suggestions-discussion

[gray nebula]

watit do we,,

[fossil finch]

Before you could just outspeed every br boss

[gray nebula]

i thought the plan was perhaps give it the guillotine treatement

[fossil finch]

Aside that, yeah ig

[tribal cedar]

Scal is just a malice nohit in BR, her and yharon

[fossil finch]

ok?

[hollow shell]

Lemme look back in dev, I know it got brought up recently

[small timber]

didnt scal damage get toned down in BR? unless you active malice and BR

[grim tusk]

Alr whats your loadout, if its “ooga booga damage” then thats your problem

[fossil finch]

Storm don't be like this

[crude geode]

^

[fossil finch]

Anyway, xp, malice does nothing when br is happening

[cobalt pewter]

blads of enmity is sus iirc

[tribal cedar]

Well the only viable weapons are literally the ooga boogas like scarlet devil and eternity

[cobalt pewter]

(you don't actually get it the same point as the other 3)

[exotic stag]

(no dev weapons are not the only viable ones)

[grim tusk]

Fine but im seriously tired of people complaining that they cannot beat boss and you can see that their accs loadout just minmaxes for one stat which is a horrible idea on Cal

[exotic stag]

^

[tribal cedar]

You can use other endgame weapons but they just don’t compete with those, especially with infinite stealth strikes

[exotic stag]

inf-

bruh

[grim tusk]

I see a lot of that in #help-advice-read-pins #calamity-mod-talk and r/calamitymod

[small timber]

what is your accessory?

[exotic stag]

you have: celestus. final dawn. literally the reaper from OD

[silver silo]

''warding is bad, go full menacing or quick and dont have defensive accessories''

[small timber]

weapon is completely debatable unless you test every single weapon in the game, so what is the accessory you use?

[grim tusk]

Well inf stealth strikes ofc is an exploit and is busted

[hollow shell]

Okay nevermind there was complaints about its existence but no plans to change it

[crude geode]

can we not turn into #help-advice-read-pins @grim tusk

[tribal cedar]

Flex weapons with demonshade is the best so yes, considering you can’t just use one weapon the entire time

[small timber]

using infinite stealth strike and complain about other weapons not viable is just

[tribal cedar]

Apparently it’s allowed when doing a BR nohit for Hollow

[exotic stag]

what.

[crude geode]

Slapping malice mode onto bosses was really just done as a last minute thing from what I can see

[grim tusk]

We’re talking about a suggestion made which is just complaining about not being able to use gear, not the bosses being unfair in some way

[exotic stag]

literally guy made a sugg about nerfing BR and then using the weird loadouts that just dont work

(or y'know saying that "dev weapon + demonshade best >:< fite me")

(which dev weapons arent the best items depending on the situation)

[small timber]

the only one I will debate is scal because she have too many invincible phase in BR (and similar damage to literally fighting the boss directly), other bosses I never have any problem with (with Malice BR AI)

[grim tusk]

Bronze somewhat allowed it due to BR’s current state, but Joey does not like it, havent heard from the other 2 judges, also using arguments of noshits on weapon balance is

[exotic stag]

tbh yeah

[royal tapir]

Why use infinite stealth when you could use the more based Contagion

[tribal cedar]

I’m not talking about loadouts, BR in general with malice AI is just unbalanced even if you can melt a majority of bosses with one shot loadouts; Scal turns into a malice nohit which bricks about 99% of the amount of players who even manage to get that far

[gray nebula]

why use infinite stealh glitches when you can use the basic infinite stealth from andro

[tribal cedar]

You can use a ton of different weapons, I’m more referencing the BR “meta” setups, not that only one is viable

[grim tusk]

Why use inf stealth when you can learn boss ai and have the nohit feel fair and rewarding

[exotic stag]

heres what should be done: Bring into account BALANCED GAMEPLAY. that means no glitches. no noshits. and no challenge runs like spear only. pure one class (or allclass armors) while taking into account items from 1-2 tiers below (i.e for post-game that being post-scal take into account exo's and yharon drops)

[exotic stag]

"bricks about 99% of people who get into the 95% range. yes good"

even so. scals boss design is meant for nohits really. its quite simple to nohit most of the BR's infact.

not BR's i mean BH's

[grim tusk]

Scal meant for nohits?

What

[exotic stag]

the BH's

[grim tusk]

W h a t

[crude geode]

ah yes my favorite fair no-hit.

screen being filled with red projectiles while being covered with giant red moons that cover said red projectiles

[silver silo]

🌚

[gray nebula]

stop nohitting imo

.

[exotic stag]

(i didnt mean the moons i meant the non-moons cause moons unfunny)

[silver silo]

.

[crude geode]

true iban

[tribal cedar]

If Scal is meant for nohitting, which mind you will take a week+ in order to master and get lucky enough to beat her with good rod placements and bullet luck, a ton of people would get bored of it and not even try it considering she’s a massive roadblock for a ton of players in BR

[crude geode]

no-hitters are indeed kinda cringe

[grim tusk]

I agree with this statement

[exotic stag]

massive roadblock? scal is like

literally the second to last boss in BR

[gray nebula]

one good amont of insight i gained from trying the cave story true ending is that nohitting sucks super hard and its fun to sometime take damage

[silver silo]

''taking damage is fun'' - masochists

[tribal cedar]

Third. Yharon is after her who is slightly less powerful, and then DoG who is kind of trivial if you can just dodge charges

[cobalt pewter]

i hate people exposing the inf stealth strike bug, now literally everyone in reddit thinks it's a legit and intended strat

🙄

[gray nebula]

well taking damage isnt fun but not having to worry about dodging everything and keeping i nthe flow is great

[small timber]

so what you mean is.... BR Scal is too hard and we should nerf it? Instead of change every single boss AI in BR?

[exotic stag]

yes

[crude geode]

ok and redditors' opinions matter...why?

[grim tusk]

Yea i was planning to save it til it got patched, but then toasty and gitgud :/

[silver silo]

yeah but then you also have a mechanic thats designed to reward not getting hit

[small timber]

so why not make the suggestion literally "Nerf BR Scal"?

[grim tusk]

At least thank fuck that that ONE bug never got to public eyes, unsure if it was patched or not

[cobalt pewter]

they don't matter by themselves, but they spread to new players who found reddit first before the discord

[tribal cedar]

^ nohitting is just a challenge, I tried going for hollow with almost 600+ attempts and having beat a majority of post ML bosses on malice-death, it’s time consuming so I just play normal but death to keep it engaging

[crude geode]

because forcing malice mode changes is kinda just a blatant last second band-aid fix to say "hey boss rush is better now!"

[cobalt pewter]

and misinformation is generally really bad, no matter the source

[gray nebula]

Malice Moment

[cobalt pewter]

and it's grinding my gears

[exotic stag]

(i mean i kinda like bossrush malice ai. its meant to be a boss rush. meaning hard)

[silver silo]

hot take, I think if a boss can't theoretically be nohit then that boss has a flaw

[crude geode]

if I wanted to do a malice mode boss rush, I would activate boss rush and malice mode.

[tribal cedar]

They’re still community feedback on things that should be addressed, even if it gets wide recognition and is abused for the time before being fixed

[exotic stag]

(its like mario odysseys post-game boss fights.)

[crude geode]

(i was meme-ing on the fact that redditors are extremely cringe)

[exotic stag]

^

[crude geode]

you can make it hard without forcing an alternative "re-fight" weirdly thought out shit on the player.

such as

unique ai

[gray nebula]

plea,,s,e,, ,noo,,

[tribal cedar]

Death as default and then being able to change to malice

[gray nebula]

MORE AI VARIANTS

[exotic stag]

tbh most endgame bossrushes are literally just current boss rush

[tribal cedar]

Unique AI would just be hell for devs

[silver silo]

boss rush exclusive ai

have fun

[grim tusk]

Indie game moment

[tribal cedar]

Devs rn

[small timber]

most BR bosses are literally so trivial even with Malice AIs except those lock you down of movement, most notably scal (and maybe yharon)

[crude geode]

Death, Rev, Expert, Malice, AND Boss Rush

[small timber]

literally every other boss cannot touch you (when BoC finally get fixed)

[exotic stag]

mario odyssey endgame:

literally the fights have the same boss AI they just change like one minor detail

(i.e being in the clouds?)

[tribal cedar]

He is (telefragging is better), before it was just charge it and use exo chair to move around it

[crude geode]

what a fucking hot take

[grim tusk]

Exo chair didnt exist on 1.4.5.7

[crude geode]

like the community will roast you alive lol

[grim tusk]

Also yes

[tribal cedar]

I’m talking about 1.5 BR right now

[exotic stag]

myes 1.4.5 exo chair dodging the invisible exos

[small timber]

name 1 boss in BR, that is not scal, BoC (which will be fixed) and yharon, that is too hard with Malice AI right now?

[crude geode]

honestly respect the opinion even though it's straight unfiltered dog shit
Personally I think that forcing malice mode changes is just really weird and goes against the whole fucking modular difficulty of calamity.

[exotic stag]

(watch someone say aureus cause: "its too tanky :<"

[silver silo]

if only boss rush could force you to just...refight bosses in a row using on tier gear again

[crude geode]

If you're going to make an event like boss rush with 3 different music tracks and visuals, you should probably have more effort than slaps alternative difficulty/refight/rage mode/whatever malice is at this fucking point on it's boss rush ai

[small timber]

I will not argue whether Malice is a "good mode", the argument now is whether BR bosses are "too hard with current Malice AI"

[grim tusk]

Imma go do BR right this fucking instant

[tribal cedar]

Duke, moon lord, calclone, profaned guardians (somewhat), EoW (somewhat), providence, old duke

[small timber]

because the only one I will agree on is Scal because it is literally just the full version of Scal battle (the end game boss) in BR

[crude geode]

I'm also going to bring up the dreaded fact that difficulty is subjective because it is. That's why we have modular difficulties and the ability to not have malice mode on for every single playthrough.

[small timber]

you have drew wings for duke that he will miss most of the charges (and you can still dash), his tornado do not matter whatsoever
moon lord is unbelievably weak in BR right now
calclone do not really deal damage unless you go "hah no-hit big damage setup"
profaned guardians drop dead
EoW is hard what?
providence is... literally just providence with not much else
old duke is same as duke

[exotic stag]

(i swear i saw someone say BR aureus was hard cause it was tanky)

[tribal cedar]

That’s the point of having multiple different difficulties in calamity for the first place, BR shouldn’t be deadlocked to people who can commit x amount of hours to actually complete the thing, and god forbid nohitting it

[exotic stag]

(okay but again ima bring this up: most games use the same old original boss AI from when you first do them in a rematch mode. they just change up minor details that dont help in the first place)

[crude geode]

Forcing malice mode on the player removes a lot of the modular difficulty and completely hard gates that experience to newer players, which is something that can be done if you want to break the rules the rest of the mod's fights and events sets.

(I'd focus your suggestion more on the fact that boss rush forcing malice ai removes the point of modular difficulties by giving it the hardest ai possible, and as such just gatekeeps players who don't want to commit tons of runs to the thing, or just aren't good).

[tribal cedar]

I respect calamity for not going that route, even though it did in older versions where BR was just simple since everything was slow and missed constantly

PreHM bosses making difficulty jumps for BR is good, I’m just advocating for the difficulty itself to be changeable and not forced to malice by default

[crude geode]

@hollow shell I assume that it was not the intended solution, but was boss rush intended to be malice ai or was it going to be given it's own ai.

[tribal cedar]

Damage and health should remain the same, since that’s the core of the boss difficulties as well as speed that makes that jump a challenge

[small timber]

I will agree that Malice is definitely not the solution to what is now considered the "highest difficulty", and I (and still) take my stand that Malice need change, but BR is too difficult outside of scal that it warrant all bosses to be changed? I don't think so

[crude geode]

the difficulty isn't (realistically) the entire problem

[small timber]

^

[tribal cedar]

Perhaps that could only reflect to bosses like Scal where massive jumps in difficulty are better seen than say bosses like EoW or DoG

Difficulty is still subjective, it’s more so the difficulty LOCK

[small timber]

Scal I will agree, because it is literally the full Scal battle in the middle of BR while most other bosses are a "shorter or weaker version (except numbers)" of their original battle

[crude geode]

^^
what's the fucking point of having rev/death/malice boss rush if they're all gonna be the same

[tribal cedar]

That’s what I wanted to discuss

[crude geode]

what's the point of the modular difficulties if you can't tune them to your liking

[tribal cedar]

BR is still supposed to be a challenge (it’s post AEW after all)

[small timber]

then just change your suggestion to "Nerf BR Scal" or something similar, instead of a board-wide nerf

[tribal cedar]

But it also shouldn’t be made easy

[small timber]

because most of the BR bosses are not nearly hard enough that they need a nerf

[grim tusk]

died Scal 20%, shes manegable

i just made a really dumb mistake on the fight

but damn do Scarlet and Celestus make it a meltfest even without that much offensive investment

i could have oneshotted Scal if I doubled ripper her

@primal python literally a dont

also no formatting at all

[primal python]

what

ok

why

[safe oasis]

they don’t want to

[small timber]

one of the main reason is probably vanilla is moving them to ranger

so it will clash completely if they make the change

[primal python]

oh yeah

I forgot about that

they could just have a config for that

[safe oasis]

that’s not a config worthy change tbh

[primal python]

ok

[grim tusk]

more like Rogue is its own unique thing and suggs for it should be made to distance it from throwing

read the damn suggs doc

[primal python]

well you dont got to be a dick about it

[grim tusk]

antibutcher still exists :/

[hollow shell]

Sorry, I do not know.

[crude geode]

Peculiar

[tribal cedar]

Unique BR ai is pretty much no bueno

[grim tusk]

BR feels so easy to me outside of the final 3

[small timber]

ya I only had problem with scal (and I sucked at scal), every other bosses are either melted or massively outspeed

[lucid marsh]

Hellkite is garbage

Garbage weapons with no upsides should be buffed or removed

[small timber]

HM rebalance is coming (or maybe in progress), I don't think suggestion of rebalancing pre-HM and HM weapons is necessary

because they are presumably, doing it

[cobalt pewter]

Fab doesn't prefer removing content from what i understood

at the very least the topic (Hellkite) will just be buffed when they get to it

[keen zealot]

...how did #suggestions-voting message get through?

[distant gyro]

idk

it got a bit too lenient i think

[cobalt pewter]

there's been a lot less sugg QA ig

[earnest raptor]

which is a mistake tbh

who will die if spore knife or celestial claymore will disappear?

also

isn't balance suggs banned?

or very strongly discouraged because they require a scientific paper for reasoning?

[safe oasis]

i thought it was discouraged because you could just ping a tester

[cobalt pewter]

I think it's preferred to throw balance matters to testers rather than sugging it yea

[earnest raptor]

is there a list of them?

[cobalt pewter]

don't think so

usually you can just go to xyk or piky most of the time

[eternal escarp]

spore knife
this guys only exists for Night Stabber tbh

[cobalt pewter]

i like how no one mentioned Shinobi Blade

[earnest raptor]

so what channel is most appropriate for tester pings?

[cobalt pewter]

it's so one off and bland

[cobalt pewter]

literally just. here

[earnest raptor]

ok

[cobalt pewter]

it's still suggestions anyways

[earnest raptor]

@pastel crow ok, I hope you have a good day, do you have any info why post-Provi mage is so wacky?

purge guzzler seems to be stronger than anything until cosmilite tier or something

and many weapons seems to be only useful on the crowds

[cobalt pewter]

oh yea Purge Guzzler is pretty good last time I used it on Signus nohit ig, not sure how bad is it compared to the rest on that tier

[earnest raptor]

it's not pretty good

it's viable on FUCKING THANATOS according to some messages from #help-advice-read-pins

exo mechs are last bosses

[eternal escarp]

well viable != good killtime, byeah

[pastel crow]

Chances are that many of these issues arise from the fact that early post ML balancing was done before a few major changes. (stuff like the piecing formula and point blank shots for ranger) Therefore some weapons are not completely balanced

[eternal escarp]

i.e you could use something like, Telluric Glare up to Yharon, and it could work fine, but itd likely still not be a good option even if it could be viable

[earnest raptor]

so the reason guzzler is so good is because it pierces 3 times and does 3x more damage than weapons that pierce one time?

something like that?

[small timber]

I done my testing, it is by no means perfect but I think it prove the point reasonably enough

[ruby plover]

this is especially evident with true melee

[small timber]

ya, I avoided true melee because they will completely outperform on short burst

and rogue on that regard (especially that many stealth strike are definitely not balanced whatsoever)

[ruby plover]

stealth adren meteor fist gets rid of 50% of desert scourges health

like just. one hit

[ruby plover]

[cobalt pewter]

incredible

[half sage]

[cobalt pewter]

time to get rid of adren and keep only rage

i hate no*hitters being pampered by the mod grrr

😠

[earnest raptor]

so is no-hitting rewarded by community or not?

[gray nebula]

rewarded by the community in whta way

[silver silo]

rewarded with epic gamer loot!!11

[cobalt pewter]

@wheat jetty doesn't feel like your sugg has any proper reasoning written down. it is implied of sorts, but you're probably better off explaining why should Meld get tools instead of asking back in the sugg

[cobalt pewter]

the ✨ roles ✨ perhaps

[gray nebula]

true

but then it's not a question?

[cobalt pewter]

actually true

[silver silo]

what's a question?

[cobalt pewter]

a sentence worded or expressed so as to elicit information.

[silver silo]

[frozen hornet]

GS dashing upwards doesn't seem to work when you're flying/pressing space

oh wait wrong server

but still why does it

[silver silo]

is the sand tortoise sprite different to the giant tortoise other than being bigger and differently colored

what purpose does the sand tortoise serve

[eternal escarp]

another source for the turtle shells i think?

thats pretty much it

[silver silo]

giant tortoises already drop them plus an accessory that can be crafted into them

why does the desert need one

whos going to go into the desert to make turtle armor 🤨

[eternal escarp]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[silver silo]

and gnashers drop them too

[deft yew]

do not get me started on the amount of calamity enemies that could be removed

[jagged spade]

you get roles which are simply pixels displayed on your monitor, basically dodge pixels = receive pixels

simple enough

[grim tusk]

Well meteor fist is balanced around evil bosses so thats to be expected lmao

Too bad it sucks at its intended tier

Heck thats why meteor shit was removed from Pre-boss in class setups
Fucking overkill

[cobalt pewter]

I always feel like there should be a smoother natural requirements for goblin army spawn

Goblin Battle Standard shouldn't have any use restrictions and natural spawns happen after EoC kill instead of breaking 1 shadow orb / crimson heart

[fossil finch]

You have good points

However, boss lock

[cobalt pewter]

while I want to propose a better lock, the current shadow orb / crimson heart requirement makes the event feel a bit weird

i think originally they wanted the players to naturally go to goblin army after beating EoC and while they're trying to spawn eow / boc through natural objects

but bomb explodes ebonstone and crimstone

and if you'd want to argue with purification powder, Dryad spawns after beating a boss, and while there's King Slime, from what I understood the game's very first boss was EoC

[half sage]

king slime doesn't spawn dryad

[cobalt pewter]

....wtf

[half sage]

it has to be EOC, evils, or skeletron

[cobalt pewter]

...incredible, my point about purification powder is even better

so yea

bombs basically threw this limitation altogether

because they can smack thru ebon and crim stones

[grim tusk]

yea valediction fucking sucks now (likely piercing formula)

[grim tusk]

Malice BR in in fact slightly harder than Death BR
Malice took me 3 tries, Death only 1
(also please nerf scarlet so that you can use it with adren and not instantly hit antibutcher even on balanced loadouts)

Malice's higher dmg is noticeable on BR

[cobalt pewter]

I guess my TL;DR (and probably gonna be used to sugg this?) is that Battle Standard shouldn't need the same requirements as natural Goblin Army to be used, and the natural requirements for Goblin Army should be adjusted with the fact that bombs basically breaks through what's supposed to be a post-EoC event in pre boss

I am honestly half tempted to sugg bombs and dynamites to explode blocks that can be mined with the best pickaxe you have in your inventory, but idk

[fossil finch]

I mean

Can you really affirm it's supposed to be post eye

And that you weren't ever intended to be able to use bombs like that

[cobalt pewter]

it should be confirmed i guess yea

bombs could explode ebonstone in 1.1

though dynamites could explode ebonstone on release

but dynamites aren't as common to go by, and on release it had significantly higher price to purchase

[eternal escarp]

hopefully the suggestion has a good standing point, and has no funny typos

[cobalt pewter]

no typing issues as far as my eyes can see

[eternal escarp]

gaming

[sleek turret]

good suggestion

[lavish cloak]

huge L considering content bloat

but this is not new news tbh

[exotic stag]

content bloat saves ram space meaning more qol :)

[obsidian cove]

How does content bloat save ram space?

[exotic stag]

i meant removing it

[exotic stag]

insert ❗

[crude geode]

making a dedicatee item part of a combined item is rarely gonna happen, especially fucking halibut cannon

[exotic stag]

(also archerfish?)

[crude geode]

please actually bring up the problems with a suggestion instead of saying mods exclaim this with no fucking reason.

[cunning patio]

?

[crude geode]

halibut cannon is dedicated to a deceased youtuber. making it a part of a random ass combined weapon for little reasoning is disrespectful, ngl.

[dawn adder]

tru! other options are out there

[cunning patio]

oh; yeah, that makes sense. it wasn't my intention to be rude, i just saw it and went for it; so what options are there?

[exotic stag]

(also seadragon is already like endgame.. so i dont see why it would need an upgrade there)

[cunning patio]

it already has one beyond that, what's another?

[exotic stag]

because thats dev tier

[crude geode]

yep

[cunning patio]

ah yeah....

[obsidian cove]

Most recent suggestion is high effort right

[crude geode]

dev/dedicatee tier weapon suggs need permission from the original

[exotic stag]

the plague biome? yeah i think

and i mean

"a plague has befallen the jungle"

[crude geode]

@hollow shell New biome sugg, kill

[cunning patio]

it'd be interesting, i think

[exotic stag]

also how are you going to upgrade dragoon drizzlefish?

[exotic stag]

the plague biome?

not really

[crude geode]

realistically plague would just be a corrupting biome but doing that is mega cringe

[exotic stag]

it'd just be another one of them "haha we spread"

[cunning patio]

anyway, i'm not suggesting the use of the voiddragon itself, but the one before it.

i suppose...

[exotic stag]

yes seadragon is still like meh option

drizzlefish is a no because what are you going to do with an actual fish rather then modified fishes

[half sage]

plague biome wouldn't really make sense, the plague is a disease that infects the organisms in the biome, why would it transform the jungle into a different biome

and yea spreading biome cringe, there's a reason astral doesn't spread

[crude geode]

not every single weapon needs a upgrade, calamity already has "material" slapped onto 90% of it's weapons

[half sage]

[cunning patio]

why not??

[exotic stag]

why not have 90% of things? because thats bloat..

and that can cause a lot of issues

[crude geode]

bloat and kinda just removes the novelty of certain weapons by having you use them 20 times over

[cunning patio]

but that kills the point.

[exotic stag]

how..?

[cunning patio]

fish. gun.

[exotic stag]

and now thats just no.

[cunning patio]

as in ALL. the fish.

[exotic stag]

you dont want to have 70 of the same item but upgraded a tiny bit

[gray nebula]

omw to

.

[exotic stag]

half of the fish items there dont make sense in a gun.

[cunning patio]

have you checked the wiki?

[exotic stag]

yes

how are you going to use the dragoon drizzlefish in a gun..

[gray nebula]

why are people arguing about this seriously lo

[cunning patio]

then you know whyi picked most of these, the ones i'm not sure about were marked as debatable.

the drizzle fish already IS a gun!

[exotic stag]

this is dragoon drizzlefish

its a flamethrower.

[cunning patio]

as i said. it already is.

[exotic stag]

(yes it is already in the "guns" list as a flamethrower. but how are you going to use it as a part of the weapon)

[cunning patio]

the barracuda, leviatitan an parrotfish are all in other catagories, so i'm by no means pickie here.

[exotic stag]

leviatitan: related to the boss in question: leviathan, Parrotfish: similar to drizzlefish as it is literally just a fish. and barracuda is literally just an upgrade to piranha gun which in itself is a unique weapon

[cunning patio]

and NOW i find the summons; blimey, i got my work cut out for me.....

[exotic stag]

what.

[spare prawn]

See

[gray nebula]

you should stop arguing... NOW!

[spare prawn]

i realize this

[gray nebula]

it's not getting added anyways

[spare prawn]

on one hand, it would be thematic and cool amd make sense

[exotic stag]

(when rover arrives both are just gonna get exclammed i think.)

[spare prawn]

on the other hand, its just like, a 4th courrputing biome you have to track

[gray nebula]

It is beyond pointless to argue about the specifics of what would be a fitting ingredient in a funny fishe gun

[spare prawn]

which isn't exactly interesting or new

[half sage]

yea this conversation is getting nowhere, and it doesn't matter cuz dedicated item and SIS don'ts

[gray nebula]

also yea

[cunning patio]

thank you eris.

[gray nebula]

spreading biomes (zzz

[exotic stag]

biomes in question

[spare prawn]

the upside is that it only effects the jungle and you could just let it run amok with minimal losses

now

i just had a slightly better idea

[gray nebula]

I have some ideas to integrate plague better into the mod but it's not rly a biome and Its just vague ideas

[spare prawn]

what if the plauge befalling the jungle actually like, changed the grass color and shit instead of just adding new enemies

[exotic stag]

uhh

because it infects living organisms.

[gray nebula]

zed

[spare prawn]

theres no spreading biome the jungle is just auto fuked

maybe a mist effect like in the astral infection as well

[exotic stag]

you could change your sugg into being: "Do something more with the plague effects"

[grim tusk]

Please fucking exclam #suggestions-posting message

[spare prawn]

i added an addendum

see

i see the pinaccle of a biome done well in this mod to be the abyss

[grim tusk]

@spare prawn the addendum goes on the same message as the og sugg

[gray nebula]

dont make addendums like t

[grim tusk]

Just edit it

[gray nebula]

yeah,

[spare prawn]

its got f u c k i n g VIBE

[gray nebula]

abyss is cool cuz it feels al ot more natural than the other areas although it dose have some problems like the fact that did you know there was a stealth system in the abyss

probably not since barely anything plays into it

[half sage]

[exotic stag]

barely anything uses the stealth system trol

[spare prawn]

i mean

anechoic items state it clearly

[gray nebula]

ok but

,

[spare prawn]

or imply it

[exotic stag]

theres like 6 different "lowers stealth detection items" and then no enemy in the abyss just uses it

[gray nebula]

did you notice a change

did you actually play around it

[spare prawn]

kinda?

[gray nebula]

yeah kinda not! lol ...

[exotic stag]

i tried and it didnt affect anything

the only thing it changed was the thin snaky boie

oarfish

[gray nebula]

giv e the enemies cool vision cones for trolling purposes or smth (for trollng purposes

[pastel crow]

Okay so I checked it out and it got an on tier kill time on yharon, so this thing is definitely too strong

[exotic stag]

literally just make abyss a gamers worst nightmare. stealth underwater missions

(oh my god imagine)

(imagine if the abyss just had a subworld where it was literally just a stealth underwater mission)

[gray nebula]

the problem is mostly that none of the systems play into it well

(and the breath loss actively encourages you to not stand there waiting, and the worldgen being cramped makes it hard to really sneak past enemies)

[exotic stag]

(breath loss

just give us the ability to use oxygen tanks

[grim tusk]

Just like MGRR
“Dont worry, stealth’s my specialty”
proceeds to recklessly attack everything

[half sage]

add a debuff called decompression sickness if the player magic mirrors out of the abyss, forcing them to manually swim back up to the surface

[exotic stag]

wut

[grim tusk]

[exotic stag]

wouldnt that be better as water pressure?

like water pressure negating you from using the mirror otherwise it'd literally shatter

[grim tusk]

Which sort of already is anyways with the breathing system

[exotic stag]

so just add it to negate the unfunny mirror

[crude geode]

this detail pissed me off as soon as I noticed it ngl.

[cunning patio]

okay, with how much i've stuffed in i didn't think it was fair to simply be called a fish gun, so i adjusted the name.

[earnest raptor]

Ehm

First of

You can't fit more than 14 items in recipe

[cunning patio]

how many's there?

[fossil finch]

I'm just pinging rover for the exclaims ig

[half sage]

adjust the name all you want it's still a SIS which is a don't

[cunning patio]

sis?

[crude geode]

I already did.

[earnest raptor]

Second what a fuck

[half sage]

specific item suggestion

[crude geode]

Give them some time.

[cunning patio]

oh

[fossil finch]

K then

[earnest raptor]

Go to fargo's discord, they love stuff like this

[cunning patio]

why isn't that okay?

fargo?

[grim tusk]

[crude geode]

used to be, but it just flooded the channel lol

[exotic stag]

the fargowiltas mods

[cunning patio]

ah

what's that?

[exotic stag]

"give me my item that does exactly 999999 damage and instant kills all bosses and costs 1 copper coin >:<"

[exotic stag]

fargos mutant mod/fargos souls mod/fargos souls dlc

those 3

[grim tusk]

Theres more

But those 3 are the main ones

[cunning patio]

ah. i'm not out for op, just wanna mix all da feesh

[earnest raptor]

Make a mod

[exotic stag]

^

or just like

get meme mods

[earnest raptor]

Nobody is going to make a mod for you

[exotic stag]

they probably have some fish item

[crude geode]

donator item tier would disagree

[exotic stag]

well

[earnest raptor]

I mean

[exotic stag]

they paid for it when it was available

[earnest raptor]

Donator items do not matter

And you can't get them anymore

[cunning patio]

fair enough. i'll see what i can do here...

[earnest raptor]

I knew it

[cunning patio]

eesh; not quite sure how to get the okay on this.....

[hollow shell]

Oh boy

@thin creek Just unequip Sniper Scope during moments where it bothers you, hotswap it into your vanity slots

[earnest raptor]

You don't

[hollow shell]

Not many weapons have right-click functions either

[earnest raptor]

SIS are simply banned

[cunning patio]

i know, it's dumb, but there just so many fish!

[hollow shell]

@spare prawn Suggestions for new biomes are not allowed

[earnest raptor]

Especially Plague Biome

Oh god I remember it from 2018

[exotic stag]

yeah theres a lot of fish in vanilla too. most of them are used as food

[cunning patio]

fish weapons

[hollow shell]

@cunning patio Your suggestion is too weak-reasoned, specific, and non-serious.

There are a lot of fish weapons but it would be unreasonable to expect them ALL to combine

[cunning patio]

sorta the point

[earnest raptor]

Again

[hollow shell]

They span different classes and there's SO many of them

[earnest raptor]

Go to fargo's place

[exotic stag]

also. they're all unique in some way

[hollow shell]

They are just a general theme

You may as well ask "All fire-themed weapons combine into one"

[earnest raptor]

Request a soul of or something

[cunning patio]

the first part i mean; trust me, i do understand rover

and fair.

[exotic stag]

"fishious rend"

[cunning patio]

if i wound it back to just guns, will that do?

[exotic stag]

still an SIS for all fish guns.. and most of them are still unique so probably wouldnt work still

[exotic stag]

(myes)

[earnest raptor]

You don't understand?

SIS ARE BANNED

[exotic stag]

and if they werent. this sugg wouldnt work out

[cunning patio]

can't say i didn't try; i'll back off nw.

[exotic stag]

because all these weapons are different. combining them all to be one would just be the old elemental quiver + photovisc fiasco

[thin creek]

true, but then again the damage buff

[exotic stag]

(then quick swap it when your not gonna use the scope for the damage)

(quick swap back and forth)

[earnest raptor]

???

[exotic stag]

basically "overload of projectiles"

(because for some reason photo had its projectiles duped by quiver)

[earnest raptor]

I mean

Bloodflare ghost were also duplicated

[gray nebula]

keep the altar of the accursed this way god its so fucking funny

[exotic stag]

to trigger people

[violet sierra]

wrong chat?

[thin creek]

my bad

[novel belfry]

🗿

[vocal ivy]

the funny part is altar sprite already looks like it's 3 blocks wide

[crude geode]

it does indeed

[eternal escarp]

when you talk to an NPC it doesnt matter so lol

and when youre in a fight and it hurts you that much just use a normal destroyer emblem

[small timber]

the only one I remember being extremely annoying with sniper scope is pristine fury, otherwise don't remember much weapon even use right click

because post-DoG you have better (or rather higher utility) accessory to use than a pure damage accessory (unless you are nohitting)

[eternal escarp]

ive used it myself, found it the most usefull tbh

you can press right click and still use main attack anyhow

[frail mantle]

not self explanatory

also this probably falls under the no emote suggestions rule, cause that's basically what stickers are

[crude geode]

Indeed

[mighty knot]

@flint jasper self explanatory, but not self-arguing. You need a reason.
...that is, if emote suggestions weren't banned. Stickers are basically emotes, so it almost certainly applies.

[cobalt pewter]

stickers

• are 350% more intrusive
• lets non-nitro cheapskates use animated stickers
• are no

[marsh girder]

Btw try ti react to my suggestion within 15 minutes if you have anything to say since im going to sleep then

[timber sail]

increase

[marsh girder]

Just to anyone

Delete that or i ping a mod

Since its rule violation

[cobalt pewter]

don't think cal is really in the right to resprite a vanilla sprite

but idk either

cal texture pack is a whole different beast

but cal as a mod doesn't seem likely to resprite vanilla things

[marsh girder]

If you dont plan to remove it @elder mist

[elder mist]

whomst

[marsh girder]

Not generally but it technically doesnt have a sprite, as its using a sprite for another thing

[elder mist]

uh oh sugma

[marsh girder]

[elder mist]

is it the 'increase' thingo

[marsh girder]

Yes

[elder mist]

🥱

yeah @timber sail if you're going to post something at least make it coherent

[marsh girder]

Alright since nobody shared anything im going to bed now, wont see anything further until tommorow so be patient or dont bother

[timber sail]

bro just increase

[cobalt pewter]

seems like the original sugg didn't make it to #suggestions-voting for whatever reason

[molten bone]

yeah, i didnt think ppl noticed it

[molten bone]

still hasnt

not rlly, i just dont like fighting a worm boss and killing it in seconds, even in malice

its a tad op

[pulsar marlin]

I have to agree with the sticker suggestion

This server needs a nice amount of stickers

[marsh girder]

Theyre an nft dude theyd sell them

[pulsar marlin]

Bruh

[frail mantle]

not you specifically

people in general tend to be less receptive to nerfs than to buffs, for obvious reasons

hence nerf suggestions usually don't get as much traction as buff suggestions

[small timber]

if you notice some weapon significantly outperform others, it is like that they will be changed in the next update, especially with the upcoming (as I heard) pre-HM and HM rebalance

and ya generally unless a weapon is so overpowered to an absurd degree (like previous eye of night), nerf suggestion is unlikely to get the required vote

[frozen hornet]

oh crap 10 min slowmode

[half sage]

another SIS

[cobalt pewter]

@ashen warren no SIS.

[ashen warren]

SIS? What's that?

[half sage]

also this one feels weirdly placed, the name and description makes it sound like it'd go with the other elemental weapons, but it's post polter for some reason

specific item suggestion

[cobalt pewter]

read pins and proceed to cease your existence delete the sugg ig

[ashen warren]

I thought that's when they were SUPPOSED to be placed, with the elemental weapons?

They were all post polter?

[half sage]

nah they're right after moonlord

luminite and galactica singularities usually

[ashen warren]

oh im an idiot im not gonna lie i just clicked looked at the recipe for my elemental quiver rather than using the wiki

to get a good placement for the crafting recipe

I didn't know that was an outlier lol

[half sage]

yea elemental accessories (glove, quiver) are post DOG, the weapons are post ML pre prov

regardless of placement tho, it's a SIS so it's a don't

[ashen warren]

Damn...

There goes my other new idea then, for a ne wpickaxe between moonlord and supreme calamitas.

"Devourer of Ore"

[half sage]

this would be fine as long as you didn't give it a specific name and recipe, there's been a few suggestions for a pick in between blossom and crusher

[ashen warren]

I do have an idea for a unique gimmick it can have, is that okay?

[cobalt pewter]

I'm surprised there isn't a whole ass

exo pickaxe

like

the opportunity is there

[ashen warren]

I'm still waiting on my Terra pickaxe.

relogic pls

[cobalt pewter]

but that's aside the point, crystyl crusher is effectively endgame anyways

needs to have pickaxes in between blossom and crystyl instead of really nearing crystyl

[half sage]

yea exo would be fairly pointless, especially if draedon was fought after scal, but post prov to endgame is a wide gap for not having any picks

[ashen warren]

Yeah, I'd say near devourer would be a good spot, maybe one at providence the next at devourer?

DEV-ORE-ERER

[cobalt pewter]

meld in general doesn't have tools

[half sage]

it has a pick

[cobalt pewter]

meld is in a really weird spot

[half sage]

just no hamaxe

[ashen warren]

I've been in this discord server so much recently because my friends have been busy and we literally have nothing to do before exo bosses

[fossil bronze]

calamity post-ml is just boss->mine for 10 minutes->boss

[cobalt pewter]

don't put your hopes up for having any kind of specific items to be put into the mod ig

[ashen warren]

I honestly don't care about that. I just wanna show people my ideas.

[fossil bronze]

ok so
here's a suggestion idea, is it too specific?
make worm bosses share iframes between their segments and remove their temporary invincibility at the start of the fight

[small timber]

what is that trying to achieve?

just so you can hit the head?

[fossil bronze]

make worm bosses suck less
piercing weapons kill them easily, and their invincibility at the beginning of the fight is annoying

[small timber]

I don't mean to be rude, I just mean I don't fully understand the wording

I think that might cause another problem, mainly the confusion that "why are my weapon not hitting the worm boss"

just imagine jester arrow, you shoot an arrow and because all segments share iframe, it will seem if your subsequent attack do not hit whatsoever, which is confusing

I think a better solution will just make only the head is vulnerable at the start of the fight, which DoG's portal attack is already doing

if you are going through with the idea of removing uncoiling dr

[fossil bronze]

i don't think it would be a particularly large issue
iirc piercing weapons don't give an extremely large amount of immunity frames

[small timber]

the problem is if they don't give a large amount of i-frame the uncoiling dr (or your interpretation) will be completely pointless

so they have to give at least a decent amount of i-frame (at least more than usual), which is shared

because it is not just piercing, it can also be aoe, lingering projectile etc

or even worse multi-hit weapon will seem completely useless

so it is better to just communicate that "you cannot do piercing damage at the beginning of the fight" rather than a somewhat confusing approach

[fossil bronze]

i guess that does make some sense

there is a mod currently that makes worms function like that, but it doesn't run on the latest version of tmodloader

[small timber]

but I do agree ya it gets annoying that you can't do anything for the first 10 seconds, which is why I proposed make the head vulnerable while other segments have no hitbox

you can still damage, just not with piercing

[fossil bronze]

if it gets updated i can test how well it works to make worms less weak to piercing

[frozen hornet]

laser drill upgrade

[fossil bronze]

there was a sugg to make crystyl pre-exo/scal

iirc

to make building an exo mechs arena easier

i don't think it's fair to use stuff from fargo as something we should assume players will use

since some players play with no qol

[small timber]

crystyl crusher is dev/donor item so the chance of it happening is slim, it will be faster to suggest a new pickaxe

[half sage]

it made it to voting so ig it got permission

only 118 votes tho

[fossil bronze]

everything gets buried in voting tbh

i've only seen suggestions that were instantly implemented get in

barely any suggestions have actually reached the star count

[small timber]

isnt that suggestion way too high effort? I understand the point, but as a suggestion it is the equivalent of "rework every stealth strike in the game"

[cobalt pewter]

lengthy sugg (real)

stealth strikes aren't necessarily just those I mentioned

like how Celestus changes the behavior of the scythe thrown

on stealth strikes

[full pivot]

nah, i think a better way to do it would just be changing the way the more projectiles happen, rather than giving every single stealth strike a unique gimmick

[small timber]

regardless, as a suggestion that is way too high effort

because it is still, "rework most stealth strike in the game" as a suggestion

[cobalt pewter]

just came back from shower

uhh what did I want to say

[cobalt pewter]

oh yeah I'm fine with it, I was referring mainly to Stealth strikes that simply add more projectiles where the base projectile already does

also I fucking know what I'm talking about, I'm not gonna suggest it if it's clearly "high effort", and while you think those kinda stealth strikes are all of the rogue weapons, then no, that's totally not the case

because what I'm trying to imply isn't to rework every single stealth strikes that adds projectiles

because duh that's dumb

I'm not an idiot

[sleek turret]

Good suggestion

[small timber]

then make it more obvious that you are referring to the stealth strike you listed as examples

I don't see any interpretation in the words other than referring to "all additional projectile-spawning stealth strike"

[cobalt pewter]

you could always start with recommending how to change the suggestion's wording to be better interpreted instead of immediately shitting on the suggestion while you knew already it might be hard to interpret

Christ

look I'm not a native, and I appreciate any help with English

[small timber]

because your wording is suggested that you want to "rework stealth strike that just spawn additional projectile and make them more interesting", therefore I am of course not trying to correct your wording, because I assume that is your intention

if you are referring the the examples you listed, I think you should make it more obvious in wording, that you are referring to them, because currently it is not really implied

[grim tusk]

@flint jasper self explanatory, but not self-arguing. You need a reason.
...that is, if emote suggestions weren't banned. Stickers are basically emotes, so it almost certainly applies.

[spare prawn]

re: stealth strikes sugesstion

i think more projectiles does work for some

like the stellar knife

[exotic stag]

(or hear me out: we just make flame canisters rather then use gel as ammunition )

[eternal escarp]

iirc making other gels work as ammo is possible, but it cannot make any like

new effects / give more damage / etc

i remember a sugg before and a person replying with the statement its not a possibility to make new gels have unique stuff to them

the most is just making them work the same way as normal Gel afaik

[exotic stag]

yeah you have to give the flamethrower that effect

[eternal escarp]

@naive ravine (you should prolly note these things in your suggestion)

[naive ravine]

even then it can still have the added damage like with bullets right?

[eternal escarp]

no

not even Gel normally has that

[naive ravine]

Ohh

I'dd edit that rq

Sorry for my complete lack of knowledge of how flamethrowers work

[eternal escarp]

@naive ravine and thats a SIS (Specific Item Suggestions)

those are disallowed

[naive ravine]

Ohh.

[eternal escarp]

you coukd however suggest for the sniper scope to have an upgrade eventually with reasoning

[naive ravine]

Okay I'll delete it

[small timber]

It will be difficult for sniper scope to get an accessory upgrade without nerfing its stat

[deft yew]

10% crit

Vanilla moment

[small timber]

For comparison sniper scope (a post golem accessory) is comparably in offensive capability with almost all post-DoG accessory

[deft yew]

It’s practically DSA but better

Crit boosts are just a little stronger than damage boosts and scope has no downside either

[deft yew]

[gray nebula]

[deft yew]

wait is that the joke

he just

dies

[mighty knot]

@muted sapphire specific item suggestions are banned

[muted sapphire]

ah sorry

deleted the msg then

[keen zealot]

#suggestions-posting message whut

I have no idea about CTP but in vanilla

I'd say these are different enough

not to mention that they behave wildly differently

[fossil bronze]

they're distinct in ctp too

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/727923018806067282/927325389955694642/NPC_128.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/727923018806067282/927325417289953340/NPC_129.png

[gray nebula]

oh yeah

i wanted to reply

i saw it when i woke up and then forgot after getting to my pc

suggestion litterally wrong

fail so much fail

[crude geode]

@marsh girder See above sprites and how they are not identical. Also no-hitters are immensely cringe and should not really be used for suggestion reasoning.

[fossil bronze]

guys' i can't nohit death malice scal
too hard pls nerf

(/s)

[gray nebula]

sexism.

[viral forge]

wym

[gray nebula]

noothing

i agree with the sugg

[half sage]

We need husbando to match the waifus for gender equality

[crude geode]

Granite Elemental, Ice Elemental, Chaos Elemental

There’s a shit ton of elementals you’re gonna need to add lol

[gray nebula]

no

shut UP

about these

its goofy

earth ele CLEARLY goes in line with the rest of the elementals

the ice, granite and chaos ones are different kinds of elementals

not humanoids, not as powerful

cmon

:|

[viral forge]

ngl earth elemental hot

[gray nebula]

Also delete chaos elemental, >:[

[half sage]

Chaos elemental cring

Reskin of granite elemental that just drops random swords because reasons

Not reskin ig

But like

[crude geode]

#suggestions-voting message
also ngl

This is a pretty damn frequently suggested

[half sage]

[crude geode]

and should be added to the list

[gray nebula]

cring

thatwas a year ago cring alert

also make rare sand elemental a male

and make it not rare nor sand

why are there 2 nearly identical sand eles

[crude geode]

because no one asked

[viral forge]

arent you a dev lol you should know?

[gray nebula]

no

cuz i didnt add them

i CAN advocate for it getting changed tho

[viral forge]

fair enough

[half sage]

Iban just lives in the sprite mines

[gray nebula]

in the code mines now

[half sage]

Forced to endlessly respite

[crude geode]

There’s approximately two spriters for calamity that Fabsol has trapped in his basement

[fossil bronze]

wait a second

isn't adding earth elemental to hote

against the RULES????

[crude geode]

It is in fact

Because it is a frequently suggested

Thank you for reminding me it is a official don’t

@lavish cloak Wizard in hallow sells it

[lavish cloak]

ah

nvm then

[gray nebula]

fail!

much better as well

since standing there for an hour trying to fishe the fishes was rly fking boring

[crude geode]

Iban Generic Fishing Hater smh my head

[fossil bronze]

fishing is boring?
i'm so surprised.

[exotic stag]

fishing for crystal serpent:

[crude geode]

@hollow shell Earth Elemental suggestion, that is frequently suggested and therefore a don’t

[hollow shell]

This is definitely a frequent sugg

@viral forge Don'ts doc:

[stiff wren]

1984

[hollow shell]

indeed

[spare prawn]

M

Hmm

Yeah i definitely agree with the suggestion

It's pretty easy to overpen or miss the seekers and hit calclone while trying to kill them

[cedar moth]

yea

[exotic stag]

i mean

its only really a problem when like

theres 2 left

[spare prawn]

I'm not even sure what they do tbh

But they are pretty hard to kill that's what I know

[exotic stag]

basically a shield

soul seekers are just a shield that shoots haha laser

heres ccals'

[spare prawn]

I managed to nuke the lot of them the first time i fought calclone because freq. Manip. Funni weapon, but in refights I've noticed that a couple tend to make it

Also noticed that i fucking suck at bullet hells lmao

[exotic stag]

a couple tend to make it if your just shooting at ccal directly.. usually you'll hit atleast like 1 at 20%

but even then its usually around dead

[crude geode]

Wait they have less health on death mode what

[exotic stag]

wait what

why do they have 3k on death?

ah yes death mode. the mode that nerfed soul seekers

[crude geode]

[exotic stag]

its not even the same with supreme soul seekers cause they have their hp buff

on rev..

[spare prawn]

Because in death mode calclone gets 10?

[exotic stag]

yeah its death mode though. enemies shouldnt be weaker just cause theres more

[stiff wren]

Death mode is when higher numbers

[worthy lintel]

a small broadsword

[dusty wharf]

this thing

[worthy lintel]

crits inflicts armor debuff

not good at all for combat

[dusty wharf]

but the plasma rod isnt that good either

[worthy lintel]

treat plasma rod as a pre boss golden shower really

its underwhelming but atleast its usable

warblade is just a selling item

[dusty wharf]

and is there ANNY other item that gives the same debuff

[worthy lintel]

meanwhile waraxe is acquired much more easily, has more knockback and doubles as a tool

[dusty wharf]

or at least an upgraded version of it

[dusty wharf]

waraxe is from skeletons which are semi-rare and has a lower rate

unless im wrong

[exotic stag]

skeletons arent semi-rare

they're actually just quite common

[worthy lintel]

6.67% drop rate from both skeletons and hoplites

[dusty wharf]

i can easily have 30 hours of mining withouth encountering one

[worthy lintel]

i usually get 5-6 in a single caving session

[exotic stag]

if im not hunting for them i'll usually see like atleast 600 skeletons phm

[spare prawn]

It's 5,000 more total HP, + more seekers means more bullets, more spawns, and more things to eat pierce

[exotic stag]

(just cause its more doesnt mean its more difficult. infact its more easy because things that spawn stuff on hit just get superboosted

[spare prawn]

Depends on the weapon

Making someone change up their weapon choice means that the difficulty change is working

Wince those kinds of weapons probably don't do as much single target damage

[exotic stag]

the single target damage makes up for it in secondary effects. which are usually "on hit" something happens or debuffs. which soul seekers arent immune to many

[gray nebula]

troll

me when trying to preventing adrenaline stalling by fucking over low dps players intead

[exotic stag]

why not just fuck over high dps players too

with haha RDR

[shell grotto]

was going to say

they already did xd

[deft yew]

i just suggested this a little while ago but you worded it much better

[exotic stag]

whas next. we fuckin over tanks? oh wait defense damage exists

[shell grotto]

oh sorry lol

[exotic stag]

and then theres just "meta"

[deft yew]

if adrenaline didn't exist none of this would be a problem PLUS we could tone down rev boss health which would be a shadow buff to vanilla weapons

[shell grotto]

Yeah TBH every new mechanic to remove freedom, RDR, Timed aggro and Def Damage all ruin certain playstyles

[deft yew]

defense damage honestly i think is fine

[worthy lintel]

defense damage is based

[shell grotto]

I think it is too

[worthy lintel]

but rdr needs to be gone

[deft yew]

just gotta mess with its intensity every patch

[shell grotto]

RDR needs to die, yes.

[exotic stag]

defense damage is literally just negated by low defense builds

[deft yew]

if you minimax to every possible limit you should be allowed to melt the boss

[shell grotto]

new patch: every boss gets RDR to a factor of 20

[deft yew]

all these new mechanics honestly uh...

[shell grotto]

every new mechanic except defense damage IMO needs to go

[deft yew]

turn all playstyles other than the literal meta useless

[deft yew]

[worthy lintel]

atleast the rdr problem is fixed

but timed agression is 🥶

[deft yew]

is RDR tolerable on worms now

[shell grotto]

no

[deft yew]

1.5's mechanics, when you fight yharon, feel designed especially to screw true melee over as hard as possible

ngl

despite it getting hard buffed

[exotic stag]

reaper vs yharon just ignores RDR

[shell grotto]

subphase 7 lol

[deft yew]

actually phase timer does help in a few cases

[shell grotto]

many. fireballs.

[deft yew]

1. twins

[crude geode]

The best part about these obscure mechanics is how difficult it is to even record them happening, ESPECIALLY RDR

[deft yew]

^

[exotic stag]

rdr is just "hey look boss take less damag now"

[crude geode]

Cuz like how the fuck are you supposed to even do the math for that shit, let alone tell a difference in your dps

[shell grotto]

okay yeah that's true because phase 3 ret is exponentially easier than phase 2 laser spam, but it's still inconsistent

[deft yew]

we in the hot take department are really stuck between a rock and a hard place

[shell grotto]

RDR is decent for malice mode. That's it though

"decent"

not good

[deft yew]

yes that was my argument

[shell grotto]

"decent"

[deft yew]

make RDR malice only

[exotic stag]

make rdr normal mode only to trigger people

[shell grotto]

keep in mind my post is to remove timed aggression

different mechanic

[crude geode]

Yeah

[deft yew]

right

[shell grotto]

both bad IMO, but still

[deft yew]

RDR shift was literally because of timed aggression

[worthy lintel]

you listed both mechanics in your reasoning and people completely ignored timed agression

absolute state

[deft yew]

timed aggression was SO PAINFULLY OBVIOUS on true melee yharon

also duke phase 4

[shell grotto]

yeah but they do go hand in hand given it caps DPS to a middleground, byeah it sucks

[deft yew]

exists

(starts dashing constantly with no warning other than a percentage)

[cobalt pewter]

ye they exist but never communicated properly

[crude geode]

I think it’s moreso because the mechanic is newer? Rarer? Harder to find?
and thus less experience = less for people to comment on

[cobalt pewter]

felt like a second thought

[deft yew]

true melee problem

stealth problem?

[worthy lintel]

yea, rdr steals the spotlight but i find timed agression to be much more vicious and anti-player

[cobalt pewter]

both are bad

get rid of both

[deft yew]

[cobalt pewter]

:sungla

[deft yew]

wait, what are all of the obscure mechanics that 1.5 added?

[cobalt pewter]

well rdr will be kinda gone next patch?

(limited to Malice)

[worthy lintel]

rdr will be restricted to malice

[crude geode]

Thank fucking god

[worthy lintel]

so huh

[deft yew]

lesgoo

[worthy lintel]

gone ye

[cobalt pewter]

yeah effectively gone

because malice doesn't exist

:trol

[deft yew]

should have looked at it before i made the sugg

[crude geode]

I do think adrenaline stalling isn’t that big of a deal

[shell grotto]

RDR, timed aggression, and defense damage AFAIK. Unless you count the mech rework

[deft yew]

it's strategy, not cheese

imo

[crude geode]

Indeed

Also shows mastery over a certain phase and lets you skip over another one in exchange for it

[deft yew]

cheese is doing the only thing that retains your sanity for rev WoF

[cobalt pewter]

defense damage is kind of? a necessary evil because facetank isn't fun, and defensive measures in general is buffed

[deft yew]

^

[cobalt pewter]

but rdr and the timed aggresion are completely anti fun

[shell grotto]

I mean facetanking is funny

[crude geode]

(Except for warding being nerfed iirc)

[deft yew]

ok can we talk about shortswords

[deft yew]

still buffed

just a TINY bit less than initially

[shell grotto]

facetank+sub shocker is fun

[deft yew]

warding post-DoG now gives 15 def instead of 16

[shell grotto]

wow, what a nerf

[deft yew]

shortswords literally require you to facetank and output ridiculous DPS for it

[cobalt pewter]

it isn't communicated properly that stealth damage is inversely larger the lower your overall stealth regen, and as much as I want to suggest smth about it, they haven't addressed the chungus stealth rogue tooltips on armors

so it's kinda lo

[shell grotto]

New sugg:
Remove RDR, timed aggression and defense damage
why?
please

[cobalt pewter]

[deft yew]

not defense damage though

[shell grotto]

why not? D:

[worthy lintel]

defense damage is good tho

[deft yew]

oh man i hate that

speaking of tooltips

repetitive or unpacked ones also exist

see:

Ultima

Celestial Tracers

[crude geode]

fun fact: Crystal piercer’s stealth strike is a fat fucking lie

[deft yew]

what

[cobalt pewter]

cal kinda needs a patch solely to address tooltips and information in the mod

[deft yew]

also mantis claws

[cobalt pewter]

like the whole patch is just fixing tooltips and making information clearer to the player

[crude geode]

It claims to summon Crystal shards as it travels but it does not in fact

[deft yew]

make them actually explode

[crude geode]

It just pierces through walls lol

[deft yew]

bru

[lucid marsh]

Hey I noticed that the true forbidden oathblade is really bad compared to things of the same tier

[deft yew]

also speaking of which:

[crude geode]

Who cares melee has about ten other options

[deft yew]

false melee bloat

not saying we have too many

they just

[lucid marsh]

For example, it has 600ish single target dps, while tyrant yharim's ultisword and the plague scythe are better despite being obtained earlier

[deft yew]

ALL DO THE SAME THING

[lucid marsh]

Also yes that's true. If it isn't useful it should be removed

[deft yew]

hellkite:

good though?

penumbra

[lucid marsh]

Hellkite also shit

Like 70% of melee weapons are useless

[deft yew]

hellkite exists to make sense in terratomere

[cobalt pewter]

cal started existing around the time where projectile broadswords were the hot stuff

Cal needs to go beyond that old age if they wanna advance

[worthy lintel]

as much as id like true melee to be balanced this is probably the 9th layer of hell of balancing and as such can't be considered an argument against timed agression

[cobalt pewter]

(start by removing half of broadswords)

[lucid marsh]

Yeah and like I don't hate projectile broadswords

[deft yew]

true

i don't hate projectile broads

[lucid marsh]

But when they're useless besides as a material that's bad

[deft yew]

i DO hate the loss of enforcer's fireball

[sleek turret]

Good suggestion

[worthy lintel]

that is too vague of a sugg

[lucid marsh]

If they're never useful then they should be removed

[worthy lintel]

also this

true melee balancing is a never ending fight

[gray nebula]

i agree

.

sugg is invalid but i agree. and

we are already working on it. as a joke. but we are.

[lucid marsh]

Ok fair