Mini Dispenser Concept

[pure skiff]

The mini-dispenser has always been a experiment that I always wanted to see attempted both in live and here. A supportive tool that encourages an engineer to play more offensively while also still staying in that niche of a defensive class.

The stats are more of all ballpark than anything, so please recommend changes!

The mini dispenser would cost 70. It'd be able to be built within 10.5 seconds (4.2 when boosted by a stock wrench) and have 150 health. It would be substantially smaller, letting it be placed in cramped areas stock couldn't.

When built, the mini dispenser would heal 16 hp/sec in a slightly longer range than stock. This makes the healing slightly better than a level 2 dispenser, though significantly weaker than a level 3 (20hp/sec) or a medic (24hp/sec). Ammo replenishing would be comparable to a Lv 1 dispenser.

The main mechanic of the mini-dispenser would be its downside. Instead of being able to regenerate metal off of your mini dispenser, it will instead need to be filled with 'ammo' like a sentry does. The maximum capacity would be based on its healing, where one 'ammo' of a mini-dispenser would equate to 1 healthpoint.

Now, what the max capacity of the mini dispenser would be and what the conversion from metal to dispenser ammo I'm not sure, but the general idea is that the engineer would have to constantly scavenge metal through either carts or dead players to repeatedly maintain the mini dispenser, though not to a level where he would have to just turtle next to it. Itd run out long before a sentry would run out, though.

In addition, it could also try and reinpliment that one trait from the original experiment where destroying it doubles as a pseudo sticky trap.

I was also thinking of calling this like a 'medical station' as alot of the inspiration comes from using medical stations in Half-Life

if mini-dispenser is too close to live to be added

[primal vale]

Okay so… Engi is gonna have no metal source… not too sure about that AND the high price to build it

[thorn nimbus]

Why does a MINI dispenser cost more than its bigger brother dispenser?

[pure skiff]

Yes, a level 2 is 300 metal and is significantly slower to place. One of my goals for this concept was to have be more portable compared to stock, though I was worried about the potential set ups one could do with a jump-pad and a mini dispenser or a mini-dispenser and a sentry

[pure skiff]

It is faster and heals significantly more than a level 1. You can consider it a 'denser' dispenser like a smartphone where there's more tech jammed into it

again alot of these stats were moreso and excuse to just explain the general concept, it could be 100 or even cheaper

I felt that having a higher base cost is better, especially since it isn't upgradable

[thorn nimbus]

you have to MANUALLY fill ammo in it each time,

make it at least 90 metal

especially cuz its smaller

[pure skiff]

That's a fair point

I'll edit it to 70 then to match jumpads

[thorn nimbus]

oh and also I dont see this weapon getting added, the whole point of tf2c "weapon making" is making the weapon an ACTUAL different one, not just modifying the stock weapon and giving it a reskin

For example:
Tf2c goes from: Revolver to tranquilizer | Scout's scattergun to nail gun

tf2:
Rocket launcher to Black box | Scatter gun to backscatter

and this weapon:
Dispenser to mini - dispenser (Which is just a small dispenser with better healing)

ehh

I dont see better changing ideas for buildings

[pure skiff]

I believe that this would fundamentally change how engineer is approached, and would put it in the same class as like the AA cannon where it's both a statswap and has some unique traits

[thorn nimbus]

yeah makes sense

[primal vale]

(Pssst. Jump pads don’t cost 70 anymore.)

[primal vale]

But a Level 2 actually Provides you the metal to you in conjunction with spending the metal into it. It’s Engi’s biggest metal source.

This mini cost the same as a sentry and then provides no return other than for Bullet & Health that now has a tax to dispense it.

There’s just not a lot of incentive to manage this little kicker for what could be an Empty healer, since there’s no claim for how much health comes with it when built.

It’s like Taxes.

• You build the thing,
• gives no metal back
• And Then cost you more to Heal yourself.

[pure skiff]

I already conceted on the base metal cost lol

When built it has 150 hp, it's heal storage I'm not really sure

[primal vale]

Well it DID cost that of sentry then.

[pure skiff]

You sent this first...!!!!

[primal vale]

I keep notes of previous states of all weapons

[pure skiff]

This is the balancing weight that keeps it from being objectively better than stock in every situation. Its better in the short term and can be placed farther up.

Sort of like a quickfix situation, where in the short-term it's much better but for long term it grows more costly

[primal vale]

I think free metal is always gonna be better for Engi 9/10 times.

[solid oar]

Concept: Metal Dispenser
only gives metal and nothing else
gives metal very quickly
downside: it doesnt give anything but metal

[pure skiff]

Maybe on defense, but on offense I can see this being run commonly on attack

Or even just on defense closer to your heavies and powerclasses, where its less of a fallback and more like something keeping them within the fight

[pure skiff]

Ah yes the evil selfish dispenser

[pure skiff]

Weird comparison, but it'd sort of be like the heal stations/flowepots in PvZ garden warfare, though with a greater cost given that tf2 isn't built around fast recharging abilities

[junior sedge]

wait why this have a lvl 2 and lvl 3 when mini-sentry in tf2 have only 1 lvl?(no fr why. and i know this not tf2 this tf2c)

[pure skiff]

It doesn't

[junior sedge]

oh yes?

[pure skiff]

I was giving the stock dispenser's heal numbers for comparison to the number I picked

[junior sedge]

oh mb than

[primal vale]

Why is it 16 though instead of just 15 to call it even.

[pure skiff]

Wanted it to be better than a level 1 or 2 dispenser and decided on ⅔ of medic's base

[vapid nexus]

I’m not sure about the mini dispenser without a cheaper sentry to go along with it, maybe I’m just not very imaginative with engie but it feels like Valve really wanted a mini dispenser in live and it just never worked out

My biggest issue with engie isn’t how long it takes to get a dispenser up, it’s maintaining my sentry gun for the most part because that’s the building everybody and their grandmother is targeting

[primal vale]

Problem is too many Engi’s focus on the gun and not their Ammo supply, Sentry’s up but no Dispenser.

All Barrel and no Bullets.

[normal frost]

If we want a mini dispenser lets get a mini sentry, but lets not do that cuz mini sentrys in this game would suck ass

[primal vale]

We could make them work as a diet Lvl1 (weaker for cheaper) and not a Mosquito that matches the same DPS as lvl1s.

But that would require some number crunching and Classic to actually Add more slots (since they’re not tying buildings to weapons no more)

[normal frost]

yeah thats a good change

i like having buildings separate from weapons

i hope they do some unique stuff for the buildings

[primal vale]

Though I wish they were embedded to weapons, but the Pads are here now, too late for that now.

[normal frost]

im not against the weapons buffing/nerfing ur buildings in some way, but having buildings be exclusive to weapons isnt a good idea imo

[primal vale]

I mean that’s what the general consensus was, I just thought of having a Wrench for the “Sentry Alts” but of course then it gets messy how they interact with the other buildings.

The problem is now Engi would have a total of 6 slots to Mess around with once Each building has a side grade. That’s a lot of moving parts.

[normal frost]

I thought they were only gonna have 2 building slots

so as an example you could only have the mini dispenser + jumppad but not the artillery sentry as well

[primal vale]

Don’t know how’d that work, i thought each slot was for each building. So it’d be 3 slots

Otherwise you’d be stacking same slot buildings on each other

[normal frost]

i imagine it would work like hats where u can put them in different slots but not 2 of the same kind

[vapid nexus]

Sounds like a skill issue more so than a reason to create a teeny dispenser with slightly easier up keep, but that's just me :x

[pure skiff]

The other stats I added would make it fill a more support role, potentially sitting at medic like ranges from the frontline instead of farther back. This would be targeted to engis who want to focus on that offensive support role while not pushing forward nearly as much as a mini sentry let's you do in live

Overall, it'd make engi have to play a more active support role and really strip away that turtling style most engis feel like they have to do right now in live, which I think is healthy to the class as a whole to atleast have a option to step away from the back and play closer to his team

[pure skiff]

The mini dispenser very explicitly would require more upkeep than stock, it just would just be significantly more powerful in the shorterm

[primal vale]

Yeah maybe, but I’d rather have a dispenser that gives me metal then me having to put in metal for health I won’t use.

[pure skiff]

support classes when they get new tools that encourange them to play supportively

[primal vale]

the defence spelled on top of engi

[pure skiff]

1. *Defense
2. Who uses those roles anyways, when was the last time you've seen a defensive demo
3. 

[vapid nexus]

Well actually

Demo is best defensively

He can be very effective on offense, but he’s also really easy to counter if you just get up in his face

[primal vale]

don't tell me how to spell, THEY spell it wrong! 🇬🇧 🇬🇧 🇬🇧

[primal vale]

me, I'm the defence demo

[vapid nexus]

To be fair, he’s bri’ish, so he’s taught to spell words like defense, color and armor incorrectly

Don’t think we have much of a leg up anymore considering most like 5th graders here read at a kindergarten level

[primal vale]

when the English man uses English.

The Aussie like our Spelling... and our TV shows.

[pure skiff]

The UK uses United Kingdomese not English