lore-discussion

[plucky juniper]

gods in calamity do leave behind a lot of stuff after death

[raven brook]

That could be cool yeah

[spare pier]

I mean yeah but that's also very out of scope

[raven brook]

Ways to show what remains of Shakidou, even if minor

Could be relatively small additions i feel like maybe a item or two related to them

[plucky juniper]

and this is genuinely such a problem that yharim had to find countermeasures to this, like the Wall of Flesh and good ol' DoG

[raven brook]

Maybe you could find Shakidou's weapon of choice abandoned somewhere and use it for yourself idfk

[plucky juniper]

point is

[west plume]

i think once you read the shakidou story you'll figure out why they are different

[spare pier]

This I could see, yeah

[raven brook]

If Shakidou was a god that had any sort of loved ones or followers, maybe a small structure, shrine-style, that is a sort of burial ground with their weapon laying on it, and then during the late/endgame you can find a way to unlock some sort of seal on it and use the weapon for yourself

[west plume]

the lack of remains is of narrative and character development importance

[raven brook]

Because i mean they were the second strongest guy

[plucky juniper]

lemme guess emptiness or something

[raven brook]

if you were to use their weapon it'd probably be near the endgame

[plucky juniper]

ANYHOW

point is that ya i think shakidou should be more than a jobber for yharim

[west plume]

maybe we messed up by acquiring shonen fans

[hollow pivot]

I was just thinking about a Shakidou Weapon.

[spare pier]

LMAO

In all honesty though I kinda just disagree that Shakidou existing primarily to lose to Yharim makes them in any way a lesser character so long as, y'know, they're well written

[hollow pivot]

Could be around Yharon level.

[raven brook]

whitebeard in one piece showed up in marineford and died in that same arc

hes one of the best damn characters in the whole manga

he had some very minor appearances before yeah but ygwim

a character's role in the story can be relatively brief and as long as it's well written it can still have a massive impact

[spare pier]

Characters fulfill narrative purposes, and sometimes the narrative purpose is to work as a foil to another and as a stepping stone in order to reach their goal. What a good writer does is exactly make so the character feels larger than their role in the story

[hollow pivot]

What about that Gold Roger guy?

[plucky juniper]

alas. lore implementation issue results in shakidou being inadvertedly becoming a pure jobber and nothing more

[raven brook]

his role in the story is different but can be seen as another good example

[plucky juniper]

💥

[raven brook]

lore implementation issues

what issues though

It feels like you're just assuming that the devs can't do implementation well, tbh

[plucky juniper]

issue (singular)

[raven brook]

Still

[plucky juniper]

its a lore implementation issue because it hasnt been implemented

[raven brook]

oh, lol

[west plume]

and you think including shakidou's weapon will fix this and somehow tell you more intuitively about shakidou as a person

?

[hollow pivot]

People are more likely to remember characters with cool items ngl.

[raven brook]

hey the shakidou weapon was my idea

i just think it'd be cool ...

[west plume]

it would be p cool

[plucky juniper]

well if you make it cool as fuck sure

[eager bluff]

ok but only if said weapon is like actually relevant to them as a character

[west plume]

wouldn't that just be cool content rather than cool literature..?

[rain osprey]

what if shakidou's weapons summoned shakidou and you could right click him to get a full monologue about him

[plucky juniper]

i think what cheese was trying to go by is that hypothetical shakidou weapon would have one of those cool lore blurbs underneath certain weapons like the SHPC

and honestly

[eager bluff]

if jetstream sam never visibly used murasama and you were only ever told that he uses murasama people wouldnt see murasama and think of him

[raven brook]

what if shakidou weapon summoned shakidou and he started telling you about the industrial revolution and its consequences

[plucky juniper]

i think the weapon of the second-mightiest god of them all would be pretty legendary

shakidou weapon summons the horrible hog

[rain osprey]

i mean i can do that

not a very impressive lore character tbh

[eager bluff]

like thats the issue its really hard to deeply connect a weapon to a character when all you have to go off of is "yeah this belonged to this one guy once"

[spare pier]

Damn...

[plucky juniper]

this chat is swinging between serious arguments about writing and memery

🤣

[west plume]

that's kinda what it would be for shakidou. a weapon they Used rather than Ultradeath Skyslayer God Punisher with 2,000 lines of lore

[plucky juniper]

-1 electrons from each of kiri's atoms

[west plume]

people like Yharim get named weapons because they do actually fantasize and hold feelings toward them

[rain osprey]

y'all are having a serious discussion tho and i am just memeing, so i should probably dip

have a nice discussion

[feral skiff]

the pendulum of lore-discussion is that it’s either completely serious, or people are just memeing

[plucky juniper]

i feel like the better thing to say is
"if jetstream sam was dead before the events of the game, and you somehow still got the murasama and did the same cool shit you do with it..."

okay at that rate people would just be like "Yeah, this sword is fucking cool. I wonder what its previous owner was like."

[agile matrix]

hold on is this like a "i know that i will die (said from perspective of Shakidou)" or "we know they will die (said from perspective of The Reader)"

[spare pier]

I don't really mean in either

[plucky juniper]

@agile matrix it was a response to this

[agile matrix]

... what is a jobber

[plucky juniper]

okay

[west plume]

shonen powerscaling brainrot

/ fridging

[agile matrix]

what

just explain the word ..

[west plume]

its not very meaningful

[plucky juniper]

it originated from wrestling and is largely used to describe characters who seem to only serve to hype up another character (by losing to the latter)

[eager bluff]

fridging is a literary term that refers to the action of meaninglessly killing a character close to another character for the sole purpose of giving them further motivation

[agile matrix]

ooooh.

[agile matrix]

aaaaah.

[eager bluff]

fridging as a term comes from an old spiderman comic where the main villain just kinda kills i think mj but it might have been gwen stacy and shoves her in a fridge in peters apartment

[plucky juniper]

jobbing can be really obnoxious in a situation where a character is hyped up for a long while, only for someone else to show up and utterly obliterate them

[agile matrix]

could the jobbing be an inside jobbing

[agile matrix]

where the character knows they're fucked but the protag does not

[west plume]

yes

see jjk

[plucky juniper]

no thats from a green lantern comic

[agile matrix]

awesome. the main antag of my series has an inside job with A Random Friendly Character Of Yours

[eager bluff]

was it? it seems like an average tuesday for spiderman which is probably why i attributed it there

[plucky juniper]

ya

[spare pier]

In a story, all characters exist for a reason. Characters have narrative roles and they fulfill those narrative roles in whatever way necessary.

For example, Raditz in Dragon Ball exists to be an introduction to Saiyans, increase the scope of the story and also serve as an opponent to Goku and Piccolo to fight, + several other minor roles.

The thing is, to the audience, characters should be characters, not simply narrative roles that the author commands. It is the writer's job to make the character be more than their narrative role, and to feel as such from the reader's perspective, while still accomplishing their goal for the sake of the story's integrity.

My argument previously was simply that a character existing for a role (in this case, and using the same wording, to hype up Yharim) is fine so long as the character is meaningful and feels like they exist for more reasons than simply die to Yharim to hype him up.

[agile matrix]

if a character dies to the Big Guy, it should be like "Important Dude Died To Another Important Dude", not "Oh look another Important Dude Kill"

do i have that correct

[plucky juniper]

some characters can be jobbed and thats entirely okay

but i doubt shakidou is one of those

which is why i graciously await shakidou ingame lore drops

[agile matrix]

i am excited to see more god stuff other than like

what the three i know of

how many actual God things do we the terrarian interact w/

[raven brook]

God things is a bit vague

is it just gods themselves? do god adjacent items, enemies, and biomes count

[agile matrix]

yea God Adjacents

Silva Armor, Providence The Profaned Goddess

[spare pier]

It's more like you shouldn't be thinking about either of those and rather you should be immersed and think whatever the author wants you to rather than look at the inner machinations of a story

[agile matrix]

like either by name or by domain so thoroughly that its Them

[raven brook]

alot !

[agile matrix]

i WOULD say perfs/hive mind but they're. not Dogma/War enough.

[raven brook]

Alot of stuff is connected to gods in some way and it'd be kind of a hassle to list all of it

[plucky juniper]

also dont forget that this includes eoc, boc, and eow

[raven brook]

Those two are some of the MOST god adjacent things in the entire game

[agile matrix]

okya when i say "god adjacent" i mean "at least mostly related to their domain"

like Silva. or Providence and her entire thing

[plucky juniper]

i personally am still iffy on eoc being a god adjacent thing

[raven brook]

they literally are about as close as can get to actual gods without being one. Arguably you could say they stil are gods, just mutilated horribly and amalgamated

[west plume]

you kill 2 imperfectly ascended gods, 1 ascended auric dragon, several dragon offshoots, 1 god offshoot, and 4 essence creatures

[agile matrix]

which 2? i know of Ravager

also ascended auric dragon?

[raven brook]

Yharon

[agile matrix]

? what does that mean

[spare pier]

Well, one auric dragon

[plucky juniper]

but only because i dont think the idea of a piece of cthluhu(adjacent figure) still living on needed to be replaced

[agile matrix]

i didnt know Yharon could Ascend i thought he'd polterghast

[spare pier]

"Ascended auric dragon" is redundant

[raven brook]

All auric dragons are ascended p much yeah

[west plume]

auric dragons are ascendees that happen to be dragons and i forgor for a second because 'ascended god' is a term

[raven brook]

they absorbed a world soul fragment and became, auric

[agile matrix]

oooh.

i hear "ascension" and think "i ate a soul and sat near a rock"

[spare pier]

Is it? It's only a term if you add the perfect/imperfect part

[raven brook]

I mean from what we know what they did pretty much is identical to what the gods did, just with different components

the ritual itself mightve been diferent but we dunno

[west plume]

we have non-ascended beings referred to as gods in-game, like astrum deus

[agile matrix]

yees.

[spare pier]

True enough

[agile matrix]

god-like :)

[plucky juniper]

h h

[raven brook]

i think using ascended gods as a term is cool and good actually and would work to help reduce the stigma this chat has against acnowledging the possibility of other beings as in fact being gods in their own right

[agile matrix]

see this is why i say "auric god" when referring to the ones that ate a dragon soul

becaus theyre god of auric thingy. theres other creatures that could be considered Like A God

Like A Dragon. Yakuza

[raven brook]

auric god i dont think is a very good term because "auric soul" is a term for the souls of the dragons explicitly

ascsended works better i think

the souls of gods and dragons are fundamentally different because of the extra layer of uh. soul. that the gods have

which is also why theyre unstable and all that

[west plume]

ascended also sees past all of the propaganda dragons put into their language

[plucky juniper]

reminder that the only provided reason gods are called gods is because supposedly xeroc called himself the first god

[raven brook]

essentially 2 souls in one vs essentially 3 souls in one

[agile matrix]

i routed it as
auric dragon -> god-to-be
auric dragon -> god-to-be
auric god to-be

[raven brook]

supposedly

[plucky juniper]

i chose my words carefully, god-worshipper.

and yet, still!

[agile matrix]

teehee. i support no one. im with draedon on this one he's making cool machines and also Worms

[raven brook]

ever since a epiphany that garion made me realize the other day

everytime i think of yharim saying "he called himself the first god" in regards to xeroc i just think of that image

[west plume]

Auric Dragons are Golden, or Great, Dragons. they made the term because they started to view themselves as the only righteous dragons of sorts which is why they didn't recognize other dragons as anything but draconids and offshoots

[spare pier]

Hum?

What Was It?

[raven brook]

She made a small little observation that made me think

Idrm the exact quote but

"A better qeustion would be if Xeroc even said that in the first place."or something

and from that on i realized oh shit yeah he would NOT say that

[spare pier]

I See

[raven brook]

Anyways as ive said before i stand by the idea that Dogma was the first one to actually refer to himself as a God because it fits him like a damn glove

[plucky juniper]

honestly i find the idea of xeroc calling himself the first god, only to immediately fuck off into space is really fucking funny

[west plume]

so the term auric retroactively refers to Ascended Dragon but from a literal perspective it would be Superior Dragon

[agile matrix]

i heard Garion and mis remembered it as Geryon

[west plume]

i mean. what else were they supposed to do

[plucky juniper]

...you could also say that they are long lived, and thefore you could call them...

elder dragons?

[west plume]

nuh uh

[agile matrix]

wait auric means something in their eyes

[plucky juniper]

coward

[agile matrix]

i thought it was just a nothing word that they made up to be called cool

[raven brook]

Auric literally means Golden i nreal life

[west plume]

^

they were just straight up calling themselves Golden Dragons to self-aggrandize

[agile matrix]

okay so you gotta realize i entirely forget that roman adjectives had possessives

Draconis Aurum is, in my eyes, Grammatically Correct

despite yes that says Dragon Gold

[west plume]

i would more or less blame Dogma for the God thing since mr. religion saw a way to gain fundamentally infinite magic power and said 'I can market this as religion'

[raven brook]

yeah no it fits him so perfectly

Specially given he weas iirc one of the first ever imperfect gods if not The first

right after xeroc ascended

so it's just

[west plume]

ye

[raven brook]

so perfect for him to have been the one to popularize the term "god" in this context

he had both the political influence to do it and came early enough in history to make it as widespread as it is plus he's godamn John Dogma WHO ELSE BUT HIM

xeroc did NOT say that shit ill die on this hll

[spare pier]

I Suppose I Can Temporarily Use My Profile Picture In Our Main Profile

I Would Like To Debut It Anyways

[rain osprey]

hi kanaya

[raven brook]

hi kanya

[agile matrix]

i find it really funny that xeroc, according to monseiur "I SAY NOTHING BUT TRUTH!!!!!! TRUST ME!!!!!!!!" and mista "all i say is truth. you gotta listen to me man", killed basically his best friend and immediately went "yup. thats me. im the fuckin best."

[dusk laurel]

hi kan

[spare pier]

Hi

[agile matrix]

ythink yharim got his propoganda skills from dogma

some of the Dogma Dirt got in his eyes and he realized he's really good at lying

[plucky juniper]

i would like to debut my new favorite gif

[agile matrix]

and some of the War Warts got in his face and "wow i can kill people really hard now. awesome."

[spare pier]

This Is A Good Gif

[plucky juniper]

what a horrific gif man

i love it so goddamn much

its so fucked up

[spare pier]

It Falls Short Of Carnys Gif Though

[raven brook]

thats the yahiamice that spy is a horse gif i posted it

[plucky juniper]

carny's... what?

[spare pier]

@unborn wind

[rain osprey]

https://tenor.com/view/my-child-will-gif-25175630

how's this one

[raven brook]

7.5/10

[agile matrix]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1116701602816999496/1319078668336894043/RDT_20241213_1302082086842006065424767.gif

[spare pier]

https://tenor.com/view/frog-eat-sudden-funny-stupid-gif-25483215

[agile matrix]

do we like this gif that REFUSES TO EMBED.

(its the entire first spongebob movie :])

[plucky juniper]

this one is god-tier too

[spare pier]

It Is

[raven brook]

this one is s tier 10/10 i love froggy

[raven brook]

-1/10

[unborn wind]

Just fuck of...

[plucky juniper]

i love how you dont even see the face of the green guy, yet you still know exactly who he is

[agile matrix]

what in the uhm

uhhh.

what its

fuckin called.

[rain osprey]

i know this is a joke but it's a little reductive

i'm only bringing it up because i want to talk about it because i think yharim and dogma can be interesting showcases of how propaganda works and how different leaders will use different messaging and tactics to win over their populace

yharim and dogma can both be charismatic and manipulative leaders in very different ways and those different ways are fun to explore

[agile matrix]

what the fuck is the game called...

the really like. crass artstyle

2000s website style....

[unborn wind]

cruelty squad??

[agile matrix]

YES THANK YOU

[spare pier]

Now That You Say It

[agile matrix]

what in the cruelty squad

[spare pier]

It Is Very Cruelty Squad Core

[simple tangle]

i like hogs

[spare pier]

Maybe Terezi Would Like To Play That Game

[simple tangle]

i still need to play cruelty squad

[plucky juniper]

okay but first show her the fucking spy horse gif

[spare pier]

The What?

[plucky juniper]

.

[glacial rampart]

Hiya kanaya

[unborn wind]

anyways im getting out of here now i depart wtigh the message: "i love yharim i hope he gets tortured for ten thousand years"

[raven brook]

I think you can accomplish both tbh

[rain osprey]

can't leave, sorry

i trapped you here

[plucky juniper]

he gets tortured because he's forced to watch stupid cursed gif like those just recently shared

[raven brook]

There can be parallels between Dogma and Yharim's manipulation while still being distinctly different in how they operate, and Yharim's manipulative prowess could still be developed in part from Dogma's influence while still being his own form of it

[spare pier]

She Has Seen

[spare pier]

We Do Not Have Memory Lapses

[plucky juniper]

good.

[agile matrix]

can you humor me on this

[spare pier]

If Any One Of Us Sees Something All Of Us Do

[agile matrix]

its like 11 pm but i am curious what you mean by their methods are different

[west plume]

Any One Of Us???

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/568192082473386020/1491677472062967938/spyhorse.gif?ex=69d89067&is=69d73ee7&hm=59c5a21468c95ac18f6630f5fe1f17bcceb5aec76825ff722913fbc928538a89&

[agile matrix]

last of us

[spare pier]

God Damn It

[agile matrix]

i dont get this joke i wont lie

[west plume]

how have u guys not watched meet the spy

[plucky juniper]

there is probably a difference between stalinist propaganda and christian extremist propaganda

[raven brook]

I didn't say their methods are different, i'm saying they could be

There are Different ways one can manipulate others in real life

[agile matrix]

these are too big a word. explain overabundantly

[raven brook]

gaslighting, guilt-tripping, etc

[agile matrix]

well yeah but how would they be

[raven brook]

sorry i'm not explaining all the diff ways manipulation can exist rn

[rain osprey]

I can't think of a good way to word this, but it also highlight's Yharim's hypocrisy more

[raven brook]

i gave u 2 examples if you wanna see more of them you can look it up on google i genuinely dont have the energy to do allat

[rain osprey]

Something something we aren't so different you and I

[plucky juniper]

i reckon propaganda from an religious extremist is different from propaganda from an "nonreligious" authoritarian state

[west plume]

i wouldnt say yharim or the crusade are nonreligious

[plucky juniper]

there is obv gonna be similarities, but theres still differences

[raven brook]

the usage of the term crusade to describe it kinda inherently puts it at a religious position i think

[plucky juniper]

extremists have diversity (they're gonna hate that I pointed this out) in their beliefs

[raven brook]

and really if you just replace dragons with gods it becomes pretty obvious

[plucky juniper]

this works even with religious extremists

[rain osprey]

the crusade was absolutely religious, but they, like many other groups throughout history would not call it that

[raven brook]

yep

lul

[west plume]

i think its funny that sometimes people read yharim as nonreligious

like.. you think 100 year crusade guy is famous for scientific process and rhetoric

[rain osprey]

yharim is a reddit atheist i think

[agile matrix]

aah i see

[plucky juniper]

oh and btw theres a reason i put nonreligious in quotes

[dusk laurel]

yharim is not nonreligious hes "my religion is better than your religion and also you guys ruined the order that the dragons provided so i have to kill your entire race unless you betray each other :/"

[mighty zenith]

i think its cause like
people usually associate religion with believing in a god/gods

[plucky juniper]

iseralrngjeksrnmg

[mighty zenith]

even though non-theistic religions are a thing

[plucky juniper]

its fuckin that again

its always fucking that

and thats about it i gotta go away

good night homies

[thick slate]

joe bart

[pulsar ocean]

are atheists in cal verse like flat earthers

[thick slate]

yharim is an atheist

[split mortar]

Your melongun is showing i think

[eternal veldt]

Does he simp for queen bees?

[split mortar]

Around the mid point iirc but that was a while ago and could have changed

[wanton pendant]

Teto.

[split mortar]

This gives me the funny image of xeroc being confused why he would get called a god if they ever interacted with terraria people

[wanton pendant]

"How the HELL am I being worshipped?"
"Don't worry, I made sure you weren't."
"WHO THE HELL ARE YOU!?"

[cloud ibex]

i'm gonna throw rocks at you

[wheat walrus]

do it buddy

throw rocks at saifus for saying that

[late veldt]

doesn't one of the Draedon labs have the fully upgraded (vanilla) diving helmet in it lmao

[wanton pendant]

Not anymore.

[robust osprey]

used to

[sharp pulsar]

About how old is the old duke?

[dusk laurel]

we dunno, minimum of 2000 years

[robust osprey]

very old

[late veldt]

I see

Why did calamity give you so many random accessories for free? Is it stupid?

[dusk laurel]

curse of boss rush

[split mortar]

Fabsolian

[robust osprey]

it is stupid indeed

[late veldt]

The playstyle, or the event?

[wanton pendant]

Significantly older than 850.

[dusk laurel]

playstyle

[noble falcon]

Draedon is the reason computer parts are 4x more expensive nowadays

He buys them all to feed the exo mechs, as they run on a diet of organic rgb graphics cards

[raven brook]

Thats true

[worthy sierra]

Do dragons age

If they do and the whole god thing didn't happen what would the ramifications be of dragons aging to death be

Do dragons when reborn by yharon just go back to babies

[dusk laurel]

1.yes iirc
2.uhh well theyd still be weakened and scarred by ml but its not like they didnt age before
3.yes and i mean we also can see that with yharon and i dont see why the others would be different if its still him rebirthing them

[waxen summit]

how strong is ML

[dusk laurel]

its strong enough

[split mortar]

Second strongest character in before it got like 70% of its body mass removed by draconic methods

[raven brook]

also don't say this

[raven brook]

also worth noting that iirc when dragons rebirth they well

they dont ressurect, they rebirth

if the dragon of flame dies and is reborn

that will be a new individual with a new personality compared to the last one

[long bloom]

they reincarnate?

interesting

[raven brook]

yharo is the sole exception afaik

atleast i remember hearing this but idrm form where

[long bloom]

where'd u hear this

[dusk laurel]

oh right i remmeber this

[raven brook]

take this with a grain of salt

[long bloom]

melongun cite my sources

[plucky juniper]

i mean

the way yharim words his lore item with yharon

it does show that yharon remembers stuff from well well before his latest resurrection

so ya

he probably is actually just straight up resurrecting

[trim edge]

is the solar eclipse xeroc sleeping

[dusk laurel]

norp

[raven brook]

https://youtu.be/s90T0SKEXqI

calamity mod moon lore

[pulsar ocean]

It’s like from that one thing

[plucky juniper]

AHAH

the solar eclipse enemies are just the same thing as what xeroc does in boss rush

using primordial light to recreate stuff

in this case he's recreating monsters from stories and movies for some reason

[west plume]

why would he do that

[worthy sierra]

A better explanation is that it's noncanon

[zenith geode]

except eyezors and reapers

theyre canon since theyre not specific references to real life media

[plucky juniper]

i dont really like that solar eclipse is most noncanon because of how much of its material is references

[long bloom]

there's still enemies

just not those ones specifically

[plucky juniper]

they should do more of those ngl

like eclipse enemies that are not explicit references

[raven brook]

i like to headcanon the terrarian is just really scared of scary movies

the solar eclipse manifests your fears into physical form and the terrarian is just REALLY scared of

mothra. i guess

[sinful adder]

I had the same headcanon except it's the world's collective imagination

[raven brook]

the solar eclipse manfesting your fears is already a canon bit im p sure

but i headcanon that the terrarian is specifically really scared of horror movies so thats why you get these guys

[eager bluff]

run! its mothra!
it looks like mothra, but due to international copyright laws, its not!
still, we should run like it is mothra!
though it isnt

[long bloom]

archon said to not put it in the lore doc so idk

[raven brook]

might just be something thats being workshoped on like most other .... nervous gulp....

⛈️ dev statements ⛈️

[wanton pendant]

Schrödinger's lore.

[long bloom]

speaking of lore doc
@cosmic zenith could you look over the revised version at some point to make sure i didn't put some bullshit in accidentally

[cosmic zenith]

? Over what

[eager bluff]

revised lore doc

[cosmic zenith]

Yes for the love of God do not put any dev statements there

Ok

I will when I can

[noble falcon]

Yharim owes me $15 for lunch last week and I must now kill everything short of the planet itself in order to get it back

[warm gull]

reasonable

[worthy sierra]

True motivations of the terrarian just dropped

[long scaffold]

why stop at the planet

[noble falcon]

I mean, I do live on the planet

[worthy sierra]

Would yharim kill babies if it meant xeroc wouldn't have ascended

[zenith geode]

if he knew what would happen yeah

[noble falcon]

I can only assume quite a few infant baby children died when he was galavanting throughout the land

[sacred pilot]

The guy killed like hundreds of millions of people.

He WILL kill babies. He probably already did.

[wanton pendant]

Don't be ridiculous. Babies are potential future soldiers.

[worthy sierra]

The terrarian is canonically bad at naming?

[split mortar]

Draedon calls you out for being bad at naming though its a subjective matter

[west plume]

yharim has already caused millions of infants to starve to death in a universe where this isn't the case

i don't think he'd ever personally murder an infant with his own hand though and i don't think he'd believe it was real or that you aren't also a god trying to trick him if you gave him this hypothetical

[magic epoch]

psure it's the only canon thing about us

[trim edge]

we tell calamitas what we called polterghast, do we tell anyone else about boss names other than draedon

[wanton pendant]

Yharim I guess?

[trim edge]

does yharim read our minds or do we yell back to him when he yells the lore items to us

[raven brook]

safe to assume the sending stone whisper thingamabog is probably one way so we can't really communicate back to yharim so that devs dont have to crack their skulls implementing the yharim dialogue system ™

[wanton pendant]

I imagine it's more like a Twitch stream and he's chat.

[long bloom]

yes

this is the only solidified character trait the terrarian has

[cosmic zenith]

Bad at naming is subjective

Draedon dislikes the Terrarian's naming

Doesn't mean others do

[raven brook]

yeah ^

persnally i think skeletron prime is fucking awesome actually

[trim edge]

who is the in universe bestiary writer

[raven brook]

Nobody

It's not diagetic

[long bloom]

an unnamed, omniscient entity

[raven brook]

Atleast not right now, anyways

It just has objective info and thats it

[long bloom]

that doesn't actually exist in universe

[plucky juniper]

thats lame

[wanton pendant]

Bestiary is the closest thing to God there is.

[plucky juniper]

they should exist

[long bloom]

god of knowledge save us

[wanton pendant]

Only if it's written by Pikmin characters.

[split mortar]

No character in calamity not even draedon is knowledgeable enough to fill that role afaik

[raven brook]

The existence of a completely omniscient character is kind of a insane thought

[trim edge]

we just absorb knowledge about entities by killing them

[raven brook]

So yeah no i don't think it'd be a good idea

[plucky juniper]

like there should be diagetically a bestiary book that is inexplicably written by... SOMETHING who clearly somehow knows stuff to an extent

[raven brook]

There are plans to maybe make bestiary more diagetic but doing so would require a reapproach of the bestiary in general iirc

[raven brook]

i dont think you need to take gameplay mechanics so literally also

[split mortar]

Terrarian is up to you, and so game mechanics like that cannot always be canon because you can just say no

[trim edge]

deltarot causes me to analyse how the player controls the terrarian

[raven brook]

"to an extent" isn't really applicable to current bestiary because the extent is Omniscient

[plucky juniper]

right

[split mortar]

Thats just
Not
The dynamic you and the terrarian have

[wanton pendant]

I remember seeing someone on Twitter saying something like that, like playing a normal RPG and thinking 'when are they gonna explore the relationship between player and character,' even though that's not going to happen.

[raven brook]

In general i feel people conflate gameplay mechanics and narrative quite often within the calamity lore circles

[wheat walrus]

i think gameplay-lore feedback loops are very cool

[split mortar]

YOU irl is not canonically controlling the terrarian unless you make it canon but then you control said dynamic and do not need to analyse much of shit from calamity

[raven brook]

They are

[wheat walrus]

i can understand not being dedicated to them though

because it's not something easy to pull off properly consistently

[raven brook]

But it's impossible to make every little game mechanic tie into the narrative somehow, and doing so if anything i think can be a detriment

A bunch of enemies in terraria drop random ass items when they die

[wheat walrus]

unless you're monster hunter,,,

[raven brook]

You can make sense of some of them, sure, but not all

Trying to justify this with a lore explanation i think is kind of a pointless venture and its easier to just accept it as Video Game

[wheat walrus]

yea

[split mortar]

Yeah but i think cheese is on about game mechanic things like respawning or having 999999999 enchanted golden apples in your inventory or the bestiary where its just absurd trying to think about it for more then a few seconds

[wanton pendant]

What do you MEAN there's not a lore reason for Hallowed enemies to have warm apple pie on hand?

[wheat walrus]

terraria takes a different philosophy from calamity in how they handle their world, so a lot of things kinda don't make sense

[raven brook]

What is the lore reason for every girl zombie looking the exact same? does this imply that the population of human females in the heartlands prior to the crusade consisted entirely of women who looked the exact same nad wore the same purple clothes

[wheat walrus]

there's also how this mod's had a bit of a development history

[wheat walrus]

yea that's just a stupid question 😭

[wanton pendant]

Fashion trends.

[raven brook]

its the type of question im talking abt when i say people gotta just suspend their disbelief and accept some things dont or shouldnt have a lore explanation and are just there because its a Video Game

why do eaters of souls drop burger? os ot bedause mhjmfhdfh mburge .tmfhd

[wheat walrus]

monster hunter fan virus has reached these parts im afraid

[split mortar]

Peak

[wanton pendant]

Souls of Americans.

[wheat walrus]

"why aren't there hundreds of aptonoths at a time it doesn't make sense"

please calamity mod lore community, im not very active anymore here but do not do this guys

🥹

[raven brook]

me entering the ancient forest as my pc epxlodes from the 200 aptonoths on the starting region

[wanton pendant]

What is an Aptonoth?

[raven brook]

cow

[wheat walrus]

early game pack herbivore of monster hunter

[raven brook]

theyre like the basic bitch herbivores from mh

yeah

[wheat walrus]

one of their thing is that they're prey to a lot of monsters, but you don't get to see that many at a time ingame

[wanton pendant]

When a Goblin Army invades I BETTER see an ACTUAL army OUTSIDE my house in REAL LIFE!

[wheat walrus]

they instead just respawn when killed

[raven brook]

its kinda like how,

the heartlands r supposed to be a whole ass continent

but even without any equipment you can go through the entire continent in like

a few minws

obviously thats not, how it would be realistically in-universe

but its, videogame

its a videogame

[split mortar]

At least the background gives impression we only see a small bit

[wanton pendant]

Clearly we're on a peninsula, duh, no other possible explanation.

[wheat walrus]

that is simply because of game performance issues; having that many of a small monster will obliterate your device, and handling many small monsters at a time has been a performance problem as early as mh1 (and wilds, the game that has a lot of small monsters active, is a performance scourge)

[wheat walrus]

yea

[raven brook]

not to mention it'd just be really dumb from a game design standpoint too lol

[wheat walrus]

there's also backgrounds which give you a vast sense of size

[raven brook]

imagine being spammed with 5 billion weak basic monsters that just exist to drop meat

[sacred pilot]

It's kinda like how time in most games is like.

24 minutes a day.

[raven brook]

see this is because uhhhhm,,, uhh primordial light xeroc moons evil

yep, thats the explanation. trust me

[wanton pendant]

Calamity should clearly use Animal Crossing's time system.

[sacred pilot]

Lore wise that'd be 24 hours, but unless you are insane, games do 24 minutes or something like that.

[split mortar]

When i want to go to the corruption but i have to trek 345 miles to the left because fabsol thought realistic sizes would be good for calamity

[sacred pilot]

It's the same with the world 'n such.

Way larger lorewise but for the sake of convenience it's sized down.

[split mortar]

And also 2d

[wanton pendant]

Why aren't there seasons? I expect the devs to work 28 hour days to implement this.

[raven brook]

ok tbf

[sacred pilot]

Holding M1 for a week just to make a hellevator (I barely reached the Caverns layer)

[raven brook]

seasons WOULD be a cool mechanic and alot of games do them

out of scope for calamity i reckon but a mod that adds seasons is a cool idea

[split mortar]

Seasons would be cool for a more ambience based mod i think

[raven brook]

i can see it being smth spirit reforge adds tbh

i think, ov erhaul added seasons? but idrm

[sacred pilot]

Seasons would be nice.

[split mortar]

I think but i also do not think about toverhaul

[sacred pilot]

It depends on how you implement them.

[wanton pendant]

I'd assume it'd be like Stardew Valley with a season lasting a month.

[sacred pilot]

Serene Seasons (Minecraft mod) without something like Tough as Nails is a neat cosmetic mod for ambience.

I haven't played it but I like how in Vintage Story, Winter is dreadful.

[wanton pendant]

Friendship mechanic system when so I can befriend the Merchant to buy cheaper torches.

[raven brook]

seasons as a cute cosmetic change with maybe some enemy/critter variety and some other small features would b neat

rain being replaced by snowfall on every biome rather than just snow in winter, with snow slimes spawning too

maybe durijng summer sandstorms r more common

stuff like that

[sacred pilot]

Yeah that would be really cool.

[sacred pilot]

Like from all the footage I've seen, the moment it hits Autumn, everything is dedicated to getting ready for Winter.

[sharp pulsar]

Since yharim tortured everyone who didn’t wanted to join his imperium, what would had happen if draedon didn’t agree to create his armor?

[split mortar]

When did he torture someone like that
Also draedon asked to join him

[wanton pendant]

He didn't torture people who didn't join them, he'd just conquer them.

And even if that was his method, you can't... torture an AI.

What is he going to do, install Bonzai Buddy?

Also, Draedon only created his armour AFTER he left the Crusade, which was Yharim's doing anyway.

[sharp pulsar]

Yeah with tortured i meant like what he did to the sunken sea and cryo

[sharp pulsar]

Ooohhh i didn’t know that

[wanton pendant]

1. That is not torture.
2. He didn't do that.

[split mortar]

Those were not to
Oh
You are years outdated
The lore got completely rewrote and got new writers do not use any knowledge you had before hand

[sharp pulsar]

Damn i have to read the lore documents

[split mortar]

Luckily theres a easily accessible one in the pins that should get you up to date
I think it is below 100 pages

[noble falcon]

“Oh I have ways of making you do what I want, computer…”
(His cape opens to reveal the most dangerous object known to technology: a Wiimote without the wrist strap)

[wanton pendant]

"Not so fast, Godseeker. I have already logged you out of your email, and I know you forgot your password already."

[noble falcon]

“…a capable foe, I see….”
And then they held hands and went on adventures until Draedon pirated The Bee Movie and made Yharim big mad cause that’s his favorite movie

[wanton pendant]

"Ah, Draedon, I just love cooking marshmallows over a fire."
"How interesting, so that is what happens to the human body while afflame for thirty minutes."

[noble falcon]

Sometimes you don’t need anything in common to be the best of friends

“Oh dearest me, Draedon, I nearly forgot! I should check in on my protege, I asked her to make us some food!”
“And what are we having?”
“Fish dinner!”

[wanton pendant]

Meanwhile, in a Tundra somewhere.

[sacred pilot]

WHAT AM I FIGHTING FOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOR-

[lucid wigeon]

the megaman x4 slander will never not be funny

[sacred pilot]

I know it's currently gold but idk.

Red fits Xeroc like a glove.

It adds an air of like.

Eerieness.

[plucky juniper]

does anyone have knowledge on the dragon of greed

[soft flame]

you refer to the terminus right

it's gold now cause of primordial light apparently

iirc

[long bloom]

such a dragon is not confirmed to exist

[plucky juniper]

okay cool

[long bloom]

you may consult the chart of every known dragon and god

[sacred pilot]

Yeagh.

[plucky juniper]

im only asking this because i have a sinking feeling that the god counterpart would have a domain over gold for some reason

[long bloom]

hmm

[sacred pilot]

Red just hits harder for Xeroc.

It gives Xeroc a...

Hint of blasphemy.

Like the divine white and gold of Xeroc is contrasted by the sinful red.

[raven brook]

its fair to speculate a dragon off greed aswell of the other sins probably existed by proxy of adragon of gluttony existing but theres no real confirmation or mention of anything like that ingame so its in the realm of "speculation/headcanon that is plausibly real in canon"

[soft flame]

i can see where you stem from

[long bloom]

[soft flame]

but yharim and his yharmy were the only people to declare xeroc a "sinner" as far as we know

along with every other god

[sacred pilot]

I mean yes I know.

But still though.

[plucky juniper]

honestly i like the red more for xeroc purely because
a) im used to it
b) its cool

[sacred pilot]

Could give a cool contrast between pre and post-Ascension Xeroc.

[raven brook]

I do like to think Xeroc is still a sinner in his own right, even if i don't think he's a villain or (atleast not intentionally) bad person

[plucky juniper]

but i get why its yellow

[sacred pilot]

Pre-ascension is blue and post is red.

[raven brook]

I like to think Xeroc knew he had to kill Zeratros but it still dosen't make him Not feel guilt about it

[soft flame]

tbf the very TOOL used to take a dragon's soul for one's own sake COULD be associated with sinning

[raven brook]

I like ot think Xeroc and Zeratros parallel Yharim and Yharon

they were like best buds

besties, even

[plucky juniper]

i personally am of the mind that Xeroc did in fact want to kill Zeratros

[long bloom]

whar

[plucky juniper]

this is literally only because he had to create a TERMINUS to ascend with Zeratros's soul

which would probably be really hard to do in the middle of the whole Moon Lord situation

[raven brook]

I find the idea of Xeroc planning to kill Zeratros in the long term very iffy atleast for my perception of the character

[long bloom]

they ascended after moon lord was defeated

[plucky juniper]

ya

but ya know what i mean

he probably had to create it in advance

[soft flame]

i just tell myself to think he had no other choice than to ascend

[long bloom]

wait until soul stone theory becomes real

[timber glacier]

I am wondering if at all the dragon’s soul they ascended with still has remnant of the dragon’s identity
Like does xeroc post-ascension have various traits zeratros had, like parts of his personality

[plucky juniper]

unless there's information where it turns out the terminus was made afterwards

[long bloom]

unlikely

[raven brook]

That is the same idea i have too

My personal interpretation of Xeroc is really just

Not a bad person

Not a villain

[sacred pilot]

No but in ascension your domain can be altered dpeending your personality.

[raven brook]

Someone who's trying to do good as the only person acting as a barrier between us and the Horrors of the distortion

[plucky juniper]

oh and mind you i still think you can make Xeroc not a bad guy but still want to usurp Zeratros purely because
yknow
zeratros is something of a jerk

[sacred pilot]

EG: Providence is destructive asf so her domain after absorbing the Auric Soul of Fire is Ash.

[soft flame]

simply viewed as one cause the masses lack details

[raven brook]

however that is a unsunmourtable task no matter how powerful Xeroc is because he is still kind of a Guy, a Person

He is flawed

[sacred pilot]

A headcanon I had is that the Auric Dragons reign was like.

[raven brook]

not malicious or villainous, but flawed

[sacred pilot]

Basicallg a loose confederation.

[timber glacier]

I could see Xeroc creating the terminus in advance to the attack by fovos as a last ditch effort in case a horrible situation would occur, not because he wanted to betray zetaros but because he didn’t want his power to be lost

[plucky juniper]

it could make sense that Xeroc might have ended up being disillusioned with the dragons and his king, especially after Moon Lord did that

[raven brook]

The task he has to accomplish is one that puts a insane amount of pressure and responsibility onto himself

[soft flame]

-dragon of mind

-no associated god

[sacred pilot]

Every Auric Dragon had to abide by specific rules but they basically did their own things.

[soft flame]

what could this possibly mean

[raven brook]

bro got eaten

[long bloom]

she was blended and transformed into the nebula pillar

[raven brook]

got slurped up

[sacred pilot]

Some Dragons were cool 'n good like Vetrasyl and others weren't.

[raven brook]

devoured even

[soft flame]

oh

[raven brook]

Which also ties into why, well

[soft flame]

i expected something else

[raven brook]

He dosen't do jackshit about Yharim or Xeroc

Or providence* oops

brain fart

[glacial rampart]

trust no one

not even yourself

[sacred pilot]

Xeroc is locked tf in trying to deal with the Distortion.

[raven brook]

He is so utterly dedicated to a responsibility only he can accomplish in his eyes that he tunnel visions to it, not to mention he is afraid of the consequences of such a powerful individual like himself could have if he did actually act

It's not really a good thing, it's a character flaw, but itso ne that makes sense in context

[long bloom]

rip and tear until it is done

[raven brook]

I think Xeroc is exhausted as fuck, actualy

[agile matrix]

are we still talkin abt xeroc and zeratros's relation in their killwise

[eager bluff]

it makes sense in the context of he was there when something that powerful did act

[raven brook]

But still trying to keep up his role due to the responsibility he feels he has

[long bloom]

probable

[agile matrix]

becaus i think zeratros had to convince xeroc to kill him in some doomed friends relation way

[eager bluff]

he knows EXACTLY how bad things can get if he acts

[raven brook]

I still am of the opinion that Xeroc, if done right

[glacial rampart]

kfc yaoi breakup

[eager bluff]

and he really doesnt want another moon lord

[raven brook]

Can be one of the most psychologically complex characters in the entire mod

[long bloom]

i like this theory

[raven brook]

His position as the first and strongest god and the only person who's really both actively aware and acting against things like Noxus

[agile matrix]

didnt we talk abt this a while back lc

[raven brook]

Gives him a entirely unique conflict that nobody else in the world really has

And also the more i think about it the more i realize he probably has some of the most emotional baggage of anyone in the mod

[agile matrix]

like how if we hold off the distortion for even a lil bit he'd thank it for the mile

[long bloom]

there's no limit to cheese's xeroc ramblings /pos

[raven brook]

i like Xeroc :D

[agile matrix]

well yea but i remmber a specific talk i had w/ them

[raven brook]

hes like in my top 5 characters

not my absolute favorite but hes up there

[eager bluff]

oh absolutely

[agile matrix]

i like draedon. i would make two whole games abt them (one focus, one with them in prevalance) if i could

[raven brook]

Yeha no i can see it

[soft flame]

kinda explains why he does absolutely nothing as yharim commits genocide

who whoa

[agile matrix]

oouh im mentally imagining his bright yellows and oranges (since sun) massively contrasting with the black and purples of the distortion (in my head) ouughhhh its so art

[soft flame]

yharim under my assumption is a VILLAN?????????????

[raven brook]

i like Draedon but i do think i find it hard to get as invested on him as some other characters not due to any writing flaws with him but due to his character fundamentally being one where emotional and psychological conflict isn't really present and those are my favorite parts of character analysis/writing

[soft flame]

[agile matrix]

i like him bc i would be his greatest autist :)

[eager bluff]

from what i can tell he never really developed coping mechanisms for dealing with the trauma from moon lord he just threw himself into training and working

[agile matrix]

also because the concept of technological advancement for the sake of advancement and not for an inherent goal outside of itself is really neat

like this dude wants to know everything there is to know. bro could talk to Gordon Ramsey on what makes food good

[soft flame]

i can respect a character like that

[raven brook]

• see hell torture alien squid nearly destroy the world and probably destroy your livelihood and kill god knows how many people including those you knew and loved
• see as your supposed guardians fail repeatedly to actually defeat it and only win by a margin
• kill your friend knowing its the best course of action in the situation
• be one of the only people in the world aware of the fucking Horrors that exist waiting to strike on earth and also having experience what happens wehn they DO strike firsthand
• be the only person *(atleast in your eyes) strong enough to ACTUALLY do something about it
• carry the burden and responsibility of the strongest auric soul, the one held by the former king of dragons, inheriting the responsibility of protecting the world as he did
• everyone you ever knew from when you were a mortal is dead by now and you probably dont have any friends or really people to talk to because you're 101% locked in your task. the only person from back them whoa ctually is alive is now genocidal and wants you dead

my favorite characters are calamitas, xeroc and agnus for their very cool characterization and story

and then signus and storm weaver because 1. aura 2. hehe worm

[agile matrix]

alternative 3rd and 3rd pt.2

• rush to your friend in their final days to comfort them in their dying
• be forced to kill your friend for [Unknown Reason] and have to live with the grief of it

see i dont actually know if Zeratros got old and died and needed Yharpacks to get back up later

[raven brook]

I think the reason is pretty conclusive as it is rn

regardless of whether xeroc did it willingly or after a zeratro spep talk

[agile matrix]

no like i know he died to That Guy

but like how Yharon did his shit

[raven brook]

Moon lord had the ability to eat up auric souls, theres a pillar that came from primordial light, zeratros was dying

you can kinda put the pieces together from that

if he died there he woulda been Dead dead

[agile matrix]

more so this

because the funniest option i can think (that does accidentally make most people idiots but works with Standard Earth History) is that if zeratros died the sun would stop moving in the sky

following a geocentric theory

[raven brook]

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say

[sinful adder]

Zeratros was going to die permanently because his soul was half eaten

[agile matrix]

presuming every person including the dragons thought the sun revolved around the earth, it coulda been believed that if Zeratros Died Died the sun would just stop moving and that'd be Bad

this is a shitpost, if its not obvious

[sinful adder]

Actually I think this goes kinda crazy because this means xeroc ascended with only a partial auric soul

[long bloom]

the sun does revolve around terraria though

the calamity universe is geocentric

[agile matrix]

What.

[long bloom]

:lo

[agile matrix]

like /srs??? i thought it obeyed normal theory????

[zenith geode]

what if the sun stopped moving
like terraria keeps moving through space because thats how space works so the sun just gets left behind

[agile matrix]

yea thats what my shitpost theory belives

[long bloom]

actually how it works

[agile matrix]

theres no shot .

[long bloom]

[zenith geode]

oh i thought you meant it still travels with terraria just thats its position in the sky doesnt change

[plucky juniper]

wait

what happens when the pillars die

considering moon lord is gonzo for good after you finish him off

[agile matrix]

bbboth. the sun stays where it is but terraria keeps moving

it just gets smaller and smaller in the sky

[zenith geode]

ok so the first one

anyways that would very quickly send terraria into a permanent and unparalleled ice age

[timber bough]

hi

[sinful adder]

No it's completely serious. The sun and moon are similar sizes and revolve around terraria. Tons of stars also orbit the planet, they're literally like the fallen stars and Mana crystals

[long bloom]

yeah fallen stars are actual stars

and the sun is not

[sinful adder]

The sun is special

[long bloom]

stars are mana, sun is primordial light

[sacred pilot]

Stars in Calamity lore are basically conglomerations of Mana.

Yeah.

They're also wayyyy smaller.

[timber bough]

is the sun still a deadly laser?

[long bloom]

not after xeroc ascended

source: you can go outside in-game

[light linden]

the sun is

weird

[timber bough]

true...

[light linden]

it used to be one

under zeratros

[timber bough]

hi there low polygon umbreon

[light linden]

the reason as to which is unknown

[agile matrix]

anyways the most normal theory i can think is that Zeratros was convinced that if he died:

the lack of Ruler would cause the world to fall into dismay
Fovos was gonna cause permanent and lasting effects no matter what happened
they trusted Xeroc enough to allow them to be the ruler of a new age
ergo
if zeratros died, he trusted xeroc enough to be the herald of a new age

this was my tedx talk

[thick slate]

ergo

[leaden bridge]

TRUE FACT: zeratros made the sun rlly bad because he fucking hates everyone and everything

[timber glacier]

He made the sun into a deadly laser 😢

[noble falcon]

In the Aerie Hospital, on his deathbed, he made Yharon promise to hate everything else forever so that it would balance out, and gave him his prized Old One’s Overwatch 2 account to get his training started.

[leaden bridge]

Zeratros was alone

[timber glacier]

Wasn’t xeroc there when zeratros was dying

[leaden bridge]

reference MISSED

[magic epoch]

like brimstone elemental

[rain osprey]

"Yharon... I beg of you, do it for me"
"Zeratos! Wait!"
"All the people on that planet... Kill them."
"Zeratos!"
"Sayonara... Yharon the dragon."
"ZERATROS!"

[hoary cape]

xeroc in the background just doing a ritualistic dance to absorb zeratros' soul

[sinful adder]

What if the ritual dance is like

Gangnam style

[hoary cape]

asserting domiance on zeratros for losing to a space monster

[glacial rampart]

then dogma says "Dont you have a human heart?" ✌️🫀

[warm gull]

providence might've been right

[sinful adder]

Can permafrost create ice out of mana, or only freeze water in the air?

So like is the water for the ice created directly from the mana

[wanton pendant]

(8)50 years later, Yharim finds Yharon in a top secret God Union Nation base, and is offered three wishes.

[wheat walrus]

ひどいなあ。の心とかないんか？

[pulsar ocean]

thank you... golden heretic
g-golden heretic..?
because umm, you are golden and are a heretic
oh, yeah

[wheat walrus]

how yharring

[magic epoch]

yharim: "oh no… it seems that yharma is finally catching up to me…"

[trim edge]

what i got from the exhumed items is that brimmy could be a false flag and yharim really hated ilmeris specifically for whatever reason

[split mortar]

Wdym brimmy could be a false flag?? What does that even mean

[trim edge]

yharim unleashed her on purpose to get calamitas to incinerate ilmeris

[split mortar]

Why would he do unleash her

Calamitas got her powers from brimmy

So brimmy as far as he would know would just burn his second best asset

Not even draedon knows for sure the fuck happened to result in scal getting brimmys power im sure yharim would not know before it happened

I am confused by this info what was the exhume you read

[trim edge]

rancor

if brimmy was unleashed by the gods i feel like yharim would want vengeance and get calamitas to kill the actual culprits instead of lying

maybe yharim was just mistaken but calamitas retrospectively saw it as purposely lying

[split mortar]

Just posting so its readable here

Reads like yharim lied about who did it to launch her at some gods who were causing him issues but did not know who actually did it not that yharim woke up brimmy
At least to me

[split mortar]

Mayhapse

He is also john gaslight gatekeep girlboss so i am biased to thinking he intentionally lied i will admit

[trim edge]

cinders of lament implies calamitas' brothers were murdered so i thought they saw yharim do it
i read it after rancor so i thought it was right before azafure's destruction but it's not actually stated so idk

[split mortar]

Brimmy was located in the centre of azafure when she woke up iirc so it seems to me at least her brothers probably died to brimmy exploding stuff

[wanton pendant]

Azafure was a close ally and industrial base of Yharim.
There is no reason he would attack it himself.

[trim edge]

the final plot twist that yharim is actually a god and the yharon we fight is a fake created by him

[feral skiff]

Calamitas is lowkey trauma-farming?!? 💔

[split mortar]

??

[pulsar ocean]

why would they build a city around a sleeping elemental are they stupid

[wanton pendant]

They did it for the hype moments and aura.

[versed gale]

From the bestiary

... so there is a fourth soldier who became a god? (Providence has just 3 guardians, but 4 soldiers are mentioned)

[split mortar]

Providence was one of the four

Guards + provi = four people

[wanton pendant]

Only Providence became a god.

[versed gale]

Oh oops haha. From the tone I assumed providence was already a god

[wanton pendant]

It's the story of how she became one.

[split mortar]

Ok
Why bring that up here though randomly?

What

[lucid wigeon]

Why does this sounds like something snyder did, saying the real doomsday is in space?

[leaden bridge]

#releasethemrrpcut

[pulsar ocean]

bring what up

[split mortar]

Someone (supposedly their little sibling) said thorium better without any prompting

[pulsar ocean]

balright

[slender marten]

darn

[split mortar]

Embed fail

[slender marten]

no

[west plume]

providence became a god and then cursed all of her girlfriends forever with her power

[raven brook]

Add me to the lore

[hoary cape]

no me

[west plume]

Cheese Atrocitas was a resident of the coastal county of Southside Derelict, Azafure, and died horribly in an elemental related accident

[split mortar]

I think this may have been azazel

[leaden bridge]

this is because she hates them a lot

ermm heres some fake flaws i made up. i should be the god. haha. fuck you.

[west plume]

Providence the Straight Goddess of Holy Flame was completely and totally evil and hated her entire polycule so she cursed them into servitude

Providence then decided to hang out with Homophobic Yharim (Pre-Dragon) because she was evil

[simple tangle]

Hi :)

[west plume]

hi

[simple tangle]

No!!

[west plume]

its true sadly... providence lost her ability to love her strong buff supportive powerful warrior girlfriends upon ascending

its a real shame. my name is yharim and this set of messages was all entirely true

[simple tangle]

Her strong buff.....
Sorry i pased out

[lucid wigeon]

brain keeps forcing peter cullen voice when reading this

[long scaffold]

My name is Yharim and I approve this message

[wanton pendant]

Yharim's social media manager here, I want to say that Yharim NEVER associated with Providence before the Righteous Crusade. Everything else is true.

[real glen]

My name is yharim and im here to hunt God of Snails

[noble falcon]

In the modern era, there’s not much of a market for burning everything with the holy and/or unholy spirit, so Providence and her gaggle of rock friends have taken to V-Tubing, with the guardians acting as her mods

Anyone breaks a chat rule, they spontaneously combust in real life

[terse moss]

Fire (literally)

[noble falcon]

“Mods, please smite chatter ‘Xx_GoozmaGaming_xX’”

[lucid wigeon]

mrrp?

[leaden bridge]

ancient lores 💀

[lucid wigeon]

ah

[hollow pivot]

Are the Essences (Sunlight, Havoc, & Eleum) Soul Fragments or something else entirely?

[long bloom]

they're uhhhhhhhhh

they sure exist

[hollow pivot]

Thank you for this enlightening information.

[agile matrix]

okay i gotta ask

bc i dont

know

what is yharons job

what does he do

like b4 the gods and stuff

what was his role as The Dragon of Rebirth

[raven brook]

he revives the dragons

thats kinda his whole thing

they die and he brings em back

[agile matrix]

okay so like

did Zeratros just die sometimes?

[raven brook]

we dont know

[agile matrix]

like The Dragon Of The Sun just Dies sometimes???

[raven brook]

zeratros for all we know mightve never died

there are several other dragons that are not zeratros that hew ould've had to revive though

[agile matrix]

well yea but those are like. not named/not mission critical

right?

[raven brook]

they are still dragons

[agile matrix]

like their deaths while monumental are not as important as Zeratros

[raven brook]

well yes

[agile matrix]

i was gonna ask how does yharon revive but he just eggs

[raven brook]

but i dont see how thats relevant

[agile matrix]

which is a good explanation

i guess.

my issue is that yharon kinda lacks aura in my eyes lol

[raven brook]

what the hell does aura have anything to do with anything

[agile matrix]

he, in my eyes, doesnt have the aura his title demands

he is closer to Gloomborf in my eyes than Zeratros

[raven brook]

he is the dragon of rebirth that is immortal because he continuously rebirths (like a phoenix, thus the title of Resplendent Phoenix) and his power lets him rebirth his fellow auric dragons

[agile matrix]

no i know that

[raven brook]

he is the only dragon that can do this and thus was pivotal to the way auric dragon society worked

[agile matrix]

i dont see that in like. writing. or gameplay (i know he's outdated but still)

he can only do it on one island in probably a ritual

everywhere else he is just a fire dragon who doesnt die

who could very likely die if his egg gets destroyed (a la, Yharim hypothetical)

[raven brook]

well no that wasn't really it being destroyed

its about Yharim absorbing the soul thru the ritual

[west plume]

yharon isnt natively a fire dragon and is just a really talented fire mage

[raven brook]

just breaking the egg, probably wouldn't really do anythingg i don't think

[west plume]

^

[raven brook]

besides resetting the cycle of rebirth back again

[west plume]

you could break the egg and kill yharon but he'd just respawn elsewhere

[glacial rampart]

if the egg was destroyed he'd probably just. reappear a decade later as an egg again

[agile matrix]

hm i see

still, he doesnt really have the Power his job and title say he does

at least in my eyes

[west plume]

wdym

[west plume]

you will see it in writing as we already have internal documents about this and probably in gameplay

[agile matrix]

hrm. i see

mainly my issue is that he doesnt really do the Rebirth part

all he does is Fire and he doesnt really have any Begin Again type beat

[raven brook]

In terms of gameplay or writing

Because i mean in writing that is his whole thing,

in gameplay though yeah he dont do any rebirthing

he shoots fireballs at you and spawns duke fishron tornadoes

[agile matrix]

in gameplay i dont even know how'd he'd do it

[raven brook]

I miss you phase 2 yharon transition

[west plume]

horse derivative

[long bloom]

[raven brook]

its true

[agile matrix]

like the issue i have is that outside of One Island, he does not do rebirth stuff

[west plume]

jungle gragon yharon who yharim rides epically around...

[agile matrix]

he doesnt hold aegis over like. therapy (spitballing.) or any kinda recovery

[long bloom]

i'm cry bc i also miss it

[west plume]

can u wait until the bossfight is dehorsed for this

[agile matrix]

he is Just the dragon of rezzing people in the spawnzone

[agile matrix]

im not even talkin abt the gameplay atp

[raven brook]

well but the thing is that it wouldn't be a spawnzone to begin with

if it wasnt for yharon

without yharon the dragons die and they're just, dead

[west plume]

i have words but i dont wanna piss off da writers

[agile matrix]

i dont know what he does rebirthwise in writing outside of The Box

[agile matrix]

could you callem perhaps

[west plume]

nuh uh

[agile matrix]

well yea and thats monumental

but that is ALL he does.

[raven brook]

I figure he probably had political power to some extent given he was the 2nd most important dragon behindd zeratros itself

[agile matrix]

its like a teleporter vs a train

yharon being the teleporter

[raven brook]

Kinda impossible for you to NOT hold some power when you're the guy who makes sure everyone else is immortal

[agile matrix]

the teleporter gets it done yeah but with the train you can actually do things outside of just transport

[glacial rampart]

😭?????

[raven brook]

This is , respectfully

[glacial rampart]

oh my god mister BEAST

[agile matrix]

lmao?

[raven brook]

hi mr beast

anyways

respectfully that analogy is bad on multiple levels i cant lie

[glacial rampart]

i would

[agile matrix]

its not incredible but i am headache and i cant think fo a better one

[glacial rampart]

rather have a teleporter

😭

[west plume]

i guess the thing with public yharon is no one else can do that. no one else can really be like Lol dying is fake and keep remaking 10,000 year old several times dead dragons into new forms or start fracturing their soul for renewed energy to kill you

[raven brook]

First of all "transport" is not really comparable to

Being the only guy on the entirew orld capable of making your entire species immortal

It'd be more appropriate if Yharon was the dragon that i don't know

[west plume]

i am going to bother the lorewriters to make more yhar tales eventually but im waiting for the lore repo 2 be complete

[agile matrix]

if we had a dragon of transportation, he would not be the god of teleportation, he would be the dragon of all things transport

[glacial rampart]

😭

[raven brook]

Yharon, the dragon that builds houses for the other dragons or something

[agile matrix]

but if current yharon was the dragon of transportation, all they would do is transport you from point a to point b

thats what i mean

[glacial rampart]

am i stupid or like what the fuck does this even mean 😭

[west plume]

can you teleport

do you know anyone who can teleport

would you consider teleportation unremarkable to do spontaneously

[agile matrix]

okay imma mildly rephrase

[west plume]

like if you were 'the guy who could teleport and no one else can' would you find it a lame power

[agile matrix]

yes, yharons position is important

it is cool

however, that is all he does

and that does not feel cool

[west plume]

what else is he supposed to do

exactly

[agile matrix]

he is the dragon of rebirth

[west plume]

what would make yharon a stronger character in your eyes

[agile matrix]

stronger =/= boring, i should

say that

he is a very powerful onetrick pony

when i would prefer him to hold more importance over other stuff than just one thing

[west plume]

what other tricks do you want him to have

[agile matrix]

best contrast: agnus being the god of sacrifice

you'd think that means like rituals bloody shit stuff like that

but its not its a more giving yourself for others type deal

[glacial rampart]

i mean i think its cool that they differ greatly in the way they act upon their domain and like

the way it is

[agile matrix]

yharon does the opposite of that: you hear rebirth and its JUST being revived

[west plume]

urgh

[agile matrix]

like you get what i mean ?

[glacial rampart]

i dont understand how this is an issue to you

i dont

😭

[west plume]

@spare pier did you finish yharon.md

[agile matrix]

its a non-issue really. i just dont like Big Lore Guy being One Note

i wont tear my hair out over it

[glacial rampart]

i have to refrain from taking part in conversations like these because i really dont know what to say other than like , this is just such a nothingburger point 😭 and thatsa really rude and nonhelpful things to say to a discussion and i dont wanna be rude to ppl i always try and understand points but i cant figure this out 😭

[agile matrix]

its a nothingburger but i will eat it nonetheless

like rebirth could be how yharim recovered from Being Tossed Into the Inferno
rebirth could be how a guy with trauma moves past from it

[glacial rampart]

im really trying my best to understand the point and not let the venom spew from my pores but i think i just have to walk away 😭

[agile matrix]

like it does not need to be just Bring Dragons Back, he can have more depth

[agile matrix]

venom spewing from pores??????????????

over my mcnothing double patty?

[dusk laurel]

i believe she is making a metaphor

[glacial rampart]

im evil and shit!

[raven brook]

His depth as a character dosen't need to be tied into What Poewr He Holds

[west plume]

have you ever wondered how yharim is 130 years old and has had energy to move and fight for a century

[raven brook]

Agnus's power being self-sacrifice isn't just that because

It'd be quirky and different

It ties to who he is as a character and his narrative

From what you are talking

[west plume]

or how dragon society didn't really have identity issues and people just Were the form they wanted to be

[agile matrix]

what came first the title or the guy

[raven brook]

You'd like Yharon's power to not just be literally rebirth just out of,

being different and unique from the expected

Which is not inherently good

[west plume]

or how dragon society functioned, at large, after death stopped being a problem

[raven brook]

Different =/ Automatically better

[agile matrix]

eeeeh. close but not exactly it

i dont want it to JUST be rebirth, but him being important because of the rebirth is completely good

[west plume]

or why yharon chooses not to resurrect gods despite them also possessing world soul shards

[raven brook]

Yharon's entire character is tied to his position in Dragon Society, he is the guy who literally Refuses to accept change and is stuck on the past

[agile matrix]

i hold no issue with yharon being a keystone, but i hold issue with him being Just a keystone with his domain

[agile matrix]

yea thats all well and good

[raven brook]

His position being that of rebirthing dragons to ensure their reign would last eternal makes it so his powerset perfectly ties into his narrative and who he is as a character

Agnus's powerset of self-sacrifice also ties in who he is as a character, a selfless individual who gave himself up for those he loved

[west plume]

have you ever wondered why the aerie Exists. like, why theres just a pocket dimension sitting around that was created by and for dragons

how did they create that?

do you wonder?

[agile matrix]

i am fine with his character. him being the dragon of rebirth and yet being stalwart on the future and where it goes

that is fine

[raven brook]

What i'm asying is that his powerset and character are intrinsically linked ot one another

[agile matrix]

my issue is that, domainwise, the only thing he does is rebirth dragons. he does not do anything else relating to Rebirth other than bring dragons back

im not saying that he should bring like. humans back. but he does absolutely nothing else relating to it

[raven brook]

I think that is a valid enough to want his domain to do more

However,

I think you really suck at wording all of your points i cant lie

[agile matrix]

oh i am abysmal at saying things

[west plume]

his domain already does a lot and i dont think u notice it

[glacial rampart]

it gets tuah point

[agile matrix]

this is known

[west plume]

the dragon resurrection is just like his role in society

he was mr. dragon prosperity

a singular unifying bulwark in an institution that grew too big for it's britches and he prevented it from falling apart at the seams By Force

he would be this even without the domain

[spare pier]

It'll be finished tomorrow

[agile matrix]

yeah i think thats my issue. maybe.

[glacial rampart]

why is that an issue !