VGC Rates

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[fresh flicker]

it then proceeds to get demolished by Urshifu and literally everything else

[frosty wadi]

https://pokepast.es/1b486c82a38c4333 how does this gdon team look, i like fast gdon to pair with flutter, the flutter lives caly-s after tera and mienshao helps with a lot of matchups like the caly-i MU, etc. i think incin and amoong are must have (max spdef amoong to always live specs mirai and help with caly-i MU+ turbo incin with will o to also help vs caly-i, raging bolt here is for caly-s mainly and kyogre while flutter is just good, the gdon set ohkos mirai and the incin set lives +2 tfairy dkiss from caly-s+amoong lives hhp - >>> lance (if u tera) + the only bad MU's are like lunala, lugia, ray and palkia (mirai/korai are bad MU's but like 55/45 for them and zama can be annoying but just burn it)

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[jovial creek]

You could consider going ogerpon hearthflame over amoon/incin

[frosty wadi]

what MU would that help with?

and u mean follow me right

[jovial creek]

It's just a very strong attacker

Pairs well with sun

Also tera steel amoon on sun seems like anti synergy

[frosty wadi]

to resist mirai draco

generally it's for mirai

[jovial creek]

wouldn't tera fairy be better

[frosty wadi]

also for ursh+torn

lives an ursh surging strikes in rain into another when u tera+bleakeind

so like t1 ursh strikes into it +rain dance

into i tera steel and live ursh strikes into bleakwind

[wraith lake]

urshifu isn't real if i don't think about it

[sterile flame]

https://pokepast.es/671acd1c2b38a5d6 mods hear me out on this one

I've also been thinking of running zamazenta instead since it could benefit off of coaching boosts a lot more but I'm not sure what pairs well with zama

also shi my b i forgot the 2 clear amulets

mystic water instead on quid

[vapid cape]

https://pokepast.es/2fb219da59767c40 This is all fully made aside from EV spreads which I'm editing as I play. Thoughts?

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[rotund fossil]

https://pokepast.es/a0d4633b49c5b0c9
Trying out a koraidon team, been struggling with caly S so moving over to the physical side!

[astral osprey]

https://pokepast.es/4184f56f81740bc1 what does everyone think about this zapdos galar team

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[wild sinew]

Tornadus is weird, Covert Cloak Rain Dance is invaluable on a Kyogre team.

Not sure if Heatran brings enough value Incineroar wouldn't here. Also allows you to run the better Wide Lens Tsareena.

[vapid cape]

Taunt was there to stop Trick Room teams that aren't next to a Tsareena or Farigaraf, as well as to shut down teams that commonly run Amoongus, like Caly I and Zamazenta, and Heatrans whole job is to trap restricteds it can't deal with such as Ho Oh, Lugia, Palkia, etc, and then Earth Power to deal with the likes of Miraidon, Zacian and Zama, etc.
I was thinking of running either grip claw or binding band over wide Lens to give the lens back to Tsareena.
So should I swap out Taunt for RainDance?

[wild sinew]

The idea of Covert Cloak is that you can drop Protect and not fear Fake Out.

Trapping those doesn't look like a priority considering your team, just a bit slow with poor damage output under rain, Incin can at least be an Intimidate and Fake Out pivot.

[vapid cape]

I guess not, yeah. It was mainly because it seemed really strong when the only threatening restricted I couldn't trap to get good positioning on was CalyS

I did also drop Bolt for Bronzong because I was getting cooked by Calyrex Ice teams

[rapid oak]

https://pokepast.es/04822944a28bdb9a

any advice for the last mon? I want this team to have a more diverse plan, meaning that it won't have to fully rely on rain to win. I was thinking of mons that have fighting and fairy coverage, but I am low on ideas

Also I’m also left and right on which direction I wanna take this team to:

Either balanced or hyper offensive

EV’s are definitely not finalized, especially for Kyogre

[trail quarry]

u need an intimidate user

go for landorus t or inc or incineroar

if up to me i would go for lando t for ur team

also go for choice specs kyogre rather than assault vest

and @rapid oak

make regieleki ice and give tera blast

instead of smthng liek electroweb or protect

[rapid oak]

Lando T sounds more fun than incineroar so imma try that

Also I dislike the choice items. Also I was experimenting with kyogre AV cuz I wanna abuse the fact that it’s really tanky, yet do a shit ton of damage

[trail quarry]

with choice specs

• water spout

ur guranteed to 1 shot most of the times

ull be dealign 225 damage

[rapid oak]

Yeah true

[trail quarry]

with choice specs water spout

[rapid oak]

Just not a fan of choice items

[trail quarry]

a p good gamble

since ur gonna be pivoting in n out in vgc a fair amount of times

specs kyogre will dominate

and when an electric type comes in switch to lando t

u turn and kyogre again

[rapid oak]

Aight I’ll experiment around. Thx

[trail quarry]

@rapid oak

u lack support pokemon

u have 0 fake out users

u dont need 2 spas

[rapid oak]

Yeah that’s what I meant about which direction I wanna take the team with

[trail quarry]

replace chi yu with incineroar

as support

[rapid oak]

Idk if I wanna go hyper offensive for more versatility or moreso balanced

[trail quarry]

hyper offensive

is really bad in vgc

[rapid oak]

Cuz I don’t wanna solely rely on just rain to win

[trail quarry]

i suggest u

[rapid oak]

Makes the gameplan too 1 dimensional to me

[trail quarry]

to get clefairy

with an eeviolite

give him moves

like follow me helping hand protect after you

[rapid oak]

How’s ogrepon water normally in kyogre teams?

[trail quarry]

a drizzle + helping hand + choice specs water spout kyogre will be op trust me

[trail quarry]

no need for it

ogerpon is bad in reg g

[rapid oak]

Ok

[trail quarry]

if u need a sample team to get an idea from

ill send u my balance team

[rapid oak]

I’m good thx

I been using YouTube

[trail quarry]

https://pokepast.es/e4db1d4391daa8e4

[rapid oak]

https://pokepast.es/c97dcba1796996f8

https://pokepast.es/b98930e65c1e9529

Been testing both of these and liking them both. The top team (honestly the one I like better) I feel has a more diverse matchup and can perform well even without rain

The bottom team feels more rain-oriented, but easier to get kills and is easier to play. Might try out booster flutter mane over landorus

Any thoughts?

I also dislike teams that are too 1 dimensional (always centralizing on 1 specific condition/plan), so my goal is to make a fun kyogre + regieleki team that has a wide variety of gameplans (also I’m a bit new to reg g team building)

[rapid oak]

This actually helped. Appreciate it

[jovial creek]

One plan is fine in a restricted format because the restricted is your plan

[rotund crown]

am I cooking or did I burn up the kitchen? after miraidon's success I kinda wanted to try it then based this team around the one that won the regional

still gonna get into EVs and tera for the last 2 mons but I wanted to try some different stuff by running top and rhyperior

[rapid oak]

I get it but I don’t prefer it lmao

I love being non linear with my gameplan

Makes it way less telegraphed and harder to predict

Like I understand that most of the time I’m bringing kyogre

[jovial creek]

What do rhyperior and hitmontop do there

[rapid oak]

But like I don’t want every of my other mons to only support kyogre, ya know

[jovial creek]

You can definitely run other attackers

[rapid oak]

Yeah that’s why I was leaning more towards a non linear balanced team

I was gonna do hyper offensive first, but I realized that sounds more frail in this regulation

[rotund crown]

hitmontop was the best alternative I found for intimidate/fake out support since I wanted to try chi yu over incineroar for beads of ruin + miraidon

[jovial creek]

I'd say a good comp is kyogre arch torn prio blocker+2

Could go rapid strike

[rapid oak]

I was rocking with arch earlier

[jovial creek]

You don't need intim

[rapid oak]

But I realized that I didn’t wanna rely too much on rain

[rotund crown]

and then rhyperior over bloodmoon just because I like the mon I felt the team needed a better physical presence

[jovial creek]

Iron hands could give fake out and then bm is good

[rapid oak]

Or else archaludon crumbles unless it has enough def boosts

[rotund crown]

also feint into miraidon go brrrr sounds interesting

[rapid oak]

Hence why I’m trying out regieleki instead

That and I wanna use my favorite mons and regieleki is one of them

[rotund crown]

wouldnt double electric hurt tho

thats pretty much the main reason I didnt go hands

[jovial creek]

It's not ideal but groudon isn't too common

Miriadon nukes a lot of problems

[rapid oak]

https://pokepast.es/b21b77cc0437d5eb This is another variant I am currently experimenting with

Altho I despise incineroar, idk what else would work well lmao

[rotund crown]

good point

free quark drive as well

[jovial creek]

If you want to run FM then specs is probably better

[rotund crown]

also tera is a thing ig

[rapid oak]

Yeah prob will rock with that

I normally don’t prefer using choice items cuz I’m not a huge fan of being move locked

[rotund crown]

have barely played VGC since the start of reg F so I thought miraidon was gonna become more relevant after the tournament so ground types would end up more common

[rapid oak]

What would a good booster/fairy feather Flutter set be like?

Just curious

I just basically stole that flutter from Wolfe cuz I really like the concept behind the spreads

[jovial creek]

Probably booster special attack

Same thing as specs but different item

[rapid oak]

Interesting

Why no speed booster

I still gotta learn more on how to use flutter optimally

[jovial creek]

You already have speed control

[rapid oak]

Makes sense

[rapid oak]

Would you still recommend a calm mind setter with all this bulk?

[jovial creek]

Nah

I'd say go offensive

[rapid oak]

Or should I just go triple attack? (Most likely Moonblast, Shadow Ball, Dazz)

[jovial creek]

That

Dual stab gleam

[rapid oak]

Bet

I think I shouldn’t really worry about other flutters atm

Cuz I’ll have speed control by then (eleki or torn)

I just wish I don’t have to rely on Incineroar but ig it is what it is

[mighty cloak]

https://pokepast.es/a154e8e9fb1f67de
I just started and I wanted to know if this team is good 😊

[mint pilot]

https://pokepast.es/744609c1fd448541
how are we feeling this team? I found it from James Baek’s newest video and it looks interesting with some off-meta picks, how would it fair against the current meta?

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[mint pilot]

or if i wanted a bulky attacker would it just be better to go for zamazenta

[real cedar]

Raters will not rate teams that are not your own (assuming this is not some sort of recreation of the team ur talking about)

[tropic tinsel]

https://pokepast.es/3c3afe22b003da7c

Ducks

[willow glacier]

ah yes, Calyrex-Shadow, my favorite duck

your ream is hard divided into 3 trickroom mons, and 3 speedisgood

[tropic tinsel]

Caly should p be another restricted

[willow glacier]

also, ducklet, where?
best duck

[tropic tinsel]

Caly ice or smth

[willow glacier]

the other Caly would be better here tbh
was searching for the duck-most restricted tho

[tropic tinsel]

What set tho

[willow glacier]

Clear amulet for the plethora if intimidators, i think?

[tropic tinsel]

Level: 50
Ability: As One (Glastrier)
EVs: 252 HP / 196 Atk / 60 SpD
IVs: 0 Spe
Tera Type: Grass
Brave Nature
- Glacial Lance
- High Horsepower
- Trick Room
- Protect ```

This?

[willow glacier]

yea sure, sounds fine

[tropic tinsel]

Idk if i wanna run brave on soft tr tho

[willow glacier]

"brave"?

[tropic tinsel]

Nature

This isn't hard TR

[willow glacier]

oh, just noticed that xd
maybe just go neutral speed...
so you outspeed hard trickroom calyrex

and other hard trickroomers

[willow glacier]

trying really hard not to unduck your team

[tropic tinsel]

It's still 3 ducks

[willow glacier]

yup, cool ducks

sub optimal, but ducks are cool

[tropic tinsel]

I built Ducks bc vgc17

[willow glacier]

can you elaborate?

[willow glacier]

Quaquaval, where?

[rapid oak]

Question. How good is armarouge with farigiraf

Or is armarouge only really usable with indeedee

[distant stump]

Not really, biggest problem here are sets and synergy. What does Ursaluna do here? Its a slow Trick Room Pokemon, its just gonna get run over by faster stuffs.
Also, a lot of your sets are kinda wack, like Focus Sash on the famously bulky Raging Bolt or Impish on Hearthflame when its mostly a offensive threat

If your new I recommend taking teams from here https://cut-explorer.stalruth.dev/2024/regional-stockholm

[drifting onyx]

VGC (Gen 9)

• Metagame Discussion Thread
• C&C Reservation Thread
• VGCPastes Repository
• Discord
• Pokémon Showdown! Room

Overview

For more info, see this format's Dex page.

[distant stump]

Check out the dex page

[distant stump]

Its probably fine, but im not a big fan of Ho-Oh, I just dont really see the point

Probably best your gonna get for a Ho Oh team

[distant stump]

Golduck is unviable, and in general your team has little synergy

Ex running BM with no pokemon to block prio or hh boost it, calyrex shadow on a trick room team, pelipper where ostensibly nothing benefits from rain or wide guard

I dont really know where to go with it

[distant stump]

Yeah

in general dont use armarouge though

[rapid oak]

Figured

I simply wanna try to cook with mons I like and that aren’t way too overused (Incineroar…)

https://pokepast.es/61193c635f472f7f unfortunately its not that easy to get that privelege, but I am more than willing to look at suggestions

[distant stump]

You can definetly cook with mons that aren't used as much

But it takes experience to know what those mons are, and know that we will likely tell you not to use htem

[rapid oak]

yeah thats fair

[distant stump]

Like idt this will really work, I just dont see what armarouge provides to the team. If you find it fun tho who am I to stop you

[rapid oak]

I want a fun core for kyogre and regieleki that isnt way too telegraphed

like, not too heavily relying on a kyogre sweep

https://pokepast.es/6924f35c0b2fc1a6 This is another idea. I was thinking of too. Another fun core idea I had was kyogre regieleki chi-yu and tsareena/rillaboom

Just wish I was way better in team building in VGC, even after experimenting and concluding what weaknesses I need to cover

[mint pilot]

Do you know a better mon I could replace it with for the same role/archetype?

[jovial creek]

I think protect would be better over taunt on tsareena

I don't really see what eleki does there but if it works it works

[rapid oak]

I just personally like eleki lmao

I’m aware it’s not as optimal as someone like archaludon (very fun mon, but feels too rain reliant, which leads to my team being too predictable by my opponent)

[rapid oak]

Also why so

[jovial creek]

what does taunt do

[rapid oak]

Turns off support mons such as whimsicott, wide guard users like mienshao, etc.

It can even stop trick room if predicted correctly

I am indeed a taunt enthusiast

[rapid oak]

Also last night I was thinking that I might switch over completely to a miraidon team (I believe it’s meta but I love electric types the most, so I’ll suck it up) (and obviously after running some games with the kyogre teams)

Cuz I feel that I have several more options to build with it

[trail quarry]

tera ground on kyogre?

[rapid oak]

Nah

I just am now a believer in choice items

Cuz I finally had a long session in damage calcs while building my team

[viscid falcon]

Does eleki need max speed? I'm just curious

[rapid oak]

Tbh prob not

But better safe than sorry

[wraith lake]

if you plan on outspeeding scarf caly-s i think so

[frosty wadi]

fake mon

[nimble siren]

https://pokepast.es/d51ba3a1c9e728c3 can someone help me make my team better, it's reg g and I need it to be better

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[wild sinew]

I'd recommend trying out already proven teams before building your own

[nimble siren]

Oh, thank you for the tip

I would like to use terapagos, do you have any recommendations?

[wild sinew]

Oh yes
Choice Specs and Calm Mind are the two common Terapagos sets run, they avoid Life Orb because the recoil removes your own Tera Shell.

[north tree]

^

Keep in mind they play differently though

Calm mind plays slow and likes partners like amoonguss and incineroar

[nimble siren]

Ok

[north tree]

Specs plays fast

Chiyu is a common partner

And pokemon who can control speed like Tornadus and icy wind booster speed flutter mane

As well as pokemon like urshifu who take advantage of sun being removed by teraform zero

Urshifu rapid strike*

I'd recommend to look online

Labmaus is a good place and so is top cut explorer

You can filter for terapagos teams specifically

[nimble siren]

That sounds great, thank you for the tips

[river thunder]

I have created a rain team. I want to know if I need to add to/change anythinghttps://pokepast.es/0fa7c355268c59a9

[wild sinew]

This is good, id say the main issue is certain EV spreads

[river thunder]

Which ones?

[wild sinew]

Urshifu R and Tsareena

Urshifu needs Max speed this Regulation to outspeed Calyrex-Shadow with Scarf, and Tsareena is wasting EVs with 8 Spd and 48 speed. 12 + 44 or 4 + 52 would give you an extra stat point because of level 50.

[river thunder]

Alr

What EVs should I decrease to max urshifu's speed?

[wild sinew]

Probably special defense considering you'll have to sacrifice the calc anyway

[north tree]

What Luna said but also involve uturn on the urshifu moveset

It's a huge part of how scarf shifu plays

Replace ice spinner most likely

[wild sinew]

oops missed that

[river thunder]

K

[cedar plank]

https://pokepast.es/8962fb6d61bd5d95
no idea how to ev spread
also i'd like to keep aloraichu if possible

[viscid falcon]

u dont outspeed it tho

[wraith lake]

"i think so"

and yeah you underspeed by 30 if caly doesn't use a speed increasing nature

[languid thorn]

https://pokepast.es/57b7c8f75e3dd152

Not sure about the last pokemon I want to place to play mind games. The current team is pretty successful, Torkoal and Ogerpon lead to Chi Yu, Miraidon sweep. Against rain teams I would do Miraidon Iron Hands lead for Torkoal Chi Yu sweep.

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[rapid oak]

Farigiraf

Blocks priority and can set up trick room

[ruby acorn]

https://pokepast.es/a52f381be0d5e74a

[languid thorn]

good point

[inner pendant]

i have never touched vgc in my life but we ball https://pokepast.es/5a6869d8f906f49b

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[wild sinew]

Incineroar Rillaboom is probably the primary issue here, can't exactly pivot properly like the two want when you're playing Dondozo Tatsugiri. Would look into more offensive stuff, an option that comes to mind is Urshifu-S + Ogerpon-H, both pair well with Tornadus and Miraidon, appreciating speed control and removing annoying Pokemon like Caly-S and Rillaboom.

[inner pendant]

is 3 waters fine

idk how type stacking works in doubles

[wild sinew]

3 Waters is probably fine if you're using Dondozo Tatsugiri
But Urshifu-S is the dark one

[inner pendant]

oh rght

[teal jacinth]

Torn between these 2 versions of the same team. Open to being verbally eviscerated regarding them.

https://pokepast.es/a59e33e10790c806

https://pokepast.es/5829a97901e6a99e

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[teal jacinth]

Why.

[viscid falcon]

best tera type for caly ice?

[austere wasp]

Draco meteor is not worth it for draco reset

[austere wasp]

Grass/fire imo, fire to mostly dodge wow and grass for amoonguss / resist miraidon

[austere wasp]

White herb*

[north tree]

First one, AV hands > dengo and mystic water > CB on ursh.

Probably get some better spreads for chiyu, ursh and flutter though

[teal jacinth]

Can u explain the choice of Hands?

[teal jacinth]

Not sure what to do about flutter, but I cooked this: https://pokepast.es/addba2dabedd2be7

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[wanton abyss]

Thanks for sharing! This team looks strong. What’s your matchup into common TR teams?

[teal jacinth]

This version? Unsure, haven't faced one yet. (I'm assuming that's what Iron Hands is for.)
The farig version (if you scroll up to my post with 2 links)? OK enough. Skill issue on my part.

[wanton abyss]

Ok! On paper it’s dicey so lmk what practice yields

[teal jacinth]

I was also advised to find a better spread for Urshifu and flutter, so I lifted these from reg f
Urshifu-Rapid-Strike @ Mystic Water
Level: 50
Ability: Unseen Fist
EVs: 60 HP / 156 Atk / 20 Def / 196 SpD / 76 Spe
Tera Type: Water
Adamant Nature

• Surging Strikes
• Close Combat
• Detect
• Aqua Jet

Flutter Mane @ Booster Energy
Level: 50
Ability: Protosynthesis
EVs: 116 HP / 76 Def / 116 SpA / 4 SpD / 196 Spe
IVs: 0 Atk
Tera Type: Fairy
Modest Nature

• Moonblast
• Shadow Ball
• Dazzling Gleam
• Protect

[jovial creek]

This looks good but you can run Tera fire chi yu since you don't have a boosting item

[teal jacinth]

Parabolic Charge/discharge

[cedar plank]

https://pokepast.es/043de37af438e0bd
the koraidon/rilla mu is pretty tough atm

[teal jacinth]

U and me, both.

[trail quarry]

https://pokepast.es/5f73099407c5383f

[languid thorn]

https://pokepast.es/ef6cae262d3953a6 is there something better i could do with itemisation?

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[languid thorn]

Lucario assault vest mainly for revenge killing flutters but otherwise i lead with tera normal dnite and arcanine espeed

[sacred path]

https://pokepast.es/8e08e2d819d1a8c9

Cause I love Kyogre and the Galar birds

[rapid oak]

https://pokepast.es/2b662c9445152546 Tryna cook some unique sauce. I am now a perma miraidon player since the electric type is my favorite type, as well as the playstyle having way more non linear plays imo. Did I cook the secret sauce, or burn the kitchen?

[sacred path]

I mean... it looks like a pretty standard team to me

[rapid oak]

True lol I just based it from the Ursuluna variant except I used armarouge

And urshifu

[sacred path]

I'm interested in seeing how the arma may perform

Wanna go up against my kyogre team?

I'm sweeping with it lol

[rapid oak]

Sure

[sacred path]

Alright let me finish this battle first

[rapid oak]

Quickie ft3 then I gtg sleep

Bet

[sacred path]

Showdown user is just Awsometime

[rapid oak]

This you?

My name will be Kibou734

[sacred path]

There's no E

After the AW

[rapid oak]

Arma is one of my favorite mons

And used to be really good

[sacred path]

Good games!

[rapid oak]

I forgot you had Tera ground

GGs

Still a bit new-ish on how to pilot miraidon teams

[sacred path]

Parabolic charge is a weird chocie to me

[rapid oak]

But I like it, and I learned from our set

[sacred path]

You murder your teammates a lot

[rapid oak]

It’s weaker discharge but gain

[rapid oak]

Yeah i normally been using miraidon as a sweeper in the back

[sacred path]

Hmm

[rapid oak]

That or I use Tera ground farigiraf with it

[sacred path]

That's not how most ppl play it. He's considered a hyperoffense mon by most

[rapid oak]

I could just give miraidon a different item

[sacred path]

Choice specs is a lot of power

[rapid oak]

However specs Draco meteor one-shots caly-ice

[sacred path]

Anything not resisting it just dies lol

Yeah

[rapid oak]

Which I think is a poor MU

For miraidon

[sacred path]

Yeah cause it's a trick roomer

That oneshots

[rapid oak]

Again I’m a bit new to miraidon, so any advice you have?

If you know how to pilot those teams

[sacred path]

I don't, I run lugia and kyogre lol

[rapid oak]

Ah

Also I think arma armor cannon with life orb also ohko’s caly ice

[sacred path]

Ohh interesting

[rapid oak]

If that’s the case then I probably won’t need specs

Cuz being locked against ground types is a death sentence

[sacred path]

Yeah you have a check

Ground and lightning rod

Which is becoming mroe common now

[rapid oak]

I normally really dislike choice items

Only cuz they lock me to 1 move

[sacred path]

I love the risky but rewarding gameplay of it

If you play it right you just win the game in 2-3 water spouts loool

[sacred path]

I can't read that tbh

[rapid oak]

I moreso like to be less telegraphed with my teams and switch up on the go

[rapid oak]

It’s hard to get it all in 1 screenshot but pretty much 252 modest life orb arma 1 shots caly ice (252 hp and 252 atk)

[sacred path]

Oh nice

I mean it's your fav mon so it's nice you found a niche for it

[rapid oak]

It’s one of them yeah

My #1 favorite mon is Cinderace, who I’m trying to build a team around

But it feels very hard cuz unfortunately he sucks rn

[sacred path]

Yeah not happening lol

It's very cute

I actually jsut drew cinder yesterday

[rapid oak]

Nice nice

[sacred path]

What would you even use it as?

Utility?

[rapid oak]

A way worse chain pao

[sacred path]

Oh if that's all u got then yeah ur fucked lol

[rapid oak]

Adamant sash
-pyro ball
-acrobatics
-sucker punch
-protect

[sacred path]

Let me see if I can cook something up

[rapid oak]

Speaking of sash, do you think I should keep sash urshi-rapid?

I don’t wanna use scarf cuz I already have multiple ways of speed control

[sacred path]

Cinderace @ Focus Sash
Ability: Libero
Level: 50
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Coaching
• Super Fang
• Court Change
• Taunt

You can try running it as focus sash utility

Court change works on tailwind iirc

[sacred path]

Honestly I don't know much about urshifu. I think it's kind of a boring mon to use so I never use it lol

[rapid oak]

Fair

[sacred path]

Cinder also gets u-turn

[rapid oak]

I just like him cuz he breaks sash

[sacred path]

True

[rapid oak]

Mannn not cinder being a support mon

[sacred path]

Better than awkwardly trying to run it offense when there's a million better options for that

At least court change is unique

[rapid oak]

That’s the point

There are millions of better options than armarouge

That’s what winning with them makes it special lmao

It’s what we call “cooking”

😀

(Coping)

[sacred path]

I think you're taking the wrong approach

I don't tihnk you have to intentionally choose a worse set on your fav mon just to win with it and make it special lol

That's just dead weight

[rapid oak]

True

Yeah the offensive Cinderace revival from Sw/Sh is mostly dead

So Imma pursue with the armarouge route. It’s honestly perfect for me cuz it has one of my favorite mons in general and my new favorite dragon (miraidon cuz he’s electric and cute)

[sacred path]

It has decent support options

I'd try it out

[rapid oak]

Maybe maybe

[languid thorn]

https://pokepast.es/32910a013eef8d10 rain dance team with answer to sun

[sacred path]

Seems legit to me

[languid thorn]

Nice thing about Miraidon is that it kills Zama, Zacian, Kyogre etc without needing tera

https://pokepast.es/3f8f07b6891a7e40 my miraidon team, chip with double extremespeed, make em think its all physical damage, then overheat/draco

but definitely not as easy as piloting a rain dance team

[trail quarry]

U don't need a trick room wetter with miraidon

[trail quarry]

https://pokepast.es/a5319e0b88f73ec5 @wild sinew should i go for tornadus or rillaboom for my 6th pokemon? also can u suggest a landorus moveset

ive made this mvoeset for him rn

[wild sinew]

Tornadus

Personally wouldn't use Lando T on that team

[trail quarry]

who would u suggest then i was sending 2 intimiadate users in the starting that being lando t n incineroar

[wild sinew]

Tsareena is pretty good to complete your FWG core and protect Specs Kyogre from Fake Out and threatening priority

[trail quarry]

fwg?

[wild sinew]

Fire Water Grass

[trail quarry]

@wild sinew does rain dance boost kyogre's drizzle

[wild sinew]

It doesn't
But rain dance helps you override opposing weather

[trail quarry]

oh

what is tsareena used as

role

[wild sinew]

Offensive priority blocker

Power Whip Triple Axel stuff

[trail quarry]

ohh

[wild sinew]

Can use Taunt to shut down Trick Room

[trail quarry]

also final question, is this smearlge moveset fine?
i cant decide between decorate or helping hand and if i should add a redirecting move

[trail quarry]

taunt is on tornadus

[wild sinew]

Decorate is better than Helping Hand
You'll want Spiky Shield over Protect

[wild sinew]

But it doesn't work on Farigiraf

[trail quarry]

why

ohh

nvm

i dont understand why

taunt isnt priority

also @wild sinew should i give him fake out smeargle? or 2 fake outs is good enough

https://pokepast.es/8ce2f8d02bbe64b0

[wild sinew]

Prankster

[trail quarry]

doesnt farigraf have armor tail

[wild sinew]

Yes

[drifting onyx]

Armor Tail (Gen 9)

Priority moves used by opposing Pokemon targeting this Pokemon or its allies are prevented from having an effect.

[trail quarry]

then how prankster

[drifting onyx]

Prankster (Gen 9)

This Pokemon's non-damaging moves have their priority increased by 1. Opposing Dark-type Pokemon are immune to these moves, and any move called by these moves, if the resulting user of the move has this Ability.

[trail quarry]

ohh

yeah @wild sinew lando t aint working

my one choice is

farigraf

considering smeargle and iron hands r p slow

[torpid lagoon]

https://pokepast.es/c7c2f587338618ea

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[torpid lagoon]

I had so many wins

[sand minnow]

https://pokepast.es/9440e6f6108b9ae4
no spreads yet

need help with that

tho i want flutter to booster speed

[trail quarry]

not a well oriented team ngl

u have no speed control

no support

no prankster and intimidiate user

https://pokepast.es/96fbc65a147dee45

https://pokepast.es/09b158b3bcf02bd3

https://pokepast.es/db6759d224b0bf31

[teal jacinth]

Try whimsicott?

[rapid oak]

I like the option of both just in case they’re going too fast if my liking

Most miraidon teams I see have both TR and TW

[trail quarry]

there is no point

[balmy valley]

For the Kyogre team
drop Smeargle
put an item on Tsareena, drop Light Screen
Hands should be AV
Tornadus should have Rain Dance
Specs Kyogre should be Tera Water

[trail quarry]

AV?

[balmy valley]

sure

wait

no the Hands should be AV

[trail quarry]

what does av mean

[balmy valley]

Assault Vest

[trail quarry]

also why tera whater and rain dance tornadus

[balmy valley]

give it Wide Lens

[balmy valley]

Tera Water = nuke button
Rain Dance Torn lets you reset Rain vs Koraidon and Groudon

[trail quarry]

rain dance doesnt bosot kyogre on any way

ohh

item for tsareena? and what should i replace light screen w

[balmy valley]

Wide Lens

[rapid oak]

I was thinking about it too

[trail quarry]

and tera type?

[balmy valley]

or you can go Goggles on Incin and run Sitrus on Tsareena

Tera Type can be anything idk
Fire or Dragon probably work fine

[rapid oak]

Whether or not an encore setter is stronger than a weather changer

[balmy valley]

let me find something

[pliant horizon]

4

https://pokepast.es/ebc8de7c6e3dd2f5

[balmy valley]

Power Whip
Triple Axel
Helping Hand
Taunt / Protect / U-turn

[trail quarry]

i dont need helping hand

i already have

[balmy valley]

why not Helping Hand

[trail quarry]

decorate on smearlge

[balmy valley]

I did say drop Smeargle

[trail quarry]

i wanna stick with smearlge

[balmy valley]

put Archaludon on that slot or smth

[trail quarry]

i love him

[balmy valley]

or Urshifu

Smeargle teams usually run Ursaluna-BM

smeargle partners

[trail quarry]

yes ik

but

it requires a trick room setter

i have already tried

smearlge with ursaluna bm

and trick room

i didnt like him

[rare slate]

the lando feels a bit random and i feel like you rly want hearthflame to be doing big damage

[trail quarry]

i agree

lando doesnt fit in there

[rare slate]

I'd maybe consider farigiraf over lando as anti-tr, anti fake out, and helping hand support to just nuke everyone with your attackers

also gives you a bit more innate calys counterplay which never hurts

[pliant horizon]

alright

[rare slate]

I'd also basically always make korai clear amulet

[pliant horizon]

yeah i had tr in mind too

like if they get tr up i lose immediately

[rare slate]

maybe goggles tera water giraf to annoy calyi amoong a bit more

[rapid oak]

Also for flutter I’ll prob suggest either booster energy or sash, over life orb

[rare slate]

foul play tr helping hand tect

or imprison over tect

also yea cm flutter mane is not a thing

I'd recommend specs or sash here

[trail quarry]

does rain dance boost drizzle?

[rare slate]

booster with korai is somewhat redundant

[rare slate]

rain dance and drizzle are the same effect

[rapid oak]

No

[trail quarry]

but it will increase the no. of tursn for drizzle

[rare slate]

no

rain dance will fail if rain is active

[rapid oak]

^

Rain dance is just there to turn rain back on if a koraidon/groudon/torkoal switches in

[hidden path]

thoughts on stall?

[rare slate]

there's some silly builds you could try with eternatus or pressure ho-oh but they're uh

experimental

[hidden path]

i got to around 1450 once w stall lol

aint much but impressive for stall

[hidden path]

gotchu

[hidden path]

gimme a ho-oh build rq

or moves i could use

[rare slate]

pressure hooh should be sacred fire brave bird recover protect

i can find a full set soon

[hidden path]

k

thoughts on bringing decorate alcremie to help set up an offense and also prevent taunt

then again ig it doesnt have enough bulk

[rare slate]

i have a calyi team with iron ball alcremie, best use I've found for it

give calyi boosts and let it run wild

also denies sleep

[hidden path]

ye thats good ig

[rare slate]

so it's amoong cplay

[hidden path]

but restricted

i cant have 2 restricted

n i rlly like sacred fire on my mon

so uh

cant i js use regular caly?

[rare slate]

you should not be running ho-oh with alcremie

[hidden path]

true

[rare slate]

these are for two different teams

https://pokepast.es/3e29542212e654d4 this is my old alcremie team

[hidden path]

can i replace ho-oh with incineroar

[rare slate]

would probably remove the psyspam component now

maybe add a blood moon

[rare slate]

once again, just make two different teams

the ho-oh stall and the alcremie tr

[hidden path]

ye

i just cooked up something horrible 😭

its scary almost

ITS WORKINGGGGGGGGGGGG

[hidden path]

is chien pao a better partner for zamazenta or ting lu???

[sacred path]

https://pokepast.es/78812acd95c33330

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[sacred path]

Made some adjustments and put in Brute Bonnet. Huge amount of fun with this team.

[frosty wadi]

clear amulet is just better white herb

[teal jacinth]

Ok, but does it reset u after a meteor?

[frosty wadi]

no but if u get intimidated u wont get reset after a meteor either

or snarl but both items are bad

[wild sinew]

Icy Wind and Snarl are also incredibly common

Very few times where you can get the value from White Herb Draco Meteor, which is already not very big
Especially in ots

[jovial creek]

Amoonguss looks better there over bonnet

Helps into zamazenta

[sacred path]

That’s what I thought too, but with tailwind it can outspeed and sleep the zam anyway

I feel like the sucker punch and dark typing for caly and taunt immunity might be worth

Also it’s so hard for zam to play into kyogre already lol

[narrow dock]

https://pokepast.es/ee7ef05a3e4f5221
How's this team

[autumn wolf]

https://pokepast.es/9ed384e6c27379a1
not sure what i should as a 5th pokemon

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[autumn wolf]

*6th

[wild sinew]

Comfey Tsareena doesn't sit right with me on this team. They don't provide enough value

Urshifu-R is an excellent Tornadus partner and actually benefits from rain so would definitely use it
And Amoonguss can do the healing stuff while completing your FWG core and protecting against opposing Urshifu

[austere wasp]

pelipper might be cool for the 6th

[wild sinew]

Pelipper probably

Yeah

[austere wasp]

https://pokepast.es/530c7547f31fdc83

this team also has unique mons

I think it won a regional & top 8ed the other

^ its a recreation but it looks good!

[wild sinew]

I'm pretty sure it has two t8s

[austere wasp]

no it won 1 t8 1

wait unless

santiago idk

[wild sinew]

Won Stockholm yes
There was another Zama in t8 though

[languid thorn]

https://pokepast.es/6beb5b37815f7a43 speed is all you need

[hidden path]

https://pokepast.es/e79fa428c74cb36d

[hidden path]

one calyi and incineroar and its all over for u

ive been having trouble with calyi asw ;-;

anything i can replace for a counter?

[wild sinew]

If you want Wide Guard Zamazenta my suggestion would be to make it Tera Grass and the Latios Tera Steel

[hidden path]

ye i js made those changes

might replace primarina

any idea what i can replace jt with?

[wild sinew]

Tbh I'd say the weirdest mon on the team is Whimsicott

[hidden path]

thats true

js needed it to outspeed flutter n miraidon n stuff

[wild sinew]

Getting outsped by Flutter should be fine
And Rilla can help make up for the Miraidon match up

They usually run Tailwind anyway

[hidden path]

and can i replace primarina with anything?

[languid thorn]

252+ Atk Life Orb Scizor U-turn vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Calyrex-Ice: 229-273 (56.6 - 67.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Tera Normal Dragonite Fire Punch vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Calyrex-Ice: 192-228 (47.5 - 56.4%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO

[hidden path]

bro i saw u typing for 5 whole mins calculating that 😭

[languid thorn]

i dont have issues dealing with ice, cal-s is something more difficult to handle since i rely on espeed a lot

[wild sinew]

Pelipper or your own Flutter come to mind

[languid thorn]

Trick Room does not affect move priority

[hidden path]

dont really want weather on my team

[languid thorn]

so espeed etc still goes first even in trick room

[hidden path]

cuz then it either gets overridden

or doesnt benefit my team

ill do flutter for prima

and ill do rilla for whimsi

[languid thorn]

would koraidon+flutter be a problem

[trail quarry]

@wild sinew which team has better ev/iv spreads https://pokepast.es/fd8ca77cde007021 or https://pokepast.es/fd8ca77cde007021

[wild sinew]

May I ask what the difference is

[trail quarry]

oops

i sent the link same one twice

ima send the other one

mb

https://pokepast.es/44eba2921620d372 @wild sinew

[wild sinew]

I'd say the second is better

[trail quarry]

clef1 or clef2?

the one i sent 2nd or the one i sent 1st

[wild sinew]

The Clef you sent 1st

[trail quarry]

this one ok

thx

[trail quarry]

@wild sinew final ping sry to be annoying but confirming this 1 right

i have problem understanding stuf

[wild sinew]

Yes

[trail quarry]

ok tysm

[hidden path]

best restricted legendary rn?

or top 5

?

[lost phoenix]

Caly i zama calys mirai korai/turtle

[hidden path]

is lunala decent?

[lost phoenix]

Its ok

[hidden path]

any other good ones?

[lost phoenix]

I could list them but thats moreso a question for compgen

[hidden path]

nah like 2-3 others

[lost phoenix]

Kyogre zacc groudon

[hidden path]

k

[jovial creek]

It's a pretty good balance restricted

[lost phoenix]

https://pokepast.es/385a475cd9ee8785

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[lost phoenix]

kinda just want to know my moves on this r right

[north tree]

Flutter Mane, Koraidon and Armarouge seem to be doing what you would an expanding force Lunala to do.

Amoonguss doesn't fit when you already have indeedee.

Would recommend torkoal to be your tr spread move spammer so you team is now indeedee Lunala torkoal goltres. You can now put more tailroom mons, ursaluna regular with maximum speed investment may be a try and so could chiyu.

The team doesn't seem to have a very good sense of direction making it hard to fix. You have bulky tailwind support with a hard trick room and a hyperoffense sun mode with a balance staple.

[rapid oak]

Another armarouge player. Based

Also id try wide guard over protect for arma

Snarl can hurt the indeedee arma combo, and that move is quite common

[hidden path]

is necrozma dawn wings better or lunala?

like overall

[lost phoenix]

I dont think korai needs to be hyper offensive at all

[hidden path]

.

someone

[lost phoenix]

The basic idea with the team is that armadeedee helps against terad zama and helps against ho matchup, which are both quite annoying as a singular sash mon can ruin korais momentum

And then goltres is there to be a bulky restricted counter to check both calyrex formes and provide tailwind

[hidden path]

@lost phoenix ^

[lost phoenix]

Lunala is better

[hidden path]

k

[rapid oak]

How did meteor beam feel? Which matchups did it help with?

Normally I do the standard life orb set

[lost phoenix]

Its basically for peli and incin

[keen escarp]

Firstly, I would certainly try to fit a Wide Guard on Armarouge. Wide Guard is what made Moltres functional on that Zama team. It's simply too good into the format. Not to mention, the team struggle against Kyogre match up.

Like insertable said, Torkoal would be a nice additional here. Helps maintain control over the weather war while also serving as a TR sweeper. Makes your team more flexible.
Amoong slot feels weird here not gonna lie . Then again, you need to be wary of opposing spore users.

Hope this helped.

[lost phoenix]

How about hearthflame or cornerstone in amoong slot

I originally had wide guard over tect but

[keen escarp]

Hearthflame is strong. However, a means to reset the weather would come in handy imo

[lost phoenix]

Sure i can also run torkoal

[keen escarp]

Korai really needs that sun to function

[lost phoenix]

So that instead of amoong and its fine yea?

[keen escarp]

Imo test Torkoal

Yeah

[lost phoenix]

Ill try that ty

[keen escarp]

I'm not fully sold on Armarouge on this format tbh, but I can see its niche here

[lost phoenix]

Its cool against ho and zama as i said

Its felt decent so far

[keen escarp]

Yeah

[lost phoenix]

Thats why im inclined to keep it

[keen escarp]

Got it

Imo test Koal for now, see how it works

[rapid oak]

Makes sense. I assume meteor beam ohko’s incin right?

[lost phoenix]

Yes

[lost phoenix]

Ill try hearthflame and cornerstone if that doesnt work

[rapid oak]

An interesting theory I am testing out atm is to make arma’s speed at the 113 range, so that arma can also be a tailwind mon

So it can be more consistent to have 2 speed control modes in 1 team

[lost phoenix]

I made it 107 as thats the bare minimum to outspeed rillaboom

[rapid oak]

Ah I see

https://pokepast.es/be06895e24d02f15 this is what I’ve been experimenting with lately. Might replace expand force for meteor beam, cuz e.force was just there to abuse my opponent’s psychic terrain

Altho that never happened so far

[hidden path]

https://pokepast.es/13dcc0a104b26736

used a lot of niche things

storm drain to stop rapid strike n ogerpon wellspring

i keep heal pulsing lunala so it shadow shield keeps getting activated

gholdengos just there for doing dmg to calyi

[rapid oak]

It can indeed 1 shot caly ice with life orb armor cannon, and with +1 spa from meteor beam

[keen escarp]

That .. is interesting

[rapid oak]

Assuming ofc the arma is modest/quiet nature

[sacred path]

Kyogre

[frosty wadi]

kyogre is trash

[frosty wadi]

u can also do ursa-bm>armarouge (though thats boring i get it)

[pulsar rapids]

can anbody try out parting shot (or any stat owering move) vs a defiant PARTNER pokemon, woud like to know if that activated defiant or not bc it doesnt on showdown

[sacred path]

Tera water waterspout is still no joke

With specs

😎

[rapid oak]

I second this

As i was a past kyogre player and have faced kyogre b4

[sacred path]

I love my Kyogre Whimsicott team

It feels so fun to just click water spout and delete things

[frosty wadi]

fake out:

its not reliable enough except its prob the best archetype on low ladder just bc u spam moves as well as caly-s

[sacred path]

My kyogre team is the first time I’ve been above 1400 lol

So maybe you’re right maybe it’s just a noob stomper

[rapid oak]

Simply play tsareena

[balmy valley]

It does not activate
Defiant only procs vs opponents dropping your stats

[rapid oak]

Or farigiraf

Problem solved

[sacred path]

True

My team is pretty stacked tho

Maybe I should get rid of Molt Galar

[pulsar rapids]

thx

[sacred path]

What are people running on tsareena?

Just damage?

[rapid oak]

Or you can play indeedee and have a trick room mode

As well as a terrain changer

[sacred path]

I like my tailwind team more

All my mons speed EVs are tailored to outspeeding key mins under tailwind

[rapid oak]

Typically wide lens with:

Power whip
Triple axel
Helping hand
Taunt/u-turn/protect

[sacred path]

Would much rather just put in a Tsar

Thx

That works out cause my moltres is usually a taunt mon anyway

[rapid oak]

Yeah

Also I think at least 160 atk EV adamant tsar is enough to OHKO Kyogre

[sacred path]

Not mine it’s got a lot of HP

[frosty wadi]

2 teams i hit high with (1650 or so +) were psyspam and ursa cress which are pretty cheese teams asw, just its all about incorporating the right mons (giga impact dnite/gastro on ursa cress) and triple fighting on psyspam (ursh-dark, hands, sneasler+sylv)

[ashen monolith]

https://pokepast.es/ffb9fe63fcb5c866

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[ashen monolith]

hey uhh ping me when you get a chance to take a look at it

this team is really based around landorus and miraidon

and my trick room checks are taunt tornadus and urshifu

[sand minnow]

https://pokepast.es/7ce66001aef36bc7 so theres this fun game I wanted to do with friends where we would only using pokemon whos first letter matches that of our username.

any tips on how to improve it

[distant stump]

If your rly want to run Lando-T I'd go Band

The damage is needed

Your team doesen't look like it ahs much synergy with Miraidon

Apart from Raichu which is really mid

[distant stump]

I dont think this is the place to ask for that advice

But not including Dragonite/Dragapult is crazy

[ashen monolith]

how can i fix this

[distant stump]

Im not really sure

I'd add at least a Farigiraf and go sash fu

That can win games I think

[sand minnow]

I should also ask, is there a way to somehow fit those pokemon onto the team properly

[distant stump]

Probably axe dipllin and dedene

[ashen monolith]

ok what should i swap it for

[hidden path]

.

[keen escarp]

Alright so, after taking a look I got a few things;

• The team seems to have some major issues into CalyS offense teams. Yes, Bloodmoon and Indeedee can be immune to Astral Barrage, however they could also be running Expanding Force or carry a Mienshao or Urshifu with them which can pin you.
• Opposing Incineroar. Meteor Beam isn't enough to deal with it. It's a one-off attack. Having both indeedee and Lunala Tera-Psychic just stacks weaknesses.

Now onto some changes I would suggest so you can better handle some of the matchups:

• Tera Fairy Lunala. I get Tera-Psychic hits very hard, but you are still reliant on Terrain and there are sufficient viable dark types going around. Not to mention, Lunala doesn't have Protect so it's a sitting duck vs Dark and Ghost types.
• Fit a Wide Guard on Lunala imo. Helps tremendously against the horses and Kyogre.
• Would replace a move on Gastrodon to run Yawn. It's very good to pressure your opponent to switch out. Maybe even run Icy Wind. imo, you don't really need Muddy Water.
• Tera Normal on Ursaluna. It's entire major value comes in it's Mind's Eye and normal moves. Buff it. You will be using Hyper Voice and Blood Moon far more than EP. Besides, Normal is better typing for CalyS.
• Maybe run Safety Goggles on Inci or Indeedee. Expanding Force isn't reliable enough in all cases. Especially if they can pin Lunala with SE pressure.

Hope this helps!

[hidden path]

ye i wanted to ged rid of power herb js felt like i had to go along w the meta

or what everyones using

[keen escarp]

Power herb is good imo, you just need to make sure thats not your only way to tackle inci

[hidden path]

any idea on what moves j can replace it with?

[keen escarp]

Boosted Lunala hits hard

[hidden path]

like..

booster enegry

?

energy*

@keen escarp

[keen escarp]

Typod lol

Meant to say Boosted

[hidden path]

ah

i thought there was some tech w booster energy

also, @keen escarp . Would tr lunala do better or a tw lunala?

cuz lunala has pretty good speed and i get more options for partners if im using tw

[keen escarp]

In your current 6, TR imo

If you are changing partners, you can run TW. But I think TR is better since it helps you compete against opposing TW teams

[hidden path]

nah like

replace the teammates

[keen escarp]

Even then, I think TR gives the team some flexibility

Over TW

[hidden path]

what are some miraidon counters?

or smth that walls it

oh wait acc

[keen escarp]

Ehh, Tera fairy Raichu or Pachirisu? Those hard wall Mirai lol. Jokes aside, Hands is good into Mirai. Terrain control in general works well. TR can work very well into Mirai provided you don't get encore'd. Juggling fairy and ground types can mess up what moves Mirai locks into

[trail quarry]

which grimmsnarl team is better?

https://pokepast.es/98288e37859337c3

https://pokepast.es/a6bffafa2d3b8ad1

https://pokepast.es/a8884ac98dd286de

[hidden path]

ight

ima make a team w that in mind

would tr imprison work?

stops other tr teams

[keen escarp]

On which mon?

[hidden path]

scream tail

[keen escarp]

And depends on the team

[hidden path]

k i gtg lemme send it rq

[keen escarp]

What kinda team you cooking

[hidden path]

https://pokepast.es/b3a02e4c58eda894

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[keen escarp]

I wouldn't recommend Imprison on this team tbh. You are capable of functioning in TR, and certainly not on Scream Tail. Scream Tail has much better uses than function as a imprison user. And honestly, I'm not sure it even fits this team.

I would run either Wide Guard on Lunala, or run a Pelipper for better sun match up. For Lunala, you could work with Calm Mind safety goggles set with Tera Fairy. And for the last slot, maybe run Urshifu > Scream Tail. Just an idea you can work with. Even Amoong maybe.

[trail quarry]

????

[north tree]

choose one for us to rate

we usually don't do "is x team better"

[trail quarry]

uhh can u rate al l3 of them

[north tree]

• Covert cloak on terapagos as this can prevent fake out and allow to be more flexible in setting up

• Amoonguss should run a different tera to grass as you're almost never wanting amoonguss to be a pure grass type. Water, dark and fairy are much better typings.

• Protect > snarl on raging bolt, it isn't an assault vest variant so protect is valuable.

The team seems very passive apart from the terapagos and perhaps the raging bolt and plays extremely linearly, try putting up a secondary sweeper.

[north tree]

Same as the last rate, but scarf urshifu is an improvement over raging bolt so your offense may be passable.

[trail quarry]

ok so urshifu scarf team > raging bolt one right

what about the flutter mane on

[north tree]

Same as the first rate, but Flutter Mane being even more support makes the team extremely passive and setup reliant

[trail quarry]

so flutter mane variant is the best one ?

[north tree]

No, worst one

[trail quarry]

urshifu best one?

[north tree]

Urshifu > Bolt > Flutter

yes

[trail quarry]

ok

thx

[north tree]

You may also want to reconsider grimm itself as the incin rilla shifu core combined with amoonguss leaves little room to take advantage of screens

perhaps the raging bolt replace grimmsnarl

[trail quarry]

hmm

what should the raging bolt set be

energy drive? since rillaboom is assault vest

[north tree]

Yes, the same set you used on team 1

[trail quarry]

ho

oh

[hidden path]

wait

why do i have heal order on my scream tail 😭

[keen escarp]

idk LOL

[hidden path]

when i was checking if it had a heal move

like every heal move popped up

so i decided to go for heal order

like the 'illegal' label didnt show up

AND FOUL PLAY 😭

[trail quarry]

@north tree can i use this team with caly-s instead of terapagos?

[north tree]

perfectly well

[trail quarry]

it wont do well in grimmsnarl teams right?

caly-s

[snow star]

What teams would y'all cook to play competitive.

[north tree]

#comp-general

[trail quarry]

for vgc cal-s teams

cal-s = best restricted

[narrow dock]

https://pokepast.es/bb42a32989bd4dbf how's this team

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[snow star]

https://pokepast.es/9e041972c254efb7 this is my first VGC team!!

[snow star]

oh I forgot something

https://pokepast.es/e6ed62118e1d8b02 that's better

[snow star]

Any suggestions would be cool!

[north tree]

I would reccomend you use samples before building your own team to get an idea of how certain good pokemon play. If you want a detailed breakdown, ping me again.

[snow star]

@north tree Cool can you help me?

[pine current]

https://pokepast.es/9560856988b7f15f

[distant stump]

The problem here is that most of the mons here are just unviable

Your putting yourself at a massive disadvantage using lucario, goodra, and gyratina

they are just kinda worse than everything else

[distant stump]

This is probably fine

Stacking Incin/Hearthflame doesen't feel great but its probably okay

[pine current]

any suggestions to replace hearthflame?

[keen escarp]

Like Choruto above mentioned, a very fine team. A few changes I would recommend for optimization:

• Flame Charge > Wild Charge on Korai. Wild Charge is too situational and oftentimes, Collision and Flare Blitz does the job. Flame Charge, on the other hand, helps you outspeed CalyS after 1 usage, which is huge.

• I would try Volt Switch on Raging Bolt over Thunderbolt. Pelipper usage is high and regaining weather control is important, and having a pivot that checks Pelipper is very good.

• You could try Gholdengo or Sunny Day Tornadus in the Hearthflame slot. Gholdengo with Incineroar does very well into CalyI Pelipper teams, and having access to Bolt means you can pin their Urshifu-R. Sunny Day Torn sets up manual weather to bypass Rain switch ins, and gives you speed control to compete against opposing Tailwind teams.

• Will-O-Wisp > Flare Blitz on Incineroar. Helps tremendously in CalyI, Zama and Zacian matchups.

• (Optional) Rillaboom > Chien-Pao. The way the team is right now, you could struggle badly against the popular Mirai + Whimsi composition. Having a Rillaboom further helps Gholdengo set up Nasty Plots, and helps in the terrain war against Miraidon. While Ice Spinner works, there is more risk in using Chien due to it's frailty, which is why I mentioned this change as optional.

Hope this helps, good luck!

[red grotto]

https://pokepast.es/e19947c4f529bef3

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[red grotto]

mirai + whims has been kind of annoying

not sure if that's just a kyo thing tho

[pine current]

instead of rillaboom , would whimsicott work I was thinking of a whimsicott farigarif core after

[keen escarp]

If you add whimsi, the only mon outspeeding their Mirai in tailwind mirror would be your Flutter in Sun

Not sure if that's enough. Mirai still ohko's most of your team

[keen escarp]

Mirai is just that strong. Even if you have rilla, they deal too much damage. Team actually looks fine. A lando-I could help you a lot vs Mirai if they lock into Elec moves

[lost phoenix]

this team would appreciate av rilla lando i and jugulis

av rilla and lando help with mirai

jugulis helps with calys

[languid thorn]

kyogre with choice scarf outspeeds choice specs miraidon

[lost phoenix]

scarf kyogre is not good

mystic water and av are the good sets

[languid thorn]

tera grass + water spout kyogre can eliminate miraidon

[keen escarp]

I wouldn't say 'eliminate' is the right word

Mirai comfortable tanks a spout

[lost phoenix]

if u really wanna anti mirai you go tera grass av

[keen escarp]

And can draco it

[lost phoenix]

take like 10 from electro drift

[languid thorn]

not if it gets locked into a specs drift

[keen escarp]

Even Tera grass AV gets ohko'd by HH draco in elec terrain iirc

[languid thorn]

dies the next round so it has to switch

[lost phoenix]

u have a rilla thats fine

[keen escarp]

Yeah, fair

[lost phoenix]

and u would have a snarl jugulis

with the changes i mentioned

[languid thorn]

252 SpA Choice Specs Hadron Engine Miraidon Draco Meteor vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Tera Grass Kyogre: 327-385 (81.5 - 96%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

[lost phoenix]

hhand av etc

[languid thorn]

252 SpA Choice Specs Hadron Engine Miraidon Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tera Grass Kyogre: 327-385 (95.8 - 112.9%) -- 75% chance to OHKO

[keen escarp]

Depends on the spread, yeah

[languid thorn]

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tera Grass Kyogre Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Miraidon: 318-376 (93.2 - 110.2%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO

really hard to say if you want to draco a kyogre tbrh

especially when there's follow me well spring ogrepon

[keen escarp]

They might just discharge

If there is a redirection

[languid thorn]

252 SpA Choice Specs Hadron Engine Miraidon Discharge vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tera Grass Kyogre in Electric Terrain: 131-154 (38.4 - 45.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

best choice is probably to volt switch

pivot miraidon

[keen escarp]

VS into Hands maybe

[languid thorn]

yep, or rillaboom

[north tree]

• Giratina Origin is worse than most restricteds and in fact is worse than the Flutter Mane on your team.

• Incineroar should run Knock off over Darkest Lariat, Darkest Lariat has damage yes but the utility of knock off far surpasses the difference in damage.

• Lucario is unfortunately unviable, especially in the direction you took which makes it outclassed by Pokemon such as Urshifu.

• Flutter Mane's set is incredibly off, you don't run four coverage moves especially on speed booster. Speed Booster flutter tends to play by supporting the team with Icy Wind, Moonblast for strong single target damage and then a choice of shadow ball, dazzling gleam of taunt. Use a dex spread and tera fairy for it.

• Hisuian Goodra is just a free slot, something like Assault Vest Raging Bolt can take it's place.

https://pokepast.es/c1ff33841b101065
This would be a slightly improved version of the team, though this changes a lot.

[trail quarry]

https://pokepast.es/7e65fee972329bdb

@rare slate done 👍

[north tree]

Dragapult and Flutter Mane are rather unorthodox picks, can you explain their reasoning?

[trail quarry]

dragpault i love him so i used him i saw eve use flutter mane so i said why not

[north tree]

I think if you want to run dragapult you run into three problems: Flutter Mane under sun, sucker punches and astral barrage

astral barrage you have zama for, but priority I think you can replace flutter mane for Farigiraf or Ogerpon-wellspring

the former provides anti tr and speed control vs tailwind teams and the latter makes the balance core even stronger

[trail quarry]

could you please fix the team for me if it is only 1 problem?

idk i efel like ill mess it up

[north tree]

just look up the dex set for ogerpon-w or farigiraf

and then replace flutter with that mon with that set

[trail quarry]

which one would u prefer

[north tree]

farigiraf seems better

[trail quarry]

also wdym by former

[north tree]

first, I said Farigiraf first so I wanted to clarify that I was talking about Farigiraf as anti tr + speed control

Farigiraf also blocks priority

[trail quarry]

yes

armor tail

[trail quarry]

should i run a trick room set on him?

what r the advantages of ogerpon wellspring though? sry m kinda dumb

[north tree]

Ogerpon-wellspring completes a fire water grass core and gives you redirection while also threatening fire types that threaten zama

[trail quarry]

hmm

lemme cook up a way in which i can fit both

but if i have to use both wont i have to remove dragapult

ukw

[north tree]

if you really want to use both, remove rillaboom for Ogerpon

[trail quarry]

ima run both sets

yes

but then

[north tree]

I chose these both because of how well they pair with dragapult

[trail quarry]

@north tree but if i remove rillaboom for ogerpon wellspring wont that remove my terrarain coverage

[north tree]

this is where dragapult shines at threatening and outspeeding miraidon

[trail quarry]

he doesnt need terrarain?

or he will need rillaboom's grassy surge to cover electric terrarain

[north tree]

sucker + ddarts kos

it's a shaky matchup though

So I'd reccomend just rilla fairgiraf

[trail quarry]

so i?

[north tree]

accidentally pressed send sorry

[trail quarry]

oh

@north tree cus of my lack of common sense, i didnt completely get this thing

does dragapult need grassy surge to compeltely outspeed and k/o miraidon?

not to be rude, but can u say in yes or no

[north tree]

grassy surge does not make a difference offensively but defensively it allows dragapult to live electro drift

[trail quarry]

ok

less get to testing

@north tree is there any need for trick room on farigraf?

cus my team is p fast and all

[north tree]

trick room is actually to beat opposing trick room by reversal

and opposing tailwind

[trail quarry]

Ohh

smart

[north tree]

dragapult 2 or 3 seems the best

2 resembles michael kelsch's worlds team from 2023 (2nd place and he had urshifu over zamazenta)

[trail quarry]

oh

[lost phoenix]

ah yea

i thought u were talking about the recent team for a sec

[trail quarry]

the recent team is his zamazenta one right

that won regionals

[north tree]

that actually is not his team but Keanu Inosanto's Indianopolis team with a couple modifications on tera types

[trail quarry]

ohh

[trail quarry]

yuh ur right @north tree

flutter mane is EW

1 is bad

lets try 2 3 4

ans 4 is bad too

yes @north tree u were right 2 and 3 r best

[rotund fossil]

https://pokepast.es/a0d4633b49c5b0c9
Thoughts? Still pretty new to team building but switching from caly S to try another restricted

[jagged thicket]

Can someone help me with EV’s

https://pokepast.es/6a5b3a0dbdf73ec4

[drifting onyx]

New [Gen 9] VGC RMT @normal stream, @wild sinew, @austere wasp, @hot wren, @wanton abyss, @distant stump, @north tree. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[prime mountain]

Koraidon Sun HO, something feels off though

https://pokepast.es/961fb59eb3d58364

[lusty spruce]

https://pokepast.es/68cf161a6c7ebc8d Usually lead with Tera, helping hand electro driftt

[rapid oak]

https://pokepast.es/f3a2c41faed86132 Would flutter mane or urshi-rapid/single work better here?

[distant stump]

Your team lacks a lot of synergy, besides some of the sets being weird

Ex running 3 grass types on a sun team, and not running any mons that rly benefit from sun

I'd at least add like, hearthflfame, bolt, incin, torn, etc

u can also take a sample which I recc

[distant stump]

https://www.smogon.com/dex/sv/formats/vgc/

Evs for most stuffs

[distant stump]

Yeah, your team lacks a lot of synergy

Like running Ursaluna, a tr mon attacker in a tw team, glimmora and pao also have not so much synergy with ur team in general

Ideally you add coverage like Raging Bolt

[distant stump]

This is probably fine, run tground fig and discharge instead of thunder on miraidon

also its usually cornerstone instead of wellspring

[distant stump]

Probably RS but you have bigger problems tbh

[rapid oak]

Like? I personally wanna use armarouge cuz it’s my favorite mon. It’s almost the same concept as the bloodmoon variant of the miraidon team

So I tried to implement that

[distant stump]

I'd prolly go with

https://pokepast.es/962350f362e914cb

SOmething like this

Replace arma for smh

[lusty spruce]

Kk thank you

[rapid oak]

Arma is just a personal pick lol

And I rather stick to miraidon as my team focus

[rapid oak]

Luckily I have a tryhard miraidon team https://pokepast.es/695eb55be7fee740

[languid thorn]

trick room with miraidon?

or is this anti trick room tech

[rapid oak]

Mostly that

[rapid oak]

What big problems does the team I sent have?

Wanna try to see if I can solve them

[keen escarp]

Ok so a few things I noticed:

• Run Discharge > Parabolic Charge. Trying to go for recovery on an offensive team actually makes you frail. The objective is to crush your opponent quickly, so you won't have much opportunity to rely on recovery.

• I assume the Mienshao is for the CalyS matchup? Is it needed is the question. You have two Normal types, and TR while blocking priority. I would say you already have the answer for CalyS.

• I would ditch Psychic on Farig for Protect. Protect is simply that good. Helps the team survive more.

• Protect > Taunt on Whimsicott. Whimsi has to survive. To either stagger Tailwind or to scout and Encore. It's also why Sash is very good on Whimsi on this team.

• Mirror matchup doesn't look that great. I would run AV Iron Hands over Mienshao and give the Sash to Whimsicott. Hands gives additional bulk to the team as well.

Rest seems okay for the intended purposes. Hope this helped, good luck!