suggestions-discussion

[novel belfry]

i still cant get over how i didnt realize rover was among the 22 incident leavers because he was mod, and that covers up your dev role. i didnt realize rover left until months later

[hollow shell]

Calamity Fables now exists in kind of an awkward spot cuz now there are two concurrently running versions of Calamity each doing their own modern peak gameplay design
Instead of Fables being the stark contrast to original Calamity's old Fabsolian ways

But hey two peaks are better than one

[crude geode]

holy shit two cakes

[drowsy plank]

fables is just like uhhhhh

[craggy girder]

🐌 <-- photo of me

[drowsy plank]

was it spirit that made two versions

[hollow shell]

Spirit did that yes
Intentionally

Spirit Reforged is their ground-up reimagining

[craggy girder]

wdym 2 versions

[hollow shell]

But made by the same team

[craggy girder]

oh i see

fresh start

[hollow shell]

ye

[craggy girder]

okay actually on the topic of fables

what is the idea of it

[drowsy plank]

yeah i know with cal it wasn't intentional but both can have a space imo since they're still pretty different in terms of design philosophy

[craggy girder]

like i know the basic

but do they have the story, do they write it ground up

[hollow shell]

Yes

[drowsy plank]

plus they dont have to have the 8 dozen bosses calamity has lmao

[north oracle]

if fables had released a bit later it would've been a bit silly (releasing calamity without fabsol when calamity doesn't have fabsol)
as it is tho it's just 2 peak entirely different interpretations of calamity

[craggy girder]

is it just "we take the bosses, cahnge em around as we want"

[novel belfry]

quick question

what is fables lore like

[craggy girder]

bc isnt that whats gonna happen with evil2 and dragonfolly

[hollow shell]

We (I get to say "we" cuz I'm still technically a Fables dev) do have a complete mod roadmap planned that isn't revealed to the public
And a story with a central theme that was written with that theme in mind

[craggy girder]

does it resolve in a similar manner to calamity?

or is it entirely different but the characters are named the same

[hollow shell]

as in, it doesn't resolve, because Calamity still doesn't have Yharim in it?

[craggy girder]

well okay presuming it did

[hollow shell]

I'm not at liberty to disclose I think

[novel belfry]

only thing i know is that draedon is planned for fables

[craggy girder]

with the current knowledge of calamity lore where we're gonna go to Zeratros's grave and we're gonna fight Yharim

[novel belfry]

because of a roadmap and stuff

[craggy girder]

O?

more Draedon Content?

oh boy two cakes?

[north oracle]

rover you should leak all of fables

[craggy girder]

you should leak all of the Draedon Content in an ARG

send me a transmitter speaking in morse code my address is 1 House Lane

[crude geode]

https://tenor.com/view/house-explosion-explode-boom-kaboom-gif-19506150

bye bozo

[craggy girder]

WHAT THE FUCK :((((((

[oblique birch]

Rover time to leak everything we will keep secret

[craggy girder]

but genuinely if someone made a mod entirely dedicated to draedon stuff and kept it like

in character

i do think i would fund it

[novel belfry]

unironically a Draedon ARG would go hard

do it for the exo mech reworks ngl

[craggy girder]

codebreaker but in a website......

yes please dude.........

[hollow shell]

(There was one, leading up to either Rust & Dust or the Exo Mechs update, can't remember which)

[crude geode]

Aren’t those the same thing or am I misremembering

[mossy pelican]

I think the solution is to buff Burning Sky

[crude geode]

Yeah

By giving it a stealth strike

[mossy pelican]

No, by making it a minion so its always attacking

[hollow shell]

Rust & Dust was 1.4.5, added the labs and the arsenal content, in preparation for the Exo Mechs update, which was 1.5

[crude geode]

Ahhhhh

[craggy girder]

was it any good

or was it half-assed

[hollow shell]

The ARG?
I wasn't involved. iirc it was more or less just a Discord account created in-character as Draedon but it wasn't clear who or what it was at first
It was just like a blue silhouette pfp and the name was "SIGNAL RECEIVED" I think?

Not dissimilar from the Deltarune twitter account as-Gaster stuff I think

[craggy girder]

ough... :(

[fossil finch]

It wasn't particularly elaborate no

[bright crag]

It was for 1.5, I think...?

That does ring a bell, and I started playing Calamity post-R&D

[indigo yacht]

ok this is literally a joke suggestion

the second one from the bottom

it is about a joke

[novel belfry]

well the response to mine and that sugg suggests that

well

its not

as absurd as that sounds, the suggestion's logic is based on the fact that the burning sky is now treated as a joke weapon

[hollow shell]

The rare non-GFB joke content

[indigo yacht]

what problem does making a weapon more absurd solve

[distant gyro]

its for 1.5

[mossy pelican]

Another all-class weapon

[earnest raptor]

Imagine if Otherworld actually released

there would be non-stop bickering about which Terraria "take" is the best

[crude geode]

god

[keen zodiac]

burning sky should be like astral's end

[craggy girder]

if they ever open donor weapons again its a coinflip between Burning Sky but fucked up and evil or auric pneumatic gauntlets

note the if they ever

[sharp helm]

Burning Sky should have summon tag damage

[craggy girder]

it should have Average Melee damage In My Opinion

where all stats are converted into Melee Damage

[keen zodiac]

they should make it an actual regular melee weapon because it has potential

[craggy girder]

no it doesnt Dragon Rage

[dense locust]

you're right, it does have potential, potential to commit even further to the bit :)

besides, melee kind of already has its bases covered for this tier
you have a regular usestyle-1 sword, a braindead homing option, a true melee weapon, the yoyo and spear that every tier needs for some reason, and the skill expression weapon

there is no real role for burning sky to fill so it being a satire weapon is more than fine

[earnest raptor]

I feel like only devs laugh at Burning Sky

making a terribly designed weapon and declaring it a joke doesn't make it any less terrible

[dense locust]

there is nothing terribly designed about burning sky
there is nothing making it any less terribly designed than any other of the multitutde of easy to use weapons that exist

[tame vigil]

1. this is true i laugh at it
2. this is true. burning sky is a joke that you don't get until explained to you, which makes it a bad joke.

it will get reworked and turned into something different, but that will happen with the rest of his drops. it's not worth the effort right now

[keen zodiac]

please make it an actual weapon i will give you my life

[dense locust]

"an actual weapon" man I cant believe you're dissing phoenix flame barrage like that

[keen zodiac]

i am

[dense locust]

tbf this tier has perhaps the 2.5 juciest targets for a weapon of that style being hunters and scal

[tame vigil]

i think getting ranger reforges also buffed it which is the funniest thing ever

[dense locust]

honestly tbs has never really bothered me even before I realized it was deliberately the way it was
I think it would certainly be a more interesting weapon if it played with its unique attributes more, but at the same time I think anything that makes it more traditional I think is just a negative change overall

its one of the only cal weapons that reminds me of vanilla weirdos like blood thorn and toxikarp and those are some of my favorite vanilla items for many of the same reasons I like tbs

[lucid marsh]

My guy. Phoenix flame barrage and burning sky are basically the same weapon

[keen zodiac]

that's the joke i think

[dense locust]

^

[lucid marsh]

Ah

[earnest raptor]

what if Burning Sky became a shortsword

[dense locust]

the return of exo gladius

[lucid marsh]

What if it was a really big shortsword

[earnest raptor]

and you could become Yharon with it and charge at the witch and engineer's fun toys

[dense locust]

can we please have a shortsword with a gimmick that isnt "right click to throw something" or "dash" that would be cool I think

[earnest raptor]

striking a wall with it creates Yharon's bullet hell?

[crude geode]

no

[frail fox]

Cosmic shiv (gimmick is shooting projectiles)

[dense locust]

true?

[crude geode]

we already have yo-yos, flails, and spears. Do we need a fourth distinct subclass to melee

[dense locust]

no

[earnest raptor]

cosmic shiv is donatorslop, though

[frail fox]

The return of all the shitty shortswords

[earnest raptor]

or maybe you stab yourself

for like 100 damage

and that becomes a bullet hell

just like Yharon does

and you are invulnerable during it

[dense locust]

holy shit lucecia

[earnest raptor]

maybe that should be just a primary way to use this weapon

and the weapon becomes like a ritual dagger

burn yourself with Dragonfire -> create scaling bullet hell

I was going to mention, that Burning Sky should create flarenaedos as the alternative

but flarenardos are archaic attack, that deserves to be scrapped

and the wand is a thing already

[dense locust]

yknow considering you seem to really want this to be a reference to a yharon attack I'm surprised you didnt go towards the attack that pretty much exactly fits the name "the burning sky"

[earnest raptor]

the ascending splitting fireballs?

[dense locust]

mhm

[earnest raptor]

yeah, that exists, but...

https://calamitymod.wiki.gg/wiki/Wrathwing

[dense locust]

profaned trident

[dense locust]

I will say
trading health for iframes has historically been an incredibly broken effect

[earnest raptor]

what things were even like that

[dense locust]

lucrecia, as well as glorious end to a lesser extent

and lucrecia required you to actually hit something first
this item just sounds like a scal bullet hell cheese waiting to happen

[earnest raptor]

makes sense

I just thought that it would be more appealing to not be fully detrimental

while still fitting for the Yharon

[dense locust]

anyway it will never not be funny to me that burning sky is the poster child for items that "dont belong in their class" when theres just straight up a line of minions that shoot bullets and proc ranged accessory effects and even do ranged damage sometimes

[earnest raptor]

those are excused because it makes summoner more "complex"

[rancid lotus]

What about Prismatic Breaker, it's ranger and melee, yet it has nothing melee apart from being a sword and is closer to mage than ranger apart from not using mana or ammo.

[dense locust]

prismatic breaker is busy being the poster child for "donor items that are unapologetically donor items"

[earnest raptor]

donator items are all quirky and unusual and rule-blending

[dense locust]

"right click to drop a single, high velocity fireball that slows enemy movement and makes them more susceptible to damage at close range"

[frail fox]

Rogue Vivid Clarity

[dense locust]

vivid clarity is already rogue

[earnest raptor]

except for a guy who just wanted sniper rocket launcher

[dense locust]

wait until you hear about plaguenade

[earnest raptor]

plaguenade is second category of donator items

"busted"

[frail fox]

Not sure if they’ve been busted in a long time

Also lol

[rancid lotus]

Dang he plays Calamity?

[dense locust]

no

[earnest raptor]

it's only logical, that liberal bee grenades are upgraded into glorious Draedonese military bombs

[earnest raptor]

I guess "busted" is too strong of a word

I wanted to say that alongside quirky left-right-clicks and mismatched classes

there are just items, that are strong and straightforward

[severe sparrow]

and some of them feel like they fit in the game pretty well

bullet filled shotgun is like the only donor weapon that's a part of a crafting tree

[obsidian nova]

An above average weapon I would say

Where?

[tepid crown]

ale tosser

[grim tusk]

This must be updated lol

[mossy pelican]

Are more whips postml planned or is that a good suggestion

[humble scarab]

there are whips planned

for sure

i dont think its worth making suggestion when devs are fully aware that postml whips is smth community wants

[gilded citrus]

There are plans to add whips they have even shown one iirc
Just
Summoner balance hell afaik

[mossy pelican]

I feel like summoner is hard to balance by nature

how tf did that get to voting lmao

[hexed crater]

anyone ever suggested adding some sort of UI that lets you know how the maximum minions you can summon currently?

because I've just been counting them manually all the time

[half imp]

there are plans relating to that

[remote dune]

qol recipe suggestion right after the "kill all qol recipes" update lol

[indigo yacht]

stat meter tells you your max minion count iirc

[grave zinc]

@dense locust - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[make skeleton merchant's calamity items sold based on moon phases]

It has officially been implemented into the game, and will be available in the next update!
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

[distant gyro]

sorry but not sorry

[grave zinc]

@polar bison - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Allow more items to use Alternative Recipe Groups]

It has officially been implemented into the game, and will be available in the next update!
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

[polar bison]

Woohoo

[remote dune]

[polar bison]

You can now craft the arid artifact with dunesand

Wait is dunesand in the any sand group

[obsidian nova]

[obsidian nova]

It's being added Eventually™

[indigo yacht]

i will make a mod that tells you your minimum summon count

which is the minimum amount of summons you can have

[dense locust]

(1)

[glass arch]

(0)

[dense locust]

(-1?)

[mossy pelican]

I dont think theres anything that takes away summon slots

[dense locust]

yet

[indigo yacht]

don't say that then i would have to actually program something to check instead of just saying 0 at all times

[kind laurel]

There are several in MM weapons

A launcher and a bomb at least

Sealed Singularity and Scorched Earth

[half imp]

I could probably add summon slots to tooltips for summon weapons tbh

[mossy pelican]

The stat sheet has your total summon slots idk if its from one of my mods or not tho

[sleek turret]

Stat sheet does tell your summon slots

[severe sparrow]

but bullet filled shotgun is the first ingredient in a multiple stage recipe

shredder, infinity, and svantechnical

[glass arch]

well yeah

because you're not considering the fact that a lot of donor weapons are also upgrades to shit

[severe sparrow]

fair, but them being the start of a weapon line is different then it being the end

[glass arch]

there are also only nine dedicated items in pre hardmode

[dense locust]

(assumingi this is ignoring random vanity items)

[glass arch]

and keep in mind this isnt even necessarily the end of the weapon line

a fair amount have upgrades

[severe sparrow]

well it IS the shortest part of the game

[severe sparrow]

which ones specifically?

oh right monstrous knives

forgot those

[indigo yacht]

i dislike donor weapons because half rhe time th tooltip is an extremely convoluted 5 paragraph essay and then the weapon either sucks or the most effective way to use it is to ignore everything on the tooltip and just hold m1

the other half of the time theyre ok i guess

[severe sparrow]

also 2 of magnomaly cannons ingredients are literally donor items

like, what

[spare bison]

#suggestions-voting message

Not a fan

[severe sparrow]

im not sure how good unstable caster gauntlet is

[spare bison]

Unless it'd be an actually cool alternative obtainment method that actually requires #effort

[severe sparrow]

its tooltip looks convoluted but it seems decent

[glass arch]

its pretty good it just fucking sucks to use

[severe sparrow]

how so

[spare bison]

Iirc there were plans to make chum buckets obtainable from the timeless shores from some enemies? Which that's cool

But just making them craftable with blood orbs is rly lame sorry

That is just a classic "qol" that is just Speed Things Up So I Don't Have To Interact With The Game

[indigo yacht]

craft them out of fishies

[golden sonnet]

We need less recipes not more. If it's hard to obtain, buff the drop rates. I'd rather make them 100% drops from blood Moon fishing enemies and ruin your storage space than make them crafted

[glass arch]

extremely slow to get started, there isnt a reason to use warped orbs from what ive seen they're just kinda worse than reusing, vis as a resource doesnt matter as soon as its maxed ive never had to think about it, also its left click is lame as shit

[spare bison]

And ill be honest

they arent hard to obtain at all man 😭

[mossy pelican]

They arent

[severe sparrow]

i see

[spare bison]

Every blood moon fishing enemy drops a pretty steady supply of em

[severe sparrow]

what about the amphibian guitar

[spare bison]

And chum caster's droprate is also p high

[golden sonnet]

Regardless, it's in voting so criticizing it now won't do much.

[indigo yacht]

oh i hate this thing

[mossy pelican]

They already clog my storage

[glass arch]

no clue havent touched it

[golden sonnet]

1.4.5 stacking will save us all

[spare bison]

I like speaking my mind on things specially when im bored as fuck theres nothing to do release me free me

[earnest raptor]

it requires too much effort

[severe sparrow]

seems like a simple and decent summon

only hitch is getting The Axe

[mossy pelican]

Amph guitar is great

[severe sparrow]

i can see that

[golden sonnet]

That's fair, and I think it is helpful to see where others, and where I stand on making obtainment easier. I just don't want it to become all dunking on one guy

[mossy pelican]

Honestly probably the best pre-golem summon if you don’t do the pumpkin moon

[glass arch]

for those that dont know what unstable casters gauntlet left click does!
it is almost literally just a recolored diamond staff

[earnest raptor]

like as a tribute it's cool

but it looks so impractical

[glass arch]

the effort isnt even that high its just annoying

[earnest raptor]

spectacle over gameplay

who made it

[spare bison]

Fair nuff

[severe sparrow]

does it have the same velocity as a diamond staff

[glass arch]

like its annoying because its animations are so slow

[mossy pelican]

Amph guitar is so cool tbh I love the way they summon

[severe sparrow]

i remember old corpus avertor, i thought it was cool but it sucked so bad to just get your HP cut in half for no reason

[glass arch]

almost exactly iirc

might be faster im kinda forgetting

[severe sparrow]

why though

diamond staff's velocity is incredibly mediocre at best

[earnest raptor]

because donator items have no reason behind them

[severe sparrow]

fair
although some clearly have thought put into them

[topaz vault]

objection: pig

[mossy pelican]

Dude… we probably wouldn’t have the game in it’s current state without said donors

It’d be pretty difficult to get devs with no money to pay them

[indigo yacht]

didn't all the donator money go directly to fabsol

and not to any of the other devs

[glass arch]

until recently yes

[indigo yacht]

even in a roundabout way

lmao

[gilded citrus]

Yeah until the guy exploded

[glass arch]

there was no payment to other devs fabsol directly lived off patreon money

[indigo yacht]

damned to jobhood

[mossy pelican]

I didnt realize that

Poor devs

[gilded citrus]

iirc it was an agreed on thing but idk how fair it was

[sleek turret]

It was an agreed because at the time of the decision a lot of the developers were underage

[earnest raptor]

I meant that they are not designed as actual weapons or equipment

with the most extreme example being this, where the references section is longer, than section about actual weapon

[indigo yacht]

the language 'may represent' sounds like someone was just adding stuff because they thought it was cool and if so shouldn't be on the wiki

[sleek turret]

Donator weapons and its consequences have been a huge disaster for the Calamitian development quote extracted from Ted K.

[earnest raptor]

they are as "silly" in other mods

at least thorium devs make items look "on-tier"

which does lead to hilarity on its own

[half imp]

fabsol paid devs who worked on donor items

[kind laurel]

Is making a suggestion for weapons with custom swing animations to have sprite consistency and not squish/stretch the sprite too high effort?

[half imp]

that is not something that would necessarily be accepted, if they squish/stretch it's because we want them to do that

[distant gyro]

note that this was not a thing until very late and also decently later doubled the pay

he only started paying people at the desperation "none of these are getting done ever" phase

[sleek turret]

lmfao

[willow widget]

should i make a suggestion about adding some sort of sound indicator to golem's eyes flashing attack (its really hard to do in multiplayer)

[drowsy plank]

yes

[willow widget]

ok cool

[indigo yacht]

follow ur heart goat

[willow widget]

❤️‍🩹

[willow widget]

boom

[tame vigil]

no way

floppa suggestion

[rancid lotus]

Should Blighted Gel be usable as ammo for Flamethrowers?
Because there's currently no flamethrower ammo other than regular gel.

[drowsy plank]

no

unless you just want it to be base damage increases (pointless) you would need a custom projectile for every single flamethrower to apply that effect

[rancid lotus]

What if it doesn't change the effect and just becomes useable?

[crude geode]

Again, do you just want it to be base damage increases (pointless)?

[drowsy plank]

why

[crude geode]

Arguably gel being the only ammunition is one of the things setting flamethrowers apart

[rancid lotus]

Because I don't see why you can't use it as ammo for Flamethrowers.

[glass arch]

blighted gel is just

[drowsy plank]

why could you

[glass arch]

more impractical and less useful than gel

[drowsy plank]

you have gel

you cant use purified gel rither

[glass arch]

ideally blighted gel gets removed because its uses can be replaced by just gel + vertebra/rotten chunks but thats besides the point

there isnt really any reason for blighted gel to be usable

[crude geode]

Big agree

[glass arch]

it wouldnt gain the player anything because blighted gel is a lot rarer of a resource than regular gel

[rancid lotus]

Pretty sure the reason why Blighted Gel is there is to contrast the purity of the purified gel, I think it's a lore thing more than anything.

[rancid lotus]

But usually gameplay trumps lore so yeah I don't see the purpose in Blighted Gel.

[drowsy plank]

blight slimes only exist so people can get prehardmode blindfold atp lmao

[pure verge]

why would anyone need that lol

[drowsy plank]

because the ankh recipe items were removed

[glass arch]

blindness fucking sucks

[drowsy plank]

so by making them accessible for longer ur more likely to get them

that too

[rancid lotus]

Why?

[worthy lintel]

ankh stocks collapsing to zero now that asgard line no longer mandates it

[pure verge]

just make mother slimes drop blindfold

[drowsy plank]

honestly yeah

[rancid lotus]

Why did Asgard's Valor lose the Ankh Shield?

[glass arch]

because they already werent rare and crafting recipes for everything is a mindless streamlining option

[drowsy plank]

so you have to play the game

[glass arch]

because its a mobility accessory

[rancid lotus]

I just don't like boring grinding.

[glass arch]

hell it even kept the one part of ankh that was widely relevant and thats the knockback immunity

[drowsy plank]

well dont use ankh shield then

it's not even that good

[worthy lintel]

i have my own reserves on quite a few aspects of the update but asgard "nerf" is not one of them

having asgard be the everything accessory was admittedly very bad for the game's health

[glass arch]

its not even that much grinding its like 5 minutes in cal assuming you dont already have all the materials for it passively from just playing the game

[drowsy plank]

ture

[pure verge]

most of the time it's basically just an obsidian shield with +2 extra defense

[drowsy plank]

yeah

[worthy lintel]

-2 damage taken tho

[drowsy plank]

on master

otherwise it's -1

[worthy lintel]

im highlighting the positive

potential -2

on the plus side

its much easier to get asgard now with the most time consuming item stripped

so thats that

[mossy pelican]

I wish the ankh shield had uses further in progression, I like the immunities

[half imp]

go my high ruler

[mossy pelican]

True

[lucid marsh]

High ruler doesn't even use ankh shield despite inheriting its effects

I think at the very least you should be able to use ankh shield to craft high ruler

[mossy pelican]

[rancid lotus]

You use the cobalt shield, but not the ankh shield?

I guess you get the immunities from the 4 Life Alloy.

[drowsy plank]

you get the immunities from it being a donor item

[rancid lotus]

https://klipy.com/gifs/231-3

[drowsy plank]

also i think an ankh shield upgrade line was considered at some point

unsure if it will be real tho

[lucid marsh]

I mean it used to be
Aegis

[drowsy plank]

no it wasnt

[mossy pelican]

Ankh shield upgrade maybe
ASUM

[drowsy plank]

ankh was just stapled onto it

nothing about aegis actually improved or built off of the effects of ankh besides sometimes getting One Boss Debuff after the boss was dead, and maybe some more defense i guess

[indigo yacht]

"hold up! his writing is this 🌊?!"

[tepid crown]

elysian aegis giving immunity to every previous fire dot debuff just because

[indigo yacht]

game design is my passion

[craggy girder]

ankh shield + radiance when

grants you stronger buffs when debuffed, like occult skull crown

Obviously

[rancid lotus]

Skull Crown upgrade?

[craggy girder]

i dont think the Cosmolite tier item needs an upgrade

[tepid crown]

not cosmilite anymore

[craggy girder]

oh right its sentinel tier

[rancid lotus]

Sentinel items tend to get upgrades.

[rancid lotus]

I mostly meant this jokingly though.

[craggy girder]

only two items from teh sentinel tier get upgrades, and its post all 3

[glass arch]

post the gif

[indigo yacht]

yeah what they said

[glass arch]

oh wait i can post it

[lucid marsh]

Ok here's a real idea

Ankh shield is reworked and merged into occult skull crown

[fossil finch]

Reworked to what

[indigo yacht]

i don't think calamity likes reworking vanilla accessories

it mostly sticks to adding effects

or tweaking values for balancing

[fossil finch]

Also i think that's an awkward direction considering laudanum. If people want an ankh upgrade theyd probably prefer an immunity stick rather ghan the gimmick

[fossil finch]

It does make some drastic changes

Berserkers glove being the most drastic imo

[indigo yacht]

doesn't it still serve basically the same purpose

actually idr what it does in vanilla

most of the other changes are just balancing stuff

[glass arch]

which part

the recipe change or the loss of melee speed

[craggy girder]

didnt it also lose a good amount of max health

[glass arch]

no

[craggy girder]

really

[fossil finch]

The loss of melee speed which is the recipe change too lol

[craggy girder]

cele shell doesnt give melee speed

[lucid marsh]

Each ankh component works like the skull crown for its specific debuff

[drowsy plank]

can we fucking revert berserker glove

[fossil finch]

It completely kills using it as a whip acc which i wager is one of its primary purposes in vanilla

[drowsy plank]

fabsolian change

[craggy girder]

whats wrong with it

[fossil finch]

It's bad

[fossil finch]

You're true

[drowsy plank]

it's bad bc it had the melee speed removed for no reason

you can't glove stack already anymore

[fossil finch]

It makes the acc pointless

[drowsy plank]

who gives a fuck

[fossil finch]

A melee player isn't using it

[craggy girder]

increases the size of melee weapons

[fossil finch]

And a summon one can't

Yeah a melee player gets their own main acc line for that effect

They won't use berserkers

[craggy girder]

just make the melee weapon size buff +20%

[glass arch]

also melee weapon size just isnt a particularly relevant stat in the first place

[craggy girder]

yeah but like imagine mapsized Grand Dad

[fossil finch]

Idk

[craggy girder]

i think ankh shield should provide benefit when it negates a buff

like burst effect

while occult/radiance wants you to have the buff

so it can [give effect/heal you more]

[glass arch]

or it can just be a debuff immunity line

[craggy girder]

i mean yeah but thats Boring.............

[glass arch]

because it negating a buff is already the benefit

[craggy girder]

Calamity is infamous for being Not Boring

or at least newlamity oldlamity has all debuff immunities glued to the player

[fossil finch]

Erm

Dk about that one chief

[glass arch]

"provides benefit when negating a debuff" is already inherently built in its called the part where it negates the debuff

[lucid marsh]

Calamity enemies also don't inflict devuffs mostly

[fossil finch]

Wdk we think it's in calamity's interest to keep vanilla things as is specially if it's this

Debuffs r a kind of really awkward part of terraria

[glass arch]

@drowsy plank #1178515062030348308 sorry i gotta do it to ya

[hollow shell]

An actual honest to god REVERSION suggestion, from a MOD?

[drowsy plank]

hey i mean

[drowsy plank]

actually fair, but my argument was more on the basis of vanilla intrusiveness

i dont really have tests for it because... i dont really know what you would test it on?

[hollow shell]

A REACTIONARY reversion sugg at that

[drowsy plank]

LOL

THIS CHANGE WAS YEARS AGO

[hollow shell]

oh nvm then

[drowsy plank]

and we purposely removed the reversion suggestion

[fossil finch]

Uncanny how they just added this yesterday

[drowsy plank]

so technically allowed

[fossil finch]

Yesh it's just a bad change from the Melee Speed wars if i had to assume

[hollow shell]

Lemme check the wiki I actually have no idea what this is referring to

[glass arch]

2023

melee speed culling

hellish harbour

[drowsy plank]

like id get it if glove stacking still existed but calamity specifically prevents you from glove stacking so

[glass arch]

oh i can tell you why it doesnt lose max hp

because

it doesnt have any in vanilla

[craggy girder]

yeah it just gives 8 defense

for. some reason.

[glass arch]

vanilla berserker glove doesnt have any max hp and i think cal did end up removing the hp buff it had

[drowsy plank]

8 defense is a surprising amount for one vanilla accessory all things considered

[fossil finch]

It's part of what makes it a fun summoner acc

[hollow shell]

Wow, so
this, plus the max health from Flesh Knuckles rework (right?)
minus the speed

Not much of a niche

[drowsy plank]

NO LOL THERE'S NO MAX HEALTH

[glass arch]

the max health is dead

it got killed

[hollow shell]

ok wiki issue
Still updating, still updating

Can someone in-game send its current damn tooltip

[drowsy plank]

i mean i showed u the screenshot it doesn't say +max health on it

[glass arch]

its like. Usable. in multiplayer. but thats only because of the +400 aggro

[fossil finch]

Aggro isn't a real stat anyways

[drowsy plank]

literally true

aggro is fucked

[hollow shell]

me nefariously inventing minions with health so aggro can be relevant in singleplayer

[glass arch]

well that only works if aggro works

which it doesnt

[craggy girder]

why DOES aggro exist

just have it target whoever does the most damage. obviously.

[drowsy plank]

red made the skeleton of a system and then forgor

[hollow shell]

I know a ton of enemies don't have behaviors to react to invisibility/stealth, and just target the player no matter what

but is there also extensive jank regarding their targeting priorities in MP roo?

[glass arch]

ok it does actually have increased hp

[craggy girder]

its not 45

its 25

[glass arch]

which is a cal thing

[craggy girder]

yes

[glass arch]

it never had max hp in vanilla

[hollow shell]

Oh hey, true melee damage

[fossil finch]

It gives tmelee damage too apparently

This is the original sin man

[hollow shell]

10% is not nothing

[fossil finch]

The day tmelee dies the angels will come back to earth

[drowsy plank]

aggro literally just adds a modifier to the distance from the boss of the player so even if you're wearing 3 putrid scent upgrades, if you're kinda closer to the boss you will get targeted first

[glass arch]

it is when power glove also has it

[drowsy plank]

it just has normal glove stats + 25 life you can do this with yeah

power glove

[hollow shell]

(I mean that's kinda how I would expect it to work)

[drowsy plank]

and obviously mech glove which is just better

[hollow shell]

So Berseker is like a more defensive counterpart to Power?

[glass arch]

vaguely

[drowsy plank]

not that i know anyone that rawdogs power glove

[ripe owl]

yes but a defensive-offensive accessory is such a weird thing

[craggy girder]

wait so does this work with uh

bers glove

[glass arch]

it does the same stuff but defensive accessories will just completely outclass

no

[craggy girder]

since its not a downgrade

factually

[glass arch]

all the gloves have that line of text

[drowsy plank]

no you can stack them

bers doesnt have that line

[craggy girder]

yeah and its not a downgrade
it doesnt stack with titan glove but its allowed to stack with others

[glass arch]

oh what the fuck it doesnt

[drowsy plank]

you can only not stack melee speed accessories

[craggy girder]

yah

[drowsy plank]

so the build is supposed to be. melee size

by stacking the gloves

which is

not real

it just is not a thing people do

it isn't good

[glass arch]

its not a relevant stat

melee size modifiers are only relevant when the size modifier in question is like +300%

[craggy girder]

why doesnt bers glove just cause two weapons to be swung at once

[drowsy plank]

i love old tungsten enchant

[craggy girder]

obvious solution

[ripe owl]

and if it's on a single accessory

[drowsy plank]

lmao

[glass arch]

not even then

[hollow shell]

What if it increased true melee weapon size by 10×? Would that make it useful?
Genuine question, for the sake of argument.

[glass arch]

an accessory slot still isnt worth that

[drowsy plank]

that's just tungsten enchant

it would be good but it would be bad

as in bad for game design

[craggy girder]

no tungtungtungsten enchant increased it by 3x

[hollow shell]

Tainted Enchantment de la SCal

[glass arch]

its worth it if its baked into a weapon otherwise melee size just isnt good enough to waste an accessory slot on

[drowsy plank]

melee weapons with a big enough melee size buff to be useful look goofy as fuck

they just do not scale their sprites well

[hollow shell]

I feel like conceptually there's a space for it
Because the whole idea of true melee weapons is that you have poor range and have to put yourself in danger by getting closer

[drowsy plank]

there's a reason fargos killed old tung

[glass arch]

actually i think yuh made a system that can do this

[drowsy plank]

we dont need calamity reinventing it just to discover it's a bad idea again

[hollow shell]

(is that the.. core issue?)

[drowsy plank]

no i mean there are other issues but im sure you remember when calamity made weapons do this natively

it looked really bad

[glass arch]

i dont have the image but there is a very clear picture in my head of a comically large occult skull crown that scares me because each pixel on it is in full hd

[drowsy plank]

what does that even mean how do you scale a pixel to be "hd"

is it like

interpolating the other pixels and adding in detail where there wasn't previously or something??

[hollow shell]

Those terrible "smoothing" filters you can enable on NES and SNES emulators?

[glass arch]

between each pixel when upscaled there tends to be a really weird almost grainy bit

yuh fixed that at some point

[fossil finch]

We think the main problem with melee weapon size is that it works on like swords

And

And like not all swords

[glass arch]

its kinda fuzzy

[hollow shell]

Issue there was that those weapons exclusively looked like that, because the sprite did not match the size they decided the weapon was balanced for

It'd be way more 'understandable' if you equipped the "made your weapons bigger" accessory and all your weapons look upscaled
I don't think players are expecting unique larger sprites for every melee weapon in the game

[drowsy plank]

i mean it also just made true melee really boring because instead of being about positioning your weapon just took up half your screen

look my main point is we dont need to ship of theseus old tungsten it has been proven to be a balancing nightmare

[fossil finch]

(also wed like to reiterate this because we think its important

[hollow shell]

But if you had to commit accessory slots (plural) to increasing the size of your weapons that much, at the cost of damage and speed (and defensive & mobility benefits too of course)...

[crude geode]

isn’t this a reversion sugg

[glass arch]

yes

which isnt against the rules

[crude geode]

I keep forgetting that

[fossil finch]

Like it's kinda awkward to have this acc that works on weapons that admit size modifiers which is very much not all of them or not even all of the same type because I'm 100% confident there's at least one cal sword that doesn't by virtue of having a freaky custom swing. It'd be a sword acc for true melee where the point is removing the true melee part of the equation it feels deeply awkward game design wise

[deft yew]

I have been summoned to execute you

[fossil finch]

😭 ??

[hollow shell]

I mean we can fix that

Make a suggestion to fix that

[fossil finch]

Can you there's decent reasons some weapons do not admit size modifiers

Vanilla does it

[crude geode]

Sounds like a lot more work than just. reverting this one accessory to vanilla values

[fossil finch]

We mean rover is arguing in the general of using this stat not berserker glove specifically

[dense locust]

^

[crude geode]

Ah

[half imp]

yeah

[half imp]

all of the custom sword swings except the ones I made and Lucrecia, maybe Lightspeed, don't get melee size

[fossil finch]

:yeah:

[hollow shell]

(I find it curious that this conversation started with "melee size isn't a real stat, it sucks" followed by what seems like "melee size is too overpowered, we can't let players have it"

Is there no middle ground to be had, brothers and sisters?)

[half imp]

melee size is not too overpowered

[hollow shell]

🫡 Thank you for your attention to detail

[half imp]

it is entirely a fine stat to have

xyk didn't like how it worked on the visuals of his swords so he didn't use it

and it doesn't work on half of vanilla melee anyway

so like shrug emoji

[drowsy plank]

melee size is broken when you give players 10x of it but otherwise it isn't a real stat

but you could say that about any stat honestly besides like
i dunno
block placement range maybe??

[crude geode]

As we all know, building isn’t real

[drowsy plank]

moreso dirt and ice rod exist

[glass arch]

maybe its just a me thing but ive never seen melee size as a stat matter outside of batshit numbers of it or when its baked into a weapon (also in batshit numbers)

[drowsy plank]

and also having big block placement range would honestly be nice

no yeah it's just when people think melee size is so much of a nothing stat that you can blast it up to ridiculous sizes that it becomes broken but that is also the only time it is viable

so it is better to just

Not

[half imp]

melee size is definitely a noticable stat

But not game changing

the difference between Galileo Gladius with no reforge no melee gear and it with that is not insignificant

[dense locust]

minion knockback

[drowsy plank]

TRUE

[sleek turret]

minion knockback is good for dealing with enemies in micro cases in vanilla tbf

[half imp]

Eh

[crude geode]

Is it

[half imp]

There's so many minions that it doesn't usually matter

[sleek turret]

it gets irrelevant by the time you get stronger summons with higher knockback

sanguine bat for example

[glass arch]

id say it gets irrelevant by the time you get more minion slots

[sleek turret]

true because enemy hit stuns

[drowsy plank]

by the time you have 2 minions u prolly got enough damage/mobility that it isn't a problem

[glass arch]

3 minion slots or higher and usually i dont find myself worrying about knockback and thats just summon potion plus any summoner armor

[half imp]

It gets irrelevant by the time you can actually boost it

[crude geode]

I feel like Knockback itself stops mattering like. Post evil boss

[glass arch]

it does kinda matter early hardmode in vanilla

[tepid crown]

wat if minions had negative kb so getting minion kb was important

[dense locust]

it still matters for events for basically the entire game

[sleek turret]

it also kinda depends on difficulty because comparing micro combat scenarios in expert is different from master

[glass arch]

because so much shit gets so absurdly strong

[glass arch]

ok now i use a sentry on the other side of the enemy and never die

[sleek turret]

and yea early hardmode because fuuuuuuck enemies deal a lot of damage and also have high kb resistance

[dense locust]

vanilla sentry with enough hitrate for that to happen

[sleek turret]

master chaos elementals 💔

[tepid crown]

no its always programmed to go towards you

[crude geode]

I noticed it slightly in early hardmode but not enough for me to actually care about the knockback of things

[sleek turret]

it is really a micro situation dependant stat

[glass arch]

sidenote its really funny how much of a dichotomy there is between vanilla and calamity master

[sleek turret]

there will be situations where it will not matter but there will be situations where you'd wish you had slightly more

[crude geode]

This is. certainly a sugg

[glass arch]

vanilla master sucks ASS it is MISERABLE and i HATE IT and in cal its perfectly fine lol

[drowsy plank]

this suggestion is really funny because anyone that knows anything about calamity knows this doesnt matter at all but at the same time

the people who hated ankh being removed from asgard's valor would probably go crazy over it tbh

lmao

[glass arch]

"this way there is no redundant effect" my ass

[sleek turret]

in calamity early hardmode however I found it irrelevant because ancient ice chunk just kills anything that is on-screen and off-screen when exploring ❤️

[glass arch]

the redundant effect is laud

because you arent getting those debuffs in the first place

[lucid marsh]

Laudanum is more interesting than ankh line

[craggy girder]

why cant they synergize

[lucid marsh]

In terms of effect

[drowsy plank]

how would they synergize

[crude geode]

^

[lucid marsh]

Exactly

[drowsy plank]

unless ankh is constantly inflicting you with those debuffs or something lmfao

[lucid marsh]

Better to remove one

[craggy girder]

if you have both ankh and laud/crown, if you get the debuffs they turn into buffs

[crude geode]

That’s just what laud does

[drowsy plank]

do you know what laud does

[craggy girder]

yeah

[glass arch]

i dont know how to explain to you that you cant both not be capable of getting a debuff and also have one of those debuffs you arent capable of having

[craggy girder]

it doesnt do it for all the ankh debuffs

[lucid marsh]

It doesn't? Then make it do that

This is just better

[craggy girder]

Laudenaum does not provide immunities to Ankh

[drowsy plank]

laud gets more non-dps debuffs while ankh also makes u immune to like

on fire burning poison

[craggy girder]

(or, undebuffs. how do you say it)

[lucid marsh]

So combine them all into a single accessory line

[craggy girder]

mmm.

[half imp]

Some laud debuffs overlap with ankh

[craggy girder]

some, not all

[hollow shell]

Actually inclined to disagree.
I thought the passive knockback from The Transformer's orbitals was noticeable n helpful, and that's post-Mech1

[lucid marsh]

I could make a specific crafting tree for immunity items but that would be an SIS

[half imp]

Anyway laud's entire effect sucks

[dense locust]

the problem with both of thse items is that debuffs are not real in calamity unless they are a dot

[half imp]

I'm slowly fixing that!

go my frozen

[craggy girder]

if you have both laud and ankh then if you get the debuff that ankh should Prevent, laud instead makes it a buff

[lucid marsh]

I think it would be way better in prehardmode and early hardmode

[glass arch]

please dont

[drowsy plank]

if you do spread out vanilla debuffs more please also consider making them good 😭

[glass arch]

i fucking hate frozen

[lucid marsh]

Especially if it were combined with ankh shield effects

[drowsy plank]

silenced and cursed do not deserve to exist as they do right now

[half imp]

Too late

[crude geode]

I think more bosses should inflict the funny gravity effect from vortex pillars

[half imp]

(cultist)

[lucid marsh]

Silenced should just reduce magic damage

[craggy girder]

okay but like cultist is easy

[lucid marsh]

Ok idea

[half imp]

Silenced is such a bad debuff

A debuff that just nukes one class

[drowsy plank]

silenced should just reduce damage because targeting one class is stupid

[half imp]

Cursed is fine

[craggy girder]

cursed is bullshit no it is not

[glass arch]

i hate frozen, i hate stoned, i hate ogre snot or whatever thats called, i hate distorted, i hate silenced, i hate cursed, i hate confusion

[crude geode]

Summon debuff that prevents you from summoning minions and despawns them

[drowsy plank]

cursed is stupid why does it disable mounts and healing potions

[half imp]

like it's annoying but that's the point

[drowsy plank]

it should just stop you from attacking

[lucid marsh]

Silenced:
Reduces magic and summon damage by 20%
Cursed:
Reduces melee, ranged, and rogue speed and damage by 10% each

[drowsy plank]

it also stops hooks

it hits so many things it just does not fucking need to do

[craggy girder]

... cursed prevents the usage of anything that you could lc right

why would it reduce damage

[drowsy plank]

yeah

[lucid marsh]

I'm suggesting it be changed

[drowsy plank]

because it would be better than whatever it's doing rn

[craggy girder]

oh i see

[lucid marsh]

To something different

[dense locust]

100% reduced damage 🔥

[lucid marsh]

I'm imagining silenced makes your magic weak, and cursed makes your physical power weak

[glass arch]

fundamentally i hate debuffs that are like this

[craggy girder]

no thats Weak

[half imp]

silenced made sense back in terraria 1.0.5

[craggy girder]

Weak makes you Weak

[drowsy plank]

ok but literally this would be fine

[dense locust]

if only we had a debuff to make your physical power "weak"

oh wait

[lucid marsh]

Yeah but this one is different because it's melee speed

[drowsy plank]

WAIT WHAT

WHY DOES IT DO THIS

[hollow shell]

(Squeaky de la Fargo's)

[craggy girder]

bleeeeh

[hollow shell]

I DIDN'T KNOW THAT

[craggy girder]

bleeheheheheeeeehhh - redigit spinks

[dense locust]

:)

[crude geode]

Yep

[glass arch]

i did know that and i dont like it

[drowsy plank]

at least it doesn't disable melee entirely like silenced

[hollow shell]

I literally thought it was X% reduced damage

[drowsy plank]

please make the damage debuff generic

[tepid crown]

isnt this literally the same as one of the moon items

[drowsy plank]

yes

but negative

[tepid crown]

dont remember if it was charm or stone

[drowsy plank]

oh and also mining speed

[craggy girder]

okay but like genuinely Weak should JUST be a movement inhibitor and ONLY on very telegraphed attacks

like Stunned! kinda

[dense locust]

we HAVE movement inhibitors

[craggy girder]

Yeah :)

[half imp]

weak should be a damage inhibitor

[dense locust]

they're called chilled and slow

[tepid crown]

theres already 5 movement inhibitors

[half imp]

slow and chilled yeah

And frozen

[tepid crown]

we dont need one more

webbed

[craggy girder]

and snotted

[tepid crown]

galvanic corrosion

[drowsy plank]

why is moon stone generic but weak melee locked 😭

[half imp]

I forgot that's a thing

[dense locust]

eutrophication

[craggy girder]

Obscured i think?

[half imp]

Is galvanic ever used on players?

Same with eutrophication

[dense locust]

old vuln hex

[glass arch]

im all for unique vanilla debuffs but considering what unique vanilla debuffs exist i would much rather have all vanilla debuffs just be dots

[drowsy plank]

glacial state

[half imp]

I don't think either of those two do that to players

[tepid crown]

i dont think so but they already exist so yknow

[half imp]

Glacial State also has no player effect

[dense locust]

this was so funny

[half imp]

(and is just frozen 2)

[half imp]

wait what

What did old vhex do

[dense locust]

yknow how vuln hex is a boss slow when used by the player

where do you think it got that effect from

[half imp]

lol wait

[glass arch]

it reduced move speed by like 50% didnt it

[half imp]

that's peak

That should come back

[drowsy plank]

yeah it did

[crude geode]

Peam

[drowsy plank]

now it just reduces flight time

[dense locust]

it used to do both at the same time iirc

[crude geode]

Reduced flight time is a funny stat

[drowsy plank]

yeah

oh wait right that was removed in 2.1.0

oops

wiki outdated

[half imp]

there should be something with 200% reduced flight time

[dense locust]

wow

smh

[half imp]

2.1.0 removed vhex reduced flight time??

[drowsy plank]

-17.5 health per second, -20 defense, -10% damage reduction

yes

[tepid crown]

ravager

[crude geode]

New ravager debuff

[half imp]

oh it still has -20 defense and -10% dr ok

[craggy girder]

disables wings :)

[tepid crown]

🐌

[drowsy plank]

i feel like debuffs need a look over in general

[half imp]

If they killed it to just be a dot I'd explode

[crude geode]

[craggy girder]

isnt Brimstone Flames a DoT already

[crude geode]

Every time something is reduced to a dot I cry

[tepid crown]

debuffs are a mechanic in the video game known as terraria

[drowsy plank]

the fact that nobody here even knew what weak did and also doze finding out about effects of some of these right here in this chat makes me feel like it really needs someone to actually

[dense locust]

reminds me that prior to this update not a single enemy debuff added by calamity gets inflicted for more than 20 seconds

[craggy girder]

we cant have two dots

[drowsy plank]

look at what they are doing

[crude geode]

I know what weak does. Specifically because someone complained about it

[half imp]

yeah I want to actually look over debuffs in the future

[glass arch]

i did know about it its just not egregious enough for me to loathe it as much as i do other debuffs

[drowsy plank]

please make the future soon bc omg

[half imp]

we need more interesting usage of debuffs and effects

[tepid crown]

there should be a boss that inflicts a very weak dot for 1 minute

itd be peak

[half imp]

which can be done now that ankh valor is dead!!

[crude geode]

Old PBG or something

Except it was never weak

[craggy girder]

whats the calamitas enchant

[tepid crown]

if you fail cultist ritual u get distorted

[craggy girder]

that inflicts a weak dot

[half imp]

ravager should inflict Bleeding at all times to all players

[tepid crown]

aflame?

[crude geode]

Can we give Astrum Deus that funny vortex gravity effect whenever you’re near it

[polar bison]

Ravager should inflict a new debuff called heavy bleeding and it should be upgraded post prov into

idfk laceration

[glass arch]

can i kill you like in real life

[tepid crown]

thats a crazy idea

[crude geode]

Ravager is moving to post provi

[craggy girder]

i do think movement inhibitors and stuff like that should be a punishment for failing to dodge a massive damage attack

as like a combo tool

(for the boss)

[dense locust]

oh that reminds me that old duke vortexes are dumb and desperately need an effect that isnt pulling you into them

[glass arch]

i think they should be punishments for failing to dodge small attacks actually

[half imp]

like ravager just having a bleeding aura that kills regen would be interesting and change how you have to approach and prepare for the fight

[polar bison]

The punchline is that they did this in Brainstorm

[craggy girder]

why small ones???

[worthy lintel]

just, please, no debuffs that take away movement speed, i do not want to roleplay swimming in molasses 🙏

[half imp]

no

[tepid crown]

so that they combo in the big one thatd normally be easy to dodge

[half imp]

Movement inhibitors should have the punishment be the inhibition

[dense locust]

because that lets the small ones be important

[half imp]

Not slowing you down AFTER you get nuked

like how cultist does jt

[tepid crown]

just take a look at deviantts big beam attack

[dense locust]

cultist debuff is super undertuned rn

[drowsy plank]

slowing you down after you get nuked feels awful

[half imp]

Ice mist does 0 damage but can inflict Chilled and Frozen

[craggy girder]

if you get hit by the big nuke, then the next (normally smaller) hit hurts Harderer

[glass arch]

because you just got hit with a big fuck you beam and punishing you more with a nuke after you get hit with the nuke sucks

[polar bison]

Polterghast shoots giant fields of slowing ectoplasm

[dense locust]

the chilled lasts like
2 seconds

and doesnt impact you at all

[tepid crown]

theres the meduss part first, then its a big beam

[drowsy plank]

getting hit with a small attack that slows you leading to you getting hit with a bigger one at least is a bit more deserved

[half imp]

chilled needs to be a little longer and ancient Doom needs to be harder yeah

The frozen is fine

[glass arch]

its a Lose More When You Lose Big Already

[half imp]

^

[crude geode]

^

[half imp]

That's not fun or interesting really

[craggy girder]

yeah thats the idea no

[crude geode]

No

[craggy girder]

you lose because you got gigablasted and if you survive that, then you gotta lock in aftermore

[crude geode]

If you want to just kill the player for not dodging an attack that’s different

[half imp]

It's better to make inhibitors make it easier to accidentally be hit by the gigablast

[dense locust]

alternatively
swap the position of ice mist and doom right before ritual

so if you get hit by mist you probably end up spawning a dragon

[glass arch]

if theres a lose more it should be on an attack where you wouldnt be losing much in the first place

[drowsy plank]

that's dumb it's already a super strong attack ur basically just guarnteeing someone dies

[half imp]

You already have to do that because you're on low HP

[drowsy plank]

yeah

[craggy girder]

but being hit by the gigablast bc you cant move sucks

that would be Not Fun in my eyes

[tepid crown]

thats the point

[drowsy plank]

then dont get hit right before gigablast that is part of the attack

if you want an attack to also slow you then it shouldnt hurt as much

[half imp]

yeah

[tepid crown]

you get hit by an earlier weaker attack leading you into getting hit by the stronger one

[worthy lintel]

scal's vuln hex should give her dodge piercing

[glass arch]

you have to actually pay attention to the little attacks rather than just ignoring the chip damage that you can heal off super easily

[craggy girder]

being hit by basically a toddlers punch that causes you to near forcefully get hit by his 360 lift dad

[polar bison]

Think of it this way. What is more engaging and tension building?

• Being hit by Thanatos' blender laser, being hit with a slowing debuff by it, and being pelted by low dmg laser.
• Being hit by a low damage laser, getting slowed by it, and seeing Thanatos charge up the blender

[tepid crown]

it looks like two attacks but in reality its one because the big attack would be easy to dodge if u dont get hit by the first one

[crude geode]

SCal should just insta gib you if you get hit too many times

[craggy girder]

the first one is more enjoyable, the second is more stressful

[dense locust]

I wonder where you got that idea from

[craggy girder]

both are, in my eyes, acceptable

[crude geode]

No clue

[worthy lintel]

the hits should really be counted.... it would be a calamity though...

[glass arch]

the punishment for getting hit with the big attacks is already that you're getting hit with the big attack and taking a whole lot of damage

[tepid crown]

again, deviantts big fuck you laser perfectly demonstrates this by having the medusa essentially guarantee you get hit if you arent careful

[crude geode]

^

[tepid crown]

but also make the fuck you laser piss easy if you dodge the medusa

[glass arch]

the punishment for little attacks that dont deal much damage should be defense damage or debuffs

[craggy girder]

okay im gonna use a crossgame example but like

[glass arch]

because thats a lose more in a situation where you already werent losing much

[crude geode]

Oh god

[craggy girder]

i would rather be slowed by a polyphemus than slowed by soy milk bullets

since one theres a LOT of while the other is just One Really Big Thing

[crude geode]

TBOI’s damage is way different tho

[craggy girder]

i would rather be slowed by a cannonball from a pirate captain than his bullets

[polar bison]

You're all losers. WAIT

[craggy girder]

how DARE you.

[polar bison]

You guys will get what I mean

As in like you'll get this reference

Think of Naoya Zenin

[crude geode]

No we won’t

[dense ferry]

Don't slow down the player ever that's about it I think

[glass arch]

who from where

[craggy girder]

i mean thats an also good idea

[polar bison]

Jujutsu Kaisen

[dense ferry]

Like slowing down the player is kinda just never fun

[polar bison]

Slowing is a very very very delicate tool

[glass arch]

chud show sorry

[polar bison]

I've seen it used well very rarely

[worthy lintel]

in general i just really fucking hate debuffs that directly hurt movement speed though, its an incredibly irritating way to punish a player

i wish all players who think slowdowns are cool a very 5 hours long pre-monsoon fight sequence

[dense ferry]

Whenever this topic comes up I just think of 5-2

[craggy girder]

whats pre monsoon

[dense ferry]

[glass arch]

theres like

[craggy girder]

which ones that

[glass arch]

a specific range of speed reduction in debuffs that i think is fine

[dense ferry]

ULTRAKILL is fucking awesome. Except when Hakita decides that making the player fight in a miniscule arena is a good idea

[tepid crown]

boss slows and stuns can be done well but they need to be done really well and typically people dont do that

[glass arch]

it CANNOT be more than 20% under ANY circumstances

[craggy girder]

oh like in 3-3(?) A SHOT IN THE DARK

[crude geode]

The box at the very start of P-2 pisses me off

[dense ferry]

The Blood Corridor is worse to me

[craggy girder]

i havent seen the prime sanctums

[crude geode]

Blood Corridors is worse actually true

[dense ferry]

The Weezer Room at least is only crowded with slow and heavily telegraphed enemies, plus you can still run in circles and be mostly fine

[craggy girder]

the what

[glass arch]

weezer room

[crude geode]

The Weezer Room

[craggy girder]

what.

[crude geode]

Play Ultrakill

[craggy girder]

i do

infact play it

[crude geode]

Play it more then

[tepid crown]

its the weezer room

[craggy girder]

thats

not specific

whats in

it

[tepid crown]

its iconic

[worthy lintel]

weezer room

[crude geode]

It’s peam

[tepid crown]

how do you NOT know weezer room

[craggy girder]

whats IN it dawg

[crude geode]

(Google is free to use yknow)

[craggy girder]

i dont wanna google it since then im just gonna stare at the wiki for an hour

[worthy lintel]

weezer room is the very first room of p-2 wait of the world that contains 4 cerberi in a cramped ass room

[crude geode]

Rewarding laziness smh my head

[craggy girder]

aaaaaaaah.

thats why i dont know it

its bc i havent gotten past 4-4 on brutal

i see it

[worthy lintel]

not that i blame you, brutal is dogass lmao

and i p ranked p2 on brutal

[craggy girder]

cant you just magnet three and conductor the final

[craggy girder]

for +CONDUCTOR x4

if the rooms so small

[worthy lintel]

i also played fraud on brutal and its even more dogass

it puts my 3070 ti on its knees

[crude geode]

Fraud is kinda dogass rn tbh

Welcome back pre-revamp Leviathan

[craggy girder]

i dont like very much stuff in ultrakill if it involves me not just running in a straight line

or a mostly straight line

for example heart of the sunrise is Not Cool

[glass arch]

this user has never learned strafing

[crude geode]

^

[craggy girder]

i moreso mean getting Lost

and having to go Back to the start of the level, run it through Again

like Manually

like Physically

(this was my 8-2 experience)

[glass arch]

i dont claim to be good at ultrakill by any means (200 attempts on gabe 2) but i do still know strafing

[worthy lintel]

i have in general a disdain of games that are not linear, i do not have the taste of exploration anymore

i am past my prime, out of time

[dense ferry]

Fuck is strafing

[craggy girder]

what does Strafing have to do with getting lost as shit

[glass arch]

when you move in a different direction from holding w

[dense ferry]

Incredible

[craggy girder]

i genuinely do not have a rank on 8-2 and 8-3 bc 8-2 broke on me and 8-3 looked like bullshit to play through

so i just noclipped them both

[dense ferry]

That's fucked up

[craggy girder]

and then 8-4 has a hole in the ceiling. somehow.

[glass arch]

8-2 is the trenches right

[dense ferry]

8-3 is fucking awesome man

[craggy girder]

8-2 is THROUGH THE MIRROR

[crude geode]

8 is fraud

[dense ferry]

That's 7-2

[craggy girder]

the first Room looked bad

i played through it and went "... its 1 am im not doing this." and got lost in noclip

[glass arch]

oh right

i still havent played fraud lo!

[craggy girder]

like even while flying outside the map i could not find the exit

for like five minutes

[polar bison]

I lost my 8-2 P-Rank to the level boss and ragequit