#Feedback for the Reanimation Update | Part II

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eager obsidian
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Hello devs and everyone! I wanted to create a part two of this discussion and feedback in regards to the recent update the game most certainly needed.
To summarize the old discussion, (https://discord.com/channels/211900829307895819/1362160397666353152) here are the main points of this feedback summarized plus some extra info:

-Regular zombies (walkers, shamblers, runners) should have their health and reduced a bit. Keep health of bloodied zombies the same along with variants.
-Make charged attacks a lot more viable against regular zombies depending on the weapon like the first game. This won't eliminate upsides and downsides of each weapon type (blunt and bladed) alongside swinging said weapons from left to right, or right to left.
-Allow stamina to recharge in between charged swings. This allows players to coordinate their next moves whether individually or in a group.
-Make shoving take a little less stamina.
-Remove the hazy white background when opening the inventory.
-Have the inventory be binded to the number 1 key by default.
-Have two separate inventories. Our main one to check our weapons, medical and passive items, etc, and a secondary one where we can check our ammo and boards.
-Certain calibers such as 12 gauge, 357 magnum, 5.56, 6.8, and 308 Winchester should kill construction and firefighter zombies in one shot to the head. Make the last two calibers mentioned kill riot zombies in one shot to the head.
-9mm and 45 ACP kills regular zombies in one shot to the head. 9mm kills bloodied zombies in two shots to the head. 45 ACP kills bloodied zombies in one shot.
-22 LR, if implemented, can kill regular zombies in two shots, bloodied zombies in three, construction and firefighter zombies in two, and riot zombies in x amount. (Let me know what numbers you guys would add to make this caliber fair to use.)

-9mm, 45 ACP, (and 22 LR if implemented), can appear a little more frequently to accommodate for the changes mentioned.

Continued

eager obsidian
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Now for some new feedback.

-Once the mentioned changes to zombie health and combat go through (hopefully), remove the zombies' animation that let us know we're going to get grabbed. The reason for this is to make the encounters a lot more lethal and intense. Before TBS took over, zombies didn't have this animation. Zombies could grab you out of surprise and then the QTE would start based on how much stamina you have.
-Fix an issue where if a player is going for a hit and the zombie goes for the swing, even if the player swung first, the zombie will get hit, but the player will also get hit.
-Fix the spawns of zombies. No need to add more.
-Reduced the speed of all walking zombies but only by a tiny amount. Nothing too drastic.
-Make certain zombie variants drop important items like the first game. Example: soldier zombies can occasionally drop 9mm rounds.
-Add more server options so people can play on low pings in their region.
-Add a server list like the first game so people can join.
-Allow private lobbies to be started with one player instead of two.
-Balance private lobbies' difficulty for solo players. (This will obviously depend on the map just like the first game did).

unreal blade
eager obsidian
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Forgot to add another thing.
-Fix an issue where if you hit a zombie, sometimes they don’t get staggered at all. In my experience, this has happened with bladed weapons mostly. I’ve yet to see it with blunt weapons.

distant bison
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based. A plastic helmet shouldn't stop a rifle round. It is ridiculous. And they should add more gore animation. One of my favorite in the first game was this head splitting thing that sometimes happened with headshots. It was pretty rad and retro fallout like.

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Also drop all gun damage perks and any ballistic perk. They are arcade. Only gun handling perks (like reloading and ammo count) and melee related perks should remain, combat wise.

eager obsidian
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They’re old, so I have to make some changes.

fringe flame
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Caliber based piercing could be coolio

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22lr and .308 are not the same when hitting a swat helmet for example

eager obsidian
fringe flame
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Maybe 22lr could take off the helmet off of the zombie

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But 308 can pierce through and kill that zombie

fringe flame
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Doesnt deal much damage

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But has more ammo per box

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It could have low recoil too

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Honestly i would love seeing the mkIII again

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And with gun customization oughj

eager obsidian
# fringe flame 22lr should be like in the first game

Agreed, but it has to be reasonable. For example, I mentioned that regular zombies can go down in two shots, bloodied zombies in three, construction and firefighter zombies in two, but I don’t know how much for riot zombies. Maybe three too?

fringe flame
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With helmet or without?

eager obsidian
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With.

fringe flame
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I think it should take like consecutive shots

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Maybe 3 to take off the helmet

eager obsidian
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Could be a possibility.

fringe flame
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9mm should one tap zombies or nah?

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OH WAIT I REMEMBERED

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Are they going to add that mechanic in the first game

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The one if you ads for like 3 secs you get into a focused mode or smth

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Making you able to one shot zombies with any handgun?

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(honestly doesnt make sense for me, and nmrih2 is more fast-paced than nmrih1)

eager obsidian
fringe flame
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With that

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22lr could only two shot common zombies

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Since is a smaller caliber

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Pros
• more ammo per box
• low recoil
• ammo isnt heavy (take less space in your inventory)

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Cons
• Low damage
• Isnt that good to pierce through armor

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Like this? @eager obsidian

fresh cradle
fresh cradle
fringe flame
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Yeah

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9mm requires double tap to finish a zombie

fresh cradle
eager obsidian
fresh cradle
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I still luv 9mm,

fringe flame
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Me too

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Even irl

fresh cradle
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But the game hate me 😞 I can't find MP5 at all

fresh cradle
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But RN, MP5 and Benelli

eager obsidian
# fringe flame Even irl

I also mentioned in the feedback here that 12 gauge, 357 magnum, 5.56, 6.8, and 308 should kill construction and firefighter zombies in one shot to the head with the last two calibers killing riot zombies in one shot.

fresh cradle
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IRL, I found Glock's recoil to be not that heavy, wanna get my hand on VP9 though

fringe flame
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Idk if this is ingame but

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Does recoil and accuracy change if you wield the flashlight

fringe flame
cloud rune
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-Regular zombies (walkers, shamblers, runners) should have their health and reduced a bit. Keep health of bloodied zombies the same along with variants.

  • get rid of variants. if you want a tanky zombie give it firefighter and swat gear.
  • get rid of lunges as they are counter-intuitive to melee. if a zombie can lunge it's more risky to melee and promotes gun play to deal with them before they even have a chance to lunge. if a zombie is tanky and lunges, that is problematic as it makes it difficult to tactically deal with the zombie since it both has speed and durability now. (or make the lunges easier to predict and counter).
  • zombies shouldn't be tanky to "promote teamplay" this idea is contradictory on an open map where people get distracted and run off in 8 different directions to loot things. team play and threat should have been controlled for by using zombie volume, forcing players to group together and fight together to push through. it's also counter-intuitive because guns exist and require little to no team work to be effective. one person can clear 20 zombies alone with a gun and ammo.
  • the only time tankiness worked in NMRIH1 was on the nightmare ship sinking map designed specifically to give everyone a melee weapon only, and force players to fight the zombies inside the ship before the water level rose and drowned everyone.
fringe flame
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I wanna ping maxx or any dev

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About

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Red eyed zombies like

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Why are they so tanky

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Compared to regular zombies

cloud rune
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they are gimmick to me, and i can't take it seriously lol, the devs probably really like it though and will never remove it for some reason.

fringe flame
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Is there any logical/biological reason?

fringe flame
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Since most of them are walkers

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Just avoid them and keep on the move

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Tho in close quarters

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Yeah i can see that

cloud rune
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yeah no that is actually the problem...

fringe flame
cloud rune
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the problem with tanky zombies if all zombies are tanky.

  • promotes running/avoidant gameplay (top of a car).
  • promotes gun play
  • doesn't promote teamplay the way the devs thought/hope it would, especially on open maps where running and gunning would still be prioritized anyway.
  • is grindy and doesn't deliver satisfying melee.

**solution: **tanky zombie is a type of zombie that is not common.
**aesthetic: **tanky zombie isn't a "special" zombie, but just a human who died and became a zombie wearing clothing/armor that makes them tanky. (swat zombie/firefighter zombie).

fringe flame
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Honestly

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Just get on top of vans and hit them with the pipe

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Thats something weird for me

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Its kinda op

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Guns are useful, true, tho they attract nearby zombies

cloud rune
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yeah thats part of avoidant gameplay, sure it works, and sure it can be what people want for gameplay, but for me personally i dont want that as apart of gameplay.

fringe flame
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Same

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Its kinda boring for me

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Just get on the van

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And youre inmortal

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Yeah eh, zombies should climb the van

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Because anyways, there are more places where zombies can't get on

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And makes any kind of melee op(?)

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You can hit them, they can't hit you

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Abt teamplay, that depends on the players tbh

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There are dudes who are lone wolfing the map

cloud rune
# fringe flame Guns are useful, true, tho they attract nearby zombies

it doesn't matter that they attract other zombies in the world where guns are better than melee, because you can usually get 90 ammo without scavenger perk, if everyone takes separate guns/ammo. and likewise the devs can't overwhelm the spawn with tanky zombies, so more zombies come in? guess what you can just run... or shoot them again since not enough are coming in because the devs had to balance the spawn because the zombies are too tanky.. lol

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if melee was actually powerful? and zombies were relatively easy to 1-2 hit kill with melee? you could have way more flexibility with the spawner.

fringe flame
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I think ammo spawn is good, cuz anyways it depends on how you play the game

cloud rune
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and this flexibility with the spawner would overwhelm ammo counts.

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meaning ammo would dry up faster.

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all because melee was powerful.

fringe flame
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Unless youre in a mess and have 40 zombies hitting you

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And need to kill/deal damage QUICKLY RIGHT NOW

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I would still prefer gettin ontop of vans or chopping legs

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I always end being the guy who carries all the ammo

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(anyone wants some 9mm ammo???)

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Just give me a machete or tree trimmer

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Tho i like the gun play

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But anyways

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It always depends on the way you play the game

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Most of the dudes i played with always ran out of bullets

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And fighted every zombie they encountered

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Idk if it is me but balancing a game like nmrih its hard

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Seems hard

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Because the responder gets op

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Or the zombies get ip

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Op***

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IP LOL

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I think guns are better for gettin out of Messy situations (like geting cornered by zombies) and melee are useful for being on the move and stuff (chopping legs and shit)

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Srry for the bible btw

cloud rune
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to balance the game you need a clear vision for what you want to achieve in the gameplay, so yeah as a baseline the devs need to decide things like

  • is this a run and gun game? or is fighting prioritized over running?
  • do we want people to mostly avoid combat?
  • do we want melee to be the side piece or the most reliable weapon even over guns?
  • do we want ammo and guns to be rare?
  • do we want tactical positioning gameplay?
  • do we want to control difficulty through zombie health or volume?
  • creating your own moments of breathing room through clearing zombies? over jumping on cars at any time?
  • is this a sandbox game where a player has the freedom to literally fight everything 90% of the time and still win? or is the game designed around forcing a specific concept of gameplay?
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and sometimes the answer is a balance between both, rather than dichotomy.

fringe flame
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Yeah thats true

eager obsidian
# fringe flame Compared to regular zombies

He mentioned the bloodied zombies are there in terms of virology. My theory is that the virus had small mutations that caused their bones to become denser. Again, that’s just my theory.

fringe flame
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One thing that made unique the first game is the realism

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You arent the protagonist

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Not the hero

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Damn not even inmune

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You're alone.

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Youre free to fight or run

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But any mistake you do can cost your life

eager obsidian
fringe flame
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Maybe shooting that zombie that was in your way was a good idea in the start

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But then

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Good luck with the zombies nearby coming after you

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Melees and Firearms have their cons and pros

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It depends on your game style

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Players are free to do anything they want but are they able to take the consequences of their actions?

fresh cradle
fresh cradle
eager obsidian
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I’ll write a separate conversation about the bloodied zombies and attach it to this one once I’m off work.

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Get people’s opinions and thoughts and see if the devs might reconsider them.

fringe flame
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I think it all depends on the player choices

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For me its just

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Only kill what you have to

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Some people like to fight every single zombie

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Help or not teammates

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You are free to do anything

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Tho ive got lost, we were talking abt red eyed zombies

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Eh yeah, for me those are kinda weird, but not a big deal

cloud rune
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all i can say is i dont kill every zombie in zomboid, but i still rack up 3000 kills, and kill a bunch of them, i'll probably just play zomboid, the only drawback to that game really is that the dev time is so long, going to take all year before build 42 is multiplayer.

fringe flame
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I had to fight my way out of the store

fringe flame
fresh cradle
fringe flame
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After all, killing its fun

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You should try it in real life!

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(jk dont do that)

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Anyways

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Are red eyed zombies inmune to stagger or smth

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?

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Cuz honestly blunt weapons dont have the same effect on them

eager obsidian
eager obsidian
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Additional feedback to add:
-Shoving should cancel your animation during a charged attack to avoid a zombie's hit/lunge. This allows to reposition yourself and plan your hit again.