suggestions-discussion

[violet pivot]

Now that Im done qith my playthrough of the 2.0 I can see why

[hollow shell]

A full hundy suggestions within a week

[crude geode]

big one hundy

[violet pivot]

A lot of things could be impove in the next update

[frail mortar]

For the plaguebringer wings suggestion
We literally already have a plague jetpack

XD

Although an upgrade to those wings would be cool. If you could make miniature versions of the thrusters PBG has

[ruby plover]

plague jetpack is in calval only

[frail mortar]

Oh yeah. Forgot that was calval

Lmao

Would be cool to have a pbg jetpack but that takes time, effort and spriting

XD

[dire mural]

I’m trying to think of how to ask “for more critters”

Does the astral biome have critters

[frozen hornet]

Just say critters can add to the atmosphere of a biome and generally are cool little additions

[neat linden]

suggestion bot wall of text

[frozen hornet]

I don't know if base cal has astral critters but calval has an astral squirrel I think

[neat linden]

rea

[dire mural]

No I know that

[neat linden]

respectable

[dire mural]

I’m trying to think of where to add critters

Or where it’d make sense

Does the sulphur or abgss or underground sea have critters

🤔

[frozen hornet]

Sunken sea already has baby ghost bells

[dire mural]

Right

Hmm, I’ll need to do research into it

I want to have a theme of short and concise suggestions, I did the DCU upgrade one, pretty proud of over 100 stars on it

[frozen hornet]

You don't need to think of ideas, the devs will do that for you

[dire mural]

No I mean

Research into what has critters or not

[frozen hornet]

m

You could do that yes

[dire mural]

Like why bother suggesting critters in calamity overall when we have so many in the jungle for example, instead of the specific ones lacking

And so forth

If astral has none that’d be the most concise suggestion for example

Just gonna look into what has critters. Go from there

[frozen hornet]

You can list what biomes you think need more critters

[dire mural]

Won’t think of what the critters could be or anything, just suggestion for the specific area

And why

Yeah

[frozen hornet]

that's good

[dire mural]

thanks

[frozen hornet]

Then you can use this for the reasoning

[dire mural]

Yeah I was going to

From the start

[frozen hornet]

cool

[dire mural]

Lol, good to see someone else thought it though

[frozen hornet]

I don't mess with critters that much but I like seeing them around

baby bells and butterflies floating around

[dire mural]

Yep

Little things are part of why big mods work

[fossil finch]

Critters:
Baby Ghost Bells, Baby Flak Crabs, Twinlkers, Sea Minnows

That is it

[grave zinc]

@cerulean condor - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Journey Mode Research Quantities]

It has been voted upon, and the devs decided it would be a good idea to implement it. This doesn't guarantee implementation, as plans may change/alternate plans may be made, but it does highly improve chances!
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

@cerulean condor - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Journey Mode Research Quantities]

It has officially been implemented into the game, and will be available in the next update!
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

[terse sundial]

(technically, it was implemented last update)

[sand ermine]

[prisma kettle]

Yalls gotta find a new name for the plantation staff, especially because of whips now.

LIKE I CANT BE THE ONLY ONE!!

I’m not even like hurt or offended by it, it’s just so weird to use

Damn my fault guys I didn’t mean to post this in the suggestions discussions

[cobalt pewter]

why would Plantation Staff's name needs to be changed?

[drowsy plank]

...what do whips even have to do with plantation staff...? further with it's name...?

[eternal escarp]

and why would it hurt or offend you?
so many questions

[swift wharf]

twitter

[solemn dust]

But why?

[fossil finch]

What the fuck are you talking about jesse

[sand umbra]

average Twitter user

[fossil finch]

ooooh wait i think i got it

They're uh
Doing the ultra stretch of
Plantation=Farms=Slavery=Slave Owner (whips

[swift wharf]

So it's a twitter user

[fossil finch]

It is

[small timber]

I mean... it is not like, a particularly good name? that I can agree, but ya I dont see how whips existing now change anything about it

if it is actually because of twitter reasons then ya not gonna happen, it is too far of a stretch

[sand umbra]

so, again

average Twitter user

[fossil finch]

(They were the only one

[solemn dust]

Love how he didnt respond

[drowsy plank]

plantations only exist in slavery, plantation obviously was not a word with it's own meaning before this, and it's not like the staff doesnt just. summon a little plantera which totally has everything to do with that meaning

[lucid flare]

Yalls gotta remove the summoner class (slavery reference)

[small timber]

rework whips to be candy bars for child friendly mod smhmyhead

[lucid flare]

candy whip

[small timber]

treating your minions with treats for them to fight better

[inland saddle]

Positive reinforcement 😊

[lucid flare]

throwing cocaine at the enemy so the minio goes crazy after them

[prisma kettle]

Sorry I was out living my life I forgot I sent this message

I don’t even know how you guys want me to respond

Oh because it has an undertone that has to do with slavery if you look at it from a coincidental angle

It’s more of just a comedic thing that I thought would be funny to bring up and maybe change

But no

People and their love of not being able to connect the most apparent dots known to man have to force me to show them a connection between whips and the word plantation

Oh my god

Are all of you 12?

IT AINT THAT DEEP

[frozen hornet]

idk what you expect,not once did I think of slavery when I think of whips and not once did I think of actual plantations when using the staff

like

[prisma kettle]

YOU DONT NEED TO COME OUT SWINGING WITH AN ARTICLE

[frozen hornet]

it's the stretch of a century

[prisma kettle]

IT WAS A COMEDIC COMPARISON MAN

LIKE

ME AND MY FRIENDS LAUGHED ABOUT BECAUSE IT COULD BE SEEN AS BAD

[gaunt tiger]

@karmic stone please calm this guy down

[prisma kettle]

please

He’s freaking out

[frozen hornet]

the fact that it took almost an hour and a half for someone to get it makes you wonder

[prisma kettle]

I am a racist yes

[frozen hornet]

cool

[karmic stone]

don't talk about that

no more messages from this topic now

carry on

[gaunt tiger]

thanks add

[solemn dust]

lol its aight

[stable musk]

Urchin stingers in sulphurous armor is very strange idea to artificially increase crafting difficulty

for me getting all other materials took around ≈20 minutes, but then ONLY URCHIN STINGERS took me a whopping amount of 35 minutes even with blue candle

[cobalt pewter]

I guess if you already got magic conch earlier the trip to the other side would be easier

but I can see how the stingers can be annoying in this case yes

[fossil finch]

yharon now turns every tree in the background on fire

fuck you

[drowsy plank]

yharon now lights every tree on fire

in the foreground too

all wood burns like in overhaul mod

[gaunt tiger]

yharon now fires you from your job

fuck you

[frozen hornet]

this boss deals 376 financial damage in revengeance mode

[ashen warren]

https://youtu.be/Y1uKahCzWoQ lol youtuber made video on it after I complained

[north cypress]

So true.

[gaunt tiger]

youtuber made video on saros after I* complained

[fossil finch]

everytime gitgud makes a perfectly balanced video is the time the weapon gets nerfed

[swift wharf]

(ignore the 5 suggestions about the rework being too good)

[gray nebula]

time to rerework

[swift wharf]

@crimson sonnet https://calamitymod.wiki.gg/wiki/Portabulb

[tribal verge]

Calamity players reading challenge

[drowsy plank]

it's a 5 minute google search how do people not figure this stuff out

im 90% sure portabulb appears in boss checklist too so it's not like it's hard to figure out it exists

[swift wharf]

It does appear

[eternal escarp]

people dont fact check anymore before making suggestions ig

[swift wharf]

[tribal verge]

Always has been this way tbh

[eternal escarp]

maybe i was the odd one in my time

[tribal verge]

I still brought boohoo to the server and that was funny

[gaunt tiger]

what about if instead of reactive DR, those bosses scaled to your progression

[eternal escarp]

i believe only night provi and day eol have rdr
which wouldnt really work with that idea

[crimson sonnet]

@ashen warren thanks man, it somehow says on the bosschecklist that there is no item for summoning her, i thought it got patched out

[swift wharf]

Yeah I checked it a few minutes ago and it's not in the checklist, don't worry

[tropic anvil]

So, how many stars do you need to get your suggestion passed?

So, it seems like im less than 3 votes away from getting into in

but i wont get here, my message is too old:(, should i try again, if i was only 2 votes away from getting into it?

[fossil finch]

@upbeat scroll you can't suggest two things at once, also, master is probably not going to be touched at all in calamity because devs don't like it as it's just artificial stat bloat

[upbeat scroll]

It's more or less an overall suggestion to master mode

The difficulty boost accomodated by the celestial onion change

[gray nebula]

man does a turbo suggestion that ends up targeting some random vanilla thing

[fossil finch]

make the game harder but make the game easier

[gaunt tiger]

I agree that the suggestion feels "confused"

[fossil finch]

u don't have to counter difficulty changes

[gaunt tiger]

you should take out the part about difficulty

[fossil finch]

They're made harder to be harder

[upbeat scroll]

celestial onion just feels wasted

for master mode

[fossil finch]

Also the reason eight slot doesn't exist is because it's stupid

[gaunt tiger]

just say "buff some of the bosses, make celestial onion do something"

[fossil finch]

GOOD

Let it be wanted

[gaunt tiger]

you haven't played post ML master lole

[fossil finch]

That's a don't

[gaunt tiger]

you need the 8th slot

[fossil finch]

You have to stick to one

Idnc

It's still stupid

Master itself is stupid design-wise
It's not my bussiness if you enjoy it or not but it's just not good design

[gaunt tiger]

I mean the alternative is that the people (and there are many) who play master mostly all installing wing slot

[gaunt tiger]

says who

[upbeat scroll]

thats exeternal to calamity mod, but also i suggested ai changes /shrug

as an option

[fossil finch]

say i (and a lot of people

[gaunt tiger]

what's wrong with a difficulty increase that makes you need to play the current content better and for longer

[fossil finch]

X3 stat boosts in a game like terraria is completely artificial difficulty

[upbeat scroll]

whatever would have seemed to fit

[gaunt tiger]

that's literally the hard mode in a ton of games, such as metal gear rising revengeance

which this mod so oft fellates

[fossil finch]

in a ton of games hard modes aren't just stat boosts

Master is

[gaunt tiger]

I like a mix of both

we have 2 calamity difficulties

and then master to toggle
for a total of 4 distinct game feels

[sharp coyote]

2?

[fossil finch]

There's a reason i don't care about rev's stat boosts, because it's not just that, and it's not exaggerated and necessary

[gaunt tiger]

I don't play malice mode, but I'm not calling for it to be removed

[upbeat scroll]

3 now but

[fossil finch]

Malice is getting removed

[gaunt tiger]

(malice is getting removed)

[sharp coyote]

why

[fossil finch]

Which reminds me

@stiff bough malice is getting removed

Your suggestion is pointless

Anyways back on track

[stiff bough]

Oh, sorry

I have only played 1.3 so far, as 1.4 keeps crashing for me, I didn’t know

[gaunt tiger]

if you don't enjoy eating an orange, will you ban oranges?

[upbeat scroll]

theres actually a lot of games that just stat change for higher difficulties

[fossil finch]

Setting aside that out of principle they won't add an eight slot, your sugg should only focus on that or on the master changes
You suggest two things at once, and that's a don't

[fossil finch]

That's a massive stretch

[upbeat scroll]

its a stretch to call it two entirely separate things when they both correlate to the same master mode premise

[eternal escarp]

all i will say is saying that "compared to vanilla" the jump between expert and master feels smaller is kind of weird considering master mode was not touched at all iirc

master as a whole is not a real difficulty mode. its just increasing stats for the sake of it

[gaunt tiger]

master was tuned already

[upbeat scroll]

i can't tell a difference between calamity expert and master most of the time

[gaunt tiger]

and if people wanna play like that, I say let them?

[sharp coyote]

there is no diff even in vanilla

fights are longer

period

[eternal escarp]

and its their duty to understand what master mode is

[fossil finch]

Aight I'll just call rover and let them judge
@hollow shell over aquatix' suggestion being two things instead of one

[eternal escarp]

its a doomed difficultt mode from the start

[gaunt tiger]

it is 100% 2 separate things aquatix

sry

[gaunt tiger]

the fact remains that a lot of players disagree

vanilla master is bad

sure

but calamity's spin on it is actually very pleasant

have you even played it?

[fossil finch]

calamity master is the same thing but with calamity's items

There's no spin on it

[gaunt tiger]

they adjusted a lot of things

[fossil finch]

It's the same thing but with different gear

[gaunt tiger]

which you'd know, if you had played it ofc

[eternal escarp]

yeah im quite certain it has no changes other then perhaps some damage adjustments

[fossil finch]

They just adjusted damage for earlier bosses

[gaunt tiger]

they adjusted a lot of damage

as I said

it's quite pleasant to play

[eternal escarp]

it doesnt change that master mode if just a glorified boss lengthener

[fossil finch]

that's completely unrelated to the point of it being objectively bad game design
facts don't care about your feelings

[gaunt tiger]

so what's wrong with that? longer more deadly bosses are not for everyone, but where's the harm?

[fossil finch]

this discussion was never about removing master so i don't get your point either

Nobody's holding anyone at gunpoint

[upbeat scroll]

calamity mod changes a lot about vanilla, so why are you in a sense under the mentality that it shouldn't be changed to give it some identity?

[fossil finch]

that's not what i think

Devs don't want to touch master

[eternal escarp]

either way i dont rwally understand the point of

either sugg in that message

[fossil finch]

It's not my opinion its that they don't want to

[gaunt tiger]

then let people who like it suggest changes

[upbeat scroll]

giving master a form of identity

[gaunt tiger]

and if they're reasonable, change it

[fossil finch]

so they don't get implemented because devs don't want to?

[drowsy plank]

what do people not understand about "we aren't touching master"

[fossil finch]

reasonable is not a thing you can quantify and the last say on what is reasonable goes to the devs

[upbeat scroll]

the only reference to master mode in the donts is the 8th accessory slot

btw

thats the only time its mentioned

[eternal escarp]

celestial onion is likely not going to be made usable in master because 8 accessory slots is kindof stupid iirc especially considering theres been damage adjustments in cal. and that defense is 100% effective unlike experfs 75%
you want to use wing slot then feel free

[fossil finch]

yes because it's not a don't

[gaunt tiger]

they've already touched master

[fossil finch]

That doesn't mean devs want to touch master

they is fabsol specifically

Who holds reign about everything boss related

It doesn't mean the team wants to go any further than that

[gaunt tiger]

do I really have to learn terraria modding to make a mod that fixes calamity master mode

[drowsy plank]

yes

[eternal escarp]

no one will stop you

[fossil finch]

if you're so hurt about it yes

[upbeat scroll]

no one will stop you from making an add on to calamity master mode externally

infernum mode exists

as a calamity add on

[eternal escarp]

thats not near whag infernum is

[upbeat scroll]

i'm just saying that mods that change calamity do exist

[eternal escarp]

infernum specifically cant be activated in master lol!

[drowsy plank]

wait really?

that's hilarious

[fossil finch]

Small bit of dom trolling

[gaunt tiger]

so if rev can be used in master
why is the response so hostile to suggesting changes to it

[eternal escarp]

one difficulty is enougj to balance bosses around

[gaunt tiger]

and yet there are already 2

[drowsy plank]

bc it's like removing boss butchers or timed dr or cross mod compatability. they let people play how they want but they arent going to balance around it

[fossil finch]

rev can be used in master because devs don't want to limit people

[eternal escarp]

there used to be 3
thered a reaosn theres only 2 now

[fossil finch]

doesn't mean they're giving a shit about master balance

[eternal escarp]

and keep in mind normal and expert also exist

[upbeat scroll]

there used to be a lot of additional difficulties to the mod but it got streamlined

[fossil finch]

Also, those 2 have been in the mod since before master was even a concept and have been balanced in a period of like 4 years

[gaunt tiger]

my comments on balance in master aside, I think the celestial onion change is a simple enough ask

[drowsy plank]

which is why it already passed

lmao

[fossil finch]

Calamity Master is a month old

[gaunt tiger]

it did?

[drowsy plank]

i mean

[eternal escarp]

master just sticks like a sore thumb because unlike expert and the rest it doesnt actually change anything. its just stats

[gaunt tiger]

also cognitive you need to calm tf down every time I see you in here you're flaming

[drowsy plank]

it's in the pool but not confirmed

i thought we were talking about the recent one

like they still gotta vote on that no reason to discuss it here

[fossil finch]

A suggestion about celestial onion in master was sent yes

[gaunt tiger]

on a second glance I don't even think master DoG needs a nerf
I think all modes of DoG need a nerf

[upbeat scroll]

if they dont like it they dont have to put it in voting at the end of the day its just thought expression

[fossil finch]

It's probably going to get denied or on limbo if devs don't agree on either side

Going to voting is made automatically

Suggs that survive a day were already filtered by the don'ts and discussions

That's the point

[gaunt tiger]

none of my suggestions passed feels sadge man

[upbeat scroll]

and thats totally fine

[eternal escarp]

either way. what yoj objectively need to do is seperate your suggestions

[fossil finch]

Anyways I've already pinged rover and we're not going anywhere so I'll leave it there really

[eternal escarp]

because they are definitely two different topics

[upbeat scroll]

thats fair

is that generally more concise?

no longer suggesting anything about changing master mode

it was recommended to edit suggestions based on discussions

[fossil finch]

It's fine yeah

[upbeat scroll]

I figured removing some of the specifics in the example would also be more fitting

just giving the general idea

[swift wharf]

good candle suggestion

[hollow shell]

@upbeat scroll Adding a new acc slot is in the Dont's

[hollow shell]

(spoilers, this is getting heavily rejected in Dev)

[cobalt pewter]

lmao

[gaunt tiger]

"it's not possible"

[fossil finch]

You should remove that part rover yeah

Because it's not true anymore

[hollow shell]

elaborate on "anymore"

[gaunt tiger]

wing slot has been out for ages

it's always been possible

[fossil finch]

Tmod implemented a system that makes adding acc slots easier

[gaunt tiger]

oh snap

[fossil finch]

Wing slot's existence was a miracle in 1.3

And it had weird bugs

[hollow shell]

Wing Slot existed when I wrote that Don't, lmao

[fossil finch]

And it didn't do vanity well (cheat sheet slots don't have vanity because of this)

[hollow shell]

Yeah
Wing Slot was dedicated entirely to doing one thing, and it still had bugs

[fossil finch]

Now all those points are moot but it doesn't matter because it's not happening anyway

[gaunt tiger]

sure

but the suggestion that passed voting said make the onion do something else

are the devs down for that?

[hollow shell]

I literally just told you

[gaunt tiger]

you didn't tho

[fossil finch]

(This sugg got a 100% denied rate or some shit

[gaunt tiger]

ah

you meant not just accessory slots

that was the context I thought you were talking in

[hollow shell]

But uh Yes I did not know that tMod 1.4 made it possible to add new accessory slots

I'll have to rethink that Don't or bring it up again with the devs

[gaunt tiger]

what does this mean sry

[fossil finch]

Can't u just remove the part about it being impossible

[unique vector]

i think the issue is adding an 8th slot is balancing hell

bc that shifts the complexity of accessory combos significantly

[fossil finch]

Because you're kinda not doing it out of not wanting to anyway

[gaunt tiger]

I think if the stance is "master isn't balanced" just let it be unbalanced

[gaunt tiger]

legit this

[unique vector]

see the issue there is we dont know if we're touching master

and i dont see a reaosn to make it worse

[gaunt tiger]

master+rev is the best thing to happen to calamity in a while
rev becomes harder without the bosses moving at the speed of light

[swift wharf]

No need for an 8th slot then

[hollow shell]

(The Don't doesn't even say it's impossible, it says it'd be really hard)

[fossil finch]

u get what I'm saying

[unique vector]

if ur looking for extended stats fsr then sure

altho i prefer just death

bc i like the ai complexity better

[gaunt tiger]

I don't enjoy the AI complexity as much? but my death master playthrough has been enjoyable so far

[swift wharf]

And if you really want a slot
there's kind of a mod for that

[unique vector]

sure

[fossil finch]

Simply put the healthbar slider at 900
Like 200k health ks
Hilarity ensues as you fight a calamitas with like 10 million health

[gaunt tiger]

isn't the point of suggestions to suggest things that would be good? does calamity itself not incorporate common qol mods into itself from time to time?

potions in shops, nonconsumable summons

[fossil finch]

That's not qol

It's balancing

[unique vector]

we add qol that revolves around calamity's gameplay

[fossil finch]

The slots i mean

[swift wharf]

An extra slot makes game easier

[small timber]

7 slot is deninitely enough for master rev/death (postML particularly, since that is where it change)

[unique vector]

we avoid qol that contradcits with the existence of other mods and contraadicts with our own mod's design

[small timber]

In fact I requested a nerf on warding because defense was too good on master with just 7 accessories postML

[swift wharf]

the Venn diagram of qols and cheats is a circle

[fossil finch]

truly

[gaunt tiger]

melee players be like

[small timber]

The main one is really just DoG, since you kinda lack the tool to deal with it as accessories gain much more effect postDoG

[swift wharf]

and you can't really compare npcs selling pots in cal to alch npc

since alch npc makes one npc sell everything

[small timber]

(so just adjust DoG instead of the headache of balancing an 8th slot)

[swift wharf]

leave master unbalanced

[gaunt tiger]

fine, balance dog whatever
but wouldn't it be cool if on master moon lord dropped the celestial lemon or some shit that is a 4th upgrade for adrenaline or something?

[fossil finch]

why do master players need to be rewarded more again

[gaunt tiger]

wtf u mean rewarded

[fossil finch]

Didn't we have a whole catharsis with the malice thing of how this is a bad idea

[swift wharf]

you do realize that

master can be played without rev

[small timber]

I think at this point having celestial onion drop combat upgrade is whatever

[fossil finch]

You're rewarding them with an upgrade no one else has

[gaunt tiger]

master can't be toggled on and off with an item

it's different

[swift wharf]

it can in journey

[small timber]

I just wish onion give like, item grab range, and thats about it

[fossil finch]

That doesn't matter

It's still rewarding players for playing higher difficulties
We had a whole development arc built around this c'mon

[gaunt tiger]

I'm losing brain cells

[hollow shell]

Hang on, hang on one second

Doesn't Master already give the player +1 acc slots compared to Expert for the whole playthrough up to ML?

[small timber]

Yes

[gaunt tiger]

yeah but it kinda balances out with the extra stats on everything

so onion not working feels really bad

[hollow shell]

Balance out?

It's a difficulty mode

[gaunt tiger]

yeah that's the tradeoff

[fossil finch]

balance out 😭

[gaunt tiger]

everything is harder BUT you get 1 more accessory

[small timber]

Which is why I feel the only part really need adjustment is just postML preDoG, and then it is fine

[fossil finch]

That's so stupid

[gaunt tiger]

y'all trying to balance master and don't play or enjoy master

this is exactly why there's a suggestions channel in the first place

[fossil finch]

We're not doing roguelike curses it's difficulty modes

[gaunt tiger]

to cover dev blindspots

[small timber]

PostDoG accessories have so many combination effect that many of them are well good enough to be 2/3 accessories in effect

[fossil finch]

We don't need to balance them out with arbitrary things

[gaunt tiger]

then don't play master

I'm not asking you to enjoy master

but there are people that do

[fossil finch]

That's as good of an argument as me saying don't play master when you were complaining about dog's damage

[gaunt tiger]

I agree with this, but any talk of balancing master mode is like hitting a wasp nest

[small timber]

The thing is I dont feel master need rebalance or even the 8th slot is needed, the player is not exactly weak even with 7 in postML

[gaunt tiger]

so I'm thinking of alternatives instead

[small timber]

I think it really is adjust DoG and done, other bosses you have a lot of counter measures now like debuff immunities and so on

[gaunt tiger]

I thought post ml pre dog was very rough around the edges, but post dog was perfect

[unique vector]

sigh

okay

listen

im going to say a few points

and im going to ask you guys to drop this rabble

[gaunt tiger]

k

[unique vector]

because this happens almsot every day and im kind of tired of it

1. nobody is stopping you from suggesting balance changes to master mode. unless a dev comes here and explicitly tells you not to (and im not), you are free to suggest whatever as long as you understand that balancing MM is not priority for us and that said suggestions comply with the suggestions doc
2. please understand that calamity is straying away from "rewarding" you for playing a harder difficulty. we do not believe that "harder" difficulties should be compensated with mechaniccally-changing rewards just because you enjoy said modes more than others. that's why we've changed things like expert+ treasure bags, why we removed legendaries from malice, why we wont add extra upgrades to master for accessories or rage or whatever

im not gonna have the patience to ask you guys to stop arguing abt master mode balancing for another half an hour so try your best to not have it happen again

[gaunt tiger]

oh
we can suggest master balance changes

[unique vector]

unless its aa newly added dont to the doc, you caan

yes

[gaunt tiger]

I heard a lot of talk about it getting added? maybe it was people asking it to be added

my b

[unique vector]

and those that are for some reason speaking on the behalf of devs claiming we're "never" touching master mode balancing and telling ppl off for any master mode related suggestions please stop

[gaunt tiger]

yeah I'll 100% drop this tho

[gaunt tiger]

that is what I've been hearing past 2 weeks

[unique vector]

theres a huge difference between "never" and "not considering it"

because master mode as it stands is the least of our worries right now

like, why dont yall try being constructive with your feedback for once

instead of saying "thats stupid"

😃

[gaunt tiger]

I hear all sorts of rumours
"fab hates master, never gonna be tuned"
and variants

anywho

yeah I try and be constructive when I can

I will endeavour to not fight with ppl in here in future tho

[unique vector]

take it from me, if i dont say thaat we're never doing it then assume theres a nonzero chance we will

[gaunt tiger]

sorry boss

[small timber]

celestial onion does nothing on master, what if instead just remove the extra slot granted from the start

[unique vector]

bc im usually up to date with most of the things we want to do

[gaunt tiger]

hissss

[crude geode]

Honestly wouldn’t be surprised it that happened

[fossil finch]

Unless it's a public leak* (we need a channel for tha

Wait do we really need one
I exist i know all of them that's literally my job

[unique vector]

ozz just said in dev suggs that we intentionally have it working with tml's system of adding slots so its nonrestrictive, but we are also intentionally not making it add an 8th slot

and never will for the foreseeable future

[small timber]

Since it kinda is like, reward higher difficulty wi the mechanic change, in the sense, just it is vanilla

[gaunt tiger]

🙏

[unique vector]

if anything

we're more likely to make demon heart non-expert+

[swift wharf]

omg yes

[unique vector]

idk if we will

[hollow shell]

(if we don't do it already)

[unique vector]

yeah

[hollow shell]

(It's unclear)

[swift wharf]

[unique vector]

it was briefly mentioned

[hollow shell]

(Someone go play the game on Normal to check)

[swift wharf]

Last time I checked only onion drops

[gaunt tiger]

I think sentinels need a small nerf, and maybe a small one to polter too
uhhh
so does old duke
then it'll be fine! 😄

[unique vector]

i dont think it currently does

[swift wharf]

only onion works***

[unique vector]

onion is all modes

[fossil finch]

You're asking too much like 3 people play normal

[burnt condor]

(demon heart doesn't work on normal can confirm)

[unique vector]

we could also just like

disable onion from dropping on master

[swift wharf]

dragon for the clutch

[unique vector]

if its that huge of an issue

[drowsy plank]

lmao

[hollow shell]

Damn

[fossil finch]

There will a player out there that won't know onion exists and to me that concept is hilarious

[gaunt tiger]

what about replacing the onion with like a sad emoji trophy you can place on walls

[drowsy plank]

sounds like a calval thing

[swift wharf]

maybe give onion something other than +1 slot so it works on all diffs😊

[gaunt tiger]

eclipse, no

[swift wharf]

+5 heath

[gaunt tiger]

lol

[small timber]

Also is Malice confirmed (confirmed) remove? Since the last time I heard is left it be until the soon™️ malice rework

[fossil finch]

True
Make it have a thousand cirrus quote about you being awful

Someone suggested degrading quotes for master players so i guess they'll be happy? (Why

[fossil finch]

It is

[gaunt tiger]

if I wanted degrading comments I'd come here kekw

[swift wharf]

[unique vector]

yes

[gaunt tiger]

that was a joke please don't kill me

[swift wharf]

what joke

[gaunt tiger]

lol

[hollow shell]

(also unrelated but just noticed
@stable musk You need to rewrite your reasoning, it seems you forgot this enemy exists in the Sulph Sea: https://calamitymod.wiki.gg/wiki/Aquatic_Urchin )

[stable musk]

is it me or terraria spawns only 1 mob per spawn

[fossil finch]

That's how it works yes

[hollow shell]

You still say the stingers are from the opposite side of the world

[upbeat scroll]

Not to mention for that idea in specific, Magic Conch is an item now and can immediately teleport you to either ocean immediately, found in one of the closest biomes to spawn.

Also thank you for I guess further clarification on the matter of slots and master mode

[small timber]

the EoL's starlight as true melee weapon is fine, though I feel the reasoning is a bit lacking tbh, or like off

since true melee only is a self-imposed challenge and 'no reason to do EoL as true melee' is a bit stretch, especially that soaring insignia exist

@hollow shell (also I think you forgot to exclaim the master mode celestial onion wing slot suggestion unless I didn't catch on the convo above)

[hollow shell]

I'm not sure whether to exclam it, or let it pass and have it get rejected by the devs

[small timber]

can also make it like the no more bloons reference case maybe? let it pass and then put celestial onion reward on master mode as frequently suggested, maybe

[hollow shell]

It's hardly frequent, this is only the 2nd one posted afaik

MOAB upgrade suggs have existed since the SIS days

[upbeat scroll]

I'll just delete it

In retrospect if people really want to have a wing slot they can just add it themselves with the mod

[hollow shell]

Alright

[upbeat scroll]

Nothing stops them from adding whatever mod they want for whatever kind of rules or gameplay they desire

[small timber]

in hindsight a nerfed wingslot will be like, abit scuffed tbh

it is such a massive nerf and you can only use 1 wings that you will likely leave it empty

[upbeat scroll]

I initially thought: "People will choose either to have it in their main accessory slot taking it up for the full effectiveness of their wings or have another accessory but have scuffed wing flight"

It was a tradeoff for using it

Maybe that should be something wing slot themselves should add for customization 🤔 mod config options

[small timber]

tbh I am fine with celestial onion having effect in master, just non combat oriented one

even like gold gain or item grab range, or even increase enemy spawn rate is fine (considering its eldritch source)

[upbeat scroll]

it would be cool if it lowered respawn timer if inflicted by not a boss

but

[drowsy plank]

isnt the respawner timer without a boss already like

3

[upbeat scroll]

last time i played calamity singleplayer without the respawn mods (a year ago) i just used respawn timer mods to make it so my timer was 5 seconds instead of the 15

thats a bit scuffed of a sentence

a year ago i started using respawn timer mods externally to shorten my timer to 5 seconds from 15

unsure if they changed it since a year ago

[small timber]

currently your respawn timer lower if there is no boss (boss despawn when you die in singleplayer anyway so MP only) and no event is occuring

[upbeat scroll]

okay

[small timber]

I dont know how much it reduce (since I have a separate one), but ya the function do exist

[upbeat scroll]

is there anything within calamity that extends buff durations?

[small timber]

amalgam accessory, abit too late in progression though

(last time didnt do too well but can always try)

[upbeat scroll]

i dont usually craft that one tbh

[hollow shell]

Weird effect to give to the Amalgam, and very different from what it was previously

[small timber]

ya, this actually feels more like COBG effect

(new one in particular)

that said it might work since amalgam will (maybe) get dodge with the boc change

[upbeat scroll]

1.4 has the magnet as a shadow chest item

[drowsy plank]

honestly the debuff effect seems way better paired with a dodge

you might actually be able to apply it without dying

[hollow shell]

Hrmmmm
"With Amalgam/Amalgamated Brain (possibly) getting a new effect from its Brain of Confusion component that have dodge,"

Sussy future content reasoning

[small timber]

ya tbh that one dont fit and I thought it was an oversight that amalgam didnt have said effect (therefore it might get added later after the balance patch come out, something like that)

I can use a different reasoning if that dont fit

[hollow shell]

It does seem like we eventually plan on making em inherit the effect
But it would still be future content regardless, much like changelogs

[small timber]

ya, then in that case I will make it not the main reasoning

(sec, will change later)

[hollow shell]

Ok

[small timber]

ok this should be like last edit unless there is other issues/argument/critcism for it (don't want to keep suggestion-posting lighting up constantly)

[hollow shell]

((editing a message doesn't give a notif blob))

This does look better

[small timber]

I didnt know that but I am glad my liking of constantly doing small edits did not annoy others

[hollow shell]

#suggestions-voting message

@flat urchin Currently a sugg in voting for what you're suggesting ^

You should probably wait to see how that suggestion does

(if the last batch's stats are any indication, it will be among the ones delivered to the devs)

[flat urchin]

Excellent!

I now feel good~

Thanks for letting me know

[hollow shell]

👍

[small timber]

he forgor to delete

[stable musk]

Rewrote a little

[hollow shell]

Much better, thank you

[dire mural]

Do you think my DCU one will get among the ones delivered, was over 100

Last I checked

[hollow shell]

Here were the stats

[dire mural]

Damn it

[fringe otter]

Make rod of discord function like it does in vanilla (aka taking max hp but no cooldown on tp) whenever a boss isn't alive (maybe events too). This change would make navigating the world simple and efficient, while still preventing it from being abused in boss fights (which i believe is why the cooldown is there in the first place)

[hollow shell]

Hm

Wondering if this would be valid or not

[small timber]

something something that will make it seems like only boss fight balance is important, I forgot who said it (ctrl+F but I dont know keyword)

[hollow shell]

Cuz yeah we had a conversation a few days ago about how we want to move away from boss-fight-only balancing changes
Cuz that enforces the idea that bosses are the only thing that "matters", balance-wise

This was in response to a Soaring Insignia suggestion iirc

[dire mural]

Outside of some things like op reaver axe

I don’t understand why stuff outside of boss orientated stuff would be a balance focus

[small timber]

another thing is pylon exist now, and most of the exploration is done in pre-HM

[dire mural]

Like unless it breaks progression completely

The soaring insignia nerf doesn’t make sense to me, I feel like at that point just disable the item vs bosses

[small timber]

I think this ^ sentence was mainly referring to the differential treatment of items have "effect when boss is alive" or not, not necessarily super major

soaring insignia in its current nerf stat is one of the (if not the best) mobility item in the game, besides wings

that is after a major nerf

[dire mural]

Soaring insignia not nerfed outside of bosses would be nice for world travel

[swift sinew]

Are you allowed to ask people to vote on your suggestion, or tell people about it? Or is it just a waiting game, it seems the vanity suggestion I made won’t go anywhere.

[small timber]

pylon exist for traversing now, for HM teleporters is also an option

[dire mural]

Fair

Just kinda feels bad ig

[small timber]

try not to since it will be like promotion (and I imagine it will get annoying when more people try to do it)

[dire mural]

Yeah don’t wanna cause a domino effect

[small timber]

soaring insignia is definitely still extremely good

[dire mural]

Of course, just feels bad, I would’ve just disabled it vs bosses

Not the only item that disables vs bosses

[small timber]

tbh for travelling I like flying mounts way more than wings flight

[swift sinew]

Fair point

[small timber]

or you can use Glorious End which is an amzing travel item

[dire mural]

People like different things ofc

If people wanna flap infinitely for travel I say let ‘em

😛

[small timber]

flap

[dire mural]

Yep

Flap their wings

[small timber]

birb

[dire mural]

Caw caw motherfucker

But yeah if it was me I’d just disable soaring vs bosses, rebuff it and let people use it for travel

People got pylons and teleporters and what not

Not game breaking at the point you get them cause you’ve probably explored most of the world already, especially compared to other options

[crude geode]

Me when op effects outside of boss fights (if you’re not fighting a boss it doesn’t matter if something is op )

[dire mural]

Yep

I fully believe in that assessment unless it breaks progression

Like reaver axe pre nerf

[crude geode]

I don’t lol

[dire mural]

As long as something doesn’t break progression by some sort of means

[crude geode]

It simplifies the game to “boss rush or unimportant” which belittles a lot of the rest of what little exploration content there is

[dire mural]

I’m fine with it

[dire mural]

Well, by the time you’ve gotten the soaring insignia you’ve explored most of the places wings would be important

[crude geode]

Or even outside of that, non boss fight combats (acid rain)

[dire mural]

I’d count it for events then

Too

Soaring insignia by the time you get it pre nerf, for travel purposes, isn’t even the strongest option for travel

[small timber]

then to certain degree it also implies that soaring insignia dont have to be rebuffed outside of boss fight, since it is not the best option for travel anyway even if it is reverted
it is less about how effective the item actually is in its circumstances, it is as above stated more with the differential treatment for these items, I will rather they have only 1 stat and thats about it, whether balanced around bosses is the case or not

[dire mural]

Unnecessary nerf to be reverted > the idea of it being unnecessary buffed

It’s clearly silly for boss fights if in its original state, but in its nerfed state it loses fun aspect for travel. I say disable the item in events and in boss fights, buff it back up. Let people flap wings forever, otherwise, for fun

[still zodiac]

the issue here would be that it implies boss fights and events are the only things it should be balanced around

which is also why chaos state was nerfed to be always high even outside the boss fights

[dire mural]

It is balanced outside of boss fights for calamity if buffed back

[still zodiac]

yeah, can't argue with that

[dire mural]

We ain’t talking a reaver shark breaking progression here

[still zodiac]

but again, it's better if it's on a consistent power level rather than having different powers at different times

[dire mural]

It’s not different powers

[still zodiac]

atleast i'd personally say so

[dire mural]

It’s having powers or none

It does nothing but increase wing potency for boss fights, and it’s not even an item slot used by that point usually

For boss fights due to the nerfs

So it’s kinda just there

[small timber]

50% flight is good enough even outside of boss fight, event or anything, the only thing more than 50% flight is useful at is travelling, which pylon and teleporters do its job but 10x better

[dire mural]

Yeah obviously, it’s why it is balanced for travel if it was buffed back

[small timber]

and by travelling I mean flying across the entire map, since just for exploration 50% flight is still definitely enough

[dire mural]

Disable it for boss fights and especially since it’s rarely used by the time you best eol

Due to other accessories

[small timber]

you mean soaring insignia is not really used?

[dire mural]

Not by that point compared to other actives, not from what I’ve gathered here or various videos

By that time you have insane class specific accessories

And boots

[small timber]

soaring insignia is the best movement accessory in the game, and that is not overexaggerated

the only thing better than it is wings, but it is wings

[dire mural]

🤷‍♂️ if it was I’d expect to see it used with the wing + boot combo or at least hear people talk about it

Only time I see it discussed is on this kinda topic. That’s kinda a problem imho for an item that should be for fun.

It’s depressing

I’m a very “for fun” person and I don’t want the item to get upgrades or buffed past its original state, just locked from the stuff it’s actually broken in

And have it be a for fun thing for your wings

It’s balanced for the time you get it as a non important fight accessory. It’s not like reaver shark axe pre nerfs or obsidian armors set bonus

[small timber]

it is balanced that way in vanilla, the problem is calamity have a lot of bosses after that which the item must accounted for

[dire mural]

I know, I did say “balanced as a non important fight accessory”

[small timber]

for vanilla EoL is about the 2nd hardest boss in the game, for calamity it is barely pass half way point of the game

[dire mural]

Which includes all bosses and events

I’d disable it for every single boss and event, it wouldn’t be solely balanced around bosses

Because it’s original state is already balanced as a travel function

Especially in calamity where chaos state is better for dodge and transports are better for actual moving. It’s just for fun with a disable of it in bosses and events

Shrug, it’s nitpicky but when the discussion is “for fun” I think it should be nitpicky

Doesn’t break progression if disabled for bosses and events, and doesn’t break travel because by that point you have way stronger mobility for mobs or just travel

And it’s by my knowledge extremely underused by anyone in calamity for boss fights(and in general) as it is now, so it’s not like you’d be upsetting a lot of people by disabling it for bosses/events

If it was so strong in practice mobility wise it’d be used a ton by the time it’s gotten, but there’s so many insane items for classes, plus boots/wings that you really just don’t care for it usually. And most just use teleports and chaos if they’re seriously moving

[crisp lagoon]

I wanna see more uses for the power cells, i often build a lab area to make batteries but never use em, a few accessories would be amazing

[dire mural]

It’s not good enough to be used for fun or in fights over other accessories/mechanics, in most peoples eyes. Clearly to me that shows a lack of balance for boss/events fights and not even fun enough to be used to f around, as it is rn

If you’re typing a wall I’m too tired to read it just letting you know

[small timber]

at this point you seem to definitely will hold onto your opinion on the item so I will not argue it (since it is just red and blue situation), so I will just put it here:

1. the current approach (seems) to be trying to have less differential treatment of item between having different effect outside/inside boss fights; soaring insignia is balanced for bosses, therefore to be non-differential it has its "boss fight stat"
2. soaring insignia is good and as of currently almost everyone I see (in nohit lounge) use it right after it is available until end game (scal and exos), so I will definitely not call it underused, in fact everyone there called it brokenly overpowered
3. Even in its current stat, it is definitely strong enough for all use for travelling and other outside of boss fights use, 50% flight is a lot considering the wings at the progression
4. not everything have to be progression breaking to justify it being nerfed, soaring insignia in its vanilla stat is simply broken, for travelling purpose or not, it is just a completely overpowered effect slap onto the 2nd hardest boss in the game beside the final boss; I will definitely not call it 'balanced for travelling' in that case since it is just a all-rounder accessory

[dire mural]

I guess it’s important for nohit

So you got me there

[small timber]

it is not just for nohit, it is just one of the best accessory in the game

[dire mural]

Meh

[small timber]

the only situation I see people not use it is when they neglect movement other than wings on accessories and go full offense or defense

[dire mural]

All rounder but outdone by clas specific stuff and tracers/boots/wings

Which most people do unless they’re doing the insane difficulty stuff xpc

[small timber]

which in another sense also means it is super good since people are using it for the insane difficulty stuff

[dire mural]

Where movement in fights matters more yeah

[small timber]

just whether or not people think it is necessary to use it

[dire mural]

But that’s a population diff

I can guarantee those people are a very small % of those who play calamity

It’s so op there they’d probably be fine with it getting disabled and becoming a full for fun item

I love “for fun” items

So disabling the item and making it more fun is what I’d personally like but that’s ofc me

I’ll stop the Convo, I get your points and you get mine

I’ll survive 😆

[small timber]

the reason that type of item don't exist in cal is generally because it will feel extremely bad when they player have an amazing item just to get told it cannot be used on things that progress the game; it feels like robbing them out of a choice

[dire mural]

It’s not the only item disabled in such cases though

Like it’d be diff if this would be an unprecedented thing

Tbf they could just add an item that is the full insignia but disabled how I want so

🤷‍♂️

[small timber]

most of them to my knowledge is for anti-cheese, for cases like recall, teleporter and stuff; soaring insignia is an accessory and always had been since vanilla added it, it is a different case if they are to get told that it can only be use outside of boss fight

[dire mural]

Well when you think about it

Original soaring is cheese

[small timber]

an item similar to this is burden breaker I think (probably can count), but they removed it because pylons

[dire mural]

sigh

My biggest complaint of this mod is the lack of for fun specific things

Like almost everything has a purpose of something beyond “for fun”

Which is fine, lots of purpose is fine

Just the lack of fun and little things always bothers me

[small timber]

the approach I think is because a lot of "for fun" stuff can be added from external mods that is not calamity, which is also available to the player, so they balanced the base calamity around like, probably can call "balanced"? or you might call it "not for fun"

[dire mural]

I guess

But then that kinda stuff does break progression

Or other silly things

[small timber]

things like wing slot, ore excavator/veinminer are big example

[dire mural]

Yeah like that’s fine

But actual more accessories?

Or stuff like that

I like fun but not at the sake of breaking the progression

It’s why I was against reaver axe pre nerf earlier

[crisp lagoon]

I will always use movement accessories like the soaring insignia, im currently fighting the mech bosses with an aero stone amphibian boots and balloons, in my opinion the insignia should be nerfed in revengence instead of overall so if people want the more difficult experience they use the modded difficulties and if people want "fun" they can just do regular expert

[dire mural]

At that point it’s better just to disable it in harder mode boss fights and events

[small timber]

I just think it will be not good to add thing that explicitly made a part of the game completely trivial, no matter if it break progression or not, but that is just imo

halibut cannon used to be the case but it was moved too

[dire mural]

Well, it’s not breaking travel

That’s the issue

Once you get it you already can have transporters

And discord

So yeah

What does insignia do

The numbers

50% boosted flight and such?

[small timber]

I was referring to this, but ya

[dire mural]

Right

Shrug, ima go to sleeps. I think insignia would be fine if it was purely infinite flight and nothing more

Iirc it’s boosted flight speed and what not plus that on the original

[small timber]

at this point just suggest to "Add an item that provide infinite flight for travel purpose"

[dire mural]

Ha

I perhaps will

[small timber]

I dont think messing with insigina is worth it (it will just have a lot of people arguing against it like me), just make a new one that achieve what you want

[dire mural]

I gave an idea for a DCU upgrade or so to give it “calamity spice”

Since it’s a beloved mount

[small timber]

DCU upgrade I think was approved, sec

[dire mural]

It was?

Pog

[small timber]

still need to wait for implementation, but ya at least the chance increase

[dire mural]

Oh, immune was a diff one

[small timber]

oh wait not that one

[dire mural]

Yeah the other one is mine

I think

[small timber]

I cant find it, I remember one is approved, but ya

[dire mural]

Has 120 now I think

Lol

Either way it’s confirmed upgrades so hey

Pog

Anywho, yeah I could suggest it

[frozen hornet]

Who needs DCU when you have onyx key+OLO

[crisp lagoon]

Who needs them when u have cheat sheet with the paint tool

[frozen hornet]

okay but cheat sheet paint tool doesn't let you backflip with a fucking drill

[crisp lagoon]

Fair point, but does a backflipping drill allow you to copy paste boulder traps above your friends bases

[frozen hornet]

DCU doesn't place stuff either

[drowsy plank]

bolders are craftable now...?

[crisp lagoon]

Ye

50 stone at a tinkerer

Can get a boulder statue aswell

[drowsy plank]

also i think the arguement for rod being like vanilla outside of bossfights is a lot stronger than the arguement for soaring to be unnerfed outside of bossfights

you have mounts for infinite flight outside of bosses, but when trying to clentaminate without turning your world into swiss cheese, or building in small spaces, the unnerfed rod was a nice QoL way to keep blocks intact while still moving, and while you can do that still with current RoD the 20 second cooldown makes it a bit obnoxious

soaring basically trivializes any exploration, but in hardmode, when RoD is avaliable, most places that are important to explore explicitly have anti-RoD measures, like the golem temple. while im not expecting anything to change i think you could at least make an actual argument with RoD

[hollow shell]

@heady sun Not a bad idea but you should please format the suggestion properly and give more reasoning than that

(ok technically it is formatted properly but it could still be structured way better)

[heady sun]

the reasons is kinda short, i'll try

[cobalt pewter]

Wikithis compat with cal would be very good

but yeah you should follow the formatting and make the reasoning better

[eternal escarp]

you could go on about how terraria is a wiki game in its core or smthn iirc

[heady sun]

it's better now?

[small timber]

if I remember correctly I think when it get turn into suggestion the link will lose its image, so it is worth saying that the link is referring to wikithis

[hollow shell]

Yes much better
One last thing you should do is put the name of the mod in your top line, instead of saying "this mod"

yeah ^

[gaunt tiger]

Oh cool a wiki mod

[heady sun]

ok

done

[hollow shell]

(you can keep the link tho)

[heady sun]

oh

better?

[hollow shell]

You didn't add it back yet

Yes there we go, perfect 👌

[heady sun]

thx for the help

[hollow shell]

👍

[drowsy plank]

finally a good suggestion

if this doesnt get like 400 stars idk what would

[fossil finch]

Isn't technically the wikithis creator the one responsible for that compat

Idk how the mod works so idk

Use omniscience

Oh my god

[small timber]

at this point just give cryogen like scal shader (literally) when fought at night tbh

[fossil finch]

That'd suck

Like literally

It'd be so off

Anyways uh

@foggy solar use omniscience potion
With that potion they start flashing a brownish color that is visible both at day and night, impossible to miss

[small timber]

tbh doesn't pbg also use a shader that is somewhat similar to scal? and surprisingly it didnt feel off

[gaunt tiger]

good point

[small timber]

but ya, it will lose its arctic/snowy shader

[drowsy plank]

id argue cryo's projectiles are already as as hell to see but for real omni is right there
i guess at some point you just gotta let people try to help themselves if they wont listen to advice, i doubt this'll pass even if it somehow gets through voting
i guess if you wanted to use a shader maybe you could use blue and make the projectiles white?? how many times will cryo have had a projectile rework at this point if that passes tho

[fossil finch]

Pbg is plague related and that is more connected to darkness and black i think

Black bg on cryo fight would feel very off

[small timber]

I think if they rethemed it to be like cryonic theme (which I think is somehow related to dark in concept?) maybe it is fine, but ya

[fossil finch]

No cryonic

Bad

Cryonic ore bad

Also no it's literally tied to crystals

Crystals are bright

The most is some item names i guess?

But they're item names

[foggy solar]

Thank you

I ended up just switching to expert mode because there was no way to not have my head hurt with how long master was taking lol

[sand ermine]

@foggy solar you could just fight cryo at night (if you're not already) or use omni potion like others have said

i usually fight cryo at night to see the projectiles a bit better anyway

since im too lazy to get omni potion

[burnt condor]

idk! using omniscience potion instead of fixing low visibility projectiles that you’re expected to react to in a moments notice feels like a band-aid over a stab wound to me. bosses should be able to be understood and defeated just, fundamentally.

[sand ermine]

thats the purpose of the omni potion, to help you see hard to see projectiles

sure its a band-aid fix but i can understand why the person who suggested it in the first place wants better visibility

[foggy solar]

Yeah a band-aid fix is "fine", but it's representing a fundamental accessibility issue that is likely somewhat easy to fix outright

It doesn't bother me so much that I flat out can't do the boss on any difficulty, but I can imagine someone with poor vision getting very frustrated if they just straight up can't kill the boss because of visibility issues

[fossil finch]

i mean that's why it exists

Not everyone needs it

If you do you use it

It's not really a band-aid fix

At least not in the sense the core issue isn't being fixed

[burnt condor]

it’s a design flaw that can be fixed player-side by using an item but it shouldn’t be player-side

sealion put it better than I could I think

[fossil finch]

It's not really a design flaw?

Like are the existence of accessibility options "design flaws"

In the way u say it you imply everything should be accessible without the need for specific options outright or it's a design flaw and that's not true

it's kinda irrelevant because they're getting resprited in the future but still

[burnt condor]

there’s a difference between an in-game renewable resource and a button you press in settings to help with eyestrain though

[fossil finch]

There is but it's still why omniscience does what it does to cryo's projectiles
It's not even what it normally does to projectiles, it's special because of all the people who complained about this

[burnt condor]

I do think projectiles that blend into the background is bad design regardless of accessibility concerns and taking those concerns at face value I think it’s more than fair to raise concern about it

[fossil finch]

it also kinda falls into the hole that accessibility options can't be integrated in the game which is not true

[burnt condor]

accessibility options can be in game I’m not saying that (though I’m not entirely certain what you mean by that?) but needing to spend in-game time and resources just to be able to see what’s going on feels like a poor fix

[fossil finch]

you can buy the materials for omniscience so u don't spend much of either but ok

[inner anvil]

@open comet Malice is being removed from the mod anyways.

[open comet]

wdym?

[inner anvil]

What I mean is that we decided to remove Malice Mode from Calamity.

In the next update.

[open comet]

Huh

[drowsy plank]

id say it's easier if yall just stay close to each other

like for two players, it isn't too much of an issue to just make sure you stay close to one another, and try to RoD or something when she does her slow down that telegraphs the attack

but like 3+? yeah that'd be hell

[open comet]

We are people, not a hive mind. We might fly in different directions while dodging, in practice it is a really hard thing to do, to stay close to each other for the entire battle

[violet pivot]

Why? Too hard?

[subtle sapphire]

RIP my dreams of a masochist master mode malice for the worthy run

[violet pivot]

Oh

[inner anvil]

Also when we removed Legendary Weapons from Malice Mode, it became more of a meme than something serious.

[subtle sapphire]

I mean, does it need special rewards to be serious ? A difficulty that's just here for, well, difficulty can be fun too

[inner anvil]

You're correct.

We still treated it like a meme.

[subtle sapphire]

Oh, so you're thinking of reworking it into a more serious difficulty at a later date ? Or am I misinterpreting ?

[frail mantle]

no

malice will just be gone

aside from the malice boss ais still existing in boss rush there will be no trace of its existence

[inner anvil]

Imagine it never existed.

[unborn oriole]

We can't imagine the non existance of something that never existed on the first place

[subtle sapphire]

Why remove it rather than leave it in a legacy way ? Never played malice, is it really that bad that it's better to remove it rather than keep it in the current state ?

[inner anvil]

I already sent 3 reasons why we are removing it.

On a sidenote, Malice AI will still exist for Boss Rush bosses.

[scarlet crypt]

@inner anvil killed Dragonfolly early and was excited to get the 10% weapon Swordsplosion. imo it's only just good even in Ravager-tier and Malachite is easily better than it. Might want to take a look at it's base damage unless I'm missing something/it's intended purpose

[inner anvil]

So you want me to test Swordsplosion?

[subtle sapphire]

ok, thanks for the explanations

[scarlet crypt]

yep as I said might be missing something but imo seems underpowered for post-ML (don't want to make a new message for this but just noticed it's base damage is 48 might even be worse than I thought LOL)

[inner anvil]

Alright, on my way, give me 10-20 minutes.

[gaunt tiger]

hey memes could you test sirius against dog? weapon bad

please

[inner anvil]

Patience, I'm doing the other request first.

[gaunt tiger]

ye ik sry, just asking while I knew you were here

[inner anvil]

I'll do it.

[gaunt tiger]

thank you ❤️

[scarlet crypt]

just saw your reply btw and thank you!!

[inner anvil]

No problem, I'll ping you when I get the results.

If you don't mind of course.

[scarlet crypt]

I don't mind at all!

[inner anvil]

Great.

[scarlet crypt]

doing some casual testing myself and Malachite outperformed it vs The Destroyer and I was using a tank build for both fights (EDIT: The reason I thought I was crazy was bc maybe it was meant to be used vs DoG but guess not)

[inner anvil]

@scarlet crypt I tested Swordsplosion, it seems more overpowered than not, the boss intended to use it on, Providence, dies quite fast compared to other weapons.

We'll need to nerf it a little bit.

[scarlet crypt]

oh LOL

I'll have to try it vs Providence before it gets nerfed then to see what you're talking about

my current playthrough is like 2 bosses away so I'll do it tonight, thank you for testing

EDIT: Just tried it, GEEZ you're right

[gaunt tiger]

hey memes

😄

[inner anvil]

Okay, update, Swordsplosion is actually balanced, the problem is Shattering Potion, Shattering Potion gives a 30 second difference on how fast Providence dies, so I don't know if Swordsplosion's overpowerd or Shattering Potion is overpowerd. @scarlet crypt

[inner anvil]

What's up?

[gaunt tiger]

just saying hi

[scarlet crypt]

ah okay, I'll have to try the potion as well then

[swift wharf]

nerf both

[scarlet crypt]

idek what it does lol

[subtle sapphire]

nerf providence

[scarlet crypt]

oh it's definitely the potion combined with the low base damage + high projectile count

[inner anvil]

The intended kill time for Providence is 4 minutes, Swordplosion without Shattering Potion gets the intended 4 minutes, so we cool, but with it we get 3:30, so bruh moment.

[inner anvil]

Hi.

[gaunt tiger]

hi!

I guess the question is if shattering potion makes other weapons go below 4 minutes right

[grave zinc]

@minor shell - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Increase Tax Collector's money cap]

It has officially been implemented into the game, and will be available in the next update!
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

[inner anvil]

I guess it's a good idea to do that, but it's your turn now.
Sirius against DoG you say?

I'll look more into Shattering Potion later.

[gaunt tiger]

yea, it underperformed compared to the other choices

[scarlet crypt]

oh god Shattering Potion works on Malachite (Malachite my favorite Calamity weapon totally needs to be nerfed)

[minor shell]

huge win

[inner anvil]

Okay, I give up with this weapon, phase 1 is supposed to take 1:30 minutes and with this weapon it takes 3 minutes to get him at 70%, I die before I even get to 2nd phase to how bad this weapon is, plus I'm currently sick so my skills are not the best right now. @gaunt tiger

This weapon is bad, we need to buff it.

[gaunt tiger]

yeah 😦

thanks memes!

maybe a rework would be better honestly

[inner anvil]

We'll see, I don't have enough devplans.png.

But yeah, no problem.

[minor shell]

the swordsplosion?

[inner anvil]

Sirius.

[minor shell]

ah

[scarlet crypt]

yeah swordsplosion was actually found to be somewhat OP if combined with shattering potion haha

[gaunt tiger]

sirius makes me cry

[fossil finch]

can someone say to how much

[inner anvil]

I can say that it's more than 5 platinum, I do not know the max.

[swift wharf]

Tax collector is now 2% more useful

[inner anvil]

No way...

[fossil finch]

jokes aside his main flaw is precisely the cap

[proud quest]

bro they gotta add the yamato

its bound to happen at this point

[gaunt tiger]

what's a yamato

[drowsy plank]

^

[small timber]

I mean shattering in essence is 2nd copy of: Ichor flask, (almost) rage and (almost) wrath; 3 in one in a single potion, yeah it is kinda overpowered

The potion singlehandedly make melee one of the highest crit chance class in the game (beside rogue dark god sheath)

[fossil finch]

why is SHATtering

idk what deathmode old spawns have to do with this

its only with 3 bosses and its extremely rare

i don't think it's worth mentioning at all

[drowsy plank]

that's dumb

it's dumb

i dont think it should be possible to happen and it has happened to me before

[fossil finch]

yeah but deathmode spawns don't have anything to do with it

[drowsy plank]

it doesnt make much sense and doesnt seem hard to fix

i was trying to like

[fossil finch]

im not saying that

please read

[drowsy plank]

ah

ok well i was trying to give "reasoning" i guess because this failed in voting before

[fossil finch]

you don't have to mention deathmode's old spawns to bring your point and to me it seems irrelevant because its very different

most voters don't read reasoning

just say it's dumb and annoying

[drowsy plank]

yeah i realize

[fossil finch]

and inevadible

[drowsy plank]

alright

[karmic stone]

remove fun

[drowsy plank]

dw ive got fun suggestions but ive been waiting for suggs to cool down a bit before sending them in, and ive got another pretty boring but reasonable one ill be posting as soon as my cooldown is done, but ive honestly just got a huge backlog in a big google doc at this point, so it's prolly gonna take a few days to get these all through

[upbeat scroll]

I don't see an issue with the block phasing...

[swift wharf]

A thrasher fell on my head and killed me once

[drowsy plank]

you havent had to clear a crimson biome inside the sulphuric sea

[swift wharf]

While I was in the dungeon

[upbeat scroll]

I don't think I've seen a single Cnidron in the Underground Desert in Pre-Hardmode even after grinding there for Desert Fossils and Luxor's gift for 40 minutes. Threshers are easily avoidable by rope or just any form of vertical mobility as they are just not very fast (very very slow). (in 1.4 tmod)

[drowsy plank]

NICE

[swift wharf]

So that mechanic can die thank you very much

.

[drowsy plank]

it's not in the actual underground desert, but if you try to work in just below the surface like i was they definetly will

[upbeat scroll]

In older Calamity the suggestion in my opinion would have merit as it actively was an uncommon enemy down there.

I even died multiple times to the block phasing randomly but at that point it was a matter of playing around it, and it was over and done with. Hook dash or recall out, they shouldn't one or two shot even on Master Malice considering I was consistently only taking like 110 as a summoner from cnidron and 180 from thrasher with wulfrum

that was the max numbers i saw btw

[drowsy plank]

that's fucking dumb
it isnt something you should have to play around because it makes no sense to exist in the first place

thrasher have 0 reason to be able to do it and it's just obnoxious

[upbeat scroll]

Sometimes cnidrions would only do like 70 or 80 and thrasher minimum 140

just depends on the +/- 15% and if you take consecutive hits

but it should never be something you can't react to and do something about

i literally recall whenever i hear a worm in ug desert in hm

and i dont have a good pierce weapon

[drowsy plank]

worms have noise cues

it makes sense they can burrow

[upbeat scroll]

but dune splicers in hm as a summoner can one shot in master malice (lol)

[drowsy plank]

malice doesnt affect enemy damage values

that's just a master problem

and it still doesnt change anything ive said

[upbeat scroll]

hook away whenever you get jumpscared

usually works for me

that is true for like anything that can immediately phase through a block unprompted

like man eaters

thrashers can not jump and can not scale air

hook to a ceiling above air and your done

[drowsy plank]

it still doesnt make sense for the enemy to have this trait and they clearly arent designed around it

[upbeat scroll]

cnidrons were stupid in old calamity because they were spawnable in a locale where avoiding them was really hard

[drowsy plank]

i already mentioned this is an issue in tight enclosed spaces, which, due to how most other burrowing enemies are designed, isnt an issue

so why can they even phase through blocks still

[swift wharf]

the problem is when they fall directly on top of you

[upbeat scroll]

okay at most you'll be taking like 100 damage usually, just hook up because they fall to the floor after that

[drowsy plank]

especially in tight, dark areas where you literally wouldnt expect or even be able to noticed them

like the dungeon, or world evil cleansing tunnels

[upbeat scroll]

does nobody use like actual lights

[drowsy plank]

you cant hook up there isnt enough room

it would still hit you

[upbeat scroll]

my brother in christ

[drowsy plank]

the blocks are solid

[upbeat scroll]

i will cheat sheet this to you

[drowsy plank]

there's no playing around this it's just stupid and they're nothing like any of the vanilla examples you've provided

there's no way to play around them and they have no cues

[swift wharf]

there's still some room for error there

[drowsy plank]

you can see man eaters and they have limited reach
worms make noise and you can leave the area and they move slow