#Old Gens OU

1 messages · Page 15 of 1

tribal smelt
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The last iteration I made of it that I feel is bonified good/playable in modern was 2bird but I went Chansey > Blissey Shedinja > Zapdos

tropic schooner
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I personally want to fit a buzzwole, gastrodon, and a more consistent rocker

tribal smelt
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Aka Gastro Corv Clef Pex Shed Chansey

tropic schooner
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Like idk hippo

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But then again its a shed team

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Cant do those

tribal smelt
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Hippo Shedinja Hydreigon is a core I saw sparingly on ladder

tropic schooner
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Sounds like a copium version of hippo glowking hydra imma be real af

tribal smelt
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It is

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It existed just so Skarmory gets spikes

tropic schooner
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Anyways we should continue this in comp gen

tribal smelt
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Yh mb

wraith mulch
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

hasty ingot
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team is definitely solid (tho it is a bit weavile weak!), i think i would do the following: move defog to lando over stealth rock, put rocks on tran over toxic, and give torn taunt over defog

wraith mulch
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thanks, and on the weav issue would bold tran be good?

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whatever defensive bold tran runs

sacred steeple
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
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i assume it's the mlop + agren

sacred steeple
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so just mlop

vast oracle
# sacred steeple https://pokepast.es/f4eb1db7db9baedd Sm ou , can anyone please rate this team?
  • Your current team has no way of immediately threatening pex, which is something mlop needs help with. Z dig protean greninja over agren lets you lure pex and pretty much OHKO it, but also helps pressure clef with gunk shot and provides spikes to chip bulky neutral mons like fini, magearna, and mega scizor that can usually take 1 or 2 hits from mlop.
  • CB Victini over blace, which pretty much does similar things except vic actually has defensive utility to help cover mons like zardY and mega zam, the latter of which can be especially problematic cause nothing on the team is faster than it. provides pivot support and works well with z-dig gren too so it can spam v-creates more freely.
  • Rotom-w over tapu bulu to complement your lando-t + av magearna core defensively. provides pivoting and defog support so lando-t isnt burdened for both hazard duties. twave for stuff like mlatias, zardx, and volc, but you can run wisp instead for mons like kart, mpert, and msciz.

final team: https://pokepast.es/1f223d6907a784b4
i have minor adjustments on some of the other sets (notably giving mlop pup over ice punch so it can clean late-game, especially cause ice beam gren + hp ice lando-t + cb vic can deal with and overwhelm the grounds for it), but feel free to ask any q's

sacred steeple
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Rest pretty much seems ok

vast oracle
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0- SpA Landorus-Therian Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-Therian: 196-232 (51.3 - 60.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

sacred steeple
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Oh ic

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Alright , tysm for your help!!

vast oracle
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nw :>

warped venture
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

warped venture
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First thing I can notice right out the gate is that opposing SD Chomp, Pult, and Volcanion is an issue, but if there's anything else lmk.

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Some variant of Eject Pex can probably help with most of this, but I'd probs have to shift a bit around and I'd like others input.

warped venture
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Whichever structure is preferred we can go from there

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I think I'm leaning towards Eject Pex just bc of the synergy it and Knock Lando provide with Zone

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Corvi's a bit of a gross slot, but I'm not really sure what else I can do abt the Kart MU.

tribal smelt
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Yeah nor can you fit Dos

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I like the eject pack route though

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Pretty fresh

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Means you get turns like Tran having to show Air Balloon

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One issue might be that you are pretty low on status which does help in long con games

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So Jab -> toxic on pex

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Then go from there since I don't think any Lele, Shifu/Fini balance wants to play fiddle with Rising Voltage + Shifu

warped venture
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Oh yeah, I actually did end up slotting Toxic on Koko over NM, seeing as team's wearing Ferro into RV Range anyway, and Toxic just means more raw advantage to keep pushing on opposing grounds.

tribal smelt
warped venture
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This also feels like smth that does really well on keeping Melm on the backfoot consitently throughout a game, which is a nice plus.

woeful pumice
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
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hi yes it's me again

woeful pumice
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oh just 2 raters i thought it was way more

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yes

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hi

vast oracle
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there's kaede too blobpeek

woeful pumice
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true

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uhh is the team missing anything else now or

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we good

vast oracle
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hmm

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i personally prefer sub over taunt on keldeo

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taunt is only good with waterium z so you can like immediately muscle past pex

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with psyspam i think you have enough pressure on pex to not have to blow it back right away

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i'd make lando defensive fly z to check hawlucha and surprise nuke stuff like bulu and tang for keldeo

woeful pumice
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alright

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that sounds cool

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like this?

vast oracle
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looks fine

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minor ferro tweak imo

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if leech ferro feels too passive, you can run twave + knock + iapapa over it + gyro + lefties

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lets you emergency check kart and weaken the steels for your psyspam

woeful pumice
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alr

vast oracle
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especially cause you have no removal so this team wants to stack hazards and win fast

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just be careful of cm reuni & mlati, keep vic healthy if they're around lol

woeful pumice
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hm

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okay

tribal smelt
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @weak mirage, @red delta, @night bridge. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

tribal smelt
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tried my hand at some Victreebell.

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Not sure where this mon fits but my idea is "oh, chansey + Jynx sets early game prio and hits good paralysis"

night bridge
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the point of having a vic is to beat up on structures with Eggy and/or chansey as sleepers

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if you're using jynx you ideally want it to be your only sleeper and free you up to use better sets on other mons

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i'd highly recommend leading a psychic, click twave if the opposing lead is jynx, double to Vic if it's Gengar and catch them going to egg/chans/whatever sleeper, if its an opposing Twave lead you probably don't play the risky double and just hit them till they switch their sleeper in

tribal smelt
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Aaah makes sense

night bridge
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also i dont think you need reflect icelax and reflect toss chans

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imo if you wanna play Vic go aggressive, reflect toss chans is fine but use that to free up your lax to be aggressive

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amnesia lax, 4 attacks lax, whatever

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victreebel can wrap once you spread some para and chip things down

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then you find entry points for bull and lax to get in and KO things

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imo the main purpose of OU trapping moves is you stop them clicking Soft-Boiled/Rest/Recover and force them to switch out at like 50, 60, 70

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then next time they try to get in there's a tauros waiting to KO them

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you could honestly run like, mie vic zap

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its like mie egg zap but more aggro

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benefit of vic is that spreading para early is also no longer a death sentence

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accidentally para the chansey? no big deal, you just find an entry and wrap it so it cant get any healing

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(ideally you still want to land sleep beforehand but paralyzing like, starmie or zam is certainly far less bad)

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the main concerns with a team like that are:

  1. consistency - its still a victreebel, one miss and you're screwed
  2. Gengar - you force it out t1 with the psychic lead but its a royal pain for Vic and you will prob want EQ on Lax to help remove it
  3. Rhydon - if Vic gets paralyzed, again, this becomes really hard
  4. Jolteon - checks zapdos and mie really well, twaves vic and then you're screwed
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jolteon and gar are def the most problematic ones imo

tribal smelt
night bridge
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those arent gonna help nearly enough vs it

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if you're running vic i think you kinda have to own that you're getting rolled by zapdos tbh

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can bring like jolteon over your own zapdos if you want more help paralyzing stuff and vs chansey, perhaps

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but i hesitate to recommend jolteon ever

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like you click rest and you arent ever waking up in most games

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yeah nvm i think w/o reflect lax or cloyster you cant pull that kind of stunt

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i think the aggressive angle is the way here but certainly you sometimes just get rolled for it

tribal smelt
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Yeah

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So basically: 6 are okay, sets are weird, Lax can be aggro Chansey can be more of a do shit set? And mie vic zap is a core to try?

night bridge
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id say dont have the jynx

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you can replace it with lots of stuff, zam, zap, gar, maybe even rhydon (kind of cloy weak though) but i'd lead a psychic

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gengar + mie + vic sounds funny to me but very zapdos weak

tropic schooner
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@orchid tiger

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tried mamo

warped venture
flint ridge
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slow

tropic schooner
warped venture
# tropic schooner Outspeed landp

I'd rather outspeed at the very least BandTar
Otherwise you just look like an idiot when your Ground can't do jack to the mon Grounds should probably be able to do smth against.

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ig you could go up to Modest Volcanion if you have Paranoia

orchid tiger
tropic schooner
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So i went with tox

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Speed control is like i couldnt cover everything i wanted w the team

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So a lot of mons ended up being defensive

orchid tiger
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Covering rotom is weird cause you have hydra

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Yeah also don’t like how OVERLY passive this team is

tropic schooner
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Point is you tox washer and go hydra

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Then just press attacks with mamo and go hydra again

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So u beat washtom easier

orchid tiger
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Fwiw speed control and the overall passivity of this team is just ehh

tropic schooner
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Every other version of this preview lost to something tho

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I guess i could do a shit scarfer like zwole over zapdos or something

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Then i have no fog

orchid tiger
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Zappy is cool here I was looking more into replacing bro since ferro clef Zapdos cover everything bro does

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you can do scarf shifu

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Tho no fs with scarf is yikes

tropic schooner
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What about scarf blace last

orchid tiger
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That could work

tropic schooner
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Mamo kills fat scarf blace kills offense

orchid tiger
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Also what does nmi secure that lo doesn’t

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Or boots

tropic schooner
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Ig boots could work

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Substitute last and lefties could also be nice

orchid tiger
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It’s fine

wind wigeon
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Smogon Format: OU
Gimmicks:
Mega Evolution is legal
Z-Moves are legal
Dynamax is banned

Clauses:
Sleep Clause
Evasion Clause
Duplicate Species Clause
Evasion Clause
OHKO Clause

Banned Moves:
Minimize
Double Team
Acupressure
Fissure
Guillotine
Horn Drill
Sheer Cold
Baton Pass
Last Respects
Revival Blessing
Shed Tail

Banned Abilities:
Shadow Tag
Arena Trap
Moody
Sand Veil
Snow Cloak
Power Construct

Banned Items:
Bright Powder
Lax Incense
King's Rock
Razor Fang

Banned Mega Stones:
Alakazite
Blastoisinite
Blazikenite
Gengarite
Kangaskhanite
Lucarionite
Metagrossite
Salamencite

I want to start off by apologizing for copy pasting. This is for a custom tournament I am participating in. So basically I want some help using gen 8 and gen 9 starter only (but no gen 9) I don’t know where to start if someone can help me. Maybe something along the line of a set up into (stealth, spikes, tSpikes, sticky web) into stats boost sweep. Or annoying wall stall. I just need some tips

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Also please teach me some OU gimmicks I might not know, and all Pokémon has to be max lvl so no lvl 99 or lvl 1 cheese

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You’re free to also @ me

wind wigeon
upper plume
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Rule 6 of #1030567099703242903 message

upper plume
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Also we only help improve fully made teams, we don't build new teams

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@wind wigeon I'd recommend you ask in #comp-general if you want others to build a team with you

wind wigeon
upper plume
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It's fine

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It's just that rmts are for official formats

burnt dove
neon raptor
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What tier?

flint ridge
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is this an om

peak canyon
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @azure torrent, @polar nacelle, @surreal crypt, @old iris. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

peak canyon
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and i don't know how can i lose with my team

old iris
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Cb gross + zard is a bit weird

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As cb gross wants to kill skarm

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But zard likes when skarm is alive because it's a free in

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You should just play leftovers on zard with beat up

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Lead gross to force skarm in

old iris
peak canyon
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zard ? i don't know the terms i'm a beginner

old iris
peak canyon
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ah

old iris
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If you're a beginner you might just want to play more

peak canyon
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do you know the first 3 gens ?

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i mean how to be good in

old iris
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Find a team you think is cool, it's completely normal to lose when you're a beginner

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Well the first step is just playing

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So you can at least know how each mon is played etc

peak canyon
old iris
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Yes then just play for a bit you'll get it back

peak canyon
old iris
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You'd gain more by playing ladder

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More different people so you'll face many different teams

upper plume
hybrid matrix
prisma heron
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@obtuse prairie

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@peak canyon

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@azure torrent

hybrid matrix
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@azure torrent @rugged hinge

winged void
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

polar nacelle
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And your sets dont make sense, youre better off starting with sample teams https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/adv-ou-sample-teams-and-team-dumps.3687813/

Smogon Forums
OU - ADV OU Sample Teams and Team Dumps

(Art by Dybala jr. Thanks for the contribution!)

Welcome to the wonderful tier that is ADV! To get you started, we are providing a bunch of free teams!

Sample Teams
These are teams that have mostly made their way into the history books of ADV. They are teams that represent ADV's major...

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And reading the official smogon analyses for the sets

hybrid matrix
neon raptor
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Liquidation Shifu

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Replace toxic on Ferro with pwhip and make Shifu’s set surging strikes, close combat, aqua jet, U-turn.

hybrid matrix
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thx

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wont forget this

neon raptor
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Make Peli scald, defog, roost, U-turn as well. Tailwind is an extremely niche option in singles that doesn’t fit rain.

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Ofc

hybrid matrix
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just did that. lets see if i get better results. thanks for the advice!!!

burnt dove
neon raptor
upper plume
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Not an expert in usum ou but the sets look very strange

hazy grotto
upper plume
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royalfluxh is the goat at doing usum rates but this team is just lost

burnt dove
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i will admit im not that great at this

hazy grotto
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also finch I never see him in here

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lol

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so just ping royalfluxh

hazy grotto
upper plume
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are you new to playing gen 7 ou?

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or competitive pokemon in general?

burnt dove
upper plume
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ok so

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I would recommend looking at the smogon dex first for each of these mons to see what they can do in ou

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for instance, toxapex

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these sets are known to work well in gen 7 ou

burnt dove
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i got some of it right at least

upper plume
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do that for the rest of the mons

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I also think a lot of metagame threats mess you up

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and lax and chansey have overlapping roles

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while tyranitar's set just isn't effective

burnt dove
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im just trying to build a team that can actually take a hit, i see so many people do it but i cant seem to figure it out

upper plume
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skarmory could be worse ig, but wiki berry is a poor fit on it

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!smsamples

karmic geyserBOT
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SM Sample Teams:
Ubers: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7ubers
OU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7ou
UU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7uu
RU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7ru
NU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7nu
PU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7pu
LC: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7lc
1v1: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen71v1
Monotype: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7monotype
Let's Go OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/lets-go-overused-discussion-resources.3667865/post-8552756

upper plume
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I'd look at the OU samples for bulky teams

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probably either the lop balance or the ditto semi stall

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gen 7 ou is a tier where you want bulk sufficient take a few attacks, but be able to respond with your own offense in return

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because any given mon can just pop a z and blow through your wall

burnt dove
upper plume
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probably

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I still don't think steelix and snorlax help your team

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I'd probably include a z abuser

burnt dove
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such as?

upper plume
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@vast oracle I'd probably ask them

vast oracle
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You really need speed control here. i'd make landot scarf instead, especially cause your double trap core can pressure/chip or outright remove most ground-resists (see: mlati, skarm, celes) so you can click eq freely late-game.

prisma heron
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Cool

vast oracle
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Ferro over magearna, gives rocks while still having a spdef steel + agren answer (lando + rotomw should be enough pivoting)

prisma heron
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Sounds fun

vast oracle
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Make your rotom-w more more spdef with twave to better deal with volc and zardx, which kinda easily 6-0es your team. (going away from full physdef in general is fine cause you have ferro for mpert, zone for msciz, and mlati + weavile for the grounds)

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either lando or rotomw can run defog. and if you want to keep split on rotom-w, run lefties instead

prisma heron
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lando or defog can run defog?

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you mean rotom

vast oracle
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cm clef looks like it can go out of hand quickly; feel free to try steelz on zone instead

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oops ye

prisma heron
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pex you don't trap actually

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but still

vast oracle
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you have knock weavile to at least remove their lefites

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but ye just a consideration

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can still keep electrium z ofc

prisma heron
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In SM, do CM Clefs run Flame or thunder?

vast oracle
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i prefer tbolt, but some run flame

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some even runs boltbeam no moon

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deals with spdef gliscor better

vast oracle
prisma heron
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ok ok

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if tbolt or bolt beam

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zone beats it

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if flame

vast oracle
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yea

prisma heron
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ferro beats not flame sets too

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flame can be more of an issue tbh

vast oracle
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ferro needs like 12 speed evs + iron head + twave to at least beat clef 1v1

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or keep whip if you get the para turns

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can also try fini + tran over rotomw + ferro

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though you lose out on pivots, so your call

tribal smelt
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

tribal smelt
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I did stare at this on repeat and I realised that there's like, no power in this spikes/balance

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So I may as well go rocks on ferro defog lando

hasty ingot
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this team is SUPER slow

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it is reminiscent of 100p balance, but that team always has a designated wincon and a koko for speed control

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it's tough cause my suggestion based off this would be to just use that team

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which would have madness koko > bro and dd dnite > melm

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that said, solo knock ferro is quite sad

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you'd probably want whip

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i dont think heal bell is worth the momentum sink

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so i'd probably go knock there

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or even trickybarb

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toxic > knock on lando makes a lot of sense too

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melm feels weird here but i suppose you need it for the pult pressure

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but yeh this feels like a more suboptimal version of 100p's team

tribal smelt
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First try at Victini and its' suboptimal

hasty ingot
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i mean vic can work on a lot of comps

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it's just that this one is super similar to a really popular team

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there's a lot of variations on this

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some have boom lando

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most have volcarona > victini

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if you're looking for a fun way to build with vic

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eforce victini + lele is a good duo

tribal smelt
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Nah I've seen this team and I had a hunch I was ending up at somewhere near there

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But yeah thanks Dex going to see if I can make better teams

hasty ingot
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the lack of speed on yours was the big thing that jumped out at me

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fastest mon vic is not gonna cut it

jade jungle
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

prisma heron
jade jungle
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I needed a special def without adding more weaknesses to my team

vast oracle
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big fan of chansey offense

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6 can stay for sure, just have to switch up sets

prisma heron
vast oracle
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ye

prisma heron
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They could go SpDef Heatran over Chansey tbh

vast oracle
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though you dont run that passive set

prisma heron
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They need a proper defensive steel

vast oracle
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twave stoss softboiled hwish

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changing it to heatran makesthe team weak to agren

prisma heron
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Yeah true
Maybe Pex then?

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With TSpikes?

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Big fan on Pex with TSpikes?

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Or maybe

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Chansey does have a less passive set

jade jungle
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weaknesses ground

prisma heron
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You have Lando and Rotom-W for grounds

jade jungle
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pex,diancie,zone and pex weakness ground

prisma heron
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AV Mag maybe an option too

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Idk man

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I think Chansey is weird on BO like this, if you run chansey you will appreciate a more defensively solid core like Pex + Steela rather than Rotom-W + Lando

vast oracle
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can always opt for av mag to fit with the classic lando-t + rotom-w, but i dont find it necessary, cause chansey offense is still viable

jade jungle
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steela(defoger)>chansey
pex>rotom???

prisma heron
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Actually, let royalfluxh handle it

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Maybe they know something that I don't

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If there's a less passive chansey set out there

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That could work on this team

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I want to know though how Chansey retains momentum on this team

vast oracle
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chansey in these sort of offenses is just a catch-all special wall, instead of opting for spdef steel and losing to random stuff like volc zardy agren etc

prisma heron
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Yeah that is true

vast oracle
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lets you run rocks too, esp if lando is scarf, and +hwish is always nice for offensive mons that love to trade with stuff

prisma heron
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But these teams like Momentum

vast oracle
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usually stuff like KB, victini, mmaw, etc

jade jungle
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chansey would be interesting if teleport was the same as gen 8

prisma heron
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Oh HWish

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Yeah HWish is nice

prisma heron
vast oracle
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you lose to psyspam

prisma heron
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It can run Payapa for Psychic Volc

vast oracle
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chansey can take psyshock in a pinch and twave

prisma heron
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The good Psyspams run Knock M-Zam tbh

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But I guess its a decent catch all here

vast oracle
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if pex has hwish then yes imma consider it too lol

prisma heron
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and h-wish lets it keep momentum in a pinch

jade jungle
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??

vast oracle
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remove edge for defog

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what does 148 atk do

jade jungle
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set for smogon

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"other options"

vast oracle
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uh scarf lando set on smogon is the 232/68/208

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oh

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i'd make that 152 attack instead

jade jungle
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The listed EV spread makes Landorus-T one point faster than a boosted Kommo-o and allows it to survive +2 Acrobatics from Hawlucha after Stealth Rock. Bulkier EV spreads such as 80 HP / 148 Atk / 84 Def / 196 Spe, which allows Landorus-T to avoid a 2HKO from Kartana's Leaf Blade after Stealth Rock damage, are also viable options if the role compression they provide is important. Naive should be run alongside Hidden Power Ice to guarantee that Landorus-T 2HKOes certain bulkier Gliscor variants.

vast oracle
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you ohko megazam with uturn after rocks

jade jungle
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hmmm

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the lack of reliable deffogers, can a hazzard stack team be used? with tytar band

vast oracle
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you have mdia too so going defog on scarf lando is fine, especially since you're running offense

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either way, i have some minor set changes

jade jungle
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ok

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can talk

vast oracle
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  • with lando as your scarfer, i think you can go with band kart for a wallbreaker instead
  • with lando not running rocks, make mdia your rocker instead over protect/dstorm/ep
  • run a status move on rotom-w over defog. twave deals with zardx while wisp for mpert and bulu. run 8 speed evs to outpace crawdaunt too
  • make the chansey set twave/stoss/softboiled/hwish and 16 speed evs for para'd heatran
jade jungle
#

hwish, healing wish????

#

idont speak inglish kk,sorry

vast oracle
#

yea healing wish

jade jungle
#

ok, thanks

vast oracle
#

another option you can try is to make magnezone specs and rotom-w waterium z, lets it deal with stuff like mega charizard x, mega tyranitar, and gliscor better

jade jungle
#

I am going to try

#

rigth?

vast oracle
# jade jungle https://pokepast.es/a342d0e074cf19d1

4 spdef on mdia to attack; drop the spdef & some hp on chansey for 16 speed evs; drop the 1 IV attack on magnezone to 0; and run the 80 HP / 148 Atk / 84 Def / 196 Spe on lando cause you have no kartana switchins atm

#

should be fine then

jade jungle
#

ok, thanks

vast oracle
#

np :>

vivid kraken
upper plume
#

I'd imagine you'd want av mag

vivid kraken
#

over what

upper plume
#

Idk

#

But it's good vs Psychics and has v switch

flint ridge
#

yeah

#

prob over torn

upper plume
#

And then z lando

vast oracle
vivid kraken
vast oracle
# vivid kraken https://pokepast.es/003e9aba122a61b6 tried making a volt turn team
  • Like the others said, you need a switchin to stuff like tapu lele, mega zam, magaerna, and ashgren. AV magearna fits the bill here, still gives you a pivot for your voltturn core too
  • Since you have torn-t as a ground-immune, I think you can afford to run a different ground-type over lando-t. i'd recommend SD Rockium Z Garchomp, it provides a soft check to stuff like ZardY and Volcarona--which are usually problematic for BOs relying on Landot + rotomw + magearna--while still possessing an offensive presence itself, pressuring and overwhelming the birds for MLop + Kart
  • Make torn-t the defensive set, with taunt to help shutdown stuff like unaware clefable and celesteela to help your offensive core
  • With torn-t dropping defog, you can run it on rotom-w over pain split

team should look something like this: https://pokepast.es/7e27de0d0c384057
Another option you can try is if you still want to keep torn-t as your defogger, you can run defog over uturn and give it eject button to still be a one-time pivot (torn-t also tends to absorb knock off anyways from stuff like kart, ferro, and opposing tornt, so having a one-time-use item is not a big deal) if so, you can keep pain split on rotom-w (but make it lefties over the berry)

vivid kraken
#

can u test

vivid kraken
vast oracle
#

if you want, you can try fini over rotomw. still gives defog but less pivot options, and you can pressure pex with taunt + madness and provides misty terrain so chomp can switch into and setup on it more safely

vivid kraken
flint ridge
#

torn feels out of place

#

on that time

#

team

#

I had smth similar but w cb kart

vivid kraken
#

i cant use this

#

no koko is not helping

vivid kraken
vast oracle
#

tornt is fine cause it lets you run chomp as your ground, cause that koko team gets 6-0ed by zardy and volc in general

#

taunt + knock off tornt can literally annoy fat builds in general too, i dont see the issue

#

but if you still wanna keep koko then who am i to stop

#

i also have a similar team with specs lele + rockz landot

image.png
#

i guess you just outoffense the fires, with sd lando being able to keep rocks up by pressuring defoggers in general

upper plume
#

yeah scarf kart + koko is super anti offense

#

that + torn is super duper anti offense

vast oracle
#

you have mlop too, idk why you need another anti offense mon

upper plume
#

this is just me larping

#

but what other megas other than lop could fit here?

vast oracle
#

mtar for pursuit + lets lando run flyinium for bulky grasses

#

or mega maw, fucks up stall builds in general

#

since you have a lot of anti-offense options already, and it works well with the tapus too

flint ridge
steep ruin
#

@vast oracle Do you approve teams just for Showdown? Or other Pokemon games as well?

vast oracle
steep ruin
#

No the game I'm playing follows SM meta

#

It's purely SM

vast oracle
#

if it's exactly SM OU then sure

steep ruin
#

The only different thing is people spam Primal Groudon

#

And I'm looking for a sand team to counter it

vast oracle
#

ok yea that is a whole different metagame that i'm neither qualified nor capable of helping lol

steep ruin
#

Soo?

#

Oh I'm sorry for the disturbance then

vast oracle
#

especially cause it doesnt seem to be a smogon format?

steep ruin
#

Actually do you think you can help me build a sand team

vast oracle
#

we only rate smogon and official formats here

steep ruin
#

Ii

#

Ik

#

I actually am looking for an OU sand team

#

Specifically to counter Rotom-W

#

So do u think u can help me out

vast oracle
#

we only rate teams here, not build from scratch

steep ruin
#

Oohk

vast oracle
#

you can try building one and i can rate it

steep ruin
#

Can u suggest a mega for sand team?

#

Okay will do

vast oracle
#

mega ttar or mega garchomp

steep ruin
#

Hmm

#

Okay here

vast oracle
#

mega garchomp is tougher to build with tho so i suggest the former if you're still new

steep ruin
#

Imma make a sand team

#

Eh I'm well versed with gen 7

#

Gimme some time imma build a sand team

#

I do think that I should've added Lando+T

#

But can you please rate this?

vast oracle
#

why is there a mega lucario on an sm ou team..

steep ruin
#

OH WAIT NO

#

Oof

#

Ight so Mega ttar it is

vast oracle
#

and aegi too lmfao

steep ruin
#

Oh sh*t

vast oracle
#

did you click the 'validate' button on the teambuilder

steep ruin
#

Oof no

vast oracle
#

😭

steep ruin
#

I'm so sorry 😐

steep ruin
#

Instead of Mlucario and Aegislash do u think Lando-T and some other mega

#

@vast oracle

flint ridge
#

3 grounds is too much

steep ruin
#

Hmm

#

I want a full proof sand team

#

Idk how to properly construct it

#

The only thing ik is that a sand team has ttar and Excadrill

copper gull
#

gen 4 OU

topaz sentinel
supple creek
#

Someone with a gen 1??

gritty scaffold
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @polar nacelle, @surreal crypt, @old iris. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

polar nacelle
#

Use subpass on zapdos to make prediction easier

gritty scaffold
#

oh kk sure

#

so ig i drop twave?

polar nacelle
#

Yeah

#

Your celebi set is also a bit unnecessary

#

Keep leech but make it more offensive maybe

gritty scaffold
#

perhaps pass a reflect

polar nacelle
#

No

gritty scaffold
#

oh the offensive set one i see

polar nacelle
#

Maybe hp fire on celebi

#

It will help vs meta

gritty scaffold
#

kk

polar nacelle
#

And also vs skarm if u didnt manage to boom it with meta

#

Note if u play this ur gameplan is to boom with cbmeta first then use hera

gritty scaffold
#

perhaps id use ice punch on rachi then?

gritty scaffold
polar nacelle
#

This rachi is probably okay

gritty scaffold
#

alr then

polar nacelle
#

But also, u might want to use a bulkier heracross

#

Anyway play around

#

It is a good attempt

#

Think about how ur gonna beat fires

#

It may be fine as is if u preserve timid zap

gritty scaffold
#

woop kk ill see around

polar nacelle
#

Or u may want tbolt on rachi

#

Just play and see

polar nacelle
gritty scaffold
#

kindasus kk

polar nacelle
#

Breloom over meta also an alternative

#

U might need hpfight on p2 for ddtar

gritty scaffold
#

so far been a bit interesting

#

sometimes they couldnt phase my hera after i baton pass with sub so

#

my hera would just start having some fun

#

or sometimes ppl would just sac the ttar to just get rid of my sub just so a dug would come in to revenge kill

polar nacelle
#

Yeah sub helps u with predictions and can sometimes snowball

gritty scaffold
#

i thought skarm could just switch into hera and take a hit but it gets pressured quite well

reef cobalt
#

gen 7 ou, previously got this team reviewed and im happy for the most part, but i wanted to replace hidden power fire on landorus with superpower and changed its evs accordingly to ko kartana, any thoughts or changes i could make on landorus? https://pokepast.es/3ae5c22986674310

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
#

a good midground option to hit heatran + rotomw cores too

#

you can even try hp ice on lando or ice beam magearna if spdef gliscor is an issue

#

though you dont actually guarantee OHKO kartana even with max attack (unlike hp fire) so just be careful

reef cobalt
#

if i opt for hp ice on lando, do i change its nature to be naive then?

#

or should i change magearna instead

reef cobalt
vast oracle
#

replacing the hp fire on mag i think. though it's just a different/alternative option if you're facing trouble with spdef gliscor, if not then you can keep the team as is

sacred steeple
warped anchor
#

ORAS rock/steel team. Seems to do well with OU as a mixed team, but sometimes prone to fall off. Is there any improvements that could possibly be made?

tribal smelt
vast oracle
#

But if you still want to, then this 6 is fine as is since they're pretty standard together

#
  • pjab pex is useless cause cm taunt fini dont exist - just run toxic/toxic spikes. with msab + chansey, you can run a mixed pex instead with physdef investment to deal with stuff like zardx and mmaw better, which helps skarm in general.
Ability: Regenerator  
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 144 SpD  
Calm Nature  
IVs: 0 Atk  
- Scald  
- Haze  
- Recover  
- Toxic / Toxic Spikes```
My ev spread lets it survive adamant mpert's eq, +2 knock off from mega mawile, and 2 specs agren's dark pulse after black sludge. icium z is an option too to for the instant healing that bypasses taunt, prevents you from being annoyed by stuff like torn-t, tapu fini, and potentially heatran too. also lets you absorb trick and take knock off from mega mawile and random breakers like crawdaunt better 
- foul play is better on physdef msab, so just run knock off instead for the utility (esp against mons like specs lele that tries to switch into u), which lets you run toxic over knock off on gliscor. 
- Another option you can try is since you already have toxic/tspikes on chansey & glisc, confide on chansey helps deal with threatening CM-ers like reuni and LO clef that ditto can't easily beat
- Unless it does something specific, just run hp ground on ditto instead so you can counter-trap opposing magnezone for skarmory, especially cause you dont run shed shell and magnezone offenses are mad threatening once your skarm is gone (sd glisc, bulu, kart, and garchomp will go ham)
#

You will still have bad matchups against other breakers like kyurem-b, hoopa-u, physical koko, thunder punch mega mawile, manaphy rain, and knock off megazam + lele psyspam, which is just the nature of sm stall losing to something else, but this should be the best you can do with the same 6

reef cobalt
#

i kinda wanna keep hp fire on magearna for kartana or ferrothorn or even magnezone, but i want to also be ready for anything

vast oracle
#

i just like the insta nuke + momentum that explosion gives, especially on more offensive structures like this

#

personal preference mostly

#

naive hp ice is fine

vast oracle
#

but if you wanna keep hp fire on mag then hp ice lando is also fine

reef cobalt
#

oh i see!

#

then i’ll likely go for hp ice on magearna then

vast oracle
#

ice beam

reef cobalt
#

any other changes i should opt for?

#

right right

#

i forgot it can learn ice beam

vast oracle
#

magearna learns everything

vast oracle
#

if you struggle against a specific matchup then we can adjust it further to your liking

reef cobalt
#

okay!

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
#

uh as per rule 4, we only rate complete teams btw

sacred steeple
sacred steeple
tribal smelt
#

Yeah listen to royal on this one I mostly fun-que and saw you posted -stall in here

sacred steeple
#

Ok!

reef cobalt
#

this time its a full team, though i am of course willing to swap out any pokemon other than tyranitar for better options

reef cobalt
reef cobalt
# vast oracle ye it's a fine change

oh! i also wanted to ask: are the evs for landorus okay? i just got them off of smogon’s page for landorus. or should i change the evs around a bit, im still keeping explosion and superpower on it!

reef cobalt
#

i recall you said something about max attack evs, and i wondered if i shouldve done max attack and max speed, or done something else

vast oracle
#

but i guess scarf is fine cause you run offensive ttar + sd z exca

#

might wanna run taunt on torn-t over knock off cause the mons you knock will tend to overlap with kartana's (see: zapdos, celes, ferro, lando, pex, etc), especially cause taunt helps you shut down celes and skarm to help both your exca + kart that can falter against them

#

mixed pex too cause mpert in rain looks mad threatening. EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 144 SpD Calm lets you live its adamant eq and potentially toxic/scald burn it back (also lives +2 mmaw knock!). you still have mttar to play around threats like volc, zardY, and specs agren so not going full spdef is fine

vast oracle
vast oracle
#

can run more bulk but since you're running 4 attacks then might as well go near-max attack

reef cobalt
#

if i run more bulk for landorus, what evs would you suggest? and in that case should i keep superpower for kartana and heatran? or should i opt for hp fire for kartana

vast oracle
#

80 HP / 148 Atk / 84 Def / 196 Spe to deal with kart better (lives 2 leaf blades after rocks)

reef cobalt
#

keep superpower or replace it with hidden power fire?

#

since im lowering its attack from near max to lower

vast oracle
#

hmm

#

can you send the final team

#

been a lot of changes i forgot how it looks like now lol

reef cobalt
#

should i keep explosion as well?

vast oracle
#

hmmm looking back

#

i think you go defog on lando over superpower/boom, and pain split + lefties over defog on rotom-w, which lets you annoy chansey better for your offensive core

#

and keep hp fire on magearna over ice beam (rotom-w + specs lele pressures gliscor enough to keep it at bay, and hp fire means you can emergency check kart too cause you can live its attacks from full)

#

tbf the last move on these 3 mons are so customizeable that you can always experiment on them further

reef cobalt
#

is this good then?

#

i opted to replace superpower over explosion

vast oracle
reef cobalt
#

okay!

#

how’s this for the sand balance team? gen 7 ou again

vast oracle
#

Keep scarf on kart, band was mostly referring to builds with like av ttar and/or lefties exca that lack the wallbreaking power

#

With offensive pursuit mtar + sd z exca, you can afford scarf

#

Other than that, looks fine to me

reef cobalt
#

ohhh gotcha!

flint ridge
#

cb is fine

warped venture
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

warped venture
#

Inspired by other Double Band Sand teams, and I wanted to put my own personal spin on it.

#

I am also just now realizing I forgot to give Pex Eject Button

#

whoops

tribal smelt
#

Old gens, not current.

hazy grotto
tribal smelt
#

Oh no

#

Some guy posted something in here earlier for SV

kindred raft
#

what should i change with clefable ferrothorn bisharp gengar slowbro ORAS OU
I haven't done comp before but have a basic understanding of ivs evs and how battling works

keen oar
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

hazy grotto
#

it’s optional tho

upper plume
opal beacon
opal beacon
hazy grotto
#

I forgot he had rapid spin

#

lol

kindred raft
opal beacon
#

Scroll down

#

U will find an option upload to pokepaste

#

If u are still not sure dm me and I will tell u how

#

Or u can ask in the help room in ps

vast oracle
#
  • I know you want the birdspam with mpinsir + zfly landot, but stone edge + rockium z landot feels better here to reliably nuke zapdos for mpinsir.
  • sash drill is generally a HO lead. you can try the bulky lefties exca instead, which also gives you a spdef steel against stuff like lele and mzam. You can try something like EVs: 180 HP / 252 SpD / 76 Spe Jolly (outspeeds modest heatran) with eq/spin/toxic/rock tomb and lefties
  • spikes is generally the preferred 4th move on agren (over ice beam), but since you want to click defog most of the time instead, you can try uturn here. lets you support mpinsir by bringing it onto agren's checks like kommo, chansey, bulu, and tangrowth. (spikes is also fine too, which you can use to force the opponent to click defog for you instead, especially cause you have rapid spin as another hazard removal option)
  • can try more physdef on fini to help check weavile, zardx, and mpert better here. EVs: 248 HP / 148 Def / 12 SpA / 44 SpD / 56 Spe Calm: enough speed for modest magnezone and Def to live mmedi's hjk into zen headbutt with lefties
#

can run more bulk on lando-t too honestly to switch into kart better

tribal smelt
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

tribal smelt
#

Since while banded exca hits hard you can probably swap it for banded kartana and do some bigger numbers at the cost of speed

flint ridge
#

fsight lele looks weird here

tribal smelt
#

Logic I had was "fuck it may as well its scarfed"

#

Since I think the 4th on Lele feels kind of arbitrary if its not Fsight

#

Although Sball is nice

flint ridge
#

yeah it’s usually filler

orchid tiger
tribal smelt
#

Yeah having to settle for Fsight lele/scarfed Psyspam in the mid game feels weird

#

But to compensate you can basically bully most Gking teams relentlessly

#

PP stall them if they want to remove Tspikes then repeat the cycle

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

keen oar
vast oracle
#
  • glisc + pex is too passive here, i'd replace them with a different ground & bulky water in lando-t + rotom-w instead. landot gives you a blanket check to physical attackers like mmedi, mmaw, and zardx, while rotom-w gives you a defogger. more importantly, they can pivot mmedi in safely or keep up the team's offensive pressure.
  • aside from being very niche, thundy-t only fits on certain HOs like webs or that mdia + volc + serp core. i recommend agren to pressure bulky psychics like reuni and slowbro for your psyspam, provide secondary speed control, and love mmedi + lele dealing with & overwhelming its checks like pex, chansey, & av magearna. can honestly go with weavile too to pursuit trap the bulky psychics (and random ghosts i guess lol)
  • tpunch mmedi is ran only when paired with koko (and by dropping zen, even) and forgoing hjk altogether in general is a no go; it's your strongest neutral hit against bulky mons in general, and not being able to dent steels like heatran, ferro, magearna, and msciz is not a good look. especially cause you pair it with scarf lele, so you wanna significantly pressure them + chansey for it
  • timid over modest on scarf lele to outspeed mega zam, z clang kommoo, and scarf lando-t

team should look like this: https://pokepast.es/2314e01fc3bfa78b
you can try running z water agren + defensive uturn lando instead too, or tinker with rotom-w's & lando-t's ev spread to your liking

brave flint
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

orchid tiger
brave flint
#

I built this before gen 9 came out, now im trying to find a way to make this better, getting back into pokemon and teambuilding

#

natdex ou sry

#

im open with switching some pokemon with gen 9

orchid tiger
#

That defeats the purpose of rmt and fwiw gen 9 ou is experiencing dramatic changes with home recently dropping and some banners being announced tomorrow

brave flint
#

how can i fix my current team then

#

forget what I said

orchid tiger
#

Like I said is it a gen 7 team or natdex cause Megas and z moves don’t exist

brave flint
orchid tiger
#

Yeah send this to the natdex thread for better advisement

brave flint
#

Ok thanks

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
#

uh just edit or re-send the correct pokepaste it's fine

flint ridge
#

random specs tran here

kindred raft
#

!sample teams

topaz sentinel
#

i got two gen 4 ou teams, they were rated previously, but i wanted to make sure i didnt make any small mistakes

#

in the first team, jolteon is supposed to have choice specs and signal beam instead of t wave but i forgot to change it

#

and for the second team, is there a diff set i should run for gengar and infernape, wanted to center the team around Gengar esp

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
#

chatot why are you pinging me out of nowhere

#

I personally prefer for this team structure to run scarf gambit vic + av magearna over kartana + heatran, but 6 is fine enough if you want to keep it

#
  • if you want to run offensive heatran, go with z move instead. aside from how non-spammable your stab combo is, not being choice locked lets you run utility moves like taunt + toxic to break down walls better; in this case, it lets you beat stuff like pex and chansey to open up agren, which you can run specs now.
  • i like landot over gliscor here to pivot into phys attackers like mlop better and less passive in general, but if you wanna keep glisc at least run uturn over knock
  • spdef rotom-w cause opposing agren just clicks, and run a status move over pain split
tired kernel
#

Rain Trick Room
Dusclops @ Eviolite
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 6 Def / 252 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe

  • Night Shade
  • Will O Wisp
  • Trick Room
  • Ally Switch

Pelipper @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 10 SpD
Relaxed Nature

  • Surf
  • U Turn
  • Roost
  • Protect

Gastrodon @ Rindo Berry
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 6 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe

  • Surf
  • Earth Power
  • Ice Beam
  • Sludge Bomb

Dracovish @ Choice Band
Ability: Strong Jaw
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 6 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe

  • Fishious Rend
  • Crunch
  • Ice Fang
  • Low Kick

Jellicent @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 58 Def / 200 SpD
Sassy Nature

  • Surf
  • Will O Wisp
  • Trick Room
  • Protect

Raichu @ Focus Sash
Ability: Lightning Rod
EVs: 252 HP / 10 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature

  • Volt Switch
  • Surf
  • Fake Out
  • Light Screen
#

Sw sh doubles

hardy steeple
#

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Ability: Keen Eye
EVs: 252 HP / 180 Def / 76 SpD
Impish Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

  • Spikes
  • Roost
  • Whirlwind
  • Stealth Rock

Flygon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

  • Earthquake
  • Outrage
  • U-turn
  • Thunder Punch

Gengar @ Black Sludge
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

  • Substitute
  • Pain Split
  • Shadow Ball
  • Focus Blast

Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 12 HP / 244 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

  • Spore
  • Focus Punch
  • Seed Bomb
  • Mach Punch

Tyranitar @ Choice Band
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

  • Crunch
  • Pursuit
  • Superpower
  • Stone Edge

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

  • Hydro Pump
  • Ice Beam
  • Rapid Spin
  • Recover

DPP OU

upper plume
#

Put it in a pokepaste next time

upper plume
proper cedar
tired kernel
#

hence my post in here

upper plume
#

I see

tired kernel
#

im really into tr rain

upper plume
#

I think that the doubles ou server might be helpful for you then

karmic geyserBOT
upper plume
#

this thread has all the discord servers affiliated w/ smogon

tired kernel
#

thanks

flint ridge
#

think ud prefer tank chomp on these type of structure

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

reef cobalt
#

i was going to ask if i should have it be fully maxed out on HP and Def (like i have it now in the link) with a Bold nature or if i should keep it as it was previously (248 HP, 84 Def, 168 SpD, 8 Spe with a Calm Nature)

#

i have will o wisp on it though and was recommended the spread by someone here previously

flint ridge
#

max def is fine

#

u could go mixed for ur volc mu ig

reef cobalt
#

im just asking since i dont really have as much physical defense as i do special def

reef cobalt
flint ridge
#

the spread u suggested

reef cobalt
#

oh i see

#

its for rotom wash

tired kernel
proper cedar
# flint ridge serp>lando

Ok I’ll try it out. Lost all my team comps cause I accidentally cleared my Pokémon showdown cookies lol

tired kernel
#

Also put scarf on lele instead of lando-t

hazy grotto
proper cedar
#

Yeah I had a sick serp mega manetric team

tired kernel
#

Take advantage of z moves

#

Swap bug z for ground z

reef cobalt
tired kernel
tired kernel
#

@reef cobalt I do recommend investing in spdef for rotom

#

Wisp will cripple phys attackers so its better in invest in spdef for more bulk

reef cobalt
#

so would the mixed calm set be good as is?

reef cobalt
tired kernel
#

Yes but invest more in spdef

#

Thats a good spread

#

As long as you have longevity to fire off wisps because your team is physically frail

#

How’s this advice for you

reef cobalt
#

yeah i was considering making landorus maybe more bulky but that would mean going away from scarf and potentially losing defog, which may not be ideal

tired kernel
#

I’m not the best when it comes to competitive but you gotta take what you can get ig

reef cobalt
#

its good, thanks!

tired kernel
#

Np

#

Hope you find success in this team

reef cobalt
#

thank you!

reef cobalt
#

i think ill stick with the mixed set, though id like to get the opinions of others if possible

vast oracle
#

re: lando-t
you can still run defensive investment while still being scarfed

reef cobalt
#

the calm spread specifically, or should i make changes to them for specific situations or match ups?

vast oracle
reef cobalt
vast oracle
#

can run like 48 Spe too for modest zone

reef cobalt
reef cobalt
#

ill stick with the spread i have now

vast oracle
#

mine as in i was the one who rated your team previously

#

but u get the point

#

yea

reef cobalt
#

OH okay!

#

so i assume that means its fine as it is, correct?

vast oracle
#

yup

reef cobalt
#

okay, thanks!

reef cobalt
vast oracle
#

ya it's fine too

reef cobalt
#

gotcha! thanks so much!

vast oracle
#

np :>

topaz sentinel
#

Can any1 help rate my gen 4 ou teams I got 2 of them

vast oracle
proper cedar
flint ridge
proper cedar
#

yeah alr changed it up a little

flint ridge
#

a steel also works

#

smth like bish maybe

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
#

looks like standard sun

#

not sure what ferro is doing here, and questionable lando set too

#

fini over ferro is the easiest change

#

if you dont want to completely use the sample, you can go with sd z rock lando + scarf defog kart on your team

#

ye thats a pretty standard 6

#

your past couple of teams have been fine though, just need minor tweaking

tribal smelt
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @short hedge. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

tribal smelt
#

This is mostly a question on how Hail Stall structures work since I did see this show up once or twice and tried to fill in the slots

proper cedar
flint ridge
#

Works

reef cobalt
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

reef cobalt
#

BUT i am very willing to make any changes or swaps to the team or the sets of course!

#

including both ash greninja and kartana

odd glade
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @polar nacelle, @surreal crypt, @old iris. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

polar nacelle
#

it also doesnt do well vs blissey

#

maybe if u explain ur building thought process we can figure out what u wanna get out of it and how to change it

odd glade
#

yeah now thhat i look back at it, there's too many special attackers, and Swampert is really the only mon that could feasibly take it out

hazy grotto
#

I have the exact same team but some things different

#

torn t can be used with Rocky helm I just like Fight Z on it

#

And knock off over focus blast if u want

short hedge
short hedge
#

for clefable

short hedge
#

Sleep Talk

#

Rest Talk*

#

Also maybe go with Umbreon > Skarm I don't think you need spike support as much as you need something that runs heal bell and a defensive all

#

I would look up Lady Bugs Hail Stall team for more guidance on Hail stall structure works

reef cobalt
vast oracle
#

though if you wanna keep kart, i'd make it sd to more reliably break through bulky waters like slowbro, rotomw, and fini, and with normal z to nuke stuff like bulu and tang, all of which helps your offensive rain core. between mpert in rain and ashgren as well as the fast nature of rain, i think you can afford to not run a scarfer (which is usually the case if you run those mpert + agren + manaphy builds)

#

was the original plan to make kartana rain or just a team with agren + kart?

reef cobalt
#

oh if i should replace kartana then i can do that easy! im not too attached to it

vast oracle
#

if you're going for rain then yeah, but agren + scarf kart is still a possible core if you wanna build a team around them

#

like the standard bo with another breaker + pivots

reef cobalt
#

any changes i should make to make the pokemon or team better?

#

or any different items or evs, etc?

vast oracle
# reef cobalt any changes i should make to make the pokemon or team better?
  • run relaxed + 22 speed ivs on peli to underspeed celesteela so you can switch into it and slow uturn out to your rain breakers. i think you can afford for max def cause that spread is very old to help against scarf keld, which has fallen off to oblivion. can go a personal fave spread of mine, EVs: 248 HP / 200 Def / 60 SpD to live 2 modest zardy's focus blast after rocks and lele's psychic
  • 252 / 24 / 232 on ferro, iapapa berry + knock over leech + lefties since you're running offense. give stealth rock on ferro cause you have spikes agren, and lets you run superpower on mpert to hit opposing ferro, which helps agren + koko
  • optional but i think you can afford more bulk on torn-t since you have koko for opposing tornt. being able to slow pivot out of them is also nice too. I recommend EVs: 240 HP / 64 Def / 204 Spe to outspeed scarf zone and lives mmedi ice punch. another thing to try is eject button; lets you pivot into your rain breakers safely, especially cause the mons you switch into like kart, ferro, and tang tend to knock you off anyways so forgoing rocky helmet and running a one-use item is justifiable enough on offenses like rain. rocky helmet is fine too ofc, lets you switch in to punish and then stay in on bulu, which looks mad annoying
  • run roost cause non-specs dgleam hits like wet noodle, you'd rather boltbeam the opposing team or just volt out. minor but EVs: 12 HP / 244 SpA / 252 Spe to live hawlucha's +2 hjk after rocks
reef cobalt
#

are these changes good then?

#

made a small mistake with ferrothorn that had to be fixed, sorry

vast oracle
#

keep rocky helmet i think, improves the bulu matchup. between voltturn from koko + tornt + peli, i think eject not needed

reef cobalt
#

ok!

#

thank you very much!

vast oracle
#

looks good otherwise

#

np!

flint ridge
#

but ferro is standard yeah

reef cobalt
#

i wanna make sure i get the general usage of these pokemon correct
peli can lead to set up rain, and switch in to defog or set up rain again,
ferrothorn can be another lead that can switch into resisted hits and set up rocks and knock off items
greninja can be brought in through u turn or volt switch to faint then wall break i believe
tornadus is used as a pivot with utility thanks to knock off and defog
tapu koko uses bolt beam and uses its z move and i don’t actually know when to best use it haha
and mega swampert should get in for free and sweep through opponents, right?

#

this is just in general and not always the case, since every match is different, but a general idea helps me learn how to use a team

flint ridge
#

yeah

stuck storm
stuck storm
#

@karmic geyser

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
#

got way too busy mb - will look at both sm teams tomorrow

stiff sail
#

I have no clue what this team is weak to other than lax walling it at times

tired kernel
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

hasty ingot
#

Hey! We don't rate doubles teams in this channel. I'd suggest DOU Rates @tired kernel

tired kernel
#

Where can i do that

#

Nvm thanks!

#

Oh its locked

vast oracle
# stuck storm https://pokepast.es/48a0ceed20ad7604
  • can just go to a HO direction with screens koko and removing magnezone for a stealth rock setter, which you currently lack. lead exca or imprison lando works; exca is better at setting up rocks against msab & mdia teams while lando gives momentum with boom
  • i'd change victini to zceleb set, which fits better on screens, and then run dclaw on zardx cause otherwise the team gets giga walled by mlati. however, you can drop victini altogether to alleviate this issue instead; magearna, volc, gyara, and kommo are decent alternative that also make use of screens too, and especially cause they run z move well, which nothing on the team currently runs atm.
#

weird amalgamation of mons, i dont quite see the synergy of vincune and gravity lando here

#

i'd lean towards a vincune semistall build instead

#

team also gets 6-0ed by sd kart

#

replace rotom-w + lando-t with pex + defog gliscor. pex in particular gives you tspikes and absorbs tspikes, which helps vincune a lot

#

with msciz, you can drop mage for ditto; gives you an anti-setup mon (and speed control too), works well with msciz to stop sd kart (switch msciz into kart and slow uturn to your ditto), and between vincune + ditto i think you can pp stall the CM-ers which magearna is tasked to handle

upper plume
#

If you're looking for help in an old gen doubles ou tier then I'd look in the Doubles OU discord

karmic geyserBOT
gritty scaffold
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @short hedge. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

stuck storm
short hedge
#

I also don't like Heatrans set

gritty scaffold
#

Hmm alr ill try the changes

short hedge
#

I'd go Taunt > HP Grass and I would go with a berry as well

#

Passho isn't bad, Shuca isn't bad, Chople wouldn't be bad as well

#

depends on matchups you're seeing on the ladder

gritty scaffold
steep ruin
#

@vast oracle Weather teams with speed boosting abilities are allowed in OU right?

#

Sand, Rain, Hail and Sun with their respective speed boosting abilites, are allowed in the OU format?

flint ridge
warped venture
#

https://pokepast.es/e44a7e5004450930
SSOU Rain
Idea mostly stemmed from Rain teams REALLY liking having a Ghost Resist, and the fact that Seismi feels like such an ugly slot on Rain in 90% of cases that's only really used because it's immune to Electric.
Using a Volt Absorb mon as a Elec Immune feels funky, and I feel like I get so much more use out of it than I would Seismi in most games.

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

warped venture
#

Gmolt + Thundy-T + Zap is also just absolutely stupid into fatter teams while Barra messes up faster teams' days.

prisma heron
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

tribal smelt
#

I do not like how weird this feels into sand teams

#

A cope is to try and fit BP on the ferro

warped venture
tribal smelt
#

No, it can be outskilled

#

I still would feel dicy loading this just since Ttar and Exca force you into some ugly trades

#

Which can lead to dumb situations like rocks never going up

#

And Weavile probably gets 1 turn of SD... idk feels like this has to be BP ferro somehow

warped venture
#

Yeah no BP's Totally fair, I'm just too used to always defaulting to Power Whip lol.

#

Like, I do find situations where I prefer Gball, and BP, but I'm so used to running Pwhip I kinda just
forget sometimes?

tribal smelt
#

Valid

#

You might be able to do lead Thunderus T, hard double ferro, set rocks, then set rain to compensate

warped venture
#

Leading Thund usually is the play into sand yeah.
Force them to play to my rules for a bit and hopefully get some valuable KOs/KO ranges set up in the process.

prisma heron
#

Thundy and Zap together?

#

And yeah

#

Sand is rough

#

You'll need Ferro at 100%

#

I also feel that you need a real wallbreaker

#

Somewhere

#

Like Volcanion or Crawdaunt

#

Volcanion's probably better

warped venture
# prisma heron Thundy and Zap together?

Over Seismi because
a. Dropping Zapdos on Rain is a cardinal sin
2. Thundurus and Zapdos work together very well offensively under Rain
purple. Seismi is poo poo smelly bad and stinks.

#

Also one of the main reasons to use Thundy on Rain in the first place is that it's an obscene Breaker under Rain.
Nasty Plot makes it do stupid numbers into most fat teams which Rain usually struggles against, and has the coverage to beat a majority of Zapdos' checks so that one, the other, or even both become far more threatening. All while packing the defensive utility of an Elec immune, and sidestepping a majority of the flaws that come with Crawdaunt.

#

If Sand really is just that difficult I could always just drop Gmolt (which sucks since I do like Rain w/ Ghost Resist bc it means you're not always just giving smth up to Pult when it gets in, but it's probably the least necesscary of the Triple Bird core).

#

And no, Crawdaunt does not count as a Ghost resist.

prisma heron
#

Idk, I get the concept of overwhelming shared checks b/w Thundy and Zap, but none of them is fast enough to clean after one breaks

#

That's usually the concept

#

You can break fat

#

But faster offenses will be annoying for sure

#

As for ghost resist

#

If you make Ferro SpDef

#

You don;t a dedicated Dark type

#

To check Pult

warped venture
#

The idea isn't priming one up to sweep, it's the fact that they overcome one of Rain's biggest hurdles, while Barraskewda can generally hold its own VS Most offensive teams in many cases.

#

Also I don't think you can ever really feel comfortable with Sp. Def Ferro in this meta, esp when it's Eject on Rain, as even with Sp. Def investment, Ferro tends to not do so hot against most Special Attackers bar Lele, Fini, and Koko, (one of which you already essentially forego consistently beating if you're dropping Power Whip anyway) and makes dealing with Weavile a lot more difficult than it normally would be, so idk about that.

#

If I do drop Gmolt, Volcan is definitely something to consider though, esp for the Rain mirror.

tribal smelt
#

Yeah

#

I would personally run something with a scarf on Zapdos Thunderus in SS

#

Its' an old core that does have some credence in SS

#

Maybe make Thunderus scarf as another way of coping with the speed issues

prisma heron
#

Yeah even G Molt + Thundy do exactly the same thing

#

NP and break, but RKed by Offense

tribal smelt
#

One smashes through BO/Balance one smashes past stall is the big difference there

#

So having both means that the offense weakness is like. three times worse lol

warped venture
#

Leaning more to Shifu though.

tribal smelt
#

I do like the idea of Zapdos/Gmolt (has been tested but usually falters since people think they can make rain HO work) or Zapdos/Thunderus ("i have twice the zapdos!")

#

All 3 in 1 team feels weird and is pretty brainstorm-y

#

You can probably get away with say Skewda Scarf Shifu Thunderus Zapdos Ferro Pelli as your offense...?

warped venture
tribal smelt
#

Actually scarf shifu Gmolt ferro Zapdos Skewda Zapdos Pelli sounds neat

#

You have one really surefire way of snapping balance while having priority on Offense at the cost of some stall breaking

warped venture
#

It does but that means no Elec immune which is
kind of worrying for Rain.

#

I don't like Seismi, but I know it's used out of necesscity for the elec immune bc Rain is so deperate to fit one.

tribal smelt
#

Yeh so you break one of the principles in SS for some better match up fishing

warped venture
#

But I guess that's just my way of saying I want to try to do Rain in a different way but still wanna stick in some kind of boundaries lol.

tribal smelt
#

I do think an alright option for some of the sillier rain teams might be Swampert as a flip turning rocker

#

You entirely grief your volcanion match up just to make the team gel better

solid cradle
warped venture
solid cradle
#

I do also think it might be good to drop a bird for sand echoing the rest but I think if you think the mu is playable I wouldn’t be super worried

warped venture
#

I could definitely go for a variation with Gmolt though.

#

As I did end up going the ThundyShifu Route

#

To be frank I could just make a variation of all three, MoltZap, ThundyShifu, and all Three.

#

and decide what type of player I wanna ruin the day of lol.

#

Seismi is an ugly fit as always, but I really do not feel comfortable dropping an Elec immune here.

#

I could potentially make Seismi phys to lure and surprise stuff like Blobs to make Zap and Gmolt way more threatening, but idt that's worth when Phys is walled by even more stuff than Special is.

#

A weird tech I could also try is Focus Punch Mixed Seismi? But that's probs way too overkill and honestly atp going Phys would be less commital.

vast oracle
# prisma heron SM OU https://pokepast.es/d0eec461772e9bad

seems alright, though team looks like it gets trampled by offenses pretty badly since everyone bar gren is slow af (especially cause ferro + fini + tran teams gets blown away by kart, which outspeeds all 5) and nothing on the team can immediately threaten or pressure out mlati@s. I'd go with agren + scarf lando over scarf gren + defensive lando. agren in general works well with your heatran too, and with spikes you can force the opponent to defog instead

prisma heron
#

Also would U-Turn be better on Ash-Gren? While Spikes are always broken, I would be defoging a lot as it is since Zard needs excessive Hazard removal

#

So I won't get much mileage from Spikes

#

Actually I do have Grassium Tran for luring Fini and Rotom-W

#

So I don't need Gunk on Gren

vast oracle
#

personally still prefer spikes cause between uturn lando + fini's terrain to let zardx come in on passive mons, it gets enough ways of entry

#

but u can still try uturn and get mileage out of it for sure, uturn out of bulky grasses for zardx + heatran

#

plus spikes agren tends to be used to punish switches in general instead of like going for a hazard-stacking build

prisma heron
#

M Sabyele is unbreakable here

#

Especially if its on lead

#

Also I think Zone can be removed since Steels lack recovery and can be worn down by Weavile and MLatios(Except MScizor and Skarm - latter doesn't handle MLatios well as it is, so only MScizor becomes a problem without Zone)

prisma heron
#

Is Z Kart a good Idea?

#

Fightium seems best to lure MScizor and other Steels that don't care about MLatios's EQ

vast oracle
# prisma heron Also I think Zone can be removed since Steels lack recovery and can be worn down...

this is true if you're running HOs that can keep up crazy amount of offensive pressure that the steels get overwhelmed quickly, or stall to just not care and outlive them (even balances/fats still run zone to help CM mlati and SD glisc, especially scarf variants to cheat on the kart check). Your build does neither, especially cause mlatios lacks the wallbreaking power for it, so removing the steels immediately is nice. and yea msciz being hard to break otherwise, and even celesteela can get annoying too cause it clicks leech pretty freely

vast oracle
# prisma heron Is Z Kart a good Idea?

you can try, but i personally hate running kart on ferro builds (90% of all my kart teams have sd z lando or heatran as their rocker lol), and it doesnt fix your lead msab issue either

#

i'd personally drop weavile and run another wallbreaker, cause you techically dont need the pursuit support here

#

you can opt for lele, similar to z0m's psyspam core

image.png
#

or even cmlo clef

#

both also work well with zone in general and turn msab teams into food

#

can even drop CM on clef too for rocks so ferro can run spikes, especially cause you can hazard stack and trade spikes with how rigid is your team is against spikes

#

with the lack of weavile, make mlati ice beam over draco for your glisc answer, defog + punishment over edge + boom on lando as your CM reuni and mlati answer, pain split + lefties over defog + berry on rotomw to annoy chansey better, and knock over gyro on ferro to cripple the steels

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

worn tiger
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

obtuse prairie
#

looks decent from a glance, any problems encountered

obtuse prairie
#

oh yea mmaw did catch my eye as a pain

flint ridge
#

una clef looks random

warped venture
#

AV Volcan is an interesting idea, but ultimately idt it's worth it with how much more limiting it feels compared to Boots or even Specs.

#

I don't think it should be very difficult to spin this into a somewhat decent Offense/HO if the main concept was KokoLucha.

#

Zera spreads + movepool, and Scarf Pult are also just blegh.
There's way better sets the two could be running.

tribal smelt
#

The core mons in and of themselves are not like, bad per se

#

A lot of this comes down to fixing the sets items etc and making it more concise

warped venture
#

The only mon that's really making it look weird to me is the Random Lucha, which I can only assume was the original idea, otherwise it could be made into a pretty standard BO (though if it's keeping Lucha it wouldn't be that hard to spin either ig).

tribal smelt
#

Team does sort of want a defogger

worn tiger
#

Maybe i can give drain punch instead of close combat

#

And replace roost with another move

#

For lucha

#

I actually using inteleon with specs instead of volcanion but inteleon is kinda breakable

#

Also sorry for my bad english

worn tiger
#

?

#

İ use landorus for Just stealth rock landorus is not very important for me

tribal smelt
#

And trying to fit a rocker here feels sort of weird

#

You could try to go Ferro -> Volcanion to free up space

#

Rocks, Knock off, leech seed, power whip

#

Or heatran, rocks, magma storm, toxic, earth power

worn tiger
#

With inteleon

tribal smelt
#

Nah, your team does need a rocker. I could see why you want that but on Lucha/Koko teams most people prefer to do Landorus therian as a defog user with another stealth rocker

#

So aim to find a stealth rock user that you like and gels with the team

worn tiger
#

What is rocker

#

Stealth rocker?

tribal smelt
#

Yes

worn tiger
#

Discard stealth rock from landorus and add defog

#

İ dont like ferro so much

#

Heatran is okay for stealth rock and some damage

#

Which pokemon i discard from the team and add heatran instead of @tribal smelt

#

Volcanion?

tribal smelt
#

Volcanion imo

worn tiger
#

İ try

#

Dragapult is okay with scarf or maybe choice band @tribal smelt

#

Sorry i give vest for draga

#

İ forgot

tribal smelt
#

Do choice specs as the Dragapult

#

Shadow Ball invested does a lot of damage

warped venture
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

warped venture
#

Mandi's a weird fit, and Buzz is sort of just there as backup since Mandi I feel like is too easily overwhelmed in a majority of cases with all the things it's usually tasked with checking.

#

I'm still torn between Rocks Ferro + Dtail EQ Tect Toxic Chomp, and just going Hstack.

#

Mostly because I feel like when Garchomp is free from the burden of running Rocks, it becomes a lot nicer to use and in general is a lot easier to get mileage out of with Dtail being such a game changer against stuff like Volc, Zap, and Balloon Heatran.

flint ridge
#

wb sd chomp here

#

u kinda lack offensive pressure for a bo

warped venture
#

wb?

#

Sorry I have no idea what that means lol

flint ridge
#

what about

warped venture
#

is Chomp really that cracked of a Heatran check that Tank is just a suggestion?

flint ridge
#

it’s a check yeah