#Help with hierarchy for VBridger Press and Tongue Out on XY corners

125 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

tepid sand
#

Hey guys, I've been really struggling trying to fix this issue and I just really don't know where to go from here. I don't know which deformers I need in what order to just make this thing stay put together but I've been banging my head against a wall over it for like a week and I'm just lost Cry

for the first video, I've tried adding adjustments above and below the whole "bottom teeth jaw" deformer, as well as below each of the bottom teeth XY deformers. for the second video, I've also tried adding a deformer above and below, but both of these attempted solutions just end up with things being wonky at the keyform it was normal at before.

I am so stuck Cry

urban gale
#

are you following a tutorial?

#

tongue needs a lot of permutations for angles in-out and form

tepid sand
#

but yea idk everything is getting wacky on the corners

#

my snakebite piercings are shifting

urban gale
#

permutations is to rig each combination possible

#

so you need to rig the tonge in and out in all angles
in all mouth forms

tepid sand
#

how does that look like in terms of warp hierarchy? bltNoted

#

I have never once heard the term 'permutations' in regards to live2d kms i appreciate your patience in these trying times

urban gale
#

is not a hierarchy

#

is

#

permutations
all
on the same object

#

right now i dont do it like that anymore i do a kind of hierarchy but, tongue is one of the pieces that you can not avoid doing permutations

#

thats why a lot of riggers dont like tongue rigging normaly... less in vbridger

tepid sand
#

yeye it is tough af

urban gale
#

a recomendation is to you to look for a tutorial that make everything vbridger from 0 to angles so you can follow step by stepp

urban gale
tepid sand
#

like workflow vids on youtube?

urban gale
#

some riggers can price it ine multiple hundreds just for vbridger

tepid sand
#

I honestly think vbridger is pretty easy for the most part

#

it's just the tongue dies freakin kills me

urban gale
#

i believe vbridger have a tutorial but im not sure if covers everything

tepid sand
#

like the people who made the app?

urban gale
#

yes

tepid sand
#

:0

#

I will have to snoop around their discord and stuff

#

also as for workflow videos, do you know anybody off the top of your head that has a good vbridger video? if nah that's also 100% ok I can look on my own dyawNodders

urban gale
#

ngl i dont know just because i learned using vbridger manual lol

tepid sand
#

def understandable

tepid sand
# urban gale permutations all on the same object

ok I have been poking around youtube and have not had much luck hmmm is there any chance you could expand a little more what parameters you have the tongue XY keyed on and in what order? in the guide I've been following, you have to rig the mouth form and open in it's entirety, THEN the funnel, THEN the mouth press to make them like read off each other properly, is the process with the tongue similar? like you have to rig it to blah blah before you can rig it to blah blah?

urban gale
# tepid sand ok I have been poking around youtube and have not had much luck <:hmmm:896822849...

more less yess
back in the day i used to do that, even one of the deformers i had it keyed in like 5 parameters for permutation fixes
right now i dont do that anymore but my way to do hierarchy in general is not the common [as far as i know] so it would not work unless you redo everything even mouth and others and honestly... i dont want to make you delete things just because my way xD

tepid sand
#

I was literally about to go delete all my head angle and mouth warps kek

#

but also like if u cba or are busy and can't then I 100% understand as well augGiggle

urban gale
#

do you know the concept of "Child always inside parent"
the idea of making sure you never move an element outside of it?
that is what i basicaly base my full rig
but because of that and because i work wide ranges, i have multiple deformers [child and parent] rig on the same parameters but for diferent objectives

tepid sand
#

I have never heard of that before nopers

#

one of my biggest goals is to also work in wide ranges Prayge

urban gale
#

the idea of never let a child element outside parent is one of the basic in live2d [in my opinion]
the main issue with tongue is the fact that it moves a lot, so is easy that it moves outside parent in the normal rig [and thats the reason i have multiple deformers rig on the same parameter to avoid this currently]

tepid sand
#

I'm trying to understand what you mean hmmm like say for instance I have this hierarchy:
Face XY Warp
Face Mouth Warp
Face Mesh

do you mean like when rigging the face mouth to also key the XY to the parameter?

#

I don't understand how a child would be outside a parent modCheck

urban gale
#

is that only skin?

tepid sand
#

yeye just simplifying to help me understand kek

urban gale
#

did you already deleted your rig?

tepid sand
#

not quite yet nOPERS

urban gale
#

ok

#

take the same video you taked before but show deformers

tepid sand
#

do u want me to have any particular one highlighted?

urban gale
#

the tongue one rigged on angle X-Y physics

tepid sand
#

NODDERS will do

tepid sand
urban gale
#

just to point
even when you said you coudnt imagine how a child would be outside a parent
and in the video the first thing i see is the deformer going outside parent lol

#

but ok out of that

#

in your case you can see your position on angles X-Y are not enought
because when you close the mouth, the tongue moves, so is not in place anymore [and you get that weird effect of going behind the skin]

what some people do to fix this?
on the same deformer rigged on angle X-Y, they add keyforms to mouth open
and fix each angle keyform to look good on all mouth open keyforms

tepid sand
#

I'm still having trouble understanding what you mean by "child outside of parent" Cry

urban gale
#

i highlighted the parent deformer with pink
on the second picture you can see your deformer going outside of it

image.png
#

thats what i means
child going outside parent

tepid sand
#

OH

#

okokokokook I see what you mean

#

so basically I need to make the parent LARG to encapsulate the XY head movement?

urban gale
#

that is an option

tepid sand
#

what is another option? make parent move with child? bltNoted

urban gale
#

I am not fan of big parents
buts thats why i said my way of rig is not the common

#

the other option is to never move the child outside the parent LOL

#

that is why i have deformers [child and parents] to be rig on the same parameter but they do diferent things

#

for example

#

on tongue
i can have a parent deformer that moves the position of the tongue to follow the mouth
BUT thats all it does, it doesnt deform

so for this i already have a child deformer that will also be keyed on angles BUT they will only deform
[now i never have a one hierarchy as it depends a lot on design]

tepid sand
#

ok I think I understand what you're getting at bltNoted

#

so the parent being the Tongue XY Calibrate, just have that move with the Tongue XY so it doesn't leave?

urban gale
tepid sand
#

okokokokok bltNoted and what are like some common problems that arise with the child leaving the parent?

urban gale
tepid sand
#

BRUH HOW DID I NOT KNOW THIS

#

this is LIFE CHANGING

#

ok yes that makes SO MUCH SENSE OMG THANK YOU

urban gale
#

//totally not sponsoring my twitter full of rig tips, everyday a new post//

tepid sand
#

dw i literally insta followed kek

urban gale
#

asdasd thanks ❤️

tepid sand
#

bro u always out here helping everyone

#

it is literally THE LEAST I can do

urban gale
#

i also have a mini website in case you want to see the current list [current like i havent uploaded the list this week because lazy]
https://kibututo.carrd.co/

KibuTutorials
KibuTutorials

List of all tutorials or info content

tepid sand
#

bookmarked Prayge

#

god u are literally a saint thank you so much

urban gale
#

aw thanks, i am trying to help as much as i got helped when i started ❤️

tepid sand
#

I will try to fix the tongue with my NEW KNOWLEDGE and maybe NOT HAVE TO THROW OUT THE WHOLE RIG LETSGO ❤️

urban gale
#

dw tongue is like this for everyone TT we all fight agains it specialy with making sure it doesnt go away

#

something i used to do before is to create a copy of the lips but like... super extend the skin, and use it as invert clip for the tongue so it doesnt go out

tepid sand
#

bltNoted that is extremely wise I was wondering about that

#

also this is so off topic but I am so proud of something I did with reverse clipping and it's ALSO SOMETHING YOU TAUGHT ME

urban gale
#

ohhh wait really? :0! what you did

tepid sand
#

basically I'm doing a new thing with the ears just having the like front of it clipped onto the back of it to pull new art over the top when the ears rotate instead of stretching it BUT there's a notch in my right ear, and I was like ok so clipping mask won't work cause then it'll just delete itself over the notch and that is silly and ugly

image.png
#

so basically I made a little thing to reverse clip and the actual base of the ear is fully intact but I have this going over it to make the notch

image.png image.png
#

so the front of the ear can still cover it and I can still have my notch HYPERS

image.png
#

I felt VERY SMART when I did this

urban gale
#

OHHH wait

#

that looks really sick!! :O! is cool!!

tepid sand
#

THANK YOU

#

and doubly thank you cause you're the reason I was able to figure it out at all waaa ❤️

urban gale
#

that is so smarth, you dont need to have diferent ears as you could make the diferences with those omg

#

omg sadasdasd i am glad i could help ❤️

#

you did amazing asdasd

tepid sand
#

THANK YOU bltPlead ❤️ ❤️ ❤️

tepid sand
urban gale
tepid sand
tepid sand
#

i will grab screenshots when i’m back in my room (making brekkie rn peepoFat ) but basically my lil snakebite piercings are not wanting to stay put on face angle X when mouth X is active

tepid sand
#

the bites aren't a part of the main like mouth XY deformer cause I didn't want them to squash and stretch Hmm

hollow oxide
#

You could “bypass” that by putting a rotation deformer on them

#

Then they could be in the xy deformer and you wouldnt have to worry about them deforming meshwise with it

urban gale
#

Isos idea is what i would do lol piercings you dont want them to deform so rotators are the best for that

tepid sand
#

u guys are so real

#

baahahaha i will try that

tepid sand
#

dang u guys are literally so SMART

#

!!!!

#

worked like a gotdang CHARM LETSGO ❤️

#

and with that I think this thing is READY TO USE HYPERS