avatar-rigging

[digital willow]

nein

the one in the screen shot haha

when you select stuff

and then you pick, median, individual etc

for where it should be shown and active

with median it's now at the tip

[cosmic vine]

this?

[digital willow]

ya

it always goes to the head

[cosmic vine]

oh

[digital willow]

but if I select the ball it's in the middle

[cosmic vine]

so you have it on "active element" ?

[digital willow]

yes

I said the wrong thing before

[cosmic vine]

and this is preventing you from making bone heads and tails overlap somehow?

[digital willow]

no

what

Im saying this is a way to do it

I just cant find the point's value...

I think in previous Blender it was always in the lower left corner

or actually no... I remember it wrong too, it wasn't done in proportion fix. then you just change both bones at the same time

maybe when I was checking the T pose a second time I messed it up T_T

amazing how something so small is so difficult

[cosmic vine]

just google your very specific blender problem and get results from 2011

[digital willow]

haha

u think I should use your video then? I can do it, my brain just is so sluggish

[cosmic vine]

if your magnet tool doesn't make them overlap properly that's a way to do it

there's probably 5 other ways I'm not familiar with too

[digital willow]

it's just fast and I need to fullscreen

[cosmic vine]

just don't make it totally straight the whole way out since you're supposed to have that small bend at the elbow

[digital willow]

well that didnt work...

trying to follow the video

[cosmic vine]

I know what you did but it's still funny

might have copied the wrong value there

[digital willow]

T_T

cause youre doing it on the right side and I did on left

[cosmic vine]

it shouldn't matter

[digital willow]

eeh

[cosmic vine]

if you have the mirroring working you can do it on either side

[digital willow]

but

I mean

I clicked on the outer arm

but you on inner

because opposite side

so for my sake, I should match the side youre doing it on

but

it wont work

because

it's the opposite I should do!

aaaaaaaaah!!jfgfnfgfbn

I want it to match the outer arm

[cosmic vine]

if you want you can send the .blend file to me and I can try just to make sure I'm not misleading somehow by totally missing something in your specific model

[digital willow]

or

maybe Im..

my head is spinning

now Im forgetting which one was in the original place

no thanks

😔 my brain is just stupid

it's like with math

I have dyscalculia I'm pretty sure

my brain just wont do it

it takes a very long time and I need step by step

[cosmic vine]

well if nothing else "upgrading" to blender 3.0 probably won't hurt 🤷‍♂️

[digital willow]

I need to search in here to see which one I said is the one I should copy from

yeah I wanna do that

on the right

[cosmic vine]

iirc there's some issue between CATS and the newest blender versions

so maybe don't go to 3.3

[digital willow]

oh

yeah I would have asked about that

I need to stop but it's hard when I havent finished this

outer arm has moved...

and that is what u did

so... I can follow it

ok I did it, finally orz

thank you TK

I need to check any other points of bones meeting

right, the shoulders

@cosmic vine could it be bad to connect all of them that are that close like this?

[cosmic vine]

well you don't want to have the finger bones directly on the wrist for example

[digital willow]

that's why I said close like this X3

like neck and head

[cosmic vine]

it's fine to overlap usual stuff like the hip to head chain

[fading verge]

hey there, what am I doing wrong here?

[cosmic vine]

head is a child of "neck_001" ?

[fading verge]

neck>neck.01>head

But I am using neck as the neck mapping

[cosmic vine]

having a bone between neck and head is the only thing that looks immediately out of place to me

[fading verge]

If I remove that other neck bone and curve the neck bone like this. I'm pretty sure it will have the same result. right?

[cosmic vine]

I'm not entirely sure what I am looking at here

is neck001 painted to anything or is it just there

[fading verge]

It is painted

So, I just tried removing neck.01 and put the vertex group on normal neck and It's the same result. Regardless of the extra bone

[cosmic vine]

yeah the rig hierarchy was the only thing that looked unusual to me, as for what is going wrong with the model I don't know because I can't make sense of what the model is supposed to be

[fading verge]

Sonic Frontiers. Giganto.

Neck is supposed to be pointed out like that

[cosmic vine]

so what isn't working then? I thought it being stretched out was the broken part

[fading verge]

No, the issue is that when he's put into unity and I either load him up in game or in the mapping. His head/neck is pointing upwards towards the sky

[cosmic vine]

oh

[fading verge]

It's not maintaining it's same rotation that it was exported from blender with

[cosmic vine]

did you mess with the muscle settings in the avatar setup?

[fading verge]

the rigging? Green mapping and shit? Put his neck bone under neck and his chest bone under chest. Made sure it lines up. yes

[cosmic vine]

these yeah

[fading verge]

I have not messed with those, no

[cosmic vine]

try setting the values so the neck rests at a lower angle would be my guess

[fading verge]

looks like when I bend the neck all way the down. It looks fine. But it shows up as a red error now

[cosmic vine]

might just be complaining about the hierarchy

is what with or without having neck001?

[fading verge]

without

[cosmic vine]

what red error? not familiar

[fading verge]

there is also no option to save the muscle setting changes

[cosmic vine]

expand it again and you can set the min/max angle values

[cosmic vine]

but the right/left sliders stop at 0

[fading verge]

changes for the neck slider do not save

If I rotate the bone in the bone mapping. It will tell me character is not in T pose

[cosmic vine]

was a guess, I've only adjusted the muscle values for fingers to get them correctly aligned but their corrected positions don't show up until in vrc

[fading verge]

So, I found my fix. I just put both my neck and head bones straight up. Put the view point at the end of the head. And reweighted the neck/head area so that even with the head bone being far away from the actual head; the head would rotate properly.

Kinda stupid I had to do it that way, but whatever, beggars can't be choosers

[cosmic vine]

👌 nothing came to mind that didn't involve repainting some of it but good it worked without being a huge headache @fading verge

[idle meteor]

my avatar's arms are weirdly deformed upon entering unity, could this be a rigging issue?

[sleek isle]

Normal, annoying, but normal

[terse compass]

Can someone do me a favor? I believe it's low effort enough that if you know what you're doing it should be no effort at all, can anyone help?

[sleek isle]

No

[kind ore]

probably now but if youre gonna ask for help dont ask to ask

just say what you need help with

[idle meteor]

any ideas?

[sleek isle]

You have to show more detail like armature hierarchy. Humanoid tab. Any warning in console or SDK panel. Something

[kind mortar]

Go into blender and do a "Fix avatar" with the CATS plugin and it will fix

I had this same issue recently

[idle meteor]

ooh, alright, i'll check that out

[rigid summit]

Hey guys! im in need of some help here, I am looking to add the Physbones to my hair and ears, As well as adding grabbing and collision on the ears. Though when i try to add in the script, it detects the hair bones, but it cant detect the ear bones, ive checked both unity and blender and there are bones for the ears. Any help would be appreciated!

here is the same model in Blender btw.

[rigid summit]

Nevermind! I fixed it

Solution :

Make sure on your Physbone script. use first on " Multi Child Type "

(average works as well)

(though, it might cause your head to become a bobble head, will check it out more

[rigid summit]

update 2: Found an actual solution to this

set both of the ears on the ignore transforms on the head.

instead, create 2 new Phys Bone Scripts, one for each ear.

It might not be the most optimized way. but it does work

[sage patio]

@rigid summit don't add the physbone on the head bone, you'll fuck with the IK. instead, have a bone which all the hair chains are parented to, and another bone that both ears are parented to

call them something like HairRoot and EarsRoot

put the physbone scripts on those

[rigid summit]

how do i do those? I cant move the bones or else i get this error :

[sage patio]

you do it in blender

you don't edit models in Unity, unity is a game engine

blender is where you do any kind of model edit

[rigid summit]

ooh alright i get you. though while i know how to make new bones so i can make them a parent to the ears, and another parent to the hair. do i just try to wedge the new bone between the head bone or could i do it on top of the head bone? worried that it might mess up the physics.

[sage patio]

position of root bone doesn't matter

[terse compass]

Ight so I have a five nights at Freddy's avatar, mangle. Her head is my right arm and I've always wanted to make the illusion that I crawl on walls and ceilings, how hard would it be to make a z plane movement in the quick menu?

[rigid summit]

alright, i hope this does work, re-arranged everything. would take some time to create a new unity instance but its all good

[sage patio]

you don't need to create a new unity instance

you can just import the FBX, put it in your scene, and use Pumkin's to copy everything over

[rigid summit]

Pumkin's?

i have never heard of that

[cosmic vine]

https://github.com/rurre/PumkinsAvatarTools
what Sacred said is right, just export the fixed .fbx from blender and drop it in your existing unity project, click the fbx once in the unity files and make sure the avatar is set to humanoid with a configured rig usual then you can copy settings over from the older avatar to the new one with pumkins

[rigid summit]

ooh, i see! that seems like a really useful tool. i already have like tons of unity projects every attempt. this would make things way more faster

[cosmic vine]

unless I am making large adjustments I typically use the same unity project for changes/additions to the same avatar and that has felt like a better use of hard drive space too

[sage patio]

you don't need to make new projects every time

[rigid summit]

ooh alright. will just use that then to port things over. i do hope it works

[cosmic vine]

by the way, be mindful of what you copy over if you've renamed bones between avatar versions when using pumkins
if you have a bone called something like "HairBone" and change it in blender to "Hair Bone" then copy settings from the old avatar to the new one, if you aren't paying attention to which boxes are checked in the copy field it'll add "HairBone" back to the rig hierarchy in addition to "Hair Bone" also being present

it shouldn't hurt anything but it will add unwanted clutter to it

[sage patio]

might want to disable "Copy gameobjects"

[rigid summit]

Alright! Though trying to use the copy feature. even if i tried to use the copy feature. when i select the avatar to copy to. it wont copy over the stuff from the old fbx to the new fbx

[cosmic vine]

once you configure the fbx and drop it into the unity hierarchy so it actually appears in the scene, the thing you have in the hierarchy is what you drag and drop into the copy field not the fbx file

[rigid summit]

ooh alright, it seems like it did import it.

the materials and whatnot. i guess that has to be done manually

but, its better to do that than to do everything manually

[sage patio]

you can also copy materials by enabling it under the Skinned mesh renderer tab

[cosmic vine]

yep, stuff like the pipeline ID remain unchecked even if you click the "select all" button so there's a couple you have to manually check off if you want those copied too

[rigid summit]

oooh alright! well, ive done those too and it seems like it worked!

all i need right now is trial and error. just need to make sure that the ear bones are the correct size

[rigid summit]

Alright! everything seems to be working correctly! Thanks guys!!

damn, it is quite suprising that things like this take hours to troubleshoot and solve

oh well, so is the life of making VRChat Avatars

[cosmic vine]

that has been my experience with blender since starting with it last year. you know what you want to do but you don't know the special tool/shortcut to do it quickly so you spend 10x as long looking for an answer

often made worse by the fact google tends to give results of topics from 2015 and older

[rigid summit]

Yeah, doesnt help me too on that department. whenever i try and find solutions to my problem the videos are always like, 2 - 5 years ago? very weird that not that much people make videos about how to rig anymore

[digital willow]

is it correct that if I have a tail and a skirt, then those bones should be parented to the hip bone?

[sage patio]

for the skirt you should have a root bone to parent all the skirt bone chains to, which would then be parented to the hip

so that you can use a single physbone component for the whole skirt

the tail can be parented directly to the hip

[digital willow]

right, I got that set up. thanks

@sage patio so what about different roll on mirrored bones?

or... I remember talking about this before, my tail do have a root bone just like the "skirt" does as well...

is that bad? is it better to parent the first bone of the tail to the hip?

[digital willow]

T.T help please

and is it correct for it to be parented to the tail of the root?

I'll make a list of the questions...

[cosmic vine]

@digital willow tail like this is fine

[digital willow]

oh... but is there anything bad with having a root for it?

I know I went over this before, but I dont remember the conclusion...

though I'd rather not have it

[kind ore]

a root? like just having it there?

[digital willow]

and connected to the tail

[kind ore]

by having a root you can easily add a physbone in unity, just one component, not that it matters too much for tails

its a single bone so theres next to nothing that it could do to make things go wrong

[digital willow]

so... not having a root for it makes it more work?

[kind ore]

yea its fine

[digital willow]

what?

[kind ore]

oh sorry, misread

[digital willow]

ok

[kind ore]

just a little

but its like an extra second of effort

[digital willow]

hmm ok well if it doesnt do any harm I'll keep it

[kind ore]

ye

[digital willow]

it doesnt like make physics worse or limited?

[kind ore]

do you have a hair root bone?

[digital willow]

yes

or

[kind ore]

nah

a hair root bone makes adding physbones super easy for hair, its good that you have that

its great for optimization and a great timesaver

[digital willow]

yeah I have it

also for cat ears

[kind ore]

ohh interesting

[digital willow]

and the parenting of the tail/"skirt" should go to the tail of the hip bone?

and legs

[kind ore]

oh that? im not too sure; rigging is not my strong suit, sorry

[digital willow]

ok. thanks

3 questions to go

with bones at least, then it's the weird "cat tail" in the hierarchy

[opal acorn]

can someone rig an avatar for me? i can class it as a commission i guess lol

[digital willow]

apparently you gotta be careful about scammers here when it comes to that. people usually say you should go to like VRC Traders' server for that I think

[opal acorn]

i dont have an invite

[digital willow]

please help with roll on hand bones

[sage patio]

why are you still on this? I thought you said that your model looked fine in game

if it ain't broke, don't fix it

leave it be

[digital willow]

no I wanna optimize and clean up and all that

it might confuse me in the future and maybe it's causing an issue Im not aware of the reason for

and roll should be equal on mirrored bones

is there something you disagree with in that statement? @sage patio

[sage patio]

I just clear roll on everything and adjust it for certain things if required. there's not much more to it

[digital willow]

I see. so now Im putting 0 roll on everything except hands and feet

but do u know how I could solve the issue of having different roll on the fingers?

[sage patio]

just select all those bones and hit alt + R?

[digital willow]

for example my hand bones are, L -1.9 and R -160

nooo

hands and ankle should have specific roll values I was told

so I shouldnt put them at 0

but they should be the same on each side

[sage patio]

did you experience any issues when having the roll at 0?

[digital willow]

I didnt try and dont wanna try that

[sage patio]

then how do you know it's going to be an issue?

[digital willow]

I dont

[sage patio]

the answer is you don't, and you're trying to do too much without testing

[digital willow]

but isnt it weird for starters?

[sage patio]

you should really just get the model in game, find issues, note them down, and address them

[digital willow]

I was told the standard is to have both on the same value

I have plenty of that

I just wanna clean up the bones and Im very close

np if u dont try to help me, but let's not argue about my practice X3

[sage patio]

your "practice" is wasting your own time and especially other people's time. I've seen you bother people with this non-issue for like 3 days now

[digital willow]

haha

Im not wasting anyone's time, people choose for themselves

"bother people", the hell?!

Im asking... stop making stuff up

if you're annoyed, that's not my problem. not targeting you haha

really really strange this...

oh and it doesnt matter what roll stuff that uses physbones have

[sage patio]

it matters if you're setting up angle limits

[digital willow]

aha. dont know what that is but remember someone saying that

but I wont 0 them

[sage patio]

if you're making a skirt with a single physbone component on a root, the angle limit is based on the bone roll

if the angle limit is set to "hinge" type, each bone can only move on one axis (like a hinge), and the direction of the "bend" is based on the roll of the bone

so if you want all of the chains around the skirt to only bend directly outwards, you need to manually set the roll to have the +Z direction be facing directly outwards

[digital willow]

oh... I do have just one root bone for my "skirt"

so the best way to make skirts is to have more than one root?

I guess this is something I'll come back to later, I dont have dynamic bones on my "skirt" right now

[sage patio]

no? never said that

you can have a single root for all bone chains, with one physbone component on the root

[digital willow]

I just have it on hair, tail and ears. maybe the belt too

dont ask me

oh single physbone component

[digital willow]

I solved the hair root question

but one still remains. there is no way but testing to determine what roll value to put the thumbs at?

they look like this

thumb bones roll value:
L0 -160, L1 -167, L2 -170
R0 -20, R1 -12, R2 -9.8

[digital willow]

my main bones, anyone who can find anything off or that should be improved?

and could this be a problem?

seems all good, time to export the FBX then I stop for today

save file 288

[fading verge]

can anyone help me import an avatar i bought, i don't know how

[quaint cosmos]

Not quite sure where to put this since it isn't exactly for an avatar but is it possible to use dynamic bone to create a rigid but poseable object like this desk lamp that can be adjusted but keeps it's position and orientation when you let go? What sort of settings or constraints would I need to set up to do that?

The idea is basically that the player could hold the area surrounding the bulb and move it around and the rest of the mechanism would follow

[sage patio]

you would need an IK system to do that

not impossible, but more involved

technically, a grabbed physbone chain is an IK chain, and you can set hinge angle limits, so in theory it would work with a physbone for the whole chain. however, for anything more complex, you might need to use FinalIK

[quaint cosmos]

Thanks! FinalIK sound kind of complicated and more expensive but also pretty powerful. Do you know if all the necessary components are whitelisted for VRChat?

[sage patio]

should be. CCD IK for the chain, hinge limits for the joints, should all be whitelisted

either CCD IK or Aim IK would work

or FABRIK IK, or Limb IK should also work

[quaint cosmos]

The documentation says FinalIK is disabled for Quest avatars which is what I would expect but it doesn't say anything about worlds so I suppose everything should work for Quest as well. 🙏

[sage patio]

FIK used to be whitelisted on quest for avatars but got removed because it was used for crashers

[karmic cypress]

THis might be a dumb question but I'm very lost on it

I have a prop with a bone attached to my hand. I've used a shapekey to shrink it into my body to hide the prop but since the bone is still attached to my hand it follows my hand around, which is obviously a problem ya know

I've tried some simple ideas like turning off the bone in the animation and such. Honestly I might just not know what to look for at the moment and the second someone says the solution it'll look so stupid so I'm sorry

I've realized I'm dumb, but just in case in the next 24 hours someone is as stupid as me: just make the shapekey shrink into the parented bone not the chest >.>

[sleek isle]

You scale the bone down, not turn it off. Wa

@karmic cypress

[karmic cypress]

oh thats gonna be so much easier than remaking all these shapekeys

[sleek isle]

They scale props in video all the time. You find tiny weapons in the hands of character

[crimson latch]

I need a tutorial that goes from the “just modeled and textured the character” to “CATS import ready”

[digital willow]

got a problem in the rig in Unity, bone length in configuration does not match the position in animation file, left leg, knee and ankle

[crimson latch]

I know how to rig and weight paint, just not sure how for Unity

[digital willow]

what do u mean by CATS import ready?

Unity is at least easier than Blender, but I've forgotten a lot and there's new shit now

[crimson latch]

When I installed CATS in blender, it seems to want to start at the stage where you already have a rigged, weight painted model

[crimson latch]

You can rig in unity?

[digital willow]

eeh... I donno, I just meant in general with the process of avatars in VRC

[digital willow]

Im still confused, why is that a problem, isnt that what you have?

[crimson latch]

No I just completed a T posed model and textured it, but I’m not sure what bone layout to add

[digital willow]

ok but... I think u can just ignore CATS for now then

I've never started from scratch

do u have this?

[crimson latch]

That’s problem, I haven’t found any complete “from scratch” tutorials, and while I’ve done the entire pipeline manually, rigging is my weakest link

Yes

[digital willow]

oke

[digital willow]

then what do u mean here?

the picture shows the layout

but I know there's more to it, I dont know much more than that though

I need help with this

I just open Unity and I have 3 new issues already T.T

[brazen island]

you need to rig it now, if its not already. for humanoid you can autorig with Accurig or mixamo, but there still will be eyes, "physical" parts and visemes. i dont think theres a single guide to all of it since its a huge work. But thats if youre going for good looking avatar and not a funny bipedal hotdog.

[digital willow]

no way I could start from scratch. just this avi has taken sooooo much work, and I dont even have anything fancy. orz

[crimson latch]

Basically, I'm here:

[brazen island]

@digital willow thats the result of your ocd and doubting everything 🥲. pretty sure your initial model would've worked better than what you have now.

[digital willow]

what? I dont know you mean. it cant be because of that haha. also I dont doubt everything or many things here...

was hoping you were writing to help me T.T

[brazen island]

@crimson latch try to autorig it, its probably humanid-enough.

[crimson latch]

Like with Rigify? Will that import to VRChat correctly?

[brazen island]

i named tbe tools, at leadt free ones

[digital willow]

also, I didnt change my leg bone length in a very long time...

[brazen island]

i did accurig couple times for humans and it worked really nice and ready to go. but it wont do a robot, so theres limitations.

[digital willow]

this is a new error

[crimson latch]

Does the free version do everything needed?

I see there's two, and theres a lot of features missing

[digital willow]

is there a way to remove the bone confiq so I can add it again and could that fix it?

[brazen island]

@digital willow change rig to generic then back

[digital willow]

oh... damn, I did "none"

is that bad?

now the chest bone was removed in the mapping

[brazen island]

@crimson latch idk abut paid festures. free one will give you fully working body.

@digital willow that means your naming or bones order is weird, id recommend to change it in blender so it imports without any need for tweaks. choosing none is ok

[digital willow]

well, now that I picked none and then did the humanoid the error is gone

thanks

the eyes still need to be fixed though...

does everyone have to fix the eyes when they get in to Unity if they have the bones vertical, or is it just because Im replacing the FBX?

[brazen island]

@digital willow check eyes in eye look preview. they can look broken outside of it and still work just fine

[digital willow]

aw man, but I still want them to look correct in Unity so I can work on it etc

but where is eye look preview?

[brazen island]

so try to setup eye look

in descriptor

[digital willow]

oh this... yeah it's not working

what happens if I press disable?

[brazen island]

disable what

[digital willow]

under eye look

[brazen island]

then your eyes will be always looking straight in game

[digital willow]

yeah but, will it mess up my settings?

like is it an on and off button?

oh no there are more warnings... but I'll look at that later orz

[brazen island]

idk, it may or may not preserve your settings. Normally you dont disable it since you have rigged eyes.

[digital willow]

ok. do u have any idea of how I can fix this?

[brazen island]

fix what

[digital willow]

... my eyes

they are pointing in the wrong direction

by default and on preview

[brazen island]

have tou tried to setup straught view

by changibg values

[digital willow]

what do u mean?

oh

but

[brazen island]

it wont alwsys make eyes look straight if you just press enable preview. you need to fiddle with values, like 0 -90 0

[digital willow]

Im confused, what's the difference between preview and not?

[brazen island]

preview=ingame, not=just how model made, like tpose, irrelevant

[digital willow]

relevant if u want it to look normal when not in preview T.T

I wonder why this is even happening. obviously cause I changed the bones but, why doesnt it just correct it from how it is in Blender?

like I asked before, does everyone have this problem?

if they have the best eye bone setup

maybe there's another issue or something I can do in Blender

um, they arent even lined up with each other

I just keep spinning them around and I have no idea how to line them up

please tell me this is fixable and that I dont have to start from scratch again T_T

herp derp

looking straight was at 0 before when it was working

my fine tuning ToT

[brazen island]

you have moved the bones or what

[digital willow]

yes

[brazen island]

do you have backups

[digital willow]

...

yeah

what about it?

[robust crescent]

if looking straight need value you done it wrong

[digital willow]

well nothing makes them look straight. and that's what he said I should change

[brazen island]

then just copypaste bones coords for these bones from backup

[digital willow]

when I say I moved them I moved them in Blender

[brazen island]

yes

im talking about blender

[digital willow]

I was like aw yeah finally I can add physbones. nope. of course there's a bunch of issues out of nowhere. never expect things to work the first time orz

[digital willow]

I cant copy from Blender to Unity can I?

[brazen island]

@digital willow youre using unpacked prefab, its 5 seconds to make a new fbx version in blender and get back to unity

[digital willow]

...

you're talking about reverting the eye bones in Blender?

I dont wanna do that... they should be pointed up

like in the template, isnt that what most people do? it's there cause that's how it should be

so Unity is just derp because of the change

but the change should work

just dont know how to make it work

[brazen island]

forst of all, do your eyes move in blender pose mode properly

[digital willow]

and I hope I can fix it without restarting in Unity

haha

[brazen island]

idk what was that

[digital willow]

your native language is English?

[brazen island]

ofc not

[digital willow]

haha

that explains it

[brazen island]

but not spanish either

[digital willow]

I think they do but lemme check

yeah it looks good in Blender

is there some export setting I can toggle for it to carry over?

or a way to make Unity reimport the settings of the bones, I thought the rerigging in Untiy would do that

[faint dawn]

hey quick question for modelling avatars, i'm just done with the topology UV mapping and texturing

[brazen island]

it should

[digital willow]

which?

[faint dawn]

what do you guys think its the easier way to make vrc shapekeys, weight painting or just doing it on editing mode

[brazen island]

@digital willow regenerate rig settings

[faint dawn]

i sculpted on zbrush

so i don't know much to sculpt in blender

[digital willow]

I see... then I need to find out how to make it do it...

[brazen island]

@faint dawn easier ofc to make it in edit mode by moving verticies. at least if you dont have facial rig already.

since all of the work of rigging face will go in the bin in the end

[digital willow]

so if the eyes look and work fine in Blender it should work the same in Unity?

it's just that something went wrong because I updated the FBX

I can try by making a new project and import as new and see how it looks...

gather some data...

if I can remember how to do the bare minimum...

oh wait

maybe I should have checked out VCC first

and also... need latest SDK

[faint dawn]

i find modeling in blender a bit janky sometimes, when i did retopo i had my sculpted mesh underneath

but i guess you're right

[brazen island]

@faint dawn you can try to rigify your mesh

[digital willow]

what's the process for updating the SDK now?

is that with the VCC? oh yeah it is

[brazen island]

@digital willow i believe you can still just download it as package

[digital willow]

you mean import?

but... I wanna do this CC thing

but... I dont understand it. this is the wrong channel for it though

[digital willow]

help plis ToT

still broken eyes

been able to gather data but no solution

[faint dawn]

i got something weird happening, my mesh is symmetrical (made with the mirror modifier) but when i try to mirror the eye blink blendshape i get this issue, anyone knows what i'm doing wrong?

[pale basin]

so I had an idea for something with my avi, and it kinda requires me to make a script where when someone interacts with part of my avi that parts rigging moves from one bone to another, was curious if anyone knew if a script like that exists that I can use?

[sage patio]

you can't do any scripting on avatars

however, what you're describing is totally doable using contacts and a parent constraint

you can do very complicated logic just by using unity's animation system

[pale basin]

I'm kinda new to unity, would you mind if I DM'd you and you explained a bit more what you mean?

[sage patio]

I'm a bit busy but you should watch some of Sippbox's videos about contacts

https://youtu.be/Cp0ysawmizM

[pale basin]

Ok, will do, and thank you ❤️

[sage patio]

this one goes over contacts and constraints

[pale basin]

ohh tyty ❤️

[pale basin]

one question tho, what if I want other people to be able to trigger the contact toggle, does that just require that I check the box sppbox unchecked that said "allow others"?

[kind ore]

yea

[pale basin]

ok, thank you both ❤️

[kind ore]

[faint dawn]

Sippbox tutorials are so well explained and simple, they’re really good. Playerbush001 and iconoclass are also amazing

[desert owl]

I don't know what happens, but when I rig my own custom models (I use Mixamo because I don't know how.. I'm a beginner!) And anytime it rigs it always has this weird stretching mouth/face problem... anyway to fix this?

I don't know if it has anything to do with the rigging or not..

[sleek isle]

Mixamo is good overall but you always need to edit some area like the neck.

Remove influence of the neck on the head to just have the head.

Look a weight paint/skinning video on YouTube

[kind ore]

tldr - theres only so much that such things can do, otherwise quite a few of us would be out of a job 💀

[bold talon]

Can someone help me with rigging? I dont know how to make joints

[covert schooner]

hey guys, I might be over or under thinking this., maybe a simple parenting thing?

I got the weight painting on the cable, clothes, ribbon etc. just fine, but for some reason I can't think of how to get the lights to follow their spot on the cable, without deforming.

[faint dawn]

where exactly is deforming, this seems to be taking areas covered by multiple bones so there's probably gonna be some deformation, my biggest suggestion would be to drag the first two loops and parent it to the hip then the upper part to the chest

[desert owl]

I plan to make a model of this character into blender, but if I want it vrchat and to rig it, is there a way to make it look normal? There's no legs just a ufo.. so I don't know how to rig things like this..

[hidden haven]

you can add a full rigify rig and just not attach the bones to anything

i recommend using vertex groups for the hands

[desert owl]

What's rigify? Is it another autorig thing like mixamo?

[covert schooner]

i love you thank yoooou

[brazen island]

@desert owl its built-in rigging tool in blender. I dont think you need to use it for this model.

[nova iris]

Hi, I came here after watching Kung's Fullbody Avatar video, hoping to find help.

I have modelled/textured and rigged a fullbody model in blender with the help of a friend, who's in charge of the unity part of things.
Thanks to Kung, I've been able to solve a few problems I have encountered but I am facing something I haven't seen talked upon his video

My trouble is with the hand of the model

That's how the hand behaves in blender

and here's what happen when it's used on a fullbody set up

I have no idea of what I could be missing or doing wrong

if anyone has some insight, I'm all ears.

[odd iris]

Does anyone know how to fix the neck bend when you are in fullbody and you are tracking your head and hip?

[bold talon]

Can I get some help in rigging?

I'm having issues with linking floating fingers and stuff

[desert owl]

anytime i try to turn on automatic weights it turns my model invisible!! whats up with that!

is it because im using a mixamo rig?

im just trying to weightpaint it so i can fix the mouth..

[desert owl]

this stuff is crazy..

[proper cove]

I know this is a long shot but, anyone know how to rig a model on android? If it is even possible

[desert owl]

nevermind oh my god he just gets HUGE is there a way to fix this issue..

[quaint cosmos]

Like on a phone? A Chromebook? How are you using android?

[quaint cosmos]

You can press the S key to scale the model

[desert owl]

i tried but all his parts are like... broken and weird everywhere and its just.. yikes

[quaint cosmos]

It looks like a bunch of stuff is parented to empties so you might have to unparent it before scaling

[desert owl]

so i unparent everything before i do the auto weight thing?

[plucky hare]

hi I need some help with this avatar it looks odd in game but only when full body is active, ill send some pictures

[quaint cosmos]

Unparent everything before you scale it. You'd need to rig it before doing any weighting

[sleek isle]

head bone too high

Not really, more too far back

[plucky hare]

so if i move the head bone forward it’ll be better?

[sleek isle]

yes

[plucky hare]

oki ty!

[proper cove]

Like on my Samsung phone

[faint dawn]

uh, quick question, i'm still new to blender, how do i assign the vertexes of my eye to the eye bones since they're the same mesh as the head

i have the vertex groups as the same name of the bones but when i parented it the head they didn't get assigned to the eye

[sage patio]

you assign them to the vertex group with the sanem name as the bone

make sure the mesh the eyes are in has an Armature modifier with the correct armature selected

[faint dawn]

i'm making it from scratch

i'm setting the mesh to the armature rn, i just parented the head to the head bone

and it has the vertex groups named properly

[sage patio]

can you screenshot your hierarchy?

[sage patio]

your head doesn't have an armature modifier at all

you can see it has no blue wrench icon, aka no modifiers

the armature modifier is how you make a mesh deform with an armature at all

[faint dawn]

ah, i just parented it directly

that's probably why

[sage patio]

gotta do both

[bold talon]

Can I get some help on my rig?

I'm stuck

[crimson latch]

Where can I find the Shape Keys (ie blink left) reference for VRChat?

[quaint cosmos]

These are how the visemes look. Blink left and blink right are just the left and right eyes closed (I think it's just a single shape key at this point). I'm still not real sure what look up and look down are supposed to be. I assume it refers to what the eyelids do when looking up or down but it doesn't seem to do much in practice. https://developer.oculus.com/documentation/unity/audio-ovrlipsync-viseme-reference/

[crimson latch]

What blend shapes/shape keys are needed besides the viseme?

[sage patio]

the "needed" ones are the visemes and blink

optionally, you can specify looking up/looking down shapes for the eyelids

the eyes themselves use bones, not blendshapes

[crimson latch]

How do you attach non-skinned meshes to a certain bone, like your head?

[sage patio]

I know for a fact you can just parent it to said bone in Unity (or, put it at the avatar root under a "container" gameobject and parent constrain it), but you may be able to parent the mesh to that bone in blender. I'm not sure if that would work though

what's your use case here?

[crimson latch]

Eyes and goggles

I saw avatar performance is higher with 1 skinned mesh

[sage patio]

that depends

splitting it into multiple meshes means one more draw call per extra mesh, one more per material slot on those

if the eyes are using the same material as the body, keep them joined to the body

[crimson latch]

Oh shoot, the eyes need to be merged into the mesh?

[sage patio]

yea?

[crimson latch]

Oops

I had them as separate objects

[sage patio]

you should probably just join them

the eyes should be weighed to their respective eye bone

for movement

[crimson latch]

Crap but I already painted them

Hmm

[sage patio]

doesn't matter

joining it won't cause issues

did you mean weight painting or texturing?

[crimson latch]

I weight painted the body, and textured both the body and the eyes

Oh wow

It automatically brought it both textures

[sage patio]

yes, because joining meshes just adds up the material slots

[crimson latch]

Ahhh

Ah perfect, exactly 3 material slots

These tiny, upright ones are the ones the eye is skinned to right?

[sage patio]

should be yea

you don't need those horizontal ones

unless you're doing something fancy with the eye weights

[crimson latch]

Strange, that was in the tutorial

I bet it was the weird anime eyebrows

[sage patio]

was that tutorial vrchat specific?

[crimson latch]

Yes

Rainhet

[sage patio]

weird. you only need vertical eye bones

but you can do it differently if you have a reason to do so

[bold talon]

How do I link mesh and other bones to a bone?

Like, all at once

[sage patio]

question is too vague. how familiar are you with weight painting

[bold talon]

Not familiar at all but wondering what it is

[bold talon]

Can you explain?

[sage patio]

the way you get parts of a mesh to move with an armature is by assigning vertices in that mesh to Vertex groups. if a bone shares a name with a vertex group, then moving said bone will have the effect of displacing every vertex in that group, proportional to the weight given to each vertex

weight painting is just the process of mass-assigning vertices to vertex groups using brushes

[bold talon]

how will that help my situation?

[sage patio]

well I don't know what your situation is, your question was quite vague so the best I can do is a vague answer

[bold talon]

I'll explain, with pictures

[sage patio]

but knowing what vertex groups are and what weight painting is definitely a must

[bold talon]

Basically, the bones with the straight lines to the middle bone is what i'm trying to link

And the scribble is basically the head mesh I want to add to the bone

Basically I want the arms to move with the head

[sage patio]

first off, that rig won't work for VRChat. what you're probably asking for though is how to parent bones to one another

which you do in edit mode by selecting two bones and doing ctrl + P

[bold talon]

Yeah I tried that

Its grey

[sage patio]

are you sure you're in edit mode?

for the armature?

[bold talon]

Yeah

edit, ctrl p, grey

[sage patio]

your proportions are also quite wrong, it won't work very well in VR

[bold talon]

Well how would you reccomend for this?

The model itself must be like this

[bold talon]

Whats this?

[sage patio]

a rig that is well proportioned that you can use as a starting point

[bold talon]

any way I can do this step by step?

I just need to link the bones and the mesh to that one bone

and the parent offset and connected options are still grey

[sage patio]

you're either in pose mode or object mode then, not edit mode

[bold talon]

Nope, definitely in edit

[civic elm]

So I forgot to turn on Mirror mode while weight painting. Can I still copy the weight paint data from this one bone to the other mirrored bone without reweight painting

[sage patio]

yes, turn on weight paint mode, and go over the correct side with a very very low strength blur brush

[civic elm]

Does not work

[sage patio]

or sorry, I meant turn on X mirror mode

it should work as long as the mesh is actually symmetrical

and that the vertex groups for the other side exist

[civic elm]

Oh wow that did work

That was an amazing tip. 💀

Thank you so much.

[bold talon]

Why is my ctrl p option not working?

[brazen island]

@bold talon elaborate

[bold talon]

Trying to link the arm bones to the one in the middle

[quaint cosmos]

If you open up the bone tab on the right and go to relations, can you parent it there?

[brazen island]

@bold talon are they even one armature? dont you need ctrl j them in object mode first

when you ctrl p normally future children look dark orange while parent yellow like on your screen

[bold talon]

When I'm using ctrl J it screws up the mesh

[brazen island]

apply all transforms for all of the meshes and armatures

rest poses as well

[bold talon]

What button do I press for that?

[brazen island]

ctrl a

rest poses - no idea, everyone uses cats for that

[bold talon]

Can I just show you the pic of the mesh i'm trying to link alltogether

[bold talon]

Mind the avatar

Basically

mesh link to bone, bone link to arms

How do?

[brazen island]

whats mesh

or whats arms?

[sage patio]

from this picture, I can tell you're trying to parent bones that aren't even in the same armature

apply the transforms for each armature first (ctrl + A > All transforms), then join the armatures together (ctrl + J)

[bold talon]

so I click all the bones and do that?

I applied all transforms

[brazen island]

you click whatever you want to parent. like if you want armo to be child of right shoulder then you select them with ctrl i believe and ctrl p

[bold talon]

Its all linked now

Every bone

but how do I put that only individually?

[brazen island]

what

[bold talon]

Each bone to each limb

[brazen island]

weightpainting

[bold talon]

How do I weightpaint? I've been pulled into something I dont know how to use

The arms are linked to the bones but the fingers arent

And its not linked to the head

[kind ore]

thats something you need youtube and proper explanation for

[bold talon]

So I did all that for fuck all?

[kind ore]

well no, i meant weight painting

that needs proper explanation

[brazen island]

now you can join armatures. its like 5 min trick compared to weightpainting but still usefull in future

good job

[kind ore]

yea, do that instead

painting is not an enjoyable experience imo

[bold talon]

In what way should I do that?

I need a kind of basic explination im not good with focus

I just need head and limbs all connected

along with the mesh

[brazen island]

no, i was talking about what you did and achieved. sorry. 🥲

[bold talon]

Oh

Uhhhh

Now that I did that, I got 2 issues

Fingers mesh detatched from arms and arm bones aint connected to head

[quaint cosmos]

If the meshes are detached, join them just like you joined the armatures

You're pretty deep into it now but I would just rig using mixamo.com. Then you just need to fix the weight paint a little but it's way easier than weight painting a whole model from scratch and more accurate than automatic weights

[bold talon]

Why tf does this keep happening?

Random parts of the mesh keep fucking up

[quaint cosmos]

Well, they won't move with the armature if they aren't weighted to it, that's the purpose of weight painting

[bold talon]

How do I weight paint

[quaint cosmos]

Look up a tutorial on Youtube. That's going to be way easier than us trying to explain it with text

Any of the top tutorials is probably fine

[bold talon]

well I was hoping someone could provide a visual parent explination

[quaint cosmos]

Just a single image isn't really gonna do it for this topic, you really need a video or a proper teacher

Weight painting is a whole process, not just something you do by pushing a button

[bold talon]

Okay I got the mixamo addon

Will that make this process alot easier?

[sage patio]

no, not at all

[quaint cosmos]

I just tend to use the website but yeah, it would make it easier. You're still going to need to do some weight painting yourself so you'll still need to watch a video on it but it will do 90% of the job for you

[kind ore]

it should do about 70-80% of what you need for basic rigging but not everything?

iirc

[sage patio]

in fact it'll complicate things more if you don't know what the basics of weight painting is

[quaint cosmos]

Agree to disagree

[sage patio]

since your avatar is too far from normal proportions

[bold talon]

Fair

[kind ore]

ill reiterate that youtuve for weight painting is unavoidable at some stage for rigging

[sage patio]

there would most likely be too much manually fixing required which would make it take longer than if you just did it yourself in the first place

[bold talon]

well then you tell me an easier process

[quaint cosmos]

Mixamo can give you a starting point even with weirdly proportioned models but you'll still have to do a fair amount of fixing. If you do it from scratch you have to start from 0 so I'm not sure how that's easier.

[bold talon]

Im literally going with whatever I can to complete this as easy as possible

[quaint cosmos]

I rigged a minion with Mixamo once and it was reasonably successful. By no means ready to go but it was a start.

[sage patio]

I recommend just creating all the vertex groups on the mesh first, and then just assigning vertices to the correct groups

to do that, select the mesh, shift click the armature, ctrl + P > With empty groups

then to make a part of the mesh move with a bone, select that part of the mesh in edit mode (can hit L to select the entire part), and click Assign with the correct group selected

also

for VRChat, your rig rill not work

there are minimum requirements for bones in order for it to work with VRChat's IK

[bold talon]

I'll figure that out later

[sage patio]

the spine should go Hips > Spine > Chest > Neck > Head

failing to do that and your avatar will not be humanoid, and will permanantly T pose

ruining the point of rigging it in the first place

so no, it's not something you should do later lol

it's something you should do now, before doing any weight painting

the arms need to go shoulder > upper arm > lower arm > wrist

[bold talon]

Right, hold on

Lets start from an easy point

All of my bones are joined into one armature

[sage patio]

yes, that's good

[bold talon]

What should I do for that next step

[sage patio]

create the spine by adding a new bone (shift A) and subdividing it to create 5 bones (right click it and click subdivide, increase amount in the bottom left)

then name the bones correctly

[bold talon]

So this new bone is a new armature on its own

[sage patio]

no

you add it while in edit mode for the armature

[bold talon]

From where

Wait, figured it

right, gonna make 5 subdivisions

Made em

What now?

[bold talon]

Wait where am I even gonna add the spine?

[sage patio]

that is a great question

[bold talon]

Thats kind of a me issue of how its gonna look around, maybe its a bend in the legs

[sage patio]

having the bones is required, but having them affect any of the mesh isn't required

[bold talon]

sooooo next step?

wait is the middle supposed to be the spine?

[sage patio]

that whole solid red line is the entire spine, from the hips to the head

[bold talon]

so should I replace the head bone with that?

[sage patio]

the dotted lines represent bone parenting

by head bone do you mean the one in the center of the ball?

[bold talon]

yeah

[sage patio]

that isn't much of a head honestly

that ball should probably be weighed to the chest bone

[bold talon]

There isnt a chest

[sage patio]

what do you mean? you created the 5 bones didn't you?

one of those should be the chest bone

[bold talon]

yeah

oh

uhh

so the head bone, what do I do with that?

replace it?

[sage patio]

the "head" bone can either be parented to the chest bone, or deleted

and then assign that whole part of the mesh to the chest bone

[bold talon]

which do you recommend?

[sage patio]

2nd option

one less bone

[bold talon]

Like that?

[hasty hatch]

is there a way to add bones to an existing avatar without the risk of the mesh braking?

or will i have to just totally rebuild every time?

[brazen island]

never unpack your prefabs unless told so by creator's manual in unity and you should be fine

[hasty hatch]

ohhhh so i can add bones to a packed prefab so long as its still packed?

[brazen island]

not in unity

[hasty hatch]

ahh thats the pain hah

[brazen island]

but adding/moving bones in blender shouldnt break your model after reimporting in unity

if its unpacked

packed*

[hasty hatch]

wanted to add an extra bone to an allready built up avatar for physbones, wonder why unity doesnt allow that?

[brazen island]

technically you can do it after unpacking prefab but better do so in blender

[hasty hatch]

ohh yeah, thats what i meant, to add bones to the FBX in blender then overwrite, but last time i did that was about a year ago and the mesh either broke, or it unlinked all the parented assets

[brazen island]

most likely it was either unpacked or export scale settings issues

[hasty hatch]

ahh, would an optimal option be to drag the avatar into the assets as a prefab varient and then overwrite the base avatar FBX?

so it packs the added assets into the prefab?

[brazen island]

??

idk, i just backup old fbx somehere else (when im not sure where it comes from) and overwrite fbx straight from blender, seems to be the easiest way

[hasty hatch]

oops lol

ahh yeahh, ill give that a go

i pack it put out of project just as a backup incase something breaks

[hasty hatch]

hmm thankfully did a backup and fixed it, but seems like adding bones and overwriting just makes the mesh bug out and dissapear

[forest zenith]

why isnt fullbody tracking osc workingg

[brazen island]

scaling or selection problem

[hasty hatch]

i'll try again, but i do alot of mesh edits on my avatars just fine, but when ever i add bones and overwrite it kills it

then it never add said bones to the hiararchy unless i just start the avatar from scratch in unity

my best guess is unity just isnt able to pick up the mesh's new weight to the bones and just errors out

just quick cause i may be explaining stuff wrong

so basically what i wanna do: my avatar ive been using for a good few months i wanted to add an extra bone chain to apply physbones to and really dont wanna have to start from base FBX and re add everything from Square 1
is it at all possible to add new weighted bones to an in use FBX set in a scene cause it seems unity doesn't like it when you add new bones to a hierarchy in use, even when prefabbed
even with the same export settings i use for just editing a mesh, any mod additional bones causes the avatar to simply failload the mesh

[bold talon]

How do I link the bones back in normally with the mesh

Whenever I go into edit mode, they pop back in like nothing, but if I go in pose or object, it goes back like this

[desert owl]

Does anyone still know how to fix this? Context : I have a model I made from scratch, I rigged it with mixamo and put it back in blender as an fbx, any time I try to do the CTRL-P to activate weight painting the model becomes huge and deformed, I don't know what's causing it?

it's driving me crazy!

Any sort of help would be great though because as a beginner I have no idea what's causing the issue LOL

[ocean lance]

Doing rigging in Maya as apart of my game development class and i figured I would ask here, what’s the trick to getting stuff like heads and hands to not warp/transform when moving bones

Also is there a way to select the bones conning off of root part and not the entire bone structure

[sage patio]

let me preface this by saying that you basically never ever need to start from square 1.

in general, never unpack your model, unless you have a good reason to do so. doing so breaks the link to the original FBX, making it harder to do any changes down the road.

when you do mesh edits and replace the FBX, it will still update even when unpacked, because the model still references the same mesh assets.

however, any hierarchy or armature changes will not be reflected, which can cause a lot of issues and can break the existing meshes

now, let's say you didn't unpack (good job!), and you want to say, add a tail or something (new bone chain, mesh, etc). you would do so in blender, and then re-export. when you re-export, you have 2 options; you either replace the FBX in the project, or you export as a new FBX. overriding an FBX using different export settings can cause issues, so I recommend making an export preset in blender. if you don't know what the export settings were for the original model, export as a new FBX. in Unity, you can make an importer preset from the original FBX to quickly configure the import settings for the new model. once done, drag the new model into the scene, and use Pumkin's to copy over every single component from the old model to the new one

if you chose to override the existing model, and you knew the export settings, you'll have to do an extra step if you did rig changes. you'll need to go to the rig config, click Pose > Reset pose, then Pose > Enforce T pose.

[quaint cosmos]

Proper weight painting. It's likely if your head is warping when you move the head bone, part of the jaw isn't properly weighted to the bone. You select individual bones in edit mode.

[ocean lance]

I figured, I guess it’s time to watch some tutorials about it

[brazen island]

@desert owl apply all transforms on both mesh and armature (ctrl a) before parenting. Also try to use cats's apply as rest pose

[quaint cosmos]

I recommend just downloading a properly weighted avatar, the readyplayerme ones aren't bad. Then you can see how all of the bones should be weighted. RPM avatars used to have bad topology but they've gotten better recently.

[ocean lance]

I have to use the model included with the tutorial

It’s a 26 videos that are 25 minutes each so I guess you are supposed to do that latter on but we are only watching 1-6 in class

[quaint cosmos]

What I mean is you can bring in the RPM avatar into your project as reference and then go into weight paint mode to look at the weights, you don't have to actually use the model.

[ocean lance]

Ah ok

Tysm

I will look into that

[desert owl]

Thanks! I'll try that out :)

[hasty hatch]

hmm, not sure why but even after following both suggestions, either the mesh breaks, or pumpkin just dumps all of the additional assets as unparented meshes and misses a few of them :/

its 100% a packed prefab too, all i've done is parent asset armatures into it

[sage patio]

in the Copy components section, you should switch to the Show all tab. from there, you can uncheck/check the stuff you want or don't want copied

[sage patio]

can you screenshot your Hierarchy?

[hasty hatch]

had to recover from an exported prefab, im guessing its not recoverable after this? (armature swapping that is)

[sage patio]

that is bad

that is not an FBX prefab

that is a model that was turned into a regular prefab

which breaks the link just as unpacking would

[hasty hatch]

hmmm

[sage patio]

updating the FBX for that will break it equally

so you have to import as a new FBX and copy over components

[hasty hatch]

yeaah, i had to make that prefab as a backup

[sage patio]

never do that on your main model

if you want a backup point, make a duplicate and either unpack that or prefab it

keep your main model intact

[hasty hatch]

ah

bleh, why unity doesnt allow to fbx repacking is annoying

[sage patio]

because that would not make sense and is impossible

[hasty hatch]

weeeeeelp, probably gonna go do the long route as some point >.> about time i reworked my avi anyway lol

pumpkin kinda works, but either misses, or completely unlinks meshes from the avatar root for some reason

even with all selected

[sage patio]

what kind of meshes?

[hasty hatch]

like, clothing meshes, some work some fail to link and get dropped in a small list unparented outside the avatar

some dont even make it over

[sage patio]

why are you adding clothes in unity? that should be done in blender

[hasty hatch]

caaaaaaause i didnt know how at the time

and was looking for any excuse to avoid the tedious toggle creating proccess i've slowly learned to loath

[desert owl]

i tried and it made it even worse...

did mixamo like just screw my whole thing over

[quaint cosmos]

All Mixamo does is rig and weight so if you unparent the mesh from the rig and delete the vertex groups, it should have no impact on your model. It generally works alright for humanoids but the further your model is from a human, the more likely you are to run into issues.

[bold talon]

Hey could I get some help with rigging this model? I had to remake it cause of save issues but everything kept going wrong with the bones and the mesh anyway. Dm me if you can help

[astral ferry]

Idk if this is classed as avatar rigging, but I’m having trouble with making my avatars knees bend…….. I’m wondering what to use for it…… I’m using Unity 2019.4.31f1 btw, any help will be appreciated thank you!

[quaint cosmos]

You need to rig and weight paint the model in a program like Blender, have you done that?

[astral ferry]

No, but thank you for telling me!

I’ll do that now

[willow knoll]

I'm having this same issue with a part of my avatar that has too many overlapping vertex groups.
When I do these changes, the issue is fixed in Unity, but my avatar reverts to the VRChat default when I try to load it in game.
Is there any way to increase the number of skin weights properly?

[sage patio]

no, but there are options in blender to limit each vertex to only the 4 groups of most influence

first, you can do Weights > Clean with a low value, and the Subset set to All groups

then, you can do Weights > Limit total, with a limit of 4

just be aware that if you have other groups which aren't for bones, like groups used for masking, this may cause issues

so probably better to restrict it to selected areas

[fading verge]

are there any tutorials for making a avatar from bought assets in unity?

[willow knoll]

The issue isn't something that cleaning or limiting will solve. I have an area where multilple groups need to have a significant influence, like greater than 25%. We're talking hips, tail, 2 butt and 2 thigh fix bones :/

I'll have to figure something else out.

[sage patio]

2 butt and 2 thigh fix bones?

[willow knoll]

Yes, the former for physbones and the latter on constraints to fix the buckling.

[final idol]

Hi! I made an avatar some time ago and wanted to remake the hands because they looked weird, after successfully modelling hands i'm satisfied with, I implanted them onto my avatar, re-rigged the arms, simmetrized everything, in no way is anything different from one side to the other, yet, once in vrchat, the left hand's fingers are angled abnormally, while the right hand works perfectly fine, does anyone have any idea what the cause may be ? (here's a pretty scuffed screenshot to illustrate)

nevermind it's not the rigging, it's the proxy animations that are weird, thanks anyway

[harsh lantern]

Oof

[bold talon]

Hey could I get some help with rigging this model? I had to remake it cause of save issues but everything kept going wrong with the bones and the mesh anyway. Dm me if you can help

[torpid burrow]

i modelled a random ass armor set for the wickerbeast model and have no idea how to rig it effectively, and i cant seem to select the bones here

[wheat cloak]

Check dm

[quaint cosmos]

There's a Youtube for that. This is a real quick overview of the process, from there, just go to any of the top videos on Blender Rigging https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X590IZeyT1s

About the same as it works for 5 fingers but one less

You assign each of the fingers to one of the finger names, so you figure out which is the middle finger, which is the thumb, etc, and some just aren't assigned so you just won't have any visible functionality with those fingers. You can still use them for gestures, they just have no effect on the rig

[candid marlin]

How would I rig an accordion to move with both wrists on an avatar?

For reference this is what I have

[quaint cosmos]

The rigging of the accordion itself shouldn't be that complicated if the arms are already out and in the right position with the hands on the handle/keys, you just rig one half the one had and the other halve to the other with a bit of blue in the middle but you would need to edit all of the locomotion animations to have the hands in the right position rather than at the avatar's sides like they are in the default locomotion positions

[candid marlin]

Does my wrists need to be nearby each other for the rigging to work?

[quaint cosmos]

Not near to each other, they should be near the bone that is controlling them, though.

It's not really a tutorial, it's not something you learn in 5 minutes. It's just designed to give you an overview of how rigging works, then you should use a more in-depth tutorial That menu isn't where you add bone constraints like IK, you add them in pose mode using the bone constraints panel but you don't generally use IK for VRChat avatars anyway, though I think you can for PC avatars. It says at the beginning of the tutorial to not try to follow along, it isn't designed for that.

If you look up Blender rigging, you'll find much longer tutorials, those are actually going to go over all of the steps, that's just a high level overview of the process.

[crimson latch]

This is me T-posing

Why are the hands so close?

[crimson latch]

I made him 2.2m, which is much taller than me, and it helped… shouldn’t it work with my real height though?

[flint crypt]

It's either you gotta fix the camera/where you look or gotta fix his armature

[ebon elbow]

I'm having something weird happen with my Armature.
when I pose the armature of my character I see some weird shadow that follows the body and things like the glove in the picture actually seems to be weight painted to the shadow thing.
I'm wondering if it's a shader thing or something else but I have no idea
anybody seen this before or know a fix?

[ebon elbow]

this picture is with Wireframe Viewport Shading turned on and clearly it is not just a shadow it's actually a part of the body

[pale pumice]

Looks like some vertices not painted and thus not moving with the bones.

[stable cipher]

In the stage of working on shape keys…. Sooo I’m hitting a wall with with mirroring the shape key to the other side. It won’t mirror it and says they’ve failed. So I first tried checking the symmetry but cutting it in half and mirroring it and doing it again. Still a fail. Checked the object location on the axis… still nothing. Is there anything else I could try or fix or is it a start over completely situation? I’m still a bit new to blender since I have been working on it for just a few months now.

[fervent vigil]

OK, question. Y'all know how Unity, when detecting humanoid skeletons, doesn't like to detect the chest bone in many cases? I'm starting to think that maybe it's not expecting the neck to be connected to the chest bone and thus not autodetecting it properly. Does anyone know this for sure?

[quaint cosmos]

Not for sure but the humanoid system is designed for the upper chest to be optional so it would be strange for its detection code to get tripped up by that

[smoky geode]

i am losin my shit

ive been trying to figure out what i did wrong here for like 3 hours

someone please help me hhhh

i attached the head to the body using CATS in blender

like, everything LOOKS correct

i cant find the issue

okay i lied, actually i've been at this since 8am yesterday T~T

?

what

🦤

wtf do you want me to do? send a ss of my whole unity model?

tf

that's what i did sweetheart.

it errors when i try to, THAT is the error message.

?

it's very clean

you're just dumb

lmao

it's alr tho

i got nagasakii's help

[little forge]

Weight Painting is the devils lettuce

[fading verge]

hhow do you combinethese

it just

appeared

for some reason

does it even matter if thats there

[brazen island]

@fading verge should be ok

[torpid burrow]

anyone know why blender isnt importing vertex groups

[fading verge]

are you sure?

looks like this if i

[brazen island]

@fading verge pose mode? then parent them

select child then parent with ctrl, I believe, and ctrl p

[fading verge]

which one should be the parent

well i know its the upper arm

but do i select that one first

and then the lower arm

ddid i do it irghr

tnope i did not

😭

figured it out

[brazen island]

@fading verge parent - one thats closer to the root/hip

[fading verge]

yeah i got it figured out

[fervent vigil]

FBT IK question.
Generally speaking, vrc's IK straightens the spine when you calibrate in FBT. Having the bones not entirely straight will cause the bones to shift in location after calibration (e.g. the common issues of shoulder sagging)
However, I sometimes see avatars, especially chibi avatars, intentionally break these rules to make the avatar 'feel' better in FBT (however, the way it lines up with the body becomes less accurate)
Would these sort of rigging setups be what are described as being 'rig hacks' from the vrc documentation? (I remember the days of upside down spine hip bones, and I know those don't work any more)
Also, what's the advantage of doing this over just exporting the avatar with the spine completely straightened out in pose mode?

[full crystal]

Cats

[livid flume]

Oh yeah

First ima make this funny

Thx Ill try that

[leaden slate]

got a question: Where do I find the info on how I should align my skeleton, kind of related to @fervent vigil 's question, like should I have the fingers completely flat in the T-Pose or is a "loose hand" type pose what you should set it as? Mainly just trying to get the avatar to feel right in full body and such and fix shoulder sagging, stuff like that

should I have the arms completely in line and straight or do I put a bend in the elbow

[quaint cosmos]

What has worked for me is arms completely straight and fingers completely straight and parallel with the thumb at a 45 degree angle

[leaden slate]

45 out sideways? does it look good ingame or like the classic stick figure hand you see on most MMD models

[quaint cosmos]

I'm not all that familiar with MMD hands but I think it looks quite good. It's the best pose I've found, anyway. Yeah, 45 degrees sideways and basically on the same horizontal plane as the other fingers

[leaden slate]

gracias

[fervent vigil]

So, in the VRCSDK there is a test robot project with some physbone tests on it. I found that the test robot lined up nearly perfectly in full body and made some tweaks to it to fit my body better. From there, I just used the orientation of the bones on the robot model to infer where I should be placing the bones on my other avatars.

All of the guidelines here apply on how an avatar's rig should be set up: https://docs.vrchat.com/docs/full-body-tracking

Personally, I find that fingers straight out works best if your bone roll on all of your fingers is set to 0. If your fingers are slightly curved, your bone roll shouldn't be 0 because otherwise the proxy hand animations will make your fingers curl in odd directions. Generally speaking, however, your bone roll should be 0 on most of your bones.

[leaden slate]

does "bone roll 0" mean just having the "palm" side of the fingers facing the ground in tpose @fervent vigil

[fading verge]

how does the eye rig work?

does the bone just rotate, rotating the eye?

[crisp tendon]

Yep

[crisp tendon]

Bone roll 0 should be adjusted in edit mode, since we don't want it to affect the actual pose of the model, it's a matter of making sure you're not exporting with a bone roll which unity will then revert to 0 and mess with your rigging.

[leaden slate]

ok

thx

[fading verge]

so I know you can't apply mirror when you have blend shapes

I'm creating my visemes and I'm using subdiv

is it going to complain about that

ugh

[crisp tendon]

Yes it will, so use this: https://github.com/llealloo/join-modifiers-and-shapes

[fading verge]

thank

[scarlet venture]

Hello!! Im trying to set up a model I got for my birthday and its really cool. I started working with the vrm and converting it to a prefab for VRC but some of the bones when converting change and no longer exist when importing them. Can anyone help me?

I also have a fbx file but it doesnt have the preset expressions and physics (I think)

[cosmic vine]

expressions you can check for in the shape keys in blender and if you mean physics like physbones you'd set that up in unity

could you give an example of a bone that disappears?

[scarlet venture]

sure, The spine and the shoulders have disappeared from the rig. these blend shapes are the ones i have

[cosmic vine]

so what does your hierarchy look like now ?

[cosmic vine]

hips - spine - chest looks right to me for order

thought you said the spine went missing?

[scarlet venture]

when I export to vrchat there is not a spine

it isnt detected

[fringe kite]

Is eyebrow tracking even a thing I need to consider?

[sage patio]

if using a quest pro, yes

but keep in mind that you also need the VRCFT application + an avatar with the logic set up for face tracking

[tawdry sigil]

what would be the best way to add simple lip sinc to this model just having the jaw move up and down and nothing else?

[quaint cosmos]

There might be other options but I'd just make an open mouth shape key and a closed mouth shape key and use the open mouth for mouth shapes where the mouth would be more open (ah, oo, ou, ee, etc) and closed for when the mouth would be more closed (mm, nn, pp, ff, etc.)

[tawdry sigil]

gotcha, thanks. makes sense, i was worried using conventional methods would just stretch the mouth up and everywhere but i didnt think about just making 2 shape keys for it

[quaint cosmos]

It should look good if you just rotate the jaw back a bit using the right pivot point You could also rig it to a bone and then apply that as a shape key

[tawdry sigil]

its on a bone already, i havent ported over to unity quite yet. i havent messed with this stuff in a few years so im relearning a lot lol

[brazen island]

@tawdry sigil theres literaly jaw flap bone mode for lypsync that will rotate bone depending on voice level.

[sage patio]

even simpler, if you want the jaw to move up and down, there's literally "Jaw flap blendshape"

make a blendshape to open the jaw by literally just moving it down, and use that

that's it

[strange fjord]

Yes

[regal trail]

Anyone any idea on how to fix this? The weight painting is the same on every finger but the index finger is doing this.

[fringe kite]

I was having this problem too, is the finger on the opposite hand lit up? Try erasing (weight 0 brush) then re- painting the finger tip, deleting the vertex group for that bone and re-creating it, and if that doesn't work delete and recreate that bone.

[regal trail]

Thanks already found the problem, it was falsely weighted to the head bone...

[restive garnet]

Anyone know of a reputable source to find a good creator to make clothing commissions for avis?

[quaint cosmos]

Good luck with that but you probably don't want to admit to breaking TOS on the official Discord server

[nimble quest]

Could someone help me put bones in and rig a large biped robot walker?

[fringe kite]

I'm just learning but I'll help as best I can

[azure fjord]

All my bones set wrong weights when using Assign Automatic from Bones in Blender, what coud be causing this?

The other hand did it correctly, is there any way I can mirror it?

[fringe kite]

@azure fjord when I had issues with this, selecting the correct bone and then briefly clicking to paint inside the red zone "snapped" the rest of the weight painting to that bone. You could try it.

[azure fjord]

That didn't work 😦

[azure fjord]

Huh?

[fierce grail]

Reset your avatar descriptor.

[azure fjord]

Thanks!

[gritty basin]

What would be the best way to sort out this spine for VRChat since you're only supposed to have Hips, Spine & Chest? I think most of my other bones are fine (Arms & legs etc).

[sage patio]

you can have both a chest and upper chest bone, so that's fine. what is not fine is the pelvis bones

you should merge those to the hip bone