if not because every single potions that used to be nearly exclusive to fishing as the only reliable sources can be bought from all NPCs
#suggestions-discussion
small timber
swift wharf
yea like a sidegrade
novel belfry
"Then I will make them care." - Suggester
drowsy plank
if you want to use my ideas, sure
tired haven
pre-mech upgrade with no wings is literally just hbob + 10% JS, then
swift wharf
the rules of the game bow upon my presence
random talon
I wish fishing was more appriciated
drowsy plank
pre-mech upgrade with no wings is literally just hbob + 10% JS, then
frankly that is plenty enough of a buff considering they were viable just a tier before on WoF lol
ur already consolidating two accessories much like tracers
tired haven
It's more so the accessory itself ending up as bland as humanly feasible
drowsy plank
if you really wanted you can just make MOAB have a full frog leg and make it unstackable with it's pregrades
random talon
hear me out: all the QOL item recipes in the mod could be removed if people remembered fishing was a thing
tired haven
I have no doubts that would be viable considering raw bob is mech viable
drowsy plank
well this is why i mentioned the 5 balloon upgrade post-Plant to makes something more actually interesting
random talon
feral claws, lava charm, etc
drowsy plank
MOAB itself being more of a stepping stone towards this stronger, more interesting version
because i dont think a 5 jump would be a good idea to give even at post-Mech tiers
im just talking about a hypothetical version with my idea
wide river
Either combine them into one suggestion or delete one of them
There is no need to have two suggestions regarding the same matter in posting, especially not by the same person
drowsy plank
^
wide river
Not exactly
Remove the bold on the second part
wide river
Maybe someday our voices will be heard
Hopefully one day MOAB gets changed
tired haven
Some of the voices certainly don't give the whole motion a good rep 
wide river
Good ideas, bad execution
~~Sometimes the motto of #suggestions-posting ~~
tired haven
Legitimately the most helpful piece of feedback about MOAB during last months was "wings mess up sandstorm fix pls" 
granted, I doubt that would actually happen because original form sansstorm is notorious for its crimes against boss design
small timber
generally the biggest problem with MOAB is just it is trying to be both BOB and wings but fail at both
this is the ideal situation:
- you have no wings so your jumps give strong horizontal movement
- you have wings so you use your jump as a "mid air boost" of vertical speed while still using your wing as mobility (this strategy works especially well with blizzard balloon + wings)
but MOAB just have wings so it can never achieve 1) while its flight time is so shit that 2) is definitely never happening
this is basically the entire feedback (which the suggestion already fix by making MOAB a pure BOB upgrade); though depend on the jump put into the suggestion having 5 jumps can either be super overpowered or negatively impact the item by making wings harder to access
because the only good jumps with wings is blizzard balloon (while sandstorm one is kind of shit with wings)
frosty trellis
~~granted, I doubt that would actually happen because original form sansstorm is...
Just cap the speed of sandstorm
Like, if you fix the interaction then if you cap the speed you can make sure it doesn't break everything for no reason by giving it a speed cap
Also yeah MOAB is just a failed BOB upgrade because the flight time of it is no where near good enough to compensate for losing the really fucking good sandstorm jump
Shit flight time + heavily nerfs the entire reason BOB is great in the first place = accessory is just not gonna end up well. The concept is cool but it just doesn't work in practice and having just a straight BOB upgrade would be so much more practical as having wings as adding a different source of mobility that isn't wings is fun and interesting and gives people options rather than just trying to combine BOB and Wings together which I'm just gonna say, is not interesting in the slightest
small timber
there are other balloons that are obnoxiously overpowered with it, notably honey in a balloon (basically nearly same as sandstorm just slightly weaker)
I think unironically the way to fix balloon is just make it so balloon always treated as using wings animation somehow (aka: treated as wings for jump/animation while not counted as wings)
tired haven
there are other balloons that are obnoxiously overpowered with it, notably honey...
amber balloon doesn't give you a double jump at all 🤔
ripe owl
Yes
tired haven
Fart is slightly lower max speed but double accel, yes
wide river
Amber Balloon is an item
ripe owl
FiaB is like, the best acceleration?
frosty trellis
Yeah it has great acceleration
tired haven
I think blizzard matches its acceleration but loses in speed
"Blizzard in a Bottle has 3x the acceleration of a player, and max speed of 4.5 (base is 3)
Fart in a Jar has 3x the acceleration of a player, and max speed of 5.25
Sandstorm in a Bottle has 1.5x the acceleration of a player, and max speed of 6"
Admittedly, I forgot to test what is sandstorm's broken speed
frosty trellis
Honestly I would love it if MOAB was just a BOB upgrade that added the other two balloons + frog leg, after the jumps get speed capped, but if you equipped wings the speed cap is reduced by like, 33% to de-incentivize the use of wings with it
small timber
the best way to buff MOAB unironically is to meta game and give it the 3 best jumps with wingless balloon (aka: sandstorm, fart and then like, tsunami?)
but I think that is way too minmaxy
tired haven
tsunami is 2nd worst lel
small timber
I forgot what was the 3rd best for wingless since I always use balloon with wings and tsunami is actually better for that, same with blizzard
ripe owl
Tsunami in a bottle is, if not equal to, worse than Cloud
small timber
because if you have too many jumps (like 5) you just have useless jumps at the end
I forgot the reason but tsunami have shorter boost or something so you can immediately go into wings acceleration, I forgot the reason
or I literally used it exactly because it don't boost upward as much to provide more precise dodging
or I just misremembered
tired haven
Well, yeah its duration is near instantaneous, matching that of cloud
so if that's valued high on wings, then you could make an argument for them being good
small timber
I dont think many people beside me really uses balloon with wings (intentionally after way pass progression of balloons), I just use it as a "midair boost" similar to jetpack boost
and for that I think blizzard is the best
night jolt
Wasn't the new suggestion shown to be objectively incorrect in it's assessment about repeaters even are?
small timber
yes and it was pointed out, but the suggestion technically didn't break any rule
it is just, badly written and constructed
grave zincBOT
@bronze tendon - Your suggestion has received an updated status!
[Make the Onyx Excavator Key Placeable]
It has officially been implemented into the game, and will be available in the next update!
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message
distant gyro
crude geode
Wonderful
north oracle
yooooo
distant gyro
b- but placing it consumes it
small timber
it only takes determination
distant gyro
(generates 90 worlds to get 90 keys)
ashen warren
(generates 90 worlds to get 90 keys)
i said what i said
cobalt pewter
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/959878556060639324/1112974722938982461/im...
Rubblemaker gaming
is that new auric resprite
ashen warren
that looks like regular auric
cobalt pewter
hmm
ashen warren
yeah thats just regular auric with the mage helmet
distant gyro
it's rampart covering current auric
small timber
magic carpet is good enough for hardmode
as in literally; and overpowered for pre-hardmode
the time when it fall of is post-ML but then you get it for free at auric tesla armor
north oracle
(also isn't this a "this would be cool" sugg)
small timber
and yes that also kind of turn into specific item suggestion; aka suggestion that ask for items with specific recipe/effect etc, which is disallowed
north oracle
yeah this is very close to straight up being SIS
ashen warren
im gonna be honest the flying carpet is my least favorite part of auric
dreamy silo
the time when it fall of is post-ML but then you get it for free at auric tesla ...
auric tesla gives its effect?
ashen warren
fucks with my muscle memory
ashen warren
auric tesla gives its effect?
yes
dreamy silo
and yes that also kind of turn into specific item suggestion; aka suggestion tha...
my bad 
small timber
but yeah, tldr is just: magic carpet is definitely good enough for hardmode as it is
it is one of those item that 99% of people just dont use and never realise how good it is
north oracle
anyway @dreamy silo
You need significantly more reasoning in that sugg, as atm all it really says is "this would be cool"
particularly what needs to be adressed is what xpc is saying, it's just still viable in hardmode anyway. the other big issue is that this is right on the edge of being a specific item suggestion, which is specifically disallowed.
There's no reason you can't edit this to follow the suggestion rules, but please do lol.
north oracle
alg, if you decide to edit it feel free to post it here so we can let you know if there's any issues 
dreamy silo
ashen warren
watch me be completely wrong about all of this
north oracle
So
I feel like this is a good suggestion that has some merit, but its definitely under the “large scale rework” thing
You can’t just suggest to rebalance an entire class
swift wharf
^
- If you want to use y'know
The actual weapon
There's an entire subclass dedicated to that
Byeah
rebalancing hundreds of weapons is
kind of a lot
ashen warren
projectile melee is ranger with no ammo or mage without mana
ashen warren
oh i didnt know it was hundreds of weapons damn
north oracle
So
I feel like this is a good suggestion that has some merit, but its definitely...
This is the issue with the sugg, not the reasoning itself lol
swift wharf
Melee has the most weapons in the game
ashen warren
Class identity is a myth
wdym
grave zincBOT
@tough ingot - Your suggestion has received an updated status!
[Add Calamity health/mana UI support for Fancy and Bars style]
It has officially been implemented into the game, and will be available in the next update!
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message
distant gyro
north oracle
Fancy
ashen warren
<@167647197091856384> - Your suggestion has received an updated status!
[**Add ...
let's go 
does it work with tmod finally
north oracle
Wait
Development that could occur on the fucked up 1.4.4?
ashen warren
alr
ashen warren
true
swift wharf
Magic guns
north oracle
Space gun
ashen warren
no i know what magic guns are
north oracle
Literally gun in the name
swift wharf
You can argue that those are just ranged weapons with mana
Byea
There is kind of a lot melee weapons for this to work
tired haven
I think that the point of projectile melee is the projectile
The point of projectile melee is in a combo of projectile + TM, but that's a can of worms of its own, mostly because it still means it has to be worse than both just projectile and just TM weapons at their respective fields, at which point it's just outclassed 
small timber
iirc (at least according to Altix), a bunch of hardmode projectile melee have been balanced exactly in that way: the projectile part of the projectile melee tend to deal subpar/below average damage compare to other classes, and you basically have to use the true melee part of the weapon to deal above tier damage
so tldr, the ideal "balanced" projectile melee already is "projectile not deal full damage of the weapon", just not in the way that the suggestion interpreted
instead of say, projectile and true melee both deal 100% of damage = 200% total damage compare to other on tier weapon if you use both true melee and projectile
it is like, 60% + 60% = 120% total damage compare to other on tier weapon if you use both
cobalt pewter
large if true
tired haven
so tldr, the ideal "balanced" projectile melee already is "projectile not deal f...
Essentially, yeah
small timber
for some weapon like starfury I think it is more that the weapon was never designed for you to actually hit with true melee in mind, so the projectile kind of is supposed to be the full damage not "double damage of true melee", because the true melee is bad to begin with
eg: you are definitely not gonna stab people with the true melee of cosmic shiv/elemental shiv
tired haven
The only wonder is whether 1:1 ratio (or projectile favoritism, since quite a few swords just are spamming multiple strong ones) is the correct one for the beam swords. It'd depend on whether TM weapons are double of average dps I guess, which is a LOT of data to gather
drowsy plank
when the sky is burning!
it makes sense why the proj should do less damage than the blade, but i am pretty sure that is already the common trend, and if for some reason cal ever wanted to not do that, i think something blanket like this restricts design. we're already taking length to address the whole melee not feeling like melee thing anyway
tired haven
it makes sense why the proj should do less damage than the blade, but i am prett...
Obviously, nothing wrong with occasional magic wand on a big stick, but I am definitely curious whether projectile swords should be more about the conjunction rather than just projectile
Most people neglect the blade part which might mean it's not rewarding enough
or doesn't ever function properly in terraria enemy design but shh
swift wharf
Yeah it is not explored a lot
Most of the time the blade just has a different effect
tired haven
Or none
swift wharf
or none!
Rather than being directly tied to the projectile
Like say
Fractured Ark, Terratomere and Beam Sword
tired haven
Beam sword?
swift wharf
The blade itself(well, the parry, but fuck you) makes the projectile stronger
In terratomere, the blade heals you
And in beam sword the blade does uhhh
Nothing
tired haven
Oh you meant that as different examples, oke
swift wharf
Ya
Exploring the idea of making everything* have true melee aspects that synergize with the projectile would be neat
But um
tired haven
Byeah
swift wharf
Now let's see the amount of melee weapons
tired haven
checks notes death.
swift wharf
there is no issue there is no issue there is no
crude geode
Tag damage will never be balanced
shut pollen
blazing kettle
you both misunderstood what they said and unnesecarilly commented on a marked sugg
ocean coral
My suggestion is adding ruinous flame Effects onto the poltergast boss I think it would help it look a little less bland looking
ocean coral
mean ruinous souls
It should look like flames if you add it to the boss
drowsy plank
???
ashen warren
💀
I literally talked about how it could be explained away by 'the star is small and hard to control' and how most projectile melee weapons aren't unique in this way (Influx Waver, Beam Sword/Enchanted Sword, Biome Blade with that one attunement where you shoot a projectile)
And I also accepted that my suggestion was flawed
small timber
I literally talked about how it could be explained away by 'the star is small an...
the main thing this suggestion didn't address is some weapon you are not supposed to hit with the true melee part, like star fury
which is why its projectile deal "double damage", because the projectile is its whole damage
if anything in this case it should be "buff true melee to be same damage as projectile"
ashen warren
And I also accepted that my suggestion was flawed
^
small timber
acknowledging the suggestion is flawed doesn't stop people from criticizing it, in fact that is the whole point of recognizing that your suggestion is flawed: to acknowledge and receive criticism
I am not here to "bash your suggestion", I am just saying how the issues can be addressed
ashen warren
Yes but what you've said I've already heard
ashen warren
I am not here to "bash your suggestion", I am just saying how the issues can be ...
Thank you for that
tired haven
the main thing this suggestion didn't address is *some weapon you are not suppos...
Well, now it is
and got nerfed to 1.5x as a result
Granted, it is a good observation. There are a bunch of such cases like old terra blade or old star wrath
marble moat
i think personally the main problem with melee as a class is that it just does not feel good at all to go for true melee strikes once there are 15 trillion projectiles on screen imo, at least from a casual perspective
austere cargo
"MOAB makes sandstorm worse" is just going to keep coming up, isn't it?
seems like the options (aside from do nothing) are "make a BoB upgrade line that doesn't include wings", "fix the odd interaction between the wing animation and sandstorm", and "nerf sandstorm to match MOAB"
wide river
It's going to come up until either it gets accepted or it gets put on the "frequently suggested" list
austere cargo
I'm curious how difficult it would be to just force wings to be hidden during the sandstorm jump
or, even kludgier, make MOAB not count as wings but still lock out equipping any other wings
glass arch
it counting as wings isnt the issue iirc
p sure the issue is just having flight time in general
wide river
I feel like there's really just not the best reasoning that can be provided at the moment to fix MOAB
The 1.4.4 port will offer that reasoning we need with the Bundle of Horseshoe Balloons existing
austere cargo
the issue is caused by wings being displayed. the effect still appears if your wings are only in the vanity slot. Also, unlike other accessories, wings appear even if set to hidden whenever you're in the air.
tired haven
As far as I am concerned the vanity slot interaction was fixed (albeit it is REALLY funny still, and essentially unprecedented)
austere cargo
it was? how was it fixed?
tired haven
No clue from a mechanical standpoint, it just was said it was fixed
tired haven
Yeah, it was exclusively targeting vanity
austere cargo
on a related note, is the sandstorm jump faster in calamity than vanilla?
tired haven
Yeah, it was exclusively targeting vanity
So I guess the real reason has got to be flight time trying to override sandstorm spin
austere cargo
the weird thing is that if you sandstorm jump while using a weapon
tired haven
on a related note, is the sandstorm jump faster in calamity than vanilla?
Afaik no, but calamity does give you a blank 50% movement speed boost on base character which scales jumps' speed
austere cargo
you don't do the spin but still get the speed
wide river
On the topic of sandstorm jumps, I did end up finding another strange interaction with Sandstorm jumps rather recently
Apparently the Wulfrum Prosthesis can do the same thing as wings where it just cancels out the momentum, I believe it was theorized that it was just a "bug" shared with items that lock the player's direction
A clip is in here, from a month ago https://discord.com/channels/225030931008847874/1095910787991736425
tired haven
you don't do the spin but still get the speed
fascinating
austere cargo
at least that's what I remember when testing
I don't guarantee I remember correctly
tired haven
Yeah that is correct, I have a game open rn and thus checked
austere cargo
well, if you have it open right now, would you mind checking a couple things for me
- just to be sure, do wings in the vanity slot no longer affect the jump?
- does hiding wings that are in the normal slots affect the jump?
tired haven
1) just to be sure, do wings in the vanity slot no longer affect the jump?
Indeed
tired haven
2) does hiding wings that are in the normal slots affect the jump?
Nope, and as you mentioned, wings are forced vanity when you are airborne
austere cargo
so if you equip the moab and set it to hidden, the sandstorm jump works normally?
tired haven
Hiding wings doesn't affect anything. So it remains broken
tired haven
No, character spins as usual
austere cargo
and wings in normal slots?
tired haven
Those turn the spin off
drowsy plank
do... do terraria dashes even have startup frames?
tired haven
Afaik no, they set velocity to max frame 1
drowsy plank
yeah okay so this suggestion makes 0 sense
tired haven
Jumps are a different story
drowsy plank
dashes happen the instant the game recieves the input, and the only delay is that between the controller and the game itself
which is something we literally cannot account for
tired haven
I think you may have misread the suggestion though
glass arch
i think they mean the cooldown between dashes
wide river
I assume it's something like "If dash cannot be done, then queue a dash for when dash can be done", in a simpler term
drowsy plank
oh okay so the idea is when the dash is on cooldown, if you press the button within a time frame then
yeah
that
frankly the wording does not help it very much but i can follow the logic at least
tired haven
Adding "input" before "buffer" probably would have made it clearer
austere cargo
so the wings overriding the sandstorm spin does seem to be what causes the slowdown. I wonder why the fix for vanity doesn't work on functional wings
north oracle
First bit of reasoning; “I think it would be super cool”
dawn pawn
I was just suggesting background effects
Not that hard to understand it’s pointless but is the same as any regular decoration
I didn’t have another item to compare background decor to seeing that monoliths are the only items that do such
drowsy plank
what background effects dont already have monoliths (calval does most already and the rest dont work bc of tmod issues)
random talon
exactly
dawn pawn
Brimstone Craig for starts
drowsy plank
that is a biome
random talon
that has a monolith effect?
dawn pawn
Right but you can’t get one on thw overworld
drowsy plank
it has a fountain maybe but again i think calval might already have it covered?
north oracle
Also, you need a lot more reasoning than “this would be cool” even if there were more backgrounds
dawn pawn
That’s a better response
drowsy plank
yeah the reasoning on this is kinda bad
and again most effects already have monoliths
north oracle
And what monoliths still need to be added?
north oracle
There’s no point asking for more when there aren’t any
drowsy plank
calamity isnt super in on vanity stuff because calval already helps with most of that, and they already have most of them implemented so
¯_(ツ)_/¯
dawn pawn
Fair enough have a great day
north oracle
Life cycle of a suggestions post
Gets posted
“There’s lots of issues with this”
“I don’t see any”
“These are the exact issues”
“Fair enough byeeeeeeee”
drowsy plank
so true
golden tulip
First bit of reasoning; “I think it would be super cool”
what other reasoning is there
why do monoliths exist in first place
because theyre cool
crude geode
Consistency would be one argument
wide river
Another argument would be that it would be a good addition for building, perhaps
frosty trellis
Life cycle of a suggestions post
Gets posted
“There’s lots of issues with this...
That's innaccurate
More than half the time the last one is replaced with "bunch of pointless arguing because they won't listen"
random talon
lmao
sleek turret
monoliths exists because of decoration practically (they kinda look cool for some special builds) really
hollow idol
monoliths will happen when they’re sprited/we get passable sprites for em
sleek turret
probably someone at the team just said "yeah let's make pillar monoliths because the pillar backgrounds look nice and can be used for decoration"
wide river
That's innaccurate
More than half the time the last one is replaced with "bunch...
True though
sleek turret
anything vanity related in calam will happen if there are passable sprites for it really
it's basically the same situation with acidwood deco and exo (?) i think
hollow idol
weve gone nearly 7 years with none, safe to say itll take a bit longer
aktually we did get the calamitas one, so one
sleek turret
sure! you can dedicate yourself to spriting if you want that idea to happen
wide river
weve gone nearly 7 years with none, safe to say itll take a bit longer
And here I thought the God Slayer "Wings" were the longest item without a sprite
sleek turret
with time and dedication you will achieve good things
north oracle
That's innaccurate
More than half the time the last one is replaced with "bunch...
True
And one in a million fixes their suggestion
random talon
And here I thought the God Slayer "Wings" were the longest item without a sprite
I've made one
drowsy plank
again
they dont have a sprite because of a lack of people making them
there just hasn't been one that was accepted
undone holly
And here I thought the God Slayer "Wings" were the longest item without a sprite
There are God Slayer wings?
drowsy plank
not yet bc there's still no accepted sprite
wide river
I still wish some of the people that submitted a sprite for that would resubmit them, since I think some of them were pretty good, and maybe they'd get accepted now that it's been three years since the request
small timber
why would they when 90% of the time the art channel bash the submission if it is mildly not good enough
(from what I heard)
wide river
I think the art channel is pretty chill about stuff
Maybe there's a few people here and there that are like you described, but overall it's a good environment to be in
Over in the Calamity Art Server, yes
Said server has an invite link over in #info
drowsy plank
I think the art channel is pretty chill about stuff
Maybe there's a few people h...
ive tried to post stuff before and i would argue the art server is WORSE than this place sometimes
which is
really saying something
idk maybe it's gotten better but i posted there Once and never went back
wide river
Oh god
I guess I was lucky in having no one mention the stuff I've posted then
drowsy plank
xd
i EVENTUALLY got some help but man it was rough
i dont plan on going back there anytime soon lol
glass arch
someone insulted me for spending more time making and animating a bar than they thought i should have once (it was, quite literally, my first time doing pixel art)
drowsy plank
someone insulted me for spending more time making and animating a bar than they ...
LITERALLY same
and the thing i posted, of ALL things
WAS A SUBMISSION FOR GOD SLAYER WINGS
it really does all come back around 💥
royal tapir
Me a week ago
"Why do I have #pixel-art muted again"
Unmutes
1 hour of lurking later: "Oh, that's why"
ornate kestrel
God slayer wings will happen within the next few business years
Wait
There's a pixel art channel?
glass arch
in calart
ornate kestrel
Oh
royal tapir
teal marlin
Adding "input" before "buffer" probably would have made it clearer
Right you are, crabby bar
teal marlin
I assume it's something like "If dash cannot be done, then queue a dash for when...
That's exactly what I meant, I'll reword my suggestion
I didn't want to specify any bosses or games the idea came from to keep things general
But it was infernum dog that made me realise how valuable it would be
I had tens of deaths caused by dashing a frame or two before it recharged
Those sorts of deaths can be frustrating, since you did the right thing, but slightly early
drowsy plank
@rough venture no reasoning and also you are just
completely fucking wrong
soaring is scal viable
wide river
Immediately there are quite a few problems present here, all of which I shall list
First of all, reversion suggestions are a don't
Secondly, the Soaring Insignia is still really powerful even after having been nerfed, so calling it "D-tier" is just not correct
Thirdly, how was it "lazy"? If an effect is too powerful, then it should get nerfed. Infinite flight is among those effects
And finally, bosses shouldn't be balanced around using an accessory, especially one that gives infinite flight, so completely changing all the bosses to account for wearing a single accessory seems like it'd be far too much effort.
rough venture
Immediately there are quite a few problems present here, all of which I shall li...
you're just defending the devs' laziness
that nerf was 100% undeserved
drowsy plank
it's okay to be wrong
but it would help if you at least read the rules first
because there are other fundemental issues with this
wide river
you're just defending the devs' laziness
Even notwithstanding the supposed "laziness", you still need address the other issues I've brought up
ashen warren
Why not just lock empress dropping this for late game
drowsy plank
that's dumb
that's like locking terraprisma, boss rematches are also silly and the mod is trying to move away from them
ashen warren
also, you realize that designing all bosses to require infinite flight makes soaring insignia a literal necessity on every build. how are you going to convey that to the player? that's also yet another accessory slot that has to be filled by a needed accessory, which limits builds by a lot
tired haven
Tbh we should really start giving post3mechs attacks with hitboxes lingering for 3 seconds to balance around powerful hallowed armor
ashen warren
Tbh we should really start giving post3mechs attacks with hitboxes lingering for...
TRUE why didnt we think of that
lazy devs smh
drowsy plank
wide river
also, you realize that designing all bosses to require infinite flight makes soa...
^
We already have a few accessories that are considered "necessary slots", like a dash and wings
This is why I still want Asgard's to lose the Ankh Shield, but that hasn't been going well
hybrid steeple
mfw the devs are too lazy to rebalance their entire mod around a purposefully overpowered vanilla accessory
ashen warren
mfw when all post ml bosses arent balanced around infinite teleportation with no drawback
hybrid steeple
when the endgame vanilla accessory/item designed to be overpowered because you've already beaten the final boss/are close to beating the final boss so what does it matter is nerfed by a mod that adds content beyond the final boss
blazing kettle
my mod will not nerf the Soaring Insignia
have you even used soaring insignia in cal?
north oracle
that nerf was 100% undeserved
ashen warren
if you want it so bad there's also already a mod for it called unnerf calamity
frosty trellis
^
Soaring is a very easy S tier accessory
I wouldn't say it's SS tier but it's definitely S tier
It was originally 50% extra flight time and it was.... Really broken, to say the least, before it was nerfed again
north oracle
Yeah, soaring is a really good accessory (because there’s nothing else that does anything similar after pre evils)
glass arch
how many seconds of flight time do lunar wings have again?
glass arch
so yeah 50 brings that up to 4.5 seconds
glass arch
which is roughly the same as tarragon right?
frosty trellis
I use Angel Treads still at that point because it gives extra flight time and ms and even that's only a 10% boost and it's STILL insanely good
glass arch
50% is basically a free tier increase for wings
glass arch
Tarragon is 4.16
so yeah even better than wings obtained a stage later
frosty trellis
More than because lunar has the same flight time as Fishron and Fishron mobility is the funny
austere cargo
what about having an upgrade to the insignia post-ML that grants infinite flight?
north oracle
*post SCal/exos
And even then, it could only be there because no one cares about BR balance
lavish condor
They're planning to put rod of harmony post-boss rush right?
Maybe add a shimmer/exhume that gives you an unnerfed version but its post-BR like harmony
random talon
If I were in the dev seat, I'd just institute a cooldown effect on it during boss rush
wide river
They're planning to put rod of harmony post-boss rush right?
Just post-Scal and Exos, not post-Boss Rush, to my knowledge
lavish condor
reread the message and you're right
versed cape
Soaring is a very easy S tier accessory
I wouldn't say it's SS tier but it's def...
So true
I love mobility accessories
bright crag
Just post-Scal and Exos, not post-Boss Rush, to my knowledge
Correct
bright crag
Maybe add a shimmer/exhume that gives you an unnerfed version but its post-BR li...
But why tho?
And yes, despite the nerfs, Insignia is a great accessory
grim tusk
People only remember that insignia gives infinite flight when it also gives
Frog leg 2 (which we also nerfed lol)
Boosted flying velocity and acceleration
drowsy plank
i use it for that 👌
hollow shell
I was about to argue against this suggestion having an exclam and start up the reversion-based sugg time limit convo again
But then I read the reasoning
and wew
north oracle
it's... not underpowered in the slightest
hollow shell
It is funny to see them call the Soaring Insignia nerf "unnecessary" then inadvertently admit that leaving it unnerfed would require reworking every single post-Plantera and post-Moon Lord boss to account for it
north oracle
random talon
hey
you know the Defender Medals from the Tavernkeep?
what if
we gave such a system to the Angler
wide river
I think another mod does that
north oracle
...why
fishing is easy enough in cal, and there's other mods that do that
random talon
you see, this is all part of my plan to replace all the QOL recipes with fishing
jokes aside, fishing actually gives a lot of accessories that got QOL recipes in Cal
so what if we make fishing more viable?
north oracle
fishing is already quite viable, i'm not sure what you mean
forcing people to fish is pointless
random talon
I see your point
wide river
I think before fishing gets expanded we need to get rid of the boss drops that invalidate fishing entirely
Those things have been a bane to fishing since it just lets you get everything without fishing
Like you can just get the absolute best fishing gear right after killing Desert Scourge
random talon
for some reason, I killed like 20 Scourges and couldn't get anything but potions lmao
austere cargo
couldn't you just increase the drop rate of fishing items from angler quests?
wide river
Why is this a thing
Combine this with how you can get the Golden Fishing Rod by simply letting the Angler die to a Trasher and you have a recipe to never do Angler quests again
random talon
yep
wide river
And the Angler was improved recently, so I really don't see a reason for this to stay
At least I think he was
random talon
He almost always gives me Master Bait when I finish the things
they definitely buffed him
austere cargo
pieces of the angler set are granted every 5 quests it seems
really the obnoxious parts are the components of the cell phone and tackle bag
1/30 is kind of low
also apparently happiness slightly improves the drop chances
wide river
Honestly I might just suggest to remove the fishing loot from the boss drop tables
Like why does the first boss drop so much stuff
austere cargo
to encourage you to farm it for some reason?
wide river
That in itself is a problem
austere cargo
though pearl shards are already enough of a reason
(btw, why did they used to be called victory shards?)
ripe owl
Why is this a thing
Combine this with how you can get the Golden Fishing Rod by ...
Idk I always end up doing his quests for most of the items because this stupid mf angling kit doesn't drop like a single Weather Radio or something
wide river
There shouldn't need to be a large reason to farm the literal first boss
random talon
(btw, why did they used to be called victory shards?)
because cringe
seriously, it was like the most anime thing ever
austere cargo
never thought of it as cringe, but it was a little odd
drowsy plank
because they served no purpose besides locking pre-Boss items
they dropped from EoC too so it was literally just for progression
austere cargo
ah, I see. didn't know EoC used to have them
random talon
locking pre-Boss items? You mean like, they'd be in the recipe for things like Demonite and such?
bright crag
Honestly I might just suggest to remove the fishing loot from the boss drop tabl...
I'd love to but some people just hate fishing
So we have to make sure there's an alternate way to acquire fishing gear
wide river
Unfortunate
bright crag
I mean
We can think of another method
As long as it isn't a purely fishing thing
I don't like the boss drops very much either
Why fish for them when you can just fight the second boss in the game
It certainly helps hammer down the boss rush aspect
golden sonnet
I mean
We can think of another method
As long as it isn't a purely fishing thing
could replace sulphuric treasure/abyss treasure loot pool? idk, just a thought
bright crag
A bit too RNG
ripe owl
I'd love to but some people just hate fishing
So we have to make sure there's an...
Why acquire fishing gear if you aren't fishing shit 
royal tapir
Something with the Sunken Sea I have little ideas past that
bright crag
Why acquire fishing gear if you aren't fishing shit <:YharimPoint:65888174114616...
Because occasionally, you will have to
Or, rather will be encouraged to
And for people that dislike it, having the gear be obtainable through other methods is a godsend
It means less time fishing overall
ripe owl
I don't think it's really necessary anymore, with both Cal's and 1.4.4's fishing quest changes
bright crag
You don't need to fish for the gear, and having the gear reduces the time you spend fishing for your desired item(s)
tired haven
Why acquire fishing gear if you aren't fishing shit <:YharimPoint:65888174114616...
After trying to casually fish for entire questline, full fishing gear is where fishing starts to become remotely fun because your speed increases to about 1 catch in 2 seconds
ripe owl
You're gonna acquire gear in no time to complain about it
bright crag
That's still locked behind fishing and I'm not sure people will appreciate that
Feel free to suggest it
ripe owl
That's still locked behind fishing and I'm not sure people will appreciate that
Again, why would you need a gear for fishing if you aren't going to fish
Do it early and it gets paid off pretty damn quick
tired haven
Again, why would you need a gear for fishing if you aren't going to fish
five quadrillion wrath potions in order to fight doggo or smth, idk I'm ignoring gear that i don't want to grind
tired haven
Do it early and it gets paid off pretty damn quick
this implies average terraria player has any resemblance of strategic planning and delayed gratification
ripe owl
Draedon labs all over again
tired haven
(herb farms are "too much effort")
golden sonnet
Herb farms are a godsend in calamity, I just rope to the space planetoid, get 30 herb bags, plant, and am literally set for the entire playthrough
ripe owl
Herb farms are a godsend in calamity, I just rope to the space planetoid, get 30...
So true
golden sonnet
but no, potions have to be purchasable 
bright crag
Again, why would you need a gear for fishing if you aren't going to fish
Because as I said, occasionally there's a huge gain from fishing and people want to get it over quick
Something only enabled by alternate methods
Say you want Abyssal Amulet for the debuff, and you hate fishing
You can either
- Do a dozen of (frankly easy) fishing quests, then fish for the item quite fast
- Fight a boss and fish for the item quite fast
tired haven
once 1.4.4 drops, shimmering like 15 bags into cans of worms will be funny too
golden sonnet
~~once 1.4.4 drops, shimmering like 15 bags into cans of worms will be funny too...
Free gold worm for permanent upgrade to fishing power, it all comes full circle back to fishing
ripe owl
Herb farms are a godsend in calamity, I just rope to the space planetoid, get 30...
But generally you'd have to buy more planter boxes for respective plants because those boxes in the planetoid are never enough
golden sonnet
But generally you'd have to buy more planter boxes for respective plants because...
True, that's just post eye tho
tired haven
Free gold worm for permanent upgrade to fishing power, it all comes full circle ...
keep fishing to get pink pearl to get more luck which increases fishing power
ripe owl
True, that's just post eye tho
Nuh-uh, that's post-WoF
Because that's when you get the last planter box
golden sonnet
? planter boxes are post eye, b/c dryad
golden sonnet
Because that's when you get the last planter box
You can plant any plant on any box
it's just aesthetic
ripe owl
Yes but they won't bloom
golden sonnet
LMAO
tired haven
Scammed by common sense
wide river
Although the various Planter Boxes have different seed names and appearances, the differences are purely cosmetic: Any herb seeds can grow in any Planter Box, and planting seeds in their respective Planter Boxes will not provide any extra benefit.
Taken from Terraria's wiki
tired haven
happens to the best of us
golden sonnet
Scammed by common sense
^Real
ripe owl
Scammed by common sense
Not only that but by a guy that told me this info
tired haven
But yeah, you can just unlock daybloom planterbox and put everything in it
bright crag
It'd be funny to lock blooming to their respective boxes
marble moat
but no, potions have to be purchasable <:calsad:1095752003268923465>
yeah because people lazy as hell and want to put the minimum effort into preparation before spending 3 hours hitting their heads into a wall as they fight a boss without proper gear
its me im people
tired haven
It'd be funny to lock blooming to their respective boxes
a devious lick for sure
I'd absolutely loathe it btw
marble moat
see yeah it takes like 10 minutes to set up an herb farm
but hey thats 10 more minutes of dog attempts i could be doing amirite
bright crag
but no, potions have to be purchasable <:calsad:1095752003268923465>
(In a mod where oceans are made of money)
tired haven
10 minutes is probably a sum of time to get 100 of each herb total
marble moat
i dont see why cal needs to make potions purchaseable tbh
tired haven
not just building a herb farm
wide river
Maybe someday the economy will be fixed
marble moat
just alchnpc if you want it no?
ripe owl
(In a mod where oceans are made of money)
True. I defeated like 1 boss and I already have 2 platinum
marble moat
(speaking as someone who uses alchnpc frequently, i am incredibly lazy)
ripe owl
And then the Goblin busted in and stole 1
bright crag
I'd absolutely loathe it btw
I'd be fine with it
I usually put herbs in their respective boxes anyways
Which is why Cal is a godsend to me
bright crag
i dont see why cal needs to make potions purchaseable tbh
Some people want potion availability within the mod
marble moat
why
tired haven
just alchnpc if you want it no?
I guess it boils down to the fact that it becomes troublesome to balance around things when they are not regularly obtainable
Cue RoD as an extreme example
marble moat
actually no i see why
bright crag
Because they hate herb farming/fishing
marble moat
no like
bright crag
Which isn't an uncommon view
marble moat
yeah i am very lazy in this game 👍
fishing is chill though i wish it was made quicker easier, like having multirods available earlier
bright crag
I'm torn
I feel like some basic or utility potions should be sold, like Well Fed items and Shine Potion
But most don't need to be sold
marble moat
not to bypass the mechanic entirely, but to make it less time consuming
wide river
I'm torn
I feel like some basic or utility potions should be sold, like Well Fed...
The stronger ones should definitely not be sold, like stuff like Lifeforce
marble moat
but like, i am NOT fishing up all those stupid ass fish for those wrath and rage potions when i need one every respawn lmao
tired haven
I feel like none of potions should be sold and instead given more interactive ways to obtain
Like more yield from the environment, help with specific "locks" like fish, etc.
marble moat
personally i dont believe cal should sell more than the basics
and yeah, making alt methods more rewarding is great
bright crag
I feel like none of potions should be sold and instead given more interactive wa...
TRUE
tired haven
Basically expanding on a silent success that was space planetoid
bright crag
Making the poti9ns more fun to get rather than just selling them
wide river
I feel like none of potions should be sold and instead given more interactive wa...
Maybe the removal of Potions of Return from the Wizard shop will give way to that
It'll definitely help, in any case
bright crag
Making the poti9ns more fun to get rather than just selling them
I just feel like that's a bit unrealistic of a take
marble moat
also on a related subject how would you make fishing in the mod more fun/engaging/whatever
bright crag
I definitely wasn't bugging everyone about Potions of Return
marble moat
because believe me i'd love fishing if it didnt take ages to get what you want from it
fishing pity system
swift wharf
kill potion shops yes
tired haven
I just feel like that's a bit unrealistic of a take
It will indeed be a tricky one to figure out
swift wharf
😇
tired haven
Especially with amount of backlash that'd happen after removing the infinitely convenient sold potions
wide river
Knowing the Calamity community they'd complain for two weeks and then forget it ever happened
swift wharf
maybe you could move fish postioning around to make the "important" potions more accessible
marble moat
why would there be backlash though, cant you just download alchnpc lol
wide river
why would there be backlash though, cant you just download alchnpc lol
Did you see what happened when Yharim's Stimulants and Cadance Potions got removed?
marble moat
aw man those are gone
swift wharf
that was SMALL compared to malice and DR
wide river
Not much need for combo potions + the buff slot limit was going to be raised in 1.4.4 and such
swift wharf
preparation for 1.4.4 + some other stuff
tired haven
They were a lot stronger than a mere combo, too
marble moat
oh ok
swift wharf
like uhhhh some vanilla potions were nerfed because of them
marble moat
oh ok
i think i play with increased buff slots (1.4.4 style) anyways so they wouldn't really have affected me
marble moat
speaking of combo potions do yall know if alchnpc combos stack with their components?
swift wharf
1st calamity already makes fishing gear more accessible so making the Important potion fish more accessible as well could work
wide river
Frick wrong reply
wide river
that was SMALL compared to malice and DR
(I remember how how suggestions to add back Malice had to be outright banned after the first two days of its removal, I really don't know why people were that angry)
tired haven
speaking of combo potions do yall know if alchnpc combos stack with their compon...
Supposedly they don't
marble moat
i mean malice was like, a whole gamemode, that kindaaaaa makes sense
but like, there's again, a mod to add it back
so like
wide river
It was pure garbage
marble moat
its still there lol
swift wharf
terraria players
marble moat
Supposedly they don't
thank god i didnt like taking up all those inventory slots with component potions
my inventory management is trash enough without 40 pots in there and my piggy bank
swift wharf
the 22->44 slots change is kinda silly because you're not gonna use all 22 slots at once anyway
marble moat
yeah but at least debuffs dont delete my funky slots now!
just in case
either way i kinda just stack as many buffs as i can because more buff = more better
swift wharf
because if you're running gills flipper featherfall gravitation spelunker mining and your buffs get deleted then that's on you
tired haven
It's mostly a problem for endgame summoner tbh
It was getting to a point where I had to decide between legitimately good potions like swiftness and regen and candles and whatnot, let alone removing pets and such
cold cosmos
It's mostly a problem for endgame summoner tbh
It was getting to a point where I...
my big issue with it was not being able to use mounts/pets/light pets yeah
marble moat
anyways my suggestion to make fishing more fun is either make fishing power easier to get or make it faster
and the first is unnecessary
so literally just make it faster
ex, more accessible multiline rods, with maybe less power than their same-tier alternatives for getting lots of potion fish
swift wharf
or make the potion fish themselves easier to get tbh
marble moat
some of the funny fishing drops are also annoying to get
because you know when there's rng you're getting screwed over
swift wharf
that is a bit tricky to fix
marble moat
how hard would it be to edit the loot tables based on how many fish you've caught per day
probably like
very right
that sounds annoying but also it'd be funny to have fishing pity
swift wharf
what i mean is like if you increase the % chance of smth to drop then you might get too much of it but idk
but that could also work
marble moat
like, lets say im going for abyssal amulet
wide river
Make it like Stardew Valley where every now and then you get a loot chest every few pulls
Not even including the minigame aspect that most people bring up when they suggest this kind of thing
swift wharf
if you craft them with fishing
marble moat
i have no idea what the hell the drop rate is
swift wharf
like instead of getting one you get 3
marble moat
that's a good start
wide river
That could work!
swift wharf
while simpler potions (ironskin swiftness regen) would wield one
marble moat
bruh
swift wharf
I mean hell you could increase the amount of pots you get for fishless ones to incentivize farming plants
ripe owl
New copypasta dropped
marble moat
does it even state the power requirements for obtaining certain items
swift wharf
i wouldn't expect a lot from the vanilla wiki considering that axe of regrowth still isnt in the 1.4.4 page
tired haven
The problem with fishing drop chances is that they are calculated individually depending on 1) how likely you are to get a specific rarity catch with X fishing power 2) how many of the same rarity catches are competing for the same spot 3) specific chance increases like crates
marble moat
damn
wide river
i wouldn't expect a lot from the vanilla wiki considering that axe of regrowth s...
Oh my god it isn't
It's like one of the key features of the update how is it not there
swift wharf
wide river
(At least I think it is, anyway)
tired haven
the key feature of killing like 6 more axes
ripe owl
I am ready to get my ass beaten
drowsy plank
nah this is good
swift wharf
and this is good enough idk what else to add cuz I cant add the exo armor yet
keyword yet 😈
drowsy plank
lmao wouldnt this just be solved by the already planned solution of adding ashes crafts
swift wharf
idk are those a thing
hybrid steeple
is that already a devplans.png
swift wharf
other than demonshade rework
glass arch
ashes crafts are in fact a devplans.png
drowsy plank
here
swift wharf
stip is trolling
swift wharf
different thing different thing
hybrid steeple
it never got a status update
drowsy plank
💥
drowsy plank
true
hybrid steeple
anyways yeagh if ashes crafts are cool thatll smooth out the imbalance
swift wharf
at roverdrive can you remove everyones react perms
hybrid steeple
at least on their endgame tiers
swift wharf
oh yeah let me cook the other suggestion
glass arch
at roverdrive can you remove everyones react perms
it only takes one ❗ from an admin and poof
swift wharf
rover is no dev they cant do this to me
unless im breaking a dont
at roverdrive can you delete the doc
cobalt pewter
mod aboose
north oracle
That’s… actually a kinda cool suggestion
ashen warren
yeah i really like this one
north oracle
Miracle matter isn’t meant to be an exo material anyway
hybrid steeple
it is actually
hybrid steeple
byeag
frosty trellis
Isn't it an exo thing? I swear that was mentioned somewhere
glass arch
its exo connection is integral to its lore according to stip in this message: #calamity-update-talk message
ripe owl
Stip literally mentioned it not too long ago
frosty trellis
(According to the wiki page it's used to craft the exo weapons so yeah)
ripe owl
its exo connection is integral to its lore according to stip in this message: ht...
Yeah this
north oracle
Huh
it doesn’t feel like it should be
swift wharf
second suggestion cooked
ripe owl
(According to the wiki page it's used to craft the *exo* weapons so yeah)
Rumor has it, Exo weapons is just a nickname, they aren't actually "Exo"
glass arch
ill tell you what it doesnt feel like it should be an ashes craft either
swift wharf
returning to troll hq
north oracle
ill tell you what it doesnt feel like it should be an ashes craft either
True
Just rename and retheme it iirc
hybrid steeple
so long as ashes crafts are good
swift wharf
yea
glass arch
idk ashes and MM dont really fit together
north oracle
Yeah, if ashes crafts are actually useful the problem is alleviated
ripe owl
so long as ashes crafts are good
Calamity Mod devs purposefully making Ashes weapons bad just to shoot themselves in the foot
glass arch
athiest matter is Science Joose
north oracle
Still feels weird that for the ultimate combination of the weapons from the rest of the game, you only have to do exos lol
swift wharf
because if ashes of calamity are gonna be crafted into ashes of calamity gear
and miracle matter is STILL related to exo mechs
then what is the point of miracle matter
glass arch
miracles n shit
ripe owl
It's your Exo
swift wharf
why not use the current exo
swift wharf
just add the materials from miracle matter to miracle gear
glass arch
why not use the current exo
shrimple: long crafting tree go brrrrrrr
glass arch
ehhhh
adding the extra materials directly to the weapon crafts also doesnt seem like a great idea
swift wharf
(the latter is nitpicking
drowsy plank
only a year old
cobalt pewter
true.
I might repost it since I doubt anything changed
(yes I still hate potion selling)
(dumbass bandaid)
random talon
common Cal QOL L
ornate kestrel
People will just use other qol mods like alchemist npc lite
So it doesn't harm anyone
rugged belfry
I think the Soaring Insignia suggestion has good intent, and I agree that an expert mode accessory from a difficult boss should be fairly powerful (I think a scaling % or boost may be taken better by the community), but I think suggesting that half of the game's bosses should be reworked is absurd.
rugged belfry
(yes I still hate potion selling)
I agree. I always turn off the Brewer and just keep the Alchemist so I can buy the plants but not the potion themselves
ripe owl
Nobody even warned me that I was wrong about Bleached Kit having better drop chances for items
At least I caught it early one
swift wharf
I think the Soaring Insignia suggestion has good intent, and I agree that an exp...
it's not an expert accessory anymore in cal
rugged belfry
My bad
My second point still stands--that suggestion is just asking too much for one accessory.
swift wharf
yeah definitely
cobalt pewter
soaring insignia should be GONE
rugged belfry
But I think nerfing SI is good, since Calamity adds infinite flight (unless changed in the past two years), and getting infinite flight so early (in Calamity terms) is wild.
north oracle
(Also it’s still good with the huge nerfs)
cobalt pewter
cal doesn't have any infinite flight things anymore
it used to be in yharon lore but like
lore effects died
rugged belfry
25% flight time is good, but it seems like it'll only be good situationally or if you have the spare space.
cobalt pewter
actually idr if yharon lore was de facto infinite either
rugged belfry
There's a lot better accessories at that time that are just objectively better than having long flight, + there's always flight mounts
rugged belfry
actually idr if yharon lore was de facto infinite either
I think it was very very long but not infinite.
north oracle
Nah, the movement buffs and flight time are more than worth it as an alternative accessory
rugged belfry
Sure, but there are better ones at that time imo
cobalt pewter
while complicated, it could be interesting for an accessory to only expend flight time if your altitude rises
rugged belfry
Hmm
north oracle
Sure, but there are better ones at that time imo
Not for movement, there’s literally nothing better
rugged belfry
while complicated, it could be interesting for an accessory to only expend fligh...
Like, as you rise you gain a % of remaining flight time, practically doubling your vertical flight but keeping horizontal the same
Although at that time in the game, horizontal flight is becoming a more viable option giving the wings from Moon Lord, and the Hoverboard
And horizontal movement is very important for Moon Lord and some other late bosses.
cobalt pewter
Like, as you rise you gain a % of remaining flight time, practically doubling yo...
I'm implying that not flying (thus falling down) and flying again won't expend flight time as long as you haven't exceeded your former max height during that particular flight
cobalt pewter
there needs to be a more fleshed out concept to make it actually usable though
since if we just take that raw idea
rugged belfry
Yeah I get that
rugged belfry
You could suggest it but idk if they would take a raw idea suggestion like that
cobalt pewter
but that's the basic idea
cobalt pewter
You could suggest it but idk if they would take a raw idea suggestion like that
I've been here on years, I know I can't sugg this
north oracle
It would still be absurdly good, you just go up till right before the limit and have effectively infinite flight lol
cobalt pewter
but it's always nice to write down an idea
north oracle
Byeah, very SIS for an actual sugg lol
cobalt pewter
It would still be absurdly good, you just go up till right before the limit and ...
yeah that's what I have in mind
tired haven
I'm implying that not flying (thus falling down) and flying again won't expend f...
Wouldn't that just mean you could flop your wings once at sky island altitude, fall down a bit and get infinite flight?
north oracle
True
Just start a boss fight at the top of the world lol
cobalt pewter
Wouldn't that just mean you could flop your wings once at sky island altitude, f...
yeah I know that's an issue
fsllgod
of course it could just be reduced flight time consumption
with the altitude mark resetting when resetting flight time
north oracle
I mean again, you start a fight as high as you can and just have extra flight for as long as you’re making your way down
It seems like extra flight time with extra steps lol
cobalt pewter
true
glass arch
I think it was *very very long* but not infinite.
yeah it was about 17 minutes
small timber
"expert drop should be good" the moment when the balance is that it is 50/50 overpowered or completely useless
rugged belfry
Gravity Globe is bad for Calamity but good for Vanilla
small timber
sadly the cal expert accessories page is completely vandalized on fandom and wiki.gg no longer have that page, but I also remember that being the case
rugged belfry
Since you're past Moon Lord so it's not like you need a combat accessory
small timber
things like nebulous core, evolution, blazing core etc
glass arch
Gravity Globe is bad for Calamity but good for Vanilla
its kinda mid
small timber
Since you're past Moon Lord so it's not like you need a combat accessory
and then you just remembered that soaring insignia exist in vanilla
with celestial starboard (unnerfed)
glass arch
unironically why use gravity globe when fucking gravity potions
rugged belfry
its kinda mid
Less so for building
rugged belfry
unironically why use gravity globe when fucking gravity potions
Gravity potions require that I make a farm
glass arch
or that yknow
rugged belfry
I would rather stab Terra Blades into my eyes
glass arch
you just have some left over
rugged belfry
Never
glass arch
(+ vanilla has soaring insignia and hover wings so like)
cobalt pewter
royal gel is good early game but that's as far as it gets
which is good imo
it doesn't overstay its welcome
rugged belfry
It'
It's good for like
In the vanity slots
If a slime is annoying you
Or if you want to grind Slime Rain for whatever reason
small timber
I am tempted to post a suggestion with this entire doc that just say "buff all these shits" but it is not gonna work
glass arch
Or if you want to grind Slime Rain for whatever reason
yeah
small timber
but yeah if anyone notice other abyssmal accessory I can also add to this
cobalt pewter
Bone Helm really needs a buff tbh
glass arch
niche situations and early game
glass arch
Bone Helm really needs a buff tbh
what does it even do
cobalt pewter
shadow hands
glass arch
spawn shadow hands?
cobalt pewter
which is wildly inaccurate and has little dmg
glass arch
buff the base damage and make them as telefraggy as the ones in deerclops fight
issue solved
cobalt pewter
I blame this on the shitty shadow hands AI
glass arch
rugged belfry
The expert Deerclops accessory should really be that you take greatly reduced damage from faraway enemies
glass arch
god no
cobalt pewter
that sounds nasty
glass arch
we dont need more tanky shit to empower mpg
cobalt pewter
lmao
rugged belfry
Yes we do 👿
glass arch
i mean im not wrong it WILL empower him
glass arch
The expert Deerclops accessory should *really* be that you take greatly reduced ...
@frosty trellis how broken would this be
rugged belfry
Terraria finally adds a new game mechanic and it's only used on one boss 😔
glass arch
yeah because its annoying as fuck
rugged belfry
At least we're getting non-worm bosses
north oracle
Yharim could still be a worm
glass arch
and doesnt work for like any other boss because have you ever tried to dodge twins from true melee range when playing summoner
north oracle
(Have you ever tried to stay anywhere near spaz phase 3 without facetanking everything)
wide river
Yharim could still be a worm <:XD:936106628833488906>
What's funny about the Yharim Worm joke is that one of the old sprites for Sepulcher looked like Calamitas Worm
north oracle
Lmfao
wide river
I know this because I had to sift through version pages for about an hour for simply true melee info
north oracle
Oof
wide river
Here's the sprite, for any curious
north oracle
…it’s literally calamitas worm
glass arch
ripe owl
Yeah that was quite something, to say the least
random talon
mmmm calamitas worm
wide river
https://docs.google.com/document/d/17SUHBgjAjO2BKks2WkgJ7M4kGQFcCEgRTPhfttLid_o/...
A very useful resource, that
hollow shell
#suggestions-posting message
enchants enchants enchants enchants
I would much rather those get buffed so that SCal looks like the far better option to kill first compared to Exo Mechs
Rather than making it so Exo Mechs have few meaningful unlocks other than direct boss drops (along with taking a rather big blow to theming) by dissociating them from Miracle Matter
royal tapir
Best part of the doc honestly
bright crag
https://discord.com/channels/225030931008847874/699359022364491868/1113985017736...
(Yeah)
atomic shell
if the miracle matter sugg somehow gets accepted that would be HUGE
but also like
draedon forge? exo prisms?
what would they do then
bright crag
(I highly doubt it would be accepted)
wide river
How long has it been since that Enchantment suggestion got voted on?
I might make a suggestion similar to that, but without the... questionable solutions
atomic shell
change the scal npc to a minecraft librarian and make all of the enchantments just the minecraft ones
wide river
Oh god the Enchantment vs. Enchanting Table discussion will be brought here too
atomic shell
protection V auric tesla goes crazy
wide river
How long has it been since that Enchantment suggestion got voted on?
I might mak...
Hmm
It got sent to the devs on the 26th of May, so just under a week ago
Is that enough time? I think it is
Or maybe I should suggest one of the 13 other suggestions I've got waiting first
bright crag
Feel free to make another suggestion, if you think you'd have a better take on it
small timber
I will be honest if the game would to introduce an "enchantment"-like mechanic, it should not be literally available on the final/2nd final boss of the game which is definitely way too late; this makes it so it is extremely hard to balance them because it need to be:
- Impactful to be useful against the other final boss, and
- not so impactful that it singlehandedly carry the other final boss
so tldr is with the current enchantment you are basically stucked with intentionally mediocre and situational effect as otherwise it will just nuke the other boss
if it is available earlier it can have a better power scaling as more stuffs in the game are accounted for the increased power level (though of course it is easier said than done)
so ideally, this is also what Ozzatron said at some point I think, is that the Enchantments have their downside removed while only have upside which is nerfed proportionally; that way you at least always get an advantage from it without worrying it end up being detrimental to your build instead
wide river
The suggestion that was suggesting to remove the downsides got denied, so I don't think that's going to happen
novel belfry
tragic
north oracle
There’s too many actual good suggestions this week lmao
small timber
now for my own full of shit and definitely never happening enchantment system idea (that definitely wasn't taken from POE):
firstly: make all bosses deal extra damage (say, 20-40% damage) based on a certain "elemental" type (eg: Providence and Yharon = fire, Storm Weaver = lightning, Ceaseless Void = cold, Scal = fire and chaos)
secondly: also make all bosses more tanky by like 10-15% (more max HP)
(FYI POE which is where I took this idea from only have Fire, Cold, Lightning and Chaos elemental resistance)
and then on every single piece of gear reforge you can roll a "resistance" secondary stat or damage stat, eg:
- +25% fire and chaos resistance (dual resistance)
-
- 10% all resistance
-
- 55% cold resistance (single resistance therefore higher value)
- +4% damage (stack with menacing for 8% but you basically sacrifice resistance for it)
(in POE it is capped at 75%)
so it basically become very important to get the resistance for the boss you are going to faced, or to max all resistance so you don't take too much extra damage
and in like Death Mode you just make it so instead of bosses just straight up dealing 15% more damage, instead they deal "non-core elemental type" damage for smaller amount, eg: if Scal deal 40% extra fire and chaos damage, in Death Mode she also deal 20% cold and lightning damage; so it really become a tradeoff if you want max resistance (which should be pretty easy if you get it on all 7 piece of gear) or to literally sacrifice a lot of defenses for mildly increased damage
but yeah never happening soon™️
(though admittedly I think a lot of POE mechanics will fit Terraria perfectly, like Aura for mage class)
.
if you are at the point where you need a "debug item" (which usually is impossible to obtain without cheat), you can just cheat sheet in the roxcalibur
north oracle
No. 1
Formatting
No .2
Slightly more reasoning
No. 3
…you can just cheat it in, you have to enable cheat sheet to get the debug item anyway
The point of yharon charging at you after the bh is that you are still dodging it and him at the same time
ripe owl
#suggestions-posting message
@astral blade there's a crafting recipe for the Roxcalibur
drowsy plank
^
ripe owl
And if you want a placeable one then wait for 1.4.4, devs'll probably add it to the Rubblemaker
serene pasture
The point of yharon charging at you after the bh is that you are still dodging i...
then maybe i just have a skill issue
that would be my bad
small timber
@serene pasture the flare dust ring is, in fact, not very random
it have very similar opening at specific part of the bullet hell each time it is done, especially the "fast and less compact" bullet hell
small timber
serene pasture
small timber
the opening is always on the left and right and slightly down from where the bullet hell is executed
serene pasture
i have no trouble dodging the bullet hell
i only struggle with the one yharon charge after that
ashen warren
#suggestions-posting message im not too sure why you would want this it’s not like you can’t pick up rox after it’s destroyed by an instabridge + roxcalibur is garbage and shouldn’t be picked up anyway
small timber
shitty mspaint illustration
serene pasture
baller
small timber
if you get to this position then you get opening for the bullet hell to your left/right, which you can then use the opening to ram yharon with Asgardian Aegis (which also move you left/right so you are safe)
north oracle
i didn't know this lmao
i just run like fuck, ram dash through him once, then fly as fast as I can back through the bh
ashen warren
Same
small timber
I dont think many people know this
but I also fight yharon like, a lot
ashen warren
And hope I don’t dash into a bullet
north oracle
I dont think many people know this
but I also fight yharon like, *a lot*
apparently lmfao\
small timber
so ya tldr the best way to dodge bullet hell is in fact not to drop down as much as possible to be as far away as possible
it is just move left/right and slightly down and stay there
north oracle
i'll still just run as far as possible
good to know tho
small timber
let me see if I still have the video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7dDwvsga8c ok this (it is Death Mode)
north oracle
embed just disappeared lmao
north oracle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7dDwvsga8c ok this (it is Death Mode)
black magic and sorcery
small timber
embed just disappeared lmao
(I dont want embbed for self promote, just video link is good enough)
north oracle
fair enough
bright crag
And if you want a placeable one then wait for 1.4.4, devs'll probably add it to ...
Correct
ripe owl
I'm not a Calcord fiend
I ain't spending my life 24/7 in this hellhole, no sir thank you
ashen warren
You should now 
frosty trellis
(No, sp2 dashes should just have an audio telegraph as regardless of how long the period is for them to dissipate, there is zero telegraph for the dash making it kinda bs)
versed cape
@serene pasture im Sorry but
sp2 is entirety consistent and its really just skill issue
You can dodge yharon during any bh by either simply delaying the bh or moving orthogonally to him
Both of which work great with just a bit of practice
Heres a clip of me (badly) demonstrating it
I urge you to reconsider your suggestion
small timber
oh the suggestion is subphase 2 of the fight not phase 2 of the fight
ya SP2 is definitely like, no issue that I can remember
if P2 I can understand people suggest to change SP4/5 because the solution is not very obvious
serene pasture
<@993748389168689262> im Sorry but
i see so basically you dodge the charge first then deal with the bh
versed cape
phase 2 is just phase 1 but slightly more complicated
versed cape
I dont think its a big issue if you already agree phase 1 is fine
serene pasture
thats all
versed cape
the only thing i struggle with is the flare dusts
Say bh
Most yharon projectiles are called flare dust
serene pasture
bh
the only thing i struggle with is bh
but now i have two new ways to dodge it
versed cape
Most ppl say that
small timber
that video is also like, for the worthy which is way more restrictive
normally you have way more horizontal room
hollow ridge
fierce mesa
I do wonder how they’ll rebalance Summoner
I think it’s in a good state personally
And I really like the Belladonna Staff rework :)
north oracle
I think it’s in a good state personally
random talon
<:clueless:1064298508653432933>
so is every other class in the mod
¯_(ツ)_/¯
they are all perfectly balanced
ashen warren
nah who super reacted ❗
that gotta be personal
also isn't this a large scale rework #suggestions-posting message
random talon
that's gotta be another level of "fuck you"
blazing kettle
does the super ❗ even work?
because its technically a different react from normal
fervent orbit
we will have to find out
tired haven
I'd assume it does not work because as you said, it's a different reaction and is likely unaccounted for since it was introduced relatively recently
blazing kettle
the sugg is already exclaimed to hell and back though
blazing kettle
super exclaim? more like pay to win sugg
blazing kettle
i cant do it as i already used my two freeies on poland suber reacts
atomic shell
this sugg is unreasonably funny to me
fervent orbit
which one
atomic shell
the whips one
grim tusk
Mf we actually got a super exclam
glass arch
i cant see the super exclam 
was it removed
wide river
i cant see the super exclam <:PensiveCore:658879827981369385> was it removed
It's on this one
glass arch
oh
what in the fuck is mobile telling me i can remove a super reaction when i dont have any
stable kiln
done you bitch
fuck you
i had to it was the suggestion
keep up the smack talk and i'll super exclam YOUR suggestgions too
swift wharf
nuh uh
stable kiln
yuh uh
glass arch
@ yuh huh
swift wharf
: )
glass arch