#NCGDMW Lua Edition

1 messages · Page 7 of 1

fiery oak
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You know what the best part about using \\ in momw-customizations.toml is?

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openmw.cfg accepts forward slashes on all platforms todd

dawn spindle
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You are lucky you aren't banned yet, Punda! 8^P

past pendant
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No problem, you have been very respectful

hoary trellis
fiery oak
empty topaz
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Question for the alchemy skill gain reduction: Do potions with 3 or 4 effects also scale lim-> min% skill gain, or do they stop at a certain point? And do potions with other effects reset the reduction? E.g: making 100 restore fatigue potions and then making restore health potions, would the health potions start at the reduced skill gain or at the Standard one?

past pendant
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Potions with multiple positive effects give more XP, but the gains also reduce the more you create potions with these exact same ingredients

empty topaz
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Uh thats so cool! So i can basically rp as an Alchemist trying out a bunch of different recipes

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It also makes alchemy a LOT more interesting than to just buy the same restocking ingredients all the time

past pendant
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Thx, that was the intent

hoary trellis
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That was the idea

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Ha ha

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Almost all skills have scaling now

past pendant
empty topaz
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Hey, im not slow, im just not usually playing with alchemy, so im just now noticing, ok?^^ but this change will probably make me pick alchemy a lot more. (Vanilla alchemy was so busted and boring thats why i usually never picked it)

hoary trellis
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Mym was quicker

empty topaz
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Ah ok.

hoary trellis
# past pendant Maybe all skills where it's relevant?

Mercantile has inherent scaling in Vanilla, but Speechcraft doesn't. I think that it can be done. It makes sense that successful persuasion attempts vs Orvas Dren, Gothren or a wealthy merchant would give more skill gain than some random slave. However, it also makes sense that at low skill convincing anyone, even a commoner or an unimportant grunt, would give you more progress. I will also note that Speechcraft is very hard to lvl up naturally without excess spamming and even then it can be annoying and super long. Anyway, by combination of various factors like skill difference between player and NPC, NPC's faction rank, NPC's level, player reputation, a proppa scaled Speechcraft skill gain can be done.

empty topaz
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Btw I felt like acrobatics is a bit annoying to level with a 0% skill floor, so i set it to 40% to just get a bit of acrobatics XP during normal gameplay, otherwise id never gain any acrobatics XP at all. The reduction from quickly, repeatedly jumping is also a good idea tho, so you cant forcefully grind the skill.

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Especially with the quickly jump up slopes method

hoary trellis
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0% is theoretical

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You will only gain it with no real jump

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If you get stuck and "jump" without movement, sth like that

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40% min actually gives you XP for such jumps as it's the minimum

empty topaz
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I made a character with acrobatics to dodge out of melee ranges and it never gave me XP for those jumps or maybe 1 point every 20 jumps.

hoary trellis
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The higher the skill, the less impactful standard hops will be.

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I'm sure it wasn't 0%

past pendant
past pendant
hoary trellis
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Keep in mind that it's % of skill gain. 20% of vanilla skill gain for a quick, unimpressive, easy to spam hop, for example. Unless it's 0%, you always gain some progress. Normal gameplay never really gives 0%

hoary trellis
empty topaz
empty topaz
hoary trellis
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But only if you don't get hit

empty topaz
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Im not familiar with morrowind modding but wouldnt you have to constantly check for enemies around you? That Sounds like it could be quite demanding.

hoary trellis
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If it's too demanding it may not be worth it as it's not a very important feature. That remains to be seen

dawn spindle
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I have noticed since updating recently that mercantile was severely swerved to the nerfward side, but I will have to update again before I finalize my modlist, since I think I saw that this was adjusted

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So please accept my apologies if I am speaking in yestertech

hoary trellis
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Why would that be the case, I wonder? NCGD doesn't really change Merc

dawn spindle
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Could be a different unexpected mod interaction with updated EV, or maybe I need to take a close look at how personality affects haggling vs. mercantile. Your point troubles me, so I will investigate. Thanks Cybvep

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My modlist is not in good repair right now, so I should probably refrain from such broad observations. Please forgive

past pendant
past pendant
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Check the changelog. What is your current version?

deep hatch
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I'd like to see an option that scales how many skill levels it takes to add one character level. TR and PT have some nasty advanced undead on their leveled list and I find characters trying to advance all major and minor skills ram into the 20+ levels too quickly.

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Also, could the option to increase training time at higher skill levels make it so that lower skill levels take less than two hours (e.g., going from 5 to 6 might only take an hour or less)?

past pendant
past pendant
hoary trellis
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There isn't much room to go lower than 2 hours, anyway, and it's really a short amount of time in-game. It's not long for a training session.

empty topaz
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How well do hybrid classes like battlemages work btw? Youre already spread quite thin in vanilla and i feel like that would make it even harder.

hoary trellis
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Well, I have a lot of experience with a hybrid class in NCGD as I've played a Breton Conjurer a lot, using both melee and magic skills. It worked well. I think that hybrid classes are one of the most common playstyles in TES in general.

dawn spindle
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I perceive that hybrids are appropriately slower to attain godhood with both Vanilla and NCGD levelling, seems fine in that respect

pale sinew
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me omw to grind alchemy to level 1,000

past pendant
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NCGDMW 4.6.1 released!

  • Acrobatics scaling now rewards melee hit dodges (jumping out of weapon reach, OpenMW 0.50 only)
  • New setting to set how many class skill increases are required for a level up (10 by default)
  • Restored the old MBSP feature (off by default)
  • Improved the main and setting docs
past pendant
past pendant
deep hatch
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Maybe some kind of modifier to training costs (and time?) for major/minor skills? Always thought it was pretty strange how training in MW didn't care about major or minor skills.

past pendant
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How training time increases based on skill level

share_8954540079579763671.png
past pendant
deep hatch
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Shouldn't simply applying a flat modifier at the end of the order of opperations (e.g., 90% cost and time if major skill) work regardless of how the initial time/cost is determined?

past pendant
past pendant
pale sinew
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.50 seems to be getting tons of really cool unique mechanics, I love it!

past pendant
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Not that many, but they allow many improvements

hoary trellis
empty topaz
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Wasnt there an option to disable skill gains from skill books? After updating my modlist i gained a skill level from a book, so i wanted to check, but i didnt find the setting.

eternal jetty
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I know there was, and it was set to off be default that I recall

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let me check here myself

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I can still see it

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I did notice I didn't get a version update message on loading in, but the version file does say it's 4.6.1

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The skill book increase option is below the Skill upcapper section, a bit before the halfway point on the slider

empty topaz
eternal jetty
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scroll down farther, it's under skill uncapper, not Attribute uncapper

empty topaz
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Ah got it. Ty.

eternal jetty
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Hmm I noticed that if you have a consant effect slowfall enchant item, I'm not getting any Acrobatics exp, though it does say as much in the description

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though that does mean I can't ever gain acrobatics exp if I'm wearing a 1 point of slowfall item

hoary trellis
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The gain won't be 0 but it will be much lower than usual

eternal jetty
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minimum is set to 0% by default

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I did get 0% when enabling debug mode

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maybe I'll set it to 10% or not wear a slowfall item, not sure which to chose

hoary trellis
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With every jump?

eternal jetty
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that I could see, yeah

hoary trellis
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I mean, did you get 0% all the time?

eternal jetty
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I'll try a few more different types of jumps here

hoary trellis
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Ok. That might need to be checked if true. 0% for every jump would be overkill.

eternal jetty
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yeah, been jumping around here, it's 0.0% for them all

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using levitation or slow fall during a jump -> Minimum gain

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which is 0% by default

hoary trellis
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Levitation is ok

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It's not jumping

eternal jetty
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yeah

hoary trellis
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Slowfall - looks like sth slipped past the radar. It should give greatly reduced gains but not 0.

eternal jetty
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hmm I am checking now, and it's is going up in progress a tiny bit

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but showing 0.0 in debug

hoary trellis
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I expect that mym will want screenshots

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When he wakes up

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So if you can, maybe make some 😅

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Of that debug log

eternal jetty
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Sure

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is there a long term debug log? I see floating messages, but not a full log

hoary trellis
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Try F10

eternal jetty
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first is with slowfall, second is without slowfall

hoary trellis
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Looks like you are getting some gain with Slowfall

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With some jumps

eternal jetty
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yeah, it's really really small, and not every jump, and not totally sure why

hoary trellis
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Because jumps are not made equal

eternal jetty
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so there's some randomness in it? I mean I'm jumping on one pace for the most part

hoary trellis
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No randomness. Just data collection

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Gain depends on many things

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For example, roof jumping in Balmora will usually give you more skill gain than hopping on the streets

eternal jetty
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ah, I can't tell what the factors are even if it's always jumping straight up, without moving from a single spot, the results are vaired

hoary trellis
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Jumping over lava will give you more than jumping over water

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Etc

dusk robin
eternal jetty
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hmm would it make more sense to just have gains from fall set to zero with slowfall, rather than the whole of jumping?

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though you can't really take falldamage to start with with slowfall

hoary trellis
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both height and depth matter with jumping calculations for scaled Acrobatics

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dangerous jumps give more gain

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the intention is for Slowfall to give minimal gain for the danger calculation

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but that's just part of the formula

eternal jetty
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I do wonder why It's showing 0.0% in the floating debug menu all the time?

hoary trellis
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the rest should still function normally

hoary trellis
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thx for checking that btw

eternal jetty
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even though it is gaining a tiny amount every 5 or 6 jumps

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but zero the other times

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hm the floating log isn't appearing any time I get a gain, only the 0.0 multipliers are showing up

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here's one with a gain

11404BB9-38E4-46D6-B5A5-1C66504D194A.png
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note on the second line: Acrobatics jump scaling: Not jumping, no scaling

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with a zero progress one, the line says "levitate or slowfall during a jump, scaling 0.000

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So I'm only gaining skill progress, when it thinks for some reason, I'm not really jumping, and so there's no scaling applied

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that's why the debug message doesn't show up, because it's not applying any scaling

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I don't know why it's still checking for a jump or whatever

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so I guess the gain is zero, unless it bugs out?

hoary trellis
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Interesting. Well, I'm sure that mym will have some answers. One thing that may be working incorrectly on the conceptual lvl is assuming that Levitation is same as Slowfall (if that's how it's handled technically). It makes sense for no gain when levitating as it's not even jumping. Slowfall just removes fall dmg so the danger part is gone but the actual jumps are unaffected. It deserves gain reduction, not nullification.

eternal jetty
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yeah

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that would be my thinking, as it would still, in real terms build up leg muscles and take some energy to do

hoary trellis
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Yep

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I think that it can be tweaked. It just never came up in testing.

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But mym does the real work here so he will know 😄

eternal jetty
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ok, cool

past pendant
# eternal jetty using levitation or slow fall during a jump -> Minimum gain

Yeah it does what it says: you get the minimum value which is 0.
For other skills the minimum is usually 10%, but for acrobatics it has to be 0% to prevent high gains with spam clicks on ascending slopes. I think we first set the min to 10, then reduced it to 0, and forgot about the impact on slow fall.

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I can set a min 10% for the slow fall effect, that makes sense, but won't be enough to level up your skill if you keep your constant effect.

hoary trellis
hoary trellis
past pendant
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I'll check that

hoary trellis
hoary trellis
past pendant
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Jump height is reduced with slow fall: you won't get much from this factor.
Jump length is special, you can do longer jumps than normal. I need to correctly evaluate the max jump length with slow fall.

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Lava gives a multiplicative bonus on depth, which will be cancelled when using slow fall. If we want lava to have an impact with slow fall, I need another approach

past pendant
hoary trellis
hoary trellis
deep hatch
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In theory lava a decent distance below the player also has the risk of falling into a pit your need levitation to escape (a classic of that square room in Dwemer locations where you can, but really shouldn't jump across the center gap instead of walking around it). Of course past a certain distance a player is more likely to be using Jump spells to go cross country. It would be a bounds (above a certain height, but below a different height) which is complicated for the relative obscurity/rarirty of jumping over lava.

hoary trellis
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Length and depth are already factors in jump scaling

deep hatch
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The dwemer pits don't have a way out without levitation/jump, which is more dangerous than just the stuff you find outdoors and "only" take some damage if you fall into. A fairly obscure situation though.

dawn spindle
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An infant can drown in even 1 inch of lava

hoary trellis
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Sorry, sir. There are no infants in Morrowind and no lava drowning 36vehks

dawn spindle
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Oops, wrong server 😉

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But the lava is sounding pretty safe to me

past pendant
hoary trellis
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Water could stay the same. Doesn't affect Slowfall but it nullifies fall dmg on its own. Sometimes it becomes inconvenient to get out

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Definitely a different situation than lava

past pendant
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BTW, shallow waters should not reduce the gain as they don't cancel the damage. But I need to know the water depth threshold

hoary trellis
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Yeah if it's knee-deep water then it doesn't change anything

past pendant
hoary trellis
past pendant
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I could check whether there is a navigation path from the lava below to the player's jump start position, but it would not cover every situation.

hoary trellis
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with water I don't think it's even possible to detect things which really affect potential hindrances to player's progress. It heavily depends on slopes and available ways out of water and back to the player's starting position or close to it. A simple modifier is probably good enough.

pale sinew
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For Magicka Refund, is there a cap to the refunded amount? As in if my destruction is boosted to high levels such as 400 will the refund return more than the spell cost

past pendant
pale sinew
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Cool just wanted to make sure

past pendant
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The average depth is computed by tracking every depth along the jump, and currently I increase the considered depth when over lava, which doesn't work with slow fall depth cancellation.
Instead, I could simply compute the percent of lava surface below the jump and add a gain boost based on that percent and a max boost.
Example with max lava boost 50%:

  • 100% lava: gain +50%
  • 50% lava, 50% rocks: gain +25%
hoary trellis
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That would be an improvement

hoary trellis
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Random idea. Optional Luck penalty for each death, e.g. 1 for each death (stacks). Off by default so folks won't be surprised by this and @past pendant won't be flooded by "my Luck is down for no reason" bug reports 😅 . Anyway, I think it's cool and not hardcore so potentially well-suited for normal gameplay. Death counter is visible in NCGD menu. Currently I'm playing with 0 Luck growth as I find "so Luck just goes higher and that's it" system meh but with death counter-based penalties I would probably turn it on as then there would be ebb and flow of player's Luck. I also think that it should be rather easy to implement. I'm purposely not proposing something extremely complex and game-shattering or sth that nobody would end up using.

past pendant
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A new setting, only enabled if the death counter is, with a decimal input, range 0-10

hoary trellis
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Sounds good.

past pendant
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Or range -10 to 10, because luck could be increased to compensate for your loose 😁

hoary trellis
past pendant
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Maybe -5 to 5 would be enough

hoary trellis
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It's just a range so no harm in 10-10

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btw is Luck growth feature dynamic/retroactive? If I change it midgame, will NCGD recalculate Luck?

past pendant
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Yes, retroactive

past pendant
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NCGDMW 4.6.2 released!

  • Improved the scaled training duration feature by adding a customizable duration range setting
  • New setting to alter your luck based on your death count (luck bonus or malus, on if the death counter is on)
  • Increased default acrobatics gains from 0.15 to 0.3 as the scaling feature now prevents abuses (requires manual settings reset or update, or a new game)
  • Acrobatics scaling: Improved the jump-over-lava bonus approach
  • Acrobatics scaling: Don't reduce risks above shallow waters
  • Acrobatics scaling: Increased jump gains when using Slowfall, and preserve the lava bonus with such jumps
  • Acrobatics scaling: Fixed errors when dodging hand-to-hand hits
  • Fixed potential initial player level miscalculation caused by unhandled gender skill bonuses provided by MOMW's Races Respected Lua Patch
  • Fixed doubled training duration
  • Fixed upgrades to v4.5.5 or above not fixing the broken mercantile progress
hoary trellis
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@eternal jetty with this update Slowfall should be handled much better, i.e. no 0 gain or almost 0 every time. You might want to manually increase base jump skill gain in NCGD settings from 0.15 to 0.3 and and switch back from minimum gain 40% to 0% (or reset settings to default after update but it will affect every setting, not just those 2). With successful manual dodging giving bonus gain, Slowfall not giving 0% (make no mistake - it will still give lower gains overall, but not 0%) and higher base jump skill gain, gameplay flow should be better. Vanilla operated under the assumption that jumping is easy and you can spam jump all the time to gain the same (base) gain. NCGD scaled skills system is much more complex and gives much lower gain for casual easy spamy jump hopping but much higher for "real" jumps so base jump skill gain doesn't need to be so low anymore.

eternal jetty
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Ok, cool, I'll give it a try here

empty topaz
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Would it be possible to add a risk scaling to enchanting? That way you wouldnt be incentivised to spam create really easy enchantments/ recharge stuff (though the recharge is already taken care of by the change in XP gain) and/or maybe a scaling based on the size of the soul used? I dont even Think it would be broken, as if you want to trap your own summons you can gain infinite levels anyways. But this would make legitimate use of the skill way more engaging than going around and trapping rats and kwamas, and reward going for tougher foes for stronger souls.

past pendant
empty topaz
# past pendant Soul trapping feels already a challenge to me: You have to find empty soul gems,...

What im saying is, its way harder to find a grand soul gem and find and capture a winged twilight than it is to find a rat and a petty soul gem (which you can loot from random bonewalkers), so higher soul values should give more XP compared to smaller ones. Of course there is the benefit of stronger enchantments being possible with higher value souls, but leveling up your enchanting skill, it makes little sense to use anything other than the most worthless souls, especially since better enchantments are riskier to pull of at low enchantment level, potentially losing you a valuable soul. I can understand if you disagree tho, enchanting is really strong.

hoary trellis
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Soul trapping summons is def highly exploitable for many reasons. However, 0 souls summons mods are commonly used. One such mod is also part of the Extended Vanilla modlist. This issue is covered. Besides that, well, it makes sense conceptually to give more skill gain for using bigger souls. However, it would have to be some souls vs skill level formula and not just purely based on souls value. Otherwise, increasing Enchanting before the player reaches high level would be terrible. It's rare to encounter grand souls at lower levels and even rarer both to have the proper soulgem and to be able to kill such a creature. Also, it's ok for mid enchanters to rely on smaller souls as you don't expect someone with 50 skill to use Golden Saints and Ascended Sleepers for enchanting. It's probably feasible to come up with a decent formula. It just can't be souls alone.

empty topaz
# hoary trellis Soul trapping summons is def highly exploitable for many reasons. However, 0 sou...

I thought the enchant chance could do that. Weak soul + high chance = minimal gain, while strong soul + low chance = maximum gain. But you're right. As you level strong souls become much more abundant, so that probably doesnt cut it. But maybe if you factor in the player level into the soul value? Like: craft chance, inversely * (soul value - player level, maybe capped for stopped scaling at a certain point ?) ? So soul value gets nerfed the higher your level is?

hoary trellis
dawn spindle
empty topaz
# hoary trellis Definitely not a fan of using player level as it's not used for any other skill....

Thats fair. Thinking about it, the soul value - skill chance part would also have to guarantee that lower value souls reduce faster in XP value compared to high value ones, or else it would just be a negative multiplier, and cant go negative, so subtraction wouldnt cut it... maths is hard... maybe some sort of exponentiality? Maybe z=(x^2)/y where z is the soulvalue skill multiplier, x is the soul value and y is the skill level. The better the soul, the less its affected by skill level? And let the rest be handled by the global skill gain, exponentially reducing EVERY souls skill gain at higher levels.

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Also, yeah i dont know if it works in lua either.

past pendant
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Except if the item and the soul gem are removed from the player inventory as soon as you select them in the interface 🧐

deep hatch
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Could also use value of item as part of equation. The obvious grinding is otherwise working with the cheapest enchantable item you can get in bulk. Sticking something on an Ebony weapon should be worth more XP than an iron one.

hoary trellis
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The problem seems to be limited LUA capabilities ATM

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So unless mym missed sth, might be hard to implement a proper scaled enchanting ATM

past pendant
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Actually I could detect what item and soul gem are missing after the enchanting

acoustic saddle
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Hello, all! New to the server, but having an issue with NCGDMW. I tried asking Reddit for help, but most everyone was stumped and a few people suggested I reach out here.

I’m having an issue with character level/progress is not reflecting accurately. My game is still showing me at level one, with only 70% progress to level up. That is with the default setting of 10 major/minor skill-ups per level up. When I switched from 10 per level up to 5 per level up, I was then level 2 with 40% progress, confirming that the mod seems to think I’ve only gained a total of 7 points to major/minor skills.

My actual number of major/minor skill ups is 22, so I have no idea why NCGDMW thinks I’ve only gained 7.

I tried troubleshooting with the ResetStats() trick from the ReadMe, but it did not resolve the issue.

For overall context, I’m using OpenMW 0.49.0 with the Total Overhaul mod pack from Modding-OpenMW. I have not added any other mods, and the only change I’ve made to the load order was moving NCGDMW further down the list as an attempt to troubleshoot the issue (it did not seem to make any difference).

Any tips or thoughts on the matter would be much appreciated. I’m happy to provide screenshots or even save files to anyone who might be able to help.

IMG_1375.png IMG_1378.png
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FWIW, not sure if it makes a difference, but as far as I remember none of my major/minor skill ups were from trainers or skill books (trainers are too dang expensive with this mod list lol, only used them for some misc skills)

past pendant
acoustic saddle
past pendant
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I'll check it ASAP, at least on Monday,

hoary trellis
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thx for posting that here, @acoustic saddle

acoustic saddle
acoustic saddle
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Just FYI, it seems that the skill increases are tracking correctly since I did the whole ResetStats() thing in the console this morning. I’ve had 4 increases to major/minor skills, and my progress has gone up 40%.

So my issue now is just the missing levels from before it started counting the skill-ups currently. I’ve had 26 total skill-ups to major/minor skills, but my level progress is only reflecting 11 of those.

past pendant
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with NCGDMW's reset command, it fixes the bug, and you reach level 3

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your level seems rights according to your skill increases

past pendant
hoary trellis
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I have a sort of report after making a long playthrough (250+ hours) with the newest version of this mod. Besides NCGD I used Expanded Vanilla modlist as well as mods like Harder Better Faster Stronger, Fair Care, Mercy, Pay Taxes Mod, Devilish Needs, Backstab, Daedra Use Bound Equipment, Slow Magicka Regen, Improved Persuasion, No Money - No Books, Burglary Overhaul, Gold Weight mod, Dynamic Timescale, Closed for the Night and 120 hours merchant gold reset mod.

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Notes:

  • it was a stealth-focused playthrough. I reached level 40 and became the Master Thief as well as the Hlaalu Councilman (didn't finish all the TR quests to become the Grandmaster - that would still take several hours, I guess).
  • I didn't cast a single spell except Argonian's Water Breathing (which isn't really a "true" spell but racial ability). I actually started the game with the assumption that it would be a no magic playthrough unlike my previous one. This worked very well. I used scrolls, potions (stock ones as I didn't use Alchemy) and enchanted items but no spells. Magicka was literally useless in this playthrough which was a nice change of pace 😄
  • I consider NCGD's HP per lvl setting one of the most important for difficulty. I used 0 HP per lvl and it was the best decision ever. By the end of the playthrough I had sth like 90 HP and that was a lvl 40 character. No HP gain per lvl drastically changes the player's survivability in the mid- and late-game. A fight with a high lvl Daedra, Undead or Sixth House enemy was always quite dangerous, so I think that it works well.
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  • I played with permament -1 Luck debuff per each death. I ended the playthrough with around 120 deaths on the counter. Death counter-based Luck penalties work great until you reach the minimum Luck value (5). Then death has no gameplay consequences again. Therefore, later on after each PC death I ended up using HBFS to increase enemy's Luck instead. I had to do it manually each time, though. Still, I think the gameplay is much more exciting when death matters.
  • the game's economy worked well for about half of the playthrough. Eventually I became very rich but I played a ruthless thief/assassin type of character with high Sneak, Mercantile and Speechcraft so it seemed fitting. I definitely recommend using Better Merchant Skill mod's scaling option to set higher max level scaling penalties at very high player levels. This creates a subtle inflation effect for the mid/late-game and acts as a counter to all the tools the player has in order to increase their own Personality and Mercantile as well as merchant's disposition. I'm also considering setting max selling base offer price (so without accounting for haggling) to 35% instead of 50% for my next playthrough in order to further slow down the player's in-game wealth accumulation.
  • this isn't really NCGD but more HBFS/BMS, but I think that cost of fast travel should be increased. Considering the convenience that is offered, paying around 20-30 gold for silt strider and 70-90 for guild guide travel (which is instantenous!) is simply too low. It would be even better if fast travel cost was increased if the player is transporting a lot of loot.
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  • I used fast Skill Decay settings and they are brutal at higher levels. It was noticeable at lvl 15-20 and very very impactful at lvl 30+. You get used to Skill Decay but if you are a chillout type of player or don't want to feel high time pressure then you should probably use lower settings. Decay also indirectly increases the cost of training because training at high skill levels takes more time which means more decay for other skills. When I started the game, I considered training overpowered. However, it has so many limitations due to governing attribute and Major/Minor/Misc training caps that frankly, I think it's fair especially if you play with fast Decay.
  • On a side note, I think that traps are too weak and lockpicks and probes have too many uses. Overall I found stealth gameplay surprisingly fun, though, even if rather basic.
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Anyway, looking for even more ways to make the next playthrough brutal but manageable 36vehks

past pendant
hallow sentinel
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@past pendant hey do you know if the mod clashes with oblivion style lock picking? I get a crash whenever I get a level in the lockpick skill

past pendant
hallow sentinel
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Wait... I think I resolved it???

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I think one of the settings is clashing with the other mod

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Looping the animation seems to be the broken option

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Or maybe not

pseudo vapor
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After updating NCG from 1.2 to 1.2.1 my character on the latest save (and only it) keeps resetting their attributes and level as if I've just finished character creation. It also says on the startup that I've updated from 1.0 to 1.2.1

Strangely, it happens after about 20-30 seconds and not immediately on load. And the skills are unaffected

image.png image.png image.png
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Older saves work as intended (though still treating previous mod version as 1.0 and not 1.2) and I was able to overcome this level and attribute reset by making new save before the mod resets my stats

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That's some really odd behavior yagrwut

past pendant
pseudo vapor
# past pendant Strange it is. Could you upload the broken save here?

I'm not sure it would help since I run like 800 mods, but sure. Just make sure to install Moonlight to be able to launch it

  • Quicksave - original broken save
  • test - new fixed save
    Couldn't upload to the discord directly, since they are like 45 megabytes each. And the links will expire in 3 days
Nexus Mods :: Morrowind
Moonlight - Birthsigns of Morrowind

A balanced and diverse birthsign mod that expands the constellation into 27 birthsigns that are mechanically powerful and thematically unique.

hoary trellis
pseudo vapor
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I just can't resist new and shiny things

pale sinew
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800 is wild... I only ever go to like 100 max

hoary trellis
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Expanded Vanilla has 400

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having 2x mods than EV is crazy

pseudo vapor
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800 individual plugins
and about 100 replacers on top

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🥹

oak herald
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Is this mod superceded by the other two mods now?

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Growth and evolution

hoary trellis
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NCGD is basically the old combined version

past pendant
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Your game save was really useful

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Version 1.2.2 should fix the issue

wintry birch
pseudo vapor
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Simple as that

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You're laughing, but I really do install mods simply because I like their premise (and if they are compatible with my current pack)

wintry birch
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I do too

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I don't have nearly as many but I am trying to make Morrowind the best RPG/high fantasy life sim possible

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I'm trying to get an idealized Morrowind essentially

pseudo vapor
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Because of some rogue mod when I open training menu, my level and attributes spike and go back to normal once I close the training menu. Has anyone had this issue before?

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Judging by my console output, I temporarily get a base skill boost so that my prices for training skyrocket for balancing. Asking here, since it may be another quirk of one of the mym's mods that I didn't know before 🤷

past pendant
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You can disable that feature to confirm the bug origin

pseudo vapor
past pendant
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Hmmm I'll have to find a way to tell NCG to not acknowledge these changes

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Thx for the report

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I'll probably be away from my laptop until the 5th of January though 😭

pseudo vapor
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Take your time

past pendant
pseudo vapor
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Yes

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It's effectively a price boost for training at the moment

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Maybe it does something with caps (since minor and major skills change), but I haven't checked it yet

past pendant
pseudo vapor
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Completely understandable

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omfg what was I thinking making mercantile a major skill yagrwut

image.png
past pendant
pseudo vapor
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Yes

past pendant
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Yeah, the concept behind the last big update was: "Chargen choices matter" 😅

hoary trellis
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Heresy

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But

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Nobody will know

pseudo vapor
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And Mercantile is either way a good skill to level via training

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(especially since you can't realistically do it any other way)

hoary trellis
hoary trellis
pseudo vapor
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what how

hoary trellis
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Ended up with 70 lvl natural value

pseudo vapor
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I still don't get how haggling works

hoary trellis
pseudo vapor
hoary trellis
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The key points are: 1) avoid haggling with low value offers until your skill is high (it's much harder to bring down the price from 3 gold to 2 gold than 3000 gold to 2900 gold, 2) always barter at max Fatigue (it affects the chance), 3) ensure you have your Merc-boosts on when trading (constant enchantments, cast on use items etc.), 4) keep disposition level high, 5) haggle more with poorer merchants who will tend to have lower skills, 6) be persistent and use haggle opportunities often even if the gain isn't high. If your base skill is too low then it may be best to train it up to a respectable value first but 30 isn't bad.

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With boosts I had 115 Merc with my Hlaalu character. No cheese as that was with BMS. It actually broke old BMS formulas, lol. They were adjusted later.

past pendant
hoary trellis
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But yes

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It will work

past pendant
past pendant
pseudo vapor
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Hey @past pendant. What do you think of granting unarmored/light armor xp for successfully evading enemy attacks? It can scale with difficulty of the dodge, avoided damage and % of exposed skin/light armor equipped. Because currently not only unarmored is pretty bad defence-wise, but it's also not really viable to level up compared to other armor types (even light armor)

I'm not really concerned with light armor (though it can get a small bonus regardless), but by taking an unarmored route, I don't feel like I level it all that much even with the help of NCG 🫠

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I might even go as far as to suggest a mirrored mechanic to the current "the more you block, the more xp you get" - "get xp for evasion". It's based on the idea that the lighter armor is tied more to evasion rather than blocking damage and should be treated as an airbag in case you get hit.

For example:

  • Heavy armor -> 100% xp bonus from blocking and 0% from evasion
  • Medium armor -> 75/25
  • Light armor -> 50/50
  • Unarmored -> 10/90

This would also offset the general lack of Endurance points granted by light armor/unarmored, as they also get less health per level to have an easier time grinding the skill xp

hoary trellis
past pendant
pseudo vapor
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I defined an evasion to be an unsuccessful hit

hoary trellis
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0

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Null

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Nada

pseudo vapor
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Yeah but
Jus factor the armor coverage for that or something sadcat

dusk robin
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it does seem like unarmoured hardly ever goes up even though I get wrecked all the time. a little boost would be nice

past pendant
oak herald
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You should look at how nimble armor does it