python-discussion

[silent fable]

also fun fact: kde stands for kool desktop enviroment

[raven urchin]

Gnome

Gnome

[bronze dragon]

it used to

[crisp jay]

man imagine dwm

[toxic smelt]

I mean honestly I will straight up leave the editor and just use neovim

[undone isle]

i buillt a hand tracker that makes it so that if i put down a finger in irl it does it with a mechanical hand in build a boat for treasure in a roblox game for a project with media pipe

[raven urchin]

@velvet trout

You were right. It was always Roblox.

[toxic smelt]

That's why I never tried it 😭

[undone isle]

i dont play roblox it was js for the project

i saw it on tiktok

[silent fable]

dont bother urself with costomization, use tty

[raven urchin]

Customization is cool

[undone isle]

customization?

[raven urchin]

Even my Termux is customized muahaha

[undone isle]

what are yall talking abt?

[crisp jay]

im thinking of trying it out but idk if theres any patch for a i3 tab layout

[raven urchin]

Linux larpinn

[undone isle]

k

[silent fable]

oh hell yea we customizing tty now

i larp gentoo

[toxic smelt]

Customisation to make it apparent on the calendar pop up about week days within the awesomewm configs.

The guys never made it possible. 😔

[raven urchin]

I changed the font to Jetbrains-mono-nerd and customized the prompt with oh-my-zsh

[toxic smelt]

To make it look bolded

[velvet trout]

xD

[toxic smelt]

Specifically.

Welp not possible there

[rare gazelle]

@raven urchin @toxic smelt @silent fable hi!

[raven urchin]

Hello!!!

[toxic smelt]

Yoo

[rare gazelle]

how you all doing, i see that you building roblox mods or something

[undone isle]

while true:
termux-api-[phone number] "Message"

[rare gazelle]

(i'm not into roblox though)

[raven urchin]

💀

[velvet trout]

No hi to me 😔/jk

[raven urchin]

It was @undone isle

[rare gazelle]

hi to you!

[velvet trout]

@raven urchin i am so right

[silent fable]

all larps need to have a server

[raven urchin]

HAHAHA

[undone isle]

mods?

wahtever

[velvet trout]

Yoooo!

[toxic smelt]

Not sure about that one. You gotta figure it out it seems.

But at the end of all that, you can make your own anyways

[rare gazelle]

😁

[velvet trout]

Seed & Syntax

For some reason, i read it as C & Syntax

[raven urchin]

He's Seedy

[toxic smelt]

EXACTLY

[silent fable]

use openbox

[undone isle]

well i also made a python program that has a face scanner and hand scanner and some other things dm me if you want the code to try it

[rare gazelle]

i did too

[silent fable]

ok so... does anyone here even use python

[toxic smelt]

C is peak, I mean just look we got python from it

[undone isle]

me!

[silent fable]

even tho we in python server

[rare gazelle]

what it does

[raven urchin]

Hello, I am the Python learner

[velvet trout]

So its not just me .. i thought my brain is overly pattern matching lmao

[toxic smelt]

I know it

[silent fable]

same

[undone isle]

its just a cool thing to try

[rare gazelle]

😂

[stoic wigeon]

so uhh joined the discord to learn python (FULL BEGINNER LIKE PRINT HELLOWORLD TYPE OF BEGINNER) and joined to sorround me with people that knows what they doing. i dont really know what to do tho...

[undone isle]

hello i am a python major

[velvet trout]

I even read ART's name as Android Runtime (which he confirmed to be right, that was an intentional reference)

[rare gazelle]

post the code in here

[undone isle]

alr

[pastel sluice]

welcome!

[rare gazelle]

or a link to it

[crisp jay]

Python is peak too,thats why im macro abusing in C to make a for from Python into C

[rare gazelle]

!code

[edgy kraken]

Formatting code on Discord

Here's how to format Python code on Discord:

```py
print('Hello world!')
```

These are backticks, not quotes. Check this out if you can't find the backtick key.

For long code samples, you can use our pastebin.

[raven urchin]

Welcome :3

What

[pastel sluice]

!learn @stoic wigeon a good suggested set of things to begin with

[edgy kraken]

Go-to beginner resources

Here are the top free resources we recommend for people who are new to programming:

• Automate the Boring Stuff — an online book (also available to purchase as a physical book)
• Harvard’s CS50P course — video lectures (slides and notes provided) with exercises
• Python Programming MOOC 2026 course — text-based lessons with exercises
• Corey Schafer's YouTube playlist

For a full, curated list of educational resources we recommend, please see our resources page!

[toxic smelt]

I haven't tried CPython nor Cython... Had looked at it once like in the past, 2.5 years ago or smth

[silent fable]

do yall know bash

[velvet trout]

Lol

[pastel sluice]

CPython is just the name for the regular Python interpreter. Cython is something else, though

[stoic wigeon]

sure ill try those, thanks!

[rare gazelle]

the president?

[sand hornet]

Uno Reverse card: asking Python Devs if they've ever written CPython

[undone isle]

the code is to big lol

[raven urchin]

I just chain commands, don't know how to actually make complicated stuff with it

[velvet trout]

I am thinking of parsing it next time

[raven urchin]

Use !paste

[toxic smelt]

Oh ok.

I learned about Cython when trying pypy

[silent fable]

I have a book from Eric Matthes on python. Such a legend.

[undone isle]

!paste

[edgy kraken]

Pasting large amounts of code

So that everyone can easily read your code, you can paste it in this website:
https://paste.pythondiscord.com/

After pasting your code, save it by clicking the Paste! button in the bottom left, or by pressing CTRL + S. After doing that, you will be navigated to the new paste's page. Copy the URL and post it here so others can see it.

[toxic smelt]

Writing C files from python now, are we?

[sand hornet]

interoperability is a thing, yes..

[silent fable]

does anyone here even use windows lol

[toxic smelt]

I know it. Not extensively but enough to make simple programs.

[toxic smelt]

I do

[raven urchin]

Most people do, this is just a larper meeting

[silent fable]

same

[rare gazelle]

many probably, i do

[toxic smelt]

Win11

[gleaming knoll]

they are not interopping, just a foreach macro rather than an index loop

[sand hornet]

Interesting life choices...

[toxic smelt]

But it's just automatically open powershell and start neovim in it.

[undone isle]

https://paste.pythondiscord.com/EFTQ6NSN5F6BSCRSJFUQOUNS44

[silent fable]

I dont , on main pc i use mint. Eh i wanted to escape microslop

[undone isle]

here it is

[prime mountain]

Hi

[raven urchin]

Why don't you install Alacritty on Windows?

[raven urchin]

Hiiiiii

[undone isle]

i feel like the convos here are more abt general pc knowledge and os than actual python

[toxic smelt]

Dang one class fits all thingy

[raven urchin]

I use Arch on main, Debian on server and Alpine on VM. I'm the full larper.

[undone isle]

fr

[prime mountain]

How's it going?

[raven urchin]

Pretty good, hbu

[undone isle]

it took me a few hrs

[prime mountain]

Unable to sleep

[silent fable]

i use mint on main, larp on arch and devuan

[undone isle]

like 8

[toxic smelt]

Try segregating based on SOLID as a refactor challenge.

[undone isle]

uhm what does that mean??

[prime mountain]

Want to read but too tired

[raven urchin]

He usually does that, dw. He speaks some kind of clanker language

[undone isle]

lol

[toxic smelt]

Let me simply fetch a portion of my notes on it

[silent fable]

lets see who larps the most, tell me os and wm

[toxic smelt]

That's wrong those are legit things

[raven urchin]

Alpine
TTY

[toxic smelt]

Clanker is shit

[silent fable]

w larp 9.9/10

[raven urchin]

LMAO HAHAHA

[undone isle]

anyways im trynna get into a college when i grow up but i need a 4.3 gpa as a minimum 🙁

[gleaming knoll]

yeah i dont understand why would someone do that in C either

[raven urchin]

American kinda stuff. My college had 0 requirements for getting into it.

[crisp jay]

im kinda bored

[raven urchin]

I've met the dumbest people ever here. Funny.

[undone isle]

im not american

[undone isle]

techincally you need 22.3 merit which is swedish gpa

[raven urchin]

You're swedish?

[undone isle]

yh

[raven urchin]

Cool

[undone isle]

you?

[toxic smelt]

Five SOLID principles
Single Responsibility (SRP): A class should have only one reason to change, meaning it has only one job.
Open/Closed (OCP): Software entities should be open for extension but closed for modification. New functionality should be added by writing new code, not altering existing code.
Liskov Substitution (LSP): Subtypes must be substitutable for their base types without altering the program's correctness. Any code using a base class must work with an object of a derived class seamlessly.
Interface Segregation (ISP): Clients should not be forced to depend on interfaces they don't use. It's better to have many small, specific interfaces than one large general-purpose one.
Dependency Inversion (DIP): Depend upon abstractions, not concretions. High-level modules should not depend on low level modules; both should depend on abstractions.

[raven urchin]

Dominican

[undone isle]

nice but im still trynna read what @toxic smelt just said

[undone isle]

i feel like u used ai for that

[toxic smelt]

It is gonna make your life easier

[undone isle]

dude im 13 i dont understand anything

[toxic smelt]

Those are stringent definitions bruh 😭

[silent fable]

heres some larping quotes : “I don’t use a computer. I command it.”
“If it has a GUI, it’s already too slow.”
“I don’t break my system—I recompile it.”
“My OS doesn’t crash. It politely informs me of my mistakes.”
“Real users don’t click. They type.”

[undone isle]

your making my brain explode @toxic smelt

[gleaming knoll]

surely you can understand

A class should have only one reason to change, meaning it has only one job.

[raven urchin]

LARPers will larp.

[steel whale]

you definitely used ai

[grim hatch]

First one is the 14 year old who just learned how to print Hello World

[silent fable]

fr

[grave tree]

Let's keep this channel focused on Python pls

[raven urchin]

He just has a whole wikipedia of Obsidian notes

[gleaming knoll]

https://www.digitalocean.com/community/conceptual-articles/s-o-l-i-d-the-first-five-principles-of-object-oriented-design
maybe the peeps at digitalocean did?

[undone isle]

r u tlkng about me?

[grim hatch]

We are

[toxic smelt]

I will put it simply then

The point of this is to make sure you are making it compliant to OOPs principles. Which makes code easier to maintain.

[silent fable]

ok uh ig letss talk abt python

[grim hatch]

them the facts

[grave tree]

Talking about random computer-related quotes is not

[undone isle]

ohh k

[toxic smelt]

Did you pass it through some filters online?

[grim hatch]

I said print Hello World

[undone isle]

okk

[silent fable]

ok bye i gtg

[toxic smelt]

Or did you assess the definition's correctness? Because I will value the latter here.

[raven urchin]

it's not python, because Pyrhon is

print("Hello World")```

[undone isle]

cya

[raven urchin]

haha, assess

[grim hatch]

print("Hello World!")

[undone isle]

helloworld("print")

[raven urchin]

YES

[raven urchin]

helloworld = print
print = "Hello world"

helloworld(print)```

[gleaming knoll]

hmh

Dependency Inversion (DIP): Depend upon abstractions, not concretions. High-level modules should not depend on low level modules; both should depend on abstractions.
how is that supposed to be done? i mean, you can introduce a step inbetween, but then there is still a module the purpose of which is to provide higher abstraction and it depends on a low level one

[toxic smelt]

I just passed it myself and it returned nothing.

[undone isle]

python when printing: print("Hello world")

C++ when printing: quhfiqkhfiuqfjoiuqbjfukhqfqoubihfohqbyfhjnqofubiqufhjiuqhfouqbijqufqifhqufhqiuhfoqihfuqhfouqiofbqiufnoqufiuqfiugqhfogqyuofgiqyufhqiyfgiu2grfqiufuiqhfouqhfouqfouqhfoquijfqnfuioqnfuqnfoqifhqonfioqfoiqnfouqnifoiqnf("Hello world!")

[raven urchin]

assert has_brain == True```

[wise imp]

(should abstractions also depend on abstractions? )

[prime mountain]

Imagine doing CAD or sculpting with a keyboard

[raven urchin]

1. Don't flood.
2. C has its reason to be complex, not really comparable.

[toxic smelt]

I was just expanding my notes to that part.

Till now I went to the Liskov section only.

[undone isle]

fair

[toxic smelt]

I will check upon DIP and perhaps get it out

[raven urchin]

🤝

[gleaming knoll]

#include <print>
int main() {
  std::println("Hello world");
}

c++23
tbh just puts if you dont format
almighty libc

[undone isle]

isnt it include iostream or smth?

[gleaming knoll]

if you want to use streams rather than print sure

[bronze dragon]

iostream is for std::cout and such

[toxic smelt]

But this shit about SOLID is based on some source of Robert C. Martin and so far those 3 are mentioned.

[undone isle]

i dont rlly know any c lang

[grim hatch]

def hello_world(foo):
     print(f"{foo}")

hello_world("Hello World!")

[undone isle]

i only know python css html and lua

[grim hatch]

Are you by any chance a roblox dev?

[autumn forge]

f"{foo}"?

[gleaming knoll]

i like DI-ing streams rather than hardcoding std::c(in|out)
so like
a function will take the output stream
and then i call it with stdout

[wise imp]

C is not complex in any way, it's quite simple, in fact
(unless, idk, we count emergent complexity originating from macro abuse)

[undone isle]

i mean i hop on studio one and a while but not rlly

[raven urchin]

I usually do this too lmao, redundant f-string for the win

[grim hatch]

What do you use lua for?

[toxic smelt]

I was confused too when I saw DIP, because I heard about it in like... Freaking web dev uni classes when using Angular lol

[gleaming knoll]

recite the entire C23 standard

[raven urchin]

[grim hatch]

Idk couldn't find a better parameter name

[undone isle]

nothin rlly just lor learning

[toxic smelt]

(don't ask me angular I forgot)

[bronze dragon]

print(f"{foo}") is equivalent to print(foo)

[raven urchin]

I think she meant that you didn't really need an f-string there

[toxic smelt]

Anyways, I will compete these notes

[grim hatch]

Oh that's actually true mb

[toxic smelt]

Right now it is freaking 2 AM

[raven urchin]

I do the same thing lol

[gleaming knoll]

_BitInt(65535) on my C23 till Segmentation fault (core dumped)

[undone isle]

for me its 10 pm

[grim hatch]

def hello_world(foo):
     print(foo)

hello_world("Hello World!")

[raven urchin]

Yes

[grim hatch]

Lol I guess it's a given

[autumn forge]

💀 I had typed out the exact same message

[gleaming knoll]

eta reduction
inlining

[toxic smelt]

2200 hours. Peak time to procrastinate on discord

[grim hatch]

True

[grim hatch]

Eta what

[undone isle]

fr

[undone isle]

i tried it and it works lol

[spice hill]

In this context, it means depending on an interface instead of implementation.

[grim hatch]

Both should

[undone isle]

ik

[gleaming knoll]

ah so like Iterable instead of list whatever
yeah thats good

[toxic smelt]

F strings are legendary like I have used them so manyyyy times unconsciously.

That even my C compiler goes, "bro, stop putting f character there"

[raven urchin]

LMAO

[undone isle]

what are f strings?

[grim hatch]

F strings are indeed great

[gleaming knoll]

!f-string

[edgy kraken]

Format-strings

Creating a Python string with your variables using the + operator can be difficult to write and read. F-strings (format-strings) make it easy to insert values into a string. If you put an f in front of the first quote, you can then put Python expressions between curly braces in the string.

>>> snake = "pythons"
>>> number = 21
>>> f"There are {number * 2} {snake} on the plane."
"There are 42 pythons on the plane."

Note that even when you include an expression that isn't a string, like number * 2, Python will convert it to a string for you.

[toxic smelt]

It's supposed to be printf("") not print(f"")

[gleaming knoll]

wait

[undone isle]

like i know what it is just what is it used for

[toxic smelt]

Exactly

[toxic smelt]

My compiler screams me that /j

[raven urchin]

I'm surprised I haven't done the same thing in go

[spice hill]

erm well actually it's equivalent to print(foo.__format__(""))

[grim hatch]

state = "weird"
print(f"something is {state}")

Prints : something is weird

[undone isle]

oh wait just to like combine strings and values

[toxic smelt]

This is C and Python

[grim hatch]

This is much better

[grim hatch]

Yes

[gleaming knoll]

https://hachyderm.io/@[e-mail]/116223565752353631

[grim hatch]

There is also printf()

[raven urchin]

Go has Printf too

[undone isle]

im gonna learn asm soon

[spice hill]

!e

class Duck:
    def __format__(self, spec):
        return "quack"
duck = Duck()
print(duck)
print(f"{duck}")

[edgy kraken]

:white_check_mark: Your 3.14 eval job has completed with return code 0.

001 | <__main__.Duck object at 0x7f75b32786e0>
002 | quack

[grim hatch]

Or the least liked way to do it

foo = "boo"
print("You are" + foo)

[raven urchin]

Duck object

[toxic smelt]

Copy cat Go

[gleaming knoll]

type(foo).__format__(foo, "") actually

[toxic smelt]

But alright

[raven urchin]

Go go power rangers

[toxic smelt]

Dangggg

[gleaming knoll]

well
not really because it doesnt use the type variable from the current scope but rather the one "baked into" the interpreter

[spice hill]

true

[toxic smelt]

Bruh 😭

[gleaming knoll]

maybe foo.__class__.__format__(foo, "")?
can you override class such that type(foo) and foo.__class__ will differ?

[spice hill]

!e

class NerdLevel3:
    def __getattribute__(self, arg):
        if arg == "__class__": raise TypeError("nuh uh")
        else: return super().__getattribute__(arg)

nerd = NerdLevel3()
print(nerd.__class__)

[edgy kraken]

:x: Your 3.14 eval job has completed with return code 1.

001 | Traceback (most recent call last):
002 |   File "/home/main.py", line 7, in <module>
003 |     print(nerd.__class__)
004 |           ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
005 |   File "/home/main.py", line 3, in __getattribute__
006 |     if arg == "__class__": raise TypeError("nuh uh")
007 |                            ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
008 | TypeError: nuh uh

[gleaming knoll]

hmmh
how to reliably access the type
without using a global

[grim hatch]

Hmmm

Word

[toxic smelt]

Stop making my man as verbose as Java please 🥺

[spice hill]

type = True.__class__.__class__

[gleaming knoll]

oh thats cute yeah

[grim hatch]

Just pass the type explicitly

[gleaming knoll]

(().__class__.__class__)(foo).__format__(foo, "")

absolute coding

[toxic smelt]

Just

class YoLo
    ...

[grim hatch]

Coding 100

[gleaming knoll]

functional programming of balls

[grim hatch]

What-

[gleaming knoll]

starts beatboxing
https://youtu.be/0ebreGjhEvo

[toxic smelt]

Even Java dev won't want their code this verbose.

[undone isle]

lloll

does anybody know if you learn python in robotics science colleges

[bronze dragon]

look up the curriculum of the college in question

[undone isle]

ok

[wise imp]

yk, I always wondered what's the purpose of !s format specifier, but it turns out that without it, it would call __format__ if it's defined, with !s it ensures __str__ is called

[spice hill]

that's right https://stackoverflow.com/a/72449614/10295729

[gleaming knoll]

for some reason f"{x=}" seems to call repr rather than format?

[spice hill]

that's because it's intended for debugging I think

[gleaming knoll]

makes sense

[spice hill]

print debugging 👍

[undone isle]

is it true that you can follow somebody on tiktok in kali with a command

[steel whale]

follow as in stalk or doing the same thing as clicking the follow button?

[undone isle]

follow button

[steel whale]

you can do that, doesnt really require kali as it's not necessary

[dry yacht]

Fixed by doing f"{x=:}"

[undone isle]

yh but i saw it on mr robot

[dry yacht]

Or as I like to call it: Reverse walrus 🦭 (I know that's a seal, sue me)

[steel whale]

jesus christ

[undone isle]

lol

[steel whale]

@bright shoal they're yours now

[raven urchin]

Well, I think I don't have an exam on Saturday anymore

My teacher was kicked out of my university.

[velvet trout]

[shrewd plinth]

You're going to share the story, right?

What'd they do? Were they tenured?

[brisk gazelle]

Sharing the story may be legally inadvisable.

[velvet trout]

she probably said "Python is Slow"

[shrewd plinth]

I mean, I assumed they weren't directly involved in the teacher getting kicked out and have a nondisclosure clause in a settlement. But maybe that's a false assumption

[raven urchin]

That topic isn't Python-Discussion friendly

But from Saturday on, I'll be 100% focused on Python until I have class again hehe.

[lime sedge]

They said python was slow and AI will steal all our jobs. I heard they even went manic and told everyone we are doomed because we pioneered skynet./s

[raven urchin]

Yeah, he vibe coded a Roblox cheat too

[lime sedge]

Oh... That jerk...

[runic flower]

taught all the students how to write a python stockmarket trading bot where they did a 50/50 split with the students. but then they lost everything on memestocks.

[grizzled scroll]

hi i need help changing a simple link in my python code but i cant find where to change it, is there anyone that can change it for me

[runic flower]

was the code ai generated?

[grizzled scroll]

it always fetches from a specific link, but i just need it to auto fetch from a different link,

nope

it was made by someone i ws once close with,

BUT we are not aqcuainted anymore

basically it scrapes my tourney mode page on a game from a website

[runic flower]

share a link to the code, or cut/paste a few lines where the link is, and explain what you need

[grizzled scroll]

oki so basically, the guys who own the site game api changed their site recently, and instead of dev.uniteapi.dev its now uniteapi.dev

[runic flower]

if you need to share a lot of code or post a screenshot make a thread in #1035199133436354600

[grizzled scroll]

so all my fetch tourney page doesnt work

cause only the start is wrong

[runic flower]

seems like a relatively simple change, can't you just change the text?

[grizzled scroll]

i dont know how to

its something i use a lot for my game but i have no euh good knowledge

[runic flower]

anyway, I'm out. let me know if you paste a link to the code or open a thread in #1035199133436354600

[mint abyss]

i have been remaking a previous code of mine and i would like to know what you guys think(its not fully complete and rn i dont have the newest vertion as i do it in school)
new : https://paste.pythondiscord.com/XIGQ
old: https://paste.pythondiscord.com/NW2A

[glacial ginkgo]

whats up chat

[mint abyss]

js chillin

[runic flower]

looks like you're off to a good start!
I would suggest
(1) learn about dataclasses
(2) learn about pathlib
(3) use ruff or something to auto format your code. (or at the very least add a blank line between functions)
(4) not a big fan of the "----classes/functions" etc style comments.
but looks like a nice start!

[mint abyss]

what is ruff?

[runic flower]

https://pypi.org/project/ruff/
pip install ruff
checks your code for you. linter and code formatter

[steel whale]

it's a linter

and a formatter

[mint abyss]

can i use it with thonny?

[runic flower]

it shouldn't care what ide you use, so yeah.

[mint abyss]

ohhhh

thanks

how exactly do i use it tho?

[glacial ginkgo]

seems like a fun lil project.

[steel whale]

ruff --help

[velvet trout]

ruff check will check your code

Ruff can also fix sometimes and sometimes safely/unsafely (though it will ask you explictly about that don't worry)

[runic flower]

ruff check or ruff format

[velvet trout]

you can enable/disable some ruff rules as you would like to

[mint abyss]

well yh but like do i use it inside the code or in a diffrent code to check the code i am coding

[velvet trout]

--isolated?

[mint abyss]

yeah

[velvet trout]

you gotta check cli args it takes, do ruff --help or go to astral docs of it

[steel whale]

ruff check /your/file.py

[runic flower]

before you run/build your code, you can run ruff on it.

[steel whale]

ruffening your code

[mint abyss]

so like in the terminal thing do ruff --checl

[velvet trout]

k*, yes

[alpine dragon]

Anyone knows how to code a re-run programm when a condition is satisfied?

[runic flower]

loop.

[alpine dragon]

Yh but its not practical

I need it without the welcome message

[runic flower]

so don't include that in the loop?

[alpine dragon]

My code of a SIMPLE calculator is 200 lines of code

So i need an alternative

[velvet trout]

Modularize or into small functions

[alpine dragon]

Wydm?

[velvet trout]

Can't help much without actual code implementation

[runic flower]

welcome()
while True:
    rest_of_code()
    if not condition:
        break
print("g'bye")

[steel whale]

print(eval(input()))
this is the entire calculator

[alpine dragon]

Yh but eval is not secure, i heard

[steel whale]

good , so you know

[alpine dragon]

Yh

But im a beginner

[runic flower]

eval will let you shoot yourself in the foot, but only if you let it. It can be used effectively in controlled circumstances. eval input is not safe though.

[mighty bay]

Why are you guys still trying to manually code when claude exists?

[velvet trout]

Then you're more supposed to write code than relying on eval

[alpine dragon]

Check rules

[mint abyss]

ruff check mainfunction.py
File "<stdin>", line 1
ruff check mainfunction.py
^^^^^
SyntaxError: invalid syntax

what am i doing wrong?

[cerulean ravine]

why are you still talking to people when claude exists?

[steel whale]

because brain need training

[velvet trout]

Lol

[runic flower]

I write better code than AI. AI code is generally weak, and introduces huge security flaws.

[steel whale]

you don;t use ruff in the REPL

[velvet trout]

In your terminal, that's a python REPL you're inside

[steel whale]

since when does adobe illustrator generate code

[autumn forge]

it is still important to learn to code. To best use AI tools you still need people who know how to code at the helm

[alpine dragon]

Exactly

[velvet trout]

Claude is an assistant, not a programmer replacement lmao

[mint abyss]

is it the same with format js ruff format codename.py?

[mighty bay]

It codes better than a big percantage of programmers

who are actually in the industry

[velvet trout]

Yes, all commands of ruff, because its a cli program, it runs inside your terminal

[velvet trout]

Source? Evidence?

[alpine dragon]

Idk, maybe its for the computer to understand what code ur talking bout or smt

[cerulean ravine]

why are you trying to convince us of this?

[autumn forge]

fwiw generating code is not the only job of a programmer / software engineer

[mighty bay]

Yea understanding networking is apart for sure

But knowning a lot of syntax is pointless now

[velvet trout]

You can call exit() or hit Control + D to exit and get back to terminal

[alpine dragon]

#rules

Read the 10th rule

[runic flower]

That's generally not true.
What is does do is generate code faster than a big percentage, and it generates code better than a lot of technical producers.

[autumn forge]

syntax of particular languages has never been the most important thing for a programmer to know

[velvet trout]

😔 who is gonna tell bro

[alpine dragon]

Who's gonna tell bro 🥀

[cerulean ravine]

seriously: why are you trying to convince us of this?

[alpine dragon]

He needs to read the rules

[cerulean ravine]

@mighty bay have you used claude code? Did you like what it produced?

[alpine dragon]

Especially the 10th one

[autumn forge]

talking about AI tools is not against the rules

[mighty bay]

its basically syntax and computer networking

[alpine dragon]

He uses AI

[alpine dragon]

Try c++, then ull wanna learn python

[velvet trout]

Mod is gonna cook you all now

Go to #ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval

.topic Our saviour!

[verbal wedge]

**What standard library module is really underrated?**

Suggest more topics here!

[velvet trout]

shlex

[raven urchin]

Interesting

[raven urchin]

What's shlex

[velvet trout]

!doc shlex

[edgy kraken]

shlex

Source code: Lib/shlex.py

The shlex class makes it easy to write lexical analyzers for simple syntaxes resembling that of the Unix shell. This will often be useful for writing minilanguages, (for example, in run control files for Python applications) or for parsing quoted strings.

The shlex module defines the following functions:

[velvet trout]

Basically, a tokenizer for cli arguments

[raven urchin]

o

[velvet trout]

i rely on it for my cliargparse too

Until i write my own implementation

[alpine dragon]

Im just a beginner so im wonder if ur talking in another language 😭

[raven urchin]

You don't have to worry about advanced stuff when you're starting :b

[granite wyvern]

I feel much happier using ast.literal_eval myself. ( @alpine dragon )

[alpine dragon]

Whats that?

[velvet trout]

async def _internal_threshold[_T: _U = _V](/, _c: _T) -> _T: ...

See this and get scared, HAHHAHA

[alpine dragon]

Im not scared

Im scared of c++

[velvet trout]

😔

[granite wyvern]

!doc ast.literal_eval

It's an eval which basic only accepts expressions with constants in them - no access to variables or function calls.

[edgy kraken]

ast.literal\_eval

ast.literal_eval(node_or_string)```
Evaluate an expression node or a string containing only a Python literal or container display. The string or node provided may only consist of the following Python literal structures: strings, bytes, numbers, tuples, lists, dicts, sets, booleans, `None` and `Ellipsis`.

This can be used for evaluating strings containing Python values without the need to parse the values oneself. It is not capable of evaluating arbitrarily complex expressions, for example involving operators or indexing.

[velvet trout]

Bro lied about being a beginner

[raven urchin]

Oh God, I AM scared.

[velvet trout]

HEHEHEHE

[raven urchin]

😭

[mint abyss]

does ruff have a fix option or not, i searched it up it does but when i put it into the termianl gives a eroro

[alpine dragon]

I can only do calculators, ive seen a lot more than that, its just that i cant write that stuff

[raven urchin]

You can configure ruff afaik

[velvet trout]

--fix

--show-fixes

--unsafe-fix for unsafe fixes iirc

[raven urchin]

Try to make a tictactoe

[cerulean ravine]

fwiw, rule 10 doesn't prohibit being in favor of AI

[mint abyss]

yh i do ruff --fix codename.py

[velvet trout]

Nah, cliargparse better

[velvet trout]

Then do it

[mint abyss]

ruff --fix rollfunction.py
error: unexpected argument '--fix' found

[velvet trout]

I think its ruff check --fix ?

I think you should refer to docs

ruff check --fix && ruff format

[granite wyvern]

Yeah.

Personally I'm only happy running

ruff check \
                 --fix --fix-only \
                 "--target-version=$ruff_pyver" \
                 --select "$ruff_fixes" \

where:

• ruff_fixes=${RUFF_FIXES:-'D207,F401,Q003,UP004'}
  and ruff_pyver=${RUFF_PYTHON_VERSION:-'py38'}

I've got a personal fix script which does that, with a diff to show what was changed/mangled.

[velvet trout]

Holy Professional

[mint abyss]

yh

i dont undesteand anything

[granite wyvern]

I'm lazy. I just want to type fix some_filename.py

[velvet trout]

Mine is just a noob bash script:

.../projects/cliargparse $ cat ruff.sh
ruff check --fix --show-fixes

[granite wyvern]

Bourne shell syntax. Basicly it runs ruff check --fix with a restrict set of fixes.

[raven urchin]

I'm the true larper

Neovim automatically formats for me every time I save.

[velvet trout]

That ducky is my copyright bro

[granite wyvern]

Same, if I've made a .autoformat file in the project dir.

[velvet trout]

You can't use it without my permission

[granite wyvern]

Though I use yapf for personal code, not ruff or black.

[raven urchin]

Can I use it Mr Aji?

[velvet trout]

No its for me only!!!

[raven urchin]

damn

[raven urchin]

👀

HAHA

[velvet trout]

😔

[mint abyss]

lwk ruff kinda seems tuff

[charred tusk]

wat

[mint abyss]

i gotta learn these two: dataclasses and pathlib, are they hard to learn?

[mint abyss]

its a liner and a formatter for python i found out about 15 mins ago

[raven urchin]

Super easy

[velvet trout]

[mint abyss]

how could i use them in my code? https://paste.pythondiscord.com/XIGQ

[velvet trout]

p = Path("src")
x = p / "abc"

Holy division operator overload 🔥

[robust ledge]

Why do you have to learn them? They are easier to use if you build something with them.

[runic flower]

no. they're easy to learn. pathlib is a simpler version of all the os.filestuff and dataclasses are a simper version of classes.

[velvet trout]

You using match-case wow

[charred tusk]

Looks like you already are

[mint abyss]

i think i am js scarping the bare minium with that code

idk howto spell

[raven urchin]

Path("thing.csv")? You should use __file__ or something like that as reference

[velvet trout]

[mint abyss]

is it bad???

[glacial ginkgo]

I just have ruff scripted to run whenever I save in nvim

[charred tusk]

If you want to go all out on pathlib:

- with open('inventory.csv', 'w',newline='') as csvfile:
+ with Path('inventory.csv').open('w',newline='') as csvfile:

- os.remove("inventory.csv")
+ Path('inventory.csv').unlink()

[velvet trout]

Keep class names in PascalCase case.

Its basically every word's first letter capital and rest small

[raven urchin]

Me too lol

[velvet trout]

No, that's cool!!!

[mint abyss]

[robust ledge]

Why make complex object if you'll only use them once?

[velvet trout]

[raven urchin]

Isn't python convention snake_case?

[charred tusk]

Why not?

[velvet trout]

For variables, yes

[gleaming knoll]

for variables and functions yes, for classes its PascalCase

[mint abyss]

idk wtf pascal case is either

[velvet trout]

I explained it two words later

[raven urchin]

Ah, didn't see he referred to classes

[robust ledge]

Hmm... let's find out.

[raven urchin]

This is:
PascalCase
camelCase
snake_case

[velvet trout]

HelloWorld

Hello and World are two different words, each word's first letter is Capital

That's the PascalCase

[mint abyss]

ohhh

[velvet trout]

IIRC

[velvet trout]

Imagine,

class person: ...

person = person()

Meh... Types/classes using PascalCase seems easier to read and quickly map them what they are

[raven urchin]

No, no, I know, I just thought you referred to other stuff, not classes

👀

[velvet trout]

[granite wyvern]

No. dataclasses are easy to start with, and pathlib's pretty simple.

[raven urchin]

Go has me thinking in camelCase and PascalCase as public and private 🥀

[velvet trout]

This is why b-komachi went downhill 😔

[minor plover]

Hey guys wssup

[velvet trout]

[mint abyss]

so does this simplify the code cuz it looks like it does the same thing?

[raven urchin]

It didn't 💔
B-komachi always goat 💔

[velvet trout]

Everyone Hail leading underscore convention 🔥

[raven urchin]

I wonder what my mom will think after she sees my Ruby rice lmao

[glacial ginkgo]

no thx

[granite wyvern]

That assumes the code is next to the data. Real world utilities aren't like that - they're installed ... wherever, and usually operate in whichever working directory you're using.

[velvet trout]

I know bro is Object lover over functions.

[glacial ginkgo]

Is there a way to like... hire someone to look at your code and give you pointers? Like a coach or something?

[velvet trout]

[raven urchin]

Better than that
#1035199133436354600 is free

[granite wyvern]

!paid

Here? No hiring. But you can show your code in a topic in #1035199133436354600 and ask for criticism and suggestions.

!rule paid

[raven urchin]

I don't understand if you're correcting me or him lol

[edgy kraken]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[granite wyvern]

Sorry, mistyped the rule !

[velvet trout]

I should go and fix my errors instead of spying in here 🥀

[granite wyvern]

You, in a way. If the program expects to run in the directory with the data, just plain 'inventory.csv' etc is fine.
Thus:

cd datadir1
run the programme
cd datadir2
run the programme

[raven urchin]

I should do homework

[granite wyvern]

The whole __file__ thing is for when you need to open soething which is colocated with the code.
Maybe default data or config etc.

[velvet trout]

I changed my terminology, operand -> positional

Now I have to update everywhere

[mint abyss]

when i finish writeng my code so that it runs in the shell, should i try and program it in smthing like pygame?

[velvet trout]

🥀 is it programming-based?

[granite wyvern]

You should do what you wantt to do.

[raven urchin]

I say this because I've had problems doing so. I find it more reliable to use Path(__file__).parent / "thing"

[velvet trout]

.parent is goated

[granite wyvern]

Yes. That is policy. You're saying "my data are in the same directory as the code".

But a general purpose utility will be run somewhere else from its code.

[raven urchin]

Nope.
I don't study anything programming related.
I'm a med student.

But this homework is reading 2 stories... 😭

[raven urchin]

Can I have an example of this? I'm interested

[robust ledge]

So I have my answer. I wanted to confirm my hunch. It's a micro-optimization. That is all.

preocts @ synthwave ~
└─▶ $ python openit.py
Using built in (1_000_000 times): 4.61
Using Path (1_000_000 times)    : 7.05

[glacial ginkgo]

thanks I tried that.

[velvet trout]

Explain mitochondria

[raven urchin]

The powerhouse of the cell 🗣️ 🔥

[velvet trout]

Write a table showing comparison between mitosis and meiosis

[velvet trout]

Real

[granite wyvern]

Well, take the fix script I mentioned earlier. The code is in (as installed) my ~/bin-cs directory.

But I run it on files in some arbitrary project directory:

cd my-project-dir
fix some-python-file.py

[glacial ginkgo]

right, I guess I had too narrow a definition of work. would asking for uni recommendations also be breaking the rule if unis aren't free?

[raven urchin]

[granite wyvern]

No. You were asking about hiring someone to review your code. That's paid work.

Asking people to review it for free is fine.

Same for general advice.

[velvet trout]

Can you cure cancer with python xD

[raven urchin]

Aight, bet

That's the best question I've got so far lmao

[velvet trout]

xD

[raven urchin]

Technically Python has cured cancer already

[velvet trout]

😔 i thought snake was slow

[raven urchin]

Some pattern recognition AI detected cancer before it developed on a lady's mammogram.

[velvet trout]

Nice

[raven urchin]

That's the real good use for AI

[granite wyvern]

Well, ML.

[glacial ginkgo]

I think seeking out educational resources doesn't really fit the category of seeking out "work" but it won't happen again

[velvet trout]

But can your python cure a disease that existed 9383839 years ago that lasted for a 17 years?

[granite wyvern]

No, seeking edutcational resources is also fine. It was the word "hire" in your request which breaks the rule.

[raven urchin]

The python would bite me and I'd die to the poison

[autumn forge]

luckily pythons aren't venemous

[raven urchin]

Really? They have a really venomous name.

[velvet trout]

😔 then you'd reincarnate as a baby of an idol with full memories and speech ability of an adult and pastlife

[raven urchin]

STOP HAHA

[turbid sigil]

they just have a lot of teeth, and are very very strong

[raven urchin]

Me going back as the daughter of Ado:

[velvet trout]

Are they slow in real life too?? :D

[turbid sigil]

they sometimes eat aligators, if I'm not mistaken

[autumn forge]

they're constrictors

[mint abyss]

do i convert my code to pygame at some point? https://paste.pythondiscord.com/XIGQ

[raven urchin]

ALIGATORS????

[raven urchin]

Erhmm, you start in PyGame.

[mint abyss]

well try and remake it in pygame

[velvet trout]

Evolution is scared after this seeing this stage 😔

[granite wyvern]

Constrictors are pythons I think, but a python isn't necessarily a constrictor. The diamond pythons here generally just eat small prey.

[mint abyss]

i js dont know whether its worth the struggle yet

[turbid sigil]

in florida. look it up, and you'll find some interesting stuff.

[raven urchin]

Oh God, I'll never got to Florida or Australia.

[velvet trout]

Why am i reading constrictors as constructors (dunder __new__) 😭

[raven urchin]

HAHAHA

[glacial ginkgo]

"Are there ways for people who are not employed in tech or in school to access informed mentors who will help them"

[turbid sigil]

Trampin, the question was worded in a way that was misunderstood by others

[terse mauve]

here:)

[granite wyvern]

regrettably we don't have something good for one-on-one mentoring.
But you can some here for help with specific things.

[raven urchin]

Hi goat

[turbid sigil]

but we know your intentions, and welcome you with open arms

[raven urchin]

Why one-on-one mentoring when we have Open Source Mentoring™?

[terse mauve]

sup?
I didn't mean "here" as to myself, but to the discord server

[raven urchin]

Ik, ik, still a goat

[velvet trout]

informed mentors means? Continuous private helping?

[raven urchin]

Yes

[terse mauve]

k lol

[granite wyvern]

Lots of people come seeking either a direct tutor or someone to pair with for learning. We're poorly set up for both.

[velvet trout]

English has lots of implicit words lol

[terse mauve]

I don't think I'm goated tbh, why do you think so?

[raven urchin]

Shoomp helps me every night I ask him because he's a goat too

[velvet trout]

Or my parser too dumb

[raven urchin]

You're cool, you know a lot, that's a goat in my books

[wise imp]

likely survivorship bias, but I've never heard or seen of pair learning ever working out really

[terse mauve]

fair

[raven urchin]

Pair learning?

[velvet trout]

key-value pairs 😭 .items() lmao

[turbid sigil]

interestingly enough, there have been studies on pair programming in XP, that show that the productivity is about the same or slightly less than if they work as individuals

[sand hornet]

This probably belongs in an #ot but I should probably consider streaming dev work in one of the chats from time to time (maybe stream to Twitch/YT too)

[granite wyvern]

Plenty of people are happier working with another person - immediate person to discuss with, no imposter syndrome etc.

[turbid sigil]

I don't remember the study though

[raven urchin]

I do, I enjoy a lot studying with Shoomp helping me

[crisp jay]

what is a constrictor

[harsh anchor]

the main benefit of pair programming is knowledge transfer

[raven urchin]

Type of snake

[granite wyvern]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constriction

[wise imp]

well, pair programming is a bit different than pair learning methinks, I suppose learning is implicit in pair programming

[sand hornet]

The downside is getting distracted by everyone questioning your life choices lol

[turbid sigil]

accurate statement. I made a logical leap lol

[terse mauve]

There's even a boa constrictor

[raven urchin]

lmao

[granite wyvern]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boa_constrictor

[raven urchin]

Anaconda

[glacial ginkgo]

technically yeah I guess I don't need a long term formal mentorship I just hear it widely recommended by youtubers. I think the fact that that is my primary source of advice is sort of the reason I am asking 😂

[wise imp]

embeddable js in rust... of course

[terse mauve]

That project has the cleanest rust code I've ever seen, if you are comfy with rust, I highly recommend looking at it

[raven urchin]

Oh yeah, of course. The LARPers will larp.

Do these said YouTubers also sell courses or tutoring by any chance?

[raven urchin]

I don't even know how Rust looks like. Haha.

I told you I'll learn rust in some months after I get comfy with Go and Py

[wise imp]

hmm, but has it ever worked out in an online form?

[glacial ginkgo]

mostly just coffee over ssh tbh lmao

[raven urchin]

Coffee over ssh?

I need this, send coffee asap.

[granite wyvern]

I think it's working for Saber

[glacial ginkgo]

I am not elaborating I am already on thin ice 😂

[granite wyvern]

coffee over ssh over ip over avian carriers

[turbid sigil]

Saber as in the airway company?

[wise imp]

@swift sparrow are you mentoring @raven urchin? (like is that what you would consider whatever you're doing, from your perspective)

[granite wyvern]

Saber as in @raven urchin

[turbid sigil]

ah, I see

[silver plover]

YouTubers don't become YouTubers by spreading facts

[jovial briar]

I’m about to start a new project. Does anyone have any tips regarding the planning stage ?

[raven urchin]

Not really mentoring but he helps me with Pyside when he's free

[glacial ginkgo]

sure, again my problem is I am stretched for good respurces lol

[jovial briar]

I’m gonna ask in the python help chat my bad

[wise imp]

well, no plan survives the first contact with the enemy

that doesn't mean you shouldn't plan though

[turbid sigil]

gather requirements, break project down into features, do a short informal design of things that are confusing (skip if nothing like that), code with good design in mind, refactor as requirements change. Test as you go.

[jovial briar]

You just start writing immediately??

[raven urchin]

I am an airway company? Wow

[silver plover]

What kind of resource do you need? What are you trying to learn?

[velvet trout]

alias Saber = Ruby

Lmao

[raven urchin]

😭

[silver plover]

Pick either the easiest or hardest part and focus on that.

[jovial briar]

Thank you guys :)

[wise imp]

that could work I guess, at least that way you're on the ground and see how things are starting to fit together and what needs planning where, what doesn't at the moment

[jovial briar]

I’m just currently deciding on whether I would like for the project to be cli or gui based

[silver plover]

Kinda what I do. I either scaffold it, and defer the science to later... or deal with the hard part

[jovial briar]

I feel like I would learn more doing gui as I’ve mostly done cli based stuff before but gui really hurts my head 🤣🤣

[silver plover]

What's the project?

[granite wyvern]

Start with the CLI. It's easier. Then add a gui later.
I've got a CLI tool with subcommands, and one of the subcommands is "gui".

[turbid sigil]

when you are making technology decisions, you are in the "programming immediately" part, in my humble opinion.

[jovial briar]

secret 🥹

[wise imp]

oh hey, since we're talking about planning
god, do I need some resource for this, it's difficult to plan for a team or as a team as I'm finding out during this uni project we're doing

[turbid sigil]

design should be technology agnostic (am I incorrect for saying this?)

[jovial briar]

That’s nice I like that

[jovial briar]

I don’t fully understand what you mean

[turbid sigil]

making technology decisions early locks you into a solution

[robust ledge]

Depends on the design. You can absolutely design for specific technologies. In fact, you should at some point of the process!

[silver plover]

Many products are designed according to the org chart of the engineering team.

[turbid sigil]

you eliminate possible alternatives, and narrow yourself in.

[glacial ginkgo]

Mostly meta skills really. I am at the point where I can make stuff that works but I can't answer "is it good, is there a better way, am I doing inefficient stuff". I did post in help here if you wouldn't mind taking a look to see what I mean:
https://discord.com/channels/267624335836053506/1501717282198388836

[robust ledge]

At some point, you must be focused.

[jovial briar]

So avoid planning too much ?

[turbid sigil]

I see. I've read the C4 model, and I had an interesting conversation with a gray haired programmer about modeling architecture with the idea of technology decisions in mind, becoming that "focus". He argued it should be emergent, rather than planned. I'll definitely look into that though

[robust ledge]

As you look into it, be mindful of the extremes. "All technology level design should be emergent" is an absolute. Obviously it won't apply to 100% of the cases. The same goes for "All technology level design should be pre-planned". That doesn't work either.

[raven urchin]

Hol Horse?
Jojo's?

[cerulean ravine]

another thing to think about while planning: what decisions can be separated from each other? You are deciding between cli and gui, but there will be some code that is the same for both. Think about how to break the problem into pieces so that some pieces are independent of the UI

[turbid sigil]

plans change, so you have to make a cost-benefit analysis of whether a lot of planning will be a good use of your time, versus how much time you spend planning on something that may be invalid in a few weeks time.

[robust ledge]

I would say, plan often and embrace change.

[turbid sigil]

that is a good sounding rule of thumb. I'll keep it in mind then, thanks for the help.

[silver plover]

Planning is essential, but plans are useless

[cerulean ravine]

i was just typing that out!

[rare gazelle]

narrow=focus

[robust ledge]

Isn't that just how it works?!

The number of times I've gone into a project with "the plan" and come out six hours later with "the new plan".

[silver plover]

(It's an Eisenhower quote!

[turbid sigil]

depth first vs breadth first traversal ^^

[sand hornet]

I always assume the plan is solid up to where we've written code. Everything else is TBD until it's merged

[jovial briar]

Thank you all for the good advice I appreciate it

[silver plover]

The German version is 'no plan survives first contact with the enemy'

[robust ledge]

I launched a small automation just this morning. By the afternoon, version three was in review.

Things change. Embrance it.

[sand hornet]

*embrace

[robust ledge]

embrance it :V

[sand hornet]

It's like RegEx.. "".join(re.findall("embrance", "[^n]"))

That is wrong, but you get the point 😛

[rare gazelle]

maybe its the combination of both

[sand hornet]

* "".join(re.findall("[^n]", "embrance"))
Turns out, I had it backwards. 🤷‍♂️

[rare gazelle]

narrow but not too narrow
wide but not too wide

[turbid sigil]

it definitely is. I've read a book a while back called "exploring requirements", and it has a good talk on it. I've experienced it myself a few times as well, for both extremes.

[rare gazelle]

yea both extremes might not be the answer

[turbid sigil]

definitely not fun experiences having constantly changing code vs using a clunky library when there's a better option out there

open closed principle is my enemy

[silver plover]

Goldilocks and the three graph traversal theorems.

[rare gazelle]

reading about it just now

the goldilocks rule talks about balance from what i understand... (haven't heard of it before)

[raven urchin]

@rare gazelle

Which is your favorite prime number.

[silver plover]

What? I was making a joke about Goldilocks and the three bears...

[rare gazelle]

1

[rare gazelle]

yea, i saw the story

i didn't know of it before

[raven urchin]

It's also used to describe the survivable parts of a solar system

[silver plover]

Oh, it's just a story about not liking the extremes

[rare gazelle]

i saw that one here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJmX1GwKMdA

[rare gazelle]

i see...

[finite rose]

If I must be forced to eat porridge, I do prefer it to be Just Right. 🥣

[vale wasp]

.topic

[verbal wedge]

**Are you currently using Python professionally, for education, or as a hobby?**

Suggest more topics here!

[vale wasp]

Yes.

[raven urchin]

Hobby!

[swift sparrow]

Also yes.

[raven urchin]

Shoomp :D

[tender bloom]

Yup

[vale wasp]

You use Python for Shoomp?

[swift sparrow]

How touching

[raven urchin]

Well, I enjoyed Python a lot more thanks to shoomp :3

[vale wasp]

❤️

[raven urchin]

I've been investigating bits in my free time about stuff for the to-do list

There are packages for displaying markdown, that will be really useful hehe

[swift sparrow]

for the list?

[raven urchin]

It would be really an advanced thing to do, but someday I'll try to make hyperlinks like obsidian

For the base tho, I've seen stuff about the widgets, also planned the layouts a bit

[swift sparrow]

Ooh yeah that would be neat. In my mind I had a to-do list as just a really simple list of things

[raven urchin]

Have to see what's the style shit thingy about

[raven urchin]

Remember that my plan is to start simple and make it bigger! >:)

[vale wasp]

That's a good plan.

[raven urchin]

Like Vexel is doing with his Axiom text editor, that's a really cool project

[swift sparrow]

Yeah, you could use a simple list as the main to-do selection, and then maybe you can add extra notes to that task

similar to Google Notes

[raven urchin]

Yessss

[swift sparrow]

QListWidget can handle the main selection, or even QListView if you're feeling spicy

[raven urchin]

For now, the plan is:

Do all the GUI related stuff first, having proper display with a placeholder task.

Then make the tasks module with all the CRUD stuff.

Then make it cuter.

Then add fun stuff!

[spark obsidian]

There is nothing more permanent than an easy solution, I think you should have deployed a full on kubernetes cluster with properly versionned microservices and a full on CI/CD pipline /s

[glacial ginkgo]

I did post to help as per the advice here btw. Thanks for the pointers. If anyone could look my project over and help me develop good professional habits I would be thrilled.

[raven urchin]

I was lost after deployed

[vale wasp]

Don't worry.

[velvet trout]

[spark obsidian]

modern meme lingo

[tender bloom]

Is it pronounced kuber-net-ees or kuber-neets

[raven urchin]

I like your name

[raven urchin]

I am soooo excited to start my lil project. :3
I hope I do well on these exams!

[raven urchin]

First options sounds better for me tbh

[tender bloom]

Or just kates if you spell it like k8s

[vale wasp]

You've got this!

[lone harness]

ammm hi guys

[raven urchin]

Ty<3

[lone harness]

how is thereee

[spark obsidian]

thanks :3

[velvet trout]

there is fine

[lone harness]

how to use discore vro 🥀

***discordd

[velvet trout]

Step 0: uninstall discore
Step 1: install discord

[velvet trout]

*** is not a valid unpackable

[lone harness]

Very interesting

[velvet trout]

Much Wow

[tender bloom]

It’s on my todo list to set up a full CI/CD pipeline for my hello world app. uv, Jenkins, dockerfile, Ansible and kuber-net-ees

[lone harness]

andd ammmm, i don't know how to speak En vro 👉🏻👈🏻🥀🥀🥀

[velvet trout]

[lone harness]

i try 🥀

[velvet trout]

And except EnglishError

[lone harness]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[velvet trout]

English should be nuked in my opinion, colonial language fr. We should standardize speaking in Python. Explicit > Implicit.

[tender bloom]

My hello world is a monolith application

But I guess I could split it into microservices architecture

[lone harness]

copy text... translate...

[velvet trout]

str.translate()

[tender bloom]

One pod that has the printed string and one pod that displays a string to logs

Communicating over http

[lone harness]

after the translation, i completely agree

[velvet trout]

[velvet trout]

🤝

[spark obsidian]

What so you mean has the printed string ? You need to put it in a 3fnbcck normalized db and add a redis layer on top of that

[lone harness]

i remember this exists

[shrewd pine]

I imagine debian testing would be quite alright

[velvet trout]

!doc str.translate

[edgy kraken]

str.translate

str.translate(table, /)```
Return a copy of the string in which each character has been mapped through the given translation table. The table must be an object that implements indexing via [`__getitem__()`](https://docs.python.org/3/reference/datamodel.html#object.__getitem__), typically a [mapping](https://docs.python.org/3/glossary.html#term-mapping) or [sequence](https://docs.python.org/3/glossary.html#term-sequence). When indexed by a Unicode ordinal (an integer), the table object can do any of the following: return a Unicode ordinal or a string, to map the character to one or more other characters; return `None`, to delete the character from the return string; or raise a [`LookupError`](https://docs.python.org/3/library/exceptions.html#LookupError) exception, to map the character to itself.

You can use [`str.maketrans()`](https://docs.python.org/3/library/stdtypes.html#str.maketrans) to create a translation map from character-to-character mappings in different formats.

See also the [`codecs`](https://docs.python.org/3/library/codecs.html#module-codecs) module for a more flexible approach to custom character mappings.

[lone harness]

but i don't know how to use it 🥀

[ashen cipher]

the word "testing" is an ick /hj

[tender bloom]

I would go straight to mongodb the superior persistent data store

[velvet trout]

I initially thought Python.org & Google Translate Collaborated for str.translate 😭

[tender bloom]

I need to make sure my app is Web Scale

[velvet trout]

Same 🥀

[spark obsidian]

Understandable decision, but in that case http is not enough, you need atleast graphql

[lone harness]

oh, i learning now vro, thx

[velvet trout]

Welcome vro

Deciding terminologies and keeping consistency between them is so hard, damn...

[tender bloom]

No I was think full SOAP with XML as the transport protocol

[shrewd pine]

debian unstable is a more unstable option if you prefer that

[velvet trout]

I have been jumping over terminologies instead of writing the freaking real code

[spark obsidian]

beat me there lol, wp

[shrewd pine]

I wonder what the worst choice of transport protocol would be

[tender bloom]

Legit I do want to write a SOAP application some day to experience the fun

[lone harness]

ahmmm, are u Native American or possibly British..?

[velvet trout]

Neither. I don't even like the concept of nationality. I directly subclass from modern HomoSapien

[tender bloom]

Depends if it’s only fully automated transport or requires a human in the loop

[velvet trout]

class AjiRomson(ModernHomoSapien): ...

Hail science 🗣️🔥

[tender bloom]

If the latter I would have some human doing a fax somewhere

[spark obsidian]

Read up quickly on it, and wth

[echo void]

What not to do to not get banned?

[shrewd pine]

maybe audio is feasible, we could do json and xml in different channels at once

[velvet trout]

not sure why this message made you think i am native american or british...

The world doesn't revolve around those two 🥀

[lone harness]

vro i wait the translate now

[velvet trout]

Ema listen to mozart now bye bye

[rotund steppe]

Guys what is numerical methods and how does it apply to cs?

[velvet trout]

The violin 🎻

[tender bloom]

On a completely different topic (for me anyway)

[shrewd pine]

could reuse my old thing
https://www.ioccc.org/2018/algmyr/

[scenic finch]

vroski what are you saying

[velvet trout]

He's saying... || meow ||

[tender bloom]

If I have just null on its own, is that considered valid JSON?

[lone harness]

@lone harness vro u soo englisher

[velvet trout]

Who thought of two union operators as a delimiter for spoilers

[shrewd pine]

surely shoving json and xml into two channels like these is cursed enough

[shrewd pine]

yes

[velvet trout]

Me no englisher bro, me japanese, me english not understando

[scenic finch]

Whoa that’s a bit racist no

[velvet trout]

😔

Yamate kudasai, watashi no racist. Kiraye! Kiraye! Dai kiraye! Watashi no goodo human!

[tender bloom]

And is that the only time valid JSON isn’t either {…} or […] ?

[shrewd pine]

well 42

[swift sparrow]

json can be any valid data

[shrewd pine]

or "blah"

[lone harness]

helll naahhhh, u japaneser?

[velvet trout]

Ngl japanese pronunciation is so freaking cute

[echo void]

some types will be merged

[swift sparrow]

it doesn't have to have a list/dict as its outer data

[velvet trout]

Nope

[echo void]

so io is diff

[shrewd pine]

japanesest

[swift sparrow]

What do you mean?

[lone harness]

u da real japaneser

[swift sparrow]

like I know list/tuple will act the same once converted

[velvet trout]

🗿

[tender bloom]

Oh so valid JSON could just be a string or int completely on its own?

[echo void]

e.g. tuple in, list out

list in, list out

[shrewd pine]

sure

[swift sparrow]

yeah, I was referring to the type once inside the json

[tender bloom]

TIL

[velvet trout]

Even an array is fine ig

[lone harness]

i agree

[echo void]

I read that b4 in docs, I think

[velvet trout]

🤝

[tender bloom]

I’ve never seen JSON be like a single string

Good to know

[lone harness]

hmm, so where are u from 🗿?

[velvet trout]

India

[lone harness]

sorry, but amm curious

[shrewd pine]

send json as a scalar json string

[brisk gazelle]

It's one of the things I like telling people, because most people think JSON is only ever a dictionary as the outermost.

[echo void]

Why u guys like this sysmbol so much 😆

[lone harness]

ohhh, I LOVE INDIA VROOO

[swift sparrow]

I used to think it could only be array/dict as outermost

[echo void]

Indians are the best coders, right? haha 😆

[tender bloom]

I know it can be more than object but thought it could only be object and array

[velvet trout]

me hate this country tho 😔

[unborn lagoon]

Older versions of the JSON spec only allow objects and arrays as a document, but nowadays, any valid JSON object is a valid JSON document.

[tender bloom]

Then I saw just null and thought that wasn’t right

[shrewd pine]

"{\"key\": 42}"

[vale wasp]

It is but you can you put import from a dictionary into other classes.

[shrewd pine]

tbf, they are the useful ones

[velvet trout]

Tho its heavily context dependent

I should say i hate a subset of people instead , to bs explicit.

[stray field]

null

[tender bloom]

I’m going to create a REST interface where the payload is a single string of SOAP XML

[lone harness]

hell yeah vro

[swift sparrow]

yeah at that point, you might as well use just a txt file or something

[rare gazelle]

thats just an assumption to be fair

[shrewd pine]

that's not meta though

[swift sparrow]

that's what I said

[brisk gazelle]

There is a very strong and ancient mathematical discipline baked into its bones, so I think it's fitting.

[swift sparrow]

I only ever used them like that, so I assumed those were the only possibilities

[lone harness]

everyone hate his place vro, i hate iraq too 🥀

[rare gazelle]

i beelieve you've seen them like that, so you assumed it has to be like that

[velvet trout]

Explain why I am so bad 😔

[swift sparrow]

Let's keep the chat on topic, ok?

[echo void]

thx

[stray field]

Doesn't jq have a function to parse json strings?

[velvet trout]

🤝

[rare gazelle]

yea, well, maybe its a mistake i'm doing as well at times

[lone harness]

ammm, no

[echo void]

how bout iran?

[rare gazelle]

trying not to at least

[velvet trout]

Idk, he hates a country, i too hate my country

[lone harness]

what about iran 🗿

[scenic finch]

Can we keep it on topic

[velvet trout]

Hatred compatible 🤣

.topic

[verbal wedge]

**What is your motivation for programming?**

Suggest more topics here!

[echo void]

that's what i said

[scenic finch]

ok bro

[echo void]

kid

[rare gazelle]

for the record:
i dont know if it can be anything that isn't a container, but i just dont know the answer

[scenic finch]

I like it

[velvet trout]

Context

[echo void]

solve daily problems, but it seems lately i am a servant to the computer

[shrewd pine]

interestingly, this is not following spec

In [4]: json.dumps(float('nan'))
Out[4]: 'NaN'

In [5]: json.dumps(float('inf'))
Out[5]: 'Infinity'

[velvet trout]

😭

[robust ledge]

To find problems that I don't know how to solve.

[rare gazelle]

i dont think you should use json dumps and assume it follows spec

[echo void]

when i was young, i started learning python, ok

[rare gazelle]

if you care about json spec read about it in wikipedia

[vale wasp]

It damned well better follow the JSON spec!

[velvet trout]

Same 🤝

[vale wasp]

What should nan and inf be in JSON?

[echo void]

🙂

[shrewd pine]

json doesn't support them

[echo void]

what did you learn?

[rare gazelle]

a "bug" that isn't appearing normally, won't be fixed

[vale wasp]

It doesn't support valid floating point values?

[rare gazelle]

python's json library is just an implementation

[velvet trout]

I dunno till this day

[echo void]

😆

I learned threading

[vale wasp]

Python's JSON library is an implementation that follows the JSON specification.

[echo void]

took me 2, can i say the word, years

[rare gazelle]

that maybe tries to

[brisk gazelle]

JSON supports floats.

[vale wasp]

NaN and Inf are valid floating values.

[velvet trout]

Did we evolve or what...

How is threading sensible as a beginner. I didn't even understand two vars getting mutated at the same time.

[rare gazelle]

if you wanna know what the json spec is you dont investigate python's json library, you read abbout the spec in wikipedia

[vale wasp]

Not tries to, succeeds. And a bug in that implementation would be fixed very quickly.

[echo void]

u know a chat is healthy when several people are typing

[vale wasp]

If you want to know about a spec you read the spec not a wikipedia article.

[velvet trout]

I thought implementations are probably close to the spec

[rare gazelle]

a bug that doesn't appear in any code won't be fixed normally, unless shown of course

[chilly whale]

valid floating values that don't have any standard JSON representation

[unborn lagoon]

The JSON spec does not require numbers to be implemented as floats and does not say that they must be floats. Numbers consist of an integer component and an optional fractional/exponent component.
-# source: https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc8259.html#section-6

[velvet trout]

Asynchronous chatting 🔥

[brisk gazelle]

It supports NaN.

[echo void]

oh

[fiery yarrow]

getting data about details of a specification from wikipedia is a poor idea

[granite wyvern]

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc8259#section-6

Numeric values that cannot be represented in the grammar below (such
as Infinity and NaN) are not permitted.

[echo void]

u mean 1 on 1 * 3?

[rare gazelle]

spec is a guide line, implementation if it uses that guide line, can aim for it, not necessarily succeed in 100%

[vale wasp]

I'm a bit surprised that they didn't include support for NaN and Inf since this comes from Javascript...

[velvet trout]

You're right

[echo void]

how does chat even work here?

[dusty ember]

what's your point here? is this not true for every implementation?

[rare gazelle]

you cant know the spec based on the implementation

[brisk gazelle]

>>> json.loads("NaN")
nan```🤷‍♂️

[rare gazelle]

fiery tried to investigate the spec through the implementation, from what i understand, so, bbetter read directly about the spec instead

[granite wyvern]

Comes from, but it is a subset of javascript also. Maybe they didn't want to require the target to support NaN or Inf.

[robust ledge]

With a little help of websockets and API calls.

[fiery yarrow]

the json page say at the beginning

JSON (JavaScript Object Notation), specified by RFC 7159 (which obsoletes RFC 4627) and by ECMA-404
. if it does not follow 7159 and 404 in a fully compliant manner, it should specify on that page, and if it doesn't, it is a bug

[dusty ember]

is that what was being said? I don't think anyone was disagreeing with the fact that the spec is...well, the spec.

[velvet trout]

What was nedbat cooking but left unserved in between?

[granite wyvern]

What a particular implementation does and what the spec requires often diverge.

[echo void]

😀 I mean like the human layer

[chilly whale]

JSON is less specified than you might think. What should 9007199254740993 deserialize to, for instance?

[shrewd pine]

one would still hope the impl would be up to spec

[rotund steppe]

Hello cameron

[vale wasp]

Spec is the definition of the standard. If an implementation follows the specification you should be able to reference that implementation. It is not a "guideline" It is a definition.

[granite wyvern]

For example, the range of numeric values (eg the max sizes of ints or floats).

[cerulean ravine]

is someone claiming that the json module is out of spec somehow?

[unborn lagoon]

Note that you can specify allow_nan=True if you don't want it to allow these values.

[rare gazelle]

hope != facts though

[vale wasp]

Probably some negative number in C 😉

[echo void]

Anybody wants to collab on... AES-128 (tada)

[brisk gazelle]

Are we talking int64 vs bigint?

[chilly whale]

vs double

[rare gazelle]

the implementation might not meet the spec at 100%

[granite wyvern]

We're probably saying it supports more than the minumim required by the spec.

[chilly whale]

totally unspecified

[velvet trout]

Y'all accept you're wrong and apologize now or else be ready to get cooked by nedbat

[spice hill]

This right here is the worst part of JSON, together with not specifying what happens to fields declared more than once.

[dusty ember]

i don't think fiery was saying the behavior of python's json library is an authoritative source for what is/isn't valid JSON, they were just observing behavior that didn't follow the spec.