#lore-discussion
1 messages Ā· Page 273 of 1
man
Iām asking why theyāre being weird
this a bad time to ask a question?
sentenced to
real
auric souls weren't given to every dragon right?
No iirc
Every dragon that was alive at the time.
what created the draconic offshoots then?
So if you were born afterwards, you didn't get one.
This is how draconic offshoots appeared.
Thatās just auric dragons having children; the soul doesnāt pass down iirc
I didn't mean it that way š

Or itās just that they ran out of fragments to give to dragons
Both iirc
Not enough fragments, auric souls do not pass down
That's why OD is not an ice dragon
World soul fucking tiny
Itās one of the first fishron generations isnāt it? Being direct child of mega mammoth dragon the frost one?
It's first gen iirc
Right so frost dragon already took
I imagine that the Timeless Shore and the currently unnamed volcanic area of the Sunken Sea would have their own themes
They seem very different from the main biome [and its divisions]
I imagine all the areas get their own theme and the more normal area keeps the current one
There's probably like multiple sub-biomes in the "calm" part of the Sunken Sea
It most likely is the largest portion
Iām talking about if thereās a biome like the one in game
Or the one closest to that one
Yeah
Volcanic Area?!
Between Sunken Sea and hell
Where the lava starts spawning in caverns normally
But the Sunken Sea version
^
iirc the only thing we have for it as of now is that big goldfish enemy Triangle was making
And potentially the sand prowler enemy from the enemy sheet
Sand prowler?
There also might be a "hydra" enemy
Hydra?
Sounds cool
Jesus christ how much stuff am I missing
Here's the aforementioned goldfish, work in progress by Triangle
Also here's the Sand Prowler because why not, at the bottom (Sheet is outdated but Prowler hasn't received any more updates) #calamity-update-talk message
Oops ping
(sorry)
there is also the grub
i did show already
sand prowler is for reefs
not for the lava zone
Searslug?
lava zone has 5 mobs planned, 1 critter 4 enemies
you already know 3 (hydra, goldfish and searslug)
Auric rejection eviscerating you
Leaked Dragonfolly resprite
here's hoping for a subnautica reference
Don't we have the abyss for that already
what
We don't but the SSO will give us the biggest look
hmm
We do know both the gods looks donāt we
Xeroc jumpscare
Providence forms might be next on the chopping block
ngl I hope we get to see the god of sacrifices pre ravager some day
Same
It would be really funny if God of Sacrifices was just a good person.
This hulking man that is over thirty feet tall, gives a flower to a young girl.
Who is the god of sacrifices
Ravager before it got revived through necromancy
GranDracmon from digimon
We do??
HAH
Weird centaurs are a based design trope
Like Ultima Weapon from FF8
Yeah, same place we have the yharim concept art
_ _
Imgur collection.
Xeroc pre-ascension concept art needs to get updated to the new version in at least like 2 years
Auric rejection
does it not whenever molded or after whatever the player does to it?
Where can I find this
Wait nvm seeker linked
We add yharon's soul fragments in it
Nullifying the rejection
Auric rejection when it launches you to the stratosphere
Nope, we nullify the rejection with yharon soul fragments
afterwards could anyone theorectially hold a bar and be fine then?
Meaning it has no rejection whatsoever
That specific bar yea
I believe Lilac is the owner of the post, and they are currently on break.
Fair
this reminds me of something
Oh those designs are SUPER cool
my first reaction to seeing auric ore shock me was uh
I did this and my computer sounded like it was buzzing in anger
What was the other sea Godās name (if we know) and domain
Itās either slipping my mind or we just havenāt been told
Otonilou [Electricity]
Tyrian [Seas]
Tyrian, Seas.
Feel like the god of seas probably came from a dragon of water
btw was calamitas azafurian?
Yes
Yes
Yes
I can't remember if she was born outside of it or in it though from the new lore
that is somewhat the ideia
reflection of providence

where she looks like a angel but is fucked up, and ravager looks fucked up but is actually mostly benevolent
was*
more specifically
Providence when she sees life: yah that's got to burn
who is braelor?
A warrior
some gay guy
Enemy of yharim
never seen this guy before
gonna be so cool ...
The tarragon armor is what he is wearing
also something I've noticed
Really? Thatās actually super interesting information
Doesn't Signus' lore item mention him?
Yes.
No.
No.
It is Silva armor
Ah that got changed
Uelibloom doesn't even exist until Providence's death.
tarragon is getting nuked
Weirdly, Braelorās accessory is made out of tarragon rn
I wonder what will happen to that
Replaced by Guardian armorsets most likely
(Badge of bravery)
are the gods who did imperfect ascensions the ones with drastically changed forms?
Providence death creating fossilized plants doesn't even make any sense tbh, so that's fine
Yes
That has nothing to do with Braelor.
wonder why
Although the only perfect ascension, ever, was Xeroc iirc
silva too iirc
It was hinted to
Silva.
It doesn't even have a tooltip.
I stated that I found it odd that Braelor had no accessory in game
Dev stated he did
I asked which one
BoB
They said āthink about what melee accessory is made from plantsā
M.O.A.b obviously
i remember back in old lore when braelor was not mentioned a single time in-game and the only connection to him was tarragon armor
Badge of Bravery extremely fits as a Braelor accessory
Braelore back when he was wurm food
"Braelore" Is that a lore reference
hey lets introduce new cool characters and kill them off offscreen in the past
speaking of DoG
-like, everyone in old lore
is it actually canon that storm weaver and them are related?
yharim thinks they are
Only via the Distortion
but yharim is also terrible at biology
draedon makes fun of him for it, they are not related
You should read the Draedon Inquiries.
Storm Weaver lore item is getting changed iirc
So that Yharim doesn't sound as baseless on the Weaver-DoG claim
whenever I get there sure
Storm Weaver is no longer a baby whatever species of wurm thing dog is
I mean isn't that like 30% of his character?
ah
i mean he just kind of says it
and then it's completely disproven by draedon
which makes you wonder "whats the point even bringing it up"
actually
do we know of anything related to signus?
ik about some deal that statis made with them
Okay I remembered wrong stip didnāt give hint at plant material at all but, I mean this is kind of the only one that makes much sense
At the moment not really
I have no idea what will happen to the badge of bravery upon uelibloom becoming profaned ore
badge of burning?
Signus is a very mysterious entity
It is likely in the distortion update, when statis is added, that statis himself may reveal a bunch about Signus
fair enough
Signus be some eldritch horror
Yeah
That happens to also be an assassin looking thing. I don't know if it still is though
Kinda is, more so a back alley way drug dealer who buys limbs and gives you whatever you want in return imo
Signus sleeve sword
Hidden blade assassin's Creed moment
Donāt think a sword normally comes out of one of your many mouths
mental images I never wanted to see
Also wait that's a mouth it comes out of?
I thought that was just appearing in his hand
Also coming with the rework
His face is mouth
He has many a teeth, indeed.
He is a mouth
I've seen stranger things
Thereās mouths for legs, so much potential
Signus is literally just a giant mouth
could be possible that those teeth are fingers
Even worse thought how
Face fingers
Worse mental image ew
They try biting us with those so no
Signus is a grown mimikyu
Pokemon is now canon in calamity
good thing throudon isnt here so he cant send rizznus
Grown mimikyu
_ _
Not the rizz
Calamitas saying not the rizz would be random
do we know who the EoL serves btw?
my guess would be xeroc but that's because he's the only one we know that can control sunlight
xeroc is our only lead currently
Weird
Confusing
Doesnāt leave many options
i think they didnt feel satisfied with how it was worded
actually
Empress of light is obviously just a big fairy with no lore connection
also the bestiary entry will help clear things up
would EoL count as a elemental?
No I don't think
vanilla reference...
She is a fairy so no
What would her element be
Light
Nope
Light elemental
if she was an elemental then i think that would be clarified
Yeah
Nah in vanilla she created the hallowed, is a goddess and is the protector of the world until a new wof type being is formed I think
she's leeching off power from something which none of the elementals are said to do
LGBT
Real
proud to be part of the LGTV community
Light isn't an element I don't think
Then smthin related with like sun
She is clearly the queen of fairies
Thats not an element either
The sun in Cal is just pure light
Fairy elemental
Elementals are of the things needed for complex life and silva is the complex life elemental basically
Light isnāt needed nor fits with the thematics I think
Plus she aināt naked
The B in LGBT community stands for Braelor
wait
Why is being naked a requirement smh
oh god that actually could hold ground as a requirement
Earth is an element
all of the elementals are or are almost
Sand Elemental
Sans is the true elemental of earth
Fire Elemental
Sand
Getting its name changed

Die
brimmy being naked is just a result of her design being fucking boring
^
Brimstone
Cloud has a bit but that barely covers shit
anahita is also like a siren, who are depicted as nude
They're all naked.
sand elemental is also fucking boring
Brimstone elemental when she causes YouTube videos to be demonitized
Cloud iirc might get Aerealite armor, but that might just be a really ancient idea I saw
those 20 pixels aren't demonetizing shit
one remark really made this chat devolve into talking about naked elementals
Cloud Elemental's armour is different colourd cloud and Anahita's dress thing is different coloured water.
I haven't
Chippy had his video demonitized
So I wouldn't say that
the word yes could get you demonetized
He had to censor her next time he used her in a thumbnail lol
ok fine youtube sucks ass
Brimmy's gonna get a dress for P1
p1?
She has phases?
Then P2 will have her become a skeletal fre banshee
She will
When she gets reworked
She will
Is the crags overhaul?
Yes.
Ye
yep
I should add that to the doc now that I think about it
They just aren't communicated via sprite changes.
Brimmy rework and resprite
Crags overhaul will be cool because I think rn that biome has next to nothing going on rn
I mean aren't her phases just what attacks she uses lol
Yes, that is
how all phases work.
It got some nice generation but crags donāt have shit rn
thats what phases are
Brimstone elemental is also a boss that is entirely optional and provides nothing for progression upon death
Not true
wait it's getting overhauled?
aw
At some point yes
I like how it is
It's getting better
It's getting expanded
You want it to stay as a bridge when itās meant to be an entire city?
I like trying to rebuild it
And bigger I think
Current crags are just the outskirts
Some bosses look different in phase 2, some clone
You have like 0 reason to go there
current crags is just there to look nice tbh
Outside of spawning brimmy lol
Cal clone
I think DoG is one of the clearest phase 1 and phase 2ās in the game
The unholy cores
bloodstone
Wait nvm
You can make unholy cores
btw is bloodstone planned to get removed?
No
I meant essences of havoc, but then the dungeon currently has it so,,,
Current Crags serve the same purpose as Sunken Sea. Looks good, 1 (mini)boss, and lore important
Brimstone elemental provides literally nothing upon death iirc
Besides a quest fish 
this reminds me
do we know what'll be used to make zerg potions when ash gets removed?
She gives unholy cores donāt she
You can craft those canāt you
yeah but demonic ash is needed
The Greatest Weapon of the Galaxy
Donāt you need to kill brim first to mine suevite on tier
itll just be removed
demonic ash is a complete bloat item
it adds nothing
Needs mythril or orichalcum to mine
It was the ash of bones of demons.
Aka one mech boss
Clearly was important.
I think she is post one mech boss
I wasn't lamenting the loss of that
So no, even on tier you can just mine suevite
just wondering what'll be used to make zerg potions
Brimmy is a fun fight though
Brimmy's current fight is ehhh
Okay I just looked
She doesnāt even drop unholy cores lol
It's sure as heck better than duke fishron lol that fight is a menace
yeah the last duke phase needs to be reworked imo
The only cool things that brimmy drops are the lore items and Hellborn
I know people like dormant brimseeker
I have never beaten fishron purely because that third phase made me rage quit my playthrough lol
I do
Wha, itās a optional fight
it's only possible with a dash iirc
Tbf I went and immediately lost to deus after fighting duke 17 times so I was mad
Although tbh, brimstone elemental is not the only boss in the game whoās aftermath is nothing
I think itās fine that thereās super optional bosses
Good weapon drops and thatās it
It gives cool stuff tho
Deus is post cultist ofcourse you would die if duke is nuking you
I mean
I beat cultist first try
Deus is kinda poopy easy
Thatās why itās like the hardest base fight in vanilla
Thatās normal
I think the other bosses who do nothing are uhh
Crabulon and old Duke?
Thereās probably more
Crab has a rage upgrade
Crabulon still gives a rage thing
okay true
Deus was an issue because I a) was not able to predict the teleporting and b) I could not hit him. Rogue was rough
CalClone maybe?
Queen slime also gives nothing important
Rav exists
Yeah but calclone doesnt do any other big changes
Ashes of calamity
Thatās later on so itās not great
King slime also has no aftermath same for slime god
Slime god gives pretty good gear
Tbf cal clone is still used for low%
SG has the adrenaline upgrade
Cal clone is an alternative cultist unlock
QB and Deerclops
King slime letās you craft balloons so thatās fine
Oh right Deerclops exists
Gives nothing in vanilla and nothing in calamity
Shitty gear too
Okay was thinking mod exclusive bosses in my head but yeah absolutely
If you include them though Iām pretty sure king slime and eye are also there
The amount of Calamity changes to Deerclops can be counted on your fingertips
why hasn't the great sand shark been mentioned yet?
Mini boss
Not a boss
They aren't sentinels
Yeah technically they donāt really have an aftermath
Not sentinels*
Calamity is trying to ignore the existence of deer clops
smh
Yeah i know i just like naming them like this
But I consider them the progression you get to dog
What do i have to call them anyway ?
I know you can just craft dog summon with luminite though
Read channel name
I call them nomads of the distortion
Can't you still fight dog without fighting them
Lore discussion
Alr from now on im naming the not technically sentinels lore-discussion
What if we Gunk Zero'd this person
Minions of noxus
Distortion nomads
[This will make a lot more sense in a couple months]
Storm weaver broke free from Noxusā hivemind and I donāt think Signus works for Noxus
Distortion nomads is wayy too long
DM
Then just call them the nomads
Sentinels is so cool too š
It's a lie
What if i call them
To call them that
NSentinels
No.
Banned immediately
And CV, exists
Get this guy with hammers
Is CV still like a mindless black hole entity thing
But a portal
Not a black hole
Itās a portal
I mean a black hole could be the portal to the distortion
Yeah cv isnāt even a living thing
We fight a seal on the portal
How does one fight a portal
We donāt, we fight the magic seal on it
How is it moving around
So arcane,,,
Witch Doctor's influence
here's a question
Think of CV as a home security defense system
Itās a portal that has attacks !
what would happen if something was between two ceaseless voids?
So the seal is what's fighting you then?
hi lorers, what are yall discussing
Yeah we will be able to enter and go in the distortion in a future update
Lore
As in, half way through two portals?
in lore chat? norway
yes
Rarity I know
I knew that part I was just confused about how it was even fighting you lol
I assume 2/3ās of them would be in the distortion (1/3 on each end) and then 1/3 in the current world
I guess the seal is just protecting the portal
Gunk Zero be upon ye
So it fights and moves to avoid being released
Hi stip
what if they were pressed against each other then?
Stip can I ask you something
with no space inbetween?
Dunno!
You enter the void
Hello
Sure
Into the back rooms you go
Hi stip
Assuming Iām not dead wrong about the badge of bravery being a Braelor accessory
What will happen to it when uelibloom becomes profaned ore?
may I ask you something after you're done answering them?
GUH
badge of braelory
Oh yeah I just remembered something I may want to tell you or devs idk, not a glitch but I think a unintended interaction
Hardy saddle turtle mount lets you go into the abyss until layer 4 before you start running out of breath I think
Uelibloom being tied to Braelor is old lore
oh word?? I know what im doing
Amidias Blessing moment
A few months ago you mentioned that there was a braelor accessory in the game
What is it then, if itās not BoB?
Abyssal amulet 
were any of the godseeker knights given auric equipment or did yharim have it all?
Fair
Silva Wings?
ā¦
They would die
Hm.
No attunement
Though you donāt need to avoid getting hit to stay breathing
No life when wearing auric
fair enough
No
None of the Godseeker Knights can even wear Auric, as only people attuned to Auric Dragons or Auric Dragons themselves can
ok ty
Thatās. You know I didnāt even consider this
Never said it was an accessory
Thatās so funny
Oh bwuh
I always describe somebody wearing auric without an attunement as a springlock failure but exploding
There's a Braelor item in the game
Braelor statue
Grax
Grax is dedicated
Or whatever the funny axe is
Terra Blade?
I assume weāll get a Braelor accessory when heās added then?
ĀÆ_(ć)_/ĀÆ
fair enough
Nope
Biome Blade?
Nope
Terra blade is with the other terra weapons
Hm.
actually, does terra blade have like ANY lore in calamity
Think this through
[X] Blade?
Nope
Itās the feller of evergreens or something
His axe
Axe of Puriy
Yes, Feller of Evergreens is an old axe of his
And is Vernal Pass due to unspecified lore reasons.
In the future, we'll rework it and turn it into a proper line of weapons
Wha
Well, speculate
Vernal Pass was Braelor's home, then.
That'd be super cool actually, I cant wait to become braelor pilled and do an axe only playthrough
Thatās awesome
Considering Braelorās pet perrikati is going to be found in the vernal pass, itās safe to assume he comes from there
Vernal Passian?
Why did I name it that
genuinely when rework happens I might do this
hope we'll get a way to get opposite evil solution at some point
Sounds dope
Opposite evil solution? Wdym
Isnāt there already is?
Oh like
you can get seeds
Steampunker in graveyard probably
not the solution
Oh
Purple and red
Huh
I guess that makes a lot of sense
I have no idea how to get them in base game tho
blood moons
you can only get the ones for your world evil though
Oh hm
Blood moon + graveyard giving opposite evil solution would be pretty good
Maybe make a suggestion for it in the suggestion channel?
Hello everyone
hi
Hi
hi
You have any lore questions?
no
Ok
Yeah, some would require magical knowledge some would just be āpoke it in that directionā
And npcs are frail
They pick up holy collider and they are crushed under the weight and burning mass
the terrarian somehow controlling a fucking nuke to not harm their friends
That is?
Is the terrarian yoyo just the soul of a slain terrarian in a yoyo
Donāt think many ml drops are canon due to funkyness
Aw man
i don't recall anything being an actual nuke in calamity but they could probably do it
can there be a lore reason for weapons not hurting friendly npcs other than gameplay
what do you mean ml's drops don't imply fovos is a catboy

Mini nuke ammoā¦
oh right
Gunk Zero nuke [well tbf, it isn't even ingame yet, and also not a weapon]
it should drop a weapon smh
It drops a nuke that you can pick up, and when you throw it it breaks blocks
I think
considering its progression point
dropping a nuke as a weapon would be too broken
Won't be thrown.
Placed and activated with wiring is what I believe was said.
^
can dog tank a nuke
p
No
Because accidentally throwing a giant bomb would be disastrous (Looking at you, Fargo's Mutants).
Point blank I doubt it heavily
A real life nuke would level the entire in game continent
Arenāt those given big windows between explosion and throw
???
scal can tank a nuke bcuz making herself invincible is totally canon and not just gameplay
Oh
I know
The area you play the game in is not the full continent
The area you play the game in is not the full continent
Would it be accurate to say that it's a shrunken down 2d slice of the full continent?
the continent has a point where it's 3 miles wide and you just happen to be limited to that
The continents are continenting
I see
Like what do you think the backgrounds are?
other continents
Continent, obviously.
Depends on the nÅ«kÉ
I would quite like to see a map of the continent and playable area
I don't think you know what's a continent 
World gen
I mean like a canon one
nah the terrarian has super sight and can also see along the curvature of the planet somehow
Continent is big big huge landmass iirc
Landmass Prime
Yes it's like Minos VS Minos Prime
I know what a continent is, I was just making a really dumb and weird comparison
how do ingame status messages canonically work
its corpse of king minos actually
Divine knowledge.
the terrarian suddenly knows that silva lets them open abyss chests after beating skeletron
Wrong because greenland isn't really a dead body stinky
every boss slain text is just
i dont think this is a terrarian is you moment though
that's not directly the terrarian tho
Slime God defeat.
it's knowledge somehow given to them
help š
And you can headcanon if and why thatās canon

there goes my biome blade headcanon though lol
Rip
-# time to delete 3000 words of biome blade fanfic
just kidding, dev statements mean nothing to me! all lore is just headcanon of the devs for me to ignore at my convenience!!!!!

Based
Hey is there any info on what god the Lihzahrd had?
Not much. It had some connection to the sun, and it abandoned them.
...so it might have been Xeroc, but we don't know for sure
gloem
that really only leaves Xeroc and maybe Providence
torch god 
Providence has no relations to the sun tho
hence why I said maybe
very weak relation but the sun stone does reduce damage dealt by holy flames
ignore that this is being changed to daybreak next update
lol
Why would she start a whole society, that kinda goes against her whole thing
Fair
but aside from Xeroc that's the only thing that is even vaguely close
but I also doubt Xeroc would make a society only to abandon it
who knows though, maybe there's a god of solar panels out there
god of solar planels made me chuckle that was p funny
part of me wants to say they have a connection to the ravager but that's a long shot solely based on the death whistle
Death whistle is getting nuked anyways
I hope we can keep it as a joke item
Remnant of old lore and getting replaced by its altar
I like the sound they make
ik about the story behind them
anyways
the old duke is one of the original draconic offshoots right?
wonder what it was like seeing most of your species being given godly powers and then being left with nothing
if they even are sentient
they are sentient, or at least old duke is
so uhh what do we really know about moon lord
Moon lord is this really strong space squid looking thing that beat the crap out of the auric dragons, it eventually got defeated and sealed on the moon
Its actions kinda lead to the whole plot that the story is in
We will get more info when its bestiary is implemented in SSO
I wonder if it has any relation to DoG since... they're both from space
DoG s from a different dimension, not space
iirc mb
Blah is the Avalon themself
considering Xeroc just dipped after ascension, someone else with an adjacent domain may have taken the role of sun god
god of modern light
God of LED light
guys does the person who speaks through the terminus is yharim?
Itās Xeroc
ok thanks
i remeber hearing a line say "you even bested my friend phoenix"
or something along the lines of that
skibidilamitas

Where do I go to like find all the lore because it seems like everyone knows a lot of stuff I canāt find
The lore doc in pins is good
Ok thanks
he was yharons friend
in the past
xeroc
he got slayed didnt he?
who got slayed
Xeroc is Alive and well
he is
Well I assume heās well, they are physically atleast
Idk we donāt see much of him
I will curse you with a very annoying and invisible fly in your room

I wonder what other kinds of people exist in calamity besides humans
And the other ones we know
Silva vs The Corruption
what can she do
Can life win
against the power of evil biomes
Probably
Considering the dryad has purification powder Iām pretty sure the strongest dryad would be able to have a purification blast and just cleans it much quicker
Is silva secretly just nokotan
Yes
ā
wdym ears
don't you use your nose to see?

Donāg stab me :(
don'g worru
what is the lore behind a sub-20 second on-tier aureus kill
aurues has been really silent after that allegation...
Who will garbo love now?
since deus was the one that caused the astral infection on terraria, aureus inherited the worm-like attribute of being hit 20 times by a piercing projectile
:3
No not you
WHY
:3
:3
:3
This is true!
:3
haai hai
what a calmity
Calamitas the Calamitous: āWitness, my final calamityā
Aurus
the brother of aureus
made from auric
i can try!!!!
I read flinged as a horribly different word wtf is up with my eyes
Beelzebufo:
Ein ?
your fate is sealed
B-but where's zwei ?


wheres the lore wikipage
Thereās also this
Lore doc is better cause it holds almost all ingame lore while lore page on wiki doesnāt
Oh damn apparently dragon cult uses CV as a power source of magic

Yes
Yes
at least its better than fandom's obnoxious ads and autoplay videos be grateful we even have wiki.gg
Stfu honest game reviews!!!!!
GET OUT-
pyromage
hello calamitas, welcome to fortnite
hello calamitas, welcome to fortnite
hello calamitas, welcome to fortnite
hello calamitas, welcome to fortnite
hello calamitas, welcome to fortnite
hello calamitas, welcome to fortnite
hello calamitas, welcome to fortnite
hello calamitas, welcome to fortnite
hello calamitas, welcome to fortnite
hello lore-discussion, i am ending this chain
fuck you



helo goose
hiya
i hope calamitas gets added to fortnite
I hope you get bombed
if that happens i will cast an evil curse on you
i lored
:<
before mod comes and brings a hammer down upon our heads
scommunity too
i wanna give it an extra line like all of the other exhumes have
but i can't think of anything
thats a sick description for scommunity
thank you
funnily enough that's the quickest i've ever written an item description and it's still one of my favourites
it took me probably about ninety seconds
ignoring when i changed one of the words a few minutes later because there was an error
and then other stuff like nucleogenesis took me about thirty minutes to write
"Rage given form" and "focus" is reminding me of hollow knight and the statue in the hall of gods for clearing every boss
that was in my mind when i wrote it
fuck i dont have the image on hand anymore




