suggestions-discussion

[kindred ledge]

oh right i forgot about that

[crude geode]

Wow it has two bosses, what a great biome

[rose panther]

still waiting for an underground normal cave boss

[kindred ledge]

tho what if astrum aureus had a chance to drop an abandoned version of the terraspark boots and the aquatic scourge had a chance to drop a suphorized version of the terraspark boots and you could combine them?

[rose panther]

why would u need terraspark boots in hm?

and its gets upgraded to angel treads b4 astrum aureus

[drowsy plank]

the fuck does "sulphurized version" even mean

do you mean sulphur resistant boots or something and those combined with aureus's boots or something?

[kindred ledge]

like an incredibly rusty version of the terraspark boots that makes you resistant to sulphur poisoning

[drowsy plank]

why would it be terraspark boots instead of just

boots

[lucid marsh]

What does terraspark boots have to do with anything

I think they just want an alternative way to get the boot line without grinding for terraspark boots

And then to add some resistances and abilities on top of it

Which tbh would be a neat idea

Would make terraspark boots more worthy of their name

[golden sonnet]

We do not need more materials in the boots line

[grave zinc]

@exotic echo - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Another Shimmer Transumation]

It has received enough votes to be passed on to the dev server for voting! You'll be notified again when a verdict is reached.
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

@lapis canyon - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Make Supreme Witch, Calamitas, Seekers and Sepulcher overlap on top of Brimstone Monsters]

It has received enough votes to be passed on to the dev server for voting! You'll be notified again when a verdict is reached.
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

@ancient crow - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Buff the Suspicious Looking Jelly Bean so it's not outclassed by the vanilla slime mounts]

It has received enough votes to be passed on to the dev server for voting! You'll be notified again when a verdict is reached.
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

[wide river]

Huh, that's... an interesting batch

[crude geode]

That it?

[ancient crow]

[exotic echo]

wow

ok

[ancient crow]

the bean sugg! the bean sugg is reeeeeeaaaaaalll

[wide river]

Also yeah, that's it
There were 13 suggestions in that batch that weren't hit with reactions that take them out of the batch (implementation, locking, and the like), so the top 20% would be 2.6 suggestions, which I assume was rounded up to 3

[ancient crow]

yeah the top voted suggestion in that entire batch was invalid

no idea how it even made it into voting in the first place

[crude geode]

Damn

It always feels like there’s like 20+ suggs

[crude geode]

People don’t ping moderators

But also idk which sugg you’re referring to, but that’s usually the reason why invalid suggs make it in

[wide river]

If you mean the Devourer of Gods/Providence one, then that one's in the next batch
Aside from that I can't see which one you mean

[crude geode]

I don’t even see a dog/provi sugg

Though that’s likely cuz I’m blind

[wide river]

This one: #suggestions-voting message

[crude geode]

Ah yeah

[wide river]

Guess I'll repost some suggestions later, maybe sometime in the next batch
I think it was mainly a timing issue so that shouldn't be a concern this time

[crude geode]

Can’t believe they removed the one interesting part of eidolon wyrm

Bc of fuckin lore

[bright crag]

What?

[onyx osprey]

the abyss should be harder in general, nothing's really a threat. like sure pre-hardmode the laser fish hit fairly hard but that's like 10% of the playthrough

[dense ferry]

My man really said the most interesting of the Wyrm was being an adult

[onyx osprey]

admittedly it was fairly exciting the first time but it doesn't live up

granted it's easy to say 'make it gooder' from my chair

I think some more enemy variety would do a lot to help

spending the majority of your abyss trips killing just the poison gas fish gets a little old

[bright crag]

I don't think the problem is necessarily enemy variety, I think it's moreso simple mob placement/environmental integration, and simple mob AI

I agree, the Abyss should be harder and make better use of stealth mechanics

[dense ferry]

I do think the minibosses need better AI ye

[glass arch]

abyss stealth rework will be real when rogue stealth gets its last rework (never)

[onyx osprey]

what if there were a dungeon guardian-esque enemy that you're meant to avoid? it would occasionally show itself, not paying attention to the player in particular, but if you alert it, it makes loud noises and charges at you (almost certain death). it'll despawn if you get away from it like anything else. there should some kind of audio and visual queue

it'd be spooky and add some much-needed tension

[bright crag]

The minibosses need better AI
The mobs don't need it, but could definitely use it
And the Abyss has a distinct lack of critters

[worldly sparrow]

just make jared the ghost leviathan from subnautica

[bright crag]

That would be Primordial Wyrm

[dense ferry]

Not a fan of that tbh

[onyx osprey]

does that still spawn naturally?

[glass arch]

if you rod in the abyss yes

[bright crag]

Not sure

[onyx osprey]

I meant passively

[dense ferry]

Because it just forces you to play in a certain way

[onyx osprey]

it used to but I think they changed that

[glass arch]

passively no i dont think so

[worldly sparrow]

jared should spawn passively though

[dense ferry]

It just says "hide or fucking die"

Even in Subnautica, you still have a lot of leeway as to how you deal with enemies

[crude geode]

The most interesting part of the worm was the tesla ball

[worldly sparrow]

i mean its better than "go down and try not to die"

[bright crag]

I like the idea of Primordial Wyrm stalking you, but not forcing hiding

[worldly sparrow]

^

[glass arch]

and when you're in the abyss you dont exactly have much time to hide :p

[crude geode]

Which was what I was referring to

[dense ferry]

??????

[glass arch]

or many places to hide

[dense ferry]

The Lightning Orb

Wasn't

Removed

Due to lore

[bright crag]

^

[crude geode]

It wasn’t?

[dense ferry]

It was removed because Wyrm literally had the same fucking moveset as the Cultist

It was just bad

[crude geode]

Ah

[small timber]

I still like the old idea I had about abyss, but yeah obviously that is not quite happening

[worldly sparrow]

superboss jared was basically cultist but it summons minions and rams

[bright crag]

Yeah
Primordial Wyrm really should get its own attacks

[worldly sparrow]

(its the same today)

[worldly sparrow]

fr someone should just suggest that seperately

oh wait

[dense ferry]

Stop suggesting that kind of stuff for the love of God

[worldly sparrow]

yeah

[bright crag]

Yeah, you don't need to suggest fairly obvious and clear things

It only really takes up space

[dense ferry]

Seriously, suggesting to Rework an Accessory or a Boss, no matter the reasons, is EXTREMELLY unlikely to happen simply because we may not agree or we just have it planned. You asking won't make it faster, sorry

[worldly sparrow]

guys im gonna suggest a rework of the sunken sea

/j

[dense ferry]

It might give Xyk or Memes something to look at and say "I think I will rework that"

[onyx osprey]

"make sunken sea better" post suggestion

[dense ferry]

Xyk did that with Void of Extinction

He saw the Sugg, we all agreed, and he wanted to, so he went ahead and did it

Byeah, just wanted to give this heads up, please don't ask for things we already know or plan to do

[crude geode]

Reworking bosses should fall under high effort

Naturally

[dense ferry]

The amount of times I saw people asking to rework Auric Soul Artifact is criminal

[worldly sparrow]

DSA to a lesser extent

but like DSA probably just needs a minor change instead of a full rework

[onyx osprey]

I guess the idea is 'squeaky wheel gets the grease'

[crude geode]

Surprised it didn’t get put on frequently suggested

[bright crag]

If we had to do that consistently, the frequently suggested section would be a bit big

[onyx osprey]

one underrated aspect of the abyss I like, that alert noise when you spawn PW
it's a good "uh oh" sound

[drowsy plank]

what are you talking about i fucking hate that stupid orb

[bright crag]

True

[dense ferry]

I wanted to pick on enemy coding but it's hard

[drowsy plank]

both the predictive version which was ass to dodge
and the multiplayer version that shoots everyone at once so you can't dodge

seriously why the fuck does it STILL DO THAT

[onyx osprey]

that's really funny

[dense ferry]

If I do actually pick it up, you can be sure the first thing I'm doing is reworking a lot of Abyss shit

[worldly sparrow]

anyways time to suggest a recipe for prototype plasma drive core (it could still be somewhat hard to craft ig)

[glass arch]

relogic when it

[drowsy plank]

it's funny the first time but then storm weaver starts using it and you just want to die

[small timber]

now make it shoot 3 lasers to everyone in multiplayer

[crude geode]

When one of the only multiplayer boss features is ass

[onyx osprey]

what if DoG did a copy of the grid attack for each player so it was completely impossible to dodge unless you were all standing on each other

[crude geode]

Anyways did anyone know Colossal Squid had an ink bomb attack

[small timber]

what if yharon do an individual bullet hell on top of each players' head and scal's BH too

[crude geode]

Cuz I sure didn’t

[onyx osprey]

I didn't either

[small timber]

that surely will increase the mod's difficulty because multiplayer is too easy

[onyx osprey]

I'm trying to think and I don't remember seeing that

[bright crag]

The grids would overlap and cause legitimately undodgeable patterns :p

[small timber]

and also likely extremely laggy

[crude geode]

Yeah

[bright crag]

On the good side, you won't die to the attack
On the bad side, your PC will first

[small timber]

sounds perfect, send it

[bright crag]

So true

[glass arch]

im still confused as to why grids work better in multiplayer than they do normally

[random talon]

what if DoG used his fire breath more intuitively instead of shooting in your direction while running at you?

[onyx osprey]

I've never had terraria lag before, do a lot of players have older hardware? I've always had a pretty good GPU so that could be it

[random talon]

ex. fire rain, bullet patterns

[onyx osprey]

not throwing shade, just curious

[glass arch]

its not gpu

[onyx osprey]

it's talked about so commonly but I've never had it myself

[glass arch]

terraria doesnt use gpu

it runs off cpu and ram

[small timber]

DoG talk is mostly pointless right now because there is a rework planned

along with a resprite

[onyx osprey]

does terraria make use of multithreading?

[random talon]

ok

[glass arch]

no clue but probably not

[onyx osprey]

well w/e, it's off topic anyway

[crude geode]

Something about primordial wyrm still irks me to this day

Can’t quite put my finger on it though

[onyx osprey]

I've always disliked enemies that just ram the player at a billion mph

[crude geode]

Pusheen is cooking something

[worldly sparrow]

ive finished cooking

[random talon]

W suggestion

[onyx osprey]

missing out on equipment is not really something the mod needs

[golden sonnet]

I mean, it's really only limited if you care about using a single world, it takes all of 2 seconds to make a new world and fly to the planetoid if both drops are good

[wide river]

(4 total times from 3 people, one of which was a resuggest)

[worldly sparrow]

it could be implemented in a recipe in which missing out on the recipe wouldn't be much of an issue

such as having it on a different classes weapon on the same tier

or smth

[random talon]

The Plasma Drive Core having one purpose is really dumb

[worldly sparrow]

actually just put it not on mage and you dont miss out on much

[onyx osprey]

Would it help if while in the abyss, you actually were able to see detection radii? maybe something like a sonar 'pulse' every now and then

idk if enemies have a detection radius, or if the player has a 'get detected' radius

but either way this can be made apparent

right now you generally ignore the mechanic, it's not super easy to tell when or how you're alerting things

[onyx osprey]

both can be true actually but still a sonar pulse would work. it would be fairly subtle so as to not make the screen too messy/obscure things

perhaps a dangersense potion can make the sonar brighter? that would be an intuitive thing

[random talon]

what does the detection even do?

[onyx osprey]

abyss enemies are passive until they detect you and become hostile

like how a reaper shark will just sit there until you get close

[random talon]

huh, I never noticed

I see

[onyx osprey]

evidently, it's easy to just not know the mechanic even exists

many accessories even mention it lmao

[random talon]

yep

[drowsy plank]

i agree with Clark that missing out on stuff is not something the mod needs considering it's constantly working to remove these sorts of scenarios

i dont think the plasma drive core having one use is dumb considering... vanilla has DOZENS of items like that

at least core is pretty unique

on the other hand you have the rusted bell from the wizard who's only purpose is to be turned into the fairy bell with mech souls like

idk why not just make him sell it after that boss it seems weird

[small timber]

but what if we give step stool upgrade

[drowsy plank]

...step stool does have an upgrade

[wide river]

Hand of Creation when it

[golden sonnet]

I actually like step stool in HoC tbh

[drowsy plank]

same lol

[lucid marsh]

hand of creation when I'm always missing one traveling merchant item for the entire game

seriously I don't think I've ever gotten the paint sprayer (or maybe it was some other one) from the merchant

[vagrant spindle]

thats funny as hell but also what did you expect

[sand marlin]

Use invis pot and you are forever undetected 💪

[stable kiln]

this is contradictory my dude

[random talon]

@grizzled echo What mods does the brimstone crag break with?

[grizzled echo]

Can't say for certain which mods in particular causes conflicts... I've got a good few mods in use

I do hear Mod of Redemption doesn't play nice with Calamity, but that doesn't have any hell world gen...

Could be something from Secrets of the Shadows, as they have something that generates in hell

[whole tundra]

Do you have Remnants/Advanced Worldgen enabled

[grizzled echo]

Advanced World Gen, yes

Or, well, did, while I test things

[whole tundra]

Yeah that is not made around Calamity at all

[grizzled echo]

As that's one such mod name that pops up often

Sometimes it works, oftentimes it doesn't

Not trying to make an XL world

Decided to use Fargo's Best of Both Worlds for some options I'd normally use from that

Crimruption, both ores

Now, with Advanced World Gen, does the overhauled world gen option fuck with Calamity?

[regal willow]

#1052330262492631071 message

Can't really quote but there is info about advanced worldgen with calamity in there

[grizzled echo]

Well, like I said...
Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't
Finally a world gen that worked
Been trying to make a world since the october update...

[regal willow]

[hushed scarab]

• world gen issue
• mixes big content mods with different world gen
• world gen incompatibility

wonder where that came from

[random talon]

[worthy lintel]

we care

but with a mod this large, more obscure items tend to fall under the mass

wires indeed...

[frosty trellis]

^

Item bloat has been reduced significantly for sure but there will always be stuff that falls beneath the cracks just because some items are so obscure that even the devs forget they exist at times and I can't exactly blame them

[hollow idol]

i dont think having the two cyst bottles is really offensive

[eternal escarp]

in this case i think it makes sense
two evils, two variants

your not gonna run next to both of them in the same world (normally) anyways

[crude geode]

It’s a lot less offensive than some of the evil duplicates

[buoyant idol]

you're

[frail mantle]

nuh uh

yr'oue

[tall ledge]

nuh uh

'yragp

[regal willow]

[bright crag]

Honestly I agree with the suggestion because of one thing

Items that combine Corruption and Crimson themes are pretty damn cool imo

Having these two very aesthetically striking vile essences combine in a foul toxic cocktail

[worldly sparrow]

🥱 reference sugg

[grizzled echo]

Look, the point is, other mods have been taking measures to be more cross mod compatible...
Why does Calamity have to be such a stick in the mud in that regard?

[crude geode]

Because cal is largely meant to be played on it’s own

It’s balance is far away from vanilla and it revamps good chunks of world generation

[worldly sparrow]

(on its own or with some qol mods that dont affect anything)

[crude geode]

it also has progression far past most other content mods, meaning unless the mod specifically plans around that, it’s going to fall by the wayside halfway through post moon lord or earlier

[worldly sparrow]

most don't have post-ml content at all

a lot of the rest have like 1, maybe 2 bosses there

[crude geode]

One of the other popular mods, Thorium, has a single boss post-ml, and then the game is considered done for them

[worldly sparrow]

so yeah cal having such a long post-ml is very unique for a content mod

[random talon]

@ashen warren what's that supposed to mean?

your suggestion, I mean

[drowsy plank]

ew reference items

[crude geode]

Pretty sure it’s obvious

They want more items which are references to warframe

[novel belfry]

well if that's the case, then i want more final fantasy xiv refer--

/s

[worldly sparrow]

yall can i get some thoughts on this sugg? been working on it for a bit (/s ofc)

[wide river]

The suggestion of all time

[north oracle]

a special mount called the Excelsus (not to be confused with the Excelsus)

[drowsy plank]

truly a horrid sight

[worldly sparrow]

i will post it in 5

[drowsy plank]

now add it to the fandom wiki

[worldly sparrow]

nanomachine armor yes

sounds exactly like a fandom thing

[novel belfry]

I had to double take this because i know you're not a new guy
still hilarious

[worldly sparrow]

bro imagine if someone new just entered the server and posted this shit in posting

[novel belfry]

sounds exactly like that

YHARIM BARS LOL

[worldly sparrow]

xeroc metal too

[long ridge]

Axe of purity's right click isn't for using it as a weapon, it's for the secondary function of well, purifying blocks.

Grax, however, has the exact function that you're suggesting

[wintry gale]

can be used as weapon anyway

[novel belfry]

Well the Grax does have a right click for using as a weapon

and yeah spacer said it too

[wintry gale]

right, i didnt know that
gonna add as reasoning

[novel belfry]

its actually pretty decent as a weapon too

[long ridge]

While you're at it, suggest that hydraulic volt crasher gets this feature as well

[wintry gale]

okay

done

[wintry gale]

btw do u guys have any opinion about my ares exoskeleton sugg?

[ornate kestrel]

Love this

[ornate kestrel]

👍

Makes it less of a hassle

You get a gold star

[wintry gale]

tysm

[onyx osprey]

did anyone like this suggestion? or is it workable?

I find a main problem with the abyss is that it's not particularly easy to tell if you're going to be detected or not, you have to guess

making the gameplay more diegetic here would do a lot to help I think

[ashen warren]

Why not just have a sound that plays when you get noticed

[onyx osprey]

well that's not quite as helpful if you're trying to avoid getting detected in the first place (though that's better than nothing)

[ashen warren]

Isn't the whole noticing mechanic kinda pointless anyway

You can just, kill the enemies

[onyx osprey]

the way it currently works, yeah kinda

ideally this also coincides with a larger rework

[ashen warren]

There's not enough room to really move around them that easily without having the detection radius really small

[onyx osprey]

I think there's room to design a more interesting system here. for one, the abyss should be more difficult in general, so that avoiding detection matters more

I actually find it's not that hard to maneuver around enemies other than the gas fish which are basically passive anyway

for example I'll avoid the laser fish until they're no longer a threat; they deal quite a lot of damage for a pre HM enemy

[ashen warren]

guns/melee weapons from warframe like soma prime, in calamity

[hybrid steeple]

THE OTHER RULES YOU COULDNT FIT IN ADDED ON AT THE BOTTOM LIKE TAGS DIAHHSVFBUDGUHG

[sand marlin]

Another mod has this functionality already, Fargo's Mutant is a very commonly used QoL mod

[lost lintel]

actually didn't knew about that, thanks for pointing out
though I still think it would be better to have something like this implemented in Calamity itself

[wide river]

After having looked over this suggestion #suggestions-posting message, I went ahead and decided to find out how many items would be available earlier:
Occult Skull Crown
Nightmare Dye
Endothermic Dye
Ascendant Spirit Essence

Discord istg

[north oracle]

Embed success

[wide river]

Byeah of those four items Ascendant Spirit Essence is the big'un

[golden sonnet]

Why the fuck would you choose to embed that link in that way. Discord is actually made by rats

[wide river]

(Actually, even then, the only thing that would be made available earlier is Omega Healing Potion recipe)

[golden sonnet]

Also, isn't this suggestion devplans.png, the devs have stated that those items being from the vanilla events is a temporary thing

[tacit ferry]

Yep. I dunno if I'm underestimating potion upgrades but it doesn't seem huge to me.

[tacit ferry]

Oops, didn't know that. Thanks lol

[golden sonnet]

Although that is just moving what they are from, not when. Although the what does have reasoning behind it so it would be weird to have the distortion stuff at like providence tier

[tacit ferry]

Distortion? The way progression is situated having the drops occur post-Providence you'd only get 2 dyes, the Occult Skull Crown, and Ascendant Spirit Essence -> Omega Healing Potion. Because everything else that uses them also uses the Cosmic Anvil and/or Cosmilite

[sand marlin]

Thematics

[golden sonnet]

Yes, nightmare fuel and endothermic are planned to be moved to the distortion subworld in some way

[drowsy plank]

yes this does conflict with devplans

i also just think that it is

a bad idea lmao

sure i mean having the powered moons after dog makes just as little sense but like

there's no reason to even allow it to be obtained without forcing a bunch of weapons to need to be rebalanced

plus i dont feel like post provi is dying for content atm

[tacit ferry]

I don't see why?

[sand marlin]

You skipped the part where you can't actually obtain those weapons at that stage

It's still pretty weird having a material be available for very little until the actual stage it makes sense to be in thematically though

[cobalt pewter]

if ASE materials are dropped earlier:

• ASE itself won't be able to used till post-dog
• Nightmare Fuel can craft Occult Skull Crown, Void Sash and its dye pre-dog
• Endothermic Energy can only craft its dye pre-dog
• Darksun Fragment won't be able to be used till post-dog

even if we're ignoring devplans, there aren't much space to move these without going too far back

and even if they're moved they just don't have many uses before dog, unless you want to do a rebalance hell and move some post dog weapons back

[drowsy plank]

yeah overall this is just not worth it lol

[lucid marsh]

Void sash being pre-DoG would not be terrible for balance considering how worthless the entire line is

[frosty trellis]

Not really

Void Sash is actually like a usable accessory post Yharon for SCal, Exos and Boss rush

The entire rest of the line just sucks balls

And even then while Void Sash is viable it still needs some love A.Aegis is still bonkers and is objectively better outside of personal preferrence and playstyle shit

[lucid marsh]

Yeah I guess that much is true

But like

[sand marlin]

Sash is perfectly fine as a dash, I'd argue that just dashing to dodge an attack is as much as a skill as ramming something to do it

[lucid marsh]

Everything before void sash is just utterly worthless because the alternatives outclass it in every way

Shield: just as good of a dash with nice stats as well
Amalgamated brain: just as good of a dodge with a nice damage bonus on top of that

None of the buffs provided by the belt are good enough to replace anything that other accesories provide

[sand marlin]

You already have a separate kb res source by post Yharon in rampart so aegis replacement is not really off the table considering you would be saving a slot by losing some defense only and not much else besides that

[tacit ferry]

Sash still requires Cosmic Anvil too

[sand marlin]

Yeah that just works

[tacit ferry]

You'd get access to 4 things pre-DoG, 2 dyes, omega potions, and the occult skull crown

[lucid marsh]

Skull I would like to be available earlier

It's probably not OP

[tacit ferry]

But if Sash is moved to Ancient Manipulator it doesn't really feel like it's breaking the game either

[sand marlin]

I don't see anyone using skull outside of improving rage gain tbh

[tacit ferry]

And anyone who hasn't done those events pre-Providence probably doesn't want to do the unempowered versions?

[lucid marsh]

Then it just gets worse and worse the longer you have to wait to be able to use it

[sand marlin]

No.
The dash is absurdly long
It also spreads sythes with the dash balanced around its current tier
Having this much mobility in just one acc is not good(at that stage)

[lucid marsh]

Also agree with this

[sand marlin]

You can also just use heart of darkness

[tacit ferry]

Fair enough, doesn't fit the default change regardless

[lucid marsh]

I would argue that no matter how good the mobility is, it's still trash

[sand marlin]

You are bad at judging balance

[lucid marsh]

Tbf I haven't used it, but I have looked at it's predecessor

that accessory is worthless

[sand marlin]

I've never used the one in between MNJ and sash, it does feel out of place

Considering you would not usually have a separate kb res source at that stage because frozen/hero shield are post plant though while they are still useful, they start to scale down eventually

@frosty trellis thoughts on Statis' Ninja Belt

[glass arch]

did you just call master ninja gear master ninja jear

[sand marlin]

Guh

[tardy geyser]

Juh

Statis belt is usable for provi, other than that its meh

[glass arch]

sash is good

especially on scal and exos where you dont need a ram

[tardy geyser]

ye

[modern rapids]

how would that even make sense when it requires nightmare fuel

[glass arch]

mpg be typing an essay on void sash

[sand marlin]

Belt*

[fervent orbit]

they want to move the event drops to post provi

[frosty trellis]

Complete dogshit
Shorter dash length than Elysian Aegis which it more of it's "counterpart", lack of knockback immunity where the main form of that at that stage is Valor/Elysian Aegis unless you want to put in frozen shield over the newer cooler calamity accessories like Absorber, Angel Treads or Deific Amulet to name a few, and all the little extra small effects and shit it has doesn't do anything at that stage to be worth losing the cool other effects or knockback immunity for, or just losing a ram because lol folly

[fervent orbit]

for some reason

[modern rapids]

???

[sand marlin]

Yeah that makes sense

[frosty trellis]

(As stated earlier: Void Sash is the only one that is an actually viable choice, but even then Void Sash is underpowered, and the other two in the line suck ass)

[sand marlin]

MNG is fine you have a great separate kb res source at the stage you get it

[modern rapids]

master ninja gear is usable on cultist and ml since they don't have contact damage

[sand marlin]

Or you know you can use it to avoid contact instead of ramming it which is arguably not harder

[modern rapids]

i want to use statis ninja belt too bad folly just forces a ram

[glass arch]

ninja belt would be viable on provi i assume

[modern rapids]

yes

[sand marlin]

This is considering dashing isn't even a req for most(any tbh) of these even with their huge investment in contact damage

[modern rapids]

(you need to get used to it i jumped into a holy orb bcuz auto jump)

but yeah ninja belt is a good way to get a dodge for provi

[glass arch]

dash accessories when i can just not use them and still do fine

[sand marlin]

I'd recommend just fluttering below a platform instead of over it

[lucid marsh]

"usable" doesn't mean good. It's outclassed in every category by other accessories, which you are likely to already have.

[sand marlin]

And hook when necessary to reset flight time

[tardy geyser]

Agreed

I used it for malice provi but that its malice ofc, where you get 3 shot

[lucid marsh]

Dashing is nice but you don't need a super strong dedicated dash accessory when the shield you're already going to have for a bajillion utility effects is plenty good for dashing as well

[modern rapids]

belt isn't worse for provi, vs asgard it's more like a choice between a dodge or antikb

[sand marlin]

Yeah I think everyone currently here agrees that Statis Belt needs to improve

[lucid marsh]

The jump boost effect is unnecessary with wings and/or boots

[modern rapids]

which makes belt better for night provi imo

[lucid marsh]

Problem with this

Amalgamated brain

Equally good dodge plus substantial damage boost

[modern rapids]

fair

[lucid marsh]

10% increased damage plus dodge plus even more damage after getting hit

[modern rapids]

gonna use void sash on yharon and see how much i want to delete the game afterwards

[tardy geyser]

Ugh just remove ankh and its immunities from the asgard line already

[lucid marsh]

But then you'd suffer from annoying debuffs constantly

[sand marlin]

For now amalgamated is a good hotswap acc at any stage of the game and hopefully that's prevented later on by locking the cooldown off slot and just encourage use of the future-buffed(?) statis belt since that's the one you would usually not be using

[lucid marsh]

And it's not like those debuffs matter for boss fights

Mostly

[glass arch]

so you equip one of the many debuff reducing accessories

[lucid marsh]

And swap what for it?

[sand marlin]

That's not what they do

Those debuffs are debilitating, not draining

[glass arch]

ok then equip ankh shield

[lucid marsh]

But like

This doesn't solve anything

Ankh shield is designed as a permanent upgrade in vanilla

[modern rapids]

laudanum

[lucid marsh]

You don't swap it out for something else

[glass arch]

your loadout does not have to be specifically tailored to bosses 24/7 you can live with losing out on a slot outside of bosses

[lucid marsh]

Laudanum is a joke. Who wants to grind for that shit

[glass arch]

you dont have to

[lucid marsh]

Exactly

[glass arch]

you are basically guaranteed to get it from bags

[lucid marsh]

I have not gotten it in a playthrough

Until like the end of the game IIRC

[tardy geyser]

Its not hard to get it though? I have all 3 by post ml

[lucid marsh]

It's unreliable

[glass arch]

yeah they're all extremely easy to get

[sand marlin]

So why does ankh shield need to go again?

[glass arch]

just farm king slime

[sand marlin]

I can agree that your loadout shouldn't be for bosses only

[lucid marsh]

Removing ankh shield will solve nothing

[glass arch]

it makes no sense to be in asgards valor, a movement focused accessory line, because its a debuff immunity accessory

[sand marlin]

That's not a bad perspective

But it's not just a movement focused accessory line

[lucid marsh]

What kind of joke is this? Asgard's valor isn't movement

[sand marlin]

It's clearly got a lot of tanky elements to it besides the immunities

[lucid marsh]

It's defense with a single movement buff

And also the dash is good offense

That said, the single movement buff is the only dash you'll ever need

[glass arch]

lets see
20 max hp ✅
16 defense underwater ✅
knockback immunity ✅

[tardy geyser]

Having knockback immunity and a ram in one accessory is what makes asgards valor and upgrades so strong, so removing the immunities from it would make it not so invaluable

[sand marlin]

No I'm pretty sure ramming is never really considered to be offensive

[sand marlin]

16 defense normally too

[sand marlin]

Sure you can use it to play more aggressively but its core functionality is avoiding damage

[lucid marsh]

Real solution: remove the asgard's valor dash and make it buff other dashes instead. If used on its own, you get the tiny default dash with a ram effect added

[glass arch]

wow 16 defense and kb immunity such a defensive accessory

[sand marlin]

You just said 20 health lol

[glass arch]

its primarily a movement focused accessory

[sand marlin]

How much more does it need than that?

[glass arch]

thats what i use it for, and i assume thats what most people use it for

[somber sage]

bro im not sure but i dont think asgard is strong but ninja gear is outclassed

[sand marlin]

that's fine, primary focus is good, does not mean its secondary elements need to go when the primary effect is fully utilized in a different line already

That being MNG

[glass arch]

except these secondary effects dont need to exist on the accessory

[sand marlin]

So what's different than it just being a dash than the MNG line?

Because it's a ram?

[drowsy plank]

master ninja jorts

[lucid marsh]

Not at all lol

[sand marlin]

Entirely differentiating a dash line with one element and none other is pretty boring and uninteresting

[glass arch]

90% of those debuffs arent going to come up during bosses and your build doesnt, shouldnt, be tailored to bosses 24/7

[lucid marsh]

Those aren't secondary effects they're the entire accessory line up until that point

This is the most ridiculous take I've ever seen

The movement is nice but I wouldn't use it without all those other effects

[royal tapir]

What are da silly goofsters in da phone talkin about

[lucid marsh]

Also calamity kind of makes constant boss loadout the best strategy already, and it's a perfectly viable strategy in vanilla too

[glass arch]

and again if you really need the debuff immunity you can remove one of your other accessories for ankh shield

[lucid marsh]

So don't pretend that's a factor that matters

[lucid marsh]

That's the thing

The asgard's valor's entire point is being the ankh shield upgrade

[royal tapir]

Oh dash accessories

💥

[lucid marsh]

Asgard's valor has a SINGLE movement related effect

[sand marlin]

This does not justify removing ankh from valor line, all it does is not improve anything but further push the player to change accessories whenever they do some mob grinding

[glass arch]

im pretty sure its not, otherwise they wouldnt have added any other effects to it and just made it more debuff immunities

[lucid marsh]

It HAS more debuff immunities

[glass arch]

no actually it doesnt

[drowsy plank]

we should add laud to ninja belt line

[tardy geyser]

Those debuff immunities are useless 90% of the time

[lucid marsh]

Oh huh

[sand marlin]

Like, as you've said your build does not have to be tailored for bosses all the time
But why does that necessiate having to remove ankh from valor line? These are not really related

[royal tapir]

Statis’ Ninja Belt combines with Occult Skull Crown

[drowsy plank]

[lucid marsh]

Honestly based idea, I love it

I would actually use it in this case

[royal tapir]

Ok never mind never doing it now

[drowsy plank]

LOL

the simple solution to ankh doing everything is to shrimply make staples ninja belt or whatever the fuck just as good

[sand marlin]

Yeah Statis' Ninja Belt just needs to improve, there's not really anything else to be had tbh

[glass arch]

oh, wait, no, it grants immunity to a single new debuff

[tardy geyser]

So true! Add frog leg to it

[drowsy plank]

uh

it has that already

[lucid marsh]

...anyways even with those:
+16 defense (defensive boost)
+immunity to lots of debuffs (defensive boost, minor in most cases)
+20 max life (defensive, sort of minor)
+Dash that deals a lot of damage to enemies and inflicts holy flames (offensive and mobility, earliest source of holy flames I think?)

[modern rapids]

[lucid marsh]

It's 1/4th mobility

[drowsy plank]

god why the fuck does that dash still inflict holy flames

[sand marlin]

Isn't holy flames gone from valor

[tardy geyser]

Oh right, just not the full jump speed

[glass arch]

nope!

[sand marlin]

Wow

That is just

[modern rapids]

exorcism is an earlier source of holy flames

[sand marlin]

Incredible

[royal tapir]

Holy Flames for 3 seconds is definitely funny

[drowsy plank]

i was watching calcast talking about culling dumb debuffs and then asgard is just like "hi"

[lucid marsh]

My suggestion was to remove the valor dash and make it add the ram and damage effect to other dashes instead

[sand marlin]

Uhhhh that's an idea for sure...

[lucid marsh]

Ok though the ingredients of it actually are movement focused

[drowsy plank]

what if we just gave ninja belt the ankh charm instead of the shield would that make you guys happy

[sand marlin]

Fuck you

[lucid marsh]

Yes. Make the ankh shield like a codpiece on the belt

[sand marlin]

[drowsy plank]

who was that one person that wanted to put a revive on the ankh charm and make it a divergent upgrade to the shield

i always thought that was mad funny

[tardy geyser]

Just add ankh to rampart since that needs a buff

[sand marlin]

WHAT

A fucking revive?

[hollow ridge]

💀

[drowsy plank]

yeah bc

ankh

get it

[glass arch]

just make it a permafrost tier revive clueless emoji

[sand marlin]

[drowsy plank]

cause the ankh is a symbol of life

[lucid marsh]

Ok all of these suggestions are actually kind of based

[drowsy plank]

it competes with permafrost's concoction!!!!

[lucid marsh]

There are like 2 revives

[glass arch]

NO they are NOT

[lucid marsh]

And the stupid permafrost one

[glass arch]

we DO NOT NEED REVIVES

[sand marlin]

Revives should not be a main line

Absolutely not

[lucid marsh]

Not THAT one

The other ones

[drowsy plank]

coc's revive is based the haters just have a skill issue

[tardy geyser]

Just dodge duh

[lucid marsh]

Asgard's valor line is thematically cool and makes sense. The things that shields do in vanilla terraria is provide stat buffs, debuff and knockback immunity, and ramming dashes

[sand marlin]

Okay let's take a step back

[lucid marsh]

I like this, but it could be better

[cobalt pewter]

typically Aegis line needs nerf more than the Sash line needing buff

they're working on that though I think

[somber sage]

great.

[lucid marsh]

The ninja belt has two useful effects. The dodge, which is on par with the amalgamated brain, And the dash, which is better on its own than the asgard's valor line

[somber sage]

[lucid marsh]

Every other effect of the accessory is useless, or nearly so

[cobalt pewter]

there's the step of removing Elysian Guard on Aegis line at least

[drowsy plank]

the frog leg is nice too

[lucid marsh]

I've never cared about frog legs

[frosty trellis]

Same here

[lucid marsh]

Wings make it unnecessary

[drowsy plank]

what

[frosty trellis]

Frog Leg on void sash has like, not helped at all for me lol

[drowsy plank]

you use it with wings

[modern rapids]

useful for old duke and dog, both of which are way easier with ram

[sand marlin]

I can see aegis staying just fine with only kb res and a ram tbh but like having ankh on the most permanent accessory line is just good QoL so it could stay anyway because like calamity is mainly about bosses() which don't inflict said ankh debuffs

[frosty trellis]

I mean yeah you use it with wings because it helps give a bit of extra flight tbf

But it's not like, insane for me?

[lucid marsh]

So, the accessory clearly needs a buff. It's outclassed by a fucking early hardmode accesory

[somber sage]

true buddy

[modern rapids]

same goes for void sash with yharon

[frosty trellis]

Remove Ankh from Valor
Problem solved

[drowsy plank]

well that's because calamity nerfed it

[sand marlin]

Killing you

[glass arch]

there are no rams in vanilla aside from solar flare set bonus
there is a bonk (shield of cthulhu), and dodges (mng line)

[frosty trellis]

Kill me later it should be done

[errant wren]

coming out of lurking again

[lucid marsh]

Make it's dodge 30 seconds cooldown instead of 90 and add ankh shield to it, and make its dash deal damage like hollow knight sharp shadow

[errant wren]

what is happening

[drowsy plank]

i really dont think the issue with valor is ankh the more i think about it

most of those debuffs are baby mode anyway

or just bad design in the first place

[sand marlin]

👆

[drowsy plank]

hnm yes debuff that makes you unable to do anything yes this is a good idea very interactive

[lucid marsh]

I agree that the entire ankh charm and debuffs it cures should just be removed from the game

[drowsy plank]

it's like if lorde was in the vanilla game but it actually is

[lucid marsh]

But it's iconic

[drowsy plank]

and lorde is supposed to be a joke

[sand marlin]

Ankh literally does not need the attention that it's grabbing like I don't really see why why it would be good to remove it at all

[lucid marsh]

Yeah

[frosty trellis]

Removing ankh gives valor a reason to not be so defensively focused and instead have less defensive shit on it to not make it as polarizing

[lucid marsh]

Ok so proposal

[cobalt pewter]

I think the issue for me when it comes to the debuff is the bloat on aegis line

I don't know how effective the line is with or without ankh but it's

too much, even if 90% of them are garbage

[sand marlin]

We already have a more movement focused line in MNG, why make valor line the same?

[glass arch]

and also debuff that makes you unable to use exclusively magic weapons (why)

[lucid marsh]

If you remove ankh shield from valor, can you give the valor all the effects of the ornate shield and victide shield's set bonus combinations?

[somber sage]

30 second cd would actually cause more adrenlin, and melt the bosses even faster, think about it

[drowsy plank]

you can do that and leave the ankh on it
i was memeing originally but just putting the charm into statis line would be fine i think, and you can still just make asguard focus on movement more without removing the effects of ankh shield anyway

[modern rapids]

what even is the point

[frosty trellis]

Remove Ankh, remove Shield of the Ocean, make it just kb immunity, ram and maybe the max hp but it doesn't need the 16 defense and the even more defense underwater with a bunch of random immunites that isn't going to be useful so if ankh's immunities aren't even useful then why are y'all complaining about removing ankh if it's not even useful?

[lucid marsh]

They're really good effects

[glass arch]

it already does that

[drowsy plank]

well ankh's immunities are useful

again fodder mobs

like medusas

[lucid marsh]

Wait but then it would literally just be the one accessory

[modern rapids]

who's using victide post plant

[drowsy plank]

which aren't bosses but stilll nice

[lucid marsh]

That's not the point

The point is getting the effect of it, without the armor

[glass arch]

also victide shield does pretty much fucking nothing

[lucid marsh]

That's what I meant

[drowsy plank]

shield of the ocean will probably die soon from how i hear it talked about

[sand marlin]

Because it is the most permanent/common line used in the game that acts as a QoL against general mobs with its ankh effects

[lucid marsh]

It gives you flipper potion basically

Ah

[modern rapids]

let's add full victide and full daedalus to asgard recipe while we're at it

[frosty trellis]

Removing recipe bloat for stuff that doesn't matter a whole lot and making all the defensive shit less polarizing would help balance it out as it stands all the defensive shit it gives + the ram is just insanely useful

[glass arch]

10% move speed 2 regen (only while wearing victide armor!!!) and 5 defense (only while underwater!!!)

[lucid marsh]

In that case... the asgard valor line is literally just

[frosty trellis]

If we want to keep Ankh in remove shield of the ocean halve it's defense and remove the extra max hp then imo

[lucid marsh]

The ornate shield

2

[sand marlin]

Yeah I can agree on that

[glass arch]

that is typically how direct upgrades work yes

[modern rapids]

but the ram has an explosion which makes it sound cool

[modern rapids]

(actually ornate shield is cool)

[lucid marsh]

The explosion shreds worms

[sand marlin]

Like you can nerf its defensive values, it having very few defensive effects still makes the line stand out from the MNG line and the ankh effects are just necessary due to the nature of its permanence

[frosty trellis]

Valor ram shreds anything it has fucking holy fucking fire on it for no reason

[glass arch]

everything shreds worms

[sand marlin]

Add slagsplitter pauldron

[lucid marsh]

Why not just put ankh shield on

[sand marlin]

Which apparently makes it even stronger

[lucid marsh]

Both

[fervent orbit]

is this still going on

[lucid marsh]

Although Laudanum is kind of a neat parallel to ankh shield

So maybe like

[modern rapids]

add evasion scarf to statis belt for another dodge

[lucid marsh]

Maybe the occult skull crown idea was good

[glass arch]

yeah

[sand marlin]

How many of ankh's debuffs does laudanum cover?

[sand marlin]

[lucid marsh]

Basically all of them I think lol

[glass arch]

as far as i know all except for stoned

[drowsy plank]

#suggestions-voting message

[lucid marsh]

Stoned is covered by ankh shield now

Oh wait other way around

[modern rapids]

6/11

[frosty trellis]

Broken Armor
Confused
Darkness
Slow
Weak
Chilled

So 6

[glass arch]

(theres 12 in cal (mighty wind immunity))

[modern rapids]

ah

[lucid marsh]

I already starred it

[modern rapids]

it should cover cursed because the debuff is just stupid

[sand marlin]

Also burning immunity from hellfire blocks/tiles

[glass arch]

cursed and silenced both need to be removed

[lucid marsh]

Make ankh charm a Silva related accessory line because life goddess

[frosty trellis]

PREACH
PREACH
PREACH
PREACH
PREACH

GENUINELY REMOVE THEM THEY SUCK

[sand marlin]

So that makes it like, 6/13, in essence 11 because the last two are not actually common

[glass arch]

silenced affects almost exclusively mages (the last class that needs nerfs)
and cursed is just horrible

[sand marlin]

Those being Mighty Wind and Burning only while standing on hellstone tiles

Also have you considered how only hellstone is the one with hazardous nature as a tile?

[drowsy plank]

new version of this suggestion which is less than a single paragraph to see if it fairs better in voting than last time lol

[lucid marsh]

Can we all agree that the entire asgard's valor and statis ninja belt lines both need almost complete reworks?

[modern rapids]

add it to silva wings recipe and make that combine into tracers

[fervent orbit]

meteorite?

[glass arch]

meteorite ore

[sand marlin]

Oh yeah that too

[fervent orbit]

[glass arch]

and astral ore

[modern rapids]

spikes...

[lucid marsh]

Auric boots make you immune to all those too

Or actually just

Terraspark boots

[sand marlin]

True

[fervent orbit]

mmm yes my astral ore immunity in angel treads

[modern rapids]

"terraspark boots make you immune to astral ore"

[drowsy plank]

yeah the ankh having burning immunity was from the ancient times when terraspark didnt exist yet lol

[glass arch]

i love it when putting on shoes protects me from having my body slowly overtaken by corrupted mana and twisted into a new unrecognizable form

[drowsy plank]

hey i mean the shoes make you immune to lava

since when did terraria make sense

lol

same with tracers getting the immunity to auric

like you can hit your head into it but it still works

that's just how it be

[sand marlin]

Bonk

[glass arch]

in all fairness that comes from the fact that you mashed a charm specifically designed to do that into the boots

[drowsy plank]

okay so explain the auric thing /s

[glass arch]

no

i will not

[sand marlin]

So basically, valor line needs tuning down
Laudanum needs to be better as an alternative to immunities
Statis' Ninja Belt needs to improve

Pretty much what we've gotten yeah?

[glass arch]

yea

[lucid marsh]

Your boots surround you in an aura of protection

Clearly it works like that

The lava charm is a necklace you wear and it protects your whole body from lava

I think the perfect least effort buff for the statis ninja belt would be to add the occult skull crown to it (and move skull crown to early hardmode like ankh)

Because then it makes the two lines comparable

[modern rapids]

holding anything crafted with auric bars should give you immunity

[sand marlin]

Having OSC that early does not work

It's still a great source of rage

Even in boss fights you do not have efficient rage gain unless you're always facetanking the boss which would give you max rage gain

And the adren gain that early might be weird/broken(?) even if we consider like a lot of people just won't actually get adren due to having been hit commonly

[fervent orbit]

osc is a great source of adren

[lucid marsh]

Another gripe with calamity:

There's no accessory variety, because every slot will always be filled with must-picks

Unless you have wing slot

Basically all the fun but weak accessories are outclassed by the standard: wings/boots, shield/belt, class damage booster, stat stick A and B

[north oracle]

…what
There’s about… 3 true must pick accessories? After that you can customise anywhere from a hyper defensive to a mobility to a super offensive build.

So long as you have vertical movement, a dash, and boots (till post ML) everything else is interchangeable

[sand marlin]

Said must picks have never been required either

Variety of ways you can make up for them

Witch's Broom is a great example of this

[lucid marsh]

Maybe I haven't experimented enough, but the reliability of those must picks always feels too good to pass up

Even if you can technically make up for it

[frosty trellis]

I mean if they were "must picks" then defiled nohits wouldn't exist

Just sayin'

[lucid marsh]

In every playthrough, I've always settled on a set of accessories by mid hardmode. That set is usually:
Boots and/or wings
Shield
Amalgamated brain
Ambrosial ampule line
Void of extinction line or similar stat stick
Class specific special effect accessory

Ok yes technically they're not required

[frosty trellis]

I mean I get that
But like
You can customise greatly

[north oracle]

Right
Last patch void of extinction was just not good

So uhhh

[lucid marsh]

But you can also theoretically beat moon lord with a copper shortsword

It's not about things being theoretically usable

[frosty trellis]

The only one that is really "required" just to actually have interesting boss design is wings

Everything else is interchangeable since we have the defalt dash now

[lucid marsh]

It's about them being outclassed

More importantly, the coolest unique accessory effects are also the least useful ones

Every (previously) expert exclusive accessory comes to mind, for example

[frosty trellis]

... What are you on???

[sand marlin]

Amalg is a hotswap and thus never required to take up a slot

[frosty trellis]

Any dodge is really

You can hotswap any dodge

Or loadout swap

Like with the exception of wings in late hardmode onwards there really isn't anything that is required or necessary

Defalt dash means you have a dash no matter what so you don't even need a dash so you can customize your build to talor to what you want to do

[lucid marsh]

It literally isn't and you're crazy if you think otherwise. It's a 10% damage boost on top of the Dodge. More importantly, hot swapping is basically cheating imo

Dodge cooldowns shouldn't tick down unless you have a dodge accessory equipt

[frosty trellis]

How the fuck is hot swapping cheating

Same with loadout swapping

It's a base game mechanic

What

A base game mechanic that neither the vanilla devs or the calamity devs care all that much about besides philosophers stone break because that was actually broken is suddenly cheating??

[lucid marsh]

Why would I ever use, say, dynamo stem cells over something that gives big stats

I mean mid fight

Loadout swapping is fine

[frosty trellis]

Dragonfire Immunity

[lucid marsh]

I just think you shouldn't get to dodge if you're not wearing a dodge accessory

Ok yeah fair that's a recent buff

It didn't give that like a month ago IIRC

[frosty trellis]

???????????

[sand marlin]

Lmao

Lol

[fervent orbit]

dynamo stem cells has ALWAYS had dragonfire immunity

[frosty trellis]

Dynamo Stem Cells has had dragonfire immunity for like

Literal years

Yeah

[fervent orbit]

since its introduction, according to the history

[frosty trellis]

Mhm

Dynamo Stem Cells is absolutely fucking cracked for Yharon

[fervent orbit]

also, you are just saying dynamo stem cells are bad because they dont give damage numbers

[sand marlin]

Like, dodge accs prob should be suited against hotswapping since it's kind of overpowered but other than that, the 10% damage alongside the dodge isn't actually all that much later in hardmode

[lucid marsh]

...oh

[sand marlin]

I can't really see myself using a dodge acc over let's say life dew

[lucid marsh]

Ok yeah fair

I picked a bad example

[frosty trellis]

Yeah pretty much even with amal brain/amalgam the only dodge accessory I actively wear is void sash which I wear for the dodge AND the dash because the dash is my beloved

Amal brain after the dodge is used up is literally just a worse avenger emblem so yeah swap it out for literally anything else afterwards lol

[sand marlin]

So far cal's getting more variety so it's at a good state just some of these are rather not useful like ambergris which should be improved later

[fervent orbit]

speaking of dynamo stem cells, that probably needs a rename, since folly isnt a clone anymore and thats where the name of the acc comes from

[frosty trellis]

Dynamo needs a rework tbh

[sand marlin]

It will prob get renamed the same time it gets reworked since it hasn't been touched for like ever

[fervent orbit]

ture

[lucid marsh]

Ok in retrospect the issue isn't what I thought

[frosty trellis]

It has one of the most busted effects for literally one fight and then it's just Not Really Useful otherwise

[lucid marsh]

A lot of things need small buffs

[sand marlin]

Also kind of uninteresting

[lucid marsh]

Yeah that's what I meant

[frosty trellis]

A lot of thing? I wouldn't say a lot of things

[lucid marsh]

It has a cool but useless effect

[frosty trellis]

What has a cool but useless effect?

[sand marlin]

The swarms are like okay as ranger, at least they could be used for all classes instead but rn it's just ranger

[lucid marsh]

Spore sac (nebulous core is basically a better version of this but still weird)

[fervent orbit]

mmm yes lets make luxors gift 2

[lucid marsh]

Uh

The PBG accessories are weird

[sand marlin]

I mean that would be an improvement still byeah it needs something else

[lucid marsh]

There's 3 of them that are similar but not quite the same

They're situationally really good but mostly mid

All the previous legendary accessories like The Bee

[sand marlin]

Oh god The Bee is also hotswap material isn't it

[fervent orbit]

it is

[lucid marsh]

Hot swapping needs to be killed for most things imo

[sand marlin]

That'll happen at one point

[frosty trellis]

The Bee is hotswap god material... for ftw/gfb because even in master-death you aren't taking enough damage for The Bee to matter

[sand marlin]

No disagreements there

[lucid marsh]

All the shrine accessories are useful for like an hour

Except luxors gift which is weird

The existence of the rare variant accessories is wacky

[frosty trellis]

Plague hive is fucking wild thanks to plague reaper armor being insane if you don't want to multiclass with wither blossoms (which most people wont)
Toxic Heart is for sickness builds, although it's other effect could use some love
Plague Fuel Pack according to shade is cracked out of it's mind

[lucid marsh]

They're all similar to dynamo stem cells where they're situationally really good but most of the time suck

[lucid marsh]

Plague hive is theoretically a 50% damage boost to any weapon with a a certain damage value

In practice it isn't

[sand marlin]

You get to use them for the entire stage up to ML so like

That's more than just situational

[frosty trellis]

Plague Hive is better than recon scope with plague reaper armor for ranger so idk what you are on there
In general not just for certain weapons

I've tested this

Plague Reaper is batshit

[sand marlin]

There's about 2 bosses weak to sickness there even

And like one or two resist it?

[lucid marsh]

But hypothetically against an enemy with zero defense and damage reduction and with a weapon that deals exactly 120 base damage it would boost your dps by 45% if I remember my calc correctly (before plague debuff)

[frosty trellis]

Moonlord being a big one that is sickness weak

[sand marlin]

Yeah debuff weakness just suddenly makes a weapon very strong for no other particular reason

[lucid marsh]

And yes it's really good

[sand marlin]

Incredible

[lucid marsh]

It's just very finnicky

The soul artifacts are weird

[sand marlin]

I mean, it works, in a simple perspective, it's not really bad

[frosty trellis]

How is it finnicky? You get plague hive, you equip plague reaper armor, you multiply your dps with brimflame armor levels of an increase without even the ability in the first place, and then with the ability OH BOY

[lucid marsh]

I've never actually played rogue

[sand marlin]

Opting for something that the boss is weak to is not out of the table at all

[lucid marsh]

So idk

[frosty trellis]

Plague Hive is for ranger lol

[lucid marsh]

I'm not talking about this one use case, I'm talking about how it boosts your dps by like 50% in some cases and by 1% in others

Used on its own

[lucid marsh]

Sorry that was unrelated, I got sidetracked

Rogue accessories seem weird but I'm in no place to judge

[sand marlin]

I'm waiting for astral armor rework to take over PReaper

[lucid marsh]

Oh yeah!

I remember now

[frosty trellis]

I can give you a rundown of most of them lol

[lucid marsh]

Amidias pendant, giant pearl, and some other one I can't remember are all garbage

[frosty trellis]

Tru

[frosty trellis]

(If ya want)

[lucid marsh]

Sure

[sand marlin]

Sunken Sea Overhaul will likely go over them

[lucid marsh]

They all seem like one-offs that do moderately cool things in certain situations

But exactly the flavor of thing that gets outclassed by a single option

Also it's a pain to figure out which items look cool but are worthless, and which are actually good options

[frosty trellis]

Coin of Deceit/Ruin Medalion: Batshit, for both spam and stealth
Dogtooth: Bad for most, gives like a 70% damage boost for like 3 of them
Scuttlers Jewel: Trash
Raiders Talisman: Good but needs hybrid to work
Glove line: Pretty good, nothing crazy
Glove of Recklessness: Bad for half, good for some, breaks a few
Glove of Precision: Finally not just batshit for everything, it's fine
Feathered Crown: Bad
Moonstone Crown: Depends on the weapon
Ink Bomb: Worthless
Mirror Line: First is situational, abyssal mirror is nice, dark matter sheath is great, eclipse mirror is the best spam and stealth accessory in the game
Silencing Sheath: ... Okay this one I'm not sure on
Vamp Talisman: Damage and lifesteal, what more could you ask
Corrosive spine: Fun spam accessory
Plague Fuel Pack: Apparently cracked
Blunder Booster: Pretty dang good, dash is meh
Spectrail Veil: NR but less cooldown and gives iframes
Nanotech: Great
Venerated Locket: Did someone say balance hell?
Dragon Scales: Ass on spam, balance hell for stealth

[lucid marsh]

Vanilla has conditioned me to trash anything looks unique in favor of good stats because things like the spore sac and shiny stone are worthless, for example

[frosty trellis]

Shiny Stone is hilariously good lol

[lucid marsh]

Er sorry not shiny stone

[frosty trellis]

Especially for just loadout swapping for regen builds to get back all of your health almost immediately

[lucid marsh]

I was thinking of something else

Also it's a huge pain when accessories are really good with some weapons but garbage with others

[frosty trellis]

That's kinda how rogue is

Just

Experiment

See what's good with what

[lucid marsh]

Yeah I would despise rogue

I do not like when things are designed this way

[frosty trellis]

For a game like terraria rogue works really well just for experimentation purposes as terraria fully lets you experiment basically however the fuck you want

[modern rapids]

spore sac for fishing

[lucid marsh]

Experimentation just results in bad builds for me

[frosty trellis]

(You have spare accessory slots for fishing?)

[lucid marsh]

Because I'll get caught in some little niche that sucks long term

[frosty trellis]

(You don't just triple bag earring alluring bait enchanted pearl and then the bobber if post moonlord/master?)

[frosty trellis]

Experimentation allows for a lot of stuff to be realized to either just suck if it can't do anything or randomly breaks shit in 17

[lucid marsh]

But like, it's not immediate obviously sometimes

A lot of times, you'll just have abysmally low DPS, and not know you're supposed to be stronger

A few years back when I played melee I was using ark of the elements against Providence and getting like half the kill times

[frosty trellis]

Not really? Rogue has gotten better with the "accessories are mostly dogshit" thing and a lot of rogue accessories are generally not bad at all and there are a lot of safe options that are easy to find like the emblem and vamp talisman

[lucid marsh]

Because I didn't know that some arbitrary other weapon was better when most of them suck

Ok cool, I'll try it then

[frosty trellis]

Or the coin line because crit is balanced

[lucid marsh]

In the past, calamity has suffered from "all the non meta options are dogshit"

[frosty trellis]

That has

Thankfully

Changed significantly

After 1.5

There are WAY more broken/balanced shit then there are dogshit shit

[vagrant spindle]

and the dogshit shit is slowly getting purged or repurposed

such as ODS and gehenna

[fervent orbit]

and blazing core getting an entire rework that just changes how it functions entirely

[lucid marsh]

That's good

[vagrant spindle]

parry 🥰

[lucid marsh]

I'm like, conditioned to stick to a single set of items for the entire playthrough, because everything else used to suck as badly as vanilla ore weapons did

[vagrant spindle]

stuck in the past

[lucid marsh]

Like, using anything other than the meta was like using a mythril sword in vanilla

Just: why

[stable kiln]

this sounds uhh very overpowered

i think the whole point of laudnaum is to work against debuffs that are extremely niche and uncommon, which is why the buffs it gives you are so extremely overpowered

[ashen warren]

I don't think I've ever used it

Would probably be better to cover more effects but give weaker buffs tbh

[stable kiln]

perhaps

sounds like itd just be a much better ankh shield basically until post plantera when you can upgrade it to asgard's valor though, on top of being a post 1 phm boss accessory

so if anything itd need to be a post at least hardmode boss if it would give you so much shit

and even if you disregard the buffs it gives, just immunity to those debuffs as a prehardmode accessory would be a lot

[ashen warren]

i havent read the suggestion i was just replying to your message

[cobalt pewter]

I do think that the stuff laudanum gives rarely mattered for most of the progression that I've never really bothered to ever, like, use it

at least on my personal runs

I KNOW there's the one vid of abusing laudanum to do something stupid that xp has (or someone else idr) but yea

[stable kiln]

yeah i havent either, but thats kinda what makes it make sense

giving it ankh shield immunity would make it incredibly op, so it will have to be done in an other way for sure

[drowsy plank]

Okay, conceptually, I get what you're saying, but that also just... is not true at all? The ones missing are Bleeding, Cursed, Silence, Burning and Stoned. Stone is from a single mob, Cursed is from like, three (and one of the is Brain of Cthulhu), Silenced is from three as well, Burning is from two blocks, the only one that actually fits that description is Bleeding (and even then it's only like 6 more mobs than vanilla and one of them is fucking Great Sand Shark), and arguably Poisoned as well but that's a DPS debuff so I didn't have it on the table anyway (though it also only has 4 extra sources in the mod so idk). Laud already covers like 6 out of 11 of them, and then it also goes and gets more like Ichor and Armor Crunch.

like the debuffs are just as "niche" as the ones ankh makes you immune to anyway

[fervent orbit]

i never realised boc could inflict cursed

[drowsy plank]

boc inflicts every ankh shield debuff for a randomized period of time

[fervent orbit]

ah

that

[drowsy plank]

it is

very stupid

[fervent orbit]

would make sense

[drowsy plank]

that's the other thing too

there's one REALLY big use case for Laud

because it is such an early game accessory

which is using it against BoC

but like

it doesn't quite cover all the same debuffs so it's like a 50/50 that it's just useless so most of the time you just don't even bother

[stable kiln]

well sure, but we're still talking about a prehardmode accessory giving you immunity to all debuffs from a hardmode one thats pretty hard to come by

[worldly sparrow]

❗

[fervent orbit]

n o

[worldly sparrow]

impending

[random talon]

@buoyant grail Sorry, but adding a rouge pillar is against the rules

[frail mantle]

it always surprises me when people ask for a rogue pillar

[fervent orbit]

the placement for it

[frail mantle]

i thought general opinion was that the pillars suck ass, why would you want more of it

[worldly sparrow]

either over your house or you have a 3/2 split

[fervent orbit]

also leon why u here

u never come to suggestions

[frail mantle]

idk i check this channel when someone speaks here

[random talon]

The rule document states that Meld Blobs are a substitute for the rouge pillar

[frail mantle]

i just don't say anything if i don't have anything to say

[random talon]

fking spam account

(I'm talking the one that just got deleted)

[buoyant grail]

oh my bad i didnd know

[random talon]

it's alright, just be sure to read through the rules document

[buoyant grail]

ok thanks

[worldly sparrow]

don't we already have this but not a lacewing?

[fervent orbit]

you can buy lacewings post plant

from drunk princess

[golden tulip]

why from her

[worldly sparrow]

no clue

[frail mantle]

she's pink and therefore hallow related

or something

[fervent orbit]

fabsol vodka is made from hallow materials

[golden tulip]

@modern vortex invalid suggestion for multiple reasons which are laid out in the pins

[modern vortex]

shit sorry mb

[golden tulip]

no problem

[drowsy plank]

tbf you can get all the components of Ankh Shield except exactly The Plan pre-Boss in Calamity, let alone pre-Hardmode (cobalt shield post-Skele unless you cheese dungeon for it), so i wouldn't consider it that broken

[stable kiln]

sure but that actually takes a while, while laudanum can be gotten from a lucky king slime drop (or just fight it multiple times, soon enough when the shimmer thing will be added it'll be even easier)

[small timber]

you probably can treat laudanum as HM/late pre-HM yeah

or at least the point where grinding King Slime is completely effortless

[drowsy plank]

eh, i wouldnt say it's that hard besides maybe getting the tattered cloth and megaphone

after all laud is a barely 2% drop

id say they're about equivalent

[fervent orbit]

why does laud even exist in the first place

[drowsy plank]

revenjaundice mod !! ! ! !! ! !!

frankly it could probably be turned into a normal accessory at this point

[fervent orbit]

it would also be easier to balance if it was

[drowsy plank]

shove it post-Evils or post-Skele or something and then maybe it being ankh like wouldn't be so bad
id still like to be able to use it on BoC with a full ankh set of immunities but id rather it be good than be restricted by arbitrary placement

[modern rapids]

bit confused about your wording, are you saying ankh shield is prehm

[worldly sparrow]

tbf it almost is prehm

its so close

[wide river]

Considering it's the only one of the Revengance-exclusive accessory trio that doesn't actually interact with Revengeance Mode mechanics (since Horror was removed), that could work

[royal tapir]

Wiki does list debuff categories

[modern rapids]

what else could it do to interact with revengeance mechanics

Enemy spawn rates are boosted by 17.65%.
Life regen scales from 50% effectiveness at full HP to 100% effectiveness at 1 HP.
Immunity frames are capped at 2 seconds.
Hallowed armor's Holy Protection set bonus lasts 6 seconds instead of 30.
the revengeance changes other than rippers

these are boring tho

[wide river]

There really aren't any other notable mechanics it can interact with without overlapping with Stress Pills and Heart of Darkness, huh

[modern rapids]

yeah

doing something else with debuffs would make it overlap with purity and infected jewel...

[onyx osprey]

the whole elemental affinity thing needs to actually be explained in-game somehow

unless I'm completely blind there's not a word about it

an accessory saying that "sickness debuffs yadayada" is very unhelpful if you don't know what that means already

[modern rapids]

sounds like guide dialogue

i'd add guide dialogue about debuff weakness and resistance, and add debuff category to the tooltip of applicable debuffs

[worldly sparrow]

solution: make laud death exclusive so it doesnt overlap as much

/j

[drowsy plank]

bring back stress for death mode and laud is a consumable you use to hold it off and- i am forcibly killed

[wide river]

Stress would have been cool if it wasn't so finicky

How it was though was quite uhhh

Something

[modern rapids]

how was it

[wide river]

tl;dr A variety of different factors could lower or raise Stress, and having too much would either give a random few buffs or some really sucky debuffs. See:

The Heart Attack debuff when the player had 9800 or more stress, which dealt 200 damage to the player and reduced damage dealt by 30% during the day, but provided a number of benefits during the night. It lasted 4 minutes.

[drowsy plank]

dont forget that talking to women would lower it

[wide river]

:hdflr:

[drowsy plank]

everyone is a lesbian /s

[fervent orbit]

wait is there embed perms in here?

[wide river]

I assume so

[coral carbon]

HI

[fervent orbit]

fuck i dont have the gif

it was a speech bubble meme over one of the tips in the stress section

it said "Killing yourself is the fastest way to get rid of Stress" or smthn like that

[wide river]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/711268703991365642/1135215406475399270/image.gif

Doesn't have the speech bubble but that's what I assume you're talking about

[fervent orbit]

yes

[coral carbon]

just like real life

[fervent orbit]

NO

[wide river]

:donot:

[wintry gale]

[novel belfry]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/329588425206530048/1159630453414830120/Reaction.gif?ex=6531b904&is=651f4404&hm=196af64c445efa42ab220a414ba90657bb54ec19cfb3a9975947f2002348df03&

this is a friendly reminder to NOT do that

[odd geyser]

Yeah, don't, not much else to say as of now

[drowsy plank]

[wintry gale]

why not

[crude geode]

“Doesn’t make sense” isn’t the best argument

@glass arch does astral shimmer into anything, because if so you could bring up the fact it’s a weird inconsistency

[fervent orbit]

yes it shimmers into scoria

[crude geode]

Yeah that would be a better argument than renewability considering there’s two different renewable ways mentioned in the sugg

Like just because Zerg is boring and people hate fishing, that doesn’t mean astral isn’t renewable

(I love double negatives)

I’d argue the renewability argument is pointless and should be removed

Even if it is like half a sentence

[grim tusk]

Can you even shimmer into meteorite?

[fervent orbit]

nope

i dont think so