#For more clarification regarding some interactions with Transaction Rollback.

77 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

harsh cedar
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I have a few questions I would like to clarify a bit more and this post objective is a bit for a reference and continuation in case someone needs to look into this for guidance. Also, I would like to say, this was a bit inspired from the MST.TV video regarding this card.

Lets start with the following cases:

Case 1)
There is a monster my opponent controls, (lets say, a Cyberdark Dragon) and I have both rollback and infinite Impermanence in grave.

Question 1: Can I attempt to activate transaction rollback to copy the effect of infinite imperm?
Question 2: If the question 1 is yes, how does it really fully act? What is each sequences or order of things?

Case 2)
I have both Transaction Rollback and Epidemic Virus or Extinction on schedule in grave, can I copy their effects? (it came to me that, it seems some judges are not so sure about this one, some say it can fully resolve, like in the OCG.
Then there is another case you just apply the first part to see and send that declared type of card from your opponent hand but everything else doesn't apply.
And finally some suggest, you can't copy their effects at all.

This is all I still need confirmation with. I would like to give my thanks to those that are kind enough to help me understand this better.

rustic mirage
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those 2 cases should be quite shrimple

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case 1 is just as if you were to activate imperm from hand i believe(no lingering column effect)

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case 2 is just as if you were to activate normally w/o the tribute/lp cost

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think of the card like verte(if you were around for verte)

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it copies the effect, but no other text

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for EEV and extinction, the whole card text is just 1 effect so it copies the whole thing

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while for imperm, it copies the whole effect, but since it wasn't set on field nor on field at resolution you don't get the column

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on the other hand

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if you set rollback

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and use the opponent's imperm

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you would get the column effect since it was set and on field at resolution

harsh cedar
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@rustic mirage then, why is there a conflict between judges regarding the epidemic virus situation?

rustic mirage
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who up conflicting

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name 1 conflict

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alternatively just ask Vee4 when you catch him around

harsh cedar
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The 3 situations are in case 2

rustic mirage
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the main error is in the translation

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in which case EEV refers to "this card's activation"

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so it's understandable

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however

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nexus is an OCG simulator

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which goes off of OCG rulings

harsh cedar
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So, epidemic can be copied without the hole thing?

rustic mirage
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and there they have no problem since EEV doesn't refer to "this card" at all

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so it would resolve the full effect

harsh cedar
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But that's the thing, it's ocg

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Mst.tv mentioned that here in TCG things might be different

rustic mirage
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😔

harsh cedar
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I don't really know, to be honest, would just follow ocg

rustic mirage
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nexus follows ocg anyway

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also apparantly i was wrong

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konami ocg says you can't extinction on schedule with rollback

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(but you can EEV still????)

harsh cedar
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That's odd

rustic mirage
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the key is

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again

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"this card's activation"

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where apparantly ocg's EEV doesn't have that line

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😔

harsh cedar
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Can you explain a bit further with the infinite impermanence thing?

rustic mirage
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imperm's whole text box

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is 1 effect

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and rollback copies the whole thing

harsh cedar
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More precisely the "target" cost

rustic mirage
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you target your monster upon activation of rollback

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exactly as if you were to imperm something

harsh cedar
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Isn't that strange?

rustic mirage
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i mean it'd blank too many good targets otherwise 😔

harsh cedar
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After mst.tv said that "target" cost is the only cost that is not ignored

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You just target a second time

rustic mirage
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mhm
anyway to summarize

  1. rollback is just imperm. if it was set, column effect, otherwise no
  2. extinction is a hard no, since it asks for "this card's activation", while EEV is questionable in the TCG but will work on nexus(OCG does not have "this card")
harsh cedar
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I also would like to ask, the second target is in the same window as you banish and target with rollback?

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How that sequence resolves?

rustic mirage
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you banish imperm
and then declare the imperm target
and then you apply imperm effect

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(try mucking around with it in nexus)

harsh cedar
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Ok thanks

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As a final question

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Traps like mirror force

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How does that work?

rustic mirage
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the trap rollback is copying

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still needs to meet its activation requirements

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so you could only rollback a mirror force when you would normally be able to mirror force(being attacked)

harsh cedar
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So, when there is an attack deceleration

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Got it

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Thanks for your patience

wet pier
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As for the TCG, you cannot activate Rollback's 2nd effect to copy EEV, since as stated above, EEV's card effect relies on referencing the turn "this card" was activated, but Rollback's effect in grave is an effect activation, not a card activation. You can use Rollback on the field to copy the opponent's EEV in their GY though, as at that time Rollback as a CARD is activating, not just it's effect, so it then meets the same requirements seen on EEV effect for referencing turns after the CARD activates.

wet pier
# rustic mirage which goes off of OCG rulings

OCG rulings or not, they typically dont apply to a card with different text in the tcg vs ocg, as the change in text is often enough to have a substantial difference in how it interacts with other cards.

queen vault
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If you copy the effect of Infinite Impermerance, you will target a monster on the resolution of the effect, as targeting is not a cost

  1. Eradicator Epidemic Virus's TCG text counts the third turn after it's activation, so you are unable to copy its effect with the GY effect of transaction rollback in the TCG
    @rustic mirage @harsh cedar
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In the TCG, you could theoretically rule case 2 as anything and it'd be correct, but going strictly by card text, as EEV refers to its own card activation and not effect activation, you're unable to copy the effect

wet pier
queen vault
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発動時に対象を選択する通常罠カードを対象としてこのカードを発動する場合、このカードの発動時にその対象も選択します。

queen vault
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I never knew that!

harsh cedar
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I guess, there will be a statement or an update to epidemic virus some day