Sun's Dusk: Needs & Survival

[warm saddle]

I'm adding blue milk, blue booze, and bantha milk to spawned liquids, any request for spell effects while I have the CS open ? Blue booze I gave the same as sujamma, blue milk I noticed as a poison on it so I just nerfed the stamina on it, no poison, and bantha milk I gave the same as water since I can't find it anywhere for some reason

[faint siren]

I am not awake enough to answer this question.

[warm saddle]

All good haha, take your time I have plenty to work on

[warm saddle]

Thoughts on Vivec having saltwater or fresh water ? It’s on the sea but there are mods like Great Seawall and I feel like it’s kinda a basin for the lakes

[humble mica]

why am i not allowed to vote for suspicious water 😞

[digital ledge]

Is there a place to report objects that are incorrectly marked as water sources.

'Cause I've got one: 'RP_FQ_jeweller'. It's a banner for a jewlery shop.

So unless it's soaked and I'm wringing it out...

[faint siren]

good rp opportunity.

[digital ledge]

Smh when is OpenMW going to have live simulated cloth soaking mechanics.

[warm saddle]

Yeah just me haha

[warm saddle]

soon

Nah I haven't decided how far I'll go with it but I think drying off with a towel will give you a short small buff

[sour leaf]

What if it should be salt water but Vivec himself purifies it

[half summit]

yeah it seems like the water would be salt ut anything coming out of a fountain should be clean but idk if theres lore on the subject

[digital ledge]

I am able to cook on a burned corpse, which would be almost metal except it's a burnt corpse (past tense).

So it doesn't make much sense.

'SLF_CP_corpseBurned07_act'

[warm saddle]

Hmm

What mod is that from?

[digital ledge]

Caldera Priory

Probably not high on the priority list tbh.

[warm saddle]

Nah it’s good to know, I planned on doing custom temperatures for that mod

[warm saddle]

Bathing/dirt module is done, just need to properly stress test it and add a few extra features but otherwise it’s good to go

There will be some quickloot integration that if you paw through containers in dungeons and tombs you get dirtier too 👀

[sour leaf]

Does this not apply to opening containers normally?

[warm saddle]

Opening containers normally with quickloot will be covered too but the reason I’ll use it is because otherwise I would need a whole container script which QL already converts

[sour leaf]

I meant for people without QL lol

[warm saddle]

It would require a new lua file from my end haha

[sour leaf]

I was just curious lol. I'm a QL user now and tbh idk if I can go back

At first I wasnt sure but then I noticed some mods add literal piles of containers

[warm saddle]

Yeah I literally can’t play the game without it and the most recent update is much more performative so now there’s no reason to not use it unless you truly want the vanilla experience haha

[sour leaf]

It’s like the new Graphic Herbalism for me lol

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure

[sour leaf]

I did a run of NV with Quickloot and I think it’s a must for Bethesda games now

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure

[sour leaf]

Do you use the pickpocket overhaul as well? I messed around with it but I wasn’t sure if I liked it

[warm saddle]

Quickloot has its own pickpocket settings but his pickpocket mod makes pickpocketing actually sensible

[sour leaf]

It might have been because I was using it with burglary overhaul and it was doing weird shit lol

[warm saddle]

Also you can disable people from attacking you on sight if you fail a pickpocket check

They just lose a lot of disposition and say nasty things haha

[sour leaf]

I’ll add it back and see

[wintry sparrow]

how do I use this magic?

[sour leaf]

I got rid of Burglary Overhaul because I realized it kinda made stealth impossible sometimes lmao

[warm saddle]

There’s a setting for it but also, I’m not sure if BO reads all of quickloot’s events for removing items from containers

[sour leaf]

It may have been a different mod. It just seemed like it was doing weird stuff

I assumed it was BO since they both affected stealth and theft

[warm saddle]

In the primary needs setting, turn on debug mode and change the log level to … 3 ? Or 2 past silent, I forget what he set the UI mode change to
But anyway yeah just turn on debug mode and change UI modes and it’ll show up in the lua debug window

If it doesn’t, you might have to increase the log level just be aware that it’s … a LOT of spam if you crank it up and you would need to dig for it

There’s also a print for UI mode change in timehud but I think I commented it out

But yeah very helpful for jail, travel, dialogue, barter, etc

And of course UI mod enjoyers

[wintry sparrow]

yeah this is what i was thinking i have timehud dont have suns dusk yet

im trying to see how you did the toggle for the mousemove

someone asked if I could incorp into the ench bar

[warm saddle]

I change its layer

[wintry sparrow]

i figure that but wasnt sure which layer

also 👀 my vscode is screaming at me when i opened timehud 😵‍💫

[warm saddle]

From modal to HUD although you can probably do a layer above HUD, I forget

[warm saddle]

No idea lmfao, I use notepad++

[wintry sparrow]

notepadd++ don't care about your locals

[warm saddle]

Oh

[wintry sparrow]

its just lls being dumb

it doenst like globals for some reason

[warm saddle]

I guess that’s why we started using G_ for global variables in sun’s dusk

I can just find the print for you haha then you can put it in any of your mods

[wintry sparrow]

nah i got it!

wow making them globals is nice actually... didnt know I could do that all my scripts have a big chunk of require() stuff in every one at the top

typically

[warm saddle]

Yeah it’s nice although another protip I have almost every library in timehud but half are commented out haha

So if you need to find one you can just look at timehud instead of going to your API doc bookmark

[faint siren]

The naming convention for Globals is PascalCase

It complains because globals are semantically supposed to be capitalized

[warm saddle]

Yeah now I know why you asked for us to change ours haha

But yeah good to know

[wintry sparrow]

1st time I ever heard PascalCase was this week 👀

[warm saddle]

Same 👀

[faint siren]

I think the convention might technically be CAPITAL, but idr.

[warm saddle]

Also haha sorry @wintry sparrow for spoiling people, I think you use onMouseWheel too for Buff Timers but now people be expecting magic UIs

But yeah timehud basically has everything you need for that, the way I do “locking” is just a bit silly haha

[wintry sparrow]

i did not and i noticed it and its pretty awesome i didnt even know this was a thing!

[warm saddle]

Oh really ? 0.o how did you do moving the UI in buff timers? I moved mine so long ago and haven’t touched them since haha

[wintry sparrow]

i do - but i never thought of using mousewheel for scaling!

that's just brilliant!

ctrl + click + mousewheel = scale, shift for scale

i only have the drag feature courtesy of s3ctor 🙂

[warm saddle]

And setting the background alpha I was going to ask if you’d consider adding that

[wintry sparrow]

oh i'd definitely add the scaling bit, and the alpha thing too at some point

feel free to incorporate the colorpicker 😛

[warm saddle]

Will definitely for timehud at some point, I don’t know how Sun’s Dusk would do

The UI settings is already in a very fragile and delicate state as it is

[half summit]

oh man quick loot just broke me, its just pure luxury

[rotund epoch]

https://tenor.com/view/weakness-disgusts-me-senju-gif-13079766

[warm saddle]

Sorry I just checked timehud and yeah to "lock" it I change the layer from modal to scene when the player selects "lock" in the settings, Sun's Dusk does the same thing although the scene layer disables tooltips when you hover over the UI

That's also why it doesn't show during loading screens if it's locked since Scene is the only thing below load screens or FadeToBlack, whatever that layer is
s3ctor's way might be better but that was kinda just a quick and silly "fix" I did

[warm saddle]

Nah I use buff timers and the debuff being a spell rather than an ability drives me crazy to no end, I was thinking about changing it for myself though haha

[rotund epoch]

Just turn it off. It's just 5 pt Drain Sneak. Unimportant.

You can literally turn it off

[warm saddle]

Oh is it a setting to turn it off now ?

[rotund epoch]

Yeah

[warm saddle]

Oh nice

[untold lotus]

man that would've saved me a lot fumbling when taking screenshots before the mod disables with toggle ui lol

[rotund epoch]

Shouldn't affect it. Drain Sneak is just a magic effect. Spotted icon disappears when you press disable HUD button

Unless you mean Sneak Step Drain, a different mod

The UI bar doesn't disappear there

[untold lotus]

i might've misread, but I was talking about bufftimers displaying the sneak debuff as a timed effect
since the drain persisted until cell change in interiors or until I walk away in exteriors, and cuz before the 1.0 update of bufftimers the timers won't disable with toggle hud (now fixed), i had to do some funny business if I don't want the icon showing in my screenshots

and yes the timer was also redundant with the spotted indicator burglary overhaul itself added

[warm saddle]

yeah same, usually I moved it to the bottom of the screen xD

[rotund epoch]

Ah, so it's about imtegration with buff timers. Well, turn it off 🙂

I don't even know why it's there tbh

[warm saddle]

Kinda curious as to why it's spell over an ability

[rotund epoch]

Seems redundant

[warm saddle]

Probably to track something if I had to guess but idk

[rotund epoch]

Then it wouldn't be possible to turn it off

[warm saddle]

Could be something hidden, idk i haven't looked at the code

[rotund epoch]

Before spotted icon was added, it could serve as spotted indicator at least

But spotted icon was added ages ago

[warm saddle]

Oh also @wintry sparrow sorry to ping you again, not sure if you’ll ever create a mod that needs this but there’s also a debug log that prints every static item when you enter a cell which can be very handy

[warm saddle]

Next timehud update will have special settings for sun's dusk enjoyers 👀

More settings for formatting and also I exposed a few temperature states from sun's dusk for other mods to use (such as with this), also setting to disable for interiors

The temperature display also comes straight from SD so if you use freedom units or have an alternate font that doesn't have special characters, it comes straight from the SD temperature UI settings

[warm saddle]

This is the version you need if you want the timehud stuff, it's missing a few starwind things so be sure to grab the upload later this week I'm just happy with the timehud shit i did earlier today haha

[half summit]

yuss

[sour leaf]

Is the Hunterwind stuff also going to be included in the next update?

nvm I see it in there

[warm saddle]

Flin also now spawns in the wild

[sour leaf]

https://tenor.com/view/smolder-tangled-disney-rapunzel-flynn-rider-gif-3557364

[sour leaf]

What’s the daedric symbol next to your cursor from?

[half summit]

oh nice did you mod AP?

[warm saddle]

It's one I made myself and yeah I added it to animated pickup and shop around but you could also add it to quickloot, or even both so that it's always consistent haha

[digital ledge]

Another mistaken mesh that the mod thinks is a well, although I understand why: 'ex_stronghold_smdwell00'

Y'know, since it has "well" in it.

It's from basegame Morrowind tho', in fairness.

[half summit]

nice i didnt realise it was just a .dds in there

[half summit]

loving the bathing module. but im able to wash myself with owned soap. i used a whole basket of soap right in front of the owner

[mild crystal]

clearly they thought you needed it more than they did!

I wonder if I'm the first geek to bring this up, but shouldn't tamrielians have their own unit of measuremeant for temperature instead of C/F?

[faint siren]

generally most units referenced are imperial, up to and including weird ones like drams, so probably just fahrenheit

[mild crystal]

bummer

[sour leaf]

What about drams is imperial?

Also, lol imperial

[mild crystal]

I don't think it is, at least in the way it's used in the games

[sour leaf]

Are drams ever even used in game

[mild crystal]

I could have sworn they were in the context of alchemy and apothecary

[faint siren]

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Feyfolken_III

Mind I am saying imperial as in the IRL sense and not the TES race

[mild crystal]

tbf the Cyrodiilic Empire had the same motivations as the British Empire to found a standardized unit set

[faint siren]

they're also somewhat of an on the nose analogue

[mild crystal]

even before them, the Remans probably would have had something

[sour leaf]

I think I got drams and drakes confused because I thought drams were currency lmao

[grizzled flume]

Hello I couldn’t see what’s in the 1.5 download?

Nvm I see what it relates to in timehud

[warm saddle]

Yeah I’ve been trying to think of a solution for that, detecting ownership somehow haha
But you should only be able to use soap when you’re submerged or in a bath house ? 0.o

[faint siren]

I feel like that would be reasonable if you had a bucket of water or something.

Sink shower ain't so bad.

[warm saddle]

That’ll be a starwind setting only I just forgot to add it

[faint siren]

what? 😂

Nah i just mean in general, you know, uh...

Totally normal adventurer carrying a bucket of water around... ?

Maybe, uh, nevermind.

[warm saddle]

I had eligible to bathe if isWet but that means you can just splash some water on yourself at a well or by jumping which is possible but just a little too convenient, but I didn’t test that extensively
It’s either that or add specific activators, but swimming is relatively easy on Vvardenfell but not so much in starwind which is why I asked you about that the other day

[faint siren]

IDK how you're expected to bathe on tatooine in general case as water is like gold so honestly I would...

[warm saddle]

I could put restrictions like “you can’t get glowing if you only bathe that way but then that would exclude starwind enjoyers until they get off of tat

[faint siren]

I would believe people there mostly don't, tbh

[warm saddle]

Sand people built different

[faint siren]

You can, uh, be clean, or you can have drinking water on the awful desert planet of death

Gamorr has water.

[warm saddle]

Yeah which is why starwind is getting its own first global variable, I was just too tired to finish it last night haha

But also the bathing module will be disabled by default, I just have it enabled by default in the one I posted here for testing and also since I showcased it and been talking about that

But yeah if you want to look at the logic in the cleaning module, it’s relatively simple, straightforward, and short compared to the others (for now)
Also I’ll be uploading it to gitlab when I clean up the code a bit more, that’ll be in a few days though

[little haven]

After you build a good layer of dirt, washing it off would actually harm you more than it would help you

[warm saddle]

Yes and I was hesitant about using metric/imperial units (the empire would definitely use something like imperial units) but also I wanted the temperatures to be understandable rather than just “hot” and “cold”
Initially I was hesitant about the mL with liquids for this reason but all of my solutions for that were more difficult and convoluted than they were worth

[faint siren]

You unironically want the grime on you

I don't wanna take that super literally in the mod tho lol be like spending weeks out in the tatooine desert building up layers of musk

too much

[little haven]

We need units used in Tamriel

What do people there use

[faint siren]

.

[warm saddle]

I’ll probably do like, you don’t get debuffs from being dirty until you get off of tat (and discovery soap + civilization)

[faint siren]

That.... actually isn't a bad idea

cuz tat is like the intro planet, there are few ways to get off, means of making $$$, but you're gonna be stuck there for a bit, doing something

[warm saddle]

Yeah I did something like that somewhere else, I forget but it’s probably the most painless solution

But yeah that’s how the only buffs/debuff settings work, the alternate just isn’t applied

[mild crystal]

Super reasonable yeah

I just saw the opportunity to ponder something fun

[warm saddle]

Oh yeah for sure haha, I wanted the refillable water to be like iNeed which is a waterskin that has 3 charges on it and displays like 3/3 but doing something like that with the bottles is tricky with formulas and name formatting

For example, water can spawn from 250mL/2L but flin can only spawn 250mL/500mL, they both have the same volume but have a different number of total charges (idk if that makes sense)

@faint siren btw, idk if it’s a little presumptuous but let me know if there’s anything you’d want me to expose for this update, I think ownlyme exposed all of saveData but it’s … a lot haha, I just did a few things with temperature but I can do more

[faint siren]

well what's in the save data that I would care about?

I mean if he went to the trouble of doing that he must've had a reson

It would be nice if there was a native way to add wells, I remember you showed me where the source file was for those.

I basically can do whatever I want with the food/drink/etc data through the csv...

[warm saddle]

He wanted to have tooltips with specific temperature modifiers for another one of his mods, so he just did all of saveData which includes like everything in every module
It’s a little above me, I just did some of the globals so I’ll just show you what he did haha

[faint siren]

oooooooo that sounds fun

[warm saddle]

in sd_p.lua

return {
    engineHandlers = {
        onUpdate = onUpdate,
        onFrame = onFrame,
        onInit = onLoad,
        onLoad = onLoad,
        onSave = onSave,
        onMouseWheel = onMouseWheel,
        onConsume = onConsume,    
        onConsoleCommand = onConsoleCommand,
        onKeyPress = onKeyPress,
    },
    eventHandlers = G_eventHandlers,
    interfaceName = "SunsDusk",
    interface = {
        version = 2,
        addConsumable = API_addConsumable,
        -- exterior temperatures before any modifiers (such as race and equipment are applied)
        getTrueExternalTemperature = function()
            return G_trueExteriorTempString
        end,
        -- current player temperature after all modifiers are applied
        getPlayerCurrentTemperature = function()
            return G_playerCurrentTempString
        end,
        getPlayerTargetTemperature = function()
            return G_playerTargetTempString
        end,
        getPlayerTemperatureBuff = function()
            return G_playerTempBuffString
        end,
        getIsWet = function()
            return G_SW_isWet
        end,
        getSaveData = function()
            return saveData
        end
    }
}```

I did the getTemp stuff but he did the getSaveData and then this in his other mod:

local sunsDusk = nil
if I.SunsDusk and I.SunsDusk.version >= 2 then
    sunsDusk = I.SunsDusk.getSaveData()
end``` ...
```lua
    if sunsDusk then
        if sunsDusk.m_temp and sunsDusk.m_temp.currentSlowDebuff then
            danger = danger + 100000000
        end
    end```

But obviously he knows his way of navigating through saveData and finding whatever he needs and I do not which is why I did separate getTemp functions, I just ask if you wanted anything too

I will say that modifying the CSV values itself is a bit annoying although I do that in formulas in the second tab of the spreadsheet, but you can modify how much food/thirst value you get everything with lua local function applyHiddenDifficultySettings(diff) if diff == "Default" then WAKEVALUE_MULT = 1 FOODVALUE_MULT = 1 DRINKVALUE_MULT = 1 elseif diff == "Hard" then WAKEVALUE_MULT = 0.75 FOODVALUE_MULT = 0.75 DRINKVALUE_MULT = 0.75 elseif diff == "Hardcore" then WAKEVALUE_MULT = 0.5 FOODVALUE_MULT = 0.5 DRINKVALUE_MULT = 0.5 end end

[faint siren]

I could work with big screw-off table of everything. That sounds fun. But the wells seem like a legit thing

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure, I think in the version I sent out I didn't have everything for starwind, but before I upload it I will
But also I put -- Starwind notes almost everywhere I could find that would need to be looked at, such as flasks/cups, wells, heat sources, cooking spots

[faint siren]

I wanna try to get some dedicated cooking stations but I may have to grant starfather some eggnog first

Christmas, y'see

[warm saddle]

Hahaha yeah sure, I saw that TD had grills and stuff that there aren't flags for atm, some of their cooking stations are picked up but I think it'd be easier to have a whitelist than just a billion flags so I'd like to move in that direction

If only there was another lua mod that had all of the TD item IDs for cooking and trees

[faint siren]

Seems like great excuse to use Tagger now that you mention it

[warm saddle]

I was gonna say I see the appeal of an interop now but I'm all for making this easier haha

[faint siren]

seems like could be handy to define say, wells like this:

tags:
  - "ArmorTribunal"
  - "PotionPoison"
  - "WeaponTribunal"
  - "WeaponWakizashi"
  - "WeaponWakizashiUnique"
applied_tags:
  "silver dagger_droth_unique_a":
    - "WeaponDaggerUnique"
    - "WeaponTribunal"
    - "WeaponUnique"
  "stendarr_hammer_unique":
    - "WeaponHammer"
    - "WeaponTribunal"
    - "WeaponUnique"
    - "WeaponHammerUnique"

You've mentioned enough skyrim mods in here I figure you're familiar with how it works there

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure and yeah that would be handy, thanks for showing me

[faint siren]

np, I wish I made some more tags for it already but I never managed to actually come up with purpose built justification to actually use it 😄

[warm saddle]

I didn't see too much of a need to do anything crazy with tags but seeing as there will be wells that give off specific liquids (such as your bantha well with bantha milk) it's probably a good idea to start now haha

[faint siren]

Yea I mean food needs to be a little too dynamic for tags to work well, but ovens maybe!

I feel like once i explore a couple more places I can come up with a couple weird things you coudl maybe use to cook with

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure, it's possible to use the cooking API to have different items show up at specific places like ovens for baking or kettles for tea

So that would help with that as well

[faint siren]

I haven't actually had a chance to cook anything you do it by placing objects in the world, right? Or?

[warm saddle]

Oh nah to cook you just interact with a fire, the campfire you build, or anything with the cooking activator flags

There'll be a tooltip that looks the same as with refilling water

[half summit]

yeah nah just horsing into it dry

is is auto adding a drop of bug musk too? Nice touch

[warm saddle]

Yeah using bug musk when you bathe gives you a little buff (having it in your inventory or interacting with it), and is consumed like soap after using it 3 times like that

[half summit]

ah OK cool, yeah that's slick. it doesn't seem like its being consumed either though

[warm saddle]

Correct, you don’t “drink” it (or spray if you have the mod) since I figure you’re just infusing it in your bath/shower

[half summit]

oh I see that's awesome but yeah like I stood in the hall in the mud bath and spammed the button on a basket of soap, used like 20 bars (without paying) and still had my musk at the end

[warm saddle]

Hmm

Was it refreshing the buff ?

[half summit]

it was giving the messages

[warm saddle]

Gotcha, I’ll check it out

[mild crystal]

when do you go full Project Zomboid and add full on metabolism tracking lipids, fats, and carbs, with each food having defined calories 😃

[warm saddle]

I already had to persuade ownlyme from implementing those although it is very possible lmfao

[sour leaf]

Both "Immersive Telvanni Bug Musk" and "Telvanni Bug Musk Perfume" implement this functionality of using the bottle multiple times. Would SD conflict with those mods or just override them?

[warm saddle]

Nope it shouldn’t touch either since it uses an entirely different keybind and also it should be removed from your inventory without consuming it after bathing with it 3 times

I’ll probably change that number or have it configurable, I haven’t decided the best way to go about implementing it yet but yeah I also use immersive Telvanni bug musk and don’t want a mod conflict xD

[sour leaf]

Ah so bathing with it and using it as a perfume are different?

[warm saddle]

Yup

[half summit]

yeah its pretty boojy

[sour leaf]

Also, fun fact, the spraying sound is not lore friendly

[warm saddle]

Interesting haha, yeah no idea how they’d diffuse it I just assume some Telvanni wizardry

[half summit]

good, i love that thick oily glug from immersive bug musk

[sour leaf]

It's described as a thick paste so I'd assume it's something you rub into your skin like lotion

[warm saddle]

Interesting haha, I guess it makes more sense then that you’d bathe with it

[sour leaf]

Does using bug musk the normal way have any affect on cleanliness? Like does it mask the negative effects?

[half summit]

is there any way to change the sound when soap is used? i know im not supposed to be able to spam it but its a little bit nausiating hearing him eat loads of soap haha

[warm saddle]

there’s also a buff called “oiled up” for mods that add bath oils to the game that I could use

[sour leaf]

I guess the vanilla debuffs would counteract it to an extent

[warm saddle]

No but I could add that

[sour leaf]

There's a what

[sour leaf]

Up to you! I feel like it would only make sense up to a certain point. Like irl, if you've gone a day without showering, cologne could probably help a little. But if you're like, pigpen level disgusting, then adding cologne would either do nothing or make it worse

[warm saddle]

I think I can change it yeah

[sour leaf]

This would also prevent you from using bug musk to skip bathing entirely

I am very excited for this bathing module

[warm saddle]

It’s not super polished yet, there are a few kinks I need to iron out but it’s in tact for the most part and there will obviously be many more features added over time, I’m just not sure how many I want to drop at first haha

[sour leaf]

Will it have interop with the defecation mod

[warm saddle]

Definitely not haha but if someone wants to integrate them, I can walk them through it haha

[half summit]

that might make a good babies first lua for me. I do actually enjoy that mod

[faint siren]

You know if you guys wanna go shit in the woods you can do it IRL too

Seems a bit far 🤣

[half summit]

🤷 it's just a debuff, anyway poop is funny. what can ya do

[faint siren]

I know I'm just giving you a hard time. What mod are you taking about actually?

[warm saddle]

https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/54823 I think

I think there’s one that just uses mwscripts but idk

[faint siren]

Oh I bet he's talking about uh oh stinky

[half summit]

haha probably similar but not the one I was talking about

[faint siren]

Need to Pee is diff thing from the author of Ultimate Teabagging

...... interesting guy for sure.

[half summit]

the depths of the nexus hold strange secrets

[faint siren]

Don't look at his profile lmao.

[half summit]

always good to heed such a warning

[faint siren]

Warned ya.

[warm saddle]

Btw @faint siren I showed the tag system you mentioned earlier to ownlyme and he sent me this

[half summit]

btw this is the one i was talking about, it was gifted to #1408674801131847702 it doesnt add any animations or meshes

from Heilkitty

i was mainly joking too though, its probably not worth precious time haha

[faint siren]

uh....

I'm sorry, is crassius curio a heat source?

I'm a bit hung up on that, as it happens.

Does... he want me to tag these?

I get what I'm looking at but not so much why I'm looking at it.

[warm saddle]

Yes that’s my doing

I’ll clean it up but you can basically set any tag you want without having to touch any lua

[faint siren]

Interesting.

This applies tags under the hood?

[warm saddle]

And also not having to define things or have separate lua files for mods, it’s just drag and drop txt docs in the same way as food, I’ll just tidy up the spreadsheet (it’ll be much simpler than the food)

[warm saddle]

Yeah I think so, I haven’t done a lot with it yet or done anything crazy but it looks like you can also do custom crazy ass heat sources if you wanted to do something like … the sun

[faint siren]

well I mean the reason you use tagger ostensibly is, that, you just format a yaml file and it's made available through a public api

[warm saddle]

Hmm

[faint siren]

don't need to have custom parser with yaml and all that jazz, it's already zero-lua when you're just making them. But you have to use them in code somehow

[warm saddle]

Yeah I’m not sure if this is the best way to go about it, I just left him alone for an hour and this is what he gave me haha

[faint siren]

No I'm not trying to be critical I'm just trying to fully understand what I'm reading here. Seems handy either way.

Do you guys just use TSV for everything because that's the easiest export out of the spreadsheet? Like it integrates well with the existing flow?

It's kinda old fashioned but it does make sense, even beth did it that way. So many items to keep track of.

[warm saddle]

This is a different parser/TSV/speadsheet and the .txt files will be in a different folder, similar to how the food values have their own folder, the spreadsheet will be much more simple to use as well

Similar to how you use the crafting framework I guess, rather than having to define recipes in lua you can just use the spreadsheet with your information instead

And rather than having tags be read in separate modules (like heat sources in global, cooking sources in cooking, wells in thirst) and rather than moving each of those to globals, it’s just importing the TSV instead

Again idk if it’s better or worse since it hasn’t really been done before, I just don’t know if it would be better or worse than doing what you described haha

[faint siren]

Global? Why?

[warm saddle]

I mean that’s how this is currently, I think the heat sources are in global since the way statics are detected in cells is global

[sour leaf]

I didn’t think that was a real mod I was just making a joke lmao

[faint siren]

fuck around and find out on 25 years of joke mods

[warm saddle]

Oldwind mods are truly a breed of their own

[sour leaf]

It’s funny how some were instant classics that are still used today and many are like, just totally batshit

[warm saddle]

But yeah I guess people who only make esp mods will have an easier time adding items to it, and I don’t have to make a lua file for every mod I add

[faint siren]

Well I think you two might have an easier time of some aspects in using markup.loadYaml. It just instantly gives you a table based on some yaml or json module. But the problem there is that I'm really experienced enough with spreadsheets to know the best way to go from that, to yaml. But it definitely does have some upsides

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure, I don’t think I’ve ever even touched a yaml

[faint siren]

one of the biggest advantages of doing it in one of the more common formats is if it has JSONSchema support you can get IDE checking for it

you guys would probably have some deeply structured ones like this for example

[sour leaf]

Half the mods are like immersion mods and then there’s “add a penis” lmao

[faint siren]

entire catalogues of them

anyway it makes for nicer code for sure but I suspect might not play very nicely with how your data's managed... Which is super unfortunate. But also i suck at spreadsheets so maybe this isn't a thing

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure, although not many people know how to write or generate things

I kinda had something in mind like ashfall has since that would be easier since people have been doing those files for years but using a TSV is more consistent with what we’ve been doing so far so I see the benefits of either

[faint siren]

Genuinely making mistakes though is what the add'l schema is for. BUT in those cases you still need an editor that'll actually use it, it's not really... It's not necessrily going to do casual editors any good in that respect

[warm saddle]

But yeah dw this spreadsheet won’t be difficult for me to write instructions for at all, I could even do formulas so that you’ll only have to enter in like 2 or 3 fields, click through a few dropdowns and then just copy/paste

Pretty sure I could make this spreadsheet easy asf to use so that it would take you (or anyone) longer to parse or generate the list of items/statics from an esp than using it

I could probably even include the parser I use for that in the modders resources since it makes everything super easy

Using a parser for a TSV for a parser some full circle shit although that’s what I’ve been doing for months

[faint siren]

Yeah I was mostly just asking from an api design perspective cause it seems to be a lot of work to make these parsers yourself, but everything about you're doing with them actually makes a lot of sense...

I guess separated values are too loose and weird for us to really like, offer some builtin mechanism for them though

[warm saddle]

Ownlyme has a few different parsers we use for esps and for databases for grabbing data from mods, but the one I used for the food values in this mod is nearly exactly the same as for crafting framework but half as complex, it was nearly a copy/paste

[warm saddle]

We also use a lua parser to convert esps to jsons through tes3conv.exe and then a separate lua parser to print data from the json that can be put into a spreadsheet as a TSV

[faint siren]

what?

[warm saddle]

Hahaha

[faint siren]

wait no I get it now

[warm saddle]

Which is why I’m a spreadsheet enjoyer with these mods and why I always offer to do food mods and get recipe data for people xD

I’ll also probably do the same for you btw if you want and anyone else who wants to add their wells/heat sources/cooking stations to the spreadsheet, I’ll definitely be using this parser for TD and OAAB

[vernal marsh]

@warm saddle JustBackgroundNoise is streaming SD now

[mild crystal]

like axe body spray

[polar fox]

Reported a bug on the mod page, but in case it's more convenient here: certain types of velothi architecture seem to register as water sources. Something like in_velothi_stairwell_01. I'll see if I can find it again, but I think the issue is the keyword "stairwell"

[warm saddle]

OMG

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

[warm saddle]

Yeah sure, thanks for letting me know. Working on a better way of finding statics and whatnot

[warm saddle]

I had a feeling he might try it out and was hoping to have a little more done before he did but this is good enough
Some of the design kinda had some of his videos in mind, like he usually plays with as few mods (if any) as possible and I want anyone to enjoy Sun’s Dusk that way, that’s why TD and OAAB aren’t a requirement like ashfall, even if it’s much more difficult to add certain features and we have to do weird workarounds, it’s worth it to have anyone be able to play 🥹 I’m gonna watch the vod rn

[warm saddle]

Not the frodo run omfg

[warm saddle]

Also tysm @vernal marsh for helping him out lmfao

[warm saddle]

@wraith berry Oh hey! Sorry this was moved to another channel ^^;
There'll be a temperature bar on the bottom left of your screen near your weapon/spell icons and health/stamina/magicka bars, the icons aren't fully transparent right away because they appear as you become more thirst/hungry/tired but that can all be changed in the UI settings

[ruby pine]

FYI the download link here points to 'Devilish guar riding':
https://modding-openmw.com/mods/suns-dusk-needs-and-survival-openmw/

[warm saddle]

Hahaha thanks for letting me know, I didn't set it up but did you need the right download link ?

[ruby pine]

No, I've got it already, just was letting you know.

[warm saddle]

Yeah sure thank you, also keep an eye out for an update later today

[faint siren]

wut?

[warm saddle]

The link on the momw website links to devilish guar riding I guess haha

[rough salmon]

Remind me, have this mod already been made obsolete or weather module is still in development?

https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/46495

👀

[warm saddle]

It’s obsolete with Soltha’s but yeah I had that mod installed and it will be made obsolete

Decided not to do a UI so it should be coming along within the next week or two

[rough salmon]

Huh? Didn't Sol make just the blight weather mod?

this one

[warm saddle]

Sol’s weather pack does extreme weather I think

Hmm

Tbh I might have made that mod obsolete with wetness debuffs + the windchill/temperature effects from storms though

I’ll be going harder though haha

Yeah I have like 95% of the base features I want, iNeed and Frostfall in morrowind, and watching JBN’s stream I get the idea that veteran morrowind enjoyers want more of a challenge haha

Although you can tweak it to have only hardcore debuffs and whatnot obviously I can get more creative haha

[rough salmon]

tbh I agree
even on harder preset the effects are kinda subtle for the most part

except for -10 speed debuff on full wetness

[warm saddle]

Oh yeah nah for sure, I made it very tame haha

[warm saddle]

Yeah this is what I mean, by “I can get more creative” I really mean that I leave any of the modules alone with ownlyme for a few hours

[rough salmon]

also a small suggestion - add fire resist on high wetness

[warm saddle]

Yeah it gives some resistance to taking heat damage, not immunity but yeah fire resistance would be good

Adding VFX to logs when they fall from trees so that they’re easier to find and pick up, any ideas for which one ?

[rough salmon]

you mean particles or overall look?

[warm saddle]

Particles

[rough salmon]

I don't even know which particles are vanilla anymore xd

[warm saddle]

Same tbh xD

[rough salmon]

I'd imagine those which Impact Effects use for hitting the ground

looks dirty enough to my

[warm saddle]

Oh yeah those would be good

Oh he has his own haha

[warm saddle]

Changelog v1.5

Features and Changes

NEW Bathing

• use sload soap or TD soap to clean yourself when submerged/swimming or in a bathhouse (new mods coming soon). Dirtiness increases over time, in storms, when swimming around scum, and in dungeons, sewers and tombs. Go without bathing for a while and you'll catch a disease.
• Receive a buff from Telvanni Bug Musk if it's in your inventory, consumed after 3 uses.
• New settings to put additional restrictions on bathing and cleanliness.
• The Subterranean Balconies at The Avenue in Port Telvannis are considered a bathhouse for the moment, expect more features in the near future!
  Camping
• Buy a tent, firewood, and soap at Publicans and general merchants who restock their supply after 1 day.
• Items in your inventory have a ~ in front of it to find them easier.
• Hit a tent with a weapon to make it despawn, otherwise they despawn after 24 hours. They're consumed right away and can't be reused, so be sure to stock up before adventuring.
• Small buff when near or building a campfire.
  Woodcutting
• Logs from woodcutting now sparkle when they hit the ground, making it easier to find and pick them up
• Khajiit (and TD khajiit races) get a bonus when cutting a tree down with unarmed attacks
• Improved xp formulas
  Wetness and Temperature
• Drying off faster, no longer immediately get wet from wells and from spilling water on yourself. You can still spam wells to cool off though
• Improved temperatures in Seyda Neen, the Odai, Balmora, and along other parts of the Bitter Coast
• Crassius Curio is now a heat source
  Cooking
• Grills can now be used as cooking stations
• Starwind and Hunterwind ingredients added to cooking database

UI

• New bathing icons
• New staged Velothi icon skins, courtesy of Katya!
• New Starwind icons
• Added setting in the Environment settings to remove the degree icon for those with alternate fonts
  Compatibility
• Starwind integration - all ingredients and potions added to database for Food/Drink and cook stew with ingredients. Expect many more features in the future!!
• Hunterwind integration - cook your raw meat into stews or risk disease!
• More NoM food added to the food/drink tables
• Added new section for compatibility settings
• Timehud integration
  Other
• Added cell detection for Hlaalu, Redoran, Sewer, Temple, Bathhouses, and Inns
• Added temperatures and temp framework for quasi-interiors, including most planets in Starwind
• For modders: Interop/integration and API exposure for temperature (see the bottom of the sd_p.lua player script
  and/or check out TimeHUD for an example)

Fixes

• Companion buffs are now removed correctly
• Stairwells no longer refill water
• Improvements to well, heat source, and cooking station detection - grill

[polar fox]

Exciting stuff! Very much want to see those bathing features in my game. Not sure about consumable tents, but pretty much everything else sounds great.

Then again I just Mark and Recall back to my house all the time so it's not like I need to engage with the camping features much right now.

[warm saddle]

There'll be more to come soon since there's a mod for bathhouses in the works right now 👀 but yeah I'm hyped too, there hasn't been a proper bathing mod for openmw yet

[warm saddle]

Btw @rough salmon for more difficulty stuff, what’s the better direction to go in ? Straight up nerfing stats + better debuffs or changing around formulas and getting more creative ? Both is fine too, I typically don’t play with higher difficulties so I’m not sure what people like or expect

[rough salmon]

I feel like current formulas for needs are quite good. They're not getting in my way of playing

The buffs are slightly subtle and it's good too I think (stronger buffs should probably be provided by keeping your habits)

The debuffs are way too minor, IMO. Maybe it would be better to have 1 positive stage, 1 neutral and 3 negative? It would also motivate you to keep your needs as low as possible in order to get buffs and thus increasing the item consumption

That's how I see it in my head

Plus since there's no spoilage mechanic, it's really easy to stock up on food/water/etc and just forget about them altogether. Maybe that's already good, maybe it can be improved, but that's that. But as of right now it lacks.. idk... Thought from the player? You just stockpile on some random items and that's it

Compared to, for example, potion brewing, it's a bit lacking in subtle strategic element

...But maybe that's because I didn't get to doing it myself yet 🤷

[warm saddle]

Gotcha, yeah nah this is good advice. I can’t change there being 6 buffs/debuffs for UI reasons but I can change what those buffs and debuffs do, like there don’t need to be 3 buffs and 3 debuffs. Some of the other things you mention will come from food spoilage like you said, water quality, and dynamic needs, such as jumping, engaging in combat, and casting spells increasing your needs

Also now that I have a good handle on presets I can add more, I’ll probably go in the direction of casual, immersive, hard and then hardcore

But yeah overall good advice, ownlyme is the one who did the whole different cups / refilling / jumping and spilling thing which has had … mixed reception, but I can loosen his leash a bit
I take responsibility for the setting that only allows bathing when wearing clothes ||or naked||

[rough salmon]

just use Loadouts lol

[warm saddle]

Yeah haha I will be

[rough salmon]

I think I buped the needs preset to the harder than default and didn't feel much difference

[warm saddle]

Yeah you’d have to do hardcore to really feel it

[rough salmon]

Also spilling the water is fun for the first time, but in the long run it makes cups basically usable only for cooking at home

[warm saddle]

Hardcore has hidden modifiers like food and drinks restoring less hunger and a few other things, personally I do hard because those hidden modifiers are a bit brutal

Hard has them to a lesser extent but yeah I can think on that stuff more

[ripe anvil]

Dang just how ambitious of a mod is Sun Dusk

[warm saddle]

And it’s only been 6 weeks

[rough salmon]

6 really active weeks, I must say

[ripe anvil]

Note you aren't being paid for this lol. Love the dedication

[warm saddle]

I just want to play the game man haha

[ripe anvil]

But have youu👀👀

[warm saddle]

Yeah I’ve put like 700 hours in or so, not a lot compared to some but overall decent

[warm saddle]

The new color picker renderer holds up well in the UI menu 🙏 very blessed

[rough salmon]

neat

[rough salmon]

i wonder if it's possible to make a mod that drastically slows you down instead of stopping completely when you're overencumbured

[warm saddle]

I guess you'd be toying with the str->carry capacity GMST but honestly I'd love a mod that that tbh

[rough salmon]

the best option would probably been a mod which dynamically adjusts your max encumbrance to always be (total_weight + 1) and giving debuffs depending on how much you're overcarrying

though I doubt that it'll ever be possible this way
maybe with custom feather effects it would be easier

[warm saddle]

There's another gmst for like how fast you walk or something I think, like how fast your character moves per point of speed

[vernal marsh]

Could disable jumping if max encumbrance too

[half summit]

hmm i suppose burden would make it alot more dangerous to go swimming in your clothes, right?

[warm saddle]

Yeah, someone on the forums suggested burden which I don't know i f I agree with but sosnoviy mentioned the speed wetness debuff the other day so I figured I'd give it a little more weight than I do to most nexus comments

[rotund epoch]

What if I told you... that you cannot move at all?

Burden isn't bad but it will lead to more 1/0 results and more annoyance. Speed has a much more gradual effect.

[rough salmon]

Just make it adjustable. So people with carry rebalances would feel it too

Or get based on carry multipler gmst

[rotund epoch]

This would be extremely cheesy because you could carry crazy amount of stuff. Easy mode.

[rough salmon]

It would probably be the best option

[rough salmon]

Unless you debuff the speed to awful values

[warm saddle]

like this?

[rotund epoch]

As long as you can move, it will be easier than Vanilla. Why should I be able to move while carrying 50 stolen gold bars (each weights 20) in my inventory?

[rotund epoch]

https://tenor.com/view/eww-gif-8985768279355337139

[rough salmon]

So you could recall yourself home and carry everything to your stash in one go ofc

[warm saddle]

only 50???

[rotund epoch]

You can do that, anyway

Burden could be interesting if more complex drowning system was introduced

Based on armour, depth etc.

Argonians would have it easier

It would even funnier if you started sinking and had to throw stuff from the inventory

[warm saddle]

Isn't there someone who has a swimming skill module or something ? Although we do have water depth detection so we could do something like "water pressure"

[rotund epoch]

Maybe Swift Swim could counter some of the negative effects

And yeah, somebody implemented swimming skill

[warm saddle]

Things like that are more for a balance/difficulty mod and not survival although they're def not bad ideas 🧐 I'll try to think of a way to include them or just add them to my eventual "apocalypse" module which has all the cursed stuff ownlyme and I have thought of on the backburner

[rotund epoch]

Pin me when you implement the hardcore stuff . Sounds good

[warm saddle]

Or actually, someone could do a swimming simulator or whatnot with Sun's Dusk it would be an esp and less than 100 lines of code for what you're asking for haha

[rotund epoch]

Would be nice if Unarmored-focused characters had an advantage in water

[warm saddle]

Well

We have an equipment detection handler and a water depth detection handler if someone wants to get to work

[rotund epoch]

Not in a well. No swimming there!

No, don't jump, Argonian!

Dammit. Too late.

[untold lotus]

aregoneinawell

[vernal marsh]

Gotta make new recall spells that drop all your items on the ground when you teleport

Or you get to keep your Mysticism in weight of items

Oh wait I'm not in dumb ideas

[warm saddle]

Dumb ideas ? those are brilliant

Ownlyme has something in quickloot that allows you to deposit all books or ingredients when hovering over a container with a keybind

Quick deposit and whatnot

[vernal marsh]

Honestly if this was implemented it should just fail all teleport spells while you are encumbered

Don't surprise anyone with a terrible trek back into a sixth house base full of monsters while you're naked

[sour leaf]

I think this already exists?

[sour leaf]

Nvm it does exist but it’s MWSE Lua

[rotund epoch]

https://tenor.com/view/meu-gif-27420939

[rotund epoch]

This actually sounds like a simpler but less annoying idea.

What I like about it is that you can still increase your STR or use Feather to increase your real maximum carrying capacity for the purposes of teleportation.

so you have to think about it more in advance or be more selective when looting

[sour leaf]

Maybe it could be implemented where there’s a chance you drop everything when you teleport and it gets lower as your Mysticism goes up.

That still sounds annoying though lol

[rotund epoch]

yeah, but if teleport is blocked by overencumbrance, you pretty much achieve the desired outcome without having to implement sth annoying like this

[sour leaf]

I think the idea is to make that idle NPC line canon lol

[rotund epoch]

and keep in mind that enchanted items exist as well

[sour leaf]

“I don't recall using teleportation. Yet there I was, alone, naked.”

[rotund epoch]

no real reason they should be affected by Mysticism, for example

haha

well, it could be implemented as Critical Failure

if critical failures/successes are ever implemented

I suggested sth like this to mym

a while ago

😄

[sour leaf]

That’s not a bad idea

Or someone could make a joke mod that has a chance of de-equipping all of your armor and clothes when you teleport

But it stays in your inventory

[rotund epoch]

here is the mockup

[sour leaf]

I like that a lot

[rotund epoch]

I was thinking a random teleport for critical failure of Recall/Intervention spells but it could end up being very buggy with the player getting stuck or sth

[sour leaf]

True

I do like the random teleport idea though

[warm saddle]

A) is entirely doable and none of that is difficult to do, although idk if it's within the scope of NCGD maybe ? but idk it touches a lot
B) hard disagree, at least some intelligence should be required to use certain scrolls since you need to know how to read daedric
C) Also doable although it requires some workarounds

But yeah spellcasting backfiring and stuff is a fun idea, I've thought on it before and considered doing something like that with spelltomes haha

[rotund epoch]

I would also like to have limited Intervention

[warm saddle]

Hahaha actually yeah ownlyme could put a cooldown on his multimark mod

That's funny

He'd like that

[rotund epoch]

🧐

[warm saddle]

And nah straight up he probably wouldn't let you pay for it but maybe he'd like the faction things

[rotund epoch]

I use such features to introduce money sinks as well

and there would be caps

Intervention spells bring a lot of convenience essentially for free which sort of bothers me

ofc is someone is used to sth like Oblivion or Skyrim with easy and free fast travel everywhere then their will be scared by this. Morrowind used limited fast travel but it can still be made harder with some thematic restrictions IMO

[half summit]

it would be interesting to implement consumable spell materials like in dnd

[warm saddle]

Yeah I'd love the vancian magic perk like we talked about the other day

[half summit]

so many cool ideas all the time

[rough salmon]

magicka without the regeneration:

[rotund epoch]

BTW Expanded Vanilla is far too generous with magicka regen IMO. I recommend @vernal marsh 's mod instead of EV ones.

[charred tide]

if a Npc sneezes while you are near them, you'll catch diseases

[rotund epoch]

GOTY!

[warm saddle]

Oh yeah I think they can spread diseases now with the latest 0.51 build

Not sure if that's been done in lua already before or not

[sour leaf]

Wait what

[warm saddle]

Yeah NPCs can spread diseases, that's vanilla behaviour

At least I'm pretty sure it is

[rotund epoch]

yeah

it's just never important

[sour leaf]

How am I still finding out about Morrowind mechanics 20 years later

Like a week ago I found out that buyign stuff from a vendor and having it disappear from their shelves is a vanilla feature

[rotund epoch]

is a genius

[sour leaf]

It's really funny to see stuff like this implemented but then like, vendors immediately equip anything you sell them

[rotund epoch]

OMW fixed this but yeah

[sour leaf]

I remember being like 10 years old and trying to see if I could kill an NPC by making them equip Moon and Star or Sunder/Keening

[sour leaf]

I know lol

[rotund epoch]

You can become a god by drinking 10 sujammas in Vanilla

What is the game trying to tell us here?

Should I try that IRL?

Is this... is this how the Tribunal achieved godhood? 😮

[polar fox]

Really liking the bathing system overall, but I think I might go ahead and turn it off for the moment until Bathhouses comes out. I also hope there is or will eventually be a solution for slapping down a doorway to a custom bathhouse somewhere, if that's even feasible with scripting.

It sort of flies in the fantasy of the rest of it where I teleport home, drink some water, go to bed, wake up and make food, and then... teleport randomly to a silt strider I have Marked so that I can leap in the river to take a bath???

Even if I can't add one to my home, I'll probably still dedicate a mark to just having a bathhouse marked. Along those lines, another thing I'd love to see is: vendors who sell complete meals instead of just Bread and Crab Meat or whatever.

[rough salmon]

Try the https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/56699

[polar fox]

Oh neat, complete meals that aren't just stew.

I didn't even think of looking into complementary mods, but I should have. This is cool.

It even comes with Dark Brotherhood "We Know" meal

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure, totally understand. You can bathe in any body of water and there is a separate bathhouse mod in the works, should be released within the next week :) and yeah that's a good idea. There is a bucket for a model in vanilla, that could maybe be used as a wash basin

[warm saddle]

Yup and they're all supported so you'll restore hunger and thirst from everything in that mod

[sour leaf]

What's cool is they're regional too. So what's being sold in Balmora won't be the same as Gnisis or Vivec

[half summit]

oh man the thought of simply mining using SD zoning for distribution..

[half summit]

im not sure if the rat skin is intentional as food haha i dont mind experimental cooking but stewed pelt is pretty hardcore

[faint siren]

https://tenor.com/view/guess-ill-die-gif-9704573

[rotund epoch]

Seems like a very good cooking item while it shouldn't be like that. Feather and 2 Restore effects? Many food items are worse than this.

[half summit]

i didnt even see that. i was focused on the swallowing fur. yeah might be a bit much, rat is a common early game ingredient

[warm saddle]

I’m begging him man

[warm saddle]

Yup it’s intentional, it’s not that great of an item but you can eat cooked pork skin and whatnot so I figured I’d just add the skins but make them bad

You can cook pelts though haha

[rotund epoch]

It's better than many food items

[warm saddle]

Yeah because you’re using a mod

I don’t balance modded items in the same way that I balance vanilla items

[half summit]

haha cool, no worries I jusr look forward to being able to grill them

[rotund epoch]

Hm, how are the effects set? OG mod or SD? You can get those pelts with Hunterwind. I doubt that Wolfweim wants the rat pelts to be that good but he didn't really have SD to consider before.

[warm saddle]

I create them myself but if he wants to try it out and balance it how he wants then yeah I’d be fine using his TSV instead

Idk what dubious’s settings are but even if the multiplier setting is changed, the chance of getting the additional effects (such as the feather) still remains low

[rotund epoch]

Yeah but most food items don't even have Feather

Restore HP/FAT are more common but they are rather weak effects overall

Because it's just 5-10 points

So it's less of concern

Feather is for 90-120 seconds

I often try to get Feather. It's nice. Water Breathing is good as well. Again, high duration

[warm saddle]

I didn’t make up the spell effect, I got the ingredient spell effect from the item table in the esp haha

[rotund epoch]

Wait, you said that you made the effects

[rotund epoch]

.

[warm saddle]

Yes I add the effects manually and base them off of the existing spell effects on the ingredient

Pretty sure I have all that data parsed if you want to see them

[rotund epoch]

Hmmm

Is it a txt file?

Eating adamantium stuff was in txt, I remember that

[warm saddle]

All of the cooking stuff is in the .txt but I look at the ingredient spell effects before adding them to the cooking system, since I don’t want you to get negative spell effects from cooking (that’s kinda the point of cooking)

[rotund epoch]

Sometimes I feel bad after eating cooked stuff IRL A

Btw last time I checked (before 1.5) hackle-lo still had higher Wake value than Moon Sugar. IIRC it was 15 while MS had 10. Very weird IMO.

Obv an easy change but it's worth mentioning

[half summit]

yeah my settings are all over the place

[warm saddle]

Speaking of cooking and spell effects and whatnot though, I’m not supposed to say anything but ownlyme told me that he hopes @faint siren never looks at the cooking omwaddon and module haha

[rotund epoch]

I'm sure that he will never look at it

Never

Nobody told him about it

He doesn't know

It's secret

[warm saddle]

Idk maybe he could get use out of it somehow until magic is dehardcoded

[warm saddle]

But anyway yeah moon sugar itself doesn’t do much, it has to be refined to do anything properly, I think that was my logic behind that

[rotund epoch]

Hackle-lo is more like tobacco

Ms is a drug

[faint siren]

I would like to continue enjoying this mod so please do not remind me I am physically capable of opening these lua files

[rotund epoch]

https://tenor.com/view/thanos-impossible-marvel-shocked-gif-15104180

[warm saddle]

Sure haha, it’s not dirty code or anything just some creative workarounds

And yes please continue to enjoy it 🙏

[rotund epoch]

You cannot open the files. It's a law of nature. Nothing can be done

[warm saddle]

Someone on nexus said they were curious as to how I did the clothing combinations for temp and ended up looking through the whole temperature module for that stuff

I’m like

That module is 2x larger than SHOP

[rotund epoch]

Crazy

Don't worry, though. If Todd did it, the module would have been 10x bigger and wouldn't work half the time

[warm saddle]

Yeah that already exists in the Skyrim survival mode

[rotund epoch]

Iirc you said that performance impact was token

[warm saddle]

And you’re absolutely right

Yeah the worst perf with temperature was calculating your distance since apparently at first it was calculating your distance between all 164 heat spots but even then I didn’t notice any fps drop, that was fixed before I uploaded temperature
And even then you’d only notice it on a rig that struggles with 60 fps, although performance has been much improved and should be able to run on a Gameboy with no problems

[warm saddle]

Btw, I’m working on trying to figure out something for bathing in player’s homes or just a way to clean up on the run 🧐 anyone have any ideas ?

[half summit]

bucket and cloth, sort of thing?

[warm saddle]

There’s a bucket in vanilla, that’s kinda what I was thinking and the direction I was going in

[half summit]

yeah, there's a hand cloth in vanilla too isn't there ? or is that Tr 🤔

[warm saddle]

Yeah there are cloth pieces

Misc cloth item

[half summit]

yeah that would be good. if you wanted to get fancy you could physically put them all in the bucket could the bucket be filled with water?

[rotund epoch]

This fits the dumb idea thread but... Darkest Dungeon-like stress system would be funny in Morrowind

https://tenor.com/view/darkest-dungeon-affliction-irrational-gif-11838038135160624284

[half summit]

it would need to co-op with Smokable Hackle-lo pipe

[rotund epoch]

https://tenor.com/view/triggered-darkest-dungeon-plague-doctor-gif-18503135

[half summit]

keyed to specific voice lines

[rotund epoch]

Dagoth Ur would be the narrator

[rough salmon]

https://tenor.com/view/emotional-damage-emotional-damage-meme-funny-gif-24332819

[rotund epoch]

https://tenor.com/view/dd-gif-12248412757376299816

[ripe anvil]

Man I love Darkest dungeon

[rotund epoch]

Mental effects are so neglected in games. So much potential here.

[warm saddle]

Introverts gain stress when talking to people and extraverts gain stress by going an hour without talking to anyone

Would be fun tbh, wouldn't be difficult either

[half summit]

high stress levels you get interrupted sleep by nothing in particular

[rotund epoch]

Incel perk: -50 disposition with women, 1% chance of getting a heart attack when talking to female NPC with INT above 50, 10% critical hit chance against female NPC

[half summit]

iterop with defecation mod

and with SD. chance to vomit and gain full hunger

sweating makes you wet

[warm saddle]

interop with bardcraft: if you're a master bard, playing music while having a high stress level will calm you down, but if you're a noob bard playing music will make you more stressed

[rotund epoch]

Darkest Dungeon also has a light system. Would be cool if dark hostile areas caused stress. Khajiit could be immune. Night Eye and light sources would nullify the penalties.

[rotund epoch]

Vomiting and farting during hangover and overeating like in KCD

[half summit]

what a game

[warm saddle]

I got that game and thought it was an RPG, not a full on survival game just in a middle age setting hahaha I love it

[rotund epoch]

Just port every KCD feature

[warm saddle]

Sitting when

[rotund epoch]

Dice roll game

Animated

In FPP

[warm saddle]

There are already gambling games for morrowind haha

even full on backgammon

[rotund epoch]

I played nine holes. Lost money. Got mad

[warm saddle]

Skill issue

[rotund epoch]

There is a casino in Narsis

[ripe anvil]

Definitely a skill issue

[half summit]

needs dice physics

[rotund epoch]

We need animated drinking in FPP. Sth that KCD actually doesn't have. Potion drinking animation in FPP as well.

Guess that we may need to start porting RDR2 into Morrowind as well

[warm saddle]

ownlyme is gonna kill me for this but idc

I want to cut it

[rotund epoch]

https://tenor.com/view/benjammins-i-would-like-to-report-the-crime-i-would-like-to-report-a-crime-crime-this-is-a-crime-gif-13506776050157713757

[warm saddle]

Fun fact: the only reason you can't pick these up and use them for firewood is because ownlyme would consider it theft and would want to make it a crime

[rotund epoch]

Makes sense

[half summit]

I'd be OK with that

[warm saddle]

Sigh

I think we mentioned ownership before, I think using other people's soap is ok (people look down on you for being dirty, anyway) but I think people probably wouldn't want you using their towels, or you shouldn't want to use other people's towels

Also, I'll mod simply mining and fix it up

Unless someone else wants to ? i haven't looked at the simply mining ore spawning logic but Sun's Dusk cellInfo is exposed for the next update and shouldn't be too difficult

[half summit]

when hyacinth says not too difficult:

[warm saddle]

Shouldn't be too difficult, hopefully about as difficult as what I did for timehud (which wasn't difficult at all)

Also

New bathing video in #showcase 👀

[warm saddle]

Tbf the temperature stuff for timehud was very easy

I just haven't looked at simplymining's code so idk

[half summit]

yeah I'd love to dig into it, it would be awesome to understand how it works but idk if I have time right now besides its a bit above my pay grade 😅

but if you think it's relatively not insane then Its definitely something I'm interested in in general

idk why I always feel like time is an issue haha there's no deadline but I guess I just wouldn't want to keep people waiting if more talented coders could do it in a fraction of the time 🤷

[warm saddle]

Oh yeah for sure lmfao no worries about it my friend besides it's not even your problem lmfao it's ownlyme's

[half summit]

yeah nah I dig it is all

[rough salmon]

https://tenor.com/view/uni-cat-gif-16508948274886257497

[half summit]

its also objectively hilarious.

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure, I think if I didn't complain so much to him then he would've done it already

[rotund epoch]

I'm not disappointed by SD's community 👍🏻

[tepid sedge]

thought i fixed that it sticks to water, w/e its funny and quirky

[sour leaf]

Is this canon

[rotund epoch]

In-game info is vague. The leaves are described as edible, succulent and roborative.

Not a drug

[warm saddle]

There’s a hackle-lo pipe in TD, but the vanilla quest for Redoran says it gives you energy

[sour leaf]

I have the hackle lo pipe mod installed

[sour leaf]

Gotcha

[serene hound]

Planing to install this mod on my playthrough I want to do now (Still modding the game and "tuning" it to how i want it), so my question is, does the mod have any requirements, or is straight install, configure as you want and that's it.

[warm saddle]

No requirements at all, straight install :)

[serene hound]

got it, i was asking cuz i have encountered some mods that did not list requirements and discovered they need something else for it to work

[warm saddle]

Understandable yeah that’s annoying 😅

So glad I have these to settle me and ownlyme’s disagreements

[polar fox]

Fun fact: taking this boat voyage will just about instantly murder you if you have Sun's Dusk on lmao

I am definitely leaving a Mark here in case I ever need to make this trip again.

Skills have decayed, all my stats decayed, all my needs were maxed out, you need a bath, you are starving, you have not slept in weeks

Some vacation this has been!

Thinking about it, is there any way for travel by boat to replenish your sleep? Not many circumstances when you do 8 hours of fast travel and you're the one piloting the entire way. You could usually take a nap.

[warm saddle]

Yeah it used to 100% murder you but I reduced the needs accumulation while journeying, I’ll be negating that completely for SHOTN and PC
Maybe they have a wash basin on the ship or something that keeps you a little clean but they definitely keep you fed in the journey haha

[polar fox]

Yeah, I'm just imagining that they use ropes to tie you to the front of the ship or something, and you're not allowed to eat or sleep or blink for two weeks

That's the impression I got showing up with just THE EYE OF SLEEP

[warm saddle]

Yup! Traveling within Morrowind reduces your how much sleep you gain a bit when you travel (you take a light nap) but an extended journey like would definitely outweigh that effect 😅 but I’ll write something unique for it

[polar fox]

Not like it's something you encounter on the regular 😛

Even if I really wanted to spend a bunch of time in Anvil, there's no way I'd travel by boat more than once unless I absolutely had to. Probably the same for Skyrim.

Especially since Skill Evolution will have your skills start to decay when you spend ten days at sea

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure, although I can’t do anything about skill evolution haha. You’d want to take that up with mym

[polar fox]

Nah, I wouldn't anyway, since it's exactly how it should work. My character is literally on vacation, of course they're getting rusty.

[tepid sedge]

clarification: and any modded towel

[polar fox]

Speaking of that, I think I picked up some modded soap the other day and was surprised I couldn't clean my ass with it.

[warm saddle]

What mod was the soap from ?

[polar fox]

One second, it wound up in my storage so I need to teleport home and figure out what it was

[warm saddle]

I’d add some kind of interop or something for modded soap items but I only knew of like 2 mods that added soap haha

[polar fox]

Thing is, it's a miscellaneous item, rather than an alchemy ingredient.

[warm saddle]

Yup I have it covered in the next update, and yeah you can wash up with the misc soap items as well

[polar fox]

I don't even know if you can get more of it, I think it might just be the single decorative bar of soap lol

Cool!

Now I want to buy more soaps and stack them by my sink

[warm saddle]

The TD soaps work that way 😄

You can find soaps at general merchants and publicans

[polar fox]

My sink is very lovely, but I need to get a bath in here

Yeah, I just found some fire soap, bedrolls, and such at a... sword merchant I think?

[warm saddle]

Hmm shouldn’t be a sword merchant 0.o but hey maybe if it works xD

Btw, want to find the ID of that fountain thing ?

[polar fox]

Eh? Sure, but it already works for water.

For some reason this lady has miscellaneous adventuring supplies including soap.

But then the one ten feet away selling miscellaneous supplies doesn't?

No wait, I just missed them, disregard. It's because supplies sort after weapons but not after "random clutter"

[warm saddle]

Gotcha haha

Yup it looks like that person is selling the soap, is that blue dial right there

It comes from Uvirith’s Legacy I believe and gives you a small buff when you bathe with it :)

[polar fox]

I've got RGB soap

Now to arrange it to play Bad Apple

[warm saddle]

Speaking of which, you’re able to bathe in the tel uvirith bath house room

[polar fox]

I'm holding off on joining the Telvanni for now, but that sounds good.

[warm saddle]

All of the soap there works too ^^

[polar fox]

I was about ready to give in just to get the house, until I found the Ancestor's Refuge

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure, I love that mod a lot and Katya wants to add bathhouses to their mods

[polar fox]

That place is great, though even if everyone there likes me I do get the oddest feeling I don't quite fit in with the exclusively dunmer population.

Fortunately, I am Lord Indoril Nerevar, so it's probably fine even if nobody knows that yet.

This game's a riot lol. Gotta find an inn or something to cure myself of "never ever sleeps insomniac" status

[warm saddle]

You can also just throw down a bedroll haha, but yeah it’s cool

[polar fox]

I did just buy some of those, but I feel like the guards either would or at least should object to me camping on the steps of the Temple of Dibella

[warm saddle]

Yeah I’ve thought about putting restrictions on where you can sleep but ehh they can get messy

[polar fox]

Doesn't the base game already have that exact system implemented though?

[warm saddle]

I guess there’s a way to limit the hours you can sleep

[warm saddle]

Yeah there is but sometimes it applies in situations when it shouldn’t, like in tents or places added by mods that should definitely be considered sheltered or a resting place but the game doesn’t recognise it

[polar fox]

I always teleport home to sleep, so I haven't noticed it 🤷

Speaing of which, now that I have somewhere I want to leave a Mark (the Guild of Mages) maybe I should do just that

[warm saddle]

Not everyone has multimark installed though xD or uses player homes in that way, although I do the same as you haha

I could add a setting for that but yeah those are kinda my thoughts

[polar fox]

I'm gonna be frank, if Multimark mod was made illegal today I'd uninstall this game yesterday. I've been playing Morrowind for 20 years, and I'm dead convinced it's just impossible to have fun with without it, unless you're abusing the ever-loving piss out of Boots of Blinding Speed and six other speed/jump exploits

[warm saddle]

Same tbh

Even though I mostly just use it for player homes haha

I did the same in Skyrim, no fast travel just spells to teleport to homes

[polar fox]

I think I've settled on a pretty good set, but I'm always desperate to increase my skills to get more marks.

Gnisis is the least useful, but I otherwise just have nothing in that corner of the map, so it's useful to get up there I guess.

I think it'd be a lot less dire if I was capable of just focusing down one quest line at a time and then not needing to go to a place, but being sort of scatterbrained and all over the place, it sucks to jump around if you only have a couple marks. But anyway, I'm well off topic!

[warm saddle]

All good haha

[rotund epoch]

I set multimark count to minimal values. Most of my characters don't have high Mysticism and end up with just 1 so very Vanilla-like 🫡 . It's a matter of preference. I like fast travel restrictions. In fact, I would want more of them when it makes sense (costlier/harder/more limited).

[warm saddle]

I like the mod that puts restrictions on fast travel in night and bad weather, you can get them high disposition to get past this but I have the racism mod that makes everyone hate you

[rotund epoch]

Closed for the Night. Great immersion mod.

[half summit]

yeah sometimes i need to spend 3-400 gold to fast travel just because they hate me so much

[polar fox]

I could get behind that if I didn't have so many mods making it stupid hard to actually get cold hard cash.

Anyway, does uh... does cleaning yourself with sload soap still involve eating the bar of soap?

Because I noticed my hunger go down 👀

[half summit]

i have a mod to pay taxes..

[rough salmon]

btw, do certain activities like refilling water at wells and washing advance ingame time?

[rough salmon]

either I slowed time too much, or the mod is quite lenient on the deadlines
I feel like in first 10 days you can achieve a lot of things 🤔

[half summit]

its true, if your proactive. i took a month to walk to balmora so im a little bit behind..

[rough salmon]

don't underestimate all the experience I've gained restarting over and over when I was getting hang of the game

[half summit]

i also have a mod where you get ranomly shaken down by corrupt guards. he got me just as i was ready to leave balmora and cleaned me out 😭 i was eating a lot of rat for that journey

[rough salmon]

wha
link it! link it! link it!

[half summit]

https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/56549

[polar fox]

I know too much about combat to not find a way to murder that guard immediately even at level 1.

[half summit]

CHim2090

[polar fox]

Taxes do sound cool, but I feel like most adventuring proceeds shouldn't be taxable? Or at least, I'm not sure how the government would know about them.

[rough salmon]

basically pay X gold each 10 days
not per tax transaction (that's already done by mercantile's presence)

[polar fox]

Ah, fair enough.

[rough salmon]

outlander tax

[polar fox]

Then again, that seems like it could be really dire at low levels and really minor at high levels, unless it were tied to your reputation or something.

[half summit]

yeah it could do with deeper implementation, it does get pretty high at higher levels

[rough salmon]

i think it's always tied to your level

20 gold at level 1 and I think ~2k at level 40 or smth

[half summit]

btw i have a cleaned version on my patch page, i also made the dialogue to be more like oblivion

[polar fox]

This may need water added.

Also, if it's possible to allow bathing in the presence of this thing

[mild crystal]

Have you considered copying Valheim's Comfort mechanic?

[half summit]

https://www.nexusmods.com/morrowind/mods/57893
first iteration of baths mod is up. ill be working on updating more in the future, especially expand out onto the mainland so if anyone spies a neat location for a bathhouse let me know :D

and yeah my screenshots are currently kinda garbage too so if anyone gets some sneaky bathing pics slide em my way

[sour leaf]

What mod is this?

[sour leaf]

Does this work with BCOM 👉 👈

[half summit]

yipyip im going for max compatibility

[sour leaf]

Hells yeah

[sour leaf]

Do you have a list of all the locations it affects

[half summit]

good question, i can do

[sour leaf]

Id appreciate it! Just wanna check to see its compatible with the other mods Im using lmao

[half summit]

hm i dont know how to get a proper list right now im very tired haha. tbh the mod made a load of edits but 80% are just placing a chest so you can buy soap. these are the towns with a bathhouse

Seyda Neen
Balmora
Gnisis
Vivec
Hla Oad
Gnaar Mok
Khuul
Vos
Tel Mora
Tel Fyr
Tel Aruhn
Sadrith Mora
Dagon Fel
Mournhold
it looks bad but their pretty neatly tucked in and i did a lot of reorganizing to fit it with my absurd .cfg

[sour leaf]

Oh I didn't mean now haha. But thank you!

[half summit]

np im just a bit wired after getting that together, navigating the nexus is the most stressfull part of modmaking

[sour leaf]

Oh it's miserable haha

Trying to format the descriptions is a nightmare

[half summit]

ikr

[sour leaf]

I'll try to use ctrl+z and it makes things worse

[half summit]

some people make it look so nice. im actually quite passionate about graphic design but i just cant with it

[sour leaf]

Hyacinth's description for this mod is so nice lmao

It's very satisfying to read

MelchiorDahrk always has well done descriptions too

[half summit]

yeah damn he makes it look so easy

[sour leaf]

Not to be a pain in the ass but the position of the Gnisis bathhouse is kind of bizarre lol

[half summit]

oh i missed that haha what the hell

surely that never fit there

[warm saddle]

Hmm I might have to do something weird with the ginger module. I don’t have it in the database for food and drinks, but I also have some code somewhere that restores a little bit of ginger if eating something that’s not in it. I’ll investigate

[sour leaf]

I tried out the bathing in a bathhouse and got so clean that it made me translucent

[warm saddle]

No but I’d like to add this at some point, idk if time is exposed yet in the API though

[warm saddle]

Yup, I added that

[warm saddle]

And that !

[warm saddle]

What’s that ?

[warm saddle]

Ikr, I hate uploading shit <_>

[warm saddle]

The original had it worse but the BCOM version fixed it a little bit

[sour leaf]

How was it in the original

[half summit]

haha fair enough. i just tried to fix it but theres not a whole lot of room in gnisis. gonna need to build it into the cliff or stn

[warm saddle]

Like poking out of the ground

[warm saddle]

Yeah you could just flip it 180 and nestle it into the cliff or something, don’t even have to put it in town

[sour leaf]

Love that lol

[warm saddle]

I think it took me as long to write the description as it took ownlyme to create the cooking UI lmfao

Usually takes me an hour or so to do the changelog as well

[sour leaf]

Lmao really?

[warm saddle]

Yeah, it took me forever

I mean it’s worth it imo, although eventually I’d like to move it all to a wiki website or something

[half summit]

should be better now. and now i can pass out

[sour leaf]

You didn’t have to fix it right now 😅

[mild crystal]

It's a scaling mechanic that ties aesthetics and crafting otherwise unnecessary things into a buff

Comfort scales up from 1, stacking with each other item nearby

And the level of Comfort confers a buff called Rested, with higher levels of Comfort extending the length of the buff

At Comfort 1, it's 8 minutes long, and iirc it extends by 1 minute per

Rested being a buff that gives the player health regen, stamina regen, increased XP gain, and regeneration of another resource I forget what it's called

but you could attach it to whatever you want, theoretically

the point of the mechanic is to incentivize players to both dress up their base and spend time in it (at least long enough for the buff to take effect)

Mechanically reinforces the player stopping to enjoy an area that has been constructed to be pleasing in character

[rough salmon]

So I'm near the lava with enabled damage from it
Is hypothermia a typo or bug here?

It's an overhauled Punabi from Vennin's Dungeons

[warm saddle]

Hmm

Mind doing me a favor, turning the environmental setting debug to “trace” and enabling print, then re enter that cell and send me the log ?

There will be a … lot of spam haha, just send it all to me

But yeah def a bug, weird as fuck too

No idea why it would give you hypothermia instead of lava damage

[rough salmon]

Logs from entering the cell basically up to starting to recieving the damage

btw Hypothermia debuff doesn't apply to you if you have godmode enabled 🤔

[tepid sedge]

https://tenor.com/view/skinner-skinnerkids-kids-gif-23476710

[warm saddle]

Correct, that’s very much intentional haha

[warm saddle]

Is the vignette red or white ?

Think it’s just a typo but that’s still weird

[rough salmon]

This debuff (seemingly) prevents me from mining ore in that cell. I just hit the ore once and it disables the progress

With godmode on it works though

[rough salmon]

There is no vignette at all xd

[warm saddle]

0.o

Something is definitely borken then

[warm saddle]

Hypothermia

Will investigate, just be sure to turn off the prints haha

[rough salmon]

oh yeah

[warm saddle]

Also yeah you can’t mine while taking damage so you’d need to have a piece of fire immunity armor equipped xD the easiest to find around would be Bonemold

[rough salmon]

🤔

oh okay

[warm saddle]

That’s for the lava/freezing water damage, not the extreme temperature damage

With the lava/freezing water setting, you take damage regardless of how hot or cold you are, it’s completely independent from temperature

[rough salmon]

I've figured

[warm saddle]

But I made it dependent on that setting because if you’re taking damage from lava you should also be willing to play with extreme temperature damage xD

Eventually I’ll increase the fire immunity armor requirement but don’t want to do anything crazy while there are still kinks to iron out

But yeah the debuff is being applied correctly the debuff just has the wrong name

Maybe I’ll exclude caves or something since sometimes modded caves will have like one little spot of lava that’s hard to see and you shouldn’t take fatal damage for that … but idk

[warm saddle]

Oh, I think you can also wear bound armor for immunity

[rough salmon]

I didn't buy the spell for them

[warm saddle]

Maybe fire shield makes you immune 🧐 there are a lot of conditions in that if statement

Oh also, you can set a background for the bathing icon just like all the others, I moved it to the UI settings

[rough salmon]

yeah, I've just didn't get to it yet

[warm saddle]

All good haha

Next update I think timehud enjoyers will get the new colour picking renderer for the settings
👀 you can hide the text widget entirely I just haven’t felt like trying to find a place to register a new renderer in sun’s dusk

[rotund epoch]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Morrowind/s/uufxEWvLzz not a bathhouse I expected...

[warm saddle]

Nvm sun’s dusk enjoyers also get a cool ass colour renderer

[rough salmon]

:0

sexy

[ripe anvil]

https://tenor.com/view/this-is-my-kingdom-cum-cum-fridge-gif-22354569

[rough salmon]

Also this is not mentioned in the option's description 🧐

[warm saddle]

Yeah let me check

[rough salmon]

I think I'm missing a locale string here

[warm saddle]

Yeah I'm about to fix that up right now haha

Working on full compatibility with dubious' new bath mod, mostly making sure my cell detection works perfectly

[rough salmon]

Liking the bathing so far. But maybe soap's durability could be shown on the UI tooltip?

At the end of it or smth
like Clean [3/3]

[warm saddle]

This is what you had in mind yeah ?

[rough salmon]

exactly, yes

Though I've just took a boat from Seyda Neen to Vivec during ashstorm and by arrival immediately got 34% dirtiness :<

[sour leaf]

Hey some people would pay good money for a filthy boat ride in a video game

[rough salmon]

Some people would pay for a fraction of what SD does in their game

[sour leaf]

It’s kinda crazy how this mod has basically all of the survival mechanics that are in Sons of the Forest

[warm saddle]

?

I haven't played that game haha

[sour leaf]

I know I didn’t mean that you were inspired by that

[sour leaf]

I mean that Sons of the Forest is sold as a survival game and it’s impressive that you two have been able to replicate most of them in a mod for a 20 year old game that had none of those features originally

Stuff like this, Ashfall, Bardcraft, Joy of Painting, PT/TR, and the extensive quest mods is why I think this game has a better modding scene than Skyrim

I think part of it is that Morrowind’s simplicity makes a lot of mods fit into vanilla content seamlessly

[rotund epoch]

No voice acting is a big one

[sour leaf]

Definitely

[rotund epoch]

It's a trap for modders.

[sour leaf]

Even good voice acting sounds off in Skyrim and Nv mods

[rotund epoch]

Yeah. That's because it's very hard to do seamless VA for amateurs.

[little haven]

the dubious bath house mod is great

[rotund epoch]

I find it dubious

[warm saddle]

It’s so good

I made the bathing module entirely centered around it

Just a head’s up that the current Sun’s Dusk doesn’t detect the bath houses correctly <_> but I’m uploading a version here soon that’s perfect

You get buffs when bathing in Great House bathhouses and in temple bathhouses and buffs when bathing with dubious’ special soap

[little haven]

i can barely keep up with all these updates

i haven't played all week and i have a hundred updates from nexus

[rough salmon]

it's hard being mw fan in 2025
i feel you

[little haven]

we're in a golden age of modding

it was never this active before

[warm saddle]

It’s mostly bathing bug fixes and polishing up haha, nothing critical but if you notice something a little sus it’s probably fixed in the update xD

[rough salmon]

Suggestion: make training contribute to your dirtiness, but up to a certain threshold (so you won't get diseased by training lol)

[warm saddle]

That kinda already exists ? Your dirtiness increases per hour or so but yeah that would be cool
Also the disease thing is tracked separately, it’s just how many days without bathing and doesn’t have anything to do with dirtiness, this will be especially useful/important when I do things like “swimming cleans you a little” and things like that

Next week’s update will decrease armour/weapon durability when you’re dirty and in dungeons/sewers/bad weather

Wetness will also reduce armour/weapon durability

[warm saddle]

[sour leaf]

I love this lmao

[ripe anvil]

https://tenor.com/view/martin-scorsese-absolute-cinema-absolute-cinema-meme-martin-scorsese-meme-martin-scorsese-absolute-cinema-gif-7188464701423971028

[warm saddle]

NCG update no longer causes an interaction with Sun’s Dusk

[rotund epoch]

Mym has been hard at work fixing various bugs and mod interactions

[warm saddle]

Yeah unfortunately he was up against todd.exe but seems he found a good fix although idk what he ended up going with

[rotund epoch]

At least Bethesda is no longer updating MW. Now they only break mods with F4 updates

[warm saddle]

Man I feel for the Skyrim modding community, having to port their mods every few years or some shit

At least that’s one thing that’s good about console, yeah there are way less mods but the ones that make it over are classics that haven’t changed

[rotund epoch]

Wait a bit. Who the fuck knows, maybe Todd will rerelease Skyrim again

[rotund epoch]

Imagine if Todd announced Skyrim Remaster at TGA

Lmfao

[sick cedar]

I think you made these buildings a well because their ID has the word well in it

[warm saddle]

And just when I got stairwell too smh

But yeah thanks for catching that haha

What mod is it from ? Or is it just vanilla

[sick cedar]

vanilla stronghold meshes

[warm saddle]

Word thank you

[vernal marsh]

\bwell\b
Too bad lua doesn't do regex

[warm saddle]

Yeah I’m just gonna have to get all the times well shows up in statics in vanilla xD

[sour leaf]

Does it not? That kinda sucks

[indigo anchor]

hey, I'm glad to read this. What was the interaction?

[warm saddle]

95% of the sun's dusk esp are abilities, we removed the abilities from effecting leveling up in vanilla but NCGD doesn't have vanilla leveling so the abilities were still messing with however you do leveling in NCGD

The abilities not being modifiers and all

[indigo anchor]

ah, I see

I think there are more and more playing with stats, that's why I now only rely on the base values, cleared of abilities

[warm saddle]

Yeah for sure, the next mod I'll be making will also be mostly abilities and whatnot as well, they're just much nicer to work with than spells

[indigo anchor]

abilities also interact with the vanilla cappers, and with my previous cappers, which aligned on the vanilla behavior

now my cappers only consider the base values minus any ability modification

we should be safe, I hope

and if anything new bad interaction happens between your mods and mine, please post something in the dedicated threads

I was not aware of the previous conflict

[warm saddle]

Yeah sure, although that's not much of a mod problem as much as a problem since yeah it is just vanilla behaviour

[indigo anchor]

agreed. But incompatibilities have to be dealt with anyway

[stark ice]

does "hours per cleanliness stage" depend on timescale? should i change it from default 12 to 6 for timescale of 15?

[sour leaf]

Ooh what’s the mod? 👀

[rough salmon]

Habits, but for religion
Iirc

[warm saddle]

The setting doesn’t scale with timescale automatically so if you have anything other than the default (30) timescale, I’d recommend lowering it yeah
Personally I play with a timescale of 10 or 15, to need to eat/sleep/drink at least once a day, you’d lower it to 6 or so

[rough salmon]

Damn, I've completely forgor about it

[warm saddle]

Changing the top preset to hard or hardcore automatically changes those haha

[rough salmon]

Uhhhh, I use dynamic timescale though... 🤔

[warm saddle]

The needs will scale dynamically then

It’s all per minute and whatnot, that “hour” setting is just a multiplier

[rough salmon]

Damn 🧐

[warm saddle]

But yeah if you want to get hungrier/thirstier faster just lower that setting

[sour leaf]

@half summit

Some conflicts I noticed with BoV:

• Tel Mora: Spawns you on the roof when you exit.
• Tel Aruhn: Not sure which mod it is but one of the mods in the EV modlist puts the Tel Aruhn one underground
• Vos: minor clipping with OAAB Grazelands
• Sadrith Mora: Minor clipping with BCOM
• Balmora: Has a tree growing through it with Balmora Arches and a Waterfall
• Gnisis: the door is half buried by BCOM
• Dagon Fel: some clipping with Nordic Dagon Fel

[half summit]

thank you! 🙏 that's a good list, I'll sort it out when I can 🫡

[sour leaf]

No rush! Just figured I’d let ya know

The clipping isn’t too bad on most of them except Gnisis where it’s very noticeable. So those can probably be ignored. It just looks like stuff has collapsed into the back of the building sometimes haha

[half summit]

yeah very useful. I've got some ideas to do a big compatability sweep. do away with most of the houses, it's a nightmare trying to fit anything in balmora especially

[sour leaf]

Yeah some of the placements are weird tbh. But that doesn’t bother me that much since most of the cities are pretty packed

But some of them are like, outside of cities

[sour leaf]

How would you do away with the houses? Put them inside like the Vivec ones?

[half summit]

btw I've got a thread for any BoV bugs #1447374211596157010 just because there will probably be more 😅

[sour leaf]

Didn’t know that existed! Thanks!

[half summit]

more like making interesting entrances. kind of like mine doorways

[rotund epoch]

It would be the easiest to place bath-houses in new underground levels of the city Temples

[sour leaf]

The mud bath one was super cool

[rotund epoch]

Almost no compatibility problems that way

No exterior changes

Peace and stability

New bath-house empire

[half summit]

Nice one! that's the one I spent the most time on. the plan is to give more of them that treatment

[sour leaf]

This might be controversial but you could probably also do away with the smaller ones in like, Seyda Neen and whatnot. I feel like the concept of a bathhouse is something you’d find in bigger cities as opposed to smaller settlements.

It doesn’t bother me but I feel like it’s kinda weird for these towns made up of mostly wood shacks to have a dedicated bathhouse.

Idk though maybe I’m off on the history there

[sour leaf]

I’d love that personally. The mudbath was by far my favorite

[half summit]

nah I kind of agree, I might end up doing some separate versions. and have "purist" onr for the Stinkers nostalgia

[sour leaf]

Id be down for that

[half summit]

and yeah temples are definitely a good idea. I'd want to do a bit of a redesign then too though

[sour leaf]

I do kind of like the humor of the small bath houses just being like, a dude and his bath

You just bathe in front of him in this tiny shack

[half summit]

yeah haha

luxurious

[sour leaf]

Maybe leave one of those in the purist version and the dude is just some weird pervert

[half summit]

make it selville

[sour leaf]

or Crassius

[half summit]

have it be a small random chance that it could be crassius in any bath you visit

[rotund epoch]

I agree. Such a small town with a bath-house seems weird. There is nothing in Seyda Neen except the Census office. Even Pelagiad is bigger.

[sour leaf]

Yeah exactly

[sour leaf]

There's also bath houses in Khuul and Hla Oad