Was ist der Unterschied?
#gemäß oder zufolge
tulip stirrup
surreal anvil
Was ist der Unterschied?
"gemäß" has another meaning: more or less like "fitting, appropriate" (You don't really need to learn that, these days, we usually use "angemessen" instead.) Otherwise, the meaning is the same, except "zufolge" is far more common.
final hare
they differ in word order, don't they
"Professor Müller zufolge" versus "gemäß Professor Müller". so especially if you want to use one of them, you have to keep that in mind (or pick whichever one is easiest for you to integrate into a sentence as you're speaking)
ah look, now i also understand what you meant about "fitting/appropriate" Susana, because i was thinking "well i guess gemäß can be used with the other order too" but that's the sense of "fitting/appropriate" you meant. those senses (fitting versus according to) have a different order
at that point then i would say the "fitting/appropriate" sense is still in use.
surreal anvil
they differ in word order, don't they
Interestingly, according to DWDS, both work as a preposition as well as as a postposition.
final hare
both ?
tulip stirrup
"Professor Müller zufolge" versus "gemäß Professor Müller". so especially if you...
danke schön, das war sehr hilfreich
surreal anvil
final hare
danke schön, das war sehr hilfreich
hilfreich :p
hilfsbereit is "intent on helping", regardless of whether it was helpful or not
tulip stirrup
OH IM SORRY I FORGOT
final hare
https://www.dwds.de/wb/gem%C3%A4%C3%9F and https://www.dwds.de/wb/zufolge 🤷
okay yeah, gemäß one can use both ways in the "according to"-sense, true! i just latched onto the fact that dictionaries distinguish two definitions and that the "fitting/appropriate" sense seems to be postpositive, mea culpa
but say "zufolge des Vertrags" sounds quite unusual to me, whereas "dem Vertrag zufolge" sounds very normal
final hare
OH IM SORRY I FORGOT
i mean, no worries :p
surreal anvil
Yes, I agree. 🤷
upper pelican
but say "zufolge des Vertrags" sounds quite unusual to me, whereas "dem Vertrag ...
We can still use Genitiv even when zufolge is a postposition, right?
des Vertrags zufolge
final hare
yeah i'd not bat an eye (or ear, i guess) at that, sounds fine to me (edit: it seems i'm wrong in thinking this)
but for all i know that could be technically against some rule / one of those cases where people "overcorrect" and use a genitive where none is warranted 🤷
upper pelican
and isn't angemessen more like an adjective rather than a preposition?
Die angemessenen Angaben
final hare
yes yes
when i said "prepositive" and "postpositive" i meant to imply nothing about the part of speech. i meant those terms literally ("positioned before" versus "positioned after")
final hare
yeah i'd not bat an eye (or ear, i guess) at that, sounds fine to me (edit: it s...
aha, okay
@upper pelican while I might nod along in a conversation, that seems to be because i'm unfamiliar with the use in that position; it does indeed seem like it would be an "overcorrect", misapplied genitive
Duden says
Grammatik ⓘ
Präposition; nachgestellt mit Dativ, seltener schweizerisch und Rechtssprache vorangestellt mit Genitiv
so yeah, use the dative not the genitive and place it after the noun to be safe.
proper delta
Duden says
> Grammatik ⓘ
> Präposition; nachgestellt mit Dativ, seltener schweiz...
Muss als Schweizer sagen, dass ich "zufolge" noch nie vorangestellt mit Genitiv gesehen habe. Das klingt echt unschön mMn.
Jurist bin ich aber auch nicht.😂
final hare
:p
upper pelican
well I am Bulgarian who likes to go to Switzerland and is planning to study in Austria and is learning Hochdeutsch from a Norddeutscher and from a Bulgarian teacher who spent a half of her life in Bavaria
@final hare don't worry
Gehweg oder Bürgersteig
es ist mir egal
Die anderen sollen darauf aufpassen
Isch gut