#suggestions-discussion

1 messages · Page 1230 of 1

unique vector
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daedalus armor also has nothing to do with it being HM anvil locked and moreso requiring a T2 ore pickaxe

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you should add reasons as to why moving Hm crafting stations pre-mech would be better than just altering item recipes, since your idea is counterintuitive of the hm rework in the first place

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gonna add an exclamation for now

hushed jetty
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you could get cryonic from slimes but you can't turn them into bars because it needs HM forge

unique vector
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ore slimes are a separate issue

hollow shell
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I do agree that the EarlyHM rework enforces a weird amount of linearity

unique vector
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its probably the best way to reduce vanilla's armor bloating

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but yea

hollow shell
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It's the lack of alternative methods

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Do we have plans to make Cryo Brimmy and AS unlock the ores too in the future?

cobalt pewter
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the return of mech alts

hollow shell
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I feel like that would help the issue at least

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Have each of the 'mech alts' count towards the EarlyHM ore progression

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Kill Cryo for Mythril then kill Twins for Adamantite, if you want

hushed jetty
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That would mean cryo unlocks two ores on death

hollow shell
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All of the mech alts do already unlock content, yes

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But, part of the issue is that that content is then locked behind Mech stuff

hushed jetty
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Ye

hollow shell
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I assume the intention was that each Mech would be more like the mech alts
where each one killed unlocks new stuff

And that you could theoretically ignore the Mechs and do this alternate path of Calamity stuff via the mech alts and still progress just fine

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But, nah. Mythril Anvil and Adamantite Forge are still important

small tusk
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Its easier to implement making the anvil and forge early than changing every recipe to pre hm crafting, it also just makes more sense to get the anvil early than make everything craftable with pre hm crafting stations

hushed jetty
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It's easier but is it better

small tusk
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Yeah

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Honestly

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It doesn't make sense to have every hm item for non linearity use pre hm crafting

hollow shell
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byeah
@unique vector I feel like moving just the Hardmode Anvil and Forge would keep the EarlyHM rework intact while allowing for more player choice

hushed jetty
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how are you going to justify crafting an adamantite forge without using adamantite

edgy sundial
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Might I suggest Calamity have an alternate anvil forge made out of materials unlocked via the alts?

hollow shell
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Each ore you unlock from the Mechs grants you access to their item set, but they shouldn't be progression lockers

hushed jetty
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It's like making rock from thin air

hollow shell
unique vector
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is that easier than just recipe changing things?

hollow shell
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wdym "easier"

unique vector
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like, causes less overall issues

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because wont that have like, potential oversights

small tusk
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You don't craft it, get it as like a WOF drop or from an npc

hollow shell
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You could have potential oversights by changing the recipes too.

unique vector
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whereas editing recipes (as we've been doing already) is better as a case-by-case basis

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by changing the individual recipes of items?

edgy sundial
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I feel like the least messy solution is to just have a different anvil that counts as the hm anvil, and a different forge that counts as the hm forge; that also would play nicely with mod compatibility, hopefully

small tusk
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Except case by case has WAY too many cases

hollow shell
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By "oversight" do you mean getting access to a recipe earlier than intended?

unique vector
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yes

hollow shell
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Then we can edit that recipe.

unique vector
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then thats redundant

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or am i stupid

small tusk
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Most HM recipes are locked by bosses not the crafting stations tbh

unique vector
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fair point

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im not too sure, although i still think you should mention exactly what it solves vs. editing recipes individually and i think it'll be fine for a sugg

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(and the cryonic ore one still stands as a separate consistency issue)

small tusk
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Yeah ill do that in a minute here

unique vector
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ye

hollow shell
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My main argument is that you are forced to fight two mechs because you are given no other options to obtain Mythril Anvil and Adamantite Forge

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And being forced to fight what should be non-essential bosses is really weird for Calamity

small tusk
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Yeah which doesn't make sense, one of cals biggest selling points was non linear progression, its a blast, but that was removed

unique vector
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hm

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im not too sure how you would solve that while still keeping ore armors progression locked

hollow shell
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You make only the crafting stations be earlier.

unique vector
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but how tho

hollow shell
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You still only get Orichalcum Bars from killing the first mech

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Just make it fuckin drop from WoF

unique vector
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dont they also require the ores

hollow shell
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Make Merchant sell it like he sells normal Anvils

small tusk
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Drop the stations themselves

unique vector
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i mean i guess

small tusk
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Skip the middle man

unique vector
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hm

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i guess that eliminates one extra unnecessary gate locking

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im gonna dip from this convo though i feel like im pissing you off rover and i dont want to continue doing that lol

hollow shell
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Nah don't worry about it

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I would not remain pissed at you Pixl for any length of time

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and, byueah it's good to have counterargument in case we have flawed reasoning

small tusk
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yeah it is

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you could yall un ❗ the post unless theres still and issue

small timber
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how many mech alts are still locked behind mechs in the next update?

hollow shell
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I have no idea

small timber
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both seafood and idol is craftable pre-mech like cryo key right?

small tusk
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not at the current state

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seafood is anvil and idol is forge

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lemme check changelogs

hollow shell
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Okay yeah Seafood is crafted at normal anvil next update

small timber
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nah referring to next patch (since anything in suggestion is for next patch anyway), and it is relevant to the suggestion that I think it must be accounted (despite future content)

hollow shell
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Charred Idol still does need an Adamantite/Titanium Forge

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from what I'm seeing in the latest dev source

small timber
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I remember seeing it get changed?

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to hellforge

small tusk
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nah

hollow shell
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Unholy Core requires Hellforge, in current patch

small timber
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oh here

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not in changelog, but here

hollow shell
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Hm...

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Perhaps it is on an unmerged branch

unique vector
hollow shell
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Hopefully it gets seen before release

unique vector
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altho im p sure its unmerged

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if it was a merk or ben change then its pretty likely its stuck somewhere in unmerged hell

small tusk
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welp, I don't know guys, I might be pushin my luck, do I address gulps quietly cryonic ore?

unique vector
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no

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well u can

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but even we dont want to talk abt it rn

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bc we want the patch to be out first

small tusk
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ight

small timber
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cryonic ore is a bit weird, a previous suggestion to tier shift it (to be usable right after cryogen) is denied

small tusk
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yea ill wait

unique vector
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cryonic ore is really fucking weird

small timber
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so I assume they want it still post 2-mechs (or on tier with titanium/ada)

small tusk
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yeah mightve been my sugg lol, I made one about tier shifting cryonic previously

hollow shell
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I have no idea what the testers/devs want to do with Cryonic

cobalt pewter
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just get rid of cryonic

hushed jetty
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Make iban rework it (he is overworked)

small tusk
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It just seems wierd to have a boss spawn items, but a completely unrelated boss lock them up

cobalt pewter
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just make all the life alloy materials spawn all the time (like Scoria) then limit then to pick power

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so cryonic already exists in ice biomes, and perennial idfk weird ass ore

hushed jetty
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unbreakable ore is kind of bringe though

cobalt pewter
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fair enough

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it works more on scoria because abyss

hushed jetty
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Scoria and charred is at least excusable by being in the least visited places

small tusk
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I think cryo should spawn cryonic ore, and it should be minable with cobalt pick

hushed jetty
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Ye I agree

small tusk
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if you kill a boss you should have access to its drops

cobalt pewter
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they already rejected the sugg about making it right after cryo

small tusk
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idk why, seems counter-intuitive to me

hollow shell
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cryo-intuitive

cobalt pewter
small tusk
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calamity's non-linearity is one of its biggest features and cryo just dumps that in the trash

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also rover, that brought a very large smile to my face

small timber
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it is just that daedalus stuff is balanced for titanium/adamantite tier so tier-shifting it cause balance problem

cobalt pewter
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it's not even non-linearity, making a boss spawn an ore that cannot be broken until later is already a stupid decision

small timber
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while to shift it to make sense it is rebalancing all the daedalus stuff

small tusk
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It just makes more sense, like obviously this isn't a quick fix but it is one of the glaring issues in calamity rn

small timber
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wait they can just make daedalus armor require adamantite/titanium

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the weapons are closer to mythril/orichalchum level anyway

small tusk
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except that just reinforces the issue of a bosses loot requiring a different boss to be killed

small timber
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and if cryo=mech, then you get post 1-mech level of weapon after beating cryo which make sense

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at the very least it is not locked behind 2 mechs, you can use all cryo stuff except the daedalus armor

small tusk
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except the daedalus is the important part, why unlock daedalus to kill a single mech and like one other boss, and get better armor

small timber
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because if they are not tier-shifting it at least make most of the stuff usable

small tusk
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except the issue requires tier shift, a cryogen themed armor shouldn't be locked with cryogen and 2 mechs

small timber
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frost armor and forbidden armor kind of do similar things to this, it is not the best get around but since they already denied the post-cryo cryonic ore suggestion this is like the closest thing we can get to it

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daedalus armor is not tier shifted, currently it is locked behind ada/titanimu anyway because of pickaxe requirement

small tusk
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except forbidden and frost are meant to be better versions of adamantite and titanium, cryo has nothing to do with them

hushed jetty
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neither have anything to do with titanium

small timber
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I will disagree with that (they are multiclass), but still the idea is still just to make most cryonic stuff unlockable post-cryo

small tusk
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like imagine if brimflame armor needed perrenial bars to craft, it doesn't make much sense

small timber
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if they are not shifting daedalus armor itself it is like the only alternative that make sense

small tusk
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I think they're gonna have to bite the bullet and retier daedalus armor to pre mech

small timber
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the problem is currently I don't think they want to do it (if a suggestion for the idea is denied), otherwise everything will be much easier

small tusk
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hence the biting of the bullet

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welp I've been debating calamity changes too long, I have science homework to do lmao

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also @unique vector before I go, is there still an issue with the anvil/forge sugg

small timber
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oh right that one, it is a massive power rebalance

unique vector
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nope, looks good

small tusk
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ight cool

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welp imma go watch a video on chi squares, cyall later lol

hot zephyr
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i'm not sure if changing the interaction would be possible without gimping the accessories heavily

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personally I think that it's a poor comparison to make between burst movement vs sustained

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the bottles are pretty good in massive no-hit platform arenas but aren't nearly as good in general gameplay

small timber
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just nerf jumpspeed/movement speed, because one of them affect the balloon behaviour

rich geode
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MOAB > literally any other wings

calm elm
small timber
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@hardy dock eventually boss rush will get completely rebalanced, it is stated at 1.5 release that boss rush is not balanced at all

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so not much point to suggest changing it (because it very likely will be change)

golden tulip
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afaik no tester wants to test it though

fossil finch
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Yes that's the, thing

austere cargo
cobalt pewter
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that's the main issue of br balancing yea

no one wants to do it

hardy dock
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If it was so unbalanced why didn’t they just

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Revert the change

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Before release

stiff wren
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Just remove it smh my head

hardy dock
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So they didn’t have a horrifically unbalanced Boss Rush in the three years it’ll take for testers to get around to it

golden tulip
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¯_(ツ)_/¯

cobalt pewter
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boss rush is an optional content

hot zephyr
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revert what change lol?

exotic stag
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thats why

hardy dock
hot zephyr
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it'll eventually get changed

fossil finch
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Previous br was already unbalanced

small timber
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I mean most of boss rush is already really easy (except a few bullshit ones like BoC or Scal which is basically full scal)

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unless the shadowspec weapon you used is very underpowered

unique vector
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death

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br sucks’’!!!!!!!!!

fossil finch
golden tulip
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bruh

fossil finch
exotic stag
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the reasoning probably is that it just has no sounds. i assume

small timber
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some weird suggestion do get in recently, like that disable final dawn dash during scal bullet hell one

golden tulip
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true melee mode

grim tusk
small timber
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final dawn nerf: if you have final dawn in your inventory stealth gen reduced by 50%

exotic stag
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final dawn nerf: it is now only usable if you do not exist

cobalt heath
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final dawn was lowkey the biggest winner of 1.5

cobalt pewter
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well it is in some way

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but probably wouldn't be major enough to matter

exotic stag
cobalt heath
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due to how it plays its annoying to use but man is it good

cobalt pewter
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would be interesting to see Final Dawn generally have way lower stealth gen while held

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makes the yeet less often

cobalt heath
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so it would be unviable again HDfailure

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why nerf a weapon wich was before like a solid 4/10 and is now like 8/10

cobalt pewter
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wdym unviable

stealth damage would be fat with that low of stealth gen hdflr

exotic stag
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because the 8/10 weapon is too meta.

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it feels like your required to use final dawn or use a VERY specific set up

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with other weps

cobalt heath
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you need to be good w stealth

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wich is good

exotic stag
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no?

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people use stealth on FD more because of the up thing

cobalt heath
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true

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but like if meta is a problem then lets nerf photovisaratorHDfailure

exotic stag
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photo WAS nerfed

cobalt heath
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was it?

exotic stag
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yeah

cobalt heath
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good

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it deserved that

cobalt pewter
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they wanted to nerf Final Dawn for sure, it's in the plans

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but idk what they're planning exactly

cobalt heath
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the real problem is that stealth itself is too strong atm

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and stealth regen is too easy to get

exotic stag
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then nerf stealth..

cobalt heath
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thats getting nerfed

cobalt pewter
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stealth regen is pretty common

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I myself like to play with minimal stealth regen (it's just more fun that way)

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so it's kinda hard to go without any stealth regen bonuses lategame

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as everything rogue has it

small timber
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I mean the thing about final dawn with stealth gen is not necessarily that final dawn does a shit ton of damage (although it do a bit too much), but that you have GSD on 3 second cooldown

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omnidirectional too

hardy dock
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Has anyone here used the Executioner’s Blade

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Just as a question about how you felt it was balanced

exotic stag
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it felt balanced other then projectile spam

hardy dock
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The low use time really kills its viability for me since Stealth Strikes are the only good way for Rogue to deal damage and it doesn’t have any compatibility with the Eclipse Mirror at all

exotic stag
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do you have a killtime for anything..

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like

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a good way to say "buff this" is with a video showing killtime

hardy dock
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I’m unfortunately away from my computer rn but i can add one when I get home

exotic stag
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byeah when i used exec blade it felt fine.

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exec blade is that weapon you use when you need to be farther away

hardy dock
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Though my argument didn’t really come down to “this Weapon is weak as shit on bosses” it was “this weapon uses the full stealth meter when it should only consume half”

hardy dock
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Only hit close enemies

exotic stag
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no?

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it spawns a row of the blades downwards

hardy dock
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Yeah but those have a range limit

exotic stag
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no?

hardy dock
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Unlike other weapons which carry their stealth strike with them like the Eclipse’s Fall

exotic stag
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if they go on hit. that means your probably going to hit it

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its a row of twenty of them

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meaning unless you are literally fighting an ant. your gonna hit

hardy dock
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Still though that’s beside the point, my point is that the stealth strike takes an average of over twice as long to charge up in price compared to other weapons

exotic stag
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i mean if your focusing stealth it shouldn't be an issue though

hardy dock
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The Eclipse Mirror preserves half your stealth with more weapons, but the Executioner’s Blade is so fast that it’ll shoot a second projectile that’ll consume that second half instantly

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So I’d say it is a big issue when it takes over twice as long

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You have to charge a whole extra half

exotic stag
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wow. a whole extra 1 second that i can spend on the floor for half a second.

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or hear me out: dont use exec blade stealth then

hardy dock
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Ok but like

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Rogue damage without it is awful?

exotic stag
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no?

hardy dock
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That’s a universal fact of all Rogue weapons

exotic stag
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stealth is op. we get it

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rogue SPAM though

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its more on tier

hardy dock
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Not really?

exotic stag
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saying "rogue damage without stealth shit because stealth op haha" is not good

hardy dock
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That’s not what I’m saying at all

exotic stag
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that is

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"rogue damage without stealth on anything is bad"

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your kinda nullifying spam there. despite spam being more on tier with the other classes

hardy dock
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Have you ever used Rogue

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The non-stealth dps is a joke

exotic stag
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yes

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i have used rogue

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infact im literally the guy whos known for the elemental disk shit.

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the nonstealth dps ISNT even a joke

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its perfectly fine

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your just saying "ok but stealth does more damage so that means spam bad"

safe oasis
hardy dock
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Yeah?

exotic stag
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well no you havent since you'd know rogue dps is good

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with spam

hardy dock
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I have though?

exotic stag
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then you'd know stealth rogue is op. but spam rogue isnt nullified by it

hardy dock
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When I played the dps was shit

exotic stag
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the dps was shit because your comparing it to stealth

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your meant to compare it to the other main 4 classes

hardy dock
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I got 600 with Utensil Poker

exotic stag
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then wtf are you doing? using throwing accessories or sumn shit?

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because i can go in game rn with a post ml rogue setup

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and do like

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6k

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with armor a singular accessory and a singular weapon

hardy dock
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I wasn’t using anything different

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The typical accessories you’re supposed to use

exotic stag
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then your doing SOMETHING wrong

hardy dock
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But when I played the class was shit unless I was using a stealth strike

exotic stag
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basically: your mostly wrong.

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because as a rogue player and the guy who did the funny spam rogue shit

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i can say that spam rogue is pretty much

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balanced

gray nebula
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also it looks boring

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.

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wooo hoo me when i spam some rapid projectile that homes in as a super end game weapon with no extra flair whatsoever.. grr.. ppl need to up their standards

exotic stag
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cool iban

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but aint that like most classes

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"me spam shooty thing endgame go brr."

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isnt it a hook not a spear?

golden tulip
unique vector
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exactly

golden tulip
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hdflr

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you say we need to up our standards but last update all draedon weapons we got are thisHDfailure

keen zealot
keen zealot
golden tulip
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my point is hes a dev

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he can directly influence what gets added

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but "we" need to up our standards

cobalt pewter
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@dusty path challenge items are kil

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changelogs

unique vector
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@dusty path cant suggest old changes to be reverted

dusty path
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Oh, ok

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Sorry

unique vector
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also please see #changelogs for changes to some challenge item obtainments

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no worries!

dusty path
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Ok, thx

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Have a good day

gray nebula
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I litterally am directly influencing what gets added

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Well, what got added. I don't want to add more stuff I want to rework existing content

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wait for the next update and realise how utterly trolled u have been gotten

cobalt pewter
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@dusty path have a more concrete reasoning

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"it'd make sense" wouldn't fly round these parts

exotic stag
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also their like rocks

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couldn't provi just..

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use more rock to repair rock

fossil finch
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Provi heals them all the time

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They could look different but lore isn't much of a reason to stand on

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They could also get entirely resprited, but that's for later

grim tusk
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Exe blade is perfectly fine lol

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May not have as much dps but makes up with braindead homing

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The stealth strike is strong as shit

grim tusk
grim tusk
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You are using both stealth strikes at once

golden tulip
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actually youre probably talking about the ark and BB line

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didnt think of that

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but my point stands for draedon's drops

gray nebula
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yeah cuz drae drops were conceptualised like a year ago

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back then I knew other mods had cool modernized weapons but like, not enough mainstream for me to go "oh yeah this would be badass

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compare it to like, scal's exhumed weapons

golden tulip
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exactly

exotic stag
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can we get a full clockwork steampunk item set :>

golden tulip
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thats why i specified draedon's drops

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the other 10% of cool endgame weapons are scal's exhumed weapons taxevasion

grim tusk
exotic stag
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cogs.

cobalt pewter
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rogue still with approx 2 post yharon righe weapons

grim tusk
cobalt pewter
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(it'll never be based)

grim tusk
golden tulip
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nothing special

cobalt pewter
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meanwhile melee

golden tulip
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dont talk about melee

grim tusk
golden tulip
grim tusk
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Ark rework XD

golden tulip
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seriously wdym scal's drops

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theyre the same

exotic stag
grim tusk
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Clockwork rifle is WoF vanilla drop

exotic stag
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and then theres also the furniture

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but then theres nothing else.

grim tusk
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And minecart (1.4 tmod)

cobalt heath
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exe blade atm is perfect

gray nebula
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or is it..

fossil finch
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it is not

exotic stag
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well it is good

fossil finch
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exoblade is cringe

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cringe bloat recipe

exotic stag
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executioners blade

fossil finch
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cringe boring use

exotic stag
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not exo blade

fossil finch
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oh exe blade

exotic stag
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ender wrong weapon

fossil finch
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fair enough

exotic stag
fossil finch
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exe blade is also cringe

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it's mycoroot but cosmic kunai but more

exotic stag
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its uh

golden tulip
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arent all exo weapons getting resprited in 1.5.1? or was that just concept art not necessarily for 1.5.1

grim tusk
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Clockwork weapons™️

grim tusk
golden tulip
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ah

grim tusk
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Also was it even exo, pretty sure it was something else

exotic stag
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i think it was elemental weapons not exos.

grim tusk
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Yea

golden tulip
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yea that

cobalt heath
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on the topic off bad rogue weapons, why does nanoblack suck so much

worn salmon
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elemental and biome blade line

cobalt heath
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like it does nothing

cobalt pewter
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Nanoblack might get stuff

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later

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there are more ass rogue weapons

cobalt heath
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it sure as hell needs some

exotic stag
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i mean

fossil finch
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already got ss next update

exotic stag
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^

cobalt pewter
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Shinobi Blade is

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terror

exotic stag
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sin obi blade

cobalt heath
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rogue other than scarlet devil has a bad post scal in general

golden tulip
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post scal lol

vestal beacon
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I think rogue should get more end game weapons. Just look at melee and mage. They get so many more

cobalt heath
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endgame is that better?

golden tulip
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no i meant

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postgame isnt balanced

exotic stag
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^

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its getting rebalanced later

cobalt heath
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oh yeah arent dev weapons meant to be post yharim when he comes out

golden tulip
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ye

cobalt heath
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aight makes sence

exotic stag
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yeah every update they move shadowspec further

cobalt heath
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only place rly where rogue needs new weapons is post yharon pre draedon

golden tulip
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well we know at least 1 auric rogue weapon will be added

cobalt heath
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aight

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good

vestal beacon
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REALLY?!

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I can’t wait

golden tulip
#

other than that, theres a ton of items added in the changelogs, who knows whats in it for rogue

cobalt heath
#

gotta love the devs

golden tulip
#

so true

cobalt heath
#

they do this free and listen us complain about stupid shit all the time

golden tulip
#

i think the "they do this for free" part is the most important HDfailure

cobalt heath
#

(or patreon exists but thats optional)

golden tulip
#

well, besides the patreons

#

yea

cobalt heath
#

and they do it rly fast

#

for being an off side work

unique vector
#

well all of us do it for free bc only fab receives the mo ey

#

and even then ots not that much afaik

fossil finch
#

it's like a thousand and half and it's pretty much voided on rent iirc

unique vector
#

mfw it doesnt even cover half of average nyc rent

golden tulip
#

america

unique vector
#

true

hollow shell
#

@dusty path What? What do you mean "tainted"?

#

How much Isaac have you been playing

exotic stag
#

just say damaged not tainted

#

or crumbled.

golden tulip
#

battle worn

exotic stag
#

war struck

grim tusk
#

withered, broken, torn, shattered, crippled

exotic stag
#

phantom

mint steppe
#

whats iirc stand for?

#

oh ok

#

but i still wish i could uncraft my asgards valor back into an ankh sheild

golden tulip
#

lmao

buoyant idol
#

Yep, they always die so quick

#

Wait, is there an even more OP weapon obtained in that stage?

#

leme try it

#

yeah

#

I can see that

#

Wow

#

yeah thats even more broken

#

I dont even have rouge accs, just hydrothermic and menacing, yeah orichalcum is very similar in power

small timber
#

@rough venture technically there is nothing wrong with the suggestion, but I will be honest what is the point of adding visual clutter to the bullet hell phase to divert attention, how long the bullet hell phase last really so not matter, especially that next patch Scal no longer immediately cheap shot you right after bullet hell

#

So basically you no longer have to prepare for next attack because scal should give you enough time to react

grim tusk
#

Also you know you can just learn how long the bullet hells last (or read wiki) and adapt to the situation

#

Calamity’s bosses are more of reacting to stuff rather than patterns

#

Thats why bosses are hard even if you fight em hundreds of times

gray nebula
#

please add timers

#

"oh yeah just fucking learn how long it lasts" seems so weird

#

like even if i know that an attack lasts 10 seconds, i'm busy dodging and all that

#

do you people manage to have a timer running in ur brain while doing that?

#

having a ring of particles around the player is maybe not the right way to go around it but like, the execution doesnt matter

#

i definitely agree wit hthe sentiment, it just sounds like good design on the same level as telegraphs

grim tusk
#

Timer, resource management, buff management, aiming, precise movement, etc

unique vector
#

go back to the scrapped scal idea of making her arena burst in a flame aura and have it die down slowly as a telegraph before a bh ends

gray nebula
#

i mean if ur proficient at that its nice but i dont think we should go the elitist route of "well just learn how long it lasts exactly if you want to be ready for the bullet hell ending

#

just add some visuals its not like its making the boss worse

grim tusk
fossil finch
#

anyways implementation lol! (lol)

violet dagger
#

I used music ques for scal

fossil finch
#

byeah sure do why not no problem sure yeah basically 👍 sign of approval :youdidit: mhm sure yeah yeah go ahead

unique vector
violet dagger
#

if I use the same weapon I often get a similar time between the non music shift bullet hells

#

so it works

fossil finch
#

i just know 👍

unborn siren
#

Draft:

Give fathom swarmer armor a third minion slot, move the minion slots from the set bonus to the armor pieces, and move some of the minion damage from the in water bonus to the set bonus.

While outside of water, Fathom swarmer armor gives 2 minion slots and 25% increased minion damage, which is 1 less minion slot and 3% less minion damage than a full set of Spider armor. It also has Spider armor in it's recipe and is listed as an upgrade to it on the wiki, so it being worse like that doesn't make much sense. Fathom swarmer does have more defense and damage reduction, but that isn't really worth the loss of a minion slot at that stage. While Fathom swarmer is generally better in water, that requires a lot of arena prep to be used against a lot of the next bosses in progression. As an upgrade, Fathom swarmer should be at least as good as Spider armor while on land, which would also mean moving some of the minion damage from the in water bonus to the normal set bonus (probably around 5-10%). Giving it a third minion slot and moving some more damage from the in water bonus to the not in water bonuses would make it a better alternative to Spider or Daedalus armor when the player does Calamitas before Plantera as summoner.

small timber
#

Ya the main problem with the timer suggestion was definitely thst it mentioned "visual telegraph" for the timer, if it is something else it is fine

Also isnt fathom swarmer like a weird purely water combat armor? (Like victide)

fossil finch
#

moving the slots from the setbonus to the armor pieces would be reverting an intended change to motivate people to not mix sets

#

i don't really see a reason for to do that either tbh

#

it could def use a buff though

unborn siren
#

the spider armor has the minion slots on the armor itself, and the Fathom swarmer set bonus is where a lot of the summon damage and bonuses in water come from

fossil finch
#

yeaaaaaaaa and spider armor is vanilla and the latter point doesn't mean it can't have them in the setbonus

small timber
#

I think fathom swarmer is similar to reaver armor, where it is balanced sround you having the water buff (despite it being not realistic for bosses), what other summon armor is at the same point of progression? Daedalus?

fossil finch
#

reaver armor does not

#

uh

small timber
#

Because the bonus is amazing on water while you will not really bother with it on land

fossil finch
#

,

small timber
#

I mean like reaver exploration armor kind of deal, it is designed to only be extremely useful in a specific circumstances

#

But not necessarily "best armor on the progression"

fossil finch
#

well yeah but still

#

reaver utility fits a very specific niche that's also very important

#

fathom fills a niche that's absolutely irrelevant by the time you get it because you have to grind in the water biome to get it

#

and when you go back for combat it's out of order

small timber
#

Ya it do is weird that it is a abyss armor for abyss

fossil finch
#

and as said, an armor shouldn't need you to build an stupid piece of arena to be viable

unborn siren
#

speaking of reaver, a problem I have with it is that it's an all class armor but only Ranger and Melee can use it without killing their dps

fossil finch
#

for the combat oriented option i could see that getting adressed

#

ATihatepeoplewithstupidnames(calamitymod) why do your multiclass set not have mana, rogue stealth and summon slots

#

WHAT

small timber
unborn siren
#

ok I made some edits

small timber
#

Wait a minute after I rechecked fathom swarmer stats is actually very much on tier with other calamity summoner armor, it is (slightly) better than daedalus while hydrothermic armor only has 2 minion slot and 45% damage

#

It just feels weak (damage wise) compare to spider armor because spider armor have much higher damage stat compare to others but also no defense

unborn siren
#

the calamity summoner armors just seem to be less offensively focused in general

#

for example Fathom swarmer has 47 defense and 6% dr while on land, but Spooky has 30 defense, 1 more minion slot, and 5% more damage than Fathom swarmer even while in water

#

also Hydrothermic summoner set desperately needs a buff

small timber
#

Ya, until hydro (post golem)it still only has 2 minion

#

I think calamity summoner power is a lot more on weapon itself and accessory, than armor

unborn siren
small timber
#

Since high summon damage scale better with minion slot from accessory (just exclude spider which has high minion high damage)

unborn siren
#

and summoners like to glass cannon

#

which is why the vanilla armors are generally preferred

#

my summoner armor progression until post ML is Wulfrum, Victide, Aerospec, Bee, Spider, Spooky.

unborn siren
#

note the lack of armors from calamity after a vanilla set becomes available

grim tusk
#

Fathom swarmer lol

#

And Daedalus

grim tusk
#

Well fathom is technically same tier as those 2

#

But since its more defensive the average player considers it bad

grim tusk
small timber
#

is spooky even that much less defensive than hydro

grim tusk
#

Spooky is a glass cannon

small timber
#

isnt it only 10 defense difference? since hydro have no DR

#

the vent dont count since although it says protect you it is just a summon

grim tusk
#

And people consider dmg better than defense even if you can just become unkillable with very little investment (bosses got powercrept lmao)

#

Equip bloodflare core, now you cannot die to Polt (unless you literally sit still)

unborn siren
grim tusk
#

Plaguebringer makes up for that by freeing an acc slot

small timber
#

I am not beta tester but is bloodflare core can finally rest in peace and get reworked, its sole purpose is to cheese some boss that dont hit often

grim tusk
#

Next patch it should be back to usual

small timber
#

ya, so much that I am surprised they buffed defense even further, when it is already good currently

#

the only time defense is not good is death malice (malice)

grim tusk
#

Pbg becomes like 10 times easier if you just equip honey dew

#

And get some warding

unborn siren
grim tusk
#

Forbidden sucks and I agree

#

Daedalus is defensive

small timber
#

the only one that I think is too much of a difference is hydro and spooky, not only is hydro a tier later but it is a 10 defense difference (which is really nothing)

#

meanwhile the difference in damage is 2 minion slot and 18% summon damage (for spooky, higher)

grim tusk
#

Defense actually matters quite a lot now

#

But sounds like hydro may need some tweaking

small timber
#

the problem is if you kill a boss faster it also matters a lot, and 2 minion is massive, for a trade off of 10 defense

#

if it is 20 or even more it is justifiable

grim tusk
#

(Imma guess that the setbonus minion sucks and last time i used it it felt that it barely did anything)

small timber
#

it is on top of your head if I remember (so you have to stay below boss for maximum potential), which is unrealistic considering movement should be use for dodging

grim tusk
#

Minion sucks then

small timber
#

it is good damage (if) your head is in boss' hitbox, but only that situation

unborn siren
#

so Provi and Ares, both of which are several tiers ahead

grim tusk
small timber
#

actually I will make a small doc for the comparison of the armor mentioned

#

daedalus is fine

grim tusk
#

10 is also too much

hot zephyr
#

Spider buff when 😳

unborn siren
#

probably never, it's really good

grim tusk
#

Nah

#

Dmg wise its good, other stats its pretty bad

#

A buff to it would be to those other stats and not dmg

small timber
#

so hydro is upgrade ya

grim tusk
#

Pre-nerf spooky was something

small timber
#

since it was not mentioned (and I dont really play summon), I didnt notice it

grim tusk
#

Especially with pre-nerf spooky wings

#

That thing was so busted

small timber
#

oh and here is Tiki:

  • 35 defense
  • 30% minion damage
  • 4 minion slot
#

and Leaf Wing bonus is good (5 defense 5 DR Dryad Blessing) so unironically Tiki the mostly forgotten, "super low defense" and considered dogshit armor is good

grim tusk
#

Then theres Fathom

#

Defensive wall but offensively its boring

#

Similar situation to fearmonger

unborn siren
#

it's kinda dissapointing that it has less minon slots and land damage than spider despite being crafted with spider

grim tusk
#

But fearmonger at least is decent enough and multiclass

small timber
#

ya, it is just the general approach for calamity, more defense = trade off less damage, though as you notice it is a lot more defensive

#

fathom swarmer is probably more tanky than melee armor on tier while still dealing relatively good damage (just -1 minion) even on land

unborn siren
small timber
#

people actually use turtle?

#

beetle yes, but turtle?

unborn siren
#

I do, it's great defensively with good offensive stats

grim tusk
#

I prefer chlorophyte, hallowed and daedalus melee to turtle

cobalt pewter
#

if Crashlands has taught me anything, it's that dmg reflect is fucking ass until you reach 3 digits of percentage

#

by endgame Crashlands can reach over 1000% dmg reflect with enough juiceforging

unborn siren
#

turtle is 100% in tmod

cobalt pewter
#

that's a very low bar of what I'm talking about

grim tusk
cobalt pewter
#

also 1.4.1 vanilla can help with dmg reflect system a bit by making it proc off projectiles

small timber
#

since it is again debate I will just post a doc for melee (post-plant), wait a sec

unborn siren
#

Daedalus vs Turtle:
Turtle:
65 defense, 15% dr, 14% damage, 12% crit chance, and a powerful thorns effect

Daedalus:
55 defense, 13% damage, 16% crit chance, 10% melee speed, 10% move speed, and you take half damage from projectiles once every 90 seconds

frozen hornet
#

I'm pretty sure there's an acc that reflects a projectile for 10000% and it still sucks

small timber
#

oh ok you have the stat

#

ya turtle is actually really good, because I never notice other melee armor also have no damage and crit

cobalt pewter
small timber
#

so I always though turtle damage and crit is completely dog, but it is pretty much on tier, but with 15% DR on top

fossil finch
#

A powerful thorns effect is comically debatable

frozen hornet
#

what was it's thorn effect again

grim tusk
fossil finch
#

like 0 damage back with a cap of -1 damage

grim tusk
#

It sucks due to 2 min cooldown

unborn siren
#

yeah if you want damage, who says you need to use a full set of 1 armor

grim tusk
fossil finch
#

evo should make reflected projs home in

frozen hornet
#

I agree

fossil finch
#

mixed sets 🤢

grim tusk
fossil finch
#

dies

cobalt pewter
#

or just replace the reflected projectiles with direct damage reflect

frozen hornet
#

though 8000 damage proj with homing sounds funny

cobalt pewter
#

but don't think it's easily possible atm

unborn siren
grim tusk
fossil finch
#

In any case min maxing is cringe

small timber
#

turtle has no DR

fossil finch
#

Oh yeah that's

unborn siren
#

oh wait is that a terraria 1.4 thing

small timber
#

no wonder I remember it is complete dogshit

fossil finch
#

Yeah 1.4 buffed tons of sets

unborn siren
#

just have calamity give it the 15% dr so it's actually viable and not just for people who didn't look closely enough at the wiki

small timber
#

getting trolled by 1.4 wiki'

#

and the thorn is only 1 (100%) time, which means you reflect a grand total of 200 damage on death malice duke charge

cobalt pewter
#

which is why dmg reflect should be super high at base tbh

#

at the very least 500%

small timber
#

and it will still be useless because it is contact only (and you have 500/600 hp only)

cobalt pewter
#

indeed

small timber
#

ideally something like hydrothermic explosion on hit is much more useful since it ignore how much you take

unborn siren
small timber
#

ya hallowed is better than daedalus and chlorophyte, daedalus 90 sec reflect is a bit unreliable

#

and it is only 50% DR reflect (not dodge), and reflect damage as stated is not useful

#

at least silva is updated, otherwise it will be so confusing

#

no it is still 50% DR on reflect

stable musk
#

bullet hell timer being ring

#

IS THIS A TOUHOU REFEREN-

small timber
#

@dreamy ocean this suggestion is already very well known and there is no point in suggesting it anymore (it will immediately be marked with ☑️ which represent repeated suggestion)

dreamy ocean
small timber
#

ya (it is a known problem), it is not your fault that you are suggesting it (since it is a really big problem), just that it will basically come out (soon™) so no need to suggest it

golden tulip
#

scal is already a cakewalk

#

you want to make bhs even easier

unique vector
#

says the nohitter, complaining that they have a subjectively easy time with a boss

hot zephyr
unique vector
#

god

golden tulip
#

o boy what have i done

unique vector
#

plus i rlly dont think a visual telegraph showing bh lengths is

#

making it “easier”

#

moreso it makes it more convenient for ppl who cant muscle menorize everything

golden tulip
#

forget i said anything

hot zephyr
golden tulip
dreamy ocean
sleek wadi
#

I wouldn't mind a BH timer, could probably give clone one too if that sugg did pass

cobalt pewter
frozen hornet
#

pixl dies

unique vector
#

im dead

frozen hornet
#

(she's a nohitter)

unique vector
#

im dead

#

inside!

dreamy ocean
small timber
#

not all bh starts with the proper music

frozen hornet
#

ye only BH 1,3 and 4 do

small timber
#

bh 1 (yes), bh 2 (no), bh 3 (yes), bh 4 (yes) bh 5 no

#

is 4 yes?

frozen hornet
#

4 is when the moons appear

#

aka when epiphany starts

small timber
#

oh right 4 is 30%

#

what is the point of it if it is not consistent?

#

wait isnt it about having a timer is unnecessary because music can serve as muscle memory not whether a timer is necessary?

frozen hornet
#

I can see why one would want it

small timber
#

kinda, but it will serve some purpose, particularly for people who do not count it is exactly 15 seconds (or going no-wiki playthrough), so I will not call it useless

#

just definitely should not be in visual form when scal bullet hell is dodging visual projectile

frozen hornet
#

Clock ticking sound

golden tulip
#

then what is the point of adding it if it doesnt make it easier

frozen hornet
#

It does make it easier
Easier to tell when it ends

#

but it doesn't make it aby easier to dodge

small timber
#

the suggestion was that scal will do diagonal brimstone hellblast right after bullethell ends so you must know exactly when bullet hell ends, but since the attack timer reset it is just purely for positioning now

golden tulip
#

no obviously not lol

unique vector
#

its quality of life

#

not a difficulty nerf

#

not everything has to be to make something easier/harder

#

guhhhhhhgghh

golden tulip
#

having something tell you when a bh ends definitely makes it easier

unique vector
#

literally adding a visual to an attack’s ending that has no fucking visual isnt “easier” its “now its actually properly telegraphed and not an instant fuck you if you havent memorized it”

#

thats like calling a bug fix a new feature

#

you’re right but like no you’re very wrong

golden tulip
#

instant fuck you if you havent memorized it

#

but thats the point

#

memorize the fight

#

that is scal's fight

small timber
#

telegraph can make and break a boss fight, while bullet hell is not exactly the perfect case but improved telegraph is still better than lack of telegraph

unique vector
#

thats only because it never had a telegraph

small timber
#

if it doesn't invalidate the fight in anyway

unique vector
#

ur making a corelation that doesnt exist

#

ive never heard anyone on the dev team say thats the point

dreamy ocean
unique vector
#

in fact fab hates memorization gameplay afaik

small timber
#

(oh god no wonder he say elden ring bosses sucks)

golden tulip
#

scal's entire fight is patterns you have to memorize

frozen hornet
#

wh

unique vector
#

nohitter’s dilemma

small timber
#

no you don't have to memorize scal at all, like literally

unique vector
#

im going to bed this is gonna go in circles

#

dont burn the place down with another 3 hr argument

frozen hornet
#

Idk I've never memorized any bosses' attacks and I could beat them fine

small timber
golden tulip
#

😐 ok

unique vector
#

i am saying this as a nohitter AND a dev that no you dont have to memorize the fight

#

it helps, but you dont

#

have to

frozen hornet
#

I did try to memorize scal's attacks but it just messes me up even more when I try so I don't bother anymore

copper crow
#

ok hear me out

#

what is a hard ore to find

#

idk

#

there are lot

#

s

#

lets say auric

#

instead of having it

#

across the whole world

#

have 'geode' things

#

that spawn like granite biomes

#

but without the right gear

#

it takes years to break into them

#

so that the later game mining gear

#

can actually be used

ruby plover
#

i mean... the ores being locked by pickaxe power already does that tho

#

like. you need better pickaxes to mine the higher tier ores

cobalt pewter
#

also gnight

ruby plover
#

the ores spawning in geode-like structures would be kinda cool i guess but the ore-mining process isn't (and likely won't be) very interesting, and that might just make it slower as well. and most people wouldn't want that

cobalt pewter
#

Auric ores being in a granite/marble styled mini biomes would be

#

interesting, to say the least

#

the only take from this is that whether you want a concentrated few of Auric ore spots or smaller but way more spread Auric ore spots

#

pick your poison kinda deal

ruby plover
#

maybe enemies that drop auric ore can spawn in these geode structures

copper crow
#

the idea that there are like strong blocks around it

#

like REALLY STRONG

#

strong as in taking very long time to break

#

but only a very long time to break if you are using just the on tier pick

#

but if you have gear and stuff

#

you can mine through it faster

#

and there could be something that puts pressure on you to dig it fast

#

maybe like meteor heads

#

or depth pressure

#

like the abyss

#

so you have to mine it quick befor eyou die

frozen hornet
#

There's still the problem of unbreakable blocks getting in the way of building

small timber
#

I don't think a structure like this is straight up possible with the in game system, at least not without a chance of accidently deleting something like player structure

ruby plover
small timber
#

there is also no "good gear" for mining, because the best ore you can mine currently is always on tier with the pickaxe

#

so unless you want the current tier of ores being a complete chore to mine something like that simply do not work (since you only get "good mining gear" after way pass progression)

stable musk
#

mining armor

#

also you can just download Fargo's mutant mod

#

If you don't like qol it gives and consider it cheating
You can disable them in settings

small timber
#

then it is literally just mining speed, not mining gear

small timber
copper crow
#

later game stuff

#

but yes mining potion and stuff like that would be usefull

#

just like how the abyss has all the stuff

copper crow
#

well stuff could be added

small timber
copper crow
#

jsut like the abyss

#

it would spawn apon world gen

#

mutiple

small timber
#

since it is the main reason we currently dont have generated structure post-Hardmode

copper crow
#

of earlier ores on the outside

#

with easier to break walls

small timber
#

then it will be really strange for new player that they have something appearing that early that are completely untouchable until way later on

copper crow
#

so that they aren't just obselete until scal

small timber
#

scoria get away with it because it is also hazard block

copper crow
#

not that golem is that far

#

but it is quite into progression

small timber
#

the idea can work, but from technical perspective it will be difficult, closest one I think is luminite planetoid

#

golem is very far, if the structure is generated on world creation (from pre-boss to golem)

#

golem temple differs in that there is only 1 of it, and it is the only structure in the entire vanilla that generate like that (this is also why dungeon is fine since there is only 1 of it)

#

so it will not be quite of an issue since 99% of the rest of the world is still perfectly traversible, meanwhile for your idea to work at least (multiple) structures for different ores must be generated, depend on how many ores you want

frozen hornet
#

Scoria is fine since building in the abyss is not feasible, and besides it's at the very edge of a world

#

Putting little patches of unbreakable ore everywhere underground is annoying as shit since you can't do anything to avoid it unlike dungeon and temple

tiny minnow
#

See early hardmode chloroplyte

bitter drift
#

was that to my suggestion?

small timber
#

@bitter drift if I remember correctly I heard that stars and gel are technically impossible to modify so probably delete that.

unique rockets and darts etc probably is possible so can keep

eternal escarp
#

unique rockets are possible, easier in 1.4 i think

#

darts absolutely possible

bitter drift
eternal escarp
#

gel afaik can be expanded but not as unique ammo, just cariety

bitter drift
eternal escarp
#

i dont remember why which is why i might be mistaken but it was said new Gel types could be added, but not with any unique effects

#

aka they can be ammo but be nothing more then normal gel

#

im rather certain its due to how Flamethrowers work in their core

bitter drift
#

well this is kind of dumb
let's show you gel
this is the 7th time you shown as gel this weak

eternal escarp
#

the most you could maybe do is higher damage Gel which is stupid

bitter drift
#

ya

eternal escarp
#

its not dumb more so just thats how Flamethrowers work in this game

#

each flamethrowe is unique on its own

#

cant give them unique qmmo types really

bitter drift
#

i see

#

and star?
can you modify stars?

eternal escarp
#

that i am not certain though i would assume its likely the same, considering most current star weapons convert the stars into projectiles like Comets, Astral Stars etc

bitter drift
#

i see

eternal escarp
#

i am certain Rockets can be modified though, atleast in JEs 1.4

bitter drift
#

i will change the suggestion to be possible

eternal escarp
#

the only star weapon to actually use the exact item it shoots is the normal Star Shooter afaik

#

you havnt mentioned Sand but ill mention it anyways
i tried suggestion something for Sandstorm before but afaik it was a huge hassle due to the way sand weapons work afaik, so that would likely never happen

bitter drift
eternal escarp
#

Sand is actually 2 weapons

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just 1 that can use different types of said samd

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Stakes are the same, theres Stake Launcher and the Impaler (post golem) which is rather good

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also some sand types actually change very slightly, iirc the evil biome sand pierces once and the hallow sand has more damage

bitter drift
eternal escarp
#

sulph sand doesnt act like sand so

small timber
#

isnt sand the same deal with gel and stars? a material made ammo so I assume it will also have problem being modified

eternal escarp
#

Astral Sand is the only one that could work

small timber
#

other than different type of sands can be use as sand gun ammo

eternal escarp
#

yeah thats what i said with Cal's Sandstorm

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it uses a specific projectile rather then the normal sand one

bitter drift
#

wait you can fire sulph sand from a sand gun?

eternal escarp
#

no

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afaik you cant use Astral Sand either

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but you can use any other actual sand blocks

fossil finch
#

..... my astral biome spawns there... on the edge fusing with a desert

bitter drift
#

you want to spread it in a desert the pre moon lord wings deus's death allows you to make are amazing

fossil finch
#

I like turning the whole stretch until the dungeon into astral

eternal escarp
#

astral desert is epic but i digress

fossil finch
#

Feels better and will probably play much better once biome changes come

eternal escarp
#

Hadarian wings are nice yeha

fossil finch
#

Hadarian wings are bad because yes

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Now go get hadarian wings

bitter drift
#

or am i confusing the names

fossil finch
#

eh

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It's just a gliding wing honestly

bitter drift
#

i never checked the name lol

fossil finch
#

Imo it's not that good but,

small timber
#

I mean you still have duke and betsy wing to compete

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and I cant imagine hadarian being that good if you are not wearing astral armor

bitter drift
small timber
#

what 2 out of 3 aspect? I know 1 of them is gliding

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because not all class can use astral armor

eternal escarp
#

Hadarian Wings are definitely too late to be used

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but they are good

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just that Fishron and Betsy are just as good earlier on

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i made a sugg for Hadarian Wings a while ago iirc which just got the thumbs up

bitter drift
#

wait you fight the OOA?

bitter drift
eternal escarp
#

no, its just that betsy wings are factually goo

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im on phone, too lazy to search rn

small timber
#

ya if you are really desperate you get it, otherwise usually fishron wing is good enough

eternal escarp
#

go search for Hadarian in the voting channel

small timber
eternal escarp
#

that was fast

cobalt pewter
#

Hadarian Wings should be better now (or soon?) when Exodus Wings is finally post ML

small timber
#

on pc just have to ctrl+F

cobalt pewter
#

but basically Exodus was its major competitor

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and Hadarian is ass to get

eternal escarp
#

well yeah but i expected more hadarian suggestions to bloat the ctrl f tab kekw

small timber
#

(most people probably dont know hadarian wing exist so likely no)

eternal escarp
#

Fishron and Betsy still are rather karge contendors l

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and yeah thats a BIG issue

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its a locked item to both astral bosses and an astral enemy in a part of the astral biome youre not guarenteed to get

cobalt pewter
#

Hadarian is pretty obscure in comparison

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yea

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same issue as light and dark shards really

eternal escarp
#

just worse HDfailure

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stleast those are just normally HM

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which is a requires progression boss

cobalt pewter
#

at the very least Hadarian Wings is a one off

a couple weapons with those shards are required for endgame trees

eternal escarp
#

neither AA or AD are rewuired nor hint at anything of that sort

small timber
#

and corruption often hit either snow or sand so you hvae 50/50 to get, while light shard and hadarian are much rarer

bitter drift
eternal escarp
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oh no i mean

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req for progression

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they are both required for the Hadarian Wings

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its basically an AND gate HDfailure

bitter drift
#

currently they are

cobalt pewter
#

yeah Hadarian should be way less obscure to get in general

eternal escarp
#

i think they should either be good contenders for the class specific wings

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and be less obscure yeah

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or be pushed back to specifically post AA

cobalt pewter
#

to be fair Betsy Wings is also considerably obscure, but at least it's god

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I did suggest to make hadarian just post oreoss

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then again it was considered with exodus in mind

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actually I can't find it in changelogs, I'm trying to remember whether exodus is actually moved to post ML

fossil finch
#

It is

cobalt pewter
#

but yeah

bitter drift
#

it's still sad that there is no way to add new stars and gels (but i guess that's a little price to pay for the ranger class, at best you can modify around this by removing the gel and stars and sands from the ammo list and add a material to replace them but y do that?)

cobalt pewter
#

with that in mind, Hadarian should be able to nestle nicely in post Deus now

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just make it way less obscure to get

small timber
#

just make hadarian spawn everywhere

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all problem solved

bitter drift
#

you can buy the fucking solution from the steampunk

gray nebula
#

what why is there no way to do that

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just make custom weapons bro

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just have like one line of flamethrowers be some weird experimental-tech flamethrower that can take in a wide array of gels or other substances and it does cool stuff

fossil finch
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TRUE

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Shotgun flamethrower iirc

gray nebula
#

That's both doable and also way cooler than just making different gels that universally apply for every single fucking flamethrower and therefore ruin any opportunity to have it feel unique

fossil finch
#

Fuck range

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You're just lit on fire

small timber
#

shotgun rocket when

gray nebula
#

like here like, thas cool

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(this isnt a flamethrower this is just to show that u can do custom ammo used by a custom weapon)

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(and also its just cool )

safe oasis
#

side note but i feel like a clarification is needed on the “crystal dart is the only ammo that bounces” part because chlorophyte arrows and that one type of bullet (forgot what it was) do indeed bounce

heavy linden
#

actually crystal bullets bounce when they shater technicly

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But in a way tho it kinda bounces

safe oasis
#

in a way it bounces yeah but that’s if you’re using a very vague definition of bounce

heavy linden
#

i actually think the shrapnel from the crystal bullets should go farther because they despawn before they really hit a target

cobalt pewter
#

the dyes working as pseudo ammo for this is a cherry on top, but I'm usually just a giant sucker for paint weapons

grim tusk
#

splatoon

cobalt pewter
#

it's so silly yet so cool, and yes, splatoon

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a bit disappointed that Paintball Gun is just a mere ass gun

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make it splash colors

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recolor the slimes that take dmg from it

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anything

gray nebula
cobalt pewter
#

no it's just a funny

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but yes, Paintball gun is just underwhelming for a paint related weapon

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I've been attracted to paint-styled weapons like that one split mod thing

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(I read it as Spirit the first time, these two mods need to rename like fr)

safe oasis
sand umbra
golden tulip
fossil finch
#

Lets see art attack fail miserably at whatever it does

golden tulip
#

pls release 1.5.1 🥺 ......

safe oasis
#

literally slime gun

gray nebula
#

also by hardcode hell i meant, if it was something that got done by vanilla

frozen hornet
#

Just have rancor's magma thing but colourful

languid dock
#

Quick question: does it count as a specific item suggestion to say ‘lategame spear’ cause I was going through the wiki and realized that spears are the only type of weapon in the game with no post-yharon option

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Like Nadir is the highest spear in progression, but it’s only DoG tier

unique vector
#

“add more X subclass weapons” arent exactly specific item suggestions, but you need to have a very clear reason for wanting one

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asking for more subclass weapons purely because they arent viable at every stage of the game is usually frowned upon

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@languid dock

half sage
#

yea it's not a SIS but it's a separate don't

languid dock
#

Yeah that’s fair, my logic was that if it was a whole bunch of weapon types missing at one specific progression point that would be one thing, but given that it kinda includes four progression points (yharon, draedon, scal, endgame/shadowspec) and it’s only one missing weapon type that might be different

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100% understand if that’s a don’t tho lmao

golden tulip
#

based suggestion

vocal ivy
#

should i suggest making the ancient manipulator obtainable pre cultist

golden tulip
#

no

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why would that be a good idea

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thats a pretty major tiershift for everything that uses that crafting bench

vocal ivy
#

right now fighting astrum deus pre cultist is pretty much pointless

vocal ivy
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just so you can fight deus first

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and get it

sleek wadi
#

There's still Astrum Deus direct drops

golden tulip
#

deus is already post lunatic even in the boss logs

sleek wadi
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Also shifting ancient manipulator would also shift Heart of the Elements an the Absorber

vocal ivy
#

non-linearity

golden tulip
#

why would you want to fight deus pre lunatic

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i take that back i always do that

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but i dont think tiershifting a crafting bench to make 1 boss less linear is a good idea

sleek wadi
#

There's also still Astrum Deus' weapon drops so if you do manage an early AD kill its not pointless

vocal ivy
#

what about just changing the astral bar recipes

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to work on a hardmode anvil or something