OM Rates

[normal marlin]

Just vanilla valiant

Oh nvm base val doesnt get uturn

[high trellis]

perrserker as the donor

with future gallade as the base

forgot to say the set

cc/play rough/knock/ uturn

[reef pier]

i did that, i also swapped out kommo-o with crawdaunt

[normal marlin]

Ah thanks

Honestly, should i start with Hands (im swapping Defog for EQ and using hands for pure wallbreaking) + Ghold + Val and just go from there?

Like totally scrap emp, moon, and tusk

And generally redo my hazard control

[high trellis]

hazard control is hard in this meta

there's few options, most of whats out there doesnt even have recovery, what does rarely offers more than wisp, and most of them dont offer a particularly useful defensive ability

the only one that does, cyclizar, is bound to be very easy to spinblock

[normal marlin]

So is that a yes or a “dont even bother”

Or something else

[high trellis]

its a "you got your work cut out for you

i think maybe like av regen paldean mence + pincurchin pex could work

uhh dragalge!bipedal suicune isnt real

[normal marlin]

Understood

Uhh what moves does pincurchin pex typically run

[high trellis]

scald spikes recover twave

and run like uhh erm hmm

[normal marlin]

Thanks

[high trellis]

maybe levighold?

you are gonna need a ground resist

[normal marlin]

Yeah

So im almost wondering if levi pex

But idk maybe thats the unmon set creation leaking back into my mind

[high trellis]

levitate donors are kinda limited rn

only a few have recovery

and pex is a mon that will need a lot of utility to not be passive af

[normal marlin]

Yeah

And the only two levitates with recovery are Chingling, which has knock off i guess, and cryogonal, which is almost objectively worse

[high trellis]

cryogonal is a strict DNU for me imo

youd think having levitate, recovery AND spin would be great but it has no utility and specially no way to scare out ghosts

no pivot no status no utility attack like knock or scald

[timid meadow]

free flygon fr

[high trellis]

the real loss is that neither roost or fog are tms this gen and gamefreak cut transfer moves (fuck em for that)

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/3b4e297ed5a1a206
(bh) ursaluna or something
it kills miraidon and ashgren kills ghosts
mirai mu sucks but eh

[umbral lava]

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[surreal portal]

gigaton gren doesn't really have any use case and fleur mmx looks like a pain in the ass to deal with, otherwise seems fine

bear may want jolly to actually outspeed miraidon and not just get sapped + do nothing

[shrewd spoke]

yeah but then i deal 0 to neutrals

this mon sucks lol

should just do something like fleur mmx fc waterceus

[surreal portal]

maybe if you fit a sapblocker in there you can stick with adamant

[shrewd spoke]

the regen blissey

[surreal portal]

idt there's an easily replaceable slot unless you sack off ho-oh and suffer even harder into diancie

or you can try and compress the gren/ursa improofs into one slot, but gl with that

[dusk pasture]

what if i told you there was another option that bh players would never dare try

[shrewd spoke]

fur coat air balloon magearna

works like a charm

or even better

earth eater eviolite bisharp

[oak topaz]

Can run impish hooh to soft mmx

[sacred oriole]

please rate my almost any ability (AAA) team: https://pokepast.es/73843ca32694424b

man idea is to use Oger and Gengar to break down walls for azelf or barra to clean

[timid meadow]

love that the team is named sflo gengar and then its normalize

i don't know how valuable nasty plot is compared to toxic spikes is for gengar, my main concern with this team is that ogerpon can kinda get a kill everytime it comes in and theres nothing that really punishes it

alternatively; drop play rough for spikes on oger-c

[sacred oriole]

Play Rough has been invaluable, but TSpikes is an interesting idea yeah

[timid meadow]

granted ogerpon just kinda does that to those teams; an alternate idea could also be bold goodra-h with regenvest

though it probably wouldn't fit as well given the offensive structure

although i also don't think its that bad, oger-c can't really switch into that team much directly if just played more aggresively

[dusk pasture]

yeah the team is far too aggressive for any passive regenvest like goodra-h to work

the team really is centred around winning faster or not

also

https://pokepast.es/20a009b72dd96eb2 GG rate (for the few GG raters that exist)

[fossil cove]

uhhh are the evs meant to be like that?

[dusk pasture]

no i just dont care

[fossil cove]

ah

[normal marlin]

https://pokepast.es/cb372066b84f2d57

(Inheritance!)

Took the advice from last time to heart and changed some things around

I do really like the iron hands set, even more so now that I’ve swapped defog out, but that (and dengo) are the only things that havent changed

Unsure about what good mons there are for a ground resist/immunity so uhh if jugulis sucks thatd be great to know

[dusk pasture]

@high trellis

[normal marlin]

I didn’t take this long to make i promise
I just forgot to get feedback on it lmfao

[sacred oriole]

Etern + Clod is a weird pairing, if you want Toxic Spikes I’d run it on Etern

You also accidentally made your HP slot not Gliscor, you should fix that

[dusk pasture]

i think the pairing is ok, my main issue is caly-i but i think it's playable with mola and sableye (and also tera)

gliscor is obv very good but sableye has been very funny so im reluctant to remove it

given HO is everywhere

not sure what other def slot i'd run otherwise anyway

maybe i can run vaporeon and pretend it's a mola lol

it does have flip turn...

[red violet]

https://pokepast.es/3ce45745d831b28d is this shared power team good?

idk if im gonna keep cresselia

but im really weak to rocks so

hazards

[fossil cove]

@flint plover

[red violet]

oh and priority

[high trellis]

Run enough speed evs on the paldean mence to creep bases 111

[flint plover]

You don't need two quark drive mons so may switch one of them with regieleki, it gives you rapid spin and is great in eterrain, and yeah cress doesn't fit well, as levitate removes most terrain related effects, may replace it with chi-yu

[red violet]

what set on leki?

[flint plover]

spin, tbolt, vswitch and tera blast ice, with hdb, 252 spa/spe timid

[red violet]

what about modest?

not alot would out speed it

@flint plover?

[flint plover]

you can try, but you have to be careful with opposite elekis

[red violet]

do i make chi yu have speed with quark drive?

or make it max sp attack

[flint plover]

thats personal preference, but you should have enough speedy mons

[red violet]

alr

thanks!

[normal marlin]

Will do

[red violet]

is this a good berry team in shared power?
https://pokepast.es/a3ddd80046b35669

i know theres alot of type overlap but

[sacred oriole]

@flint plover

[flint plover]

you dont really need both cud chew and harvest, would replace fari with stickyhold swalot, so you don't autolose to knock off

[high trellis]

Run pblades on Groudon

Whats crunch for

[red violet]

coverage?

idk

[high trellis]

Is giratina free?

[red violet]

i think it doesn't ohko without set up

but it's giratina

that things like

bulky af

[high trellis]

So it is free

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/2eaebcf244f18246
(bh) gambit lunala and guys that like yveltal and scalesceus being gone
scales mpert is copium but it is what it is

[umbral lava]

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[surreal portal]

you don't really have good options into take heart cage arc, and diancie mu looks precarious

[shrewd spoke]

i could also run haze on mpert > flip

and then have haze on yvel be another move or something

mdiancie is a sucky though

[oak topaz]

What’s the play when lunala gambits ygod

And their scales arc is still alive

[orchid grove]

https://pokepast.es/7090f86613b69106

Shared Power

Wanted to do Kyogre + Manaphy because that sounds like a disgusting core.

[sacred oriole]

@flint plover

[flint plover]

Do you really meet that many grass types to need sap sipper? Seems like Frosmoth would help more so you dont get swept by special attackers, also run close combat instead of focus punch on croak, the power difference isnt big enough to be worth it

[orchid grove]

I'm more thinking in the context of how this gets 6-0'd by WaterPon and Hilligant without Goodra's Sap Sipper like that, and I really didn't want to disrupt the team's flow in builder at the time bc I really liked the direction it was taking.

Goodra does a fine enough job leveraging Offense and Bulk to still ward off quite a few things, while flipping that MU on its head.

[flint plover]

Well, you do have some checks to waterpon in zamac and toxi, maybe give toxi some bulk to check lilli-h better

[orchid grove]

just making Toxi Bulky SD in that case.

Easier than just being a nuiscance with Sub 3A

What's a good speed benchmark for Toxi to hit?

I wanna say Heatran to avoid getting sniped by EP when you should be KOing it but I'm not sure.

also what does Frosmoth look like set wise?

https://pokepast.es/0a35ff49a5773f31

[shrewd spoke]

alright i think i solved this

i run axe on mdia and click it

then i knock yveltal as it hards ghostceus

then it loses long term

and then it dies then i setup lunala and i win

[orchid grove]

https://pokepast.es/48344b553e6d2d11

Back with another STABmons rate

Wanted to build offensive spinner Gengar because that sounded cool.

[sacred oriole]

@sleek merlin get in here

Also free Astral Barrage

[sleek merlin]

sec

Honestly think you could run gengar without sludge bomb as it doesn't really hit many things that aren't already hit by Ghost/Fighting Coverage. This frees up a slot to let you run things like Sub, Nasty Plot, Knock Off, Encore, etc...

Unsure about Urshifu, the sheer omnipresence of Toxapex really hurts the set you are running and I think you could even drop Surging Strikes in exchange for thunder Punch or drop uturn. There are several reasons even beyond Toxapex for this, Corviknight often run Rocky helmet meaning you'd self-nuke yourself with surging strikes, prevalence of Cornerstone Ogerpon is really high and your fighting coverage is generally strong enough as a stab alone, Jet Punch fulfills the water stab fine enough as is and the additonal coverage really helps in general.

Suggest running a defensive Tera on Kingambit such as Flying if you are running leftovers, helps uno-reverso matchups.

Landorous-t is fine, though I am always hesitant about dropping flying coverage in Dragon Ascent over spikes.

Toxapex is standard, no comment.

Kommo-o looks good.

@orchid grove

[orchid grove]

Realistically I brought out Shifu Rapid mostly bc I wanted to have a solidly strong Prio more than anything to make up for the lack of anything that's particularly fast, and make up for it with dual priority.
Though I'm ngl Gyara also looks like a rough MU regardless of what I slot over Shifu.

[sleek merlin]

when i doubt use rotomw

[orchid grove]

I normally spam WashTom on 90% of my teams anyway, but PlotTom has some really awkward synergy, and Defensive means my only real offensive presence is just Gengar and Gambit, when that's not really the teams I'd imagine Gengar works on.

[sleek merlin]

run offensive rotom

with Nasty Plot or Torch Song

[orchid grove]

That was what I meant by PlotTom yes

[sleek merlin]

or

run

scarf

:3

trick scarf to be precise

[orchid grove]

I tend to prefer Nasty Plot simply bc Torch Song has never really felt immediately threatening enough, and the coverage doesn't really make up for it in a lot of scenarios for me.

That is of course unless you're doing like balls to the wall 4A, which isn't a very good use of smth like WashTom imo.

https://pokepast.es/1eb5f09f40e2cd52
Anyway
Tech'd PlotTom to be overall more defensively oriented to check Gyara and Lando-T, but still overall be offensively threatening.

Specifically is never 2HKO'd by Band Lando Dragon Ascent from Full and outspeeds MinSpeed Lando-T

[sleek merlin]

if you are running parabolic drop roost for coverage

or you can drop parabolic and even electric typing for

Freeze Dry

which lets you hit dragons

[orchid grove]

btw, idea for Spikes Lando was that with an Offensive Spinner so robust into beating most of the Steels that would otherwise block it on top of Pex, that would be fine enough hazard control.

[orchid grove]

Considering how scary the Gyarados MU is already I think it's within my interest to keep Roost for consistency's sake.
I've been under the impression Parabolic Charge is more good for being able to win 1v1s with its added longevity rather than a form of recovery worth relying on.

Plus I think a lot of the Dragons end up losing the war of attrition to WashTom to begin with, and if you're in a position to you can just Tera and beat a lot of them out anyway bar Kommo-o I think the bigger reason for Freeze Dry is the occasional (but still relevant) Water Absorb Clodsire.

[fossil cove]

https://pokepast.es/72fd182048d3d0df AAA

[umbral lava]

New AAA RMT @echo lodge, @sacred oriole, @dusk pasture, @timid meadow, @gloomy elm. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[paper moat]

@remote bison can you take this one

[dusk pasture]

weird to see a balanced structure and see a random clanging souls kommo-o

[real osprey]

Yeah id change the kommo-o for maybe another strong electric-type, either no guard zapdos or like thundurus cause u have no real way to break manaphy and ur wincons (azelf/ghold) are both walled by mana

[paper moat]

ng zappy is fake

[real osprey]

[orchid grove]

https://pokepast.es/aedf701875a086ed
STABmons

Alternative Gengar build around LO 4A as opposed to Lefties Offensive Utility built around overwhelming Pex for Gren to win the game.

@sleek merlin (I don't know who else is a STABmons rater here).

As opposed to the other one which is winning the war of attrition in the hazard game, this version takes the approach of "power through before hazards become a problem on your side and make it a problem on their's."

[acoustic cradle]

https://pokepast.es/9f58534fb33b4ce3 something tells me theres a massive hole in this one that i just didnt see yet

but outside of that how much do we want something speedy in this meta

[sacred oriole]

@high trellis get in here nerd

[high trellis]

Idt bu lax might work

What its tasked to stop is too strong, and what it could try to break with bu is too fat

Id try mixed shaymin

With supper power

But ig it is your removal

Oh ik what you're missing

Rain hydro pump switchin

Arguably a rocker too

Ninetales switchin too

[acoustic cradle]

an idea was cloud nine but i couldnt find a suitable alt inheritor and duck havent got recovery so uhh

manaphy ig?

or roaring moon or x other better dragon

regenvest/scarf moon with power whip?

[fossil cove]

https://pokepast.es/96085c66e5586348 back with da AAA

[umbral lava]

New AAA RMT @echo lodge, @sacred oriole, @dusk pasture, @timid meadow, @gloomy elm. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[sacred oriole]

I like the general idea, but do have a few notes

Without Intimidate on Corv, you’re going to struggle with physical breakers like Oger, Pao, and Gapdos

And you don’t super need the fire immunity since you have manaphy + tusk

I also am a big lvl99 Corv hater, but to each their own

I also don’t leave Samurott in the current meta, especially on a balance team

It doesn’t have the longevity to keep spikes up

I would probably replace it here with a more potent physical break, Pao or Gapdos or Barra

If you want to build around it it’s fine, but I think you’ll get more mileage out of more firepower

Oh actually one other thing, this core struggles badly with opposing electrics

Zapdos / Thundy / Shocks all go hard here

Maybe try physdef Manaphy and SpD VA Corv?

[fossil cove]

https://pokepast.es/8607334f4521ed2c @sacred oriole

or aaa

[sacred oriole]

Last note, I run Adamant Gapdos, also Knock Off over TKick

Knock Off is important to hit Ghold

Adamant is being greedy to 2HKO Intimidate Corv, but obviously makes for riskier speed situations

Otherwise I like it

[fossil cove]

alr then

ty

[high trellis]

Goodrah

[acoustic cradle]

goodrah can handle moth right?

[high trellis]

Its really really fat

It can suffer a little vs it still but i think regular goodra could work if you're confident in your hoothoot!future gallade mu

Or whatever primarily special fairy

And i think you can play around dragalge!bipedal suicune

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/0bc382591801d08d
(bh) very unconventional scales chansey HO inspired by onyx

[umbral lava]

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[shrewd spoke]

mdiancie could also be painsplit > sap

[surreal portal]

the first things i'm seeing are that take heart arc-fairy sets there and only leaves if you sack something to get blaziken in

[shrewd spoke]

i could also do poison move ghostceus

[surreal portal]

and that aside from the arc improof, moldy judge diancie is worse in basically every apsect than standard mixed

[surreal portal]

gunk is very necessary imo yes

[shrewd spoke]

i mean it does kinda selfproof?

pixi doesn’t too much

[surreal portal]

you also have the issue of how any of this is actually getting in since there's one pivot (who is frail as shit and also scarf no regen) and no screens

[surreal portal]

zero chance you don't just lose to imp fblast

[shrewd spoke]

fair

[surreal portal]

so you can do arc stuff here but diancie itself isn't doing normal ho diancie stuff, being v-create spam, chasing out annoying bastards like take heart mirai, and exploding

you would need teleport chansey over heal bell i think

especially given you have something that doesn't care about mortal, something immune to para, and a jungle mon

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/b6ebcd5b59cdf6d8
alright here’s the second take

actually i might not even need scales chans that much anymore

[surreal portal]

the sceptile simply existing mandates scales chansey i think

p sure regular chansey just dies

registeel maybe lives 2 chloros but definitely not well

unless you're doing the cursed dragon judge mg sceptile

which is still going to be a speedtie on the second turn anyway lol (could use ferro improof ig)

[shrewd spoke]

no av takes 50 from denergy

forced to regenvest :(

regenvest PLUS something that denies it from setting up this is so sad

[surreal portal]

even with regenvest there you have to nuzzle it and hope they stay in

so it's a 50/50 even though you live 2 attacks

the easiest solution here might just be to drop the sceptile lmao

[sturdy lake]

I know these channels aren’t really for this, but for the life of me I can’t figure out what my 6th Mon should be.

https://pokepast.es/ba0d4dbfe2661c8d
Stabmons

[umbral lava]

New STABmons RMT @sleek merlin. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[sturdy lake]

Also forgot Tera for hydre

[sleek merlin]

okay

[sturdy lake]

Just put a lando on with roost and brave bird added, but dunno

[sleek merlin]

Infernape is, kinda EH, lacks kick and actual speed but regardless I will assume you are deadset on it and as such will break down what I find wrong with it. First Off, don't use Axe Kick, use Close Combat or Thundurus Kick. Axe Kick isn't reliable and is gonna get you killed, not sure if passho is the route either, you'd haave to show me some calcs tthat make it worth it such as trading up into something.

Don't use Toxic spikes on toxapex literally useless move in STABmons outside of rare Glimmora usage through ability. Use Clear Smog so you can occasionally prevent non-steel setup sweepers (though generally you want to be pressing mortal spin or flip.

IMO, run Diamond Storm / Aqua Step / Flower Trick / SD on Ogerpone-Cornerstone pyro ball doesn't really give you much when SD can let you potentially sweep entire teams and Dstorm has the +2 def which can reshape matchups.

Use Dragon Energy or Clanging Scales for dragon stab, former has more upfront damage, later has better damage over dynamax cannon, also U-turn is probably better then parting shot in this case.

Get rid of weezing-galar... it overlaps with Toxapex far to heavily and will be walled by the same things, especially gholdengo which it can do nothing versus.

Landorus-Therian @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Impish Nature

• Precipice Blades
• U-turn
• Defog
• Shore Up

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 140 HP / 252 SpA / 116 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Torch Song
• Make It Rain
• Stealth Rock
• Earth Power

@sturdy lake

other options are Gliscor, Moltres, Meloetta, Gholdengo, etc...

[sturdy lake]

Thanks

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/a2dff6be55148293
(bh) i am addicted to building HO send help immediately
the idea is that i ultra pressure scales with popbomb ray mdiancie and lunala
yveltal improof looks kinda shoddy if it has boosts, i wanna change this to something else that can also improof lunala

[umbral lava]

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[oak topaz]

Psysurge counterplay?

[surreal portal]

my main concern with this is that mmx getting in sort of means you need to sack on the spot

[oak topaz]

Idt that is as much of an issue

Mmx is rked by like everything

But deoa is not ok here

[shrewd spoke]

cry

i can uh

go lunala on deoa and hope i somehow live

i can also do some funky scarf yveltal

mg scarf wicked bb vc uturn or something

[orchid grove]

https://pokepast.es/ead2d72dfd99ff20
STABmons
wanted to build Band Ape bc I think people need to explore more immediately threatening variants of this mon.
Rage Fist sets are fine and all but with just how high the power ceiling is in this tier it gets hard to accumulate enough to really be dangerous.
Band Ape however...
right out the gate you ARE the danger.

[umbral lava]

New STABmons RMT @sleek merlin. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[supple musk]

https://pokepast.es/0b1dba27f67642c3

Pokebilities team. Wanted to build around a Mon that isn't seen too much, but has a ton of potential, so I decided Dragalge. I knew I needed a solid amount of pivots, so I built a lot of the team around pivoting both it and Mamoswine in.

Dragalge EVs are to outspeed no investment Clef and other base 60s

Also, forgot to give Clod a tera type, so making it's tera type steel to wall Basculin because it's always caused issues for Clod, even having the option of Psychic Fangs for Ability Shield variants

Ability Shield is there because Basculin and Basculegion are big threats that normally get past Water Absorb with Mold Breaker. Also helps with Hawlucha, though, so it can't get past Unaware

[sleek merlin]

@orchid grove First off, big problem that is easy to solve, you have zero hazard clear... Replace Stone Edge with Defog on Scarf Lando-t, done (doesn't even hit anything that isn't hit by either stab.

Honestly may as well run Rage Fist over Poltergeist, taking a hit to make it the same BP with the potential to improve massively is too valuable and relatively easy.

Run Covert Cloak on Wo-Chien, just a better item over Heavy Duty Boots; consider Tera Fairy or Tera Water so you don't have any overalapping weaknesses (Tera Ghost works as well).

A fun set for Slowbro is Body Press with Tera Fighting, lets you snipe Kingambit's which can be achieved by getting rid of Slack Off and making it a pivot centric mon.

Outside of that looks fine.

[keen remnant]

https://pokepast.es/0341f3c89956cc20 sketchmons

weak af to ogerpons

[red violet]

https://pokepast.es/59a17abc350ac74a im trying to make a webs team idk if its good though

Sketchmons

[red violet]

oh dengo got banned

[red violet]

updated it
https://pokepast.es/ab671ab3865475f4

might replace mystical power for esper wing

[supple musk]

https://pokepast.es/a19d981636a5f584

Another pokebilities team. Again, building around lesser seen mons, so this time, went with Heracross. Guts+Swarm+Moxie and it got Trailblaze and tera this gen, so sounded like fun and potentially broken

The defensive core is where I had struggles because I originally wanted multiple bulky mons that had momentum, but that fell apart quickly. Pult synergized really well with Hera, getting rid of the ghosts and smacking flyers with Thunderbolt, Glowking hits fairies with Sludge Bomb and threatens poisons with Future Sight while simultaneously providing Thunder Wave support and momentum from Chilly Reception. Gambit is priority and late game win con with a solid list of resistances, Tusk is rocks setter and only hazard removal, and Oger for a Mon that can play a utility role while still applying offensive pressure and having momentum capability. It feels like something completely different from what I envisioned and I don't really know what to do to make it better

[halcyon solar]

https://pokepast.es/8940b4b0e172bf6a
STABmons set that originated from me theory crafting about Power Swap Chansey, and turned into this balance abomination

[umbral lava]

New STABmons RMT @sleek merlin. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[real osprey]

... this does not look like STABmons

[halcyon solar]

oh mu god

wrong format

im such a dumbass

can i change it to sketchmons? (the format i wanted to use it in)

[sacred oriole]

@cold wadi sketch team

[halcyon solar]

thank you

and sorry for the error

[high trellis]

Power swap seems too gimmicky

You half someone's attack

Now what

You're still better off twaving them than hitting them

This team 100% does not want screens

That duck set is um

Existent

Drop flame charge for espeed

[zealous pelican]

https://pokepast.es/09cae196ce4066d0
sketchmons team
I'm not too confident in it, mainly with salamence on it, and I'm looking to improve upon it

[sacred oriole]

I’m not very familiar with the sketch meta, but on Amolololololololo, Scald is probably still better than Steam Eruption

24 PP is a lot more than 8, especially if you need to burn fish, and the power difference isn’t very noticeable on a defensive

[high trellis]

Im not convinced earth power is important enough for you to have to run hex and wisp in a single slot

30% can betray you on key moments

You should run behemoth bash on kingambler bc it has higher bp

And idt dclaw is needed on mence

[zealous pelican]

what'd I swap dclaw out for? roost or a different offensive move?

[high trellis]

Either seems like a fine choice

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/fe722cfe7852d6b1
(bh) sapblock mchomp sf mmx

[umbral lava]

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[shrewd spoke]

mdiancie mu looks very dire

dk how to fix w/o scrapping the mmx tho

[surreal portal]

questioning why edrift isn't moonblast, also yeah diancie matchup is dire so the likely swap-off is bliss or mmx

[shrewd spoke]

snipe celes

[surreal portal]

you have this fancy little move called combat torque

[shrewd spoke]

yeah but it saps to full or it clicks knock and saxe on my blissey

[high canyon]

real question is why is it edrift at all

it's SF so tbolt is weaker but way more spammable

or like

pyro ball if the goal is snipe teela

[shrewd spoke]

the aegislash improof

[high canyon]

ew aegislash

[shrewd spoke]

i absolutely forgot tbolt existed though lol

[high canyon]

i didnt look at the team aegislash is ew

dont approve

[shrewd spoke]

i agree

[high canyon]

dont use aegislash!!

[shrewd spoke]

this mon sucks ass

[high canyon]

number one rule of post-g7 balanced hackmons

[shrewd spoke]

it’s just the cheapest sf mmx improof + blissey “improof” thing i can find

[high canyon]

you will believe at some point an aegislash is the correct choice for your team

this is always wrong

anyw i'd much sooner use gholdengo

but even that seems ass

[shrewd spoke]

what should i use

its being improofed by ghostceus btw

[high canyon]

hm

ok so this team is like

losing to snr ghostceus

[shrewd spoke]

cant lose to snr ghostceus if they misplay their ghostceus into my ghostceus and die to judge

[high canyon]

id say go fur coat lunala + scales fairyceus should be passable, you don't really handle ghost/dark move mmx but fairyceus can pretend to

fc lunala handles mmx

and chomp

[shrewd spoke]

hm

i’ll try it, thanks

[high canyon]

fairyceus can run th

and lunala can run like

koff infernal

koff infernal sap filler (i like mortal well enough)

bliss could handle that tbf

since luna's knocks are weak

mortal makes th fairyceus a so-so improof so maybe best letting blissey take the koff

imo lunala really wants koff infernal on defensive sets so that part is non negotiable

ig glare hex/infernal is fine too, but i prefer koff to deal w regenvests and hurt imp a ton

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/46bb5d2a36ad6c60

is this passable

mdiancie mu still sucks but cope ig

[oak topaz]

That diancie mu is abysmal

[shrewd spoke]

i hope it’s not espeed and rk with mmx

[oak topaz]

It’s always espeed

If it’s not you have blissey

[shrewd spoke]

specs?

[oak topaz]

Specs runs speed

[shrewd spoke]

yeah but it’s not that common, is it

[oak topaz]

It should be

[shrewd spoke]

specs should be something like bb ep revdance something

[oak topaz]

You only need boomburst

Pick 3 out of ep rev volt espeed

[oak topaz]

You can try scales Psnceus actually

Bandaid fix but not a bad check

[high canyon]

makes psychic/ghost coverage kinda pain, shit deo mu

but yea not bad

[red violet]

can i post UUbers teams here?

[sacred oriole]

#1060682530094862477 is a better fit

ping @kinesquared when you get there

[twin edge]

Can anyone critique my doubles team for gen 6? Im tryna beat my friend https://pokepast.es/794f57e68a0cdb11

I like its offense but I think I might need better or more setups

[sacred oriole]

try DOU rates

[cunning cairn]

DOU rates is closed

[paper moat]

yeah, but gen 6 doubles isn't an OM

[acoustic cradle]

https://pokepast.es/6625b0b070c6e50c stab

not sure how i ended up with both latis

[acoustic cradle]

update: it is no longer a latios it is a np thund

[high trellis]

Does noxous torque does smt notable over scald?

[acoustic cradle]

it made me not lose instantly to that subcm prima that one time

also i can pretend i can do damage

[acoustic cradle]

ok so uh

• this team dies to ice
• this team dies to pz unless pex teras then it dies to a bunch of things
• this team dies to [some other things] that i didnt run into yet or forgot about (notably sub setup that beats pex is a huge pain)

[orchid grove]

How does this not just lose instantly to Kyurem?

Like, I'm pretty sure any variation of Kyurem just rips this team right open thoughtlessly.

esp DD I think that's just smth this loses to unconditionally.

Your problem here is you have way too many ways Ices can find their way in and too little ways to force them back out.

[acoustic cradle]

i noticed :/

i literally wrote it right up there

so this is in the rmt

would i replace tinglu here?

[orchid grove]

I think Tyranitar is ever so better than Ting-Lu rn, but I also think you could move Defog to Lando over Stone Edge and then replace Corvi with smth more Sturdy like Skarm.

You really don't benefit from the pivoting of Corvi here, if at all, and for stuff like Plot Thundy Spikes go so much further of a way.

Ttar + Skarm in general is also just a very good core that covers a lot of the tier quite handily and is really good at putting on residual damage.

I have very little faith in the Latias set but ig you can make it work if you're dead set on keeping it.

[acoustic cradle]

oh yeah skarm is a mon

would i run like

idbp beak roost

and yea ttar prolly helps a ton

latias has been working fine for me even out of low ladder scrubs so i think ill keep it

[high trellis]

Kyurem broke id say that

[acoustic cradle]

too true

[high trellis]

Just cope

And complain to the mods

[orchid grove]

I personally like Beak Blast Body Press Spikes Roost

you give up too much having to pick one or the other and typically you can at least manage without Iron Defense.

[orchid grove]

I think rn it's just a product of the current meta

a lot of the broken mons punish the mons that would otherwise check Kyurem extremely hard, thus deterring them being used bc Kyurem typically isn't as common as the bigger brokens atm.

I think as the meta settles Kyurem might become easier to manage, but there's only one way to know for sure and that's to wait and see.

[high trellis]

what can check kyurem

what beats attacker kyurem that doesnt lose to sub sets

[orchid grove]

Tyranitar, Lax, Scizor, Sylveon, Volcarona, all naturally check it defensively, and on top of that Kyurem is super prone to simply getting out offensed by a lot of the tier before it can get up to much shenanigans.

idt its pure breaker sets are the big thing to worry abt, that'd be DD, and even that finds itself quite the tera hog to net opportunites to set up.

Note a lot of these mons get absolutely hammered by current Meta trends and aren't in a very good spot with the exception of Tyranitar, which imo makes Kyurem feel a lot harder to answer in practice at the current moment.

There might be a couple Kyurem checks I missed but those are the ones that most immediately came to my mind.

[acoustic cradle]

oh yeah should post the updated version

https://pokepast.es/88b3dc7d6e7287a4

how does it look?

skarm should be impish cause im dumb

[orchid grove]

Scald > Noxious Torque on Pex
Ting-Lu looks like a pain in the ass now but you should at least have the tools to deal with it.

Try it on ladder and see how it goes ig.

[acoustic cradle]

aight

thank

[red violet]

https://pokepast.es/e79592df43306966 tried to make a screens team
sketchmons

[orchid grove]

https://pokepast.es/c73c949450f38b35
STABmons Psyspam
figured the playstyle still held merit in the current meta, esp with how well it dunks on most of the brokens rn through just sheer offensive pressure and invalidating priority.

[umbral lava]

New STABmons RMT @sleek merlin. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[sleek merlin]

sec

[high trellis]

Imo i dont like cinccino in that team

I dont trust any pop bomber without coil and more than 100 attack

Also doesnt tidy up remove your own screens?

Change behemoth badh for sunsteel strike

[orchid grove]

Ping in case you're still up for it.

[sleek merlin]

Ah I forgot

[orchid grove]

all good

[sleek merlin]

Way to much Psychic, like WAY to much...

With Dark types being as good as they are, Great Tusk doesn't not make up for having 5 psychics, this ain't monotype...

Change Armarouge for Weak Armor Ceruledge IMO, Just a more effective set with similar performing roles. IF you want it to be HO though, I think an even better choice of fire type is Gouging Fire, great defensive/offensive typing and under Psychic Surge is very difficult to revenge after a single DD.

No Rock Stab Iron Boulder is a waste of a mon IMO. Gholdengo can be handled through other means such as the aforementioned Gouging Flame. Slap Diamond Storm on that baby!

Great Tusk is fine, as a spinner / HP bomber.

You now need something for groudn types, which gobble your team alive... hmmm

Change Munkidori for Latios

Just a more effective mon as a whole

Run Tera Steel for Lando-t with a take heart set.

[red violet]

it doesn't remove screens actually

[orchid grove]

Iron Boudler's and Munki's fair but I think you miss the point of Psyspam
stacking a shit ton of Psychics is what makes the style effective, it exploits the fact darks cannot feasibly take on every single one of them in rapid succession.
Also doesn't Ceruledge just make this lose to Darks even harder? Its best sets often don't even bother running CC for darks.

actually I got an idea
@sleek merlin
Scream Tail @ Booster Energy
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Expanding Force
• Moonblast
• Fire Blast
• Lunar Dance
  This > Munki
  Solves a couple problems in the Darks, and eases Ground MUs while still providing RKing, EForce cleaning, and Lunar Dance.

[sleek merlin]

Psyspam is pointless if it has glaring weakness that are meta specific

It's just fish then, Psychic surge should be as much about utilizing Expanding and Psychic damage boost as it does the anti-priority nature of it through setup sweepers

the moment you encounter a Weavile you just autolose basically

[orchid grove]

I don't really see how its fishing when all of the Psychics have some means to pressure or even outright beat most Dark types.

Also I feel like regardless of Psyspam structure, your gameplan VS Offensive Darks like that is to win faster™️

(Which I mean it's Psyspam that's not necesscarily an issue for you).

[orchid grove]

There are 3 whole booster mons that force it out and if Weavile comes in on anything that isn't Indeedee it's not winning that exchange.

[sleek merlin]

Biggest problem however

is Psychic vs Psychic matchup

[orchid grove]

Yeah that's what I was mainly worried abt more than anything
that's actually why I even made an RMT lol.

[sleek merlin]

IF a Meloetta with Take Heart comes in

you autolose aside from gallade

which is why rock stab on Iron Boulder is valuable

[orchid grove]

idt unboosted Diamond Storm is KOing Take Heart Melo, but I was considering it for Slowbro of all things to have a STAB to blow through it with.

I could be wrong though I'll check calcs.

252 Atk Iron Boulder Diamond Storm vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Meloetta: 135-159 (33.4 - 39.3%) -- 11.9% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Yeah not even close

Ironically Gallade looks the most droppable for smth that can better deal with it but my brain is fried from the initial build and I cannot think of anything atm.

@sleek merlin You don't reckon Ceruledge > Gallade could be done to better soft check Melo do you?

[sleek merlin]

Personally I think a more amusing iddea

is running Booster special Iron Valiant with Expanding Force (it does learn it) and pair it with Psychic Tera

[orchid grove]

how does that help VS Melo though?

[sleek merlin]

it doesnt

Iron Crown though

could help

or Metagross

[orchid grove]

Valiant did get Secret Sword though so I like CM a lot more, could do it over smth.

[sleek merlin]

it also helps your Weavile game means you can switch into any move

but glacial lance

Just has better defensive syngery for your team whilst still have offensive potential

[orchid grove]

I don't see why Weavile wouldn't click Glacial Lance though
it doesn't even need to click Knock to KO most of these mons lol.

[sleek merlin]

which is why you will be running Iron Crown

🙂

or Metagross

Honestly I think Boulder handles Meloetta fine after an SD, the thing is surprisingly bulky

[orchid grove]

I could be wrong but I think Banded Lance just 2HKO's both of them on the switch anyway.

[sleek merlin]

what

[orchid grove]

Chances are neither of them are gonna be heavily Bulk invested and Glacial Lance Weavile is already doing like 30% to even invested resists so it wouldn't shock me lol.

[sleek merlin]

Yeah but that requires Tera

[orchid grove]

252 Atk Choice Band Weavile Glacial Lance vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 74-87 (24.4 - 28.7%) -- 99.3% chance to 4HKO
I was half joking why is it somewhere in that ballpark :(

[sleek merlin]

Iron Crown @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Expanding Force
• Tachyon Cutter
• Focus Blast
• Endure

😛

sarcasm aside

I think you will be fine if you just change one of your mons to Iron Valiant

[red violet]

are these the only changes I need to do?

[sleek merlin]

Iron boulder should be capable of pressuring Meloetta

[orchid grove]

Dropped Scream/Munki for Valiant

[sleek merlin]

remember it isn't frail

and resists both stabs

[orchid grove]

Thinking abt it realistically I get like nothing out of a second Lunar Dance and it is literally just there to be overkill lol

[sleek merlin]

2 lunar dance is just a waste of a team member

[orchid grove]

wait
wait no I brainfarted
I do have a Lance temporary switch I'm literally using Armarouge

I think I could cut some of its Speed into Bulk since it wants to fish for Weak Armor boosts anyway.

[red violet]

I didn't mean to remove ping @high trellis

[orchid grove]

Okay now we're cool
I can EV to dodge a Band Lance Weavile 2HKO and outspeed Scarf Lando-T at +2.

https://pokepast.es/a94dce19cc1f223f
this went from Psyspam to SwordSpam real quick.

[red violet]

replaced deoxys and cincinno

are these good changes?

i wanted to use a fighting type but i didnt have any idea what to use so

[high trellis]

I feel your team is too slow

Maybe like change both cinccino and thundy for mons that are fast by themselves

[high trellis]

Keld has too much 4mms since it isnt that strong unboosted

So probs something else

The speed tier is fine tho

[red violet]

wb moth?

[high trellis]

Whats wb

[red violet]

what about

[tidal knoll]

DOU isn't an OM

If Doubles OU rates aren't open, it's cause they're not ready to be open again since DLC just launched

[high trellis]

Nplott moth sounds cool

Fire blast/eball/whatever you can find that hits dragons hardest

[red violet]

I alr have np on great neck 😢

[high trellis]

Qd volc

Flame giga and ep

[red violet]

alr

I think the unabanned mons are still banned there

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/44bfef8f959e9915
(bh) scarf moongeist blace + mdiancie + shit tons of hazard removal

[umbral lava]

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[shrewd spoke]

mmx mu kinda sucks

i wanna fix that

[oak topaz]

Absolutely obliterated by special psychics

The th arc mu isn’t great either

Since it’s no stab not cage arc

[shrewd spoke]

i mean i have the scarf blace

[oak topaz]

You must run espeed here

[shrewd spoke]

i can rk

[oak topaz]

I think

No point having spin

[shrewd spoke]

spin is removal for blace?

[oak topaz]

Blace has no breaking power on its own

You are relying on diancie to actually break

[shrewd spoke]

i am not running mortal psnceus as my only real removal

[shrewd spoke]

from my experiences thus far, it’s been pretty decent

[oak topaz]

Idk I used blace before

The mon has no power

You 2hko stuff but it’s all around the 60 max

I’m also not particularly satisfied by 3 mon defensive core rn from my limited building

A lot of threats to account for

[oak topaz]

So the thing here is

Any blace check basically cannot check mmx

Because ghost fight

And any diancie check basically also has shit mmx mu because diancie is basically poison or scales fat

So neither of those improofs are going to help

And considering ghost fairy coverage unlikely to condense improofs into one

Which means of the three defensive mon slots you need one improof for blace one for diancie and something to cover the rest

I think you go double fc scales or smth

Alternatively you compress blace slot into imposter guzzlord

[high canyon]

so someone should cook a blace/mmx team ur saying

[oak topaz]

No I am not saying that

[gleaming bough]

https://pokepast.es/a9cf7909f497841c

[sacred oriole]

What metagame is this for

[gleaming bough]

🤷‍♂️

[gleaming bough]

I just wanted to know if it was good

[dusk pasture]

if there isn't built for any meta we cannot help you

[gleaming bough]

Oh

[red violet]

scarf speed boost is insane

[gleaming bough]

Blaziken can't really take hits, so I wanted them to be fast and hit hard

Glass cannon basically

[high trellis]

idk where did you plan to use this but i guarantee you that any sample of the respective tier will be more effective than that team

[gleaming bough]

Oh

I just thought it was cool and fun

[gleaming bough]

What's bad about it?

[high trellis]

The biggest issue is that these are your 6 fav mons, and that rarely turns out to be a team with rhyme or reason

Like these are 6 guys

Not a team made with a specific purpose

Not everyone is the guy whos favs are lando t, ferrothorn, clef, koko, victini and dnite

[red violet]

i am though

[red violet]

https://pokepast.es/52b9855355798b44
how do i make this team better?

sketchmons

[red violet]

i might replace tidy up for ddance and use a better dragon stab for my sketch move instead

[fossil cove]

bro just run flare blitz for gouging fire

[red violet]

i dont like recoil

[red violet]

glaive rush or dragon darts?

[oak topaz]

Surely you sketch fire move then

[red violet]

flare blits and heat crash are the srongest 100% accurate fire type move

that doesnt lock you into it

so do i keep tidy up or get a better dragon move?

[shrewd spoke]

just use pyro ball if thats legal

the accuracy is worth it

for 0 other downsides

[sacred oriole]

https://pokepast.es/0a7d2f17fc72671e Almost Any Ability

I like it, but really struggle with setup and some key threats like Ceruledge

@echo lodge fix it

[echo lodge]

put deod in the trash and run spdef desoland tran, probably

[sacred oriole]

how does that help vs Ceruledge?

[echo lodge]

then run physdef on your av pert

[dusk pasture]

does that really

[echo lodge]

Should be fine from there

[dusk pasture]

take +2 polter

[echo lodge]

if ppl are running triage, it should

[dusk pasture]

i dont see how spd deso tran helps here though

i mean there's already a wabs gholdengo

[echo lodge]

the spdef deso tran is to make up for pert not being spdef

gholdengo alone isn't beating everything

[dusk pasture]

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Ceruledge Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Swampert: 386-454 (95.5 - 112.3%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

[echo lodge]

Oh, rip

[dusk pasture]

i'd trash the deo-d for sure

[sacred oriole]

too many Grass move Volcs and Moths on ladder to get away with this imo

[dusk pasture]

though

if you want something i ran

idk if this is actually a secure check at all or good but

Gouging Fire @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 48 Atk / 208 Spe
Jolly Nature

• Morning Sun
• Earthquake
• Flare Blitz
• Dragon Tail

[echo lodge]

then throw out deo d for like...itemless mg gouging fire or something
Seems cool, is bulky

and can set up

[dusk pasture]

can check moth volc ceru

[echo lodge]

Shuold be fine from there

I would run itemless so ceruledge has zero chances

[dusk pasture]

maybe

though idk

eq already ohkos it i think and it's even weaker

you could run ddance as well probably and get away with it on ladder

or maybe not wbb corvs and skarms are everywhere on ladder

[sacred oriole]

https://pokepast.es/9d35b4db646bc59d

like this?

[dusk pasture]

if only gouging had one more utility move...

[sacred oriole]

one true physdef guy scares me but

we can try it

[echo lodge]

I would not run an item

[dusk pasture]

small suggestion change you could possibly do that could be a sidegrade could be mglo bundle as i feel that's a more reliable option to pivot in gapdos

[echo lodge]

If it's adapt LO ceruledge, high roll polt + ssneak kills gouging

[dusk pasture]

well

lo eq should kill

i think?

[echo lodge]

You're never getting the eq off

if you switch into poltergeist

which it's 100% clicking if it ever gets in

[dusk pasture]

ladder is dumb as well

[echo lodge]

Oh, it's not even high roll

[dusk pasture]

you can run itemless as well though

[echo lodge]

just mid roll

252+ Atk Life Orb Sword of Ruin Ceruledge Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Gouging Fire: 285-335 (68.8 - 80.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Life Orb Sword of Ruin Ceruledge Shadow Sneak vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Gouging Fire: 103-122 (24.8 - 29.4%) -- guaranteed 5HKO after Leftovers recovery

[dusk pasture]

might just run full defensive at that point though

[echo lodge]

A lot of people are mistakenly running triage though

so maybe you won't see this

[sacred oriole]

was MGLO but found it weaker than I wanted

[dusk pasture]

cause like

[sacred oriole]

but might try that now that the Deo-D spot is less passive and not providing Spikes support

[dusk pasture]

without atk invest and life orb you really do like zero

[sacred oriole]

wait

can't do MGLO Bundle

[dusk pasture]

oh lol

right

[sacred oriole]

with MG Gouging Fire

[dusk pasture]

damn 1ac

!

[echo lodge]

another option is hdb max def gouging with like, heat crash dtail msun filler

and either desoland or uhhh

[dusk pasture]

could even try bulwark as an annoying utility move to do something but im probably coping

[echo lodge]

fluffy as an ability

or even unaware

[sacred oriole]

anyways, happy with this but

[dusk pasture]

doesn't polter still do like

[sacred oriole]

while I have your attention

[dusk pasture]

70-80

[echo lodge]

I won't help with rain

If that's where this is going

btw

I don't condone rain teams

[sacred oriole]

you are no fun

[dusk pasture]

LOL

[sacred oriole]

https://pokepast.es/fad8d4d1208e7670 @timid meadow @paper moat @dusk pasture help with rain

[dusk pasture]

ill help with a rain team

as long as it doesn't have arch

[sacred oriole]

made this in 30 seconds and it gets some kills

but obviously the defenisve core is zero

[echo lodge]

252+ Atk Life Orb Sword of Ruin Ceruledge Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gouging Fire: 208-247 (50.2 - 59.6%) -- 82.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

[sacred oriole]

and we can probably trim the fat

[echo lodge]

252+ Atk Life Orb Ceruledge Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gouging Fire: 157-187 (37.9 - 45.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

[timid meadow]

Drop Volc for something that doesn’t auto lose to sandy shocks

[echo lodge]

super eats if no ability

[paper moat]

sorry i only help viable teamstyles

[dusk pasture]

arch actually sucks tbh

never seen it do anything

[sacred oriole]

if you load no Pert it actually takes lives

[paper moat]

surely you can use a better sswimmer

tbh

[sacred oriole]

that's the hard part though

[dusk pasture]

does it really though

[paper moat]

maybe like sswim canion instead

[sacred oriole]

yes

[dusk pasture]

all my teams do fine into it

[timid meadow]

Arch is fine

[sacred oriole]

okay well

claims lives on ladder

[paper moat]

he looks sketchy

[sacred oriole]

I have only used this team 5 times

[paper moat]

i dont support it sorry

[sacred oriole]

3 Arch sweeps 2 auto losses to Triage

[dusk pasture]

hgoodra, swamp

[paper moat]

yeah just bring scarfzelf here

[dusk pasture]

even my meloetta team

[paper moat]

gg

[sacred oriole]

melo loses cause you just get two free electro shots but

[dusk pasture]

i just pivot out anyway

[sacred oriole]

hoodra / swamp murder

[dusk pasture]

i have a scarf rmoon

[sacred oriole]

I am open to replacing it yes

[real osprey]

Is wake not just better as a water-type breaker or do u need the coverage?

[paper moat]

over who

[dusk pasture]

i question if it's so great to just load like

choice lock items

[timid meadow]

Wake is better than arch but I think the use is more like

[real osprey]

Over volc

[sacred oriole]

this team is not good tbc

[dusk pasture]

sounds really annoying into desoland mons

[sacred oriole]

I know it needs lots of changes

[timid meadow]

Oh over Volc then ya

[paper moat]

hey mr ut theres someone in om rates using a weird team and wont change it!!!!!!

honestly if we had ferro here

[dusk pasture]

i guess if we're assuming no desoland

[paper moat]

this would be so much cooler

[dusk pasture]

because if you encounter a half competent moth user

[timid meadow]

Also UT the Skewda having no aqua jet when weak to scarf electrics is wack

[dusk pasture]

this team is smoked

[paper moat]

actually ut do you want to try

bor zapdos

stabs weatherball roost/uturn

[timid meadow]

.

[dusk pasture]

weather ball

incredible

[sacred oriole]

I am willing to try everything

[timid meadow]

At that point why not just thundy

[sacred oriole]

Barra has been the best mon

[timid meadow]

If we want something more offensive

[sacred oriole]

So probably keeping Tinted Barra

[timid meadow]

If it’s tinted idk why it needs both cc and fangs though

[paper moat]

oh true

[timid meadow]

Drop fangs for jet

[paper moat]

thundy is a mon

[timid meadow]

CC tinted lens Will obliterate moth regardless

[paper moat]

keldeo feels really off here tbh

[dusk pasture]

if you dont have keldeo

you auto-lose to hoodra

[paper moat]

skewda cc

gg

[timid meadow]

No hazards meaning Hoodra can come in for free on some stuff yes

[dusk pasture]

it comes free on 4/6 of your team

if no keld

[timid meadow]

The Hoodra is real

Sign of a bad meta

[paper moat]

why are we pretending that people use hoodra btw

[dusk pasture]

because they do

[timid meadow]

I’ve seen more Hoodra than manaphy on ladder

[paper moat]

also isnt the better evs for canion

[timid meadow]

In my about 80 games or so

[sacred oriole]

Hoodra is real

[dusk pasture]

regenvest manaphy fell off

[paper moat]

252+spa/252spe

[dusk pasture]

top 4 to not used

owned

[sacred oriole]

who do we want for Swift Simmer

if we are dropping Arch

[paper moat]

canion

[timid meadow]

More that it’s niche has competition

With the pert

Big pert

[real osprey]

I ran Wellspring before, although idk how it does vs Deoxys

[dusk pasture]

i literally have not seen it like once

lol

it's probably still usable ish

im still making a team with it

[timid meadow]

Ladder teams are not real

Most of the time

[dusk pasture]

i haven't seen anyone use it

whether in tests roomtours or ladder

[sacred oriole]

okay how do we like

not auto lose to Triage

[paper moat]

dazzling pao

[timid meadow]

You bribe council to ban it

[sacred oriole]

https://pokepast.es/5c615a294f5aeb36

this is where we are now

[dusk pasture]

actually

[paper moat]

tan briage

[dusk pasture]

you might want a flying resist

so maybe keep arch lol

i realise dnite is a thing

[paper moat]

corv

!

[sacred oriole]

Arch feels bad without speed

[dusk pasture]

it ddances a billion times and wins

[timid meadow]

Corv is doing nothing to dnite

[paper moat]

wait actually

[sacred oriole]

and loses to drain punch

[paper moat]

if we dont have ferro

maybe we can cope with skarm instead

[timid meadow]

The setter with no oivot

[dusk pasture]

well i was talking in terms of dnite

for uh

kommo-o

[paper moat]

yeah hes a mini ferro

[dusk pasture]

maybe put a zapdos there or smth

[timid meadow]

Bulky zapdos

[dusk pasture]

surely it takes one +6 dpunch...?

[timid meadow]

Unaware zapdos

[dusk pasture]

or like

unaware deo-d

[timid meadow]

It does not

[dusk pasture]

and forget about setup

forever

man

[timid meadow]

Deo-s???

[dusk pasture]

when are we banning triage

or LOL

i meant d

[sacred oriole]

Ability: Fluffy  
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA  
Modest Nature  
IVs: 0 Atk  
- Hurricane  
- Thunder  
- Weather Ball  
- Roost```

[paper moat]

p sure lo kommo-o ohkoes offensive zap ye

[sacred oriole]

am I trolling or is this heat

[timid meadow]

No no I see the vision now

[dusk pasture]

maybe if zapdos got cm

[timid meadow]

Unaware Deo-s

[dusk pasture]

no...

[paper moat]

https://tenor.com/view/cooking-fail-on-fire-flame-burn-gif-9814465

[timid meadow]

I’ll bring that r1 of aaa open

They’ll never see it coming

[sacred oriole]

Zapdos does still get agility..............

[paper moat]

nawwwwww

[paper moat]

persona 5 reference

do we want mglo wake here

btw

[timid meadow]

Why not boots

[timid meadow]

Do we really want the beak

[paper moat]

ive got it

i know how to beat triage and dnite

tranq wont like what im about to say though.........

[real osprey]

[paper moat]

Ability: Dazzling  
Tera Type: Ghost  
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe  
Modest Nature  
IVs: 0 Atk  
- Shell Smash  
- Shadow Ball  
- Stored Power  
- Giga Drain```

[sacred oriole]

sash seems bad when my ability to keep hazards off is negative

[real osprey]

And u called Wellspring troll...

[dusk pasture]

clearly

we need to

pretend it's bw

and make this rain stall

so we can have spin tentacruel

ok this is a mess why are we trying to make rain work again

[timid meadow]

honestly is poltchagesit not just better

u strength sap them

resist eq from dnite

[paper moat]

did you mean gesundheit with that spelling

[dusk pasture]

benefits from rain...

[sacred oriole]

https://pokepast.es/a064de053cda1bdb
alright team what we thinking

[paper moat]

agility

dont see wake being too useful ngl

[dusk pasture]

maybe it's better to just

focus zapdos on being defensively mainly

and run pivot for our fun fun breakers

[timid meadow]

nah wake is like

probably the best breaker here if im being honest

[dusk pasture]

tbh

why mguard

why not beads or some dumb ability

[timid meadow]

dragon maw

👍

beads too

[dusk pasture]

we're rain HO surely we dont last long

unless this is our like

cope moth check

btw do we just want to give up when we see moth

or like have something for it

[sacred oriole]

you CC with Tinted Barra

works a lot

[paper moat]

click earth power/cc

[dusk pasture]

i never hard into barra with my corv directly

but i guess ladder is different

[sacred oriole]

https://pokepast.es/f5c6a00efc653212

don't love the wake, and think defensive Zap is better here yeah

what do we do with last?

[paper moat]

thundy.

[dusk pasture]

tbf thundy doesn't even benefit much from rain does

it

[paper moat]

it does

[dusk pasture]

i guess you can now thunder

[timid meadow]

normalize gengar.

[paper moat]

oh wait

he doesnt get

hurricane

[sacred oriole]

I like the way you think

[paper moat]

💀

[dusk pasture]

man

if only we had mega swampert for the electrics

[paper moat]

actually

hear me out

sswim pert

[dusk pasture]

the zero damage dealer goes hard

[timid meadow]

delete ur builder

[sacred oriole]

Free Mega Pert

[dusk pasture]

on a note

[paper moat]

wtf????????/

[dusk pasture]

dont we lose to opposing swift swim arch

lol

[sacred oriole]

I tHoUgHt ArCh WaS bAd

[paper moat]

it is

!

[timid meadow]

thats not real (cope)

[dusk pasture]

ladder thinks it is

maybe we could fit a regenvest

[timid meadow]

ladder meta is awful

[dusk pasture]

idk how much more defensive i wanna get

though

[timid meadow]

cant wait for actual tours

where my teams will shine

[dusk pasture]

wait

we have 5 mons anyway

[sacred oriole]

we only have two true offensive abusers of rain

plus keld

[dusk pasture]

is there a better

actually well whatever

i guess we'll just swift swim volc all over the electrics

sswim arch would never be on ladder copium

[sacred oriole]

what about like

a Water Absorb Great Tusk?

[dusk pasture]

hm

perhaps

could also maybe be worth running big bundle again

mglo probably does decent in the rain

also questioning if tinted band is the best set on barra

tbh

cc into moth is funny but you can already drill run it can't you

[sacred oriole]

lightning rod bundle y/y

[sacred oriole]

Tinted Liquidation 2HKOes the meta

[dusk pasture]

lightning rod bundle goes so hard until you realise it cannot take one hit from any special attacker

[sacred oriole]

excluding immunities

[dusk pasture]

i mean

corv

[sacred oriole]

you flip turn on him if you think they have Intimidate Corfv

and 2HKO everyone else

[dusk pasture]

mglo just seems a bit more flexible to me

if you were able to bluff band on barra

and then switch to drill run to ohko iron moth

would be nice

no chip from hazard might give it away though

[sacred oriole]

https://pokepast.es/e6fb93605ecd326c

just going to run this for now then unless there are any last notes

thanks team

[red violet]

there's not alot of things heavier than gfire and the things that are close are ubers, not in the game, not common in ou, or i could hit with a dragon move and earthquake

[surreal portal]

the issue with heat crash isn't that stuff heavier than gfire exists

it's that stuff may not be light enough relative to gfire for heat crash to be doing substantial damage

[red violet]

can't i use smtn like glaive rush instead?

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/ca377b0df440ea41
updated w/ playable mmx/th arc mu

oops forgot to ping

@oak topaz @surreal portal

[oak topaz]

Seems playable

I’m pretty sure arc has to be sap though

To actually improof

Flutter mu can be shaky but flutter is broken so like

[shrewd spoke]

reg heal improofs fine

im not improofing blace w/ arc

[oak topaz]

Reg heal works vs imposter?

Ok actually there are two stand out stuff

A. No knock off, steela is full bait into cloak and nothing to knock regenvests

B. Hooh looks annoying af

[shrewd spoke]

https://pokepast.es/8d9bedae8d41b6f0
(bh) mchomp semi stall
the idea is that i try to get it in as much as possble & with wish support i'm not afraid of being chipped down by salts/uturns/etc
psnceus is 50% heal because i'm not trying to selfproof & this gives me actual sapblock counterplay

[umbral lava]

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[shrewd spoke]

specs diancie looks annoying, i'd like to fix that

[acoustic cradle]

https://pokepast.es/5d35a951093d49ac stab

wicked blow being free does not make me happy but eh

(some sort of latios hstack)

[orchid grove]

I think Gren just destroys this.

You don't really have any sort of retort outside of just switching around its STABs and hoping.

[acoustic cradle]

yep

forgot about that one

[orchid grove]

I think you could pretty easily solve this seeing as you already got Latios to check Volcanion Offensively letting you go Pex > WashTom to better get around this.

[acoustic cradle]

yeah latios was sorta there for that purpose lol

physdef pex? or sdef

[orchid grove]

I like PhysDef here to continue soaking up hits from stuff like WaterPon and Valiant better.

[acoustic cradle]

fair

team does not like waterpon either so thatd probably be nice

[orchid grove]

Granted most forms of Ogerpon are also pretty tough here but I think you have the tools to outplay.

Rillaboom also looks a bit scary.

[acoustic cradle]

hm

[orchid grove]

What does Sylveon do?

[acoustic cradle]

we can pretend gholdengo+tera dragon pex helps out enough idk

[orchid grove]

To help with both I think you could slot Torn-T > Sylv.

[acoustic cradle]

sylv is my removal and pressures ting/ttar i guess

those sorta becomes annoying without it

[orchid grove]

Oh yeah Torn can do some pretty similar stuff, it can Knock those two and keeps your Hazard control.

I think between Lando and Ting-Lu you're fine VS opposing Ting and Ttar.

[acoustic cradle]

aight then

ill give that a go

[orchid grove]

Ghold seems like a bit of a weird slot, I feel like there's smth better that could go there but it should be fine for now.

It helps VS RockPon so it can stay for now until I think of smth better (if I do think of anything it's probably fine lol)

[acoustic cradle]

aight

thank ya as always

[orchid grove]

np.

[gritty tinsel]

https://pokepast.es/73387528d0e33728