Smogon Doubles Rates

[lament kite]

I think so

I gave ratpacker free elo

[formal needle]

this is just the tail end

but this is now the new latter part of the team

[lament kite]

Why does rhyperior have no nickname?

[formal needle]

oh

[lament kite]

Un

This is s/v ubers doubles

[formal needle]

oh I know

I dont have an ubers team

I have this though

[lament kite]

Mega char X?

[formal needle]

y

not x

[lament kite]

But mega’s arent legal?

[formal needle]

they are in gen 7 doubles ou

that this team was made for

[lament kite]

Im battling an mono ghost with an SABELYE

I got humbled

[formal needle]

https://pokepast.es/862a15d1bfaf0dfc

this is if I cant get charizard

[ashen pond]

Oh okay thanks, I thought this was for it on all doubles

[lament kite]

Hi

[vapid plaza]

https://pokepast.es/425fbb34bf58c59e

So this team is focused at blastoise,araquanid,and florges,i can entertainment water bubble to blastoise also i could Shell smash with blastoise when florges is around and give it sitrus berry so that symbiosis will give it to blastoise when it has used the white herb.the florges is faster than blastoise so that it could pollen puff first then water spout also alluring voice on florges cause theres so much xspeed dragonite with Valiant coaching

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[vapid plaza]

So what can i improve or change?

[slow ibex]

https://pokepast.es/c5b418dd31d47e0e

[peak crypt]

The hard conversation to have here is this team is built on a weak foundation—good opponents are just not going to let you get away with setting up a Water Bubble Blastoise, and even if they do, they can use Tailwind or Trick Room to get around the Shell Smash boost, or just throw priority moves at it.

If you’re really committed to setting up a super Blastoise, the rest of the team should be as strong as possible to make up for the resources you spend on Blastoise. My first recommendation is actually to swap the Florges for a Comfey. Comfey isn’t the best thing ever, but it gives you priority healing that can’t be redirected, which lets you run speed investment on your Blastoise and actually outrun threats like Ogerpon and Chien-Pao after a boost. I’d then recommend you drop the Pelipper and Sneasler entirely—yes, Pelipper gives Blastoise another boost, but it also gives your opponent’s Wellspring Ogerpon a damage boost, and right now you are incredibly weak to Wellspring. I’d recommend swapping them for a Calm Mind Raging Bolt and an Assault Vest Incineroar. With multiple support Pokemon already on the team, a backup setup attacker is a natural fit, and Raging Bolt is great against a lot of the things that give Blastoise trouble, Incin meanwhile is just a really good generalist answer to a ton of the format, gives you an edge against things like Psychic spam, and can keep Blastoise safe on crucial turns. I recommend AV on this team because it’ll let you run more Attack on your Incineroar, to make up for the relative lack of immediate damage elsewhere.

I’d also recommend finding room for Protect on your Blastoise in order to avoid things like Fake Out—probably over Ice Beam. There are probably a couple other ways to fill out the last few slots, like a build with Farigiraf to keep Blastoise safe from priority, but this seems like an easier first step.

[keen summit]

Somewhat weak to gambit, Pao offense, wetpon
Anyway set changes
Swift swim basc-F, possibly with choice band over lorb
Bolt should probably be running assault vest else it takes insane damage from lando-I (main Mon that weather ball is targeting)
Volt switch over thunder could be nice but I think you want the power, if you do volt then switch pulse for Draco meteor (actually could do that anyway)
Lando-I doesn't really need weather ball I think, you're likely to get more value out of something like sash rocks to break pao sash
Room might be irritating, ursaluna goes crazy

Hmm I wonder if you fit hands

Or rilla

[jade rover]

Hatterene @ Assault Vest
Ability: Magic Bounce
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Mystical Fire
• Dazzling Gleam
• Expanding Force
• Draining Kiss

Reuniclus @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature

• Expanding Force
• Tera Blast
• Trick Room
• Calm Mind

Indeedee-F @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Psychic Surge
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Trick Room
• Follow Me
• Protect
• Alluring Voice

Kingambit @ Assault Vest
Ability: Defiant
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Brave Nature

• Brick Break
• Kowtow Cleave
• Iron Head
• Tera Blast

Chien-Pao @ Focus Sash
Ability: Sword of Ruin
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

• Protect
• Icicle Crash
• Crunch
• Sacred Sword

Iron Crown @ Booster Energy
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 84 HP / 172 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature

• Expanding Force
• Tachyon Cutter
• Tera Blast
• Protect

reuniclus soft tr

[mild lichen]

https://pokepast.es/cfb402bd3d7c6873 a setup-centric team ive been working on for a while what do yall think

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[torpid moat]

you'd probably be a lot better off if both reuni and hatt were cut for necrozma, who gets earth power and better stats so it doesn't need to tera for coverage

what you really need is more mons that can beat incin, whether that's waterpon, okidogi, or sd clear amulet iron hands

[torpid moat]

the dnite set here is pretty awkward, if you're committing to dd then clear amulet baxcalibur is usually better, it has much stronger attacks

the strongest part of dnite is tera normal espeed, but that's usually on chien pao teams

rilla wants wood hammer over drum beating, and you should still consider u turn over horsepower

waterpon doesn't actually need spiky shield and can run another strong grass move like power whip or wood hammer to pair better with rilla

I do think you could use more speed control, I guess scarf chi yu can handle some of it but np ghold teams really want tailwind, which pairs well with rilla too

maybe the clef isn't totally necessary and could be a torn instead

[hardy ruin]

https://pokepast.es/2ff9e220a98f0563
I made this team with the intention of setting up veil with nintails and having supportive mons to try and whittle the enemy team down, but im not sure how to really carry that out or if that's viable

[tight spire]

there's not a lot of actualy damage comming out of anything here aside from Ogerpon

Tinkaton is a mid pokemon and air balloon doesn't really help it for anything except for like a landorus encounter...which you have an alolan ninetales for already (and air balloon is very easy to lose in doubles ftr)

Sinistcha isn't really gonna be that great a sweeper with just matcha. Having Sinistcha and Farigiraf on your team with neither possesing Trick Room is just wasting a both of these pokemon, Especially Farigiraf bc farigiraf is mediocre on its own otherwise without trick room dealing barely any damage (and here it just seems to only be capable of using Helping Hand. Also I would not recommend running a wiki berry, run sitrus instead

Raging Bolt and Ogerpon seem like the only pokemon here actually doing much and I feel you could at least have had Raging bolt be Leftovers Calm Mind and have sinistcha be more supportive for bolt with like trick room or Life Dew to go along with the whole set up gig you're trying to do here (but AV is fine)

Generally I would at least drop Farigiraf for something like Kyurem (if you wanna do snow) or something else that's less do nothing and give you better damage output

Tinkaton if you wanna keep I would probably drop air balloon for something like clear amulet, covert cloak etc.

[mild lichen]

Tbh I've tried messing around with bax but I've found that dnite has a lot more surprise factor on top of making my genie mu infinitely more bearable since torn/lando usually means a forced tera for the rest of my team

I 100% agree on the speed control aspect though, hence why I ran drum beating. I'll look into dropping it, running torn and a grass move on pon

In regards with u-turn, I've lowk been loving ground coverage recently against gouging fire comps; I've also seen a pickup in usage of okidogi and the occasional volcanion which would both otherwise be huge problems

[warped vessel]

Can anyone help me with my Passimian teams? Its my favourite mon and Ive been trying some things out but it doesnt always feel smooth
https://pokepast.es/1a1281f9777ec98a
https://pokepast.es/4d8d7c38344a27ff

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[warped vessel]

was originally running Oranguru with the first team for Symbiosis but realized thats not how it works, so Im not even sure if hes good on the team anymore

[tight spire]

Well I can't really say much here bc nearly every pokemon here is either unviable or using a completely anti synergy set

Like oranguru is running trick room

But you have no real trick room support that is actually viable

[warped vessel]

its just to reverse trickroom if murkrow cant taunt cause of psychic terrain

[tight spire]

That's spending a whole team slot on a dead weight pokemon

Sinistcha could do that better

And it heals

[peak crypt]

the rule of thumb I like to give people is

if you want to use a fun Pokemon

you should make the rest of the team surrounding it as good as it can be

[tight spire]

Team 2 also seems to have psych up and costar flamigo but

Nothing to actually boost

[warped vessel]

Beat-Up Justified passimian is the point of that team

[torpid moat]

yup, if you're sticking with azu + passimian, then sure, fine

[tight spire]

That is kinda super convoluted

[peak crypt]

you're already giving up some power with Passimian, so the rest of the team should be a bunch of all-stars

[tight spire]

Like what if

[torpid moat]

ah so beat up justified after 1+ mons have already died

[tight spire]

Lucario dies

Like

Then what

U lose?

[torpid moat]

is just worse than running terrakion with justified

nah they're doing luke dies to gambit -> passimian gains justified -> beat up 5 hits

[tight spire]

If you build you want to be able to play with the idea that your main strategy may fail and you have back up

[torpid moat]

but yeah that's just a super unrealistic sequence

[warped vessel]

thats fair, i just dont really have much experience teambuiliding so im kinda figuring things out

[tight spire]

I think you should probably try using dou sample teams

[torpid moat]

I think you could make something cute with just the passimian + azu

and then 4 real mons

[tight spire]

They can help understand team building and structure

But yeah if u wanna use Azumarill u can with like sinistcha

And as pain said some real pokemon

[warped vessel]

are incin and murkrow not that great anymore?

[torpid moat]

incin is, murkrow definitely isn't

tornadus outclasses it in every way

but I moreso meant real mons that function completely independently of your original strat

like just having a chien pao or firepon somewhere on the team

[warped vessel]

would wellspring be good as well? i dont really have a real water type since zuma is built to die

[torpid moat]

that's another thing, there's actually nothing stopping you from running real attacks on your scarf azu

you can just run 252 atk

[warped vessel]

thats fair but what would i be able to sacrifice in EVS, it doesnt really feel fast even with scarf

[torpid moat]

you'd sacrifice the hp

you don't care if it dies, remember?

[warped vessel]

i guess thats true, weakness policy just wont be as reliable

[torpid moat]

oh wow, scarf azu's speed tier is really miserable

327, 1 less than base 100, also slower than lando i

[warped vessel]

yeah it hardly really outspeeds. usually its just so both mons cant outspeed to double on it so it can get misty off

https://pokepast.es/d08f92231e0cd08d
is this any better?

was debating between rain dance for wellspring+bleakwind accuracy or just running protect

[torpid moat]

rd torn is fine here

imo, what you actually wanna cut here is the sinistcha

the healing really just won't be relevant, and waterpon is already redirection

I was checking out speed tiers as well, and I think you may just need to run max hp passimian

[warped vessel]

even with tailwind accesible in team?

[torpid moat]

so it's moreso that

you have nothing preventing the passimian from immediately dying

because it has to not protect for wp to activate

it's actually the opposite, you don't need as much speed because tailwind will cover it

[warped vessel]

i feel like trickroom usually feels like my worst match up from the games ive played though. and i dont really have other ways to play against it if they have an indeedee

[warped vessel]

sorry whats wp?

oh nvmnvm weakness policy

[warped vessel]

would i still run jolly or just go adamant/bulky nature

[torpid moat]

adamant should be fine

[warped vessel]

would it be worth redirecting 28 evs in speed to outspeed Chienpao by 1?

and if you feel like cutting Sinistcha is the move, do you have a suggestion for who would be a good replacement? i can see if it feels more consistent with them

[torpid moat]

yeah definitely worth running a tailwind speed bench

sinistcha slot can straight up just be chien pao

because the majority of your attackers are physical focus

you can also run taunt over spiky shield on waterpon

nonprankster taunt can be really helpful vs trick room if you're having trouble

[warped vessel]

oh yeah I like that a lot better! i didnt know ogerpon learned taunt, ty

[torpid moat]

ogerpon should be max speed in that case, you can cut from hp

so you can outspeed ninetales-a/tie other ogerpon

[warped vessel]

i see! thank you

[karmic pebble]

https://psim.us/t/1322447-pobjlw0ngy6e1d7bqr58

Thoughts on this? Swalot Slaking and rillaboom have serious synergy but I’m not sure what else to do to fix it up?

[torpid moat]

I think you're going about this the wrong way, you're taking an extremely roundabout path to get the end result of "strong attacker under speed control"

ability gimmicks in general are almost never worth it, the cost of spending a turn with 2 specific allies on the field is just too high and inflexible

and the rillaboom thing you're going for is super counterintuitive, it looks like you're deliberately halving bulldoze damage and using it as a weird speed control mon?

if you want your slaking (or better main attacker) to move first, you can just use tailwind tornadus

prankster tailwind is significantly more powerful and flexible than needing to actually land a hit to slow your opponents down

but yeah, think of it in like a cost benefit sense

slaking has strong stats, sure, but it requires 1x targeted action from an ally

so when comparing it, slaking has to be better than something like "entei who has received a coaching boost"

which it is not better than

and entei has the added benefits of not requiring that coaching boost to function, having a real ability (inner focus, ignores fake out and intimidate), and better moves like sacred fire and extreme speed

for example, check out this team by SuckyLucky that makes great use of entei, pairing it with damage boosts from chien pao's sword of ruin: https://pokepast.es/976b7dc8f9e470a3

entei can reach even higher damage than your slaking with normal tera espeed + chien pao, and does so while making every mon on the team a threat of its own

they also have a second copy of the team that leans bulkier with aurora veil ninetales-a: https://pokepast.es/560769435aafce10

@karmic pebble I recommend reading their seasonal writeup here: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/doubles-ou-team-bazaar.3710875/post-10612539

[karmic pebble]

Thanks you gave a lot of advice I appreciate it. I just got to work but I will def read up on it

I really like Swalot and like the idea here. That being said I will definitely fix a lot and look into it more

[peak crypt]

The problem with Swalot is just that no utility is going to make up for this:

There’s just nothing going on here

It’s kind of bulky, but if you want a bulky Poison, we already have loads of those

[karmic pebble]

Gluttony makes up for it tho

Long as you don’t get one shot

They coul really buff him by giving him recycle

Is there any other way to remove slaking ability?

[peak crypt]

the only way that really has a shot to consistently win games is Neutralizing Gas Weezing

because Weezing doesn't always need to be on board alongside Slaking and Weezing has more utility against your opponent's Pokemon

(people usually use Galarian Weezing for the Fairy typing)

to be perfectly honest though

Slaking with no ability is still a worse Pokemon than a lot of the prominent threats in DOU

while it in theory boasts better stats than most of the format, Normal STAB isn't great because you can't hit anything super effective

and you need to pack specific moves to beat things like Gholdengo, Gouging Fire, and Roaring Moon

[subtle marlin]

Hi, i am currently building a SV doubles team around Garganacl
https://pokepast.es/4614acd0caf030e6

I have found amoongus and incineroar to be a good synergy with garganacl but id like advices and pokemon recommendation on bringing more synergy with the rest of the team if any needed change

i have also found that amoongus rage powder doesnt really do much because of the low speed

thank you!

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[warped vessel]

wanted to come back on this and I wanted some input on some new changes I was thinking of

weakness policy misty explosion was way too risky most of the time and I found that intimidate pivot and any speed drops from bleakwind and icy winds really messed me up since my speed tiers are so tight

so instead swapped over to bulk up clear amulet and it has been performing a lot better but the loss of a spread move is felt. im wondering if a set up move is doing too much? but even just a +1 gets me to a lot of important OHKO thresholds since buffs are exponential with access to Huge Power. even lets me one-shot ursaluna under screens, even if they ghost terra

I was wondering if its better just to forego the set-up or lean more into it and run Grimmsnarl instead of Incin. Honestly Incin has been more of an intimidate bot than anything, anyone he covers I feel like the rest of my team can already do better at and Grimm has all the tools that he has with access to Fake Out + Parting while also being able to have access to screens so that monkey can set up more safely.
But im not sure if Im taking for granted what Incin provides to the team

[peak crypt]

if you don’t mind me interjecting: is there ever a world where you drop Receiver and just run Defiant Choice Band next to stuff like Wellspring and benefit from them trying to use Icy Wind or Intimidate against you?

This seems like the way better option to me but idk how much emphasis you want to place on Passimian—if you want it to be the star or just a contributing member

[torpid moat]

yeah, though if you want to use defiant, there are far better options like kingambit, okidogi, and zapdos-galar

It sounds like you've organically learned the flaws of receiver in general, especially the wp commit

but the natural conclusion of that is to use one of the better defiant options I listed

because those have actual stats/power to back up defiant while passimian doesn't

[torpid moat]

for the second half, incin is usually considered better than grimm because it provides the damage reduction in far fewer turns than grimm does, you're underestimating how valuable it is to intimidate without spending a move, including on the turn incin enters

grimm does get fake out and parting shot, but it doesn't want to be clicking those moves, it needs to click screens first

incin only needs 2 turns to do its damage mitigation job:enter/intim, fake out, parting shot, while grimm would need 4: fake out, reflect, light screen, parting shot

and 4 turns is just way too long to not put up any threat in one slot

[warped vessel]

want it to be more of the star of the comp and yeah if I run Defiant there'll simply just be better options. Huge Power Receiver at least makes it reach OHKO thresholds that most other mons cant get without more set-up even without the +1

[warped vessel]

thats fair, I think maybe I just need to learn to use it more effectively because I rely too much on ogre or torn instead as the partner

[warped vessel]

thats true, then theres just a lot of turns where im not really doing anything

[subtle marlin]

can anyone help with my garganacl team?
https://pokepast.es/4614acd0caf030e6

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[brittle spade]

on that team garganacl just kinda sits there until it dies

since it can't ever apply enough pressure

you either need to get rid of gholdengo kingambit and put stuff that'll slow down the game

or change the garganacl set to wide guard stealth rocks salt cure recover

and then run something more offensive

[subtle marlin]

i see, thank you
garg is my fav gen 9 mon so i wanna use him competitively, but is it viable to play other styles othjer than stalling game?
i heard stealth rock is not good for doubles , but is it good for this style?

[subtle marlin]

do you have recommended mons to replace them?

[brittle spade]

i was running this a while back https://pokepast.es/6471fc9cda7408d5
if you had to modify it to play it today you could try this https://pokepast.es/3ec19275ba6ffbdb
you can also run this if you have no respect for you or your opponent https://pokepast.es/80e782d9df47b547

[brittle spade]

i saw people on ladder run it with screens or tyranitar

you could do like grimmsnarl rillaboom garganacl with iron defense recover body press salt cure, a trick room setter and stuff to deal with gholdengo

kingambit was a good call since gholdengo will farm slower stuff like garg + amoonguss

[brittle spade]

stealth rock is ok for doubles, you don't set them every game but sometimes they have a lot of value

garganacl is straight up bad though, since it's not very active

setting rocks and clicking salt cure twice is often the best that can happen for it

[subtle marlin]

i see, thank you so much, your 3rd team suggestion looks very fun to play with its trick room and priority moves

[rough blade]

https://pokepast.es/fdaf5a4af6030396 is there anything I can improve? I get cooked by some fairy trick room teams

[brittle spade]

you have only one answer to diancie landorus and nothing to deal with glimmora.
you also shouldnt be losing to trick room teams with torkoal and raging bolt

[brittle spade]

try this https://pokepast.es/aa8f1d74932d6b1e

i'd advise you to check the sample teams for something more standard tho

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/doubles-ou-sample-teams.3710876/

[rough blade]

ursaluna trick room gives me a hard time

Thank you for this new team, ill give it a try

[rough blade]

played around with it very solid

I gave chi yu psychic again though

Thank you man farigiraf is what I needed

[elder nacelle]

https://pokepast.es/8aef0b101eb669a5
Soft tr team
Rate plz

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[normal aurora]

ngl havent seen anyone use alcremie in a while

ik its bad but still

[tight spire]

i don't really see tinkaton doing much here

even with life orb and like Chien pao

it's still 75 attack

and the only reason to use it is to fake out certain inner focus pokemon which I don't really think are all that common atm in dou

[elder nacelle]

:(
I like tinkaton...

[tight spire]

assuming we want to keep it then I feel at least you should focus on more than just regidrago for damage

[elder nacelle]

Ok bias aside, whats a replacement

[tight spire]

well I think Incineroar is probably a lot better for one

Tinkaton + Sinistcha + Chien-Pao means you have a lot of fire weakness

incineroar you could probably also use to parting shot into regidrago during a trick room set up

in that sense I feel like you may want more pokemon to mix with alcremie assuming you want that mon completely

Ursaluna Blood Moon I think is a pretty decent idea

over drago

or grimm

[elder nacelle]

Also i heard about a grass-fire-water trinity which i heard is strong?

[tight spire]

i mean thats kinda just general strong coverage

but like I feel regidrago is better on tailwind than

trick room

bc its limited to dragon type mooves

ad has low coverage

so if a fairy type switches in

u may be like

[elder nacelle]

Sininstcha and incinroar is already there so i need water

[tight spire]

(nah just tink)

but tinkaton isn't really good for that either

given its low atk and limited use from gigaton

if you want a water type

mmm you can maybe try ogerpon-wellspring ig

[elder nacelle]

Yeah ill may replace oger on tink

[tight spire]

but that makes you kinda snow weak

[elder nacelle]

Hmmm

[elder nacelle]

How about walking wade?

[tight spire]

thats something you should only use in sun

[normal aurora]

I was told multiple times it was bad in dou

[tight spire]

I feel like Alcremie + Ursaluna BM + Incineroar + Sinistcha at least so far

is a potentially good combo you could run

to make use out of alcreamie

(BM ursa is probably its best partner)

[elder nacelle]

So team is, ogerponW, incinroar, Sininstcha, alcremie, chien pao. Blood over drago?

[tight spire]

idk about chien pao

Its kinda just there

just being a fast guy

I mean maybe it works well with ogerponW

[elder nacelle]

Like what. Replace it with amongus?

No no that wont work

[tight spire]

you already do have sinistcha so it would be a bit akward to add amoongus

[elder nacelle]

Ooh roaring moon?

[tight spire]

maybe... iron hands actually

that could actually work with alcreamie as well

bc iron hands + incineroar + sinistcha + ursaluna BM is already a good tr core

there's a galar moltres sample team with some of the ideas I'm thinking about here I can show

https://pokepast.es/d925bbec7a624fb9

[elder nacelle]

Grimmsnarl tho

Ah right

Just replace ut with cream

[tight spire]

yeah grimm u can use here in the moltres case

but also u should run light clay

idk why u were running helmet

[elder nacelle]

So ogerW, cream, inceneraor, blood moon, grimm, sinistcha

[tight spire]

i feel you may kinda want to use iron hands as well bc it gives alcreamie another decorate target

if it's just ursaluna

it's prone to failure

[elder nacelle]

So yeah i hate running grim

[tight spire]

then hands is fine over it

hands + ogerpon w should work well

[elder nacelle]

In a vacuum, my team is complete

[tight spire]

sd + redirection

[elder nacelle]

Though is this a soft tr or hard tr

[tight spire]

it's trick room but u don't necessarily need it all the time

iron hands can kinda just act on its own

and ogerpon is fast

incineroar is incineroar

[elder nacelle]

Me watching the enemy iron hands do resisted gigadrain and still healed 50%:

[elder nacelle]

Haha fake out oarting shot go brr

[tight spire]

if u plan on using alcreamie with hands one thing I also suggest is potentailly making it so Alcreamie underspeeds both iron hands and ursaluna

assuming you plan on pulling it off in Trick room

so that decorate goes first in tr

[elder nacelle]

Question

Should ogerpon invest speed ev

Or just bulk

[rough blade]

@sabrinapyjama I'm finding clefable psych up teams are giving me trouble, would running clear smog on torkoal help?

[peak crypt]

This isn’t an archetype you should expect to run into frequently and you shouldn’t feel a need to tech for it

You can probably also beat them just by identifying the combo pieces early and taking them out before they can actually get the strategy going

[rough blade]

thats fair you're right

[rough blade]

https://pokepast.es/291c359a73846290 im having alot of fun with this gimmick team i made for doubles uu is there anything I could improve on?

[brittle spade]

https://pokepast.es/9b128f22789651bf

adding support makes it way more consistent

[peak crypt]

(Yes, Clangorous Soul is a dance move)

[normal aurora]

oh that makes more sense now

[normal aurora]

I just noticed this

congrats sneasler

[rough blade]

i never knew that whatttt

so cool

does oricorio lose hp? curious cuz petal dance doesn't lock it into the move like it does normally

[peak crypt]

It does

[elder nacelle]

https://pokepast.es/b46620f5b21f38d7

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[elder nacelle]

Rate it plz

Yeah i know theres no sun abuser

But i dont have space

[tight spire]

The idea of alcreamie underspeeding is a bit novel, but idt sinistcha works with a life orb

And I'm not sure about ice punch here on iron hands

If you're worried about landorus I'm sure it gets obliterated by everything else

[tight spire]

You don't rly need a sun abuser with full TR like this

The sample Hoopa psyspam has a similar thing going on

https://pokepast.es/913462734c068c32

[elder nacelle]

Oh that one

[tight spire]

Diancie could be considered for rival fire types and pokemon like Incineroar who can hurt most of the pokemon on your team (aside from hands but it can intimidate it)

Over sinistcha

[elder nacelle]

Ice punch is coverage, is it not

[tight spire]

But you can still run sinistcha for helping out hands

It is

I'm just not sure you really need it

Well

I think it's fine

Some hands do run ice punch only

Rather than thunder punch or wilde charge

[elder nacelle]

Should i put life dew on tcha

[tight spire]

You can if you think it would help iron hands out

I think if you don't have much issues with lando potentially move to electric stab on hands

Like if you get a random pelipper

With wide guard and everything

[elder nacelle]

I havent run into a single land

[tight spire]

That may be bad for your team

So thunder punch may be nice

[crisp laurel]

Can someone rate my team

https://pokepast.es/58d580f6888b103f

I want some improvements on it

[peak crypt]

First question: what format is this for?

[crisp laurel]

Nat dex doubles

@peak crypt

Its pretty funny if it works lol

[final kestrel]

You're technically in the wrong RMT section (the correct one is NatDex Other Tiers), but I'll still help you out. First of all, you seem to be somewhat familiar with doubles fundamentals; I see that you have Protect on some of your mons, but not on all of the mons that require it. Another issue that I want to address is that your team doesn't seem to be built around a particular mon, core, or archetype. Charizard is usually used to set up Sun via its ability Drought, and this is done so by giving it one of its Mega Stones. Deoxys-A is also usually paired with Indeedee-F or Tapu Lele to take full advantage of one of its most powerful moves, Expanding Force, under Psychic Terrain. Charizard and Deoxys-A can be used in the same team, and there is already a popular team that the ND DOU community uses for laddering. Ferrothorn, on the other hand, would require a team that could assist its setup and eliminate its threats. The other mons on your team are hardly ever used (unviable) for the ND DOU metagame. If you would like to build a more viable team, than feel free to ping me. Otherwise, I won't notice immediately that you're trying to reach out to me.

[stoic grove]

Would I post Doubles UU here?

https://pokepast.es/62575e54c1720208

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles UU RMT @torpid moat. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[torpid moat]

this is the place, though I don't recommend using gliscor in duu

you can use great tusk instead

also bonnet should use spore instead of stun spore, duu doesn't have sleep clause

this is actually a sun sample team from the duu thread which is probably the logical conclusion of what you have so far: https://pokepast.es/da0f1df6c52fd7bb

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/sv-doubles-uu-updated-sample-teams.3712825/

[stoic grove]

Ohhh really? But I will do that

Thanks for the feedback tho

[torpid moat]

there are other directions you could take it than psyspam, like adding goltres or baxcalibur

or just tailwind mew or jugulus if you wanna lean into eruption heatran

[stoic grove]

The direction I was thinking was just spaming earthquake and setting up tailwind with Ribombee

But I dont know tho

I think it could be better

[torpid moat]

eq can get kinda sucky compared to headlong rush

which is just a way better move

what makes tusk so good is headlong + cc 120 bp moves

on top of proto on sun

ribombee is fine for setting tw, just be careful of faster opps

[stable cradle]

https://psim.us/t/1333718-ic7fasg07ihs7nq1e6kr

I am so sorry. This came into my brain uninvited. Please, have mercy on me.

Also, Mewtwo is supposed to be Gothitelle, and Scream Tail is supposed to have Perish Song instead of Boomburst.

[keen summit]

There's a separate DOU format in showdown
Shadow tag is banned in DOU and most of your mon choices are also bad

[quaint crystal]

https://pokepast.es/3dd356a3d3835864

Can ppl lmk abt what they think of my DOU Grass Team and what can be done to imrpove!💚 I think my team needs some ice coverage but what does everyone else think

||Im not getting rid of the snail.||

[night plover]

https://pokepast.es/ceca1ed7732e1c7c

[torpid moat]

this depends, are you attempting to bring this against dou teams that are not monotype? If so, you're going to have a really awful time no matter what

[torpid moat]

also there are various set issues here, the bramble should be sash or clear amulet, wide lens definitely isn't worth

rilla should have max hp, not speed, and run high horsepower over knock

tera blast doesn't make sense on wo chien, it wants pollen puff or ruination

it's also probably not correct to have on mono grass, using it weakens a lot of your best available mons like firepon, meowscarada, rilla

[mortal bison]

https://pokepast.es/37b7b7e6f216ac14
wondering who to replace iron hands with or how to use the team more affectively

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[peak crypt]

why are you trying to replace the best Pokemon on the team

[tight spire]

Yeaaah arguably this entire team is just trying to do some weird rattled beat up strat that fails 95% of the time

Iron Hands is the only one actually doing anything on this team

Or the odd chance Gardevoir somehow gets trick room up

Torkoal

Who has a life orb despite running eruption

[peak crypt]

I do think there's probably just a better supporting cast if you're really married to Maus Dudun Flamigo

Torkoal isn't awful but it generally requires very specific kinds of teams to succeed

Gardevoir meanwhile is... kind of awful

[tight spire]

This kinda looks like it's trying to baton pass speed to Torkoal

[mortal bison]

That is the end goal

[tight spire]

Well what happens if like ur opponent just kills Torkoal

[mortal bison]

Pick a God and pray

[tight spire]

[mortal bison]

I do need to figure out a better moveset for gardevor tho

[quaint crystal]

||Im not getting rid of the snail.||

[quaint crystal]

this is all helpful tho thank you bunches

tho if i did run meowscarada instead of snail, what sorta kit should it run?

[torpid moat]

prob some kind of cb protean flower trick/knock/u turn set

[remote jolt]

https://pokepast.es/d6180f1205d375ee

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[brittle spade]

this is fine

id just run stealth rocks on landorus with either a focus sash or some bulk

rocks are important for dragonite

i would either run this team with landorus + taunt heatran

or sash rocks glimmora and substitute heatran

substitute loses some value without toxic spikes

[brisk berry]

https://pokepast.es/61fb25d66eccc03c

[normal aurora]

Ok I wanna examine how a pro person examines teams for this one

Although Since I have used liligant h multiple times, im not sure what its purpose is

[brisk berry]

Honestly, I was going for more 'Dancer's forgetting Lilligant didn't had a Dance Move on it

[torpid moat]

I really really don't recommend oricorio at all, its stats are mediocre even after a dancer boost, and the mon is extremely inflexible

what you have here is also poorly suited for screens, too many frail mons, especially sashed ones, with no defensive utility

because running dancers like quaqua prevents you from using better options like waterpon

[brisk berry]

Ah, I see. What would you recommend then?

[torpid moat]

it's possible to build around qd volc alone, if that's what you want, but there are more reliable setup mons like cm raging bolt, np ghold, sd hands, sd firepon

you generally want to pair these with disruption like from incineroar or rilla (who also provides healing), tailwind from tornadus for speed control, or some form of semi trick room comp in hand's case, redirection (usually from waterpon), and also just decent standalone attackers

[brisk berry]

I see. Alright. I’ll see what I could do with this recommendations

[wild topaz]

Working on a gimmick team, idk what last two mons would fit well, feel free to make suggestions for the rest of the team but I want the core strat to be the same https://pokepast.es/9c6e87f92afdd742

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[sacred merlin]

i feel like going whims could be more effective for speed control, armarouge wants some speed and terrak and probably arma should have protect, then for last two it depends if you want to further into the gimmick (not recommended) or just add some solid mons to fill it out (what i woud go)

[brittle spade]

this is what we posted for DUU for a previous RMT

https://pokepast.es/2a8ba58d1744c830

if you want to run this in DOU you really should run whimsicott instead

https://pokepast.es/7ed0859bb358c9c6

[hollow pasture]

this has surpirsingly been getting me pretty far, been replacing that araquanid slot every day though not sure what fits

https://pokepast.es/9cee710a97a85a82

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[wild topaz]

Honestly yeah the DUU fits well, I only had indeedee female for follow me but prolly isn't worth for a faster offense team. Thanks!

[viscid beacon]

https://pokepast.es/c3b0ca7979ebdd98

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[viscid beacon]

what can i fix here

thinking of replacing oger with amoongus

[peak crypt]

Sinistcha over Hatterene seems like a slam dunk

Hatt without an Indeedee on the team kind of sucks

[tight spire]

hatterene is kinda just there yea

[peak crypt]

and Sinistcha supports CM Bolt super well

[tight spire]

it only works with psyspam

[viscid beacon]

i see

but would i need a 2nd tr setter

[peak crypt]

Sinistcha is your second TR setter

[tight spire]

it is the 2nd setter

[viscid beacon]

oh wow i didnt know it got it xD

thanks

[peak crypt]

Matcha Gotcha / Rage Powder / Trick Room / Life Dew or Shadow Ball

[viscid beacon]

thoughts on replacing oger?

i have it for speed outside of tr

[tight spire]

also consider using either earthquake or swords dance over fire punch (you can eq sinistchca safely if it has life dew)

fire punch is like not going to do more damage to anything noteworthy

[viscid beacon]

sd with guts a little overkill no?

[tight spire]

than facade would

not necesarrily

[viscid beacon]

yeah i felt that

[tight spire]

Incineroar is common

[viscid beacon]

true

[tight spire]

and its a good way to counter it

also with Swords Dance you can just facade most steel types/rock types without using headlong anyways

(so its easier to predict against the opponet)

[viscid beacon]

so headlong for eq and punch for sd

[tight spire]

you can keep headlong if you want

[viscid beacon]

eq kinda screws everyone but sinischa

[tight spire]

but fire punch needs to go for one of them

either eq or sd over fire punch

[viscid beacon]

ill stick to headlong

anything else

and thanks :)

[brittle spade]

https://pokepast.es/67fbc3b6abfde24b

noivern stinks

in doubles

[hollow pasture]

i thought so too i only kept it because its just happened to work out really well

it's fast, decent bulk for its role, don't have to deal with psychic terrain

and the tera rock slide dragonite is a great lead catches so many mons off guard who try to set it up especially all the volcarona and alolan ninetales ivebeen seeing

[brittle spade]

if that's what you're trying to beat id just run focus sash tornadus over dragonite

[torpid moat]

yeah, torn and roaring moon are way better tw setters than noivern

the telepathy really isn't valuable at all

[hollow pasture]

bless i guess tailwind is just good in general haha thanks guys

[torpid moat]

in case you weren't aware, speed updates mid-turn in modern gens, so fast/prankster tailwind is really helpful for letting allies move first immediately

[rose juniper]

Wdym exactly?

[torpid moat]

not caring about psy terrain because they're not using espeed I think

which is a little backwards but I think they got the message atp

[stone chasm]

https://pokepast.es/d3618cd050bef59e hey yall , this is my sv dubers team ! I wanted to make it around the concept of fainting (teammates and opponents) , and was wondering how to improve it / use the concept better ! sorry if this is the wrong place to post

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles Ubers RMT @torpid moat. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[hollow pasture]

tankier than prankster tailwind mons better resistances, prankster moves dont work on psychic terrain also and the dragon typing is better bait for an icy wind that tera rock dragonite resists usually gets me a very good early lead and if not very easy to switch into registeel+glimmora

but sash tornadus is probably better actually

[sacred merlin]

basically, outside of the core of annihilape (which needs to be scarf) and magearna (which should be trick room protect two attacks) and also amoonguss (but doesn't work amazingly here) all of the pokemon here are bad in dubers so its impossible to find real successs without stripping the team down to just magearna annihilape and then go a trick room route from there with calyrex-ice + friends

[wild topaz]

I am not a team rater but I've played with a similar idea(though it is gimmick) https://pokepast.es/79b007e97f48ddcd You basically lead garg and magearna and eq + tr and next turn you explode and maybe protect if you can't ko, then you can bring in indeedee if you wanna stop priority and stuff or caly/hat for dmg. It works extremely well low ladder cuz no one figures out they have to ko magearna but I assume high ladder would be harder. You can also predict turn 1 if you think theyll attack with a supereffective move and just insta explode or rocks or smth. Idk the team isn't furnished but it's very fun

[torpid moat]

I'll just reiterate that annihilape + magearna should be your maximum investment into the gimmick if you want to be competitive at all

the rest of the team would want to run standalone powerful mons like ice rider, miraidon, arceus, etc

box legends still have synergy with each other, like miraidon dealing with ho oh for magearna

and there are still certain support mons like incineroar and amoonguss and indeedee-f that can fit on a trick room comp with ice rider

[hybrid forum]

https://pokepast.es/8abef1cac9dcdc71 rate my team pls, if someone has an idea to imporve my team let me know

i know pinky team is so goofy but sometimes work and I ask for help to upgrade my team

[tight spire]

I feel like there are several "pink" Pokemon that I would rather use before I would wind up using Alomomola or Malamar, mola doesn't really have any offensive presence and Malamar needs to use Superpower multiple times before it becomes an effective pokemon (which by then it usually is killed by the enemy team's special attacker)

The Mew here aside from setting hazards is also particularly do-nothing, idk what Mew would run normally but probably at least give it something like snarl or a body press set

Some other pink Pokemon I think you could consider:
Clefairy/Clefable (redirection)
Comfey(healer and support)
HoopaU/Hatterene (if you're ok with using the more purple indeedee for psyspam)

[azure quail]

https://pokepast.es/442f04c965e75069 https://pokepast.es/9902a613b608f5b9
Hard stuck 1500 trying to make dragonite chien pao work. Both teams have their weaknesses and need some fixing.
The one with a rain duo was the original where I initially had basculegion instead of kingdra, but later switched cause my kingambit matchup was bad.
I created the second team after losing 75% of my games against wheezing teams.
I'm still having trouble using the team, i feel like Sneasler isn't doing much and i'm losing to basculegion pretty badly.

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[brittle spade]

you shouldn't have to try very hard to make dragonite chien pao work

and you definitely shouldnt be losing to weezing of all things

[azure quail]

i cant get rid of the exitment when dragonite one hit KO's pokemon before they can move with no setup

ive used it in vgc and its just what im comfortable playing

[brittle spade]

https://pokepast.es/0a79b5839da14aa2

this should make you more consistent into stuff that isnt amoonguss

and snow

[azure quail]

alr

i havent faced amoonguss in like 2 weeks

[brittle spade]

rain is kinda bad so id just drop the first team

[azure quail]

alr

[brittle spade]

if you're still having trouble with stuff like diancie, you can try slotting ogerpon + glimmora over landorus sneasler

[azure quail]

im lowk getting destroyed so hard rn to bulk up corv

[azure quail]

the bronzong and corv matchup is really bad

[scarlet nexus]

https://pokepast.es/b1d7738a0ffd87db I havent made a team in months and it shows, feel free to roast me but also lets see if we can salvage this

[scarlet nexus]

you are correct, first think I said was what is sneasler doing here, you need a def switch in imo, sum you can switch in no matter whats coming, incin isnt awful for this but replacing sneasler for sum like iron hands

and investing spdef

[azure quail]

Im trying to replace him with chi-yu rn

corv and bronzong matchup is unbelievebly bad without him

[scarlet nexus]

I get that, only really have the pao for it, hands only really struggles with the bell. 1 question, whats eq doing on dnite

are you act ever clicking it

gterrain weakens ground moves and getting dnite next to lando seems heavenly difficult and ineffective

[azure quail]

yeah its switched out for stantrum

i was clicking it pretty frequently tho when i was using rain

[scarlet nexus]

I can the rain variation, pelliper easy

[azure quail]

do you usually speak like this

your writing is uncomfturbly difficult to read

[scarlet nexus]

pelliper is easy to get next to dnite

didnt think I needed to fully write it out

[azure quail]

nah i got what you were saying

[scarlet nexus]

I did mean to put see lol

thats just my brain being faster than my hands

[scarlet nexus]

dont ask questions because I dont have answers, im winning more than losing

moon is a surprisingly good twind setter

[peak crypt]

Corviknight is rare enough that you shouldn’t really concern yourself with it

[peak crypt]

Roaring Moon is great but most of the rest of this team is real bad

Tornadus is a better weather setter than Kanto Ninetales to be totally honest, Comfey is incredibly niche (and doesn’t belong here), and Arcanine and Toxapex both stink

there really isn’t a ton I can say about this beyond “start over and only use Pokemon listed on the viability rankings”

if you’re really set on specifically K-Tales sun we can probably workshop something, but there are many reasons that Pokemon sees almost zero play

[scarlet nexus]

I tagged in torkoal, just dont like using the weathers as moves unless its also the abil, having move and abil on same mon auto win weather matchups

[shrewd iron]

A team always has some weaknesses, corviknight and bronzong are rare enough

[hallow wyvern]

https://pokepast.es/5251658b801c4333

not the best at team building but decided to whip up something

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[hallow wyvern]

?

Anyway I wasn’t gonna add whims because I had Rilla so I was planning on replacing it but idk who

[peak crypt]

to say the same thing I did to the last person: Ninetales sucks

You’d be a lot better off running Torkoal, or even scrapping it and just giving your Whimsicott Sunny Day

[hallow wyvern]

Alright thanks

[torpid moat]

try tw tornadus then over whims, also be sure to give rilla assault vest instead of lefties

[small swift]

https://pokepast.es/e70d85ef5f1d2049 guys, this sand team is cool?

[brittle spade]

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/doubles-ou-team-bazaar.3710875/post-10535276
this was brought to tour

[brittle spade]

stacking ground types isnt good to consistently win games

this is what people load for sand : https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/sv-dou-teambuilding-competition-v3-week-27-gouging-fire.3711634/post-10247798

they like including firepon

[brazen gale]

hear me out, alolan sandslash trick room

[torpid moat]

clear amulet glastrier does that better with icicle crash/horsepower, and even glast isn't that great

[elder bone]

https://pokepast.es/0448ced33ac7ac63 this is my team and i feel like im missing something

[brittle spade]

what format is this supposed to be for ?

[elder bone]

Nat dex doubles, I switched Krogre with peliper bc it was banned

[brittle spade]

a bit underwhelming, especially against sun which is the best team in the format

try this https://pokepast.es/d650d0a5e7ee22f1

[elder bone]

Allright thank you

[stray wave]

no

[slender basin]

https://pokepast.es/31d48db40187160c

Guys i needed some help

I want to use this team for ou doubles, but flutter mane is banned

As i understand it, its there for both sweep potential and trick room

Is there any alternatives?

[sonic rock]

Not to knowledgeable but I've bumped into this problem myself tbh, I ended up using a meowscarada but I don't know how that would work in your team comp tbh

[slender basin]

My best guess en is sinistcha, since it can heal on entry, set up trick room, and deal lots of ghost damage

[slender basin]

Plus its grass tyle has its fire weakness reduced by rain

[torpid moat]

I don't recommend adapting this kind of rain comp to dou, dou has waterpon legal which really invalidates stuff like azu

I recommend a lower-commitment rain with rain dance torn/waterpon/pao/lando-i as a baseline 4

you can have np ghold as next slot maybe

and let's say incin or iron hands or av raging bolt last slot

also the ghold should not be trick scarf, that's significantly less powerful in 6v6, just go for leftovers with a bulkier build

here's one of my older teams that has those exact 6 actually: https://pokepast.es/fe88fffd952de2d3

in current meta I'd say pao should be ice spinner/crunch/brick break/protect

but the other sets can stay exactly the same @slender basin

[slender basin]

ah gotcha

[torpid moat]

there's also no real replacement for what flutter does

you have to compromise somewhere, whether that's chi yu or lando-i on speed, or chien pao on being way weaker to incin

and pao doesn't have a similar kind of bulk, it almost always needs sash

oh, also give waterpon taunt > spiky here

nonprankster taunt is pretty valuable for certain mons like sinistcha or amoong or alolatales

[shut bough]

Hello! this is my team for Gen 9 double ubers https://pokepast.es/7c71ace12540b390 , i usually open up with grimmsnarl and arceus-fairy and set up stealth rock, reflect and light screen, then i keep using dazz with both, after one dies i try to use murkrow to set tailwind and spam astral barrage with my Calyrex-shadow (or switch to tera-fairy miraidon and iron moth if both spots are available), then i use the miraidon and iron moth to sweep the rest of the team

the biggest issue so far is dealing with trick room teams

cuz of tailwind and high base speed of some of my mons

(not that high, but higher than some meta picks like amoongus, calyrex-ice etc)

.

Do you guys know any way i can deal with it without using a different team?

Im kinda new to showdown, so im trying to learn

i also have been using some derivations of this team using groudon instead of calyrex-shadow

[tough timber]

https://pokepast.es/9ac9d3aec2ce06a2

(duu)

built this bc I really like regigigas and wolfeys Baltimore regional team which is what I took main inspiration from

Explanation of some things:
-I know simple beam on latios does not get rid of slow starts effects, but its stat-doubling qualities do still affect regigigas, and activating its weakness policy gives 3x attack so while it's more riskier than leading regigigas weezing it still gives me a backup plan

-regigigas is running drain punch so it can have reliable recovery, especially with its Tera fighting which is necessary to activate its weakness policy. Comfey can activate it with her priority draining kiss and weezing can activate it with fairy wind if need be (although fairy wind is more riskier since its mroe powerful, haven't checks the damage calcs on that yet)

I appreciate any suggestions

[mighty acorn]

https://pokepast.es/847512cc80414113
DM me if you want to talk about the team. It's in dou. I use kommo-o since it's the fastest belly drum sweeper with drain punch.

[wheat scaffold]

Realize monotype is singles so im reposting here.
This is my first time making a team.
For context the friend tourney im in is monotype double
No legendary.
The rules are Either 1 paradox/future or pseudo legendary pokemon
No repeating type so no Azumaril and Primarina on one team.
https://pokepast.es/20e267c8c11fe1ca
This is what i made for my mono fairy team.
I'm having issue trying to make a team that can deal with most other mono team especially fire and steel.
Would appreciate any kind of feedback for future team build.
Oh yeah Iron valiant was suppose to have booster energy (not banned in the tourney im in) and would lead with florges

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles Ubers RMT @torpid moat. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[torpid moat]

a lot of these sets seem pretty awkward, also if you wanna spam dazzling gleam, the best mon to do so is magearna

but yeah I don't recommend iron moth really, bulkier ubers like ho-oh are a lot more reliable

your mirai has rest for some reason, which you are prevented from using on eterrain

did you think that healed you to full and immediately woke you up?

haze murkrow is also pretty gimmicky, tornadus or whimsicott are considered the better prankster twind mons

but if you kept murkrow it really needs to be sash

@shut bough check out the dubers magearna sample here, it might give some better ideas on how to support it https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/doubles-ubers.3712864/post-9456565

but yeah the answer to beating trick room is to run bulkier middling speed mons of your own like groudon and ho oh, or some of the defensive options like incineroar or amoonguss (without mirai)

if you wanted fewer changes from your starting team, I'd say Grimm/Mirai/SR clear amulet Groudon/SD Espeed clear amulet arceus/magearna with trick room/rillaboom wouldn't be a bad 6

[wheat scaffold]

Is it worth to have hazards on doubles?

[torpid moat]

sometimes yes

generally you don't go beyond sr + glimmora's automatic tspikes

because sr weakens key mons like tornadus, pao, ninetales-a, kyurem

of which torn and pao are sashed

as well as others like firepon, incin (if no boots), dnite

[wheat scaffold]

Alright ill prob use 1 move slot of Sr and thats it

thanks

[torpid moat]

I don't recommend sr in your weird monotype format

there's not necessarily an established meta for that

[wheat scaffold]

Yeah idk why my friend made that rule LOL

[torpid moat]

btw, is flutter mane legal?

[wheat scaffold]

Whats like the general idea behind team building?

Should i just watch a guide

[wheat scaffold]

Yeah

I changed iron valiant to flutter

[torpid moat]

you should absolutely be using it

[wheat scaffold]

i forgot flutter was a thing LOL

[torpid moat]

oh no repeating types either lame

[wheat scaffold]

WHAT IM SAYIN

[torpid moat]

you're not allowed to get away with running magearna right

[wheat scaffold]

its whatever at least they have fun

Nope

[torpid moat]

ok so in this kind of format

you really just want a bunch of solid attackers

[wheat scaffold]

Im replacing azu for primarina

[torpid moat]

maybe some speed control involved

[wheat scaffold]

I see

[wheat scaffold]

I was thinking of either using whim or just giving tink thunder wave

[torpid moat]

you also generally want protect and fake out in doubles

yeah whims is a good tw mon

[wheat scaffold]

I see

alright i should prob do that

[torpid moat]

you should also definitely get a follow me togekiss or clefairy

I'll just give you your 6 tbh

I do think keeping azu is pretty powerful btw

[wheat scaffold]

Ohhh alright

[torpid moat]

it just needs protect and redirection support

[wheat scaffold]

i havent had the best decision making when it comes to using azumaril

[wheat scaffold]

Alright

[torpid moat]

but yeah premium mons for mono fairy in particular are things that can kill fires, steels, poison

[wheat scaffold]

Whats a premium mons?

[torpid moat]

premium meaning very valuable

[wheat scaffold]

ohhh

[torpid moat]

like flutter who has a lot of useful coverage on a powerful mon

[wheat scaffold]

Btw can i use fake out with vest on?

[torpid moat]

you can yes

[wheat scaffold]

great

tink will prob use vest while hatterene speed control with nuzzle?

[torpid moat]

that's a singles thing

you don't need nuzzle on hatt at all

if anything you'd run trick room on it

[wheat scaffold]

oh when i was playing with the previous team nuzzle was working out LOL so i thought it would be good alright

[torpid moat]

probably give it fire tera psychic/mystical fire/trick room/protect

[wheat scaffold]

Speaking of trick room

i was thinking of using weezing for the terrain

[torpid moat]

azu should be aqua jet/knock off/bd/protect

I don't recommend gweez really, misty terrain isn't particularly valuable

and ngas would weaken your own azu

[wheat scaffold]

ohhh yeah ur right

[wheat scaffold]

Ok

[torpid moat]

whims can run tailwind/encore/fake tears

[wheat scaffold]

Encore is so good

when they do protect

Is there a way to fit in taunt?

one of them is running a rain team with tw

tailwind

[torpid moat]

yeah taunt last is fine as long as it's covert cloak

[wheat scaffold]

and the other trick room

[torpid moat]

are you allowed to ct for specific opponents?

[wheat scaffold]

whats ct

[torpid moat]

counter team

[wheat scaffold]

Nope LOL

team comp arent reveal until the day it happens

[torpid moat]

no I mean

can you switch teams for a given opponent's type, the day of

[wheat scaffold]

Nah

[torpid moat]

ah gotcha

[wheat scaffold]

A lot of weird rules

[torpid moat]

yeah you should be taunt then yes

[wheat scaffold]

Alright

[torpid moat]

the more weird rules, usually the worse the players are

[wheat scaffold]

lmao

its just some small thing my friend group is doing

but it got me into pokemon vgc

so its whatever

[torpid moat]

flutter should be specs moonblast/dazzling gleam/shadow ball/power gem

[wheat scaffold]

As in interested in competitive pokemon where i started watching tour

[wheat scaffold]

Alright

[torpid moat]

potentially you may want ground tera blast over moonblast or dazzle, idk who your opps are though

ghost tera is probably pretty safe

[wheat scaffold]

Oh yeah

forgot to mention

[torpid moat]

no tera?

[wheat scaffold]

every gimmick is allowed but u only get to use 1

[torpid moat]

wait what

is this natdex as well?

[wheat scaffold]

Tera is allowed but only of the typing the mons has

[wheat scaffold]

I found out

just now

it is

[torpid moat]

that's a completely different story lmao

[wheat scaffold]

Yeah i was thinking of just terra being allowed

[torpid moat]

run mega mawile then

[wheat scaffold]

until he went yeah nat dex

[wheat scaffold]

with trick room i assume?

[torpid moat]

yeah

[wheat scaffold]

Replacing tink

[torpid moat]

wait you're not allowed to dynamax right

[wheat scaffold]

its allowed

[torpid moat]

because that's by far the strongest one

[wheat scaffold]

but idk how to set it up in team builder

[torpid moat]

where are you playing it?

[wheat scaffold]

showdown

[torpid moat]

dynamax and tera are incompatible

you can't have both be legal in the same match

[wheat scaffold]

ohhhh

[torpid moat]

most likely dynamax isn't allowed

[wheat scaffold]

yeah

that would be the case i assume

For the mega mawile do i run SD on it or just pure all attacking move with protect?

[torpid moat]

sd iron head sucker protect seems fine

[wheat scaffold]

Alright

what i have so far

[torpid moat]

whims can run trick room as well then

no fake tears

[wheat scaffold]

ok

[torpid moat]

togekiss can be max bulk follow me

with sitrus berry

unless no item clause

[wheat scaffold]

Not allowed to have 2 of the same item

Sleep clause

thats about all the rule i think

heres the rule

[torpid moat]

ah, was gonna suggest shiinotic otherwise

[wheat scaffold]

i tried talking him into just using the vgc rule

He infact did not want it

[torpid moat]

do leftovers then instead of sitrus

[wheat scaffold]

the opps

we all spun a wheel

there was no choosing

[wheat scaffold]

alr

by max bulk u mean max ev on both the def?

[torpid moat]

no, 252 hp first

hp is more efficient than defenses

[wheat scaffold]

oh alright

[torpid moat]

just pass me an updated version and I'll fix it tbh

would be faster

[wheat scaffold]

Alright

https://pokepast.es/a05ffa2e06e522ce

[halcyon panther]

Hey @wheat scaffold, it looks like you're trying to share a gen9nationaldexdoubles team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1060037469472555028 instead.

[wheat scaffold]

here

I just wanted to say i really appreciate ur help

Life saver

[torpid moat]

@wheat scaffold something like this then: https://pokepast.es/148a41f2e3a4fb4a

I still think it feels a little light on proper attackers, but there aren't many great options with no dupe types

trick room comfey is potentially better than whims here

[wheat scaffold]

Alright thanks let me take a look at the team

For follow me togekiss Im assuming only use it when SPA are on the field?

[torpid moat]

you can use it for anything

[wheat scaffold]

Oh alright

[torpid moat]

its main purpose is to ease setting tr or to protect azu

[wheat scaffold]

ohhhh

Im assuming the general gameplay of the team is set up tr

and flutter is the wallbreaker

[torpid moat]

you don't necessarily need tr

as both maw and azu carry priority

maw and azu are definitely more of the focus

and then you set tailwind or tr as necessary, depending on what the opponent has

[wheat scaffold]

i see

[torpid moat]

you have to position maw/azu carefully

but yeah flutter is there as well to just kill random stuff without requiring support

[wheat scaffold]

Is leading with whim and flutter a good idea

[torpid moat]

no

[wheat scaffold]

if i regonise any tr or hazard on the enemy team?

[torpid moat]

flutter is usually fast enough on its own

[wheat scaffold]

oh alright

[torpid moat]

you can actually lead maw pretty often

like maw + hatt

or like maw + whims or flutter + maw

or togekiss + hatt if you think tr is valuable

if you're not confident in your positioning skill and your opponent doesn't have any disruption, potentially togekiss + azu is an option

[wheat scaffold]

I will be taking notes of everything u just said

Im prob going to run alot of battles with the team

to get the hang of it

[wheat scaffold]

With this lead if i see the option to tr i should just do it and mega maw right

[torpid moat]

yeah

[wheat scaffold]

Looking at the stats aswell whim is the def tank while togekiss is the sp def tank is what im assuming

[torpid moat]

kinda, but don't think of it in terms of tank

togekiss is the only tank on the team, but it can take hits from both phys and special

role is more important than stats in this case

[wheat scaffold]

Noted

[torpid moat]

maw is a bulky attacker rather than a tank

intimidate helps a lot of course

but its primary job is to kill stuff

[wheat scaffold]

Ohhh i see

if i can take hit on maw i should just go for SD

hatt is there to tr

[torpid moat]

if you can kill something or deal significant damage that's more valuable than sd

[wheat scaffold]

Ok

[torpid moat]

you're more likely to protect or iron head t1 than click sd

[wheat scaffold]

Noted

[torpid moat]

you would sd during tr turns if your opponent is carrying protect or you expect a switch or something

[wheat scaffold]

Ok togekiss and hatt can deal with steel

thats a banger

[torpid moat]

togekiss not really

it'll do some damage but don't treat it like an actual answer

[wheat scaffold]

damn

alright

[torpid moat]

you can overpower steels with flutter/azu mostly

or maw sucker

[wheat scaffold]

thats insane damn

[torpid moat]

if you don't like how sucker plays, you can run like knock off maw + play rough azu

actually, definitely do that

[wheat scaffold]

Whim + Maw is prob my best answer to rain team right

[wheat scaffold]

Alright

Knocl off maw and play rough on azu

[torpid moat]

setting tr should be the most important vs rain

you prob won't find an opportunity to belly drum well against mono water but azu under tr will do work

[wheat scaffold]

Alright

Theres depths to this shit damn

[torpid moat]

it's moreso a gameplay thing than a team thing

this is a really simple team and not that well made tbh

but your opponents will probably be worse

[wheat scaffold]

Lmao

hopefully

i was worry about the mono fire and steel

with how this is looking i should be fine

[torpid moat]

uh, if your opponent is actually good both matchups are probably unwinnable

the most this can do is give you a chance

[wheat scaffold]

https://tenor.com/view/tweaking-cat-tweaking-cat-help-gif-15027370981305715566

Better than nothing

Thanks again btw

[torpid moat]

yw

[wheat scaffold]

you helped ALOT

I'll play around with the team

[torpid moat]

you can consider rain dance or sunny day whims

[wheat scaffold]

i'll prob have more questions down the line to ask i hope it doesnt bother you

[wheat scaffold]

omg thats actually smart as fuck

[torpid moat]

oh jk it doesn't get rain dance

[wheat scaffold]

that shit shuts down rain team no

ok nvm

LOL

[torpid moat]

yeah fire is unwinnable

oh actually

[wheat scaffold]

I hope brackets gets made

[torpid moat]

try grimmsnarl instead of whims then

[wheat scaffold]

and i never see him

put fight dragon and dark in my bracket

[torpid moat]

light clay light screen/reflect/parting shot

[wheat scaffold]

alr ill make a duplicate and see which one im ok with

[torpid moat]

last move spirit break

sure, gl

[wheat scaffold]

what item?

leading with grim + togekiss would prob be good right?

I could tw someone ft

and parting shot grim out for maw when the screen are down

[torpid moat]

light clay

you wouldn't want grimm + toge, far too passive

grimm + hatt maybe

[torpid moat]

simple beam does get rid of slow start, no?

though the wp regi is too gimmicky

I recommend coaching mew + clear amulet regi

mew gets pollen puff as well

so it can replace comfey

[wheat scaffold]

Ok thanks

[torpid moat]

also you wouldn't want cm on the lati

prob something like tailwind coaching pollen puff mew/gweez/regi/toedscruel/follow me ogerpon-cornerstone/moltres-galar would be a lot tighter

ah, though that's awkward without simple beam

fine, lati over goltres, or give mew worry seed or skill swap or something

[tough timber]

I think huge power is genuinely the only one that works, because slow start is like almost its own volatile status condition and for whatever reason using simple beam on regigigas gives it simple but its attack and speed still remain halved, I assume the same would apply with worry seed

Or correction, skill swapping the slow start away gets rid of its adverse effects but simple beam or worry seed don't

[torpid moat]

that's not true at all no

you can override slow start with anything and it will clear

oh hm

ah yeah I found it, that was only true in gen 4

in modern gens you can remove it in any way and it'll clear fully

but yeah regardless of that, it's still very gimmicky and I don't recommend it

if you're more interested in a comfey dkiss target, goltres is way stronger

[tough timber]

Watch this it doesn't

Bro

My internet is so bad

Is that actually how it works in the real games or just an oversight by devs

[torpid moat]

ah, ignore the tooltip

it'll still be proper damage

[tough timber]

Alr then

[torpid moat]

but yeah just so you're aware, metagross is like way better than regigigas

largely due to innate clear body

but having to commit tera + wp activator is really not worth it

[tough timber]

Yeah honestly I agree it's too hard to pivot my team around gigas

[torpid moat]

for example here's one of my coaching duu teams with basically dozo in regi's place: https://pokepast.es/3326c8b2ba66a740

where it's a lot more flexible because you have 3 actual targets, and mew is a way better support mon than gweez

[tough timber]

Gweez is more of a special attacker on my team not rlly support but I get what ur saying

[peak crypt]

I know a lot of people like the Weezing Toedscruel team but Wolfe is not among those people

a week or two after last year's Baltimore Regional he tweeted that he "took Toedscruel out back and shot him"

Weezing is in a unique spot of "this isn't great but it can absolutely wreck people sometimes," but it's much better at doing that next to something that's always good

rather than something that needs to be next to Weezing to hit its full potential

it's also worth noting that DUU is just a stronger format than Reg H and attacking Weezing doesn't have the stats to contribute what it needs

[shut bough]

Thanks for the advice! I’ll run this team

[static hawk]

Can somebody rate my team?

[peak crypt]

only if you post a link to the team

We cannot rate a team we cannot see!

@static hawk

[torpid moat]

if you're gonna use drum, you definitely should not be life orb, sitrus berry is still very important for ensuring drum actually happens

but kommo is not fast enough for drum to work on its own without support from tornadus tailwind, same for chi-yu

I recommend iron hands instead, it has way more natural bulk and fits better into a trick room shell

[torpid moat]

try a comp like this instead for a bd hands semiroom: https://pokepast.es/c3fde90e6887e784

@mighty acorn

[remote jolt]

https://pokepast.es/4a217676f951046e
I want to use Kyogre.

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles Ubers RMT @torpid moat. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[torpid moat]

Try mystic water instead of specs ogre, protect + ice beam > thunder + hydro, locking into spout can get really annoying. You should also run ice rider over rilla here, you want something that can kill mons like koraidon and amoonguss, and it fits well with rain and zama

[edgy brook]

Can anyone give me feedback for this team?

https://pokepast.es/412a541c85f1fb3b

I'm kinda new to Doubles OU

[silent wyvern]

https://pokepast.es/ce530980bd8762bc
been liking ou doubles its nice (except seeing that cat) and i wanted to use a sun team kinda i saw like toakoal after you thing on youtube so i made a team based on it

this deck mons all of a purpose and i will say they are there when ask, but i would like feedback on how to approve this as i am fun with it and i wanna comp more with this list

[halcyon panther]

New [Gen 9] Doubles OU RMT @brittle spade, @peak crypt, @torpid moat, @rose juniper, @tight spire. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[rose juniper]

hey

let me take a look

im not entirely sure what you mean with the thing on yt btw. As for the team, I don't know if your main goal is to just have fun and use the mons you like or to make an actual good preforming competitive team @silent wyvern

cause if you wanna keep these 6 guys we can definetly improve a bit but keep the essence of the team but if you want to go a more competitive route then there is a lot to change

[silent wyvern]

The ladder as I want to win more games with this deck with a concept I enjoy

Also the YouTube is the litigant using after you on toakoal while toakoal uses eruption

[silent wyvern]

I do want to keep the 6 guys as much as possible but if there is something either much better mons or moves then I will change them

As I try to optimize everything (except maybe the numbers of EVs as I am not good at them) and have reasons why a move or Mon is there

[peak crypt]

Raichu and Ribombee are both just... kind of bad

like sure they technically do things that nothing else can exactly do, but the things they do aren't worth including on a team in the first place when there are Pokemon that just win more without the specialization

Teams using the Lillikoal "combo" usually just jam as much damage into their team as they possibly can

or they have a full Trick Room gameplan that uses Lilligant to throw off anti-TR leads or to clean up after a Hatterene or Ursaluna

they don't really bother trying to heal the Torkoal because it's simply another piece of the offense puzzle

if you're not interested in Trick Room, you can probably still use some of these concepts: the Raichu and Gouging Fire can get folded into a Raging Bolt, which is great into a lot of Fire resists, gets powered up by Torkoal, and can take advantage of After You with its low Speed

(it does have Thunderclap already but sometimes you want to use a turbo speed Dragon move)

Hearthflame is a great choice but Gouging Fire is probably one Fire-type too many

speaking of Hearthflame, I'd definitely run Spiky Shield over Stomping Tantrum, and while not totally necessary, I'd consider dropping Swords Dance for Follow Me - these moves both have their own strengths so this is optional for sure

Ribombee is kind of outclassed by Tornadus - you can prevent sleep by Taunting, or even using Follow Me Pon to redirect Spores

[silent wyvern]

Wow you saw everything I wanted to do and improved it

Let me read more and think about things

Like how I wanted ribombee as a tailwind setter that doesn't let my team use to sleep

If I remove both gouging and Raichu for raging that leaves me with 5 mons

And I think I should play a ursaluna as it's big, beefy, had ground and rock move as if I am removing hearthflame's stomping I might need

[torpid moat]

you could try diancie instead for trick room comp

lilli torkoal diancie bolt firepon torn isn't too bad

still fairly unbalanced though

walking wake or lando-i over diancie would help you be less weak to opposing lando

[silent wyvern]

ah bolt doesnt not have flash cannon

[torpid moat]

bolt would not want to run flash cannon

dpulse + tbolt (or clap) hits everything already

[silent wyvern]

oh really

[torpid moat]

who would flash cannon be for?

[silent wyvern]

i say this because i want more moves that hits more mons

ice fairy

[torpid moat]

you know how stab works right?

[silent wyvern]

i do

but i am talking about coverage

[torpid moat]

technically yes, flash cannon could hit like diancie or ninetales-a for 4x

but those are mons that you already hit fine with neutral tbolt

you generally want coverage for stuff you can't normally hit

[silent wyvern]

hmmmm ok ok

so dragon pluse, thunder clap, thunderbolt anddddd

snarl seems good

[torpid moat]

it depends on the set you're going for

[silent wyvern]

ectroweb

[torpid moat]

it sounds like av bolt you're talking about here

which would prob want draco meteor/tclap

plus some combination of electroweb, tbolt, snarl

[silent wyvern]

can i just go with dragon pluse rather than meteor as i dont like it
it can miss and i need to switch out my guy as the sp atk lowing

[torpid moat]

it's really important for actually threatening certain mons like lando-i or ogerpon-hearthflame or av kyurem

[silent wyvern]

why because its a instant kill is it does hit?

[torpid moat]

you can run volt switch as well if you're concerned about the switching out part

yes, threatening a kill on those frailer mons instead of 2hko is very important

[silent wyvern]

ok

[torpid moat]

and something like this is miserable

68+ SpA Raging Bolt Dragon Pulse vs. 92 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Kyurem with an ally's Aurora Veil: 136-160 (32.8 - 38.6%) -- 98.5% chance to 3HKO

[silent wyvern]

draco, thunderclap, thunder bolt, volt switch

how does this sound

[torpid moat]

ah, snarl or eweb over tbolt then

I'd say snarl

[silent wyvern]

ok

i am just going to copy the evs from the smogon website

[silent wyvern]

let me look at walking and check if i like it's tools

oh water dragon, thats a strong typing

wait a min

i was going to say i kinda dont like it because its a water guy in a sun team

but it has a move that does more damage in the sun

what if i give tornadus sunny day

as a back up setter

[torpid moat]

that's fairly common

[silent wyvern]

oh ok good

[torpid moat]

you should definitely not be heat rock torkoal though

charcoal is better

and focus sash lilli

or covert cloak to ignore fake out

[silent wyvern]

i gave tornadus a coat

[torpid moat]

you're aware dou doesn't have item clause right?

[silent wyvern]

cloak*

yes

[torpid moat]

if you're unwilling to run protect on the lilli then cloak would be really useful

by leaning so much into sun you'll end up with a pretty unbalanced team

[silent wyvern]

yeah make sense, i just wanted lilli to hit harder

cloak is good

the team is ready, i am going to try it out

[silent wyvern]

my god ivy cudgel is stupid strong

anyways i really like this team

and will keep playing it

[torpid moat]

if you're gonna build sand, I recommend covering your bases by adding chien pao and ogerpon-wellspring, these are really important for hitting specific mons that ttar and exca can't like lando-i

garchomp is kinda mediocre as well, if you're gonna use it it has to be clear amulet for intimidate, but it's just a worse mon than exca on sand

exca can actually run bug tera x scissor instead of ice tera blast, it's important for hitting opposing waterpon and adds a very useful ground + fighting resist

sneasler also doesn't really fit here, it's generally not good in dou and only makes sense with unburden + seed

@edgy brook here's one of my own sand teams, though even this is on the unbalanced side: https://pokepast.es/db3dac470221cbe7

having houndstone + exca is a little too much commitment

[remote jolt]

https://pokepast.es/b72fa13bc75f3fad