lost-ark-discussions

[sand marsh]

i did way too much stagger LOL

[tulip charm]

we all lived except the aero but he only died at the very end got a revive, dps check is very tight, we had a perfect 2 bar rumble, and he still enraged at 6bars, paladin hyper awakeninged at enrage and we killed it

[sand marsh]

but i had too otherwise no 2nd rumble

[grim crane]

eeek lol

[sand marsh]

which means no clear

[tulip charm]

did you guys enrage too? i heard some groups cleared with like 30bar enrage like ishy's i think

[obtuse oyster]

we only got the one rumble

[runic hill]

the dmg was just fluctuating too much i had a pull on which i did 1b before rumble on 3.9k but i just never got close again

[sand marsh]

we got 2nd rumble at x30 bars on enrage
came out of 2nd rumble with 3 bars
cleared

[obtuse oyster]

Our pull close to cleraing enraged at 30bars, the clear pull enraged at 15bars

[sand marsh]

i dont think 2nd rumble is possible without paladin, using holy sword core tbh

[tulip charm]

[sand marsh]

could be wrong but it feels that way

[loud vortex]

They ''nerfed the raid difficulty'' by adding rumble system to boost dps, but then upscaled boss hp (shortened berserk time) to force u optimize the rumble

[runic hill]

on average i was doing like 700-750 before rumble so on average pull i just needed a good rumble to do minimum but i feel like in HW this wouldnt be an issue later

[obtuse oyster]

Yeah, you need like a good stagger comp and get the first rumble early

[sand marsh]

i didnt even bring the battle item because i ran out mid pulls

[runic hill]

and in HW you probably will get the current best pulls more often

[sand marsh]

so i put on splendid darks lol

[loud vortex]

Guess I'll have to play 5 min of dodge ball in g2 after berserk

[runic hill]

we split 2-2 on battle items

2 destro and 2 new

[deft ridge]

how do you get mordum HM mats if playing solo?

[obtuse oyster]

yeah but the boss doesn't get hp back in beserk

[sand marsh]

probably, but considering a lot of ppl are clearing hard mode the 1st/2nd day, same with nightmare, it'll only become easier going forward

[runic hill]

solo shop xd

[sand marsh]

compared to prog time spent on kazeros

this is a good twist for now

[obtuse oyster]

so if you're close to killing it and have Sup HA, you can finish teh last couple of bars

[tulip charm]

my paladin showed me how cheap and busted that skill is

[obtuse oyster]

compared to the old raids where it's gg if the boss enrage

[tulip charm]

the paladin skill that fires multiple machineguns sword thing

[loud vortex]

It is said that next raid is the real nerf

[runic hill]

i think ppl highly underestimate the amount of DPS gained by exp

[sand marsh]

yeah holy sword lol

[tulip charm]

if 3 people get iron maided in g1 cerka, that holy sword skill, 1 skill button, does 80% stagger bar

[loud vortex]

That twilight priest stuff

[runic hill]

our pala solo staggered G2 thorns even xd

[sand marsh]

yeah i can solo x60 prediction velganos stagger with 2 buttons

paladin is just goated man

[tulip charm]

we also never had to dodge clones in g2 either, if all 4 of us hit the first justguard, we can finish the clone stagger without a clone even attacking once

its close, but we always did it like that

[runic hill]

i was out as well on my sorc but i had my counter and blaze ready so gl with that i guess

i was cheering him on tho

[sand marsh]

oh the x240 mech

ive never seen him do a 2nd guard LOL

because paladin xdd

[tulip charm]

ye, ive never learned how to do this mech properly

[runic hill]

we barely couldnt do it in 1 round

[tulip charm]

because we always finished after the first jg

[sand marsh]

ill never have to do that mech thank god

[runic hill]

on 2nd round we just did initial guard and everyone used 1 skill

[sand marsh]

i just press a few buttons, it ends instantly W

[tulip charm]

arti is solid stagger too, i will always have napalm there, and napalm boost the entire pt's stagger by 20%

[sand marsh]

ahh yeah stagger synergy is nice

scrapper has that too

tai scrapper i think

[tulip charm]

almost no class have that

[lilac frigate]

wait... people already use "reclear" for groups?

[sand marsh]

yeah its just tai scrapper and arti

[tulip charm]

its just arti and another class or 2 i think

[sand marsh]

yeah especially for normal/hard

[lilac frigate]

this community is fucked

[runic hill]

im down 7 clears so i think im pretty reclear at this point

[sand marsh]

lol how so

if a bunch of ppl clear day 1, you want them to title there next run as prog

im confused

[runic hill]

but idc i'd take a no reclear to NM as long as ppl saw most stuff from HM or nightmare u are good to come into my NM HW

[sand marsh]

people do this in WoW. clear normal/heroic week 1. ask for recelar week 2

[tulip charm]

why? what happened?

[sand marsh]

lost ark doesnt have a monopoly on that

[loud vortex]

I'm not gonna go nmm again if I cleared it this week

[runic hill]

i mean i agree this community is fked, but asking for reclear on reclear is the only normal thing this community does

[loud vortex]

[sand marsh]

its not fucked due to asking for reclear tho

thats just common sense when raiding

if you clear and wanna do it again, why title it as fresh prog or something

makes no sense to do that

[tulip charm]

wait, "reclear" ? thats the thing everybody put in their lobby title right?
tfm g1 reclear/g2 prog, g1 becomes infinite prog pre500bars

its like the old thaemine lobbies

[sharp rock]

What's ur chars cp and gems ?

[tulip charm]

"reclear hw rtc fast fast super fast extremely fast" come this lobby

none of them could clear g2 at thaemine

[sand marsh]

lambo run

ferrari run

W

[tulip charm]

i think the way this game works is if youve progged the first mode kazeros for 5minutes, you are now rtc and reclear

[runic hill]

ye the fked thing about this community is the gatekeeping

[lilac frigate]

that too

[runic hill]

ppl act like a 50 or 100 CP dif matters

getting knocked once in a raid is a bigger dmg dif than 50 or 100 CP

[tulip charm]

you don't like vagris players gatekeeping 3k cp for normal a4 and 3k for hm brel?

[obtuse oyster]

"ferrari run" - on ilvl and min cp

[tulip charm]

oh wait, your eu, you don't have those guys there

[sand marsh]

i mean if you see someone with 5000 cp why take the 4500 cp guy

bigger number ppl jus gonna take

[runic hill]

i just check logs for both and take the better

[sand marsh]

also the community came to a consensus on what minimum CP to look for (generally) due to some creators out there creating a precedent

and people will naturally follow that precedent

[runic hill]

ye but its dumb tbh since CP is not reflective of actual char power

[obtuse oyster]

it is tho

[runic hill]

cause certain stats give more CP than real dmg as we all know

[sand marsh]

it is to a degree

[obtuse oyster]

it may not be 1 to 1

but you can gauge a character power off of cp

[sand marsh]

and no one is going to sit there doing mental math

when looking at the application window

[runic hill]

also it fully ignores skill and exp which is just kinda rude towards the ppl who do 6 HMs early on

so just take the 15 sec type name in uwu and press on logs

[sand marsh]

blame the ppl who focused on getting 6 chars to HM instead of focusing on making a single char stronger

idk what u want me to say to that

[lilac frigate]

checking logs is also a kinda bs thing

[sand marsh]

spreading your resources thin across many chars is stupid

[sharp rock]

Not everyone has aktivated logs in uwu

[sand marsh]

ur not a whale, not a busser

what do u expect

shrug

[sharp rock]

Me personally won't share that

[runic hill]

if you only do 1 HM you are probably bad (because you lack playtime in HM)

like most 1 char andies are so cringe bad its insane

[sand marsh]

its not 1 char andies

[potent dagger]

[sand marsh]

It's putting all your resources into a single char to make it powerful, while your alts, are treated like alts

[obtuse oyster]

W stimmy check

[sand marsh]

More people should think like that

instead of trying to make '6 mains'

[potent dagger]

Spoken like a 🐳

[sharp rock]

All those general statements ... sus

[runic hill]

if you do the most recent raid on 1 char thats overgeared by 50% you just wont learn anything

[sand marsh]

i see some rosters where there "main' is very close to alt cp

[runic hill]

you blast it before you learn the raid

and then u do 5 NMs who u can just die on

[obtuse oyster]

plus if they're juicing their main and did nightmare (what would be og hard mode week 1 with frontier for the older raids)

[runic hill]

ofc u wont learn anything

[obtuse oyster]

they straight up have more experience then teh guy that did hm

[lilac frigate]

thats not an issue at all

[potent dagger]

Not everyone is for 6x hm

[lilac frigate]

if the CP is good enough to clear

[runic hill]

just do HM on low CP

[sand marsh]

its an issue when that person cries about gatekeeping

[runic hill]

even better

[lilac frigate]

no.

[potent dagger]

And not clear because no dmg?

[lilac frigate]

if the CP is high enough, it is not an issue

[runic hill]

you mean clear after learning the raid not before?

like KR ppl who clear the raid without doing a single mech cause they are maxed out xd

[lilac frigate]

like, complaining about gatekeeping for kazeros nm with 2k CP for example

completly justified

[potent dagger]

Whats the point of doing hm just because you reaches cp but cant do the dmg because hands or gear,

[sand marsh]

doesnt matter if it's high enough. there's going to be people out there who have a strong main, who apply, and take over your spot. because you decided that every char in your roster should be treated as a main.

[lilac frigate]

you dont need 5k CP just to clear something and not be gatekept

[sand marsh]

and when u dont bus or swipe

you just end up hurting yourself

[obtuse oyster]

they can make a party

I just did that on my 1.8k cp dps account

[runic hill]

you are still reliant on ppl playing with you

[potent dagger]

[runic hill]

and most ppl rather apply to 2k+ for 1 hour to get taken once

[sand marsh]

this is how a roster should look, arguably the alts should be even lower. but my main is nowhere close to my alts

[runic hill]

than doing a run of full 1.8k CP

[sand marsh]

Thus when i apply to nightmare lobbies "LF sup"

[obtuse oyster]

and guess what applied, the 1.8k players dps and sups

[sand marsh]

ill almost always get accepted

because i have higher cp than the other supports

[runic hill]

ah yes a 1 class player should have guessed

[obtuse oyster]

yeah, this is an exception tho

[lilac frigate]

if your main was 4k, then that would be enough as well. unless you want to do nightmare of course

[runic hill]

who can use the gems on all 6 chars ofc you think CP is good

[sand marsh]

doesnt matter if it's "enough"

[runic hill]

cause you can just inflate it

[sand marsh]

people don't want "enough"

[obtuse oyster]

you're a mono roster there's a huge advantage since you share gems

[sand marsh]

they want juice

[sand marsh]

even if i wasnt a mono roster, i'd still put everything into one char for the most part

and only hone alts when it makes logical sense

[obtuse oyster]

yes, but your alt cp would be shit

[runic hill]

and your other chars would be 1k CP less each xd

[obtuse oyster]

lvl 10s giga inflate your cp

[runic hill]

ofc mono roster sup player thinks CP is fine the classic

[sand marsh]

if i wasnt a mono roster, it would be lower, but not by a crazy amount. i wouldnt of bought 10s if i wasnt a mono roster

i would of instead bough full 8s on every char, and 9s on main

[runic hill]

mono sup roster talking about CP is like usain bolt saying running is easy

[sand marsh]

also, i took a month+ break. my ark grid is fucked on my alts

[tulip charm]

[sand marsh]

im very behind in the alt territory when i look at other people in party finder

[tulip charm]

where is your berserker main

[potent dagger]

Its insane how much cp gems give for so little actual benefit

[tulip charm]

don't try to hide, i remb this

[obtuse oyster]

yeah, you get a little bit of buff power on support but it's insane how much it inflates your cp

[runic hill]

the buff power even scales additively on the gems its the biggest scam ever

[sand marsh]

if you enjoy having 6 mains thats fine, but there's going to be people who put resources into one char, and will take your spot.

gatekeeping 101

[runic hill]

i would be fine with that if CP wasnt omega inflated via gems (and slightly inflated via atk power but thats not that much of an issue)

[tulip charm]

there was once a great man name tubby in this discord

he was a avid 6paladin enjoyer

[potent dagger]

Swaped 7 to 8 on alt bard got like 25cp or so. For like 0.01% buff difference

[tulip charm]

he quit, playing 6 of the same class enjoyers usually burnout the fastest

[sand marsh]

i only bought 10s because i literally had no other way to increase CP on my main

[obtuse oyster]

[sand marsh]

outside of cutting astrogems

5/5/5/5's

which is very difficult

[runic hill]

you have 5.4k

there are sups without esther with far over 6k

you are coping now

[sand marsh]

they are 1755 if they are 6k+

ancient cores

etc

[potent dagger]

Maybe even 0,1% buff difference

[runic hill]

like you are just making excuses now to justify a flawed system that you can abuse to your advantage

[sand marsh]

i cant just "buy an ancient core" or "buy a relic astrogem"

[runic hill]

but nothing else to be expected of a guy who plays 6 palas

[sand marsh]

but i can buy level 10s

it was a simple decision

[runic hill]

i wouldnt even dare to defend CP even if i was a 1 class player

[sand marsh]

im not defending CP lol

all i said was there wasnt much way to increase CP on my main

[obtuse oyster]

there is

[sand marsh]

outside of things that are impossible to control

[obtuse oyster]

but it's down to rng

[sand marsh]

and are rng

[runic hill]

i mean honing is a much better investment (on sup) than gems

[sand marsh]

yeah, buying gems is not RNG

so its a simple decision

shouldnt be hard for you to understand this lol

[runic hill]

gems are so terrible on sup its beyond words

[sand marsh]

idc, im a sup main

our CP gains are marginal beyond high/highs and rng bullshit

[obtuse oyster]

nah

[runic hill]

you could swap to full solo 6s rn and your party probably wouldnt notice if they didnt check u

[obtuse oyster]

full 10 cds on bard is goated if you do 20/20 or higher spec build

[sand marsh]

yeah but i like finishing a system in a game you know

[runic hill]

ye bard i get the spec dif

[sand marsh]

when i bought my last level 10 it felt very good

[runic hill]

but even then best core is T skill so you are lowering your T skill uptime too

[obtuse oyster]

brave is best but like the difference is minute

[runic hill]

also depends on who you play with ofc

[obtuse oyster]

so if you do swift t-core is better, but I'm pretty sure high iden uptime 20/20 brave is better

[obtuse oyster]

definitely

[tulip charm]

thats what they should add into the game

t skill gem

make me the lost ark balance director

[lilac frigate]

I think I need a lvl 10 on my valk...

[runic hill]

if it lines up with your party main burst T is actually diabolically broken

[lilac frigate]

but im poor so im not gonna get one

[sand marsh]

i just like having a very strong, single character. doing whatever i can to make it more powerful. if i wasnt mono roster i'd still have this logic. i apply this logic to any MMO i play

[obtuse oyster]

I hate that two of my bards got the ap core as ancient (one of them being my main)

that shit is smoge

[runic hill]

i asked my pala to time his Ts with my ignites once in a raid and my DPS jumped up by like 10% xd

[lilac frigate]

yeah and people with your mindset are why mmos are always fail

[runic hill]

like pocketing with T core is beyond insane

[sand marsh]

????

[lilac frigate]

because new people and people who want to have fun are gatekept

for no reason

"not enough CP"

[sand marsh]

and the mindset of 6 characters, doing 18 raids a week is healthy?

lol what a joke

[runic hill]

LA is designed to be played like that

[obtuse oyster]

I enjoy playing my bards

[runic hill]

LA is not a main only game

[lilac frigate]

this is this and that is that

[obtuse oyster]

so I don't mind the 18 raids a week

[sand marsh]

aw boo hoo, i like to minmax and other people dont

[slow saddle]

whats the topic now

[sand marsh]

im so ruining games for people

because i like to minmax

sounds like an entitled mindset u have bud

[obtuse oyster]

the usual gatekeeping off of combat power

[slow saddle]

every time uwu princess is in here, the word parse and CP comes up at least 15 times in the convo

what is it this time

[obtuse oyster]

HM 1-2 reclear "Doloris only"

[runic hill]

wasnt me tho i just joined in on the convo

[slow saddle]

like what more do people want

We never had CP before and people gatekept on ilvl, now they summarized a decent idea of all your collective subsystems, the same is bound to happen

[runic hill]

because i think the full 10 ppl gatekeeping on that are mentally damaged

[lilac frigate]

nah, its just that everyone minmaxes and forcers everyone else to minmax then you have no choice but to minmax

[sand marsh]

man is trying to say that having a mindset of a single, strong character (not spreading resourcs to infinite chars) is why MMOs fail

[obtuse oyster]

I seen a couple doloris in hm reclear

[slow saddle]

because we have no way to gauge competency in game,you use the best you can and know its flawed, but you still take whats on the resume

[lilac frigate]

no, that was not my stance

[sand marsh]

Yet lost ark is failing because people are doing the OPPOSITE and smilegate is designing it around that

this is what i said

[obtuse oyster]

think a chunk of people are just getting their clears yesterday night and today

[sand marsh]

and thats what u responded with

did u forget to read or something?

[slow saddle]

i think the alt system is the most garbage shit imo

[lilac frigate]

yeah, and i keep saying that once you reach a certain CP its stupid to gatekeep

[sand marsh]

thats not what u said

[lilac frigate]

it is

[sand marsh]

no. i didnt say anything about CP

[runic hill]

this is based af

[sand marsh]

i said making my char stronger, doing anything possible to make it stronger

and somehow i am ruining games

[slow saddle]

sure but its gonna happen regardless, and theres nothing wrong with that

You group up with similar folks and 'tier' your way downwards, while have a rough gauge of what you're willing to accept and not accept

[lilac frigate]

oh come on, we have been on this the whole point

[sand marsh]

with that mindset

[lime stirrup]

BuT wOw HaS iT

[runic hill]

who cares if you do 600m or 800m in kazeros either way the boss is phasing in seconds

[sand marsh]

how am i ruining games by wanting to progress and minmax to the tinniest 1%

[slow saddle]

i do, like the avg OG MMO player

[obtuse oyster]

my friend when they were chasing 6k cp on their main

[swift tree]

RMT lords that like having their $$$ make them “stand above the peasantry”

[slow saddle]

theres very few ppl that i see that spread everything on their alts

They all have 'one' main and then use their alts to funnel but also bring them up to a reasonable place

[sand marsh]

disgusting jesus christ

[obtuse oyster]

all their alts are stronger then my main, gg

[sand marsh]

ehh its more common than you think. i see many full x1730 rosters, or a single 1740 main, 1730 x5 and wonder why there 1740 gets denied. its because u were stupid in how u spent ur gold

[slow saddle]

oh yeh true

but that personally, i see from carried paradise andys

people getting so much ilvls, its a piss poor joke

with low ass CP

the ratio between ilvls and CP has gotten worst

[sand marsh]

yeah agreed terry

the scrolls are a nice plus

[slow saddle]

and people can see that gap at the max ilvl as well

[obtuse oyster]

if only we got them when I was doing my ah sessions

[lilac frigate]

wait, adv honing from serca or where? i missed that

[sand marsh]

i remember atk, or was it zeals, saying that people focus wayy too much on ilvl, and not actual power gain

its funny how people still do this

[slow saddle]

yup

[sand marsh]

to this very day

crazy as hell

[runic hill]

talking about gold spending when all your stuff is free is crazy talk

[obtuse oyster]

people think hitting the min ilvl req is enough to do the raids when it's not

[sand marsh]

yeah the top percent, correct

[obtuse oyster]

when the raids are being designed with having certain levels of systems done

[sand marsh]

but the average player absoluely not

[tulip charm]

HI, i am new returning player!!! do i still need to play 6 characters and 18 alts to play this game!@@#!@!!!@!

[slow saddle]

and people wonder why CP gatekeeping is a thing

its like no shit, ilvls mean nothing in comparison to if you have your other subsystems done

And yes, we ALL know gems inflate that, but you can STILL filter through people with gems and see how much of their other systems are done

[sand marsh]

sorry that i oly like playing paladin and no other class

ill enjoy the game how i please and will not be sorry for playing a single class

[tulip charm]

#1 asked question for every returning player, idk why its like this, who even told people to do this?

[runic hill]

dont judge others on CP if they have to spend 10 times your cost to reach same CP xd

[obtuse oyster]

, noone still hasn't noticed my level 4 karma on my 1730 bard

[slow saddle]

even if i wanted to play other classes, i would play multiple of the same class for the sake of progression.............

You later weave in alts when things make economical sense..........

[tulip charm]

people listen to content creators to play games?? lol what kinda sheep behavior is this

[sand marsh]

you can spend 0 unbound gold on alts, and spend all unbound on main and do the same shit i did, or close to it

[slow saddle]

like do people not use braincells to do whats efficient? or do they keep bitching about their own decisions LMFAO

[sand marsh]

problem is that people dont xdd

[obtuse oyster]

[runic hill]

one of my books costs more than all your books combined

[sand marsh]

omg wow

your penis is so big man

holy shit

im impressed

[runic hill]

one of my accessories costs more than your entire gear did pre sup rework

[slow saddle]

back to bitching about how 1 gem classes were a thing

[lilac frigate]

uwu is just pointing out that its not as easy as you claim

[runic hill]

typical delusional sup

[obtuse oyster]

support h/h were expensive as dps h/hs

[slow saddle]

back to bitching about how support engravings are cheaper than dps

like at some point, choices are made

[runic hill]

no they were not

[slow saddle]

when u sign up to play a DPS, no shit, what do you think was gonna happen

[sand marsh]

and you wouldnt be clearing any raids without a support

[slow saddle]

[runic hill]

before sup rework hh ancients went for under 1m even

[sand marsh]

whos really the bitch in this situation lol

xdd

[obtuse oyster]

maybe in EU

[runic hill]

xd

[slow saddle]

i think people cant stomach the reality

[runic hill]

ppl just RMT to gatekeep others based on CP to feel good about themself having no hands

just one of the things

[lime stirrup]

https://tenor.com/view/tom-gecko-lizard-hoppers-pixar-gif-11983652841046942850

[tulip charm]

[sand marsh]

i want to be efficient and i only play 1 class. so those who play 6 different classes and have a chip on their shoulder, think they are of a higher standard

[slow saddle]

idk why that bothers you, just play with your people and stop worrying about people who are toxic

[sand marsh]

i find this to be the cringiest shit ever xdd

[lilac frigate]

cant be playing with poor peasants

[slow saddle]

there are ppl with giga gear and have hands that exist too

are you upset they gatekeep?

[runic hill]

ye i finally dont have to deal with those ppl anymore cause currently we have 4 ppl raids

[slow saddle]

you're walking into a job interview wearing raggity ass clothes, wondering why they turned you away

[runic hill]

nah if you have hands and gear you look for ppl with hands and gear

[sand marsh]

i just hope you dont walk around with a chip on your shoulder IRL because you have it harder than others

dont compare yourself to others

and just be quiet

[obtuse oyster]

I'm ngl, if people keeping undercutting my atros

[sand marsh]

👍

[slow saddle]

like i said earlier, everytime uwu is in here, its about:

• something parse
• something hands
• something CP
• something gems

Did i miss anything?

[obtuse oyster]

I'm dropping the market 30g by saturday

[sand marsh]

drop stimmys too pls

[runic hill]

typcal RMT gunslinger defending RMT was already the same during brel "not overgeared" on a pretty much maxed out char back then

[lilac frigate]

time to post atros

[slow saddle]

i defend swiping on the game, no shit

[runic hill]

it is what it is

[slow saddle]

does that bother you?

and all my swiping is legitimate, with receipts, if you want to get pissed off more

[obtuse oyster]

[sand marsh]

it would be nice if all you whales came together and protested with wallet sometimes

[runic hill]

just another asuun xd swipes a bit legit and the rest is RMT xD

[surreal gyro]

as you should queen

[slow saddle]

and i know there are also wayyyyyyy better players than me, i never talk about myself or put my ego high

[slow saddle]

you're more than welcome to prove it

you're just upset

[obtuse oyster]

real

[runic hill]

oh no anyway

[lime stirrup]

This mira guy massive ego when he doesn't even have the hands to use a keyboard

[slow saddle]

sorry that I spent close to $65k on LA and $190k on BDO

[lime stirrup]

Unbelievable

[slow saddle]

[sand marsh]

curious, how much did u do. the GS in my clear was cranking

[obtuse oyster]

190k on bdo wtf

endgame maxxing frfr

[slow saddle]

god forbid i didnt waste my 20s IRL and got a good career

[surreal gyro]

190k on BDO on WHAT

[sand marsh]

yeah he did around that

[zealous lintel]

skins

[sand marsh]

easily 1.5bil+ dps i think

[zealous lintel]

ya dork

[sand marsh]

with gear transfer

and greeding

[surreal gyro]

good career means nothing if u are in a poor country

[slow saddle]

for sure

i think reasonably

people can pull 1-1.2b

[zealous lintel]

seems like a fun topic again

[slow saddle]

after the transfers, way higher

[zealous lintel]

i love my timing

[runic hill]

its def possible to pull a lot, the DPS goes up a lot on good pulls

[sand marsh]

powdersnow is out here doing 2c nightmare dps on his breaker

which isnt even his speciality xdd

the power gain is insane

yeah

[slow saddle]

+330CP just from wep transfer and like +10k attackpower or so

[sand marsh]

man is talented but also

[surreal gyro]

i do 1.2b on my opener rotation does this count?

[sand marsh]

the game is just crazy power creep

[obtuse oyster]

yes, in your dreams

[runic hill]

our best pulls everyone did like 200 more than in our clear its just a new raid

[sand marsh]

yeah, 15ms would probably give you an extra few hundred mil

unoftunate

[slow saddle]

i cant play well in thaemine/brel lobbies but i still join them like a masochist at my hours

[lime stirrup]

If it was the best pull why didn't it clear

[runic hill]

ok my bad enxt time i ask for re so we clear on better pull xd

[lime stirrup]

[sand marsh]

usually during prog.. the worse pulls (from your dps perspective) are the ones that clear

not all the time

but the saying exist for a reason

[runic hill]

only recent raid i got my first clear on a good pull was kazeros G2

[slow saddle]

naw bro, you're a whale and if you're good, you're not because you have gear

and if you're bad, you're just bad

If there is a lower CP player that parses more than you, you're clearly BAD!!

lose-lose situation

[sand marsh]

the scariest kind of player is one with lots of money

and good hands

[slow saddle]

dealt with the same shit on BDO when it came to pvping LOL

you MUST play perfectly!

you cant even be an above avg player or below avg with gear

smh

[obtuse oyster]

I just shout class diff, and "insert class carried" real and true

[slow saddle]

yup

i need one of those pocket support friends while we're at it

[runic hill]

xd

[sand marsh]

pocket princess GL, with x2 supports. 1 bard with full spec and your numbers

will look beautiful

[runic hill]

princess adding 30% is the most cringe thing i ever heard

[obtuse oyster]

they fixed that

[sand marsh]

not what i mean

[lime stirrup]

It's the spec cdr sup that adds it

[slow saddle]

@distant swallow lets take off gear next time we run to butt heads for hours on the game rather than just killing the boss and enjoying IRL with the free time

[obtuse oyster]

can we delete yearning, so I can just always run the cdr setup

[lime stirrup]

But half the people playing princess do the sup setup wrong

[obtuse oyster]

pls and ty

[sand marsh]

x2 supports can play full spec dominion build because princess GL runs yearning

it adds

a disgusting

amount of dmg

[lime stirrup]

You see the 2 esther party playing princess with 25 points in crit and strike orm

German init

[runic hill]

its just cringe when u see 4k CP ppl with gray score gatekeep 3.8k with 100s

[slow saddle]

im here to talk as much about my logs and parsing and complain about the game

[lilac frigate]

im a bad player!

[slow saddle]

people play casually

[sand marsh]

no one wants to stare at a website sifting through logs bud

[slow saddle]

its a thing

[sand marsh]

idk what u want people to do

lol

[slow saddle]

like god forbid people want to just casually clear their raid and call it a day!!

[lime stirrup]

Where is log plugin they had in xiv

[runic hill]

yes but why gatekeep like its your TFM speedrun then xd

[lime stirrup]

Where it shows you their percentiles

[obtuse oyster]

nah, gotta min-max sweat parse every raid

[runic hill]

thats the point i dont get on that

[obtuse oyster]

or you're bad if you get gapped

[zealous lintel]

not these days i am afraid. most people play to min max or parse

[runic hill]

you are clearing fast no matter what

[slow saddle]

you know, if i was a responsible person and I was annoyed/bothered by the game, I'd figure out what solutions there are to deal with my troubles

I know, kinda hard to think about

[sand marsh]

because people want to do the raid fast. Are you telling me when you make a lobby, you have auto clicker on and take anyone who applies?

[slow saddle]

you completely miss the point

[sand marsh]

there's no way you do this

[slow saddle]

thats your problem

[sand marsh]

if you do, your lying

everyone, is sifting through applicants

[obtuse oyster]

you say that, but people rarely dark

[sand marsh]

everyone gatekeeps

[obtuse oyster]

and most time they are atro'ing for funny big number and not to parse

[slow saddle]

everyone knows what's 'POSSIBLE'

its common sense that you go with what's more 'likely' or 'better' in terms of chances to have a better clear experience

[runic hill]

the point is there is no real difference between 4012 CP and 3850 CP so just take ppl and stop spending 30 min in party finder

its not like 3k applying to 5k

[lime stirrup]

I mean i think thats a bit generalized tho because i don't think resenting whales for making the mmo landscape what it is today is unfounded

[sand marsh]

no one is spending 30mins in party finder looking for 4k cp. 4k cp is common. and if they are, why you bitching? its there lobby

[zealous lintel]

well its about the others dark-ing for you so you dont miss a frame

its always like that

[slow saddle]

i just find it funny as if its so common that people are sitting there debating much about a few hundred CP

[zealous lintel]

and always like this in every game with a raiding cult

[slow saddle]

[zealous lintel]

its the same in other games

like who does the expose weakness

or armor shred

dont want to waste GCD

its the same with darks

[slow saddle]

every kaz I did today, had players between 3.3k-4k, so many ppl applied, the lobby host just picked

The second a 4.5k+ player applied, they got accepted/looked at sooner

Nothing farfetched at all

[zealous lintel]

in one DKG(throw) i could use two abilities

[slow saddle]

like if its not CP, its gonna be ilvls

If its not that, its gonna be something else

tough shit

[obtuse oyster]

yeah

[sand marsh]

be glad its not wow gatekeeping

you would of uninstalled by now

trust me

[runic hill]

because nobody would ever decline half of the chars that apply if CP wasnt a thing, there are full relic books full ark grid chars being denied because of whatever reason their CP is 100 below someone elses and then u see that naked char with full 10s getting accepted

just brainwashed

[slow saddle]

you really think people didnt get denied OR outprioritized based on ilvls??

[zealous lintel]

thats just the game man. keep up with it or quit

[sand marsh]

ok this is not true.

[slow saddle]

LMAO

[lime stirrup]

The stories i hear about wow gearing are actually even more cringe than this alt system we have in loa here

[sand marsh]

Before CP it was item level and gems

[slow saddle]

uwu acting like tier 3 didnt exist

[surreal gyro]

people also look for synergies now a lot

[slow saddle]

[sand marsh]

??????

[lime stirrup]

Like playing dupes of a class to pray you get gear is kinda crazy

Is that why paradise is what it js

[surreal gyro]

they will always prioritize a GL with lower CP than a juiced DPS

[sand marsh]

race to world first is extremely degen in this aspect

[obtuse oyster]

hm?

[runic hill]

in T3 i was actually a rat and barely got gatekept (but i also always had all titles super early)

[sand marsh]

creating 21 warlocks

cinema

[lime stirrup]

Its like so fucking absurd

[sand marsh]

it sure is

[lime stirrup]

Like so much shit about rwf

[slow saddle]

OH YEAH WHERES YOUR PROOF

u could be accepting 1 lower char but be a hardcore gatekeeper surelyyyyyy

[lime stirrup]

Is just designed to keep anyone but the top 2 guilds from playing the game

[runic hill]

gatekeeping kinda started af after ivory from my exp

[lime stirrup]

Well top 1 cause one of them gets timezone diffed

[sand marsh]

compared to people bussing TFM speedruns or practicing in KR. wow RWF shits on all of that for degeneracy

im glad its not that bad here

[obtuse oyster]

gatekeeping was happening since valtan

[lilac frigate]

me eyeing serka on my 1,8k cp alts looking at that information

[obtuse oyster]

and if we wanna go further back since argos

[zealous lintel]

its due to lower population in general.

[runic hill]

ye but title was a much bigger thing back then at least from my exp

[lime stirrup]

Like i have never played wow but splits and alt rng gear looting is absolutely crazy

[obtuse oyster]

no, they were doing it off ilvl

[lime stirrup]

Its like you are trying to 25man paradise

[obtuse oyster]

title mattered later for your shitter alts

[zealous lintel]

if we had the playernumbers from 2023/4 this would not happen as much

[swift magnet]

[surreal gyro]

it would supp shortage was worse back in the day when we had a lot more players

[runic hill]

im pretty sure we all did funny stuff back then

[slow saddle]

also its funny but i guess players dont exist to take whomever if they know the dps is enough

I say this because my friends and I have a habit of just filling a lobby knowing we can carry weaker chars

I guess that doesnt exist

[sand marsh]

yeah when i was watching maxs stream explaining this. i could smell the foul body ador through the screen xdd

[surreal gyro]

ivory tower was a bigg issue because getting to 1620 ilvl was pretty hard back then

[devout nymph]

Why take low CP if in 15s someone with higher CP applies

[slow saddle]

LMAO

[surreal gyro]

what ilvl was ivory

[lime stirrup]

Fuck this maru guy

[surreal gyro]

i forgot

[slow saddle]

sometimes people dont care or want to rush through, I fall under that category whenever i host

[zealous lintel]

yeah true but i am talking about the general gatekeep. i think this stuff got worse with t4 introduction. behemoth and echidna were easy raids with t4 power spike but gatekeeping got worse somehow from month to month.

[devout nymph]

Ivory had 0gk for supports

[runic hill]

i recently had someone who had a script that autoopened uwu logs for anyone who applied

he checked logs of like 5 ppl at the same time

[lime stirrup]

I mean t4 just ran the gear appart

[obtuse oyster]

WTS support service

[runic hill]

i should have asked him for that

[surreal gyro]

are we talking about HW or Prog?

[zealous lintel]

hw

[errant fable]

https://tenor.com/view/mujikcboro-seriymujik-gif-24361533

[lime stirrup]

In t3 the only damage diff was 5x3+2 and gems

[zealous lintel]

prog is and was kinda chill

[lime stirrup]

Like 20-30% tops

[slow saddle]

did u remember how behemoth went?

[lime stirrup]

Now a geared char does double your damage

xd

[zealous lintel]

obviously. i was there

still

[runic hill]

ye rat alt was like 30% weaker than juiced main

[zealous lintel]

no point in gatekeeping fiesta

[runic hill]

and now normal main and fat main are 50%+ apart xd

[devout nymph]

Ups im trolling

[slow saddle]

we went from c7 chest/pants to full transcendence after the nerf game for behemoth

reminder

nothing changed with the raid

[obtuse oyster]

W gatekeeping

[zealous lintel]

na

[surreal gyro]

Behemoth was cancer on the first weeks

[slow saddle]

gear just got easier to obtain

[lime stirrup]

Go back to sleep maru

[zealous lintel]

i mean like

[slow saddle]

the standards go up as gearing gets easier

[obtuse oyster]

when you need full weapon trans to do behemoth

[zealous lintel]

when everyone got their hypers

[errant fable]

Can we make a Deal to gatekeep Altroster ?

[lime stirrup]

Ya in 1h allegedly

[sand marsh]

OMG LOST ARK SAVED?

[obtuse oyster]

but you can't get the weapon trans till you clear behemoth

[zealous lintel]

and behemoth already died like a punching back

[sand marsh]

HOLY SHIT

[devout nymph]

I woke up to this woke chat

[slow saddle]

yeah, if i see 'altroster' in SH names, i decline

[zealous lintel]

you needed like 1-2 groups with gear

[slow saddle]

[zealous lintel]

and he would die just by looking at him

[neon silo]

Wdym saved, its in a perfect state rn!

[zealous lintel]

and people still gatekept the fck out of it

[slow saddle]

id rather help a legitimate singular roster than people who play LA as a job

[sand marsh]

someone gave me shit for this, saying i am fucked up for not taking them

[slow saddle]

naw fuck them

[sand marsh]

i dont want an indo player on there 25th account to get carried in my lobby

he can take his ass somewhere else

[slow saddle]

i dont mind filling my lobby when i need bodies

[runic hill]

honestly havent been happier about anything in the game recently than not needing to use PF for the next 2 raids

[slow saddle]

but i WILL prioritize a non-alt roster

[errant fable]

But thats hard to tell

[runic hill]

how do you even tell alt roster and new player apart if its not in the stronghold/guildname?

[slow saddle]

i havent had a need to use PF after i made friends, joined a guild, led a community

I know, crazy how networking and getting to know people can work

[errant fable]

If its a New Guy or Just some Ricefarner

[obtuse oyster]

the easier the raid get, the worse some people get at doing mechs (because they don't have to do them by skipping), so when they end up getting into a lobby where the dps isn't a free ride they get jailed. leading to them to gatekeep toa weirdly high level

[runic hill]

ye we are just never 8 ppl with equal raid amount but with 4 man content it checks out for us

[lime stirrup]

There are no new players

They are all alt rosters

[sand marsh]

i bring this up sometimes, but i made a reddit thread back in 2023, seeing the rise of alt rosters for brel normal/hard and asked for peoples opinion on this. my opinion was clear, that its bad. and most people replied saying its not bad because they are spending more time for gold when p2w exists.

[devout nymph]

Nah u don't make friends on the Internet just business partners that stab u in the back like Korean dramas when there's a good opportunity

[zealous lintel]

well, yes and no. you could have also went with a half/half approach instead of gatekeeping everyone. but people wanted to cruse through the raid asap

[sand marsh]

its funny how the community shifted from that perspective now

[slow saddle]

then whats your problem always if yall can just host and pick n choose on your own?

[lime stirrup]

Wtf nameddopping kimchy like that

[slow saddle]

you get a group of 4 ppl, host an 8 man raid, fill from there

[zealous lintel]

the mentality is the main problem when it comes to the game. thats why many people choose to do what they did back then

[slow saddle]

your friends aint gonna gatekeep you

[devout nymph]

Wtf that's toxic and just a generalisation

[runic hill]

ye it works usually but its mostly just a free bus

[lime stirrup]

You dont know me

[slow saddle]

ohhhh so now free bussing is a problem?

[lime stirrup]

Im gatekeeping this maru guy

[zealous lintel]

it got worse over time cause the playerbase doesnt support all brackets

[runic hill]

not a problem but annoying

[slow saddle]

what about helping people regardless of their dps, ilvl, CP?

[sand marsh]

hey i agree with that. stop bussing for free bud

[slow saddle]

now its annoying

god the irony

[sand marsh]

charge for that shit

[slow saddle]

LMAO

[sand marsh]

like i do

[obtuse oyster]

om

[runic hill]

i want ppl who at least do the mechs

[lime stirrup]

Orm

[slow saddle]

LOL

[runic hill]

idc if they do 400m

[sand marsh]

[runic hill]

but at least do mechs

[zealous lintel]

you bus in almost any game

or free carry

[slow saddle]

bussing friends for free

[zealous lintel]

thats just the normal flow of things

[sand marsh]

yeah i wont charge a friend for a carry but

anyone else, pay up sir

im broke

[zealous lintel]

there is always one person worse or bad at sth they partake in with you or someone else being better in their group

[runic hill]

i also play with omega casuals ppl and there is no issue

[lime stirrup]

I charge @devout nymph

[zealous lintel]

so technically you bus 24/7

[errant fable]

Busser = Parasit Just Like Altroster

[slow saddle]

thats why i constantly say, even tho im against paid bussing, im not against the reasons as to why people do it

[sand marsh]

hey if im a parasite, im a parasite. it is what it is

[lime stirrup]

I am

[devout nymph]

I'm bussing chaos no cap

[lime stirrup]

Every mech should be body count

[slow saddle]

why would you 'logically' want to bus someone for free if u can make money out of it

there are times where charity is a thing, you can only do so much of it

[sand marsh]

im just feeding a need. if people wanna buy something, someone has to sell it

[runic hill]

there is a difference if someone is upper end fighter doing all mechs or if someone is half of upright fighter and didnt do a single guard, clash or counter in the entire run

[sand marsh]

you not gonna walk past $100 on the ground

[neon silo]

So just because someone messes up some patterns and deals less dps its a carry/bus run?

[sand marsh]

unless ur crazy

[devout nymph]

Moral reasons

[tulip charm]

why indo when you can egyptian instead

[obtuse oyster]

you bussers got meter banned for a week on na, gg

[lime stirrup]

And there should be single player prokel in every raid and if you fail the dps check you wipe the entire raid

[runic hill]

its annoying if they contribute almost nothing

[sand marsh]

what is this moral reason you speak of exactly

[slow saddle]

their personality reeks the opposite

[sand marsh]

im curious

[slow saddle]

hey aint it crazy how that works

[zealous lintel]

big exaggeration. obviously there are nuances. why do people in LOA always talk in absolutes/black and white?

[errant fable]

https://tenor.com/view/oh-no-gif-21238437

[slow saddle]

sometimes a 5k CP player throwing random skills like an idiot gives enough damage to a tryhard at 3.5k CP

Which one was i going to take chances with

[lime stirrup]

Have you seen serca this game doesnt support color yet

[zealous lintel]

[obtuse oyster]

great SG design, black on black palette

[devout nymph]

The same reason why ppl gk alt rosters, some random moral reasoning that makes them feel better

[lime stirrup]

Its a trick question

You cant see serca cause shes black on black

[neon silo]

You made it sound like that imo. Maybe i misinterpreted it

[slow saddle]

the game is black n white, reminder people are braindead

you can only be 'one' or the 'other'

[sand marsh]

im just providing a social service and charging for it. would you rather them pay for the bus, or everyone pay for the bus equally?

[zealous lintel]

no, i meant it like i wrote it. you put too much weight in my words

[slow saddle]

never both or neither or in between

[runic hill]

im actually inbetween on alt rostering

i dont like multiaccounting for alt roster but alt roster on 1 account is fine

[tulip charm]

buy the cheaper service instead like at thaemine, just undercut everybody!!!!!

[runic hill]

cause u dont get extra event abuse

[tulip charm]

why is there so many g2 thaemine lobbies?

[slow saddle]

same

[zealous lintel]

there is always someone being harder to pull their weight. or have problems concentrating for 2 hours

its just the nature of humans

[lime stirrup]

Alt rosters are just real people unless you just sit in gold positive busses and generate free gold

[zealous lintel]

and no, anyone can make mistakes

[lime stirrup]

They still play game

[slow saddle]

we couldnt clear yesterday for serca, i legit couldnt stomach the raid since i didnt sleep enough

[devout nymph]

It's not a bus its just a mandatory tip % on the reward that's charged earlier

[zealous lintel]

but that doesnt mean immediatly = bad or need to be carried

[zealous lintel]

see

here

thanks

[lime stirrup]

Mirra couldnt clear cause he couldnt do 120x mech

His cursor doesnt hover over the clone

[tulip charm]

almost took 7 hours to clear g1

[neon silo]

Well ok, you wrote „so technically you bus 24/7“, thats just what i was referring to. Just because someone is slightly worse youre not bussing them imo

[tulip charm]

was expecting g2 to be a multiday project, instead it was cleared in a little under 4 hours

[runic hill]

3rd try was the charm

[lime stirrup]

Im struggling

[runic hill]

xd

[lime stirrup]

https://c.tenor.com/7OTDAnaJRh8AAAAC/tenor.gif

[obtuse oyster]

I think the issue is that it circumvents the 6 gold earning system and allows them to generate more gold than what's normally possible. Even if they're playing it manually and not bussing

[slow saddle]

i actually noted down a few things i had genuinely had trouble with

Now if i was pugging, id be a dogshit high CP whale (sorry not whale, RMTER) that doesnt know mechs

[zealous lintel]

you are too hung up on one sentence, one word instead of looking at the whole comment

[sand marsh]

well bus is just what we call it. but i dont see a moral obligation to carry these people for free. do you want people on unemployment to receive money without paying taxes on it? (well this is probably the case in some EU countries)

[runic hill]

well the game allows you to do that as well if you play on multiple servers

[slow saddle]

i couldnt do the mouse thing on CONTROLLER for obvious reasons

[lime stirrup]

This doesnt matter they are essentially just an additional player

[neon silo]

Yea okay my bad

[runic hill]

which is why i think 1 account multiroster is fine but multiaccount isnt because you get "free pushed chars" for no effort

[lime stirrup]

Thats not the underlying problem of the economy and inflation

[obtuse oyster]

it does matter when it comes to purchasing power

[zealous lintel]

all good

no bad blood

[lime stirrup]

Im convinced open economy mmos are just a systemic failure at this point

[slow saddle]

thats entirely why i see no moral reason against bussing

[runic hill]

additional players also create additional items tho

[zealous lintel]

[devout nymph]

He cleared in under 25 pulls doloris, don't listen to him

[runic hill]

not just gold

[errant fable]

When o decline ppl

[lime stirrup]

People "gamify" it too much

[slow saddle]

i hate deadbeats and bad people who cant commit/put in effort than my love for helping people

i draw the line somewhere

[sand marsh]

yeah disliking it is one thing, but putting yourself on a moral pedestal over it is just weird..

[slow saddle]

id be bussing if i had more time on the game

[zealous lintel]

lul, dude know you ger akoya?

[runic hill]

i'd be bussing if it still paid as well as early T3 relative to income

[slow saddle]

i can somewhat stomach carrying friends or getting them past gatekeeping when issues arise, according to if we can sync up for friends

[tulip charm]

here is my issue with this, if this is true, i woudn't have a problem with alt rosters, but its just not, most alt roster players are competing with other alt roster players in the same lobby to see who can die first before the 2minute mark and use up both lives

[sand marsh]

oh u poor thing. you missed out on 4c kaz normal 300k week 1

500k serca 3c normal

it is what it is

[errant fable]

Dude my Island Name ist klapensmühle

[slow saddle]

i have super low CP friends/rats, but they play casually, deal with the same issues as others

Diff is, they put in effort to getting to know friends/bigger fish and that goes a long way

[lime stirrup]

Well maybe they are just real mokokos

[errant fable]

And the Clan Name sonderschulausflug

[zealous lintel]

the frick

[lime stirrup]

I think there is a differenve between getting someone a clear and getting someone a carry where they afk

[runic hill]

80k brel NM 1-4+6 was peak

[lime stirrup]

Its ideologically different

[slow saddle]

if we had the ability to see how an alt roster is tied to a main account, i wouldnt mind at all

[runic hill]

^that would be so good

[devout nymph]

Only works if you have more gear than them most of the time

[slow saddle]

but people obv take advantage, make separate steam accounts and all taht shit, because they KNOW they want to take advantage of passes

[sand marsh]

hey some new players are putting SH name as alt roster to get into lobbies. it works xdd

[runic hill]

ye the passes and events are the issue in my book as well

[tulip charm]

i joined setsura's lobby earlier

[runic hill]

cause it just generates a new gold earner without effort

[slow saddle]

i dont care much if people want to play the game more and earn more

Do it properly and actually support the game/devs

[runic hill]

which you wouldnt have on 1 account

[obtuse oyster]

om

[sand marsh]

oh dusty

that guy is pretty good

[devout nymph]

Ain't no way you have time to carry those low CP friends on ilvl

[sand marsh]

setsura not so much

[zealous lintel]

kinda funny that AGS wanted to help people with speeding up progress for returnees and new players through igniter and it backfired horribly

[lime stirrup]

I mean the problem is gold being a "scarce" resource tied to characters in the first place

[tulip charm]

you can tell right away when its setsura

[sand marsh]

yeah

naked aeromancer

= setsura

[obtuse oyster]

they just needed to fine tune

[lime stirrup]

If we didnt have this whale bait player driven economy this wouldnt be a thing in the first place

[zealous lintel]

yeah it did

[lime stirrup]

But it is what it is

[obtuse oyster]

it was a great idea and definitely brought a lot of people back

[zealous lintel]

but for many the wrong way

[runic hill]

first time for everything hard agree on that

[obtuse oyster]

it was just to easy to abuse with making new steam accounts

[zealous lintel]

true

[tulip charm]

i tried to get chuan to apply but he got gatekept

[slow saddle]

yup

[tulip charm]

[obtuse oyster]

you didn't even need to raid to get your character to 1620

[lime stirrup]

Mmo space is dead

[zealous lintel]

but for the overall game economy it wasnt a +

[obtuse oyster]

you make a character,hone to get the free gold

[lime stirrup]

https://tenor.com/view/hamster-funny-grab-inventory-steal-gif-7017947373975637877

[devout nymph]

If we had a gear ceiling we wouldn't have the issue with busses that much

[obtuse oyster]

delete it, rinse and repeat

[runic hill]

in my opinion this game would do much better if it focused on the raids rather than progression cause there are a lot of hyper progression games but not a lot of games with this good class and raid design

[zealous lintel]

but how do you make money?

[runic hill]

ppl will still dump a shitload into cosmetics

[lime stirrup]

Idk if that is actual true

[devout nymph]

I dunno about that class design part ...

[zealous lintel]

but thats not enough

for SG that is

[lime stirrup]

The "permanence" they are trying to give gear is pretty powerful psychologically

[runic hill]

cosmetics make more money than P2W in KR (SG stated that somewhen)

[lime stirrup]

But it is cringe

[errant fable]

More ayaya bikinis

[obtuse oyster]

1700 for nm*

[runic hill]

if the game is less hostile to F2P or casual players then more ppl will play

so more skins can be sold

[obtuse oyster]

[zealous lintel]

Yeah but why be happy with a lot of money when you can get all of the money?

[runic hill]

so i think overall it makes the same if not more money

[zealous lintel]

[obtuse oyster]

yeah

great direction that they are going in

[runic hill]

i think you just get a way higher playercount

[obtuse oyster]

end game players will chase/fomo for the challenge mode

[zealous lintel]

but asian games like short time period gains over long time

[runic hill]

and thus the losses from less/no P2W come back that way

[lime stirrup]

Too bad the suits in management at kmmo studios only know one game design philosophy

[obtuse oyster]

new/casual will slowly catch up with lower req nm mode

and casual can just hone to "hm" and just take their time

[runic hill]

true but AGS could make heavy adjustments like china (if they cared to do so from the start)

[lime stirrup]

And the space is dead everywhere else cause making gacha is cheaper and more profitable

What ags they are closing down

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1180341320355696640/1333591082499440650/SusDogInASkiMask.gif

[slow saddle]

would be nice if people didnt have a fomo mentality

We already see it on LA, they latest shiny toy comes out, people argue how they going to get it

[zealous lintel]

they didnt know what they are getting themselves into. AGS themselves stated in an interview that they are beginners in life service MMOs

[devout nymph]

That would mean Catering to casuals and ditching end game more

U can't win

[zealous lintel]

roxx confirmed this sentiment as well

[slow saddle]

if they had a gap between 1700 and 1730 for example, people would bitch about how long it would take to get to 1730

[zealous lintel]

they wanted a piece of the pie

[slow saddle]

there is no 'journey' when it comes to LA players

[zealous lintel]

and went for just a publishing contract

[slow saddle]

[obtuse oyster]

people are still bitching about not being able to transfer gear from 1710 serca

when it didn't even give mats for the transfer before the change they did

[lime stirrup]

This doesn't work in modern gaming mentality esp in online games where you have a reference for pace

[zealous lintel]

pheongate told you already they dont know how to react to xy

[devout nymph]

The journey is farming 6 goldearners

[zealous lintel]

it got better over time

[slow saddle]

yup

[lime stirrup]

And also if you miss the wave of competent rusher players you are screwed in mmos

[slow saddle]

OG MMOs, they set the content for even up to a year out, even if no one can grind/get there

lmao

[runic hill]

you can do both if you dont have to spend so much on fine tuning progress to make sure F2Ps can do bare minimum while top end still can sink thousands each month easily

[lime stirrup]

Nah i dont think that is entirely true

[obtuse oyster]

exactly

[slow saddle]

that was a good change

[lime stirrup]

Everyone was just bad 15 years ago

[obtuse oyster]

W change, but people still find some dumb reason to nitpick

[lime stirrup]

And had no idea how to optimize

[devout nymph]

Works in theory not in reality for mmos

[lime stirrup]

We were digging in the dirt and enjoying it

[zealous lintel]

yeah but optimizing is the bane of fun

[runic hill]

its possible but i am not saying its easy

[zealous lintel]

well except for some people

who love spreadsheets

[lime stirrup]

No spreadsheets just press button

[slow saddle]

BDO died when they catered to new players and forget about endgame

[runic hill]

ye you cant ignore the endgame cause thats the ppl who are least likely to quit

[lime stirrup]

Bdo died when all their devs went to make single player game instead

o7

[slow saddle]

and i was a business, id focus on the retention rates than acquisition for fast cash flow

[obtuse oyster]

Bdo is on it's up and up

[zealous lintel]

bdo never had an endgame to me. but last time i played was 2018

[devout nymph]

Money income in mmo is very whale heavy

[lime stirrup]

I mean you see wow classic

[runic hill]

you need to give ppl an option to get into the game without leaving endgame players dry and thats very hard in a perma progression game like LA

[lime stirrup]

People optimize the shit out of it

"og mmo"

Its just a diff playermentality now

[zealous lintel]

eh, do what someone else already said: stop progress above newest raid limitations

change main income/source

[runic hill]

ye it can work for sure

[zealous lintel]

kill of personal trading

and you would have already a better game

but as i said above

[slow saddle]

agreed

[zealous lintel]

SG wants all of the money

[devout nymph]

Ah yes the private server policies

[runic hill]

the issue is its all too late now u lost the ppl who would like the game more like that

[zealous lintel]

it would go against their money making machine

[runic hill]

ppl are not gonna come back in the amount u need them to make that concept work

[slow saddle]

speaking of costco and the hot dog

they did tht with baby dolphin swipe packs

[zealous lintel]

n.1 problem is the overall vibe and controversy regarding the game

even if they would pull of a realm reborn

[runic hill]

if they did that 3 years ago it would have been fire

[lime stirrup]

BuT mY pLaYeR dRiVeN pVp-bAsEd OpEn-WoRlD aCtIoN mMo-RpG

[zealous lintel]

you would need a big ass campaign

[lime stirrup]

gotta tick all those investor boxxes

[devout nymph]

U forgot AI

[lime stirrup]

oh shit

sorry

AI POWERED

[slow saddle]

it would be rare to find people who know and can fight for/support both camps of players

[zealous lintel]

anybody who i talk to about LOA first comment i get is heavy p2w and alts

[slow saddle]

theres extreme bias on both sides

[lime stirrup]

you would need a new fucking game is what it is

just keep the engine get rid of all the garbage gearing and make it a combat focused game

[runic hill]

i wouldnt mind doing so, i think if the curve had better adjustment (and actual RMT got heavily banned, probably too late now xD) you can make a game in which it works out

to support both paying minmax customers and F2P maybe get a skin for 20€ sometimes ppl

[lime stirrup]

like this games economy is cooked there is no saving it

[runic hill]

ye T4 cooked the eco and progress hard

[lime stirrup]

unless they full wipe on t5 and at that point you may aswell just make a new game

[devout nymph]

Let's face it new/casual player wuck and you don't wanna deal with them if you don't have to

[obtuse oyster]

they won't ever do a full wipe

[errant fable]

altroster

[slow saddle]

wym support minmax customers

They're all RMTers to you

[lime stirrup]

and theys would have to gamba antagonizing half their playerbase

[slow saddle]

[zealous lintel]

a full wipe is dead game

[obtuse oyster]

full wipe = top end spenders quitting

[lime stirrup]

in pursuit of new players

ye

its cooked

[slow saddle]

yup easily

[lime stirrup]

new game angle just go next

[devout nymph]

Not even casuals want to play with casuals if they have the choice that's attitude issues

[runic hill]

in the current state of the game yes in a better state no, i didnt mind it at all in T3

[lime stirrup]

(new game is ai powered mobile gacha)

now with 50% more vibe coding and malware distribution

here enjoy your 10 freepulls

[runic hill]

thats exactly the problem, we are too deep down the hole to not make 1 side full rage

[lime stirrup]

just go lostark2

[devout nymph]

My freepulls are just server compensations

[lime stirrup]

a t5 wipe would do nothing

[runic hill]

if you wanna fix it without getting anyone angry it has to be a long term process over like 1 or 2 years

[lime stirrup]

just rebrand and rerelease

[runic hill]

and idk if the game has that much time

[zealous lintel]

t4 was the chance

[errant fable]

Lets all start bns together

[lime stirrup]

wanna go play bns retail!?

[zealous lintel]

hell no

[devout nymph]

Fuq no

[zealous lintel]

[lime stirrup]

jk i levelled to fucking 45 on release

and saw books

[devout nymph]

[lime stirrup]

they were like

[sand marsh]

lol i made west people DC

[runic hill]

bns was one of my fastest uninstalls out there xd

[sand marsh]

i hold the power!!!!!!

[lime stirrup]

they see engravings and relic books in loa and went "hold my fucking beer imma one up them"

[obtuse oyster]

om

[runic hill]

tbh i should go hit my best friend IRL, he made me download LA in the first place

[sand marsh]

im on luterra. W

i should do this all ay

day

make ppl dc

[runic hill]

he made me addicted to this shitshow

[obtuse oyster]

diabolical