#wiki-related-chatroom

1 messages · Page 3 of 1

dreamy berry
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didn't know that, will do

acoustic scarab
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Please double-check my math.
If someone ran 10 missions and got a 20%-to-spawn event 4 times, the chance of that occurring is 0.2^4 * 0.8^6, right?

sterile crescent
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Roughly, yes

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Roughly only because its a Pseudo-random system

acoustic scarab
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We're getting more threads with people farming MEs on point extractions and getting way fewer events that they should.

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https://www.reddit.com/r/DeepRockGalactic/comments/ytnmvc/is_procentage_in_machine_event_chance_to_occur/
Here's one with 6 MEs out of 60 missions of length 2/3 point extractions. The chance of that happening is 0,000000000092389%, assuming all caves are searched thoroughly.

https://www.reddit.com/r/DeepRockGalactic/comments/yocfmg/i_refuse_to_believe_that_machine_event_spawnrate/
Here's two with 1 ME out of 50 missions of length 3 point extraction. The chance of that happening is 0,0000000442% (again, assuming due diligence on OP's part).

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Chances are calculated based on the currently listed spawn rates of 20% for L2 and 35% for L3.

sterile crescent
sterile crescent
acoustic scarab
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Oh, right. I should've added up probabilities of ME on missions 1, 2, 3 + missions 1, 2, 4 + missions 1, 2, 5 + etc.

sterile crescent
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Or ~9%

acoustic scarab
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What's 10C4 here?

sterile crescent
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10 choose 4

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Its shorthand for a bigger equation that spits out how many possible combinations there are of choosing 4 options from a set of 10

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It evaluates to 210 in this case

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So 210 * (0.2^4) * (0.8^6)

acoustic scarab
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Ah, I see

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Yeah, 20C3 * 40C3 should be a large number

sterile crescent
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Why would you multiply the two choices?

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Oh I see

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The sampling set is weird

acoustic scarab
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The person in the thread says they got 6 events out of 40 L3 missions + 20 L2 missions

sterile crescent
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Also, tbf, that 35% is assuming you scour the cave top to bottom

acoustic scarab
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I decided to assume they got 3 from one set and 3 from another

sterile crescent
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And on high complexity caves, good luck with that

acoustic scarab
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Yes, that is also a big assumption

sterile crescent
acoustic scarab
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Yeah, let's go with that instead

cinder crater
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you need to sum up all the different breakdowns between complexities to get the right number

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otherwise you're calculating the probability of the event "3 events out of 40 L3, 3 events out of 20 L2", which is a subset of the event "6 events out of 40 L3 and 20 L2"

acoustic scarab
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Yeah, that sounds fair

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There are more ways to draw 6 from 40+20 than one

sterile crescent
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Even that is still an estimate though, since you'd have to weigh each set somehow

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Likely just by saying "they are all equally likely" (except maybe all in one set, as that's very unlikely to factor in if they reported both sets)

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Assumptions need to be made no matter what, though

cinder crater
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is ME probability the same regardless of mission length?

sterile crescent
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No; longer missions have higher chances

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Supposedly, anyways

acoustic scarab
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That's the million dollar question.

sterile crescent
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15% for short, 20% for medium, 35% for long

acoustic scarab
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⬆️ this is the working theory that I'm trying to call into question

sterile crescent
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Honestly, you should collect your own dataset if you want to evaluate that

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Then do a hypothesis test

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Just start a bunch of missions of each length in sandbox, go free cam fullbright, and scan everything

acoustic scarab
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I have been doing that, but it's taking a lot of time

sterile crescent
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Yeah, the fun of data science :(

acoustic scarab
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Except I don't use sandbox, I want to play the game too, not just run tests in it

sterile crescent
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Fair, but that does mean you're almost certainly going to see odds lower than the wikis

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Even a single false negative will skew the results

acoustic scarab
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We know from Jacob that, for example, cargo crate spawn rate depends on mission type too, not just length. This doesn't mean it's a factor for MEs too, but it could be

sterile crescent
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True

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Only way we can be certain is to dig into the code, and I don't think that is accessible right now

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Those odds, rather

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So simulation w/ hypothesis test would have to do

acoustic scarab
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Well, the 15/20/35 numbers were mined from the files. It's just that the numbers aren't always what we think they are.

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What I'm checking for is not "shadownerfing" or "anti-farming rules", but unintended interactions that affect spawn rates, or Unreal Engine's RNG being not random enough

sterile crescent
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Ah, gotcha

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In that case, the only thing I can see happening is it trying to generate a machine event, but failing to due to generation issues

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Certain mission types and biomes might be more prone to that, I imaging, so it'd need to be tested per mission/biome

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Which you already knew, so I'm just rambling now

acoustic scarab
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I mean, I understand bad luck. I also understand that a few complaints on Reddit are visible, while the tens of thousands of "good" odds aren't visible.

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What I don't understand is people in these threads consistently getting improbably low odds

sterile crescent
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I don't think they are, neccesarilly; let me run the math again quickly

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40 L3 and 20 L2, right?

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With 6 total MEs

acoustic scarab
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Yes

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40 choose 4 is 91390, 20 choose 2 is 190

sterile crescent
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Alright, let me throw together a script quick

sterile crescent
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(Sorry if I pinged you there)

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Let me just throw together a script

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For the sake of replicability, I'll be using Scipy's binom function instead of hand-writing the nCr * p * q over and over again, and just throwing it through a loop and taking the mean

cinder crater
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sum from i = 0 to 6

  sum from j = 0 to i
   
    40Cj * 0.35^j * 0.65^(40-j) * 20C(i-j) 0.2^(i-j) * 0.8^(20-i+j)
sterile crescent
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Pretty much, though I'm skipping over the 0 in either set case

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Since I'm going to assume the redditor mentioned both sets for a reason

acoustic scarab
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You both contain at least 1 ME?

sterile crescent
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And it'd be divided by the number of total sets to form an average, rather than a sum

cinder crater
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this is the probability of getting 6 MEs or fewer, in 40L3 and 20L2 missions, assuming 35% and 20% chance for each

sterile crescent
cinder crater
sterile crescent
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As you wrote it, it's the sum of all probabilities

cinder crater
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there's no identically likely elemental case here

sterile crescent
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Whereas we want to assume they are all equally possible, so want to take their average

cinder crater
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they are not equally likely though

sterile crescent
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At least thats what I read out of the pseudocode

sterile crescent
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Though you are actually correct, come to think of it

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Because (assuming the wiki is right) we should expect less in the medium set

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Plus there are samples in the medium set

cinder crater
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right. we don't need to assume they are equally likely, since we can just calculate each one separately

sterile crescent
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Ah, so you want to print out a list instead

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Can do, one sec

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Medium: 1, Long: 5, prob:  0.058 *  0.085 =  0.0049
Medium: 2, Long: 4, prob:  0.137 *  0.047 =  0.0065
Medium: 3, Long: 3, prob:  0.205 *  0.021 =  0.0042
Medium: 4, Long: 2, prob:  0.218 *  0.006 =  0.0014
Medium: 5, Long: 1, prob:  0.175 *  0.001 =  0.0002
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So it peaks around 4 in 1000 odds

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Or about 1 in 250

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Which, given the size of the reddit and the game's population, isn't that unreasonable

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This code has been corrected for the error mentioned below:

for i in range(1,6):
  medi_p = binom.pmf(i, 20, 0.2)
  long_p = binom.pmf(6-i, 40, 0.35)
  print(f'Medium: {i}, Long: {6-i}, prob: {medi_p: .3f} * {long_p: .3f} = {medi_p * long_p: .4f}')
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Code to replicate my analyses if anyone cares

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binom.pmf is from the SciPy stats package

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Wait, acutally the odds should be higher

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Just realized my odds for long as 0.2

acoustic scarab
sterile crescent
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Medium: 1, Long: 5, prob:  0.058 *  0.001 =  0.000056
Medium: 2, Long: 4, prob:  0.137 *  0.000 =  0.000035
Medium: 3, Long: 3, prob:  0.205 *  0.000 =  0.000010
Medium: 4, Long: 2, prob:  0.218 *  0.000 =  0.000002
Medium: 5, Long: 1, prob:  0.175 *  0.000 =  0.000000
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0.000056 being the highest, about 1 / 18000

sterile crescent
acoustic scarab
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Is that Python or?

sterile crescent
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Python, yeah

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Just started a python console and threw together a for loop, too lazy to boot up the IDE for this

cinder crater
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julia> sum = 0
0

julia> for i in 0:6
           for j in 0:i
               sum = sum + binomial(40, j) * 0.35^j * 0.65^(40-j) * binomial(20, i-j) * 0.2^(i-j) * 0.8^(20-i+j)
           end
       end

julia> sum
0.0001812541248270609
acoustic scarab
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I'll get into Python soon I think, saving both snippets.
Thank you and huxing both for correcting my unnecessarily strict math 😄

sterile crescent
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I'm not familiar enough with Julia though, so maybe I'm misunderstanding something

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It should not really be summed, though

cinder crater
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yeah, it is

cinder crater
sterile crescent
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Ah, ok, gotcha

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You're doing the 1-tailed hypothesis test, not the probability evaluation

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I misunderstood, sorry

cinder crater
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normally you'd want to include these ones as well, if we're testing the hypothesis "MEs are more unlikely than we think"

sterile crescent
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True, for the sake of testing whether the hypothesis is "correct" or not

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Those are pretty shite odds though, damn

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1 in ~5500

cinder crater
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it's not great!

sterile crescent
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Given the size of the playerbase, I think given multiple sampling error that could still be realistically possible though

acoustic scarab
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Yeah, it's not out of the realm of possibility

cinder crater
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yeah there's definitely a risk of publishing bias

acoustic scarab
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Like 1 in 100 quadrillion I calculated initially

sterile crescent
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lol yeah, combinatorics are a deathtrap for statistics

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Or at least for making mistakes in statistics

cinder crater
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as a personal anecdote, my friends and i did have the independent impression that ME odds are lower than what i would expect after the patch, for what that's worth

sterile crescent
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I wonder if the missions pre-calculates meteor spawns

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And thus, if a ME would spawn where a meteor would, its no longer created

acoustic scarab
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What really gets my knickers in a twist, though, is one person in all of these threads saying "The wiki is correct. You are wrong. The chance is random. You could get no MEs in 100 missions because it's RNG".

And when I try to explain the concept of how the empirical % should approach the listed spawn rate as you increase the sample size, the person replies "RNG is RNG, no need to make it complicated"

cinder crater
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now that i think of it, there are mods that boost ME chances, right? i wonder if those parameters simply exist somewhere in the files

sterile crescent
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Yeah, there are, I think theres even one that garuantees it

acoustic scarab
sterile crescent
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Lol noted

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nvm then

acoustic scarab
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And also today, a Trytilyte (I will never spell that correctly) deposit spawning so close to the Caretaker that one of the buttons is buried inside the base of the Caretaker's podium

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There's definitely enough wonkiness in ME positioning

sterile crescent
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I think you literally got every y and i flipped lol

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Tritylite

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Oh its Tritilyte

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oops

cinder crater
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i ran the numbers on 8 MEs out of 60 (the case where 2 were not found by the player): the odds are 1 out of 500

sterile crescent
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Completely reasonable, honestly, in a game with this many players and missions played daily

cinder crater
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when the number is 10, the odds go up to 1 in 77

cinder crater
sterile crescent
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Still, RIP them

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Poor guy needs to buy some horseshoes to hang up around his house with that luck

cinder crater
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if there's interest we could crowdsource some data

sterile crescent
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It's easy enough to test with mods, honestly

acoustic scarab
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The only crowdsourcing DRG project I'm currently running is the XP to PP translation, but I'd be happy to start another sheet

cinder crater
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if there's a mod that reveals the whole map that would take a lot of the tedium out of it

sterile crescent
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Sandbox allows you to allbright + freecam

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But theres another mod which just tells you whether a machine event is present or not

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I'm trying to find it, one moment

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Display Events

acoustic scarab
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It's called something like Display Events

sterile crescent
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(hope linking isn't against the rules given the context)

acoustic scarab
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Is it up to date? Last time I checked it wasn't

cinder crater
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it's tagged for 1.37 so i assume it is

sterile crescent
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Some of the comments are remarking that it might be a bit buggy (heh) though

cinder crater
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As requested by the devs, events will not be displayed unless you have completed your objectives. This means that you can use this mod to make sure you've cleared the caves before evacuating rather than using the mod to decide whether or not the cave is worth your time.

sterile crescent
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Ah, lovely

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I wonder if theres a sandbox mod somewhere that restores its original function

acoustic scarab
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There are always "illegal" mods

sterile crescent
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True

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For the sake of wiki testing, I don't mind them though tbh

cinder crater
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if we can look at the mod file

high cloud
acoustic scarab
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I've made a sheet for machine events, "ME spawn rates"

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I've included everything I can think of that could possibly affect ME spawning or not

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I'm not going to ask you to fill mission seed numbers since it's tedious as all hell, but if you do, we'll be able to give GSG something to work with if we discover something is amiss

sterile crescent
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What are the Jam Percentages?

sterile crescent
acoustic scarab
acoustic scarab
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This sheet tracks the progress % at which the refining stops

sterile crescent
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Ah

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Also, how does one grab the seed?

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I'd like to be as thourough as possible

acoustic scarab
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Escape menu while on a mission, bottom-left corner

sterile crescent
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Aight, thanks

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And finally, what should I place in the ID field

high cloud
acoustic scarab
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Correct, without any bonuses. On the end screen with season progress it's the first listed number. The game always shows the base PP (from XP) and then bonuses like plaguehearts or, previously, data cells. We want the first number only

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We're pretty set for missions below 16k XP, but feel free to add anything. Hazard level isn't the only factor in XP. You could get an error cube on a double warning mission and it'd be almost like a +2 hazard modifier, experience-wise.

high cloud
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and include 2xp missions too?

acoustic scarab
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Yes, definitely

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They don't affect the XP to PP calculation ifself, only boost the XP number that is being translated

acoustic scarab
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I'm rebuilding this whole doc into a proper SQL database when I can find time for it.

sterile crescent
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Alrighty

acoustic scarab
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Started studying/interning for a job in data analysis recently, I'm learning proper database maintenance

sterile crescent
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Oh, well welcome!

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I'm working as a student research in a data science field right no

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Also, one more column request; non-ME events

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Stuff like Hulli Hoarders, Korloks etc.

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Just got a mission with a Hullli and an ME

acoustic scarab
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Yeah, it occurred to me and I just kind of brushed hem all into "Comments". It should be its own column probably

sterile crescent
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Honestly, I think the ID column is redundant

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You could just generate the values later

acoustic scarab
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I guess. If we want to talk about a specific row, we can refer to it by Google Sheet row numbers

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Thanks for chipping in!

high cloud
acoustic scarab
tidal warren
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i want to help grab cropped weapon framework/skins but i don't know how to remove the weapons stats block or crop the image properly, can anyone guide me with that?

shell frigate
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Uuu gives the option to hide the ui

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Unreal universal unlocker

cinder crater
tidal warren
glacial topaz
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geez that was quite the long ME discussion
so many stuff to test, but I better stick to one and finish it first

lament vale
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Does the secondary DoT of the SSG counts toward the drone's damage caps?

worldly salmon
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From testing there doesn’t appear to be a damage cap, but a maximum hit cap

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As in, when the drones do their melee attack 12 times, they break

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The dot doesn’t count as a melee attack, it effectively doesn’t interact with the system

short cloud
worldly salmon
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Essentially

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But framing it as a hit cap makes it more clear that the dot doesn’t really interact with it

short cloud
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yeah

worldly salmon
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The ssg isn’t looking for an amount of damage dealt, it’s just looking for how many melee attacks it has done during its lifespan

gaunt cipher
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What's the duration on shredder DoT? 2s, along with the tickrate?

floral drift
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shredder DoT is weird

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IIRC tick interval is 2.1 sec

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but the duration is 1.9 sec

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so an enemy would need to be hit at least twice to have a second tick applied (once instantly upon affliction, and then 2.1 sec later)

gaunt cipher
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That makes sense, haven't seen the DoT ticking after shredder expires ever.

silent sierra
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I guess they set the tick rate like that in order to avoid its dps being too high when placed on tiny slivers of terrain that let it spin in place.

floral drift
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Friendly Shredder Swarm? spin in place, what?

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that sounds like Driller's Springloaded Ripper to me, to spin in place

dawn moat
lament vale
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oki ty, this helped ^^

worldly salmon
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i don’t think there’s really any “dps cap” in place on ripper other than the damage cap when hitting targets with more hp than the base damage

dreamy berry
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10 days have passed and the wiki link on the website does not point to the official wiki

silent sierra
dreamy berry
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the alignment on "More" and search bar on a user page is in the title page and not at the header. there also isn't an edit button, is that intentional?

image.png
dreamy berry
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nvm it's fixed

shell frigate
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Not intended, likey browser width based, may cook up a quick soloution to it sometime soon

rancid blade
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latest update includes "- Fixed ricochet triggering incorrectly on revolver Magic Bullets OC"

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and from some random gameplay, i think magic bullets no longer triggers on weakpoints

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not 100% sure, i just shot at some praetorian bums while playing

acoustic scarab
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How many meteor strikes are possible in one mission? Two or three?

weary sonnet
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afaik 2

acoustic scarab
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I stand corrected then

weary sonnet
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Theoretical info only, didn’t saw more than 2, but I saw the talk about the chance for the second meteor but never heard anything about a 3rd one.

worldly salmon
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i have seen people say they've seen 3 meteors in one mission

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i have not seen physical evidence

short cloud
glacial topaz
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So we didnt find the variable to confirm it ?
Otherwise we could increase the chance of spawn to 100% and the limit to observe

short cloud
glacial topaz
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Sadly no access

short cloud
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I can assure you I've never seen more than 2 in all my time of testing, and never did the devs talk about 3 meteors as well, it's always been 2

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I've seen no evidence, nor supported theory, that there could be 3 meteors in one mission

glacial topaz
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💀 I know

sudden jay
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Do we have a list of what status effect Reatomizer works with? I need to verify Ignited/toxin/electric

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Basically any effect I can get applied as a gunner

glacial topaz
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The wiki dont inform that ? Evan can probably work on that one
But I can verify the list later

sudden jay
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I didn't see one. In mean time I verifed Ignite does work. Been using Steeve as my status holder. He only needs to be set on fire once then anytime I hit him all other bugs hit are set on fire. I'm trying to build around Necro+Reatomizer.

silent sierra
short cloud
silent sierra
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Given the craziness stemming from that overclock people found last season I half expect it to somehow transfer the STEs from the new grenades as well as things like Persistent Plasma and other ridiculous effects.

short cloud
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that wouldn't surprise me

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this OC was bugged in closed testing, it was bugged during experimental and it's been bugged ever since

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I think at this point they'd be better off reworking it entirely than trying to fix it tbh

glacial topaz
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is there even a list ?? I can't find one so far like the mercy one

cerulean berry
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AllowExternalSread flag on the STEs themselves I believe

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untested but these have that flag set to false

STE_Plague__EnemyBuffs
STE_SpiderBuffer
STE_Coilgun_ChargeResistance
STE_BeastMaster
STE_HeroEnemies_Detonator
STE_HeroEnemies_Shellback
STE_HeroEnemies_Praetorian
STE_HeroEnemies_Mactera_Grabber
STE_HeroEnemies_Spitter_Acid
STE_HeroEnemies_Slasher
STE_HeroEnemies_Warden
STE_HeroEnemies_Guard
STE_HeroEnemies_Grunt
STE_HeroEnemies_Mactera_Spawn
STE_HeroEnemies_Mactera_Tri_Jaw
STE_HeroEnemies_Mactera_Goo_Bomber
STE_HeroEnemies_Oppressor
STE_HeroEnemies_Mactera_Brundle
STE_HeroEnemies_Spitter_Menace
STE_HeroEnemies_Youngling
STE_HeroEnemies_Spitter_Web
glacial topaz
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so sad, you can't spread Elites and Warden buffs

short cloud
glacial topaz
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takes me some time to not use their internal names when discussing, smh

short cloud
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given how broken the OC is, it might still be possible

glacial topaz
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Elite Dreads when

short cloud
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98% damage resistance dread

glacial topaz
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now we are talking

fair oxide
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does plasma trail stack with itself? like with spinning death and return to sender

short cloud
serene yacht
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hey I found out something pretty interesting lore-related that isn't in the wiki

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I pinged a cave leech and my dwarf called it "One of those weird tentacle things that got Karl

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...
Did Karl go out like a bitch to a cave leech?

short cloud
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it's a supposition, not a declaration

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it can hardly be considered lore, it's just a dwarf wondering about things

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the strings reads

Ten credits say it was one of them tentacly things that got Karl...

serene yacht
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yeah, that's the one

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Well, we know Karl got taken out by a "Tentacly thing"

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perhaps a creature we haven't seen

short cloud
serene yacht
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oh hold on
Okay I think I just read the quote wrong

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I thought it was the dwarf not knowing the name of the cave leech like they didn't know what it was and betting that it is one of the type of monster that got Karl
and not him betting that that type of monster killed karl

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Looking back on it my first interpretation is a bit of a leap in logic-

gaunt cipher
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You could still spread the steeve damage resist with reatomizer prior to season 3 I believe

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and you can still do the incredibly janky thing of "spread visual effect of freeze without the bug actually being frozen"

image.png
short cloud
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👌

gaunt cipher
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yeah. to my knowledge the way reatomizer interacts with freeze is:
-if 1st target hit isn't frozen, does nothing
-if target is frozen, copy both freeze visual effect and also current temp of 1st target

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so if you carry over freeze from, in this case, a praetorian onto a bulk, the frozen temp of the prae isn't low enough to actually freeze the bulk

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but it still gets the model change

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hence this

image.png
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oh, actually I just noticed... the 'not frozen' bulk's weakpoints can't be destroyed, either. so not purely cosmetic, it's applying some aspects of the freeze status.

short cloud
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great, even more jank

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maybe this OC needs a whole document just for itself, like Armor Break do

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then I'll share it to the devs with a note "plz replace it"

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😂

gaunt cipher
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honestly I agree with the sentiment that reatomizer should be scrapped and replaced with something else, yeah. it's so fucked up I don't feel good about using it in actual games

worldly salmon
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I don’t believe it’s ever been in a reasonably functional state since it released

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Not as a question of viability, but actually functioning intuitively if at all

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I’ll be proposing my rework shortly

vivid hill
floral drift
vivid hill
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A little about reatomizer atm, ground heat DoTs I.E. Sticky flame/fire nades when reatomized make it so the on fire status does not go away, Inferno leaves a fire damage dot that lasts forever when reatomized

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all of boltshark's T1s when reatomized last forever

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IFGs last forever when reatomized

dreamy berry
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Shouldn't all these effect interactions just be listed as fact since it explains how the OC works? Even if the mechanics seem potentially unintentional, it's a part of its mechanics

acoustic scarab
short cloud
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and the pass is missing 3 scrips

acoustic scarab
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Eleven? What an odd number

short cloud
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🤷‍♂️

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should be 14 anyway

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because missing scrips

acoustic scarab
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Should we update the wiki while it's not patched?

short cloud
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I would say to wait until the problem is fixed and see from there

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but I ain't a wiki editor, it's up to you guys

glacial topaz
silent sierra
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Incidentally. Temperature Shock has become impossible against these bugs and I can now freeze them while they are on fire.

short cloud
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Reatomiser just playing in a complete other dimension

silent sierra
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Okay. I think Reatomizer's temperature shenanigans make a little bit more sense now. It seems like whenever I transfer the On Fire status from one enemy to another enemy of the exact same type, such as a Praetorian to another Praetorian, then the temperature transfer works differently than one enemy to a different type of enemy.

#

A burning Praet to a non-burning Praet causes the transfer to spike the second Praetorian to 100 degrees even if the first one is sitting at 80 or so degrees.

#

Both then douse at the appropriate temperatures.

#

But if I take a burning Grunt and transfer the On Fire status to a non-burning Praetorian it will transfer whatever temperature the Grunt currently has along with the On Fire status and then the Praetorian will never douse no matter what its temperature ends up becoming.

#

Oh! One other thing. If an enemy has a temperature above 0 but not yet above the On Fire threshold then Reatomizer will ignite everything it hits without a care in the world. The On Fire status is permanent in this case as well.
Edit: Correction. If a creature was on fire and is now not on fire then it will transfer a permanent On Fire status.

vivid hill
#

Wack

#

I love how DRG is a simple game when you first look at it

#

But that’s the tip of the iceberg

#

Honestly I want to know how much time and effort reatomizer has had put into it

silent sierra
#

Looks like the permanent version of the On Fire status is different from the standard one as well. The enemies don't appear to have the radial heat application.

short cloud
#

or any on-fire STE ?

#

if I recall inferno got his own personal STE, right ?

silent sierra
#

I'm talking about the temperature afflicted On Fire status, so it's not specific to any particular gun.

#

I ignite an enemy, let its temperature hit zero, and then use Reatomizer to shoot through that enemy. Every enemy will then be ignited despite there being no burning enemy anywhere.

#

But also these enemies won't have the expected radial heat either.

short cloud
#

this is so incredibly messed up

#

I love it

silent sierra
#

Wait... Can we build Steeve to be the ultimate carrier by igniting him so as to create permanent burns on otherwise very tanky bugs?

#

Let me see how Frozen works out.

floral drift
#

Typhoid Steeve, the carrier

worldly salmon
#

I want to see what temperature amplifier does to those guys

sterile crescent
#

So, from a coding standpoint, I think I know wtf is actually happening here

#

My guess is the "douse"/"ignite" checks is only made when the temperature reaches their respective points, so if you transfer the "ignite" effect with a temperature less than or equal to the douse temp, it never checks whether it should ever douse again

#

I suspect that this check is also what leads to the jank related to the temp shock effect

#

I think that would make creating a "Typhoid Steeve" very difficult to create, though, as you'd need to get a Guard, then ignite something that douses at a heat low enough that it would be below said Steeve's ignite temp, and manage to hit that creature in that sweetspot before the ignite actually kills it

#

By that logic, temp amp would actually be terrible for it, as it would allow the temp to cross that "douse" threshold, allowing it to extinguish

#

That makes me wonder though; there is technically an infected status that bugs infested with RockPox have

#

Could it be transferred using this OC

sterile crescent
#

Off to the sandbox!

#

Also, this all implies temp is treated as a status; does the transfer respect temperature scaling?

sterile crescent
short cloud
#

supposed being the keyword

#

because it kinda does and does not

sterile crescent
#

Testing now with a Neme boi

#

It does not even seem to transfer heat at all against the nemesis

#

But it did transfer the Ignite DoT

#

And it does not instantly kill the nem

#

What a janky OC

#

And it is permanent, as described earlier

floral drift
# sterile crescent And it does *not* instantly kill the nem

that supports your hypothesis. Nemesis and other rival bots have a flag "Die If On Fire" which only gets checked when their heat meter exceeds their IgniteTemp. thus, if Re-Atomizer isn't triggering instant death then it's just moving the STE_OnFire onto the target enemy without checking if the Heat it's bringing over is enough to ignite.

sterile crescent
#

Yeah, also yet another bug found

#

It can permanently transfer its own electric DoT to frozen targets (tested with two Spitball infectors)

#

Spitball infectors also properly inherit the frozen DoT, and it is also permanent

#

And I have 0 idea why the electric becomes permanent

#

And the permnanent electric DoT is rather inconsistent

#

One sec, going to record it for the sake of clarity

silent sierra
#

It doesn't even need to go above 0° anymore.

sterile crescent
#

Fair, but I meant that to make Steeve permanently on fire to do that resource-efficiently, it would be incredibly difficult

silent sierra
#

Steeve doesn't need to be permanently on fire.

floral drift
silent sierra
#

I made a fresh Steeve, lit him on fire once myself, and let him naturally cool off to zero degrees. Steeve is now a permanent source of spreading the On Fire status with no additional input from anything.

#

I'm watching an Oppressor slowly die to my healthy Steeve's fire spreading powers right now.

sterile crescent
#

Brilliant

#

One sec, just converting the video to something Discord actually understands

silent sierra
#

I'll take some footage as well.

sterile crescent
#

Sorry for the choppy frame rate, my computer is still running an older GPU

sterile crescent
#

Its WAY jankier than you saw

#

The bulk keeps thawing then re-freezing

#

Over and over again

gaunt cipher
#

I think that depends on the freeze source

#

idr what I used exactly

sterile crescent
#

I used the "freeze very fast" cyro cannon build I showed in the prior video

#

I'll document it again in this video shortly, one sec

gaunt cipher
#

I probably used cryo minelets

sterile crescent
#

I wonder if the AoE freeze aura is the cause

#

Being counted as a "status"

#

In which case, why

gaunt cipher
#

or ice trail

sterile crescent
#

True

#

I'll test with both, one sec

#

Just setting up the experiment(s)

austere fossil
#

oh yeah, didn't you say the enviro heat from sticky flames was perma heating stuff?

#

Ice Path/Sticky Ice has a similar thing

floral drift
#

i'd expect Ice Trail to the culprit

sterile crescent
#

Yeah, just tested again

#

It is the ice trail

#

Still real janky

#

Just converting the file now

#

Recording w/ freeze trail now

#

Ok, so I got the permanent electric effect again

#

And it seems like the Bulk det is just weird; I tested on a Praetorian and it is "properly" frozen

#

I think it only happens if the AI is disabled still

#

And being frozen forces the AI to remain permanently disabled

#

The question now is, does this work on Dreadnaughts

#

Bringing in the new Freeze meta

#

(also ignore the gnome noises, I forgot to disable the mod)

floral drift
sterile crescent
#

It lasts forever

#

I had it go for a minute once

#

I'll try to replicate it in a bit

#

Its rather unreliable

floral drift
#

nah, i trust you. just wanted to make sure it wasn't "oh it lasted 9 seconds and killed the enemy, it must be permanent" kind of conclusion-jump

silent sierra
#

It looks like you can cause a freeze that will continuously build more cold damage for itself by freezing a bug that has an easy Freeze temperature and then tranfer the frozen status from it to a tankier bug like a Praetorian. Not sure how it'll work with Dreads and Oppressor.

sterile crescent
#

Gonna test now!

#

First with an Opressor

floral drift
#

Fist of the Oppressor, yes

silent sierra
#

Looks like it only partially works on Oppressors.

#

A frozen Guard into an Oppressor will spread 60 Cold damage that keeps compounding on itself and freezes the Oppressor, but then it unfreezes one second later. It keeps refreezing itself though.

#

Presumably this will work on Dreadnoughts as well. I'll test it out.

sterile crescent
#

Thats just the Opressors increased thaw rate

#

It and a handful of other enemies have that

silent sierra
#

I know. The reason this happens is because of how warming works. Each tick of cold damage pauses the warming timer by 1 second for most enemies, Oppressors included, and then that pausing stops working once the Frozen status is achieved and won't work again until the creature thaws.

sterile crescent
#

Yeah, its but thats to be expected (bug notwithstanding)

#

Have some footage of it, one moment

cerulean berry
#

i managed to get the real™️ equipment terminal working in mission yet my shitty version lives on, incredible

sterile crescent
#

oof

#

Gonna test on a Dread now

#

It works, even on the Hiveguard when they're invulnerable lmao

#

Going to try and replicate the permanent electricity bug now

#

Actually, wait a sec

#

Can you use the OC on your fellow Dwarves?

#

Like, if they have a status, can you transfer it off of them onto something else?

cerulean berry
#

pretty sure i've seen an iron will'd glyphid this update

sterile crescent
#

Oh no

#

I need a guinea pig willing test subject

dawn moat
sterile crescent
#

Or I can be the test subject, if you prefer to take your frustrations out on a willing Dwarf

#

I want to see an Iron Willed Bulk Det in person

#

Also, if we can wrangle 3 people together, Iron Will transfer might allow for another dwarf to become immortal

silent sierra
#

I just managed to set a Dreadnought on fire along with freezing it too...

sterile crescent
#

Going to test the Sludge Pump's effects quickly

#

You can transfer it, but it is not permanent

floral drift
#

the irony of all this is: as busted, broken, and buggy as Re-Atomizer is, almost nobody will use it anyway 😐

sterile crescent
#

Yeah, though I can see some funny strats for Dreadnaughts

floral drift
#

Someone, Evan: after all your findings are done, i think it would be interesting to see a write up about how to reliably exploit these bugs in game. going beyond simulations in the Sandbox, how can Re-Atomizer find its niche

sterile crescent
#

Oh wait, sorry, wrong chat

sterile crescent
#

I can see a co-ordinated team doing the freezing path transfer onto a Dread pretty reliably using a Steeve

#

Or twins

#

Or a Hiveguard spawn

#

Nem having a sticky flame path transfered to him could also work

#

Testing the latter now

silent sierra
trail gust
sterile crescent
#

The nem strat works. Also confirmed that the heat DoT is permanent on him for some reason as well

#

Just converting the file now

silent sierra
#

It does seem like Reatomizer applies a fresh duration status when it's working properly though, so I can see it being alright for toxin builds as well.

sterile crescent
#

Also the DoT from Sticky Flames is transfered

silent sierra
#

How about Sticky Fuel?

sterile crescent
#

Thats what I tested with

#

Based on these tests, it seems any "ground hazard" could be transfered permanently with the OC to a target

#

Ground hazard with continuous effects, rather

trail gust
sterile crescent
#

Oh please tell me it

#

I always panic when I got to swap

cerulean berry
#

FYI in the DRGLib menu you can bind keys to class switch (i set mine to CTRL+1,2,3,4)

cerulean berry
silent sierra
#

The best part about it transferring the Sticky Flames STE is that it forces a permanent Heat Source onto the enemy. So the enemy is literally incapable of cooling off naturally anymore.

sterile crescent
#

Perfect, thank you

sterile crescent
#

I think the Sludge Pump's ground effects could also be trasnfered

#

Also the slime puddled on Fungus Bog

silent sierra
#

To be honest I doubt the jank outside of the temperature shenanigans is even something the devs would be all that concerned with.

trail gust
sterile crescent
#

I think the Iron Will thing, if its true, it also rather concerning

trail gust
#

he still cools

#

I don't know much about player STEs but what involves on-creature STEs I tested everything, so ask if you have any questions

sterile crescent
#

I noticed a Hacked Patrol Bot can be trasnferred

#

Is that similar to the Steeve DR?

trail gust
#

yes but try to do it when it's high in the air all the time

#

STE_PatrolBot_Hacked
Source: a hacked Patrol Bot.
Effect 1: DoT 2 damage every 4 seconds.
Effect 2: attracts 2 creatures.
Effect 3: x0.02 damage from players.
Effect 4: x1.15 Movement Speed.
Infinite

#

from my data

sterile crescent
#

Oh lovely

silent sierra
# trail gust then why Dread's temp goes down and up all the time?

So Dreadnoughts normally have a burn temperature that's well outside the range of any bug's maximum heat value. So they'll never catch on fire. The thing is that a Heat Source will override a bug's natural cooling rate while it's in effect and replace it with +2, +12, or +20 Heat depending on the intensity value. If the dread leaves the Heat Source then it can cool off as expected, and no Heat Source is able to ignite dreads without something breaking REALLY hard because of their natural ignite temperature.

trail gust
#

it's kinda not worth it tbh, given how hard is to line up hacked patrol and steeve

trail gust
#

when it reaches maxtemp

#

after re-atomization with heatsource, incendiary nade for instance

silent sierra
#

Oh, that's because of the limit applied to the Heat Source itself. Usually they have a limit of +100 degrees, and once at that limit the Heat Source won't apply until the bug is below the limit.

sterile crescent
#

Can fear be re-atomized?

trail gust
#

no it's not status effect

#

it's a state

silent sierra
#

So at 100 degrees the next tick will have the Dread cool as normal before the Heat Source will apply again.

trail gust
#

ok that's convenient 😄

sterile crescent
#

Weird that that is the exception

trail gust
#

not an exception but that's just not how it works ™️

sterile crescent
# 
STE_InsectDoT
    Source: any creature that has been hit by Deeptora Swarm.
    Effect: DoT 4 Melee every 1-2 seconds.
    Excluded: any Deeptora.
    Infinite
silent sierra
#

You can actually get the Dread to warm above 100 degrees for a single frame if you mod the Heat Source's max temperature to go above 100 degrees, but then the game will force it back to exactly 100 to enforce the temperature limit.

sterile crescent
#

Lol, good to know bees are able to be transferred

trail gust
#

ye all the worthy creatures stes are there

sterile crescent
#

Oh, the IFG transfer could be really good, actually

trail gust
#

on a big bug? sure

sterile crescent
#

Very reliable to set up, and the 1.3x damage multi and slow on a dread permanently is pretty good

trail gust
#

but remember to re-atomize it only after breaking his shell

sterile crescent
#

Oh, is there a weird interaction there?

trail gust
#

I wrote about it in Forbidden things section

sterile crescent
#

Ah, I quickly skimmed through that, oops

trail gust
#

invulnerable to kinetic damage = can't be triggered by coil gun

sterile crescent
#

Also, wait

#

STE_HydraWeed_Heal

#

Could that be atomized onto a Dwarf?

trail gust
#

although hiveguard can be re-atomized any time smh

sterile crescent
trail gust
#

I didn't testdwarves at all

silent sierra
trail gust
#

I saw it's possible to re-atomize dwarves' STEs t bugs but I doubt it's possible to go other way

sterile crescent
silent sierra
#

I'd be down, but it'll have to be tomorrow. I'm going to be heading to bed here in a few minutes.

sterile crescent
#

Sounds good, though I might be teaching a class tommorow evening

trail gust
sterile crescent
#

Sure, one sec

#

Aight, ready when you are

trail gust
#

Pod 19 vc

silent sierra
#

Seems like the perma-freezing is a result of the Ice Trail from Driller. Cryo Grenade can't replicate the same results.

sterile crescent
#

Yup, confirmed that earlier

silent sierra
#

I think I missed it when you mentioned that.

cerulean berry
#

just noticed you can apply toxin to the appendages lol, not that i think it's useful in any way?

image.png
sterile crescent
#

So we confirmed at least one effect can be transfered off of a dwarf onto an enemy

#

Namely the Hollow Bough Thorns effect(s)

bold plover
#

sounds utterly useless

sterile crescent
#

Yeah, though we're testing some other stuff now

bold plover
#

Has anyone figured out how many extra boils plague praetorians get with extra players

sterile crescent
#

So, new developement

#

Dash is the most busted perk in more than one way, turns out

#

When you're not dashing, most status effects cannot be transferred

#

But when you are, it allows some status effects that could not be transferred before to be trasnferred

#

So, turns out its even dumber

#

Its only the first dash of the mission

bold plover
#

🤔

calm chasm
#

Uhh, I'm in a mission right now and I found Error Towers

#

took some screenshots, where or to whom should I send them?

sterile crescent
#

Upon further testing, its actually only on a full charge

#

Testing with 2 and 3 bars of charge now

#

It doesn't have to be the first

#

It doesn't have to be a firstdash either, it just must be full charge

#

The fun of testing

bold plover
#

nothing special about dna trees fyi

#

besides name

calm chasm
#

But aren't they like, rare as shit

#

my friends told me that the wiki guys want more photos of them because they're really rare

raven wadi
#

is there a way to use meatshields june 3rd version of the dps calculator

floral drift
#

i'm overhauling ~80% of the internal workings first, then i have to add/update the new content from U35 to U37 (11 months' worth of changes)

#

it's interesting, though. in the last 3 weeks there have been several people all asking about a DPS Calculator update after 11 months of radio silence. i wonder what the psychology behind that effect is 🤔

weary sonnet
analog rock
sterile crescent
#

Ah the wonders of Re-Atomizer

image.png
#

(This is 3 different goo effects overlapped + the freezing effect)

glacial topaz
#

// do we know how to add line breaks to hover overs ?

sterile crescent
#

So, theres a status that multiplies ones speed by 5x

#

And another by 4x

#

And they stack

#

(Apologies for the horrific overlay, theres no way to reset it without restarting the game and we were one a roll)

trail gust
#

I think I got all the data for dwarf-to-creature-to-dwarf interactions, now I will edit it to make it look nicely and I'm only missing dwarf-to-dwarf interactions which requires 3 dwarves to test

#

It's been 10 hours in a row of re-atomizer testing solely 😄

sterile crescent
#

As well, a short summary of what we discovered in that testing (to use on the wiki as a summary, with SplitSentro's guide being the much more detailed source)

#

1). The effect only works if both the entity with the status and the entity receiving the status take health damage from the Gunner's attack. Shield- and Armor-only damage negates it entirely, as does being invulnerable (though Hiveguard is an exception for some reason)

#

2). If an entity is not currently under the effect of a status, but was previously under the effect of a status, the status can still be transferred

#

3). Most statuses which do nothing to an entity can still be afflicted onto that entity, then passed on again to entities which do benefit from it (i.e. Berserker, which provides no benefit to bugs but can be transferred from to bugs and then back to dwarves to "reset" the berserker effect)

#

4). Many statuses that only cleanse themselves when a condition is met (such as Shield Link's increased shield regen rate effect dissipating when you go distance yourself from someone with the perk) become indefinite until that condition is re-checked. A frankly absurd number of status effects actually work this way

#

5). Getting knocked down ends all statuses on the player, effectively "cleansing" them of otherwise permanent effects. Some entities have similar cleanses as well

#

Now that the serious talk is out of the way, some of the funnier interactions we found while testing

#

Weather effects are treated as statuses, and can be transferred to other bugs and your fellow dwarves. Most of these only last a few seconds, but blizzard lasts indefinitely, or at least until a "real" blizzard happens again to force a re-check. This generates all the appropriate particle effects too, but only for that dwarf, giving them their own personal winter wonderland!

#

You can transfer the "swarmed by bees" status effect

#

Most active perks give a status effect when used, and as a result can be "shared" with your teammates by atomizing them onto, say, Steeve, then back onto a Dwarf (presumably Dwarf to Dwarf transmission is also possible, but we have yet to test)

#

Most ground hazards dwarves place will not effect themselves or other dwarves, but strangely the status effect is still actually allied. As such, you can get a teammate to walk over ground hazards safely, then atomize all of their effects simultaneously by shooting them! And as most ground hazards are conditional removal, they tend to be functionally permanent

weary sonnet
#

Self reminder: update the breeder temperature after work.

trail gust
#

it's -320 from the file

weary sonnet
#

It was -150, so they really decreased it.

#

Ty for the value, I updated the wiki.

sterile crescent
#

Split, did you test Embedded Detonators at all?

trail gust
#

what you want to know?

sterile crescent
#

Just curious if the embedded explosives can be carried from enemy to enemy

#

Or if its only the slow when the enemy is "primed"

trail gust
#

only STE_DeadBugWalking that is attached to it

sterile crescent
#

Darn

#

Great name though

#

Thanks!

trail gust
#

it has 2 s duration so kinda worthless unless you re-apply it over and over again

sterile crescent
#

Yeah, makes sense

weary sonnet
#

For the breeder their remove its warming rate in the file, so it should now use the default value of 10.
Not sure if it is intentional or not since it wasn’t in the patch notes.

glacial topaz
#

me on my way to watch it unthaw before hitting the ground

weary sonnet
#

That shouldn’t happen with how high his unfreeze temperature is.
Plus iirc there is a script that kill it as soon as it is frozen.

cerulean berry
#

pretty sure they die when they hit the ground, that's when the death event fires

#

i've also seen the ragdoll get physically stuck in the ceiling and never go away even though it's been frozen

weary sonnet
#

When I checked their health with CE, their health reached 0 in the air when frozen last time I tested it.

glacial topaz
#

lol, was joke
pretty simple math, 32 seconds is a lot of time for a fall
also, do we have anything already known about craft mineral spawning ? wanna be sure on how to go on about it, like count the number of crystals spawned, or just the total amount

weary sonnet
#

Actually since the unfreeze temperature is positive, I am not sure how high you would need to go to really unfreeze it.

#

Either the burn temperature or really the unfreeze temperature, which would mean that it can potentially be on fire and frozen at the same time.

silent sierra
sterile crescent
#

Alright. Frankly I think it'll be a quick test, as if I've status can transfer from dwarf to dwarf, most probably can as well

silent sierra
#

So can Gunner transfer his Shield emitter to Steeve and then go from Steeve to every other dwarf on the team?

sterile crescent
#

Yup

silent sierra
#

This is some Warframe tier shenanigans.

sterile crescent
#

And it's permanent after, at least until you re-apply it "properly"

#

I have 2000 hours in Warframe, and while I completely agree I'm still insulted by such slander

silent sierra
#

At the very least we don't have a path to sextuple dipping on any of the multipliers via proc chaining yet.

sterile crescent
#

We can get a 20x speed multiplier though

#

Which makes us competitive with a Warframe speed wise

silent sierra
#

Those stubby legs are doing so much work.

sterile crescent
#

Oh, btw, the Scouts "Hot Feet" effect is conditional

#

And this can be transferred permanently to teammates

#

And Steeve

silent sierra
#

I'm 90% certain all of this will eventually lead to Reatomizer being given its own set of exclusive debuffs with a list of triggers like Bullets of Mercy. If not completely scrapped in favor of something else that's easier to manage.

floral drift
#

i'd recommend replacement. fixing would incur way too much tech debt, imo

sterile crescent
#

Honestly, yeah. But I'd much prefer that it's blacklist just be extended to avoid blatantly broken effects

#

Namely Iron Will and the Gunner shield, as they're both trivial to set up and can softlock the game

silent sierra
#

How do they soft lock the game?

sterile crescent
#

You can Iron Will Boss enemies

#

They are then immortal

silent sierra
#

Oh god...

sterile crescent
#

Also, for some god forsaken reason, iron will is a conditional effect

#

Which means it's indefinate once applied

silent sierra
#

This is reminding me of how Garuda could make Demolists immortal by using them to make her Blood Altars. Just without the part where it could be turned off.

sterile crescent
#

Yeah, very funny

austere fossil
#

Are y'all waiting on SplitSentro specifically or just any third body?

sterile crescent
#

Honestly, most of the really strong re-atomizer effects require co-ordination and set up though

#

I just waiting on the bus to get home, will be on in like 30 minutes

#

Frankly, if you can get that 20x speed multiplier, you earned it

#

It requires you hit an air born target with the buff at the same time you're hitting something else

silent sierra
#

I feel like just giving a single Grunt the effects of Shield Booster and the Gunner shield just to have a permanent 50% damage reduction and health regen with a 90 hp shield should be enough. That seems like a pretty trivial thing to set up and run with, and easily enough to effectively turn off any challenge that doesn't instantly kill players.

sterile crescent
#

Yeah, hence me arguing for that to be added to the blacklist

#

If they're trivial to set up and either very strong or soft-locking, blacklist it

#

(or just take the overclock out behind the shed, probably the smarter option, as funny as it is currently)

glacial topaz
#

is there even a cool revive animation for iron will dreads ?

silent sierra
#

I really do like the idea of a status spreading overclock. Maybe change it to be an adaptive trail that triggers status effects based on stuff happening to the first enemy hit?

sterile crescent
#

*praying

silent sierra
#

That'd be such a troll to have happen accidentally.

sterile crescent
#

It's not even that hard, it's the wiring part

#

*worrying

#

You just have to have had the status effect at some point

#

Once that occurs, atomizing someone will transfer every effect they ever had all at once

#

Honestly just making it so the effect has to be active would fix a lot of the issues

silent sierra
#

That and maybe changing how the conditionals deactivate.

sterile crescent
#

Something like a 60s default duration for status effects, with premature disabling conditions, would help substantially, but that's assuming status effects all inherit from some shared component to be easily implemented

#

I don't know their code base, nor their coding methodology, so this is wild speculation

#

Alternatively, atomizer itself could be a status

#

With a set duration, that just happens to itself copy statuses

glacial topaz
#

yall planning to file out a bug form ?
bug book from the looks of it

floral drift
sterile crescent
floral drift
#

it's just some durations are really short, like Persistent Plasma, because it gets reapplied within an AoE

cerulean berry
#

There is a map of active status effect types to instantiated status effects which hold the current elapsed duration, presumably to prevent stacking duplicate status effects. Once a status expires, it's never removed from the map. That alone isn't necessarily a bug, but reatomizer does not check whether the status effect in the active status effect map is actually active before transferring it.

sterile crescent
#

I will once we test dwarf to dwarf transmission so we're thorough, though

sterile crescent
glacial topaz
#

you know, I can test that, won't be able to talk however

sterile crescent
#

I'm almost home, but I think there's enough of you to test without me now if you like

cerulean berry
#

Last night I added a watcher to Sandbox Utilities that lets you view all status effects in that map and whether or not they're active of the actor marked with the laser pointer (can be enabled in DRGLib overlay menu)

sterile crescent
#

Yeah, Split did something similar while we were trading

silent sierra
sterile crescent
#

*testing

#

Bug: the overclock does what it says on the tin, but it's way to good at it lol

glacial topaz
#

"report: the OC is working too well"

#

you beat me to it lol

sterile crescent
#

Also, we know the devs have a way to control our

#

*it

#

There are flags on some statuses that make it impossible transfer certain statuses to certain enemies

floral drift
#

is Jira still active? i thought it was shut down

sterile crescent
#

Namely immunities and "no-dwarf"

silent sierra
#

Jira's shut down, and a new report system will be going up soon-ish. In the meantime they have a report channel here on Discord.

sterile crescent
#

Hive guard has a speed boost with the latter tag, and thus you can't pass it to a dwarf

#

You can give it to steeve though

#

So the devs seem cognisant of the possibilities of the overclock, at least to some extent

floral drift
#

the whole point of submitting them was so that i wouldn't have to remember them in my head 😆

sterile crescent
#

Alright, just got home, @silent sierra, @austere fossil, and @glacial topaz if you're still up for testing (sorry for the ping, no other real method of getting your attention aside from DMing)

#

Don't think we even need to do a sandbox save for this, just hop into a random mission with a gunner w/ the lingering shield mod

silent sierra
#

Alrighty

glacial topaz
#

isn't sandbox more fun and less having to worry about random stuff

sterile crescent
#

Kind of, but this is a really quick test; I'm find doing it in sandbox though

#

Pod 36

glacial topaz
#

which mods needed

sterile crescent
#

Just Sandbox Utilities, the rest are verified QoL

bold plover
#
  • Decreased Naedocyte Breeder freeze point temperature
#

Can't tell if this means it is harder to freeze or easier . .

trail gust
#

3 cryobolts, 2 cryonades, impossible with bosco, 1 cryonade+cryobolt, 2 snowballs now

bold plover
#

Knowing Daga, probably harder.

#

Nice, thank you for the info.

floral drift
#

rumor is it was lowered to -320

glacial topaz
#

do let me know if more coop testing is needed, otherwise will move to solo mineral testing

sterile crescent
#

Thanks! We confirmed that dwarf to dwarf transmission is possible

#

Including Iron Will

vivid hill
#

If it warms a little you fail to freeze

trail gust
#

I couldn't do it in 10 tries in Sandbox, then 1 rocket deals 100 cold, 3 rockets deal 300 cold, the temperature is -320
How?

vivid hill
trail gust
#

I got that info earlier from her as well, she didn't answer to me on this question

vivid hill
#

Wonderful

dawn moat
dreamy berry
#

i can't figure out why the Builder's choice for breach cutter is shifted up on the row when every other Builder's choice is not shifted up

image.png
#

if someone is able to take a look at the formatting or figure out why it isn't aligned that would be appreciated, i've been staring at tags too long figure out what i'm doing wrong

weary sonnet
trail gust
silent sierra
#

@floral drift I recall you were trying to set up the heaviest single hit earlier. With the shenanigans from Re-Atomizer do you think maybe a Gunner using Volatile Bullets against a Frozen and Burning Frost Preatorian would do the trick?

floral drift
#

70 * 4 * 3 = 840
Hyper Prop: 445*3 + 150 = 1485

even if the Frozen/Burning praetorian didn't have its weakpoint disabled, x1.6 is only 1344.

#

so, probably not 😦

silent sierra
#

Ah yeah. I keep forgetting about how crazy the base damage of HP is.

#

Oh wait… frozen weakpoint + temperature shock would be pretty nutty if we consider the Brood Nexus.

#

2x3x4x1.6x70+200=2888 right?

#

Plus the damage of the broken eyeball if that actually works.

#

Though Hyper Prop still gets the same weakpoint and goes to 3000-ish right?

floral drift
#

Yeah, HP would still probably win. It’s absurd.

glacial topaz
#

suspecting it might just be spawning based on number of crystals, and not values
like 8.75 x mission scale and rounding down, wanna try changing some values to see what happens

image.png
gaunt cipher
#

By the way, did breeder freeze temp change sometime recently? I definitely remember them requiring way less cold than -320 to freeze before, I wanna say like -150

#

oh nevermind, there it is in season 3 patch 4 patchnotes

#

"Decreased Naedocyte Breeder freeze point temperature", my eyes slid right over that

weary sonnet
glacial topaz
short cloud
glacial topaz
#

so I can just remove that edit, ye ?

short cloud
#

yes

shell frigate
#

Can be made trivia about how it was the case, as it was true

glacial topaz
#

I know that name appears on the translators guide, so it isn't made up

short cloud
shell frigate
#

Why? would stop anyone adding it in other ways

glacial topaz
#

possibily for the event to be added fully
otherwise it is kinda like adding a trivia of a random 1 day patch error

short cloud
#

my sentiment as well

bold plover
#

It was a coding error, wasn't supposed to happen but it'll likely be making a return.

short cloud
#

given the reddit uprising, I suppose the devs are confident it'll please people if they do bring it back

bold plover
#

Well it wasn't ready for release due to client side issues, so, yeah.

glacial topaz
# glacial topaz suspecting it might just be spawning based on number of crystals, and not values...

There we go, found the interesting value
so, Umanite has a "UnitsPerCarver" variable using the normal value of 6, I was getting 8 crystals and around 70 mined value
but as soon as I changed the carver to 60, I got only 1 crystal and 6 mined value
and that works well if the formula is " (Base x Scale) / Carver" and then rounding it up or down
figuring out the expect total mined value might be more complicated... wonder what I can do about that, if game spawns all umanite with the same value, I can just use "Crystals x individual mined value" and say there is variation due to generation, I saw some other values I can change though, maybe that will give me a 20 value crystal

bold plover
#

what is your goal

glacial topaz
#

Make a clear table of how much crafting minerals you can expect based on biome and mission type

floral drift
#

35-45 abundant type
10-15 rare type

more for long missions

is more precise than that really needed?

austere fossil
#

Those are values taken from the code, right?

#

I think Omega's looking to verify whether say Magma Core and Glacial Strata actually give similar amounts of Magnite or if one skews lower/higher than the other.

glacial topaz
#

Not that simple however
Script values arent a 1-1 relation to what you can get
I have had the base value on each biome for ages, but it isnt usable

glacial topaz
gaunt cipher
glacial topaz
#

you have to calculate those values anyway though, and if you have the variables already, why not go all in and explain how it works

floral drift
#

have you accounted for minerals being lost due to terrain generation, object/debris placement, etc?

glacial topaz
#

when all the tests return the exact same number of minerals I imagine terrain generation and placement isn't being a key factor
though yes, it should have a note saying results may vary, specially Escort Duty (as all other mission types did not show to be affected by RNG, at least not so far)
Got an example of mission type I can test several times to see if I will get some variation ?

floral drift
#

Escort was what i had in mind in particular

#

Sandblasted, REZ, Glacial all have large stone pillars that i've seen Hollomite clip into on numerous occasions, who knows how many things are engulfed entirely within them?

glacial topaz
#

REZ was my pick for testing, no weird results so far
ofc, it isn't considering the umanite getting chopped in half (and to test for that I would have to make it spawn with a fixed size)
and iirc even when it clips , the umanite is just hidden from view, but not lost

high timber
#

Y'all are probably aware, but it's pretty hard to find the wiki.gg and there doesn't seem to be anything obvious redirecting me from fandom to the .gg. Is anything gonna be done about that?

glacial topaz
#

What do you suggest for that ?
We have a pin here
The game links to it

gaunt cipher
#

ah, I was gonna go do something about that but got sidetracked

#

should get back to that

glacial topaz
#

If we could we would have done so many ideas, but not as simple as it seems

naive bone
#

I have a tricky question about the colette wave cooker. Does the mod ''Contagion transmiter'' mod spread the base corrosion debuff or does it spread the debuff applied on the first enemy originally? Like for example if you have fluoroantimonic acid equiped on the goo gun is the debuff spread by the colette wave cooker scaled with the fluorantimonic acid. If yes is it also the case with supersaturation and Hydrogen ion additive? Sorry if im not super clear my first language isn't english.

glacial topaz
#

Never be sorry for english
And iirc contagion transmitter has its own status values, you can check on the collete page (wiki gg, not fandom)

#

Link pinned here

glacial topaz
#

or I could get a small cave, have the mineral spawned be high and see if I get all the expect minerals

dreamy berry
#

@shell frigate Can you add

.ambox {
  border-radius: 0 3px 3px 0;
  border: 1px solid #FF9C00;
  background: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.5);
  color: #d5d5d5;
  font-size: 95%;
  margin: 0 auto 10px auto;
  padding: 3px 6px;
  width: 80%;
}
.ambox-image {
  padding: 2px 0px 2px 0.5em;
  text-align: center;
  width: 60px;
}
.ambox-text {
  padding: 0.25em 0.5em;
}

to the vector css? It is mostly copied from the fandom css but i just changed the border color and didn't include the optional side colors

shell frigate
#

I think that full outline may be a bit too much

shell frigate
# 
.ambox {
  background-image: linear-gradient(to right,rgba(0, 0, 0, 80) 0,rgba(0, 0, 0, 0) 66%);
  font-size: 95%;
  margin: 0 auto 10px auto;
  padding: 3px 6px;
  width: 80%;
}
.ambox-image {
  padding: 2px 10px 2px 0.5em;
  text-align: center;
  width: 60px;
}```
trail gust
dreamy berry
shell frigate
#

Well pushed that live then

hidden gorge
#

So, have any changes to the nemesis cooling rate or temperature needed to set aflame been noticed? There is nothing in the patch notes, but the same heat flamethrower build I've been using for ages to set it aflame has been struggling a lot lately

weary sonnet
gaunt cipher
hidden gorge
#

It's just odd, since I used to ignite nemesis just fine, but now no matter the haz, my heat flamethrower can't get the bar even half full and will kill the nemesis with pure damage sooner than with heat

weary sonnet
hidden gorge
#

Odd, I will need to check it again

weary sonnet
#

Just in case I checked the temperature component for the arms, no change at all there.

hidden gorge
#

The arms have differnt temp resistance than the body?

weary sonnet
#

They have their own stats, not sure if their temperature count or not since they don’t take normal damage at all.

#

Tentacles stats:

{
  "Type": "EnemyTemperatureComponent",
  "Name": "Temperature",
  "Outer": "Default__ENE_TerminatorTentacle_C",
  "Properties": {
    "TemperatureChangeScale": 0.5,
    "BurnTemperature": 100.0,
    "FreezeTemperature": -1000.0,
    "WarmingRate": 20,
    "CoolingRate": 30,
    "IsHeatsourceWhenOnFire": false,
    "WarmingCooldown": 1
  }
},```
#

Main body stat is up to date on wiki.gg.

hidden gorge
#

Good to know, but that's still a bit confusing then

weary sonnet
#

If setting the arms on fire is enough to blow it up that means aiming for them basically divide by 3 the heat needed, seems weird to have such a huge difference.

glacial topaz
glacial topaz
#

ok, first test on sandblasted 7 aquarq with goal of 20 Magnite done
one interesting detail, I found 21 total crystals, but one of them was not whole (see picture), so I wonder if the intention was really to spawn 20, but when making the cave the game detected 1 was cut in half, so it spawned a new one

unknown.png
glacial topaz
#

also oh wow, a single crystal can have a huge range of minerals, 11-23 so far
though I am guessing it is more like "normal size crystal" vs "big sized crystal", not much inbetweens

acoustic scarab
#

Can I get a refresher on what blacklisting on Steam does and doesn't do, please?

weary sonnet
#

if you host a game you can "ban" a player instead of just kicking them - you ban them on steam - the banned player then can not enter games you host (they can still see it on the serverlist tho)
you can also unban them if you unblock them on steam.
If it hasn’t changed, that info was from QA-manda.

acoustic scarab
#

Can you see lobbies hosted by blacklisted players and join them?

weary sonnet
#

No idea

acoustic scarab
#

A big part of S3 notes was about how the blacklisting feature actually works now

glacial topaz
#

note, PE is quite the pain to look for minerals when you are dealing with high amounts
or could it be due to sandblasted...
anyway, the 4 eggs mission returned expect value of magnite crystals (200 * 1) / 7 = 28.57 -> 29 total
wonder what options I have

gaunt cipher
muted cove
#

atleast it actually transfers temperature now

acoustic scarab
#

Apparently Nemesis is no longer auto-marked on the terrain scanner with an orange pyramid

naive bone
#

Hi I just discovered that the pressure drop rate of the cryo cannon is independent from the flow rate, meaning that even if you increase the rate of fire, your "magazine" depletes in the same amount of time. I think it's a really good thing to know when making a build and I though maybe it should be added to the wiki?

floral drift
#

Check the Cryo cannon page to make sure it’s not already there, under unique mechanics below overclocks. The pressure drop being independent of RoF has been known for a while.

naive bone
#

I just looked and I couldn't see it.

sterile crescent
#

Anyone noticed they added loading screen tips this update? I think we might need to start documenting them for the wiki now

short cloud
#

didn't know they intended to bring them back so soon

sterile crescent
#

I was getting a tip on how to resupply and that multiple dwarves helping revive a teammate speeds it up, so I assume so

short cloud
#

As far as I'm aware, they're the same tips as before they got removed, way back then.
It's mostly fluff stuff and very basic tips

sterile crescent
#

Either that or running the game through Wine/Proton restores them by mistake, which would be very funny

#

Weird it wouldn't be on the patch notes anyways

short cloud
sterile crescent
#

yay! Should help green beards a lot

floral drift
# naive bone I just looked and I couldn't see it.

you're right -- all it says is "Pressure Drop Rate is the equivalent of the magazine size for other weapons. It represent how long you can fire before you need to 'reload' your weapon by repressurizing it. The lower the better."

so it's really subtly said -- "how long to fire before repressurizing". i agree with you, that this should be more explicitly called out.

glacial topaz
#

if it was affected there would be shown how much it affects it
all the upgrades says "x0.7 drop rate" and so on
flow rate not having any of that seems to indicate it is a completely different variable

floral drift
#

it is

#

info-dump incoming

#

Default Pressure Drop Duration: 6.5 seconds
Default Pressure Gain Duration: 5 sec
Default Flow Rate (RoF): 8 particles/sec

Default "magazine size" = 6.5 sec * 8 particles/sec = 52

Adding T3.B +1.6 RoF, the "magazine size" becomes Math.floor(6.5 * (8 + 1.6)) = 62

Adding T1.A x0.33 Pressure Drop Rate, the "magazine size" increases to Math.floor(6.5 / 0.33 * 8) = 157

Combining T1.A + T3.B: Math.floor((6.5 / 0.33) * (8 + 1.6)) = 189

#

so, because the RoF increase lets it fire more particles in the same amount of time, it increases the "effective magazine size". similarly, by decreasing Pressure Drop Rate, it increases the time during which RoF pumps out ammo. both of those factors affect the "mag size", as Mapletato indicated eariler.

glacial topaz
#
  1. o
    so nobody was confused about the times
    thinking that "more flow = less shooting time"
    and the part on number of "ammo" per "clip"
    pretty much no weapon has that in detail, other than having the values
floral drift
#

there was a myth that more flow = less shoot time, but i thought it had been dispelled over a year ago.

naive bone
floral drift
#

it seems as if GSG tries not to repeat mechanics, when possible

glacial topaz
#

they do be liking a challenge

naive bone
#

I meant system like not having an actual magazine

austere fossil
#

Well, minigun is effectively the same, just flipped

floral drift
austere fossil
#

flipped as in "heat building" instead of "pressure dropping"

floral drift
#

i would phrase it thus:

  • Cryo Cannon starts at full and counts down to empty based on time, RoF doesn't affect how long to reach zero
  • Minigun starts at empty and counts up to overheated based on time, RoF doesn't affect how long to overheat

for both weapons, higher RoF = more ammo fired before empty/overheat respectively

#

mechanically, mathematically, implemented very similar. how to think about it is very different, though

austere fossil
#

They even have the same set of possible spinup values

#

0.7, 0.5, 0.3, and 0.1s (but Cryo doesn't really have much spindown)

floral drift
#

i've always considered Cryo Cannon's auxilliary penalty to be pretty trivial, almost ignorable. the extra 1 second penalty before repressurizing only hits if you full-empty the tank, IIRC.

#

as soon as i say that, now i'm doubting my memory and want to retest it 😆

austere fossil
#

I believe that's accurate, I mean there isn't long after releasing the trigger before you must go through the full spinup duration again

floral drift
#

the only instance it's meaningful is Ice Spear / Snowball, because they force-empty your pressure which inflicts the penalty

#

just tested in-game, memory did not fail me 🎉

#

only 1 sec penalty on full-empty

austere fossil
#

With the recent change to Breeders, it's sort of relevant that it affects how quickly you can fire a second Snowball

floral drift
#

i suppose, yeah

glacial topaz
#

do we know what magnite and Co size variable is ?
pretty much whatever makes it have multiple sizes

floral drift
#

i do not, sorry

fair oxide
#

does heat mod on hyper prop still not reduce dmg?

floral drift
#

yup, and we finally figured out why just a short while ago

fair oxide
#

oh why is it?

floral drift
#

short answer: spaghetti code

layman's answer: when the game engine converts damage from one element to a different element, it can basically "subtract" from the starting element as much as it wants to, even if it would go below 0%. as a result, the converted elements can add up to > 100% because the starting element can't do less than zero damage even if it gets subtracted below 0%.

the three examples we're aware of right now:

  • Engineer PGL T3.A + Hyper Propellant = [-50% Kinetic/Explosive, 50% Heat, 100% Disintegrate] = 100% damage + 50% Heat
  • Engineer Breach Cutter Inferno = [-40% Electric, 140% Fire, 90% Heat] = 140% damage + 90% Heat
  • Driller EPC T5.A Burning Nightmare = [-5% Electric, 95% Fire, 10% Disintegrate, 70% Heat] = 105% damage + 70% Heat
fair oxide
#

thanks for the explanation

silent sierra
trail gust
#

Cryo bolts and fire bolts stacking works quite non-intuitively. For n hit bolts:

  • On the first hit status effect of the direct hit gets pushed as active, elapsing its duration (6 s) from the first bolt.
  • After these 6 s, no matter how many bolts have been shot, status effect of the direct hit becomes inactive (i.e. ends) for all stacked instances.
  • The next moment (literally the next frame) AoE status effect for n - 1 instances gets pushed as active, but for the 1st instance — as inactive and it all lasts, elapsing its duration (5 or 6 s) from the last time their respective bolts fired (supposedly) or even ends later if there was 3 or more bolts stacked.
    FYI, for Cryo Bolts AoE status effect is 11% stronger, than direct hit effect; for Fire Bolts - 25% stronger, but 1 s shorter.
#

The most unpredictable part is when you stack 3 bolts, it switches STEs midway and lasts longer, than you would expect.

#

I made 2 videos, showing the impact of 3 cryo bolts and 3 fire bolts.

floral drift
#

rocknstone thanks, SplitSentro

trail gust
#

Devs changed smth with Re-atomizer in Patch 5. Many infinite effects are now banned smh, as well as some not infinite. Necro-thermal chaining still works.

trail gust
#

Re-Atomizer became whitelist in Patch 5:

STE_BoomerangSnareLesser
STE_BoomerangSnare
STE_Electric_BurstPistolMines
STE_Electric_Plasma_Linecutter
STE_ElectricSMG
STE_EnemySlowdown_HeavyParticleCannon
STE_EnemySlowdown_MicrowaveGun
STE_GooProjectile_GC
STE_GooPuddle_GC
STE_Grenade_Neurotoxin
STE_Grenade_Pheromone_PropogatedAttacker
STE_Grenade_Pheromone
STE_M1000_Electrocution
STE_PlasmaPersistentExplosion_EPC
STE_Revolver_Neurotoxin

#

I tested this whole list - everything works, and several ones I tested outside of this list - do not work. They all have AllowExternalSread True, and old blacklisted ones got their AllowExternalSread False properties removed.

#

In that list there's only one infinite effect and it is Sludge Puddle STE and Plasma Field from BC or EPC.
For those, who don't know the sources of these STEs:

#

Voltaic Stun Sweeper
BRT7 OC Electromines
Breach Cutter OC High Voltage Crossover
Stubby / Bosco / LOK-1 elecotrcution
Shard Diffractor T5C slowdown
Wave Cooker T3A slowdown
Sludge Pump projectile direct hits
Sludge Pump puddle
Neurotoxin Grenade
Bug that bit another bug that got pheromoned by Pheromone Canister or Pheromone Bolt
Pheromone Canister
GK2 OC Electrifying Reload / M1000 OC EFS / DRAK-25 T4A Overcharged PCF
EPC OC Persistent Plasma / Breach Cutter T5A Explosive Goodbye
Autocannon OC Neurotoxin Payload / Bulldog T5B / Colette T5A Contagion Transmitter

gaunt cipher
#

Do rockpox swarms only happen on litho warnings?

#

That's what I've observed but I haven't really looked into it much.

glacial topaz
floral drift
white plume
#

25:04 is the timestamp

short cloud
glacial topaz
#

So sad

short cloud
#

why ?

short cloud
glacial topaz
#

.... so troll edit ??
I wiill revert it in that case

white plume
#

no, the chance is now never 50%

short cloud
#

I think being in an infected biome just double the chances of getting a meteor

#

can't confirm if it's actually double though

short cloud
#

I would wait until it's in the actual patchnotes to confirm it

white plume
#

actually yeah, when he said "this update" he might have actually meant "next update" since he's like, you know, a dev

short cloud
#

yeah but they can still change their mind

#

wouldn't be the first time

glacial topaz
#

so the edit is correct,
but might change later ?

short cloud
#

yeah

austere fossil
#

No, the edit is premature, but it is apparently planned to happen next patch.

#

The edit being removing the mention of missions having 50% chance if in an infected area but without the Lithophage Outbreak Warning

vivid hill
simple mesa
#

I had to fight the Caretaker in Deep Dive, someone made an edit to say you don't have to fight it, anyone had a previous deep dive where they didn't had to fight it? (as primary seems it's not secondary)

analog rock
glacial topaz
#

Apologies for letting that DD one go by unchecked

acoustic scarab
analog rock
merry cloud
#

How do you earn event bonus scrip?

glacial topaz
#

did you deposit the plague hearts ?
did you get 6+ in total already ?

gaunt cipher
#

It looks like the range SSG shredders aggro on enemies is 10m, or something close to that. Not sure if this has been talked about before.

glacial topaz
#

hmmm, I can see a value of 12 meters on the part of their behavior that might be related to finding targets

gaunt cipher
#

Reviewing my footage more closely, I think that may be right. I managed to get a shredder right above my head as a grunt approached:

vlcsnap-2022-11-19-22h24m47s669.jpg
#

And then as the grunt crossed within 12m, the shredder started to move to attack it.

vlcsnap-2022-11-19-22h24m55s235.jpg
acoustic scarab
trail gust
acoustic scarab
#

I think an asterisk that sends you literally two lines lower is redundant. I'm gonna remove it

image.png
acoustic scarab
#

We should probably update that with something less than 3 years old

#

Mission icons have changed, more missions can show up there

naive bone
#

Hey, apparently for the minigun with bullet hell + blowthrough part on the wiki: "With Blowthrough Rounds equipped when a bullet hits an enemy the game will roll to see if it ricochets if it does, the bullet will spit and the new bullet will bounce while the old one continues its original path. If it does not ricochet then the game will roll to ricochet off of whatever it hits next." the last sentence is wrong and only the initial hit has a chance of ricochet?

gaunt cipher
#

That's correct, yes. Lot of ways you can see that via testing. Ricochet shots only roll for their chance once, and on a success ricochet off the first thing hit(be that enemy or terrain).

#

True for both bulldog with magic bullets+BT or chain hit+BT, and minigun with bullet hell+BT

#

I should go edit that on the minigun page and also the ricochet page, both have incorrect info.

dreamy berry
acoustic scarab
glacial topaz
#

wasn't meat shield that created it ? ricochet stuff
was that change recent ?

acoustic scarab
#

I guess we could specify "per mission" on the page, since questions appear

dreamy berry
#

just making sure; thought it was the latter case but that sentence is worded a bit ambiguously

gaunt cipher
#

I'm also going to remove the note that magic bullets can ricochet off weakpoints due to a bug, since that was fixed.

glacial topaz
#

there we go
" i believe that a ricochet can occur after a blowthrough provided that it has not already ricocheted on an earlier target"
so that is why I got bit iffy on changing it without fully understanding what changed

gaunt cipher
#

to the Ricochet page, I changed a bit and replaced an incorrect explanation with this:
"The ricochet chance is rolled once, and if it rolls a ricochet, it will bounce off the first enemy the original path impacts. If the first enemy does NOT roll a Ricochet, it CANNOT roll them on subsequent enemies or terrain that it reaches with Blowthrough. As a result, a shot that can ricochet that also has blowthrough equipped can only ever bounce off the first target.

This is even true when the first enemy is not a valid ricochet target but the second is. For example, if you use the bulldog with Chain Hit + Blowthrough Rounds to shoot an enemy in the body, and the shot penetrates into a second enemy's weakpoint, it will never ricochet off that second target-the 75% chance to ricochet is only checked against the first target hit, even though it was not a valid target because it didn't hit the weakpoint.
This also means that if you take Bulldog with Magic Bullets + Blowthrough Rounds and shoot through an enemy into terrain, the bullet will not ricochet off terrain despite the 100% ricochet chance."

I can confirm that that is how it works, but mention if the wording should be different.

gaunt cipher
glacial topaz
#

what about terms page ?

shell frigate
#

Was just switching it to terms

glacial topaz
#

Perfection

floral drift
daring epoch
#

Is there somewhere on the wiki that answers the question: Do minerals in pockets in drop pod get multiplied by hazard bonus like the minerals deposited in molly? I know it wont count held in hands stuff or secondary mission objective items. But if I have gold or jadiz in pockets, does it get multiplied or just added as flat number additive?

tranquil hazel
acoustic scarab
#

Thank you

short cloud
earnest osprey
#

So there was another weapon skin set showed in the narrated trailer for plaguefall, which does not appear in the game. Any info on it?

#

For example, this one

image.png
glacial topaz
#

you checked if it wasn't any of the DLC ones, or Season ones, with different paintjobs ?

earnest osprey
#

Yep, this is the one we can get from this season framework, but not the one showed above

image.png
glacial topaz
#

so no way they tweaked it ?

earnest osprey
#

And as far as I understand, there is only armor in biohazard DLC

austere fossil
#

@earnest osprey It's the Mechanized Framework with (probably) the Biohazard DLC Paintjob

short cloud
austere fossil
vivid hill
#

Did they remove the extra chance meteors have to spawn in the red zone but not the litho mutator?

glacial topaz
#

something like that but intended to increase on another patch, iirc

vivid hill
#

Ah

#

it's bugged is what you are saying

glacial topaz
#

guess it can be called that

acoustic scarab
#

@dreamy berry I appreciate that you keep updating both Fandom and Wiki.gg as a service to the comminuty. However, it is my opinion that it would be more helpful if we only focused on wiki.gg. Currently we are competing with Fandom for traffic and users, and it's an uphill battle. The longer Fandom goes without updates, the larger the content gap will be and the easier it will be to convince people to switch to the new one.

glacial topaz
#

did they explain the reasoning ?
since, if we were supposed to have both, we wouldn't go into the trouble of making fandom non official
and the posts only said about moving
never "we are gonna have 2 wikis, cuz reasons"

spring whale
#

Anyone has all the daily fluff texts available in the ore trade catalogue rolling text?

analog rock
spring whale
#

What do you mean, the text or the trade rates?

analog rock
#

texts

spring whale
#

Huh, neat

glacial topaz
#

we do have that page yes

analog rock
#

(I really took big shortcuts to measure that)

spring whale
glacial topaz
#

no problem

#

if anyone remembers, we are missing the XP / credits values for the different sabotage missions sizes
some pages only list 1 variation too
so taking screenshot of mission end helps

acoustic scarab
#

Nov 10

image.png
glacial topaz
#

Experience:
4200 x 2.45 = 10290
1010 x 2.45 = 2474.5 (probably rounds down ?)

#

wait, was it nerfed ?
the wiki says 1050 for that variation
that would be 1050 x 2.45 = 2572.5, quite the gap

#

oh, you got holomite ? that have lower payout
took me some time to remember it is dystrium that won't appear on missions with the mule

acoustic scarab
#

Yes, hollomite

image.png
spring whale
glacial topaz
#

Lower complexity

spring whale
#

I'll do the 1 complex on easy mode real quick just to check it out for you

spring whale
glacial topaz
#

experience
2800 x 1.35 = 3780
Credits
950 x 1.35 = 1282.5

#

missing the secondary payout now

#

hollomite and others btw
updating with current values soon

spring whale
#

There's a 2 cave complex that is also apoca blooms

#

are we missing that one?

glacial topaz
#

only complexity 1

#

and awesome

#

now only missing complexity 1 holomite

image.png
dreamy berry
glacial topaz
#

xD I knew you weren't going crazy

analog rock
winter pond
#

does the leadburster actually do more damage if the enemy is further away...?

image.png