OM Rates | Smogon | Page 10

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:46 PM

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nosepass is pure rock

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:46 PM

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oh

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wait

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i was thinking of probopass

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:46 PM

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that being said @sacred oriole i can try? but im also like not there fully so

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:46 PM

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im dumbb

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:46 PM

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ok actually this one is easier

flint plover Oct 17, 2023, 10:46 PM

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The rillaboom could be a four attacks ogerpon, with supper power, ivy, knock and eq

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:48 PM

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yeah a lot of these are kinda just outclassed or the sets are suboptimal

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:48 PM

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ah

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:48 PM

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the best one here probably is like thorns or skewda, but skewda seems awkward at best to set up

flint plover Oct 17, 2023, 10:49 PM

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I prefer Close combat over high jump kick in cinder, you dont want to miss and the extra power is too little, may give it heavy duty boots if you dont want to give rapid spin to something

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:49 PM

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id also probably give it uturn over gunk because this looks a lot more offensive than anything

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:49 PM

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thank you for all the advice, im gonna make these changes asap

flint plover Oct 17, 2023, 10:49 PM

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barra is better with adapt and choice band as setting up isnt easy, with wave crash, jet punch and flip turn

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:49 PM

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idt skewda fits

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or rather

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cind makes the team more awkward

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:50 PM

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what does cind do

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:50 PM

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drought

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:50 PM

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other than weaken barra a bit

flint plover Oct 17, 2023, 10:50 PM

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is more than a bit tho

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:50 PM

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make everything weak to fires

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also that

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:50 PM

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ah

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:50 PM

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like your only counterplay to fires is av garg

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which should be a spinner anyway

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salt cure knock volt rapid imo

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:51 PM

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so i need more fire safety, gotcha

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:51 PM

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but stone edge is usable too

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:51 PM

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upbeat sapphire so i need more fire safety, gotcha

not just that but more direct synergy

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:51 PM

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i see

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so maybe a chlorophyll mon?

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solar blade?

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:51 PM

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some of the mons directly clash and youre not keeping in mind what happens when the mon leaves the field

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:52 PM

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/beam

flint plover Oct 17, 2023, 10:52 PM

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also replace gliscor with lando-t, it has better stats overall, with either a bulk up set or spike setter, poison heal is usually the better ability too

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:52 PM

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upbeat sapphire so maybe a chlorophyll mon?

i think rather you should allow for ways to abuse sun indirectly, think of offensive and defensive cores that allow for cind to abuse sun constantly without the fear of just stuff going crazy with it

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:52 PM

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flint plover also replace gliscor with lando-t, it has better stats overall, with either a bu...

honestly imo drop both

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:53 PM

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i see

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:53 PM

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you can easily fit something else in that intim role if you wanted and transition it into a pseudo-balance team

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:53 PM

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so like how do i abuse the sun indirectly?

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more water weak mons?

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since sun weakens water?

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:54 PM

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rather try to abuse what comes in

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i like thorns for that reason

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it directly benefits from balloon and sun

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:54 PM

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wait, sun?

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:55 PM

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yeah

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water moves

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:55 PM

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ohhh

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i see

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i have balloon thorns already

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hang on a moment

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HOW THE FUCK DOES GROWLITHE learn CLOSE COMBAT

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ok continue

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:56 PM

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actually

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you dont need spin on garg

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:57 PM

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what need

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:57 PM

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i have a set that works well specifically on this team

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:57 PM

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replace spin

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:57 PM

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give me one sec

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its up to u here tho bc spin is generally better as a move

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:58 PM

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alright

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also question

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is there a type combo that resists both grass and fighting

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:58 PM

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Ability: Intimidate  
Tera Type: Water  
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD  
Impish Nature  
- Brave Bird  
- Flip Turn  
- Roost  
- Defog / Thunder Wave / Knock Off```

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:58 PM

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upbeat sapphire is there a type combo that resists both grass and fighting

poison

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:58 PM

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true

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alright so eq

flint plover Oct 17, 2023, 10:58 PM

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flying

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}

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:58 PM

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ye but gyara doesnt

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i highlight gyara here because it gives you nice defensive util while switching into a lot of the stuff u fear

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 10:59 PM

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flint plover flying

fuck

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uhhh what beats both

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nothing

slim monolith Oct 17, 2023, 10:59 PM

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you do need a ground type to cover but like u can run stuff for that easily

upbeat sapphire Oct 17, 2023, 11:00 PM

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zen headbutt would work

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no

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thats only 90 acc

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hmmm

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what coverage do i need?

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@slim monolith

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hmmmmm

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is protosynthesis hatterene viable

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ehhh probly nah

high trellis Oct 18, 2023, 12:16 AM

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upbeat sapphire

Im pretty sure hliligant, and thus victory dance, is banned

upbeat sapphire Oct 18, 2023, 12:18 AM

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damn

compact dirge Oct 18, 2023, 12:32 PM

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As strong as hoopa-u is I think what you need in the defense slot is something that can switch into korai and has hazards, bc tspikes glowking alone doesn't really cut it imo

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 12:36 PM

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The fuck
What happened to bh wow
Im late

paper moat Oct 18, 2023, 1:03 PM

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do you mean the dexited mons?

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tldr: all mons actually have code that can be used in battle that contains their stats, abilities and type

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:06 PM

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paper moat do you mean the dexited mons?

Idk
I decided to quit showdown for a few months
Now im back then
uNecrozma and megas????????

paper moat Oct 18, 2023, 1:06 PM

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yes

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:07 PM

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How
Idk what is this dexited mons

paper moat Oct 18, 2023, 1:08 PM

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mons that are "not in" sv

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like megas, unecro and even like

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kartana

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:10 PM

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But why

paper moat Oct 18, 2023, 1:11 PM

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paper moat tldr: all mons actually have code that can be used in battle that contains their...

^

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gf is lazy

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:13 PM

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funnily enough they re-added all the cut mons

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all the tables were 0'd out in gen 8

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so they're not lazy, but just stupid perhaps? idk

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:15 PM

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I see

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Well

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How much has the bh meta changed?

paper moat Oct 18, 2023, 1:15 PM

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a lot

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:15 PM

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almost unrecognizable from pre-full dex aside from arceus

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:16 PM

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glape

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Well
Maybe i should back

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But idk

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:21 PM

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surreal portal almost unrecognizable from pre-full dex aside from arceus

Any new bans/unbans since then?

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:22 PM

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tera, hadron engine, substitute, imprison. dire claw, gorilla tactics, mega gengar, mega mewtwo y, protean/libero, tail glow

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:22 PM

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main sequoia Any new bans/unbans since then?

we banned tera (big one)

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also the ones tea mentioned but theyre not as big

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:22 PM

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zamazenta-c and palafin-h are also now unobtainable with a custom ability

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:23 PM

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zama-c can’t even have an item too unfort

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:23 PM

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surreal portal tera, hadron engine, substitute, imprison. dire claw, gorilla tactics, mega geng...

Jesus, even hadron
What pokemon made it get banned exactly?

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:23 PM

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funnily enough regieleki

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:24 PM

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firedog

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:26 PM

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how can m\i make this bh team better?
https://pokepast.es/8f283016d14db613

umbral lavaBOT Oct 18, 2023, 1:26 PM

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New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:26 PM

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surreal portal funnily enough regieleki

i think hadron could be free now that we have real guys to wall him

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but then again mirai is holding the tier back together

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:27 PM

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absolutely not free with mirai around

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zero chance

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:27 PM

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red violet how can m\i make this bh team better? https://pokepast.es/8f283016d14db613

?

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:28 PM

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on this sort of structure i'd probably recommend gunk shot arc-ghost instead of triple arrows; you also don't have a very secure ho-oh improof currently since ho-oh never beats imp and pretty sure knocked yveltal just dies if rocks are up

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:29 PM

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red violet how can m\i make this bh team better? https://pokepast.es/8f283016d14db613

i think mdiancie should be specs
or you can do something like explosion because snr ghostceus is right there (should be low kick/gunk shot > tarrows btw)

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:29 PM

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other set adjustments can be stuff like revdance or draco instead of make it rain on dialga, making it max speed teleport rather than min speed pshot (to underspeed stuff like mlix and regenvest pogre), and to use a move on diancie like v-create that will hit steels for good damage

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:30 PM

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surreal portal on this sort of structure i'd probably recommend gunk shot arc-ghost instead of ...

im new to this meta so 😭

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:30 PM

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we all start somewhere

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:30 PM

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shrewd spoke i think hadron could be free now that we have real guys to wall him

idt there's actually any good electric resists brought in with fulldex ngl

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that don't just get blown up by coverage (ie. grass knot for mpert)

oak topaz Oct 18, 2023, 1:31 PM

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surreal portal idt there's actually any good electric resists brought in with fulldex ngl

Biggest uh

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Mega Venusaur

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:31 PM

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dragon energy / armor cannon gg

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:31 PM

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arent people running armor cannon

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:31 PM

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surreal portal on this sort of structure i'd probably recommend gunk shot arc-ghost instead of ...

can i use smtn else instead of gunkshot?

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:31 PM

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standard mirai is cage/torch/mortal or spikes/sap

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:32 PM

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i really hate game ending misses

oak topaz Oct 18, 2023, 1:32 PM

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All we needed was zygod

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:32 PM

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red violet can i use smtn else instead of gunkshot?

gunk is specifically chosen because of its power into fairy-types while still maintaining an imposter-proof, so no not really

oak topaz Oct 18, 2023, 1:32 PM

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You can use noxious

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:32 PM

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red violet i really hate game ending misses

umm uhh noxious torque but then you actually gotta improof it

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:32 PM

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something like noxious torque misses the OHKO on stuff after rocks

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+2 252 Atk Arceus-Ghost Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Arceus-Fairy: 344-406 (77.4 - 91.4%) -- 25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 Atk Arceus-Ghost Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Audino-Mega: 332-392 (80.9 - 95.6%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:34 PM

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fur coat boots maudi ggez skill issue

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:34 PM

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sick uhh

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any phys attacker matchup

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:34 PM

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i simply run 2 more fcs

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totally viable

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:35 PM

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do i replace ho-oh?

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:35 PM

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yeah idt its providing much here

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:36 PM

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kinda why im asking

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:40 PM

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Can fur coat affect body press?
I dont remember

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:40 PM

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no

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:40 PM

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Shit

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Is there any pokemon with single huge stat that can shine somehow?

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:42 PM

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kartana

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:43 PM

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Ah ye
How could i forgot my second favorite ub

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:44 PM

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red violet do i replace ho-oh?

what should i replace it with?

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:45 PM

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red violet what should i replace it with?

probably some kind of hazard removal, like mirai who also helps w/ kart

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:46 PM

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Is final gambit viable?

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:47 PM

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well it’s not consistent because everything has so high hp but you can bait specific stuff in

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like SNR lunala

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you bait scales arc in, you gambit on them

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and then SNR ghostceus instantly wins

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:48 PM

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shrewd spoke like SNR lunala

Snr?

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Oh

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Simple no retreat

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Fuck
I always got the answer by myself right after asking

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CalyrexBrain

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:50 PM

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i wonder if throat spray simple clangorous soul stored power is cooking

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:51 PM

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shrewd spoke and then SNR ghostceus instantly wins

Is there any other hybrid offense viable besides hoopaU?

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:52 PM

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red violet i wonder if throat spray simple clangorous soul stored power is cooking

this already sort of exists with fillet away + sitrus berry (or just no retreat); the issue is that without an item only very specific and often otherwise-flawed mons can actually sweep while not being bricked by imposter

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:53 PM

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main sequoia Is there any other hybrid offense viable besides hoopaU?

Hmmm
Maybe DeoxysA but idk if its banned or not

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:53 PM

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it is allowed

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:53 PM

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Oh

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Sheeesh

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:53 PM

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we banned it for a while but we banned protean instead and that’s now free

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 1:53 PM

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main sequoia Is there any other hybrid offense viable besides hoopaU?

there are a couple good mixed attackers like mmx, mega diancie, and deo-a, but not that many are good with setup stuff

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:53 PM

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it’s kinda meh now actually

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:54 PM

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Dont care tbh
Guess ill return to showdown bh now that my favorite buddies have returned

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:55 PM

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big kart

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stupid as hell

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(please ban)

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:56 PM

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shrewd spoke stupid as hell

Insert american dad meter meme clef

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Hmmmm
Marshadow
Melmetal
Darkrai
The whole gang i love is here now

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:58 PM

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free multi attack…

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also uh here’s a funny team

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https://pokepast.es/25b4c2a10ea96390
(bh) i hate fairyceus

red violet Oct 18, 2023, 1:59 PM

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shrewd spoke probably some kind of hazard removal, like mirai who also helps w/ kart

btw which set?

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 1:59 PM

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i probably dont need judge on etern

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 1:59 PM

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shrewd spoke free multi attack…

cwl

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 2:00 PM

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red violet btw which set?

tcage + sap + mortal + torch/salt/th/whatever random coverage that can maybe hit grounds and doesn’t break the selfproof

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 2:05 PM

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shrewd spoke free multi attack…

Wait
Dont you need like silvally itself to change ma type?

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 2:05 PM

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no

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its just the memory

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 2:07 PM

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I see

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What

wise iron Oct 18, 2023, 2:10 PM

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Multi attack doesn't exist in Gen 9

sleek merlin Oct 18, 2023, 2:12 PM

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@main sequoia basically all the pokemon's data was found in the code of SV but none of the moves were

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meaning they aren't usuable

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 2:13 PM

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sleek merlin <@551757101819756544> basically all the pokemon's data was found in the code of ...

Lmao

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Hmmmm
Maybe
I just dont know what attacks because im not familiar with the meta

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And maybe fillet away instead victory dance

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 2:33 PM

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i think i cooked with mluc once

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what i say from the experience is that just use mmx

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 2:37 PM

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shrewd spoke what i say from the experience is that just use mmx

Mmx?

shrewd spoke Oct 18, 2023, 2:37 PM

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mega mewtwo x

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 2:38 PM

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Oh

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Fuck

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 3:05 PM

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shrewd spoke mega mewtwo x

Why is mewy banned but x not?

prime bane Oct 18, 2023, 3:06 PM

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Special attacking psychics are generally better than phys attacking psychics

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And y is faster and stronger than x

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 3:07 PM

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Thank god spatk gorilla tatics isnt a thing ~~yet~~

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Hmmmm

surreal portal Oct 18, 2023, 3:16 PM

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main sequoia Why is mewy banned but x not?

slower, weak to fairy, generally more special options than physical

main sequoia Oct 18, 2023, 4:44 PM

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surreal portal slower, weak to fairy, generally more special options than physical

messi

stiff python Oct 18, 2023, 8:17 PM

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this team needs a better way to beat gliscor since i'm forced to tera against it https://pokepast.es/eaf47517429568db

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thought about maybe using wellspring ogerpon over cornerstone

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godly gift btw

red violet Oct 19, 2023, 10:38 AM

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shrewd spoke tcage + sap + mortal + torch/salt/th/whatever random coverage that can maybe hit...

what item and ability?

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 10:39 AM

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fur coat covert cloak

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 11:45 AM

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shrewd spoke https://pokepast.es/25b4c2a10ea96390 (bh) i hate fairyceus

https://pokepast.es/5732dfc18b947daf
“fixed” some kinda glaring issues
no mixed guys suck but it is what it is

lone helm Oct 19, 2023, 12:00 PM

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what does bisharp do on this team..

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 12:02 PM

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i can improof mlati etern hooh and maybe check kart

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it still fucking sucks but lol

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 12:08 PM

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steam mirai doesn't look like it really does anything here

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except specifically hit groundceus, which grass knot / possibly seed flare exist for

oak topaz Oct 19, 2023, 1:00 PM

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Please do not run modest etern

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 1:51 PM

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Will terrain pulse inside terrain+mega launcher deal 125BP or 150BP?

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 2:42 PM

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oak topaz Please do not run modest etern

i will run modest etern to annoy the shit outta random 120 base speed guys (and also you)

oak topaz Oct 19, 2023, 3:00 PM

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?

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Only one that will be annoyed is you when you don’t outspeed the scales arc?

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:02 PM

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who needs outspeeding the scales arc when i either

murder the shit out of them
i get murdered regardless of speed in which case i click prankbond and profit more with less speed
joe

oak topaz Oct 19, 2023, 3:05 PM

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Scald waterceus 6-0s

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:11 PM

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i have a miraidon?

lone helm Oct 19, 2023, 3:11 PM

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~~volt absorb waterceus Copium ~~

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:11 PM

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cookery

lone helm Oct 19, 2023, 3:12 PM

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🔥 🔥 burning the kitchen with this one

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:12 PM

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in which case i hard mlati and then click denergy

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wyd

lone helm Oct 19, 2023, 3:13 PM

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shrewd spoke wyd

live and ohko NAWWWWW

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:14 PM

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main sequoia Will terrain pulse inside terrain+mega launcher deal 125BP or 150BP?

?

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:16 PM

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main sequoia ?

if i’m calculating it correctly it should be 195 in non-misty terrain

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 3:16 PM

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order of application seems to be "doubled in terrain" -> mega launcher -> 1.3x terrain boost

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:17 PM

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Why is thing allowed firedog

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:17 PM

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surreal portal order of application seems to be "doubled in terrain" -> mega launcher -> 1.3x t...

does the order matter

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 3:17 PM

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because steel-types are allowed

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 3:17 PM

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shrewd spoke does the order matter

depending on whether terrain pulse doubles damage or sets to 100 bp, yes

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if former then order doesn't matter

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:17 PM

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fair

dusk pasture Oct 19, 2023, 3:18 PM

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i used to experiment with a dumb 4a necromza ultra

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was fun

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:18 PM

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what was the set

dusk pasture Oct 19, 2023, 3:18 PM

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idr

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:18 PM

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dusk pasture i used to experiment with a dumb 4a necromza ultra

4a?

dusk pasture Oct 19, 2023, 3:18 PM

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it was kinda similar?

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:18 PM

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4 attacks

dusk pasture Oct 19, 2023, 3:19 PM

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i just remember it being like

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:19 PM

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Oh

dusk pasture Oct 19, 2023, 3:19 PM

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a bit of a pain to use and improof

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 3:19 PM

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i was using sor expert belt with glaive / gigaton / crash / v-create

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:20 PM

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dusk pasture a bit of a pain to use and improof

Well i guess not giving him steel counter is a kind of improof already

dusk pasture Oct 19, 2023, 3:20 PM

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yeah but then your set sucks

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:20 PM

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And using a steel type aswell

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 3:20 PM

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the main issue is that you have a mon that doesn't hit steel types at that point, and putting v-create on to hit steels is going to get much more value

prime bane Oct 19, 2023, 3:20 PM

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My unecs are usually mglo/beads or that one fc set i experimented with

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:21 PM

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nah the fc unec is fire as hell

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best mmx check ever

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coverage who

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:21 PM

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prime bane My unecs are usually mglo/beads or that one fc set i experimented with

Mglo?

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 3:21 PM

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magic guard life orb

prime bane Oct 19, 2023, 3:21 PM

#

Magic guard life orb

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:21 PM

#

Oh

#

This

dusk pasture Oct 19, 2023, 3:21 PM

#

shrewd spoke best mmx check ever

the astral barrage and moldy wicked blow in question

prime bane Oct 19, 2023, 3:22 PM

#

Fc is nice its speed tier is rly good and it can afford to run a defensive ability cuz it has like

#

172 or something spa

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 3:22 PM

#

167?

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:22 PM

#

dusk pasture the astral barrage and moldy wicked blow in question

there are monkeys in the walls

prime bane Oct 19, 2023, 3:22 PM

#

Idk prob smth along those lines

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 3:22 PM

#

its a prime number around that range

dusk pasture Oct 19, 2023, 3:22 PM

#

doesn't it get like ohko'd by moldy gigaton as well

prime bane Oct 19, 2023, 3:22 PM

#

Ran like

#

Lumina draco knock ssap

#

Pretty potent

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:23 PM

#

zacian if it actually hit hard

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:24 PM

#

It does
Its just not allowed to

#

clueless

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:25 PM

#

the pixilate banded popbomb when i pull out any fc that isnt miraidon

#

or even better, i simply dodge

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:26 PM

#

Hmmmm

prime bane Oct 19, 2023, 3:26 PM

#

Thats a lotta random moves and idk what they hit lmao

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:27 PM

#

Neither me
Im totally clueless about meta atm

shrewd spoke Oct 19, 2023, 3:27 PM

#

flare hits mlix sbeam hits fairyceus chloro hits waterceus and head smash does i don’t fucking know

lone helm Oct 19, 2023, 3:27 PM

#

head smash probably ho=oh i guess

#

ho-oh*

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 3:28 PM

#

shrewd spoke flare hits mlix sbeam hits fairyceus chloro hits waterceus and head smash does i...

Head smah is stronk
Why not clueless

high trellis Oct 19, 2023, 5:11 PM

#

main sequoia Hmmmm

I like the 0 stab this thing has

#

Buddy you aren't doing any damage

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 5:11 PM

#

surreal portal order of application seems to be "doubled in terrain" -> mega launcher -> 1.3x t...

oh so like
if you setup things correctly terrain pulse can turn into a extremely busted move
btw is there any updated doc about current bh meta or is it still in progress?

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 5:12 PM

#

set up correctly it will do a lot of damage yes, but there's damage options that aren't too far of 195 (esurge + rising voltage, pixilate + boomburst, etc) that are generally more useful thanks to not requiring team support

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 5:12 PM

#

high trellis Buddy you aren't doing any damage

ik
im just doing random combinations that pop up out of my mind and sharing here to see what other people think about it

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 5:12 PM

#

for stuff about current bh meta you have the main thread (https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/balanced-hackmons-mortal-spin-stays-free-samples-open-survey-533.3710859/) and the resources thread (https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/balanced-hackmons-resources-thread.3712766/)

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 5:12 PM

#

nice

#

tysm

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 5:13 PM

#

surreal portal for stuff about current bh meta you have the main thread (https://www.smogon.com...

why is shedinja banned?
sturdy being busted as aways?

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 5:14 PM

#

sturdy with no mold breaker moves + protective pads, goggles, and boots

main sequoia Oct 19, 2023, 5:14 PM

#

i thought so

#

#

interesting
parallel sides ended in opposing ways
pgroundon banned and mewx allowed
pkyogre allowed and mewy banned

normal marlin Oct 19, 2023, 5:19 PM

#

This is MnM

#

Right

surreal portal Oct 19, 2023, 5:20 PM

#

no

#

bh

normal marlin Oct 19, 2023, 6:25 PM

#

Ah ok

oak topaz Oct 20, 2023, 12:42 AM

#

shrewd spoke i have a miraidon?

It clicks take heart to +6 and sweeps

golden tendon Oct 20, 2023, 12:52 AM

#

i ned help with my little cup team :(

#

https://pokepast.es/f41c47e2e7b8c6cd

dusk pasture Oct 20, 2023, 12:53 AM

#

wrong channel

golden tendon Oct 20, 2023, 12:53 AM

#

wat channel

#

do i use

dusk pasture Oct 20, 2023, 12:53 AM

#

well normally you'd use LC rates but that's closed for some reason

#

so you can ask in general i guess

golden tendon Oct 20, 2023, 12:54 AM

#

no one will respond in general tho :(

dusk pasture Oct 20, 2023, 12:54 AM

#

unlucky but this isn't the right place

shrewd spoke Oct 20, 2023, 2:15 PM

#

oak topaz It clicks take heart to +6 and sweeps

yeah while i click np and deal a billion

#

i just hard it in

#

and boost faster

#

while it 3hkos me at +4

oak topaz Oct 20, 2023, 2:25 PM

#

Scales gigachad

shrewd spoke Oct 20, 2023, 2:26 PM

#

the scales when i +4 252 SpA Galvanize Miraidon Boomburst vs. +3 252 HP / 252 SpD Ice Scales Arceus-Water: 237-279 (53.3 - 62.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

oak topaz Oct 20, 2023, 2:48 PM

#

Oh

main sequoia Oct 20, 2023, 5:20 PM

#

oak topaz It clicks take heart to +6 and sweeps

wait
what does take heart do?
i've only heard about this move

sacred oriole Oct 20, 2023, 5:21 PM

#

It’s new this gen

#

Calm mind + cures status

main sequoia Oct 20, 2023, 5:23 PM

#

wow

high trellis Oct 20, 2023, 8:01 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/00629fe0f2fe7a96 hey so

#

How do i stop loathing this gen, and how do i not lose to everything by using a three guy defensive core (aaa)

sacred oriole Oct 20, 2023, 8:03 PM

#

you forgot your regen

#

I don't love Hadron LO Gengar, I would go Sheer Force or Specs

#

to have more staying power

#

I think actually depending on how you want to proceed, I'd replace one of Ghold, Gengar, or Gapdos with a regenvest

#

and probably SoR > TC; it's not a huge boost, but it's somethign and you're not bluffing much with hidden ability

high trellis Oct 20, 2023, 8:10 PM

#

sacred oriole you forgot your regen

I had a regen fighting over corb i forgor

high trellis Oct 20, 2023, 8:10 PM

#

sacred oriole I don't love Hadron LO Gengar, I would go Sheer Force or Specs

Its to at least trade with the opposing av so that ghold can win

high trellis Oct 20, 2023, 8:11 PM

#

sacred oriole I think actually depending on how you want to proceed, I'd replace one of Ghold,...

Not the spdef guy?

sacred oriole Oct 20, 2023, 8:13 PM

#

Wait lol I said regenvest instead of just regen

#

Slap a regen tusk on this team and have a good one

#

Can be regenvest or not, take your pick

high trellis Oct 20, 2023, 8:16 PM

#

Regen Lo

#

Y/n

sacred oriole Oct 20, 2023, 8:16 PM

#

I mean I wouldn't, but it's not the dumbest thing ever

sage rose Oct 22, 2023, 11:48 PM

#

GG rmt https://pokepast.es/0cdd550b09c3e987, ik theres no hazard control but I have alot of boots

umbral lavaBOT Oct 22, 2023, 11:48 PM

#

New GG RMT @broken kestrel. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

sacred oriole Oct 22, 2023, 11:53 PM

#

I would say the meta is too unsettled for serious rates, but you’re missing a nature on Volc, probably would rather have defense investment on it than SpD

shrewd spoke Oct 23, 2023, 12:37 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/83ecd29e6e191a27
(bh) i have no idea what i’m doing
the “idea” is that i bait miraidon in after they know i’m aerilate and then i epically click draco on the switch and ohko them and then i win with kart

umbral lavaBOT Oct 23, 2023, 12:37 PM

#

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

shrewd spoke Oct 23, 2023, 12:38 PM

#

explosion was kinda a leftover i should probably change it

dusk pasture Oct 23, 2023, 12:39 PM

#

shrewd spoke https://pokepast.es/83ecd29e6e191a27 (bh) i have no idea what i’m doing the “ide...

mon walled by the 3rd most common mon in this tier is interesting

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 12:42 PM

#

yeah i mean the main issue is that if you don't catch mirai with draco you sort of just never make progress against it

oak topaz Oct 23, 2023, 12:48 PM

#

Not the hallward Mari

shrewd spoke Oct 23, 2023, 1:14 PM

#

i started as ghostceus mmence but then i instantly lost to kyu-b without any remorse so i just copied the big unoriginal core

oak topaz Oct 23, 2023, 1:15 PM

#

How does that help against kyub

shrewd spoke Oct 23, 2023, 1:16 PM

#

i lose less now

#

between fairyceus and kart

oak topaz Oct 23, 2023, 1:16 PM

#

?????

shrewd spoke Oct 23, 2023, 1:16 PM

#

what is vcreate never heard of that

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 1:17 PM

#

Maybe

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 1:20 PM

#

what is the base 145 speed mon first impressioning

oak topaz Oct 23, 2023, 1:21 PM

#

Deoa

#

Duh

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 1:21 PM

#

/dt pheromosa

oak topaz Oct 23, 2023, 1:22 PM

#

Big psn stab

tired cave Oct 23, 2023, 3:38 PM

#

Now let em cook

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 4:57 PM

#

oak topaz Big psn stab

What is psn

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 4:57 PM

#

Poison

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 4:57 PM

#

surreal portal what is the base 145 speed mon first impressioning

Ok fine
Better? firedog

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 4:59 PM

#

you'd want gunk / v-create / u-turn / filler with jolly

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:13 PM

#

@echo lodge rate my team: https://pokepast.es/67f049e748355013

high trellis Oct 23, 2023, 5:15 PM

#

Whats your gameplan vs azelf

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:15 PM

#

None of your screens abusers actually beat azelf unless screens ar eup

#

Which sounds dire

high trellis Oct 23, 2023, 5:15 PM

#

Even then

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:15 PM

#

oh nvm, it's max spdef enamt

#

you're set

#

it's playable

high trellis Oct 23, 2023, 5:15 PM

#

How much does enami take from scarfzelf eforce

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

only change I would make is you probably want uhhh

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

is it playable?

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

not modest iron moth

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

252 SpA Azelf Expanding Force (120 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Enamorus-Therian in Psychic Terrain: 178-211 (50.7 - 60.1%) -- 88.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

you can't heal with enam

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

You need max speed right away in case you don't get an agility

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

I am trying to get more variety in teams for sampels

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

surreal portal is it playable?

with screens up 4 things scare it out

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

and we have no HO sample rn

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

without screens up, azelf dies or almost dies if it attacks enamt

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

echo lodge with screens up 4 things scare it out

my point was without screens

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:16 PM

#

depending on what point of the game

#

It's pretty scar ythough

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:17 PM

#

just, don't get caught with screens down

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:17 PM

#

maybe roaring moon > kommo-o?

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 5:17 PM

#

enam can't dkiss so it just dies no

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:17 PM

#

I don't think hitting corv is that important with this team

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:17 PM

#

yeah that makes sense

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:17 PM

#

Not sure what the magic HO roaring moon is, though

#

I doubt fluffy is still any good

#

and it does kinda just get farmed by tusk

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:17 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/d7e7bae679949e05

#

SoR seems fine

#

wait let me calc something

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:18 PM

#

that should work out

#

Honestly I would consider weakness policy

#

on the rmoon

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:18 PM

#

oh

#

moon has 55 SpA

#

nvm

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:18 PM

#

you're almost definitely getting hut by a uturn

#

at some point

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:18 PM

#

oo weakness sounds heat yeah

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:18 PM

#

and that might be enough to do actual dmg to tusk

#

Roaring Moon cannot be adamant

#

you need to be faster than azelf at +1

#

non negotiable option

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:19 PM

#

right that's why we're doing this lol

#

SoR or Fluffy

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:20 PM

#

probably sor since weakness policy

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:20 PM

#

works

#

https://pokepast.es/904ad765a0a52356

#

good now?

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:20 PM

#

Hmm

#

I would use the dex corv ev spread

#

Corviknight @ Light Clay
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 192 Def / 64 Spe
Impish Nature

Reflect
Light Screen
Taunt
U-turn

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:21 PM

#

did

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:21 PM

#

in case you run into max speed spidops

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:21 PM

#

In case you--

#

okay

#

https://pokepast.es/5ebf0e0ca0a5b454 final answer?

echo lodge Oct 23, 2023, 5:22 PM

#

It seems usable enough to test now

#

so yeah prob

#

Last consideration I can think of is maybe ebelt or LO on moth instead

sacred oriole Oct 23, 2023, 5:28 PM

#

yeah LO good call

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 6:38 PM

#

surreal portal you'd want gunk / v-create / u-turn / filler with jolly

Btw
What are the currently most common fc/scales users?

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 6:38 PM

#

miraidon, yveltal, arceus-poison

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 6:42 PM

#

surreal portal miraidon, yveltal, arceus-poison

Is moldy unecrozma viable?

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 6:43 PM

#

it probably is but its a hard sell when mmx is right there

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 6:44 PM

#

Ah yeah

#

cordead

#

maybe

#

or maybe fleur cannon instead hammer/vcreate bc of mmx and yveltal

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 6:55 PM

#

scarf is sort of pointless here

#

it's already faster than arc and the choice lock is not convenient

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 7:46 PM

#

surreal portal scarf is sort of pointless here

what item then

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 7:47 PM

#

expert belt or life orb imo

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 8:41 PM

#

Im considering build a new team for the current meta
Since i believe my previous one is unviable now
What should i keep in mind while making a new team?

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 8:42 PM

#

there are big meta threats that are basically required to answer (things like kartana, mmx, miraidon, cm arc, etc), so these should be on your team

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 8:43 PM

#

surreal portal there are big meta threats that are basically required to answer (things like ka...

Cm?

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 8:43 PM

#

calm mind

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 8:43 PM

#

Oh

surreal portal Oct 23, 2023, 8:43 PM

#

/ take heart

main sequoia Oct 23, 2023, 8:44 PM

#

Yeah
I think take heart is generally better since annoying para exist

#

And i hate rng stuff like hell

fossil cove Oct 24, 2023, 9:51 AM

#

https://pokepast.es/0828471039d4f050 (bh)

umbral lavaBOT Oct 24, 2023, 9:51 AM

#

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

fossil cove Oct 24, 2023, 9:53 AM

#

(also can one of you like my post for the om analyses plzz?)

surreal portal Oct 24, 2023, 9:58 AM

#

fossil cove (also can one of you like my post for the om analyses plzz?)

we're discussing the set

surreal portal Oct 24, 2023, 9:59 AM

#

fossil cove https://pokepast.es/0828471039d4f050 (bh)

ok this seems sound but ho-oh doesn't seem like it does anything here given you already have scales arc-psn

#

there's also not really a backup plan against spooky plate imp

#

(you'd want haze chansey in this case)

dusk pasture Oct 24, 2023, 10:28 AM

#

btw isn't mixed mglo mmx a huge pain for this team

#

i guess imp and celesteela are there?

surreal portal Oct 24, 2023, 10:30 AM

#

oh yeah no fur coater i just realized

dusk pasture Oct 24, 2023, 10:46 AM

#

another day another kyu-b victim

oak topaz Oct 24, 2023, 10:56 AM

#

Why is it a deoa walled by fc mirai

#

Idt hooh is improofed

fossil cove Oct 24, 2023, 11:09 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/cb41f37c4219fb5a back with the bh

umbral lavaBOT Oct 24, 2023, 11:09 PM

#

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

dusk pasture Oct 24, 2023, 11:13 PM

#

arent both your breakers walled by fc miraidon

#

i guess you have a simple lunala

fossil cove Oct 24, 2023, 11:16 PM

#

mb kart

dusk pasture Oct 24, 2023, 11:16 PM

#

that kart still gets walled by miraidon without ability shield

fossil cove Oct 24, 2023, 11:17 PM

#

do i run headlong rush then?

oak topaz Oct 25, 2023, 12:13 AM

#

Please do not run a deoa that gets walled by fc mirai

#

The entire point of deoa is running coverage that is walled by none of the best mons

fossil cove Oct 25, 2023, 12:16 AM

#

ah

#

lumina then?

oak topaz Oct 25, 2023, 12:41 AM

#

Imo lumina isn’t very good on deoa

#

You don’t have the bulk to use it well

#

And in terms of actual coverage it only hits psn

red violet Oct 25, 2023, 9:18 AM

#

https://pokepast.es/b60555b0ad5a7eb7
is this godly gift sun team i made any good?

umbral lavaBOT Oct 25, 2023, 9:18 AM

#

New GG RMT @broken kestrel. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

dusk pasture Oct 25, 2023, 9:25 AM

#

red violet https://pokepast.es/b60555b0ad5a7eb7 is this godly gift sun team i made any goo...

im assuming that koraidon shouldn't have a serious nature

red violet Oct 25, 2023, 9:27 AM

#

oh

#

didtn see that

#

so is it?

main sequoia Oct 25, 2023, 11:44 AM

#

Which one is better with technician
Triple dive or surging strikes

dusk pasture Oct 25, 2023, 11:49 AM

#

surging strikes would be stronger

sacred oriole Oct 25, 2023, 12:32 PM

#

Liligant should be Adamant and not have Weather Ball, something like Ice Spinner is probably a better last move

#

Also give it Life Orb

#

Your team has no reliable method of getting your sun users in, I would strongly consider adding 1-2 pivots like Corv or Amololololomolololo so you can get your users in safely

#

Also, for a sun team, relying on non-Heat Rock Koraidon as your only source of sun is really iffy

#

I ironically would recommend using a different god + Torkoal to build sun, maybe someone like Etern or Rayquaza

#

But that’s a larger change than worth going down rn

main sequoia Oct 25, 2023, 12:40 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/0e0b62fa7f723e1e (bh)
Might be good, might be bad, idk yet

umbral lavaBOT Oct 25, 2023, 12:40 PM

#

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

surreal portal Oct 25, 2023, 12:42 PM

#

with that deo's specific coverage you don't really have an improof for it outside of trading with mirai or arc, and with kart / mmx it feels like these sets are putting moves on to get value out of their abilities rather than being good moves

#

eg. wave crash and head smash on mmx hit a combined total of ho-oh, which you already do up to 44 to with high jump kick, so neither really needs to be here

main sequoia Oct 25, 2023, 12:52 PM

#

surreal portal with that deo's specific coverage you don't really have an improof for it outsid...

So
What should i change to

surreal portal Oct 25, 2023, 12:55 PM

#

given the improofs you have you likely want something like hjk/sap/gigaton/fleur or astral mmx, scarf sor kartana, and if you want a deo set then psychic surge with gigaton is probably the best bet provided you're ok with the shaky improof

main sequoia Oct 25, 2023, 12:57 PM

#

Ok

oak topaz Oct 25, 2023, 1:43 PM

#

Fc psn scales mirai is a very very very very shaky defensive core

#

When you take way too much from mg mmx hjks and get destroyed by chomp

main sequoia Oct 25, 2023, 1:44 PM

#

Too much acronyms kirbyUH

orchid grove Oct 25, 2023, 4:27 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/b338f9b1afe14b51

New STABmons team starring Band Tusk because this mon is seriously hard to switch into with the current meta.

#

Kommo-o is an interesting anti-meta rocker, checks basically all the Torch Song users + Ursa BM while also being annoying into Gambit and Ogerpon forms.

high trellis Oct 25, 2023, 5:42 PM

#

run either infernal parade or bitter malice on ghold

#

unless you can really justify the 5 bp difference withs shadow ball

orchid grove Oct 25, 2023, 6:04 PM

#

Gholdengo gets way more out of Sp. Def drops from Shadow Ball, even if rare, than the Atk drops VS mons that (who commonly switch in) don't even care about the atk drop and threaten it out regardless of them.

high trellis Oct 25, 2023, 7:11 PM

#

orchid grove Gholdengo gets way more out of Sp. Def drops from Shadow Ball, even if rare, tha...

Buddy

#

Dude

#

2 bitter malices can turn most ground types into free setup

#

Admittedly better on bulky sets tho

orchid grove Oct 25, 2023, 7:12 PM

#

This very clearly is not a bulky set lol
also Bulky sets would even then rather Infernal Parade to not have to deal with having the PP on their main attacking move cut in half.

#

And even then for a less effective secondary effect than Infernal Parade provides.

#

The only time Infernal Parade relevantly comes into play on Scarf outside of fishing and praying for a Burn is VS Gliscor, who already isn't a super concrete switch in.

#

Also literally the only Ground type Gholdengo has massive issues with is Ting-Lu, what you're thinking more about with Scarf Dengo is AV Pex, thus Plot + Trick, because the only way Ghold is feasibly getting through Ting-Lu is if they straight up let you get to +6.

high trellis Oct 25, 2023, 10:35 PM

#

getting a burn is hard

#

getting two bitter malices is easy

#

and since very few tinglers run whirlwind, you can get to +6 for free after theyre at -2

#

especially with good tera usage

orchid grove Oct 25, 2023, 10:40 PM

#

high trellis and since very few tinglers run whirlwind, you can get to +6 for free after they...

In order for that to even be an actually legitimate option to advance the game from you need to
a. have tricked the Ting-Lu so that you can actually set up Nasty Plot
b. have to be playing against a team that actually has Ting-Lu
c. have the actual health left to properly set up even WITH two Bitter Malice drops
d. not have used Tera to even generate that opportunity
and e. somehow still be exhausted of every other option that you actually need to go for such a desperate play.

#

but why do all that when I can just
play good and never have to get in that situation in the first place?

#

esp when I have a whole 3 different responses to Ting-Lu

#

Actually no four if you wanna stretch and include Wellspring Ogerpon.

high trellis Oct 25, 2023, 10:43 PM

#

orchid grove In order for that to even be an actually legitimate option to advance the game f...

bulky wincon ghold is legit wydm

#

you exaust their resourses, kill things that might cause problems

#

get ghold in, click bm twice and then recover

#

and nplot to +6

#

either way the defensive boost can come in handy even for offensive ghold

#

again, idk if you can justify the 5 extra bp

orchid grove Oct 25, 2023, 10:54 PM

#

high trellis bulky wincon ghold is legit wydm

This is not a Bulky Ghold

#

it is literally in the Paste as an Offensive Choice Scarf user

#

and even then if you're going to sacrifice Power you're either sacrificing it for Infernal Parade or you're not sacrificing at all.

#

Nasty Plot is there to not be a huge momentum sink when it sheds its scarf, otherwise once Scarf is gone I might as well be down a mon.

orchid grove Oct 25, 2023, 10:57 PM

#

high trellis either way the defensive boost can come in handy even for offensive ghold

Randomly Sp. Def dropping their main check and then proceeding to run away with the game comes in a lot more handy.

#

Also if Ting-Lu ends up getting Tricked while trying to switch in on Scarf Ghold it might as well be put out of comission anyway because it gets coverted into a Spike/Parting Shot bot which neither of make much progress into this team between Lando and Kommo-o.

still tangle Oct 26, 2023, 5:10 AM

#

https://pokepast.es/8b0cc5d24713a411

https://pokepast.es/d5a1aacd0d8dac87
BH rate(s)

umbral lavaBOT Oct 26, 2023, 5:10 AM

#

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

oak topaz Oct 26, 2023, 6:59 AM

#

Very weak improofing in team 1

#

Second team looks better but sceptile can’t touch steels and there are some odd stuff like baneful zac

normal marlin Oct 26, 2023, 2:29 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/f09535f26b4b4444 Trick Magic team, ive never played BSS

surreal portal Oct 26, 2023, 2:40 PM

#

bss has its own channel

#

its currently locked though

normal marlin Oct 26, 2023, 2:51 PM

#

Yeah

#

And trick magic is like
“BSS Monothreat Ghost” so its very much in OM territory

still tangle Oct 26, 2023, 4:29 PM

#

oak topaz Very weak improofing in team 1

How would I fix the issues with the teams?

high trellis Oct 26, 2023, 4:38 PM

#

normal marlin And trick magic is like “BSS Monothreat Ghost” so its very much in OM territory

Monothread is not om like

normal marlin Oct 26, 2023, 6:00 PM

#

Yeah but combining two metas in this way is

#

Plus zu is an om technically, apparently

#

Look where do i even post this

high trellis Oct 26, 2023, 6:20 PM

#

normal marlin Yeah but combining two metas in this way is

Thad be an omm, and even then since none of the base metas is an om it wouldnt count

high trellis Oct 26, 2023, 6:20 PM

#

normal marlin Plus zu is an om technically, apparently

Zu is an unofficial meta, or um, which is different from an other metagame, or om

high trellis Oct 26, 2023, 6:21 PM

#

normal marlin Look where do i even post this

Theres a thread that says "other"

#

That one

#

https://discord.com/channels/192713314399289344/1060682530094862477

normal marlin Oct 26, 2023, 6:23 PM

#

Ok

#

Thanks

still tangle Oct 27, 2023, 6:22 AM

#

https://pokepast.es/be1c714b1ed8181b
BH rate

umbral lavaBOT Oct 27, 2023, 6:22 AM

#

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

still tangle Oct 27, 2023, 6:23 AM

#

Fixed the team a bit (I think?)

oak topaz Oct 27, 2023, 7:06 AM

#

Actually pretty good improvements

#

I think the main issue here is that it’s basically solo palko for progress

#

While the bounce hooh feels out of place in a team with no physical attackers to take advatamge of anti sap

sacred oriole Oct 27, 2023, 3:29 PM

#

rate my AAA team: https://pokepast.es/37ab950ca0168f21

#

@echo lodge @timid meadow @dusk pasture get in here

#

I like the double fighting and offensive regen ideas, just curious if you see any immediate optimizations

echo lodge Oct 27, 2023, 3:35 PM

#

Drowning in randbats atm

#

Will look after

#

Take Heart manaphy might be better for gholdengo matchup

#

Loss of immediate boost might be a problem, though

#

Only other changes I would do before testing more is considering jolly tusk to outspeed opposing neutral base 100 speed stuff

sacred oriole Oct 27, 2023, 3:47 PM

#

I could see Take Heart, early play testing has been really nice to have the immediate power of Tail Glow

#

if I go Take Heart, should I drop LO for lefties?

#

oh okay non-choice sandy shocks is a dire matchup

timid meadow Oct 27, 2023, 3:53 PM

#

Knock is almost aways better than trick on azelf

sacred oriole Oct 27, 2023, 3:54 PM

#

yeah non-choice sandy is just a 6-0

#

need to fix that

echo lodge Oct 27, 2023, 3:54 PM

#

sacred oriole if I go Take Heart, should I drop LO for lefties?

yes

#

there's not much you can do about the sandy shocks matchup tbh

#

unless you're willing to use something completely different over manaphy

sacred oriole Oct 27, 2023, 3:55 PM

#

or is there something else I can slot over empoleon?

timid meadow Oct 27, 2023, 3:55 PM

#

Desolando

sacred oriole Oct 27, 2023, 3:55 PM

#

that is a spd pivot and doesn't need regen?

echo lodge Oct 27, 2023, 3:56 PM

#

nothing really

#

swampert doesn't exist

timid meadow Oct 27, 2023, 3:56 PM

#

Looking bleak

sacred oriole Oct 27, 2023, 3:56 PM

#

well that takes regen anyway

timid meadow Oct 27, 2023, 3:56 PM

#

This is why swampert would solve all of our problems

sacred oriole Oct 27, 2023, 3:56 PM

#

probably need to replace manaphy then

#

okay yeah empoleon sucks

#

back to the drawingboard

dusk pasture Oct 27, 2023, 8:21 PM

#

sacred oriole rate my AAA team: https://pokepast.es/37ab950ca0168f21

gengar goes brrr

sacred oriole Oct 27, 2023, 8:24 PM

#

what's a gengar

#

but yeah this team is bad, empoleon is bad

#

I need to do a major rework on it 😭

main sequoia Oct 27, 2023, 8:48 PM

#

dusk pasture gengar goes brrr

Wait what
Was gengar unbanned??? doom

dusk pasture Oct 27, 2023, 8:49 PM

#

main sequoia Wait what Was gengar unbanned??? <:doom:942619320566034483>

yes

main sequoia Oct 27, 2023, 8:49 PM

#

dusk pasture yes

Why

#

Sheer force ban?

dusk pasture Oct 27, 2023, 8:50 PM

#

main sequoia Why

because the council felt like it

#

(and the introduction of new checks)

main sequoia Oct 27, 2023, 8:50 PM

#

I see

timid meadow Oct 27, 2023, 9:13 PM

#

Gengar isn’t that good tbh

#

A- Mon

dusk pasture Oct 27, 2023, 9:18 PM

#

gengar is fine

#

apart from its potency offensively it's a tspike absorber

#

which is very valuable

paper moat Oct 27, 2023, 9:19 PM

#

~~its can spinblock tusk too!!!~~

timid meadow Oct 27, 2023, 9:23 PM

#

Most tusks are running scrappy anyways so that’s just

#

Not even true

dusk pasture Oct 27, 2023, 9:25 PM

#

timid meadow Most tusks are running scrappy anyways so that’s just

most seems like an exaggeration but yes

high trellis Oct 28, 2023, 1:12 AM

#

gengar can maybe beat every av regen mon with the right set

#

but it does require some reads and careful play bc its frail af

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 3:28 AM

#

dusk pasture gengar is fine

Gengar release i never saw an issue with

#

I have no clue how dnite survived the sus voting or whatever it was

sacred oriole Oct 28, 2023, 3:39 AM

#

It was banned by suspect, then freed with DLC cause we got new checks

#

Like Azelf and uh

#

Azelf

paper moat Oct 28, 2023, 3:40 AM

#

intim zap!!

#

uh if it reveals fire blast then

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 3:41 AM

#

Dnite is also A-

sacred oriole Oct 28, 2023, 3:41 AM

#

It’s A- but it’s broken into offense

paper moat Oct 28, 2023, 3:47 AM

#

just bring azelf

#

win

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:08 AM

#

Heres my thing

#

Ehh nvm azelf is mostly ok

#

I think

#

The idea was “if one of the only viable checks to a mon is another mon thats also stupid strong, both should go.”, like how dragapult was banned shortly after gambit in natdex

sacred oriole Oct 28, 2023, 4:15 AM

#

Dragonite has other legit checks

#

Like Corv and Zap that annoy it, and Garg that really annoys it

#

Azelf just really pisses it off

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:16 AM

#

garg is a stretch

sacred oriole Oct 28, 2023, 4:24 AM

#

~~yes but I was trying to think of another one Mon is broken~~

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:26 AM

#

See

#

Like corv i get

#

Its also everywhere

#

Dnite can power through zap tbh, just use one of its billion coverage options

#

Dragonites issue was never its power and speed control, it was that it makes everything a guessing game

#

Well i shouldnt say never

#

Espeed is disgusting through and through

#

Wanna beat Garg? Low kick
Wanna beat WBB/Vabsorb Corv? Thunder/Fire punch, respectively.
Intim? Nothing is stopping you from using fire blast or thunder (mixed goes hard tbh)
Zapdos? Ice spinner!
Azelf? Well ok i have nothing for this one.
Unless you wanna use fuckennnn fling lmao

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:32 AM

#

dusk pasture garg is a stretch

If it’s earth eater dnite is doing nothing

#

Dnite running low kick is not that good tbqh, sure it can theoretically beat anything but it also has 4 moves

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:33 AM

#

timid meadow If it’s earth eater dnite is doing nothing

garg is a stretch because it isn't legit

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:33 AM

#

Garg is fine

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:33 AM

#

not because it can't check it

#

"garg is fine" and also has zero usage

#

i'll retract my statement when i actually see it

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:34 AM

#

Usage =/= Viability

#

Garg can easily fit on debris teams

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:35 AM

#

if only there was any proof of that

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:35 AM

#

Isaiah had laddered with it, I’ve tried it once before and it’s aight

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:36 AM

#

timid meadow Dnite running low kick is not that good tbqh, sure it can theoretically beat any...

Yeah but thats the thing
You dont know which move its running until it uses it
Its like schrödingers cat, right? Until observed, it has every move. Then, once used, it collapses into the move you know it has

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:36 AM

#

on an archetype they have since called bad?

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:37 AM

#

timid meadow Usage =/= Viability

This is 100% true though

#

👍

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:37 AM

#

normal marlin Yeah but thats the thing You dont know which move its running until it uses it I...

This argument goes for quite a bit of mons tbf, i think the difference with dnite is the ease of winning though

#

It can auto win games a lot easier if it’s in the position than say a regular breaker or whatever

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:40 AM

#

Yeah but most mons its like
Take great tusk for example
“Oh its either ice spinner + rapid, or knock + rapid, doubt its ice + rapid” thats 3 options for coverage and is fair to play around

“Low kick or thunder punch or ice spinner or fire punch or earthquake”
Thats 5 options you have to play around, and thats one move
Ive used banded before (stab + stab + coverage + coverage) so that makes it like what
5! Options? Factorial, i mean.
Thats 100 different coverage combinations

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:40 AM

#

ok no

#

that's a stretch

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:40 AM

#

I mean yeah

#

Realistically its closer to like

#

10 viable combos

#

Max

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:40 AM

#

timid meadow It can auto win games a lot easier if it’s in the position than say a regular br...

That reason is why I also think triage is broken, Dnite for me is a step below since it usually can’t just sweep teams after one Settup which is why I’d a bit on the fence about it in general.

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:41 AM

#

Maybe even less

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:41 AM

#

usually only the 4th move is open for coverage

#

maybe the 3rd if you give up ddance

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:41 AM

#

timid meadow That reason is why I also think triage is broken, Dnite for me is a step below s...

Agreed. When hariyama is banned in a metagame with chien-pao thats where you need to realize how stupid triage is

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:42 AM

#

Tbqh I’m just really waiting to see more examples of dnite winning games in high level play before being pro ban

#

There was one instance of it in aaapl, but that was more due to terrible misplaying of it

#

Though I also think quite a bit of stuff rn (Oger / Wake / maybe debris) should be banned

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:43 AM

#

Wake is shaping up to be outclassed by manaphy atm, at least to my knowledge

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:44 AM

#

lol

#

nah

#

if anything they do completely seperate things

#

except for manaphys primsea/sflo set but that set is rather unpopular

#

manaphy prefers to run bulky setup as an offensive mon while wake is a purebreed breaker

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:44 AM

#

Wake just go specs beads or maw and call it a day

#

And break everything

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:45 AM

#

and wake is far more effective at its role in breaking down teams

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:45 AM

#

Specs maw has very funny numbers on everything but Emp but like

#

That can easily be pressured over a game

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:46 AM

#

I see

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:46 AM

#

I should build a spikes + Wake team sounds nasty

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:46 AM

#

you fool

#

i already have been

#

in ndaaa

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:46 AM

#

Cooking

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:46 AM

#

actually you literally have access to those teams

timid meadow Oct 28, 2023, 4:46 AM

#

Unfortunately it gets nothing to hit Fini so kinda washed

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 4:47 AM

#

nah just run like beads/primsea and you can cook it

#

fini doesn't like spd

#

but this is also getting offtopic i realise

#

probably should move out of this channel

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 4:49 AM

#

Ok but awful idea: “oops! All coverage” Dnite.
Aerilate + Espeed, low kick/EQ, blizzard, Fire punch

#

Like just go full extremist

high trellis Oct 28, 2023, 4:58 PM

#

sacred oriole Like Corv and Zap that annoy it, and Garg that really annoys it

Garg is not real, and corb notoriously loses to any dnite with roost+dd unless it has ironpress

sacred oriole Oct 28, 2023, 5:00 PM

#

Corv can pivot fine anyway and gives you room to outplay

#

It’s workable

#

I actually wouldn’t mind seeing Dragonite banned again, but we do have more tools to deal with it than before

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 5:24 PM

#

I know azelf

#

What else showed up

paper moat Oct 28, 2023, 6:32 PM

#

zapper

normal marlin Oct 28, 2023, 7:10 PM

#

Right

lone helm Oct 28, 2023, 10:14 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/92355e35cf6d193f @dusk pasture

topaz hearth Oct 28, 2023, 10:15 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/7ba8feb09a1d0708

#

Mnm

Moltres walls dnite and after mega it kills jolteon
Glimmora punishes greedy leads and sets rocks
Jolteon and eleki do their thing
Hatt has great bulk and sets up
Hands same thing

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 10:15 PM

#

looks mostly fine at a first glance

#

uhh who plays mnm in this server

#

i literally know no one

#

maybe clas

sacred oriole Oct 28, 2023, 10:16 PM

#

@swift tree are you alive

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 10:16 PM

#

man

#

make mnm leaders choice next month

#

free mnm activity...

#

or like

swift tree Oct 28, 2023, 10:17 PM

#

Hi hello

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 10:17 PM

#

pay off freezai to make a yt video on mnm

swift tree Oct 28, 2023, 10:17 PM

#

I'll look quick

lone helm Oct 28, 2023, 10:17 PM

#

dusk pasture make mnm leaders choice next month

would that even be possible
i guess it would but unlikely since we just had gg..

dusk pasture Oct 28, 2023, 10:17 PM

#

lone helm https://pokepast.es/92355e35cf6d193f <@623046566353043466>

ok well i have a deep unreserved hatred for stail but it's probably ok

#

just make sure your corv doesn't die to weavile otherwise it's like kinda gg

#

also stuff like sd ace owns but who cares

lone helm Oct 28, 2023, 10:18 PM

#

i just use stail on every team for no reason

swift tree Oct 28, 2023, 10:18 PM

#

topaz hearth https://pokepast.es/7ba8feb09a1d0708

First 2 are fine, make eleki 8 hp 252 attack 60 Def rest speed naughty nature

#

Hat is not good, if you're dead set on using hands make it latiosite/aero

topaz hearth Oct 28, 2023, 10:19 PM

#

what are the evs for

lone helm Oct 28, 2023, 10:19 PM

#

dusk pasture just make sure your corv doesn't die to weavile otherwise it's like kinda gg

hm could i switch out rm for something to help against weavile

topaz hearth Oct 28, 2023, 10:19 PM

#

whys hatt not good

swift tree Oct 28, 2023, 10:19 PM

#

It just doesn't really do anything a lot of the time bc you need setup to accomplish anything and you're not getting the turns you need

topaz hearth Oct 28, 2023, 10:20 PM

#

i think it does just fine even without the boosts because of its sheer bulk

#

But also

#

It can set up with not that much difficulty on special attackers

#

Even things like magearna w flash

#

It wins against it

swift tree Oct 28, 2023, 10:20 PM

#

Im going to give you my feedback, it's up to you to take it into account or not

topaz hearth Oct 28, 2023, 10:20 PM

#

yeah i know just justifying

swift tree Oct 28, 2023, 10:21 PM

#

Moltres is mediocre and you need a ground type

#

Glimm is like fine I guess

#

Could go spdef groundy and then then like slowbro over moltres and hatt

#

Actually I'm not a big fan of hands here, I think you switch it out for lop skewda

uneven hawk Oct 30, 2023, 6:55 AM

#

Thought I was cookin

#

It is a sun team

#

So I might have burnt it

#

All good tho

#

https://pokepast.es/08aca10acbbead7a

gloomy elm Oct 30, 2023, 7:29 AM

#

timid meadow Desolando

adachi_true

main sequoia Oct 30, 2023, 3:39 PM

#

Maybe

#

Thought prob walled by tanky fire types/psea steel types

surreal portal Oct 30, 2023, 3:43 PM

#

you would want headlong rush over cudgel for miraidon

#

sash is also largely unnecessary here, life orb is usually better

main sequoia Oct 30, 2023, 3:45 PM

#

Ok

orchid grove Oct 30, 2023, 4:20 PM

#

Speed Boost Kart looks hype actually.

main sequoia Oct 30, 2023, 4:41 PM

#

Kind of improof

#

ArroKek

main sequoia Oct 30, 2023, 4:56 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/3a4e7057a153f8b2 (bh)
Well here is the fixed team
I will keep technician deoA despite the imp risk tho

umbral lavaBOT Oct 30, 2023, 4:56 PM

#

New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

surreal portal Oct 30, 2023, 5:04 PM

#

kart lacks a good improof here aside from simply winning the tie, which you have no paralysis to make easy

#

mirai should be timid min atk, same for arc

main sequoia Oct 30, 2023, 5:05 PM

#

surreal portal kart lacks a good improof here aside from simply winning the tie, which you have...

Wait what
When does speed boost start working when copied by imposter upon switch in after a pokemon fainting?

surreal portal Oct 30, 2023, 5:06 PM

#

if they slow pivot into imp you have the speed advantage, but the current risk is that they bring imp in on a sack, win the tie, and take 1 and a half kills minimum

main sequoia Oct 30, 2023, 5:07 PM

#

Shit
I didnt know this about sboost

#

cwl

surreal portal Oct 30, 2023, 5:10 PM

#

yeah it's not a plain unconditional speed advantage

main sequoia Oct 30, 2023, 6:41 PM

#

surreal portal kart lacks a good improof here aside from simply winning the tie, which you have...

Wellthen
Should i add something of this kind to some other member or just change the set?

surreal portal Oct 30, 2023, 7:16 PM

#

the recommendation is just changing the set, since this kart is exceedingly hard to improof outside of specifically prank screens slowbro-mega

main sequoia Oct 30, 2023, 7:23 PM

#

Guess imma just go with sor thing

#

So

oak topaz Oct 30, 2023, 10:29 PM

#

You can use the fc waterceus or bro

main sequoia Oct 30, 2023, 11:04 PM

#

oak topaz You can use the fc waterceus or bro

Slowbro?

sacred oriole Oct 30, 2023, 11:21 PM

#

Mega Slowbro yes

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 1:11 AM

#

Whats so special about slowbro

sacred oriole Oct 31, 2023, 1:18 AM

#

Slightly better bulk + some more resistances (namely fighting) but with some more weaknesses

fossil cove Oct 31, 2023, 1:35 AM

#

good bulk

orchid grove Oct 31, 2023, 1:43 AM

#

Two kinds of people

oak topaz Oct 31, 2023, 3:43 AM

#

Slowbro has better physical bulk (20% with same natures, 32% if bro is running +def vs neutral)

#

You also don’t consume Arceus slot, have a mixed usage psychic typing (weaknesses are annoying but you get a decent fighting and psychic resistance and stab future sight), slightly (negligible basically) higher spa, much lower speed for very slow pivoting

#

As a fc you check kyub and chomp quite well

#

Though fc water generally has comparable performance and in terms of mono physical mmx it’s mixed because waterceus doesn’t resist cc but isn’t weak to the coverage like wicked polter Uturn

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 11:30 AM

#

Is there anything i can use to guarantee my pokemon from outspeeding imposter besides scarf web and paralysis?

surreal portal Oct 31, 2023, 11:35 AM

#

webs doesn't work

#

also no its just para and scarf

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 11:38 AM

#

firedog

shrewd spoke Oct 31, 2023, 11:38 AM

#

clearly you haven't learnt hallward tech and use big tailwind

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 11:38 AM

#

shrewd spoke clearly you haven't learnt hallward tech and use big tailwind

Hall what?

shrewd spoke Oct 31, 2023, 11:38 AM

#

or unburden ~~with nothing to actually proc it~~

shrewd spoke Oct 31, 2023, 11:39 AM

#

main sequoia Hall what?

hallward the player

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 11:39 AM

#

shrewd spoke hallward the player

Elaborate

shrewd spoke Oct 31, 2023, 11:41 AM

#

main sequoia Elaborate

the guy who made the big stall team on the samples basically

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 1:06 PM

#

Can fur coat and power trick work together? worrywhirl

surreal portal Oct 31, 2023, 1:08 PM

#

don't think so

oak topaz Oct 31, 2023, 1:19 PM

#

main sequoia Is there anything i can use to guarantee my pokemon from outspeeding imposter be...

Unburden and tailwind

dusk pasture Oct 31, 2023, 1:22 PM

#

free belly drum

tired cave Oct 31, 2023, 1:39 PM

#

Drum spam? ConcernedFrogeDolch

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 1:40 PM

#

dusk pasture free belly drum

Kid named prankster haze

dusk pasture Oct 31, 2023, 2:00 PM

#

kid named espeed

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 2:31 PM

#

Kid named giratina

#

morpeko

surreal portal Oct 31, 2023, 2:32 PM

#

most belly drum is either -atespeed, triage, or unburden

#

none beat imp and prank on the one set barring winning a tie

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 2:50 PM

#

Maybe

surreal portal Oct 31, 2023, 2:51 PM

#

see the issue with this is that you don't OHKO imp i think?

#

pretty sure you need leech life for that

#

fillet away's banned anyway

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 2:52 PM

#

Oh

#

Shit

#

I forgor

shrewd spoke Oct 31, 2023, 2:53 PM

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yeah so unburden's kinda bad now cause there's kinda nothing good that can proc it

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you can use like, white herb + cc or something? but then you're really strapped for power

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 2:53 PM

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Better?

surreal portal Oct 31, 2023, 2:53 PM

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you see this is where you run torch song throat spray

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clearly viable

normal marlin Oct 31, 2023, 2:54 PM

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Unburden throat spray might be more viable than simple throat spray tbh

shrewd spoke Oct 31, 2023, 2:54 PM

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main sequoia Better?

i'm pretty sure csoul takes 33% hp and doesn't poc unburden on 1 use

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so you either use it 2 times which is inconsistent as hell given hoopa-u's bad bulk

surreal portal Oct 31, 2023, 2:54 PM

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main sequoia Better?

csoul gives defense buffs so unless you flatten your defense, even megahorn isn't killing imp

shrewd spoke Oct 31, 2023, 2:54 PM

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or you use it once and gamble to imp

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 2:55 PM

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shrewd spoke i'm pretty sure csoul takes 33% hp and doesn't poc unburden on 1 use

Oh wait
I forgot to swap sitrus with throat spray

shrewd spoke Oct 31, 2023, 2:55 PM

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ic

surreal portal Oct 31, 2023, 2:55 PM

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the most defense you can have while OHKOimp with megahorn is 31 iv, 44 ev, lonely

shrewd spoke Oct 31, 2023, 2:56 PM

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inb4 miss

main sequoia Oct 31, 2023, 2:58 PM

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I fucking hate rng doom

main sequoia Nov 1, 2023, 11:56 AM

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Maybe

red violet Nov 1, 2023, 12:20 PM

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consider: adaptability surging strikes + wicked blow

surreal portal Nov 1, 2023, 12:24 PM

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red violet consider: adaptability surging strikes + wicked blow

tough claws + those + edrift is better than adapt

red violet Nov 1, 2023, 12:25 PM

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really?

surreal portal Nov 1, 2023, 12:25 PM

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this sf set can maybe work? but no physical stab means spdefs not weak to it might be hard

surreal portal Nov 1, 2023, 12:25 PM

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red violet really?

you get basically the same damage but can OHKO yveltal

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so yes

normal marlin Nov 1, 2023, 3:57 PM

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https://pokepast.es/cefb1cbe09dd3e95

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Unfinished BH team, only three mons

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Low priority, if a complete team is sent go rate that first

paper moat Nov 1, 2023, 10:12 PM

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rates are only done for completed teams

normal marlin Nov 1, 2023, 10:23 PM

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main sequoia Maybe

Ahem

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Not to mention ive tried to get advice on some unfinished BH stuff several times and only got a response ONCE

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but ok

orchid grove Nov 1, 2023, 11:18 PM

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https://pokepast.es/d93c4495c171beb6
(STABmons rate)

I match against someone on ladder
I'm Weaved to meet them
There is insufficient evidence to allow the charges to stick
The case goes cold

surreal portal Nov 1, 2023, 11:24 PM

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normal marlin https://pokepast.es/cefb1cbe09dd3e95

despite this not being a completed team, the biggest issue with trying to win with smth like this is that there's not really any good option into imposter outside of just forfeiting all your boosts

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also gigaton or torch song over sandsear, you don't want to miss

normal marlin Nov 1, 2023, 11:36 PM

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Aight sounds good

paper moat Nov 2, 2023, 4:24 AM

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@remote bison rate this uwu https://pokepast.es/299175dc2cb39380

timid meadow Nov 2, 2023, 4:38 AM

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I’d probably make Manaphy a lil bit more spdef so Gengar / Thundy isn’t as terrible

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Some other stuff like chain chomp or Knock Tusj can be annoying for the team too but manageable

dusk pasture Nov 2, 2023, 5:27 AM

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physdef regenvest manaphy ew

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will never forgive dfm for spreading fake sets

acoustic lichen Nov 2, 2023, 6:14 AM

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Can someone tell me why this Sinistcha set is illegal for Inheritance? I'm trying to copy Polteageist and it doesn't work

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The same thing happened when I tried to make Scream Tail inheriting a Contrary Enamorus set. It forced me to make it with Lurantis

paper moat Nov 2, 2023, 6:29 AM

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smash is banned, enam-i is banned

acoustic lichen Nov 2, 2023, 6:31 AM

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I finally found the gen 9 version of this and saw that

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Went to correct it and saw your response lol

acoustic lichen Nov 2, 2023, 6:38 AM

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paper moat smash is banned, enam-i is banned

Is Ogerpon not implemented as well ?

paper moat Nov 2, 2023, 6:39 AM

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i dont understand your question and you shouldnt be asking here

red violet Nov 2, 2023, 1:33 PM

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https://pokepast.es/eae2f566da72347d is my bh team good?

umbral lavaBOT Nov 2, 2023, 1:33 PM

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New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

surreal portal Nov 2, 2023, 1:35 PM

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victory dance and punching glove on gren don't really offer anything over sap + life orb, and gren on this team in general doesn't really help diancie get past its most troublesome walls, being opposing psnceus

red violet Nov 2, 2023, 1:37 PM

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what do i replace it with?

surreal portal Nov 2, 2023, 1:39 PM

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something like an eternatus or psychic move mmx would be most useful, since these both beat arc-psn

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and can also offer a bit of aid against ho-oh

red violet Nov 2, 2023, 1:44 PM

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is this good?

surreal portal Nov 2, 2023, 1:45 PM

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this would work fine yeah, although gigaton might be more useful than steel beam here

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hits arc-fairy and ho-oh harder

red violet Nov 2, 2023, 1:46 PM

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alr

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thanks!

oak topaz Nov 2, 2023, 2:05 PM

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surreal portal something like an eternatus or psychic move mmx would be most useful, since thes...

??

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When does Etern beat psn

surreal portal Nov 2, 2023, 2:07 PM

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that was meant more for ho-oh idk why i split the messages

timid meadow Nov 2, 2023, 4:26 PM

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dusk pasture will never forgive dfm for spreading fake sets

]its good

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usually

high trellis Nov 2, 2023, 9:06 PM

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acoustic lichen Is Ogerpon not implemented as well ?

sets that inherit from the ogerpon formes with dual typing need the respective masks as items

acoustic lichen Nov 2, 2023, 9:07 PM

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That is weird

remote bison Nov 2, 2023, 11:34 PM

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paper moat <@640339552073940993> rate this uwu https://pokepast.es/299175dc2cb39380

make manaphy 252 hp 160 def 96 spdef bold
i'm not really convinced on the skeledirge, i think a bulky primsea zap would fit well here to better deal with ogerpon-h who just kinda mauls you otherwise while still dealing with pretty much everything that dirge does
Zapdos @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Primordial Sea
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 40 SpA / 4 Spe
Modest Nature

Thunder
Hurricane
Roost
U-turn
looks fine otherwise

paper moat Nov 3, 2023, 12:25 AM

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~~it can't spinblock tho~~

remote bison Nov 3, 2023, 12:43 AM

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dirge after getting knocked and poisoned by tdebris

normal marlin Nov 3, 2023, 12:45 AM

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Magic Guard Dirge could go crazy tbh

slim monolith Nov 4, 2023, 10:10 AM

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levi dirge is better atp

normal marlin Nov 5, 2023, 1:42 AM

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Two questions
1: wouldnt earth eater be better over levitate?
2: what does atp mean

sacred oriole Nov 5, 2023, 1:45 AM

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If you’re trying to dodge Toxic Spikes without Boots, Levitate has a niche

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atp = at this (or that) point

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Until / unless Thousand Arrows comes back, Earth Eater and Levitate both have minor niches over each other

normal marlin Nov 5, 2023, 1:56 AM

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I see

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Yeah tdebris is certainly am ability

cunning cairn Nov 6, 2023, 3:28 PM

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(AAA) how can it make it not suck
https://pokepast.es/e05214f1dc0770b7

umbral lavaBOT Nov 6, 2023, 3:28 PM

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New AAA RMT @echo lodge, @sacred oriole, @dusk pasture, @timid meadow, @gloomy elm. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

timid meadow Nov 6, 2023, 3:33 PM

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Milotic isn't the best toxic debris mon since you usually want it to something that can threaten hazard removal (and in general that set is walled by Iron moth which also absorbs tspikes), so something like Great Tusk Ursaluna-BM or Garchomp are better usually there

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also earthquake > surf on emp to not be walled by moth as well

cunning cairn Nov 6, 2023, 3:38 PM

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alright, thank you, is there anything else that stands out?

timid meadow Nov 6, 2023, 3:40 PM

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WBB Gambit quite frankly isn't that good either with how good Tusk and Corv are, I think something like RegenVest Roaring Moon can be a nice piece to fit as both an offensive presence (annouying stuff with dragon tail + knock) as well as checking special attackers which could otherwise overwhelm emp on its own

cunning cairn Nov 6, 2023, 3:43 PM

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ok, tysm

timid meadow Nov 6, 2023, 3:43 PM

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just a heads up the ev spread for moon should reach 354 to outspeed thundurus

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so its knock off dragon tail stone edge uturn with 252 hp something sdef and then that speed

cunning cairn Nov 6, 2023, 3:44 PM

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done

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thank you

high trellis Nov 6, 2023, 11:39 PM

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I feel like the main issue here is how you just have a collection of mons that arent very good at making any progress or are just thoughly mid

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Since youre adopting regen paldean mega mence, you can fit mons that actually do stuff

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Ghold will most likely be tricking an av so smt that can abuse mons without their avs

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 12:28 AM

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https://pokepast.es/d6580c651e460b92 bh rate so i can make a somewhat decent sample sub

umbral lavaBOT Nov 7, 2023, 12:28 AM

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New BH RMT @surreal portal, @oak topaz. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 12:29 AM

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Mono fc mirai is asking to die to chomp and kyub

surreal portal Nov 7, 2023, 12:30 AM

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the imposter groundceus matchup doesn't seem that great in all honesty, since imp can fairly easily trade toxics and still be healthy enough to stave off mmx

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 12:30 AM

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I know qt has a build with band mmx specs diancie but with ygod psn lix as the defensive core

surreal portal Nov 7, 2023, 12:31 AM

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idt running tidy groundceus is worth it unless you have basically no other removal

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and you have the mirai mortal + a bouncer there at the end of the day

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 12:32 AM

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Idt you are affording to have a mono FurScales core here

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Your offensive stuff simply provide zero defensive utility

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 1:26 AM

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oak topaz I know qt has a build with band mmx specs diancie but with ygod psn lix as the d...

huh?

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yveltal?

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 1:27 AM

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Yes

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I’m not a huge fan of that team either but it has a better defensive core than yours

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 1:31 AM

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soooooooooo what defensive core could work?

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https://pokepast.es/4a3e35cb2798a7cb

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something like this?

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 1:41 AM

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oak topaz Idt you are affording to have a mono FurScales core here

_ _

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Idt you can afford bounce here

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 1:45 AM

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AAHHHHHHHHHH

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OK

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https://pokepast.es/dafbdb21e17edc60

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what about now

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 2:11 AM

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This looks better but you absolutely need a scales I think

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Otherwise you immediately fold to diancie

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Or you use Poisonceus

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Which gets dangerously similar to the other core

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 4:05 AM

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https://pokepast.es/6d1adcf85c9dd3b7 @oak topaz

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 4:06 AM

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Uhhhh

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Kyub issue

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 4:12 AM

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https://pokepast.es/3edfd92ca5bac9dc

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how bout now

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@oak topaz

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 4:15 AM

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Chomp issue again lol

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Let me take a look at how to fix in a sec

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 4:16 AM

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-_-

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 4:19 AM

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There’s probably a few options for defensive core wise is there any mon you would like on it

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 4:20 AM

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nah

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just fire away

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@oak topaz ?

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 4:25 AM

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I’m thinking

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 4:26 AM

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oops sry

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 4:36 AM

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Uhhhh
A. FC Ygod FC Victini Scales Groundceus (loses to rare palk)
B. FC Psnceus FC Celesteela Scales Hooh (also loses to rare palk)
C. FC Hooh RegenLix Scales some arc
D. FC Hooh idfk

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Teambuilding is hard

fossil cove Nov 7, 2023, 4:36 AM

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lmao tysm

oak topaz Nov 7, 2023, 4:37 AM

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Those probably have like

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Other underlying issues

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You can also always use ygod psnceus because that does kind of work but need to find a scales

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You technically can go without scales but then some random spa will be aids to deal with

reef pier Nov 8, 2023, 12:16 AM

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@flint plover https://pokepast.es/6c61f1dab51c62a2 is this good

flint plover Nov 8, 2023, 12:19 AM

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There doesn't seem to be much synergy between your abilities

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is better to try to build thinking on a way that everything add ups, powering up some kind of moves or increasing your bulk or trying to take advantage of some interactions

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Also intimidate isn't recommended in the format as your may find some defiant users on ladder, and stuff like scrappy and inner focus arent that rare either

reef pier Nov 8, 2023, 1:29 AM

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fair

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i was thinking about getting something besides gyarados anyways

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im keeping iron hands and im keeping rotom wash

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possibly a dragapult switch

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but its been really good as a win condition

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alright

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crawdaunt and kommo-o could work better, i dont know what to swap gyarados in to so i did something that would at least benefir

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should i have kommo-o have clear amulet or throat spray

flint plover Nov 8, 2023, 12:58 PM

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im not sure what would kommo-o would be for, but if you are keeping hands then you should try pincurchin to get access to electric terrain, but that conflicts with levitate

normal marlin Nov 8, 2023, 4:29 PM

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https://pokepast.es/94f2c9aeaf7cc831
Feeling very weak to ghost, fighting, and fairy atm, what could i change?

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Inheritance

sacred oriole Nov 8, 2023, 4:55 PM

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@high trellis

high trellis Nov 8, 2023, 4:56 PM

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normal marlin https://pokepast.es/94f2c9aeaf7cc831 Feeling very weak to ghost, fighting, and f...

I feel like the fairy weakness is super simple to explain

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You have Three fighting types, 2 of which are meant to be some sort of defensive utility

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Av regen big donphan kinda sucks bc its weak to everything, not that bulky, and the utility it might bring can be given to anyone else bc of how inh works

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People have yet to crack the code on offensive metal hariyama, but i will say running guts on it is pretty rough bc you just eat chip all day, even worse when youre supposed to be a hazard remover

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The ursh set is just bad in a more traditional way

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Moxie is just mid when you can have adaptability

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Id call empoleon not that great defensively

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A water resist thats weak to fighting AND neutral to grass manages to be bad into both the good physical waters, water ursh and waterpon

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The ghold set can work

high trellis Nov 8, 2023, 5:05 PM

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normal marlin https://pokepast.es/94f2c9aeaf7cc831 Feeling very weak to ghost, fighting, and f...

When you say "weak to fighting and fairy" i feel like you're specifically thinking of future gallade

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If youre not too torn on losing on pivoting, you can run like

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Pincurchin pex, the mon that always pops up when smt is kinda unhealthy despite looking like a good set in a vacuum

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Pincurchin (Toxapex) @ Black Sludge
Ability: Lightning Rod
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

Scald
Recover
Spikes
Thunder Wave

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I think you might prefer to make it specially defensive

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Oh and an easy way of making your team not lose to fighting types is by running physically defensive ghold

normal marlin Nov 8, 2023, 5:54 PM

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Ok thanks i was unsure on a lot of that
So what im getting is (very simplified, bare minimum) is replace Empoleon and tusk

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And physical defense ghold sounds great actually

normal marlin Nov 8, 2023, 5:56 PM

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high trellis Moxie is just mid when you can have adaptability

Ok id like to clarify i only used quaq over crawdaunt solely because of flip turn

high trellis Nov 8, 2023, 6:55 PM

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I feel like youd rather just cut ursh and run like scarf future gallade

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Its faster, which is good bc of how many fast mons run qd, but most importantly it can run tc stabs + uturn + knock

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Although now youre in dire need of a ground resist

normal marlin Nov 8, 2023, 7:07 PM

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Like

#OM Rates