Same with crash particles
#vrchat-general-2
stark swallow
coarse blaze
@winged quartz WHY
winged quartz
🤔
coarse blaze
Tho relatable 
tacit plank
"Hackers" in general are the issue
umbral reef
Well they are taking on part of the crash stuff
safe prism
if it's live right now, i can still upload avas so i think most people that could before can now.
opaque hawk
@heady steppe your probably fine since you’ve uploaded before
tacit plank
I don't even mind people with crash avatars that much. But the invisible ones (even from the social menu) bug me
heady steppe
Well that'd mean anyone who has uploaded hack stuff would also be fine
stark swallow
Well Selner is banned so he can’t fucking delete his avatars so people use them to crash others
vocal shard
who
coarse blaze
I know some people use crash avatars to crash obnoxious people, which is understandable
polar jasper
All accounts have been "grandfathered" in, which means that all accounts are trusted. New ones will start at ground zero and current ones will start being reviewed
coarse blaze
tho I haven't encountered a mass-crash avatar
stark swallow
I suggest deleting his avatars
winged quartz
lmao true selner is still banned
still lark
@polar jasper Pretty sure that's false
stark swallow
Selner is a memer
vocal shard
id wager its a server side thing, a hacked client wouldn't really get around it. 1 up nuke
good or bad memer
stark swallow
Both
umbral reef
With what they said its clear its a server side check
polar jasper
@still lark https://i.imgur.com/1x9lFz2.png
heady steppe
I didn't mean hacking the system, I meant that marking anyone that has uploaded as safe would also mark most hackers as safe @vocal shard
frozen trout
If the new gating system relies on ingame reporting to determine players privileges to upload. Couldn't people just report others for fun and/or trolling? Example we had a person in our group get blocked but 20+ people for being a shitty person. We could technically all report them and get their avatar uploading rights removed right?
gaunt carbon
I miss November
winged quartz
we both do
thick rivet
GRANDFATHER-ZONED 🙀
vocal shard
@gaunt carbon wait arent you the guy with fucked up neptunia avatars
gaunt carbon
Ye
vocal shard
nice
vocal shard
i would love to create avtars like that
That's exactly what im concerned about kareeda
bit right now i’m stuck with giving fate characters tf2 emotes
pseudo dawn
It seems VRChat has gotten too big for itself to be sustained.
winged quartz
5800 🤔
vocal shard
it’s smaller than it was before
iirc
I really dont see it working that way, im pretty sure it will be time based.
pseudo dawn
5000 can still be a fair size for an early access game like this.
winged quartz
It was better when there was 200 ofc
stark swallow
If there is a moderator watching this and has the ability to. Please delete the models that have crash particles inside of them. It’s not that hard finding them.
vocal shard
Then had 17k
velvet quarry
Used to be only 10-20 people on at any time, which is when most of the current systems were designed.
vocal shard
Cuz Ugandan knucks
kind folio
The blacklist is already in the sdk for the allowed playmaker scripts right? I remember seeing it.
vast tulip
A year ago you had a lot of people on if 50 people were on at one point
velvet quarry
Things haven't really been scaled up since then.
raven silo
@winged quartz when it was smaller it was easier find people
kind folio
or may be it was the whitelist
odd bay
How about they just make a better report system?
winged quartz
@raven silo I prefered it that way tbh
pseudo dawn
How about they have a functioning report system?
winged quartz
that's why I mostly stay on friends+ worlds
heady steppe
@stark swallow "Not that hard to find them" Tell me then, how would YOU find all the ways of doing it with a single filter?
odd bay
I was trying to be nice but
stark swallow
@heady steppe the poly size
winged quartz
🤔
pseudo dawn
Maybe VRChat should just change to a VR-only title?
stark swallow
@pseudo dawn 
heady steppe
Afaik particles don't add any polys @stark swallow
winged quartz
vr only would be heaven
stark swallow
That’s a fucking horrible idea
frozen trout
@pseudo dawn Can't be VR only. The way the game is funded is to Sell VR headsets from Vive.
pseudo dawn
So many people have brought that idea up in the past.
heady socket
So many people bought vr just for vrchat though
raven silo
@winged quartz if stay Vr might stay small l.ol
winged quartz
@plucky hemlock wtf lmao
heady socket
Htc would be killing themselves
winged quartz
why would someone with anime pic be a sjw
vocal shard
VRChat puts in VAC System and VAC bans crashers and exploiters
pseudo dawn
Or have Desktop Mode be a trial?
kind folio
@frozen trout not that true. oculus and vive gave them money a long time
stark swallow
OK I am actually furious right now
heady steppe
How so?
viscid seal
@stark swallow why?
stark swallow
Why the FUCK do you want it to be Vr only
heady socket
Some of the best people I've met in game are desktop
vocal shard
^
viscid seal
@stark swallow who wants to make it vr only?
stark swallow
That’s actually the stupidest thing I have ever heard in my entire life
vocal shard
yeah
hasty wedge
down with the desktoppers long live VR only 
🗡
polar jasper
Read up Lakuza.
empty sail
let's calm down with the cursing
vocal shard
not everyone can get a VR
hasty wedge
jkjkjkjk
winged quartz
it's actually questionable
lusty drift
"vrchat" being vr only, sounds weird am i right 
stark swallow
There are so many talented people that can’t afford to get a VR
pseudo dawn
I'm not insisting they do VR only. I'm just suggesting something quite a few others have said for months at this point.
heady steppe
I wish I had the money for VR
bronze sable
long live the desktop users
vocal shard
@stark swallow exaxtly
heady steppe
I currently have 0.06€
vocal shard
VR Only Worlds > All
viscid seal
oh XD
stark swallow
And you just wanna day fuck em and deny their entry
winged quartz
You would invite to the server, not to the room
pseudo dawn
Not everyone can get VR
But not everyone can get a gaming PC either.
odd bay
We should have an option to make VR Only worlds yeah
winged quartz
and make it a "list of rooms"
vocal shard
yeah
winged quartz
I actually would love to see it
heady socket
Or just make private worlds and invite vr users then
vocal shard
few people mentions vr only and desktop users get triggered
winged quartz
private worlds are messed up
stark swallow
THEY GET A PC SO THEY CAN ACTUALLY PLAY GAMES
viscid seal
@vocal shard XD
vocal shard
a gaming pc is one thing
stark swallow
YOU NEED A PC TO RUN VR
polar jasper
@odd bay Easy to make a world VR only
pseudo dawn
Limiting your audience is not always a bad scenario.
fickle plinth
so i have a question for the newest update with the trust thing, that a friend of mine put up
drifting adder
I'd like vr only worlds
heady steppe
I am a filthy desktop user, but goddamn do I envy the immersiveness and expressiveness and the animation capabilities of VR
vocal shard
I was able to get a VR and a good PC at minimum wage
lusty drift
has this been requested before, i want it to be a thing
empty sail
it would be possible to restrict worlds to only vr using a type of "two-handed" lock system prefab
vocal shard
Oh woops
viscid seal
you can make things vr only or desktop only with interactions in worlds
hasty wedge
i wish the day they remove access to talking on a mic
viscid seal
vr users cant interact with triggers inside other colliders = desktop only world
vocal shard
you do know minimum wage is different everywhere right
vocal shard
LOL
sudden sky
. . .
vocal shard
Why not we remove anime avatars while we are at it?
Yeah, but America is great to be for it if you want VR
swift pulsar
So does everyone start from scratch with this new content gating system? nobody can make avatars and worlds till they unlock it...? lol
hasty wedge
NO
ancient adder
Why did they not just make it so uploaded avatars simply don't load for people not on your friends list until verification
sudden sky
That’s an... interesting comment
vocal shard
Can anyone help me?
stark swallow
what
viscid seal
@swift pulsar everyone in game is fine
iron heart
@vocal shard but keep dbz ones
viscid seal
its just for new players
severe ridge
soooooooo when we getting an inventory system? 
bronze sable
we should make vrchat desktop only 🤔
fickle plinth
so my friend said [ My question is whether sending warnings or muting people or blocking them for short periods will affect this. Because I know people like Ikrium like to do that as a joke, but if it has negative effects... ] dunno if any mods or admins see this but it is a good question right?
iron heart
Pffft
heady socket
Someone was saying existing people are grandfathered in
stark swallow
TAKING AWAY YOUR AUDIENCE MAKES IT BETTER
vocal shard
It'll be the first to go.
polar jasper
@drifting adder I do agree there. One of my dev worlds has a VR only section because only VR users can pick up what is required. But Desktop users can still watch and walk around in the world
stark swallow
OK BUDDY
vocal shard
So basically in some rooms people sound robotic when they talk @vocal shard
"We're going to build a wall, and make the desktop users pay for it!"
stark swallow
Are you hearing yourself
pseudo dawn
There should be a VRChat and a DesktopChat.
vocal shard
No
@plucky hemlock i’m fine with that
@vocal shard does everyone have that issue in the room?
tts user here
sudden sky
Please no
vocal shard
I don't know if its an internet problem or not
winged quartz
I'd love to have some "private servers" where only invited people would be able to join, and those "private servers" would have their own "public" worlds that only people in those private servers can join... so people could organize better their groups
iron heart
SEGREGATION OF POORS
stark swallow
@pseudo dawn Lemme guess you only friend girls or people with Vr
vocal shard
it sounds like burger king foot lettuce guy
raven silo
option let you go to VR invite only
vocal shard
it sucks
@vocal shard i would ask, if others do, try a different room, if not might be a connwction or audio issue for you
If my friend can't give me an under the table handy back then I don't want to be friends
i took
a year
sudden sky
Wait who was it that said we need to get rid of mic users? XD
vocal shard
of theatre
and my voice still sucks
Why have it VR only? Isn't the point of VRChat to bring people together?
pseudo dawn
Wow. The salt.
stark swallow
Boi
vocal shard
Well in other rooms its fine, it doesnt happen. I think its more populated rooms?
yeah salty about my voice
pseudo dawn
And my last post was simply a joke.
vocal shard
But my internet speed is 20mbps so-- probably is my internet if anything
stark swallow
Do you have any friends that don’t have a vr
vocal shard
isn’t desktop chat just second life
raven silo
@vocal shard it just be setting in call VRpublic so only VR can access lol
stark swallow
hasty wedge
feel like one day someone is gonna make a world where u need to press a button through a wall to enter
lusty drift
i love the thought of only meeting vr users
vocal shard
@vocal shard might be an issue on your end yeah. 😦
lusty drift
only
sudden sky
Yknow... desktop users aren’t that bad
smoky isle
This new content gating is a retarded system.
tacit plank
Damn, 👙 is a character now?
umbral reef
@smoky isle You know how ti works then?
If not, please explain whats bad about it then 👌
vocal shard
oh
sudden sky
Also yeah I’m not a fan of this gating thing...
tacit plank
It was added in Unicode 6.0 2015 this wiki says
vocal shard
i have a wario in a bike emote
@vocal shard what sort of framerate fo you get ?
huh
If the fps dies it might sound like that?
I'd have to re-check
smoky isle
@umbral reef You should not have to have interactions with people to be able to upload worlds
umbral reef
@smoky isle Where does it say you need to do that?
vocal shard
So it's wrong to use proper grammar?
Try and block avatars by default amd see of it helps maybe?
I'll try that stuff yea
Or else you might sound like an upstuck snob.
smoky isle
@umbral reef It literally says that in the announcement post
umbral reef
Where then?
vocal shard
No it doesn't?
yeah what graysob said
Stereotypes much?
I have on desktoplow in graphic settings
wispy scarab
1-up, though* ;)
raven silo
i think add VRpublic setting on world would not be bad idea if you want to hangout with desktop user just stay normal setting on worlds
empty sail
We've reached the point in the conversation beyond speculation and have arrived at personal attacks/personal jabs, let's turn back.
ancient adder
"This time may vary from user to user depending on various factors." vague much
smoky isle
@umbral reef @vocal shard "When a user first creates a new VRChat account, they will be unable to upload custom content like worlds or avatars. After spending some time in the app and having positive interactions with other users, they will eventually receive in-app and email notifications that their account has access to world and avatar creation capability."
uncut gyro
Wtf, srsly. What the point of this shit exept overprotecting the triggered ones? Make VRchat friendlier? For who? 6 yo children? Its already friendly.
vocal shard
so far it’s been almost always friendly for me
umbral reef
@smoky isle You really think they game will be checking what and how you say things 😂
plush iris
Yea same
vocal shard
with rhe occasional troll but that’s it
sweet sandal
People don't know what a block button is
vocal shard
VRChat becomes 1984.
sweet sandal
xd
umbral reef
If they can do that they can shut down VRC and start a new company that will make millions
plush iris
@vocal shard rip Winston
vocal shard
we can only speak in newspeak
wait how do i speak in newspeak
@vocal shard it says my pings between 50 - 60
i forget
plush iris
LUL
smoky isle
No, I am guessing it will be like how you can give different commendations to other players in csgo
vocal shard
@vocal shard fps?
umbral reef
And again, that does not state any gate limits
Beside that you need time played to get anything~
plush iris
F
digital hazel
all you need to do to learn newspeak is to go on reddit, twitter, tumblr
uncut gyro
Well, now we heading stright to canada level
plush iris
Big happy :)
tulip violet
the only thing i am more worried about here is that Why are developers adding more content instead of focusing on Optimization?
vocal shard
Big Boss
png is 60
or ping*
A weapon to surpass Metal Gear.
Whats your framerate at?
Optimization is one of the reasons why my friends list is limited now
plush iris
Optimization so that more people can play I guess
vocal shard
Eww optimization.
plush iris
LUL
plush iris
My 18 core Xeon doesn't mind ;)
vocal shard
But they would have to eliminate the fun
And add limits
I make my avatars 200,000 polygons with 50 materials, 10 dynamic bones, and lots of particles.
Vban incoming
well it goes between 50 - 63
the highest it goes is 72
Vacban*
if not 63
That's alot of Vac bans
plush iris
@vocal shard oof goes someone with a 750 ti
vocal shard
😂
tulip violet
If you can't get your game to be optimized then Framerate will be terrible and people will start leaving due to worlds lagging them
vocal shard
And people sound robotic?
plush iris
XD
unborn snow
VRCHAT OPTIMIZED OMEGAOOF
vocal shard
I had 50-60 FPS average in VRChat in VR mode with 20 people
Optimization is for little babies.
smoky isle
I have £1k pc build in january and still get huge lag spikes making the game unplayable
when in very popular worlds
vocal shard
might be spikes in packet loss or something of randomly happens
vrchat
Now I drop to 10-20 Frames
I'm joking btw.
optimized
lul
could be
At least this isn't PUBG.
But I have 20mbps with internet too
oof
pubg has mega gay in optimization
bronze sable
you kids
back in my day we had to play on 0.5 fps and we were happy with it
vocal shard
so that could be it as well. I cant go into very populated rooms or I lose connection
tulip violet
Trunks.. even people with high end gamer computers still get issues without optimization... i know several who been having this issue
vocal shard
The game runs like garbage, let's be honest.
not for me
lmao
I'm joking @tulip violet
Oh definitely may be a internet thing
tulip violet
I don't joke Trunks
vocal shard
I don't have an avatar like the one I mentioned.
I'm doomed till I move
Idk if you can do much about that:(
raven silo
vrchat only use one core for there process
vocal shard
tear
plush iris
Vrchat minium spec: 1950x threadripper + gtx 1080ti LUL
vocal shard
Ya'll need Jesus.
i have a 1060
I have 1050 gtx
and it runs at like 90 fps usually
and never dips below 60
huh
plush iris
But rip unjoined meshes and the extra drawcalls :/
vocal shard
mine is prevbuilt
ibuypower
it has rainbow colors
Are you guys able to upload avatars?
plush iris
Ibuypower is pretty decent
vocal shard
I can't for some reason.
plush iris
? I don't think the new sdk is up yet
vocal shard
yeah their designs are 
My first PC was Ibuypower
Well, still using it, just upgrading from it piece by piece.
plush iris
BibleThump
plush iris
@vocal shard I did the same
vocal shard
Shoutouts to people who used Windows XP as their first OS.
i’m thinking of upgrading the card soon
polar jasper
plush iris
Shout-out to people who had 98
vocal shard
Although the downside of my system is that it's all AMD.
Cheaper yes, but..
mine’s nvidia
lol
Yeah I get the Unity package error when uploading an avatar.
plush iris
Hmm delete the pipeline?
vocal shard
but you can upgrade an ibuypower’s card right?
plush iris
And try again?
vocal shard
I got the RX 480 8GB at the time because I got it only for $200
plush iris
And the psu
vocal shard
yeah but some gaming pc’s can’t be upgraded i believe
like some are hardwired or somethn
lusty drift
yes they can
plush iris
But I'm sure any ibuypower has 500+ watt
plush iris
@vocal shard you should try ryzen :)
vocal shard
i don’t know how to overclock
oof
Upgrading to Ryzen for sure
I plan on it
my shitty laptop was also an amd
Although if I do, I gotta swap ram and motherboard aswell
meager rose
lol i ha d an ibuypower before and that thing was awful
plush iris
For my workflow ryzen is good but really depends what you do
plush iris
Just watch the temps and voltage
vocal shard
the who and what now
plush iris
Chat's getting hectic lul
vocal shard
I don't overclock, I think I'm in fear of stressing my system too much.
yeah that’s my concern
plush iris
Mainly keeps the temps and voltage reasonable
plush iris
My main rig is a Xeon so I can't even oc it LUL
Evga ftw :)
Love their customer support
🤔
@vocal shard hey you still can't upload?
winged quartz
what happened to this chat so quickly lmao
I just come back and people are talking about girls nuts being their boobs
plush iris
Lmao shrugs
vocal shard
I got it to upload.
plush iris
Went from sdk -> optimization -> pc -> gpu -> nuts
plush iris
I'm just a vegetable :/
vocal shard
broccoli makes you grow big and strong
winged quartz
plush iris
plush iris
velvet quarry
It'll be back when it's ready.
winged quartz
oh
velvet quarry
Round 2
plush iris
Sleep tight #vrchat-general-2
vocal shard
and now...we wait for the fix of framerate
kind folio
oof
scarlet prairie
better avatar blocking and selective unblocking would be nice
winged quartz
Yes indeed
fair magnet
it is selective
scarlet prairie
for non friends?
fair magnet
well thats its selection
winged quartz
...private servers are still the way I'd mostly like now
private servers with public instances
that would be heaven
fair magnet
no im not
scarlet prairie
like for instance in open mic and pug theres people performing
scarlet prairie
you're not necessarily friends with them so you dont want block them as well
polar jasper
@covert chasm is it intended that steam users get the message for "revoked access to uploading avatars" in game by default?
vital jewel
Please fix your game
raven silo
steam user cant upload avatar in the first place lol
lusty drift
steam users cant upload, so why would they upload avatars
raven silo
need vrchat account
lusty drift
plush iris
OOF
plush iris
Oh cool didn't know they have this emote 
polar jasper
I know they can't in the first place, but there were a few confused steam users in this lobby.
tacit plank
What's new?
plush iris
Well I'd say just make an account
covert chasm
@polar jasper Steam users can't upload, so the message is a bit redundant, but its there anyways.
tacit plank
In the new SDK
polar jasper
Gotcha, they just thought that they couldn't use custom avatars (pedestals)
mossy totem
im definatly not playing in vr any time soon cause its going to make me fall unconscious. i have serious heat problems and i need a new ac unit cause its Fuken 31 C inside of my room
covert chasm
plush iris
winged quartz
whispers: private servers with public instances
kind folio
I was the one with the chair whip
plush iris
@covert chasm how does new sdk work for the existing avatars that we currently have?
fair magnet
Im hoping this fixes the problem with me needing to upload a new picture for my avatar whenever i upload an updated version
covert chasm
@plush iris As mentioned in the post, it only affects uploading new content.
vast tulip
A "fix to framerate" is a world and avatar issue mostly until the 20-30 player area
plush iris
Ah ok sorry I might've misread mb
jovial ivy
@covert chasm will the update also help a bit with the performance of the game ? beacuse its running pretty laggy for me since the recent update if there is more than 15 people in a lobby
violet burrow
Lol does this mean after awhile Matsix will lose access to custom killing Joeybagels?
mossy totem
also @covert chasm was it that hard for your team to make the GUI normal instead of leaving 2 holes on the top and bottom just fit all the quick menu buttons into a 3x5 grid?
covert chasm
@jovial ivy There is no client update right now, so no
@mossy totem As far as I'm aware we wanted to keep some buttons separated out so they get hit accidentally less often.
unique geode
where is this plugin folder
plush iris
OOF
mossy totem
@covert chasm Maybe an idea for a Custom gui layout? it means you can take and move buttons to a place you want. Or its just too small and stupid to be added
vocal shard
all i just want is the ability to move around avatars in your menu
it’s annoying to have one GTA abatar in the middle of my fate avatars
and i don’t even have ocd
kind folio
100 avatars is the cap before it breaks right?
vocal shard
expanding list should fix it
frozen trout
@covert chasm since it's not publicly listed how the system determines permissions or levels of permissions. Is it possible that as an example conflicts between streamers with large followings couldn't abuse the system and mass ingame report/warn/kick a player to flag them as malicious unfairly?
vocal shard
oh dear
stoic saddle
@frozen trout You really think they're going to answer that? Because answering that would literally tell those people if they can or not
mossy totem
@frozen trout wouldnt they have mass bad reputation and mass good rep at the same time and just leveling it out?
stoic saddle
You literally just said "Hi I'd like to know how to abuse this new thing"
sour willow
How do i use that thirdperson camera thing I see people use? can it be done on desktop?
mossy totem
You cant
sour willow
vr only?
mossy totem
yes
vocal shard
i mean no answer does imply yes
floral aspen
only in vr
plush iris
vr only
sour willow
meh
plush iris
shrugs :/
fair magnet
vr only (unless you make your own)
plush iris
😃
mossy totem
and i prolly will make a build log
after i will get the last component
that is kinect
violet burrow
gets the feeling vr chat is going to lose its fun real fast and be a cautious zone
vocal shard
how so @violet burrow
mossy totem
ive started playing from mid 2017
where there only was like 1000 people play at best
dark narwhal
No more kicking your friends for fun rip
plush iris
i started when it was really empty :c and kinda stopped til more people got on
violet burrow
think of it like your going to an amusement park and in the entrance they now have a secuirty game liek you see at airports
feral ginkgo
Okay so question that comes up often that we don't have answer for: what happens to existing accounts regarding content upload?
mossy totem
but now its considered raw stuff
vocal shard
what?
plush iris
its kept
violet burrow
plus for the longest time my vr chat just stopped working
plush iris
@feral ginkgo it's kept
vocal shard
@feral ginkgo do you mean if you dont get on in a long time or what
feral ginkgo
@plush iris thanks
no, it's just i have to redo some weight paint so it would suck if i had to wait for such a simple thing
fair magnet
Isnt there a new social vr game coming soon?
plush iris
@feral ginkgo quoting from tupper: "As mentioned in the post, it only affects uploading new content."
mossy totem
idk
feral ginkgo
Considering we have to upload new content all the time because SDK is glitched regarding upload to existing blueprint though....?
plush iris
so everything we have atm is kept unless server bugged and rip everyone ;w;
mossy totem
lol
plush iris
@feral ginkgo i personally just delete the pipeline manager and upload new one and delete my old avatar :/ its a bit painful but at least it doesn't crash my unity
violet burrow
but if they update the sdk dont al existing avatars need new update?
vocal shard
i would imagine they keep rollbacks in case the servers bug
floral aspen
no, you won't have to reupload your old avatars
winged quartz
They have enough space to keep all the avatars and worlds we send
inner cape
Public lobby is pure canc*r. 🤔
winged quartz
ofc they have backups for rollbacks
plush iris
@floral aspen yea just sometimes it bugs out on me :/
winged quartz
@inner cape that's why I said in the #feature-requests
I'd love to have some "private servers" where only invited people would be able to join, and those "private servers" would have their own "public" worlds that only people in those private servers can join... so people could organize better their groups
tight galleon
The new system has been thought out for the past few months now, it’s not like it was impulsive
inner cape
The fuq.
tight galleon
So idk why you’re all freaking out
vocal shard
lmoa
tight galleon
Or some people
floral aspen
Agreed Yui. We don't even know how the trust system works so freaking out about it is pointless
inner cape
Using my "lmoa" now. I see how it is Acorn. 🤔
plush iris
LUL
sturdy crypt
It’d be best to see how it is first ^_^
tight galleon
If you behave and or are not a cheater then there’s nothing to worry about
feral ginkgo
I think that's the problem honestly, we never know how something works, more transparency would be nice
feral ginkgo
Especially regarding security, i.e. saying "we made some security improvements" says nothing
sturdy crypt
I do wish it was explained better to get the point across
plush iris
i feel like it's kinda like the "follower 30 min mode for twitch"
vocal shard
maybe
floral aspen
thats the thing though. They can't tell us how the trust system works otherwise people could just game the system
errant creek
^conversely speaking though, too much detail on how security works sort of defeats the purpose of it
vocal shard
its nunya business
inner cape
I always say lmoa 🤔
mossy totem
laughing my off ass?
plush iris
where you be a good kid and you can be free shrugs
feral ginkgo
Well I can see people are still stealing avatars and crashing people's games, where's the security improvement in it
tight galleon
Tidus ron has been chatting about it the past few times I’ve been with him, it’s well thought out
mossy totem
its the right way to say
feral ginkgo
It's not about bitching but about transparency
violet burrow
trust system is the first lvl of skynet the machines are taking over
vocal shard
its still bitching lol
feral ginkgo
I don't want to know how exactly, I want to know what type
What's being fixed regarding security, maybe finally server-side checks?
floral aspen
talk about overreacting Viper7
vocal shard
but maybe its n u n y a b u s i n e s s
sturdy crypt
You’ll likely be fine as long as you aren’t being extremely disturbing ^_^
vocal shard
errant creek
@feral ginkgo i'm not sure i can really agree on being told about what type of security they're using -- because that in itself gives a starting point for people to figure out what to look up on how to get around it
vocal shard
maybe if they ever move to something that yknow
isnt unity
security could be better
violet burrow
who said I was being serious geez
vocal shard
but idk
mossy totem
i can use emotes with out nitro who else can?
floral aspen
moving to a completely different engine at this point in development is out of the question
feral ginkgo
@errant creek No no, I don't need security type, just what they focus on, like what we can expect, what's being done regarding issues people have
Just transparency in a subject
vocal shard
they do that
feral ginkgo
Show me
tight galleon
@mossy totem because they’re in a partnered server
blissful garden
whats up vrchat peoples
vocal shard
check #announcements
floral aspen
what about announcements?
feral ginkgo
Show me where's the transparency regarding security updates
tight galleon
Anyway I’m heading off to go do work stuff, trust me the new system will make the game a ton better
floral aspen
bye Yui
sturdy crypt
See ya Yui 🌻
tight galleon
Cya tidus, nice seeing you again
mossy totem
@tight galleon Game wisp*
vocal shard
developer update #1 and #2, they tell you what they're focused on, what to expect, and go over other things
earnest ermine
how much are they paying you to say that
strange harbor
Hey, can someone help me with this last ping? I viewed the message, but the ping is stuck or something.
vocal shard
lol
floral aspen
okay? What does that have to do with moving away from Unity?
floral aspen
oh
feral ginkgo
They don't do that regarding security update though, something which is probably the most important now
floral aspen
my bad
vocal shard
i mean not really
feral ginkgo
People stealing avatars, crashing other people's game?
strange harbor
Can people still use the podium avatars?
earnest ermine
can't get your avatar stolen if you aren't able to upload it in the first place fellas
plush iris
rip
earnest ermine
fixed
raven mango
vrchat is not running for me
vocal shard
no? its just nothing to fret over really
raven mango
I get on but it doesnt load in
vocal shard
especially the crashing thing
plush iris
@earnest ermine true lul
raven silo
@feral ginkgo best report them they remove them when they make new account they cant upload avatar
till they get trust
floral aspen
right now any wannabe troll and create an account, grab a hacked client and upload an avatar with crash particles and other shit. Have an initial upload restriction on that may deter some trolls and they won't be able to just go create a new account immediately and reupload their avatar
dark narwhal
i dont trust myself
vocal shard
it dies out over time 
if you update your game enough then they wont be assed to update their crashes
feral ginkgo
Last I heard the method for crashing is all the same
Some people get more creative with other things though
And all it needs is a simple server-side check and limit
To something people don't even use other than crashing
plush iris
@feral ginkgo server-side check would help a lot of issues
tight galleon
Subs
dark narwhal
yup
errant creek
i was under the impression the particle limiting thing they had up temporarily was there to address at least one of the ways users could get crashed -- just that they rolled it back because they needed to finetune it a bit more, or something along those lines?
raven silo
mayhbe should use particle limiter on this trust system instead
hasty wedge
wuts stopping them from going to a private world with a model that can crash tho?
tight galleon
The new system is to help cleanse the game of cheaters and crashes
raven silo
then cant use particle and music
hasty wedge
🤔
feral ginkgo
@errant creek We did tests after that update, still crashed
plush iris
it's the sub emitters
vocal shard
and its subemitters that th
plush iris
thats screwing people over
floral aspen
yeah they didn't limit the sub emitters
feral ginkgo
Wouldn't talk about it openly guys
tight galleon
This way getting banned actually means something, cheaters can’t just hop back in and crash people again
strange harbor
Can I please get this ping resolved? It's bugging me, I can't get it to go away, and no one has been willing to help with it.
vocal shard
lul
floral aspen
cleanliness thats a discord issue. VRChat can't help you with that
plush iris
disclaimer i know how to do it but pls i never actually done it :/
dark narwhal
make a ball pit avatar with that effect
vocal shard
@strange harbor ping issue? u on mobile im assuming
tight galleon
Please stop talking about this issue publicly
solemn sapphire
It's un-optimized particles + Certain shaders that crash players. kappa
earnest ermine
open the ping with desktop and mobile at the same time
feral ginkgo
@plush iris would probably remove those messages
plush iris
@feral ginkgo yea i should
errant creek
@feral ginkgo hmm, then i can't comment much further on the particles thing, seeing how my knowledge doesn't extend much further than that...on the topic of "avatar theft" though, i personally can't really see a way to completely block out that issue unless the custom avatar in question simply isn't being displayed to anyone
feral ginkgo
@errant creek I haven't tried CATS method yet, might do it today, with 'meshf**king' blend shape
Apparently they can't steal then
feral ginkgo
Or what they steal is a mishmashed bullshit
vocal shard
no
solemn sapphire
LOL
errant creek
the moment the avatar's visible to someone, it means the file's in their cache -- there're too many ways to get past things from there
vocal shard
they use subemitters
tacit plank
Many use particles to crash
solemn sapphire
yes but shaders can also casue an issue
quartz kayak
I don't think the new limits will prevent people from stealing avatars, as far as I've read, that exploit doesn't require uploading anything
feral ginkgo
@errant creek Yeah but apparently the cached version is a blendshape mishmash, broken mesh and because cached version doesn't have blend shapes they can't recover it
solemn sapphire
People who know what they are doing with shader forge can tell.
plush iris
literally just rip from the game since its running on a common api
feral ginkgo
That's what I've been told
vocal shard
At least this isn't a very particular fanmade AOT game made in Unity a few years back where you can just crash people by sending a few packets :^)
solemn sapphire
True Acorn
earnest ermine
god I love tribute
errant creek
@feral ginkgo i'm aware of that new CATS function, yeah -- but the cached file itself is still capable of producing a functioning avatar by some means; CATS will make it harder to use the cache file to reproduce the avatar, but the capacity will ultimately still be there for anyone determined enough
earnest ermine
very good times
vocal shard
RIP raohfat
plush iris
lol
vocal shard
cant install linux without bricking his PC 
solemn sapphire
@errant creek Hopefully they would be a type of Encryption i know they HAVE somethign i believe But not good enough since someone can just BOOm get the whole unity assest.
plush iris
lmao what distro
vocal shard
i forget
earnest ermine
really makes you think
plush iris
yikes :/
vocal shard
but he fucking bricked his PC and lost all his mod progress
plush iris
yikes :?
vocal shard
trying to install linux
mossy totem
also i can steal other's avatars
plush iris
why not run a VM?
mossy totem
cause im a russian hacker
raven silo
question how long till new person can upload avatar and world. even though there not social person but good at make stuff be big question?
plush iris
feelsbadFam
errant creek
@solemn sapphire as much as i'd like that, the file still needs to be readable by the game client in order to actually make sense of it...if the file can be decoded by anything locally, then there's really no way of protecting it, short of the game only streaming a pixel image to your screen rather than ever downloading the 3D model (and i don't imagine that's going to be good on the servers or your bandwidth at all...)
tacit plank
You don't have to be social to not get muted or blocked, you just have to have an alright mic and not spam effects
vocal shard
Lmao we literally had to complain to the people who host Fenglee's servers for months on end to fix the unavoidable DC if you remember that
errant creek
@raven silo the note they released with the update says it'll vary between user to user, i don't think they're going to give a clear answer on that one
vocal shard
Bc he didnt work on the game anymore
solemn sapphire
I know that Certain games Encrypt LUA, or C## and the game still reads it, somewhat would be a same as locking a certain .files.
But all we can do is wait for Vrchat to see what happens in later dates
plush iris
well unless the server is literally sending rendered images to you (which rip response time and bandwidth) there isn't really a foolproof way to stop thieving :/
plush iris
well or write your own graphics engine LUL
solemn sapphire
Someone out there would always find a way to bypass systems
plush iris
good luck with optimization though :/
quartz kayak
@tacit plank I don't think that's how not being social works, lol
errant creek
remember that this is a game running on a widely-used engine, not a global bank -- i really can't see any game dev having the time or resources to develop a security system powerful enough to rival something used in international business :/
solemn sapphire
we just have to se how things go really and stay by the side of the devs and put faith in it
errant creek
and then on the flipside, the amount of reverse-engineering talent floating in the gamer-base as a whole is actually pretty frightening
solemn sapphire
Honestly, I'm a little excited about the WHOLE playmaker stuff, but at the same time a little Bit unsure how it'll work with Avatars, and worlds. But then again, it'll bring a whole new system to Vrchat.
Which honestly will make things quiet entertaining
errant creek
i'm actually quite eager to see how playmaker's going to change world interactivity -- haven't seen too many worlds which try to match what you'd see in actual video games, if that makes sense
solemn sapphire
yea i get that
errant creek
like, we've got people building atmospheric bars and hangout spaces, and then there're people over in #world-development literally building things like flying vehicles and inventory/chest systems
solemn sapphire
Honestly if it comes down to it, and you can make Basically different games within Vrchat it'll blow allot of things out and just be enteratining,
Zombie survivals, Some good D&D, otehr roleplay stuff, Maybe even let's say more type of gamemodes
could bring allot to the table for players and also creators
World stuff i can understand how that'll work
But when they mentioned "intteract with otehr players"
That kinda Shook me
not sure how that is gonna work
ruby lintel
So all the time and effort i put into my avatars is for nothing because i dont join public lobbies 🤔
solemn sapphire
That's up to you really if you wannajoin them or not
errant creek
@ruby lintel i'm not so sure about that -- i just logged in and didn't get any message about "upload rights revoked", and i'm pretty much in my own private worlds 99% of the time
ruby lintel
Havent been on the game since that message popped up :P but good to hear
errant creek
granted, i've been around for maybe about 3 months now, but at least for older users, joining public rooms frequently doesn't seem to be a requirement...?
i'm not sure how they'd track that anyway, seeing how there was no way of "upvoting" a user before -- you could only mute or block, so only negative feedback possible
solemn sapphire
well belongs you got some good Ol group of friends to chill with it's all good. But i know allot of the time people start out fresh and get Greeted with nothing but a Crash or Particle spam. Eitehr one, But, I'm sure it'll be best to not go to much popular world choices
Kinda what i end up doing
quartz kayak
I don't think it will kill VRChat, however, it kinda kills the charm of being able to create in it freely
solemn sapphire
Not really
it just stops people Spamming content
like someone makes a new account from being banned
they get blocked for doing so
quartz kayak
I mean, yeah, new accounts because they got banned, I agree it's a good thing, however, for new users that want to upload content to the game, they get a brick to the face
And I've met people who block others for no reason, so that kinda could skew a bit the system
raven silo
it hurt people who just start vrchat not here to be troll but actually want to make something
solemn sapphire
Understandable
tacit plank
New players want to upload avatars, but 24h is not long to play
Plus, there's avatar worlds
solemn sapphire
But i'd give this thinga chance, and then they will fix things in the futue time, as it goes on
quartz kayak
and as @raven silo said, people who aren't very social might get screwed over a little
tacit plank
If it doesn't work, they will undo it, don't worry
quartz kayak
hmmm 24 hours as in a day, or literal 24 hours of gameplay time?
magic osprey
It feels like for all new folks who are good, and aren't out to start trouble, they're being punished because of what others have done. On paper this idea is ok, in practice it's another matter altogether.
solemn sapphire
or fix it up
tacit plank
I have never been kicked, and I have no ability to socialize
magic osprey
I've been kicked BY Trolls who own the room but were the ones spamming/abusing others.
quartz kayak
no, I mean, people who don't want to be in public worlds, but in private worlds with friends who asked them to join them
magic osprey
Heck, I've been kicked by a hacker, he wasn't room owner, but still kicked everyone out.
quartz kayak
pretty sure every system you can develop will have its downsides, anyway
and will also be exploitable, too
maiden pilot
24h is a pretty long time to play
glad forge
nah it's not lol, a good amount of hanging out for a week would cover that 24h
maiden pilot
Some people might not have that amount of time
vocal shard
In the grand scheme of things not really, and with how many avatar worlds there are now its not like you are stuck with custom avatar man, or one who has finally got a ear texture girl.
glad forge
yeah really lol, I upload stuff and even then I use pedestal avs more
maiden pilot
You're stuck with an MMD avatar until the 24 hours is up
raven silo
guess see 24 hour afk people
vocal shard
just go into a private lobby and keep the game open all day lol
raven mango
is vrchat currently down?
vocal shard
Nope
raven mango
know how to fix a stuck in loading start up screen?
quartz kayak
I haven't really used pedestals ever since I uploaded a custom avatar
but yeah, some people just log in to VRChat for like 2~3 hours per day
24 hours is quite some time for those people
glad forge
that's still only a week or two of play, which isn't long lol
quartz kayak
well, I already had started working on custom content on my second day because I was bored and wanted to create, and honestly, I would have just stopped bothering with the game if I had to wait a week lol
glad forge
I guess that's true too, a lot of my initial playing was me messing around in unity and blender trying to upload things
runic agate
Now you have more time to make them better
glad forge
only issue there is, not much opportunity to really improve if you can't upload to test :P
testing is a good 80% of the improvement process
quartz kayak
I was just going to say that, Freya
glad forge
only way I got to where I am with porting avs in is uploading and shit going wrong xD
quartz kayak
@runic agate you have to try to put yourself in the mind of someone who might just be starting and the impression they'd get if they want to create stuff in the game but they get a brick to the face instead
runic agate
I get that
vocal shard
less of a brick, more like a politely worded message saying to be patient. There's plenty of content to explore already, and plenty of people to meet.
quartz kayak
I mean, don't get me wrong
glad forge
yeah like, if the limitation was there back when I started, it'd be a lot worse, but now there's a lot in the ecosystem already, so it's really not too bad
quartz kayak
I'm all about stopping the crashers and content thieves if possible, but we have to balance it too
I mean, to be honest, I'm pretty bored when I get in VRChat because most of the content is just avatar worlds and hangouts, for those of us who are social outcasts, it gets kinda dull, which is why I wanted to start creating
puzzle maps have been the alternative when not creating things though
we need more of these
vocal shard
only getting in 24 hours in a week
I agree on the puzzle maps. I freaking love those.
quartz kayak
any idea if that would work?
glad forge
also where did this 24 hour figure come from lol, is there any word on this system
runic agate
When I fisrt started only vrchat account ie not steam accounts could upload
vocal shard
since theres nothing to measure if you're afk
raven silo
i dont think be 24hour system unlock be better off be moderation unlock it
quartz kayak
isn't it still only vrchat accounts the only ones able to upload?
vocal shard
yea
raven silo
24hour troll will make muitply account easy it been done so many time in mmorpg
errant creek
@glad forge i think it's just a figure that was getting speculated in here -- going from the last announcements, it doesn't look like a figure that the devs would actually officially disclose themselves
runic agate
IDK I gave up on uploading shortly after
brisk aspen
I dont think the trust system is useful :/
raven silo
more like legit player get bored because there not be able upload what they want for avatar
so they go some were else
runic agate
Its a start but it's gonna need to be improved
quartz kayak
yeah that's the issue, I mean, someone ill intended will just find ways to get around the system, legit players will suffer from it
vocal shard
i think itd be a better system if they made it like 3-4 hours
brisk aspen
Steam accounts also need to pass the trust test
vocal shard
not a whole day
brisk aspen
Or that
glad forge
@errant creek ah ok lol, cause I was thinking like, that's oddly specific for something that they're not allowed to disclose xD
quartz kayak
Steam accounts can't upload content AFAIK
vocal shard
they cant
quartz kayak
no need for the trust test
brisk aspen
I haven’t experienced abusive avatar tho
vocal shard
Im curious, why is it that we can lose upload rights when most of the people reporting for people avatars dont even meet the minimum requirements to run VRchat with their potatos?
plus
its just easier to use a vpn and make a new account on vrchat
rather than to make a new steam and then vpn
raven silo
i think done oppsite let people upload but if they get report lose when instead
vocal shard
bc sometimes steam will just bean you or some shit
raven silo
make only use default avatar if abuse the system
vocal shard
ehhh
someone might just not like an avatar or whatever and just report
theres definitely people who do that
quartz kayak
yep, you're right Acorn, I've seen that happen
people even report just for the sake of it
vocal shard
the avatar can be well within the rules and people will get reported
quartz kayak
I've gotten blocked for no reason before
iron spear
i'm reporting you for even thinking that @vocal shard
quartz kayak
haha
brisk aspen
Yeah now they will ABUSE the report, unfair
iron spear
not if i report first
vocal shard
Why dont they just implement an option to turn off particle systems locally so people will stop bitching and reporting for a single lost frame? I once used an effect that blocked some world particles, increasing peoples frames, and still got kicked and reported.
already did
I use text to speech, i get blocked by randoms for just saying hi. I just hope it's not based on the amount of blocks you get otherwise i can just say goodbye to using avatars.
ha
quartz kayak
it will be an easy way to screw over a content creator
iron spear
dang
frail wagon
soon with enough updates it'll turn into just PCChat instead of VRchat
vocal shard
i would use TTS but i dont have the realtek audio thing
brisk aspen
This will be the start of the dying VRChat phase.... until it get a truly overhaul
vocal shard
so i cant even do that :/
ruby needle
you dont nead that
vocal shard
nah umbreon
quartz kayak
I would use TTS but I have no idea how to do it with a VR headset
vocal shard
p sure its still growing
iron spear
i want to know like, how many reports do you need
ruby needle
anyone can use TTS via voicemeter or equivalents
brisk aspen
The update just went on, haven’t affected at all
iron spear
we on about a couple dozen or what
brisk aspen
Time will tell
quartz kayak
well, the ugandan knuckles already brought a lot of people
ruby needle
grim owl
RIP Raids
vocal shard
Not all of it was knuckles, it was pewdiepie too, he played it several times. Yknow, the guy with 63m subs?
@quartz kayak It's easy, get a virtual audio cable, install clownfish, install the voice changer to that audio cable, then set it to the mic source in vr chat.
everything was like greyed out in it lol
quartz kayak
pewdiepie played like 7 episodes and he was done with it
vocal shard
idk id think even someone like jameskii brought in more people overall, rather than pewdiepie
quartz kayak
@vocal shard the issue is using it while using a VR headset, I have no idea how to type with it
vocal shard
bc pewdiepie's videos were tbf kinda sub par
quartz kayak
he didn't seem very amused about VRChat, Acorn
vocal shard
I know on the oculus you can see through the little nose part, i don't know what it's like on the vive.
I didnt say they were good...his Amnesia vids werent amazing either, but look how many people played it so they could see whats up?
quartz kayak
on the WMR I have a bit of light bleed, it helps me situate myself, however I can't really use that to fluenty type xD
vocal shard
Tbh i doubt pewdiepie could play the game normally without people recognising him and fanboying over him. I'd imagine that would ruin the game a bit for him.
vocal shard
oculus gen 2 will be lit tbh
quartz kayak
any idea how much the oculus gen2 will cost?
ruby needle
propably also €€€
quartz kayak
I'm so curious about it
vocal shard
im guessing $600
quartz kayak
even tho I'm poor a f
quartz kayak
I suppose there are mixed opinions about them, I see people going really hyped about those leg trackers
I sort of felt that way with the Kinect v2
runic agate
What's wrong with them?
vocal shard
and at this stage until oculus gen 2 comes out, if i get a VR capable pc then ill prob just get WMR
much more noob friendly to set up it looks like
iron spear
tbh i think its just the price
vocal shard
that too
quartz kayak
yeah, setting up the WMR is just, plug it in, play
vocal shard
i don;t think i'll be going with oculus on my next head set, i mean after the whole locking out people because they didn't update a certificate fiasco....
when was that? lol
ruby needle
WMR vor VRC sucks
quartz kayak
it's also the cheapest unless you go for the Odyssey, it also has the best resolution (well, vive pro has the same resolution now) for an all-in-one vr solution
ruby needle
unless you just play sitting at your desk
quartz kayak
but the tracking leaves to be desired
vocal shard
@ruby needle idk, i saw some videos and it looks fine
iron spear
they gave me like £10 or something cause of it though...to use on their store
warm gust
I'm always afraid when I get unfairly kicked like stepping into a portal I'm not supposed to cuz it's friends only, etc. Sometimes people also start votes to kick just to be malicious and I don't wanna lose my rights because people abused that power.
quartz kayak
@ruby needle it ain't so bad, but it can be a little frustrating when it isn't working right
vocal shard
u play with your hands below your hand most of the time anyways
so the tracking should be fine
REE ENGRISH
HANDS BELOW YOUR HEAD
AND IN FRONT
For the price of the trackers, theres really not enough utility to justify it, and if your room isnt huge the tracking is bad, causes glitches. Also causes you to have to re-edit models to make them compatible and tposing every time you swap avatars is annoying af
quartz kayak
we get it, Acorn 😛
yeah, the HTC stuff is really overpriced, I couldn't justify the price of a VR headset either, if it wasn't for Microsoft's WMR I wouldn't even be bothering with VR
vocal shard
lul
tbh when i saw the WMR video
Well there's also a mod of sorts that lets you use a phone.
quartz kayak
Riftcat? it kinda sucks
vocal shard
if he hadnt told me it was WMR i would have thought it was just normal vr stuff like oculus or vive
fika you have to buy a headset for that to even work lol
lmao
and anything below a galaxy S7 wont even work with it
At the current 500, vive is worth, the leg tracks that cost nearly as much as an oculus, not even close...if it was 3 for 100 instead of 1 for 100 itd be worth
quartz kayak
well I mean, my phone is an equivalent to a S5, it worked fine but it overheated like crazy, however it still wasn't really a good experience, from time to time my modem would stop transmitting data
quartz kayak
what's your current rig?
vocal shard
cause its basically a gtx 760, some i3 core, and 4gb of ram
quartz kayak
ah yeah, might need to upgrade, my girlfriend has a 950, which seems to be the bare minimum for the WMR to work
ruby needle
4gb ram, rip, 760, rip, the i3 depends on gen
vocal shard
i could use an external GPU and upgrade my ram & core though but that would cost like $700 more
ruby needle
external gpu?
ruby needle
dont
vocal shard
get a new pc
indigo fern
^ best option
vocal shard
even though it will run me $1.2k
quartz kayak
you should look for a 1060 minimum if possible
soft skiff
WMR is fine, Oculus is fine, Vive is fine... anybody who says different is fanboying their insecurities about their particular HMD purchase.
vocal shard
i can get a 1080 probably
vocal shard
not ti but still a 1080
ruby needle
dont trow WMR in tbe boat with Oculus/vive it definite has differences
soft skiff
Well, that's a you problem then
vocal shard
which WMR headset do you have
soft skiff
We have two different WMR rigs here in the studio and they work just fine in SteamVR