#Melee combat is still like this? (This isn't Chivalry, doesn't make sense to have it this way.)

20 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

inner crown
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I'll fix the combat:
Left click - attack
Left hold - heavy attack
Right click - shove
Right hold - Kick
Or...You put right click as a sort of block that negates 40% damage if you wanna go that way.

Why they've done it this way? The former justification was "To get around the riot police zombies shields"...Now that they've removed that feature (That they introduced) we've still got this clunky, stiff combat system...When before they touched it, it was 100% fine.
The knife/wrench were quick little spam items
Lead pipe was a basic all-round weapon. Not great at anything, but not terrible
Mallet was a solid little basher
Baseball bat was good for doming crowds
Rebar wasn't fantastic, but it was a solid two handed weapon to keep things knocked down
T-pipe and large wrench were just terrible
Fire axe, Sledgehammer, Clawhammer, Hatchet, Machete, Crowbar were all arguably the best weapons you could get, they all felt unique and weighted dealing solid damage at the cost of rarity.

Someone decided "Well...We've got this PVP game. Let's use the PVP mechanics for a PVE game and have zero idea why that wouldn't really work."
Added the 'melee combat update' which the first looks, seemed super promising. They kept the way the weapons moved, added kicks and stuff...All cool.
Then for some reason, when they implemented it, all the weapons felt the same.
Only difference was "Two handed weapons are different than the one handed weapons" they all swung the same, all felt like you were just slapping things with wet pool noodles.
Tree cutter leg chop became the meta and ruined it for anyone who wasn't a sweat.

Now we've got...All bladed weapons are just terrible to combat the leg-cut sweaties.
We went from 'all weapons feel unique and cool to use, it rewards you to try them out and get something you like the feel of' to 'eh, they're all the same' to 'just use a claw-hammer or crowbar' Just remove all the weapons you don't want people using at that rate.
End of the day...The complicated melee system worked for a game like Chivalry because you were fighting other people...Here it doesn't work it's just...Idk confusing? Borderline backwards?

nimble flame
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In a sense it definitely doesn’t feel needed as a system anymore unless they add a spear and use jab with the scroll wheel. Either add more to justify it or change it entirely cause what is the reason?

most of the melee weapons nowadays are now weighted better and you can feel that with every swing (some better than others), tho with the blunt being far more superior than cut it feels like there isn’t a reason to even take a machete (a 1 handed 3 star weapon), fire axe is good but not better than blunt because you don’t stun the enemy when they slowly lunge at you they are awkwardly taking the hit then grab you. It’s ridiculous.

I just think there should be a rebalance in the cut aspect to help have a reason for cut to be of use like let’s say they bleed and slowly die, or level 3’s can cut off heads but cost a lot stamina to do so or a kill animation so it’s not a meta Strat, killing zombies should be fun to do not a chore to do so that’s why L4D2 is so much fun cause using melees to chop off heads or make their heads explode is so satisfying (different games I know but best example I can give)

With the knife and wrench I like that they realized they will never be played seriously so they have them as throwables. (if only they get perks soon to do more damage)

proud maple
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Melee is fine we don't need to reinvent the wheel

nimble flame
proud maple
nimble flame
# proud maple I disagree. People say the meta is baseball bat but that's not true it's just th...

I mean yeah, that’s mostly what a meta is, the easiest and more effective way to win (in this game itself), and i disagree when it comes to just as effective to certain weapons, the biggest ones to me is the blades which 1 handed is useless unless it’s a 3 star or the tree trimmer because the biggest flaw with them is that they can still hit you even when you hit them, they should dismember to not hit you mid animation or cause them to at least stop the attack, there is so much unfairness to it.

I could think of “oh just shove after I hit” but that’s one zombie which could be fine if I had I-frames or have the other zombies stay and look at you after the animation to get some time to react, but I don’t. It doesn’t feel fun to enjoy blades because of those aspects itself

Blunt is great and I don’t think that should be changed as much maybe increase more blunt and less base damage to baseball so it doesn’t just two swing (with the fastest swing animation out of the whole 2H arsenal) to kill a good chunk of the zombie horde I think it should knock them down so you can get past and disable them for a bit, make it what it is intended for a bat to handle hordes easily and get past

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Again I don’t disagree fully just on some weapons

loud bane
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End of the day...The complicated melee system worked for a game like Chivalry because you were fighting other people...Here it doesn't work it's just...Idk confusing? Borderline backwards?

I'm truthfully a bit confused on this post, you think the current iteration of melee combat is confusing and complicated? Is it combat 1.0(Pre-April 2025) you want to go back to?
Stripping away directional attacks(I honestly wish we had more control over these instead of just Left and Right) and Strong Attacks isn't going to solve the current problems as it's all just changing numbers and getting rid of the hidden input/animation delays from this point.

They're on the right path with balance; but every time it's a pendulum swing where they make one side too strong and entirely forget about the other, as well as being just slow to do balance in general.
We're not going to get any further weapon changes until 1.0 which sucks as I'd think they'd want it more refined before then.

Bladed is in a meh spot, the Fireaxe is ridiculously strong, but every other Bladed weapon pales in comparison to it.
The change to make zeds stagger when a limb gets cut off was good, but not at the cost of all stability damage on Light+Strong attacks, especially when they gave zeds 10 more HP on their legs that was never disclosed.

inner crown
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Reinvent the wheel?
They had the wheel when they first dropped the game.
THEN they decided "Let's reinvent the melee combat" and it's all been down hill since then

Direction and control of the swings doesn't really mean anything. "Instead of hitting this zombie in the head from the left. I can hit it in the head from the right"...Like...Idk, whoohoo?
There needs to be some kinda solid in-between for the melee system. I personally think they had it right the first time. The 'upgrade' to it was complete and utter trash. This current update we've got is a bit better. Not as good as the original IMO where all the weapons felt unique and fun to use (Minus the T-pipe and the large wrench)

Idk. Maybe I'm missing something. Someone explain why the swing from right to left and left to right isn't terrible and designed to combat an issue they introduced, then got rid of...

fleet rain
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The directionality of attacks don't matter too much to me atm, but I do like the rhythm gaming aspect of alternating left click and right click

sleek horizon
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Personally I think the melee combat is fun, the biggest issue is with melee is weapon balancing right now. The baseball bat has some insane stagger and stability damage to it where you can just knock down a zombie and finish them off. Weapons like the Sledgehammer and Fire axe should be powerful as they are rarer and more expensive but the crowbar, machete, hatchet and carpentry hammer being two stars doesn't make a whole lotta sense they're powerful but they really shouldn't be as powerful as the sledge and axe, however I will agree that blades are a bit meh right now. You get zero stagger which is kind of needed but in turn get raw damage output and paired with specific perks the machete can deal some insane damage but the stagger isn't there so no matter what you will get hit. As for the combat itself it's what I was expecting from torn banner and what I thought the combat was going to be originally, It's more interactive then M1 = Swing Left, M1 again = Swing Right and Hold M1 = Strong Attack. Overall I think the system is fun and fine but weapons need some tweaks here and there thats how it looks from my point of view.

fringe gust
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The nerf probably won't help if someone's got expert stability damage but it still should be something to look on

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Preferably, making stronger zombie types for variation

sleek horizon
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I wouldn't be surprised if the national guard zombie and the riot shield zombie are supposed to combat this problem but it can't be tested as the spawns for them aren't present this update but we shall see what they do in 1.0

fringe gust
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I do feel like increasing their spawn rates by a moderate amount on nm would be nice. If we're not getting any new zombies anytime soon buffing them and the prime versions a bit would be ideal if we're calling it "nightmare"

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Cause truly the nightmare is watching some of your teammates do nothing while everyone is being torn apart

inner crown
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That's what I mean about the directional swinging...
If it doesn't matter, or change/add anything...Why's it in?
We're pressing 2 buttons to do something that we were able to press a single button for.

As for zombies holding shields...May I introduce the 'kick button'.
I don't buy the interactive argument. I mean you could have two steering wheels in one car that controls the left and right side wheels and chop it up to 'adds interaction'...Doesn't mean it's a good idea. Also most've the comments here are also complaining about things they've changed in the melee...Which I don't think most of ya'll were even here for how the very first melee system was before they changed it the first time.

I'm starting to be convinced the handful of people defending this as a "good melee system" haven't touched another FPS game with melee in it.

nimble flame
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Ok proposal, to add more to the system, what if the devs made it to where right swing has lesser damage than the left swing, but has the fastest way of swinging because of your character holding the melee on their right side, your way is totally fine as a system, tho if we wanted to add more to justify it, would that justify it or do you have something better besides the bypassing riot shield? which honestly is a shame that it’s gone now I agree.

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@inner crown