lost-ark-help

[glossy swallow]

4 people were alive

This move kileld our support, then on x27 bingo there was only one person alive, who didn't knew, that you can DAMAGE clown during his channeling of explosion

[radiant flame]

is there a question

[glossy swallow]

there is

Why there is support shortage when you're trying to do anything on dps alts,
but if you're main support, You'll always find 6 other supports for content you're applying, thus also not finding a place

[radiant flame]

I think you know the answer to that

also you know...you can guide?

[glossy swallow]

after telling "take panacea on g2 to not die from fire" during my tries of unjail w/o support, and saying "don't fall down during m1", I wasn't mentally prepared for "Why didn't you pulled two levers at last stagger" from my teammate

[radiant flame]

shrug. i pull the other lever if someone is delayed

or hooked

[glossy swallow]

He wasn't

[radiant flame]

then pull it anyway

[glossy swallow]

He was standing IN BETWEEN of both levers, and just shooting, since he was pistoleer

[radiant flame]

ok

[glossy swallow]

I pulled my lever, then started doing stagger, noticed that it's not falling while he is shooting at boss, And then we failed

[radiant flame]

so you cant stagger without both

[glossy swallow]

Yes

[radiant flame]

ok?

idk its not like we dont experience idiots

only thing you can do is mitigate it as much as you can

[elfin basalt]

are u able to still make relic brel gear?

[lime kiln]

I never tried currency trading but how does it work? I got gold and I need crystals

[cosmic belfry]

Do they have increased clown matts drop yet? Since we just got increased brel matts.

[vast oriole]

no

[vast oriole]

yes

[glossy swallow]

Does bleed rune has any stagger?

[vast oriole]

if you want stagger, you get overwhelm

[glossy swallow]

Thanks for basic knowledge

i ask for forgotten knowledge

[vast oriole]

no it doesnt have stagger

seems logical

[glossy swallow]

Such as fact that skills without stagger in description deal sometimes more stagger than :mid ones

[vast oriole]

its not a skill

[radiant flame]

Stagger is from the skill

Bleed is not a skill

It’s just a minor dot

There are stagger tables for skills

And you can even test this yourself in trixion

Put a bleed rune on a skill and see if the stagger pixels change when the dot procs

[exotic oak]

did you appeal a penalty for this and if yes what was the outcome? It happened to my mokoko account as well kekw. Created last year decided this week to play it again and made a new char with the hyper express event all I did was daily 2x chaos and woodcutting daily to have some extra gold next week to hone to +1520

[glossy swallow]

I'm technically blind, and if bleed has any stagger, it's abysmall amount, so i would need to look at bar with my face in screen, and be sure it moves.

That's why i ask: If anyone tested, knowledge should be there to pass

[radiant flame]

There is no stagger from bleed

[vast oriole]

i mean we answered

[glossy swallow]

^

Yeah, I'm commenting right now on "test it yourself"

[outer mason]

https://youtu.be/-BCWZdLVV84
video from 1 year ago, but still relevant
Basically you buy blue crystals in packs of 95
Let's say you need 475 blue crystals, you gonna put "5" in Quantity, and for Sale Price you put the lowest value on the bottom left (for gold)

[glossy swallow]

I mean, What's the point of asking? To learn.
If there's a question, there is big chance anyone else asked same question. So why shouldn't i give it a shot, and ask

[radiant flame]

? But we answered. And I simply gave additional advice to how you can quickly find out something like this yourself

If you don’t want to that’s fine

[glossy swallow]

And i answered "ok, but i'm asking to save that time and not check myself, if it was checked already"

Asking on discord takes 10 seconds, And if anyone knows answer, replying takes also 10 seconds.

Now i would spend at least 5 minutes on : go on trixion, summon boss, select one skill which will apply bleed, and look at stagger bar

[radiant flame]

I can’t see how that takes 5 minutes. But okay. You made your point.

[glossy swallow]

Since we're talking about small amounts, that are not noticable on go through raids, it could take longer to cast bleed once to see if it does stagger,

[radiant flame]

Great

[glossy swallow]

Right now i have couple other questions that would require only answer "yes/no", but i'm afraid of asking, because i could test it on my own

[vast oriole]

ask

[glossy swallow]

Does any of those affects stagger:
Crit,
back/front attack,
damage. (be it from buffs, or from good gear)

[vast oriole]

front attack yes, rest no

[outer mason]

Back Attack - 5% damage, 10% Crit

Frontal Attack - 20% damage, 10% more stagger.

[maiden locust]

dumb question but can anyone help me? i started my first legion raid (valtan) and at the start they asked me if i wants to buy or bid on a stone or something i dont remember and after i said idk what they mean they gave up the raid lmao im a little confused

[vast oriole]

^better answer

asking if you want the stone of chaos, that is used for upgrading quality of your gear

[outer mason]

I think that's a bus

[vast oriole]

yeah most likely

[glossy swallow]

On end of each legion raid, there is auction, usually with: 1 material chest, 1legendary engraving recipe, 1 stone of chaos and 1 honing book.

So they either asked about stone that everyone skips, Or you've joined some bus lobby, that takes gold from carrying people, and they asked how you pay

[vast oriole]

did you join a lobby that stated ''wts''

[maiden locust]

ahhh

[maiden locust]

idk xd

what does that mean if the lobby is stated as wts?

[glossy swallow]

want to sell

[vast oriole]

that they sell a carry and you pay them

[maiden locust]

oh

[glossy swallow]

translating:
wts duofastbus/1000g/freebid/1slot : want to sell, 2 carries, 1000 gold for entry, we can take one more.

free bid- you can bid on whatever drops on end of dungeon.
box yours- material chest mentioned earlier.
los30t4- they advert that they are whales with big pp gear

[vast oriole]

t4 means their tier in the bussing discord

how many times they bussed etc

[glossy swallow]

might be

[vast oriole]

it is

[amber sentinel]

can i find here something like raids bonus loot calculator?

[glossy swallow]

About stupid questions: Auto attacks have stagger?

[vast oriole]

i think it does but like really really low

not sure tho

[vast oriole]

pinned message

[maiden locust]

ty now i get it i think it was a bus lobby xd

[amber sentinel]

got it thx

[glossy swallow]

how do i turn stagger here

[amber sentinel]

choose lower type of boss, they have stagger bar

or rank i dont remember

[glossy swallow]

i suppose it's full after beating half hp bar from autos

[vast oriole]

auto attacks doesnt stagger

[maiden locust]

and the raid leader also asked everyone (itemname)(playername)bid510 buy1000 or something what does that mean? @glossy swallow

[vast oriole]

they need to buy it

they search that particular item in ah

and buy it

its the way to buy bus

[maiden locust]

okok i understand

ty for ur help

[humble pulsar]

Honing from 1540 to 1580 requires 2mil shards. with doing chaos dungeons daily, thats about 200 days or more. Is that really the case

[vast oriole]

i used less than that pretty sure

depends if you pity a lot

[humble pulsar]

Seems painfully slow if you dont shards with gold

and shards are not cheap

guess akkan wont be close for me

[rigid plank]

That amount sounds like pity amount to me

[outer mason]

event gives 4x 5x Honor Shard Pouch per week (that's 20k shard per week)

[humble pulsar]

2.1 was average according to the honing calc

i guess all my gold is gonna slowly go to honor shards

or maybe ill just take it slow

[vast oriole]

take it slow

buy shards from event, guild shop, pirate ships

[humble pulsar]

yeh taking it slow would be best

but thinking of if chaos dungeon is the only source, im looking at 7 months away from akkan xD

but obviously there are other sources

[vernal venture]

Yo

At which brelshaza gate can we reward Esther drop ?

[radiant flame]

front attack stagger bonus only applies to attacks which are frontal

So there are only very specific instances which that matters

[glossy swallow]

That's pretty obvious tho,

anyone aside of gl and destroyer has front attacks tho?

[maiden locust]

Gunslinger

[radiant flame]

Idk, what’s obvious to you isn’t obvious to other people

[glossy swallow]

Might be true

[radiant flame]

A lot of people don’t understand that front/back attack bonuses apply only to skills with that designation

[maiden locust]

Also buckshot, bard main

[radiant flame]

And tbh that’s not really intuitive at all

Instant hit on scrapper

[glossy swallow]

spec bard main. Counters are fully random, meter generation is more important

[radiant flame]

Stomp on slayer

[vast oriole]

even on swift bard you dont use buckshot

[radiant flame]

you take it sometimes for counter mechs

[vast oriole]

not really

ah you mean slayer skill?

nvm

[radiant flame]

🤷🏻‍♂️ buckshot is a much better counter

[vast oriole]

u have better skills than equip buckshot

[radiant flame]

Yes

But if you need the counter

[vast oriole]

and msot classes have better counter than bard

[maiden locust]

If you’re holding prelude for counter you lose

[radiant flame]

And sometimes nobody can counter for you

[vast oriole]

i hold prelude only in g1 brel and g6 at x7

rest of the times, dps have better counters

if i have a pally or gl in raid, they need to counter

if they dont, i kick

[radiant flame]

But that’s your choice lol

[vast oriole]

im pretty sure most bards say the same

buckshot is shit

[radiant flame]

Ultimately buckshot is a much better counter than prelude

[vast oriole]

better to take stigma for meter gen

ofc its better

[radiant flame]

So idk what the problem is

[vast oriole]

but other than counter, its a shit skill

no problem, i dont like holding a skill and when i will use it, someone will counter faster

[glossy swallow]

swift bards can counter with prelude no problem, If i have only slight problem with countering important mechs

ohter counters are 50-50, if i;'ll randomly hit

[radiant flame]

Prelude is just a shit counter.

[vast oriole]

ofc

[radiant flame]

Basically no range, no paralysis immune

[vast oriole]

but its fine for when you require a counter

[glossy swallow]

better than deadly slash from sh

[vast oriole]

is that the purple skill

[radiant flame]

On g6 no problem with taking buckshot over sh

[vast oriole]

i dont take sh

i take stigma

[radiant flame]

What do you take, rhapsody? Lol

That’s even less useful

[vast oriole]

yeah to not move

i have a lot of ping

and i play with a sorc that likes to tank damage

[radiant flame]

Right so for most of us, rhapsody is useless right

[vast oriole]

yeah

[radiant flame]

So again it’s personal 🤷🏻‍♂️

[vast oriole]

i just mean that it doesnt require buckshot

[radiant flame]

Not saying you’re wrong

[lavish grove]

The Ultimate Slayer Infoset

Below you can find a comprehensive list of useful information for the Slayer class. This list is not exhaustive, but it should give you a good idea of what to expect from the class.

​

Slayer Community Guide

This information was created by community members · Jul 24, 2023, 4:12 PM

[radiant flame]

No of course it doesn’t

[glossy swallow]

I like rhapsody on spec bard, I don't complain with meter generation, and it allows me to somehow repair lower uptime on shields

Tho paladin skill with 80% damage reduction is easier to hit imo

[vast oriole]

i think if i were to replace rhapsody for g6, i would just take sonatina

[radiant flame]

And have no mana at all?

[vast oriole]

but i have max mp3 so

[radiant flame]

Lol

[vast oriole]

i dont do g6 anyway since i got pets

[lavish grove]

The Ultimate Paladin Infoset

Below you can find a comprehensive list of useful information for the Paladin class. This list is not exhaustive, but it should give you a good idea of what to expect from the class.

​

Paladin Community Guide

This information was created by community members · Jul 24, 2023, 4:14 PM

The Ultimate Sorceress Infoset

Below you can find a comprehensive list of useful information for the Sorceress class. This list is not exhaustive, but it should give you a good idea of what to expect from the class.

​

Sorceress Community Guide

This information was created by community members · Jul 24, 2023, 4:14 PM

[prisma widget]

what are engraving combinations

like

4x3

and such

[shy chasm]

4 rank 3 engravings

[prisma widget]

ah i see tysm

[fiery phoenix]

Hi, is there a way I can do a 5x3 engraving with a 9/6 stone and class engraving at 9?

[radiant flame]

yes

yes

[vast oriole]

you can just craft epic

[radiant flame]

lol

it will not pay off

it literally takes

years for you to see that value

ok

and it is maybe - at best - maybe 10% better than a good epic tool

and that's really at its peak

i mean, just dont think about it

you just need super armour

i mean you can craft if you want.

just dont expect immediate returns

thats all

and you're not going to run 30 plat fields

trust me

you're going to get bored after about 2

must be a good friend

you could just

play something else

and not farm in a game for...another person

anyway, just a suggestion. just sounds like you're basically...a living bot

i used to enjoy doing 2v2 pooling strats in starcraft but this is another level

[glossy swallow]

Is there any reason people runs re-clears of inferno raids, other than fun/selling titles?

[radiant flame]

mosty fun

i think you have to appreciate that the number of "sellers" are very low

a lot of people just enjoy hell raiding full stop

as it presents a different challenge than normal raids, which quickly becomes outgeared

[glossy swallow]

sellers are low, but there are still 1590 lvls who fail valtan hard mode with deathless title

[radiant flame]

sure, but one seller can have many customers

im sure people buy hell titles

im just saying its not unusual at all to reclear hell

[glossy swallow]

It's kinda weird aspect for me, Title should be your ego-reward for doing something hard

[radiant flame]

plenty of people reclear to help friends

why weird

people gatekeep on titles

pretty sure hell titles get insta accepted into a bunch of raids

for some people if you determine cost/benefit in terms of time waiting in PF without hell title compared to time waiting in PF with

[glossy swallow]

Technically it's true.

sad but true

[radiant flame]

getting a bus to get a title might be the best way forward

[glossy swallow]

"you don't have phantom legion commander title? sorry, your1500 alt is not getting into clown"

[radiant flame]

ofc

i dont run clown in non skip parties

i just dont have time

[glossy swallow]

~~ at least you avoid 18 hours jail~~

[vast oriole]

Innever accept hell titles

90% of the times they are full egoboosted and annoying af

[radiant flame]

maybe true. usually the legitimate clearers are good players though

[vast oriole]

Ye nit talking if good players

Its about the attitude

[fiery phoenix]

Hi. By any chance, anyone able to help me create a 5x3 engraving? Apparently I am able to without having my class engraving at 12. And my dumb brain isn't able to make one with my 9/6 stone

[vast oriole]

Almost every hell players i met are complete a**holes

[radiant flame]

lol raiding is 90% silent

[radiant flame]

whats is your stone

what do you want

[glossy swallow]

he said 9/6 stone

[radiant flame]

engravings

[glossy swallow]

[fiery phoenix]

Ambush master 9/ adrenaline 6
This is how my accesories look, but i didn't know I could get 5x3 without my class engraving

[radiant flame]

you have 2 3/3s

you need a 5/3 and a 4/3

at least

your adrenaline should be 6+4+5

punisher 9+3+3

[fiery phoenix]

Yeah, I had these like this bc I'll eventually get my class engraving

[radiant flame]

idk what you want me to solve then?

[fiery phoenix]

But now I realized I don't need it. So I want to get there without having to change my whole accesories

[radiant flame]

you can also get 6/0 class if you want

[fiery phoenix]

I need 1 more week to get to 1540

[radiant flame]

i would probably wait until 1540. you need high spec for punisher

[fiery phoenix]

Tyvm!

[radiant flame]

so you cant skimp on quality

[fiery phoenix]

My quility isn't that bad except for my neck

[radiant flame]

neck is most important

[vast oriole]

neck is the most important

u can cheap on the rings

[fiery phoenix]

I have 1712 at the moment

[radiant flame]

that's quite low

you want to do 1.0 cycle asap tbh

[glossy swallow]

rings provide up to 200 stat, earrings 300 iirc, and necklace up to 500 with 2 stats, so 1000 together,

so quality on neck is pretty important

[radiant flame]

if you're stuck on 1.5 cycle its going to feel bad

[fiery phoenix]

Yeah my neck sucks

I'm on 1.5 yeah

[radiant flame]

you cannot cheap on neck

i do not go under 85 on neck

personally

[fiery phoenix]

Ok, thank you!

[glossy swallow]

worth to mention, that quality on necklace is split between two stats not equally

[vast oriole]

yea u want the highest spec u can get

[worn oar]

Hey guys, is there possibly another honing nerf that can come when we get akkan?

[fiery phoenix]

I should aim for 1800?

[radiant flame]

yes but both stats are usually important so again, high q is important

[vast oriole]

dont forget that u will get free 20 spec for upgrading bracelet

[radiant flame]

no there is a breakpoint in guide

[glossy swallow]

As spec class, you aim for spec as high as possible, there is no "optimal"

[vast oriole]

at 1540

[glossy swallow]

more=better

[fiery phoenix]

My bracelt is at 93 spec but doesn't have crit

[radiant flame]

shrug. up to you how to make your character

if its an alt maybe you dont care as much

[glossy swallow]

Aside of quality, is there any use for that one?

[vast oriole]

no

[fiery phoenix]

I do care xD

[glossy swallow]

[radiant flame]

lol, marking spirit absorption

[glossy swallow]

destroyers sometimes run it, and spec bard gear with high quality might yield some profit

[vast oriole]

sa accs are cheap

only gt des, spec bard and artist run it

[glossy swallow]

swift spec necklace with high quality, sa and some other useful engrave are still more gold than just trashing

[vast oriole]

not sure about that

[glossy swallow]

on my spec bard i would rather buy cheaper necklace with sa than some other one costing me my entire budget

because i can't run spec+endurance, since it's considered trolling even more

[vast oriole]

4k gold

[glossy swallow]

+3+3

not like you need more with drops and sa since they are cheap engraves, so you can get both at +12, but

[vast oriole]

i mean yeah youre spec bard

but 90% of bards are not spec

[glossy swallow]

as long as there is more than 3 users, there is demand

and where's demand, there is profit

4k is more than 10 gold worth of dismantling

[viral ginkgo]

can you not get excavating maps when you excavate in rowen?

or am i just unlucky

nor any chests spawn

[radiant flame]

r n g

[glossy swallow]

is there any difference if you excavate in rowen, elgacia, or vern

[radiant flame]

none

[viral ginkgo]

sure?

[radiant flame]

yes

[viral ginkgo]

its been like 30k energy and neither dropped

[radiant flame]

i havent got a map from the last 100k

[viral ginkgo]

but did you get one in rowen before?

or a chest

[radiant flame]

i dont excavate there often

but i am 100% certain its possible to drop there

[viral ginkgo]

ok so probaly dont exist

thank yo

you should get them way more often thn that

[radiant flame]

i guess you know more about this than me

[viral ginkgo]

i guess i excavate alot

but not been on rowen for too long

[radiant flame]

i mean it sounds like you have an entirely different client

if you can drop a map every 30k life energy

[viral ginkgo]

maps come from chests mostly

and i drop chests atleast once per 10k energy

in other places

[vast oriole]

yeah so youre lucky

[radiant flame]

or yeah, t he more likely scenario

rowen is bugged in your game

just yours

[viral ginkgo]

lucky idk i excavate on 3 accounts

and my main acc is the only one in rowen

and never get shit

[radiant flame]

well, idk why you're asking us if you are the excavation master and know how it is

[viral ginkgo]

this is why im asking?

what

[radiant flame]

?!

[viral ginkgo]

im new to rowen

asking if anyone knows

since i dont

[radiant flame]

yes, and i answered

there is no difference

[viral ginkgo]

yes and then i asked since they dont seem to exist and you never got one?

so obviously there seem to be a difference?

[radiant flame]

right, because I only excavate on...my one account and i dont generally do it in rowen since i got my omnium star there

what do you mean there is obviously a difference

i'm telling you a fact that there is no difference

there is no logical reason why there is any difference

[viral ginkgo]

and you dont have anything to back that fact up if you never seen a chest nor a map in rowen...

anyway we're done here

thanks for your time

[radiant flame]

thanks for asking us!

[viral ginkgo]

🤝

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cute-happy-jumping-gif-26555219

[vast oriole]

[grim lotus]

Arna

Cats pic when

[vast oriole]

never

[prisma widget]

https://tenor.com/view/smilecat-gif-25781442

we need cat

give banana cat mount

[maiden locust]

is the 5k life energy from maris worth for profit?

bout 100 crystals

[south jungle]

is this real?

[floral saffron]

xddd

tierlists

[south jungle]

is it t old?

[floral saffron]

tierlists are stupid

any class can do dps

except for reflux sorc

[shut pasture]

Has nothing to do with old, it has to do with tier lists being worthless for this game

[floral saffron]

especially with gs and deadeye being at the very bottom

theyre both good classes

[vast oriole]

deadeye gs bottom

glaivier c

arcana not being s or a

[floral saffron]

im assuming thats some dogshit based on bal patch

[vast oriole]

[floral saffron]

but deadeye is bottom

so it cant be

bc pistoleer is gigabusted

[vast oriole]

na the eprson has no clue

first

you dont base a tierlist with classes but engravings if you REALLY want to

true courage bard a tier

[floral saffron]

xdd

[vast oriole]

ez top dps

[south jungle]

but how can i find out if a char is good or nah

[shut pasture]

They are all good.

[floral saffron]

literally play anyone

[shut pasture]

Literally just play any class you want to

Simple as that

[floral saffron]

everyone can top dps everyone can bottom dps

[vast oriole]

you know how to know if a class is good? watch videos about it and see if the skills or gameplay appeals to you

thats the secret

[prisma widget]

how do u get 5 engravings i swear 4 is the max

[vast oriole]

you will be bad on a class if you dont like it, even if its the msot broken shit

[shut pasture]

Every class is kept pretty well within a viable spectrum, some things are lower some things are higher, but even if something is lower doesn't mean its bad. This game does not have steep DPS checks, like ever. Just pick a class you like, or classes, and play em.

[shut pasture]

The right stone, the right accessories and 2x legendary books for whichever respective engravings you're using

[prisma widget]

ah i see

tysm

i got a choice for punisher or predator but i picked the wrong engraving

[shut pasture]

How do you mean?

[prisma widget]

by this

i picked the wrong one lol

[radiant flame]

um,

rip 15k

[prisma widget]

somehow i got the option to pick an engraving without knowing what it was

[shut pasture]

Well you need 20 of those anyway, but also can you not sell it on the Market?

[prisma widget]

oh true

[radiant flame]

its not

tradable

its from the express

[prisma widget]

ive only just started and learned what engravings are lol

[shut pasture]

Yeah just saw that

Nvm, can't sell it unfortunately

[radiant flame]

you've learnt a valuable lesson in not opening stuff you don't know about

[prisma widget]

what happens if i learn it

can i still go for a punisher?

[radiant flame]

you can

[shut pasture]

Yeah, you can

Its not "you're stuck here forever"

[prisma widget]

ah i see

i wanna switch freely between both

[shut pasture]

Not freely

But...sure

[radiant flame]

I strongly advise against this

[prisma widget]

lol im new and idk what im doing

[radiant flame]

if you are new

[prisma widget]

i got a powerpass somehow and skipped it all

[shut pasture]

Yeah for one its expensive

[radiant flame]

in this game switching between builds is basically building an entire new character

[prisma widget]

oh

ig ill stick to punisher

[shut pasture]

Besides, the way those books work is you have to open them in order.

You need 20x green books, then 20x blue then 20x purple and then you need 20x legendary

[rose wren]

community is just bad, if u arent going with meta, basically stuck

[jovial urchin]

not true, sounds like a personal problem

[floral saffron]

stfu bitch

[shut pasture]

And even then the books are only the things you're equipping into your Engraving Slots on your character page

[jovial urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/snoop-dogg-rapper-raper-angry-anger-gif-17002797

[shut pasture]

Engravings are a whole system you'll need to figure out

[prisma widget]

i have a chest for green ones

[floral saffron]

engravings arent too complicated once you figure it out

they're very simple

[prisma widget]

i did a tutorial on them but still didnt understand it lol

ill probably search it on yt

[floral saffron]

tl;dr 2 +12s from books 2 +x from a stone

and then everything else from accs

[rose wren]

u'll know it when ya aint new

[lusty radish]

wtf is with the card enhancing system

do i need a duplicate card to awaken the card ? lmao

[shut pasture]

Yup

[lusty radish]

after enhancing it

[rose wren]

yes

[lusty radish]

good lord

[shut pasture]

And it increases for each awakening "node"

[lusty radish]

lmaooo

what

[rose wren]

its how u gain set bonus

[lusty radish]

yeah i know that

[floral saffron]

here is a very simple example of how to hit 5 at lvl 3 @prisma widget

[shut pasture]

First node only needs the single duplicate card, 2nd node you need 2 additional duplicates, and so on

[jovial urchin]

you need total of 16 cards to get awa 5

[blazing crow]

does anybody know how much orehas crafting superiors give you?

[lusty radish]

wow thats crazy honestly

ty tho

[prisma widget]

ah i see tysm

[shut pasture]

Its why we tell people not to FOMO out over cards, and why if they are going to shoot for anything the easiest thing to aim for is Deep Dive 18

[floral saffron]

if you get a stone better than 6/5 you can buy different accs and it'll be cheaper

but if you get a 6/5 stone with engravings you want its not really worth it to go higher

[lusty radish]

yeah i just got the deep dive set put together

guess i shouldnt worry too much about awakening 18 then ?

[floral saffron]

on what

[lusty radish]

but just add to it when i can

[floral saffron]

deepdive?

[lusty radish]

yeah

[floral saffron]

i would reccommend still stalking lostmerchants

and grabbing 18

[lusty radish]

have been doing that

[floral saffron]

you'll get it fairly fast

[lusty radish]

aight got you thanks

[floral saffron]

you can also run 18 until you have los 18

[shut pasture]

Deep Dive 18 is a good holdover while LoS18/LoS30 just happens over time

[lusty radish]

yeah was hoping for los18 but didnt realise you had to get duplicate cards

so that will definitely be later

[floral saffron]

the 4 blues are incredibly easy to get and they are combined 20 awakenings

if you max them all out

[lusty radish]

ah yeah i guess that makes life easier for sure

ill work on that first

ty so much

[outer mason]

it crafts x20

[radiant flame]

Mizu where are your azenas

[floral saffron]

idk man

you fucking tlel me

where are they

PLEASE

where are they

im 2+2 thriain 2+2 shandi 2+1 balthoor

then fucking 1 wei 0 azena 0 kadan

[radiant flame]

At least no kadan trap

[floral saffron]

i have 0 kadan too xdd

my server actually gets no weis bro

its insane

we get like oncea month

and we're yet to get a balthoor or armen

oh we did get 1 vaigrys that i missed

rip bozo

[radiant flame]

I missed mine too 😦 rip 3 crit

[floral saffron]

which book is he even part of

i forgor

[sturdy lichen]

have anyone tried to play with a vpn?
i tried nordvpn and it only shows SA server
exitlag maybe? anyone tried it?

[floral saffron]

oh yeah he gives 2 spec too

[wraith basin]

yes, if they're trusted on steam

[vast oriole]

my server got 2 balthorr and 2 armen in 4 days

[floral saffron]

stfu bitch

idc

[vast oriole]

🤡

[brittle tangle]

do we get arcteus touch for hard mode brel?

or only normal

[vast oriole]

both

[brittle tangle]

so do you get 40 doing G1G4 with Arc.Touch Normal mode?
10 + 10 G1G2
10+10 G3G4 ?

[outer mason]

yep

[rustic ridge]

Does both NM and HM brel give a 1st clear box or is it just one now?

[grim lotus]

Wow

[safe mural]

what gives?

[radiant flame]

Just one

[prisma widget]

whats a fun class to play but also performs well in end game

actually nvm

[trail hawk]

thats on you to try out....

[wraith basin]

he found the slayer button

[prisma widget]

i did

but i also got a runika pass and used it now i regret it

idk what half the stuff i have does lol

so im starting fresh

[wraith basin]

oh boy have fun

alt+q has most of the stuff you wanna do daily/weekly and the hammer npc increases your ilvl

[prisma widget]

yh

i thought that since my friends are all on story which i skipped i might as well start fresh

[trail hawk]

gold -> blue crystals -> aura

[midnight nimbus]

You can buy blue crystals with gold, and then buy aura with that

[prisma widget]

is bard good

[trail hawk]

every classs is good

bard is support class

[prisma widget]

i meant like good as a support sorry

im probably gonna be doing main quest solo

[drifting hatch]

Bard is a great support

[prisma widget]

but with dungeons my party need a support so

cool

[midnight nimbus]

Not worth imo. It's very convenient, but if anything I'd probably pay real money rather than spending gold on aura

[trail hawk]

depends how much gold youre making per week...

and what the gold -> crystal ratio is

[radiant flame]

I personally think aura is trash

There isn’t much it gives us. AGS/SG actually gave us a bunch of paid for stuff in KR as standard

Like 10% pet stat buff

[trail hawk]

you can repair in raids without aura now?

[radiant flame]

No

But 🤷🏻‍♂️ I don’t think that’s super useful outside of progging

And for progging you get so much free aura anyway

[floral saffron]

just be a hell gamer only

no aura needed if you only do hell

[radiant flame]

Or that

[floral saffron]

aura is pretty unworth it right now though

with how high conversion rates are

[radiant flame]

AGS = Amazon game services (west publisher), SG = smilegate (KR developer)

[floral saffron]

i like DN

theyre my fav

[radiant flame]

100%

I’ve never spent gold on aura

Why do you need 60?

[floral saffron]

^

levels arent a substantial mount of skillpoints

[radiant flame]

Nothing special about 60 other than level 12s…and that soaks more points

Then change stuff now

[floral saffron]

get sp pots

if oyu need skill points

levels dont give that many

[radiant flame]

And yeah slowly get some horizontal stuff

What do you play?

You just need 10s on most stuff

That looks fine

I would drop sh to 7

Take prelude to 10

[floral saffron]

leveling to 60 wont change much there

you just need to do horizontals

[radiant flame]

Your build is otherwise completely fine

Er

I mean bard is quite flexible

I ran with your build for everything

[vapid bluff]

does the name of the legendary secret map from southvern chaos gate matter in terms of rewards?

[radiant flame]

I’ve only recently changed rhapsody to stigma for more meter

[radiant flame]

No

They’re the same

[floral saffron]

the map name doesnt matter

its just the rank

either blue can run together either purple can run together either leg can run together

[vapid bluff]

someone from my party said because mine was named different despite all having the same tier and he left party

oooh i see yea figured

[trail hawk]

its random roll everytime you craft it

but purple has 3 rolls, legend 4, relic 5

[radiant flame]

purples cost hardly anything

i would just get purples

yes

i am still using purples

[rose wren]

but do u have decent stats

[obtuse igloo]

where to get charisma potion

[rose wren]

look ingame codex it tell u how on each 1

[midnight nimbus]

What's typically cheaper? 3x +5 class accessory or 20x books & +1 class accessory?

[radiant flame]

depends on the class

but most of the time, the books

mainly because quality

and also you dont need to buy a whole new set when you upgrade to ancient

you can also just...check the market

[floral saffron]

if you really dont wanna buy books just cut a 7/7 and use 2 3 class accs

atleast then you can keep one at ancient

[rose wren]

its stupid how people price 'em

[radiant flame]

price what

books?

[rose wren]

class access

[radiant flame]

lol why

its supply/demand

class accs are rare

[rose wren]

not that high tho

[radiant flame]

only people who play that class can drop

well, you can price yours low then

[floral saffron]

class accs are extremely annoying to get

especially usable and good class accs

[radiant flame]

^

[floral saffron]

hence why theyre always the most pricey in builds

since the drop rate buff theyve lowered a bit on kr

[radiant flame]

theres just very very low supply

[floral saffron]

but theyre still more expensive

iirc saint got a 90 qual se acc for like 70k

[radiant flame]

just spent a week looking for my pinnacle acc

[floral saffron]

thank god we get 5x3 with se express

will have a couple months to find her acc

[vast oriole]

better wealth on prelude, prelude to 10 because its big generator

guardian tune to 7

[midnight nimbus]

was this confirmed?

[radiant flame]

no hes talking about KR

we dont have se

confirmed

[floral saffron]

we get the express that kr gets so

yes when we get se it should come with free 5x3

[radiant flame]

in 2025 😄

[floral saffron]

thats too soon

[heady hollow]

I’m selling a class acc currently and there’s only 4 entire accs on the entire market with this engraving combo

So it makes since for their price

[midnight nimbus]

what? I was asking a question

[heady hollow]

[heady hollow]

No it’s not confirmed, ags is pushing for it though

[rose wren]

have u look at recent price too?

[floral saffron]

it is confirmed for se express

[heady hollow]

Yep, still roughly what I’m selling it for

[floral saffron]

we're not talking about aero

[rose wren]

wealth...

[radiant flame]

you do

wealth and c/j

[floral saffron]

even if you dont need the runes you should still work to get them

[radiant flame]

c/j

is v important

[vast oriole]

sv and ss/harp

[radiant flame]

sv, sound shock

[floral saffron]

oh boy the supp nerd is here

go away arna ur cringe

she went away

it worked

[vast oriole]

c/j is pretty mandatory on bard, im pretty sure its written in the guide

please dont follow maxroll for skills

its bad

[lavish grove]

The Ultimate Bard Infoset

Below you can find a comprehensive list of useful information for the Bard class. This list is not exhaustive, but it should give you a good idea of what to expect from the class.

​

Bard Community Guide

This information was created by community members · Jul 24, 2023, 9:00 PM

[rose wren]

fucking dumb, they use website instead of just doc now

[vast oriole]

yeah and its bad

[rose wren]

going back and forth

[floral saffron]

its annoying lowkey

its cool but

having the links in the guide is just more convenient

[rose wren]

either port the whole thing to website or

[floral saffron]

i might ask civo about it

bc google docs can get rly buggy when theres more than like 30 ppl on it at once

[river harbor]

I’ve been following that and as a first time mmorpg player I even feel the skills are off

[vast oriole]

i told you some changes

[river harbor]

How often does people offer LP here?

[vast oriole]

i wouldnt use rhapsody if you dont know pattern of the bosses and people you play with btw

in 90% of cases its useless

you go double branding usually but harp requires to be 10

msot bards dont play with ss anymnore, takes toomuch mana

like, unless its a barrage or a igniter, usually people dont stay in rhapsody to greed dmg anyway

[floral saffron]

if only bards were like artist

could regen 3/4ths of their mana with one skill xdd

[vast oriole]

bard has probably the worst skill design of the 3 supports

[rose wren]

should i choose something else, lookwise... holding for aero, i dont have the best graphics

[prisma widget]

most of bards skills look the same to me icl

[prisma widget]

whats the most popular class engraving ppl go for on summoner?

[dull sky]

hi

I am struggling a lot to into a legion game

dont wanna cry about gate keepers doing gate keeping I need a website to help me build engraving

[outer mason]

you can type /class (e.g. for striker type /striker) for the community guide of that class

[prisma widget]

i forgot about that

[lavish grove]

The Ultimate Summoner Infoset

Below you can find a comprehensive list of useful information for the Summoner class. This list is not exhaustive, but it should give you a good idea of what to expect from the class.

​

Summoner Community Guide

This information was created by community members · Jul 24, 2023, 9:32 PM

[rose wren]

master summoner

[lavish grove]

@dull sky

The Ultimate Striker Infoset

Below you can find a comprehensive list of useful information for the Striker class. This list is not exhaustive, but it should give you a good idea of what to expect from the class.

​

Striker Community Guide

This information was created by community members · Jul 24, 2023, 9:33 PM

[prisma widget]

master?

ok

is that most popular?

[rose wren]

yea instant big dmg instead of other 1

[prisma widget]

whats other one

[rose wren]

in the guide look xD

see what u prefer

[prisma widget]

lmao ok i will

i just want a dps

i wanted to play bard but my friends went both paladin so i gotta be one of the dps in the party

[rigid plank]

https://loa-todo.com/engrave

[dull sky]

here ?

[outer mason]

yes

[lavish grove]

The Ultimate Deathblade Infoset

Below you can find a comprehensive list of useful information for the Deathblade class. This list is not exhaustive, but it should give you a good idea of what to expect from the class.

​

Deathblade Community Guide

This information was created by community members · Jul 24, 2023, 9:39 PM

[dull sky]

the one bug there is

you need gold for builds

you need legion raid for gold

you need builds for legion raid

🤣

thanks anyway guys ❤️

[polar zenith]

so chaos dungeon has those blue orbs that give ms, how much swift is required to max out ms with those blue orbs

[outer mason]

blue orbs always give max move speed

[polar zenith]

oh so if running RC, then no extra swift is required aside from desired attack speed?

[heady hollow]

class acc sold

[outer mason]

yes as long as the keep the blue orbs buff active, you gain full benefits from Raid Captain, regardless of your Swiftness

[polar zenith]

sweet thanks

[rose wren]

not even ancient ,whalers

[heady hollow]

probably couldve sold it for more

easy 130k though

[floral saffron]

you couldve gotten liek 150 with that

gave it to the elcheapos

[heady hollow]

i am

impatient

[lime kestrel]

where i can get second awaking skill?

[midnight nimbus]

Is this worth it? It feels like a lot of blue crystals >_>

[rose wren]

well that be oreha stuff huh... hmm

[rose jewel]

awakening quest line after rohendel, takes 7hrs, or use a powerpass (like punika from event) and you get it asap, for alts go to trixion

[lime kestrel]

ty

[radiant flame]

Worth it in the long run. Up to you

[midnight nimbus]

like "a year" long-term? Couple months?

[lament hornet]

meh

[rustic oracle]

guys when transfer to brel/ancient gear do the quality transfers too?

[outer mason]

yes

[midnight nimbus]

Well, the quality transfers if the old one's higher. (You always end up with the better quality of the two)

[timber mauve]

Weak

[prisma widget]

whats dps like for shadowhunter

[timber mauve]

On the lower end

[prisma widget]

oof

compared to summoner?

[timber mauve]

Summoner is like top 3 dps in the game.

[prisma widget]

ah i see

i just thought shadow hunter looked cool lol

like the demon mode

[timber mauve]

They’re all kept within a relatively close margin, but shadow is noticeably lower dps.

Same with scouter.

[prisma widget]

oof

[still nymph]

whenever I try to log onto my character lost ark crashes. has happened 3 times so far

[gaunt condor]

Hello how hard is g3-g4 brel compared to g1-g2?

[heady hollow]

[heady hollow]

the mechanics are relatively easy, more involved than g1 and g2 though. g3 should be pretty easy to learn, g4 is usually where people struggle since they have trouble remembering where to be and what mech they need to do

all in all, if your party only has like 1-2 learners in it, it shouldnt be very hard or take very long

[gaunt condor]

Bruhh im worried actually

[gaunt condor]

And if most of us are learners..?

[heady hollow]

then get ready to commit multiple hours to progress

and thats okay

because thats normal

[gaunt condor]

[heady hollow]

shapes are honestly not that bad that people make it out to be, unless your doing stars on a weird class or something

once you get where the shapes actually spawn, its ezpz

since the only 3 ways of messing up the mech is if someone doesnt kill their shapes in time, either of the star players mess up, or if someone takes a shape that doesnt belong to them

thus, if everyone knows where to go, should be relatively easy

[gaunt condor]

Ahh T_T

[heady hollow]

if your party has gunslingers, i reccomend telling them to do stars, since they are probably the best class to do them

[grave leaf]

uh

[gaunt condor]

As a SH with demonic is it fine?

[grave leaf]

i just failed an 100% skill transfer...

how is that possible?

[heady hollow]

i dont play sh so im not too sure how they fair dealing with stars

[heady hollow]

im sure you didnt, and just misread something

[grave leaf]

aight...

[heady hollow]

i think "dont quote me on this" that sh can just auto the stars in demonic form

from what ive heard

[gaunt condor]

o.o

intronsting

[grave leaf]

i feel incredible, i reached a point in this game where i look in my inventory and i know what the hell everything is.

[rose wren]

r u sure

[grave leaf]

aye... i dont understand the raids and stuff quite yet, and some system are still a lil tought too grasp, but i dont have any items anymore that i just dont understand

when i started this game i got bombarded with shit, i felt like i playe a moblie game with claim this that reward, but know i finnaly understand the core items XD

[maiden locust]

wasn't this quest supposed to be added with the july patch its not here yet

[midnight nimbus]

is this setting per character?

[gloomy path]

You need to save transformation for stars, W-first star, auto attack(3hitcombo) second star, W-third star.

The window for holding transformation is potentially short or really long, depending on if the boss goes into counter pattern right before mechanic, be patient and just sit back in human form and be full gauge at around 44-50bars.

Or if you're feeling risky you can just auto attack all 3 stars, you most likely have enough time if inana is used.

(Previous is assuming you 1shot with W-skill)

[gaunt condor]

Useful, thanks !

[shut pasture]

Yes

[lapis ginkgo]

Hi, is that ok to get atk speed debuff for a sup char?

[quasi tree]

I mean atk power doesnt affect you and neither does defense down if you use any level of heavy armor

Get those instead of movement speed or attack speed down

[lapis ginkgo]

well i will have to wait for another necklae then ;=;
i mean.. full swift will atkspeed really influence?

[quasi tree]

Not the end of the world

[harsh dawn]

wtf is this

oh

x42

whys it make it so confusing

OH wait this is help

[minor briar]

no

[minor briar]

u kinda want atk speed on supports so that u can cast things faster and not get them cancelled

and u dont get ur own yearning 8/10/12 % so

[maiden locust]

ty wonder what quest they were talking about in the patch

[minor briar]

u usually wont have max unless u run some variant of SA

[minor briar]

its an after story after u do that epilogue for elga

the one about the sword of lazeniths ||disbanding||

[maiden locust]

do you know where i can start it

[minor briar]

have u started the epilogue?

purple quest in the middle of elga

[maiden locust]

thanks i see it now

[pine agate]

how much damage is relic > ancient accessories with same quality

it's like 2k str/dex

[floral saffron]

Going from full relic to full ancient is like

2% or lower iirc

It’s not worth the pheons

Only got ancient if ur building +1 tbh

People won’t really gatekeep +1 until much later

[pine agate]

thats p low, ty

[ancient turret]

in kr, do we get this twice or once?

[minor briar]

i think they mightve only gotten it once? from pc cafe tracker

[floral saffron]

I’m pretty sure kr got all the halos.

Iirc

I remember soup saying smth like that

[minor briar]

oh, wasnt a select chest? i got no clue

but heard it was from pc cafe thing

[ember vale]

12 set kazero or los 18 for kayangel?

[floral saffron]

Klc 12

It gives 10% for 2-4

Los 18 only gives 7

[ember vale]

ok tyty

[ancient turret]

ah ok

good to know

i want the black one

[floral saffron]

It doesn’t mean we’ll get it.

[sage coral]

since akkan will release soon is investing in blue/purple oreha a good idea?

[vapid crater]

Hey, do you guys know why i cant go for the "infinte darkness" quest ? I'm right in front of the NPC and the 2 past quest are done 😦

(please 🙏🏻 )

[tawdry yoke]

is it better to open normal legendary card pack or abyss?

[vital shard]

For los its abyss

[floral saffron]

Do you play supports and need lostwind?

Then open the original

Do you play dps and need klc?

Then open abyss

[rose jewel]

you completed the quests on other char

[tawdry yoke]

Mainly dps

[floral saffron]

.

[tawdry yoke]

Ty

[minor briar]

theres a new oreha coming with akkan so who knows if old ones r gonna go up or down in price

[arctic pasture]

what do i do if my card collection is full do i delete some? or expand with crystals?

[quasi tree]

Should be the same odds for LoS. You're just gambling lwc vs klc

[heady hollow]

expand with crystals or just put the cards in storage for now

dont delete

[arctic pasture]

but like im forced to expand eventually right? when i need to collect the proper cards for builds etc

[heady hollow]

i mean kinda

[minor briar]

never delete

[heady hollow]

but im saying if u dont have the crystals to expand currently

just put them in storage for now

[minor briar]

or just store them on an alt storage til u can buy

[arctic pasture]

i have 200 crystals and im f2p so is it worth it to spend for card slots or use them for something else

[minor briar]

u have to eventually

also u can just buy more bc later

when its cheaper to convert with gold

[arctic pasture]

ok ill just use em for the card slots rn

[misty token]

Hey guys
Can someone help me ?
I m stuck at game assist

[minor briar]

wats that?

[drifting igloo]

I think hes talking about the narration thing (???)

[zealous crescent]

So I saw the infographic, how do you build 5x3+1 with 9/6 stone and purple class book? Since 9/5 is minimum for 5x3+1 with full ancient apparently in my case

nvm figured a distribution

[sick walrus]

Can i reroll t3 gems on a newly created character? Or I have to reach ilvl for t3 first?

[rigid plank]

My assumption is no you can't until t3, cuz it's technically not unlocked yet for that character

[ember vale]

is ancient gear glow +21 and +22 the same?

my friends 22 slayer wep is blue but these pictures are saying 20-22 are all the same

[heady hollow]

the picture is wrong im pretty sure

22 is the new glow

[ember vale]

ah gotcha ty gonan chase it then hehe

[midnight nimbus]

How do you increase level?

[heady hollow]

by doing stuff in rowen

[midnight nimbus]

Can I farm like 55million boars for 2exp a piece? or do I have to wait for time-gated stuff?

[heady hollow]

no idea, ive never done rowen

im pretty sure just doing your weekly and daily rowen stuff is enough

from what ive heard

[misty token]

Yep u right

Idk why always stuck at there

I cant click continue

[drifting igloo]

Does the game freeze?

[misty token]

Nahh the game doesnt freeze

This happen like 2 days before and still cant login until now

[drifting igloo]

Tried verifying game files?

[radiant flame]

no

[misty token]

Already try but still nothing

I m trying re instal and same thing happend

[radiant flame]

you can only increase rowen faction xp by killing players, or doing quests

[drifting igloo]

That's really strange Ive never had this problem I can't help very much : 😔

[radiant flame]

you also get a bunch by doing the battlefield

[misty token]

Should i text amazon??

[drifting igloo]

You think they're gonna help?

[misty token]

Prob i guess

Cause the last time i cant login they helped me

[drifting igloo]

Reddit or maybe even the official lost ark discord server might be able to help a lot

but yeah you can make a live support ticket with Amazon they probably could help

[misty token]

Yes sir , thanks

[minor briar]

press alt+r

[bold forge]

I am trying to farm purple galewind runes. Does the percentage differ from boss to boss? or is it all the same?

[fallow sail]

I'm not sure about that, what people do is pick an easy guardian that doesn't need battle items and turn it into a punching bag

[minor briar]

the whole tier has same rate most likkely

[fallow sail]

Like deskaluda

[bold forge]

Yes exactly my thought

[brave veldt]

err any idea what this warning is for?

like will i not be able to transfer gear properly if i level too high?

[rose jewel]

ignore

its a "we remind you you can craft relic gear now"

[fossil linden]

I have collected over 60K green SH coins which gets you C+J but I don't have many if not any characters that run it so idk if I should get it, is there any other place those coins are used or should I just get c+j

[outer mason]

CJ?

https://tenor.com/view/cj-gta-gif-24474285

[fossil linden]

the runes

[outer mason]

you can buy Stronghold music with those coins

cards, sometimes

runes, other than C+J

Secret Map

[fossil linden]

are there anything more useful than those? the 2 you mentioned doesn't really seem worth

I c

I think I alr bought 1 secret map but can't remember exactly

[outer mason]

check https://lostarkcodex.com/us/item/78100002/
"Used to buy" tab

[fossil linden]

ty

[maiden locust]

what is the difference between the first and second when sending gold via mail ?

[fossil linden]

runes and secret map it is then

[maiden locust]

OH

first one takes gold from the recipient

[midnight nimbus]

I can't find this item. Do I have to go through all my character's inventories?

[radiant flame]

Yes, probably

I’m not sure how else we can help

[midnight nimbus]

was half hoping I could re-claim it again somehow

[tidal void]

I terms of gathering mats for crafting oreha, is there a big difference between fishing and excavating?

[radiant flame]

Not really. But fishing is extremely slow

Excavating way faster assuming you don’t have competition for spots

Hunting is by far the best, but takes the most effort

And hunting is actually not “profitable” to craft oreha iirc

[maiden locust]

Excavating is worth more cause of the other people griefing

[radiant flame]

But you can sell the mats

[maiden locust]

If you play on a server without other players excavating would be great

[radiant flame]

That feeling when you fish and you lose 4x stacks because RNG

[brisk bridge]

Any recommendations to maximise card xp?

[radiant flame]

Do card islands, do south vern chaos line, buy from stronghold vendor, do cube

[drowsy parcel]

anyone know how many time takes to be validated as trusted to get the punika powerpass?

[wind loom]

whats your guys guess on how impactfull roster lvl (roster progression in general) and collectibles are in terms of character strength?

[oak pike]

How to get card exp?Im farming wei so the green cards get exp for cap

[heady hollow]

pretty worth, with collectables like skill points being the most important, and roster level being a decent thing to have to combat gatekeeping (assuming everything else is in order)

[wind loom]

okay so focus on skill points first iguess^^

what about the +5 dex/str/vit etc bonusses you get from leveling up... i guess it adds up ofc but is it a big difference tho?

[heady hollow]

nah not really

very very very minute gains

[floral saffron]

Day

The reason ur so trash

[wind loom]

thanks for replying Day!

[floral saffron]

Missing 100 str from roster

[heady hollow]

[heady hollow]

np

[floral saffron]

[oak pike]

The main reason I sux it because I never fixed my class swiftness

[outer mason]

?trusted

[sage dune]

FAQ for Trusted Status (may take a few days to update status)
Must spend at least 5 USD on steam account AND set up 2FA with mobile steam guard.
Details: https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/71D3-35C2-AD96-AA3A

[drowsy parcel]

i did that 1 week ago and dunno get nothing