Archer Class Discussion and what you want changed. (Actual Archers only to keep talk relevant)

[boreal owl]

did you know archers are strong at range

[dreamy grotto]

did you know archers have bows

[full coral]

a shotgun is going to be a shotgun (buck shot). higher damage up close. very little damage at range

scout is close range

soldier is close/mid range

pyro is close range (with a few projectile weapons)

demoman is mid range

heavy is close/mid range

engineer has a shotgun, the sentry is a building. not his weapon

medic can hit long range. with a projectile, that is better used shooting at teammates to heal them

spy is close range/ with the ability to cloak/disguise

notice a trend here.. most classes in game are very limited being able to challenge the sniper from the snipers range

[boreal owl]

I didn't. First time I've heard of that. I know they have throwing axes

[dreamy grotto]

wow, i bet axes are nice, it must be nice having a ranged weapon

[vernal trellis]

Brother again im not going to be a robot. You cant compare FPS games to a medieval game lol. There is no relevance.

[full coral]

but here.. i'll add a bit too it.

how much damage does a quickscoped headshot do at long range...?
its 150

how much damage does that same quickscope headshot do in mid-range?... yep, still 150

how much does a headshot do in CLOSE range?..... if you guess 150... you guessed right!

[slender kiln]

Think I'mma be a spectator today last night drained my will

[dreamy grotto]

i am wheezing so much that he is really doing this

[vernal trellis]

Thats why i stopped responding to these archer threads lol.

[full coral]

youre choosing to not compare it..

the mechanics have counterparts and if you translate what you already know.. you'd find that it can be quite similar.

[boreal owl]

Booo, fence sitter. Take a real side. Boooo

[dreamy grotto]

i choose the skirmisher side

because i like throwing stuff

[vernal trellis]

There isnt anything to compare lol. Its an FPS game. Anyone can tell you that you cant compare the 2 together lol.

[full coral]

theres A LOT to compare..

anyone with a brain can see the ability to translate the information from tf2 into chiv2 mechanics and gameplay

[vernal trellis]

Medieval games do not have what FPS games have, Customization to allow their weapons to do more, damage, accuracy or even turn a shit pistol into a sniper.

[full coral]

hmm.. odd.. because archer is effectively playing a fps game with their bow out..

[vernal trellis]

TF2 has a shit ton of weapons now to swap between and even can turn your shotguns into a sniper lol

[full coral]

oh.. i see.. youre just ignorant to the game.

[vernal trellis]

No you aint being realistic

[full coral]

you cannot turn a shotgun into a sniper.. there isnt a slug shotgun in game.

[dull cliff]

I want to see a Chiv Archer to Tetris blocks comparrison

[boreal owl]

Off topic but this is my axecher

[slender kiln]

Homeless

[dreamy grotto]

let me tell you why the jackel in halo 2 legendary is too OP and compare it with your warbow

[boreal owl]

Yes

[full coral]

this is how i know that most people here are looking at things in poor faith..

because youre not even putting effort into seeing a different viewpoint

[vernal trellis]

We even went over this in a match together. You had decent experience with bow, crossbow, warbow but yet i closed the distance to you every time by doing a simple maneuver that average players do. You missed shots constantly and yet here you are stating average players can easily be a god like archer

[dull cliff]

What lol

[full coral]

because that a 1v1 situation... not a single person has said that archer is strong in a 1v1.

[dreamy grotto]

The Type-50 Sniper Rifle System,[2][3] otherwise known as the Particle Beam Rifle, is a Covenant long-range weapon and the counterpart of the UNSC Sniper Rifle. They are most commonly seen being used by Kig-Yar, although Sangheili and even Jiralhanae are also seen using Beam Rifles on occasion.

I like to state that Keeper is obvious a Kig-Yar

[full coral]

im not saying the average player is going to be a god...

but the average player can put damage out easily without needing to fully understand the mechanics of the game..

[dreamy grotto]

it makes sense, we need to give melee battlerifles or something

[boreal owl]

The only effort I'm putting in is throwing them axes

[vernal trellis]

Its a circle at this point thats why i stopped responding. Hell even Badger stated that archers are as balanced as they can be lol

[slender kiln]

Archers that don't know basic mechanics are fodder and I can't imagine complaining about them, unless they're on your team lmao

[full coral]

archers that dont know basic mechanics.. .can still be on a team with a solid frontline. and land damage from a range, without NEEDING to know the mechanics

[vernal trellis]

Im a Maul guy and when i see an archer its free kills for me lol

I get excited seeing an archer

[full coral]

funny. because an archer can look at you and say the same thing.

[dreamy grotto]

im a cooler maul guy, they are free killing sprees for me

i do wish the maul special on sprint 1 shot archers just to see them fly

[vernal trellis]

But yet why am i not complaining an arche killed me?

[dreamy grotto]

the archer not looking down

[full coral]

but yet.. youre not seeing archers complaining about melee killing them either

its almost like that melee player had to put in a very unproportionate amount of effort in order to kill the archer

[boreal owl]

I hate it when the Dane axe user kills me when I’m archering

[dreamy grotto]

i like letting a archer who lost an arm live so they cant shoot

[vernal trellis]

Yeah the reason why you aint seeing it cause they aint complaining about something killing them. They go negative but they aint complaining. Thats odd i wonder why that is? Maybe because they understand they play archer they are easily killable? Its part of the game and if you die oh well respawn and try again? Like we can keep going on about reasons why and yet they go negative

Even with their teaming winning in TO they still go negative

Are you going negative in games?

Like you even admitted that you dont like dying once in a while to a random arrow. I dont like dying to anything random either like getting headshot by a random dane axe or a random person hitting me in the back or an arrow or catapult etc yet im not complaining they need a rework cause i just got hit randomly.

Like hell i was even that archer starting off going negative and yet i never complained cause i know i was picking the worst stat class in the game

[full coral]

the difference there..... you CAN defend against the dane axe

you cannot defend against an arrow without a shield.

[hollow willow]

Watched the TF2 video. Although some of the talking points can be applicable to archer, the comparison is rendered moot since we can’t one shot anything besides non overhealed archers

[vernal trellis]

Random not seeing meaning you still get hit lol. Even mid fight you can still get hit and i got many clips to show that. I die to thrown weapons way more then an random arrow hitting me or even an archer focusing me.

[full coral]

weather you can 1 shot them or not. yhou can still put a disportpotiate amount of damage compared to what they can return.

[full coral]

not seeing is an awareness issue

even if youre aware of the archer, without a shield. youre forced to dodge the attack

[vernal trellis]

Yet no one can show that. Why? Why cant you see average archer putting out so much damage that they would be going positive and rocking scoreboard even past half way.

[full coral]

stop. the scoreboard is inflated with warhorns and banners.

[vernal trellis]

so like your issue is awareness. If you had awareness then you could easily prevent yourself from taking damage and yes mind you im not using shield either

[dull cliff]

I still wish he would upload a full Warbow gameplay : (

[unkempt tangle]

I can get top 3rd pretty easy on warbow, and my aim is dogshit. legit arrows going sideways and stuff

[vernal trellis]

Yet Crossbowmen get warhorns so why they aint high on the leaderboard? Even with kills why dont you see it?

[unkempt tangle]

xbow is even easier to top score with the banner and an axe

[boreal owl]

Archers Op YouTubers said so

[hollow willow]

Yeah but that dmg is rendered meaningless by any sufficiently skilled players who will play cover and break LOS. Compared to a sniper in a FPS where if you get hit, you will die

[vernal trellis]

So lets see a clip if you say aim is dogshit. Lets see you score top 3.

[full coral]

so.. if i follow your train of thought.."if they dont die. the damage is worthless"

so if youre low health. do you just fight to the death?

[unkempt tangle]

top 3rd of scoreboard so top 10

[boreal owl]

I’m always fighting to the death. I’ll do what I must to get the funny props

[unkempt tangle]

@vernal trellis that was one game

[hollow willow]

I’m saying comparing a sniper with an archer is a brain dead take. Snipers 1 shot, that’s literally their identity and problem. Archers can’t one shot and have to keep dumping arrows into a healthy player, or finish off a half dead player.

[dull cliff]

3rd in 64? Let's see it!

[full coral]

if you cant understand the comparison between archer in chiv2.. and sniper in tf2... the only thing braindead is you ability to translate mechanics between the games.

[unkempt tangle]

top 3rd of the scoreboard, so top 10

and again, horrible aim

[dull cliff]

Top 3rd....? I have never seen someone claim that. But good on you for getting there.

[vernal trellis]

Can you please show a clip cause anyone can easily show a screen shot and say i played such and such class. Thats not even top 3 like you said either

[unkempt tangle]

@vernal trellis asked for even halfway so... idk what you want

[dull cliff]

Why is he still going on about they TF2 to Chiv Archer comparrison still lol.

[unkempt tangle]

top 3rd, not top 3

[hollow willow]

I literally agreed that talking points were similar, but the comparison to an FPS and chiv2 was stupid. Archers are not snipers

[vernal trellis]

what are you talking about?

[unkempt tangle]

you said about at least halfway, im saying top 10 is easy with my terrible aim

[dull cliff]

Checkmate buddy

https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/Huntsman

[unkempt tangle]

also you can see my stupid lobster hat in the background

but no, I don't have clips of myself missing a bunch. I don't tend to save those

[dull cliff]

So no proof you actually used the bow?

[vernal trellis]

No just a clip in general that your playing archer cause i cant fucking see what class you are with that blurriness or how ez it is to just switch classes lol.

[unkempt tangle]

the few archer clips I have are doing things in melee

and one good jump shot

[vernal trellis]

The reason why i even said how ez it is to switch classes not to be petty but someone already tried doing that months back stating they were playing archer and went 25 and 0, turns out he was just using catapult the whole time lol

[unkempt tangle]

lol. that's stupid

i mean the person, not your claim

[boreal owl]

My evidence as to why archers are bad for the game

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E24Q43ALCoI&ab_channel=DaRealBeesechurger

[vernal trellis]

Well their reasonings behind nerfing archer was stupid too. Like one suggested they cant duel in duel servers cause of an archer so they wanted them to be nerfed

Actually rid off entirely

[hollow willow]

Please provide more evidence, I would like to see more

[boreal owl]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsqxhlCYJg8&ab_channel=Jozinek

[unkempt tangle]

just a comparison with my mason archer, so you can see the silly hat

[slender kiln]

You use controller? 🤨

[unkempt tangle]

no, idk why it does that

[vernal trellis]

Again you could be switching classes or not even using bow lol. Thats why i prefer clips and you using controller on PC you dirty monster!

[unkempt tangle]

my items are numbered!

[vernal trellis]

I know but on the side it shows controller pad lol

[hollow willow]

Thank you, I will review this carefully

[unkempt tangle]

yeah it's had that forever, I forget it's even there tbh

[slender kiln]

I doubt he would willingly use the shitty controller scheme in this game

[dull cliff]

Complains about Controller Auto Aim

Uses it

[boreal owl]

Interesting

[unkempt tangle]

uh

[slender kiln]

He's memeing based off the amusing argument last night

[boreal owl]

This is no time for memes. This is evidence

[full coral]

its a meme.. because it doesnt work in practice

[unkempt tangle]

ah. oh right the drawing

[vernal trellis]

@unkempt tangle Here my stats to even show i aint even an archer main but with archer experience telling you this.

[full coral]

or ya know.. it has an equal chance to fail

[slender kiln]

Based katars

[vernal trellis]

I love the Katars

Challenging

[unkempt tangle]

i would if they worked better

[slender kiln]

They do need hitboxes fixed and cancel to parry fixed lol

[unkempt tangle]

maybe with the servers fixed I can go back

[vernal trellis]

I actually have FFA wins with Katars and even before the buff they got i got FFA wins with them

No it was not ez at all lol

[unkempt tangle]

they're very good. Unique to use, and not very safe should the hitbox gods decide it's not your day

[boreal owl]

Rookie numbers. You should have a lower K/D like me.

[vernal trellis]

They werent really much of an issue in my opinion since im like a counter god

[vernal trellis]

I used to have a 0.25 kdr when i first played the game as archer lol

it was under 1 kdr for awhile till rank 124 when i past it and i think thats when i finally put down the archer class.

[boreal owl]

1.5 KD right now

[vernal trellis]

Better then the average player lol

[boreal owl]

It's not about being good it's about throwing yourself at the objective

[slender kiln]

Oh, you're 4 spots up from me on katar exp

Not for long tho

[boreal owl]

I need to get my throwing axe levels up there, this is just unacceptable.

[unkempt tangle]

A good number of battlecries

[vernal trellis]

I mean the ranking for Katars isnt really all that high so you can easily pass me lol. I used to be top 15 with them but i havent used them in awhile since i got so addicted to 1 shot people with Maul. I even made a funny video of the weapon lol

[vernal trellis]

Staying in character gotta AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH while i fight lol

[slender kiln]

Ya I just wanted to get the fancy skin and found myself up there

[boreal owl]

This is how it should be

[spice cedar]

he's only got like 10 battlecries per match

you need like 100 per match

[vernal trellis]

There are matches when i dont do it but in reality i battle cry like over 100 times in matches

[unkempt tangle]

I look at battlecries to deaths

[spice cedar]

just scream constantly

[unkempt tangle]

over 1 is good

[vernal trellis]

Honestly im trying to battle cry my way past my current kills lol

[spice cedar]

it's all about how often you're deafening some rando next to you

[vernal trellis]

No its to the person im fighting so they cant tell when im using a heavy attack drag lol

[spice cedar]

based and maulpilled

[vernal trellis]

@slender kiln https://medal.tv/games/chivalry-2/clips/1c5hmZZVkbP1vw/d1337ml73MZj?invite=cr-MSxNVUcsMTg2MjMxMTY4LA The clip i made for Maul 1 shotting people lol

[full coral]

61-20-14.. longbow archer...

i was just messing around, was dueling people in melee instead of just backing up

i was able to contribute a lot of damage to fights. and most of my kills came from kills my teammates werent able to get

[boreal owl]

A fucking Robots song.

[slender kiln]

Lmao, maul looks fun but I like my speedy weapons

[vernal trellis]

it fits perfectly tho lol

[boreal owl]

It does

anyways, back to the discussion

Archers are unfair because they are strong at range

[vernal trellis]

Skirmishers are broken cause they 1 shot vanguards

[vernal trellis]

wheres the clip?

[dreamy grotto]

the best is you sprint specialing and sending them into space

[full coral]

clip? its a screenshot.

[vernal trellis]

Thats the thing tho the sprint speecial is really weak meaning you gotta hit them low. But i know the effect that you have when you do kill them cause they go flying lol i have a few clips showing that

[dreamy grotto]

so old yet better than 99% songs released nowadays

[vernal trellis]

So where is the proof that was an archer gameplay? Even if it was it seems like you died a lot too meaning players got to you.

[full coral]

oh.. im sorry... i dont see a reason to lie to you about the class i played in order to get that stats

and yes, i died alot... sure.. but its wasnt because they got to me.. its because i was openly dueling them.

[dreamy grotto]

it does low damage but the stagger+surprised makes them open to another hit if you move in the right way as they turn and ur behind them with a new attack on the way as well

usually downs them at that point

[vernal trellis]

If i can hit them with sprinting special i might as well just jump and do the 1 shot special lol.

[vernal trellis]

Thats why i asked for clip cause if your openly dueling them that means they got to you right? Like your creditability and both sides are saying this too about you, you contradict yourself a lot and even post a lot of hate. Thats why people dont like speaking to you.

[full coral]

or.. they dont like speaking to me. becuase i dont just take an on paper answer as the solution...

"oh juset dodge"... what if the archer still hit you becuase they waited for you to dodge?

"just flank 4head".. what if the map doesnt offer a flank path?

its almost like you dont want to believe that those stats were achieved with longbow archer..

[vernal trellis]

So your saying everyone is wrong about you and your right? Again both sides are saying this, both people that want changes to archer and people that dont

[full coral]

im not saying people are wrong... im saying that theyre giving half assed answers.

if i were to ask someone in this thread what is outside out atmosphere

9/10 of them would just say "space".. without being able to go into greater detail.. or at least refusing to go into more detail.

[vernal trellis]

You have been telling people they are wrong you just contradicted yourself like what everyone has been saying.

My guy you are all over the place and you get heated so quickly cause people dont agree with you

[full coral]

sure. flanking is how you can get close to archers.. but those flanks arent always there...

sure a shield can block arrows.... but shields break, and passively they dont always break

everyone contradicts themselves when someone takes something out of context in order to disprove it..

no. i get heated because dumbasses are inacapble of seeing something that isnt in their fucking bias.

getting told "you cant compare a class based FPS to a class based slasher!!!"

becuase youre too fucking stubborn to actually translate the mechanics

[vernal trellis]

Bruh even Ziggy would point out your wrong on this lol

what would you say then?

[boreal owl]

H-H-HERE WE GO AGAIN

[full coral]

i wouldnt give 2 fucks. because im not a kiss ass. if youre making vague points and claiming it to be the full answer

im going to point out that your vague answer isnt going to solve anything

fun fact: ziggy has me blocked.

[vernal trellis]

Honestly the main issue is him and both sides have been saying this.

[full coral]

why. becuase i dont fuckign lay down because the general playerbase is too fucking dense to realize what the issues are?

[vernal trellis]

I aint a kiss ass to him i actually have him blocked myself but he is on your side about wanting changes but even he agrees your ridiculous lol

[full coral]

becuase everyone has their own thoughts on what should change to fix the issue

but guess what.. most players will at least understand that there is an issue

[vernal trellis]

Actually when the heat finally chilled out even people that wanting changes for archer realized they are actually balanced at the best spot possible.

But now you want to compare fps games to a medieval game lol

[full coral]

if you cant compare a class based shooter to a class based... then youre fucking stupid

you have to actively avoid being able to see that

[vernal trellis]

Like if you have both sides agreeing that your being ridiculous you should really stop and think about what you are doing.

[full coral]

you are purposefully ignoring counterpoints to what im saying because you dont want to open you fucking eyes to actually see the comparison.

[vernal trellis]

There isnt any comparison lol thats the issue.

[full coral]

you dont have the mental capacity to be able to SEE the comaprison.. thats the fucking issue

[vernal trellis]

Worsed off you used a game that generate itself to the worst possible state its currently in lol

[vernal trellis]

See your getting heated cause you cant accept your wrong

[full coral]

no im getting heated becuase you FUCKING REFUSE

you fucking refuse to look at something that isnt your own fucking viewpoint

you are actively ignoring the comparison.

YOU DONT WANT to see the comparison..

[dull cliff]

When you have 10 years of competive gaming experience you don't have to take others advice because you know better guys

[vernal trellis]

#1120674199158141018 message Read this at least i compared to the game to the same type of games lol

[full coral]

dude.. if you cant compare what you know to what youre trying to learn.

you have an actual learning disabilty

you can know that 2+2=4

but if you think its an ENTIRELY DIFFERENT THING AND NO COMPARISON CAN BE MADE.. to the question of 2+4=??

[vernal trellis]

Here is the Random that insults people

[dull cliff]

Let's not tell people they have learning disabilities because they disagree with your claims. That's pretty sad

[vernal trellis]

Wonder how long his timeout will be this time

[full coral]

shooters teach me how to use cover

mobas teach me how to play a certain type of role in order to compliment what my teammates are doing

basic common sense teaches me that if i can hit someone through a block (without a shield) and they can return that damage... that the class im currently playing. probably is a bit cancerous to play against.

[vernal trellis]

Okay so lets use your logic. You dont have a riot shield in COD and you take damage cause you dont have a riot shield. We need to rework that weapon

[full coral]

i coach a few games competitively

the first question i ask is "do you play any other games competitively"... because if im able to find something i can translate. it shortens the time needed in order for them to graps the concept.

[unkempt tangle]

I got 4 kills as a druid cos aberfell, but that wasn't a bad match. ill edit and upload, unless you want a 1.3gb video file

[dull cliff]

Almost like they gave the class who gets hit more ways to

• Mitigate damage 1 (bracing)
• Mitigate damage 2 (Deflect)
• Mitigate damage 3 (Shield)
• Health ( to get in)
• Ability to kill in 1 shot when you catch them

Nah

[vernal trellis]

video plz

[full coral]

no. you wouldnt need to rework it, because that shield isnt a threat to you

now.. if that shield had a gun attached to the front of it, THEN it would need a rework

that is a true tradeoff

[vernal trellis]

Riot shield isnt a threat? I was using your logic cause if you get too close then they can bash you and you cant do anything about it. You cant shoot past the shield it blocks it. But now when you have no shield you take damage, the same goes with Chiv 2. We using your logic to compare an FPS game to Medieval. So now we gotta rework that weapon cause i couldnt stop the damage without having a riot shield

See where we getting at

[dull cliff]

Good riot shielders are amazing

[vernal trellis]

Bruh i watched videos of people winning games with riot shields and stun gernades only lol

[dull cliff]

Pretty broken if you use Random's logic

[full coral]

can a riot shield be used to kill someone.. sure

can i smack someone with my bow to kill them... yep

also. fun fact.. riot shields arent allowed in competitive COD.. because theyre problematic

[vernal trellis]

Well hopefully he understands now

[cunning umbra]

Not true

[full coral]

which part? because the last COD i played competitively was MW3

[vernal trellis]

No we using your logic. We are comparing chiv 2 to FPS games. So if i cant block damage without my riot shield that means we nerf it or rework that weapon right?

[cunning umbra]

Mw2

[full coral]

i didnt compare chiv2 to ANY fps.. i compared it to A CLASS BASED FPS

again. you refuse to look at that part.

[vernal trellis]

They both FPS lol

[full coral]

chiv 2 and tf2 are both class based.

[vernal trellis]

I said you cant compare an FPS game to a medieval game lol

TF2 FPS game

[full coral]

tf2 class based

[vernal trellis]

im using your logic

[cunning umbra]

What about for honour

[full coral]

see. you refused to even admit that im comparing 2 class based games.

[full coral]

there isnt a ranged class in for honor

[vernal trellis]

1 is FPS and 1 is Medieval i dont understand how hard that is to know

[cunning umbra]

Discussion closed.

[full coral]

1 is class based. and the other is... CLASS BASED

how hard it that to know?

[vernal trellis]

Im using your logic but now im wrong lol

Im done with you lol

[full coral]

youre not using my logic

youre using what you SAY is my logic.

[unkempt tangle]

bruuuuu im limited to 15 minute videos

[full coral]

its what youre taking away from what im saying. because you arent comprehending it.

[vernal trellis]

15 minutes is fine honestly thats most the match

[unkempt tangle]

the match was 20 mins. i dont wanna edit cos it fucks the quality a lot

[full coral]

verify your youtube account. it takes like 5 mins.

[unkempt tangle]

yeah I am now

[vernal trellis]

Its fine honestly

again like i said its most the match

[cunning umbra]

Dont start with the excuses.

@halcyon solstice right?

[vernal trellis]

Everyone has excuses lol

[cunning umbra]

Whats your excuse

[vernal trellis]

Im AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH thats my excuse

[unkempt tangle]

shouldnt take too lon, my internet is decent

[cunning umbra]

Proof?

That your internet is decent

[halcyon solstice]

Hopefully devs will view these 3 threads of bickering as just cause to delete archers. To restore peace back to the community 🙏

[unkempt tangle]

just trust me bro

[vernal trellis]

It better be ive had rain storms for almost a week in a row now and had no issues uploading lol

[vernal trellis]

No it just makes them delete the threads and forget it was even a discussion lol

[cunning umbra]

Something is off

[halcyon solstice]

Do the right thing devs

[cunning umbra]

Thats why i always take screenshots of the entire thread

[vernal trellis]

Me too lol

[unkempt tangle]

I did get the most bow bugs I've had in a match. the neck removal bug, and super loud bowstring bug

[vernal trellis]

Really we still waiting on our private servers. We had that then that solves all issues caues then people can make their server to what ever they want it to be lol

[boreal owl]

Archers win again

[vernal trellis]

Someone wants no archer server, they can make one. People want archer only server, they can make one. Horde mode, Fisting servers, chair only matches, bam ez day

Less spam on their discord and more people wanting to play the game lol

[unkempt tangle]

it begins the processing

[vernal trellis]

Thats gonna be 1 hour later lol

[unkempt tangle]

probably

[vernal trellis]

Be playing Battlebit while i wait

or diablo 4

havent decided

[unkempt tangle]

I will link this bit which was as i respawned as druid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WX3McoAuepY and this bit as i respawned as archer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPLVroUQUgM

though the last part was a bit easier with everyone so close

[boreal owl]

Druids have throwing axes right?

[vernal trellis]

14 seconds in and you hit a teammate wtf lol

[unkempt tangle]

just getting into the archer spirit and all

[vernal trellis]

so minute and 40 you damaged 2 team mates got 2 kills hit 3 players but ran out of ammo, had no place to replenish ammo without dying to the other team

[boreal owl]

I do this all the time with throwing axes it’s fine

My team’s fault for being in the way

[unkempt tangle]

pretty accurate last stage aberfell

[vernal trellis]

you honestly missed a shit ton and they were close to you

[unkempt tangle]

I told you, im bad

and yet, 4th

[cunning umbra]

DONT MAKE UP EXCUSES

[unkempt tangle]

If i was going for points I'd use xbow

[cunning umbra]

😞😞😞😞😞😞😞😞

[dull cliff]

Hey at least badger posted gameplay and it wasn't horrible. Good on you man, now maybe we can get that other guy to post.

[unkempt tangle]

actually I'd probably steal a warbow as a crossbowman.

[vernal trellis]

You did objective which got you up there nice

[unkempt tangle]

aha, you can watch it in a zesty 360p https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M29047onLjI

[halcyon solstice]

Can i try that?

"Oh em gee that last click broke my nail 💅 where my ice cream😭 i need a mental health day 💀"

[vernal trellis]

what recording software you using?

[unkempt tangle]

shadowplay, it's just youtube fried atm

[boreal owl]

No matter how bad you are, if you play objective you’re always the best player on the team

[vernal trellis]

Use medal tv its much better trust me

You can even edit your videos with Medal as well

[unkempt tangle]

shadowplay i dont even think about. I don't realyl record, I mostly clip the last 30 seconds to find out what happened

[vernal trellis]

Medal Tv does the samething but it doent hold up space on your computer.

[unkempt tangle]

oh, cloud stuff. neat

[vernal trellis]

And if you wanted to share you can easily do it

[dull cliff]

I like YouTube streaming since it saves an upload and it's easy to edit on mobile

How is that new platform to stream on?

[vernal trellis]

Honestly this is gonna take me a bit watching the video cause im adding stuff up. This video im glad you uploaded shows what we been saying a lot about archers

[slender kiln]

https://tenor.com/view/green-mile-im-tired-boss-michael-clarke-duncan-gif-5852775606711249238

Random's capslock key

[dreamy grotto]

i usually save 45 second clips and edit in my own editing software

[unkempt tangle]

like what? Most of those people had no chance against me, and I was rarely pressured at all

and a few times I was a spawn waves came to the rescue

[dreamy grotto]

45 seconds seems to be the best for the longest period replays in my opinion

since you never know you may do a huge killing spree

[unkempt tangle]

A Random certified accuracy stat would be nice

[dreamy grotto]

Random's CAPSLOCK KEY.

[full coral]

damn im in your head deep

its been 30+ minutes since ive said anything..

and yes. i have to type in caps, otherwise it wont get read and the time put into typing it out would have been wasted.

[boreal owl]

Shinobi can fight from range

[full coral]

im uploading archer gameplay aswell

there was a few that were able to get to me.. but my teammates constantly bailed me out

i felt bad for one guy though.. he was a vangaurd and i kept interrupting his fights with arrows

to a point that he went warbow archer.

[boreal owl]

https://tenor.com/view/useless-fellow-lawbringer-fh-for-honor-gif-23925411

[full coral]

iirc they reworked that

[boreal owl]

For Goner

[unkempt tangle]

@vernal trellis oh, it's early but it's in HD now

[vernal trellis]

1 question did you think it was ez hitting people?

[unkempt tangle]

Not really, but aim does take skill, i've never denied that

I do try and maximise my target size by shooting into groups

[full coral]

aim takes some skill. but you dont have to hit 100% of your shots to be effective.

20% aim is enough to be of value to your team

if you hit someone and they use a bandage. thats a bandage they no longer have, youre forcing resources to be used and applying pressure

[slender kiln]

Twas a joke, lighten up milord

[full coral]

about 10 more mins for my gameplay to upload to SD. idk how long it would take for HD.

and i used longbow, which i dont think is weak, i think it just serves a different purpose compared to the warbow.

[vernal trellis]

Just asking cause i will say this. You knowing how to use melee helped you a lot in the beginning. I've noticed also you hit a lot of targets that werent moving compared to moving targets ( which honestly is not ez ) You didnt really do much too impact fights all that much, you missed a lot of close range shots and big fights. This i will say was impressive cause i can easily add this up, the whole match you only hit 4 teammates thats actually impressive lol but 1 being a melee hit on teammate that was random lol. Most of your kills was War bow i believe you only had about 4 or 5 kills as melee. You played objective which allowed you to score so high on the scoreboard as well too. But consistency on damage doesnt show.

Also you only used the ammo box 3 times the whole match

[full coral]

you have to consider someone's ability to melee when looking at their archer play

if the common point is "archers are easy kills if you flank them". you have to look into the players ability to melee in order to survive

[unkempt tangle]

yeah I consider a medium archer player as someone that can melee for at least a bit

[full coral]

as long as you can survive the melee as archer, your team can bail you out.. might take a bit till the next spawn wave. but you dont have to kill the flanker, you just have to survive, then theyre at a disadvantage having to fight multiple people at once

[vernal trellis]

Honestly thats the issue. The average player isnt that good in melee lol

[full coral]

if the average player isnt that good in melee. they would get less value if playing a melee class

playing archer at least lets them ignore the challenge of having to get around an opponent gaurd.

[unkempt tangle]

it was 9 times. I had a couple of convinient deaths

[full coral]

also, @vernal trellis you pointed out the accuracy on moving targets

how often was he punished for missing, compared to how often he just knocked another arrow and continued on?

[vernal trellis]

9 times of ammo box? From what i seen it was 3 i didnt see use of it another 6 times

[unkempt tangle]

yeah I just flicked through and counted. I actually fire a pretty consistent 1 shot per 5 seconds when I'm in position

[full coral]

so on average, you were able to stay in position for a full minute, which can be really impactful for pressure due to most objectives only having 5 minutes or so in order to complete them

[unkempt tangle]

that's all in that first video since the other two are being a druid and running out at the end

[vernal trellis]

Yeah i had a brain fart lol

[full coral]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEl9CW0N2jQ still in SD. but theres my take on longbow archer, was able to rack up a lot of takedowns, and still have a positive KD. while playing a bit greedy at times.

[vernal trellis]

Damage consistency since that was the talk.

[full coral]

hmm. not sure why the audio didnt record.. i probably messed something up in obs.

[full coral]

longbow and warbow serve different purposes

warbow lends itself toward burst damage. where longbow is able to keep up a more consistant flow of damage with the higher fire rate.

i will say though, i hit a lot more teammates than badger did, luckily longbow only does 11 team damage

[unkempt tangle]

But 3 actual deaths as an archer. one from a crossbow, one from the objective moving up and a mistake on my end getting sprint charged, and then another mistake getting cornered in the hamlet. Through 20 minutes I rarely got pressured, many times a spawn wave was there for me. You could probably add 2-3 deaths in that game if I was bad at melee

[full coral]

just for the shits and giggles. try and count up how many times someone was able to get in melee range of you at all

this would help the concept of "getting TO the archer is only half the fight"

[boreal owl]

https://tenor.com/view/brick-wall-talk-gif-5290288

[vernal trellis]

whats random saying?

[boreal owl]

‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‍‌‌‍‍‍‍‌

[dull cliff]

This is some great examples of inefficient spam, poor spacing and poor choices, you made fun of me for far less.

You also can see you score at 28:06 but it's so low quality I can't make it out yet.

[vernal trellis]

lol

[vernal trellis]

he uploaded his clip?

[full coral]

HD is still proccessing

[dull cliff]

A very hard to watch Longbow gameplay

[vernal trellis]

I blocked him cause i didnt feel like dealing with him anymore lol but yeah im definitely watching it

[dull cliff]

He went the easy route instead of going Warbow like he claimed was so easy lol

[full coral]

wait.. i thought longbow was harder?

[dull cliff]

It's exactly what I expected and more

[full coral]

or that is was weaker?

[boreal owl]

https://youtu.be/rEkRN6Ao-YA

[dull cliff]

Nobody has ever said Longbow was harder than Warbow lmao

[unkempt tangle]

13

[full coral]

hmm. imagine talking down on someone's gameplay that you demanded to be uploaded

[dull cliff]

You have a bad memory? You literally made fun of my gameplay for like a week lol

[full coral]

couldnt be a egotistical "i made archer myself and put it in the game, bow down to me" archer main...

[full coral]

no. i pointed out that you had a 31% accuracy, and claiming to be the best archer.

[dull cliff]

Lol and far more

[unkempt tangle]

13 times they got close and two near the end looked fucking deep-fried

[vernal trellis]

Didnt he make fun of your clip saying you missed a lot and now he uploads a video missing twice more arrows then you lol

[full coral]

you mean like you getting rolled by a default footman?

dude, i'll make fun of my friends for that shit too. because its funny

[vernal trellis]

But it apparently its ez tho

[dull cliff]

You got rolled by a default at the end and get saved by a teammate

All that talk lol

[full coral]

so 13 times someone was able to get in melee range of you

how many takedowns did you have again..? was it more than 13?

takedowns+kills*

[boreal owl]

Ngl I'm amazed at the level of skill on both parties to keep this discussion going for so long

[unkempt tangle]

35 takedowns, 16 kills by that point in the game

the end of aberfell becomes a bit of a clusterfuck, so i'll exclude it from the count

[vernal trellis]

first 2 minutes of the video he missed a shit ton of arrows and dies twice to melee players. Should i even keep watching this hypocrite?

[full coral]

so, you were in danger from melee players 13 times

but were able to help with/and secure 51 kills

seems a bit disproportionate

[dull cliff]

It just gets worse, he actually does the spam arrows into the front line but misses so much somehow.

[full coral]

how many was i punished for?

when did i miss that made me take damage or die?

[vernal trellis]

I noticed he spammed arrows like he said all that archers had to do but apparently there is more to it in his video since he missing lol

[full coral]

i never said all archers HAD to spam... youre putting words in my mouth again...

i said that all archers COULD spam.

[dull cliff]

It's honestly hard to keep watching after all the talk about how easy the class is.

[vernal trellis]

idk if i can keep watching cause he keeps hitting teammates left and right

[full coral]

hmm. couldnt be players talking down on gameplay that shows that archers can put in a lot of pressure without being in much risk

no.. them admitting that would directly conflict with their insanely obvious fucking bias.

[vernal trellis]

Hell Badger did a better job with his video. Randoms video just shows archers are not that serious as he says they are

But im wrong he right though

Random always right

[full coral]

wait.. wait... so youre saying that im not a good archer

yet i was higher on the scoreboard than most of my team

so.. youre saying that bad archers can do well?

so... are bad archers fodder

or can bad archers contribute to the team and still have higher scores. despite they lack the specials that give them a lot of points?

[dull cliff]

It's wild seeing you try to play the victim to your own words

[full coral]

its wild seeing you contradict yourselves

an acting like youre not

[dull cliff]

Where have I contradicted myself? Link it

[vernal trellis]

Have fun with Random. You cant use his logic though comparing FPS games to Chiv 2 remember that as well

Only he can

[dull cliff]

It's just wild seeing this game play after all the trash talk he had about how I was playing wrong and he knew better.

[full coral]

you cant get your head wrapped around the CLASS based portion of the fps it was compared too

again. you DONT WANT to see my point of view. its not because you cant. its not because its wrong or right

its becuase you are actively avoiding seeing it.

[dull cliff]

You going to link where I contradicted myself or just ignore that?

[full coral]

where did i say you played wrong.. link it.

[vernal trellis]

No remember your wrong he right. Im just agreeing with random on everything now

Want to see where that takes me lol

[dull cliff]

Maybe that's the right approach, because he clearly can't handle everyone telling him he is wrong.

[full coral]

i cant handle people telling me im wrong

without giving me the correct answer

[dull cliff]

Link where I contradicted myself, you know give the correct answer

[full coral]

also.. "poor spacing"

hmm. last time i checked. arrows didnt give a fuck about your spacing.

[full coral]

notice how i said "yourSELVES"..

as in.. the people defending archer.. not you directly.. not everything is about you keeper. i know thats a hard concept for you to grasp

[dull cliff]

Oh wow, Mr 10 years of competive gaming doesn't get what I meant by spacing?

[full coral]

mr godlike archer doesnt realize that arrows dont care...

[dull cliff]

It's not about arrows lol

[full coral]

longbow arrow will do 45 damage at 5m... and 45 damage at 25m

spacing does not matter in that context

[unkempt tangle]

Well, tbh even with shit aim he's not often pressured by the other team. Not until the flag breaking bit which is harder for attack archers, and he runs into melee like a baboon

[dull cliff]

Im constantly amazed at what you choose to argue over

[full coral]

they all stacked around the same flag.. that was a bit rough to break through.

and it being uphill and them having the cover advantage. i had to get risky with positioning and go in with melee in order to try and break up their defense.

[full coral]

even with shit aim

look how much damage i was able to put out

thats the point of all this

[dull cliff]

Not once did he do the "use your spikes for high ground" move he told us about.

[vernal trellis]

Because he wasnt a threat. I honestly stopped after 5 minutes into the video cause i couldnt bare watching him continue to shoot his teammates in the back lol.

[full coral]

didnt need to.. notice that i think i did... 1 jumpshot?

[vernal trellis]

i skipped through to see scoreboard but it was blurry as anything you couldnt see it

[unkempt tangle]

you can see he's top half though, even with that gameplay

[full coral]

im 8th on the scoreboard

hopefully the HD renders a bit faster

[vernal trellis]

Anyone can be top half by just doing objective. Someone even posted a video showing this a guy with only 30 something take downs, 5 kills and 5 deaths but he was top of the leaderboard on score

[full coral]

but.. was i doing the objective??

[vernal trellis]

I wanted to see kills cause people saying thats all archers need to do to be top of the scoreboard

[dull cliff]

Are we now moving the goal post from "poor gameplay" to "but was I doing the objective"?

[unkempt tangle]

you can't really do objective as an archer. It's one of the few things I agree with keeper on, archers should get offense/defense point for shooting into the objective area

[full coral]

wait.. wait..

i thought archers were supports.. why are we focusing on kills now?

[boreal owl]

This is wrong

[vernal trellis]

Did they change that cause i have clips showing you cant get points unless your on objective

And im asking if they changed that cause those clips are from 5 months ag

[unkempt tangle]

That's what I mean, archers are typically outside that zone

[vernal trellis]

I clipped that too show someone thats not true

[unkempt tangle]

so they don't get bonus points for shooting people around the objective

[vernal trellis]

oh okay mybad read that wrong

[unkempt tangle]

you can do the interactables of course, but you tend to be behind the lines so it's harder

[full coral]

imo, points dont matter, since some classes have insanely easy way to farm points compared to others

knight with trumpet for example, just play a good defense. and farm your special, use it on cooldown and you'll be pretty high on the scorebaord without needing to put much effort in.

[unkempt tangle]

you still need to do something to get points, either healing at choke points, or doing the objective

[vernal trellis]

If i can find the link i can show a video Jebastrus used saying archers only need to sit back and get kills to be top of the leaderboard. It showed that crossbow guy going 14 and 14 with 40 something take downs but was top of the leaderboard with the clip showing he actually doing objective while shooting his crossbow. The man even went out of his way to throw his crossbow and axe to start punching the VIP with his fists lol. A true champ right there

[full coral]

yes thats true.. but when comparing something like longbowman, who only get the brazier

the ability to gain points isnt equal

[boreal owl]

points matter

[dull cliff]

So what matters if Points and Kills don't?

[full coral]

also, HD will process in 28 minutes. so it'll be a bit

[dull cliff]

The friends you make along the way?

[full coral]

did i say kills dont matter?

[unkempt tangle]

Sure, but you're helping the team a lot more. Even xbow with a good banner placement, those farmed points are still team healing

[vernal trellis]

Honestly i still want to see someone do what you did going 60 and 1 in a match. Im still shocked seeing that

[dull cliff]

Weird

[dull cliff]

I think I have higher ones in my live streams on my channel, but I am not going through all those lol.

[full coral]

i agree. but what im saying is that some clases have an easier "challenge" to get their special faster

knight is to take hits

archer is headshots

vangaurd is sprint attack kills

not only are the specials not created with the same ability to farm points. but their method of speeding up the charge isnt either.

[vernal trellis]

send me a link cause i cant even do that

im jealous

[dull cliff]

https://www.youtube.com/@keeper5849/streams

This one is 3 perfects in a row

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bj7qFDOpFVo&t=359s

[vernal trellis]

gonna look later

[boreal owl]

My honest reaction to this information

[full coral]

i just looked at the recording to give yall the score a bit faster

at 26:08... i was
72 takedowns
21 kills
9 deaths

[dull cliff]

Looks like a 26-0 TO, 11-0 TDM and a 30-0 TO

[vernal trellis]

eh not impressed with those stats

60 and 1 better lol

[dull cliff]

Same, I will look through, I named some of them.

[full coral]

@unkempt tangle HD is uploaded, you can check score now

[earnest seal]

Is there a way to jump to the original post?

[unkempt tangle]

I will watch it to this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHGiXSLkrNg

[vernal trellis]

only impressive videos i can upload are basically just going 27 and 0 in an FFA with Katars which is hard asf to do and me not dying in FFA with a win with Maul

[full coral]

i was tied with 1 other person for least deaths on the team

and only 4 players had more takedowns that i did

7 players had more kills than i did

so for a bad archer

i would say those are pretty solid stats

[unkempt tangle]

at 1.25x

[vernal trellis]

Good luck lol

[unkempt tangle]

pro tip, pin the start post in archer threads before you hit 2000+ commments

[vernal trellis]

Honestly if you want to know what the thread is about just look at the other 6 archer threads out there lol

[unkempt tangle]

they all blend together

[earnest seal]

most of them disolve like salt in water when the archer haters pile in

[unkempt tangle]

I prefer archer revisionists

[earnest seal]

Got it!

[dull cliff]

I can't pin

[unkempt tangle]

okay randoms vid at 1.25x plus this ragtime music at 1.25x is great

[earnest seal]

can you pin my reply then?

[boreal owl]

no

[earnest seal]

aww

I'll just search all most posts in the thread (which isn't alot) and keep finding "Got it!"

[full coral]

the catapult part would be extra funny with the music.

[unkempt tangle]

[vernal trellis]

lol

[full coral]

hey man. gotta put on the jam when youre just shooting arrow for free into players who cant do anything about them.

[boreal owl]

Me when I try to use longbow or warbow (the weapons are horrible)

[vernal trellis]

https://tenor.com/view/general-grievous-skill-issue-lego-star-wars-lego-star-wars-gif-25690118

[dull cliff]

Oh man I was looking through my Chiv Screenshots and found these sweet bingo cards I made for Threads like these and the other Archer ones.

Make sure to use them in the future

[boreal owl]

They are not real archer weapons, sorry bro, accept that fact and maybe you’ll get good at skirmisher some day

[vernal trellis]

lol

[vernal trellis]

I will admit skirmisher is the way to go

[boreal owl]

Should I start another archer thread

[vernal trellis]

https://tenor.com/view/the-book-of-boba-fett-this-is-the-way-the-armorer-mandalorian-gif-25545276

[vernal trellis]

I like this

[full coral]

im still curious though
if im a bad archer.. and was able to be pretty high up on the scoreboard

am i a good archer, or is archer capable of putting out a lot of damage without neeing to be good

[dull cliff]

Bad lobby it looked like, still a bad archer.

[full coral]

so im a bad archer and archer is capable of doing well without needing to be good at it

gotcha.

[boreal owl]

If I was there no cap would have killed you with a throwing axe from 100 yards away ez

[hollow willow]

Did you post a video? Link?

[dull cliff]

You went what 21-9 as the "Safest class in the game" , that speaks pretty loud of your skill.

[boreal owl]

#1120674199158141018 message

[full coral]

right here @hollow willow

[earnest seal]

I'ma answer these for funs:
1:What would you change for each Subclass?

• a: Make warbow require the user to stand still with taxing drawtime but increase velocity, increase longbow damage and decrease speed, produce shortbow with even more speed but with less velocity and damage than original longbow

• b: increase velocity by alot, decrease reload time. Ramp up damage drop off to make it a short range weapon, add jab

• c: return javelin's flinch, increase stamina

2: What get's you killed the most?
Me, I get me killed the most.

5: What secondary would you like to have?
Cudgel on skirmisher

7: What change would you like to the class
More hp and stamina.
Effective range where arrows bounce off of armoured classes
A new reticle (like a shrinking circle to show "spread")
Jab on the crossbow
Reduced longbowmen damage to armoured classes
longsword/mace added to longbowmen

8: what ping do you stop playing archer at?
100+ I just whip out the vanguard with the HLGS and sweep into the crowd

9: what is your preferred range to play at?
Point blank as I smack people with the bow. Shooting is just to get their attention.

10: Do you prefer going after other Archers or Melee?
Any archer that looks at me, I prioritize to survive but other than that, not really.

11: do you actually use the arrow cam?
I use it like a spy drone to see where everyone is, but no, It's too slow to confirm if I actually hit anyone or where I missed.

[hollow willow]

Thx

[dull cliff]

You not answer the Ballista hitbox question : (

Good suggestion the warbow change also. Haven't seen that option presented.

[earnest seal]

I skipped some answers as I feared making it too long and nerdy

[boreal owl]

1. Skirmisher
2. Nothing
3. Canada
4. France
5. Throwing Mallets
6. Not a real way to play the game
7. Add slings
8. No such thing
9. Right next to the enemy
10. Whatever God tells me to do
11. Every time

Alright now I’m legally allowed to be in here

[full coral]

did you prove that youre an archer main??

[boreal owl]

I don’t need to. As you can see I’m the #1 sling user on PC.

[unkempt tangle]

mace on longbowman would be absolutely busted

[earnest seal]

It's cause proper warbows couldn't be shot like normal bows and required a dedicated stance to loose.
I think it'd be cool if chiv showed that to make the warbow act like it's actual counterpart

[vernal trellis]

lol

[earnest seal]

Maybe, but it's to give them something to make up with decreased arrow effectiveness, especially if the arrows bounce off at X distance, forcing the longbowmen to engage the knight/footmen when they close the gap

[full coral]

i think a better approach to specializing your target prioritization would be to implement specialty arrows

[vernal trellis]

They should add sling shots

[full coral]

bodkin. broadhead. etc

[earnest seal]

I'd love arrowhead types, shoulda added that to the suggestions

[boreal owl]

https://tenor.com/view/shepherd-sling-gif-23852092

[full coral]

i would prefer to see a staff sling over a standard shepard sling

would fit skirmisher nicely, and still be an actual melee weapon, since its a short staff

[boreal owl]

I don’t care what it is, as long as it slings

[dull cliff]

I just want to see the Siege Bow, Heavy Jav and some skins.

[vernal trellis]

Remember Random is right you cant disagree

[dull cliff]

Yes always agree or prepare for caps

[boreal owl]

I know I’m right

[earnest seal]

Things like cresent moon for increased damage but cannot hurt armoured units and is very slow
Bodkin, increased velocity and can hurt armour at range but reduced damage overall
Blunt has flinch but low damage and drops heavily
Regular: normal damage, normal everything except can't hurt armour at range

[full coral]

you can disagree. just give a logical reason to why you disagree

and if a counterpoint is given. actually address it and not just read half the setence, reply and ignore the fact that what youre saying was addressed before you even typed it out

[full coral]

i pitched the concept of arrows doing less damage to armor... it got shot down by the pro-archer gang

[earnest seal]

I'd rather the arrows just bounce off after a certain distance but there'll need to be a buff to make up for that like giving them bodkin heads like you said
or a mace like what I said

[boreal owl]

Can I get heavy throwing axes as well

[earnest seal]

dane axes

hehe
maybe 3 dane axes in a quiver for the skirmisher would be funny

[boreal owl]

I’m not gonna play an inferior class for them

[full coral]

theres different ways to balance it. but im perfectly okay with giving archers a stronger up close fight if you reduce their ranged effectiveness

[earnest seal]

definately
but then again, maybe just makijng longbowmen less effective against knights isn't too bad because then the crossbowmen would actually have a reason to be used. (though they definately need a buff too)

gtg, got a friend to meet. bubye

[full coral]

more along the lines of making the damage falloff a bit harsher, so once youre past the effective range, youre getting heavily reduced damage

[dull cliff]

Nothing balances a ranged class quite like making it an up close class

[earnest seal]

Ironically they need that

[full coral]

nothing like balancing a safe class like making them a bit riskier

[earnest seal]

otherwise they'll never leave spawn as a sniper

[dull cliff]

You went 21-9 on a safe class, what are you doing on Melee?

[full coral]

dont forget the 72 takedowns...i feel like that attributes to it.

[vernal trellis]

They never will regardless cause you cant make an archer a melee class

[boreal owl]

Should be 72 Kills

[vernal trellis]

Or else it defeats the purpose of the archer

[dull cliff]

You only have to get what 25 damage to get a takedown now?

[vernal trellis]

Actually know what you right. Give the archer the ability to use two handed weapons but keep their stats so i dont have to scour the field looking for a weapon to use to fight in melee

Give me more of a challenge

[unkempt tangle]

peasant class

[vernal trellis]

Better

[unkempt tangle]

should be a thing

[full coral]

if im putting out 45 damage hits.

archer has 90 health. and longbow does 60 on a body shot.. thats 66% of their hp

vangard has 130 health.. 45 damage is ~38% of their health

footman has 150.. 45 is ~33% of their health

knight has 175... making that 45 damage arrow be like 18%..

its all mental math

most melee weapons do around 40-60 damage on a light.. but can be blocked/countered

[boreal owl]

This already exists, it’s called Longbowman and Crossbowman

[unkempt tangle]

hah

[vernal trellis]

People want peasent class to exist as the zombie in horde mode

[full coral]

also, i want you to watch that back.. when i died. was going to them.. or were they coming to me?

i got greedy and wanted to push, that wasnt the fault of the class. that was me wanting to get in and melee a bit

your attempts at insults only further the point

if im able to go 72-21-9 as a bad archer.... the class might be a bit easy to play

[dull cliff]

So If I can do that as Melee is it easy to play or does that just apply to Archer?

[full coral]

you even aggreed that archer is easy to play when you said that im a bad archer and was able to score what i did...

[dull cliff]

You didn't answer

[full coral]

idk, is it an "bad lobby"?

[dull cliff]

2 deflections in a row

[full coral]

also. melee actually has a lot more counterplay compared to an arrow.

[dull cliff]

3!

[full coral]

keeper.. pointing out someone's deflections.. while asking a bait question

IRONY AS ITS FINEST

[dull cliff]

4

[boreal owl]

Fellas maybe we should put an end to this. It’s getting late

[dull cliff]

I am done as soon as he answers this, I have a druid to go play horribly

[full coral]

itll never end. keepers ego is too big for him to accept the fact that he contradicted himself and he's looking for some way to take attention away from that before it gets known that he's backed into a corner with no way out

[dull cliff]

That is a record 5 deflections in a row lol

[vernal trellis]

should add me on battlenet

[full coral]

am i a good archer, or is archer easy to do be impactful with

option 1: im a good archer
option 2: archer is easy

1 or 2...

[dull cliff]

6? We going for GOAT Status

[full coral]

ignoring the question.. keeper deflection counter : 1

[dull cliff]

Lucky 7, I am out for the night. Good luck with anyone who tries!

[full coral]

ignoring again.. after being actively pointed out.. thats a combo multiplyer.. youre up to 10 now!

[hollow willow]

Watched your upload Random, I think you're an average archer. Not bad, but not a "pro"

[slender kiln]

Random vs keeper final destination no items

[unkempt tangle]

I still need the certified accuracy %

[full coral]

and i'll accept that. i never claimed to be good at this game

but most of the pro-archer players say that bad archers are just fodder to melee

but they say that im a bad archer.. when i went 72-21-9 (at last check of the scoreboard, forgot to open it at the end)

so its a contradiction saying that bad archers dont do well, while also saying that im a bad archer WHILE doing well.

[full coral]

of mine or yours?

[unkempt tangle]

Game giving accuracy with bows would be nice

[boreal owl]

https://tenor.com/view/disgusted-dog-disgust-yuck-offended-gif-10533630

[full coral]

while it would be nice. i think it would jsut be like having the player card in call of duty. it would just be something that players would use in order to shit talk each other.

[boreal owl]

Everyone here has an ego but me

[unkempt tangle]

skirmisher isn't a real class

[boreal owl]

You son of a bitch. You piece of shit. You fucking goddamn fucker. Listen, fuckhead, you have fucking crossed the line. Get that through your goddamn fucking head. Stop pushing your shit.

[vernal trellis]

lol

[boreal owl]

Incoming mute

[slender kiln]

Reporting you as we speak

[full coral]

ash has been typing for a while...

[unkempt tangle]

what magic shit is going in you your post in #🎥︱gameplay-zone ? That arrow grew some fucking legs and walked into that dude face

[boreal owl]

Be quiet leaf lover

[hollow willow]

Well this is how I usually interpret an archers skill as bad, average, "pro"

Bad: bottom half of the scoreboard, goes negative, misses shots, doesnt help on objective, doesnt help in melee

Average: top half of scoreboard, goes positive, lands most shots, helps in melee, helps on objective

"Pro": consistently places top 5 of scoreboard, less than 10 deaths, lands most shots and each shot has some impact in the field, can help the frontline in melee and survive, helps on objective, good map/spatial awareness, gets targeted by players on the enemy team

This is just my in general view. I watched Keepers videos aswell. I view him as above average

[dreamy grotto]

Shes pro green

[slender kiln]

Pro: username is Ayla

[unkempt tangle]

ayy, i'm semi-pro by those metrics

[full coral]

im a pro skirm then, im constantly top 5 lol

[dreamy grotto]

Im usually 1-5

[unkempt tangle]

listen to the wizard

[boreal owl]

*Lameyla

[hollow willow]

Console is weird, but I flicked my joystick for that.

[unkempt tangle]

oh, controller. that might be why

i've heard they get magical arrows

[hollow willow]

Yeah, the bar isnt set very high for archers. The class takes skill but not much imo

[dreamy grotto]

Magic shortbow when

[boreal owl]

75 range

[dreamy grotto]

Im 99

[full coral]

this is what i was pointing out

it doesnt take much "skill" to become effective at archer, the skill floor for effectiveness is fairly low

combine this with its ability to bypass the block mechanic on everything that isnt a shield. makes archer a VERY annoying class

new players tend to gravitate towards archer when learning the game due to this by-pass. which gives the impression that archers are bad and dont need to be changed, all because it attracts players that dont have the experience

when you put archer in the hands of average+.. it becomes a lot more oppressive.
(if you watch my gameplay back, the vangaurd that was constantly trying to kill me on the first objective. was playing warbow on the bridge)..

that player was forced to swap to archer himself in order to have a better chance of killing the archers

[slender kiln]

I don't think new players gravitate towards any one class

I see noobs of all shapes and sizes

[dreamy grotto]

Am i a noob

[slender kiln]

Yes

[boreal owl]

Probably

[full coral]

i see them most commonly on archer and knight.. vangards the least

[dreamy grotto]

https://tenor.com/view/worried-scared-oh-no-stop-it-fearful-gif-12534009

[boreal owl]

Vanguard takes no skill

[slender kiln]

Mm I dunno, the amount of dane axe scrubs...

[unkempt tangle]

I think it's more apparent on archer. A brand new player can survive a bit on melee since held block now exists. But with archer you have the insurmountable challenge of swapping weapons

[full coral]

thats noob, not newb*

[dreamy grotto]

Oh my god

[slender kiln]

For sure, archers that just stare at you while you butcher them are hilarious

[unkempt tangle]

or run with the bow out, lil' scamps

[boreal owl]

Melee with the bow

[full coral]

i was playing longbow and had a knight running at me. when i swapped to my secondary. he just stopped and stared at me. i dont think he had ever seen an archer do that before.

[unkempt tangle]

dude's having 'nam flashbacks the last time he fought an archer

[slender kiln]

Everybody gangsta till the archer whips out the butter knife and flourishes

[full coral]

pretty much, we just mutually crouched at each other, then he ran off without even attempting the fight

[hollow willow]

Tbh, I think shields do work to protect from archers. Atleast when Im playing, i have to rotate around to the enemies melee hand to land a shot. Or course this is when block is being held. Most archers will just wait until the enemy throws out an attack since theyll be left wide open.

I think new players dont only choose archer because its easy, but because it also mimics FPS controlls (atleast on console). Thats one of the reasons I main archer, since im coming from COD/OW0.9 and Im waiting for XDefiant.

[unkempt tangle]

lmao, that's good. I think the most enjoyable part or archer for me is the ones that rush you and get greedy in melee

[slender kiln]

That's why playing more aggressively is much more fun than sitting on the ramparts

[unkempt tangle]

no one expects the superbly timed pocket knife accel

[full coral]

you cant compare a FPS to chiv2.. youre going to invoke wrath upon yourself!!!

shields do help, but theyre inconsistant when youre attacking. making it SLIGHTLY more difficult to get an arrow onto them

[hollow willow]

Well its mostly the ADS/firing buttons which mimic FPS since those are pretty standard controls on console shooters

Yeah, I noticed the inconsistencies when firing at shield players too. Tho I cant provide a good solution since I dislike using shields myself

[carmine loom]

I usually play archer if i can’t get any active parry or i just want to relax

[hollow willow]

yah, archer is pretty relaxing too. Since the games casual, sweaty lobbies are a hit or a miss

[dreamy grotto]

Rmb with a shield, problem solved

[unkempt tangle]

you are now being attacked by melee players

[vernal trellis]

Remember Random is right

[full coral]

sigh... why do you choose to read half a sentence

shields do help, but theyre inconsistant when youre attacking. making it SLIGHTLY more difficult to get an arrow onto them

"inconsistant when YOURE ATTACKING"

[dreamy grotto]

Did you ever see his suggestion to fix that

[carmine loom]

if i can’t get active parry to work i just say screw it, play something that i don’t need to worry about it. anybody that gets close is usually on there way out anyways

[vernal trellis]

Yeah to just agree he is right lol

[full coral]

you mean to tell me.. you play archer when youre having an off day with melee??

wow, its almost like archer is simpler to be effective with

[carmine loom]

i’ve given up on this war random, it’s pointless

[dreamy grotto]

A front shield blocking when attacking over a moment you should be exposed vs you ducking, dodging out of the way or not draining ur stam

[hollow willow]

Yeah, I personally like classes that use a wide field of view in combat. Prefer "support" type classes as opposed to frontline dps

[carmine loom]

I like both styles, usually a GS main but been having fun with the MAA morningstar

[dreamy grotto]

Then telling archers to "adapt" on changing positions while you just move and void their entire classes existance because they cant help in a group fight anymore

[carmine loom]

I liked vanguard for speed but then MAA i can dash around like i’m skating

[full coral]

archer can be both a support OR a dps.. even both

archer is a VERY dynamic class capable of a lot of different playstyles

longbow can put out consistant damage but with less burst damage

warbow can offer extreme range and higher burst

crossbow can do bonus damage to knights, while keeping your stamina high and allowing you to use cover a bit easier

skirmisher is similar with ambusher, just a bit more ranged based

[hollow willow]

when cqc, I prefer fast weapon so ambusher is my go to. If I ever play big weapons, I go highlander cuz BIG SWORD

[vernal trellis]

Vanguard is amazing for catching people that try to run away

[carmine loom]

MAA will do the same and if not they can go run if they want

[carmine loom]

Greatsword is better but highlander is interesting, never really got into ambusher

[dreamy grotto]

Well you obviously didnt read the chat last night then, dude kept saying a shield should be facing the front to cover your moments of attack animation making ranged attacks pointless now vs shielders unless they moved to your side. Problem here is enviroment matters a lot and ur able to just move ur angle to make the archers movement pointless

[carmine loom]

Though one time i did play ambusher and cleared a good handful of people

[dreamy grotto]

Thats forcing range to move in a obvious moment an arrow should be able to hit because ur opening urself now to hit

[hollow willow]

Yeah, highlander isnt very good but you know, BIG SWORD. Ambusher is a bit difficult to play, especially on console since throwing weapons on console is shit

[unkempt tangle]

was someone saying arrows don't execute like ambusher or am I making that up?

[dreamy grotto]

Its as much as a spear user hitting you early when ur opening for a hit

[carmine loom]

also dagger has hitstop no cleave but amazing backstab dmg with any attack

[vernal trellis]

Honestly there is like 6 archer threads to read through and i tend to forget which one is being typed in lol. I try my best but its hard cause so much is being said and most the time its the same thing being said. But honestly shield solves the whole issue of archers but then people say " I dont want to use it " I use Maul and dont have a shield but i dont have issues like they do

[full coral]

at 5:30 in my gameplay https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEl9CW0N2jQ

a MAA approaches me, managing to get a hit before i turn around

i land a counter and his shield breaks on hit

a few teammates come to support me

the MAA is forced to back off due to being at a disadvantage against the longer weapons

while he's disengaging, im still loosing arrows towards him, luckily for him he's MAA and gets bonuses to his dashes, allowing him to dodge more often

i still manage to get an arrow on him as he's retreating

he's finally able to get behind cover removing himself from LOS. but also no longer being a threat to me.. meaning we're back to square 1 and im free to just loose arrows at whover i want to

[vernal trellis]

when i do use shield i feel like im cheating

[hollow willow]

yeah, backstabbing players is crazy fun tho I find it hard to effectively get behind players

[full coral]

this shows part of the issue with archer.. .shields dont last forever

an archer still has melee

and archers are typically in their own backlines. meaning you dont get very long to 1v1 the archer in melee before their team supports them

[dreamy grotto]

Shield is honestly pretty fine, tried 1h spear, did great, lost a shield, looted one from the floor

[hollow willow]

I think they were talking about executing being ambusher exclusive or something along those lines

[dreamy grotto]

Like 5 deaths 46 kills

[unkempt tangle]

it'd be nice if ground shields showed their actual damage state though

[carmine loom]

got to make a big flank or if you mean up close then yeah true, if dagger didn’t have hitstop it would be one of the best weapons

[unkempt tangle]

I was half asleep skimming the thread tbh

[full coral]

it would be nice if shields actually lasted for longer

400 hp isnt much when youre its taking 40-50 damage hits on average

[dreamy grotto]

The look doesnt unfortunately change per hit, near broken ones do

[hollow willow]

sometimes I straight up leave the battlefield to find a new one to take by surprise lol

[carmine loom]

just pick them up and put them on the back

[unkempt tangle]

the visuals reset though

[hollow willow]

I dont doubt it, these discussions are pretty tiresome

[dreamy grotto]

8-10 hits on a shield is pretty great hp ngl

[carmine loom]

exactly haha

[carmine loom]

if i ain’t gotta shield i ain’t going😤

[dreamy grotto]

Ur shield will only break if ur just being spammed and do nothing against it or long term fighting

[boreal owl]

I am right

[full coral]

shields are effectively an extra stamina bar.. instead of being a defensive tool

lowering the stamina reduction on block, and adding more hp would give them a bit better chance to last long enough to block arrows

[carmine loom]

Just put the shield on your back till you are being targeted

[dreamy grotto]

Shield is fine

[full coral]

riposte make the shield take damage. and if youre looking for active parry. riposte is the safest way to do that

and during an active riposte, and hits that connect while youre attacking. still counts towards your shields health.

[vernal trellis]

Shields on back deflect arrows and shit up front apparently lol

[unkempt tangle]

it's sort of a weird way to usutilise shields, but is game so w.e.

[dreamy grotto]

I use a shield in combat all the time, never see the issue

Just a clear advantage

[carmine loom]

i’ll never hold my shield in front, shit makes me walk like i’m in the mud

[full coral]

and clear disavantages.

[plucky lake]

Shields are great

[full coral]

thats been disproven. shields dont apply any speed debuffs

[vernal trellis]

no im saying shields on back since the update blocks projectiles from your front time to time lol

[carmine loom]

yes they do

[dreamy grotto]

Force field

[plucky lake]

Just need droideka arms

[carmine loom]

it takes away double sprint speed

[vernal trellis]

pretty much

[dreamy grotto]

2 extra arms and 1 more bow

Add a short bow and boom

[carmine loom]

if your lucky yes aha

[unkempt tangle]

The lack of mighty two handers

[full coral]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bmf5hTgKrPQ 5:30

[vernal trellis]

Rotten can contest to it and Rabbit. They both thrown shit at me with my shield on my back and my shield block them lol

[carmine loom]

do i take “stripedsweater” word for it?

i was just playing with my shield about an hour ago

[full coral]

i take the visual proof that accompanies it..

[carmine loom]

if i’m running and out the shield up i stop running

[vernal trellis]

bruh random is always right you gotta agree with him or else you bias

[full coral]

that happens with all weapon, if you hold block for more than like .5 seconds, you stop sprinting

[carmine loom]

i’m a neutral party here, ive given up

[carmine loom]

so shield does slow you down when it’s up?

brother i’ve been playing MAA first hand

[full coral]

all blocks slow you down

[carmine loom]

To test this “bring a shield” cilium

copium

[carmine loom]

there shield block slows you down

[vernal trellis]

Thats why i stopped replying in these threads lol

[unkempt tangle]

this vid is 11 months old/ wildcard did some tests recently and it does affect you a little bit

[carmine loom]

therefore

[full coral]

can i have the link to that updated test? this is just the one i default to

[dreamy grotto]

He told me to stop typing, im bias, im pro archer all last night 😔 he must be right

[full coral]

i mean, if you choose to ignore half a sentence in order to try and make a point...

thats either trolling, or bias.. take your pick of the two

[carmine loom]

all i know is when i hold my shield(block) i slow down

[vernal trellis]

Then listen and sstop typing

[dreamy grotto]

Death to archers bro

[vernal trellis]

fuck em

[dreamy grotto]

Add 2handers that fly and kill an archer and come back

[full coral]

all blocks slow you down when youre hold them, thats not exclusive to shields, although shields may exaggerate the reduction

[vernal trellis]

delete the class

[next furnace]

gross

[carmine loom]

boomerang?

[unkempt tangle]

maybe it was proving that it doesn't exist, at least for the smaller shields #🤺︱training-grounds message

[carmine loom]

That’s the word for it, it exaggerates it

[full coral]

i feel that test is a bit incomplete, as theyre not comparing it to without the shield equipped aswell

would be worth looking to further at least

[plucky lake]

I believe Paul Harrell's famous quote of saying enough of a difference to make a difference is subjective with shield carry vs shield held.

[unkempt tangle]

top left is unqeuipped small shield

[full coral]

lol i got that far, but i meant without having the shield on your person at all

also, im not able to see in detail to be able to check if all are reaching full sprint at the same time

as large shields might delay the 2nd level of sprint

[carmine loom]

i usually don’t walk up to an archer with my block up like a fool

[vernal trellis]

interesting

[carmine loom]

*both with shield or no shield block

[vernal trellis]

should implement M&B having 2 shields at once. 1 on back and the other you wield

[unkempt tangle]

turtle gaming

[dreamy grotto]

Could have 3 technically

[vernal trellis]

really

duel wield shields? lol

[plucky lake]

Ohma and reeves

[dreamy grotto]

In wb you had 4 slots in sp and mp, you could have a shield out 2 shields on ur back

[vernal trellis]

@carmine loom got a video for you too

[plucky lake]

Or whatever the dual shields in ds2 are

[boreal owl]

Nat 1

[carmine loom]

just seen you nerd

[vernal trellis]

This is why i call you a dirty ass hole for using GS lol https://medal.tv/games/chivalry-2/clips/1gw5R2Vjq8XX1_/d1337AfAKIyR?invite=cr-MSxtc2QsMTg2MjMxMTY4LA

[carmine loom]

Well sheesh didn’t know you called me a dirty ass hole ahaha, but yeah countering is pretty power when it works alongside active parry. but trying my luck with 1hander is ffa lately tho

i like being able to gamble peoples attacks more effectively

[vernal trellis]

working on another vid right now and 1 hander is op asf in FFA especially ambusher. Its what everyone has been using since Heads Up! been winning FFA's non stop with the class

[boreal owl]

What archer uses a crossbow?

[carmine loom]

well yeah just go up to people that are focused on each other and boom back stab or just gamble with stabs

[plucky lake]

The ambusher

[vernal trellis]

Crossbowman lol

[boreal owl]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-yuck-eww-gross-gif-14788039

[vernal trellis]

If i use skirmisher i get more stamina i was just challenging myself with the worst stat class lol i got bored

[plucky lake]

I like crossbowman

Need to get more vanguard in but I also wanna unlock some knight fashion

[vernal trellis]

I need to farm longsword to get those lvl 100 skins but i really dont feel like grinding when Maul is way more fun lol

[plucky lake]

It really is

[vernal trellis]

Dont think i will ever reach that point tbh. I already been telling people at the end of the year or possible September when StarField comes out i might uninstall chiv 2 and be done with the game

[plucky lake]

I'm gonna be playing chiv by the time AC6 and LotF come out.

[boreal owl]

So is it official did archers win the discussion

[plucky lake]

We always win

[boreal owl]

Cool

I’m not an archer though

[plucky lake]

You are now

[boreal owl]

No

[plucky lake]

Yes you are

[boreal owl]

No

[dull cliff]

Of course we won, we made the biggest haters submit footage of them playing lol and it went as expected.

They proved the class is fine. By dropping the hottest stat lines this side of Rudhelm

Random 21-9
Badger 16-3

Random dealt with Flankers multiple times getting rid of the majority of his talking points almost single handily in 1 game.

Both being so heavily reliant on 3rd person was the weirdest thing from both videos for me.

But they are the Archers you expect in a game not the ones they built up in their complaints.

They both mellowed out from their initial personal insult filled comments, well more so Badger and a little Random.

So ya overwhelming win for Archers so far

[unkempt tangle]

I still hold my original opinions, archer needs a rework. The whole game I was barely threatened and I didn't have to interact with the melee system to apply damage from range, the people I hit could do nothing about it.

[dull cliff]

I still don't get why the talking point remains

" Archers use Archery and Melee system and I only have to use the Melee ones, so it's not fair. Yes I have access to both and yes I was flanked and died when I played Archer".

You guys essentialy are pushing for a more generic game where no class is different, no weapon is a bad choice for whatever gameplay you want nor do classes have advantages and disadvantages.

[unkempt tangle]

The issue is the archer system bypasses the melee one to do damage

[dull cliff]

Do you bypass the Archery system to damage Archers?

[unkempt tangle]

to the archer receiving the damage there's no real difference

[dull cliff]

You didn't answer the question

[unkempt tangle]

there is no question. to the archer, receiving damage from melee or another archer makes no difference, they can move out the way but that's all they have until they switch to melee, then they are a part of the melee system.

[dull cliff]

You again are deflecting.

The answer is yes, you can bypass the Archery system to damage them.

Do Archers have to deal with the same systems each game as Melee?

Yes

[unkempt tangle]

it's a flawed question

[dull cliff]

LOL you presented the situation and logic!

"The issue is the archer system bypasses the melee one to do damage"

You are saying it is flawed when reversed?

Just like that, another talking point falls.

[unkempt tangle]

It's a poor analogy tbh. So, melee has tools that deal damage and prevent damage, archery has damage tools that bypass most of the melee damage-prevention tools, while staying outside the range of melee's damage dealing tools. So while player A doesn't have defensive tools against player B, player B cannot even use their tools to deal damage. So you have a situation where player A can deal damage to player B, and player B cannot realistically do anything to prevent that damage. Player B being a typical 2h loving melee player.

In a vacuum under perfect conditions player B could counter Player A's tools. But in the real world player A's tools deal damage faster than human reaction time, there is other sensory information, and player B will mostly likely by engaged in combat with other players, preventing this perfect scenario where countering Player A's tools is even theoretically feasible.

[dull cliff]

You are still deflecting from your point.

If you kill an Archer with Melee , You would be doing what you claim is an issue. Bypassing a system to do damage to the class not using that system.

This is your own logic and this easily produced example shows it is bad.

You 100% have the defensive tools to go against Player A as B, we have went over this and this is where you move the goal post to 2/X and Not Fun!

I have done nothing but explain in detail and gameplay how easy Archers are to counter. The gameplay I provided was a direct mirror of the Ziggy footage. Same Map, Same objective and I killed 5 Archers. He died.

The hurdles you guys go through to act like the class is an issue when you both proved it isn't untouchable or even close to it should stop that talking point.

[unkempt tangle]

the difference is melee has to approach the archer to actually do that, the archer does not have to be anywhere close to the melee, and even if they are, it's easy to be behind a wall of team mates

Approaching a player is also slow and reactable, an arrow is not often reactable

[dull cliff]

That is a goal post, not what you said.

Again if you kill an Archer who is using his bow you did the exact thing you claimed was the issue.

"The issue is the archer system bypasses the melee one to do damage"

But reversed

[unkempt tangle]

^

[dull cliff]

Your quote

[unkempt tangle]

yep, I explained why your point falls short

[dull cliff]

LOL It didn't you are moving the goal post to try to distance yourself from your own logic.

If you kill an Archer with a Melee system are you using a different System to bypass the Archer one to do damage to the Archer?

It is a yes or no question

[unkempt tangle]

How come? I explained quite clearly the issues with the class

[dull cliff]

If you kill an Archer with a Melee system are you using a different System to bypass the Archer one to do damage to the Archer?

Yes or No

[unkempt tangle]

you're just taking distance out of the equation for no reason

[dull cliff]

Your quote didn't mention that as I showed

[dull cliff]

See here

[unkempt tangle]

"while staying outside the range of melee's damage dealing tools"

[dull cliff]

You said this correct? Nothing else in here correct?

[unkempt tangle]

oh you're still on that. seperate systems was a bad analogy

[dull cliff]

No you are avoiding it because I am right with your own logic

[unkempt tangle]

the tools analogy is a better one that explains my problems

[dull cliff]

LOL you are running from your own point because I used it to shut you down.

[unkempt tangle]

im admitting it was a bad analogy to explain my point

[dull cliff]

Then you moved the goal post correct?

[unkempt tangle]

No, I changed the way I explained it

[dull cliff]

LOL you change the whole argument lol

[unkempt tangle]

reformatted it, you could say

no, it just makes my point more clear

[dull cliff]

"I see what I said was wrong and you used it against me, Let me add more qualifiers , details and points to avoid that"

Literally moved the goal post

[unkempt tangle]

I said it was a bad analogy, it did not explain my point clearly. I'm trying to make my opinions clearer to you, but you are ignoring those efforts to fit your own agenda. So, bye

[dull cliff]

Are you sure that is what you mean?

[dreamy grotto]

I love how this thread has nearly 3000 chat messages now

[dull cliff]

I wish I could pin post in it : /

[unkempt tangle]

I actually want you ask you @vernal trellis @slender kiln @hollow willow if this message gets my issues with archers across. does it explain it clearly to you? #1120674199158141018 message

and other archer players you can think of

[dull cliff]

Pretty dishonest to not link to the original statement before that , I also addressed that one.

[dreamy grotto]

idk, i find the majority of archer stuff fine, the only issue is an archer all the way at their spawn ranging ages far without an actual counter, archers will hide behind people no matter where even if close because they are a range weapon so them playing like that is their structure of gameplay. it shouldn't really be gameplay though to be untouchable though and sit at a spawn point that spawns teammates every few seconds on the attacks side. ill just say archers are fine, maps need to just increase a restriction zone for archers to not sit at the spawn too much, same with map fixing areas that archers should not be at anymore

like in tenosia the wall map, theres a rock ridge good archer players always abuse, its impossible to ever catch up to them, and it is easily out of bounds as adefender that they can run away

at the front wall

[unkempt tangle]

I'll add, regardless of opinions on it, we can discuss that later. but those two paragraphs get my point across, yes?

[dreamy grotto]

theres just really no way to balance a normal general thing for a minority who abuse it too heavily in unfair practice

you could idk reduce length of time it takes to draw a spam shot

or maybe make those counterable like athrown item as a fast drawn arrow isnt really high in velocity

force archers to increase their draw to an actual shot

or average shot

but i just cant think of anything else, archers will cause just stress in general while fighting melee because its just built like that ingame and irl

[fickle fox]

Hello i am Fembowman the legendary archer !

For methe archer class should be more focused on supporting like making more trap and maybe less damage on head shot (specially for armored guy)

Is that make sense ? My english is bad

[dreamy grotto]

it may not actually hurt to reduce the damage of a warbows max draw

idk the longbows max draw damage either

[fickle fox]

On some class but for other class with less head armor it should give 100 damage

Knights are not supposed to take more than 80 damage in the head

[dreamy grotto]

well both vanguard and footmen already have it rough with warbows

[fickle fox]

True 2 shot can be enough

Maybe less damage overall but more capacity to support your team

And buff this god damn crossbow

For me the crossbow should be overkill in the head but hard to aim

[dull cliff]

Damage nerfs to bow are lazy , If you aren't hitting headshots you are 3-4 shotting fully healthy people. With a damage nerf it would be 4-6.
There would be no point in playing the class if you have to land 3 headshots in a row to kill someone.

But sure take their damage away but make it where no Melee can 1 hit kill them. Seems like a good balance right?

[dreamy grotto]

then reduce damage by being too heavily far, and keep damage normal on being somewhat far, extra if close and being risky

[dull cliff]

What is the damage on Non Archers at max range currently.

Say 60-100 m

[hollow willow]

I just want to say again that I have no issue combatting enemy archer, but I understand the issue you’re bringing up. The distance and inability for some melee players to reach archers is a hurdle that is difficult to overcome. Archers can keep pumping out arrows and there’s not much an enemy frontline player can do about it unless they take care of the archers frontline, they succeed in performing a flank, or the archers frontline is trash

[dreamy grotto]

im just suggesting a fix to go for archers sitting at their spawn to encourge them to go forward more to deal more damage, a lil less if they plan to stay there

they wont need to go far forward like frontlines

[dull cliff]

Warbow sit back because they took away 40% of their ammo and no headshot take 2-3 shots, 3 more so to kill non Archers.

[dreamy grotto]

just a few more meters, not 8ft from the spawn

[dreamy grotto]

this is ur reason, that wont stop the persons being able to keep doing this even if ammo is returned

you may move forward if u had more ammo but that wont prevent people from still doing that method

[dull cliff]

It is literally what forced me to play back because you would be out of Ammo the majority of the time and exposed.

[dreamy grotto]

thats ur own reason, some others maybe too. but that still isnt gonna prevent a person from doing it, there still needs to be a solution to make people actually just not go that far back

if ammo is increased i could still go back and stay there

[dull cliff]

The majority of Archers shooting from Spawn are not contributing . In my 700+ Levels I have seen maybe 2? Make an impact besides me from shooting at 50M +

If they are spamming the front lines Banners and Horns easily make up for their damage and poor hit %

[dreamy grotto]

i dont find it an issue for the majority, i find it an issue on the minority having a way to actually not have a counter or be encourged to go to the front. they may not contribute much unless perfect but they still have no real counter if they aren't gonna move forward

if you want more ammo fine 10-20% but the radius change does need to be included

[dull cliff]

Why are you wanting to nerf the class for what maybe 5% of Archers can do ?

[dreamy grotto]

not wanting to nerf a class at all

[dull cliff]

Lowering damage is a pretty direct nerf

[dreamy grotto]

the radius will be considerably still very high and normal, but itll weaken a lil if ur at ur spawn

this will only effect that 5%

[dull cliff]

What about on Maps where you spawn 40-50m from the checkpoint/objective on Defense?

[dreamy grotto]

i could also just not do this method and instead suggest adding map restricted zones on spawn zones

[dull cliff]

Same point

[dreamy grotto]

this will be edited in a smaller scale then per dependent on the obj and map

this is a very delicate matter after all, it cant be half assed in a simple way to screw all archers

[dull cliff]

You think they are really going to go in and edit the spawns on the maps to implement a nerf to archer damage?

[dreamy grotto]

its the only way, if theres nothing then its gonna be how it is

[dull cliff]

How are you going to implement damage drop off for each weapon and projectile?

[dreamy grotto]

because ur solution for more ammo buffs all archers, encourges only you or some to go forward, still doable either way in the far back

[dull cliff]

What about TDM where you spawn on people? Now you nerfed all your damage.

You surely see how this approach isn't good?

[dreamy grotto]

Aren't TDM matches all close

i dont think the nerf would apply just a small radius or gamemode

ur already screwed in TDM and FFA

[dull cliff]

So even more changes to their game engine?

[dreamy grotto]

no actually, just changes to TO

[dull cliff]

You are talking about massive work to counter less than 5% of a classes players

[dreamy grotto]

you can isolate changes on a gamemode alone

[dull cliff]

TO would be the hardest one to do this on

[dreamy grotto]

as i said thats the only actual solution to prevent and only issue in archers i see. it wont nerf bad or average archers, it will reduce archers from sitting directly at their spawn, it wont nerf anyone just going a bit foward

i rather have this then 40% ammo increase ffor all archers

[dull cliff]

They only took away 40% from Warbow. Longbow and Crossbow shooting from spawn shouldn't be an issue and would be exactly what you want. A wasted slot.

[dreamy grotto]

i can draw a diagram if you want, it wont be fancy but itll show the way how i mean

[dull cliff]

Draw a diagram that shows less than 5% making changes that aren't needed to impact 95%+ and won't change anything in the long run. But will require massive work

[unkempt tangle]

don't reformat your ideas, it'll confuse him

[full coral]

he wont hear them out anyways because it would be changing archer

[dull cliff]

You mean completely change your idea when it is shown to horribly flawed?

[full coral]

keeping archer is the same is also a horribly flawed idea

badger has already pointed out

archer is able to hit melee without melee being able to:

1. block the damage without a shield
2. return the damage since the archer is really far away

[dull cliff]

1. Why would you be able to block damage without a shield?

2. Why would you be able to return damage with a close range class?

Wait almost like we have systems built in for this

• Increased health, bandages, Healing Horns, Banners, Arrow Deflecting, Friendly hitboxes overlapping enemies and more!

[unkempt tangle]

I dunno, fun maybe

[dull cliff]

Is it fun to get one hit with no counter play?

[dreamy grotto]

something like this

though tbf it may be more of a retangle

rectangle* since the archer on a side is taking a risk already moving and far from his spawn

so instead of a square see it as a vertical rectangle

[dull cliff]

You already have damage fall off though

[dreamy grotto]

how much is the fall off from range

[dull cliff]

Not sure amount but it makes it not worth shooting Knights and only makes it worth shooting Archers

[unkempt tangle]

archers get a melee weapon last I checked, and bow throws/jabs. Though most lack peripheral vision so maybe you have to unlock that 🤷‍♂️

[dull cliff]

This is a deflection

Is it fun to be one shot, this is a simple yes or no

[unkempt tangle]

It's fine when there's counterplay, which every class has. Except archer vs other archers

[dull cliff]

Again you didn't answer

Is it fun to be one shot

[unkempt tangle]

yep

[dull cliff]

Bad faith as expected

[unkempt tangle]

what

"agree or it's bad faith" strange argument

[dull cliff]

You are clearly not being honest saying it is fun to be one shot

[unkempt tangle]

It's fun when there's counterplay

[dull cliff]

You are doing this because it goes against another one of your horrible talking points "muh fun"

[unkempt tangle]

why do you know my opinions?

you're putting words in my mouth

[dull cliff]

You say it's fine as long as their is Counter play? Isn't a shield counter play to Archers? Weird new goal post incoming

[unkempt tangle]

all classes have counterplay to one shots*, besides archer vs other archers, when not overhealed of course

[dull cliff]

Lol called it

[unkempt tangle]

it's what I said before

[unkempt tangle]

right here

[dull cliff]

Is a shield a direct way to counter arrows?

[unkempt tangle]

on that one class, sure

[dull cliff]

So it's fine according to your logic

[unkempt tangle]

what if im a class without a shield? There's a few of them

[dull cliff]

You swap to rhe counter because as long as it had a counter it's fine and fun

Your words

[dull cliff]

See here

[unkempt tangle]

To things that can one shot you, which was your question

[dull cliff]

Can arrows not kill you?

[unkempt tangle]

so in the context of one shots, I pointed out the one class that doesn't have that counterplay

[dull cliff]

So it's not fun to die to a class that can 3 shit you even though you have a counter?

Why is that less fun?

[unkempt tangle]

It's not fun to take (reasonably) unblockable damage

[dull cliff]

But you can by countering it like the one hit and you think that is fine

Even fun

[unkempt tangle]

This is a common logical fallacy. The things that can one shot you are counterable by every class, besides warbow vs a non-overhealed archer. However, a majority of classes cannot reasonably counter an arrow, therefore arrows are not fun (in my opinion)

[dull cliff]

You are just bring a hypocrite by your own logic

[unkempt tangle]

how so?

these are different things, they elicit different opinions

[dull cliff]

One hit is fine you can counter and as long as you can counter it's fun

3 hit isn't fun but everything is the same

It's just you not wanting to follow your own advice

[unkempt tangle]

but everything isn't the same, most classes cannot reasonably counter those three hits

they are different things

[dull cliff]

A counter isn't what you want it to be though is It?

[unkempt tangle]

if you mean in-game counters, that's why I add "reasonably"

[full coral]

1. so. if i swing my axe.. you should take damage every time i swing it?

2. thats... part of the issue

[dull cliff]

This is a deflection

Again you are trying to say all classes need a counter but that isn't what you claimed. You said as long as there is a counter it is fine and fun.

Your own words

[full coral]

thats not a deflection

thats pointing out the issue between archer and melee fighting

you dont NEED a shield in order to block a melee attack

[dull cliff]

Nobody said you did and it's literally deflecting

[full coral]

dude, i think youre lying so much that youre getting yourself confused.

[dull cliff]

He didn't say this

[dull cliff]

A shield is direct counter play

[full coral]

a shield isnt direct counterplay

a shield is a deterance to reduce the amount of times you get shot with an arrow

[unkempt tangle]

you're taking things out of context. For maybe the third time now, things that can one shot can be countered by all classes, (except warbow by archer). it's why I'm fine with that mechanic, however, arrows not being something that can one shot don't come into that discussion.

So if we move over to arrows, these can, in fact, not be reasonably countered by most classes, and are therefore a problem

[dull cliff]

It's clear that is two times you got caught with your logic exposing your bias and you fumbling to try to save face.

Good luck in out

[unkempt tangle]

I'm not sure how much clearer I can make it, and I can only assume you are arguing in bad faith as you are wrong

[full coral]

3rd time?? the dude does it every time you make a point that he cant dispute

[unkempt tangle]

this specific point today

[spice cedar]

Nitpicking and biased. I win. Bye bye

[unkempt tangle]

have fun being wrong, it's okay sometimes

[full coral]

he doesnt understand the concept of risk/reward

archer is able to be rewarded by hitting their opponents at range, without being at risk by melee players

this applies to the opposing archers aswell, being that the only players who can be a threat to them. are typically the ones who can match their range advantage

TLDR: as a melee, anyone you can hit, can hit you (disregarding the minor difference in weapon reach)

as an archer, you can hit people without them being able to hit you. AND you can ignore attempting to block without a shield

[unkempt tangle]

@lusty sundial sorry to ping, I cannot message chivmail. but I believe keepers behaviour in the above exchange breaks the anti-social rule of this discord

[dull cliff]

Directly addressing your logic is anti social?

Always amazed at the rush to censor people you disagree with

[unkempt tangle]

Im sorry, I've done nothing but try to explain my points and you are simply dismissing them with made up reasons

[dull cliff]

I directly quoted everything I talked about lol

[unkempt tangle]

using false logic, maybe to garner an emotional response from me

[dull cliff]

Using your own words isn't false logic, again I directly quoted you

Directly your words

[unkempt tangle]

aksing questions only to dismiss my opinion. it's just not reasonable behaviour

[dull cliff]

If you don't like your own words and gameplay to be used to discredit your claims I suggest you leave or stop making bad claims

You choose to be here

[dreamy grotto]

almost at 3000!

[unkempt tangle]

If that's what you claim, I think others can read through this and also realise how you are currently making things up