suggestions-discussion

[small timber]

endurance is nerfed because defense damage is much less punishing now (you regenerate it much faster if you don't get hit)

[frail mantle]

as long as you're still trying to dodge the boss' attacks, tanking is completely fine

[small timber]

@ashen warren true melee is so buffed to the point that they may need nerfed (unless you are playing Malice)

There is a different between "skill issue" and literally "don't want to put in any effort whatsoever"

[distant gyro]

i always thought having most of the powers especially early game comes from needless grinding is kinda dumb

especially considering those 5% DR nerfed from endurance potion is put back into buffing accessories like the absorber and sponge

absorber went from 6 defense and 5% DR to 10 defense and 10% DR

sponge from 10 and 10 to 20 and 15

[small timber]

and then there is warding that the suggestion did not touch whatsoever

warding late game get buffed by nearly doubled

[distant gyro]

in vanilla it usually doesn't matter that much

since who actually grinds past getting the 3 basic buff potions and a food item

but when modding implements ways to make grind easier, then introduce a harder difficulty, people's instinctive first choice is to grind for the temporary potion that increases way more stats than any of your items reasonably do

like: eye of the golem and rage potion grant the same amount of crit

one is post-golem, and the other is literally pre-boss

[ashen warren]

yeah true melee deals way too much damage it def needs a small nerf but endurance potion was pretty balanced. damage reduction is not that strong in calamity because of how scaling works and they already nerfed it multiple times.

[small timber]

you miss the point, the point is that endurance is nerfed because so many other aspect of the game is so buffed that it needs the nerf (and I mean defensive aspect, not offensive)

they are basically just shifting the power of one concentrated item (endurance potion) to other items, which you will most likely use in true melee anyway

[ashen warren]

Ops

[ashen warren]

Is this outdated?

[small timber]

seems up to date

if 15% seems a lot, I think it is post-mitigation damage

[ashen warren]

for example: a boss deals 100 dmg, but I have 100 defense so it will end up dealing only 25 dmg

the player's defense stat is reduced by 15% of 25 or 15% of 100?

[small timber]

your defense is reduce by 1 (100 damage, 100 defense you take 1 damage, so 15% of it rounded up is 1)

[ashen warren]

100 defense you take 25 dmg in expert mode

[eternal escarp]

also to remember, not all attacks deal defense damage

[small timber]

that MAXIMUM defense loss stat is the max amout of defense loss you can take in a single hit

eg: you have 20 defense, you take a 1000 damage hit, your defense should had reduced by 980x0.15 but the max you can loss is 20x0.25=5, so you loss 5

ah forgot it is not Master Mode calculation, then your defense should be loss by 25*0.15

[eternal escarp]

so not all attacks are going to be as brutal as the others

[ashen warren]

but yeah I think I understand now, doesn't seem to be OP

thanks dude

[small timber]

to some degree you can even still face tank with high enough defense, just you cant tank "permanently"

need to take time off to recover defense damage then you can do it again, just that one thing to note is that the higher your defense the less defense damage you take, so melee is still by far the best tank class (if you want to do it)

[river wave]

Isn't the boss rush background meant to turn black for bosses like Cal clone and SCal?

is that a bug or..?

[small timber]

probably just hadn't fully fleshed out yet, since they mentioned that they don't do extensive testing on Boss Rush (yet) when 1.5 released

[river wave]

does that mean that I shouldn't suggest it or is that still a good idea

[small timber]

most likely they are aware of it

[distant gyro]

background colors and boss rush are rather experimental atm

you can spawn bosses before turning boss rush on, and there is a known bug where the shader is kept

but it's cool so it's not getting fixed yet

purple or red background on boss rush is actually really cool, after all

[river wave]

yeah I love the red, I hope they experiment more with bg colours later when boss rush is more of a thing

transitioning to red with reign of lords playing in the background would be epic

Oh yeah, there was something about the nanoblack reaper

I haven't tested it too much but when I tried to fight ares with it I was literally doing 1-2 damage

[distant gyro]

yeah that's what extensive testing on br kinda refers to

not only regarding how the bosses in the event die way faster than other of the same tier, but also some dev weapons being way better than others

[kindred summit]

yo, just wondering, after post post scal/draedon bosses, wouldn't upgrades for insanely fast guns (such as soma prime) be either multiplying the amount of projectiles flung per bullet or more damage?

[small timber]

may you elaborate what do you mean "upgrade"?

[distant gyro]

isn't that already the case

p90 is already the fastest a gun can be, so the main upgrade (soma prime) is just that it shoots two bullets with more damage

[candid grove]

p91 when

[tardy smelt]

p90 firing 1 bullet per frame momento

*per 2 frames

[tardy smelt]

uhhh quick question

is this intended?

[unborn siren]

it's a bit bugged, and it results in him dying at some hp percentage that is not 0

but the actual hp still works fine so it's just visual

[tardy smelt]

ah!

I see

[exotic stag]

bugs doc. i posted it before

so no its not intended so yeah just use the.. regular boss hp bar

[tardy smelt]

mmhm

got it

[exotic stag]

yep

(all i did was use unleveled's boss hp bar thing)

[grim tusk]

@ashen warren tank build still good, as long as you not facetank
Also endurance used to be pretty busted, specially later when paired with titan scale
Defense damage regenerates a few frames after iframes expire so you get some hits in, get out and regain hp and defense then head back in

[small timber]

Not sure about this but these two should get exclaimed no? technically a dont

[deft yew]

Hardcode

[grim tusk]

@hollow shell any opinions?

[hollow shell]

I dunno how I feel about that Don't

I've gone back and forth on it

[deft yew]

The Yharon one I understand

The DoG one I don’t

[hollow shell]

I may even remove the Don't for modifying vanilla biome spread
because although it'd still be a pain to do, our programmers are getting better at modifying vanilla features, and are doing it more regularly

[deft yew]

#lore-discussion message

[fossil finch]

Welp
Time for the obligatory iban vibecheck

Oh

Didn't realize we got a bingo

Also, shouldn't the endurance pot sugg be exclaimed? Aside the "readd removed features" thing it doesn't really have any reasoning, and that last paragraph sure doesn't fit

[hollow shell]

I guess yeah @ashen warren You could try wording your sugg less aggressively

[eternal escarp]

from this comment i thought they'd delete the sugg

[gray nebula]

her p1 anims arent less detailled they're just more methodical

p2 anims are more energetic

[novel timber]

i still think that the p2 anims add too much to the attack visuals to only use for the last 40%

especially considering you can barely notice the p1 anims since they're borderline static

[gray nebula]

:|

[sleek wadi]

I can barely see the animations anyway due to how small Scal is

[gray nebula]

and how opaque her shield is

[exotic stag]

and also all the other things

[novel timber]

yeah but the p1 anims are just her holding her hands out

seeing her do the punches/fire punch whenever she shoots makes the attack feel more lively

i guess it makes sense that she starts calm and gets aggressive when pushed far enough but still

[grim tusk]

@cobalt heath
Need to ask for the dedicatee’s permision
Formatting
Better reasoning

[worthy lintel]

Take the care of following the formatting when posting

[cobalt heath]

oh, sorry

but its not a bad idea is it

[worthy lintel]

It's effectively not bad but you need proper reasoning

[grim tusk]

Its meh, adding it for no reason is

And besides you need the dev’s permision

[worthy lintel]

However having the rogue spear line completed is not impertinent

[grim tusk]

If thats how is it going to be add eclipse’s fall, wrath wing and atom spliter then

[worthy lintel]

Wrathwing is already in Scarlet's recipe

[cobalt heath]

oh eclipses fall. Completely forgot about that weapon

but wrath in my eye doesnt make sence being the only one. Most post scal tier weapons have a long crafting three or have a component which is crafted earlier. Wrath being the only one is odd to me. And this days wrath isnt even a spear while attacking, more off a projectile

[grim tusk]

Wrath is still a spear lol

Stealth strike specially

[worthy lintel]

tl:dr

You need to fix the formatting and ask for Scarlet's dedicatee permission

[dusty stirrup]

I wouldn't mind having Phantasmal Ruin added to the recipe/replacing Wraithwing, it didn't exist back when Scarlet Devil was made, but it's way more fitting than Wraithwing is

[worthy lintel]

epic, problem solved

[cobalt heath]

ill get the reasoning done and message the dev who made scarlet for premission

[worthy lintel]

And yea Phantasmal Ruin thematically makes more sense than Infernal Spear ngl

[dusty stirrup]

(I am the dev )

[worthy lintel]

(he is)

[cobalt heath]

oh lmao

so reasoning done and its good to go? If you give me premission

[dusty stirrup]

Reasoning that Phantasmal Ruin is more thematically similar to Scarlet Devil, alongside their ressembling mechanics of producing homing projectiles on travel and exploding when hitting an enemy.

(Finishing an upgrade line is also cool but it's secondary to the issue at hand)

[worthy lintel]

however if you want to also include Eclipse's Fall you also need that one's dedicatee perm so it's better to stick to Phantasmal Ruin imo

[cobalt heath]

eclipse doesnt fit cause it doesnt have on travel projectiles

[worthy lintel]

Excellent, all your problems are solved

(nearly)

Fix the formatting and I will remove the ! react

[cobalt heath]

time to open note pad

done

better now?

[hollow shell]

Yeah it looks pretty good, one thing that should be changed though is the top line, it's confusing in its wording atm
Should be worded more like "Add Phantasmal Ruin to the recipe of Scarlet Devil"

[cobalt heath]

copy that

[hollow shell]

👌

[grim tusk]

@pastel crow can you take a look at hardened honeycombs, ashen stalactite, meteor fist (stealth) and infernal kris, they feel so op atm
Also take a look at sludge splotch and sticky spikeball (spam, stealth is op), bouncy spikeballs, those are just bad

add Seafoam bomb and Seashell boomerang to the chopping block

Buff Dune hopper

Take a look at Shroomerang and Mycoroot (stealth), they feel very weak

[cobalt pewter]

i forgot sludge splotch is a thing

[tribal cedar]

Malice nohitters explaining how dying to prehardmode vanilla bosses thousands of times is fun and enjoyable

[gray nebula]

you can always bully malice nohitters. it is always morally correct

[tribal cedar]

I enjoy bullying r*gue players personally

[cobalt pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/hololive-korone-inugami-korone-not-funny-no-gif-21129159

[tribal cedar]

rogue

player

detected

[grim tusk]

[exotic stag]

me out here with near 7k hp as a rogue and just using ele disk

[steel minnow]

I would like to see how many votes my asteroids thing had but I can't see it :((((

[obsidian cove]

@wraith briar you need a title line on your suggestion so the bot can read it

[short walrus]

#suggestions-voting message this one?

[steel minnow]

Ohhh it has 61? that's great! xD

Thank You!

[rugged belfry]

I don’t think “it’d be fun” is a valid reason. It would for sure, but that reason won’t get it through to the game.

[steel minnow]

Wait, is that to me or another user?

[ashen warren]

not you

[crude geode]

Is it just me or should Greusome Eminence and Cinders of Lament have swapped damage types?

I get that Cinders of Lament summons the brothers but so does Greusome Eminence

[hollow shell]

It's cuz of the weapons that they are exhumed from

We won't change the damage type upon exhuming

[crude geode]

I guess that makes some sense

[wraith briar]

can the bot read it if I edit the post?

[obsidian cove]

yes

[hollow shell]

mhm

This reasoning is uh, it's pretty weak

I understand that it literally is just something you wanna do for fun but can you think of any kind of elaboration?

[wraith briar]

hmm well it could be used in builds. Its already just deco now so it would just make it more practical, sort of a special purpose sign for cautionary messages or suggestions, or at least that's how I would use it.

since you can collect them

[small timber]

@cloud surge a better suggestion will probably just to always give the attack a consistent "gap" so the players can realiably dodge it, like either increase gap between each projectile or to give 1 large gap for each barrage which the player can position themselves to reliable dodge it

I don't see any chance of the ceiling projectile to get removed because they will have to completely rework the boss

[unborn siren]

yeah, having gaps would make it more possible and fun

[small timber]

ya, because the problem is not that the ceiling attack "cannot be deal with", but rather the get around is just a much easier solution (just leave area covered by barrage)

[cloud surge]

fair, i edited it

[small timber]

although I will lean more towards giving a "large gap" in each barrage, since unironically the current version DO give enough space to dodge (between each individual projectile)

just hard to be precise in the midst of chaos

[unborn siren]

yeah, but if there is one big gap then maybe the other gaps could be slightly smaller? idk

[small timber]

ya something like that

to incentivize doing it instead of "lets just leave the area covered by projectile instead"

[cloud surge]

i think it would be better if the attack promoted staying in a closer area rather than running away to the left or right currently, and a "large gap" version of the attack would do that

[small timber]

maybe, depend on their iteration, but I think it will not be too much different unless they increase the area covered by a lot

whether the projectile move left/right or drop straight down

because if they massively increase area covered player will for sure complain "we used to be able to dodge out of the area as an option now we are forced to be precise and pass through the gap"

[unborn siren]

I think a very slight angle to the left or right would be good

but mostly down

[cloud surge]

my idea is there is a pretty big gap in the spikes directly under where the hive shoots them (meaning the direction the spikes move when shot is fixed, not based on its current momentum) in order to promote not running away as much, which would make the ceiling attack not as bullshit to avoid and also make avoid the hive itself slightly hard and make avoing the worms harder, although overall it would make the fight more fun and fair

it would also make the new attack introduced in 1.5 not completely redundant

[small timber]

sorry may you elaborate what you mean by "spikes"?

oh ok that one that leaves on ground

[cloud surge]

the projectiles in the ceiling attack

[small timber]

that will probably make it a bit too easy, considering to certain degree you will "not have to move to dodge it", I think just random position between each barrage for the gap will do

since the projectile do stay in air long enough for you to predict where the gap will be

[cloud surge]

yeah thats fair as well

[cobalt pewter]

probably the hive still shoots the projectiles in the same manner, but now it has a large gap in a section of the line and the rest of the line is super tight?

can also change where the safe spot is

[small timber]

ya basically what we are discussing here

[cobalt pewter]

oh yea I was working, didn't read context

[small timber]

although I will debate whether to increase the area covered by the attack to disincentivize running out of the covered range and to incentivize dodging the dedicated large gap

[safe oasis]

yeah it stays in the air but it stays off screen

[cloud surge]

you can see the projectiles for a little bit right as they are fired

[small timber]

not so much in the underground fight in my experience

since the projectile speed is not very fast

[cloud surge]

really old perfs use to have random gaps in between each projectile an honestly that was better

[small timber]

and you can drop down below after seeing the projectile to get more time to dodge, the change is just to make it more strategic and consistent to dodge

[cloud surge]

i really havent noticed the difference between above ground and underground perfs

[small timber]

although I think you should remove the "remove ceiling attack" from the title and suggestion, chances are it is likely not happening, so just focus on improving the attack instead

[cloud surge]

ok

[keen zealot]

Honestly? I don't think fun should be ignored as a critical game design factor, since that's ultimately what we're after in a game after all. Yes, it shouldn't be the only reason for a suggestion, but it should not be discounted without evaluation either.

You can have a perfectly balanced or perfectly sensible game, but if it's not fun, is it still a good game?

[safe oasis]

nobody said to ignore fun though? he just said it's not enough of a reason

[keen zealot]

I've seen a lot of suggestions whose reasons get discounted merely for including the words "it would be fun" even when it's not even the actual reasoning

[safe oasis]

i don't remember that happening but if it did then that was probably just a mistake

[keen zealot]

don't really think you can call something a mistake if it was deliberate

[safe oasis]

well i have literally no examples to go off of so there's no way to really tell

[keen zealot]

and I'm not about to surf through months of history to find the short little blips of text that exemplify this

[dapper coral]

sounds more like people being misinformed, then

if it didnt come from rover or some other purple person then thats not impossible

"it would be fun/cool" is of course ok but you gotta have something else in there

thats the stipulation

[short dust]

i saw the suggestion for increasing the space in the dungeon for cvoid and polterghast.. now if i may ask, isnt there already a large box area in the dungeon that you can clear out and prepare for those bosses?

[safe oasis]

there's no guaranteed structure afaik, just pray to worldgen that you get that box area

[cobalt pewter]

yea

you'll always need to excavate Dungeon for those 2

how much depends on your worldgen

[short dust]

oh i see now, well on my first playthrough i got the big box area in my dungeon

[cobalt pewter]

huh

the endurance pot sugg

I'm not sure what the sugg is getting at there

the reasoning is vague as hell, and the quoted condescending sentence doesn't help the cause

[crude geode]

The reasoning isn’t really that vague ngl but it is kinda insubstantial

“dr already got nerfed as well as warding, along with defense damage reducing the effectiveness of tanking”

[cobalt pewter]

fair

Perhaps preboss potions like endurance can get upgrades like wrath and rage?

wrath and rage have quite a lot of dmg buff already, and those are also practically early game

[frozen hornet]

Endurance already crafts into stimulants

I guess it's not really an upgrade but still

[distant gyro]

it is

but not one that disables the previous

titan scale also exists but that's indirect

[still zodiac]

it's weird that titan scale doesn't have endurance potion in its recipe tbh

[distant gyro]

titan scale is basically ironskin + endurance + titan

but the first two parts aren't there

especially weird when you consider that

titan scale quite literally sounds like ironskin

just... extra edgy

[still zodiac]

maybe removing ironskin and endurance from stims and adding to scale instead could work, but idk

those 2 are pretty weird

[small timber]

I think that guy had confusion on how defense damage work so he thought defense damage is literally -15% your defense each hit making tanks completely useless, but after discussion he seem to know now, but he did not delete the suggestion I guess

so he thought when tanks are already useless nerfing endurance potion only make it worse

[small timber]

I think rather than "decrease rarity of charred ore" a better wording will be "increase the amount of charred ore" (or something along the line), since rarity can be confusing (with the rarity colour in the game)

[cobalt pewter]

the provided solution in the sugg is fine enough to me

[river glen]

i wonder if people actually read pins at this poin

point*

[exotic stag]

nah its just like some people dont read rules. they dont really care

[gray nebula]

how does the regeneration really show players anything

and if the goal is to show players its yharon's last stand, why would something be considered "too climatic

[cobalt pewter]

the issue with the current transition imo is that it's too long to matter, now that the healing doesn't exist

at least make the transition stop the moment the lyrics kick in

[exotic stag]

(tbf i just kinda dislike the fact the invul is so long.)

[gray nebula]

yeah

i mean why even does he do a transition at all if he doesnt heal

:/

[exotic stag]

he just becomes invincible at random

[cobalt heath]

Tbh just bring back the old dog and yharon p2 healings whit lover numbers to make game More difficult and climactic

And sentinels back to dog transitions pls

[frozen hornet]

DoG never healed smh

[sleek wadi]

Nah the heals being gone means shit like coldheart and the RE guns aren't randomly nerfed against DoG and Yharon

[exotic stag]

the healing isnt more difficult. its just more boring.. the invuln is the difficulty

[cobalt heath]

Well it got a New healthbar, now its shared between phases

[fossil finch]

And?

[frozen hornet]

It's the same fight

[sleek wadi]

Theres actual gameplay reason to keep the shared healthbars as they are now, so just changing Yharon's invuln would be the better solution

[exotic stag]

yeah

[frozen hornet]

With the same relative health compared to 1.4 DoG

[exotic stag]

yharons invuln is kinda BS as it is rn

but the rest is fine

[sleek wadi]

Only good Yharon's excessively long invuln does is give the player an idea of how they should be handling the fight: As far away from Yharon as possible

[frozen hornet]

I'd be fine if yharon's invuln lasts long enough for the music intro to finish

[cobalt heath]

Its a good fight but the p2 transition doesnt make sence cause No healing

Bring back the healing❤️

[exotic stag]

or lower the invul

without the healing

[sleek wadi]

Nah healing should stay gone. Because of the healing, Coldheart Icicle needs 90 stabs instead of 50 and the max HP% damage guns effectively deal less damage

Just sync up the invuln to the lyrics kicking in and we're good

[frozen hornet]

fab also said that he doesn't like surprise phases which is one of the main reasons it was removed in the first place

[sleek wadi]

Keeps the flashiness and cuts down on the slowest part of the fight

[distant gyro]

Yharon doesn't need to heal for the phase to be climatic

for all we know he could have his own cutscene

I feel like bringing back healing over anything else is setting the standards low

[cobalt heath]

Cant we just vote on it and let the community say

And then let the devs think

[sleek wadi]

Thats how suggs work

[distant gyro]

#suggestions-voting message

[sleek wadi]

And currently nothing is getting to the devs because everything is drowning

[distant gyro]

but it's literally right there

[cobalt heath]

That was the sarcasm

But just wait and vote and let democrasy work

[exotic stag]

democracy will say no. like usual

[cobalt heath]

But the Changes what were made in 1.5 was a risk but i like em

[distant gyro]

democracy for the people works but it can only go so far before being rejected

it happens with 99% of "revert x change that just happened last update"

because that change obviously was decided for a reason

[cobalt heath]

I Hope My idea goes trough

[distant gyro]

when it gets there, it's just bound for rejection

unless you have a really compelling case on why x change should be reverted

[exotic stag]

^

[sleek wadi]

If you really want your stuff to go through I'd wait like, 2 months before suggs posting settles down and stuff isn't getting thrown off screen within 3 hours

[exotic stag]

^^^

literally i made a nerf sugg and in like.. a day it was already thrown out the window by like 6 other suggs

[worthy lintel]

problem is that nerf suggestions very rarely pass unless its something a good chunk of the comm can agree that it breaks the game

people don't like having less powerful tools

[tardy smelt]

this sugg sure did die to in-dev voting

[tardy smelt]

yuppp

[exotic stag]

i mean mine was literally able to kill game.. because of the amount of projectiles that it did

(insert elemental disk funny)

[cobalt heath]

Only nerf sugg that comes to mind wich went trough is the halibut nerf

[cobalt heath]

Oh you are the one i should flame. I was literally able to go till dog whit it before the nerf

[exotic stag]

wh?

no

i was talking about my sugg about nerfing ethereal extorter with it because of how fast the thing kills games bro

[cobalt heath]

Oh sorry

But old elemental was funny

[exotic stag]

yeah.. so funny

[cobalt heath]

Went from 240 fps to 4 before the nerf

[exotic stag]

i mean i literally crashed my game after nerf

[cobalt heath]

Fun

Halibuts nerf is prolly the Best weapon nerf ever In calamity

[worthy lintel]

@hardy whale you need to provide a reasoning and fix the formatting

Besides, Piggy is a critter so the issue is pretty much there to stay

[hardy whale]

[worthy lintel]

I do admit having to poke a 2000 hp critter with a pickaxe is not fun at all but there's not much the devs can do

[exotic stag]

didnt i submit a sugg for that a while ago?

yeah

[cloud surge]

Honestly why is this not a thing

[fossil finch]

Because it isn't

Trolle

[exotic stag]

trolle indeed

[cobalt heath]

Light Mode dc

Bro are you ok?

[hollow shell]

funny obligatory response

[cobalt heath]

Sarcastic laugh emojis

[exotic stag]

insert guy complaining about light mode here.

[hollow shell]

also @twin timber Doesn't setting the lighting mode to Retro or Trippy also disable screen shaders?

[exotic stag]

(retro lighting. )

[ashen warren]

they do yes

but it looks worse so

[full pivot]

@hardy whale formatting innit

also add reasoning

oh yeah also if you just want the money piggy can be caught with a bug net and sold for the same price

[safe oasis]

that's true but then you'll be stuck with retro or trippy quality lighting (very low quality)

[hollow shell]

It mainly affects blocks which you're not gonna be looking at much during SCal's fight anyway
Clone's fight, maybe

Could prolly be acknowledged in the suggestion anyhow

[shy dune]

@ancient widget heres a great idea make reaver shark pickaxe power 35

this way we will get 1.4 changes to 1.3

[worthy lintel]

why did you try to ping the owner instead of making full suggestion

[shy dune]

because amogus

[worthy lintel]

damn

(but yea use #suggestions-posting instead)

[shy dune]

look at #suggestions-posting

[worthy lintel]

There's a formatting to respect

And it's the 2nd ping you tried

[violet dagger]

lmao

[hollow shell]

Yeah uhh don't ping Fabsol please @shy dune

The suggestion system exists for a reason

[shy dune]

ok

[exotic stag]

[cobalt heath]

Add proper reasoning, multiple is always better

[exotic stag]

alek

the sugg is gone.

[cobalt heath]

Sad

[hollow shell]

(Actually I'll give you a full warn for that, your message history doesn't look pretty)

[shy dune]

what

messages can be pretty

[cobalt heath]

The scal thing suggested is a good idea but i think its kinda obsolete. Like yeah the p2 sprite looks better but the p1 sprite still took a lot off effort

[exotic stag]

he means "it looks kinda awful"

[shy dune]

i dont remember saying something bad bruh

[cobalt heath]

And basicly is trying to say nicely that you are a hazard to society by looking at your message history

[exotic stag]

well not a hazard

its just that hes unfriendly

[shy dune]

wait u cant say f#ck?

[exotic stag]

you can.

[frail mantle]

you can

[exotic stag]

hes talking about how unfriendly you were..

[shy dune]

og

oh*

wait

[ashen warren]

why are you talking about this just leave it

[shy dune]

im friendly

[cobalt heath]

Just leave it you are making it worse

[shy dune]

ok ok

[hollow shell]

Posted a few memes, complained about getting banned from Terraria main for LGBT jokes

[shy dune]

uhhh

[hollow shell]

Not quite squeaky clean

[shy dune]

sorry

but

the thing i was banned

was stupid

[hollow shell]

Yeah yeah I can see what you were talking about there

Coulda been a misunderstanding or whatever

[cobalt heath]

Making bad jokes about lqtbq is not really cool

[shy dune]

it wasnt a joke

[hollow shell]

Not really for this channel

[shy dune]

it was on #general-talk

[hollow shell]

(Sorry for my elaboration bringing us further off-topic)

[exotic stag]

its fine rover

[shy dune]

i said that on #general-talk not on here about that

[cobalt heath]

It doesnt Change the fact that you still said em

[shy dune]

oh

[hollow shell]

Yeah I meant this current conversation

[shy dune]

oh

ok i am sorry but please dont ban me i dont know any servers to talk tho

[hollow shell]

Yeah don't worry this is just a Warn

[cobalt heath]

Can we talk about the actual thing that this channel was made for and not about the reason why someone should be muted/warned/banned

[shy dune]

ok

lets go to #general-talk

[cobalt heath]

👍

[hollow shell]

byeah

BigE's sugg is fine
I disagree with the proposal of making Charred Ore spawn throughout the underworld, it'd be better to just increase the crafting quantity of the slabs

but that's my opinyot

[cobalt heath]

My sugg is so minor that the person Who made scarlet was like i could just add it

Or was they

[worthy lintel]

they even agreed it was thematically better

[cobalt heath]

They didnt atleast mind it

Cause wrath alone is so weird i dont like it. Like phantasmal, add some blood and shit, boom scarlet

[cobalt heath]

Is the going on voting part automated

Cause bot is now a minute late

[hollow shell]

Sometimes the bot gets hung up and needs to be reset. Give it a few more minutes to see if it catches up, and if not our bot dev can be pinged

Your life hearts change color.

There we go, the bot got it.

[cobalt heath]

There it goes

Can i vote on it myself Or is that not alloved

[hollow shell]

You can.

A drop in a bucket.

[ashen warren]

dude, now i crafted miracle fruit and tried to consume it, didnt work ( already consumed it without knowing ). heart colour doesnt help much

[exotic stag]

are you using unleveled

or anything that changes how hearts look

[ashen warren]

no

[exotic stag]

then did your hp increase

[ashen warren]

my heart colour was orange, miracle fruit was not consumed. so it was already consumed

[exotic stag]

then you used blood orange after using miracle fruit probably

[ashen warren]

yes

[hollow shell]

Ah yeah, that's the thing about the heart colors

They are sequential based on the intended order

Blood Orange is craftable before Miracle Fruit

So if you eat any of the health boosters for the first time, your hearts turn orange

[exotic stag]

o o f

[ashen warren]

ok so, i ate miracle fruit first ( cause it was not consumed now ), then i ate orange because heart colour is orange. how that possible

[hollow shell]

Are your hearts now green, after eating Blood Orange after Miracle Fruit?

[ashen warren]

bruh, i forgot i never ate blood orange, now they turned green

[hollow shell]

There you go

[flint ruin]

Anyone know any good pre hard-mode melee weapons

For Slime god

[ruby plover]

probably best to ask that in #help-advice-read-pins

[cobalt pewter]

stealth supremacy

[gray nebula]

skill issue

[cobalt pewter]

(no spam)

[gray nebula]

'just don't have carpal tunnel

:|

[grim tusk]

Infernum testing
fuck seashell boomerang why the fuck is it so op

[cobalt pewter]

[fossil finch]

Dev plans.png

[gray nebula]

that crazy bro.. almost as if it was alre

🤐

[cobalt pewter]

sticky fingers

[grim tusk]

I hope we dont find any more issues in pre-hm cuz mechs are going to be pain

Blazing star is already the carpal tunnel wep on this stage

[worthy lintel]

@tawny drift refrain from making joke suggestions please

[tawny drift]

it wasn't.

[worthy lintel]

A better alternative to your suggestion is simply to not toggle on Malice

The devs are not removing such a big feature

[tawny drift]

remove it

[hollow shell]

Even if it wasn't a joke sugg it was insubstantial to the point of being invalid

What problems do you have with Malice Mode? We can start from there

[tawny drift]

bad

[hollow shell]

Why's that?

[tawny drift]

👎

[hollow shell]

(are you going to attempt to be helpful at all?)

[tawny drift]

nah

[hollow shell]

A shame

[dense marlin]

[tawny drift]

👍

[hollow shell]

Okay definitely a better suggestion, it's actually acceptable by the bot

[tawny drift]

yeah sorry i'm being baby

[crude geode]

Isn’t there already a suggestion in voting relating to this

[hollow shell]

There've been a few iirc

[tawny drift]

when i scrolled up i didn't see it

so i clearly didn't do enough

[hollow shell]

Few weeks old

It's fine

[marble hazel]

reposts fine if its like few weeks old yea

[crude geode]

Ah alright

[ruby plover]

pretty sure there have been multiple people that have put suggestions for malice drops to be moved back to revengeance, i think they may have not fixed their suggestion after needing to fix it tho. if my memory serves me well

[crude geode]

I think so yeah

[cobalt pewter]

time to make it a don't

like seriously

this suggestion is never going through no matter what happens tbh

[worthy lintel]

I wouldn't say that

Enough people in disagreement can prompt a change, even if its small

[hollow shell]

Malice has been a point of contention in the dev server too

for a few devs, at least

[worthy lintel]

Well, items such as The Bee and Community are 100% understandable locked in Malice

But items such as Crown Jewel? Ehh

[crude geode]

I also don’t understand the purpose of each mode now ngl.

[small timber]

what malice drop is even used before 1.5? the only one I know for sure is scarf and crown jewel

[cobalt rose]

making the legendary drops malice-only is ok with me

[tawny drift]

for me i didn't see the changelog and thought my game was clitched when i didn't get a scarf. i tried to fix and mod conflicts or character/world bugs for like an hour before i realized

[hollow shell]

Didn't check the wiki?

[small timber]

for weapons maybe just that two yharon drop (void vortex and yharim crystal)

[tawny drift]

i checked the wiki and didn't see the malice only at the very top my brain auto read it as revengeance only

[hollow shell]

wew

[crude geode]

Rev and Death seem just like incredibly similar with not much differentiating them (which brings up the point of why have it)

[hollow shell]

Well Death has the world stuff

[small timber]

death and rev is a lot different, difficulty wise

like a lot, people who is used to death might not notice

[crude geode]

Not that the world stuff has really ever been expanded on since it was introduced to differentiate the modes more

I’d argue that the legendary drops could have just been moved to death mode ngl

[distant gyro]

challenge drops are alright

[small timber]

I will argue the other way, challenge for death and legendary for malice

[hollow shell]

The devs have sorta decided that they dislike difficulty modes being used for item exclusivity
That vanilla started a bad trend with making Expert items

And that Malice is the dedicated "mode" for unlocking new items which is not intended to be a playthrough difficulty

[distant gyro]

although when there are 3 of them concentrated on the same boss you kinda wonder if it could've gone somewhere else

[small timber]

I think the main point of conflict is the fact that malice is introduced "as a mode"

[distant gyro]

malice is just weird

[small timber]

a very easy solution is to just make bosses summoned in malice through a "upgraded summon item" instaed

like suspicious looking eye upgrade summon malice EoC, something along the line

will face much less complain

[hollow shell]

(I'm still rooting for this suggestion, even though it didn't get a lot of stars)
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/458432092301295618/918615376949047366/unknown.png

[distant gyro]

In terms of AI it's an extension to death mode, and overlaps all of death mode entirely along with giving bosses dm AI even in normal mode

[small timber]

partially disagree with that, because to certain degree some people will still try to beat malice on tier (and be able to do it), and also that beating regular version remove reactive dr

[hollow shell]

Malice always has Reactive DR

[distant gyro]

so it sounds like the 5th main difficulty and not a difficulty branch

[crude geode]

Yeah

I didn’t realize it gave all bosses death mode AI

[distant gyro]

it's not what a classic enrage would do

[crude geode]

That’s kinda silly ngl.

[distant gyro]

which would simply make things faster

and not implement new AI

[crude geode]

It’d be like if you were playing normal terraria and queen bee suddenly became expert queen bee when enraged

[small timber]

I think Malice activation should be "activate the ability to craft Malice summon items", so even if people activated malice they will not feel obligated to fight malice bosses, the choice is still theirs whether to craft malice summon or not

[distant gyro]

suppose you just play on normal mode and plan to activate malice to get new drops

[small timber]

since we already have draedon decryption indicating that something like this may be possible

[distant gyro]

then you use it and suddenly spazmatism starts firing shadowflame and homing shadowballs

that is rather uncanny

[crude geode]

It is indeed very wack

Also ngl I feel like death mode shouldn’t have boss changes. It just makes it feel more like Rev 2.0, Harder Boogaloo

If you’re gonna do anything with death mode just make it focus on the world change aspects

[small timber]

the difficulty difference still exist, just that there was gear difference between expert and rev, with death being just difficulty increase
now rev is expert but harder (and with rippers), and death is harder rev

people who can barely beat rev will get destroyed in death, so the distinction should still be there, just need something else to set them apart

[worthy lintel]

Problem with this approach is that keeping only the environmental changes would just make the game more annoying, the highlight of Death are the AI changes

[dusty stirrup]

Deathmode is the jack of all trades but master of none

[worthy lintel]

And about half of the env changes are gone the moment you hit Hardmode

[crude geode]

That’s more a failure of the environmental changes being added and then never touched upon again

[small timber]

and I don't think people care about the env either, most people play deaths for harder bosses rather than to be bothered with early game cave darkness or random lightning strike when raining

[dusty stirrup]

Deathmode needs revising and even moreso now with the addition of malice

[crude geode]

#suggestions-voting message

#suggestions-voting message

I feel like Rev but Harder is just far less unique than what the environmental changes could be

[distant gyro]

death mode just does not exist imo

[cobalt pewter]

If we're being real here, yeah death and malice totally need revamps

(I'd prefer malice removal but ech)

[hollow shell]

(This is never going to happen but
We could remove all the boss buffs from Death Mode, and slightly buff up Rev to make up for that loss in difficulty tier
And retheme Death Mode to be an optional "Furious World" toggle that can be used in any difficulty)

[cobalt pewter]

but I don't have high hopes for that

[crude geode]

I’d honestly prefer that for death mode

[cobalt pewter]

sure

[cobalt heath]

Wait did My sugg get accepted Or what

[dusty stirrup]

Yes

: )

[cobalt heath]

Yay

[hollow shell]

Yep it happened

[crude geode]

Masochist no hit “hurt me lots please calamity” players can already get their fill from arma defiled malice fuck mode

[distant gyro]

I prefer malice to be simple enrage, death mode removed

[cobalt pewter]

ah the Scarlet Devil recipe

I thought it's smth else

[cobalt pewter]

mad

(malice arma death)

[hollow shell]

I heard the term "Maid Mode" for the first time a few days ago and it made me double take

Malice Arma IronHeart Death

[small timber]

the thing is public expectation, death mode is perceived as "harder revengeance but still fair", which is why when death mode bosses was unfair there was a lot of complain

[cobalt pewter]

wheeze

[worthy lintel]

The I is attention bait though

[small timber]

while malice can be the ground to make bosses "excruciatingly hard" without facing any complain

[crude geode]

players already get their fill of difficulty

Malice+Armageddon+Defiled Feather

[small timber]

armageddon and defiled are more self-imposed, people will not consider them to be difficulty

when they say difficulty they see "classic" and "expert"

[crude geode]

People are also very stupid ya gotta realize

they complain about things like heart rapier being removed

[hollow shell]

But it may be a bad thing that Malice is as hard as it is

Something I said in dev:

[crude geode]

Yeah sounds about right lol

[small timber]

(although definitely high-effort), I think it is very agreeable that Malice need a rework

because there are many interesting changes with malice, but it get so overshadowed by just bosses moving 2x faster and hit 2x harder

[cobalt pewter]

I just don't like how the initial idea of making the riv and legendaries obtainable in a consistent way was kinda corrupted to this fuckass mode

[crude geode]

I think that you can shove current “malice+current death mode AI”changes into a new “difficulty” while making death “angry world”

[small timber]

I think malice mode should be an experiment ground where they introduce some "fucked-up difficulty" that will certainly face complain in death

(although high effort), like Scal sepulcher must be manually destroyed after brimstone heart, 4 rows of brismtone heart at each corner, +2/3 bullet hell sections, curving projectiles etc

[hollow shell]

(Having changes like that for every fight would definitely be high effort yeah)

[small timber]

yeah certainly, but I think it is very agreeable that it is a better idea for malice (just as an idea, I recognize the amount of effort it will take)

[crude geode]

Malice is a modifier moreso than a difficulty mode of it’s own

But the modifier sucks balls and simply overrides things currently

[small timber]

I feel like Malice was more of like a retaliation from devs to people saying "death mode is too easy"

[crude geode]

Every calamity elitist will always say “(blank) mode is too easy” because they’re insane people who spend 12 hours a day mastering the newest hardest shit, or just trolls

[hollow shell]

It wasn't intended to be that way
We came up with the idea of it being a perma-enrage pretty early on, and to consolidate all of the different enrage types into one (incorrect biome/time, Malice, Demonshade set bonus, etc)
But... then it was decided to make enrages also use the Death AI
And so Malice became harder than Death

[small timber]

hmm interesting to get an insight on it, because I only based my statement on one of the devs saying "now that Malice exist people will stop complaining that calamity is too easy"

[grim tusk]

The I in DADI and MAID stands for
“I abuse effects that happen at certain hp thresholds (rotten brain, necklace of vexation, yharim’s insignia, OD’s scales, etc)”

Iron heart without Arma is just

[small timber]

ya the I literally has 0 effect on A, just pure benefit

unless you are actively degening (for some reason)

[crude geode]

Brimflame moment

[silver silo]

Dunno if anybody commented on it but didn’t a dev say a special cryogen summon was planned?

[crude geode]

Iban indeed let it slip that it is being planned

[crude geode]

Here

[small timber]

pretty much yes I think, but at the same time it is not a public knowledge (I mean not in change log), so the suggestion itself should be valid

[silver silo]

Haha I fucking knew it was iban

Chad dev

[hollow shell]

Yeah Flak's sugg is fine

[cobalt heath]

Elizo its a good idea but will prolly not get in

Devs dont like taking back Major changes

[crude geode]

Yeah but I would also read the convo above cuz malice is contentious

[tawny drift]

i'll just take a month to cope

[cobalt heath]

Content being locked behind malice is kinda eh imo cause malice is malice

[safe oasis]

content is a strong word there

it’s an optional overpowered weapon/accessory

[cobalt heath]

Yes, so i would pretty much say it was a good change

Nothing forzes to get them. They are just really good but not nessesary

[tawny drift]

i always loved getting the counter scarf in revengeance and now i don't really have much of a reason to activate the mode

[small timber]

unironically I think if they just add a new item to expert that is literally pre-hardmode tabi crafted from SoC or something it will shut off a lot of complain

since the most argued malice drop is counter scarf

[hollow shell]

I dunno why people dislike SoC

[small timber]

they are just used to tabi-like dash, because most people only use it to dodge projectile rather than actively bash into enemy, so the bash bounceback become a limitation rather than advantage

[hollow shell]

Or at least, why Counter Scarf was so much better than it that it made doing Rev worth it completely

[small timber]

and most people can do revengeance fine but still a big gap for death

[crude geode]

The fact is that the bouncing off is a bit tough to get used to

[small timber]

so to them taking away counter scarf just become a massive nerf rather than "well SoC is as good if not better"

[tawny drift]

are the perma rage and adrenaline buffs also malice?

[crude geode]

those are Rev

[tawny drift]

alright

so crabulon has a new malice drop?

[cobalt heath]

Yes i think so

[tawny drift]

he did drop an adrenaline buff right

i feel like i might be saying something stupid

[hollow shell]

Can't remember what Crab got in Malice

Oh he got Transformer

[tawny drift]

optiimum pride

geh ee a a ow

[hollow shell]

I like Transformer solely cuz of the awesome sprite

[tawny drift]

yeah that is pretty cool

[cobalt heath]

Rover did the fact that scarlets creator liked My idea play into the accepting

[hollow shell]

Yes

[cobalt heath]

Nice

Tje Best thing imo about the malice Changes was that gael is actually easy to get now

Gael is such a good weapon its good that its not that rare No more

[ruby plover]

wait huh?

"easy to get"

[cobalt heath]

Malice scal is not that hard

(I am a No-hitter veteran)

[safe oasis]

who

[grim tusk]

People cant abuse :gaelsmile: anymore, now mana-less mage (as in ark of the cosmos for those without context) rules pre-Scal braindead homing again

I miss nitro sometimes

[cobalt heath]

Gael before was like you get it you get it and youll use it if melee

Now its consistant to get

And consistansy is always better than chance

[grim tusk]

Very true

[river glen]

well rev drops back to normal is just dumb

hehe got drop first try

but then u have people about the shit luck they are having

u have to balance around that and for some the effort is nothing for others the effort is hours of tedious grinding

[grim tusk]

Or people just going alch npc operator goes brrr

Meta was stale as hell

[safe oasis]

or just don’t use the weapon tbh

[cobalt heath]

Is corvus adventor a malice drop btw

That shit was bad back In the day when playing rogue praying not getting the melee version

[ruby plover]

no its not a malice drop

[cobalt pewter]

no

but it got reworked now

and oddly enough it's the only rogue weapon I know so far to have a somewhat MP oriented effect as stealth strike

[crude geode]

MP lol

[torn crown]

Was there a reasoning behind you having to hold a movement key in order for GS dash to work?

[hollow shell]

Because it's omni-directional, you have to tell it which direction you want it to dash you to

[cobalt heath]

Perfs rn are fine

[river glen]

isnt it like smth like blunder booster?

[pulsar marlin]

Crystal Blade is quite useless

Ngl it has very low damage compared to most melee weapons and it is outclassed by them.

[crude geode]

Mfw rework instead of buff one of the short range melee weapons

[cobalt heath]

I Hope the charred idol Change goes trough

[cobalt pewter]

who knows

the devs definitely wanted to make the alts a fixed progression

cryo - as - brimmy

for what reason I don't know

[frozen hornet]

Why was burning sky changed to work like a staff?

[ruby plover]

Probably because it basically was not in any way a melee weapon, really (also I know it still it a melee damage weapon)

I doubt anyone actually desired to go for the true melee with it before

[eternal escarp]

tbf the fact they removed its normal swing makes it further then melee

[frozen hornet]

Yea but it's swinging is the only thing keeping it being melee

[ruby plover]

Yeah it literally looks like a magic weapon now

[eternal escarp]

personally, id say they should have kept that little bit of melee to make it make sense, or just convert its damage type

[distant gyro]

because it isn't melee

[ruby plover]

Looks just a tad similar to Phoenix flame barrage

[distant gyro]

[eternal escarp]

tro

[frozen hornet]

Now it's quite literally manaless mage, even more so than ark which is funny

[frail mantle]

starcore

[frozen hornet]

@boreal musk can't you just move the altar?

Also ye starcore

but it's post-deus

[ruby plover]

Yeah, the altar can be moved (and crafted), and you don’t need to be in the astral infection to summon it

Also atlases spawn more commonly post-cultist pre-astrum deus, to mitigate that issue to a degree

[eternal escarp]

For balancing purposes, probably give it a somewhat difficult crafting recipe thst could include Titan Hearts maybe.
to be fair making a summon non-consumable has 0 impact on game balance

and regardless as stated above here

Starcore, a post Deus infinite summon item, exists

and Atlases spawn uncommonly, its not too hard to actually achieve a few Titan Hearts

[small timber]

I think there should be no problem for deus summon to be infinite pre-deus, since many other summon items are already non-consumable

so why should deus be consumable when starcore already exist

the only two others that I can remember is WoF (due to Guide Voodoo Doll must be consumed unless alternative method of summoning is introduced) and Scal (but it use ash of calamity which is easily obtainable at that stage of the game and "eye of extinction" exist)

[cobalt pewter]

truffle and blood worms

both are closer to titan hearts

in terms of how they work

[small timber]

that two is probably directly Tmodloader limitation, because you cant make unconsumable baits

also more likely just tradition (like WoF)

[eternal escarp]

Scal (but it use ash of calamity which is easily obtainable at that stage of the game and "eye of extinction" exist)
this is the exact case with AD to be fair

the summon item is very easy to get a hold of at that stage, and you can summon it infinitely right after for farming convenience

the only difference is, 1 is a boss drop while the other in an enemy drop

[small timber]

to certain degree it make sense, just that Scal is intended to be one of the final boss of the mod, so I feel like it makes more of an exception, while for Deus I see no harm for it having non-consumable pre-Deus (by making Starcore available earlier)

and also drop quantity of 1 for titan heart do not really help

[gray nebula]

don't atlases get an increased spawn rate post cultist

[small timber]

ya, but the case is just for the argument is that it may be unnecessary for deus to have "consumable summons" even pre-deus

considering if it is intended to be post-cultist (somewhat), often that the player may also need to clear pillars then farm the hearts

Scal can make an exception due to the plot and gameplay relevance of her as one of the final boss, but deus is just a pre-ML boss

[gray nebula]

I mean it's just more fun

,

[eternal escarp]

thats what the "...tunneling the astral infecion" message stands for??

[gray nebula]

deviating a bit from haha craft summon item haha

[eternal escarp]

i had no idea thats what the message is implying if thats the case

i wanted to suggest to make that message be mor elike "Lurks the astral air" or something since the current message makes it feel like an UG boss rather then a "surface" one

but if thats what its supposed to imply then it doesnt do its job well iirc

[small timber]

or if more dramatic "the astral god descend from the stars", since practically astrum deus is a flying worm not a tunneling worm

[fossil finch]

That's more of a wanting to tell you deus exists

Atlas thing is kind of still a thing when you needed to kill 3 of them

[eternal escarp]

well regardless it makes it more imply of an UG boss / entity

[sick bane]

Make ravager despawn from further away
I'm not sure how its speed scales in modes that aren't Death, but I have lost several attempts at ravager due to it, when at low health and super-jumping all the time, jumps a little too far away from me and despawns. I can't imagine this is intended, so it would make the boss feel much fairer to fight without having to worry about it running away.

[worthy lintel]

@sick bane post that in #suggestions-posting

And I think it's being worked on

[fossil finch]

@small timber anyways for you
While they may take time to implement, wouldn't it still be kinda useless to boost their stats like this? I mean as in, if they do that they may as well be reworking the thing right away

[small timber]

well currently it is literally useless, as it pal/cob/ori/myt armors literally have less stats than statigel even on pure numbers except defense stat

the suggestion is just for temporary solution so that they are not literally not worth using whatsoever

[fossil finch]

I mean that like

Temporary solution when
Next update may aswell be the one with the reworks

[small timber]

oh they are working on it right now? then I guess the suggestion will not be necessary

I thought it will be the next major update

[fossil finch]

I mean we don't know for sure (and they're taking a rest anyways) but no it is not for the next major update
1.5.1 is confirmed to be something else

[small timber]

ya, then I guess to some sense it will not be necessary, just that I initially thought there is confirmation that it will be way later

[pulsar marlin]

I hope so, in our terms of progression

[cobalt heath]

Its a valid point cause they are meant to be non linear

[exotic stag]

wait doesnt starcore still exist for nero's sugg?

(i mean its post deus but still exists if you needed to grind him)

[fossil finch]

Yes it does

[exotic stag]

so yeah just starcore it post deus.

[frozen hornet]

making vanq and gss need luminite is kind of a hassle

[small timber]

the reason is a bit stretching, not really any direct connection with "laser" and "clone arrow"

[frozen hornet]

Ye

[small timber]

and ya it is just add an extra step to crafting ammo

[ripe owl]

They are additional projectiles

[small timber]

a lot of things in the game have additional projectile

[ripe owl]

Whatever

Not that kind of a projectile yknow

[small timber]

just that particularly I don't see any connection of luminite arrow with clone arrow, other than it is additional projectile
they simply don't relate

both thematically and functionally

if something clone arrow relate more to phantasm than luminite arrow

[ripe owl]

Luminite, drops from a Moon Lord only (i know it ain't anymore)
Cosmilite, drops from the Devourer of Gods only

[frozen hornet]

That's a really loose connection

[small timber]

that is not really a solid reason to just make them an upgrade with each other, at the very least make no sense whatsoever

that is like saying draedon drop should have connection with scal drop just because both drop from exclusive bosses

[ripe owl]

That is a complete bs

[exotic stag]

"weapons have similar functions. so make one an upgrade of the other"

[small timber]

ya, same as ml and dog, there is nothing relate between them whatsoever

[ripe owl]

1 bar = 333 ammo
Bars/ore drop exclusively from bosses and you can't get them any other way (YES I KNOW ABOUT PLANETOIDS)
Somewhere somewhat similar functions

[small timber]

this is even more stretching, considering that is literally just the amount of ammo you craft

[cobalt pewter]

yeah

this is quite reaching

even for my desperate standards

[frozen hornet]

If that's usable then I can suggest a cosmilite kunai because luminite has a kunai as well

[exotic stag]

^

bazinga

[frozen hornet]

Byeah that's kinda stretching it

[cobalt pewter]

fuck yes, give me more rogue weapons

[small timber]

I will just make a different iteration of your suggestion: frostburn arrow should be a burning arrow upgrade with ice block, naplam arrow should be upgrade from hellfire arrow and hyperious bullet should be upgrade from crystal bullet

[frozen hornet]

I hope there's more auric ones

[small timber]

it is just unnecessary extra step for no reason whatsoever

[cobalt pewter]

exos one have lame stealth strikes tbh

just wee more projectiles oonga boonga

[frozen hornet]

celestus at least feels powerful

[cobalt pewter]

I mean

the exos drop

[frozen hornet]

Ah right

[exotic stag]

celestus? why not just use elemental disk

[cobalt pewter]

not the exo crafts

[safe oasis]

tbh make all broadsword weapons upgrades of the wooden sword because they act the exact same following this logic

[cobalt pewter]

I haven't seen Celestus and Supernova atm

[exotic stag]

celestus is kinda op cause it uses ele disk function except faster & stronger

[frozen hornet]

atom splitter looks cool but ref rotor looks meeh

[exotic stag]

although not as many "projectiles" shoot out

because of how fast it is

[cobalt pewter]

the stealth strike was kinda piss poor before 1.5, but again, I haven't used it now

[frozen hornet]

It does decent damage but it doesn't feel all that strong

[cobalt pewter]

I gotta say Celestus stealth strike is fairly fine compared to exos drop rogue weapons tho

Atom Splitter is the comedy

[frozen hornet]

celestus' speed feels like throwing a truck

[exotic stag]

reaper

reaper vs yharon feels kinda unfair cause he just gets abused..

[frozen hornet]

Is reaper's stealth still funny quint scythe

[exotic stag]

yes

[cobalt pewter]

honk honk fuckers

but either way, not gonna derail the convo too much

[worthy lintel]

how did it go from bullets to celestus

byea

[exotic stag]

bulletus

[grim tusk]

@boreal musk star core exists

[grim tusk]

Strong
Celestus feels similar to 1.4.5.7 (except that dps is the opposite of laughable)
Supernova now has bigger bang and stealth hits fucking hard

[grim tusk]

Atom splitter and refraction rotor

[deft yew]

Honestly I feel like Supernova stealth and spam should be swapped
So it always trails homing energy but the mega explosion is only stealth

[grim tusk]

Mega explosion is on both

Maybe slightly bigger on stealth

But spam is bigger than in 1.4.5.7 by a huge margin thats for sure

[deft yew]

I mean like
Wave Pounder feels right (aside from how garbage it is on spam )

Supernova stealth just feels weak because not much changes and you already get the explosion on spam

[grim tusk]

Visually

[cobalt pewter]

supernova hasn't got the chungus rework yet no?

[grim tusk]

No but got buffed a lot

[cobalt pewter]

alr

[deft yew]

Wait it gets a rework later?

[grim tusk]

Its just not seeking missile of doom yet

Which may never happen considering how rogue is

[deft yew]

[cobalt pewter]

draedon chat is archived

hooboo

can't yoink ozz's essay on supernova rework

[boreal musk]

post deus which makes it annoying

[grim tusk]

Atlases are easy to grind anyways

Just zerg pot or smth

Or cheat star core in

@boreal musk acknowledge star core in your sugg, also asking for certain recipes is a dont

[hollow shell]

That's not a specific recipe, it's fine

I do agree that Starcore should be acknowledged to explain why it is insufficient

[half sage]

perhaps retooling the suggestion to making the starcore pre deus, as if you make a different pre deus nonconsumable, the starcore loses all purpose, and it would be less work for the devs to just change starcore's recipe than to make a new item and remove starcore since it no longer has a unique purpose

[fossil finch]

But then why even have atlas hearts at that point

[hollow shell]

It'd probably have a dynamic like the two Profaned Cores did in previous updates

... except the consumable core got removed eventually

Hey that's a good point actually

AD is one of the only bosses that has a consumable on-tier summon method still

[half sage]

him, Scal, and the dukes are the only ones iirc

[hollow shell]

That's another thing Nero could bring up
Deus is now out-of-place among bosses for keeping a consumable summon method

[fossil finch]

The thing is how it's summoned doe

I mean you could just change that for him and scal ig

And then starcore and ceremonial urn become useless again and need to be removed

Cringe

[paper torrent]

Well, so does SCal.

Oh, that was already brought up. Man, I'm slow.

[exotic stag]

(also wof exists.. but i mean his summon is way easier)

[fossil finch]

Grinding for titan hearts is as easy imo

[paper torrent]

You know... Zerg potions exist.

I also have some QoL mods that make grinding a bit less of a chore since I have 3000+ hours.

[rare hazel]

Would the 1.4.3 terraspark boots be in the angel threads recipe? I asking since in 1.4.3 the frost spark boots and the lava waders can get combined

[exotic stag]

insert future content

[eternal escarp]

WoF, SCal, Dukes are the others yeah
But then agian, AD's summoning ritual is more akin to the special summons to the likes of Golem, Plantera, AS's natural spawn, etc

byeah SCal is the biggest example for this as mentioned a few times

its not exactly out of place

especially if its for a more thematic reason

like WoF's dolls

or Skeletron's NPC

[fossil bronze]

vanilla power cells are also consumable still iirc

speaking of power cells
they seem kind of redundant now
the old power cell is non-consumable and pretty easy to craft

[eternal escarp]

i mean, cant remove vanilla items because that could lead to a lot of issues iirc

and the calamity added one is slightly different i think?

[half sage]

yea, they're kinda irrelevant now but they're a vanilla feature so they ain't getting removed period

[fossil bronze]

you don't need to use it on the altar

[eternal escarp]

yeah so

[fossil bronze]

it just spawns golem

[eternal escarp]

theres a difference

so no real point to delete Old Power Cell either

[fossil bronze]

i suppose

[pulsar marlin]

Ahem, Starcore exists

Talking about the newest suggestion

[eternal escarp]

5th time it was mentioned iirc

[fossil bronze]

it's post astrum deus though
which means before it's defeated you have to use consumable titan hearts

[eternal escarp]

which are easy enough to get regardless

[shadow otter]

would it be a good idea to move gravity normalizer potions earlier into progression for those who made a medium/small world?

[hollow shell]

Not a big problem for medium worlds, and our philosophy around small worlds is that if you make one you are asking for trouble anyway

But, it wouldn't be an invalid suggestion

[grim tusk]

I just had a possibly amazing idea but too bad its a SIS
Essentially: adding more weapons from the “Winds of destruction” from MTGRR
L’etranger would be summoner and summons Mistral’s bots
Whatever Monsoon uses would be rogue and used like in his boss fight’s ph2 and the stealth strike drags you towards the enemy and stuns it (like how the weapon does when used by Raiden)
Bloodlust would be melee and its just big true melee machetes
Some chainsaw or a mount to represent Khasmin

Ranger and Mage get nothing

Any ideas on how to make a suggestion for this and not get instant SIS mark?

[humble sonnet]

I was thinking about that too, that would be awesome

But something's been on my mind after reading this: tModLoader 1.4 is coming soon, with this Summoners will now have Whips, mabe Mistral's weapon could be a Summoner Whip?

And something could be used to summon Blade Wolf as a Minion, acting similar to the Desert Tiger

[grim tusk]

A reasoning could be:
We got Murasama from Minuano Sam. So what about the rest of the Winds of destruction? They could provide options as well as making the trips to the labs more meaningful rather than get schematic and parts, get out. Specially later in the game

[grim tusk]

Could work as well

[humble sonnet]

Yeah, maybe these weapons could work like Murasama, by "Proving our Worth" or "Having the right ID"...

To prevent people from Dealing 30K+ Damage pre-Hardmode lol

[humble sonnet]

Hey i just thought about something, maybe one of Raiden's Subweapons (EMP Grenades, Rocket Launchers, Etc...) could work for Ranger. As for Mages i really have no ideia of what could be used from MGR. Also a Helicopter and Khasim Metal Gear could be nice Mounts.

[grim tusk]

EMP grenades would go to rogue no question, but unlikely they get added as plasma grenades exist

[humble sonnet]

Oh yeah True

But something that would be really awesome are Costume Sets from MGR Characters

A Jetstream Sam Vanity Set would go really well with a Murasama in Hand 🙂

[grim tusk]

@turbid tendon formatting
title
Reasoning

[turbid tendon]

aight

[hollow shell]

This is as good idea

But

Actually, I was gonna say that the title could be clearer, but it's pretty clear if you read the rest of it

So it's fine

[turbid tendon]

okay

[hollow shell]

(you could still edit the title if you want)

("without having to start the fights" or something)

[turbid tendon]

did so

[hollow shell]

Nice 👍

[turbid tendon]

it would be quite helpful to have since sometimes you could get one melted before placing the border

[hollow shell]

@ Trashbox sugg
But this is just free DR throughout all of Rev boss battles right?

[half sage]

perhaps instead of separate items they could be right click functions of the egg/ left click function of the altar? like "left click the altar to spawn the arena blocks", build arena, then right click the altar to consume the ashes and spawn Scal

[earnest raptor]

Edited

[hollow shell]

That is still a significant amount

20% DR is the highest amount of DR any piece of equipment can give you in Calamity

The DR Stat, that is
which Adrenaline isn't
It's separate, meaning it isn't subject to the DR scaling 'softcap' mechanic

[earnest raptor]

Okay, if you think that's OP, I will delete the sugg

[distant gyro]

that's wrong smh

[hollow shell]

The max-Adren DR is interesting because it not only serves as forgiveness for not activating your Adren before getting hit
but it allows you to choose between taking halved damage and choosing to deal boosted damage

While Adrenaline is building, you don't have that choice, it'd just be free protection

[hollow shell]

God damn it, I don't want to do another arithmetic test just to understand how a game mechanic works

[distant gyro]

ADR is simply DR 2

both of them get affected by the softcap

just that because they are separate, having a mix of the two helps make the diminishing returns not as drastic

comparatively to putting all the DR in one basket

[exotic stag]

insert fourth "make ravager spawn further away" sugg

[hollow shell]

Last one was two weeks ago so this can stay

[exotic stag]

(i know but like. its literally the same thing)

although that one from two weeks ago is just

"im mad and im gonna rant"

(just use rope. but okay)

wait

wrong potion

crap

nvm just use a hook. build platform hook to platform boom

[hollow shell]

Temi's sugg is fine

[exotic stag]

which one? rues or the other

[worthy lintel]

has to be rue's due to timestamps

woops i mean the other way around

typed too fast

[exotic stag]

well for me it says rovers a minute ahead

[worthy lintel]

discord

as for the most recent sugg

there used to be a screen darkening effect iirc

[velvet lynx]

since i keep going too far and i cant really see anything then i guess its no longer there or not working haha

[exotic stag]

its no longer there

its replaced with the tiny flame above the players head

[hollow shell]

Yeah the screen darkening was replaced with a flame on the player

cuz the darkening was very.. obstructive

[exotic stag]

tbf the flame could be color changed

and bigger

[hollow shell]

and the darkening could be more harmful than the actual DoT due to the loss of vision

I thought there was a suggestion to increase the visibility of the on-player flame, but I think it got reworked into this:

[exotic stag]

eh probably

(also "turning music off" kinda negates the entire sound effect thing)

i would've suggested changing the flame to maybe be like 1.5x bigger and maybe just black instead? since it doesnt get hidden by both night and day forms

or wait would it..

[warped oracle]

That would suck because me, personally, i play with the music and sound off, and when i don't, my music is too loud to hear anything. So i'll just die out of nowhere. I much prefered the darkness

[hollow shell]

Obligatory comment:

This would detract from Murasama's uniqueness

Especially considering it has a whole Draedon log page dedicated to it

[rugged belfry]

I disagree with the idea of adding more Murasama-type weapons since it’s so unique, although I agree with the idea of doing something to make the labs more interesting/relevant in early gameplay.

[crude geode]

I can agree with that part yeah, considering the arctic diving gear in the frost lab

[grim tusk]

hmm

[crude geode]

But adding more funny metal gear references just seems like reference for the sake of reference (even more so than murasama already is)

[grim tusk]

if only i got stuff like this sooner

maybe how about using the plates

for something earlier

rather than yes i mined em but i can only use em for decoration until post-ML

[cobalt pewter]

giving more general purposes to the labs is good

[fossil finch]

don't give tracers hovering
Tracer meta dies

[hollow shell]

@tidal sage You're going to need a more extensive reasoning than that

And also yeah I would personally prefer that Tracers do not get any more encouragement, people already gravitate toward them so heavily

[crude geode]

Indeed

[tidal sage]

[thick river]

Much more reasoning, and also proper capitalization in the title

[tidal sage]

oh wait you're the guy who made the acid rain theme right

[hollow shell]

yeah

[tidal sage]

👍

great song

[thick river]

Yeah don’t get mad at the mod

[hollow shell]

lol

[thick river]

Would not recommend

[hollow shell]

Thanks man

[tidal sage]

its so great

[thick river]

It is

[tidal sage]

just wish music boxes were functional

took me like 4 hours last playthrough to get it on a music box