#question concernant les pronoms relatifs

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brisk jackalBOT
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question concernant les pronoms relatifs

wary cove
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what's your question

floral narwhal
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would you be able to explain what this question is asking me? specifically question e

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sorry i was studying the notification didn't come up

wary cove
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question e?

floral narwhal
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like i know i'm supposed to use un pronom relatif dans l'espace indique mais je ne pas compris pas laquelle a utlilise dans cette phrase

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  1. Les problèmes sanitaires___________ certains pays continuent à faire face sont loin de trouver des réponses faciles
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quelle pronom relatif comment puis-je utiliser

wary cove
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do you understand how pronoms relatifs work?

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you're setting up a dependent clause whose subject or object is the word in the dependent clause

floral narwhal
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not really could you explain

wary cove
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in english this is pretty straightforward

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"the problem that i have"

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if you introduce a preposition

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"the problem that I'm looking at"

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"the problem at which I'm looking"

floral narwhal
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ahh okay

wary cove
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the relative pronoun depends on what's going on in the relative clause

floral narwhal
wary cove
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not in french

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no other way to speak in french

floral narwhal
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got it

wary cove
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you can't put the preposition at the end like in english

wary cove
fallen jewel
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In short, the preposition moves along with the noun it introduces.

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And it moves after the noun when you use a relative pronoun.

wary cove
floral narwhal
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unfortunately i don' t have the answer key, this was a practice exam question prof gave us

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ill trust y'all though

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i've gotten better help here then from my actual professor

fallen jewel
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In a prepositional relative pronoun, the preposition is preceded by either qui (for people) or lequel (for objects or concepts, etc.). There is no contraction with qui but there is with lequel since "le" in lequel is an article. Dont is an exception since it's the prepositon "de" used by itself instead of being a part of the expression such as "à gauche de".

floral narwhal
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ahh okay makes so much more sense! I was debating between dont and lequel originally

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so dont should be the correct solution?

fallen jewel
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For?

floral narwhal
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like i know i'm supposed to use un pronom relatif dans l'espace indique mais je ne pas compris pas laquelle a utlilise dans cette phrase
Les problèmes sanitaires___ certains pays continuent à faire face sont loin de trouver des réponses faciles
quelle pronom relatif comment puis-je utilis

wary cove
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but what preposition do you use for faire face?

floral narwhal
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de i think

wary cove
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check again

floral narwhal
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à

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mb

wary cove
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this is where a dictionary comes in handy

floral narwhal
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ahh i see, since this was a previous exam question they didn't allow any aids so that's why I was trying not to use a dictionary

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but i guess this is a learning curve

fallen jewel
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It's just a question of knowing which preposition a verb uses. Here, faire face uses à.

wary cove
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it's fine to practice without aids, but obviously you want to know the answer before you take the test...

fallen jewel
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Some verbs use both or more. Penser is one of them.

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Penser à = have something in mind
Penser de = have an opinion on something
Both mean think about, this trips beginners up a lot. So be careful around this verb.

onyx gust
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What preposition a verb uses is really specific to that verb

wary cove
onyx gust
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So try not to generalise

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Not generalising also helps in memorising verbs because prepositions don't translate between languages easily

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If you memorise the prepositions with the verbs, it'll help in training you to not translate as well

floral narwhal
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so i think in this case it would be auxquels since "problèmes sanitaires" is considered masculin pluriel?

fallen jewel
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Correct.

floral narwhal
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thanks everyone, you're explanations and help was awesome!

fallen jewel
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Relative pronouns using lequel agree with the noun preceding them.

onyx gust
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You think of « lequel » as a placeholder for the indirect object itself so it has to agree with the thing it's replacing

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Le problème auquel je dois faire face
La menace à laquelle je dois faire face
Les problèmes auxquels je dois faire face
Les menaces auxquelles je dois faire face

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This pattern of preposition + lequel/laquelle/lesquels/lesquelles applies to all indirect objects except those under « de ». There, we just have the pronoun « dont ». You can think of it as the pronoun 'swallowing' or 'eating' both the preposition and the pronoun lequel.

fallen jewel
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Don't make the mistake of agreeing lequel with the word inside the prepositional locution. Côté in "à côté de" is masculin singulier but lequel doesn't agree with it.

Le garçon à côté duquel la fille est assise
La fille à côté de laquelle le garçon est assis

onyx gust
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It gets a bit more complicated with complex prepositions like « à côte de » but that's the basic idea of it

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With complex prepositions, there's a sort of conflict here where you have a fixed expression – the complex preposition itself – like « à côté de, près de, en dehors de » and the relative preposition « dont » which 'swallows' the preposition. Because of this 'conflict', we instead revert back to the original construction with « lequel »

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so instead of having, say, « L'arbre à côté dont je me suis assis est grand », we have « L'arbre à côté duquel [lequel agrees with « l'arbre »] je me suis assis est grand »

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because the complex preposition has to be preserved

floral narwhal
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thanks again everyone!

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this was super helpful

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writing everything down now to keep in mind for my upcoming exam on thursday!

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good day/ night to everyone

wary cove
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can i get confirmation from one of you that 5. is auxquels?

fallen jewel
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It is not.

wary cove
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ah merde

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what is it

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i can't figure it out

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@fallen jewel don't leave me hanging lol

fallen jewel
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There are actually two options: one with sur and another with de.

wary cove
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hmm, est-ce que tu peux en dire plus à ce sujet?

fallen jewel
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Dire quelque chose de quelque chose = donner un avis sur ladite chose
Dire quelque chose sur quelque chose = donner un commentaire sur ladite chose

wary cove
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mais on peut a la fois dire quelque chose à un certain sujet, n'est-ce pas?

wary cove
fallen jewel
wary cove
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ah bon