor

right

so if I make a popular yt channe

lwill I have a better chance of getting into a better colledge

this is my channel

220

is that like popular

ig

https://www.youtube.com/c/smartepicpeoplz/about

[sudden shadow]

is community college good to go to starting out?

if i cant afford a university

[hearty island]

this is a CS server

[hearty island]

yes

[sudden shadow]

whats the difference between the two? Do I learn less?

[hearty island]

no you just save money

if you go there for 2 years get your associates and have good grades you can transfer to any good university

[sudden shadow]

for free?

or you have to pay the same price still

[hearty island]

you have to pay that price the tuition costs for the university you're transferring to

[sudden shadow]

man i cant believe im going to college soon this sucks its going by so fast

im not ready

[hearty island]

don't worry

do you know the basics behind python or whatever language they're starting w?

[foggy agate]

I went to community college 2 years, balled out

but i'd have preferrably paid more to a private university and balled out

[sudden shadow]

no, im not even sure what to learn yet

im constantly on my computer and would like to do something with computers but im not exactly sure of what yet

i just want it to be enjoyable and get paid alot

i hear of so much like software engineering, computer scientist, web developer, idk what to do

[hearty island]

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

https://pythondiscord.com/pages/resources

[hearty island]

automate the boring stuff with python is a good start

[foggy agate]

are yo uthe next Logan Paul? How about Jake Paul? No? Then John Hopkins ain't taking you unless you got a 4.6 GPA, 2400/2400 SAT, 800/800 GMAT and 35,000 extra curricular activities with President of 3,000 of those clubs

[sudden shadow]

and im scared i wont be accepted for alot of jobs, my gpa is only like a 3.2

[foggy agate]

bruh i graduated with a 3.2, just bump it up to a 3.5 if possible and you got the universe ahead of you

pssshhhhh