just, no big pictures basically unless they’re related to a sugg
#suggestions-discussion
hot zephyr
What suggestion are you discussing
zealous ridge
(alright, you should probably move to gentalk, yeah)
tawny garden
well, I also did that png "emoji" thing, and I seem to be fine
zealous ridge
yeah it’s probably good
also, Ian, idk what the feedback was on the arcane suggestion
(Alright, feel free)
Were people generally good with it?
hot zephyr
Seemed to be universal approval
hot zephyr
Other than like, people still preferring other reforges even after the proposed changes.
zealous ridge
ah, alright
hot zephyr
But, if you have any opinions, go ahead.
zealous ridge
Mana cost reduction, says here in the sugg right?
okay, so
mainly, it’s hard for me to really get behind scaling accessory mods
I already don’t like how the defense modifiers are handled, I think it’s a bit awkward
like, the fuck is 0.25 dr
so tiny
Also, the scaling stuff present currently, and I think with the rework to defense mods and defense damage coming soon
is also a bit... strange?
and, in fairness, modifiers are strange overall
okay fuck sorry I’m getting off track
Arcane scaling would be a bad idea, unless the mana hard cap is changed
Or the +20 mana doesn’t get scaled, but the mana reduction does
and mana reduction stacking has its own problems
namely, having it be able to be applied in such bulk may fuck with some weapons whose balancing factors are based off of their mana cost
hot zephyr
Scaling is already presenting in Menacing (due to being a %) and Warding (scaling with progression)
zealous ridge
well, menacing’s number values don’t literally change, right?
zealous ridge
Yeah yeah
hot zephyr
Unlike Arcane, which doesn't scale at all.
hot zephyr
Warding was poo-poo garbage until the devs gave it scaling; it's only natural other under performing modifiers get it.
zealous ridge
I know the defense mods scale, like literally get bigger the further they are through the game
but, is the DR not good enough?
it would only be a total of, at most, 7% at endgame
kind of substantial, but it takes a while
5% DR in pre-hardmode is nice I feel
Add a thing to the mod
wow ok
@uncut orbit cool meme can u delete please
Or like, not
zealous ridge
ok
uncut orbit
i want it in
if not get in me gon eat ham leg
oh no
a demon
i have a holy relic
sleek girder
this is #suggestions-discussion
zealous ridge
okay fucking thank you i didn’t know who to ping
uncut orbit
@uncut orbit
sturdy geyser
you are not funny
uncut orbit
yes
elder kestrel
@uncut orbit hey uh no memes in here please, warned
uncut orbit
kk
tawny garden
elder kestrel
@wintry wharf you too
wintry wharf
k
elder kestrel
alright
uncut orbit
ight im out
elder kestrel
bye
elder kestrel
stop
uncut orbit
k ill use the channels for what they are ment to be used for
storm cove
i think my suggestion that i did in posting is quite good, i just finished my melee playthrough today and when i farmed prov in hell and got the oathcrest sword, that the scythes it made were almost useless, because it took time until they would go and they did not do much damage per sec like other weapons in that tier of the game
i farmed prov to get the samurai badge, and one of the enemies that i killed randomly after killing prov dropped it
ashen warren
e
serene fox
it's
crude geode
oathsword is a pre-hm weapon.
crude geode
if you feel like traveling to hell pre-boss
you make it sound like it's op in your suggestion
contact a tester if you think it's op
storm cove
im not english good
i didnt say oathcrest sword is prov tier
i said that when i farmed prov today, i got it from a random enemy and remembered when i started the playthrough, it was kinda bad
crude geode
ohhhh.
serene fox
ah
crude geode
Well tbfh, it's a projectile melee weapon pre-hm, it shouldn't be as good damage wise.
serene fox
(it is though)
crude geode
(keyword on shouldn't)
storm cove
well, there are other projectile type weapons that are better then it, pre-hardmode
serene fox
just ping a tester for balance changes like these
dapper coral
hi
serene fox
hi demik
distant vault
here's one
crude geode
couple months ago?
dapper coral
late october
storm cove
yo-yos just overpower it completely somehow, biome blade is like 1.5 times better
hollow shell
"overpowered" is a bad term to use
crude geode
hollow shell
cuz when you say "the bladecrest oathsword is already kinda overpowered..." it's a bit confusing when you mean to say that other stuff is better than it
You could say "outclassed"
crude geode
^
storm cove
it is outclassed then
hollow shell
ye
(edit your sugg when you can)
crude geode
also, since you're saying yo-yos outclass it, are you actually hitting with the sword?
storm cove
well, i suppose if its a projectile type weapon, ill try to hit it with the projectile, and yoyo's are kinda long range if you use string and they outclass it
crude geode
If you're this insistent about it you can ask a tester like demik to retest it, but killtimes are what really matter.
But really if you're not using the sword part of the weapon, you're hindering yourself by removing a portion of it's damage in exchange for being discount mage.
storm cove
well, i dont like to get close to enemies though
cobalt pewter
Then don't play melee kekw
storm cove
but i want to, its fun but there is just some weapons that get outclassed and feel weird using them
cobalt pewter
Getting close and personal is (supposedly) melee's identity imo
hollow shell
(I wish that sentiment were true mmm)
crude geode
(saaaame)
hollow shell
(Range costs ammo, Mage costs mana, Summons cost slots, Rogue 'costs' stealth,
Melee should cost distance.)
(separate issue tho you can go back to talkin about this sugg specifically)
crude geode
I'm just gonna ask since bread god won't, @dapper coral can you test bladecrest oathsword/pull up some tests to debunk this sugg?
dapper coral
may as well
crude geode
ty
dapper coral
for reference this is the old one
cobalt pewter
I think me and tom already mentioned to give biome blade line true melee effects
None took off iirc
crude geode
Yeah I thought I heard it from somewhere.
cobalt pewter
So good luck with that 
crude geode
Did you actually suggest it at all?
crude geode
yeah, I'm just focused on biome blade itself right now, as it's obnoxious
mainly for a pre-hm weapon
crude geode
prolly just a rant about AoTC
cobalt pewter
most likely
swift wharf
The thing with bladecrest is that it is basically like demon scythe
It should be more powerful than early game weapons if you get it early game
And it pretty much dies if you get biome blade or wind blade
Also, the projectile already slows down a bit after piercing an enemy
That makes it hit the same enemy twice
(excluding true melee strikes ofc)
ty for coming to my ted talk
crude geode
Imma bring it up now, crim/corro slime staff is such hot trash. There's variants of it that absolutely don't need to exist, and it's almost completely outclassed by herring staff.
serene fox
I can agree with the two variants not existing, but corro/crimslime are quite good from when I used them
good for WoF that is
which is just what it needs to be
crude geode
I've never really used them, bc herring staff floats and doesn't require a specific arena for it to be any good.
serene fox
yeah I can see where you're coming from
but anyways
which would be better
giving the staffs unique effects
or just making an amalgamation of corro and crim staff
crude geode
making an actual slime god staff that you can only summon one of, similar to the clonelamitas' staff, that consists of the core and the two slimes.
crude geode
exactly.
making it actually feel worthwhile to get the staff, instead of just "slime staff but better"
...holy shit I just realized you can make the night's edge/ bloody edge regardless of world, bc it doesn't matter what evil sword you have.
why
serene fox
I mean
evil island still exists
so if the recipe was changed it'd still be obtainable regardless of world evil
crude geode
evil island sucks
at least then you have to go out of your way instead of having the choice handed to you on a silver platter
serene fox
didn't thomas suggest to eviscerate evil island
tawny garden
yes, he did
serene fox
it was both
cobalt pewter
Kinda obvious on the stars it got that it's not only ya
I think my sugg to reshape evil island was somewhere near that sugg of tom's
crude geode
Once calamity 1.4 comes out in a decade I’m going to suggest obliterating the evil island and placing the other world’s evil chest in the dungeon naturally
cobalt pewter
Because I remembered I was doing a dumb challenge with a separate mod, and I had to hook onto the bottom of the island in order for me to count into crimson
Because just standing on the top doesn't count apparently
tawny garden
I uh
don't care much about the existense of the evil island, mainly because when I played Crimson was objectively better in every way so there was no point for me to go there so I just used the island as a free house for the Painer 
but what I don't understand is
why is in an island? why, of all things, they decided to create a fucking floating island for this purpose
swift wharf
Ppl don't like removing things without use, i see 
tawny garden
Ppl don't like removing things without use, i see <:HDfailure:482263678150770729...
mhm
crude geode
that one stupid life crystal sword
swift wharf
ench metal when you can just make perma sell the summons directly but overpriced smh my head
cobalt pewter
Heart Rapier do be do
cobalt pewter
~~ench metal when you can just make perma sell the summons directly but overpric...
This tbh, glad my sugg about it got approved
Because ench metal is unepic
swift wharf
Also funny ice bacon
tawny garden
tbh the ugly and useless wardrobe in my room also falls under that
crude geode
Also funny ice bacon
Don’t wanna fish/farm pumpkins? Buy meat.
tawny garden
At your local supermarket Archmage
sleek hornet
wonder where is that 'meat' came from 
toxic basalt
my suggestion is doing better than I wanted it to and now I'm a little scared
tawny garden
hm? you didn't want your sugg to get to the devs?
that's a strange thing to hear read
zealous ridge
The ultimate meme
toxic basalt
Well I did...until so many people said about how auric melee has been dragged around so much after I made the sugg
zealous ridge
Ah, I wouldn’t worry about it causing more bloat
at least, I hope so
the devs will have the final say regardless
And, what with draedon and all, who knows
toxic basalt
I mean at least it isn't a sword sugg 
zealous ridge
Draedon tier may get a cool spear
a sword suggestion would have gotten more votes probably
tawny garden
oh god
zealous ridge
but it would have been way worse
toxic basalt
Sure, but it's better for something more unique
zealous ridge
The votes mean it’s popular, but by no means is it a good idea
the issue stems from how calamity has generally presented itself
toxic basalt
Tbh I'm better at balance than addition suggestions
zealous ridge
because for a good while people just didn’t give much of a fuck about balance or bloat
but it’s starting to rub off, I feel
of course, this is just my limited scope of things
toxic basalt
People seem to care a lot now about the flow of mod progression
zealous ridge
Yes
It’s a long time coming, honestly
a year or two of the opposite mindset has kind of fucked things
For me old duke was a tipping point
toxic basalt
I still feel like Old Duke needs some little nudges
Because he is is basically the Empress of Light of Calamity
zealous ridge
I would make a suggestion to remove that crusty thing but, I highly doubt ANYTHING like that would fly with literally anyone on dev
toxic basalt
Way too difficult for its intended point in the mod
zealous ridge
that implies he ended up being good in the end
Old duke is not good
as far as I can tell almost no one likes the boss
toxic basalt
Old Duke is Post-Polter, his Ai is bullshit and punishing with dmg and he has Over Double the amount of HP to Polter in Revengeance+
zealous ridge
He’s in such an awkward progression space and he’s just such a rehash
toxic basalt
Plus he has heavy resistances to specific weapons
I found DOG so much more fun than him
zealous ridge
Sure he’s hard as fuck
but I think that balance can grace him yet, and make him at least not unbearable
what annoys me about old duke is the fact that 1. He owes almost all of his identity to Duke Fishron and 2. Offers almost nothing to any player
toxic basalt
There are only some things I can think of, either:
- Reduce his HP
or - Reduce the DR values against specific weapons
and yes, his loot is just not worth it
zealous ridge
The exhaustion thing is just not a good idea, nor is it executed well
it makes every attempt of the boss feel the exact same
toxic basalt
Hard to hear or see if he's exhausted when you're supposed to be around 500 meters away from him
zealous ridge
hearing is one thing
Actually fucking knowing where the boss is, getting to him, throwing random bullshit until he takes a good amount of damage
these are all issues with the current design
toxic basalt
I'm also thinking a change with the Dungeon. Because having to make an arena just for Polter and Ceasless in a place that was never designed to have bosses in is very tedious
zealous ridge
Okay, this much was helped
because they don’t enrage out of underground so at least you don’t have to arenafy an entire dungeon
but still
toxic basalt
Still tedious
zealous ridge
Agreeably, underground arenas are more tedious than usual
And arenas in general usually have to be bigger for calamity bosses
toxic basalt
They need to do something like what they did with the Temple, include a very large room, in this case, at the bottom of the dungeon
cobalt pewter
Hard to hear or see if he's exhausted when you're supposed to be around 500 mete...
87 - Old Duke now plays his tired sound on the player he's targeting so it's more clear when he's tired and not. - Done
zealous ridge
Yep, this change was made recently
Somewhat recently at least
Either way, my stance is unchanged
eternal escarp
yeah so, old dukes gonna be way better now that you can do alotta damage while he is tired, and not be afraid to come close
zealous ridge
it’s poorly executed
...what’s being changed?
not being afraid to come close? I don’t know what that means
eternal escarp
also, dunno why people complain he is too hard.
yeah he is difficult, but he is optional and he isnt that hard to do imo atleast
eternal escarp
not being afraid to come close? I don’t know what that means
i meant like:
for melee for example
pine star
It's a lot easier to know when Boomer Duke is tired now
eternal escarp
you can rack up more damage while you are up clowe to him
leading to the fight being shorter, atlesst thats my logic rn
toxic basalt
@zealous ridge @eternal escarp Remind me, how often does Old Duke get tired and when in the fight?
zealous ridge
through changes to the boss directly, or just weapons?
eternal escarp
every 5 attscks, doesnt he?
zealous ridge
he gets tired around every... 50 seconds roughly?
toxic basalt
so basically after 1 round of his attacks?
eternal escarp
yeah iirc
eternal escarp
yeah go check up on that
zealous ridge
It’s an estimate
toxic basalt
it's after every 10 attacks
cobalt pewter
<@!161273570150842368> <@!219792179013353472> Remind me, how often does Old Duke...
Every 10 attacks
Each dash counts
toxic basalt
and only lasts 5 seconds
eternal escarp
so yeah
cobalt pewter
Counter is the same between all phases
eternal escarp
each dash counts, so it lessens up doesnt it
zealous ridge
What I remember, is that shortly after getting adren, usually the boss goes into sleep mode
sssuming you aren’t hit
eternal escarp
he dashes like, 3 times before the occasional thing, so it really isnt too much afai aware
toxic basalt
The thing is that my main issue with Old Duke is Phase 3
cobalt pewter
Phase 3 can be a fuck
zealous ridge
my issue with old duke is his fucking existence
eternal escarp
i agree on that, yeah
zealous ridge
but phase 3 is pretty bad, yeah
toxic basalt
Who in the hell thought it was a good idea to give him invulnerability on the first round of attacks?
eternal escarp
i like od, but phase 3 is the thing i find obnoxious
pine star
So make a sugg about that?
zealous ridge
no idea where to start with that
toxic basalt
I know
zealous ridge
Not make him invulnerable?
eternal escarp
i wouldve, but we should prolly discuss more, and i have shitty grammer tbh
eternal escarp
content of said title?
toxic basalt
I'm working on it
eternal escarp
ah alright
pine star
zealous ridge
“Let’s drag the fight even more despite this boss being tanky as fuck”
Jesus I hate this boSS GOD
ok I’m sorry
yeah, remove that shit
eternal escarp
i still think od can be a very fun bossfight, just some flaws
and a few of said flaws are massive
zealous ridge
It’s... strenuous for me
earnest cape
Ah yes a sugg to make biome blade even more trash
zealous ridge
it’s not really a discussion for here
Ah yes, I was going to mention that
Giving the debuffs to the true melee just makes the weapon worse
which arguably it doesn’t need
then again, it doesn’t need to exist either
pine star
IMO on true melee hits, the weapon should afflict the debuffs for a longer time
earnest cape
Or just a special effect or smth idk
pine star
Like for 5 seconds instead of the 1.5 the projectile afflicts it for
zealous ridge
Why is the biome blade line even this large to begin with
It’s spread across like, 5 tiers
Normal biome blade is really ass
toxic basalt
"Old Duke is...certainly a something boss. However despite the changes he's still very flawed and unfun to fight where he stands atm. His AI is already a pain to put up with but is slightly bearable in his first 2 phases. Phase 3 however...pushes it too much, the fight is already more about endurance and having Old Duke become invulnerable at the beginning of Phase 3 is absolute BS, at that point all his attacks become extremely difficult to dodge and not being able to dmg him for quite a bit of time can what ultimately leads to the player's death in the fight."
How's this?
pine star
AoTC needs either a massive rework, or yeeting
zealous ridge
keep the first line simple, meister
cobalt pewter
AotC needs erasure
zealous ridge
No need to sugarcoat things
I think you can go straight to “okay, this boss doesn’t really work”
cobalt pewter
It violates melee in every single way man can explain
earnest cape
Oh speaking about endgame weapons saros' needs a buff
zealous ridge
don’t say exactly that but
zenith hazel
fab is adamant on not changing ark
zealous ridge
eugh
earnest cape
A slight buff
toxic basalt
"Old Duke is still very flawed and unfun to fight where he stands atm." @zealous ridge better?
pine star
WHAT?
zenith hazel
if anything, the only thing it needs is a visual rework
cobalt pewter
Ark line is separate from Biome Blade line until post Yharon no?
pine star
AoTC is far too good at EVERYTHING
zenith hazel
but fab has said that changing ark would inevitably get people pissed
zealous ridge
Why is fab adamant on keeping it?
zenith hazel
including him
zealous ridge
why would... fab get pissed?
zenith hazel
...fab does
earnest cape
Ark is an iconic weapon
pine star
Yes
toxic basalt
Ark is very solid weapon still
pine star
My proposed change to the weapon would be to make the homing severely weaker
cobalt pewter
Well Fab being pissed can be a given, considering fab likes melee the most
pine star
yeah
earnest cape
But who cares about that anger
You do know fab is the owner of the mod... right
pine star
yes
zealous ridge
yeah, sometimes it’s... frustrating
cobalt pewter
Though Brav, is adding true melee capability to Biome Blade line (without changing current effects) feasible for Fab?
zealous ridge
but, at this point it’s something we have to design around until something changes
earnest cape
Eh as long as you dont intentionally get him pissed idm
zenith hazel
did you see how people piled on ssv when it was reworked?
earnest cape
Byeah movine on
zenith hazel
can you imagine ark?
zealous ridge
people piled on ssv?
zenith hazel
too many
cobalt pewter
Yeah, quite a bit
pine star
yeah they did
zenith hazel
because braindead support weapon is bad compared to funny spam
earnest cape
Yeah, quite a bit
This is an understatement
cobalt pewter
I know, my brain is fucked up doing low%
earnest cape
What can we say people dont have more than 1 brain cell including me
zealous ridge
I suppose
pine star
People love weapons that don't need a brain cell
cobalt pewter
I switch my extra cell on and off at times
earnest cape
I honestly prefer old ssv
toxic basalt
people piled on ssv?
ssv?
earnest cape
Subsuming
cobalt pewter
Subsuming Vortex
pine star
SubSuming Vortex
toxic basalt
Didn't someone suggest giving it an alt fire that acts like the old SSV?
pine star
iirc yes
earnest cape
Yes
cobalt pewter
On the topic of low%, has anything been confirmed about Guardians within Providence fight, Brav? This specific part breaks the rhythm of the fight and just makes everything a mess imo
earnest cape
Guardians during provi is hage
crude geode
People get mad for a few weeks after something like ssv rework, but then it slowly dies down in public discussion. It’s annoying to have to deal with during said weeks, but I don’t think it means that changing weapons like that shouldn’t be done.
toxic basalt
🤷♂️
pine star
🤷
earnest cape
Tbf people get attached to iconic weapons such as old ssv, aotc etc so when devs change it its like slapping their baby
crude geode
Subsuming Vortex actually feels unique to me now tbfh
zealous ridge
Razor blade was a fun weapon in its own right, it wasn’t annoying to see it again with a similar weapon
zenith hazel
On the topic of low%, has anything been confirmed about Guardians within Provide...
no
earnest cape
Sadge
pine star
Tbf people get attached to iconic weapons such as old ssv, aotc etc so when devs...
That said, the baby needs to be slapped for the better
toxic basalt
Sometimes keeping a weapon conventional and faithful to what it was created from is what makes it good
crude geode
That said, the baby needs to be slapped for the better
^
zealous ridge
I can say, though
toxic basalt
It's a similar thing with bosses
crude geode
Nuclear Fury already exists lmfao, do we really need third razor blade typhoon?
earnest cape
Honestly all I can say is if you want to change an iconic weapon maybe give the community a heads up first so they know what to expect
zealous ridge
It was changed to remove hard cap on summoned vortexes right?
that much is fair, misfortune
dapper violet
@earnest cape What if guardians was only on your first provi kill, like the sentinals part of DoG?
earnest cape
Like showing it's attack if its changed etc
toxic basalt
@zealous ridge Yes and no, the older version where you could only summon 5 felt like a summon, but yes, they've removed the cap now
earnest cape
Hm
zealous ridge
removing them after first win feels like the cheap way out
crude geode
^
zealous ridge
Like, instead of making them part of the fight and actually not terrible
Let’s just remove them because they’re bad, but only soft remove them
crude geode
There’s already a fairly recent sugg about that
dapper violet
Providence just needs some extra oomf in that last 30%, you know?
zealous ridge
like?.? Why not remove them outright
earnest cape
Maybe just lessen their aggro mainly the offensive guardian since its just unbrpearable
zealous ridge
literally don’t make them attack, only let them buff providence
They do not need attacks
No need to contribute to spam
at all
crude geode
zealous ridge
the boss is hectic enough
zealous ridge
people hated it, no?
earnest cape
Oh really?
zenith hazel
some people still hated it
zealous ridge
we’re people complaining before?
dapper violet
What really irritates me is how the guardians have contact damage but not provi
Like, are they magic tangible rocks or not?
zenith hazel
not sure
earnest cape
Maybe ask for community feedback?
zealous ridge
Like, I’m unsure if the patch notes mentioned a rework before
fucking PLEASE
SURVEYS
Not just fucking boss favorites picksies
But actual content surveys
crude geode
Chill Chozo.
zenith hazel
calm the hell down
toxic basalt
some people still hated it
When I first saw the rework, I was actually pretty hyped, the only thing that disappointed me was the fact it had a cap, which it no longer has
zenith hazel
#changelogs message and yes it was mentioned
crude geode
There’s always going to be a portion of the community that hates change, which is natural tbfh. But it needs to happen ocassionally.
zenith hazel
and we do have occasional surveys
dapper violet
@zealous ridge If they opened future content to public votes, it would just ask for big chungus boss fight every patch.
zealous ridge
it needs to happen way more, arguably
earnest cape
Also out of pure curiosity if the ark was gonna be changed what will the change be or has it not be set in stone?
zealous ridge
oh, no way would I want to make it that open
ah yeah, menacing vs warding
That’s a pretty broad thing, though
And it’s 1 question
zenith hazel
that is the complete opposite of broad
zealous ridge
that’s, very easy to interpret
cobalt pewter
Also out of pure curiosity if the ark was gonna be changed what will the change ...
Didn't Brav already say that Ark line changes isn't happening? At least stats are the only one free to change for sure iirc
zenith hazel
that is a topic that’s been debated in this community for a fuck ton of times
crude geode
(Weekly surveys could be a nice thing)
earnest cape
Hmm
zenith hazel
if anything this poll delves into specifics on the direction the community would like to go for
dapper violet
Okay, so a not broad content vote. Like the minecraft one where they picked a glowing squid because funny? @zealous ridge
zealous ridge
it’s still a really broadly phrased question
zenith hazel
more damage or more defense
and it resulted in us having a more concrete consensus on rebalancing
earnest cape
Tbh the new warding change looks spicy
crude geode
It’s pretty specifically about modifiers on accessories and whether you prefer the defense oriented one or the damage oriented one.
crude geode
and it resulted in us having a more concrete consensus on rebalancing
^^^^^^
earnest cape
People like menacing
zealous ridge
Or, as brav implies, is it a decision about mod balance as a whole
because I’m unsure of that because of his comment
zenith hazel
there was also a movement survey
dapper violet
28% more damage for absolutely free is hard to say no to.
zenith hazel
we also did numerous balancing surveys in cmt in the last month
until we decided to scrap that idea because we’re going through everything anyway
zealous ridge
that’s, beta testing?
zenith hazel
but it still gave us a sense of what to look out for
earnest cape
I wonder how the community's gonna react when 1.5 clam comes out and yharon stuff are actually post yharon
And darksun is right after dog
zenith hazel
then people should read changelogs
earnest cape
Heh
zenith hazel
if they can’t then that’s not really our issue
zealous ridge
But I can see people being like “muh power fantasy”
zenith hazel
they already have plenty of time to prepare for said changes
earnest cape
Yeah true but what im saying is how they'll react with the changes in their future playthroughs etc
crude geode
People who don’t read changelogs are the same people who don’t read pins
zealous ridge
people who complain about decent balance changes are the people you shouldn’t listen to
in a similar vein
zenith hazel
anyway if you’re not suggesting anything then move to cmt
earnest cape
I mean depends on their argument honestly
zealous ridge
(Yeah, that’s fair) regardless
earnest cape
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
zealous ridge
I guess would be a good time to say, the suggestion looks good
Unless anyone else has to say
(The duke one posted recently)
earnest cape
About the suggs i just completely not agree with the duje sugg
crude geode
Isn’t the whole point of giving duke invulnerability in p3 to actually balance his health total at said point?
zealous ridge
health total?
earnest cape
Hmm
crude geode
iirc, terraria says vanilla duke p3 is balanced Bc he has basically no health due to being vulnerable in phase change.
Calamity changes this Bc that is really dumb.
crude geode
...oh yeah old duke my b
earnest cape
About the suggs i just completely not agree with the duje sugg
And after no hitting him(in rev if you were curious) all I see that can be a tad bit unfair is his tooth balls which shoots out 4 homing teeth in 4 directions
The rest is just learning your timing
zealous ridge
okay, I have issue with considering no hit as the balancing determiner for old duke
earnest cape
I bet the people that complain about OD being unfair doesnt know he gets exhausted luk
crude geode
Old Duke sucks to me Bc I rarely get a chance to actually practice him
earnest cape
okay, I have issue with considering no hit as the balancing determiner for old d...
Yeah was trying to say after no hitting I got a lot of experience in that fight
zealous ridge
no hit is a specific situation with majorly different parameters from normal play
yeah, that’s admirable
And your feedback, in that case, may be more accurate than mine in terms of overall play and flow of the fight
But designing bosses to be fun no hits does not a good boss make
earnest cape
The only things I dislike about the fight is teeth balls
crude geode
I personally can’t comment much on old duke, as I’ve barely fought him.
zealous ridge
And, honestly, why would you fight him 99.9% of the time
earnest cape
And gathering blood worms(legit) is cbt
crude geode
Exactly why I haven’t fought him
zealous ridge
it’s so horrible
crude geode
like at all
crude geode
what if we made truffle worms but even worse to acquire
earnest cape
:fear:
zealous ridge
Old duke drops should at least be changed in 1 crucial way
(I’m looking at his expert item)
earnest cape
add old duke's version of fishron wings
zealous ridge
Why was it made a summon acc?
crude geode
Bc quirky
zealous ridge
I thought it was going to be a super cute Fishron, and I was disappointed
zealous ridge
horrible
zealous ridge
Cute Fishron is at least interesting for an expert item
But instead, summon weapon
earnest cape
Leviathan Ambergris.
we dont talk about that
pine star
Rotten Brain
zealous ridge
Honestly I just don’t get why when old duke is a complete clone, you don’t even copy the interesting things
earnest cape
But instead, summon weapon
Accessory* and on the topic of that at that stage you will more than likely have all your acc slots filled out by other stuff so it just makes the expert drop obsolete
zealous ridge
Old duke scales should be different, as well
crude geode
old duke scales lmfao
earnest cape
Honestly I just don’t get why when old duke is a complete clone, you don’t even ...
Hmm? The only thing that differentiates it from duke is its kess intense
Imo at least
Since his dashes are slow
zealous ridge
Are they, like, secretly good or are they actually bad
What...?
Dang, I don’t agree at all
Old duke is way more nerve wracking
crude geode
Old Duke’s dashes slow??
zealous ridge
you are way more methodical in old duke, but he’s way more dangerous
so I’m almost always on edge
earnest cape
Hmm
zealous ridge
You slip up, you’re dead
Duke Fishron has leeway
Old duke does not let up
until his breaks
cobalt pewter
Mutated Truffle is the expert drop ye
zealous ridge
like, really really suck
zealous ridge
The expert drop is young duke
crude geode
Truffle
zealous ridge
Yes
earnest cape
Wait i really gotta look up his loot now
crude geode
rip
crude geode
Old Duke Scales at least have a purpose and can have an effect.
zealous ridge
there are 2 things
crude geode
Gehenna.
zealous ridge
the tornado, and him being a duke clone
Old duke scales do what, exactly
Because I have seen no one use them
crude geode
Give you some nice crit and damage with omega blue, according to wiki
earnest cape
crude geode
It’s a stat stick lmao
crude geode
Byech I find it infinitely more tolerable than, say, Leviathan Ambergris.
earnest cape
Its literally post moon lord and yet it fails to be better than a prehm accessory
earnest cape
Ive really been thinking about suggesting old duke wings
earnest cape
For co sistency's sale
zealous ridge
pre Hardmode accessory
zealous ridge
crude geode
make it give you a limited number of dashes before instantly dying in mobility
tawny garden
Old duke wings would be too old to be in one piece and they would fall apart immediately upon obtaining them
pine star
earnest cape
Maybe just make it like expert qs drop where it shoots random teeth balls when enemies are close?
zealous ridge
I feel that being on a young duke mount more than wings, cursed
crude geode
You say that but his head is doing just fine
earnest cape
Old duke wings would be too old to be in one piece and they would fall apart imm...
i agree
pine star
But it's literally a SEVERED HEAD
tawny garden
You say that but his head is doing just fine
That's only temporary
crude geode
?
earnest cape
You guys question about his head still being alive yet dont question him puking out infinite fucking sharks
zealous ridge
yeah
earnest cape
zealous ridge
Old duke wings would be nice
crude geode
If Old Duke’s so old, why does he ram me at light fuckin speed? Answer that, terrarians
earnest cape
tawny garden
crude geode
Old Duke Wings would indeed be pretty cool. Not sure if anyone would use them over the god that is tracers, byech.
pine star
~~If Old Duke’s so old, why does he ram me at light fuckin speed? Answer that, t...
he's practiced for decades, possibly a century
zealous ridge
I would, if they had an enrage function
earnest cape
if old duke's skin is rotting from the sulphiric poisoning then why isnt his skin falling off from dashing that long and fast
earnest cape
Old Duke Wings would indeed be pretty cool. Not sure if anyone would use them ov...
Elysian wings is better than tracers :/
zealous ridge
Unique stat boosts at hp thresholds, and potentially better wings than tracers
or Elysian, yeah
crude geode
An extra accessory slot is better than Elysian wings.
crude geode
People who like to walk faster than 10 mph
earnest cape
Elysian wings already give 40% extra movementwhich is worthless byech and also when do you find yourself running much in the duke fight
zealous ridge
mhm
cobalt pewter
I run a lot vs OD last time I checked
crude geode
In the duke fight? Not much. Provi and other fights? A lot.
zealous ridge
the boots requirement thing is honestly a fallacy imo
cobalt pewter
Not sure for what
earnest cape
Oof
zealous ridge
it’s just how people play, but it’s not the only way at all
crude geode
It’s literally a preference thing tbh
zealous ridge
Yeah
earnest cape
Indeed
pine star
Elysian wings already give 40% extra movement~~which is worthless byech~~ and al...
It soon will not be useless
earnest cape
people dont use silva wings enough
zealous ridge
But to argue boots are best always bc it saves a slot is not entirely accurate
earnest cape
It soon will not be useless
Wdym "not be useless" elysian wings is fucking godly
pine star
I was talking about the 40% move speed increase
crude geode
and not be able to move when not flying.
zealous ridge
it’s about weighing what you need
earnest cape
Ah
crude geode
It’s a preference thing really.
zealous ridge
yeah yeah
earnest cape
I enjoy the extra speed and flight time with elysian/silva
zealous ridge
I think it’s still arguable how slow you really are without boots at that point
Keep in mind, movespeed is also being reworked to be waaay more impactful
crude geode
I personally use boots until SCal, where I swap to wings Bc I don’t need to move at light speed for that fight, unlike most others.
zealous ridge
Making boots even less appealing
earnest cape
Celestial tracers currently is garbo :(
zealous ridge
Over just... not using them and getting better wing stats
zealous ridge
it’s a discussion for a different channel, in any case
pine star
byeah
earnest cape
Off topic less goo @ philo
zealous ridge
if it is to be to continued we could just move to caltalk
I think most of it has been said though
crude geode
indeed.
I like boots for my own reasons, you can prefer wings, it’s a matter of opinion and opinion alone.
tawny garden
if it is to be to continued we could just move to caltalk
Unless either of you want to sugg something close to the topic
crude geode
Such as Old Duke Wings.
crude geode
outplayed
tawny garden
cobalt pewter
OD Wings 
zealous ridge
I think misfortune is writing that, right?
earnest cape
What no
zealous ridge
Ah
earnest cape
crude geode
cobalt pewter
More unique wings that aren't dumb tracers are anyways
zealous ridge
okay, fair enough
earnest cape
Its just discord being discord
zealous ridge
i was unsure
earnest cape
i could write it but mobile ech
crude geode
Cool and epic.
earnest cape
earnest cape
Sure
tawny garden
S
earnest cape
S
earnest cape
That was fast
zealous ridge
Should this simply ask for its addition, or should I include changing dukes scales
Well, it’s a pretty pressing one I need to address
crude geode
Make it change dukes scales from boring stat stick to cool epic wings
zealous ridge
alright, I was feeling that
crude geode
zealous ridge
but, would that come off as too specific
I guess it depends on how I word it mostly
crude geode
Entirely
crude geode
^
zealous ridge
Ok
crude geode
If you’re worried about it coming off that way, don’t include any specifics about the wings, just about consistency with Duke Fishron, and boring stat stick being boring
earnest cape
^
zealous ridge
time to die from sulphur overdose
crude geode
Mmmmm tasty
earnest cape
Do love dying
crude geode
Anyways imma go off and sleep since I have to be ready for family things 
zealous ridge
Okay
earnest cape
Gn
zealous ridge
Convert Old Duke's Scales into a pair of Old Duke-themed wings.
The Old Duke isn't worth making time for in most playthroughs, and one of the reasons for this is his lack of useful items. Old Duke's Scales are a particular offender, as the item is uninteresting, unusually weak, and disappointing.
So, rather than buff this item to make it more of a "stat stick", the Old Duke's Scales could be given new functionality as wings. This would make the item more interesting, consistent with vanilla precedents, fill in wing progression gaps, and overall give players more options post Moon-Lord.
im undecided on the spaces here
tawny garden
This ain't the posting channel
zealous ridge
i know its just formatting, but what would look beter
zealous ridge
im just posting for if theres any major problems
i ususally write them here then paste them
radiant meadow
people still post in here sometimes and there's nothing wrong with that
I just remember the one time I tried to star a suggestion posted in this channel
heady storm
people still post in here sometimes and there's nothing wrong with that
Yeah there's nothing wrong with posting here first.
tawny garden
GG
radiant meadow
and then another time I started talking in the real suggestions because I got too used to people posting in here
eternal escarp
lmaoo
zealous ridge
is their anything that needs major working here?
tawny garden
Not really
eternal escarp
i think the suggestion is fine
sleek ore
fishron wings are iconic in vanilla so I really like the idea of OD wings
radiant meadow
oh right the reason Old Duke didn't drop wings was to make the stuff similar but not the same as old duke
sleek ore
same vibe as yharim's crystal
radiant meadow
which is why Old Duke doesn't drop a bow, a normal summon, a flail, a mage tome, or a mage gun
eternal escarp
i mean, theres elysian wings
gap
silva wings (and next update something about DoG boosters? cant remember)
drews wings
and the tracers
cobalt pewter
Give OD Wings hover and different perk, easy
eternal escarp
so filling that gap would be cool imo
cobalt pewter
radiant meadow
just wanted to throw that out there
eternal escarp
oh
zealous ridge
Fishron, you mean?
i was thinking that was why he dropped something defensive rather than evasive
but, like
Why not like, make them defensive wings
sleek ore
I didn't think that OD's drops were that similar to fishron
zealous ridge
because the boss is still able to fly
Well, moreso i mean
He still visually has wings
eternal escarp
thinking of it, it seems like both dukes have complete opposites of drops
zealous ridge
Kind of?
eternal escarp
i mean, yeah kind of
sleek ore
it fills in a lot of weapon types that OD didn't drop
zealous ridge
they’re different, but what the fuck makes a flail the opposite of a spear
Yeah, that makes more sense
radiant meadow
old duke drops 2 mage weapons, 1 melee weapon, 1 summon, 1 rogue, and 2 ranged (because we wanted to fix up sdfmg and septic skewer was already made)
zealous ridge
fetid emesis
radiant meadow
wait
zealous ridge
Oh fuck
zealous ridge
No
eternal escarp
radiant meadow
just 1 mage weapon then
eternal escarp
only the viper yeah
radiant meadow
for awhile in testing it was
sleek ore
that's a pre-plant weapon what lol
zealous ridge
Huh, that’s a fun little factoid
eternal escarp
it is an interesting fact true
zealous ridge
I’m not surprised, it sounds like it would be fucking terrible for that fight
cobalt pewter
What's miasma?
zealous ridge
the nimbus cloud upgrade
eternal escarp
eternal escarp
it really does look like an OD drop lmao
zealous ridge
I wondered why if didn’t really feel like anything else at that point
sleek ore
it's a sulphur sea thing
cobalt pewter
Huh
sleek ore
post-AS
radiant meadow
It looks like an OD drop because it was supposed to be =)
zealous ridge
anyways, just a minor thing
Uhh
How do I make text appear as it does in sugg voting
because I want to see what it looks like
sleek ore
the bot does that automatically if you format it properly in sugg posting
radiant meadow
You probably can't unless you know how to make a personal bot and have it do the same thing
eternal escarp
^
tawny garden
You can only make rich embeds through the api
eternal escarp
closest thing is like this
zealous ridge
alright, so it’s exclusive to the bot essentially
eternal escarp
ye
sleek ore
wait how do you get the black bar
zealous ridge
was just wondering if it was something reproducible
tawny garden
And using api from your non-bot account is against tos iirc
eternal escarp
three `
sleek ore
ok
tawny garden
So you'd get beaned
eternal escarp
i mean, itd just look like the text, inside and embed
tawny garden
And uhh
eternal escarp
and a bit smaller
tawny garden
Codeblocks are really far away from embeds
eternal escarp
oh, they are called codeblocks?
tawny garden
Codeblock
oh those, yeah they arent the exact same ofc
it just feels like the closest thing possible in text form
radiant meadow
more importantly though, should talk about actual suggestions than how to try and replicate the looks of suggestions
eternal escarp
oh right
zealous ridge
it was just mostly a question so I could see how it looked myself before it got into voting
I wasn’t really going to put it in posting like that
I guess I’ll post, in that case
eternal escarp
yeah, i think that suggestion looks fine tbh
so i think you can post it, doesnt seem to break anything in the pinned doc
zealous ridge
alright da post is made
toxic basalt
https://calamitymod.gamepedia.com/Miasma
Miasma, also known as "The Fart Staff"
eternal escarp
indeed
zealous ridge
Death
hot zephyr
Yharon needs a pitched up Duke death sound 
sharp prism
thats true
frozen hornet
Yharon already explodes into a bunch of fireballs on death
I guess that's not epic enough
earnest cape
And scal is justifyable cause acceptance phase
toxic basalt
I think the only boss here that needs some spicy death effect is DOG
because having him just go poof with a small explosion sound like the mech bosses is a bit anti-climactic
especially for a boss with a very intense final phase
zealous ridge
Yharon’s death sound is already like, pigron death right
I might be totally fucking wrong on that
I feel like it’s phantasmal dragon sounds but I’m unsure
Yeah it’s phantasmal dragon
Hit sound is as well
And, well
frozen veldt
Since scal has acceptance phase atleast it should be a good ol superbright explosion
zealous ridge
Yharon exploding into projectiles that can kill you instantly is annoying
I don’t really know what the reason is for keeping it around
yharon could use a cosmetic death, the fireballs are just stupid
like “you Win so I’m gonna kill you now”
hot zephyr
Ask Dom to show you the HK clone providence death
zealous ridge
what is that
frozen veldt
yharon should be like him screaming for five seconds while launching harmless fireballs everywhere
zealous ridge
nah he can explode instantly
cobalt pewter
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/607919195132526602/780667060689960990/2020-11-23_23-26-32.mp4
Infernum Providence farting Wave Pounder-
zealous ridge
just I don’t want him to kill me after I beat him
zealous ridge
Okay
so, that’s a little annoying
I expected it to be shorter
but hey, it looks nice
so I guess I’m not complaining
sleek girder
now just put in radiance scream on provi death
zealous ridge
also, yeah, it’s more hollow knight theatrics, which I wish we could just get away from at this point
eternal escarp
it really does, but its too long i think, by a bit
zealous ridge
this really does just feel excessive
sleek girder
maybe there could be an option in the config to turn off death animations
zealous ridge
imo
sleek girder
if people dont want or like them
zealous ridge
That’s probably what’s gonna happen
sleek girder
and for farming purposes
eternal escarp
maybe there could be an option in the config to turn off death animations
^ best option i think
zealous ridge
but I’d prefer it just not being a potential problem in the first place
I mean, this could be first kill only
frozen veldt
how about when you kill polter ghast all the ||innocent prisoner souls fly away|| since in the in the lore ||polter ghast is just a bunch of prisoner souls combined||
zealous ridge
subsequent kills just cause explosion way faster
eternal escarp
dont think spoileproofing is a must in the server
frozen veldt
some people havent read the lore ya know
eternal escarp
i mean, its on them for joining the server expecting not to be spoiled, but i guess the effort is welcome
zealous ridge
eh it’s whatever
eternal escarp
anyhow
eternal escarp
first kill is an idea
zealous ridge
Dog could definitely get something
eternal escarp
for animations
zealous ridge
The boss is weird though
Because he’s another boss that just hates to be on screen
so what would be the point of a death animation if he’s going to be far away from you anyways
eternal escarp
maybe he teleports to you before litterly dying?
eternal escarp
i mean, we are hypothetically speaking ofc
zealous ridge
Yeah
eternal escarp
imo death animations arent really needed at all lol
zealous ridge
still that sounds jarring
eternal escarp
thats fair
zealous ridge
They aren’t, they add to theatrics
But like
I don’t see the need to put this much effort into it when
You could be making actual content or fixing shit
this is a low priority thing
eternal escarp
yeah, i think if they want theatrics, theyd would prolly either keep it for last, or if its easy to do they will do it on free time if they are progressing fast enough with certain hypotheticall update