🍁・general-2

[twin gust]

If you're disrespecting others/whatever being rude/controversial (which lets be real, in a public setting this almost always happen) then yes

[warm vale]

chick fil a sauce

[gusty ermine]

I want chicken nuggets

With sauce

[twin gust]

I usually tell people to go to dms for it so it doesn't escalate or a random person walks in and goes "TEEHEE LET ME RAGE BAIT THESE NOOBS"

[south radish]

Bbq?

[twin gust]

wrong

[twin gust]

close but no

[warm vale]

and all I ask is permanant purple name, thank you

[twin gust]

as much as I like chik fil a sauce....

[gusty ermine]

RANCH

ITS RANCH

[twin gust]

gyaaaaat ranch is so good but no

[gusty ermine]

[south radish]

Eww ranch

[twin gust]

1 more try

think carefully

[gusty ermine]

[pliant tusk]

It doesn’t taste like nothing to me

[twin gust]

its not ketchup btw

[warm vale]

raising cane's sauce

[twin gust]

holy fuck

[south radish]

Sweet and sour

[twin gust]

he got it right

[south radish]

Tf

[twin gust]

i'd sell my soul for raising canes sauce

[warm vale]

calculated

[gusty ermine]

What happened with the nuking

[pliant tusk]

PANDA😭

[twin gust]

https://tenor.com/view/buh-gif-14465458220549268962

[south radish]

👀

[twin gust]

I got nuked

I can't give you mod anymore

sorry

[warm vale]

purple plz 🙏

[twin gust]

[south radish]

Thats so random that sauce tf

[warm vale]

I know you have it

[twin gust]

there

[warm vale]

close enough

thank you sir

[twin gust]

[warm vale]

blast

[twin gust]

takes it off

Never said it was permanent

[south radish]

Thank you for keeping us company ❤️❤️

[warm vale]

usually these things last 24 hours

[twin gust]

uh oh I'm being summoned in mod bot lol

adios

[warm vale]

bye bye

[twin gust]

[gusty ermine]

[twin gust]

anytime

oh boy so many tickets lol

I wonder who complained now

[south radish]

Tickets?

[gusty ermine]

https://tenor.com/view/kim-kardashian-work-days-gif-26598260

WORK

GET YOUR ASS UP

[warm vale]

is that a JID reference?

[gusty ermine]

don't ban me pls

JID?

[warm vale]

he's a rapper

recent song is called work and get your ass up is the chorus

[gusty ermine]

Interesting

[warm vale]

indubitably so

[vernal hazel]

Definitely.

[hushed marsh]

A superficial observation can make comparisons between settler colonial and non settler colonial countries which can then, hopefully, be corrected by a deeper observation. I will elaborate on both.
Settler colonial countries, by virtue being from another land, has placed traditions on foreign soil that isn't theirs. Whereas European, Asian and African cultures has grown more spontaneously through a much slower process, it seemed that when colonialists moved to the other 3 inhabited continents, they took their culture and tried to artificially impose it on the natives already there. For example, religion, which festered slowly, like a gradual fermentation, suddenly slapped itself on the region. It was a forced cultural development where parts of the native culture in large part was suppressed or outright driven to extinction and the settler culture was divorced from their point of origin. I think as a result of this, much of the culture in the New World, for example, is not seeing the consistent fermentation that has existed for thousand of years in the old world. The depth isn't there. It hasn't had the time to ferment well. I think it would help if they were better able to revive certain indigenous elements and I know that this is being done to some extent. This resurrection is what enabled the arab cultures to still be rich even though the cultures were severed in some respects by centuries of Ottoman and European colonialism. Now, I know that Latin America, to me, does have it's culture, but I wonder what specifically I can look into in order to prove myself wrong that it's history as relatively new states built upon the mix of peoples divorced from their former colonial countries or outright uprooted, can still produce powerful and original culture, despite the severance. The Latin American literary boom is one example, but are there others? I want to prove myself wrong. I have read some pages of their literature but I want more. Please tell me what you think!

[gusty ermine]

Ok now I understand more about what you mean

But I think this topic is outside of my scope of knowledge

I don't think I can give a good answer to it

[hushed marsh]

[static garnet]

Personally I find Latin American culture very interesting and rich

[hushed marsh]

Okay, can you elaborate more?

[static garnet]

U forgot spain and equatorial guinea

[hushed marsh]

I do not plan to go there

I should have clarified that

that's what I meant by "region"

[static garnet]

Wats ur plan

U said livelihood

[static garnet]

Its difficult to explain

Sry

[hushed marsh]

travel and live there from time to time

[burnt jewel]

holy yap

[hushed marsh]

to each his own

[lone furnace]

@odd wyvern:
You have been invited to join @junior flicker in voice chat in #809491752150106122.
Please join a voice channel and type &accept to accept this invitation.

[stray bloom]

[safe dome]

What I like about being Latino is that I can count both local culture and medieval Spanish culture as part of my culture

Although they have differences they share foundations

For example, listen to Puerto Rican music and listen to interpretations of Medieval Spanish music and you will hear that they sound very different

Check the lyrical content and you'll see that structurally and on subject they tend to be very similar

Sure, Spanish culture may have been a spontaneous arrival, but as a Mestizo I am glad to call the Spanish and the Taínos our fathers

[pearl bramble]

i aint readin allat

[hushed marsh]

you didn't ask, she did.

[pearl bramble]

actually wait

no

i will read all that

[hushed marsh]

ok.

[pearl bramble]

ah you're so articulate

i was expecting nonsense my bad man

[hushed marsh]

[pearl bramble]

haha superficial observation is a very like

beginning

that's why the joke

mind if i respond?

i have some thoughts

[hushed marsh]

Go ahead

[pearl bramble]

sweet

[pearl bramble]

so i think you make very good points. imo settler colonial culture def "transplants" is right overall, but if you look deeper, it becomes more complicated. so like in LA, the cutlure in particular isn't just a superficial layering of european culture with the indigenous population's, but instead a product of its hybridization, resistance, and its then reinvention

so catholicism is a great example there. in mexico, brazil, the andes, etc, it isn't just european catholicism but instead it's catholicism that's been absorbed and transformed by the indigenous and african cosmologies! same goes for lang, music, cuisine, even rituals and culture. they're not "copies" or anything, but instead entirely new, unique cultural forms

as for the literary boom, i'll admit i'm ignorant on this. my literary knowledge is mostly of german literature. but for music, there's tango, samba, salsa, etc, and art from brazilian modernism, and a google search pulled up movements like indigenismo and testimoto litearture, where these indigenous/marginalized voices actually shaped a lot of national idenitities.

so imo, rather than being "unfermented," LA culture is entirely fermented in its own way. it's instead a rapid, hybrid, and definitely culture-ridden process which produced a lot of depth the old world couldn't. the "rupture" itself became a source of the new originality.

but, like i said, i haven't dug into it too much myself. i think something like afro-latin religious/musical practices would be a cool thing to look into it, seeing the blend there. also you can prolly look into folklore, anthologies from LA poetry (ruben dario!), and even just LA cinema in general. brazilian cinema novo. some modern films like Roma or City of God, etc

i will admit i did look some of this stuff up, my knowledge of LA culture isn't too much. so i'm speaking out of my element here! but i wanted to share with what i could :)

https://poets.org/poem/roosevelt

cool poem i found!

[safe dome]

I can't pretend to be too knowledgable on the situations in other Latin American countries

[pearl bramble]

I know virtually nothing haha

[pearl bramble]

but i really love this poem

[safe dome]

As for the indigenous of here, I will say I am more indigenous than the average Puerto Rican

[pearl bramble]

oh cool, i'd love to hear about it?

[safe dome]

My great grandpa was from the tall hills and a blue eyed mestizo with straight black hair and brown skin. My grandpa on another side of my family has rather similar features although he is not related, but with green eyes. But really, I don't know much of what else to say

I am a pretty orthodox Catholic and am not aware of any religious practices I use being exclusive to Puerto Rico, my dad, my grandpa and my great grandparents used to do cockfighting. I enjoy Jíbaro music which notably developed separate features from Spanish music

I don't speak taíno and I don't know anyone who does

[pearl bramble]

Oh that's really cool!

[safe dome]

Cockfighting is a tradition that was illegalized relatively recently. I was never into cockfighting unlike my family though

[pearl bramble]

Yeah imo it sounds a little barbaric?

[safe dome]

I personally am unsure about what to think about it

But I lean towards a negative opinion

Morally it appears wrong

I would avoid it

Yeah, many bishops condemn it, I think it appears to be wrong

[sick sentinel]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-man-dog-ai-ai-artificial-intelligence-funny-gif-3175676680904430623

[stray bloom]

.pat

[junior crystal]

better luck next time :^)

[stray bloom]

[stray bloom]

[gusty ermine]

Can you recommend me German literature

Im learning German and I would like to read some books

But idk which books are interesting

[willow aspen]

Oooo uhhhh

@gusty ermine Read Demian by Hernan Hesse

[gusty ermine]

What's that book about

[teal horizon]

.hug

[teal horizon]

🥺 I tried

[willow aspen]

I wouldn't be able to explain honestly

But I highly recommend it

[bleak latch]

Das Kapital 🤑

[cerulean vine]

We should all come here now

[topaz crescent]

fr

they're gonna shut down this server soon, not one day is it normal

[cerulean vine]

Dang

[sterile peak]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/510566607815442453/1380257717645475860/IMG_2054.gif

Play Deltarune

[cerulean vine]

[topaz crescent]

@south radish

[south radish]

Oy

[cerulean vine]

Real

This is our new general

[south radish]

General is my home what shall I do now that im forced to flee 😢

[cerulean vine]

Do like the red panda

[topaz crescent]

i wanted to tell you my plans

[cerulean vine]

What plans

[topaz crescent]

my fitness plans

[south radish]

No .. I love red pandas

[cerulean vine]

Oh

[topaz crescent]

bruh if shushed like i said this wouldnt be happening

[cerulean vine]

I see that

[south radish]

What is it?

[topaz crescent]

ok so

from next week momday

every morning i do 1hr pilates

mon-wed tennis

[cerulean vine]

[topaz crescent]

in the afternoon 30min jumping jack

no sugar

but im undereating so

[cerulean vine]

Is you overweight

[topaz crescent]

for my age yes

[cerulean vine]

If you don’t mind me asking, how old?

[topaz crescent]

15

[cerulean vine]

Hmmm

I think I’m too young to be in this server

[topaz crescent]

how old are you

[cerulean vine]

Good question

[topaz crescent]

im the only teenager under seventeen that ive spoken to

[cerulean vine]

I don’t wanna get kicked from this server yall 🫩

[south radish]

1 hour everyday of pilates? Seems like a bit much to me. What about less time and some cardio. In my experience setting extreme goals makes things harder

[south radish]

30 mins straight?

[topaz crescent]

m

30 minutes worth

[topaz crescent]

i HATE cardio, 4 hours of tennis a week is enough

i might swim

[cerulean vine]

Swimming 😋

🏊‍♀️

🏊

🏊‍♂️

[south radish]

Those are great

[topaz crescent]

i just need to organize a better dieting plant

[cerulean vine]

I just reduce calories

But do NOT follow me

[south radish]

Do you like veggies?

[topaz crescent]

@coral river

[south radish]

They are great cause they're nutritious and keep you full longer

[topaz crescent]

i dont like them but i dont hate them

[cerulean vine]

Carrots 😋

[coral river]

@twin gust my wait in gen is still 10 mins. The fix didn’t change it for everyone?

[topaz crescent]

hello welcome to the server

[twin gust]

It's a general chat slowdown

it's down to 10 s

[topaz crescent]

its very scary here...

[twin gust]

;sd 1m

[merry river]

Set the slowmode delay in this channel to 1m!

[topaz crescent]

@twin gust hi no i cant

[coral river]

Yeah I know but I mean I still gotta wait 10 mins even if the cool down is 10 seconds?

[twin gust]

No

You can start typing again lol

[cerulean vine]

Aww

[south radish]

.nuke @twin gust

[coral river]

No I can’t.

[topaz crescent]

im tired of yall goodnight

[cerulean vine]

No don’t leave

[twin gust]

;sd

[merry river]

Turned off slowmode!

[cerulean vine]

Yay

Ok

Bye guys

[twin gust]

close and reopen the app?

[cerulean vine]

Shower time

[twin gust]

oh try typing and see what message you get lol

It's probably a visual glitch

It's down to 5s

[gusty ermine]

I will check it out

[willow aspen]

Yay

[gusty ermine]

Tennis!!!

Wunderbar

[topaz crescent]

OMG HI SARAH

im not leaving no more

we got in trouble today 🙁

[gusty ermine]

Why

[coral river]

It denied me when I tried to send a message. Reclosing the app didn’t work either. Damn I gotta wait I guess

[topaz crescent]

bc people dont know when to shut the fuck up

[gusty ermine]

It's cool that you're going to practice tennis

[twin gust]

That's so weird lol

[gusty ermine]

Isn't that the usual over here

[twin gust]

Can you imagine if there was a 6h cooldown 😭

Let me try using the built in tools

[topaz crescent]

can you imagine if i was suicidia?

[twin gust]

Try now?

[gusty ermine]

[junior crystal]

@topaz crescent

[compact reef]

that happened to me too 😭

[topaz crescent]

how much people got muted and who got banned?

[coral river]

Nope but it’s okay I got a minute left now

[twin gust]

1. None of your business

-# A lot

-# at least 5

[topaz crescent]

i see..

[hushed marsh]

what genre

you mention marquez, I heard his magical realism is somewhat similar to Borges, and if so you might like some of Ernst Junger's works, but not many of them as he was not strictly a magical realist writer

[stray bloom]

.pat

[slim ivy]

[fluid aspen]

oh I LOVE magical realism as a genre

[slim ivy]

Same it’s amazing

[slim ivy]

Do you know more about german literature?

Regarding Márquez being similar to Borges, hmm that depends. Marquez also wrote novels, compared to Borges who wrote short stories only, there can be definitely some similarities, mostly between both authors short stories, but some novels of García Márquez, like El otoño del patriarca, has a more political undertone within the magical realism genre.

[fluid aspen]

I'm more familiar with German films than literature but I'm definitely interested to see any recommendations

[hushed marsh]

Do you know more about german literature?
No

I haven't read Marquez so you're probably right but I saw political undertones in Borges as well, maybe not as much though

[hushed marsh]

I like their philosophers

they have the best modern philosophers, in part because of their syntax

[fluid aspen]

me too! I studied philosophy along with English Literature and the German philosophers helped me fall in love with the subject

[slim ivy]

Oh yeah Borges was somehow political, to the point of not receiving the Nobel award in literature due to his controversial political views,

[hushed marsh]

he hated Peron for reasons that made it contradictory to his support of the Junta that followed it. Strange.

[slim ivy]

Yeah I’m more familiar with German films too hehe like Wim Wenders for example

[slim ivy]

Speaking about magic realism, have you read Pedro Paramo?

[hushed marsh]

I haven't heard of him, I am not well read

[slim ivy]

That’s a Mexican novel by Juan Rulfo, highly recommended if you want to get into the genre

Speaking about literature in Spanish

And if you want to get into García Márquez, his short stories book, Ojos de perro azul it’s a good start too

[hushed marsh]

actually you seem very knowledgable, can you reply to my wall of text I wrote above?

[slim ivy]

Which one?

[hushed marsh]

.

[slim ivy]

You are looking for more proofs* of Latin American culture, literature right?

[hushed marsh]

proofs* yes

especially depth

asking in part because I want to travel lots as well

[slim ivy]

Miguel Angel Asturias was a Guatemalan writer who wrote an extensive work of novels regarding indigenous culture, for example Hombres de maíz, he was even awarded with the Nobel prize in literature.

In my country, Mexico, writers from different movements like Jose Emilio Pacheco, Jorge Ibarguengoitia, Luis Spota, Jose Agustin, arose between the 1960s-1980s or even earlier

Josefina Vicens a least known writer wrote two great novels called, El libro vacío and Los años falsos

Juan Jose Arreola, another superb writer who also wrote lots of short stories was Mexican, Confabulario his most famous work let alone with his prolific work too he did even on TV

Gabriel Zaid, another unknown, anonymous writer who has written poetry and essays is well known for his work in some circles.

Let alone that in countries like Argentina you have writers like Cesar Aira, Ricardo Piglia, Alejandra Pizarnik
And in Uruguay Juan Carlos Onetti or Mario Benedetti, to put a small example.

Or in Paraguay writers like Augusto Rosa Bastos who wrote about the figure of the dictator, with Yo, El supremo

There’s many information out there

It’s just a matter of searching

I can’t do the depth task because it would be a never ending rabbit hole

And I’m speaking by memory

[gusty ermine]

I think I'm more interested in fantasy. Probably some books directed for teens. I don't want a very complex book something more light-hearted and better if it's related to German folk tales

[hushed marsh]

oh then I can't help you there, I'm sorry

I'm not well-read, don't have much time to read, and when I do, it's limited to literary fiction

[gusty ermine]

Sure no problem

[desert pecan]

No way... Fking bot deleted my message

;hc

[merry river]

I've removed hardcore from you.

[desert pecan]

Creo que es necesario discutir algunas premisas que manejas en tu ensayo. Primero hay que cuestionar la noción de que las culturas europeas, asiáticas y africanas se desarrollaron de manera "orgánica" o líneal. Ninguna cultura es producto de una evolución pura. Guerras, invasiones, migraciones forzadas, imposiciones extranjeras, etc. Rompieron y reconfiguraron la identidad cultural muchas veces, por lo que siempre está en transformación.
La idea de que los países de Latam, Oceanía u África no tienen cultura con "profundidad" porque fueron colonizados niega lo que hoy se ve: raíces indígenas vivas, mezclas, mestizaje y todas las creaciones nuevas que surgieron como suma de los "mundos antiguos". Latam no es una extensión o copia incompleta de Europa, es un continente donde lo europeo, lo indígena y lo africano se encontraron, de mezclaron y nació algo nuevo. Ya @slim ivy mencionó muchos ejemplos de autores relevantes.
Finalmente las culturas indígenas no están tratando de "volver" o resucitar sus raíces para tener valor propio (eso es un idea muy purista), porque muchas comunidades no dejaron morir esas raíces a pesar de los intentos de exterminio antiguos y modernos.
La idea de "una falta de tiempo" como impedimento para generar profundidad cultural es engañoso, ya que eso que mencionas no depende de cuántos milenios ha estado, sino de la capacidad de crear sentidos colectivos, memorias, formas de cultura, de vida, etc.
Si quieres probarte que estás equivocado, creo que debes ampliar la mirada de lo que es la cultura en general y ver otras formas de su manifestación, no solo en literatura.

[hushed marsh]

actually, I never said Africa lacks deep culture.

I said Africa doesn't have the same institutional framework to propagate that culture. But they are undoubtedly rich with culture. The main premise of my argument is less to do with colonialism but rather settler colonialism. A settler colonial country has made a new state entirey.

that's the first thing I will say

I will now paste the english version and respond to that

I think it's necessary to discuss some of the premises you address in your essay. First, we must question the notion that European, Asian, and African cultures developed in an "organic" or linear manner. No culture is the product of pure evolution. Wars, invasions, forced migrations, foreign impositions, etc. have repeatedly disrupted and reconfigured cultural identity, so it is always in transformation.
The idea that the countries of Latin America, Oceania, or Africa lack "deep" culture because they were colonized denies what we see today: living indigenous roots, mixtures, mestizaje, and all the new creations that emerged as a sum of the "ancient worlds." Latin America is not an extension or incomplete copy of Europe; it is a continent where European, indigenous, and African cultures met, mingled, and something new was born. @slim ivy has already mentioned many examples from relevant authors.
Ultimately, Indigenous cultures aren't trying to "return" or resurrect their roots to gain their own value (that's a very purist idea), because many communities haven't let those roots die despite ancient and modern attempts at extermination.
The idea of ​​"a lack of time" as an impediment to generating cultural depth is misleading, since what you're mentioning doesn't depend on how many millennia the culture has existed, but rather on the capacity to create collective meanings, memories, ways of culture, ways of life, etc.
If you want to prove yourself wrong, I think you should broaden your view of what culture is in general and look at other forms of its manifestation, not just in literature.

First, we must question the notion that European, Asian, and African cultures developed in an "organic" or linear manner. No culture is the product of pure evolution. Wars, invasions, forced migrations, foreign impositions, etc. have repeatedly disrupted and reconfigured cultural identity, so it is always in transformation.

I actually addressed this by saying that when there is a native majority before and after then they are essentially able to sustain a culture despite of the wars and invsaions. The disruptions altered yes, but there is still an essence there and maintained. This is why I mentioned the arabs.

[slim ivy]

A settler colonial country has made a new state entirety

Wiping out also their people and culture completely? Or what do you mean with that?

[hushed marsh]

supplanting was the word I'm looking for

there is a reason why Korea has a rich culture despite almost half a century of Japanese colonialism because Korea wasn't a settler colonial state

Latin America is not an extension or incomplete copy of Europe; it is a continent where European, indigenous, and African cultures met, mingled, and something new was born. @Otis Nobody (ARISE) has already mentioned many examples from relevant authors.

the consequence of "something new was born" is a point of disagreement, let's address it later

Ultimately, Indigenous cultures aren't trying to "return" or resurrect their roots to gain their own value (that's a very purist idea), because many communities haven't let those roots die despite ancient and modern attempts at extermination.

not telling them die is what I meant by return/ressurect, it seems we agree here

The idea of ​​"a lack of time" as an impediment to generating cultural depth is misleading, since what you're mentioning doesn't depend on how many millennia the culture has existed, but rather on the capacity to create collective meanings, memories, ways of culture, ways of life, etc.

I disagree because collective meanings and memories is largely helped by a span of time

a child has less memory than an adult, and there in lies the formation of a stronger identity in the adult

[slim ivy]

I don’t know if supplanting is the correct word either because you can still see part of that culture, in many regions and places depending the country, surely it has evolved and the colonization marked a substantial part of it, but supplanting feels like there’s is a complete disregard and a deliberate attempt to forget or erase that, which I disagree, because while it evolved, it’s still there.

[hushed marsh]

If you want to prove yourself wrong, I think you should broaden your view of what culture is in general and look at other forms of its manifestation, not just in literature.
Yes that's what I am trying to do - I am asking for other manifestations

[slim ivy]

It all comes to how we are educated too

[hushed marsh]

I think the supplanting was less severe in latin american than say... America and Canada that's for sure

but that's observing as an outsider to Latin America

Argentina seems pretty European to me, compared to the rest though

but supplanting feels like there’s is a complete disregard and a deliberate attempt to forget or erase that, which I disagree, because while it evolved, it’s still there.
there was an attempt, and you yourself said that by saying "espite ancient and modern attempts at extermination."

the "it is still there" part isn't because the colonists didn't try to supplant it, it's because they succeed in it. That's like saying "Germany didn't supplant the Jews from Germany.... because there were Jews still there during and after the war and even within the party"

Yes, it's true there were Jews still there during and after the war and even within the party, but that doesn't mean there was a conscious effort at supplanting them going on there

[static garnet]

los africanos...

[thin olive]

Hola en español hay

xd

[static garnet]

pues es una lengua extinta

[safe dome]

Cierto eso

[safe dome]

Tuvieron gran influencia, sí, y la gran mayoría de los puertorriqueños tienen una cantidad significativa de sangre de africano subsahariano, pero yo tengo más sangre anglosajona que subsahariana, y no conozco de algún antepasado reciente que yo tenga de Inglaterra, así que se siente raro decirlo.

[slim ivy]

I don’t know why you are mentioning Jews and Germany, all what I wanted to say is that at least our traditions, cultures, are preserved and are not erased at least in my country , if you don’t know that it’s alright, but I never said there are “modern attempts at extermination” or pretend to say that. and while true we were conquered by the Spanish, it became a mixed of both cultures, hence why the majority in Mexico are mestizo people, as many Latin American countries, even in Argentina believe or not, the difference is that a lot of European immigrants came to Argentina at the beginning of the XX century,

Anyway I just tried to help you out mentioning examples of Latin American literature

I’m not that smart and I’m aware I can be wrong

This was just my opinion

[static garnet]

pues dijiste "our" creo que los padres de la nación puertorriqueña serían los españoles, los taínos y los africanos

[hushed marsh]

I think we're talking over each other as in you're not understanding me or I'm not understanding you.
I am saying there is a modern preservation
I am also saying that it was in large part erased
Entire empires in the regions were conquered and replaced.
The language you speak mainly is Spanish. Yes there are other Languages especially in the south of the country where the Zapatistas are present, but they are not the majority in terms of quantity and political quality.
The reason why literature is so powerful because it is the most reflective medium of art in my opinion because it articulate everything that is going on and that has been going on in a more explicit way. I think this is why every culture, unless illiterate, has the ability and potential to be good with literature, and the Latin Americans have produced some of the finest for sure.

[safe dome]

Tienes razón ahí

[slim ivy]

Then I think I misunderstood your point, fair enough 🫱🏻‍🫲🏼

[hushed marsh]

okay now to you

[pearl bramble]

what’s your German level?

[slim ivy]

In terms of languages in the south recently the government wanted to reinforced their teaching, which cause a little bit of controversy

But I get your point now

[hushed marsh]

i aint readin allat

actually wait
no
i will read all that

[hushed marsh]

gov enforces which language.... cuz if they tried to enforce spanish then it kinda proves my point... no?

[slim ivy]

It was Nahuatl if I remember correctly

[hushed marsh]

oh i see!

[slim ivy]

Yeah I didn’t mean Spanish

[hushed marsh]

I think religion language and ethnos is the three most fundamental core

[pearl bramble]

deserved ngl

[hushed marsh]

Arabs for example only has the last one
Japan has all three (sorta)

Canada has none

[hushed marsh]

The cutlure in particular isn't just a superficial layering of european culture with the indigenous population's, but instead a product of its hybridization, resistance, and its then reinvention

I didn't say it was a layeringm you're right that it's a hybrid but there's still a clear fundamental core that's in large part European. (I define the core as Language, Religions and Ethnos - a bit arbitrary, but I think we can agree it's important.

so catholicism is a great example there. in mexico, brazil, the andes, etc, it isn't just european catholicism but instead it's catholicism that's been absorbed and transformed by the indigenous and african cosmologies! same goes for lang, music, cuisine, even rituals and culture. they're not "copies" or anything, but instead entirely new, unique cultural forms

It being new and unique doesn't have the same depths.... or it might, and if so, please tell me

as for the literary boom, i'll admit i'm ignorant on this. my literary knowledge is mostly of german literature. but for music, there's tango, samba, salsa, etc, and art from brazilian modernism, and a google search pulled up movements like indigenismo and testimoto litearture, where these indigenous/marginalized voices actually shaped a lot of national idenitities.

sure music is cool.
Their literature is some of the best in the world!

so imo, rather than being "unfermented," LA culture is entirely fermented in its own way. it's instead a rapid, hybrid, and definitely culture-ridden process which produced a lot of depth the old world couldn't. the "rupture" itself became a source of the new originality.

I addressed this above

i think something like afro-latin religious/musical practices would be a cool thing to look into it, seeing the blend there. also you can prolly look into folklore, anthologies from LA poetry (ruben dario!), and even just LA cinema in general. brazilian cinema novo. some modern films like Roma or City of God, etc.
I like city of God.

[glad bison]

[slim ivy]

Hi Kastel

[glad bison]

Hi I just woke up, after scrolling through these massive text walls it makes me feel like I want to go back to sleep perhaps hahah

[slim ivy]

Yeah perhaps, hahah, good morning by the way

[glad bison]

Good morning, or maybe good evening/night for you

[slim ivy]

Yeah it’s almost midnight

I can’t sleep

[chilly beacon]

[inland heath]

Hi

[static garnet]

What do u mean

[warm vale]

I just saw a crusty old dude with a beer belly wearing a shirt that said 'Torn btwn eating a snack and being a snack'

[tribal crypt]

[twin gust]

Honestly, based

[signal trellis]

I'm looking for a girlfriend, it doesn't matter if she's a cashier at McDonald's.

[tribal crypt]

This isn't a dating server my guy

[warm vale]

https://tenor.com/view/sully-sad-monsters-inc-gif-21703430

[tribal crypt]

Bruh

[scarlet brook]

I don't know if looking for a girlfriend that way is very Jesus friendly but I ain't no religious person so I wish you the best haha

[tribal crypt]

Real

[lavish willow]

Nah, In my case I am a Catholic Christian , that has nothing to do with it. No one forbids looking for a girlfriend, nor does the Bible say it's wrong. It's totally normal; the important thing is to do it respectfully.

[lavish willow]

Hello brother, XD

[signal trellis]

Hello bro

[static garnet]

X qué no

[signal trellis]

¿Y por qué no habría de serlo?

[scarlet brook]

I don't speak Spanish guys so I have no clue what you're saying

[static garnet]

https://tenor.com/view/google-gif-google-gif-for-messages-google-gif-gif-1045234766527568383

[compact reef]

naur, deepl all the way

[static garnet]

deepl sobrevalorado

[compact reef]

smh

[deep sinew]

https://tenor.com/view/piccolo-orange-piccolo-piccolo-rule-rule-248-dragon-ball-gif-14000534852182203026

[stray bloom]

[cerulean hazel]

Thoughts on my current artwork? it is WIP

[jaunty sequoia]

Do you have a speedpaint?

[inland heath]

Buenos dias

[cerulean hazel]

No i use sort of layer masks with Clip studio paint. I never used a speed paint program

[tawdry goblet]

That's AI 😭

[cerulean hazel]

With me making cleve edits. Do not be sectarian for the future of art

[tawdry goblet]

Cleve?

[cerulean hazel]

Clever as in putting intentions in what too change about the orginal. the orginal was just grayscale

[tawdry goblet]

I understand that what was once considered strange and scary may become mainstream (e.g. computers)

But I think there is too little control of generative AI for it to be considered useful in its current state

Plagiarism machine.

[jaunty sequoia]

Clip studio has built in time-lapse feature

I know that's AI bro you dont have to lie about it

[cerulean hazel]

Will look into that tonight, see if it works and is useful for my

[cerulean hazel]

I never lied. No art is 100% AI or 0% AI. All art is based on previous artworks and changing materials reality. I do not see how I was lying I only asked for advice on it

[tawdry goblet]

AI is not the same as inspiration

[jaunty sequoia]

Ai is not artwork

[tawdry goblet]

All art is derivative, yes, but it's different

[cerulean hazel]

Sure, and with your logic it is fair to Copyright strike your current profile picture bescause it partially represent a known Intelectual property.

[tawdry goblet]

I have permission to use this.

With AI, it is often scraped from artists who did not consent to their work being included in the AI.

[jaunty sequoia]

They also gave credits for their pfp

[cerulean hazel]

And i have premission under current international AI laws to have a AI concept generated and not fall under copyright infignment. No law breaking with my current "AI artwork" as your refere to it

[tawdry goblet]

Legality does not equate to morality

Copyright as a system is imperfect anyways

[jaunty sequoia]

You can't credit the artists that made the artwork mashed into the algorithm to make that ai generated photo

[tawdry goblet]

I don't intend to come across as rude to you, but I want you to be aware about this.

[cerulean hazel]

Yes and plagarism is a term only sensable in context of wanting to defend copyright. I am a copyleft advocate, no art should be copyrighted in the future and artists (workers) should be more compensated to their labour to make a artwork with or without AI asistance in the process.

[tawdry goblet]

What I mean is that it takes without permission

Copyright is flawed, yes

You can believe that copyright is imperfect and still view taking things without permission as wrong

[jaunty sequoia]

Why should someone be compensated for typing words into a generator?

I just want to understand your logic no hostility

[cerulean hazel]

Bescause it is labour. I am doing this as a hobby but there are people already who have to use AI tools to edit videos. THe boss decides which tools to use at work, the worker just follows others and does labour with the new tools given to him at there office.

[tawdry goblet]

It's also ridiculous to me how AI defenders are upset when artists try to protect their work from being scraped, via tools like Glaze and Nightshade

Also, just because someone in a position of power says you should use something, it doesn't mean it's a good idea

companies have been pushing AI as the tool to end all tools, but that's just not the case

There are a lot of people out there who will instantly be turned away from something due to the mere presence of AI.

[cerulean hazel]

I do not scrape. The AI company owners do it. I am using a model with is not a part of training automatically. it is nuanced.
Fight agianst private profit gains from AI tools, do not try to defend Copyright like it is helping you that much.
I know from experience that most Artist before AI tools were even public already were broke bescuase they only wanted to make art on there terms instead of trying to find a job in the Art related sectors

[tawdry goblet]

AI in my opinion is a sign of laziness. One of my professors used it to make our assignments, and the questions were all terrible. Editing it would've improved quality, sure, but it would've needed to be rewritten entirely.

It is used because you cannot hire or are not willing to hire an artist, a voice actor, a writer, etc.

[cerulean hazel]

Okay, if it is laziness can you give my 1000 euros a month tax free so i can study art full time? You are just being elitist with your logic.
I am already working my ass off at my part time work and you think I both have the time and money to learn "tradional art techniques" in my spare time.

[tawdry goblet]

Why is AI not allowed for writing English assignments? Ask yourself this. If it can be done in an easier way, what is the point of doing it without AI?

You don't have to study art full time.

You can draw with just a pen and some paper. You can draw in your spare time.

[jaunty sequoia]

If you are using a service knowing that the company is scraping from artists then you are still responsible, also most artists dont do art as a career they draw for fun, because they enjoy it

[tawdry goblet]

I am not rich, but I have been practicing for a long time (because I enjoy creating art!)

You don't have to learn in a school or be particularly "good" at art.

We create things to share our stories and give life to our imaginations.

[cerulean hazel]

Bescause the goverment who decides what the assignemnts should be about indirectly have a intrested in making assignemnts tasks for studensts to crush critical thinking of a subject matter and give the illusion that they are learning about X topic in a scientifice way. But in reality it is made to create obedient workers, AI tools are in a figurateive way obidient workers

[tawdry goblet]

Why read a book when you can have it summarised?

Yes, the education system is incredibly flawed, but think about it

The intent is that you will learn how to do something

[cerulean hazel]

I will pause this discussion atleast on my side. Still need to do some shore before I go prepare my Diner. Hope to continue later on

[tawdry goblet]

You can't show up to a cooking class with something you ordered from UberEats and claim that you cooked.

Okay.

[jaunty sequoia]

You dont need to study art full time or any money to become an artist, every artist has started with pencil, paper and enjoying drawing, everyone also started with bad drawings, youre telling me you dont have a piece of paper, a pen/pencil and 5 minutes to doodle something everyday? There are also millions of free resources out there, you dont need the best supplies or paid classes or expensive textbooks in order to draw

[tawdry goblet]

When I started drawing, it looked terrible. I didn't understand any of the concepts - colour, anatomy, shape, etc.

But you gain that skill over time through practice.

You don't even need a fancy art tablet - I started out with pens & paper, and when I drew digitally, I used my mouse & turned on "stabiliser"

There are free programs on PC and phone

many, many video tutorials on youtube

I still haven't learned all the basics. I mostly learn through drawing what I feel like and taking inspiration from other artists

And if I ever use something someone else has made, I try my best to credit them

[twin gust]

What about artwork that was made before it was even invented? 😭

That uses 0% ai lol

[tawdry goblet]

I think what they meant was inspiration from someone else

[twin gust]

I miss oldge art

[tawdry goblet]

All AI generated imagery is made from a mix of a million other images, which is being compared to inspiration

[twin gust]

My ex was a painter and would paint everything in front of me at like 3 am lol

[tawdry goblet]

Was it fun to watch?

[twin gust]

And wake me up asking if this color is better than the other haha

[twin gust]

Sometimes

My eyes didn't work at 3 am hahaha

So I couldn't tell

I would default to the good ole "yep looks great! Let's go to bed" trick

[tawdry goblet]

lol

[twin gust]

Whenever she pulled an all nighter, she would paint me a cute card 😭

And it would be inside my backpack and would fall out during class

[tawdry goblet]

Cute...

Hope you kept them!!

[twin gust]

I kept a few in an archival binder somewhere so the ink didn't fade. I haven't touched the box (full of random stuff) though in a while

It actually inspired me to do watercoloring.

I suck at it now, buuuuuuut I want to pick it back up

[tawdry goblet]

Go for it!!

I've tried it a few times, but I'm really much better with pens than paint lol

Unsure if this would belong here - some art I did recently of one of my characters.

[twin gust]

OMG CUUUUUUTE

HAHAHAH I love it

[tawdry goblet]

Strange cross between a seagull and a crane. Crane's body (kind of), seagull's personality

[twin gust]

Is that India/archival ink?

[tawdry goblet]

I don't think so? It was just, hold on let me find it

[twin gust]

God I love pens... I was chatting with someone the other day about our own collection 😭

[tawdry goblet]

This, I believe

[twin gust]

BASED

[tawdry goblet]

The colour was done with some pastel highlighters

[twin gust]

faber-castell is so good!!

I love their pencils for shading and random doodles

[twin gust]

Ooooo if you like pastel/non bleed through highlighters, check out "Midliners" by zebra

[tawdry goblet]

I'll look it up :]

[twin gust]

They're my ride or die highlighters. They're awesome!

[teal horizon]

Yoshi

[twin gust]

Hola gira!

[tawdry goblet]

I can't remember what ones I use, it's just a basic 4-pack of pink, purple, blue and green

[twin gust]

Honestly, that's pretty cool. I don't see highlighters used as often so I respect it lol

[tribal crypt]

Lovely

You should check out #1020416976339869786

[tawdry goblet]

Oh!! Thank you!!

[teal horizon]

You don’t look like you, how come?

[twin gust]

It's spooky season

Sort of

[teal horizon]

lol ahhh that’s right

[twin gust]

I can smell my pumpkin spiced latte brewing in the air

[teal horizon]

Heehee you are so sweet Yoshi 🥰

Like a pumpkin spiced latte

[twin gust]

Likewise

Okay time to walk doggo number 2

I've been distracted for 30 mins now

Ciao pt2

[merry river]

I've removed hardcore from you.

[pliant tusk]

U leveled up yea

[cerulean hazel]

Wow what a suprise, inventions are made over the human lifespan that change reality. I clearly meant it in the post 2020 context that that is not Art that is directly of indirecetly influenced my AI tools.
Even not wanting to use AI tools conciousnenly is influenced by mainstream AI tools existing. Mattter influences thought.

[twin gust]

What da tuna

[cerulean hazel]

This is how i end the "discussion" adapt to the changes in society, those who do not adapt and keep a elitist position will be replaced by people who think more tactical about changes in automatization.
You and the other debater have a very flawed static idea of what art means.

[twin gust]

I sure do love mainstream AI slop

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-spongebob-eating-spongebob-eating-poop-spongebob-eating-snail-food-gif-23111277

Yummy yummy

[vague stone]

would capitalism still be an issue if everyone was rich?

[glossy lance]

Si todos estan ricos todos estan ricos o pobres

[vague stone]

¿cómo todos estan probes?

this is literally the first time i'm actually trying to form a full sentence in spanish since 2019

[glossy lance]

No quiero decir si todos estan ricos nadie esta rico

[vague stone]

dependíra cómo tu defines ser rico

monaco esta lleno de las personas ricos

¿a menos que quieras decir tods estan es pobres comparados entre sì?

this would sound like broken spanish bruh 😭

[glossy lance]

Jaja no se realmente

Por cierto no debes que usar ¿ en conversaciones casuales

Busque la defincion y apartemente ser rico es solo tener mucho dinero o cosas

[vague stone]

gracias para la formacìon

[glossy lance]

de nada

Tambieon ' y esos

[vague stone]

verdadera

[glossy lance]

Pero en cosas relatado al trabajaro deberias usarlos

[vague stone]

👍

[cerulean hazel]

No bescause by its class condtradictions not everyone can be rich at the same time. I am a socialist, by definitions against the capitalsit world order
What point are you trying to make here, or are you arguing in bad faith?

[vague stone]

it was a genuine question

i was in no way in bad faith

[cerulean hazel]

I get it now, so capitalism would still be a issue since it inherently created monopolies, which automatically means that there have to be poor people in a capitalist society

Does that answer your question?

[vague stone]

tbf if you think about it socialist principles can benefit rich people too

[cerulean hazel]

what is tbf?

[vague stone]

to be fair

[cerulean hazel]

Revolutionary socailist principles or organizing and power dynamics are dymaterically oppsoed to rich people. How would it benifit the Capitalist who are richt now?

[vague stone]

if i was a millionnaire in a country that had decent free healthcare i would choose that over spending thousands in a private hospital

that was one of the only examples i can come up with tbh

[cerulean hazel]

And it is not true in a dialectial sense of the material conditions of being a millionaire. I better recommend you a video bescause the information is hard to summarize.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNHzVeC7jeY About dialectics and why the "rich" a.ka. capitalist can only oppose socialist development by there contradictions of existence

Laters have to go offline

[vague stone]

ty

[wooden surge]

oh my god

[cerulean hazel]

Here is a timelapse, i do not see how a 30 timelapse would be useful for my yet.

[cerulean hazel]

What is oh my god?

[willow aspen]

@brazen flame

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPgu8cZyYtw

[brazen flame]

lol I started laughing the first 15 seconds

[willow aspen]

Its funny

I like her music though

[brazen flame]

i don´t understand the lyrics!

[willow aspen]

Its mostly socio-political commentary but I like the lyrics

[brazen flame]

oh no!

[willow aspen]

Rythm is fine

[glossy lance]

Marxist 💀

No puedo hablar en politica tengo suficiente advertencias 😢

[lapis dome]

vine al tienda y comprá algunas cosas para mi,ahora estoy hablando con mi padre y el me quiere a revirtir allî y comprar alguién más jaja

ahora solo quiero descansar

[tawdry goblet]

I'd say the reasons I dislike it are:

1. It takes from other artists without permission - usually thousands and thousands of them
2. Environmental affects (I'm not as knowledgeable about this, but from everything I've seen, running the AI takes a lot of energy.)
3. Takes away jobs from actual artists

I'm not one of those people who go to art galleries and thinks "I could easily paint that simple-looking painting, it's barely art" or "That's just a pile of sweets, it's not art". I believe many things can be art, but AI image generators are not creating art.

I would argue that AI being pushed on everyone is part of capitalism.
It's in all the technology ads - "check it out! This phone has AI!", the advertisements you see on YouTube and other social media - "Talk to a chatbot!", "use this AI to edit your resume!", it's all over every website that's been deteriorating due to corporate greed - (Deviant Art's dreamup, Twitter/X's grok, etc.)

Because it costs money to hire artists, voice actors, etc. People use AI

And who owns the AI? The companies.

Artists both small and large suffer because people hire them less and companies profit.

There's a whole argument to be had about how AI imagery is soulless and lacks intent, and though I agree with it, too

If AI was completely free to use and we lived in a world where everyone was cared for and didn't have to struggle for basic necessities, I'd still be against it, but definitely less so.

It still takes from artists without permission or credit. My issue with that isn't legality, but rather, morality/ethics. I believe it's better to credit people, but that doesn't automatically mean I love copyright.

The way it's currently being used is detrimental & uncontrolled. Especially deepfakes of video and audio.

iirc, Disney is suing one of the AI companies for copyright infringement, and the company's response was essentially, "How can we know what artists we're stealing from? There's just too many to count!"

For the record, I loathe Disney just as much as anyone else.

[slim thunder]

@dense rover

[dense rover]

Wag1

[slim thunder]

How to know you're english

[tawdry goblet]

Also, small note, "automation"?

[slim thunder]

Basically the venezuelans didn't come here rich, the government made them rich and gave them incentives and prioritized them over chileans (and businesses did too)

[tawdry goblet]

Artists don't care about making things with efficiency in a mechanical way

[slim thunder]

They received money from the government and it's easier to hire a venezuelan immigrant than to hire a local

[bleak latch]

actually I hate AI art because it's ugly and soulless (for me)

[slim thunder]

AI art is meaningless

I don't care about art that was algorithmically formulated by a machine

Art is special because humans make it

[bleak latch]

AI puts the "L" in "Art"

[willow aspen]

Loser,, heh,,,,

[dense rover]

They received money because they're refugees or because the chilean government gives money to all immigrants?

[tawdry goblet]

That too, but if you say it's soulless, religion is gonna get brought in, amongst other things

[bleak latch]

Eso Brad

[tawdry goblet]

This, too.

[willow aspen]

https://tenor.com/view/brad-buttowski-kick-buttowski-yeah-brad-paxidermist-made-by-paxidermist-gif-9297339205537396643

Brad se parece a mi hermano

[slim thunder]

Because they're venezuelan

[willow aspen]

Anybody trying to shill that AI art is non-problematic is lowkey just trynna sell you smoke

[slim thunder]

They said "sorry you're in a bad situation, come here and we'll boost you up"

[dense rover]

Any Venezuelan that arrives in Chile gets money for being Venezuelan and no other reason?

[tawdry goblet]

I don't care if it looks like a like a child's drawing. It has effort and love put into it

[willow aspen]

And I'm 99% sure that you can dog-whistle right wing thoughts with the use of AI art

Like I SWEAR on it

[slim thunder]

It's a special benefit they made for them because of where they came from

[willow aspen]

For some reason they think AI art is good

[bleak latch]

I have no problem with AI users as long as they keep that shit away from me

[dense rover]

TBF Venezuela is shit

[willow aspen]

Well we kdo know why they use it

[willow aspen]

Tbh I just wished it didn't take shit from people via theft

if tehy actually paid the poor bastards for the database I'd be happy

All industry wastes a fuck ton of water that's just ... normal sadly

[dense rover]

Replace "AI Users" with "Gay people", sounds bad doesn't it? Think about that before you say something mean :'(

[tawdry goblet]

I don't know if you've noticed, but it's kind of spread to everywhere. Especially when searching on the internet

I have come across many Ai-generated websites when looking for something

Many AI images, too

[willow aspen]

LOL

[slim thunder]

They gave them incentives to get housing too which drove all the prices up and pushed out the locals, because a venezuelan buying up a home with money given by the government obviously artificially inflates the cost of living, and venezuelans are willing to pay way more because they have so much more to spend

[tawdry goblet]

Gay people are cool, however

[bleak latch]

Actually we should replace AI Users with gay people

the world would be better

[willow aspen]

TRUE

[tawdry goblet]

Agree lol

[frozen mason]

Actually i tyink the USA did something similar, they would give citizenship but i think obama stopped that last i recall? Or maybe that was the cubans

[willow aspen]

@tawdry goblet I Like Your Fursona

[slim thunder]

And since Chile wasn't prepared for so many new ppl coming in, all the social services and benefits were overpopulated by immigrants

[tawdry goblet]

Not my fursona, just a character, but thank you lol

[slim thunder]

It's the reason you have to wait over a year to get anything done

[willow aspen]

Make it your fursona

Now

[tawdry goblet]

(character I made but they aren't me)

[willow aspen]

too late

[tawdry goblet]

My actual sona isn't furry, but they're not exactly human either

[frozen mason]

I remember my boss telling me abt it. Smthn abt if ur from a country with a sucky government

[frozen mason]

Oh so thats the beef that chile has then

[slim thunder]

Basically

And it also significantly drove up the crime rates

[frozen mason]

[slim thunder]

Now I must make the disclaimer that I have nothing against venezuelans and I'm simply stating why tensions are so high

[dense rover]

You've convinced me now

I've never met a Venezuelan but if I see one in the street I'll shout at them

[slim thunder]

[dense rover]

For you ❤️‍🔥

[frozen mason]

NOOOO

They are my homies

Just politely say “Dont go to chile”

[dense rover]

STAY AWAY FROM CHILE THEY GIVE YOU FREE MONEY

[slim thunder]

I do not condone any mistreatment of innocent law-abiding people

[willow aspen]

I Do . . . Beat Up EVERYBODY .

[dense rover]

Of course you don't

WINK

[frozen mason]

Lowkey damn of i was venezolana i would too

[slim thunder]

I just wanna mention some funny nicknames have come out of this, like "Chilezuela" and "Chilombia" for example lol

[bleak latch]

oh we got the fun police over here

[dense rover]

Its nice that there's nicknames like that, I mostly just see people say Perukistan and nothing else

[bleak latch]

ay mi Cerrú

[slim thunder]

Also memes like "Santiago es la capital de Venezuela" and "Caracas es la capital de Chile" lol

[frozen mason]

Perukistan damn

Everybody just be mixing nowadays

[dense rover]

Mí juego favorito, Perú o Marte

[frozen mason]

I love that name.. Santiago

There’s an ecuadorian at my work named that and everytime i say that name i feel like

[slim thunder]

The US has a Santiago too

In Washington

[frozen mason]

https://tenor.com/view/yoonchae-katseye-gabriela-telenovela-yoonchip-gif-12310667214491357623

[slim thunder]

There are a total of 6 Santiagos throughout the world

[obtuse flint]

Santiago del Estero>Santiago

[frozen mason]

https://tenor.com/view/katseye-gabriela-yoonchae-gif-13827179379619249058

[frozen mason]

I love that for me

Im going to all the santiagos

Fucking goated ass name

[slim thunder]

There is a Santiago in Spain, USA, Dominican Republic, Cuba, Chile, and Argentina

[frozen mason]

Amazing.

Finna see me posted up in Santiago bitch

[slim thunder]

Santiago de Chile can be fun to visit but I would never live there lol

[frozen mason]

Everyone get the Santiagos ready

[dense rover]

Santiago is Spanish for Saint James, so basically Epstein's paedo island is Little Santiago

Do with that what you will

[frozen mason]

Periodddddd

Thats so fire

[dense rover]

No, they were too young for that

[obtuse flint]

Devuelvan las malvinas y listo

[frozen mason]

Hispanic names be so like, goated for no reason

Fernanda is so fucking goated

[dense rover]

Devuelve a quién?

[obtuse flint]

Ana de armas

[frozen mason]

I like Fernanda better than fernando idk why

[obtuse flint]

A Argentina

[dense rover]

Argentina nunca tuvo las Falklands

[obtuse flint]

Si que las tuvimos

Las malvinas son una herencia del virreinato del Río de la plata

De cuando fuimos colonia de España

[dense rover]

"herencia"

[obtuse flint]

Y?

[dense rover]

Herencia no existe

[obtuse flint]

Es mejor herencia que robar

🏴‍☠️

[obtuse flint]

Fornai

[dense rover]

Si querés las Falklands, tomatelos innit

[obtuse flint]

?

Háblame en Ingles que se te entiende más así

[dense rover]

Uhhh agarrar?

If you want em, take em

Innit es inglés

Lo siento

[obtuse flint]

Cuando peleen solos tal vez

Pero si siempre va a estar su marido EEUU,La OTAN y la ONU no podemos hacer mucho.

Cuando peleen solos lo haremos

[dense rover]

Pero la ONU y la OTAN no ayudaron al RU, y los EEUU solo ayudaron un poquito

Con intel

[obtuse flint]

🤣?

Bro seriously thinks they fought alone

Even Chile helped you.

With Mirages decades older than their planes, we sank the shitty little ships they sent.

"HMS INVINCIBLE"

Destroyed by a pilot with a flying tractor

[dense rover]

All the military forces involved were either British or Argentine

[obtuse flint]

The United Kingdom would not win without the help of their husbands.

But it was all the fault of a dictatorship anyway.

@dense rover

[willow aspen]

Why are we beefing with the brits again

[obtuse flint]

Blame the Argentine dictatorship

[dense rover]

But we did!

[dense rover]

I do dw

When I went to Argentina everyone was lovely

[obtuse flint]

England and Argentina were almost always partners

In the late 1800s we had an economic boom solely thanks to U.K

[willow aspen]

I still don't think that dependency was any good

Even if the economy was "good"

[obtuse flint]

And the United Kingdom had begun negotiations in the mid-1900s with Argentine presidents to return the Falklands peacefully, unfortunately the dictatorship and war occurred.

Perón and the United Kingdom had practically reached an agreement but the man just died xD

[dense rover]

La gente dijo "de dónde sos" y luego dije "Birmingham Inglaterra, conoces a Aston Villa?" y dijo "Dibuuuuuu!"

[obtuse flint]

Here we only talk about football

[dense rover]

In England as well

[willow aspen]

Didn't the Argentinean dictatorship have backing by the USA goverment at the time

[obtuse flint]

La dependencia nos sirvió pero no supimos aprovechar

[bleak latch]

hay que devolvérselas a Francia

[obtuse flint]

Yes

[bleak latch]

sería gracioso

[willow aspen]

Sighhh its always the USA ruining shit for the global south

[obtuse flint]

Argentina logro gracias a las inversiones de Reino unido tener una o directamente la mejor red de ferrocarriles de la época en 1800

Teníamos los sistemas más modernos y avanzados

Todo pagado por reino unido

[willow aspen]

Y DESPUES LOS SACARON A LOS FERROCARILES

😭

[obtuse flint]

ARGENTINOS

[willow aspen]

CAMIONEROS PUTOS

[bleak latch]

Operación Condor 🗣️🔥

[obtuse flint]

Los ingleses y franceses invirtieron mucho

En Argentina

[dense rover]

Yeah if Argentina had waited 10 years then the Falklands would be Argentine, but they invaded and now everyone in the UK cares very strongly about the Falklands and they will be British forever

[willow aspen]

ODIO A LOS CAMIONEROS

[obtuse flint]

Son nuestros clásicos aliados

[obtuse flint]

We did not invade, it was a dictatorship

It's like blaming the Germans for Hitler.

You understand?

[dense rover]

I do blame the Germans for Hitler

[obtuse flint]

Well, it's not bad.

[willow aspen]

I really don't like th way these things are framed, the populace had no control over what the dictatorship did

[dense rover]

But a military dictatorship is different yes

[obtuse flint]

And on top of that it was put there by the United States.

[willow aspen]

It creates this stigma around Argentina that is just really fucking annoying to deal with

It inherently enables the british side to see things with a bad faithed perspective if you blame the people/country itself instead of the powers that took over it at the time

[obtuse flint]

In short, Argentina and the United Kingdom were allies even before Argentina existed, but Argentine dictatorships and socialist/communist governments ruined the friendship.

[dense rover]

Dw you guys I love Argentina I was just not being specific

[willow aspen]

I am aware

Its just that type of rhetoric is what causes the stigma

[obtuse flint]

United Kingom supported San Martín with resources and intel to help Argentina achieve independence.

That's why I say that the United Kingdom was already helping Argentina before it existed.

[willow aspen]

Wtf didn't they invade back then

[obtuse flint]

Si pero a los españoles

[willow aspen]

Oh yeah

[dense rover]

I think in the UK people very much know about the Argentine junta and they know that it wasn't the Argentine ppl who wanted war

[willow aspen]

True

[obtuse flint]

San Martín era masón

Se formó en Inglaterra

Siendo masón

Masonería del reino unido

[willow aspen]

Yeaaah that's just heavily overestimating the average education a country has

99% of people here don't know England isn't Argentina's enemy and I doubt it is much better there either

And I am not blaming specific school systems its just

Not logical to teach that kind of stuff at schools

Not efficient* I mean

[obtuse flint]

Friend, there were deaths of civilians here because of the dictatorship that was fighting against Argentine terrorists, so we were already tired of conflict, imagine adding a war to that.

[dense rover]

When I was a kid some kids in my school did a play about Los desaparecidos and las madres de la plaza de mayo

God knows why

Terrorists or freedom fighters? 🤔

[obtuse flint]

That was something we did to receive international aid, we made that case very famous.

[dense rover]

I'm reading El Eternauta at the moment

[willow aspen]

Weren't they commies

[dense rover]

Some were Peronists

[obtuse flint]

Terrorist= Montoneros
Civils
And La junta

[willow aspen]

Freedom Fighters then

[obtuse flint]

The Montoneros were fighting against the junta and in the middle there were civilian casualties.

[willow aspen]

But heh,, the USA got what it wanted and we fucking hate socialism

[dense rover]

The author of The Eternaut fought with the Montoneros and was killed by the Junta

And all his family too

Great comic

[obtuse flint]

Bad thing

[dense rover]

Very bold of you to say

[obtuse flint]

Luckily, Milei is now reestablishing relations with the West, especially the United States, but not so much with U.K.

[willow aspen]

Maaan I don't like what Milei is doing

[dense rover]

Milei has a very sensible stance towards the Falklands though which is nice

[willow aspen]

The USA is not a particularly pleasant place to be allies with

[obtuse flint]

Better than the previous ones at least it is

[willow aspen]

Specially considering that their culture is going to bleed into ours

I don't wanna hate gay people, man

[obtuse flint]

If it is for investments and militarily speaking yes

[obtuse flint]

We will never do that

[willow aspen]

Can't help but pray the USA economy goes to shit so we stop bootlicking the USA

[obtuse flint]

We were going to do that if we continued to join forces with Russia like the Kirchnerists.

Kirchnerism joined forces with countries that hated women and LGBTs.

Milei is the complete opposite.

[willow aspen]

Fair enough honestly

But the USA Is going down a path of repression towards its own people

[obtuse flint]

It is a lesser evil

[slim thunder]

My first name is French 💀

[willow aspen]

Lesser evil still a whole-ass evil

I just hope it doesn't bleed in what we believe culturally

Although it probably will

[obtuse flint]

We have no other great power that is our ally or wants to be one.

[willow aspen]

Argentina is like the N1 USA suck-up

[obtuse flint]

You always have to do it if it brings you advantages, otherwise screw them.

[willow aspen]

Ehhh, I suppose so

[obtuse flint]

There is no need to repeat 1860-1920.

[willow aspen]

I just hope whatever Milei is planning isn't just "lets make GDP bigger"

[obtuse flint]

Where thanks to the United States, France and England we became economic powers and we did not know how to take advantage of the opportunity

[slim thunder]

Southern cone in general

[obtuse flint]

We should have used the profits to invest in Argentina.

[willow aspen]

Yeah, sadly

[obtuse flint]

I don't know what the idiots did 🤣

[willow aspen]

We're basically lapdogs which is just annoying

[obtuse flint]

Fucking radicals I guess

[dense rover]

Can you guys sort your shit out so I can move to Mendoza please

[willow aspen]

Lol that's not going to happen any time soon

[obtuse flint]

Note that Chile did the same with the U.K and even gave them territory.

[willow aspen]

Well yeah

[slim thunder]

Chile sold itself out to everybody

[dense rover]

Chile gave us territory?

[obtuse flint]

No, U.K to chile

[dense rover]

Oic, we gave Chile territory?

[obtuse flint]

Yes

[dense rover]

I didn't know

[obtuse flint]

Canal Beagle

[dense rover]

Which territories

[obtuse flint]

The United Kingdom came to help Chile.

[slim thunder]

We don't own our own water or natural resources lmao

[willow aspen]

South America entered the global picture way too late to actually have a strong start with dealing with the world economy

[obtuse flint]

Without the help of the United Kingdom, Chile would not have had that territory.

[willow aspen]

If only they had discovered the americas sooner

"discovered"

We'd be better off

[dense rover]

Guess who is the only other country in the world with private water?

[obtuse flint]

Nobody does it 🤣

[dense rover]

England WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[obtuse flint]

Gaza

Palestine

[willow aspen]

The USA also has privately owned water reserves

Which is fucking baffling

That's what late-stage capitalism gets you though

[obtuse flint]

Guess who is bicontinental

Argentine woooi

[dense rover]

Antarctica doesn't count haha

[willow aspen]

I will never understand how people can be overtly proud of the country they come from

That's such a huge weakness for people to have

[dense rover]

It's irrational but idc I love England

[willow aspen]

All countries are utter garbage and do not their best to fullfil their democratic purpose of representing the people

[dense rover]

There are many great things about England, I am English therefore those great things are part of me

[willow aspen]

Which makes liking them so irrational

[dense rover]

Ignore the bad stuff

[teal horizon]

I think I never loved my country because I always kind of knew how cold it was

[willow aspen]

Culture should not equate country

I also don't like how we tie those two things together

[dense rover]

Culture usually closely follows borders in Europe

Whereas it's different in other places

[willow aspen]

Not anymore with the globalization of the world

Culture should stop being tied to country and land its

So annoying

It adds value and excuse to things that shouldn't be valuable or excused

"ooo i love argentinean culture so i love the country"

Country is shit

[dense rover]

British culture spreading throughout the world just means everyone can get a small window into other countries cultures, but the culture doesn't leave the country unless there's lots of emigration which doesn't always happen

[bleak latch]

except for URUGUAY 🗣️ 🔥 🔥 🔥 ‼️

[willow aspen]

Oh yeah I can still feel the effects of British culture everywhere I go

[dense rover]

You can feel the effects of it yeah, but that's a different thing

[willow aspen]

Shudders in imperialism

[willow aspen]

You have to admit all Latin American countries do not reach their full potential ever

[dense rover]

We were only slightly imperialistic in Argentina 😈

[willow aspen]

Nothing here is anywhere near as close to good as it could be

[dense rover]

Colonialism not me, raves though that's me

[obtuse flint]

La cultura de Argentina rn: e' gato vamo' a fuma' un fasito

[willow aspen]

Why would you say something like that in such a way

[willow aspen]

Its so OVER bro

[dense rover]

Because being facetious is part of my culture innit

[obtuse flint]

Por eso es que me quiero ir 🤣

Que se vaya a la mrd

No es la Argentina con la que crecí supongo

[willow aspen]

Sighhh and to think I once fell in love with a brit

[bleak latch]

yeah that's true (||except for URUGUAY 🗣️||)

[dense rover]

Q significa gato en este contexto

[willow aspen]

Nadie que siga vivo crecio con una "buena argentina" JAJAJJA

[obtuse flint]

Yo si

Bueno al menos lo q me rodeaba

Después

[willow aspen]

La "buena argentina" nunca existio

[obtuse flint]

Cada vez q salgo a la calle veo puros turros

[willow aspen]

Actuamos como si las cosas eran mejores antes pero eso es una farsa increible

[obtuse flint]

Para mí la Argentina turística es algo que queda

[dense rover]

We have great fun over here

[willow aspen]

La Argentina turistica es una poronga

[bleak latch]

Yo sí, porque nací en URUGUAY 🗣️

[obtuse flint]

Crecí yendo de vacaciones a las playas de Buenos Aires y era hermoso

[willow aspen]

No hay mucho que ver acá

[bleak latch]

bueno ya fue

[obtuse flint]

En el sur si hay que ver

[willow aspen]

Obvio viviste en la buena argentina si sos provincia

[dense rover]

For all the imperialism there doesn't exist a single country in the world that can do a pub properly (except for Ireland)

What a waste

[obtuse flint]

Q

[dense rover]

The pubs in Mendoza were shit sorry

[obtuse flint]

Pubs q era

[willow aspen]

Bares

[obtuse flint]

Lo estoy confundiendo con otra cosa

Ahh

[dense rover]

Bares pero no bares

[obtuse flint]

Puticlubs pensé que decía

[willow aspen]

You do realize the concept of "Pub" you have in your mind is exclusively british right
Thus no other place can actually match that expectation right

[obtuse flint]

Ni idea del tema no estuve en England

[dense rover]

It's Irish too, but lots of countries around the world have "English and Irish Pubs" so

And they're all bad

[bleak latch]

La provincia de la prosperidad y los Youtubers pedorros

[dense rover]

Which is what I'm saying

[obtuse flint]

Argentina

[willow aspen]

I am saddened by the fact people want to try and import shitty european culture into a place like this

Too bad we genocided the fucking native population

We'd probably have some decent culture if not

[obtuse flint]

Y ahora nos están matando a nosotros 🤣

[willow aspen]

A que te referis

[obtuse flint]

Los mapuches

[dense rover]

It's not that deep, I'm just saying we had all this imperialism and yet I still can't get a decent pint so what was the whole point

[obtuse flint]

En la patagonia

Se están haciendo polenta a los Chilenos y Argentinos

[willow aspen]

Ay gracias a dios

[willow aspen]

Nah it really goes that deep

[bleak latch]

Why didn't a cooler European nation decide to colonize and spread its culture like Poland or Romania

[willow aspen]

Cultural indepence is like the first step for south america to stop being the backwater neighbourhood of the world

[obtuse flint]

No gracias amigo los edificios en Romania son un asco

[dense rover]

I'm just saying if a place calls itself an English pub then it should be like an English pub yknow

[obtuse flint]

Que se vaya a la mierda la cultura

Prefiero q tengamos plata

[willow aspen]

I am saying that those places should not exist anywhere outside of england

Fuck that shit

[dense rover]

Damn, you hate curry houses too?

[willow aspen]

Jajaja no te va a servir de una mierda la plata si tratas de vivir como yankee

No podes mantener el mismo estandard de vida

[willow aspen]

I don't like cultural imports

Or exportation either

[dense rover]

Multiculturalism is fun you should try it

[willow aspen]

Yeah I
I am doing that

[obtuse flint]

Quien dijo que quiero vivir como yankee

[willow aspen]

And I now damn well I don't like it

[obtuse flint]

Yo quiero vivir en algún campito

[willow aspen]

Creo que no te entendí mala mia

[obtuse flint]

Tipo los Alpes suizos

Una re paz

Sin que nadie me rompa los huevos

Todo verde

Todo naturaleza

[willow aspen]

No vas a poder vivir así

[obtuse flint]

Yo si

Me gusta la tranquilidad

[willow aspen]

NO va a quedar montaña o campo lindo en el que estar

[obtuse flint]

Por?

[willow aspen]

Si es que no se vende toda la tierra antes de eso

Cambio climatico flaco

Destrucción del medio ambiente

[obtuse flint]

Eso es una boludez

[willow aspen]

La pampa esta hecha pelota seguro

Si vos decis que es una boludez

[obtuse flint]

Sigue haciendo el mismo calor en veranos que 1990

[dense rover]

Wait so should I stop drinking mate

[obtuse flint]

Pasa que ahora somos más sensibles

[willow aspen]

No me digas que pensas que s mentira

Noooo flaco quien te dijo esto

Me voy a poner a llorar

[obtuse flint]

Los 38° de los 90 se sienten como 60° ahora

[willow aspen]

De donde sacaste esto

[bleak latch]

si el calentamiento global es real entonces por qué tengo un re frío?

[obtuse flint]

No digo que es mentira, pero que no es tan grave

[willow aspen]

You do whatever you want

[willow aspen]

Ese tipo de pensamiento nos va a hacer mierda jajaja

[obtuse flint]

Y si pero que querés que haga

No tengo un sope

[willow aspen]

Reza para que si tenes familia tengan donde vivir

[obtuse flint]

Y las empresas no van a dejar la industrialización

[obtuse flint]

No quiero tener familia la verdad