N'Garde. Vanilla-Friendly Parry and Active Block.

[rustic latch]

😅 oh yeah, and then it's hundreds of weapons, even without TR/TD

[uncut sun]

i dared not look at td

[inner hare]

it's a lost cause without some sort of automation and/or dynamic system

mods like that have been done

during MW's history

same problems all the time

[rustic latch]

I mean - probably can automate a big part of it by exporting the ESP to json and then editing values with a script before packing it back in

but I haven't played with esp exporters yet

iirc tes3conv can do it?

[uncut sun]

i feed dirty even changing esp's to omwaddons

[scarlet vault]

Oh yeah, absolutely! I'll be glad to see it there

[rustic latch]

It's going up then

[inner hare]

do you want to talk about it?

[uncut sun]

lol

[inner hare]

therapy may be useful

[rustic latch]

TES modder therapy, an untapped gold mine

" can't hurt you"

[inner hare]

Oldwind would be best.

• How many times have you faced evil GMSTs?
• Yes.

[rustic latch]

https://tenor.com/view/typing-several-people-are-typing-gif-15407184

[cinder gulch]

My brother in almsivi, Todd is the only reason half my mods are usable

[inner hare]

[cinder gulch]

Wouldn’t have magic window extender or cups with drinks in them or food in bowls and plates without Todd

Or cooking tbh

[rustic latch]

And here we see a clear case of Stockholm's syndrome

:P

[cinder gulch]

No I just accepted that the worst workarounds all involve toddscript who manages to save us from the devs (nightmare scenario)

[rustic latch]

I know, I'm pulling your leg

the animation system however

[cinder gulch]

Any modder who’s out here writing mwscripts in the json has my utmost respect

[cinder gulch]

Literally me earlier omg

I read through the code for veloth’s staff, TR end game artifact

[rustic latch]

We are not alone, however:

[cinder gulch]

Mfers replace an NPC with a skeleton (yes the animation skeleton) when you hit it with its enchantment

[rustic latch]

jfc

I mean... Does it always "kill" the npc?

[cinder gulch]

Just swapping out body parts and skeletons on death

[rustic latch]

or can you still talk to it?

ah

[cinder gulch]

Yeah it’s a 1 shot

[rustic latch]

well

then maybe I can see some workarounds

but damn it will probably be cursed

[cinder gulch]

I’m still mentally recovering from that lmfao

[uncut sun]

what i usually do is look at the tr head repository. especially the altmer ones
https://wiki.project-tamriel.com/wiki/Heads_and_Hairs_Catalogue

[inner hare]

.

[cinder gulch]

Before I started on it, I knew it was a 1 shot but didn’t think there was much more to it than that

[inner hare]

can it be reflected?

imagine this

[cinder gulch]

No

[inner hare]

damn it

[cinder gulch]

No reflect haha

It’s not a spell

[inner hare]

reflect a script!

[cinder gulch]

Ownlyme was like “let’s just spawn it as a creature” I’m like ok, open up that nif in nifskope

OpenMW lua enjoyers literally cannot comprehend

[rustic latch]

I mean, I'm assuming you did this already n your own way, but off the cuff - create a creature record via createRecordDraft, have that "skeletonized" creature in the esp, in the record draft rename it, copy the inventory and place it?

[vale wind]

aha, I see I was late to the party (late to the parry, could not resist the pun)

So again here, nice work @rustic latch

[cinder gulch]

Don’t need to do any of that nonsense haha

Yeah literally none of that

[rustic latch]

Fair

[cinder gulch]

There are a few workarounds but none of them involve createRecordDraft haha

Don’t think we use that once in this mod 🧐

[rustic latch]

That was the idea of "hiding" the dead actor asap, and placing a dead skeleton there, with same name and inventory

[cinder gulch]

Removing the dead actor is no problem, but where do I find a complete mesh of a khajiit skeleton that actually renders in game?

Transferring inventories isn’t a problem either

[rustic latch]

1. Use one of khajiti skeletons that ship with TR/TD
2. Create a crreature in your own ESP that is just a khajiti skeleton with a specific ID
3. createRecordDraft Nonsese

[cinder gulch]

1. Not remotely the same thing and I don’t think there are complete beast skeleton statics or even meshes/assets, whereas I (probably) need an actor
2. Doesn’t work for the same reason
3. Also doesn’t work for the same reason since createRecordDraft does almost everything you can do in an esp

I’m not talking about a skeleton like the creature or anything, I’m talking about the actual Body Part IDs in the esp/json

We just ripping those off out here

I know the workaround and it’s not worse than anything we’ve done so far, just caught me for a woozy

[rustic latch]

Bah

Cs was fighting me

and regular skeleton.nif can be used for mer/men

there's also argonian skeleton in there somewhere

But anyway - you did it your own way, and chair input is not valuable, was just thinking out loud about what I would've tried first

[cinder gulch]

You think the nifs they use for this are in /cr/ ?

[rustic latch]

Does it matter?

Unless you want to replace bodyparts one by one or something.

Remove the actor, spawn dead skeleton where it was

[cinder gulch]

Well yeah, I can’t just put any mesh anywhere I want haha

[rustic latch]

Well, that's why I mentioned createrecroddraft

take a creature that that mesh is assigned to

rename

place to actor.position

ah, fuck

nah, nevermind

only see NPC createRecordDraft, not creature

[cinder gulch]

Open tr\\c\\tr_skeleton_arg_veloth.nif in nifskope or your program of choice and tell me what you can do with this in openmw lua

[rustic latch]

If we had creature.createRecordDraft - we won't need to, but we don't so my point is moot

[cinder gulch]

You can create creatures 0.o

https://openmw.readthedocs.io/en/latest/reference/lua-scripting/openmw_types.html#%23(Creature).createRecordDraft

[rustic latch]

huh

[cinder gulch]

Although there’s no need to if you’re doing summons, and I don’t think it would help here

[rustic latch]

wtf version of docs I've been looking at

[cinder gulch]

No idea xD

[rustic latch]

but then:

local creatureTemplate = types.Creature.records['AppropriateSkeletonCreature']
local creatureTable = {name = "{KilledNPCName}", template = creatureTemplate, health = 0} --don't remember if this will work for health or other shenanigans necessary
local recordDraft = types.Creature.createRecordDraft(creatureTable)
local newRecord = world.createRecord(recordDraft)
world.createObject(newRecord.id):teleport(playerCell, killedNPCPosition)```
copy inventory and remove the original killed NPC
we are left with a dead body that looks like a skeleton and has same name and inventory

[cinder gulch]

Transferring inventories and removing actors is no problem

[rustic latch]

What is then? Just make a draft of e.g. TR_m3_Hal_SkelBarbarian for orcs, T_Glb_Und_SkelKha_01 for khajit, any old skeleton for mer/men.

I can't find an argonian one though

And, just so you understand - this conversation is entirely driven by curiosity

[cinder gulch]

What am I supposed to do with this in openmw lua?

[rustic latch]

Give me a sec

[young aspen]

Idk if axes should have any bonus to thrust, since it’s not really intended to be used that way.

Armor pierce or bonus damage to condition on axes seems interesting though.

A big ol axe whack to your shield seems like it would mess it up

[rustic latch]

here's what I mean

[rustic latch]

Yeah, I'll focus on this for a bit - bonuses /weaknesses vs enemy parry for certain weapon types

[inner hare]

It seems interesting to give short blades bonuses against long-reach weapons. Not exactly convenient to defend with a spear or warhammer against a dagger hit.

[rustic latch]

Hmmmm

[cinder gulch]

Yeah this is what ownlyme was thinking but the code is much more involved than that

But maybe just manipulating or doing anything with bones is beyond an openmw lua enjoyer’s comprehension

[rustic latch]

I mean, yeah. Need to get enemy position, inventory copy, and proper creature type based on base race

[cinder gulch]

Oh no, those are the least of the problems

We already have an API for that

[rustic latch]

I'll let you cook

[cinder gulch]

Yeah I need to see the OG

[inner hare]

You can make some fun combos. Not easy to defend with a short blade against a warhammer, but it works in reverse as well since you shouldn't be allowing your opponent to hit you with a fast and short weapon when using a warhammer in the first place. So unless you perfect parry, parrying is hard. Warhammer bonus vs shields is also fun. 2H blades could have a bonus when parrying spears. Pretty sure that a nice table can be made for all weapon types.

[rustic latch]

yup, it's shaping up. I don't have too much time to work on it today, but once it's close to ready and I plug in the effects - I'll post here for more brainstorming and balance review

[inner hare]

https://tenor.com/view/shaq-shimmy-excited-smile-gif-2048765052329044460

[young aspen]

Trying to think about bonuses within the existing parry framework

[inner hare]

It's kind of there already. It's just that every weapon has a static modifier, so they are always good, mid or bad. With the new system, it would be more dynamic.

[rustic latch]

ye, good, mid or bad vs specific weapon types

[inner hare]

there is a great case to be made for spears to be weak vs short reach weapons and good against long reach weapons on defence, I think

[rustic latch]

will also give shortblades more utility, cause instead of plain 0.7 always, - they can be good vs hands and swords (parrying daggers are a thing for a reason)

[rustic latch]

Yeah, cause with a spear you should be keeping distance

[inner hare]

exactly

so if somebody is close, you are already doing badly

[rustic latch]

Especially considering that because of "fireball lol" formation fighting is not a thing in TES, hence spears are a "duelist martial artist" weapon

[inner hare]

formation fighting can still be a thing in TES

defensive magic exists

it has side effects btw

[rustic latch]

^ that's an "official" explanation

However, that may require more combat AI updates, for you to be able to keep enemies at bay for a sec with your weapon reach

otherwise too much backpedaling, as enemies don't fear weapons at all

[inner hare]

there is a book which describes a siege when Reflect was used by the assaulting army to protect against fireballs and such. Unfortunately, when they were battered with arrows and healers came in to help them, all their spells were reflected as well. Reflect caused a loss.

[rustic latch]

I think I vaguely remember that one

[inner hare]

there are some fun stories like that

[rustic latch]

Yup, quite a few

[misty phoenix]

If the AI was more advanced, an interesting bonus for slash attacks with spears would be crowd control, making it easier to keep multiple enemies at a safe distance

[torn crown]

I mean realistically you would be skewered before you could even get in range to do so lol.

[inner hare]

if you dumbly go straight at the spear - sure

[torn crown]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igaQww59NY0
Spears pretty well shit on most other weapons due to range and quickness. The only time they stop is when your opponent is heavily armored, at which point an axe head is added onto your spear to make a halberd or poleaxe.

[inner hare]

this isn't even what I'm talking about. Spear's reach advantage is already there. However, the weapon is as effective at close range as it as at long range in Morrowind and currently it's very effective for parrying no matter the weapon type. So gameplay-wise, while talking about parry efficiency tables, if the opponent is close enough to hit you with a short blade, it's not sth that spear is good at protecting against.

you keep the opponent at bay

that is the point of the spear

(no pun intended)

[kindred imp]

mid to high tier damage, best range and best governing attribute

[inner hare]

yeah, it's a great weapon type

[torn crown]

Have to gimp myself to not fucking use it

[inner hare]

hell, in Vanilla with no other mods, you can even run backwads at same speed

[torn crown]

Or use a worse version of it to make it fair

[kindred imp]

only issue is not having many artifact variants to choose from

[inner hare]

I think that all weapon types in MW are cool, though

everything can work

[kindred imp]

not daggers

[inner hare]

I literally like every weapon skill in-game

[kindred imp]

screw daggers

[inner hare]

I like short blades!

[torn crown]

I havent gotten maces to work quite as well as I want, or daggers. The only exception to that is the jinxs blades you find on higher level bandits

[inner hare]

the only problem I have with them is that they are not good for sneak attacks in Vanilla

[kindred imp]

tanto is a bootleg long sword
dagger is a wet noodle

[inner hare]

tantos and daggers are similar

you probably confused it with wakizashi

[kindred imp]

i'd understand if daggers were better weapons for enchanting
but they're not...

[kindred imp]

probably

[inner hare]

it's funny that Vanilla gives same sneak attack dmg for every weapon type

but I've been using Sneak Attack Buff mod since forever

[torn crown]

I like most of the weapons in the game, I just wish some of the meshes were better. Some of the weapons, particularly axes and maces, look really goofy

[inner hare]

besides the dubious reach stuff, I really dislike the handling of dmg spread on most Vanilla and modded halberds, i.e. only good thrust dmg. That's what spears are, not halberds. In Vanilla, it seems that only Dwarven Halberd was handled differently.

there aren't that many halberds in Vanilla or even in TD/OAAB, so changing this alone isn't hard, but it's just such a weird choice (why bother adding halberds if they are the same as spears, lol)

one of the things which are cool about N'Garde is that it gives you more defensive options when using 1H weapons without shields. I was already playing such characters from time to time. Mostly assassin-types when I didn't want to carry a shield with me or invest in Block or when I wanted to carry a torch. It's cool that now parrying is possible pretty much no matter what you pick (although at different efficiency lvls).

[uncut sun]

my greatest wish would be to give different attacks (chop swing stab) different reach and speed. combat could be very complex if that was the case

[rustic latch]

That would probably require quite a bit of dehardcoding to happen first

[regal egret]

Make 3 different copies of every single weapon and hotswap them depending on the swing animation

[rustic latch]

ya'll are thinking of katanas, wakizashi is still a shortblade

[strong lynx]

Tough, if you for example make thrusts always faster - it will only boost the strength of thrust weapons while marginaly helping non-thrust ones

To do something about the whole "make it make sense to use dif attacks" conondrum im thinking of few options:

First and most obvious one (and i believe was do e before) are combos, do a specific series of attacs to get access to a cool finisher

But ifc noone did a cool finisher part cos people prefer not to touch animations

So its usually some kinda buff instead which is not that fun

[rustic latch]

Cool finishers also get old quickly

[strong lynx]

Or another option is making mist unfavourable attack do something special, like have a chance to knockdown opponent if used occasionally, kind of as an unexpected surprise atrack

[rustic latch]

(I got tired of them in DOOM 2016)

And that's a game with possibly best done cool finishers

[rustic latch]

That, however, is an interesting call out

[strong lynx]

Ah, got what you mean, but no, not execution - finishers as in combo finishers - soecial cooler attack at the end of the combo

[rustic latch]

Ah

yeah, that's fine then

[strong lynx]

With altered damage and or reach or special properties

[rustic latch]

As long as it doesn't interrupt the combat flow

or fits into it nicely

[strong lynx]

Its just an attack animation, it shouldnt really affect the rhytm, only give an optional opportunity to go all in and for high damage option

Or for whatever utility it brings

[rustic latch]

Nah it makese sense

feel it may be clunky with current controls

and we can't override them meaningfully to get "mouse move to choose attack"

not at this time, not until 8101 is fixed

[strong lynx]

Mm, yea move direction determines attack direction is a bit clunky, but im not sure that mouse move is that much better

[rustic latch]

have you played M&B

it definitely is

[strong lynx]

I havent seen that kinda system implemented in a truly comfy way

Yes mnb is a first thing i thought about

[rustic latch]

especially in bannerlord

[strong lynx]

An i still sometimes mess up attack direction

[rustic latch]

it's very comfortable

for both block and attack direction

I never got good at manual block direction in warband, but in bannerlord - it's actually nice

[strong lynx]

And sometimes it also felt stupid that i have to swing my mouse all around to ensure correct direction, theres a different flavour of awkward to it, that awkward just not in movement but in csm controls

Its is "better" though i would say yes

[rustic latch]

Anyway - https://gitlab.com/OpenMW/openmw/-/work_items/8101
Otherwise I'd have implemented "mouse move to choose attack" already :D

[rustic latch]

I tend to play with high-ish sensitivity, maybe that's the difference

[strong lynx]

But yea, in any case i wouldve picked mouse look attack direction as well i think, with some tweaking im sure it can be fairly fluid

[rustic latch]

Yeah, I think it's just a question of tuning the sensitivity and deadzones

[candid wren]

You have made it to Reddit 🫡

https://www.reddit.com/r/Morrowind/s/dObmEM1g3a

[rustic latch]

Oh no!🤣

Well the response seems positive at least

I honestly expected first reddit post be some purist going "what this mofo doing"

[candid wren]

I think the outlook of “ohhhh I used this old mod that did the same thing but in a small way but now there’s a more robust system to use”
To go from shields up to this mod and it being good is the most accurate

[rustic latch]

That is probably quite accurate. Shields up walked, so we could run

[pastel vine]

One thing that's underrated about this mod is how compatible it is

[rustic latch]

That's great to hear, but I'm not sure it's more or less compatible than any other mod written in a sensible manner

[pastel vine]

You've really made something special here

[inner hare]

https://tenor.com/view/why-persian-room-cat-guardian-but-why-trendizisst-anyaboz-gif-2156104475561014590

[rustic latch]

https://tenor.com/view/didnt-read-lol-didnt-read-serious-sam-croteam-gnaar-gif-26160539

redditor moment

[inner hare]

every time somebody writes that it's a 100% hit chance mod, one guar dies

[rustic latch]

I'm also renaming the all attacks hit setting in the next update. Cause I've seen like several people now go "all attacks.. fuck that" and not read further

Other people seemed to like it cause it preserves vanilla dice roll 🤷‍♂️

[inner hare]

https://tenor.com/view/raise-hand-taylor-swift-me-pick-me-gif-13450592849393686614

[inner hare]

maybe naming and description of the parry window threshold stuff should be changed as well. Can give a sort of false impression about what it really does.

[rustic latch]

Yeah

[inner hare]

You can also add a disclaimer right in the beginning of the mod's description that it's not a 100% hit chance mod

this might reduce the number of such comments by 10,33%

[rustic latch]

your decimal separator is off by one place to the right

But that's a good call to add it to the description

[inner hare]

This is not a 100% hit chance mod.

This is not Mount & Blade combat system.

Please read further for more details.

[rustic latch]

You won't believe what I've just wrote before you posted that

(pretty much 1to1)

Think this looks better

[inner hare]

It's not impossible. I did many perfect parries at 35 skill lvl.

[rustic latch]

"practically impossible"

[inner hare]

Eh

Wasn't that hard at least on full Fatigue

[rustic latch]

that's on 35 skill level and full fatigue

83 miliseconds

hmmmm.... Does the timer look right?

that was easier than it should be

[inner hare]

Maybe go for "considerably harder"

[rustic latch]

Yeah, that works

[pastel vine]

Personally I love that setting and if I'm being honest the game is far more challenging since it affects NPCs

[rustic latch]

Yeah, and ttk is roughly the same

but, I think the new name may still be better

that won't go up for a bit though, as I didn't have time to sit down and debug the mwscripted fights, nor do I have other meaningful updates yet either

I've got linked Just Background Noise vod - the man went to Narsis Arena with ngarde installed :D

"Oh, she staggered me" - pure gold

[misty phoenix]

Reddit user tries to read the modpage before commenting challenge (impossible)

[tough juniper]

All while bulls-eyeing Womprats in your t-16

[pastel vine]

Arrean, how's Glancing Blows option with Maxar's timed attacks? It should still compliment each other correct? I'm just going through every combination for testing haha

[rustic latch]

I think it's fine

I haven't looked at maxars code. May need to check how they buff the attack, but probably is fine as long as ngarde is loaded after

[pastel vine]

Thank you

[rustic latch]

@here, I know we may have German and French speakers in here. Would anyone volunteer to translate the localization file to those respective languages?
je ne parle pas français and Ich spreche nur ein bisschen Deutsch, so need help with that.

[maiden tangle]

I could help with the German translation if you want. Just tell me what you need 🙂

[rustic latch]

Grab this file from gitlab, and translate all the strings in there. Not actual variable names. Rename it de.yaml and send to me.

I'll see if there's more stuff that is outside of localization files that should be in there, but I think it covers most of it

https://gitlab.com/Arrean/openmwluaparry/-/blob/master/l10n/ngarde/en.yaml?ref_type=heads

[torn crown]

It is much better lol. If you use really high DPI or high sens, it can be hard to control and a bit awkward but its significantly better than TES's attack control via WASD even under non-ideal circumstances. If you dont want to interact with the blocking at all, you either have auto block or shields, which are breakable.

[strong lynx]

yea, im near convinced, i wouldve like to try that in morrowind

[inner hare]

https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/58729 look at that. Seems that everybody is doing sth with weapon reach now 😄

the mod is based on Real Weapon Range again. What I find interesting, though, is that it comes with this script:

can be handy

[rustic latch]

It seems they did what we've been pondering here for a bit. Good shout

What I don't get is why each of these mods feels the need to fuck with fCombatDistance, fair, but - the reach itself as a multiplier of that is enough no?

[inner hare]

I wouldn't even touch fCombatDistance

it can only leads to problems

as for reach values used by default, the mod is quite similar to what Foxuder did in... another mod which was released today 😄

https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/58753

[rustic latch]

Btw. Cybvep. Feeling up to translating the l10n into polish at some point? Kinda want to cover all langs the launcher ships in

[rustic latch]

Lmao, something's in the water

[inner hare]

Sure, I can look at it at some point.

[misty phoenix]

It's becoming the new magicka regeneration, with how many mods are being released

[rustic latch]

https://tenor.com/view/rucoy-highlander-bees-knees-gif-13863171

^ let the best one survive

[rustic latch]

Let me know. Cause I can read Polish, but not much else

[inner hare]

oh yeah, exactly. In fact, I sent mym Mr President meme once he told me that was doing another magicka regeneration mod a few months ago. The mod is actually good (State-Based Magicka Regen), but damn, we have many of them.

[rustic latch]

It's also the "all attack hits mods"

though those seem to have quieted down

[inner hare]

yeah

[rustic latch]

Ah, this lad is also in N'Garde comments on nexus

[inner hare]

since the mods are based on Real Weapon Ranges, they are very similar to each other as far as default values are concerned

[rustic latch]

Should I... Shouldn't I... Nah there's enough of them

[inner hare]

I might use the script just to see how it works and create my own version for custom use, lmao

[rustic latch]

That's actually a good value add from that one. The lad posted the tools to do it

[inner hare]

yeah. It would be better if it was dynamic in-game LUA tool. Unfortunately, that seems to be beyond current capabilities.

so I guess this leaves custom plugins

[rustic latch]

No can do, without very cursed workarounds.

"theoretically possible" - as any actor enters combat, attach a script, scan the inventory for the weapon, copy and modify it with "createRecordDraft" based on predefined characteristics per weapon type and sub-class

remove original weapon

cursed beyond measure tho

maybe do the same on any merchant when you talk to them?

and any container as you open it

quickly becomes heavy

and game is choke full of unique autogenerated objects

And there are surely some stuff that would prevent it from working smoothly that I'm just not thinking about now

weapons that are just there in world e.g.

[inner hare]

I was thinking about using Fresh Loot system on this but as you say, it's just too cursed. Quests not recognizing items, having to change every item placed in the world and in the player inventory (as they can be added via dialogue) etc.

[rustic latch]

yup

[inner hare]

too much BS

not worth it

[rustic latch]

so "can be done" - "best left alone"

we need content.weapons for it to be pretty

then it'll be a simple script

[inner hare]

so where are you from?

[rustic latch]

🇺🇦

[inner hare]

👍🏻

[rustic latch]

There's this generations old joke - eternal ukrainian curse - can understand poles, can't respond

[inner hare]

Ukrainians learn Polish quickly

[rustic latch]

I live in the UK now. And once I had a painter come over.

At some point he asked where i'm from cause "your english is good"

I, at that point, didn't yet clock that he is polish, so I've responded.

He threw his hands up "Dliacego po angielsku!?" (pardon the spelling)

[inner hare]

close enough. "Dlaczego"

[rustic latch]

Ah

See - that always throws me off

[inner hare]

but the way you wrote it is how it often sounds with accent when UKR are speaking

[rustic latch]

all the diftongs for cz cs sh etc

[inner hare]

haha

I will say that Polish is not easy for foreigners

UKR actually have it easy

you get it quicker

but Germans, French, British etc.

offf

[rustic latch]

It's funny - I've tried hiring a teacher or going to lessons several times.

Cause I understand that I need to learn the basics. But the basics are so obvious that I have a hard time staying focused for them, but if I go for harder stuff right away - I'm lost

[inner hare]

yeah, basics must feel like elementary school

[rustic latch]

Which leads me to where I'm at. Reading books in polish, can't properly pronounce it or hold a conversation

[rustic latch]

yup

[inner hare]

you will probably understand this

😂

[rustic latch]

definitely

🤣

So yeah, if you ever feel like you have some time to spare, I'd really appreaciate the pl. localization file

[hearty scroll]

I'll look at it and see if I can (never done that before, so no idea if I can do a decent job. Any other french speaker wanna go at it, don't let me hold you)

(doesn't help that I don't play in french version 😅 )

[rustic latch]

I had that problem myself. I mostly play games in English. So gaming specifc vocabulary in my native language is just ???

Doesn't help that alot of it is loan words

[hearty scroll]

yeah I started looking at the file, and already had to check how best to translate some game/technical words 😅

[inner hare]

yeah, it's a typical problem. Especially considering the fact that you want to maintain consistency with the official translated version.

[kindred imp]

https://tenor.com/view/indeed-i-love-you-concur-thats-what-she-said-is-how-speed-gif-24958898

[rustic latch]

And here i thought you may have it easier cause most fencing slang is french in origin

[inner hare]

here it shouldn't be too hard, though. Fatigue, Block, Hand to hand, skills and attributes seem to be only things (words) that need consistency checks.

[kindred imp]

just throw transliterations at them

[inner hare]

doesn't help that for some goddamned reason, there is no Polish version of Morrowind on GOG

[hearty scroll]

guess I'll do my first french install of the game in... maybe 15 years? I probably haven't played in french since before Oblivion came out, if ever ^^'

[inner hare]

there actually is a French version on GOG

why?

no fucking clue

what kind of deal they signed with Todd?

must have been cursed

as it's probably about licencing

there were more versions than 3

[kindred imp]

5

iirc

[rustic latch]

Official ones 5 iirc

there's also a turkish community made one that I know of

[kindred imp]

chinese?

[rustic latch]

No idea

probably, but maybe not

[kindred imp]

I definitely saw Italic translations of mods, but idk if they have the game translated

[rustic latch]

And if there's a chinese one, there may be more than one

cause HK/TW/CH would be slightly different

if they did it right

I also need to figure out how to get the game load l10n files for mods without a cursed workaround for languages that are not in the list of allowed locales

🤷‍♂️

"allowed" i say - "supported" probably is better

[misty phoenix]

As a brazilian who can understand hispanics, but can't respond, I relate

[rustic latch]

Roughly same situation as portuguese to spanish yeah

[hearty scroll]

I want to relate to this by mentioning Italian for french speakers, but it would require the Italian to speak slowly, seems less understandable than what you guys are talking about ^^'

[inner hare]

I think that Italians tend to speak quickly in general

[rustic latch]

Nah, for me it also requires a pole to speak slower. But if we both speak slowly - we only get tripped up on some case forms and can hold a decent conversation, so quite close I'd guess

[rustic latch]

https://tenor.com/view/italian-river-speed-boat-perfecto-gif-17332909

Funnily - we tend to speak with our hands too, especially when excited

[hearty scroll]

I also have no idea if it goes both ways. Italian is the easiest language to understand "by default" (no training) for french speakers, but I'm not sure the reverse is true

the one Italian person I knew who could speak both french and spanish, had an easier time with spanish

[rustic latch]

I mean - it may depend on the person too, and the region they are from. I'd imagine cisalpine italy somewhere close to Nice would have some french influence already

and vice versa ofc

[hearty scroll]

might be. I have no idea

[rustic latch]

I love learning languages and regional differences within one language - it's absolutely fascinating

[hearty scroll]

she was from Sardinia

[hearty scroll]

Not sure of the italian influence in this region of France. Aside maybe from some region-specific nouns? The Provençal dialect isn't spoken much any more, nearly exctinct (I live in the area, although I'm not native)

[rustic latch]

I would imagine it would've been historically. France put a lot of effort into language standardization though, is my understanding

[hearty scroll]

definitely

[rustic latch]

So I guess dialect amplitude these days would be lower

[hearty scroll]

the revolution took its idea of universalism very seriously

so everyone had to speak the same language

[rustic latch]

That makes the language nerd in me sad

And well, other implications of losing local langauges are not pleasant too

[hearty scroll]

same. I like the idea behind it, but at the same time, I mourn the loss of linguistic diversity

[rustic latch]

Yup

[hearty scroll]

the only ones in continental France that barely survive seem to be the Breton (Brittany) and a couple south-western ones. Only oversea territories seem to still have healthy practice of local languages

[rustic latch]

[hearty scroll]

oh, and I guess in the east, since they were German until WW II

there you can definitely see the german influence

[rustic latch]

Well, at least there's some

I lament language standardization. But then you look at the UK, where you ride the train for 1 hour, the accent changes 6 times, and local cakes (indistinguishable) have new name every 5 minutes

Accent 1 and Accent 6 can barely understand each other and both try to emulate london english to converse

[hearty scroll]

I mean, there are local accents and expressions.
But the dialects that were the majority a couple of centuries ago, have mostly disappeared. It took until mid 20th century to even have some use in school teaching iirc, and still none of them are considered "official language" to this day

[rustic latch]

Yeah, and then there are probably a lot of old bullshit arguments of "what is a language, and what is a dialect"

[hearty scroll]

I mean, I wouldn't be able to understand someone speaking Occitan for example huhu

or one of the overseas Créole

[rustic latch]

yeah

[rustic latch]

Draftity-draft:
Numbers hard on too little sleep, but this seems conservative enough to work. Pondering the way to communicate it in game

(fractions of 1 which is 100%)

This is parry effectiveness of each weapon type against other weapon types. parrying with blue against green strike

shields and h2h have convoluted or AR dependent systems of their own, so left out of this

[rustic latch]

Nota bene: if I'm to implement this as is, with maluses for very long reach weapons against very short ones - Imma need a better working version of "threat/backoff" - I have something working, it's currently ass

[inner hare]

This looks nice. Definitely an improvement over the static system. Some thoughts:

• 1h axes being easier to parry with sb than 1h blunt and 1h lb seems kind of random. If anything, I would expect sb to be more effective on defence vs other blades than heavy and less flexible stuff like mace or axe, but parity sounds fair as well;
• 2H lb shouldn't get a parry bonus vs sb. No reason for them to be better at it than 1h lb. If anything, they are more unwieldy at such close range. They can be better than 2H axe and 2H bw, but not 1H lb;
• maybe a defensive bonus for 2H parry vs spear/staff? A nod to them being anti-pike weapons. Let's swat those spears. Also, nothing gets a bonus vs spears and staves, so this works for gameplay;
• 2h weapons getting such a high bonus for parries vs HTH is not intuitive IMO. HTH gets rather close. Punches, grappling etc. Yes, I know, animations, but why would 2H weapons be better on defence vs HTH than 1H one?

[inner hare]

Spears are great kiting weapons in-game. Even when using HBFS with no backwards running, they work great.

[rustic latch]

1. Let me review 1h axe and blunt rows.
2. Yah 2h Long getting a bonus against sb is a typo, should be -0.2. Fixed on my end.
3. That's a good idea.
4. It kinda reflects h2h position in game - it's strong by not obviously so. Since h2h and 2h Long range is exactly the same - this kinda represents "back off or I'll cut ya" against h2h

[inner hare]

As for 1, I mean the first row

[rustic latch]

yeah, I figured it out after a minute

lmao

[inner hare]

Horizontal

[rustic latch]

yah

methinks.

[inner hare]

Nice

[rustic latch]

I'm actually glad I released when I did. And that I've got the mod, with ya'll help to where it is by then. You may have noticed that updates slowed down - it's cause I barely had time to do anything this past week

[inner hare]

As for this backing off, I actually wouldn't worry about it too much. In fact, it's better if the enemy is aggressive when they don't have reach advantage.

Understandable

[rustic latch]

That might be fair

[inner hare]

And you got a solid 1.0 out

[rustic latch]

Quite happy with that yeah. Fewer bugs that slipped through than I feared

much fewer

[inner hare]

2Hb and 2Ha parry vs sb should be the same, I think

[rustic latch]

yup. Set both to -0.2

there's also an argument to be made for some weapons to be not great against the same weapon type

just by their nature

but not sure I wanna go there

[inner hare]

Yeah

[rustic latch]

short blades specifically

[inner hare]

I was actually thinking warhammers more

[rustic latch]

I've sparred with resin knives. It's "stabbity stab" unless you're speciically "playing to "fence""

buuuut

shortblades are not just knives

so probably not

[inner hare]

Fair

[rustic latch]

I'm holding out hope for a warhammer replacer

[inner hare]

Daedric is the closest. The rest go for fantasy Dwarf kind of warhammers.

I have to say, imagining getting hit by a Daedric warhammer is damn scary.

[rustic latch]

oh yeah, and it actually looks best somehow with WH parry animation,

[inner hare]

2Ha and 2Hb parry vs 2hb and 2hs being easier than 2h lb is sus. Maybe they should be treated the same? Even if you want 0 for same weapons for gameplay clarity, other combos apply, e.g. 2hb parry vs 2ha shouldn't be easier than vs 2h lb, I think.

[rustic latch]

As they are presented in game yeah

I think

[inner hare]

Basically, parrying a dai-katana strike with battle-axe wouldn't be harder than parrying a warhammer strike (could be the opposite, heh), so -0.1 for all of them sounds fair. 2H lb parries vs other 2h weapons like 2h bw and ax treat them all the same way (0).

Just to be clear

I ignored greyed out areas because you use 0 for everything

All in all, looks like a cool system

[rustic latch]

I think I see where I've fucked up.

Actually, no. Hold on -that's right. Idea beign that 2hAxe and 2hBlunt are roughly equally unwieldy - while 2h Long bonuses reflect it's comparative versatility

[inner hare]

Ok, not the same thing

[rustic latch]

Hmmmm

[inner hare]

Let's try again

2hb parry (blue) vs 2h lb strike (green) and 2ha strike (green)

What I'm suggesting is that they should be -0.1

[rustic latch]

hold on - you want them both at -0.1

ok

yeah, I see what you mean

[inner hare]

I agree with 0 for 2H lb vs other stuff

[rustic latch]

same for 2hA vs 2hB

got it

yeah, that works

Good. Now I need to sleep on it, and stare at it tomorrow with hopefully fresher head and eyes

[pastel vine]

Out of curiosity, has there been discussion of having the first person shield block animation match the third person perspective? It just seems more raised in third person?

[rustic latch]

Both of those probably need redone. The 3rd person one especially so that it looks fine when moving and when standing

But holding off on that

[pastel vine]

No problem brother, and thank you. I know S3ctor has some animations with the shield block/raise in CHIM that might interest you.

[rustic latch]

Will need to ask him, and I don't think he's been around on discord since the beginning of april

[fickle crown]

There's also that unrigged animation pack posted on Nexus which S3c said he used some, maybe there's something there

https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/56734

[rustic latch]

I have it. There's some interesting stuff in there

Not specifically for armed animations

(there's a pistol shoot one in there though :P)

[fair wing]

@rustic latch would it be possible to significantly slow down movement speed (to like 5%) while falling or jumping?

that controlled jumps mod removes the ability to move but thats too much imo

very slow is better

[rustic latch]

ugh... Maybe? you mean so we can't strafe through the air?

[fair wing]

yeah

moreso move at all

[rustic latch]

Right... Hmmm. I'm not sure how the game controls jump "physics"

theoretically there's an types.Actor.isOnGround(self) that can be checked on update, then doublecheck that we are not levitating of slowfalling

and if those conditions pass we can set movement and sidemovement to 0

or 0.05 as you said

but I'm not sure it will not break jumping

may need to test

[fair wing]

Ark has nice physics but it has momentum and everything

[fair wing]

it shouldn't

[rustic latch]

well, it may in first person

[fair wing]

jumping while moving only calculates speed before the jump

[rustic latch]

right, but that's speed. I'm talking about frame by frame characters controls value

hmm

let me test quickly, disregarding the levitation edge case for now

[fair wing]

ok, thanks

I wonder if it would be possible to fix gravity too

[rustic latch]

fix how?

[fair wing]

believe it or not the reason morrowind is so floaty is the acceleration due to gravity uses the meters constant but uses yards as the actual unit

as far as I know anyway

[rustic latch]

lmao

ofc it does

close enough for some purposes I guess

[fickle crown]

If only we could have something like Precision(Skyrim Mod)

[fair wing]

it hurts to think it just requires a simple change in the constant

[rustic latch]

I've seen it mentioned, what does it do?

[fair wing]

what does precision do?

[rustic latch]

Let me play around for five minutes with move constraints

[fair wing]

it separates each part of the body afaik

and adds colliders and physics to the weapons

[rustic latch]

ah

yeah, we can't do that yet

not without cursed workarounds

(can't get precise bone positions)

but one day

[fair wing]

Physically accurate collisions for melee attacks
Procedural physics-based hit reactions
Weapon trails
Integrated hitstop and subtle camera shake
Melee attack recoils when hitting certain materials while standing too close
Support for both first person and third person
Support for creature attacks
Support for custom collisions for new animations, set up by the animator
An API for other SKSE plugins to use
Everything is done through SKSE, can be installed/uninstalled anytime
Modular and flexible - most features can be disabled or configured through MCM

[fickle crown]

Was also getting its text from their modpage

[fair wing]

gotta love cursed workarounds

[fickle crown]

""attack collider is created for a given duration and attached to the weapon (or fists, feet, or whatever has been defined in the animation or .toml file. Details below.) which will collide with other characters' bodies or other objects.
The attacks will naturally hit all targets that they collide with during the swing. The sweep attack perks don't do anything anymore by default, but you can select a different mode in the MCM if you want to limit the maximum amount of hit actors per swing, or want to add a diminishing damage multiplier"

[rustic latch]

So, SaintJ, that movement change nerfs acrobatics tae fuck

let me record it

[fair wing]

it does seem that movement speed while floating in the air might be a gmst

morrowind rebirth seems to lower it

[rustic latch]

Not sure, but actually

I like it

give me a sec

Check this out

[fair wing]

you can see it's ever so slightly slower in the air

[rustic latch]

with the change - you jump and you keep flying into that direction

but the jumps are also much shorter

and slower

may need some finetuning

but doable generally

[fair wing]

yeah thats how controlled jumps does it

but I mean taking away a % of movement ability rather than removing it

fully removing movement while in the air is pretty bad too

try jumping a fence

[rustic latch]

local isOnGround = types.Actor.isOnGround

local function onFrame(dt)
    if core.isWorldPaused() then return end
        if not isOnGround(self) then
        self.controls.movement = 0
        self.controls.sideMovement = 0
    end
end

for basic proof of concept in player script

    if not isOnGround(self) then
        self.controls.movement = self.controls.movement * 0.05
        self.controls.sideMovement = self.controls.sideMovement * 0.05
    end

like this if you want to limit movement instead of removing it

0.05 being 5%

[fair wing]

does this work when falling without jumping

[rustic latch]

yah

[fair wing]

controlled jumps uses space bar as an input

[rustic latch]

but also needs a check for levitating

[fair wing]

so if you TCL it's wraps

it's over

no more movement

[rustic latch]

tcl works

ah, no hold up

lemme retest

nah

tcl also screws up

but I can add edge cases for that, levitation and slow fall

give me 5

local debug = require("openmw.debug")
local core              = require("openmw.core")
local types             = require('openmw.types')
local isOnGround          = types.Actor.isOnGround
local self              = require('openmw.self')

local function onFrame(dt)
    if core.isWorldPaused() then return end
    if not isOnGround(self) and debug.isCollisionEnabled()then
        if not (types.Actor.activeEffects(self):getEffect("levitate").magnitude > 0 or types.Actor.activeEffects(self):getEffect("slowfall").magnitude > 0) then
            self.controls.movement = self.controls.movement * 0.05
            self.controls.sideMovement = self.controls.sideMovement * 0.05
        end
    end
end
return {
    engineHandlers = {
        onFrame = onFrame,
},
}

this will do it

TCL works, levitate and slowfall have movement allowed. Only applies when your feet are off the ground as engine considers it

limits speed to 5% of what it would otherwise be

at 100 acrobaticsa and 85 speed - jumps are still quite superhuman

but not as much as in the base game

and can't strafe back and forth through the air

Now, this was a curious detour, but what did you need this for? :D

[rustic latch]

this should work as a whole player.lua to apply it

[rustic latch]

There are also fMinFlySpeed and fMaxFlySpeed GMST but I guess those would apply to levitation too

[fair wing]

evil sith lord business

just personal stuff for more realistic movement

[rustic latch]

This may not be entirely realistic, but kind of an improvement actually

[tough juniper]

yeah that sound quite interesting

[rustic latch]

Too small to release as a mod :/

And may be other edge cases

[fair wing]

this works great

I'll pack it as .zip anyway for anyone interested here

[rustic latch]

Any other ideas on movement updates? We can do them and release a small mod on nexus

[fair wing]

hmm

[rustic latch]

If possible ofc :D

[fair wing]

any way to increase gravity?

reverse slowfall?

[rustic latch]

let me see if slowfall with negative magnitude even works

[hearty scroll]

@rustic latch Working on an attempt at translation. What do you mean in the line "base_parry_durability_loss_setting_desc" when you write :
"Default {default}"

[rustic latch]

{default} is a variable, it will grab actual value at runtime

so leave that as is

[hearty scroll]

cheers

it just means that {default} is the default setting, so I should treat it as a name, right?

[rustic latch]

When rendered in game it will look like
Default 3

so just translate first "default" and leave the curly braced one as is

Yah nah. Negative slowfall is weird

[cinder gulch]

Negative jump?

[rustic latch]

Can't tell if it dos anything

[rustic latch]

that's an option

[hearty scroll]

intuitively, I would have guessed that it increased fall damage?

[rustic latch]

but it will just make you jump lower, not fall faster

[hearty scroll]

never tried it though

[rustic latch]

I either did it wrong, or it doesn't do anything when mag < 0

positive one applied though

so I think it's just it's clamped

[cinder gulch]

Yeah some effects do things when they’re negative and others don’t

[rustic latch]

think slowfall is one of those

and I don't think actual gravity constant is exposed to us anywhere

[rustic latch]

comments on this btw. While nice, what it also prevents is jumping onto ledge until quite high skill level

acrobatics 41 - couldn't jump onto the railing in vivec arena

[fair wing]

do you mean the only way to jump onto things is run jumping?

[rustic latch]

not even that

[fair wing]

I set the speed higher from 0.05 to 0.25

so I can still move a bit

[rustic latch]

ah, no, I'm still poking the local version that is 0.05 :D

0.25 may be fine

[fair wing]

enough to standing jump onto something in front of me

[rustic latch]

with 0.05 need acrobatics 60 to jump onto here

and not reliable

[fair wing]

are you moving and jumping or standing and jumping

[rustic latch]

standing

moving is easier actually

it kinda clips me onto the railing O-o

[fair wing]

does it affect the actual height of your jump then>

?

it's great anyway, when falling it mimics having 0 momentum

[rustic latch]

height no, but mw really wants that horizontal movement to place you onto the ledge

[fair wing]

side to side momentum anyway

[rustic latch]

so need to instead press move -> jump not vice versa

I can get used to this

feels more natural somehow

[fair wing]

I wonder if proper movement physics will ever be a thing

try 0.25 too

[rustic latch]

Yeah, feels a bit better

and forward speed feels a bit more natural

[tough juniper]

is there any way to transfer/share fall damage to what you land on?

[misty phoenix]

Stomping mudcrabs would be awesome

[tough juniper]

i was playing around with a beta climbing mod and i have to say the best part by far was the ability to easily cross chest high walls

[rustic latch]

Yeah, it's nice. I don't really like how it integrates so dropped it

movement felt clunky

but the idea itsef is nice

[rustic latch]

not sure - maybe

[tough juniper]

yeah there are parts of it that could be implemented within the morrowind style philosophy, like n'garde has done with combat

[rustic latch]

I mean - two real options imo

daggerclimbing

fully - you stick to the wall and move how you want

first person only

second - full rework - animations etc

both may feel clunky if the block movement

[tough juniper]

low grade vaulting of some kind i think fits, its that space just between where is useful but non invasive and just keeps things moving. for bigger climbs/spaces there are already a few options

so like to make movement smoother without necessarily superseding magic

so rope arrows etc. will still be desirable for the non mage

[hearty scroll]

@rustic latch sorry to bother you again, just want to make sure I understand it right :

1. "weapon type parry effectiveness" > you mean the effectiveness of short blades (for example) for parrying, or effectiveness of staves for parrying, etc?
   (appears in line "base_parry_fatigue_cost_setting_desc")

2. What should I do with those lines (not sure what they are for) ? :
   true_string: "true"
   false_string: "false"

[rustic latch]

they are in the docs but don't seem to be actually used, but you can just translate them to what equated to "yes" and "no" or "true" and "false" in your language

and for 1. Yes, that's what I mean

[hearty scroll]

Cheers

[rustic latch]

YOu think that line may need to be rewritten in english too?

If it's not clear what it means

[rustic latch]

yeah, something to ponder

[hearty scroll]

Depends on the context. It's not really confusing imho, but to someone who doesn't understand what the mod does exactly, it may seem a bit vague (or it might just be my non native english speaker's brain who gets disoriented when confronted with too many nouns used as adjectives in a row).
With context, it's clear, don't mind me ^^'

[rustic latch]

Yeah, not sure how to communicate it better. It means "each weapon type has specified effectiveness for parrying, and that effectiveness applies here"

[hearty scroll]

that's what I meant with context. Since that line explains that "that effectiveness applies here", if you already understand that each weapon type has specified effectiveness, it's perfectly clear. If you had no idea, that's when it might get more strange. Can't think of a better way to communicate it either, seems good to me as is.

as I said, don't mind me, I just want to make sure I don't make a mistake ^^'

[rustic latch]

Nah, you good. It's good to ponder these things, even if we can't really improve on what's there. Cause I have instinctual understanding of what all of it means - hence my explanations might rely on the reader having the same knowledge that I do

[maiden tangle]

https://tenor.com/view/the-legend-of-zelda-breath-wild-gif-11281393

[river sluice]

Cheeky request - can we build in starwind detection, and change the sfx for deflection when using lightsabers (blunt weapons)

Even cheekier, but legendary if possible - deflecting blaster bolts with the lightsaber?

[cinder gulch]

Is that possible without a raycast ?

I’d be very impressed

[rustic latch]

Why woudln't it be? Bolts are arrows

[cinder gulch]

Raycasts don’t work in Starwind

[rustic latch]

It won't be pretty, but we don't have proper collision anyway

[cinder gulch]

Or rather they do, they just bring the engine to its knees

[rustic latch]

oh yeah

the omegamesh thing

[cinder gulch]

Yeah

Even a regular ray can tank your fps by 30 depending on the area, idk how many rays you use in this mod

[rustic latch]

barely one

and I may not even need it

[maiden tangle]

Couldn’t you just apply a brief ability spell with an reflexion magic effect via a script, every time you press the parry button?

[rustic latch]

well no

hold up

I also do navigation rays

that may be fine, cause pathgrid

but may blow up too

[rustic latch]

Are bolts in starwind magic?

[cinder gulch]

Wait, aren’t you using our raycast? Or something similar?

[rustic latch]

no, I don't need "activation" distance cast on frame. So I used it and the docs as an example to build my own on demand one

without a distance limit

[maiden tangle]

Don’t know, I never played starwind before, but even if they aren’t, hyacinths new reflect damage magic effect could be used instead.

[rustic latch]

Which I appreciate, hence ownlyme in credits. But I don't use your interface

[cinder gulch]

Yeah, the unlimited distance raycast will help Starwind

[rustic latch]

I needed it to add the current "guy in crosshairs" to target list to communicate threat events to npcs, and cause threat may be ranged - distance is much greater

actually limited, but beeeg

not actually sure it's useful anymore... 🤔 cause I add all incombat NPCs to target lists

and navigation rays for backpedal and ledge avoidance logic

[tough juniper]

oh if you can crack lightsabers starwind is starting to look pretty interesting

[cinder gulch]

I think s3 had some trick with the camera that might work but not sure if you want to refactor your mod to use that

[rustic latch]

I have no idea if this will work on starwind at all btw

never tested it

never played starwind at all

[cinder gulch]

Which is why I said I’d be impressed

[rustic latch]

No, I mean, I think I just don't need that ray, Like at all. It's there from earlier version before I changed threat communication logic

[cinder gulch]

Let’s just say that attaching scripts to every actor in an instance is not the most imperformant thing you can do when that .esm is enabled

[rustic latch]

lmao

[cinder gulch]

Not even kidding btw

[rustic latch]

Navigation rays should be fine right? as long as navmesh is present - since they don't care about other intersections

[cinder gulch]

You could run reanimation + mercy + bardcraft before their updates and you’d still have less of a performance impact than a single onFrame raycast (not even render ray btw)

[cinder gulch]

No idea lmfao

[rustic latch]

well, I don't have onFrame raycasts

it's on demand when weapon is raised

but I get what you mean

[cinder gulch]

Like I said, I’d be impressed

[rustic latch]

I'm not curious enough to install starwind for this

Star Wars is over. Some stories must end

[river sluice]

It's a whole new story with 50 voice actors!

But

Totally get it

[rustic latch]

And I still need to figure out how to fix mwscripted fights before that

Speaking of. @river sluice while I got you here

I've managed to fix archer hands for that fight in 1.0.8. But there is weirdness

specifically

[maiden tangle]

If you’d make a tweaked N’Garde version for Starwind too, with the usual parry mechanics, but also lightsaber having the same ability like shields being able to block arrows/bolts, your Nexus page might blow up even more 😉

[rustic latch]

if I disable and re-enable all 3 melee hands once they enter combat -

they get through the rest of the scripted fight just fine

but if I dont - they get stuck after first phase

I have no idea why that would be the case

[rustic latch]

I'll consider it

:P

[maiden tangle]

Even if I never played it myself, I know that it has quite an active community itself.

[rustic latch]

Nah, I getcha. Starwars mods usually do

[hearty scroll]

So...

fatigue_effects_formula_desc: "How much fatigue affects parry, block and other related formulas"

...apparently, the french version's name for the "block" skill is literally "parry". The name of the mod would literally translate to "Parry and Active Parry".
Makes keeping all the explanations clear... interesting

[rustic latch]

I mean, what is it called in french version of MW?

[hearty scroll]

Parade

[rustic latch]

right

parade-riposte should've guessed

bleugh

I mean - you can then jsut do "active parry"

clear enough

for the mod description at least

and just deduplicate the references

cause really - the same thing in eglish too

just that "block" is a dnd-ish new term

How much fatigue affects parry, and other related formulas e.g.

and same in other strings

can call "perfect parry" riposte, unless there's a french "perfect parry" term used in souls games and the like

[hearty scroll]

yeah, most of the time I just stuck with "parry" for the mod's parry. This specific sentence, I went with "How much fatigue affects formulas related to active parry or the Parry skill"

[rustic latch]

nah, don't need "or the parry skill"

block in that sentece refers to "shield block"

cause "shield parry" makes no sense in english

[hearty scroll]

ohhhh ok, cheers

[rustic latch]

🤝

I see that 💡 :D. As I said - some things may be easier cause modern fencing uses french terms :P

[river sluice]

Sadly I'm just the writing guy from reforged. Superduple did the scripted boss fights

[rustic latch]

They on discord?

[river sluice]

Yup

superduple

[hearty scroll]

I'm not familiar with the specifics of fencing vocabulary, so I would have intuitively thought that "riposte" implied some counter attack or damage reflexion.

[river sluice]

Discord username

[rustic latch]

Well, it kind of does

[hearty scroll]

the verb "riposter" is typically used in french to mean "attack in return"

[rustic latch]

dammit, last active im MMC in 2025

[hearty scroll]

retaliate

[rustic latch]

I'll try to reach out

[rustic latch]

yeah you right

well, then parade - something I guess

not sure what correct adjective would be in french

[hearty scroll]

I'll figure it out ^^

[rustic latch]

Thank you!

Decided to be less rude and reached out to superduple on nexus. We'll see

[hearty scroll]

It's funny how the French Academy can makes things harder sometimes huhu
You'd expect having an "official" reference for proper french would make things easier... except they hate foreign imports so much that they basically create french versions of words for everything, regardless of what the people actually use everyday. Some of the stuff they come up with is used by close to no one (except some hardcore patriot grammar nazis or smth).

In this case, there is a french translation for "debug log", but since it's IT language (that tends to use a lot of english words), I have no idea if players would be more familiar with the english version, the french version, or some type of mix or other "anglicism" lmao

@rustic latch "Print debug log messages to f10 log" -> what is f10 log?

[rustic latch]

press f10 in game

[hearty scroll]

so f10 log is the debug log?

[rustic latch]

well, yeah.

I guess it would be "print debug messages to f10 log" or "to debug log"

[hearty scroll]

cheers

Sorry to bother you so much (I'm close to the end!)
"Base multiplier for short blade weapons parry defence applied on top of skill based formula"
-> what does "parry defence" refer to exactly in this case?

[rustic latch]

percentage of damage that is cancelled on weak parry

weak parry being a "non perfect one" when you didn't time it right

https://gitlab.com/Arrean/openmwluaparry/-/wikis/Formulas/Parry-Block-Defence-factor

this

[hearty scroll]

cheers

[rustic latch]

🤜 🤛

[hearty scroll]

Just to clarify something :

When you write in shortbladeonehand_base_effectiveness_setting_name:
"Short Blade base effectiveness"

You reference the skill, not the weapons, right?

[rustic latch]

Same thing, weapon type that is governed by that skill

[hearty scroll]

OK

[hearty scroll]

Should be the last one :

"This number is further modified by Iron Palm 'feat' at an appropriate skill level"

This is the first time in the whole file you mention "feat", what do you mean exactly there?

[rustic latch]

"perk", or "feat" it's in quotes because it's not really a perk, but kinda acts like one

becoming active at a configurable threshold level

[hearty scroll]

Think I could use a wording along the line of "modified by the effect of Iron Palm"?

[rustic latch]

yeah

and I probably should change to it in english

[hearty scroll]

Oh, I have one last question I almost forgot I wanted to ask (should really be the last!!)

technical, this one

you used single quotation marks often : is it a simple choice of writting, or is it required in place of double quotation marks so it won't mess up some code or something?

(asking because single quotation marks aren't really a thing in french afaik)

[rustic latch]

it's required for the yaml formatting

[hearty scroll]

ok

[rustic latch]

you can probably do \"

I don't remember if yaml properly accepts escape symbols

[hearty scroll]

single quotations should be good enough, people will still understand, don't want to mess anything up

[rustic latch]

yeah, \" works

so it should be fine

do it, or don't I'll convert all of them after

[hearty scroll]

so should look like :

"something something words"

?

wait, that didn't translate in discord huhu

[rustic latch]

need another \ on discord

that's how escape sequences work

[hearty scroll]

\"something something words\"

?

[rustic latch]

yup

[hearty scroll]

cheers

[rustic latch]

you "escape" something with a \, so it shows up in the string as a literal instead of being interpreted as part of formatting or anythign else. Or you can add special symbols. \n being newline for example

[hearty scroll]

"Allow a successfull parry to cancel effects from an on-strike enchant of the enemy weapon." -> you mean a perfect parry I'm guessing?

(just noticed a typo while I'm here, one "l" in "successful")

[rustic latch]

will fix the typo

It's... It's either perfect parry or "weak" parry with high enough skill etc that it cancels all damage

Let me think how to best phrase it

[hearty scroll]

alright

Just wanted to make sure I wasn't using wrong designation to avoid confusing the reader

[rustic latch]

I think

[fickle crown]

Was it S3ctor's Chim?

[inner hare]

https://tenor.com/view/on-fire-pizza-gif-6074641

I thought that a few hours without visiting the thread wouldn't mean much

how many new messages? LMAO

any updates? Or is it just discussions and brainstorming? 🧠 😄

[rustic latch]

discussion shitposting and l10n work

[inner hare]

https://tenor.com/view/roger-roger-roger-roger-that-copy-that-robots-gif-5912820

[tough juniper]

No it was another one from a thread here, called FLOW. Can't find it now, good fun just undercooked

[inner hare]

enjoyed the challenge provided by Redoran warriors blocking my arrows with shields today. Got the opportunity to use that command scroll I had in my inventory. Turned 1 of them against the other 2. It helps a lot when your enemies are killing each other

[rustic latch]

More gameplay opportunities - love it

[inner hare]

yeah, I really like it when various mods affecting difficulty heavily encourage me to use these consumables which are often gathering dust in the inventory

[rustic latch]

Oh, also - we made a jump mod #1482416741077356692 message that prevents you from strafing midair

[waxen cliff]

saintj_

Attachment(s)

jump.rar

Linked by @​.arrean from #N'Garde. Vanilla-Friendly Parry and Active Block. 1.0 · Apr 27, 2026, 12:30 PM

[rustic latch]

It's in regards to "how many messages!?"

[rustic latch]

Aaaah.

I thought you are talking about this one:
https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/58063

[fair wing]

@rustic latch add swimming to the list of exceptions in the jump mod

[rustic latch]

lmao, knew we were missing something

[fair wing]

just required some playtesting, I'm sure there's some more stuff maybe

[hearty scroll]

@rustic latch This is as good as I can make it

[rustic latch]

Thank you! This is much appreciated!

[hearty scroll]

Cheers. Your mod is much appreciated

[rustic latch]

You got a nexus account, or a specific name you want to be credited under? (can DM it to me if you want)

[hearty scroll]

it's fine, cheers

[tough juniper]

Pretty similar implementation

[rustic latch]

Nah, you're getting credited, But for now you're getting called Billie :D I'm asking if you want another name used

[hearty scroll]

Yeah, Billie is fine ^^'

[rustic latch]

So it will be written

[tough juniper]

BILLY!

[rustic latch]

Oh, lovely, you even localized the hotkey recommendation to AZERTY

🙏

[rustic latch]

Ya need updated script, or did you modify your end yourself?

[fair wing]

I need the updated, I can't script for shit

[rustic latch]

there you go

[tough juniper]

So this is just to reduce control when jumping?

[rustic latch]

yeah

and it also nerfs jump length quite a bit

[tough juniper]

Sick!

[rustic latch]

and barely any midaird control

unless you're levitating or slowfalling

[inner hare]

with no climbing in-game (at least not in Vanilla), I would be careful about nerfing jumps too much. Acrobatics is pretty much a substitute for climbing.

[rustic latch]

nah, height is still there

[inner hare]

you need to move in order to use that height

move mid-air

[rustic latch]

you jsut can't magically move left right or fwd-back after you've jumped

well, fair

[tough juniper]

That might fit nicely with shield surfing

[inner hare]

at least move forward

[rustic latch]

the version that I've linked above limits midair speed to 25%

at high acro - it's still fine

at low - more difficult

[tough juniper]

But you can start moving before you jump, right?

[rustic latch]

was SaintJ's idea, I just scripted it together

[rustic latch]

yeah

not as fast as you used to though

hmmm

[inner hare]

it would be better to bundle jump changes with climbing tied to Acrobatics IMO. But oh well, it's an optional mod.

[rustic latch]

I have an idea

[tough juniper]

I like the sound of it anyway, tes jumping has always been such moon physics

[hearty scroll]

I thought Acrobatics didn't only increase jump height, but also the ability to walk up steep slopes

?

[inner hare]

walk?

[rustic latch]

???

[inner hare]

jump, if anything

[hearty scroll]

that's what I took as the replacement for climbing

[rustic latch]

I don't think it does that

[inner hare]

you can jump on steep slopes

but Acrobatics doesn't affect walking

in any way

[rustic latch]

and kinda shimmy your way up by jumping repeatedly yeah

but it diesn't affect walking

[inner hare]

note that Fatigue impacts jump height

and encumbrance

[hearty scroll]

I guess it was a wrong impression I got. Funny, 'cause I was certain it did for so many years huhu

[inner hare]

speed can greatly increase jump length

[tough juniper]

This is the TES way. Just hammer jump against a thing until you pass it

[inner hare]

often not as effective as believed

[tough juniper]

I managed to climb into the college of winter hold the back way with nothing but determination

[inner hare]

much better to use a short duration Levitate instead of getting frustrated

ah

Skyrim

ok

[tough juniper]

But that's skyrim

Yes

Obviously levitation is a better option lmao

[inner hare]

Jump is very good, though

so convenient in many situations

[tough juniper]

Yeah but it's still using magic

[inner hare]

and you move faster than Levitate

yeah, sure

although with high Acrobatics you don't need it

high Acrobatics + high Fatigue + low Encumbrance will give you insane results

at no magicka cost 😄

[tough juniper]

Back to good old hammering spacebar (or e if your an animal)

[inner hare]

another nifty thing is that you can jump backwards in order to dodge enemy attacks

[rustic latch]

There's apparently an fMaxFlySpeed GMST

[tough juniper]

We need a mod for stumbles

[inner hare]

Levitation speed is affected mostly by spell effect magnitude. Jump doesn't affect your speed. Only helps you with height/length. No help against fall dmg btw.

[rustic latch]

I know

[inner hare]

pretty sure I saw sth like that

based on encumbrance

giving a random chance to fall

like in Death Stranding or sth, lmao

I wish ground and slopes affected movement speed and stumble chance

with ice having the highest chance to cause a fall

and walking would reduce that to 0

https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/56722 found it, haha

[tough juniper]

nice! haha yeah there was some interesting work being done with slopes and raycasts a while back, death stranding might be the extreme but i do think there is something to be said for an intuitive balance system

[inner hare]

DS would be too annoying. That game is a Fedex courier horror, though, so not surprised they went with that

[tough juniper]

it works in that instance because its the whole point of the game

i love that game, i wouldnt want to have to deal with that while also fighting etc.

[inner hare]

btw that game had such bad corny dialogue and storyline full of long and boring cutscenes that I found myself grabbing my head in disbelief 😅 . Definitely not everyone's cup of tea

let's call that Kojima-lvl

[tough juniper]

no for sure

it was off the kojima chart even. i did weep like a baby at the end though. proper ugly blubbering tears

[inner hare]

as for adopting a stumble system to MW, we have staggers and knockdowns in-game. Maybe sth in between could be adopted for stumbles and integrated with the rest of the game's systems, e.g. Fatigue, movement, jumping. That would require some animations, though.

[tough juniper]

yeah, it should be fairly subtle so as not to be an annoying gimmick, its mostly when your leaping backwards at full speed that it gets pretty silly imo

[inner hare]

well, we have no backwards running option for HBFS already. Maybe a sort of stumble system would fit there.

for backwards jumping

[tough juniper]

yeah maybe mym could add that without too much hassle

[inner hare]

maybe stumble could be just a sound effect + additional Fatigue loss

or maybe just speed/jump length should be lowered while jumping backwards. I don't think that it should be disabled altogether as Acrobatics should be useful for dodging.

oh, the newest reach mod is hidden now

[rustic latch]

@fair wing check this one out.
Idea being - if you're running or walking in any direction when doing so - all of that movement transfer into the jump - no movement - no momentum and limited to 25% we had before. Meaning a running jump in a direction will carry you the distance

[strong lynx]

hmm but this will more or less just make it the same as if you held the control direction after jumping no? And therefore also reduce air control

oh i get the idea, the idea is to reduce the air control but then bring back some of it via momentum preservation

well, ok

[pastel vine]

Ohhh this is interesting

I'll have to give it a shot

[inner hare]

while you are at it, maybe you can differentiate backwards jumps and forward jumps

[rustic latch]

How exactly?

[rustic latch]

Yah, that was the plan. SaintJ's idea

[inner hare]

backwards jumping would have lower momentum. Forward jumps - higher momentum. Side jumps would be somewhere in between.

[rustic latch]

hmmmm

I mean doable

[inner hare]

basically, jump length based on direction

[rustic latch]

limit back to like 50%?

[inner hare]

I dunno. Depends on how it feels. Makes sense on paper.

[rustic latch]

momentum specifically - there still will be length and I can't control that much - that's speed and acrobatics

but I can control how much your movement factors in

[fair wing]

all I'll say is the distance is a little crazy

equivalent of doing a full power jump every time you jump

[rustic latch]

every? if you walk - it will be shorter

[fair wing]

I was also thinking of making it timed

as In longer jump longer you are moving with a limit

so that if you just started running and suddenly jump or change direction and suddenly jump you don't fly as far as a full sprint jump

[rustic latch]

hmmm

Let me bring up a gitlab and a makefile for this one

:P

editing it in place is becoming annoying

and a settings page, needs a settings page

[fair wing]

this is 70 acrobatics

seems too far

idk if jump power and acrobatics influence is a gmst

[rustic latch]

It's not

at least I can't find one

[inner hare]

this is too far? At 70 acrobatics? Ignoring TPP stuff (jumping never looked good in TES and TPP was never the focus, anyway), seems like a stretch to call this "too far" at such a skill level.

in real gameplay, when you spend most of the game at much lower skill lvls, it will probably feel awful

getting stuck at small rocks is not exactly fun and seems silly when you can't overcome such obstacles

esp with MW having "seamless" gameplay (no prompts to jump over fences and such)

[rustic latch]

There are things I can do to make it interesting, - e.g. accumulate "momentum" over last several seconds instead of taking it once at jump time etc

but probably not today. Repo is up and I've made some changes(including nerfing backwards jumping) but am tired

I've also patched couple more minor incompatibilities with Foxunder's mods in N'Garde (love that lad for reporting them) . And am hooking in the per-weapon vs weapon effectiveness system - but that needs polishing

I was going to jokingly call 1.0.9 a "clarity update" given that it will ship with better descriptions and localizations. At least some

but now I'm shipping a much more esoteric effectiveness systemt with it

[fair wing]

thats why I was thinking about making acrobatics influence jump height less too

acro 0 vs 100

55 acrobatics seems to be the most lifelike jump

I guess thats where most people will be around

IDK imo it should have less input on jump height

[inner hare]

don't focus too much on how it looks in TPP, that's what I'm saying. Jumping in Morrowind isn't like in real life because you have no animations for it, no grabbing, no pulling yourself up etc. You can literally fall in Morrowind if you miss an inch - that's how collisions often work (and it can be janky). Even in Vanilla you often cannot jump over a small fence on low skill and it's sth that pretty much everyone would be able to do just by moving one leg over it and then the next one. There is also no climbing in Morrowind while an acrobat would be able to scale many obstacles easily. In MW that's represented by Acrobatics and you jump because that's the game's limitation.

BTW 55 Acrobatics is pretty high. Unless you start with Acrobatics as major/minor, focus on that skill via training or hop around all the time like a lunatic, it will take a long time to reach such a skill lvl. Nowadays many players use some mods to slow down levelling one way or the other.

[inner hare]

On a different note, I'm wondering what kind of feedback would be best for parry efficiency. I guess that it would be sound since you learn audio cues during gameplay even without trying.

[rustic latch]

https://tenor.com/view/think-meme-thinking-memes-memes-2024-gif-6703217797690493255

[inner hare]

I guess that there is already some feedback due to the character grunting if hurt (so dmg goes through)

probably not easy to find proper sounds, but I bet sth recognizable can be done for very weak (low parry efficiency parries) and good ones (perfect parries are covered so it's about the rest)

[rustic latch]

as well as damage and stagger yeah

[rustic latch]

Problem beign I currently have no concept of what that would sound like... 🤔

[inner hare]

I imagine some kind of loud sound for weak efficiency shield block representing struggle

and sth more effortless for high efficiency