suggestions-discussion

[hollow shell]

That reason is a bit better yeah
I think I'd also mention that they'd serve as good practice for the full boss rush, as it is quite punishing to lose in the full rush
while being able to fight, say, the final tier of bosses at their proper BR stats without worrying about being set back so much when you die, as practice material for when you get there in the real thing, would be helpful

[drowsy wren]

If you want to preserve the challenge of the final fights you can just leave them exclusive to the full boss rush too

I believe Absolute Radiance is only in the final pantheon

[hollow shell]

Nope. You gain access to AbsRad in the Hall of Gods as soon as you reach her once

[drowsy wren]

Ah nvm

but the idea remains

[violet dagger]

"on gamepedia" we all wish

[exotic stag]

its fandom

not gamepedia

[violet dagger]

that's the joke fandom sucks in comparison to what gamepedia was

massive downgrade

[exotic stag]

arent they the exact same.

[violet dagger]

no

fandom looks way worse and has tons of ads

I use an adblocker on my computer but no luck when on phone

[exotic stag]

lole

the only fandom i browse is wikitubia

[violet dagger]

calamity used to be on gamepedia but they were acquired by fandom

so all gamepedia wikis are fandom now

[hollow shell]

Indeed

[crude geode]

Should trashbox's sug be exclaimed considering the forum is no longer being updated?

[hollow shell]

mmmmmmprobably I suppose

If he updates his reason to include why they should be updated despite the forum no longer being maintained, I'll un-exclam it

[exotic stag]

(probably because fandom likes to break)

[fossil finch]

What does fandom have to do with that

[violet dagger]

some other mod wikis like soa moved to other wiki websites

but its a way smaller wiki than calam

[violet dagger]

.

[stiff wren]

Fandom is the alternative to the forum

[fossil finch]

It isn't

[stiff wren]

How is it not one

[fossil finch]

The forum's a forum and the wiki's a wiki

They're at base very different

[exotic stag]

fandom is basically what the forum was

[fossil finch]

no?

[exotic stag]

basically a list

[fossil finch]

I mean yeah

But it's introductory

[exotic stag]

uh yes ender. the forum had all the stuff the wiki currently has (albeit old)

[fossil finch]

It doesn't really go in depth

No???

Lol

It just had the sets and the lore

it wasn't anywhere near wiki level

[hollow shell]

Nnnno that's not a great comparison

[fossil finch]

Comparing them is just dumb

A wiki's a wiki and a forum a forum

Ofc the forum post will have teasers and info on the mod

That's their point

[hollow shell]

(The forum also has a discussion/replying component which is ironically the most overlooked aspect about it)

(considering the Discord has absorbed that purpose)

[fossil finch]

..m it's still active to today i believe

[exotic stag]

(i mean fandom also does too but like. its less)

[fossil finch]

Not a lot ofc but

fandom doesn't really

Sure there's discussions but they're not structured at all

[hollow shell]

Fandom does have a forum-like.. thing
that can be enabled on wikis
Calamity doesn't have it

[fossil finch]

And are meant for questions.. does cal wiki even has discussions on

[hollow shell]

Lemme get an example

[fossil finch]

yeah there's a forum chat available

[violet dagger]

comments on fandom wikis are horrible

[fossil finch]

Cal wiki doesn't have those on either

[hollow shell]

Bloons wiki:
https://bloons.fandom.com/wiki/Bloons_Wiki

Bloons wiki "community":
https://bloons.fandom.com/f

[violet dagger]

celeste wiki comments are pretty bad

but then again the celeste wiki itself is pretty bad

[stiff wren]

The celeste wiki is so shitty

[fossil finch]

Byeah
Imo keeping the forum post maintened would be nice but eh

[stiff wren]

It has like no information

[fossil finch]

Forum is still used by a good chunk of people and it's just tradition making a post for your mod there

[violet dagger]

the entity list there sucks compared to the everest wiki one (everest is the modloader)

[hollow shell]

It's just really inconvenient to update
We're keeping it around as an access point to our modern communication and information areas

[violet dagger]

but that's getting off topic

[hollow shell]

m

[fossil finch]

Yea

[crude geode]

See above for why it’s annoying to update enderpikmin (if you don’t already know)

[fossil finch]

I do

[crude geode]

Byeah updating it sounds like a pain compared to just. pointing people to the wiki or discord

[obsidian cove]

There are people on the forum who doesn’t want to use discord, but theirs probably not a lot of them

[exotic stag]

for infinite star pouch dont you by the time you hit anywhere that requires THAT many stars

already have a star farm?

[deft yew]

agree with this, i hate calamity star cannons just because they're completely unrealistic to farm ammo for

star farms take quite a long time to build

and star cannons consume enough you WILL need a colossal one

[wise raven]

and like
once youve hit ~400 from beating up aureus and deus you should probably be able to just. say you're set

[exotic stag]

literally once you hit hardmode (which wont require that much tbh) just farm aureus for a bit.

get like 9000 stars

done

[wise raven]

endless crystal dart pouch also sounds cool

shame cal adds like, actually one dart weapon lol

[deft yew]

darts in general are way underdeveloped

[ruby plover]

only crystal darts?

[wise raven]

theyre my favorite

[exotic stag]

aureus is just basically infinite star pouch tbh

[crude geode]

^^^

also like even outside of that just Zerg the astral biome

[ruby plover]

or fish for astral crates

[half sage]

even before aureus doesn't stardust craft into stars

[crude geode]

Yep

[ruby plover]

yes it does

[wise raven]

f*shing

[crude geode]

also ammo box/conservation potion exists for a reason lmao

There’s multiple ways of getting and conserving stars for starfleet

also this sounds like a SIS ngl

@hollow shell Does latest sugg count for SIS?

[hollow shell]

No.

[crude geode]

Gotcha

[hollow shell]

Naming and numbering schemes are just based on Endless Musket Pouch

It could be reworded to be less SIS-like I guess

ex "Add a Fallen Star equivalent to the Endless Quiver / Endless Musket Pouch"

[languid quartz]

Also star cannon is getting rebalanced to have an 80% chance to not consume ammo so it can actually be balanced and not overpowered

So other star upgrades may get that treatment as well

[deft yew]

is it getting hard nerfed

in exchange for that

(i mean it would be stupid not to )

[languid quartz]

Oh you bet lmfao

[deft yew]

specific item suggestion

[hollow shell]

"Specific Item Suggestion" yeah

A type of sugg we used to get a lot, basically like writing a wiki page for an item that you came up with, a specific proposal

You can find more info in the pinned Dont's doc

Basically, around half of all suggestions that got written were specific item suggestions
We got hundreds and hundreds
And the devs only ever ended up implementing like... 4? 5?

[fossil finch]

1.5 implemented like 2

[hollow shell]

We decided that they were not worth keeping around as a valid sugg type

[half sage]

basically just clogging up the suggestion channels

[cobalt pewter]

essentially a major part of the playerbase can't design items and shouldn't be given the power and encouragement to

[crude geode]

A major part of the player base can’t understand basic game design, let alone items

[hollow shell]

(not to say that the devs are design geniuses
But... yeah we got some bad suggs)

[fossil finch]

time to pull the most obscure sis shit ever

[cobalt pewter]

this is still a relevant statement regarding playerbase

I'm only trusting speedrunners with bug hunting, not balance and design

[hollow shell]

I've gotten quoted for that many times, even in the dev server
I'm proud to have said something so poignant

[cobalt pewter]

epic

[crude geode]

I've seen it quoted on youtube b4

[hollow shell]

Hmm enemy critter

I do not know if CalVal adds critters but I assume that it does

[sleek turret]

ok I agree with the idea of more critters but the explosive bunny I don't

otherwise

[violet dagger]

isn't there gonna be a brimstone crag overhaul sometime soon

[sleek turret]

Good suggestion

[violet dagger]

that would probably be a good time to add brimstone critters

[small timber]

also I just notice the bot is down

[cobalt pewter]

@zenith hazel bot needs a bonk

[crude geode]

Next update is mostly focused around that type of shit iirc

[violet dagger]

*next major update

the next update as in the current #changelogs one is definitely not that

[half sage]

yea next update is what's in #changelogs atm

[zenith hazel]

notified amber

[crude geode]

Indeed.

[shadow knoll]

What exactly does this entail? Like a general overall rework to terrain, enemies, loot and what not?

or something smaller?

[violet dagger]

I think terrain is gonna change definitely

[shadow knoll]

good, I hated traversing that place.

[hollow shell]

"God Slayer Dash is currently just much more superior compare to Silva Revive"

Weird. I usually hear people complaining about how GS and its Auric upgrades don't have a revive

[small timber]

people are just get too used to being revived after getting pummeled by Scal

the GSD is actually one of the most overpowered thing in the game right now

if it is pure movement then it is just a second RoD (which is fine), but it gives god mode during the dash (and like 2 second of immunity after the dash end)

[hollow shell]

(That is still technically RoD-like, considering you don't take damage from whatever is between you and your teleport destination)

[warped coyote]

or literally just spectral veil

[small timber]

but GSD is even safer than RoD, with RoD you can teleport into projectile (obvious example is during Scal bullet hell), wuth GSD it is free

[hollow shell]

Indeed

[small timber]

I think the main reason people say revive is better is because most of them do not bother to learn to use GSD

[hollow shell]

GS armor is also post-DoG whilst RoD is post-WoF

[small timber]

most post 1.5 video I seen on youtube never use GSD once in their lifetime

[hollow shell]

I do agree with your sugg though

I think having a crazy long recharge time would be more welcome than having to die to reset it

[small timber]

and also revive is just less effort (and people playing glass cannons), GSD is less reliable on glass cannons

and also don't have to die to reset the CD

[crude geode]

Hardcore players are crying with joy

[hollow shell]

All 4 of them

[small timber]

ah yes calamity HC player

[warped coyote]

*3

[hollow shell]

(one died)

[small timber]

tbh it is definitely doable now, previously the concern was DoG just one tap you on Dmode

[hollow shell]

byeah a 4 or 5 minute long cooldown sounds reasonable for a revive that's balanced around being once-per-fight

that late in the game

[small timber]

it will (at most) trigger 2 times, considering it do give complete damage immune after revive I think it is reasonable

in most case it is once unless you die really quickly at the start of the fight

[crude geode]

You could bring up stalling but I personally think that anti-stalling is an extremely bad argument

As most bosses don’t have easy phases late game

[small timber]

and also Revengeance phasing

[hollow shell]

Calamity already has anti-stall built into it now (apparently)

[small timber]

it is a much longer time to stall than Adrenaline

[crude geode]

It’s already been called out as bad as well. #suggestions-voting message

[small timber]

(and also why risk stalling for a defensive mechanic when just killing the boss is less risky)

[hollow shell]

Also yes @languid quartz I feel I should acknowledge your suggestion
I am aware that the star req is currently not sufficient

[languid quartz]

yeah I figured it'd be hard to miss for testers/devs, felt like throwing together a suggestion just so it would be brought to more attention

[distant gyro]

I think I have an idea on what to do with stars but idk if it's gonna be the most favorable thing ever

[languid quartz]

what would that be altix?

or can you say

[distant gyro]

On a timed based basis, the top x% of suggestions get sent

[languid quartz]

oh interesting

so like the top 5% of suggs in a given week would get sent

[hollow shell]

Not a bad idea I suppose

[crude geode]

mmmmmm

[languid quartz]

and that would be a permanent solution which is nice

[distant gyro]

so regardless if the situation is in star drought or star flood

[hollow shell]

That would indeed mean star reqs would never need to be changed

[crude geode]

makes it hard for controversial suggs to go through ngl

[distant gyro]

the same % of suggestions are gonna be delivered everytime

[hollow shell]

It's already hard for them to go through

[distant gyro]

and then keep 200 as the lower bound or something

[hollow shell]

("already" as in, pre-270)

[crude geode]

true ig

[small timber]

the only problem I can think of (seeing how it currently is), is that QoL suggestions have overwhelming chance to occupy the top %

[crude geode]

also true.

[small timber]

and other suggestions almost can't compare

[distant gyro]

yeah but that's gonna happen regardless

even if the star count has to meet a fixed number

[languid quartz]

well if qol ones are getting the votes they'll be sent either way but I see what you mean

[distant gyro]

the main issue is if those qol suggestions eat up the slots for everything else

[crude geode]

yes that's moreso the problem

[distant gyro]

then we just have to be stricter on the qol suggestions

[hollow shell]

Well, ok

There are two interpretations of what "top %" can mean

[distant gyro]

the original idea was that:
suppose 100 suggestions get posted in a month
after the month passes, the 20 with the highest stars are chosen

that's the "top %"

[hollow shell]

It can either be the whatever% of suggestions that had the highest amount of stars by the end of the period (what you just said)

Or it could be an average of all star counts over the period, and the "star req" is set to a specified proportion of whatever that average is, and all the suggs meeting that req get delivered

There are problems and advantages to both options

[languid quartz]

I feel like a month might be too long of a time period though, you wouldn't know for the full month if your suggestion passes or not and plenty can change in that time period

something more like the top 5 each week might work better

[hollow shell]

If either one of these happens I sure hope it's fucking automated

[languid quartz]

yeah lmfao

[distant gyro]

the latter sounds like practically the same thing unless the average is referring to something else

[small timber]

my own idea (though I don't know how it should be implemented), is that a second (lower) star count is set for a suggestion to get "highlighted" (basically more exposure), and the suggestion that reach the actual star count get sent. The idea is just purely for suggestion that has potential to not get drown out

[distant gyro]

basically a weighted top 50%

[hollow shell]

Basically the latter is
instead of changing star reqs whenever we feel that they need changing,
The star req changes on a periodic and consistent basis

and isn't changed to like, "nice numbers"
It's raw averages

And that would allow star req changes to be automated

[distant gyro]

yeah it will either have to be automated or painfully done

[crude geode]

the bot has trouble transcribing messages as is, let alone this shit (no offense to the bot, it does it's best)

[hollow shell]

I have no idea why suggbot goes down as often as it does

Our ModNotifs bot gets put through way more strain and it has way better uptime

[crude geode]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[crude geode]

Personally I would love a weighted top 50%, so that more controversial but good suggs can go through

but understandable if we need to keep the percent low

[distant gyro]

actually

[hollow shell]

Unfortunately you can't really quantify controversialness

[distant gyro]

it should probably use a median because outliers happen a bit too often

[small timber]

#suggestions-voting message ya stuff like this is about as controversial as reverting RIV

[crude geode]

rage rework moment

[distant gyro]

I was thinking the star req could be
A: 80th percentile
B: the median multiplied some value like 1.5

and then the numbers are readjusted monthly as provided by the example

[crude geode]

yeah that would be nice

B would probably be like just the title or something

[languid quartz]

I could probably run the stats for the past week on what that would be

[hollow shell]

This is all wishful thinking, the assumption that we can get someone to develop a bot to do this
cuz
Amber maintains the suggbot but she does not develop it anymore, not for free at least

She's gotta pay the bills and bot dev takes up a lotta time

[languid quartz]

that's a good point as well

[distant gyro]

manual

[crude geode]

🤮

awful, abysmal

unless you wanna drag philo out of the depths every week

[languid quartz]

if it's manual I will do it but you have to pay me

my love for stats will barely outweigh the slog of reading 100 suggestions every week

[distant gyro]

I can do it probably

but will I feel like doing it

[languid quartz]

oh right even if I did it I couldn't send them right

[distant gyro]

depends

[languid quartz]

I'd just ping you with a list of message links

[distant gyro]

if only cutting the screen in half doesn't make the suggestion text screenlength

[hollow shell]

I only had to do one tally for the course of a few weeks at most
And I couldn't bring myself to do that

I mean, in the past I could, but

point is I'd rather not rely on a human and their emotional state to do it

[languid quartz]

I mean I know nycro's a CD and he has created like 6 different bots that all maintain really well but that would be a large ask plus probably a logistical headache as having a bot in main comes with a lot of perms

[crude geode]

the problem with manually doing it is that retrieving numbers+title is impossible, you have to go through the pretty block of text every time

like this is all we need when star counting

we don't care about sugg author, nor the actual reasoning of the sugg, but simply the title and it's stars

[feral basin]

Author? Yes
Reasoning can be useful for some suggestions though

[distant gyro]

sometimes the body is needed for clarification

and those are usually painful

[crude geode]

sorry I phrased that weirdly

when reviewing whether or not to send a sugg to dev voting

[small timber]

ya things like this will become confusing without context

[distant gyro]

you mean like the star check

[crude geode]

yes exactly

[distant gyro]

if yes then message link is preferred

[feral basin]

“Put Giant Clam in Boss Rush”

[crude geode]

honestly if there was a way to have compact mode on discord somehow remove the body text that would be incredibly nice, but I doubt there's anything we can do there.

[feral basin]

Title:
Star Count:
Link to Message:

Feel like that could work

They get to see the title to see if it’s worthwhile, see if it’s well received, and then can look at the message if further clarification is needed

[crude geode]

not sure if much resulted from all of this

[wise raven]

if only dodu's hand cannon weren't a donor item, I'd suggest letting it inherit lifesteal from the component aeries

[small timber]

you can still suggest it

just have to inform the donor

[crude geode]

Indeed

[feral basin]

I wish I had enough money to get my own donor item when you could’ve gotten one

[crude geode]

Overall it seems like having the suggs delivered be based on percentage isn't too bad, but also would need to be tweaked and adjusted as things go on. Automating got brought up again, but manual might have to be relied upon which would be a pain and unlikely to happen.

[wise raven]

okay well where's dodu

[feral basin]

Find them

[wise raven]

not actually worried too much about it I'm tired

[crude geode]

(post the sugg first and get a mod to pull up the list)

fair

[small timber]

I think the main concern is that if something are to be implemented, it like have to be done manually

so basically it must be a very simple work for it to work

[crude geode]

yeah that's moreso the problem

[crude geode]

the math of doing it isn't the problem, it's retrieving the numbers

[hollow shell]

@past pagoda How you feel about this

[feral basin]

I feel like a few people think coding is just ticking a box and then thing works

Unfortunately, I don’t know if this is true, as I can’t code.

[crude geode]

coding is simple, you just do
if
else

[feral basin]

If
Then

If
Then
Or

If
Else

I can code

[crude geode]

byeah having a bot automatically do all that shit sounds very complex and a lot of work overall

[feral basin]

Let me read a book on how to code and I’ll figure it out from there

[crude geode]

manual review seems like the most likely option but it seems like a massive headache since no suggestion looks like this

[feral basin]

Because hypothetically, you’d need a time period for the suggestions to be in, then the bot needs to pick the top _% of suggestions, and have a format to give it as

As an example:
Time Period: Day
%: 5
Format:
Title:
Star Count:
Link to Message:

Like that could work, I’d just need a brain to code it.

[cobalt pewter]

do the stars on the bot tallied separately? or is the only instance the votes matter is on the reaction?

[feral basin]

Honestly, I have no idea how the bot does it

[crude geode]

Well the bot just transcribes the message so it doesn’t have to do much

[cobalt pewter]

I guess there's no chance of having the bot being developed further, so idk why I said that

[feral basin]

When I learn how to code I’ll try making something to make it easier for the devs to look at the suggestions

[past pagoda]

i like health so sure

[cobalt pewter]

@wise raven approval.

[hollow shell]

coolo

Thanks Dodu

[pulsar marlin]

Dear Fabsol,

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF STARS IN THE SUGGESTION VOTINGS!!

             Sincerely, Mr. Pootisman

I have to agree 270 is way too much

[frail mantle]

fab isn't the one who manages the suggestions channels

checkmate, liberals

[crude geode]

[pulsar marlin]

Well, admins should read my sincere letter

Should*

[frail mantle]

rover knows the star req is in a weird spot

[silver silo]

nah fabsol is responsible for every single thing in the world if a problem exists blame fabsol

[crude geode]

Arguably serpentine could be one of the weakest weapons in the game

[lone geyser]

holy fucking based

[crude geode]

Can you not.

then you really don’t have to say anything. It’s like saying dead chat

[small timber]

I just hope ravager have the samething as 132, everytime he spawn he slamdunk me immediately

[lone geyser]

are you spawning him while in the air? never happened to me

[small timber]

nah I think in general he need that, even if you spawn him on land he can immediately fist you

you can always just dash away immediately, but it is the same deal with astrum aureus

[lone geyser]

yea he's never done that to me so i cant comment

[potent rivet]

ravager and aureus spawns right on top of you

and it also deals contact damage

if you don't dodge it

[crude geode]

Oh boy we’re bringing up this again?

This is a pretty subjective opinion so I can’t really invalidate it

[cobalt pewter]

get rid of this mechanic on eow and boc as well, then maybe

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[crude geode]

I honestly don’t mind the mechanic all that much tbfh, as even if someone fails at EoW/BoC they can get evil pickaxe and leave since that’s really the only actual relevant loot from said bosses

This is moreso a problem because all of the unique boss loot is crafted for both evil bosses and evil bosses +

[ripe owl]

REEEEEEE PROGRESSION SKIPS

[crude geode]

cope

[ruby plover]

I personally think either the worm drops should be removed, or the hive minds minions (maybe dank creepers?) should drop the corruption equivalents

[crude geode]

It’s not even a progression skip you’re still fighting the boss

[ruby plover]

Not every world evil thing has to be the same as the other, but in this case it would make sense

[crude geode]

Indeed

Honestly wouldn’t mind if simply killing a cyst caused aerialite to spawn ngl

[crude geode]

also continuing off of this, just make some of the drops only available through the boss itself and not crafting lol

@ripe owl You should at least mention EoW/BoC in your sugg imo, as it’s why the mechanic exists for Perfs.

[ripe owl]

Fair

Done

[crude geode]

ah yes my favorite EoW weapon…squints The Breaker

[spare prawn]

My issue is that in the yahron fight it's easy to meet yourself out of the fucking arena on accident

[small timber]

you usually block off the edge so it is really not a problem

[spare prawn]

Yes, however, i am lazy and have not yet built an arena

[small timber]

then do smaller tap for GSD

[inland saddle]

Bronze mentioned this already, but I’d be happy to make a suggbot and I’m confident in my abilities to consistently update/maintain it when circumstances change

Like they said I already have a few other bots running, and it’s no issue for me to make another; I actually have a lot of fun doing it anyways

Obviously I can see it not being a necessity, and that’s fine, but reading through the conversation I could probably make any of the changes/ideas that were tossed around

Probably would not take me more than a day or two

[exotic stag]

uhh

thats not

the right

channel

[jagged bluff]

then what is right channel

[exotic stag]

#help-advice-read-pins #calamity-mod-talk

[cobalt pewter]

while I don't want to discredit Amber's efforts with the suggbot so far, having a somewhat regularly updated sugg bot would be pretty nice

[inland saddle]

Oh yeah absolutely

[exotic stag]

(yes because then we can have added ideas of some ways of sugg discussion y'know. giving ideas about fixing sugg-posting because by god the amount of donts)

[inland saddle]

Amber’s done lots of hard work and they absolutely deserve recognition for that

[exotic stag]

yes

keeping ambers work is fine. adding onto it is even better

because your improving off an already good idea

[cobalt pewter]

if you would make one, it's probably gonna be more for backend and stats, and not taking the spot in the sugg channel

yea

both can coexist

[exotic stag]

(probably more moderating the actual sugg posting channel)

oh a donor wep sugg

[cobalt pewter]

I feel like moderating posting could still be done manually, just needs a bit more people to work on it

[exotic stag]

i didnt mean like exclam

[cobalt pewter]

but stuff like the top % delivery and stuff totally needs a bot

[exotic stag]

i meant like y'know how we were all talking about the google forms role thing a while ago

[inland saddle]

I don’t think they can be exclusive, as the discussion was about the amount of votes needed to send a suggestion

I can’t control when Amber’s bot would send the suggestions

[cobalt pewter]

@wise raven the remark in brackets isn't needed, if your donor related sugg isn't exclaimed, then you're good I think

[exotic stag]

(also if you provide proof here so we atleast know your not lying)

[cobalt pewter]

but otherwise the sugg is fine

[exotic stag]

(mostly because im too lazy to use search function while im working on something in mspaint)

[sleek turret]

Good suggestion

[inland saddle]

Either way, it would take a bit of change but I think it would have a largely positive impact in the long run

[cobalt pewter]

[wise raven]

alright

[wise raven]

there ya go

[exotic stag]

coolioe

[hollow shell]

Alright, that's great to hear that you're willing

If you ever join the dev server in the future (I thought you were a tester already whoops), then your bot could even handle the automatic deliveries
Amber's bot was planned to do that but it was never implemented, all deliveries are still manual

[inland saddle]

I already made auto deliveries for the Infernum server

[hollow shell]

ooo

[exotic stag]

btw rover uhh

what r your thoughts on like a google forms verification system for actually posting in #suggestions-posting

(explained better up here)

[hollow shell]

Not worth it. We have exclams for that purpose.

[inland saddle]

Essentially once suggs get enough support they get automatically forwarded here, and then once Dom/Pin/Me reacts with one of the emotes it’s automatically carried over to public

If Suggs are accepted but aren’t finished they get ported to a channel called suggestion to dos where the only option is to mark them as finished

(And again it carries over)

[hollow shell]

Oh you have a way higher rate of implementation than Calamity it seems

But that is cool, looks similar to our system on the dev side

[pulsar marlin]

A person wants Astrum Deus to be fought only after Cultist.
Well, non liniary Calamity sucks but it needs to make the mod feel free, so you can fight a boss at all times

[exotic stag]

its just like how you can fight the sentinels pre-provi (or was that removed this upd)

[hollow shell]

How is "support" determined in Infernum, is it also a one-reaction voting system like here?

Yes I was gonna address Derick's sugg once this convo here ended

[inland saddle]

Yeah, it’s literally the exact same lol

[pulsar marlin]

The Rune of Kos recipe is not removed. And yes you can fight them at any time

[exotic stag]

yeah thats the linearity

you have options

you still have to progress to unlock stuff. but you have more options to do while waiting for that progression

[inland saddle]

Suggestions are posted in a dedicated channel, and after 24 hours have passed if there are no issues they automatically get forwarded to a voting channel

[hollow shell]

Wow, nice
It'd probably be no issue at all making one for Calamity then, just duplicate it and change the channel pointers

Aight I think I'm on board then

As long as your bot doesn't crash as often as Amber's
and, I'm sure she will be happy to not have to keep rebooting it

[inland saddle]

I’ve considering seeing about testing before, I’d like to be able to help out if possible

And that could serve as a double help by also allowing me to get implementation in dev

Would I just need to talk to Fab about that?

[hollow shell]

I think so yeah

[dapper coral]

yeup

[hollow shell]

(You prolly don't even need to do testing if you don't want to, the bot business should be enough on its own)

[inland saddle]

Well that would be awesome lol

I guess if you could bring it up there so I could get an invite that would be nice? Not sure what the process would be lmao

[hollow shell]

I'll ask there but Fab has the final say

[pulsar marlin]

Well

The Plague enemy suggestion will work

Since PBG is after Golem and is the only boss that is locked after another boss, I hope the suggestion I make will help

[fossil finch]

I will die of cringe

[pulsar marlin]

Me too

I'd die instead of cringe

[fossil finch]

I honestly just say... no to this

[brittle pumice]

honestly i feel like having plague suddenly overtake the jungle after golem dies is much more effective of a sudden shift than it just being another start of hardmode thing

[pulsar marlin]

Oh

[fossil finch]

Having them spawn on early is just unnecessary and overwhelming imo
Having them spawn where they are now (with more work at least) can give a non boss break to the post plantera eighty bajillion bosses available at the time

[brittle pumice]

and it lets the devs balance plague enemies around postgolem without needing to worry about hardmode start gear

[pulsar marlin]

I might need to edit a bit my suggestion, regards the enemies stats

[exotic stag]

(i mean also isnt golem like a jungle guardian like plant)

[fossil finch]

Calamity already is a complete mess and non linearity isn't doing it any good at this point

[pulsar marlin]

That's what Fabsol really wanted to

[hollow shell]

This is a good suggestion imo

[pulsar marlin]

Well, thanks. But regards that, non linear Calamity might be average, but it's actually necessary for the player to fight bosses earlier at any time

[fossil finch]

This type of stuff just forcefully meshes eight billion things at the same place for the sake of "people fighting things when they want to" which is just.. not a good excuse to confuse the players who don't know that much with eighty billion different things to do

It is not necessary in any way

[hollow shell]

Just a few things:

Title should probably say "to the start of Hardmode" rather than "at"

And you don't need RoD to access the Lihzahrd Temple, Calamity allows the Temple Key to be crafted at the start of Hardmode

[fossil finch]

Calamity could've gone massively linear and it'd be the same

[pulsar marlin]

I might edit it again for grammar issues

[fossil finch]

I just dislike it heavily because it removes the only non boss part of calamity's lateish hardmode

Even if it's just 3 seconds of farming plague enemies

post plant and post golem are already bloated to hell with eight billion bosses

[deft yew]

Honestly non-linearity exists just for low percent players but we keep changing recipes to screw low percent over harder

[pulsar marlin]

[deft yew]

like

PBG is required for exos

hearing that by itself is kinda

[deft yew]

post plant has 2 and post golem has 3 but alr

please just remove half the calamity bosses at this rate

[hollow shell]

I have a personal idea for how to make Plague accessible earlier without being overwhelming as you say Neko

That being, the Jungle Biolab contains a big important green tank, which is initially intact in PreHM, then gets cracked at the start of Hardmode, then shatters after Golem, releasing the plague
But when it gets cracked after WoF, the player can manually shatter it to release the plague early, if they want to

So it's still forced to happen after Golem, but you can let it come earlier

[fossil finch]

That'd be better yea

[pulsar marlin]

That's a pretty good idea, I like it

[deft yew]

Ok that’s

[hollow shell]

Prolly too specific for a suggestion, but I got dev privileges so I can talk about it with them directly

[deft yew]

true

[fossil finch]

My main problem with all the non linearity changes is that it confuses new players too much for the sake of things not many people actually do

[deft yew]

in that case fire away

we’re behind you, lo

[deft yew]

[fossil finch]

Though with the idea i feel it'd be good to have some sort of way to know what you're doing is dangerous if you chose to crack it
Ofc in some way that's not disruptive
Considering it's draedon it can just be some hologram or screen thingy that's close by and originally can be read even in phmode
In hmode it'll start glowing red and have a warning sign on it or smt

[wise raven]

i did that in my playthrough

[brittle pumice]

maybe have right clicking on it bring up a message saying smth like "Warning: Active Nano-Plague samples within." and in hm it says "Danger: Plague containment failing. Critical damage has been sustained. Cell integrity low" so they know whatever it is is dangerous and trying to break it would probably let the plague out#

because if you find it in ph mode you'll probably try to break it, see you can't, and right click on it to see what it does

if you break it or when golem dies it pops up a message like "Plague containment breach, evacuate immediately. This is not a drill. Evacuate immediately."

would help reinforce that the plague is Bad Shit™️ and not just another enemy thing

[exotic stag]

well i mean

plague is already bad shite

for jungle enemies

[violet dagger]

this would be really cool tbh

[exotic stag]

(ANOTHER GUY MENTIONING AURIC SLIME AAAA)

[deft yew]

This is being fixed next patch

Auric veins are bigger

[exotic stag]

that just looks like a blue slime infected by scuttlers jewel syndrome

it is literally a blue slime with scuttler jewel syndrome

[eternal escarp]

i still find it hard to believe people legit just run out of auric ore

i ususlly have spare

unkess you play ssmall worlds but at point like

[orchid turtle]

Multiplayer worlds may have issues a bunch.

[eternal escarp]

why are you playing small

MP is an issue in an of itself, auric ore is he least of the issue

and besides you only need the stations and stuff once, and the weapons dont require too much bars to my knowledge

[wise raven]

if you need more auric ore, bring a dragon egg to a new world

[orchid turtle]

To be fair it’s almost a necessity for progression. So if you run out of it for the armor then someone in the server is just out of luck.

[exotic stag]

each weapon costs like 12 auric bars which is like what?

120?

[eternal escarp]

thats a bad solution but regardless

[tacit wraith]

It’s a bit of a pain in multiplayer

[eternal escarp]

s

[orchid turtle]

It doesn’t have to be though

[eternal escarp]

and at that point youd prolly play large which tbh

defo has a decent chunk of ore all around

yeah theres absolutely enough for like, 3 people in medium lets be honest
its changed anyhow so the sugg is moot blike

yeah

[exotic stag]

also "less rare" doesnt really mean "give more"

cause it could refer to rarity titling. or something else

[small timber]

Next patch they will generate in larger vein so it is kind of fixed

Unless you are playing 10men multiplayer or something ridiculous

[exotic stag]

(calamity veterans lmao)

[eternal escarp]

the sugg definitely talks about scarcity

[exotic stag]

i know but for those people who just read titles like

[eternal escarp]

ah

[hollow shell]

Permafrost isn't great either

But he at least has weapons for multiple stages of the game

Amidias is only post-DS, never more

[fossil finch]

He already holds utility on being a guide but ooops! Nobody cares

(I do

[eternal escarp]

i remember sugg something similiar to this

[spare prawn]

i've seen people use amidas blessing in crazy challenges to cheese abyss

and, uh, never else

[deft yew]

i use it in the abyss a lot

[orchid turtle]

The issue with the guide thing is that the guide in vanilla is only useful for showing you crafting recipes. Amadias is cool and all, and can be helpful to first time players, but doesn’t offer nearly enough help to be a true guide.

[deft yew]

before i knew how good diving suit was, i put no gear on other than the buff and just nohitted the minibosses

[orchid turtle]

Maybe if he had something similar to help show progression like the guides crafting tab.

[spare prawn]

maybe give him more special item obtaining tips?

[orchid turtle]

I think a special tab that offers help specifically on what to do next instead of generic advice in help. That way boss list mods wouldn’t be a necessity for new players to beat every boss.

How many players would just skip ravager without a progression mod?

[obsidian cove]

with terraria, especially modded a lot of people are used to using a wiki/other mod or some other way to get information about progression, to the point where it’s hard to get people to use the things provided by the content mod itself

[fossil finch]

The guide in vanilla isn't only useful for showing recipes, he has extremely helpful guiding dialogue, the fact you already know everything about the game doesn't mean it's any less useful.. games should tell you things and shouldn't expect you to open the wiki every other second just to see basic stuff like progression or how to do x, guide or amidias are basic steps in that direction
Terraria community in general doesn't seem to mind this things at all, but a lot of mods don't tell you stuff and calamity could be a good example of a mod that does

[fossil finch]

Yes, but that habit is a result of not having systems in place so people can know things without consulting the wiki xd

[orchid turtle]

Yes but I feel like Calamity is close to becoming self sufficient (except for the lore). Now you can buy potions from npc’s, so the alchemist npc isn’t nearly as necessary for casual players.

[fossil finch]

(xd)

[orchid turtle]

Something like a progression option for the help would make another extra mod become not as necessary.

[fossil finch]

The point isn't making calamity players use no other mods anyway

It's just qol in general

[obsidian cove]

There’s probably people who don’t use any other QoL/the wiki and miss boss because of it

[orchid turtle]

That’s what I’m saying

[tawny garden]

I mean I mostly do jack shit

[tawny garden]

oh and I think the bot didn't gracefully handle when suggestions that were manually approved were ✅ed etc.

[exotic stag]

or the bot just had a sugg issue and freaked out and just spazmatismed

[tawny garden]

cause it updates the embed (color change)

and if there's no embed to update, ig it just fails

cause Amber did say at one point that manual suggs were causing problems

[exotic stag]

ah it probably tried to submit a sugg that was manual. then freaks out cause it sees it there.

[tawny garden]

nah not that

[violet dagger]

auric slime suggestion #464785859374

well its not specifically for an auric slime

aren't the ore veins being increased next update tho close to what it was before 1.5

also I see a problem with the suggestion to lower the star count in that the suggestion itself would need to get 270 stars

[hollow shell]

I see it with my eyes and my eyes are the most important eyes

[exotic stag]

(no)

[worthy lintel]

it already exists under the form of resentful and the current results are uhhhhh.... not great

mechanically speaking terraria likes to put the bosses in your face so reverse fall off would be a balancing nightmare

~~also terraria doesnt naturally have fall off now that i think about it ~~

[crude geode]

Resentful is a problem because the two bosses it's available for are SCal (you literally cannot be far away from her) and Exo Mechs (the only one it's really usable on is Thanatos, because Ares stays directly above you and Apollo and Artemis right to your side)

and boss rush but also like. boss rush is unbalanced lol

[worthy lintel]

true lel

[dapper coral]

(also i think resentful is also just not good rn in terms of when it works)

[worthy lintel]

but second point still stands that reverse fall off would just encourage players to run away instead of actually trying to dodge

i think current resentful is atleast a screen away for the effect to start being an upside

[spare prawn]

i was thinking like half a screen for the damage bonus to activate

haha

another ranger suggestion

[crude geode]

wow this seems like an immense balancing headache and bloat!

[exotic stag]

(bro just give them SLUGS for crying out loud)

(thats it. slugs.)

[spare prawn]

eh kinda

[crude geode]

you already have the variety of guns/bows/flamethrowers/rocket launchers, do we really need shotguns to be their own subclass

[exotic stag]

just give shotguns slugs like a sniper bullet

boom done

[crude geode]

helping with the somewhat lack of variety in ranged weapon options
are you fucking serious.

[exotic stag]

(lacking variety. literally ALL the shit in ranger)

[crude geode]

ranged is literally the second most common class in the entire game, with four different classes of weapons.

[worthy lintel]

make all shotguns fire a single bullet and multiply the damage by the number of pellets it used to fire beforehard

[exotic stag]

yeah thats just slugs

[exotic stag]

And the second most subclasses

[crude geode]

what has more subclasses?

[worthy lintel]

can't wait for boomstick to deal 200 damage pre boss

[exotic stag]

melee.

[crude geode]

ehhhhhh if you're counting flails, shortswords, etc. than that's more types of weapons than distinctive subclasses tbfh

[exotic stag]

wel they are technically

subclasses

[worthy lintel]

they're subclasses but they're just not very unique

[crude geode]

indeed

[worthy lintel]

what's the difference between a yoyo and a boomerang

👁️

[exotic stag]

one can be held out for longer

[worthy lintel]

besides melee is already its own hell pit

woops i mean fat mage

[crude geode]

Byeah I really dislike this suggestion ngl. It implies ranged has a lack of variety when it's probably the most varied class in the entire game, and giving it two different ammo types for shotguns feels like immense bloat ngl

[worthy lintel]

~~byea back on topic ~~ ranger is designed around ammo types so you would need to do the balancing work twice

[exotic stag]

the only thing i can say for shotguns is just give it the ability of slugs and thats it

[crude geode]

but why

[exotic stag]

because shotgun snipurrr

[worthy lintel]

slugs cool

:(

[spare prawn]

i agree at least on that

[crude geode]

[spare prawn]

slugs would be neat

[crude geode]

smh my head provi breaking the don'ts

[worthy lintel]

[crude geode]

byeah the reasoning of "ranger lacking variety" is just straight up false ngl

has more distinctive weapon types than most other classes, shroomite being the prime example

[ashen warren]

well dev tier ranger is

3 fast shooting guns and a bow

[crude geode]

dev tier is abysmal reasoning for suggs about class variety

[worthy lintel]

and only the bow is viable

can't wait for a dev tier shotty that will fire gauss nuke slugs

[ashen warren]

ik

i was just saying it has no variety

[crude geode]

ok

@spare prawn I think this sugg is technically valid, tho I will suggest removing the final point, as it's coming close to just adding bloat ngl by adding two types of ammunition instead of just 1, which will likely result in a massive balancing headache

and arguably adding two types of unique ammo across the game sounds pretty high effort, at least to me

[spare prawn]

i was thinking that its like

different materials are either a slug or a shell

with many more shells than slugs

[crude geode]

hm.

I'm gonna ask again the question of whether this qualifies as high effort don't or not, considering the effort of adding ammunition and making shotguns distinct from normal guns

[spare prawn]

thats entirely fair

[hollow shell]

I am unsure how much effort this would be

Hardest part would be making the shotguns utilize the new ammos and be unable to use standard ammo, all while still making them be considered guns in the eyes of Sniper Scope and Shroomite Armor

which may be impossible
because those two things determine weapon type by the ammo they consume

Unless we really go ham with how much vanilla code we want to edit and changing the definition of "gun"

[river glen]

gun now means u throw ur "gun" at the enemies

effectively a boomerang

[spare prawn]

that is

fair rover

[ripe owl]

Tale your bets

Will Bronze's sugg about reducing stars required earn stars required for sugg to at least be delivered

[kindred relic]

nice point

[half sage]

last star sugg made it so maybe

if so then it'll be 5 suggestions that have made it since the increase, with 2 of them being about lowering the star count

[violet dagger]

its already at 91

[small timber]

the problem with uzi is it is on-par (or at least not very much worse) than megashark, so if they decide to make it craftable it will need to be post-mech (which will defeat its purpose)

because pre-mech uzi is one of the better weapon you can get (besides obvious weapons like daedalus stormbow)

[brittle pumice]

yeah, i could probably make it clearer that i meant like post mechs or plantera

[small timber]

then it will be... useless?

I think just make gun dealer selling it is more appropriate, like sell it post 1-mech or plantera instead of craftable

[brittle pumice]

it is an ingredient in a decently important post ml ranger weapon and probably some others

[small timber]

therefore you can get it for crafting without rng grind

[brittle pumice]

yeah maybe like sold post 1 or 2 mechs

[small timber]

(ya you already address it), just that I don't feel it will be very fitting for craftable

at least hard to find when it should be craftable

[brittle pumice]

fair enough! my thoughts were basically "well if you can craft a p90 you can craft an uzi"

[small timber]

ya it make sense

[cobalt pewter]

just make the base drop chance of uzi higher and add another way to get it later for catching up recipes

[brittle pumice]

okay suggestion edited!

[golden narwhal]

Tbh I'd suggest directly mentioning it's an ingredient for a weapon later on, since that's basically the reason to make an rng weapon not rng

[brittle pumice]

added

[gentle fog]

I was wondering, are the mech souls really necessary in a lot of recipes?

the valkyrie ray for example, it already needs hallowed bars, which now requires all three mechs to be defeated anyway

recipes that require only one soul are fine, but requiring all three seems a little redundant imo

[safe oasis]

should be noted that hallowed bars requiring all three mechs to be defeated is an optional change

[crude geode]

Indeed

[gentle fog]

any change a mod makes is optional

[safe oasis]

that's not the same thing

there's a config in calamity specifically for disabling the early hardmode rework

[gentle fog]

yeah I get what you're saying lol

I just feel it should be balanced around default config since well, that's default

but either way the souls thing isn't really a big deal so I guess if a lot of people turn off the rework then it makes sense to keep the recipes as they are

[crude geode]

I think making valkyrie Ray not a mech soul recipe is actually a fine suggestion ngl, as it lends more credence to it being the excalibur equivalent for Mage

[gentle fog]

that was just an example of a recipe that uses souls but yes

[sleek wadi]

I've heard talks of the hardmode changes being no longer a config in the future once the rebalance is finished so it'd still work

I wouldn't include that bit in the reasoning though as that would make it a future content suggestion

[cobalt pewter]

right now early hm is still in the works

[pulsar marlin]

All we need to wait is for altar ore armors rework, some stuff that needs to be moved earlier and class specific helmets for altar ores

[patent scaffold]

this suggestion is interesting lol

"Jungle Dragon" is a cool title for Yharon bc i find it neat that it understates Yharon's importance to the lore

he isn't necessarily connected to any sort of Jungle theme, but then you look at his story with Yharim and then it clicks because of how tied the Jungle is to the tyrant

then again, i do find that other titles might be badass for him, something that might convey his position as Yharim's strongest aide more specifically i.e. "Tyrant's Dragon, Yharim" or something along those lines

[brittle pumice]

ah yes yharim, the tyrants dragon

although yeah i do get where they're coming from

[exotic stag]

(sounds like a mini-SIS

[brittle pumice]

yeah doesnt really feel like an actual helpful suggestion and more like "this thing would be cool"

[ruby plover]

it would literally just be a hinderance is all

[exotic stag]

and also useless

[ruby plover]

just simply max out crit chance

[exotic stag]

also its a donor item

[ruby plover]

that too

[exotic stag]

also its post moonlord for dawnlight anyway

[honest isle]

why would you tho

not critting already is punishment enough for not hitting the mark

[exotic stag]

(and even if you do have the item. ranger already gets over 100% crit chance

[hollow shell]

@subtle sapphire I'm sorry what?

[subtle sapphire]

Should I remove the suggestion ? 😔

[hollow shell]

It is a pretty weird suggestion

[subtle sapphire]

It is

[hollow shell]

A challenge centered around one donor item

[crude geode]

I know this community has a hard on for challenge items but this is like really really weird

[subtle sapphire]

True true

Not gonna argue that

[grim tusk]

Just go commit Ball and Chain Torture if you want to please your need for masochism

Or Iron heart

[spare prawn]

what does the Daawnlight do any way

the wiki doesn't seem to explain it well

[exotic stag]

basically no crits but you will guaranteed crit on bullseye targets

[fossil finch]

ranger players when they have to aim

[half sage]

and iirc any crit% you do have is converted to extra damage, since it'd be useless with the guaranteed crit

[exotic stag]

yes

[gray nebula]

for the. for the gambling people among WHO?

among WHAT?

🤨 WHAT

among?

[ashen warren]

[river glen]

sounds like a "add cuz cool"

suggestion

[hollow shell]

Yeah fair enough sugg, Small

Not sure why that Megashark-style gun has no ammo chance

[charred agate]

It was bothering me

[gray nebula]

10 MINUTES TO FIND???

euGHHhghhghghgh

wait how long does it ttake to find heart crystals / life fruits

[hollow shell]

Don't these dye plants show up with Spelunker

[river glen]

yeah

they do

[hollow shell]

so uh

[dapper coral]

they also show up on the map

[river glen]

i bulldozed half the world

for it

[hollow shell]

The fuck did you need those dyes for that badly

[river glen]

hp upgrades

[exotic stag]

the heart upgrades probably

[hollow shell]

Okay I see

[gray nebula]

skill issue

[hollow shell]

But I never had any trouble with these plants personally, I'd just see them while I'm out doing something else and I would pick them up 🤔

[gray nebula]

i bet you didndt pay attention and missed some

[river glen]

litterally couldnt find any

[exotic stag]

i just trash em cause i never make hp upgrades anyway. i end up with 4k at the endgame

[river glen]

wut

[river glen]

i never find them...

[hollow shell]

Okay

I suppose this sugg is fine then

BUT

You should include the HP upgrades as part of your reasoning

[river glen]

k

looks good now?

[hollow shell]

Yes much better 👍

Thanks

[river glen]

thx

[small timber]

I mean the alternative that had always been brough up is why are hp upgrades using dyes instead of herbs anyway

You have some really fitting one too (waterleaf for miracle fruit, fireweed for blood orange, the daybloom for elderberry and moonglow for dragonfruit)

[crude geode]

because herbs are already used for potions, something that boss rush type players care about

[grim tusk]

#suggestions-voting message less than 70 to go

[languid quartz]

[cobalt pewter]

incredible

[half sage]

[silver silo]

How would we feel about a sugg to make calclone named just calamitas clone and scal just calamitas

[hollow shell]

We've gotten similar suggestions before so ye you could

Particularly, people have suggested to make Calamitas's name change on refights to "Calamitas Clone"

because the player is no longer fooled

[cobalt pewter]

there's no longer a bamboozle anyways

so the argument for renaming Calclone is stronger

[silver silo]

The issue is people aren’t fooled even on fight one anymore as the clone is so significantly different looking to the real thing, even considering the clones new design

[hollow shell]

We can consider that when the new design gets implemented

[silver silo]

Even before it does who’s going to see a metal eyeball and think oh yeah this is definitely the human witch

[small timber]

the idea is that we did not know calamitas is calclone

because we don't know it is a "clone" at the time we fight it

[hollow shell]

I mean

iunno how much lore the player is expected to know

Like, that they would know Calamitas is a humanoid witch at all

[silver silo]

That’s true if it was a totally blind play through

[small timber]

the mod should not expect every player of the mod to be a veteran to the mod, so it is better to build on play playthrough experience instead

otherwise the new player experience will be, kinda lacking you know

[hollow shell]

I do recognize that it's strange to give the player a fake-out with the name "Calamitas" if they don't know why the real Calamitas was significant at all

Maybe the namesake similarity to the mod being called "Calamity" is enough to do it

[small timber]

ya when you see a boss named directly after the name of the mod, it usually is of significance

just like how you immediately knows soul of cinders is important in dark souls

[silver silo]

Well let’s not forget the issue of people confusing cal and scal

[small timber]

despite reading no lore about it

[silver silo]

The “real” calamitas is referred to as both supreme calamitas and just calamitas whereas the clone is only called a clone when it dies

[small timber]

new player can just treat them as two separate boss, for veteran player they are just refer to as calclone and scal anyway, if renaming is implemented like stated above, only on refight (or after beating it) will be more suitable

[silver silo]

Well would it be possible for the refight to be a clone AND have supreme removed from scal or is scal just what people are used to now

[small timber]

I think a better idea will be literally just hide Scal from bosschecklist until calclone is defeated

I think Shadows of Abaddon do it for their final boss

[silver silo]

Speaking of, it’s kind of amusing you can show victory shards to the guide and he’ll show you the lore drop for scal, yharim telling you to fight him included

Yharim be like you killed desert scourge? You’re ready to fight me

[small timber]

still need trophy no? ya you can see it but recipe browser will do the samething by typing "cal"

[crude geode]

Considering Cal Clone actually has a redesign concept to not look like a giant eyeball, it actually kinda makes sense for the fakeout

[small timber]

ya it is soon™

[obsidian cove]

Yes they have to use a mod call to add their boss

Strange place to ask this

[small timber]

I accidently press enter before finishing it

I will juts edit it

ya I think all mods edit their own boss checklist

it will not make sense whatsoever for boss checklist dev to just update on all mods in existence ever

to my knowledge it should be, mods edit what they want in their boss checklist

[obsidian cove]

Yeah mods provide basically all the stuff

[small timber]

ya seed of infection is rather early, not surprisingly you didnt notice it

[obsidian cove]

Yeah that’s a part of boss checklist, you can pass a function to hide the boss iirc

[ruby plover]

(Just building up the idea here before potentially posting) but would it be too big (or bad) an idea to move all vanilla+calamity expert mode drops to revengeance, since it’s the mods main difficulty and revengeance really doesn’t have any exclusive drops?

[small timber]

no

I think ^ sums up the opinion on the idea, I do not have problem with it, but it will cause massive outrage

there are people who barely beat expert mode, revengeance is death sentence to them

[ruby plover]

Yeah, and I don’t know how it would be able to be communicated especially to casual players

They might not see their expert drop and think it’s bugged or smthn

[small timber]

and it will completely break expert mode balance (namely that 99% of the bosses are balaned AROUND having expert items, like Shield of Cthulhu)

[ruby plover]

Oh that’s true

[cobalt pewter]

forget the outrage, that will make Cal a lot more broken in terms of crossmod compatibility

(the very base concept of compatibility, as in not making other mods lethally broken)

[ruby plover]

Mmmmdidn’t think about that

[small timber]

also tbh another reason is there is literally no reason to do it

moving expert exclusive item to revengeance exclusive is just a giant middle finger to expert player like "hey git gud"

[ruby plover]

Worst that can happen is that it doesn’t get enough votes I guess, I might post it when I get to my computer next, but I might not. The for argument isn’t really as strong as the against

There is just the alternative “make revengeance exclusive drops” but that’s more work

[small timber]

if they want to have revengeance exlusive item the best approach is still to add new ones, moving expert items just do not work (and also perceived as extremely lazy)

[ruby plover]

Yeah I might not post this one, the against is stronger than the for

[crude geode]

I just don’t see the for when there’s so many reasons not to move expert mode items

[humble rain]

Maybe add the legendary scar from fortnite? For ranger. Would be cool

[crude geode]

[keen zealot]

@small timber not sure how I feel about hiding SCal considering you don't have to fight clone to fight scal

I'd have to say probably not?

[ruby plover]

you do have to fight clone, you need ashes of calamity to summon Scal

[small timber]

ya with the new change it is mandatory to fight calclone before scal

both the altar and the consumable for altar requires ashes of calamity which only drop from calclone

[crude geode]

low%ers be like

[small timber]

low%ers: let's skip all the bosses to go yharon then scal, oh no turns out I need blossom pickaxe to mine auric and DoG for Cosmilite anvil, guess I just fight all bosses anyway

just without auric tesla armor (because polterghast is not mandatory)

you don't no? I dont see ruinous soul in cosmic worm crafting material

oh god it has luminite so you cant even skip moon lord

phantoplasm is normal post-ML dungeon drop

[sleek wadi]

Phantoplasm also dropped from some obscure post-ML cavern layer enemies so polter was never needed

Ya boi, PHANTOM DEBRIS, coming to low% rescue

[small timber]

@blissful prawn #suggestions-voting message a very recent suggestion that is suggesting the exact same idea is at voting

[blissful prawn]

lol

if already two people had the same idea it should be good, i guess

[small timber]

nah it is just that suggesting the samething in such a short time spent end up diluting the votes

and also a bit unnecessary (since it is basically posting the samething twice)

[grim tusk]

@blissful prawn add more reasoning for exo cart

Its too vague

[blissful prawn]

You're right, but it's the only thing I can explain

[crude geode]

This is just exo box

[grim tusk]

Also explain why do we need a better cart than the recently added Cart of Gods

[crude geode]

That too

[blissful prawn]

ok, an exo cart isn't necessary

Should I delete the suggestion?

or ignore it

[cobalt pewter]

probably delete it

[deft yew]

Which is already busted

[frozen hornet]

Just wait until calval makes exo cart

[silver silo]

hey, if I got permission from the person the item is for, I can make suggestions about dev/donor items yeah

[exotic stag]

yeah

(opcional)

[grim tusk]

@trail fiber invasión -> invasion
autocorrect am I right?

also difficulty is subjective

and provide gameplay reasoning

[ashen warren]

yes, that's right

[exotic stag]

(also it feels like half the sugg is referencing optional bosses rather then pirate invasion)

[trail fiber]

yes, autocorrector

[grim tusk]

(true)

[grim tusk]

again add more reasoning about pirate invasion, most of your reasoning is (likely outdated) Ana and Levi lore

[gray nebula]

why would we even upgrade it

😴

[exotic stag]

"Because iban. you are a pirate"

[fallow hedge]

what could you add to the Pirate Invasion anyway

Discounter Card

[exotic stag]

(buffy i think thats been suggested b4)

[silver silo]

no problem with that though

technically encouraged if its been enough time right

[exotic stag]

yes

[grim tusk]

thiefs dime + greedy ring

[exotic stag]

just give it more money

literally make them a money farm

[trail fiber]

also i think it's usseles, the drops of the invasion era weak in comparision of other items

[eternal escarp]

Not only does it have sense with the lore
what lore sense?

[exotic stag]

well yes

because they are

literally

most of the time the first thing you'll get in hardmode

[eternal escarp]

because both of them probably would kill most of the pirates on the ocean
if you mean this then its not really lore wise and more so just a speculation, unless im not updated on some lore

[eternal escarp]

also in this case you could just suggest to expand on the invasion

[fallow hedge]

more powerful Thief's Dime, the Thief's Quarter

[eternal escarp]

Calamity already adds 2 weapons to it

[exotic stag]

i think he means like

[eternal escarp]

maybe even 3 i dont remember

[exotic stag]

how actual sirens act

by luring in people

[eternal escarp]

well thats a connection

[exotic stag]

upgrade ot the thiefs quarter: thiefs dollah bills

kekw

[eternal escarp]

and is Anahita even a siren anymore i dont remember

[exotic stag]

probably?

(anyway i can think of a few changes to add to pirate invasion)

[small timber]

the suggestion reason do not link to the suggestion itself

[exotic stag]

(that being just buffing some items and thats it)

[small timber]

what does "optional boss" have to do with upgrading pirate invasion?

[trail fiber]

well, i think thats enough

[eternal escarp]

regardless suggestion to buff an event just because l&a could vaguely connect doesnt really make much sense

[exotic stag]

ima explain what i actually meant by that

i was going to say give some buffs to discount card and stuff to make them passively produce money over time

[eternal escarp]

itd be a better and more interesting sugg to straight up just expand on the invasion a bit by adding more to it at the same time it exists in

[small timber]

leviathan and anahita are optional bosses, but the suggestion reason should be establishing why upgrading pirate invasion is a good idea rather than how upgrading pirate invasion somehow gives value to fighting leviathan and anahita

[exotic stag]

since pirates are usually gold hungry people. having a card that produces money over time or something would be interesting

because

money

pirates like money

[eternal escarp]

discount card is that but in a different way.

[exotic stag]

it lowers prices.

[eternal escarp]

and or/ just use the tax collector (lol!)

[trail fiber]

Yeah I couldn't have said it better

[eternal escarp]

byeah

rather then just randomly connecting it into a boss simply because

[exotic stag]

yeah but waste of a house

[eternal escarp]

okay, waste of an item then

also tbf that wouldbe like

counter intuitive

[exotic stag]

okay then how about just making a buff to the discount card that increases tax collectors money gain

[eternal escarp]

to the entire "no more gold farming"

[exotic stag]

well

it atleast makes sense if you think about it. pirates like golden and money things. so why not add more money related things to their event

[eternal escarp]

rework proporse pistol when iirc

anyhow

[eternal escarp]

trolling tbh

i dont see a real reason to lock an upgraded version of the event behind l&a when you could just expand the event straight up

besides upgraded events are doodoo

[cobalt pewter]

the pirate sugg seems a bit reaching

particularly on when it upgrades

[exotic stag]

literally the only thing i can say that could go with pirates is just "make it more money because pirates like money and golden things" which wont work in a sugg

because half of the pirate items are genuinely just golden versions

[trail fiber]

well, i'm happy with any change, it would be great that the pirate invasion wasn't just for money

[eternal escarp]

well when (and if) the sugg reaches dev

they would take the idea as is

and less of a "expand pirate invasion" as a whole

[exotic stag]

because your title and your reasoning are oppoiste

opposites

in the body you reference optional bosses. in the title you reference pirates

[trail fiber]

yes, i mean, the main reason it's add more value to the fight and make the pirate invasion not just for money.

[exotic stag]

well

no

your body just says "more reason for optional" and your title is entirely different

[trail fiber]

srry, my bad

[exotic stag]

you need to have a reasoning fully on why ana and levi could buff pirate invasion. and why it would matter

[small timber]

you need to first establish a reason why upgraded pirate invasion is something you do want in the game, before you connect it to leviathan and anahita

[exotic stag]

and why it would matter

[small timber]

basically add more reason why upgraded pirate invasion need to exist in the game before saying that it adds values to fighting anahita and leviathan, otherwise currently it has no values (like fight anahita so your pirate invasion have buffed stats and more annoying to kill?)

[trail fiber]

so, the main problem is the syntax of my suggestión and the way that i said it?

[exotic stag]

yes the reasoning

[small timber]

not necessary the way you say it, your suggestion currently lacks reasoning why we need upgraded pirate invasion

the anahita/leviathan part can stay, just add more reason why we need pirate invasion

[trail fiber]

ok ok, i can erase that message and re-write it?

[exotic stag]

(and add reasoning why levi and ana should be there)

[exotic stag]

edit it yes.

[small timber]

(and also polterghast is a poor example of optional boss when its drops is literally needed for auric tesla armor, the final armor for the final bosses; old duke is a better example in that its weapon help significantly against dog)

[exotic stag]

(also polter is needed for most things)

(people just do polter later when they are stronger)

(because dungeon)

[cobalt pewter]

also it holds adren upgrade

[spare prawn]

Rip deadtop, suggestion massacred by spanish autocorrect

[spare prawn]

İ mean most other events get some kind of upgrade, its not too crazy to give the pirate invasion an upgrade in late hm.

[small timber]

the question is why, people don't do upgraded moons and solar eclipse just for fun, they do it for energies and dark sun fragment

ya that reason seems doable

because discount cards (and pirate drops) have absurd drop chance, even from pirate captains and the ship

[trail fiber]

well, i already corrected the suggestion, i hope it's right now

[exotic stag]

you could remove the end bit about l&a killing pirates

[small timber]

and post-plantera is suitable for a long-term upgrade like this (discount cards)

[exotic stag]

since that just seems like "oh ANDDDDD" and doesnt fit too well)

[spare prawn]

İ was thinking give the pirate invasion, like, a "gilded dubloon" item that can be used to craft various items, similar to the solar veil

[small timber]

I think the part about killing pirate can stay, otherwise it is hard to explain how anahita is connected to upgrading pirate invasion

[gray nebula]

upgraded events boring

zzs

New content is more interesting

zzz

[small timber]

space dog invasion when

[fossil finch]

Never

[spare prawn]

İmagine not supprting color out of space eldeich abominations invasion

[fossil finch]

Just make killing levi unlock her stomach as a place you can visit idk

[small timber]

tbh anahita and leviathan (if it is new content) can be directed to enhanced ocean biome

under ocean city (the ruined city that amidias came from)

[fossil finch]

That'd be on the desert doe

Lo

[spare prawn]

Thats the desert bro

[exotic stag]

yeah thats the sunken sea part

[small timber]

lore is subjected to changes

because tbh the current ocean is simply boring compare to the otherside of literally abyss

[fossil finch]

Don't care
And probably that one wont

So like

Lol