German card dump

[rancid pilot]

Why is the case red text small

Here

[scarlet bay]

1. ME BF 109K-4: Too OP, this card has unit stats for 3K, the effect is worth 1K easily. OP cost of 3 does not balance it in any way, and even in the right deck it is only an advantage... In addition, I do not know if you can put Develop on Destruction, because if the opponent destroys it during their turn, it will not work mechanically, giving you a choice. I would increase the cost to 3K and change Develop to add random air german unite, and change rariry into Limited.

2. SD. KFZ. 221: Mhm, the effect is terribly strong, because German orders are usually like that, from a lot of discards to removals, but I guess the statistics balance it out and the requirement not to trade everything to the opponent is strong but in the limit.

3. Panzer II-LUCHS: The passive effect seems very strong, and the unit stats themselves do not lose much, I would increase the OP cost of this card to 2 for balance.

4. Pazner III-G Early: It seems too strong for a common card, 3/4 stats on a tank for 3K are good stats, but you have a card draw on a unit and a buff of your other units of that type (including the one that activated the effect)... Rarity to Limited or Special would be worth changing.

5. No.179 Recon. D: Generally either one or the other, the effect of increasing the cost of orders is already powerful in itself, and here comes the ignoring of Smoke Screen... The stats are weak, but it's a technical card that will block OTK more than once by itself... I would increase the cost to 4K at least.

6. Neubaufahrzeug: Oh, too strong, the 4/4/4 tank with Fury and Guard is already quite strong, and here the card draw comes into play, and not on this unit, but on all of them... I would increase the OP cost to 2 and limit the card draw effect to this unit only.

7. Grey Wasps: Mhm, dear secret, the effect is strong, even very strong, but I don't know if 6K isn't too much for this card. I think it could be given for 5K.

8. Turkey Shot: This seems very strong on Leopold's level... Permanently changing the attack to 0 is a bit OP. I would give the effect "until your next turn" here and then reduce the cost to 7K.

9. Case Red: Honestly, it seems good, better than having to destroy 3 units xD Now all you need is to trade 1 of your and the enemy unit, which immediately makes the card very strong, because the requirement is not that difficult to meet, I would increase the cost to 4K, because now it seems a bit too strong for 3K.

[neon field]

So uhm these cards are all over the place

The ME BF109 just shuts down Brit air decks, if you draw this at all during any Brit air encounter you just straight up win. Additionally it could beat ramp into the dust ask they can never hit face with their bombers. Generally a restrictive card rather than an expansive one, as instead of promoting new playstyles, it just counters existing ones

SDKFZ.221 is not worded well, but it appears to me this is literally an order printer. This just shouldn’t exist. At all. I get it not all German orders are good, and there’s little German draw, but being able to generate value for free because the enemy wishes to play the game is simply insane. Even if it was 3k develop a German order it is as powerful-if not more than their German-develop-cm-infantry.

[scarlet bay]

BTW, Germans have a lot of draw, although not that direct xD

[neon field]

Panzer ii Lynx is a very decent tank body. Its ability is cool, but smokescreen is a passive effect, unless ur running a smokescreen deck. In which, why would you run this if ur units alr have smokescreen. I think if this was just a 3/3 1op 3k tank it would be fine as is.

If u want to make it a more smokescreen oriented unit, maybe make it so units with smokescreen can’t be targeted by the enemy, or perhaps give make it buff units that lose smokescreen, like giving them shock, or 0 op

If u do go that route, it should prob be an elite to prevent insta wins with Japan smokescreen aggro

[scarlet bay]

Keep in mind that you don't have to play it in a deck for Smoke Screen, but it can be used as a simple "safeguard" for your units with passive effects. Whether it's artillery/non-blitz units or cards like 22nd Infantry Regiment or Dornier.

Ah wait...

Its non-ground units xD

Then yeah, Dornier / Yak 7 / Skytrain would like to get Smokescreen ;d

[neon field]

Panzer iiiG early is… a card. Not very impressive, especially when this game doesn’t let you consistently get the same copies of units down at one time without orders and whatnot. Card draw is always nice, but the buffing really doesn’t promote the tank synergy that German tank decks should get. I think that maybe make it a 5k 0op tank so it can reliably get the kill on units rather than just kinda sit in the back and wait for jaggro to take the frontline and get card draw for 2k

[scarlet bay]

Note that this card buffs itself for +1/+1 if it trade something.

[neon field]

Nr.179 is just a commando cope card. No. Shouldn’t exist. Maybe make it so it copies the enemies positive buffs, like ‘when the enemy draws a card or gains a kredit slot, also draw a card or gain a kredit slot’

[neon field]

Not always

It specifically has to be buffed before combat

!polish firefly

[pine hull]

Cards found: 1

[scarlet bay]

Yeah, when it destroys, but still, it's a buff on yourself after the trade, so it's a pretty strong effect with card selection.

[neon field]

But it only applies if you survive.

Your still spending 5k to do that

[scarlet bay]

Firefly is worse in my opinion, it's an AOE effect, but it costs 2K more and doesn't draw a card.

[neon field]

Just showing that the buff applies afterwards rather than before, which makes it even more situational

[scarlet bay]

I don't really agree, it's not that easy to destroy a 3/4 unit at once for 3K. If played on turn 3, it will survive in most cases, unless it catches hard removal, but we have no influence on that.

[neon field]

Neubaurfahzeug is a mess. It has otk potential with Brit guard buffs, and it is way above curve compared to all other 4k tanks. Guard tank, 4 attack fury, and conditional draw is too much. You gotta cut off some of the fat on this card, make it just a fury guard tank, or just a draw engine. Not both. (Also make it like a 2/5 not a 4/4)

[neon field]

The two situations where the enemy will have board presence by turn 3 are near-peer midrange decks, buffing decks, air decks, and aggro.

Near peer would probably have 4attacl tanks

Wether it be the m10 or the T-34-76

[scarlet bay]

Take into account that as Germans we also set a good tempo on the table.

[neon field]

Or even Shermans (air escort is a popular midrange)

[neon field]

And then u kill it on turn 3 with a 2op tank

The only way I see this being unfair is paired with somua

In which any 1-2op tank is unfair with the somua

[scarlet bay]

The OP cost in German/US decks for tanks is probably not that big of a problem. But sure, 2OP cost is good tool balancing it, but its still strong Common card.

[neon field]

Commons are allowed to be good

They just can’t have overbearing effects

Or be suppression units

Look at Germany’s 2kcm-infantry

Or glamour boys

[scarlet bay]

That's actually a funny statement looking at the 12th Guards from the Soviets xD

[neon field]

SD ruining every good Soviet card-

[scarlet bay]

Well, that's just my opinion, I would just increase the rarity of this tank and that's it, but the card draw should carry some disadvantages if you put it on a unit with "good stats".

[neon field]

Unless ur playing against jaggro I don’t see ur drawing more than 1 card

In which that case card draw isn’t ur concern-

[scarlet bay]

Well, Panzer 38 (t) also draws a card, and has -1/-1 stats. (although it does have that lower OP cost)

[neon field]

But it’s non-conditional

You have to spend 5 kredits over 2 turns to get it

7 kredits if the enemy isn’t contesting the frontline

It’s just isn’t reliable card draw

That’s why u believed making it 5k 0op would make it stronger, cus for a higher up front, the conditional card draw doesn’t cost additional credits

[scarlet bay]

It seems to be true, but here you have a potential buff + card selection in a unit with good stats. The card would rather require testing, because it seems quite good to me coldly and would easily find a place in many German decks. I take as an example ME BF 109 from Finland, which works somewhat on a similar principle (although it is a fighter), it is a very strong card, which is probably hard to disagree with. This tank has a similar power level no matter how you look at it.

Well, I guess it's not worth arguing about such trifles in this card, after all our opinions don't diverge too much xD You can go on with next cards ;d

[neon field]

That simply isn’t true. The finish fighter doesn’t need to fulfill the same condition-

[neon field]

The last 3 I have nothing to say

They are all sucky gimmicky orders

[scarlet bay]

Yes, it has different ones, it would be strange if they had the same effects, but they are very similar cards, the fighter must hit in the face, without trading for value, and the tank must trade. The effects are kind of "opposite" but they are largely comparable.

[neon field]

Hitting hq is always possible

Trading isn’t

And the enemy is forced to trade into you to kill the fighter

[scarlet bay]

Well, not necessarily always, the guard blocks it, plus we draw "not our" cards, which is in a sense worse than drawing our own cards.'

[neon field]

Maybe removing ur enemies cards is better. Maybe it isn’t

The point still stands 2op is a different beast on a tank compared to a fighter

[scarlet bay]

Yeah, it's a real pain, that's why this card is so playable, like a lot of Finland cards, it doesn't belong to the most balanced group of cards xD

[neon field]

And the conditions are more forgiving to a fighter than it is to a tank

[scarlet bay]

It's hard to disagree, but faction also plays a big role in considering this, after all you can play decks with Greif or Breakthrought, which are cards from this same fraction as this tank.

[neon field]

Same with Finnish and guards/ discard synergies

[scarlet bay]

The Finn Fighter is simply powerful on its own, this tank, as I emphasized, is ok, but not outstanding, but in the overall faction it only gains advantages depending on the deck.

[neon field]

So it behaves like every other common with text-

[scarlet bay]

Discard is a toxic mechanic that should be removed from the game xD Let's not write about it xD In 90% of card games, developers are aware of this and it is very limited, and in KARDS there are even archetypes around discarding opponent's cards >.>

[neon field]

Discard is the least skillful archetype

It revolves completely around chance

That you discard their draw

[scarlet bay]

It varies, because there are cards that are simply so OP that it's strange that they are commons, like the 12th Guards I mentioned.

[neon field]

Like I said commons are allowed to be strong

It’s only when they are cumulatively strong that they are bad

[scarlet bay]

Which doesn't change the fact that it's a toxic mechanic of "not letting" the opponent play their game. That's why tempo/aggro is so popular in this game in most cases, because the control meta would be plowed by discard in a lot of cases.

[scarlet bay]

They can be strong, but they can't be "too strong", because it ends up like with Calliope or Glamour Boys. 😄

[neon field]

Those are relatively healthy cards right now?

It’s not like having 4 Caliopes will make ur deck stronger than having 3

Maybe 4 glamour boys would be preferred over 3

[scarlet bay]

It's hard to agree with this, they defy the mathematics of balance and their existence imposes standards in the style of "Either a new card with a similar use will be stronger than me, or it will be unplayable".

[neon field]

This isn’t the case with these cards. And even if they were, there are other cards that due that alr

Like 13th cav

Or m4 Sherman

[hearty pumice]

Germany doesn’t get unconditional guard and the first two cards are too cheap imo but it’s pretty cool overall

[neon field]

Yet I wouldn’t call those cards too strong

[scarlet bay]

Well, everyone has their own opinion, but if so, then how do you define older cards that followed mathematical balance like PAK 38 or 6 Pounder.

[neon field]

Yes there is a distinct difference between the way old and new Kards are balanced

But to say a card is overpowered is to say it outperforms cards within its same range.

And most standards made now are on par with other standards made bowls

[scarlet bay]

Yeah, that's why you should be realistically careful and regularly balance old cards a bit, so that the game is more balanced. The "reserve" system doesn't solve this, and deepens the problem, because in reality, in the standard, each faction has "must have" cards that play in most decks, regardless of archetype, and some cards in the reserve are unplayable, even in their own archetype.

Well, this is rather getting off topic xD

[neon field]

Well it’s good to share views on this game

[scarlet bay]

Is the comparison between Pack Howitzer and Calliope (3K artillery) a good example of something like that? Both cards are standard xD

In a similar way you can compare Glamour Boys and Churchill Mk IV, they differ slightly in details, but it is still a 5K guard unity from standard.

[neon field]

Yeah, but what about comparing the Caliope to something like Italy’s new fighter?

They both are powerful turn 3 openers for specific scenarios

[scarlet bay]

It's a bit hard to compare, first of all "supporting" factions should have "slightly" higher power level than the main factions, as they are always limited to 12 cards. Secondly, it's fighter vs artillery and from different factions. It's a bit inappropriate to compare it like that.

It's best to compare cards within the same faction, cost, type, potential effect, that gives the best balancing throw. I don't know, e.g. comparing a T-80 to a BT-7 from the Soviets.

[neon field]

Can’t do that with arty really

Just not enough arty cards

[scarlet bay]

Of course, this is not always possible, but then the mathematics of balance comes into play.

Let me give you an example:
Artillery without an effect has an average of 4 stat points for 2K and gets 1 point for every 1K. Effects, depending on the type, have their own costs, and combining many effects that potentially have their reflection in other, separate cards costs an average of 0.5K.

[neon field]

Ik how kredit curves work

[scarlet bay]

In KARDS it gets more complicated because there are more factors to calculate like OP cost, unit type, synergy effect with unit type etc.

[neon field]

They just don’t work with how powercrept the game has become-

Unless you only take into consideration cards that are considered ‘balanced’, there it won’t reflect the actual stats a card should have

[scarlet bay]

And here we can end the discussion, because I also think so, power creep has really messed up the balance of the entire game, and the developers aren't doing much about it, and you can practically say that 60% of the standard cards are dead, 30% are ok and play everywhere alternately, and 10% are a must have, because there are no alternatives xD

[neon field]

Guess we gotta make 100 posts advocating to buff half the cards

#rip Humeji

[scarlet bay]

Well, you can look at it from a different perspective, if we consider that Calliope is balanced, then it would be appropriate to buff all other "worse" artillery to its level, which I am personally a fan of "raising the floor" rather than "lowering the ceiling".

[neon field]

The problem then becomes a textless arty better statted at 3k could overpower the current 3k arty

And then it continues

[scarlet bay]

Good discussion isn't bad xD

[scarlet bay]

But what's the problem with reworking cards without text? Ask yourself, wouldn't you be happy for a patch to rework 100-200 unplayable cards?

I would be happy, it would probably change the meta a bit, but is that a bad thing?

[neon field]

The point is how would you balance, let’s say the other 3k US arty?

If you give it stats equivalent to the Caliope (3/2)

It’s just a worse Caliope

But the second you stat it 3/3 it’s incredibly strong

And would ruin any kind of midrange

[scarlet bay]

Mhm, I would give e.g. Pack Howitzer an effect under unspend credits, like: If u have 2 unspend credits, deal target enemy 2 dmg.

And M1 AA Gun probably changed the effect to lowering the attack of the hit unit by -2 until the start of our turn.

[neon field]

And if we were to give all textless cards text, that would take months of time the devs clearly don’t feel like using to benefit the game

[neon field]

And so every card from now on out* should have text?

[scarlet bay]

Well, not everyone needs to be given such changes, there are cards that are good but need some push to make them sensible, and some only need to be changed because they are hopeless D

[neon field]

Well we can only hope

[scarlet bay]

Is that bad? In 90% of card games, as the years go by, the cards stop being textless. The natural order of things, so to speak xD Potentially, cards can be created that give something with a textless card, like in Marvel Snap Hight Evolucionist.

[neon field]

Problem is as long as text exists suppression exists.

Also there are only so many ways to make a card have useful text

And 1939 doesn’t seem to like negative text very much

[scarlet bay]

Is that an argument? Balance is also about balancing effect/stats, a card can have good stats and a weak, situational effect.

[scarlet bay]

Well, that's the developers' problem that they limit their possibilities. For me, for example, T-80 is an example of good card design, but it falls behind after years of power creep ;d

[neon field]

My point was the more text is pushed, the more suppression would be a requirement. It also spawns more deployment effect and non suppression units that we have seen in recent updates

[neon field]

I love the T-80 card design

Very impressive card that was ahead of it’s time

[scarlet bay]

Okay, we've generally come to an agreement here, so I guess we can stop spamming, because others would also like to write about the thread topic xD

[neon field]

I guess so

Maybe I’ll make a post discussing cards that need some love

[topaz sorrel]

Nr 179 recon.d