so adding more would probably just turn others obsolete
#suggestions-discussion
manic gale
considering most good summons are just a projectile, clinger, or charger minion that does more damage and applies more status effects than the others
cobalt pewter
@ashen warren check the doc in pins
ashen warren
Oh alright
cobalt pewter
Specifically about balance concerns being forwarded to testers instead of suggestions
Plus everything should be planned to be balanced in 1.5
ashen warren
Nah it's a buff but it's also like a rework in how it attacks
Like it adds tornados and stuff
I didn't reccomend any specific values
Just "the way it attacks itself is boring and not viable compared to other summons"
tawny garden
Plus everything should be planned to be balanced in 1.5
Most of the balance will concern post-ML byeah
ashen warren
🇧
tawny garden
And if you want to see a change in how the weapon works, you should include it in the title
ashen warren
Will do
tawny garden
That's better
ashen warren
What do you think about the actual sug tho
hollow shell
Damn, you hate to see it. Looks like he put a lot of effort into that without knowin it was against the rules
dapper coral
unfortunate
tawny garden
yeah 
dapper coral
@half kayak please don't
tawny garden
muted marsh
Yeah sorry for that, didn't know it wasn't allowed. Removed it then.
tawny garden
(fyi there's a doc in the pins)
muted marsh
Now I see, thanks
soft quest
would it be a good suggestion to play the unused theme, "catastrophes before the calamity" after Yharon is defeated?
frail mantle
the interludes are only there for the album
soft quest
ah
frail mantle
they're not meant to exist in-game
tawny garden
it's a don't
soft quest
theyre just so damn good
tawny garden
you can listen to them on Youtube/Spotify
soft quest
i know
frail mantle
yea they are good, they just are only intended to create atmosphere when listening through the album
soft quest
ok
hollow shell
(Big reason we don't wanna add it to the music mod is cuz of filesize)
(It's big enough already)
frail mantle
eah
tawny garden
and it's about to get even bigger
unreal star
draedon theme draedon theme
eternal escarp
you have to wait you have to wait
eternal escarp
(i actually thought you were involved in it, lmao)
(all we knew is that its multiple composers, from what ive seen in #calamity-update-talk )
dapper coral
merk has also been saying not to expect a theme right when 1.5 drops
tawny garden
(tho iunno who will end up makin the final Drae theme)
you won't be making it?
eternal escarp
oh yeah, im not hyping myself as if its 100%
byeah sorry for expanding to off topic lol
frozen storm
Dont stop buffing DoG
hollow shell
Your top line can be structured better
Prolly wanna start with the condition of his last phase with the black sky
Ok that's a bit better
tawny garden
is that a leftover from when his body segments could take a reasonable amount of damage?
hollow shell
Nah I think we just do it for effect Philo
tawny garden
m
zenith hazel
is this not a balancing suggestion?
eternal escarp
i think its supposed to mean that make fire rate shorter
b'like
doesnt that stuff require testers?
zenith hazel
well yes, I can see why
but we'll decide on what to do with it when we get to balancing the post-yharon weps
eternal escarp
ah yeah, thats fair
zenith hazel
also, just because a weapon is slow doesn't mean it's bad
for example, halley's inferno
zenith hazel
an awkward to use weapon doesn't make it bad either
for example, most of draedon's shit
so yeah @rancid saddle , we'll get to testing supernova soon and we'll make the decision on what to do with it ourselves
hollow shell
Reason could be better. A weapon firing slowly is not inherently bad
manic gale
i think he's more saying its too slow for its other stats
hollow shell
If he does mean that, he could make it more clear
His whole reason is that it's too slow.. end of statement.
grim tusk
Last sugg rework and more reasoning example:
Supernova depends too much on glove of recklessness/ethereal exorter to do decent damage and does low dmg compared to other weapons in its tier, buffing its use speed will make the weapon a better choice and increase its viability rather than be used in niche scenarios were other weapons could perform better
swift wharf
isnt supernova getting tiershifted
grim tusk
Plasma nades are what you’re thinking of
sand umbra
Supernova is the exo bomb not the Arsenal wep
grim tusk
They function way too diferently but oh well
While testing post-Yharon tier weapons for a tierlist (which i wont post til a few weeks before 1.5 cuz i dont want to centralize the meta) I found out that supernova really depended on throwing speed. Its also funny with old die
It also does more dmg if an enemy is against a wall
Its decent on brothers
Sadly on Scal’s second phase its usefulness ends
tacit phoenix
I tested dps with it and it didnt do better than an emblem but still was pretty strong (with rogue weapon ofc)
it was slightly* worse
bu its prehm isnt it?
pine star
I tested dps with it and it didnt do better than an emblem but still was pretty ...
On average, Old Die=Avenger Emblem for rogues
grim tusk
“Old die will never be balanced,
So these memes will live on forever!” -Merk
pine star
And yes it is pre HM
tacit phoenix
thats pretty crazy
pine star
That said, on average is not perfect
grim tusk
Old die can reach more dmg boost than DSA on occasions
tacit phoenix
yeah, but its luck bases
grim tusk
Broken with multihit weps or that attack real fast
tacit phoenix
still, avg dmg buff is pretty crazy
worthy lintel
yea but DSA is literally only usable on 2 bosses
Old Die lasts nearly the whole game
grim tusk
Pre-SG to endgame 
pine star
Old die can reach more dmg boost than DSA on occasions
That requires a lot of luck
dapper coral
that's normal random damage
grim tusk
Rogue rolls twice and picks higher number and as i said its stronger with weapons that attack fast it gets more broke
dapper coral
old die is -25% to +30% iirc
pine star
it's -15% to +15% right?
That's default variation
Old Die variation is -25% to +30%
frail mantle
yea
grim tusk
Its also broken with slow weps if lucky enough
swift wharf
ah i see
grim tusk
Plasma nade’s stealth strike becomes ridiculous
swift wharf
weird
grim tusk
Vehemence now 1-shots BR Old Duke with a rage and brimstone enrage, rather than enrage + both rippers + frenzy
zenith hazel
ok?
grim tusk
I need to test with Scarlet devil
zenith hazel
how is this relevant to suggestions?
grim tusk
Also wand gets a 50k-150k dps increase
Yea we deviated a bit 
#suggestions-discussion message
This is were everything was fine before we started a convo here
Talking about this: #suggestions-posting message
viscid dagger
Hey yall back again. This time I have a more simple suggestion. Tone down the volume on the Greatsword of Judgement. My reason being is that its just way to loud and the volume seems to silence out everything else
grim tusk
Sounds good
half kayak
Hey yall back again. This time I have a more simple suggestion. Tone down the vo...
why are you using it anyway it causes i-frames
viscid dagger
Because with my current setup its my highest damage dealer against Yharon
golden narwhal
Funni bot is alive/dead again
grim tusk
Hopefully Nohit bot doesnt have a stroke as well
dapper coral
unlikely
gray nebula
dom dies
zenith hazel
I'll dm her too just to be sure
grim tusk
supreme bot of nohit souls reaping is fine
sugg bot aint
yes that is its role in nohit server
zenith hazel
doesn't eternity just auto stick itself to a target?
how does ssv's homing compare to that?
tawny garden
@vocal grotto eternity sugg
zenith hazel
I didn't ask for lag nor dps
I'm asking how ssv's homing is stronger than eternity
@kindred creek can you explain this?
grim tusk
eternity is better in every way, even homing
vocal grotto
Alternate attacks don't work with charge projectiles.
grim tusk
^
vocal grotto
Also Eternity determines what it attacks based on what's closest to the mouse, so homing is more or less irrelevant
tawny garden
yeah lol, it just locks into the target
homing 💯 
kindred creek
I'm not sure if it's my computer, but I seem to have an issue where eternity doesnt attack the enemies close to me
grim tusk
you need to hold button
zenith hazel
did you hold your left mouse button?
grim tusk
not just tap once
kindred creek
it just kinda holds out the book and nothing happens
grim tusk
maybe something you have is causing the projectile to disapear
zenith hazel
now I feel like it's a mod conflict
vocal grotto
That's #bugs-read-pins then
kindred creek
i tried it against supreme calmitas, and subsuming vortex killed him faster
zenith hazel
because eternity should only do that when there's 0 target nearby
grim tusk
yea sounds a lot like mod conflict
antilag mod installed?
if so disable delete far-away projectiles option
kindred creek
then again, it was on a server, do it could just be a server issue
grim tusk
mp
kindred creek
so*
grim tusk
zenith hazel
try doing it in singleplayer
grim tusk
mp causes a ton of bugs
tawny garden
kindred creek
for eternity all I have to do is hold down left click, right?
vocal grotto
Yes
grim tusk
why hasnt someone reacted with an ❗ on his suggestion yet?
weak field
Isn't eternity like basically the best mage weapon in the game, maybe tied with fabstaff
grim tusk
Isn't eternity like basically the best mage weapon in the game, maybe tied with ...
that was pre-nerf
now its probably the worst mage-wep at post-Scal, nothing maybe except Vehemence with its 1-shotting gets close to power to Fabstaff
grim tusk
apoth is pretty good
problem its hitting constantly to reach its full potential
every weapon has a certain area where it excells
tawny garden
...what
fossil finch
no
tawny garden
@ashen warren 1) "it would be cool" isn't a reason
fossil finch
punishing the player for dying is not fun
tawny garden
- what?
fossil finch
the sugg is "add a moon every time you die"
tawny garden
ah
fossil finch
that is not fun
That's punishing the player for dying
heck, it could make the fight impossible
tawny garden
imagine 1500 moons
zenith hazel
brimstone moons have nothing to do with the player
fossil finch
without mentioning it would be unfair
zenith hazel
also I still can't tell what the suggestion is trying to achieve
fossil finch
you died?
haha noob get a harder fight
golden narwhal
Punishing a player because they haven't learnt the fight makes it harder to learn the fight
zenith hazel
yeah that's still a no
unless you provide a really good reason, that is not going into voting
not to mention what you're saying about "the player's soul" is irrelevant
so you don't mind it being deleted?
pine star
Another moon every death <:sweating:382447970710192129>
But that said, it could work if the moons got smaller the more of them there were
cerulean estuary
Technically eventually you'd hit the entity/projectile limit
whole sedge
yeah uh punishing the player for not learning the fight via making it harder is probably not a good idea
heady storm
I mean; Storm, we are already going to rebalance Supernova when we finally reach that phase in testing.
@grim tusk pretty sure you already knew, did you not?
heady storm
Fair enough honestly.
grim tusk
~~and its just day 3 
~~
crude geode
I thought summoners critting was a bug
unreal viper
No
rancid saddle
its not, I'm talking about an intentional dungeon defenders set bonus that applies to ONE weapon
unreal viper
They can do it naturally
4% fixed rate
Letting summoners crit would be p broken, but I guess can acc that increases the fixed crit rate wouldn’t be bad
Just don’t see a point
rancid saddle
I mean it would make it more consistant for dps builds, and it would make more armour peices that give crit strike actually useful
rancid saddle
yeah I guess? but it would give like every calamity collective armour set (ones with different helmets per class) more useful for summoner. I don't see the reason of having a crit strike bonus on a summoner armour if it does nothing
zenith hazel
provide a really good reason as to why summoners need to not have a fixed crit rate
summoner is already powerful as hell
raising the crit chance would inevitably break balance
@rancid saddle
not to mention that minions can crit in calamity, at a fixed 4%
rancid saddle
but why? pre skeletron minions have low dps, pre the plant they have ok dps, pre provi they have ok, pre poltar their dps is the same, nerf sirius, pre scal their weapon is pretty good but is still the second lowest dps class, second to ranger at the time.
zenith hazel
then those weapons can be buffed
making them crit more often is not the way to go
and unless you can provide specific numbers, that doesn't really help your case
fossil finch
not to mention that minions *can* crit in calamity, at a fixed 4%
Wasn't this removed? I have not seen them crit, unless the red number indication does not appear or i'm missing something
zenith hazel
and even if this miraculously goes to dev, fab would most likely reject it
he made it hardcapped at 4%
it should still be a thing
fossil finch
Uh, i'm sure i saw somewhere it was removed as it caused some really fucky issues with multiplayer desync was it?
rancid saddle
I do feel like summon crit should be a think but it should be capped at like 20% or smthn to make up for a loss of dps at pre plantera
zenith hazel
20% is still overkill
and I've already said summon crit is a thing
if pre-plantera has a dps loss as you say, then we can buff the weps at that tier
fossil finch
Yea it had the problems i'n talkin about, now to see if they were removed
crude geode
This is not the way to make summoner better. The way to make summoner better is actually giving them unique summons that do different things, like Cold Divinity or the one Charred Ore weapon. Also actually adding weapons
rancid saddle
honestly all of this probably won't matter when whips are added.
crude geode
tbh no, whips are really bad, for the same reason Gamma Heart is bad.
rancid saddle
20% extra dps is pretty nice
crude geode
it’s just discount melee weapons slapped with a summon damage tag
zenith hazel
whips are stupid but that's irrelevant
rancid saddle
ngl terraria's gonna be so niche then it probably won't even matter
crude geode
that’s a negative outlook
Prolly not really. 1.4 brought in a huge influx of players, and once tml gets it it’s going to cause a lot more interest in the modding community, in addition to players just getting bored of vanilla.
whole sedge
This is incredibly specific nor do I see a reason for it existing in the first place as overly complicated and long term stuff usually is not a great idea
cobalt pewter
@zenith hazel mind checking if the last sugg breaks any don'ts? this is just formality it definitely is too specific
dire loom
just putting that out there, sounded like a cool idea in my head
zenith hazel
it's practically a specific item suggestion
dire loom
ah
hollow shell
@dire loom You're gonna wanna either rephrase your sugg and add more reasoning
or delete it
Notable: Yharon doesn't drop Ascendant Spirit Essence. That's the post-DoG events item.
He drops Yharon Soul Fragments
cobalt pewter
Rather rework the spawning to be either on sides instead of on top when using Teratoma
river glen
like he just spawns and fals on top of u
river glen
Rather rework the spawning to be either on sides instead of on top when using Te...
or off screen
like most bosses
and let him tp in
or smth
cobalt pewter
I'd prefer a bit on player's sides instead of offscreen
craggy stratus
This is the most exclamation marked sugg i have ever seen
craggy stratus
Also, doesnt hive mind is intangible for the first few seconds of spawning
Or im mistaken for crabulon
proper grail
river glen
Also, doesnt hive mind is intangible for the first few seconds of spawning
no
i litterally attempted no hits
and he just spawns on top of u
and kills u
cobalt pewter
This has been like, the issue for months
golden narwhal
The problem with having blue projectiles against a blue background and environment
cobalt pewter
At this point, just resprite cryo
zenith hazel
this has already been suggested and denied
cobalt pewter
zenith hazel
the crabulon thing
cobalt pewter
Byeah
Cryo's projectile visibility is a touchy issue
Though atm the aurora should help if you don't use potions
golden narwhal
The "some people don't find him at the right progression" isn't really a strong argument
river glen
what about making deus fire less projectiles and mines and instead they are buffed
golden narwhal
Since other bosses exist that fall under this criteria
river glen
since my pc lags the hell out
golden narwhal
I was talking about the most recent sugg, yours is p valid tbh
Doubt it's only a death mode issue, since it only buffs cryo and introduces the "instakill without cold protection"
river glen
what about making deus fire less projectiles and mines and instead they are buf...
what do u guys think of this
cuz deus is a lag machine
and veeyrone knows it
deus
fires mines
and lasers
and the lag is even worse in phase 2
watch any deus fight
golden narwhal
Less projectiles would be good lag-wise, ig
cobalt pewter
Less projectiles doesn't define cal 
cobalt pewter
But uh
ig it works
Though I'd rather have them look at like
Phase 2
Because that phase as a whole is a massive slog
river glen
how is it worded
golden narwhal
tbh simply buffing damage is kinda , byea
river glen
~~tbh simply buffing damage is kinda <:ech:636958034748375042>, byea~~
didnt know what else of the top of my head
golden narwhal
Yea, dunno either, apart from just altering how the attack works
dreamy drift
yea i realized that halfway through writing that
dreamy drift
so im questioning if i should delete it if its abnormally hard to code in
earnest cape
ask a dev
dreamy drift
normally a dev or a mod will ping and say if something is wrong with my suggestion
so im gonna wait until then
earnest cape
infinite piercing likes the sound of this sugg
cobalt pewter
There's already a dash priority of sorts
For accs at least
Solar dash will always be bugged with modded dashes
earnest cape
cobalt pewter
There's already a dash priority of sorts
Basically the game will take the dash from the lowest acc in order
dreamy drift
earnest cape
lemme test that in game
frozen storm
Doesnt Cryogen shut down Blizzard when he is summoned?
earnest cape
yep the lower dash acc gets prioritized
frozen storm
frozen storm
Just use Teratoma in Corruption Island
cobalt holly
yeah i thought about that, which is why i suggested the recipe
frozen storm
In hardmode
cobalt pewter
Hive Mind and Perforators drop Cursed Flames and Ichor respectively in Hardmode.
smoky wigeon
Or that yeah there’s a corruption floating island
cobalt pewter
So yeah, irrelevant sugg imo
earnest cape
so it's a bloat if anything
cobalt holly
oh damn i forgot abt that
cobalt pewter
Plus by the time you're in HM, you can just murder these 2 no problemo
frozen storm
And if you are lazy just buy Purple Stuff and make underground Corruption with Cleaminator
golden narwhal
I mean, if the sugg is about making it easier to get the two mats, could sugg to make it easier to summon the other secondary evil boss
earnest cape
don't they already sell the summons
cobalt pewter
Can we please don't encourage making choosing evil less relevant than it already is atm
earnest cape
for them both
cobalt pewter
earnest cape
actually I might check
cobalt pewter
No
earnest cape
she does
cobalt pewter
Dryad doesn't sell spawns of opposite evil boss
golden narwhal
o shit, forgot about my alignment to tom's stand on this
cobalt pewter
Only the-what
Oh yeah
Yeah Dryad sells their summons
But not of opposite evil ones
cobalt pewter
So if you killed HM in your world, you'll make her sell Teratoma
earnest cape
that's fine then the sugg is already answered itself right?
cobalt pewter
But she does sell the expert drop of opposite evil boss that way
earnest cape
well the discussion here
cobalt holly
well damn i didn't know it was THAT bloated lmao
earnest cape
I was using other mods so she sold plants so yeah
golden narwhal
Dryad about to break her back carrying everything
cobalt holly
ah
cobalt pewter
@earnest cape are you taking that in nohit world
earnest cape
bold of you to assume her back isn't already broken from havign to stock upon planter boxes
I am
cobalt pewter
earnest cape
h
cobalt pewter
Yeah she isn't supposed to sell opposite evil boss summons in a single world
Unless you go to another world and get the stuff
I think?
earnest cape
I'll make a new world
golden narwhal
<a:echviscerate:786406248304082974>
cobalt pewter
Wtf 
earnest cape
I'll disable fargos if that's something with it
golden narwhal
You beat both secondary evil bosses there as well
cobalt pewter
checking wiki is simpler, but I like annoying mis this way
earnest cape
:/
golden narwhal
cobalt pewter
cobalt holly
i think choosing between evil worlds still has integrity considering early game where that choice has an impact on the gear you get for a while
making loot from the opposite type more available later on in progression when you need more materials seems fair to me
cobalt pewter
It already barely has impact beyond the funne debuff when you reached HM
earnest cape
nope, apparently she doesn't sell opposite world evil spawning item
even in hardmode
cobalt pewter
And in cal their integrity falls short to like pre boss
earnest cape
frozen storm
frozen storm
What about "When you defeat Perforators/Hive Mind Dryad will sell both evil summon item:"
cobalt pewter
Still irrelevant since HM and Perf provides enough of respective evil debuff mat for the rest of life
still moss
Increase weapon drop rate to inrage bosses?
frozen storm
What
cobalt holly
What
cobalt pewter
In any case, there doesn't need to be another method of getting these
Since HM and Perf serve this role in hardmode
And you're essentially buying
earnest cape
(don't forget there's mods that lets you craft cursed flame from ichor byeah)
not relevant to the sugg just thought I'd mention
frozen storm
Calamity is Qol mod
cobalt holly
dies of cringe
crude geode
You can literally just farm Hive Mind/Perf if you want evil material. It's super not a problem.
Plus this suggestion is about merging world evils and making them matter less which is really stupid.
Plus Plus I think that evil materials are in a similar position to souls. You should have to actually work for them, not just be able to buy them from the Dryad.
@cobalt holly
earnest cape
yep we discussed abotu that before 
crude geode
mhm
just wanted to gigve my opinion on it.
Does it invalidate the sugg? No not really
earnest cape
the sugg's fine imo
earnest cape
Plus this suggestion is about merging world evils and making them matter less wh...
oh yeah speaking about this we have opposite evil floating islands
so 
cobalt holly
i meant it to be more of a convenience thing
eternal escarp
oh yeah speaking about this we have opposite evil floating islands
which are stupid tbh
crude geode
They completely invalidate world evil.
eternal escarp
the chests are fine imo, the rest is just breh
although, like
just choose the world you need the most
and dont rely on those shit
crude geode
And are the source of world evil choice not mattering
eternal escarp
if you make their special stuff not special then whats the point of them existing other then being a nuisence
crude geode
i meant it to be more of a convenience thing
Calamity isn’t really a qol mod. It includes qol features (that should have a limit), but it is not primarily a qol mod. Go download another mod if you want to buy evil materials.
eternal escarp
^
hell, LuiAFK allows crafting ichor for cursed flames and vice versa iirc, just get that
crude geode
Also you imply that you need to go to another world for the other evil’s materials, which is completely wrong.
I feel like you’re not looking at the features currently in the game, like HM/Perfs dropping evil materials, and the evil islands.
Tbh I feel like we should have a don’t regarding evil biome differences.
crude geode
Minimally.
tawny garden
And stopping people from suggesting them is overrestrictive
It's still a valid thing to sugg
crude geode
I mean, at a certain point evil biome choice literally doesn’t matter. It’s almost already to the point where after hardmode, the only difference between worlds is you have to put a minimal amount of effort into moving the other evil’s sand underground, whereas you just have your chosen evil naturally generated.
At the very least, the existence of Hive Mind and Perfs kinda makes this suggestion feel illogical? Like, those provide a pretty damn easy way of getting evil materials.
crude geode
This sounds like it could be really buggy and hard to do.
bold wave
I am certain the devs are capable of doing it
eternal escarp
its prolly possible, but will make the game very laggy
bold wave
I doubt it
eternal escarp
i actually dont, judging how worms work, but who knows? not us (ithink)
tawny garden
have you looked at redcode
eternal escarp
^
bold wave
I have no idea what it is
distant vault
you.
crude geode
Redcode is terraria’s code. Known for being like, actually the worst thing ever.
tawny garden
now that I think about it
crude geode
It’s basically a guide on what not to do with coding
distant vault
yandev
eternal escarp
thats just madness
bold wave
I'm sure they're capable enough
eternal escarp
it doesnt mean it cant be laggy af tbh
tawny garden
it might be possible to do this by making individual segments invisible and setting dontTakeDamage to true for them
unless dontTakeDamage applies to the whole worm at once
in which case bye bye dreams
eternal escarp
wont that make the game calculate alotta shit at once?
crude geode
^
eternal escarp
assuming the last phrase isnt true
crude geode
Worms are pretty notorious for being buggy. I wouldn’t be surprised if this was buggy as hell, and not at all worth the effort.
eternal escarp
which i think it is true in 1.4, i recal seeing something about worm enemies changing there but no idea
tawny garden
I wouldn’t be surprised if this was buggy either
eternal escarp
i mean, isnt seperating worms a problem on itself? or is there an easy way to do it?
crude geode
@heady storm do you know (or know of someone who would know) if this is possible?
tawny garden
(should've pinged ben)
eternal escarp
(he is offline doe)
cobalt pewter
iirc Dom straight up makes DoG a projectile when he teleports in Dom's Infernum mod (granted, Infernum DoG is stupid fast)
crude geode
(The fuck is infernum mod)
eternal escarp
(^)
cobalt pewter
(A step up from Death mode, unofficial difficulty addon for cal)
cobalt pewter
distant vault
well maybe tomorrow
tawny garden
make it spawn is a spiral
crude geode
make him spawn in a pentagram
tawny garden
😈
eternal escarp
~~make it not spawn 
~~
tawny garden
good idea
crude geode
I sometimes wonder if Calamity will one day be too big for Terraria and become it’s own game, but that would take immense effort and would prolly only happen when the mod is done and finished like 5 times over.
tawny garden
I don't expect it to
frail mantle
fab does want to make a Calamity game at some point
crude geode
Rad
tawny garden
I bet it will look nothing like what it looks now
tawny garden
bot lives!
heady storm
<@!247207355429683200> do you know (or know of someone who would know) if this i...
Context? I am on mobile.
crude geode
Latest suggestion
heady storm
Oh, no afaIk.
crude geode
Understood, @bold wave see above
tawny garden
I bet that this has been tried before, actually
heady storm
We would have done that already it it was possible yeah.
half kayak
@lunar sky maybe it could just drop shroomite bars
crude geode
Yes it has been suggested
crude geode
It’ll be a blue check but it’ll be fine iirc
half kayak
oh
eternal escarp
i hate making shroomite lol
crude geode
It was denied mainly Bc shroomite is fairly easy to come by via crabulon dropping seeds iirc
gaunt parrot
What if lunatic cultist was made to be an exponentially more difficult boss?
eternal escarp
was talked here to death
the problem is also known to the devs, since i remember someone asking ozz once iirc
i would go search the message but im lazy
gaunt parrot
Also give him a treasure bag whilst we're at it
cobalt pewter
crude geode
thank god that’s known
eternal escarp
yeah, so i think us continuing to complain / discuss about it is just futile tbh, and is just prolly annoying
stable bolt
I know the Brimstone Crag is already being reworked, but i still wanted to get my suggestion out just in case
frail mantle
huh
i always thought brimstone slag was craftable with essence of chaos and stone but i guess not
stable bolt
I was thinking of suggesting that but i wanted to keep it to post brimstone elemental
lunar sky
<@!694961358231437352> maybe it could just drop shroomite bars
Perhaps, seems kinda illogical. Don’t know why a giant crab zombie would drop this high-tech Metal.
tawny garden
pine star
lunar sky
I love this place
@cobalt holly maybe the Wizard should sell them instead of the dryad? I think that would make much more sense considering that the dryad is actively trying to get rid of the evils.
lunar sky
Yeah
sleek hornet
but, perf and hive mind already dropped bunch on em in hardmode
(and also evil floating island exist)
dapper coral
that is correct, you can already get cursed flames/ichor from perfs/HM
you don't need a conversion or someone who sells them
@cobalt holly
cobalt pewter
Also we shouldn't really push for more irrelevancy of choosing world evils tbh
I won't blabber much about that anymore, but lemme get tom's doc rq
lunar sky
Is that a ddlc reference or is that just funny
tawny garden
good name
sharp prism
another feedza google doc
lunar sky
The name I mean
pine star
That's Thomas' doc
sharp prism
FUCK
tawny garden
Is that a ddlc reference or is that just funny
Thomas is just angry
lunar sky
Makes sense I guess
lunar sky
dapper coral
angy
pine star
😡
sharp prism
cobalt pewter
In any case, the main reasoning (if you don't wanna slog through it idk) is replayability
lunar sky
Yeah
cobalt pewter
Is that a ddlc reference or is that just funny
Prolly both ig
tawny garden
or a lack thereof
lunar sky
When I first started playing terraria I played another world because it was just crimson
cobalt pewter
or a lack thereof
mhm
lunar sky
Prolly both ig
Makes sense
cobalt pewter
There's the issue of the evil world content being not actually balanced
lunar sky
I heard that the crimson had cultists so I tried making a little sarkic community
I stopped playing when I got to plantera
cobalt pewter
How come Crimson gets a RIV (Spear of Destiny) while Corruption doesn't?
eternal escarp
while corruption doesnt?*
tawny garden
lol what
eternal escarp
yep
tawny garden
ah
lunar sky
What a minute
cobalt pewter
Mhm that's what I meant
eternal escarp
i mean
cobalt pewter
to be fair I had stevie make one for Cataclysm, but that's aside the point
eternal escarp
corruption gets cursed capper and demonic pitchfork but crimson doesnt
theres alot of inconsistencies like this
cobalt pewter
Inconsistencies in weapon design would be fine if both evils get the same amount of content on each possible tier
lunar sky
Probably
cobalt pewter
Byeah, cursed capper is apparently supposed to be a counterpart to Golden Gun?
But the former is ranger and latter classless?
radiant meadow
it's not really
cobalt pewter
Ah
radiant meadow
it's just
cobalt pewter
I always thought it's one
radiant meadow
one is a corruption only weapon and the other is crimson only and the happen to be the same tier
cobalt pewter
Yeah that's fair then
stable bolt
Still waiting for feedback on my suggestion 
cobalt pewter
If there aren't much feedbacks, then you'd probably be set
But I don't see a prob with the sugg
cobalt holly
that is correct, you can already get cursed flames/ichor from perfs/HM
yes i know i have been told that 5 times already
stable bolt
eternal escarp
one is a corruption only weapon and the other is crimson only and the happen to ...
oh, yeah thats a fair point
stable bolt
finally i can stop checking on this channel and play hollow knight
cobalt holly
quirrel best character
dapper coral
yes i know i have been told that 5 times already
yet you haven't addressed it in your sugg
if there is already a super easy way to get them, why is this necessary
cobalt holly
because i wasn't aware of it being a thing until after posting
cobalt holly
may as well delete it if its redundant
which uh
it is
ok done next person to tell me bosses drop ichor/flames gets a stern talking to
radiant meadow
what would the point of Mushroom soup be?
sleek hornet
:why:
river glen
puumpkin pie 2.0
zenith hazel
cobalt pewter
But aside of that, there's no real point ye
zenith hazel
there's this but it's with regular mushrooms
cobalt pewter
https://terraria.gamepedia.com/Bowl_of_Soup
cobalt holly
minecraft
cobalt pewter
Forgot that thing exists
radiant meadow
@old storm you're not allowed to really suggest new specific items and ^ that item already exists
zenith hazel
so crabulon dropping mushroom soup is a direct trip to the hospital
tawny garden
uhwot
sleek hornet
Forgot that thing exists
to be fair, no one really use that as a well fed source
sleek hornet
Crab dropping Odd Mushroom <:lets:797929687187587142>
cobalt pewter
Cooked Fish is broken
radiant meadow
because there's like 50 different food items already
cobalt holly
itd be cool if it got you drunk like ale or something
cobalt pewter
old storm
<@!541350373525553153> you're not allowed to really suggest new specific items a...
does it?
radiant meadow
yes, the item is a vanilla thing that exists
cobalt holly
clearly i was drunk typing that
radiant meadow
and yes, suggesting specific items is not allowed
old storm
didn't realise sorry
cobalt holly
mostly because of people in the past going "can i get my megahyper uwu super buster cool sword in the game? it has a right click left click middle click triple sidekick flip click and a mechanic that gives you invincibility for 53.624 seconds"
manic gale
would it be possible for them to make the evil islands a config thing
cobalt pewter
old storm
i ThInK tHaT mY bUsTeD SwOrD sHoUlD dRoP fRoM AsTrUm AuReUs
velvet locust
would it be possible for them to make the evil islands a config thing
i dont think so
manic gale
or is that too big to be toggled with a button
because if its possible
that would be the best solution
cobalt pewter
Probably only a worldgen thing, but config shouldn't be the default for everything
manic gale
because as far as i know
cobalt holly
ah yes. the og
manic gale
fargo's bothevils does not add the second evil's chest
true but this seems like something that would be in a config
do you want both evils in your world y/n
cobalt pewter
If that's the case, the chest can just be moved to dungeon and make wof only drop keys of current world evil
Get a new world if you want that or smth
manic gale
but as it stands
velvet locust
@cobalt pewter evil islands make it so that you dont have to face most of the tradeoffs when choosing an evil. for example, you can have wrath potion and golden shower
or you could have vampire knifes
tawny garden
that's exactly why it should be removed
manic gale
the evil island doesnt bother anyone
cobalt pewter
And can't you convert Vamp Knives and Scourge with fargo mutant
tawny garden
it's a choice
manic gale
And can't you convert Vamp Knives and Scourge with fargo mutant
shouldn't have to rely on other mods to replace a feature of the mod
old storm
i think the evil island gives too much demonite though or crimtane
manic gale
but if you have an issue with that could you not just
not take the demonite/crimtane?
velvet locust
that's exactly why it should be removed
my point is that evil islands let people face some of the tradeoffs when choosing an evil
cobalt pewter
Because again, replayability is an actual thing people are interested in, and if you can get both cursed inferno and ichor in every pt, that's an example of no replayability and makes shit relatively boring
manic gale
then just dont
its a conscious decision to get the other world evil's stuff
you can just not
manic gale
that has nothing to do with the current discussion but ok
velvet locust
also there is no way for the opposite evil to be in the same world without the use of mods
manic gale
its just like how you can choose to not multiclass
people do it all the time
well
actually
summoner cant
velvet locust
and it adds to the lore
manic gale
but like
cobalt holly
it's a conscious decision to go pee pee on the toilet
lunar sky
Yeah don’t ask to have your own item in the game unless if you are a DoG tier patron or something
radiant meadow
An item is no longer the DoG tier patron reward at this time.
lunar sky
Oh damn
cobalt pewter
also there is no way for the opposite evil to be in the same world without the u...
I mean, you can get stuff from other worlds, but 1.4 also allows dryad to sell seeds of opposite world evil
velvet locust
I mean, you can get stuff from other worlds, but 1.4 also allows dryad to sell s...
but this isnt 1.4
cobalt pewter
Which is a bit iffy, but also fine since you're at least sacrificing something (time) to do it
velvet locust
and also i forgot to mention speedruns
cobalt pewter
I'm just giving an example, byeah
Why does speedrun matter
Mod already doesn't balance around nohits
Why should it care for an even smaller niche
velvet locust
evil islands allow for people to fight the other evil boss
sharp prism
dps and time limits
manic gale
isnt the point of nohit that its a challenge
velvet locust
for extra loot
swift wharf
you dont need to fight other evil bosses
cobalt pewter
I'm just telling this guy about even catering to speedrunning
swift wharf
dryad sells them
cobalt pewter
Because that'd be even dumber than catering to nohits
velvet locust
you dont need to fight other evil bosses
but it could help in a playthrough
manic gale
sorry i misunderstood
cobalt pewter
Np
cobalt pewter
Yeah and then Scab Ripper exists
manic gale
and thats why the crimson bosses are kinda useless for summoners
swift wharf
''however if you want a bit of this, get this''
the evil island negates it
no choice
velvet locust
also if someone wants crimson armor but has corruption world then what are they going to do if they have no evil island
manic gale
can also fix the argument that inevitably happens at the beginning of every multiplayer run
"what evil we goin with"
cobalt pewter
and thats why the crimson bosses are kinda useless for summoners
This is also why balancing exists
tawny garden
also if someone wants crimson armor but has corruption world then what are they ...
stick with the Corruption armor
sharp prism
(there's always a option to make a new world for the items then delete that world after)
manic gale
that kinda stuff
tawny garden
or generate a new world
manic gale
i dont like using outside worlds
velvet locust
but still
manic gale
but like
frail mantle
cursed inferno is no longer objectively worse than ichor so that's nice
swift wharf
^
velvet locust
i dont like using outside worlds
agreed
manic gale
id also rather not progress another world to hardmode
just to get some green fire
wait did they buff cursed inferno?
swift wharf
brb
cobalt pewter
That's why the choice should be built upon, you get to choose what scene you want, with what loot
frail mantle
ichor no longer reduces damage reduction
marble hazel
uhhh, whats wrong with evil islands, its for convenience, it doesnt halt any progression or anything, you can always limit yourself from using evil islands, "but its there so of course its intended to be used" lol bad arguement, evil islands are conveniently placed in the sky so that if u dont wanna bother u wont and its not gonna fuck up anything or anyhow, and you're actually gonna work to spread the evil (place 1 block lol and wait for it to spread) so its not just yooo free QoL, and im pretty sure theres a handful of people would prefer not world hopping / using fargo's twin evils or whatnot and rather keep the blessing that is evil islands
velvet locust
evil island allow for more variety in playthroughs
manic gale
the arguemnt of "its there so of course its intended to be used" is hypocritical in itself
the majority of the community locks themself to a class, later in vanilla and calamity in general encourage it
but like
velvet locust
@cobalt pewter if you dont like evil islands dont use them
manic gale
technically you can play through the game with murasama and halibut cannon and nothing is stopping you
but you dont
cobalt pewter
Multiclassing can work pML in cal, but HM is pretty hard on single classing iirc
cobalt pewter
Ehh, I actually find both to be dumb too yeah, technically it's hard to find out about Murasama now because of the name check rework
manic gale
wdym name check rework
marble hazel
<@!359879246446854147> if you dont like evil islands dont use them
yeah this
cobalt pewter
Initially you only needed "Sam" in order to unlock Murasama anytime
manic gale
now its samuel rodrigues right
marble hazel
ye iirc
dry latch
evil islands ain't even a replayability issue. that's on classes. no one is gonna replay the same class just to use the weps from a different evil. at best it'd affect the 2 boss variants, but then boss rush exists
cobalt pewter
It got changed to "Jetstream Sam"
manic gale
oh
crude geode
Evil islands are dumb. There’s a point to world size, and difficulty. But calamity has actively chosen to ignore and even go against world differences.
manic gale
what does it do against world size???
marble hazel
too many things in sky, hrngggg!!!
crude geode
I’m saying that choosing a world size matters in how the world plays.
marble hazel
but yeah i do agree that cal adds to many things to the sky
but it only really becomes a problem in small world
manic gale
whats wrong with large world
cobalt holly
small world fucks up worldgen in general lol
marble hazel
idk large world too big for me
tawny garden
too large
crude geode
Early game sucks for large worlds
marble hazel
walking is tiring tbh........
tawny garden
walking is tiring on a smol world for me
crude geode
It’s nice for later Bc more resources tho
marble hazel
but yeah if world size is a problem in evil islands i guess you could code something so that it replaces a sky island rather than add one? or does it already do that
crude geode
It’s not
I’m saying that evil choice should matter like difficulty choice or world size choice
Evil island and the complete lack of individuality in anything past pre-hm for crimson vs corruption makes it not matter
real steppe
Yes please a Tempest Staff buff
dry latch
world size doesn't lock you out of anything tho. just affects how long a game would take
real steppe
Duke drops a lot of good items in Vanilla at least but Tempest Staff is not one of them
manic gale
as i said
if you dont like the choice being removed
make the choice to just
not use the evil island
marble hazel
truee
crude geode
The argument is circular
manic gale
there is nothing you are losing except the other evil
crude geode
If you don’t like the other evil being removed, download an external mod
manic gale
yes but here's the thing
crude geode
We don’t get anywhere with that type of argument
manic gale
one requires the devs to do something
cobalt holly
i like evil islands theyre funny
manic gale
the other doesn't
what you are essentially saying
is that the devs should have more work
crude geode
...it’s literally just removing code. Not that hard.
cobalt holly
oh youre just asking for trouble saying that
real steppe
I don't know if I agree or disagree with that sugg but I can definately understand his points
manic gale
removing stuff is never as easy as just deleting it
real steppe
Getting the opposite biome chest is piss easy
WoF even drops the key for it right after hm iirc
manic gale
it is much easier to just not use something than to have it removed from the game entirely
crude geode
I mean, when you literally get it recommended to you everywhere you look it’s a bit difficult not to.
This suggestion is gonna fail anyways Bc calamity and muh quality of life
manic gale
that is like saying because everyone says to go melee you want it removed from the game
so you can be rogue
simply dont listen to people
dry latch
why are you even asking for qol to be removed. that's like asking for blood orbs to not make potions or npcs to stop selling boss summons. sure it's enjoyable to some people to work for it, but why remove it instead of them just not using it? cuz other people do? why should they care what other people do?
manic gale
yeah that is genuinely the same argument as "remove blood orbs because they make potionmaking uselesS"
real steppe
This suggestion is gonna fail anyways Bc *calamity and muh quality of life*
Sadly, yes
crude geode
I’m not asking for every single qol of life thing to be removed
real steppe
Because of that and people may abstain from voting
manic gale
we aren't saying you are
we are just saying
they are all the same
you can choose to not use them
crude geode
why are you even asking for qol to be removed. that's like asking for blood orbs...
^^^
Literally the first sentence of this
manic gale
the majority of the community wants them
manic gale
he never said all
dry latch
cuz that's what the islands are
manic gale
the majority of the community wants the evil island
if you want to not use it
thats your choice
but that shouldn't mean others cant use it
dry latch
if you really want it to not be there in world gen, at least make it a config
crude geode
Evil biome choice is a fundamental part of terraria that calamity literally spits in the face of. It doesn’t really do this with a whole lot else.
manic gale
you are acting like it makes evil biome choice impossible
simply
do not take stuff from the island
and boom
you have your biome choice back
when WoF drops the key
cobalt holly
calamity tends to break away from standard terraria in general
crude geode
Simply don’t use it isn’t a good argument, it puts it on the player to fix the fundamental feature, evil biome choice, that it takes out.
dry latch
then why did they remove multiclassing for summoner? even tho vanilla obviously designed it for it
velvet locust
evil islands are QoL. removing it would be insane
crude geode
Bc summoner is a bad class in vanilla terraria
velvet locust
then why did they remove multiclassing for summoner? even tho vanilla obviously ...
balencing
manic gale
that you can not use with a simple choice
and saying
"nah"
instead
the devs should remove it entirely from the code
tawny garden
then why did they remove multiclassing for summoner? even tho vanilla obviously ...
bad balancing
cobalt holly
because the summoner class has actual options as compared to vanilla lol
dry latch
exactly, my point is: calamity doesn't have to adhere to vanilla's opinions
manic gale
because they aren't allowed to differentiate from vanilla
dry latch
just because it's in vanilla doesn't mean it has to stay that way
we're modding for a reason
cobalt holly
fuck the establishment
manic gale
but that's just
smoky wigeon
Well tmod isn’t 1.4 yet
manic gale
inconvenient
smoky wigeon
But also
smoky wigeon
Most people already use both world evils mod