1 O'Clock / LOVE

[silver thistle]

Also correct

[shrewd condor]

was that edd model available ingame before?

[gray plinth]

i'm that odd ball that looks up just because i got burned in a game that hid something on the ceiling lol

[silver thistle]

Don’t make us get the hose out

[terse pilot]

so we have the room, the items within (some have been there for 8 years) a torch and the icon

[broken ridge]

<@&285953105202511872> Can someone help me pin this? It is a document I created after starting a new lvl 10 character and entering the catacombs the first time. It is about 1 O'clock puzzle.

[safe vine]

Yeah it was something on the ground you right clicked to pick up then you handed it in for quest rep

[wild forge]

has anyone tried fishing from the room with the intrigue debuff ?

[safe hound]

Edds been looked into a lot i dont think its that, if were lookijg for something mentioned and not followed

[main frost]

just cause we can't force your to take hydration breaks like we did on your streams doesn't mean you should hydrate 😛

[stiff nexus]

Im gonna Go Grab a Coffee and try to think simple about this room. Im Like 80% Sure we will figure it Out in the next 1-6 hours

[queen summit]

Click the EDD and start typing stuff

[main frost]

shouldn't*

[strange narwhal]

I played point and click adventures in the 80/90's I look EVERYWHERE lol

[meager lion]

I feel like literally any idea from pulling words out of the other books, messing with the sealed clue in any capacity, the interactable objects. It's all thrown out the window now with Josh's latest hint. This is the first time I'm seeing a discussion of missing water, elements in general

[heavy merlin]

looks like a cyclops head to me (green triangle is the eye), the entrance is the mouth

[ember umbra]

what if handcrafted is a clue towards doing something with our actual hands, like sign language or braille? or something like shorthand that is used by journalists?

[terse pilot]

all Joshs clues do shout out to me like you zoom out to see the entire room, Tunnel vission etc.

[proven condor]

ok what scene can items in the room represent? any major fountains?

[meager lion]

Which isn't a GREAT thing, because Josh also said someone brought it up before. But who knows I may have missed a water discussion at some other point. Checking search history now

[glossy yoke]

Gonna recap, let me know if I miss anything:

• Everything we need is in the room
• Right in front of us
• No wow or lore knowledge needed
• 6,1,2 x x x x x x, x, x x
• Rearrange some text
• Something else (x)
• Everything tried and fiddled with can be considered as "start fresh"
• Missing element "water" is the big thinking Josh is looking for

[silver warren]

Thats tunnel vision xD

[cerulean mason]

ok it's crazy theories time this book kinda looks like a 1 and then the triangle above the entrance

[strange narwhal]

is tunnel vision a telescope?

[safe hound]

Yeah theres a sl one, someone explored the related guy, and brought the hiddent toy down thats to do with the other edd questlibs. Weve mapped out the chars on the edd paper and tried to match to note on floor- maybe we need to get it to work but i dont tbibk it fits the definition of being mentioned and not explored because a few people have tried to explore it last couple days. Idk though worth another look - im not at pc so cant share the notes on it but theres some stuff in korthia and the symbols are mapped if you search for it here

[broken ridge]

#1308885127819952158 message
You can check out my document if you want a fresh view. 🙂

[tardy iris]

It's that you focus in on one thing too much ignoring the rest.

[wild forge]

looks like 70 to me lol

[stiff nexus]

Has anyone tried flipping their Screen upside down to See If Something Looks sus? 😅

[lavish cosmos]

What is this?

[proven condor]

a sealed clue

[merry meteor]

Bro's drooling. Gross.

[safe vine]

Yeah bro i thought i was clever thinkign i have to remove the letters SEAL to unSEAL it but NO

[cyan blaze]

Josh, would you say this is the right direction to solve the french version?
This seems very close to work but that might be confirmation bias
#1308885127819952158 message

[safe hound]

I was SOLD on this too it was clever lol

[bold kestrel]

Start fresh could mean reset the instance and walk in with only our normal view as if we enter for the first time get into that mindset

[safe hound]

Looking right at ys

[merry meteor]

Did we ever explore the triangle, though. Does it have a meaning? Does it have a purpose? Is it there in the previous version of the catacombs?

[whole sandal]

Mankrik would definitely be "Ol Hardjaw" to me
That looks a bit like: old warrior.

[rustic yew]

https://tenor.com/view/edge-world-heavyweight-champion-entrance-raw-wwe-gif-17118055

so much dry ice i think edge is going to spawn

[strange narwhal]

glass breaks

[gleaming pumice]

I keep finding myself in my "cooking" outfit, is this Ratts' doing?

[safe hound]

What about nitrogen? About 3 people have mentioned nitrogen with that fountain and got no respobses - N, because of the looking like liquid nitrogen fog

[safe vine]

Dude that's just ratts liquid nitrogen cooled 4090 9800X3D

[lost tundra]

damn thought I found something but that was just a glimpse of stuff behind the door 🤪

[lavish cosmos]

We should active the "Enigmatic Bla Bla Device" to solve i guess.

[safe hound]

Trying to think of the stuff thats been mentioned that we didnt tunnel down

[wet basin]

These puzzles have made me realize I'm real good at justifying my own theories if I put enough time into it.

[quiet adder]

yeah lol i thought i was making progress with the anagram and almost getting the clue but i guess not

[shrewd condor]

start fresh only makes potions relevant imo

[safe hound]

Yeah this would be good but cant think of how

[gleaming pumice]

I mean fire is an element and all over the room

[heavy merlin]

suits well, but not helpfull

[echo maple]

Hold on now! You can fish while inside the room to the water outside. Cant try it with the torch because i'm at work

[coral sail]

cant fish with torch it interrupts

[queen summit]

If I entered that room for the first time I would be certain the potions have something to do with it all

[tardy iris]

... Just a thought.
The waterproof note by Ratts has the exact same bubble model.
And we could read it/get it while underwater..

[safe hound]

Maybe what were supposed to look at the letters in the lhc and somehow understand them as a sentence but in English

[main frost]

I'm doing that right now, you can't cast into the fountain and if you fish from the outside water you get trash or rosy sprats (red herrings)

[safe vine]

Now this. This is beginning to look like a chat room full of people who have never heard of mankrik

[cerulean mason]

i tried that but it just tells me your fish got away i would assume if it was relevant you could do it with lvl 1 fishing

[gleaming pumice]

new phone who dis

[wispy hawk]

Fun fact: that sun gear thing is not solid, you can clip into it

[ionic zinc]

when you fish from the room do you always get fish got away

[heavy merlin]

it's an illusion! what are you hiding?

[lost tundra]

perhaps but can't really search for pictures

[lavish cosmos]

Can i try reverse engineering like software etc?

[heavy merlin]

by the way, using /duck doesn't help

[rapid pier]

I am so far

[terse pilot]

i was thinking about this the last 5 minutes with the tunnel vission mentality

[silver warren]

tried to fish with the torch, now the torch is gone 😦

[main frost]

no, getting mostly trash but also 2 Rosy Sprats (Red Herrings)

[coral sail]

thought this only happend to me because my char has 1 Fishing

[heavy merlin]

I had multiple times when the torch stopped interacting with the orb

[tardy iris]

It's not the Hyper-Compressed Ocean I hope?

[queen summit]

The duck is outside the room. It us thus missing from the picture. The word we are missing is duck.

[past jay]

because of all the rune/color hints i went back to focussing on the bejeweld game.
when playing you turn into mardivas. his lab is in nazjatar which ligns up with the naga portal. mardivas lab contains a red a blue and a yellow crystal. mardivas journal mentions "start with red, rule of threes, next blue" (paraphrasing here)

so im thinking it could be that we have to clear 3x red, then 3x blue, then 3x yellow
(ideally without the runes dropping accidentally clearing anything else in the process)
or maybe clear red - blue - red - blue - red - blue

it is not easy because of RNG, ive been resetting the game A LOT already, and so far been unable to clear gems in this order without either accidentally triggering another row to clear while falling, or simply not having the option of clearing another red or blue when i need to

i highly doubt this is going to be the solution but i have nothing else to try so will keep at it....

[gleaming pumice]

People talked about water yesterday, the note and flooding the room

[ionic zinc]

Also interesting the fire debuff damage does not stop you from fishing

[tardy iris]

This is for 1o'clock m8

[cerulean mason]

wrong chat

[ember umbra]

wrong channel

[main frost]

the torch connected to the orb does though

[past jay]

oh damn my bad

[tardy iris]

Good going tho

goodluck ol' chap

[terse pilot]

talihoe, what what

[meager lion]

I feel this. I was trying to anagram out "Untitled Journal" and saw RATT LIES and thought THIS IS IT. THIS IS THE GIMMICK. But it led nowhere else

[ionic zinc]

well normally any kind of damage stops you from fishing I believe.

[lost tundra]

There's also this which looks like AU in runes but can't identify the third one

[wet charm]

@broken ridge Can you update the document to note that the outside of the orb is rotating left and the inside is rotating right? Same with the strange arcane crystal/device.

[wet basin]

Thats why i jumped the 9o'clock ship to here, I was getting way too red string and cork board

[main frost]

I was calling this out last night, was thinking it was a clue that maybe the missing word(s) and the text of the LHC, one lays over the other backwards

[meager lion]

The "inside ball" looks like its rotating both right and down if it matters idk

[merry meteor]

The triangle is there in the uninstanced version... Could still be something.

[lost tundra]

jinxed

[tardy iris]

Think that's Uldum again

[fierce fox]

If the missing clue is not that freaking orb thing. Then why the heck is our clue finder pointing right at it!?
It has to be the clue, and I will never consider otherwise.
Fireorb
Lightorb
fireball
Lightball
What else would you name it?

[lost tundra]

that's believe from the Uldum version of the lights out puzzle

[safe hound]

I think its the same as the orbs of power in panda bg butn ot sure - but i have no idea what to call it i can barely conceptualise it when i look at it lmao

[limber tangle]

• Mystery and arcane (ogre orb)

[heavy merlin]

ogre orb is the artifact of power from Ashran

[shell herald]

Since it was pointed out that there's actually two 10 sided orbs there, is it just another reference to the number 20 for the anniversary event?

[lost tundra]

Right? one'd think an ogre statue would fit in there but no

[rustic yew]

are we using phonetics then Diphthong langauge? so ei becomes a

[terse pilot]

everything is rotating which kinda brings me back to think about rotating the text notes on the clue. altho i think some people said it woudnt work for every language ?

[safe hound]

Can we do some weird rotations only on 20 chars? Some guy was mentioning trying last night iirc but not followed i think

[heavy merlin]

noo, don't think about the notes and ciphers again, I am beggin you

[safe hound]

Yeah i think stuff like this thats been said and didnt gain traction should be looked at

[terse pilot]

someone saying it was within the 24hours Josh said we got something right

[safe hound]

It feels like we all just go back to our thing lol itll be back to spamagram with more letters in a min and ill be making unhinged and pointless stuff whilst wondering if maybe the lhc is a clue

[quiet adder]

im trying fire

[tardy iris]

I only got my 10 sided theory, not so confident about it

[fair condor]

Some of the languages have ciphertext of prime length, meaning you can't place the text in a rectangular grid (without padding it at least, or a degenerate useless x by 1 grid)

[ruby tartan]

did 10 laps around the fountain the middle.. nothing

[safe hound]

Whats your theory?

[main frost]

one thing I'm wondering as well, whenever we find 'X', will it just allow us to unscramble the LHC text ourselves?

or

Will 'X' provide some sort of aura that when we click on the LHC the text will already be rearranged?

[limber tangle]

mb color ?
blue, yellow, green and white...

[safe hound]

Yeah - and hes said similar a couple days now too that were ignoring something/someone, were looking at it, its not what we keep trying etc… what can we jump on

[wispy hawk]

Thought: the floating platform below the orb goes low-high-low-mid-low-...., could this be of any use

[fair condor]

He also said every part of the solution has been mentioned . Just nobody combined all the right things

[tardy iris]

When I saw the mention that the puzzle isn't supported by wow lore or knowledge. My mind went to deducing the objects in the room cuz of the 'staring right at it' comment.

I just found that the sun gear got 10 sides, the sphere is a decohedron (10 sided) and the purple box is 10 sided.

[safe hound]

Could be some backwards/forwards vignere like rotations thats been mentioned and not fullly tried?

[fair condor]

The problem is this doesn't really help, since no one knows every of the 14000 messages said in that period

[safe hound]

We have 30 chars without spaces commas, maybe relevant

[wispy hawk]

I personally consider such things "bad puzzle design"

[safe vine]

wtf how do you notice that

[tawdry hull]

and there are 10 skulls aside the pile with the spear

[safe hound]

Yeah theres things ive actively ignored because of that lmao im just solving the puzzle i want it to be 🤣

[lavish cosmos]

Overall difficult : 11/10

[lost tundra]

0102010201020102

But which one is the starting position

[stiff nexus]

1st of 12 Puzzles btw 😄

[tardy iris]

But deducing it further results in the decohedron having 20 sides, inside and outside models. the sun cog has the 10 points but also the actual cog in it's middle.

[safe vine]

How do we explore the fel mask on the wall...

[spark stag]

For what it worth, in RU version you can deduce "ИЩИТЕ ОЛЬГРУ" meaning "SEEK OLGRA" straight up from the ciphertext without doing any mental gymnastics

[tawdry hull]

could binary be part of the solution ?

[fair condor]

It's a decahedron, 10 faced 3d object

They typed decohedron, but meant decahedron

[tardy iris]

It is, but it's a decahedron within a decahedron

[fair condor]

I'm replying to ella23

[tardy iris]

I am tired and spelling mistakes is getting more common

[lost tundra]

@viral furnace a new meme just dropped

[safe vine]

art

[lost tundra]

(don't ping staff randomly, he just collecting stuff)

[safe hound]

Gon try playing with text rotations of sorts but not at pc til tomorrow, not sure else how to apply it but its interesting

[viral furnace]

[coral sail]

problem is that the orb is pondering back

[merry meteor]

It's pondering back and forth.

[tulip depot]

can someone open the door to the cat room so we can at least take a break to pet them all?

[lost tundra]

Everyone fancy about the sage, no one asks about the gal in the background

[fierce fox]

That is terrifyingly close to how I was sitting, hood and all. Wish I had a beard like that though

[fair condor]

At least we have comfort in knowing 9 o clock are totally stuck too from the look of things

[wild forge]

https://tenor.com/view/home-alone-wave-macaulay-culkin-bye-sanity-gif-13055717

[ashen oak]

tried transmogging some sunglasses. and reading the note and clicking the device. Didn work

[terse pilot]

Sanity was a while ago, we are onto acceptance now

[wild forge]

lmao

[clever ridge]

but for some reason i have the feeling, we make at both orbs the same mistake xD

[tardy iris]

I'd really just like to extinguish all these torches and orbs to get some actual darkness

[vivid wave]

i'd almost wish they weren't. it would be refreshing to exit this dungeon and go into a new puzzle 😆

[rapid pier]

Of all the objects in the room you can jump on, it's the only one where there's an invisible box around it, as in you don't go up and down with it.. so that's either just a wow engine thing or it's not what it appears to be?

[merry meteor]

That's my fiance, peaking into my room and going 'You are still looking at the same room?'

[vivid wave]

pretty sure this is just "the model includes the animation instead of the model itself being animated"

[fair condor]

Could be. There's a reason it was suggested we try to solve this the correct way even though we were past the puzzle already. Maybe we need the "same way of thinking" for 9 o clock too

[lost tundra]

In a similar manner to the platform, the countdown timer also has numbers bouncing around. But I guess that's random

[rapid pier]

Yea, most likely

[tardy iris]

It's not some Rebus is it?

[safe hound]

Guys, if you look at the letters on the lhc, “sgho eiuii abd moo nk ghn, dl, llse”, but move each letter forwards by the length of the body text, you get “sgho eiuii abd moo nk ghn, dl, llse”

[tardy iris]

Orb Torch Cog

[meager lion]

could be big

[polar yacht]

Good job, I have a feeling this arrangement is solvable.

[rustic yew]

SGHO aoiI ABD Mu NK GHN, EDNY, DL LLSE elements

EH SEEK OLGRA IN HELL GENTS MIND, BODY AND SOUL

[tulip depot]

it works the same in reverse too if you shift left

[cloud terrace]

Is the new Chinese solution scrambled, string reversed, or each word reversed?

The pinyin one.

[safe hound]

It feels like a big lead. Im trhing to read it upside down but its hard because of the blood rushing to my head

[lost tundra]

Wait the numbers did something to add up to 22?

[merry meteor]

Josh said it was wrong

[vivid wave]

similarly, i noticed that if i took a screenshot of the journal, then rotated it 90 degrees 4 times, the image looks like the original. i think we're on to something

[meager lion]

Try upside down in water

[lost tundra]

That's another part of the catacombs

[merry meteor]

Try THEN rotating it 180 degrees twice, but left this time.

[cloud terrace]

He said it's wrong in the same way. X was skipped. But the "rearrange" was not. And I want to know how they rearranged so I can do the same to these letters.

[ashen oak]

I tried mirroring the text upside down and side to side

[tulip depot]

I flooded the room, but it didn't work either

[hot bear]

so we are missing water and shadow

[meager lion]

Maybe this is a Harry Potter reference clue. Read the clue out loud under water

[main rune]

those notes on the ground are not always present, I think everyone gets a randomized set of notes + potions

[safe hound]

Flooding the room feels more satisfying than the solution might, maybe we could get ratts in there somehow first?

[subtle ledge]

30/47

[buoyant beacon]

"here" is also 4 letters

[terse pilot]

per instance reset

[stiff nexus]

progress!

guy wait

[lost tundra]

That just means we need to use only these 30 we've got at the start, right?

[stiff nexus]

we had a comment a few days ago with 27/47 i believe?

[rustic yew]

SGHO aoiI ABD Mu NK GHN, EDNY, DL LLSE is phonetically filtered then the double vowels are then sounded out to make the new letters then i added elements at the end that might be wrong

[safe hound]

Hmm it must have 47 letters, it used to have 71. where are the other 24 - maybe we need to find 24 letters in ratts joirnal and make them into a poem about olgra

[wild forge]

the actual crazy part is this is tech the day 1 puzzle that everyone should have done before moving on and we are still here on it lmao

[safe hound]

27/71 lmao

[loud solstice]

i didnt realise, but the orb is a double orb

like, theres a smaller one inside of it

[stiff nexus]

😅

[fierce fox]

Yes but no: FIREORB btw

[terse sail]

Let's find the bold elf!

Johnny awesome?!

[wispy hawk]

"KILLED ORC FEELS UNDYING LOVE LIGHT CHANGES MIND, BODY, AND SOUL HEALED" 26/71
"EH SEEK OLGRA IN HELL GENTS MIND, BODY AND SOUL" 30/47

[terse sail]

The note writer is Australian, confirmed

[main rune]

That's not a confirmation that it's correct, only that 30 characters out of the 47 total characters are correct

Empty spaces can also be counted as "characters"

[safe hound]

The weird thing is and i havent verified 100%(but checked a lot), also sorry for bringing it back to an old theory ive already glanced over cus we know its something unexplored, but theres a note in broker text next to the sealed clue thats not randomised. Its probs just flavour but it sussed me

[merry meteor]

For 47 to be the letter count, it includes spaces and commas

[main rune]

The 27/71 from yesterday also counted spaces and commas, yes

[safe hound]

Yeah i was joking lol

[zenith thorn]

also doesnt mean characters are in correct order

[safe hound]

People went mad on 71

[clever ridge]

its 4 characters more so maybe its SEEK

[main rune]

That is reasonable to assume (1 K has to be used somewhere), but once again we're solving the anagram instead of finding how it's solved 😄

[safe vine]

ya'll better get back to running in circles on fire real quick if we go back to anagrams ima scream

[safe hound]

Yeah we know now theres an approach to find we can spamagram again

[cloud terrace]

I can make "SEEK HER LOVING LIGHT IN MIND, BODY, AND SOUL" but I need an extra VRT and either the IN or some other word to go there to do it and can't figure out where to get them or why.

[thorn summit]

The sentence has been found? And did it give a clue. I was with my mum level 80 plus plus plus her birthday today

[meager lion]

Was playing around with your idea, where'd the R come from for Olgra? Just making sure I'm understanding

[safe hound]

https://tenor.com/view/monday-feels-carousel-tired-lazy-gif-15400779

[heavy merlin]

is it just me or /train doesn't work in the room?

[hot bear]

How does this work out without the phonetics and just he LHC letters?

[rapid pier]

works for me, just no animation with torch out

[heavy merlin]

thanks, I am just too paranoid at this point

[silk cape]

is there a brave soul who wants to scroll up and document suggestions made yesterday that were mentioned but not explored lol

[rustic yew]

i think that was where i went wrong with the anagram part and bias to the already solved

https://boulter.com/anagram/?letters=SGHO+aoiI+ABD+Mu+NK+GHN%2C+EDNY%2C+DL+LLSE+elements&words=MIND+BODY+AND+SOUL+SEEK+IN+HELL

[tardy iris]

I was going to do that this morning

[silk cape]

all i can think of is kissing demons. And some comments about toys either from Love is in the Air or a mirror from broken isles

[rapid pier]

And Josh has confirmed this is the syntax of the answer. Nothing extra.

[tardy iris]

But holy fbleep that's alot

[safe hound]

The ones i know are just, orb, fountain, something rotational, matrix stuff with the text, vignere shifts but each letter up or down, the button (inputting something to get a result?), 430, the letters ascii all summing to 430 with a word addrd

[lost tundra]

Oh, so maybe casting out characters, but instead of trying to find something in them, replacing them? But spaces and commas mattering… hmm

[frigid tiger]

The torture... 💀 If first orb isn't solved by Monday....mercy.

[safe hound]

If people could like… check things out before suggesting tjat would be great lol leave nothing unfollowed

You cant get shot down if you do it once first

[loud solstice]

i somehow feel we need to just shove the orb in the sun thing kekw

[wet forge]

A few people have said they have ideas but they aren't good at anagrams, or english isn't their first language, or other reasons why they personally cannot test it.

[safe hound]

Yeah fair, if theres a solid thing to try ill give a go

If its “maybe the lhc is an anagram but only with ratts journal” its always said in the middle of spamagrams anyways lol and i feeewl like weve explored it… a lot

[fair condor]

I mean, he's saying the letters are correct. Not the words (i.e. letter order). Not really that useful information unfortunately

[meager lion]

I brought this up last night in a late night mental breakdown...but I don't know that it was every brought up beforehand, so it doesn't factor into Josh's first note that it was mentioned but not thought out, because he said that yesterday well before I posted this 😄 But, bringing it back up in case it sparks any brains out there

[rustic yew]

the letters are different from what everyone else has been using which is a start

[lost tundra]

SGHO▒EIUII▒ABD▒MOO▒NK▒GHN,▒EDNY,▒DL▒LLSE with blocks instead of spaces so they aren't accidentally skipped

[safe glacier]

Dumb question, does the objective when you walk in say "find ratts", did we ever find ratts in there? Could that be the piece we are missing?

[fierce fox]

FIREBALL btw

[rapid pier]

What hasn't been explored at all? We've fiddled with the button and fire statue I guess? Is it just the EDD and Orb of Power we've done nothing with?

[stiff nexus]

Sry for asking, whats EDD again? 😅

[main rune]

I wish I knew if solving the anagram involves math (or a little bit of math); I've been doing so many calculations in hopes of finding a pattern 😄

[versed obsidian]

What about DOOR

That rooms missing a door

[hot bear]

the device with a cog but nothing happens when you press it

[stiff nexus]

ah, thanks^^

[frigid tiger]

If you feel up to it. The wall has the orb, the sconce, the light thingy. Try using "Burning Fire Light" probably way wrong and a waste of time.

[cloud terrace]

How far did we get into trying Purity on that sealed clue?

[fair condor]

Still doesn't really help since we don't know the amount of letters in the correct text. It's like the game mastermind, but you don't even know how many things you need, and instead of a handful of colors, we have 26 letters possible for every position

[vivid wave]

well i tried

[fierce fox]

Gonna go for Lightorb next

[stiff nexus]

Bro i have that weird phobia. delete that sh**

[loud solstice]

i wonder if the way the orb is rotating has anything to do

like, the outside one is going left

[marble crypt]

josh was the first to refer to the Lovingly handcrafted clue as LHC. the enigmatic decryption device (enigma machine) requires 3 positions. L H C. now we need to figure out the rest

[rustic yew]

lʌvɪŋli Handcrafted klu

I've been googling how to say the letters where it looks weird

[ashen oak]

maybe we should talk ingame to it with ingame voice

[loud solstice]

while the inner one is like, somehow bottm to right

[wispy hawk]

I seriously hope the rearrangement has a math reason instead of picking a sentence in myriads of possibilities

[fierce fox]

Well, cant make 3 words from ABGHHLLLMOT

[heavy merlin]

just another random fact, which hasn't been mentioned at all (so you can ignore it) - if you open the /console enable
when you log in, you can see "Gamespeed set from 0.017 to 0.017"
whatever that could mean

[main rune]

There's definitely some logic to the puzzle, I wish I knew if it involves math 😄

[hot bear]

lol sorry I meant instead of using phonetics, using the LHC letters + elements to see what that gives

[rustic yew]

oh sorry haha

[safe hound]

I used to hope this but now i just think its going to be so funny if its just “guess one of the other words in the room and spamagram”

[fair condor]

That's the problem with creating an anagram puzzle. The person making the anagram knows the solution so they can obviously find the right words

[wispy hawk]

That's why long anagrams are usually frowned upon in puzzlehunt communities

[frigid tiger]

Whatever it is. Im convinced its a reach. In that, until we know the answer, making the connection is like connecting a dot in china with a dot in mexico.

[safe hound]

Maybe the books are a reference to the Oxford English dictionary, and were supposed to find the right words in there

[vivid wave]

i mean haven't we also been told from the beginning that this isn't just an anagram puzzle? we just made it that because we know what the answer looks like

[safe hound]

Because theyre not a puzzle theyre brute force guessing lol

[versed obsidian]

Also in other languages is the LHC still handcrafted vs like handwritten? Handcrafted feels so out of place for a note

[quiet adder]

well i tried light again and got this but still 3 words left:
He'll go seek light in body, mind, and soul

[lavish cosmos]

Should we go to a spesific location after we solve letter or can we completely solve that in the room i really dont get it.

[fair condor]

The French name translates to "clue crafted with care", doesn't even mention love

[fierce fox]

The biggest issue I had with it, is that there was so much stuff in that dungeon, and we had no idea that the solutions would be limited to what was in the room. - Like I was originally trying to fit stuff like "Rubenstein" and his missing "Dagger" into the puzzle.

Straight up hard gating the first puzzle would have been better I think.

[cloud terrace]

I know it's evil, but what if the letters are just missing and we're not supposed to add them back. Maybe there's some method that gets us close to the right words and we're supposed to just deal with the fact that some stuff got left out.

[wispy hawk]

In zhCN it translates to "Delicately/Heartfully Designed Clue"

[safe hound]

Hmm actually, ive found some words in the dictionary and i can make “undying orc love lights up body mind soul sghoeiuiiabdmoonkghndlllse” with them?

[tame prawn]

try adding light love and play

[gleaming pumice]

just looked at my work from last night adding darkness in, but it has GHHSS left.

[lost sierra]

sorry .. i only was surprised that this is a real shit

[hidden spire]

anyone tried to do anything with this in the catacombs? i don't have the toy to try

[cloud terrace]

Maybe the X was "remove 5 random letters and put them in this specific ordering"

[lost tundra]

I've just noticed the damage I took from the flame keeps the same pace as the natural health recovery (as long as it's just one portion ofc)

[stiff nexus]

its fine bro 😄

[haughty horizon]

yes nothing happened

[main rune]

If we still attempt to solve the anagram, shouldn't we start with "undying orc" ?

[terse sail]

It's just an example I believe, based on the Chinese version

[bold kestrel]

I think it could just be the crystal the top layer is rotating clockwise and the bottom counter/anti clockwise

[fierce fox]

I read that as "Undying orc" is a not in the english version

[quiet adder]

exactly

[main rune]

Fair enough

[haughty horizon]

i just call my mom she needs to come over solving a puzzle for me, Josh said someone without wow knowledge can do that, so we're all blind due to too much WoW 😄

[tardy iris]

Undying orc just sounds like Nazgrim to me.

I miss Naz

[wet charm]

The first word kidna looks like Ghost?

[bold kestrel]

Or soul

[safe hound]

Yeah theres a few places kt looks like word fragments, we have ghost in mo arg and tough could be if theres a thing of matching chunks or the lhc to books

[gleaming pumice]

Yeah without going deep, I see Ghost, deny, else, and maybe moonkin

[safe hound]

Or working out by moving several chunks of it

[loud solstice]

ye and the orb seems to be rotating the same way

[zenith thorn]

how is the barrens memorial called again ?

[safe hound]

maybe the thing were supposed to find is if we start with the chinese cheat answer, we could try to just write out that answer, and then force any missing letters into the lhc and then coming up witn 50 versions of that sentence?

[fierce fox]

Honestly if the Orb is a red herring. We would need to be taught, that "In here, the Torch lies" with a much easier puzzle.

[stiff nexus]

I get you, but we have to think from a perspective where we DONT know the Answer.

[bold kestrel]

We are trying to think differently using context clues instead of given information

[safe hound]

Sarcasm lol

[stiff nexus]

😄

[lost tundra]

maybe the 1020 string from the platform, but hmmm,

[safe hound]

But maybe the 51st sentence will be the right one

[loud solstice]

I mean, josh said not that all the things extensivly explored arent it and i think ciphers anagrams and shit has been very explored

[safe hound]

1020?

[safe hound]

Yup

[lost tundra]

The platform has 3 states, 1020 is the ternary description of the movement

[safe hound]

Oh i see! Nice

[agile edge]

Did ppl just completely skip the part that a guy just had 30/47 correct?

[safe hound]

Lol

We had that many correct just by using the chinese translation

[fierce fox]

the "Fountain" of Truth? ? ?
The descend into madness only works because you keep thinking you are almost right.

[frigid tiger]

It wasn't helpful. At all

[vivid wave]

i don't think its relevant tbh. we don't know how many characters the solution will have. we don't know if the order is correct. we already know we haven't done the thing needed to make the anagram more obvious. it's still just shooting in the dark

[astral bane]

A bit to this point: we figured out the vendor early on for the Pieces of Hate and the Muffin idol, and knowing the reward (Muffin) before we knew what would yield the muffin set everyone off on a wild goose chase hunting for a Muffin idol out in the world

Turned out what we needed to do was the Uthers Tomb bit and then get the muffin as a reward for pet battle.

The fact that we knew the outcome (A muffin) distracted players from the ways to get to that muffin

[hot bear]

Yes it seems everyone then went on tangets rather than doubling down on this and what else we were missing

[safe hound]

Thats not a lead. We know the translation is almost identical. How is that a lead lol

[fair condor]

It's just not that useful information. 1) You don't know which of the 2/3 of the letters are right. 2) Says nothing about the letter order being right. It's practically useless as a hint

[loud solstice]

but even if you would find the right sentence, that still might not give us the missing piece?

[safe hound]

Yup that, were not looking my for the sentence this isnt a game of guess the sentence

[ashen tapir]

maybe add some of the words of "Undying Orc Love Lights Up Body, Mind, and Soul" to complete?

[glossy yoke]

P isn't available.

[quiet adder]

why?

[loud solstice]

anyone recorgnise the symbols on this btw?

[fair condor]

If we could use Josh as an oracle and feed him a bunch of sentences we could use it to solve the puzzle, but he comments on the right letter counts of random sentences once every 24 hours lmao

[rustic yew]

is looking at it phonetically correct?

[rotund shard]

This is what I did with lhc+gibberish inside lhc+sealed clue. It contains literally every word, with no left overs, from the Chinese solution. Which I know we hate talking about working backwards but to me is just too large a coincidence

[lost tundra]

that's just Mogu architecture aesthetic

[safe hound]

Looks like patterns

[frigid tiger]

We still need the missing piece and we will need to figure out how to USE the missing piece. Even when we find it, and it appears we have, we have no idea how to apply that to the puzzle. Thats where we are stuck. Even with the clue, we still have no clue how to apply it. Everyone just gets gibberish.

[unique nest]

good morning gamers hows it going

[meager lion]

I drew circles like that on my paper in class back in the day, which is why I can't solve this puzzle presently

[safe hound]

Yeah we know this for over s week, but were finding the route n it guessing the sentence

[zenith thorn]

Josh -> its ingame mapping of orcish to alliance
It took forever to find you And now you are gone

[safe hound]

We picked out the lhc title hasa bynch of the missing stuff like 10 days ago lol

[broken ridge]

Is this idea properly explored? So in the EDD we have the text, I imagine the first part is the input and the second part is the output. The only difference is we are missing 10 letters at the start. So my current idea is that we need to add back the 10 characters at the start (X can be anything) and then we will reassamble the letters. Provided a picture for the idea. This way the 10 has a correct meaning and we have more letters to work with.

[rapid pier]

There seems to be something about the empowered glow when you use your torch on the orb.

When you have the toch up, the glow pulses, on for about 2 seconds, off for a second, on for 2 seconds, constant repeat while torch in on.
If you turn the torch off while the orb is empowered, the glow lasts longer then if you leave the torch on. (extra second or two)
If you turn the torch off while the orb isn't empowered, it remains unempowered, as I guess it should..

Not sure what this means if anything, but it's a pretty subtle change in behaviour

[safe hound]

I think maybe sharing anything you can think thats not just another version of the chinese sentence is key, and maybes people trying new things for at least a half day?

[loud solstice]

and like, the orb/sphere has holes : so missing circles
the sun has a giant holy in the middle : so maybe missing a circle too?

[safe hound]

No wrong answers blue sky meeting (if its not a gd version of that sentence with no logic)

[lost tundra]

Wouldn't it mean different locales need a different machine asset?

[loud solstice]

and the sun has 10 arms and the orb has 10 holes?

[glossy yoke]

Input this where? To get what result?

[frigid tiger]

I ignore all ideas that include the chinese translation. Because that is working backwards and we have been told doing that will not lead to an answer.

[safe hound]

Love this! I can dind you a thing one sec

[loud solstice]

even more, the sun lik thing, has an inner circle too

[safe hound]

Its not been filly explored imo but i cant work it- the bottom is from the floor next to sealed clue

[lost tundra]

is this upside down loss

[main rune]

From the pins: "Here is the translated and original text in chinese" Orcish love that lasts forever lights up body, mind and soul

However, there's the earlier translation with: Undying orc love lights up body, mind, and soul

Which one is more accurate? If someone could clarify this for me please

[rapid pier]

Anyone else able to repeat this or observe anything else about the glow behaviour? Or assume this is just a distraction? Just trying to look into stuff which we've been staring at and our brain has been ignoring

[glossy yoke]

2nd one meets the 6,1,2 pattern but no P available. ... Second is most accurate.

[lone python]

I tried approaching this while ignoring the chinese solution and instead tried finding a different breakdown. I'm not sure if this is accurate, but maybe it will spark someone else's ideas to lead us closer to the solution.

I added the title "Lovingly Handcrafted Note" to the letters "SGHO EIUII ABD MOO NK GHN, EDNY, DL LLSE". Ignoring the left over letters (naughty, I know) of DDEEHKN I was able to make Missing Orc Found Loyal Healing Love, Light, and Beyond.

It's not as tidy as I know the solution will be, but again I'm hoping someone might see something I don't. Off to my next new attempt.

[feral lintel]

It's nothing. Also happens with naga portal and anything else it reacts to

[limber tangle]

idk, I get it for russian:
ШЕЕВЕГА РОЛЬ ВУДУ, ЗМЕИ ТЕЛИЩЕ ->
ольгру ищи ее душа в теле змеев (look for Olgra her soul in body of snakes)

[devout valve]

Orcish love that lasts forever lights up body, mind and soul is mine i think passed via google transate from Chinese version from wiki if i remember correctly

[frigid tiger]

Any idea that involves a translation needs to be abandoned. That is working backwards which will never lead us to the answer. Keep trying.

[glossy yoke]

My only comment from my attempts of a very similar nature is that the English doesn't read great, could read better, if you get what I mean?

[lone python]

I agree, I'm having a hard time finding something that doesn't feel clunky.

[cloud terrace]

If I add RATTS' I can make: SEEK THE LIGHT IN OLGRA'S BODY MIND AND SOUL

I have no logic for how to solve the anagram but that gets the letters in there.

[devout valve]

I have some code to check if letters are correct

[cloud terrace]

Please do, I was about to ask someone to check my work.

[glossy yoke]

Is anything left over?

[cloud terrace]

Nope

[gleaming pumice]

and that's simple enough to just add ratts

[glossy yoke]

We do visit her body, her soul is buried, do we visit her mind?

[gleaming pumice]

does it work in other languages?

[lone python]

Gonna double check your work but I like this a lot

[cloud terrace]

I speak English and bad English, so I have no idea. 🤞

[gleaming pumice]

her mind would be in maldraxxus right? anger/fury/revenge?

[prime orchid]

her soul

[silver warren]

no idea what he/she is doing tbh

[subtle ledge]

This is close enough to the solution that I will call it correct. Congratulations @rapid pier !

[prime orchid]

[subtle ledge]

Explanation incoming

[glossy yoke]

Nice Trashman!

[stiff nexus]

😮

[eager valley]

WWWOOOOHOOOOO

[vivid wave]

holy smokes

[prime orchid]

LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[main rune]

Congrats!

[ashen oak]

LETS GO DUDE @rapid pier

[gleaming pumice]

WOOOO bow down to trashman

[lost tundra]

👀

[haughty horizon]

GGs

[stiff nexus]

BRO TRASHMAN Congratulations! 😄

[final adder]

I was there, Gandalf

[lone python]

Nicely done!!!

[prime orchid]

Danny DeVito wins again!

[fierce fox]

Well done!

[eager valley]

@cloud terrace GOOD JoB!

[woven finch]

Nice man you ended our suffering!

[lost tundra]

We still need the method, right?

[devout valve]

Damn we were runnign so much around it xD

[quiet adder]

yesss well done @cloud terrace

[glossy yoke]

Give Josh a sec, he said incoming.

[stiff nexus]

Wait. IT WAS THIS EASY ALL ALONG? I feel so stupid rn.

[ruby tartan]

@cloud terrace thats awesome.. my wife pointed out that we were missing R and T to figure out the anagram.

[vivid wave]

still waiting for josh to tell us we did the whole thing wrong but at least it's progress

[final adder]

https://tenor.com/view/trashman-alwayssunny-gif-20476414

[lost tundra]

Also apologies for calling the light red herring

[ashen oak]

https://tenor.com/view/dumb-post-ron-swanson-mad-gif-14599019

[prime orchid]

https://tenor.com/view/frank-wrestling-always-sunny-trashman-gif-5505237

[fierce fox]

Man post mortum on this one will be wild.

[lone python]

It makes so much sense that Ratts would use her own name as a key

[gleaming pumice]

well ratts was missing, so we put ratts in

[main rune]

imagine using math, toys, pets for hours (definitely not me) ... but it was this simple!

[silver warren]

So, how did you get that phrase?

[meager lion]

Ayy, congratulations!!

[haughty horizon]

<@&285953105202511872> pin maybe?

[crisp ridge]

Would you say this is an AHA moment ?!

[vivid wave]

OH HOLY SHIT THE OBJECTIVE IN FRONT OF US HAS BEEN FIND RATTS THE WHOLE TIME

[lone python]

More like a d'oh moment facepalm

[zenith thorn]

bro ... i ran the expensive GPUS!

[grizzled pivot]

*RATTS IS MISSING 8)

[subtle ledge]

[teal pollen]

i need a drink...

[glossy yoke]

I did the same hah just should have tried RATTS ><

[final adder]

Jenafur's Law: the longer a a puzzle goes unsolved, the more likely the answer was obvious the entire time

[cloud terrace]

It was the ' that made me see it. I needed one for OLGRA'S

[cerulean mason]

so with no prior wow knowledge you're just supposed to invent the word olgra

[cloud terrace]

Which still is annoying because that's workign backwards from the Chinese.

[safe hound]

Yum yum yum delicious i hate it

[strange narwhal]

I hide the objectives to clear my screen 😦

[lost tundra]

Blight's sake

(I am not arguing for anything just to be sure xD)

[south ridge]

With everything left over. Yes.

[broken ridge]

The bottom part I would drop since it has 4 symbol per row. The last character is also a hint imo. It means if there are no more text the first 10 char should contain the last character of the output. Example in picture.

[shrewd condor]

yeah, never gonna participate in these, ill just wait for final result

[silver warren]

and how this is going to get us the sealed clue?

[glossy yoke]

It doesn't.

[rustic yew]

its simple...we kill the rattsman

[prime orchid]

very fulfullingly simple solution lmao

[ashen oak]

To be honest, Josh said it had been mentioned, but not explored

[prime orchid]

now you can all focus on 9oclock

[lone python]

My guess is the sealed clue is probably related to 10 o'clock, since the two mini orbs came from the button press.

[main rune]

@cloud terrace the folks in #felcycle-solved-read-only are waiting for you, go go go!

[astral robin]

As always, please try your ideas and report back!! Good thinking though

[stiff nexus]

now i wont do it! :<

[gleaming pumice]

As the GM of <Dad Jokes> I feel I need to turn in my badge

[lone python]

I had nothing but bad ideas, idk if I should :c

[hot bear]

When we get the explanation, we should be mindful of it, I am sure one of Josh's previous comments was "work as one" at the end of it so we should do the same as clue 1... maybe...

[prime orchid]

me either I'm far too stupid

[safe hound]

You have released us!! Were freew Thank you!! Nicely done

[zenith thorn]

i hate anagrams

[cloud terrace]

Well let's hope all they're missing is an apostrophe.

[median rapids]

brilliant

[wise trellis]

THAT WAS THE MISSING KEY WHAT THE HELL LMAO

[green saddle]

Well done @cloud terrace 🙇‍♂️

[fierce fox]

If the next great secret doesn't involve around a mad person doing ton of crazy tests, that's a missed opportunity.
As once again, the lesson was. Test your ideas.

[torpid sierra]

well done all, now figure out 9! ❤️

[ember umbra]

How were we meant to make that anagram without knowing the chinese translation first though?

[safe hound]

Its OVeR 😄

[clever ridge]

wasn't there a Scenario goal on the right that said "find Ratts"?

[safe hound]

Burn the soreadheets

Im freeeeee

[silver warren]

I still dont understand how @cloud terrace solved this

[prime orchid]

now we wait for the explanation

[south ridge]

He said he'll give an explanation soon

[lone python]

Anagrams are hard, but if you solved all the words down and found out you had "Olgra's" leftover you could make it work

[uneven knot]

so the solution was to add "ratts" to the annagmam of the lovely ?
But wat's was the clues to do this ? When i look to a ppl, i've not the reflex to add his nam to all weird text than I can found...

[cyan lotus]

I don't get the logic aside from "just trying" to adds things : / Are we now adding Ratts to every clue because she is missing?

[lone ruin]

Now go help 9 u wondeful ppl

[lone python]

He's typing, be patient.

[wild forge]

THETRASHMAN coming in to clean up our mess get em !!!

[fierce fox]

Lets go ask in 9-oclock if they have seen the glowy orb when you are inside the Nage Portal room 😄

[main rune]

Josh is typing...

[prime orchid]

[devout valve]

just a confirmation xD

[wanton cipher]

Heard this got solved. What was the answer?

[heavy merlin]

we are all patients now

[teal pollen]

the room had lots of missing things, one od those the ogre with no body, ratts is missing

[zenith thorn]

im waiting to see the explanation then im gonna kill some braincells in 9oclock

[fallow mural]

The journal entry said that some of her puzzles were "incomplete" - addings RATTS' got an anagram that worked apparently 😄

[safe hound]

By cheating with the answer and sticking letters in 😄

[sonic rover]

thats an unsatisfying solution... ._.

but congrats @cloud terrace

[gleaming pumice]

I said this morning I was dreaming about rats in this room 😂 wrong rats

[safe hound]

Puzzzlleeez

[silver warren]

You have everything in the room to solve this...

[lavish cosmos]

It's become boring.. I hope it's not a FBI recruitment exam.

[safe vine]

are you fucking kididng

[safe hound]

🤔🤣🤣

[prime orchid]

It's the first puzzle it was meant to be easy (it was easy and we overcomplicated it)

[subtle ledge]

THE SOLUTION TO 1 O CLOCK

Ratts' Journal says that her puzzles are "incomplete" and "unsolvable".
Looking at her Lovingly Handcrafted Clue, it seems very much like an anagram -- but perhaps she has made it incomplete and therefore unsolvable.
But what is the missing piece you are trying to find?
The answer has been in front of you the whole time: Find Ratts.
She took her own name out of the anagram.
Adding RATTS back to the puzzle, you can solve for the intended phrase:

OLGRA SEEKS THE LIGHT IN MIND, BODY, AND SOUL.

But how were you supposed to solve such a massive anagram?
In a sense, you weren't.That's the point. Ratts made her puzzles too difficult, unsolvably so. The fact that you had to "cheat" to solve this proves her point. But, as secret finders always do, you triumph anyway.

FAQ

• **What did the original Chinese solution skip? **Subtracting Ratts
• Why is Pinyin important? Ratts is phonetic, not semantic
• **Was this aggravating for you? **Yes

Congratulations again everyone who worked on this, and good luck with 9 o clock! Now that you have a better sense of who Ratts is as a character, you can begin to tackle this chapter of her story.

[livid pagoda]

wait but i found her again in the celebration and there wasn't anything...

[safe hound]

Dude its been aawesome waking up to see your work gg

[normal wing]

So i think the gimmick is actually around optimisation - the letters/words are the start of a 9x5 grid that we need to fill in to find the missing letters.

The rules/constraints are based on the 'magic number' of 450 - given by the Door 430 and Button 20. This is useful for the optimization because 450 / 9 rows = 50 and 450 / 5 columns = 90.

So it would be an indicator to the solver they found the answer when each row = 90 and column = 50 and can do something else

The grid starts as listing the letters in LHC in 9x5, converting to numbers and including known 0's for spaces.

I used a knapsack/backpack algorithm to sort these into something solvable and got the missing numbers 15 15 26 7 21 22 and 26 = O O Z G U V Z

HOWEVER - I suspect there's another gimmick, possibly around a rubrik-type movement from the original (the orbs still bother me!) that also gives a solvable answer.

I've done enough cooking for one day - hopefully you guys can get further than me! (seriously i'm going to bed) It might be possible with linear programming to generate a full set of solved matrixes and see if anything in those is useful, or another pattern

[safe hound]

We just needed to guess more

[snow temple]

https://tenor.com/view/men-in-black-table-drag-gif-22197967

[safe hound]

Lmao

[fair condor]

Epic trashman!!

[safe hound]

This fucking thing the owl stat then a fucking guess puzzle

[safe vine]

mate this is the least satisfying solution on the planet

it was actually just a long anagram

[lone python]

I didn't realize Ratts was a Josh self-insert, making puzzles to watch us suffer.

[fallow mural]

we need Will Smith in 9 o'clock orb STAT

[median rapids]

how unbelievable was this LMAO
it was the most obvious thing ever
great job @cloud terrace

[crisp ridge]

Might I make a suggestion? We all just chill here and not join the shitshow that is 9'oclock??

[safe vine]

Josh has been in this discord for days telling us to think outside the box and look with new eyes when the answer had no rhyme or reason

[silver warren]

So we have to cheat to get a real answer

[shrewd condor]

F Ratts tbh

[terse sail]

We must have tried almost every possible word, but forgot to use the word that was right on the screen 😂😂

[teal pollen]

I'm scared of 9 o'clock lol

[final adder]

Well I certainly hope Josh doesn't quit his job out of frustration like Ratts lol

[tulip depot]

so the trashman still got it the wrong way because he thought the apostrophe was important 😭

[fair condor]

Damn... Lol so troll

[trim hemlock]

Oh yay, good job!

[rotund shard]

Also, "it's right in front of you" was a paly on words.

[zenith thorn]

Josh , my GPU hates you , nuf more said ... now going for JQQ[whatever]

[sonic rover]

FIND RATTS wtf i thought it last day.. WHY WE HAVE STIL THIS QUEST on the list xDD

but at least.. i thought we need to find specific rat ... D: for example count the rats for 8

[safe hound]

What solution lmao

[hot bear]

Amazing, thanks Josh.... right... back to progressing 9 and enjoying all these puzzles.

[hushed widget]

Lie, cheat, steal...let's get us a new bike

[cloud terrace]

https://tenor.com/view/mcgonagall-harry-potter-professor-minerva-mc-gonagall-gif-15434846199196401022

[dire star]

I swear I can imagine Josh giving us tips about "right infront of us" and we're like...GUYS ITS RELATED TO VISION going insane

[lone python]

If we need to think outside the box to beat unsolvable puzzles, has anyone tried to bribe Josh yet?

[lavish cosmos]

I don't get it. What will this solution unlock?

[ashen oak]

I do have to say, like mentioned: One of the 'hints' was that said person didn't need to know any old wow lore. However, how would such a person land on OLGRA

[meager lion]

Now we know the missing rhyme isnt love atleast. Well, I guess. Maybe

[rocky shuttle]

It's the keyboard, it must be, let's permutate keyboard layouts

[subtle ledge]

I did say it was right in front of you the whole time...

[light urchin]

what rhymes with Ratts = Is it Cats

[shrewd condor]

every single time its an anagram bu we try all the ciphers out there

[gleaming pumice]

It has a clear rhyme and reason. Our objective in the scenario was to find ratts, she said her puzzle was incomplete, etc.

[hidden flower]

Time to celebrate with a nice meal of trash

[mild grove]

To be honest, i find the "solution" rather unsatisfying

[rapid pier]

What's the world like outside this room now? I don't want to leave.. 😛

[lavish cosmos]

It'n NOT "in front of us" .

[gleaming pumice]

Just becuase it wasn't cipher logrithmic mathematics doesn't mean it was bad.

[frigid tiger]

I feel like lots of people tried this but using a proper name in the solution made it impossible. If we didnt know the answer, how would we ever think of putting letters together to form the name, Olgra.

[subtle ledge]

It's not in front of your character, but it is in front of you the player.

[last thistle]

https://tenor.com/view/donkey-shrek-hug-need-a-hug-down-gif-12672989

[hot bear]

it was... its on your screen

[gleaming pumice]

it would have been the letters left over

[final adder]

https://tenor.com/view/the-universe-tim-and-eric-mind-blown-mind-blown-meme-mind-explosion-mind-explosion-meme-gif-18002878

[potent salmon]

i said monitor yesterday

[strange narwhal]

what did this get us?

[oak bramble]

In hindsight, the other note in the room did tell us the puzzle was "unsolvable" and "incomplete" as it was

[rocky shuttle]

Right in front us you too, if you think about the standard location of the quest tracker

[clever ridge]

Do you mean the Scenario goal?

[astral robin]

Tomorrow quest NPCs will be asking us why their name is floating in front of our right eye. 👀

[south ridge]

If you find this solution unsatisfying that's a you problem. This is golden lmfao. So many of us thought "it's Ratts" but NO ONE tried it? Lmfao

[final adder]

Keyboarders were on the right path

[normal wing]

holy shit i was spending so much time on optimization and this was the answer 😂

[lost tundra]

Not to mention Ratts is also anagram of Start, and this is the first thing we do

[lavish cosmos]

I have many things on my "screen" .

[hot bear]

A better understanding of thinking outside the box for future puzzles

[subtle ledge]

This too!

[dire star]

I spent way too much time on the "darkness" part

[safe vine]

I want to say, to the people who have been in here for a week working together. We came up with much, much better riddles of our own and im proud of us.

[ruby tartan]

i think it gave us insight into how ratts creates her puzzles

[subtle ledge]

If you added "START" instead, that would have also worked.

[wise trellis]

hey josh why are rats the solution to like 3 parts so far

[shell herald]

Something to learn from this is that the sealed clue, orb of power, and fire debuffs are still unused and possibly involved with 9, 10 oclock?

[cerulean mason]

if i have any feedback just do not say things that get pinned that are straight not true

[wispy hawk]

But, HOW do we arrive at this after adding "RATTS"? just pure anagram??

[rocky shuttle]

Check the DEN for the final orb! (end)

[ruby tartan]

time to solve the thunderfury console

[sonic rover]

not complaining.. but ive playing since vanilla... and have not a single idea who olgra is or was

[gleaming pumice]

yup, just unscrambling with nothing fancy

[crisp ridge]

Yes

[safe vine]

Its a bad puzzle

[odd siren]

so mankrik's wife?

[toxic nova]

How the heck could anyone have solved that anagram with Olgra? Without the reverse engineering I mean. I would maybe have gotten the mind body and soul thing, but if I ended with the leftover letters LRAOG I would just assume I had the Ratts part of the anagram incorrect...

[quiet adder]

well, it was great being part of this, ty guys ❤️

[torpid sierra]

what about Tarts!

[wispy hawk]

bad puzzle yes

[ember umbra]

yeah, apparently, to speak freely: it's really dumb (in my opinion)

[mild grove]

It doesn't feel like a good puzzle indeed

[grizzled pivot]

https://tenor.com/view/eddie-murphy-aha-gif-5283284

[lost tundra]

I mean once we stop hyperventilating through the laugh, can try what's present in the other locales :>

[gleaming pumice]

Lovingly crafted clue -- would have led you to lovingly (grave marker) so you would have figured out olgra (yes, with leaving the room)

Josh only told us we had everything we need in the room because we already KNEW it was Mankrik/Olgra.

[south ridge]

Would you shut up? It's not

[strange narwhal]

Feel like I already got that lol. But cool.

[wild forge]

so the sealed clue is nothing ? lol

[lone python]

I think it's important to remember Ratts is known to make incomplete and unsolvable puzzles. It's literally one of the first clues we find, is her journal.

[main rune]

That "start fresh" makes a lot of sense now...

[whole sandal]

#1308885127819952158 message Wasn't that far off with finding the gimmick after all xD

[dire star]

While I'm very satisfied, I'm half annoyed at Josh for saying a non-wow player could solve this.... I discounted the word olgra instantly

[oak bramble]

We knew it was anagram + do X.
X just turned out to be "Ratts is missing"

[terse sail]

Proud to have worked on all of this with you all 🫡

[snow temple]

It totally is, though.

[safe vine]

If you think a 45 letter anagram is a good puzzle. iom sorry.

[final adder]

Are you able to give us the other localized solutions?

[silk cape]

Josh, appreciate your work and all the effort that goes into this. Feedback from me is that this is too unconstrained. The space of possible added words and anagrams is essentially infinite. And the fourth-wall boundaries are not particularly clear as to whether things like objective text and other languages are fair game - in particular I don't think even a very smart player not in this discord, not comparing across languages and only taking the in-game items as given, could reasonably solve.

[glass marsh]

would love see how this work with other languages...

[true spire]

@dire star

[sleek siren]

Ok, but how do you find that the next step is about Olgra and Mankrik?

[safe vine]

There would have been no way to solve this without brute forcing it ahead of time. I suppose that does fit into the theme of cheating but we were told NOT to retroactively look for the solution WHEN THAT WAS INDEED THE CORRECT THING TO DO

[shrewd condor]

yeah our STRAT was bad as well

[south ridge]

Anagrams are a staple in wow secrets. Meme level even.

[cursive cape]

The main problem is the massive build-up I think. We've been working on it for too long for any solution to be satisfying at this point...

[astral robin]

Is this the first 4th wall break in game?

[cerulean mason]

tbf secrets have always involved things like the wow books and stuff

[silver warren]

Bad puzzle, bad secret... resolve something you, in a sense, are not supposed to solve. I dont see the logic behind this

[gleaming pumice]

Olgra is mentioned in the annagram, and "lovingly crafted" leads to her grave.

[wispy hawk]

Yes, If I'm writing this puzzle I'll at least let the rearrangement step be something like a scytale

[wet basin]

So what I've learned is ratts is really into herself

[lavish cosmos]

That was completely "thinking out of the box" not game related.

[snow temple]

This would work better if Ratt wasn't.... not missing at all. She's lounging on a towel on the beach in Tanaris, having drinks and snacks, as we speak. Ratts isn't in the catacombs, okay.. but she's not exactly hard to find right now.

[sonic rover]

i did mentioned an hour ago.. in the Silent Hill P.T. a puzzle peace/ a clue was hiding in the menu/pause screen.. i feel this could have been an great idea of using it in 1'

[safe vine]

Idk, im just pissed cause we were told to not work backwards. When working backwards was the only way to solve this because it required us to cheat first.

[vital karma]

So what happened to zhTW translation? was that intended to be incredibly easy?

[mossy canyon]

All the people crying it was a good first puzzle

[lost tundra]

I feel that about the owls, which is absolutely not a commentary about the actual puzzle. I feel that about Zandalar as a zone in particular, too, even though Dazar'alor itself is amazing.

[fair condor]

Problem with that is it doesn't work in other languages. In French, neither the clue name nor the gravestone mention lovingly at all

[ruby tartan]

given that thought process, looking at the other steps ratts has inserted herself multiple times.

[trim hemlock]

I think a bigger thing to take from this also is that Ratts also places a LOT of red herrings around to distract us from the actual puzzle - turns out the only useful thing in the room for this puzzle was the Clue and her Journal

[snow temple]

Right, we know where she is.

[gleaming pumice]

do they match each other?

[ornate blade]

Thats not true.

[potent salmon]

in german she would be named "Ölgra"

[silver warren]

who is crying?

[dire star]

This made me completely discount looking for the word Olgra, and if we didn't have the chinese clue it'd probably be insane to solve an anagram this big but hey I was entertained 😄

[safe hound]

Yeah and spamagram is definition of brute force lmao

[lone python]

Some people seem super upset about an already solved puzzle having a solution that is "unsolvable" or "incomplete".

[lavish cosmos]

Okay so what we need to do? Is it completely solved or does it directs to somewhere/something?

[rancid mason]

GERTHRUDA

[gleaming pumice]

Anyway, taking a break from actively solving this I have collected a few mounts and achievements this morning haha

[tulip vault]

I think it's body (grave) mind(child) soul(shadowlands)

[sonic rover]

in my opinion, it would have been fair to have had it like "Find RATTS"

[broken ridge]

Ngl I get it now, but this is not satisfying for me at all. I mean I usually close the objective bar because it is annoying for me to say the least. Also it just makes me think that there is no reason to search ingame because the solution is supposed to be elsewhere.

[frigid tiger]

Using a proper name in the solution...We would never have got that.

[wispy hawk]

Okay so in zhCN we add LACI/拉茨 instead?

[safe hound]

Nah just dont think its a puzzle

[cerulean mason]

you can't really say it was a good puzzle when it probably would have been brute forced 10 differrent ways before finding the intended solution

[dull osprey]

for anyone dissapointed with the answer, are you forgetting that this was the intro puzzle? i think it perfectly fine to be a bit simpler, and lets be honest, it also has taken the longest to solve

[snow temple]

If the way of solving this is a hint towards solving 9, I understand better why he's offering to give us a gentle nudge.. probably realized this isn't being solved because it's not solvable with logic.

[thorn summit]

Ah this was really silly. I was excited about it. 10 was another clue and I hoped it has to do with pearl jam but that is more a pub quiz. So where are we now?

[pastel fable]

Honestly there were zero clues in the room that would guide it towards that solution. Not to mention the lack of any key for the cipher...just bash our heads for it.

[median ruin]

bad puzzle...

[oak bramble]

Yeah and Khadgar's currently in like 30 different locations rn.
When anniversary's over, she won't be. As far as the instance and storyline of us chasing her down is concerned, she's missing.

[fair condor]

I fully agree, it's not feasible to solve that big anagram without already knowing OLGRA is part of the plain answer

[crisp ridge]

Those same people having awesome attitudes through the whole thing too REALLY helped! /s

[safe hound]

The only way jt was got was backwards by cheating anyways lmao, going forwards you can spam anything which people did.

Nonsense

[snow temple]

Her location in Tanaris was updated after we found her in the cave though..

[rocky shuttle]

Not to mention, she's in different locations depending on where you are in the anniversary secret quest-line

[safe vine]

I want to thank @merry meteor for this piece. It made the whole week worth it. We had some fun

[normal wing]

did her journal have something along the lines of 'all puzzles start somewhere' or words like that? would have been a nice logical to have

[merry meteor]

Even having the completed version, I still don't see the connection between Olgra's past and 'mind'. But maybe that's a me thing. 😛

[strange narwhal]

The message or lesson of the clue to think out the box and ratts character is already told to us in the note that she makes puzzles unsolvable etc. I don't get it... What we learnt we already knew. But I think moving on some people will have learnt to look at things differently.

[lost tundra]

I actually like that Ratts is a bit childlike. Sure, it's a stereotype on its own, but we already know that a perfect puzzlemaster would've felt too… artificial.

[fair condor]

In fact, solving that anagram without knowing mind body and soul are part of the likely solution AND that it refers to OLGRA is completely impossible

[safe hound]

The lesson is to stick to other outlets for this stuff

[cerulean mason]

i think it makes sense it's like they're different person (alternate timeline) but they're "the same" conceptually. It mentionned olgra anyway

[wet basin]

It was a pleasure working with yall in the calm chat, now off to the chaos of 9

[unique nest]

probably because In-Universe the Puzzle maker (Ratts) is a bit ego centric and also still mad that they got fired?

[dire star]

This is what I'm confused about

[quiet adder]

Why is it bad puzzle? Because it was so obvious that we couldnt see?

[astral bane]

I, for one, was satisfied by the answer because finding out that it was just a big anagram with a proper name in it, I can rest easy in the knowledge that I was never going to solve it to begin with

[snow temple]

If Ratts is like Amanda from SAW, I hope we get to shoot her dead like Amanda.

[broken ridge]

It is because Draenor did not happen, it was just our imagination.

[dire star]

I guess it was assumed we'd skip the anagram and then go back to it and solve it using olgra as a keyword?

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[safe hound]

Because to find a 50 char anagram or whatever it is is brute force. No logical rearrangement. You come up with a thousand sentences and get there by chance

[proud nacelle]

https://tenor.com/view/ernie-sesame-street-smh-shaking-my-head-dismay-gif-18210872

[south ridge]

That's the connection for multiple parts of the puzzle. Rats.

[tulip vault]

The lhc did give us the number of words and the punctuation.

[silk cape]

Yeah essentially the solution method is "a billion monkeys typing randomly until one of them types Hamlet". Not really feasible by an individual imo.

[terse sail]

I'm glad we at least had been working with the correct method the entire time

[safe hound]

And ee had 3 other full sentences yesterday with lhc alone

Following those words

[shell herald]

That's a good point. He would know that people would find those torch reactions out in the world, because every puzzle people scour all of Azeroth. So it's not really blindly solving, we have an idea that the answer refers to her.

[safe hound]

And commas

[quiet adder]

but that only happened because of the chinese translation. it was not josh's intention

[potent salmon]

wondering how someone with 0 wow knowledge could think that "olgra" is a thing

[safe hound]

Just as valid an answwr as guessing the “right” one lmao moreso cus they wont just the chinese kne with ratts stuck in cus we need letters

[oak bramble]

Many npcs are in different locations at any given time. When you're trying to save Malfurion in Darkheart Thicket, do you just say "oh well he's in the shadowlands rn, we don't actually need to rescue him"?

[safe vine]

So Josh was saying- he saw someone say "maybe we should add RATTS to the anagram", and didnt say WE HAVE A WINNER then and there? They were then meant to make a 45 character anagram?

[cerulean mason]

i feel like it would have been much better if like :
You see the impossible puzzle (maybe ur player character or an npc remarks on that)
You see the word love
Your bruteforce to olgra
When you come back with the orb activated, there's like steps and hints to the "cheating" thing (helps you understand ratts' mind)

I don't think the concept of developping the character through her cheating is bad (she's fired for a reason after all) but if it's a mechanic of the secret it should be explained, instead of letting you continue to the next orbs

[south ridge]

Yes

[safe hound]

No, we have plenty of other anagrams and without knowing the answer, youre guessing which is right lol

[ruby tartan]

that isn't the solution though, they still need to solve the anagram

[oak bramble]

With a fixed format it's not that unreasonable

[safe vine]

YOU CANT SOLVE A 45 CHARACTER ANAGRAM

there is no fixed format because youre ADDING CHARACTERS

AND YOU DONT KNOW WHERE THEY GO

[strong void]

Did we have any idea on which words to adds the RATTS letters? (trying to find in FR)

[safe hound]

You can solve 10 but not one lool

[strong void]

(for words length)

[gleaming pumice]

There's definitely room for improvement (when you zone in there are SO MANY clues to work with, how do you know this was even where to start). I'm not sure we would have gotten it the "correct" way, definitely would have found the torch interact with her grave before the puzzle got solved. And people probably couldn't individually do it.

But that's no reason to bash Josh's help or responses in here. It's not like he had a team reviewing his replies to make sure it was semantically 100% on point.

I kinda wish it wasn't solved, the channel was a lot nicer before..

[silk cape]

it makes no difference - it is a global anagram but with the word spacing the same as original clue.

[strange narwhal]

https://tenor.com/view/escalated-quickly-anchorman-drinking-gif-5112090

[strong void]

oh mb, though the lengths was maintained, so hard ^^

[tulip vault]

I am curious if there were clues on what words to make out of the anagram. Bruteforcing that would be tough.

[safe hound]

Yeah i should have learned first time round to just drop this to. Be fair, just wish we just better ideas of what it might be instead of holding out for a fun logic thing

[safe vine]

Supposedly we had to cheat to begin with

[frigid tiger]

Definitely some feedback for Josh. Moving forward, keep proper names out of solutions for puzzles like this. No one without prior wow knowledge would ever think of putting letters together to form someones name, like Olgra. Especially such an uncommon one.

[fair condor]

Because it is unsolvable. The only reason it was solved is because we got the literal solution from the Chinese version... And used information from that to solve it. You can't solve the anagram without knowing it's about OLGRA and that it's about mind body and soul

[crisp ridge]

That depeneded entirely on the input you provided before it was solved. I can count multiple instances of people being absolute dicks in responses to only my ideas. Not counting everyone elses.

[safe vine]

an anagram. with a proper name. the name is OLGRA.

[safe hound]

Just dont make anagrams look like fun ciphers and fun ciphers look like muffin hunts lmao

[whole sandal]

@Josh So the Russian version should be ОЛЬГРА ИЩЕТ СВЕТ В РАЗУМЕ, ТЕЛЕ И ДУШЕ then 😄

[ruby tartan]

despite what all these naysayers are going on about it "being a bad puzzle" well done josh. thank you for having us circle back and correctly solve it.

[merry meteor]

Oh, I am not bashing Josh at all. We did, eventually, land at the solution. Albeit - with plenty of hints from him, and the cheated solution. Perhaps those hints could have been added somewhere into the game - for example, a few 'scratched' notes, where the letters are completely different, but structure of the sentence is the same, so we knew that's what we are looking for.

[wispy hawk]

Yes, Even if we're told to add RATTS we won't be able to anagram the sentence out of this

[ashen oak]

I started with anagramming, adding letters etc, so I think the hints we got threw me off more than they helped me tbh.

[strong void]

in FR there is no G xD...

[sonic rover]

i think its the first time to have a "out of the box thinking" riddle where it wasnt like this before except from using other sources as wowhead etc. maybe we have to continue thinking that way. not specially for this secret but future

[tulip vault]

BODY and LIGHT seem like they are referred to in the room a bit.

[safe vine]

So the translation teams were given the sentence, told to remove the letters RATTS. and rearrange.

[ashen oak]

might be a different phrase in FR, that still points in the same direction. Chinese version also didnt have olgra

[vapid hornet]

So Ratts =Start so does that mean Den=end

[safe vine]

youre out of your mind

[ashen oak]

I think the chinese version had a better solution since orc is a lot more easy to get than olgra

[cerulean mason]

you can make "orc" with the R from ratts

[ruby tartan]

back to what he said someone with no wow knowledge could get close to solving is pretty accurate, I put the puzzle in front of my wife and she noticed that key consonants R and T were missing.

theres no C though

[lost tundra]

But she knew the prior solution, right?

[gleaming pumice]

I definitely saw that particular interaction and thought you were justified in response. It's too bad, but everyone should feel happy we can move on and put energy elsewhere.

We're not going to get more puzzles if this is the response to them.. and I'm sure Devs learned SO MUCH seeing the thought processes.

[ruby tartan]

i mentioned that we had the chinese localization but not to go off that.

[crisp ridge]

Yeah, people being childish about a hard (12 piece) puzzle would make me want to walk away for sure.

[lost tundra]

Anyway, if I had a nickel for each time the solution got out and people were unable to think without it, I'd have two nickels, which isn't a lot, but weird it's happened twice

[gleaming pumice]

saving this for later 👀

[snow temple]

Well, I did Darkheart Thicket like 4 years before Shadowlands so no I wouldn't think that at the time..

[sleek siren]

Ok and that must lead her to Olgra and Mankrik, how? She sees Draenor mentioned in one of the notes, so she just scans the whole of Draenor to look for them.

[cerulean mason]

by this point i was sadly discarding everything that was rawdogging the anagram because we were told "to ignore everything other than the room" and that "someone with no wow knowledge would find it"

[astral robin]

Wowhead

[ruby tartan]

no, i'm just saying she noticed that key consonants were missing to solve the anagram. she didn't solve it but took notice that if we added some letters we could maybe come up with the proper answer

[sonic rover]

However, good bye 1 o'clock people. See you in 9 ... for eternal damnation. 😈

[placid bobcat]

I'll take some consolation that I was on the right track with adding letters. I was just adding the wrong letters. Funnily enough I kept getting stuck on the lack of Fs and Ts in my string! I would have preferred if there were some clues in the room to give some context to the solution though. That's pretty frustrating.

[rotund shard]

So it was somehow a huge coincidence that the 3 documents contained the entire chinese solution or was that by design?

[sleek siren]

no WoW knowledge, so no Wowhead

[fair condor]

I think saying a 40+ letter anagram with a proper name isn't a good idea is good feedback for the puzzle setter. Particularly if you need to add an UNKNOWN amount of letters to it first. It just isn't possible to solve

[gleaming pumice]

The Chinese localization team scrambled all the letters but apparently did not remove RATTS from it. So it was much easier to complete.

[rotund shard]

To solve this, not to learn what it meant.

[wet basin]

Well now that we have 2 puzzles involving rats we should keep an eye out for 9 having critters as well

[rotund shard]

OH, I thought the person that added ratts only added it to the gibberish in the note?

[main rune]

I still can't believe we knew 7 out of the 9 words and we couldn't solve it faster 😦

[cerulean mason]

i think it is fine that it's not possible to solve but i think the game should tell you or at least hint at the fact that it wasn't possible to solve before letting you do 8 other orbs

[tepid bramble]

do we need to do more steps for 1 clock or its solved already with initial clues ?

[echo maple]

Whats funny is that i always had the quest panel completely closed, so it wasn't "infront of me"

[safe vine]

funny. if the chinese text never got leaked. we NEVER would have figured this out. we wouldve realised olgra reacts to the torch. but not a soul on this planet would have said "theres an anagram here missing the words RATTS"

[sleek siren]

To solve it you must not solve it at all but from our perspective this must lead you to Olgra and Mankrik somehow and just a Draenor mention isn't much.

[terse sail]

I can't believe we added all the words we could find except for the one right on the screen 😂

[trim hemlock]

Guys, lets focus on constructive criticism instead of just complaining about the puzzle - Its not a bad puzzle, I think if the entire discord had put all its energy into solving the puzzle, we probably would've figured out the anagram eventually - I think something to improve for future puzzles is to have a lot less red herrings, especially at the start of the instance, since that did a lot to distract us from the puzzle

[gray plinth]

its technically been solved this whole time. we were just trying to solve it correctly cuz it'll indirectly help with 9

[steady stream]

I scrolled a bit in 9 o'clock and then watched "The Ring" movie to forget about what I saw in that group chat 😅

[rotund shard]

Someone said they tried adding ratts, and at least implied they spent time on it.

[olive minnow]

If you simply imagine this puzzle with the following two things, you'll understand why people are disliking it:

1. If the interactions with Olgra weren't unlocked globally until someone successfully typed the phrase in /say
2. The chinese version didn't spoil it

My assumption is that the entire community would still be at this step.

[rotund shard]

Like, a long time ago

[tepid bramble]

@gray plinth ❤️

[safe vine]

look i know we sound harsh, but weve been at this for a week and blatantly led astray. were allowed to be frustrated

[proper quiver]

We definitely would have found it the other way around though. We discovered the torch interaction with olgras grave in barrens before the start of the hunt. We would have figured it out regardless.

Ratts doesn't care so much about the solution as she does the process and she's also mad about being fired now. She's purposefully making it unfair.

[safe vine]

i had fun nonetheless

[cerulean mason]

i mean that number 1 would have made it straight impossible by design yes

[pulsar sail]

Damn, I was out today and did t see then some. What was the e gimmick?

[warped adder]

I was under the impression that someone who had never played wow before could solve this puzzle, so I never considered using NPC names

[snow fable]

I would never have gotten this

[merry meteor]

Admittedly, we only had that assumption from hints.

[terse sail]

Honestly, most fun I've had in ages. It was incredibly fun bouncing our insane theories with everyone here

[mossy canyon]

Crazy how cringe you sound

[safe vine]

the gimmick was it was missing the words RATTS'. it was a 45 letter anagram. there is no solution to arrangement

[cerulean mason]

yes but then the game should hint at that

[warped adder]

Yeah, imagine taking hints given by the creator of this puzzle seriously

O well

[safe vine]

all good man

[silk cape]

This is the "monkeys at the typewriter" approach - it should be realistically solvable by a single clever player IMO (who isn't in discord, using one language in-game and no prior knowledge of solution)

[main rune]

Here are my notes, I was somewhat close 😦

[olive minnow]

Do you mean, "how would you know to /say and know something happened"?

[fair condor]

Absolutely guaranteed. You can create 50000+ valid English anagrams sentences with 9 words with 40+ letters. And that's assuming you already know to add RATTS. This would have never been solved without the Chinese fuck up

[main rune]

the 26/71 and 30/47 hints were huge 😄

[trim hemlock]

if all the Secret puzzles were designed with this mindset, they'd be incredibly simple and this Discord/community wouldnt exist bexcause everyone could solve each puzzle on their own

[dire star]

Anyway guys the whole event has been crazy good except this one step. And I can only assume they expected us to find olgra some other way and work backwards for this, so time to focus on the next puzzle!

[trim hemlock]

its not about the puzzles, its about the friends we make along the way ❤️

[gleaming pumice]

That's not true, people knew about the torch and Olgra's grave already (before the catacombs). They had to adjust the puzzle assuming a community of thousands would be playing it.

[cyan lotus]

For Spanish players it would be "Olgra busca la luz en mente, cuerpo y espíritu"
I personally don't like this kind of play if we don't have the basis to work like this. Now I suppose we are stuck on step 9 because we haven't been "taught" the mechanics for this. This is not real life where you know where the limits are 🤷🏻‍♀️

[thorn elk]

so what we are supposed to do now?

[rotund shard]

Disappointed a little bit that the number 10 didn't play a role as well. So many things...

[main rune]

#felcycle-solved-read-only

[pulsar sail]

Come on now, there must be more to it than that? Please do t tell me I just spent days on this and in the end it was a glorified guess?

[safe vine]

You had some great takes

[rocky shuttle]

What was the global unlock from a /say?

[safe vine]

Thats it.

[lavish cosmos]

Did we complete 1 o'clock?

[trim hemlock]

oh no, don't send us into that god-forsaken place

[rotund shard]

I was just about to log in to count the number of lights on the button and if it was 10 lights throw my monitor.

[unique nest]

I think we need to push the critiques of the puzzle aside and objectively think on what the take-away from this is

1. Ratts is salty and deliberately making incomplete puzzles
2. We need to figure out what Ratts has left out

[snow fable]

Gratz @cloud terrace btw!

It's been fun everyone. Now let's go fix 9'o clock 😄

[safe vine]

Pins for more info

[crisp ridge]

It's lore appropriate. People are mad about it.

[fair condor]

Read the comment I'm replying to. It specifically talks about the torch interaction

[olive minnow]

Nothing, someone is just referencing me saying "imagine you had to verify it somehow to make the next step available to be done"

[tulip vault]

Yea, great puzzle josh! I'm still looking for clues on what words to make out of the anagram. A possible area for improvement could be to make sure the clues text has the correct number of characters as the answer. It would definitely be a hard puzzle without knowing "body, mind, and soul"

[terse sail]

Exactly, it wasn't intended to be 'fair'. Ratts is just incredibly salty

[merry meteor]

It honestly makes me feel like the puzzle is commentary on wow players telling devs how to do their job lmao

[rocky shuttle]

Ah thanks, thought I'd missed seeing a step somewhere.

[rotund shard]

Does the clue work out better if you just slam "ratts" into the empty spaces? There are 5 right?

[hot bear]

A lot of salty people getting confused with "soloable" and "solvable". You can do the entire puzzle in isolation... the secret takes the community (hence this discord). Josh - you did good, really good puzzle and helps us to see that outside the box thinking is needed. see you all in 9 (hopefully with less salt from some)

[wispy hawk]

The problem is we will not be able to solve this even if being told to "add RATTS and anagram"

[safe vine]

Today we say goodbye to this accursed room. GG

[low dust]

There is no G in french, couldn't get OLGRA so.. or i missing something ^^

[silk cape]

They can still be extremely hard. I gave Endless Halls as a great example of this earlier.

[charred smelt]

Could/Will you provide the answer for every langages ?
i never trust the localization team for secret. for exeample in french "LSEN LLIEULUIN LESPI ILOC LMELUME INENTLE OCMMRTLPS ILIN ENNT" even adding "ratts" won't help finding olGra because there is no G (and the name is Olgra in french), if we need to add "typo" to "incomplete" and "unsolvable", this could be a really hard secret...

[gleaming pumice]

The localizations might have different sentences

[cerulean mason]

it's probably orc

[quiet adder]

well it was fun, there were some great theories

[merry meteor]

Ratts clearly has background in solving puzzles (see, the earlier pages from her journal). She gets a job doing it for the anniversary and does a shit job of it, because she does not consider everything that's involved. And gets booted, which makes her more salty.

[steady stream]

We will have to come back to it no?We still have the button, enigmatic device, orb, potions 😄

[safe vine]

Oh god I didnt even consider the other languages would have different localisation. Good luck with your 75 character french anagram

[rotund shard]

the Chinese solution didnt have the name either, it had orc.

[safe vine]

The italians wait

WHAT WAS THE ITALIAN SOLUTION

[charred smelt]

Olgra vs Orc is a big difference to point to the first step to follow...

[gleaming pumice]

Ok now we need someone to make a "get up to speed" doc for 9 o'clock

[cerulean mason]

not a lot of famous orc couples in the game

[merry meteor]

They made no actual progress.

[ashen oak]

Ladies, gentlemen: It was an honor! On to 9 O Clock! 🫡

[terse sail]

They will now that they can use our braincell

[gleaming pumice]

AWESOME! That means I don't have to think about anything they've done and maybe will be fresh start. haha

[merry meteor]

There's like 5 theories and Josh said one of them is vaguely correct.

[twilit merlin]

theres no O in german anagram to make orc or olgra

[rotund shard]

Tahts not entirely true. There are only like 8 things in the doc and were told that one of them is a valid lead to work.

[cerulean mason]

there is one in Dorp

[wispy hawk]

I'd say adding RATTS is genius step, the anagram after is not

[cerulean mason]

Dörp

whatever

[twilit merlin]

ö is used for Körper i guess

[safe vine]

Italian doesnt have the P for BODY (Corpo)

KIDC ONKE CIMI DLIC ARANA

[rotund shard]

I would have also liked a logic to solving it. But with the entire discord slamming at it I think it would have been solved fairly quickly.

[mental vault]

Calling it now: the key to solving orb #12 is to add the letters J O S H

[safe vine]

So their translation wouldve been very differennt

[cyan lotus]

The thing for the find Ratts as a reason to add it would have more sense if it said "Ratts is missing". Find Ratts isn't a hint at all

[burnt hearth]

Ok, so we only needed to add Ratts? That's too funny actually! I tip my hat to anyone who worked hard on those anagrams 🫡
Good job Trashman! And thank you Josh for the explanation!

[subtle ledge]

Adding RATTS is the correct answer to all languages. However, different languages may have used a difference sentence. Since it would be a bit mean to ask you to solve huge anagrams on your own, remind me tomorrow and I'll try to dig up possible sentences they may have localized.

[thorn summit]

https://tenor.com/view/michael-oliver-problem-child-problem-child-movie-junior-healy-annoying-gif-24572223

ok reading back thus we are still at the same point?

[fair condor]

Lol 75 character French anagram. Pure horror

[safe vine]

LSEN LLIEULUIN LESPI ILOC LMELUME INENTLE OCMMRTLPS ILIN ENNTRATTS'

Good luck bro

Seriously

[burnt hearth]

No no Fortyforty! Quest complete!

[rotund shard]

I think hearing the solution and where the clues were to the solution and I like it very much. The missing piece I think was something, however obscure, to unscramble the resulting letter pile.

[cerulean mason]

i mean honestly when i tried the french one it wasn't that bad

[proper quiver]

Also adding "Ratts" implies some ego too

[ashen oak]

Illuminer is in there for sure

[tulip vault]

I can see BODY, MIND LIGHT in the room. Need SOUL.

[wispy hawk]

Anagrams of this scale cannot be solved EVEN WITH ALL 200K PEOPLE HERE

[unique nest]

correct, Ratts is salty about being fired and has deliberately made puzzles that are incomplete. We need something, I think, from a previous step to make head-way for 9 o clock. (Like the second step clue's note is incomplete without the buff from this first step, the enigma machine needs items from previous steps, etc)

[burnt hearth]

I'm now wondering if we get to unlock those Mo'arg chests as one of the last puzzles. Those are probably the objects that Ratts pulled out of the Hidden Hatch in the Mechanar!

[high stone]

No freaking way. I did add ratts as one of the possible keys for everything I was trying, but not in a million years I would suppose I would just need to anagram it.

[thorn summit]

Ok I read back more. All now 4040 === 80 👹

[ashen oak]

I feel like people are overreacting to the long anagram thing. It was the first thing I tried. My bad for missing the 'incomplete' clue and not adding letters. I'd also pick wow like words out like LEGION, MIND, SOUL etc. I think its not that far fetched. I think the only shame is that the orb was able to be activated without actually solving it

[safe vine]

I think the motorcycle is what she found

[pulsar sail]

I get the rhetoric / story aspect of Ratts making this incomplete / unsolvable. Is this the same for 9 o’clock too? How would we know? Do we just start randomly guessing solutions because Ratts might not have left enough clues for a solution to be derived?

[proper quiver]

Good work yall

[safe hound]

Nah its just some of us were holding out for a fun logic thing, its not about whether we could solve it its just we didnt want to spamagram because its shit ool

[proper quiver]

She wrote about things being "incomplete" and "unsolvable" intentionally

[burnt hearth]

Yeah you're probably right and I'd love for those Mo'arg chests to be involved so we can get it!

[safe hound]

Yeah we all picked that and tried it and would have got there. But whats the point in coming back to solve a fucking anagram lmao

[safe vine]

whats in the box!!

[safe hound]

How is solving an anagram fun

[astral bane]

I do wonder,

But how were you supposed to solve such a massive anagram?
In a sense, you weren't. That's the point. Ratts made her puzzles too difficult, unsolvably so. The fact that you had to "cheat" to solve this proves her point.

Given that it's orb 1 and we seem to have been expected to solved the orbs in order, were they intending for people to be stuck on this step for a longer time without progressing to #2? Or had they anticipated we'd solve the unsolvable as quickly as we did with the help of the Chinese 'cheat'?

An "unsolvable" anagram seems a pretty rough start to a 12 piece puzzle

[unique nest]

There is a logic here, Ratts thinks highly of themself, and Josh has said we have all the pieces for 9 o clock. So maybe something like the Warden owl, or maybe it's something rat focused again - we don't know

[rotund shard]

There are 45k words in that string but you can remove a bunch of them for being too long/short or being outdated or weird that's still tens of thousands of words.
If you slam Ratts into the spaces does that leave you with exact word length?

[pulsar sail]

So you believe a problem / puzzle with no clue to allow a solve is an appropriate barrier, and that a clue staying “this is unsolvable” is fine?

[high stone]

The solution is there is no solution. The solution was even just "close", not the thing.

[rotund shard]

To the now known solution

[cerulean mason]

you would never do the anagram

[proper quiver]

I think cheating the solution like Ratts is cheating us is fine

[cerulean mason]

if josh didn't ask us to solve it legit we would have just continued on orb 9

[rotund shard]

No to my theory because of the solution containing a two letter word.

[astral bane]

Right, but that was only possible because the Chinese localization got a much easier puzzle. If that hadn't happened, it's possible nobody would've solved this step

[proper quiver]

Like someone would have returned to olgras grave because we knew it interacted with the torch. Lhc or no lhc

[fair condor]

We could barely solve it even knowing basically all the words lol

[rotund shard]

Perhaps the large anagram with a "cheat" was why leaving olgra to be stumbled on is a thing.

[burnt hearth]

Maybe someone would have picked up on the lovingly and by accident got the reference with Olgra's monument in the Barrens ("lovingly inscribed orcish runes"). Then the link about all things Olgra would have been made.

[proper quiver]

Exactly

[cerulean mason]

no you would just see "lovingly" in the name and maybe "body,soul" in the text and then go to famous wow couples, go to olgra because it's like an old wow meme and this is the 20th anniversary puzzle and youd find the buff

[broken ridge]

So all in all I conclude that nothing hinted at how to order the letters in LHC. Sealed Clue was a red herring. From the journal (and maybe with EDD) we could guess that there where missing letters but could NOT guess how many, and EDD was a red herring as well with the symbol counts. Also nothing pointed at the fact that we need to keep the LHC word structure or not, and if we keep it where to put the missing letters. The answer containing real name like Olgra is impossible to get if you don't know what you are searching for beforehand without a proper ordering tool (like cypher or something), not to mention you have to add back the correct letters at the correct positions beforehand for it to work at all.

AND imo quest objective is outside the room so that was misleading to me (not that I would got it otherwise since I play with a closed objective list all the time).

All in all the solution to add Ratts name back is great but the rest is simply not my kind of leadup and rest for a puzzle.

Anyway at least I was working my brain for days on something even if the solution was not to my liking, so thanks for the puzzle Josh.

Well this is enough puzzle solving for a day for me tomorrow I will check on 9 o clock see you there folks.

[mighty sail]

Josh's clue from today about "discard all your previous solutions and start fresh" makes no sense to me now. We've been discussing adding letters to the anagram for a few days, and that just doesn't fit with "oh it's just a different word to add". I'm pretty sure both RATTS and START got investigated as additions but never got anywhere. I'd gone back to trying to figure out if the bloody button did anything

[olive minnow]

"Cheating to solve", to me, would mean one of two things, either "Bruteforce the entire world to find the interaction and skip the anagram", "Chinese mistake was on purpose"

[main rune]

start fresh can be interpreted as an anagram for RATTS

[high stone]

Maybe the chinese realized how utterly ridiculous and disrespectful this is, and said "ok, let's not waste people's time on this".
Props to them.

[main rune]

the objective of the dungeon (from the start) has always been "Find Ratts"

[proper quiver]

This reads like a cryptic crossword clue. Feels intentional

[mighty sail]

Who knows. I'm probably done and will just wait for the full solution to be out.

[main rune]

It's not a clue

[fair condor]

Yes, I agree that the assertion that someone with no prior knowledge of the game could solve this anagram is farcical

[mighty sail]

Do we even know what the clue is for 9oclock yet or are we just going "IS THIS NEW" to everything in the catacombs still

[main rune]

It was a hint shared by Josh earlier today

[sleek siren]

just scan Azeroth and that's it. RNG

[wispy hawk]

People saying this is OK are seriously underestimating the "unsolvable-ness" of large anagrams, 35 letters have 35! ~= 10^40 possibilities

[heavy merlin]

so ChatGPT wouldn't have solved it, right?!

[main rune]

Well... there's a reason Ratts tells us the anagram was "unsolvable" - we had to "cheat" with wow knowledge

[safe vine]

Supposedly one of the 6 leads in the doc in the pins is correct

[wispy hawk]

Not in a million years

[fair condor]

Technically since you have only 26 letters you need to consider combinations, not permutations, so a bit but not a lot less

[mighty sail]

I'm pretty sure you can rearrange the intended solution into other plausible sounding solutions pointing at something else in wow, even keeping the word/comma structure

[proper quiver]

I know. I'm referring to a particular type of crossword puzzle where the "clues" tell you what the solution is. In this case "fresh" tells you to make "start" fresh by rearranging it.

[mental vault]

I feel like this anagram was just intentionally impossible without the Chinese solution and/or solving orb #1, but, like, why include it at all? and why encourage us to spend so much time solving it?

[vocal sentinel]

<@&285953105202511872> i know it's pinned, can we make sure to get the full explanation added to the wiki.

[echo maple]

I had the objective, quest panel minimized 🤣, though tbh i did know what the objective was.

[thorn summit]

Josh I was banned for an hour yesterday because I mention you. I found it silly but did it hurt you?

[quartz elbow]

We dont edit the wiki we are not wiki administrators

So no you have to wait for the appropriate people to do that

We manage our own official guide on wowhead and that information will be added when we are able

[slim plinth]

Wait

Noo

NOOOOO

[quartz elbow]

As with ALL information, it is added when we can and will not happen instantly due to people having irl/job/regional time differences etc

[safe vine]

its done minty

its done

im sorry

you tried harder than anyone

[slim plinth]

WHY DID HE TELL US

[proper quiver]

The thought of "what if the ui was needed in some way; is 'find ratts' relevant at all?" did cross my mind too, but I didn't make any connection

[slim plinth]

NOOOOO

[safe vine]

come be upset with us its okay this is a safe space

[proper quiver]

Someone got the answer

[main rune]

It was solved by someone else first

[slim plinth]

oh

[quartz elbow]

Because someone basically answered it

[vocal sentinel]

Thank you for the info

[slim plinth]

yay

[quartz elbow]

if you look at the pins it shows that

[crisp ridge]

This is a safe place? LOL

[slim plinth]

Someone got it, that makes me happy

[terse sail]

Yeah, we didn't have our pride hurt by being told the answer 😂

[slim plinth]

and it was something missing

[silver warren]

If any spanish speakers would like to know the answer in spanish is this: OLGRA BUSCA LA LUZ EN MENTE, CUERPO Y ESPÍRITU

[quartz elbow]

[slim plinth]

that makes me happy too

[keen quarry]

good morning...congrats on answer...though i do have to ask: was it then just a simple anagram missing "ratts"? (ie - no real formula to it)...cause i have to wonder how anyone was honestly supposed to put it all together if thats the case

[terse sail]

We had the right method, I'm happy with that

[cyan lotus]

Maldraxxus and Barrens Olgra were reacting to the torch for a while before the secret was out, after the guest relations ended without using them, 100% we would have gone there and then see the buff with no need to solve the "anagram", but then with no outside confirmation, maybe we could have been still at 9 without rulling that "clue" out... In my opinion that's not a good design for a secret ... : /

[safe vine]

it was a 45 character anagram

[proper quiver]

Anyway, take out your feelings on Ratts and not, blizz staff and go solve 9. Good work everyone!

[hollow plover]

now i think we gonna search about mankrik if i'm not mistaken

[terse sail]

I miss our relaxed madness chat here though 🙁

[olive minnow]

Maybe we should recreate this puzzle with a different phrase, and offer a shop reward when someone solves it. 😁

[slim plinth]

I’m a little sad that I slept in and missed the aha moment

[topaz cipher]

that doesnt work, one P is missing

[keen quarry]

yeah im not really sure how one would solve that then...cant you make a bajillion different anagrams technically...how would one know they were even going in right direction (especially someone with no WoW knowledge as Josh said

[safe vine]

omg he did say you dont need wow knowledge

[mystic sparrow]

So, Ratts is too good for us, her secrets are too difficult but we really like it (but we most of the time bruteforce it), maybe thats why they fired her - because she is so smart that her secrets are almost unsolvable and we have to "cheat" to solve them - cause we are dumb 😄 Not to blame her, she is too clever for us.
I really like her thinking and the way she made her secrets is amazing.

[safe vine]

how would you solve this without wow knowledge

[shadow sedge]

Excuse me, I just got back from work and saw that the puzzle has been solved. Could someone tell me exactly what needs to be done? Should I talk to Olgra?

[proper quiver]

You could likely make progress without specific wow knowledge. You're playing a fantasy game with magic after all

[fair condor]

It's unsolvable. But apparently that was the joke all along

[safe vine]

are you asking for the step or the english solution

[spring swift]

the wiki has a full walkthrough https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Incognitro,_the_Indecipherable_Felcycle#1_o'clock:_Love (with the updated explanation from in here)

[keen quarry]

welp..on to the "hard" one i guess....lol

[shadow sedge]

thanks

[slim plinth]

and someone did say “Is it maybe adding ratts name to it?”

i remember someone said that

[silver warren]

yeah bc "its right in front of us" the players

[high stone]

It doesn't matter... at all

[mighty sail]

I'm pretty sure people even got results from adding ratts name to it, just the wrong ones

[slim plinth]

I did wonder a couple of times if “Olgra” was in the solution but I discarded the idea because it felt like working backwards

ah well

my own shortsightedness

[safe hound]

Yeah keep going on spamagrams woulda got it just needed more guesswork lmao

[safe vine]

we were told not to work backwards by the dev that designed this puzzle

we were indeed meant to work backwards

🤷

[mighty sail]

I doubt it would have been solved without at least part of the translated chinese solution

admittedly using too much of it also made it impossible

[safe hound]

What cryptic crosswords do that lol theres no wordplay there

[polar yacht]

I had given up on trying to just purely anagram something because I was convinced it couldn't just be an anagram.

[slim plinth]

Ok but how funny would it have been if removing the “seal” was the answer

[safe vine]

infinitely better

[chilly kelp]

I think even without the anagram we’d have stumbled on the torch interactions, no?

[safe vine]

i was saying, we came up with some great alternatives to this puzzle