hardware

[grave sundial]

Way better than my 7800x3D once the extra cores get involved.

But, slightly better than mine with single core.

Not bad.

It's apparently WAY better at ray tracing than the 7800x3D.

60.8 Mpx/sec vs 22.9.

Slightly higher wattage; to be expected.

[mighty patrol]

😮

I got 7950x rn

My plan though

I was going to replace my 3700x with the 7950x then the 7950x with the 9950x3d

Would hopefully fix the bottleneck on my mid-range system which I guess is now lower-end

[grave sundial]

The 5700x3D is super cheap now.

[mighty patrol]

Yeah

[grave sundial]

Bit less than $300.

[mighty patrol]

Having extra cpus can't hurt

Maybe one dies someday

[grave sundial]

I wish I could install another 7800x3D.

😄

[mighty patrol]

Just make a Frankenstein

https://tenor.com/view/cpu-cpu-kill-gif-22236310

[grave sundial]

With two bonsai trees.

[mighty patrol]

What can go wrong

[grave sundial]

And another monster dual tower air cooler for the 2nd one.

I certainly have the space in the full tower.

[mighty patrol]

Wait

Gotta make the 4 in 1 ltt tv

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YX29Hk08lAY

[mighty cosmos]

Core parking was recommended for 9950x as well but I never enabled it
It seems like it does it automatically now, I can see when I run a game and the game bar detects it that one of the ccds has all its cores at 0

[mighty patrol]

Interesting

There was this, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wdQpVcL_a4

I never had the issue myself so

I have 7950x just shy of the series that has the issue

[orchid iron]

That's the thing with software issues, they will happen, and they will be fixed.
When? Idk lol

[mighty patrol]

Soon™️

[orchid iron]

Actually ignore what I said, the 13th and 14th issues were cause by software and did irreparable damage

At the very least, you can't somehow make your GPU burn itself through software...unless you played new world during launch

[mighty patrol]

I'm sure you could write code that would brick a gpu

[dreamy temple]

Intel CPU hardware faults being fixed in software and giving 30% performance degradation after you're out of warranty is basically tradition at this point

[devout pendant]

to play games in 4K is heavy. To stream in 4K is even heavier. Can the game be recorded at 1080P and then upscaled with AI to 4K?

[mighty patrol]

This process can be done using specialized software like VideoProc Converter AI or WonderFox HD Video Converter Factory Pro.

[devout pendant]

is upscaling recorded gameplay to 4K better than playing at 4K?

[mighty patrol]

On your system resources for sure in terms of quality there's no way it would be better.

Upscaling w/ dlss even makes it have more motion blur etc

[orchid iron]

native will always be better than AI generated

The question is, by how much?

Because if an AI frame looks 99% like a real one, but only costs like 1/10 to make, would you use it?

(I'm talking about upscaling, frame generation for me isn't a good thing)

[mighty cosmos]

The cool part is that dlss4 upscaling can and does look better than native in a lot of cases
Dlss is in a way an AA method, dlss4 is capable enough to clear out smeary results where for example motion vectors would be missing and normally result in smearing

[devout pendant]

but my doubt was about recording at lower res and processing to upscale it.

not realtime upscaling

[orchid iron]

you should try it out and see if you like it

[tough owl]

I'm under the impression dlss artifacting is quite common

not that people will notice it on their rbg-9000-gamer displays that are ghosting VA panels

[median marsh]

i think DLSS4 may look better than native at some points

because it is most likely able to denoise TAA

[orchid iron]

especially on games that force anti aliasing

[orchid iron]

depends, if you are at 1440P 90fps native, noticing any artifaction will be difficult
but if you are below that, you may find it more commonly

[halcyon silo]

Just want to point out a few updates that should be put on this. You should always use VT in a project with high quality graphics, which then means you can work just fine with an 8GB card, laptops are more then capable of running the editor & all it's peripheals. It seems you've not used a modern gaming/creator laptop, otherwise you wouldn't be mentioning it like that. 1TB of NVMe storage should be sufficient, as you can always place a lot of your older projects or vault cache on a removable external HDD which will be a massive amount cheaper. Although I agree on the source builds, they're ridiculous, you should just use the standard release that's only around 50GB.

It's probably also worth mentioning to people that these are specs for running on Epic/Cinematic quality, and you can get away with much less if you're running on lower settings (eg. 60fps on cinematic for my 4060 goes to 500+ on low)

[tough owl]

one could make an argument if you're planning on compiling engine from source on a laptop, you shouldn't pick the cheapest

[wise elbow]

from my experience, dlss artifacting usually isnt very noticeable

on friends tn monitors

[halcyon silo]

I wasn't suggesting you should pick the cheapest, I'm just saying a low to medium range gaming/creator one will generally get the job done for you. I'd argue for custom source engines you should pick a creator laptop as they generally prioritise CPU over GPU performance. Then you could have an i9 with a 4060 type setup, much better then an i7 with a 4080 (with CPU reference I am targeting a 14700K or 14900K)

[tough owl]

it is bit hard to find 4060 laptops nowdays because nvidia in their great mind stopped producing the chips prematurely

in favor of 50-series,which still hasn't come out

(and 50 series is less-suitable for laptops anyways due to higher power requirements)

[orchid iron]

https://tenor.com/view/monkey-look-the-other-way-look-away-awkward-weird-gif-17246188

Me with 6th gen i7 and 16gb of ram compiling the engine from source

[mighty patrol]

How long does that take

2 hours?

[mighty cosmos]

if it's just 2 hours I would be surprised ngl

[white horizon]

Took me like 1.5 hours on a 3700X

[plush turret]

16 days and 6 burned out components later

[white horizon]

At least

[grave sundial]

Did you use a molyfab to fabricate another 6 components? 😏

[plush turret]

I wish

If i had a class 9 molyfab i could save all my money...

Build a freaking car by shoveling dirt into it

[grave sundial]

Or just attach wheels to a molyfab and drive it around.

[plush turret]

The electric bill would be absurd

But hey i can sell dirt made into gold

[grave sundial]

Gold would become devalued though, because of transmutation tech.

Still, probably more valued than earth.

[plush turret]

Yeah, but honestly i want it for the fact you can make candies that are sweet but also actually nutritional

[grave sundial]

and quite possibly, guns.

[plush turret]

I want food more than guns

[wise elbow]

they still make explicitly the 4060 I think

laptops are crap unless you get a nice business made one like a thinkpad

IMO get mostly the cheapest one possible that has the specs you want

[tough owl]

you can get just as premium quality gaming laptops as business thinkpads

they just are absurdly expensive

[wise elbow]

yeah thousands of dollars

[tough owl]

and that's the main reason why public opinion about gaming laptops is so poor, nobody buys the good stuff

[mighty patrol]

Framework laptops?

Can even repair parts if anything breaks

https://frame.work/ca/en/products/laptop16-diy-amd-7040

[orchid iron]

@mighty patrol @mighty cosmos 4-5 hours, I use Linux commands to cap the CPU resource usage so it doesn't burn

Also, to change the thermal paste of my laptop, I need to disassemble the whole thing
That's like the mechanic telling to in order to change motor oil they have to remove the engine

[mighty patrol]

More people need repairable tech

Now more than ever

[orchid iron]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ayH93IS_WSs

[mighty patrol]

Oh god dell

[orchid iron]

Wdym, look at how easy it is to change thermal paste xD

[mighty patrol]

They never make things fun

I have a dell workstation laying around

Things a pain in the ass to open

Has like a clasp to open a lock mechanism

[grave sundial]

Just use a wrench.

[mighty patrol]

Which literally just hooks around some metal hooks

[grave sundial]

The Russian way.

Fixes everything.

[mighty patrol]

I just yank on it

Eventually comes off

[orchid iron]

Ifixit should have an emergency wrench yeah

[mighty patrol]

I hear they have a good solder kit

Lifetime warranty

[orchid iron]

Btw gotta love it when you own a kit of screw driver heads, and to disassemble this dell laptop it needs such an niche and specific torx head that I had to order it while disassembling it

So now my laptop that I do unreal engine on is sitting half disassembled on the table while I wait for the correct screwdriver to arrive xD

[tough owl]

meanwhile my grossly overpriced ROG laptop; 9 screws to remove the bottom, 8 screws to remove the heatsink

[orchid iron]

Oh yeah ASUS is also cringe

[mighty patrol]

Used to own one of their not quite desktop not quite laptop tower systems.

Thing was booty

[tough owl]

I had G731 too myself

thicc boi

[mighty patrol]

g20 I had

[orchid iron]

It feels like I just have a thing with leaving dissasmbled computers around

[mighty patrol]

Just make some frankenstein pcs

[orchid iron]

You know it xD

[mighty patrol]

Get your hands on one of these, https://techgage.com/article/asus-rog-g20-gaming-pc-review/

[orchid iron]

This dell laptop will be a test PC to check how compatible my game is on older hardware

[mighty patrol]

It's power supply is the main bottleneck

But it's also not that great

Lel

[tough owl]

G20 was basically laptop in desktop box

[orchid iron]

Reminds me of the framework mini desktop which is a basically a laptop motherboard in an ITX case

[tough owl]

which is an odd product for a company that sells desktop cases for their laptop motherboards

[orchid iron]

I think they mentioned it was too complicated to do it in laptop format or something

[mighty patrol]

Right

It was very odd

[orchid iron]

Which is funny because Asus said it was the other way around

[mighty patrol]

Desktop form factor with laptop parts

[tough owl]

if they had like AM4 socket in it and clearance for custom cooler, then it would have made sense for me

[mighty patrol]

They could have changed many things

[orchid iron]

They tried making the ram swappable but AMD said it wasn't possible

[mighty patrol]

But I took mine out

🤔

Twas laptop memory

Asus lies!

[grave sundial]

Just buy this.

The tree adds to your productivity.

The astronaut gives you encouragement.

[mighty patrol]

I just got a dollarama keyboard ontop of my pc

It's basically the same thing

[grave sundial]

show pics.

[mighty patrol]

Basically a hat

[grave sundial]

you can replace all the keys with pokemon.

[mighty patrol]

Idk if it would break trying that

Thing bends lol

I can twist it

[grave sundial]

eep

[mighty patrol]

My main keyboard can't do that luckily

[grave sundial]

I like the glass.

[mighty patrol]

Same

[grave sundial]

the Republic of Gamers neon is nice.

[mighty patrol]

Corsair 5000d case ftw

[mighty patrol]

I wish it was without rgb

I could disable but no point

[grave sundial]

Isn't the RGB controllable?

[mighty patrol]

With armoury crate probably

or openrgb

Armoury crate has conflicts with unreal engine though

Same w/ msi afterburner etc

All those type of programs

[median marsh]

huh? how does that happen?

[tough owl]

haven't had any problems with armory crate

[mighty patrol]

Usually its due to overclocking that causing the issues.

Since Unreal prefers things stable.

Also seems like the forum page that had a list of conflicts is gone all I can find now is wiki pages made by randos.

https://traine9.github.io/Unreal Engine Wiki/mediawikiv2-website-prod05.ol.epicgames.net/index4471.html?title=Software_Conflicts

[mighty patrol]

The air conditioner cooler ftw, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ewmReWmxdQ

[halcyon silo]

50 series has the same power requirements as laptops in their mobile versions. Only the 5090 & 5080 increased by any notiable power limit. 50 series is also more efficient with their power, so definitely better for laptops, more gaming on battery power. Having said that, you should never really be needing to use it on battery for gaming, so it's not so much of an issue

[halcyon silo]

really? Really? My laptop is a low range gaming one, and will trounce anything from AMD or Intel prior to the 12th gen, and still will demolish everything except the high speced 12th gens. In fact it's more powerful then a lot of the common 13th gen workstations going around

[wise elbow]

what i meant is that the specs might be the same, but the everything else is going to be ass

thats why i always reccomend just getting the cheapest gaming laptop from a somewhat reliable brand

[halcyon silo]

"premium" is all in the eyes of the user. Objectively one of the most "premium" laptops in the world is the Legion 9i coming out. We've a 5090, 64GB RAM (upgradable to 128 before shipping, supports 192), a 275K, and Gen5 NVMe storage. Along with a 99.99Wh battery that allows (when not gaming, and properly configured) ~11h of video playback, or office tasks. And when gaming, ~2h under load

[halcyon silo]

wdym?

like at least I've a built in UPS, and I'm pretty sure my screen is better then a lot of the monitors people here have

[wise elbow]

build quality is ass, keyboard is ass, drivers are ass, camera probably mega-ass

[halcyon silo]

It's soo good, but overpriced like hell

[wise elbow]

most laptops are just kinda crap because they're basically disposable

[halcyon silo]

Keyboard = perfect. No desktop keyboard is ever nice to use, they're all horrible. Hate them with a passion. Drivers are the same, litterally. Cameras, since when did desktops come with cameras included 🤨?

And as to build quality, it's about as good as prebuilt desktops at the same price range

[wise elbow]

im not comparing to a desktop

[halcyon silo]

they're litterally not. I don't think you've used anything much more then a chromebook at this point

[wise elbow]

also a desktop cpu/gpu is always going to demolish a mobile version

[halcyon silo]

at the higher ends, maybe so, but the laptop versions are still nothing to scoff at

[wise elbow]

yeah not at all

[halcyon silo]

I mean a laptop 4090 beats a desktop 4080...

[wise elbow]

i dont think thats true at all lol

[halcyon silo]

and from about the 4070 range and below, the laptop counterpart performs about the same to the desktop, there's not much loss in power at all

[halcyon silo]

well it does depend on what you're doing, but then we can say that about everything, it's all subjective

the most impressive thing really, is that with half the power, it even comes close to the desktop counterpart

[wise elbow]

i dont think its anywhere close to a desktop 4090

it doesnt even have the same specs or memory

[halcyon silo]

alright, think of it this way. A laptop GPU generally matches the desktop equivalent of the previous generation (give or take about 8%). Then they use less then half the power (desktop GPUs should use a lot less, even if it results in slightly less performance). Additionally a mobile GPU is still a beast for current gen. You're not going to have any issues with a laptop 4090, it's going to run everything perfectly fine

[halcyon silo]

iirc it has 20GB of VRAM vs 24?

[wise elbow]

16

[tough owl]

premium =/= top end

and I would also point out most performance gains 50 series gained over 40 series is due to increased power consumption

which is not beneficial for laptops with limited cooling capacity

[halcyon silo]

sigh, except the laptops have increased performance, and no change to the powerlimits

[tough owl]

last time I checked they bumped power limits from 125 to 175W

[halcyon silo]

they have made a few architectural improvements, but they're minor. Most of the change has gone into the AI performance

[halcyon silo]

ehh? No?

[tough owl]

yes, go see the specs yourself

[halcyon silo]

nop, and I think Nvidia knows what the specs for their laptops are

[tough owl]

that is not small jump, 40-series was 45, 60 and 100W + 25W boost

[wise elbow]

how tf are they going to cool that in a laptop?

[halcyon silo]

so a laptop 4060 has a max TDP of 115W + 25W dynamic boost

so a max of 140W card

the 4090 had a max TDP of 175W + 25W dynamic boost

[halcyon silo]

It's called cooling that's more advanced then a desktop

[tough owl]

they don't, unless you pay for vaporchamber and liquid metal which I can guarantee is 404 not found in anything cheaper than 2000$ category

[halcyon silo]

my laptop has a vapour chamber of sorts

$1000

[tough owl]

yea technically any heatpipe is vapor chamber

I'm talking big-ass copper plates

[halcyon silo]

then what is the point of your comment?

[halcyon silo]

then every modern gaming laptop qualifies

[wise elbow]

no lol

[halcyon silo]

yes lol

have you not seen the IceFront5 tech?

[wise elbow]

never heard of it

[halcyon silo]

it's more efficient then any desktop solution, tbh I wonder why they don't expand it, maybe it doesn't size up well

[wise elbow]

dont see anything online about it

[halcyon silo]

well put it this way, it can run a 175W GPU + a 120W CPU at <70C for hours

[wise elbow]

send link

its almost 100% just a vapor chamber

[halcyon silo]

they had a whole page about it, just trying to find it now...

I'm sorry, I misremembered, it's called ColdFront5

there used to be a lot more advertising around it, so not sure what they did, but most of what I remember seeing has gone...

[wise elbow]

looks like its just a vapor chamber

[orchid iron]

If we are comparing laptops and desktops I got my two cents on the matter as someone upgrading from a laptop to a desktop:

The main difference between the 2, portability, and that single difference changes everything

-motherboard support, way better on desktop

-motherboard/power supply/GPU/CPU upgrade? Haven't heard about those on non framework laptops

-also related to previous point, if the mobo, CPU or GPU break, you have to throw away all 3 to swap it

-Oh you wanna change the thermal paste? Pray that the laptop manufacturer made it easy to remove the cooler, because mine (Dell) really wanted people to disassemble the whole dang thing just to change paste

-look up Chiclets keyboards, if you like laptop keyboards you may enjoy those

-as mentioned portability is way better on laptops than any itx case tries to make you think

[naive cloak]

I have old Asus laptop that allows upgrading CPU, RAM, DVD, HDD, WIFI 😆

[mighty patrol]

Did they solder in gpu?

or igpu

[naive cloak]

it has NVIDIA GeForce GT 540M

[mighty patrol]

Oh my gt series

[naive cloak]

Intel Core i7-2630QM

[mighty patrol]

1gb of vram?

[naive cloak]

idk, I remember that I played Splinter Cell 3 on it and it worked fine 😅

ASUS K53SV

[mighty patrol]

Pretty much this thing, https://www.newegg.com/silver-aluminum-asus-n53sv-eh71/p/N82E16834230144

[naive cloak]

yes

[mighty patrol]

Apparently some people have played skyrim and stuff like dishonoured

also cod warzone

Lol

Seems like it would be painful

https://howmanyfps.com/graphics-cards/comparisons/geforce-gt-540m-vs-geforce-rtx-5090

Not meant to be taken serious but an interesting comparison.

[naive cloak]

$5111.99 😂

[mighty patrol]

"Only"

[naive cloak]

but people buy it 😢

[mighty patrol]

Tis a crazy thought

I'll be waiting for 6090

Starting to save now

[naive cloak]

people who buy Nvidia GPUs should know that when they buy it at least two gamers will not be able to buy GPU.

[mighty patrol]

I found that reality buying the 4090 lol

Arm and a leg later

All because I wanted frame generation

and vram

[naive cloak]

why would someone want frame generation?

[mighty patrol]

Idk I thought it was better

Then I started using it on every game I played

and ended up hating it

Miss native frames

[naive cloak]

at least you can use UE5

[mighty patrol]

For now

[naive cloak]

I am waiting for Al Max+ 395 motherboard/mini pc to be released (if it will) and will try to buy it instead

[mighty patrol]

Like these but not? https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/X870E-AORUS-XTREME-AI-TOP#kf

Apparently gigabyte has a bunch of ai-ready mobos

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/AI-TOP-Capable

[naive cloak]

with CPU soldered

barebone motherboard or something like that

[halcyon silo]

because why wouldn't you? It's just about as close as we'll ever get to free performance. I'm seriously considering upgrading to the 50 series to get access to multiframegen.

Like it or not, DLSS & Frame Gen are the rendering techniques of the future. Especially as we get games that are pushing more and more realisic physics simulations, higher polygon counts, & insane resolutions. 4K is becoming a standard slowly, 8K is finally making it's slow way into the market

[mighty patrol]

8k is a myth

Quixel barely even had 8k textures

We won't be using 8k for a while.

[halcyon silo]

you realise that iGPU is basically the same price as a 4080Ti Super (which will trash it, 3x over)

[halcyon silo]

that is the max resolution if I'm not wrong?

[halcyon silo]

I mean it is what 4K was about 10y ago

[mighty patrol]

True

But without any major breakthroughs we are kinda just relying on softwares now

[halcyon silo]

I'm not going to buy anything for "8K games", that's just advertising atm, but it will come eventually I'm sure

[mighty patrol]

Hardware is closeish to it's peak

[halcyon silo]

esp. on the larger screens

[mighty patrol]

Until next major breakthrough

Where we realize we can just break physics more and more

[halcyon silo]

yeah, Nvidia would make their GPUs more powerful if they could, but there's no real way other then with clever optimisation via software. Other then that they can make more physics related stuff easier to render through things like RT cores, but that's about it

[mighty patrol]

Yeah even making the dies smaller won't do much at this point

[halcyon silo]

well quite literally we're bottlenecked now by things like the speed of light

[mighty patrol]

All about just optimising our code it seems right now.

Which is good for sure

[halcyon silo]

and sure, Nvidia throws on more cores & more power to give people more performance, and they just get more hate for it. Like c'mon man...

not possible to please these gamers now it seems

[mighty patrol]

I think the main problem

Is the msrp bs

and the lack of stock

Which doesn't please anyone

Shouldn't cost 2k more for a gpu than it did a year ago.

Makes no sense

[halcyon silo]

also, they seem to have forgotten that originally games would run at <20fps, with absolutely no lighting, everything was 1 brightness. Then PS1 era brought lighting, PS2 - 3 we saw a standard of 30fps, sometimes up to 60 fps. Then with the launch of the 20 series GPUs there was a massive explosion in computing power, so we saw games run over hundreds of FPS, meanwhile it's taken until now for engines to catchup & we're getting upset that a fully CGI movie rendering in realtime only runs at 70fps???

[mighty patrol]

Year ago I bought 4090 for 3200$

5090 is asking 5200$

[halcyon silo]

what currency?

[mighty patrol]

usd

[halcyon silo]

that's expensive

4090 was going to cost me NZ$4,200

just 6 months ago

[mighty patrol]

Got asus rog one

[halcyon silo]

most expensive 5090 here is NZ$5,900

cheapest is NZ$4,999

so half the price you have?

US2.8K it seems

[mighty patrol]

Just the one I saw on this link

Was 5200

An asus rog

[halcyon silo]

yeah, well it's like paying extra for a white GPU & then blaming it on Nvidia

obviously you will have some overpriced cards that are more like a collectors item, or looks cool in some way

[mighty patrol]

Yeah just paint it yourself

[halcyon silo]

also ROG is overpriced in every aspect

[mighty patrol]

Yup

[halcyon silo]

not just GPUs, everything that is in the ROG range is super expensive

[mighty patrol]

Apparently I got lucky though

[halcyon silo]

xD

[mighty patrol]

Because my 4090 never melted

[halcyon silo]

I wouldn't say lucky

you just need to push the power cable in properly

then you've no issue

[mighty patrol]

Yeah

[halcyon silo]

these things don't randomly occur

[mighty patrol]

I did that part right

[halcyon silo]

there's always a reason, and sometimes it is people are stupid

<@&213101288538374145>

[mighty patrol]

Just report it

They will get a notif I think

[halcyon silo]

that might have been a good idea

I didn't think of that

😅

[halcyon silo]

at this point why haven't people realised that a "release date" is simply the announcement, and the real release will occur much later

and that MSRP is just the price that the developer will charge for their cards. Obviously retailers are free to set their own prices

[mighty patrol]

But 5090 was said to be $900 or something

[halcyon silo]

in your dreams

[mighty patrol]

For real

To make it

Doubt it even cost them that

[halcyon silo]

The 5090 starts (according to MSRP) at US$1,999

[mighty patrol]

Nvm mixing up gpus

[halcyon silo]

maybe so, there's no way we can ever prove that. But do consider the amount of money it costs to develop them. And then there's many people involved along the production who will want a slice, including the retailer

[mighty patrol]

Still

[halcyon silo]

the people who develop the architecture are incredibly smart people, and they're not going to be cheap. They know their worth 😄

and Nvidia has to pay them for the research, even if they're unsuccessful in making the GPU much faster

I mean, I think we're agreeing in essence, just maybe we have different opinions on what is good marketing or not

[mighty patrol]

Think we can both agree most of the price comes to cover their brand

While it's good it still like everything has it's issues

[halcyon silo]

Not like AMD has done particularly well with their pricing

[mighty patrol]

Has good software

[halcyon silo]

not sure I quite understand?

[mighty patrol]

Mean as in the price is reflected due to the brand

If it wasn't nvidia

They solidified themselves

Made a name

So people trust them more or less

[halcyon silo]

well yeah there's a certain element of that

I just don't think it's any greater then a normal company has

[mighty patrol]

Based on market share maybe

But what % of users have nvidia vs competitions

Steam db shows favour in nvidia for sure

[halcyon silo]

Nvidia is 77% according to Steam

[mighty patrol]

Favours green heavily

[halcyon silo]

more people have a 4060 then have AMD dGPUs

for context

[mighty patrol]

3060 fell off eh

Makes sense

[halcyon silo]

only just

they're both about the same

[mighty patrol]

Nice

Good choices

I want an intel gpu

I really wanna to some ue work with it

[halcyon silo]

they're impossible to get here

[mighty patrol]

May wait for next gen

Sorta tossed

b580 looks decent starter

Wanted to race it vs a 2080 super lol

[halcyon silo]

I mean it's kinda similar to a 4060

but it depends on what you're doing

if you properly utalise them, a 4060 will look & perform better

[mighty patrol]

I still havn't found a happy balance of nvidia settings for unreal

Just sorta left it default for all programs nowadays though

[halcyon silo]

for instance, Cyberpunk2077 @ 1080p High

Turn on DLSS Balanced/Quality, Frame Gen on, Reflex Boost, RT High

The 4060 will outperform

[halcyon silo]

well considering an outdoor valley, about 1Km2 with plenty of fog, sunset lighting, several trees, water mechanics, runs 70fps with DLSS Quality & Frame gen enabled on Cinematic quality, I think is fairly good

it's basically a cyberpunk environment, with RT on overdrive

unfortunately trees are horribly unperformant, as is grass in UE5

[mighty patrol]

I was more talking the control panel 3d settings

[halcyon silo]

oh

😄

[mighty patrol]

Yeah that's been a fun time finding a balance of too much and too little of.

[halcyon silo]

I mean for me I usually like to set everything up to get the best all round performance, and then leave

[mighty patrol]

Also in what time to use pcg vs painted vs landscape

[halcyon silo]

well I use the foliage actor for trees, and then landscape grass for the grass

seems like the easiest to implement, and also fairly performant compared to alternatives

[mighty patrol]

I wanted to make a landscape material sometime that has all vegetation spawn with it.

Like shells on the beach etc too

[halcyon silo]

try the MAWI autolandscape material

I will be making my own at some point, but it's a great starting point

esp. for prototyping

[mighty patrol]

On my wishlist

[halcyon silo]

it's free?

[mighty patrol]

I do have m4 magic

It is

Now

For personal

[halcyon silo]

and prof I believe?

[mighty patrol]

Nope

Just personal

https://www.fab.com/listings/6602874e-ef24-48c9-9055-a7ac07384696

This ones free

Rest of his stuff is paid

[halcyon silo]

ahh, must've got it on a sale or smth then

[mighty patrol]

or free for month?

[halcyon silo]

tbh it's tough to find out what grade of licence you have when something is in your library

[mighty patrol]

Don't think there is a way to tell is there?

[halcyon silo]

doesn't seem like it

[mighty patrol]

I been trying to study vfx a bit more lately, and have had an interest in tornados and wanting to make them in unreal then realized how expensive particles really are on even modern hardware lel.

[halcyon silo]

xD

[mighty patrol]

Was doing fish sims and had up to 1.1 million fish

But got chugging hard and eventually crashed ue

[halcyon silo]

btw, would you like to colab on a game? I've got about 5 people so far, and a VFX person could be really great

[mighty patrol]

Possibly in the future currently trying to learn as much as I can this year. I part-time support in oceanology discord atm while learning unreal.

[halcyon silo]

I sent you a friend req, hopefully we can colab later on. How long does it take to make more AAA quality VFX that go around RPG style games? Like the combat sparks, etc.?

[mighty patrol]

Depends I havn't actually achieved anything i'd personally consider AAA yet but I imagine it varys.

Team I'm with making an ocean has been re-writing for 2 years now.

This is a work in progress, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Is9_7PghffM

Right now finishing the shore waves

[grave sundial]

where tsunami?

[mighty patrol]

Soon

[grave sundial]

™️

[mighty patrol]

Actually something I brought up to main dev

He wants to add it

[halcyon silo]

nice choice of music

but looks pretty good actually

[mighty patrol]

Felt like it was dancing w/ the waves nicely

That and the foam

[halcyon silo]

yeah, it's definitely believable. For absolute max realisim, I felt like the physics on the water was slightly off, but it's a minor point

[mighty patrol]

Yeah that's on the git issues

[grave sundial]

where's crazy woman taking selfie and falling off the mountainside into the water?

[mighty patrol]

In p2 of the setup

[grave sundial]

™️

[mighty patrol]

Also scary, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7h6kUNlC6cs

Don't often share ltt but this is popular power supply apparently

[naive cloak]

I prefer to buy dangerous PSU than watching LTT

[mighty patrol]

Hell yeah

[grave sundial]

Every PC deserves some fiery vfx on occasion.

[naive cloak]

also I am pretty sure all tech youtubers will make video about it, they all release same videos anyway...

[mighty patrol]

Pretty much

If anyone Gamers Nexus will

[naive cloak]

its like there is someone in charge who tells them what videos they should make

[mighty patrol]

Big tech

[naive cloak]

now they all overclock 5070

[naive cloak]

WD HDD 10TB black cost 200$ on Amazon.com

[mighty patrol]

Sale?

[naive cloak]

-23%

[orchid iron]

Luckily I have a seasonic PSU, and no one uses that because of how niche and small the brand is, so I am safe!

[grave sundial]

Everyone, buy seasonic PSUs NAOW! 😛

[orchid iron]

https://youtube.com/shorts/tFv8agYVpiU?si=55vbBs6zW4vL9Xgh

Makes sense now

[mighty patrol]

LTT shills seasonic

Lol

[median marsh]

i think they are pretty big actually, since they also supply the OEM market

got my 2nd seasonic PSU in this system, and i can't complain about them, never had issues

[orchid iron]

Ikr

[nova pumice]

Hi My ue mates

I need suggestions on pc buildup

Can Anyone tell me which ram is better.
Gskill trident or Corsair Vengeance.

[median marsh]

i would pick corsair

2/6 of my gskill sticks had issues

[wise elbow]

there wont be any difference assuming the speed and timings are the same

the actual memory is made by the same 3 companies

[wise elbow]

im pretty sure most of these pc tech youtubers all communicate pretty heavily in the background, so not surprising that a lot of their videos end up being similar

i dont know of anyone other than ltt though thats pretty actively making videos on PSU quality

they have a 2nd channel that is just PSU videos. the videos are pretty low quality but informative

[orchid iron]

There is cybenetics which has info about PSUs I didn't know I wanted

Btw, I just finished upgrading my laptop ( I didn't even know I could do that up until a few days ago ) y'all wanna know the thermal paste and battery state after years of usage without being swapped?

[wise elbow]

lol im sure it was awful

i repasted my 6 yr old laptop and replaced the battery recently

paste was turned to dust and the battery was like 30% capacity

[median marsh]

there are different grades of the chips they sell tho

and some companies may cheap out on lower grades

there's even a whole black market where chips which didn't met the specs are sold

[orchid iron]

@wise elbow basically non existent paste on the GPU

The 3d photo is after I cleaned it

4th is before xD

[wise elbow]

he was being cooked 😦

[nova pumice]

Ohkay. Thank you.

[nova pumice]

Ohkay. Thank you.

[orchid iron]

That copy paste lol

[grave sundial]

I'd recommend the Corsair.

I am using 32x2 Vengeance sticks and I had absolutely zero problems with them.

Setting the AMD OC profile was a cinch and they have been operating at 6000MHz for several months now.

[nova pumice]

Ohkay. Thanks .

[grave sundial]

My Clevo workstation has exactly the same copper plate.

Gripping it while cleaning is a bit delicate; otherwise, great stuff.

[north arch]

just pick the one that works best with your other rgb lighting tools

[grave sundial]

we should have cmyk lighting tools.

[north arch]

cym I get (but it won't work for reasons), but how do you do k light?

[grave sundial]

Kryptonite

[orchid iron]

Compiling unreal engine 5.5.4 after reposting, let's see the temps

[orchid iron]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eGx_T8zCkWc

Man, real world prices from US, EU and Australia, now that's based content

[wise elbow]

overall sucks

i just want a gpu

[orchid iron]

https://m.youtube.com/shorts/yQUQg8xAmxo

[grave sundial]

I just realised that I COULD put a THIRD fan on the left side of my Thermal Assassin dual tower air cooler.

I don't NEED it, but I COULD install one. Now that I realise I CAN, I feel strangely motivated to waste money on an expensive fan.

[orchid iron]

A man of culture

[wise elbow]

just buy another like 5 dollar fan

you probably wont get much benefit from it though

[grave sundial]

Correct, Lab. The culture demands it.

But, I shall resist and cultivate myself in silicon purity.

[orchid iron]

We need to see a triple fan CPU cooler, ignore the engineers that say it would be like a 5% difference, we need to have it

[grave sundial]

🤔 You are tempting me with a YT video, fully aware that I might bite for the sake of my channel.

Clever.

[orchid iron]

Alright, unreal engine 5.5.4 has finished compiling with my CPU the 6700HQ with 16gb of ram!!!

It took 6 hours

[grave sundial]

Urf.

[orchid iron]

The temps never went above 75°C and mostly stayed in the 50-60 range

[grave sundial]

Why haven't you upgraded the RAM yet? Is it soldered or something?

[orchid iron]

My laptop ram is already maxed out

It is ddr3

[grave sundial]

Ooof.

[orchid iron]

No, lddr3

[grave sundial]

I figured it was something like that.

[orchid iron]

Dude that's fine, compared to before where I was worried because it would hit 95°C while compiling

Freaking over 25°C drop and the fans don't even spin at 100% anymore

[grave sundial]

General AI says that CPU's temps under load generally stay around 80C.

So, unless you had zero cooling, had crappy thermal paste, and blocked all your vents, you wouldn't reach 95C.

[orchid iron]

Sounds like BS to me, remember, thermal paste was basically nothing and there was thicc dust build ups in the vents

[grave sundial]

But, you cleaned everything before this test, right?

[orchid iron]

Yeah, now it is way better, haven't hit 80°C since the clean up

[grave sundial]

Well yeah. That tracks.

It's normal for that CPU.

[orchid iron]

Also, I set my hardware display to show max temps not average

[grave sundial]

Average is for the average.
Max is where the culture is.

But yeah, even my i7 Skylake never went above 70C when the laptop was clean.

When it wasn't, it'd reach 80C and I'd just clean it up.

---

Why haven't you purchased a Strix laptop yet?

[orchid iron]

Also, it is currently a normal 15°C in my room, so that may help

[orchid iron]

I have a 3000€ pc in parts on my other table remember

[grave sundial]

Oh yeah!

I forgot about that.

When will it be assembled?

[naive cloak]

only 3000€?

[orchid iron]

When the grounding situation is resolved

[grave sundial]

Why is that taking so long?

It's been a while no?

[orchid iron]

Legal process always take ages to resolve

But the actual work will be short

[grave sundial]

Legal?

[orchid iron]

Me Vs landlord

[grave sundial]

Are you trying to siphon power from an old granny's basement?

Ah, just an old fart's socket.

And for some reason, he doesn't want earthing in his power sockets?

[orchid iron]

Once that's done zen6 will be out

[orchid iron]

The grid wasn't changed since 1970

[grave sundial]

Intewesting.

I hope you get it done soon.

[orchid iron]

Should be this year, unless court appeal

[grave sundial]

Send me that money, please.

[orchid iron]

But I got a bigger project going on

[grave sundial]

One that doesn't involve lawyers?

🙏

[orchid iron]

Van life

[grave sundial]

Can you get earthing in a van?

[orchid iron]

If I stop somewhere then put a copper rod in the ground then yes

So now I'm doing FreeCAD to make a custom chassis part in order to make my GPU no die during off-road

[grave sundial]

🤔 You should 3D print an aquaman copper trident and have it suspended from your van on the outside.

The bottom tip should just graze the road, so that it remains in contact with it as you drive, but doesn't damage it.

Mobile earthing.

[orchid iron]

Hmm, maybe

Man, seeing 65°C on my max CPU temps while compiling my project brings a tear to my eye

Had to disassemble the whole laptop and unplug so many wires because Dell, but it was worth it

[grave sundial]

Yeah, that's pretty much how you maintain those things.

Regular cleaning. 😄

[orchid iron]

Alright now shader compilation, CPU usage is at 100% let's see how the temps go

[orchid iron]

Regularly cleaning that thing ain't possible, once every 4 years maybe xD

[grave sundial]

If there're vents on the bottom and at the rear of the laptop, you COULD use a strong blower every now and then on either end.

I did that every now and then with my laptop. It helps unclog the vents.

Not a thorough cleaning, but it helps.

[orchid iron]

I risk spinning the fans and since the laptop is ungrounded just straight up killing it

[grave sundial]

Just how much of a bad shape are the fans in?

Are they wobbling and breaking apart?

[orchid iron]

Nah, they are fine, somehow, but I could replace them if they break

[grave sundial]

Then, the occasional blower will be fine.

[orchid iron]

Don't they generate electricity?

[grave sundial]

The fans?

[orchid iron]

Yeah, saw somewhere they could if spun too fast

[grave sundial]

I never had a problem using my blower on them.

And I used it at max power. 😄

You can use a lower power setting.

[orchid iron]

Idk then, I have cans of compressed air so a bit hard to do that xD

[grave sundial]

Get a blower made in China, mate.

They're CHEAP and GOOD.

I've had mine for YEARS now. Still in GREAT shape.

[orchid iron]

Imma do that once these cans run out

[grave sundial]

Plus, some of these blowers have a dual vacuum function.

I figured out that mine has one the last time I used it.

I had never realised that swapping the tubes on them reversed the function from blowing to vacuum. 😄

[orchid iron]

That could be handy in a van life

[grave sundial]

Indweed.

[orchid iron]

Wow even compiling shaders the CPU doesn't heat up at all

[grave sundial]

Yeah. You have a nice CPU.

[orchid iron]

Heck ya!

[agile lodge]

"more you buy, more you safe" now seems also "more you buy more you make" Jensen Huang

[grave sundial]

Yes, for the few. It's the principle of consumption driving consumption making money. Sadly, it'll never work for everyone.

It's akin to taking a loan to pay a loan, to pay a loan, to pay a loan. You'll always end up with a shortage without another source of income.

BUT, the peeps up there don't care about the peeps down here. So....

---

That being said, I read a report about AMD selling MANY GPUs in Japan. Apparently, they are doing very well over there, mainly because of the price point I think.

Good for AMD.

[pseudo cobalt]

anyone know how much of a difference an 8 core vs 16 core cpu, for example a 9800X3D vs a 9950X3D would make for certain operations/calculations? working with meshes over a certain polycount painfully slow on my current setup, like doing modelling tool operations like boolean/deform etc.

wondering how much of this kind of stuff is multithreaded
saw benchmarks for compiling, shader comp and light baking. but couldnt find anything on the stuff above

[tough owl]

AMD is cooking some sleeper iGPUs

[plush turret]

is this a decent drive or are they known to have problems? https://www.amazon.com/WD_BLACK-SN850X-Internal-Gaming-Solid/dp/B0B7CQ2CHH

[mighty patrol]

High-end

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1B27_j9NDPU3cNlj2HKcrfpJKHkOf-Oi1DbuuQva2gT4/edit?gid=0#gid=0

Nerd list if you want it

[wise elbow]

ive heard good things about them

[orchid iron]

I thought this was a GPU thing ngl, when you do these operations did you have task manager open and did the CPU usage rate went up? Also did cores get used at 100% or are they all more or less evenly used?

[halcyon silo]

I mean, a true nerd just knows every single spec off by heart 😆

[mighty patrol]

Too much nowadays for that

[halcyon silo]

As far as I'm aware with modelling it's almost entirely CPU bound as it's got to calculate the vertex points. However, any rendering then goes on the GPU. If you're doing modelling, do NOT get AMD, the productivity performance of AMD CPUs is significantly less then that of Intel, it's just not a debate. I would recommend a 14900K as they're relatively cost effective.

Also consider how much RAM you have, high vertex counts results in a huge amount of RAM usage, and if you start running out, it's going to have a massive performance impact, far worse then any CPU bottleneck

[halcyon silo]

nah

I take time to memorise all the latest hardware, and understand the naming schemes of businesses to be able to work out anything I don't know

like the name of a 14900K says soo much, I wouldn't need benchmarks even if I'd never really paid attention to it before

[mighty patrol]

Depends all what you think you need to know.

[halcyon silo]

I need to know everything 😅

[mighty patrol]

Just follow gamers nexus he usually covers "most" stuff

[halcyon silo]

yeah, not good advice

[mighty patrol]

lol

[halcyon silo]

you should listen to actual IT professionals, rather then influencers

[mighty patrol]

Obviously take things w/ a grain of salt

Cross reference

Idk many w/ IT professionals on call

[halcyon silo]

when it's my job to research things for businesses, to basically recommend multi-thousand dollar budgets, I kinda know what I'm talking about

whether people agree with me is not important. The fact remains, Intel is better all-round then AMD, "stability" issues are all caused by the MOBOs, Nvidia is always superior to AMD, might be more expensive, but the performance is better, the power efficiency is better, and the software is better

[mighty patrol]

Maybe one day amd mobos will be top tier

[halcyon silo]

the problem with the influencers is they say whatever their audiences thinks is true so they get views

[mighty patrol]

Well ofc

[halcyon silo]

and they generally seem to collude & follow the same narrative

[mighty patrol]

They want more $

They gotta shill

But they do cover general topics

and the tech itself

[halcyon silo]

so the whole Intel shaming they've been doing is hugely misinforming, and they just make things up

Intel is still going to remain top dog because the professional space is 99% Intel powered, and that's actually the majority of money

[mighty patrol]

For now.

[halcyon silo]

it's not changing any time soon

AMD is so far behind in productivity

[mighty patrol]

But as long as intel is being accused of crashing game devs pcs

[halcyon silo]

it doesn't

[mighty patrol]

Then they will continue to be avoided for certain applications

Well

[halcyon silo]

game devs in large studios are absolutely fine

[mighty patrol]

Some sure

If they updated bios

or didn't do crazy overclocks

[halcyon silo]

if they actually just changed back the bios defaults to intel defaults

the issue is the mobo pushing wayy to much voltage to the CPU, ignoring the intel specs

[mighty patrol]

But you have to remember

How many don't do many of these things

When devs have to warn their users lol, https://wccftech.com/game-devs-add-game-warnings-for-gamers-running-intel-13th-14th-gen-cpus/

Apple also moved away from intel

Years ago

So 🤷

[halcyon silo]

well here's the thing with components, if bought individually (personal builds), each manufactuere is individually responsible, so mobos have no reason to protect the CPU, they simply seek to make it seem that their boards give the best performance. In prebuilts, the OEM is responsible, so they actually adhere to the specs, and no issues arise

[halcyon silo]

that was many years ago, around the 10th gen. And they did it so they could lock Apple hardware to their ecosystem. You can't run anything other then MacOS on apple now

nothing about the actual CPUs

[mighty patrol]

Just another reason for them to be anti-consumer really

[halcyon silo]

absolutely & complete rubbish

[halcyon silo]

that's apple's motto

[mighty patrol]

My issue w/ intel is the vulnerability side

If you compare on cve they have a lot more

Might not mean much to some people.

[halcyon silo]

they're not inherintly more vulnerable then AMD or any other CPU

[mighty patrol]

Only 1700

[halcyon silo]

wdym?

LGA1700?

[mighty patrol]

https://www.cvedetails.com/vendor/238/

Total cves

Makes me not want anything to do with them

It's not as bad as it was

Sure

But over time

1721

[halcyon silo]

I'll read that through, but I feel most of it is scaremongering

[mighty patrol]

Compared to amd with 281

[halcyon silo]

how about the fact that AMD consistantly promises about 5x more then they deliver?

[mighty patrol]

I mean....

[halcyon silo]

like Zen5 was supposed to be this amazing new platform, and it barely delivered 8% more performance over Zen4

[mighty patrol]

Nvidia keeps selling us performance that is just software so.

All the tech companies are shady af

[halcyon silo]

it's still performance

[mighty patrol]

Not native

[halcyon silo]

so?

[mighty patrol]

Not worth

[halcyon silo]

the rendering methods are changing

[mighty patrol]

The inflationary price

[halcyon silo]

well you're going to have to get used to that. 1 inflation happens. 2 raster wasn't always the norm, it was new at one point

[mighty patrol]

Guess we will see if Intel dethrones nvidia

One can hope

[halcyon silo]

and like I think we concluded the other day, we're reaching the physical limits of hardware

it won't happen

all of these people on social media you realise is like 1% of the customer base, so Nvidia really doesn't care

[mighty patrol]

Can always change if all of the sudden Nvidia can't get their hands on rare metals

and China cuts off all trade w/ usa

[halcyon silo]

objectively, as a professional, I can only state the raw facts, which is AMD is not ideal, it's performance is always worse in productivity, which is the main use of all businesses. Same for GPUs.

Personally, I have a pet peeve with these influencers, so I'm quite eloquent on this topic when we're debating which is better

I mean China's gov won't last much longer

they're going bankrupt so fast

[mighty patrol]

So many are

[halcyon silo]

true

[mighty patrol]

Yet somehow seems to not matter

[halcyon silo]

they can't hide it forever

[mighty patrol]

They try

They seem to hide the fires quite well

and the ruin nation

[halcyon silo]

soon it will all catch up and they're going to come tumbling down. Yeah, they certainly do, but it's slowly stopping working

so yes, I've got something to do now, so I will need to go

[mighty patrol]

Just gotta hope for Taiwans continued freedom

[halcyon silo]

yeah

good that Intel is making new foundries, soon it won't only be Taiwan

[mighty patrol]

Shouts out TSMC

[grave sundial]

https://www.indiatoday.in/technology/reviews/story/amd-ryzen-ai-9-hx-370-processor-review-all-about-power-2695255-2025-03-19
HX 370.... still in laptops only.

😠

[mighty patrol]

It likely only will be

They have an AI mobo for threadrippers

[halcyon silo]

? Having foundries outside of TSMC is good surely? Less of a monopoly?

[grave sundial]

Radeon RX 9070 OEM screenie.

[mighty patrol]

Yeah ofc

But why let someone else make semiconductors

[halcyon silo]

no reason to not

[mighty patrol]

Ah but the greed of man is unmeasurable

[halcyon silo]

so, make a competition

[mighty patrol]

Not like their methods and tools to do so are exactly something common people can start up.

[grave sundial]

You can buy a Ford in any colour you want, so long as it is black.

Bless Henry Ford.

MINE, MINE, MINE! ✊

[halcyon silo]

no, so a bigger company that can do it (in this case Intel) is, surely good?

[mighty patrol]

Nope we should go back to using simple computers

[grave sundial]

--- the Blackwell Ultra family of accelerators boasts up to 15 petaFLOPS of dense 4-bit floating-point performance and up to 288 GB of HBM3e memory per chip. ---

Okay, so, this'd probably cost a kidney, a heart, and both lungs, no?

[mighty patrol]

https://www.wired.com/story/unbelievable-zombie-comeback-analog-computing/

[mighty patrol]

Hope so

[halcyon silo]

no, when you're a corporate, it's not much

[orchid iron]

userbenchmark alt account found

[unreal ledge]

hi, I am planning to buy the RX 9070 XT for unreal, will it work for maya and zbrush as well ?

[grave sundial]

It's 50% better than my 4060ti. So yes, it'll work for those software too.

AMD also has a 20GB 7900XT video card out though.

Check the prices and see if that's better for you.

[unreal ledge]

i see, thank you. RX 9070 XT and 7900XT have the same pricing at here as well

[grave sundial]

The 4GB extra video memory will be nice for Unreal.

Just remember that in terms of raytracing, NVidia is better than AMD at the moment (which doesn't matter if you aren't planning on using RT much).

Other than that, Radeon is great.

[unreal ledge]

i see, if it work with maya and zburh then it's great. I will spend the extra money on ram and ssd

[orchid iron]

yup

[unreal ledge]

yes, i am so glad, the nividia option so expensive. i am gonna die

[agile lodge]

https://youtu.be/UaGFUtqravQ

[orchid iron]

petaflops just sounds so funny

so many flops

also if anyone is wondering, the 20 cpu cores are in a 10p + 10e core configuration

[orchid iron]

for real, here in europe, the 5090 is around 5000€, I thought the marketing name shouldn't be the price of the thing xD

[halcyon silo]

Nope, I only hear a brainwashed gamer here. I'm not saying AMD CPUs don't have their place, just that Intel is just as good of an option most of the time, and is definitely better in productivity

[orchid iron]

define the budget, because last I checked, threadrippers are the leaders

also "brainwashed gamer" is so funny of an insult ngl xD

[halcyon silo]

uhh, well then you're going against all the ethos of AMD gamers. Those make the Nvidia pricing look cheap

[orchid iron]

yeah, of course

[halcyon silo]

and sure, in multicore they might be more powerful, but only because they've like 96 cores & draw an insane amount of power. If Intel did that in their next CPU your crowd would be all over it saying they didn't put in any work, they just crammed more cores in

[orchid iron]

the funny thing is, their 14900k can draw as much as most threadrippers

[agile lodge]

https://press.asus.com/news/press-releases/asus-introduces-ascent-gx-10-ai-supercomputer-powered-by-nvidia-gb-10-grace-blackwell-superchip/

[orchid iron]

Intel is doing a brand new tile based cpu generation because they were forced to by amd, monolithic cpus are just not able to keep up with chiplet design

[halcyon silo]

they were never forced by AMD

they're bigger

and they've got a bigger more stable market

[agile lodge]

intel need 3d memory tiles

[orchid iron]

cough cough, the 4 core era by intel

[halcyon silo]

so? 4 cores is actually plenty sufficient for most tasks even now

[orchid iron]

yeah? So? Doesn't stop people from wanting more than 4 cores xD

[halcyon silo]

well then they can buy the more expensive versions, or make their own

Intel did make more core CPUs so why are you fussing?

[orchid iron]

since when I'm fussing about only having 4 cores?

[halcyon silo]

by mentioning it as a big issue?

[orchid iron]

oh btw, I saw you spread misinformation, you mentioned how the whole intel rapid degradation was due to OEM and BIOSes, technically they didn't improve the issue, Intel themselfs admitted their micro code, that they make and share to all the bioses, was what caused elevated voltages that increased degradation

[orchid iron]

nah, I mentioned the 4 core era because it was ended after amd's ryzen series came out, odd coincidence

[halcyon silo]

No, absolutely incorrect. I've had to deal with plenty of these hardware generation, and it's absolutely to do with the BIOS

[orchid iron]

yes, and intel's micro code

[halcyon silo]

as even the influencers admitted (some of them) the bios was feeding the CPU wayy more voltage then it needed or was built for. Idling at like 1.5V is insane

[halcyon silo]

barely anything to do with it. The microcode updates were released in conjunction with a bios update, so primarily forcing the bios to respect factory specs

[orchid iron]

oh yeah, 1.5V at idle is insane, and intel did nothing about it until people complained

[halcyon silo]

how are they supposed to know what the board partners are doing with their products until people do complain?

[orchid iron]

to respect "factory recommendations" that were never inforced for years

[halcyon silo]

and how complex do you think the legal situation is? To force them to make changes to their products is a delicate legal process to get right

otherwise how do you explain how not a single OEM PC of that generation failed above average? Obviously not an inherint issue with the hardware, obviously a settings issue. 90% of issues are all software based

[orchid iron]

idk, amd is harsh on their board partners, now we know why, they'll all try to push the products to their max, and it benefitted intel quite a bit

[halcyon silo]

well it's not really helped them considering how many 9800X3D & 9900X3D etc. are being burned out

[orchid iron]

would of never happened if they weren't obsessed with driving more and more power directly or inderctly (letting oem and board partners overclock)

[halcyon silo]

I mean you were so eager to jump on Intel, what are you going to do with AMD & their failing CPUs?

[orchid iron]

you mean the few that rarely burned out? last I checked the situation wasn't as widespread as blasting 1.5v in the cpus

[halcyon silo]

well they aren't are they? They make a product & give it the safe operating specs, OEMs respect that, board partners don't

[halcyon silo]

umm yeah it seems to be nearly as widespread

[orchid iron]

I'm still on intel and nvidia idk what you are talking about

[orchid iron]

cough cough, over 400 watts that people joke about being hard to cool

[halcyon silo]

you see the issue is that people won't say anything when it works, but they'll fuss when it doesn't. So given that Intel has a much larger market share, then it's clear that the vast majority of CPUs were working, and just a few unfortunate degenerates who spend their entire time gaming or benchmarking their CPUs were upset

[orchid iron]

"few unfortunate degenerates" lmao

[halcyon silo]

most of the population doesn't give a f**k about your crowd's pov, and they're not going to ever, because it's a nonissue you're making a fuss about

[orchid iron]

would you saw they are "Neanderthals"

[halcyon silo]

who?

[orchid iron]

yeah, because they ask tech savy people which is best cpu, and if the niche tech savy people all say ryzen is better, then most will likely buy ryzen

[halcyon silo]

except they won't, because people who are actually working in IT (and are true IT professionals, not shop assistants) all know that there's no actuall issue with Intel inheriently and know exactly what you need to do to avoid it. Additionally, they won't have a choice if OEMs don't manufacture personal & business machines with Ryzen, and why should they? They're so much worse then Intel at the same price for productivity

[orchid iron]

the 9800x3D and 9950x3D launches both made them be amazon #1 best seller, meanwhile intel's 15th gen (ultra core 200 series) ain't there

[halcyon silo]

So? You realise this isn't helping you? Amazon ISN'T where businesses go, and it isn't where the average citizen goes. Only a few people actually build their own machines

[orchid iron]

there is no issues with xeons, that's for sure, but 13th and 14th gen? Their failure rates are way higher than 12th gen

[halcyon silo]

maybe so, but that isn't entirely due to the CPU itself, and it's not a significant amount higher. We're still talking like a few percent. The chances of it happening to you are very slight

[orchid iron]

yeah, in the short term it'll be fine :D

[halcyon silo]

you also realise with Xeons, there's a lot more control & enforcing of factory specs

[halcyon silo]

even long term

[orchid iron]

yup

[halcyon silo]

I've been using 13th gen for a long time now, still no issues

[orchid iron]

what settings and what model?

[halcyon silo]

I use my own overclock specs which are primarily aimed at reducing power consumption, I prefer higher performance per watt. Also prioritising multithreaded long term performance over high singlecore instant performance, so technically slower in games, but it makes it insane in productivity

13700 is one of my machines

13900K is another

[orchid iron]

there you go, that's why you were spared

[halcyon silo]

13450HX

[halcyon silo]

yeah reducing it from the overpowered bios defaults that are suicidal

but as you just admitted the issue isn't in the CPU, it's in the firmware

[orchid iron]

yup, if I had those even before the information spreading, I'd have done the same

[halcyon silo]

NO CPU ON EARTH WILL ENJOY HAVING MORE VOLTAGE SHOVED DOWN IT'S THROAT THEN IT CAN HANDLE

[orchid iron]

yup, it is all mostly a software issue...Cause by Intel and their board partners that intel is supposed to manage

[halcyon silo]

the issue is far to many people just took it at face value

[halcyon silo]

technically it's up to us to ensure the settings are all correct

but yes, I would agree that Intel should have managed them better

but I also want to give them leeway as the legal side of it is incredibly complex. According to all the people involved in that kind of work, I've heard that it's a delicate situation to keep relations good

[orchid iron]

no normal person would go through each and every setting to tweak and make sure some specific value don't go over a specific value

[orchid iron]

wdym? they were the top dogs!!! They had all the leeway they wanted

[halcyon silo]

that's why the mobos should come with an Intel default profile (so it's easy to change to), but should really be Intel defaults by default

[halcyon silo]

right, OK then, so where is the bycotting justice for AMD? They've consistantly overpromised & underdelivered by like 5x every generation of Ryzen. Zen5 was a disaster, we got barely 5% uplifts, and most of that from more cores/power

it's been years now that they've been pulling the same stunt, promising the world, and giving you an apartment

they even did it with the RX9000 launch, at least Nvidia delivered what they promised

[orchid iron]

Zen5% was quite funny ngl, but this gen was mostly focused in the enhanced 3DV-cache so it makes sense

[halcyon silo]

cost is a whole other ball game, that in the end isn't the manufacturers problem

[halcyon silo]

I hadn't heard that one, but it is funny

[orchid iron]

yeah, they promised large stock, gpus that wouldn't melt, the 5070 matching the 4090 and what else?

oh yeah, AI

[halcyon silo]

well it's an awful long time, and a heck of a lot more money they're charging more for marginal increases in most of the CPUs

[orchid iron]

they always pull the "launch overpriced, lower prices overtime"

[halcyon silo]

GPUs don't melt if installed correctly, the 5070 does match the 4090 in-game performance most of the time (ensure you're using the entire product Nvidia provides, which means DLSS & FG). And AI is the future whether you like it or not, so the AI performance is going to be increasingly overpowered

[halcyon silo]

except RX9000 was expensive at launch (same price as Nvidia), and now is only going up

as soon as Nvidia gets stock in, it's going to sell better because AMD isn't offering a price bonus

tbh I'd like to get my hands on a 5060Ti when they launch

[orchid iron]

"GPUs don't melt if installed correctly" yeah, as some tested proper installation isn't enough

[halcyon silo]

would be nice to replace one of my 4060s

[orchid iron]

the 9070 xt is noticeably cheaper than the 5070 ti

[halcyon silo]

alright, well proper installation both of power and PCI, and proper quality cables, and proper pins on the board, and proper PSU supply??? It's just basics, make sure everything works then it won't melt. On a 5090 there isn't leeway for poorly manufactured parts, because it's so high powered

[halcyon silo]

not by much, and esp. not now with the prices going up

not like it is more powerful though

[orchid iron]

excuse me, have you checked real world prices? If you have 5070 tis not being that higher than 9070xts I'm interested

[halcyon silo]

overclocked it can only just reach base performance of a 5070Ti, then overclock the 5070Ti & turn on DLSS, and sent the FG to 4x, and it's out of the 9070XTs league

[orchid iron]

AI is just the new ray tracing, it isn't the end all be all, it is just a new feature the GPUs can use, but the most important remains just raw computation power

[halcyon silo]

not much cheaper

[halcyon silo]

not now, AI is set to become the new rendering technique. It will be interesting to see how long raster stays as the primary rendering technique

[orchid iron]

oh hella nah, nvm, that's way too much xD

[halcyon silo]

I imagine it won't be too long until the new AI rendering piplines comes

[halcyon silo]

I'd consider it, it wouldn't be too much if I sold my current GPU

[orchid iron]

AI rendering sounds like fancy way of saying matrix calculation

[halcyon silo]

but the question really is, do I need it? Not really

[halcyon silo]

if it's faster, then who cares?

[orchid iron]

true, but not if it is 5 times more expensive for double perf

[halcyon silo]

considered inflation?

and cost of labour etc.

[mighty cosmos]

Well neural rendering (cooperative vectors) aka access to tensor hardware and inline model inference inside the raster pipeline is becoming an official part of the directx api

[halcyon silo]

thank you

[orchid iron]

excuse me, but this is just ignored, inflation doesn't multiply by 5 times last time I checked

[halcyon silo]

it still weakens the ecconomy though, and that can have major unseen effects

[orchid iron]

so? we are talking about hardware, not global economy

[halcyon silo]

it's still not a thing you should ignore entirely. The sideeffects can have major effects even if it's no the primary effect

[halcyon silo]

hardware prices

[orchid iron]

hardware prices are primarly a result of nvidia and amd maxing out capacity because of how successful ai accelerators are

[mighty cosmos]

Raster won't go anywhere but parts of it will start getting accelerated by ML models

Like the neural materials that basically allow you to take a movie grade shader, bake it down into an ml model and executes for a fraction of the cost the actual shader would

[halcyon silo]

that would also probably be true, but since when did AMD supply AI datacenter chips? Maybe to the smaller projects that Nvidia isn't interested in

[halcyon silo]

that's probably true, as raster is what makes 3D into 2D, which we're still going to need

[median marsh]

as long as nvidia probably

[orchid iron]

since it started? they aren't a big part, but ROCm is still somewhat helpful if business don't want to spend more on nvidia, plus their epyc is where they use up most of their tsmc capacity

[grave sundial]

Here, the 9070 XT OC 16GB is just $1,000.

[median marsh]

and not every gpu accelerated application needs the amount of performance that nvidia offers

[orchid iron]

way too much still xD

[grave sundial]

Aye, but cheaper than 5070ti

[halcyon silo]

true, but then you could get like a 5060, far far cheaper

[halcyon silo]

but also nowhere near the performance

[median marsh]

i'm more thinking of science simulations, etc.

[orchid iron]

8gb for 600 bucks soudns miserable

[median marsh]

AI isn't everything they are used for

[orchid iron]

based

[median marsh]

it's just the most hyped sector... (probably with the least value)

[halcyon silo]

stop obessing on the VRAM, 8GB is more then enough for 1080p gaming, which is where the 5060 is targetted towards

if you want to play 1440p, you buy that grade of card, so a 5070 or above

[orchid iron]

8gb is enough lmao

[median marsh]

it's true

i've played minecraft on a 512MB GPU for months

[mighty cosmos]

The problem is amds software ecosystem is so abysmal compared to cuda that amd is often an afterthought when it comes to ML

Pretty much any new research, model, etc... is always first developed for cuda and then some poor soul does the amd implementation

[halcyon silo]

I was gonna say, I have like 3 UE editors open, on Cinematic on my 4060 at it's more then enough

[median marsh]

than

[halcyon silo]

that's why I will never buy AMD, they can't do anything productivity related at the same price point as Nvidia or Intel, it's surprising, I'd have thought they would have improved by now, but no.

[median marsh]

i'm pretty sure they sell a lot of CPUs for productivity related activities

[halcyon silo]

they're not as good as Intel

heck the 14900K outperforms the 7800X3D by 3x

[mighty cosmos]

Well for the consumer market amd is good, their CPUs consumer and professional are great

What sucks is their gpu compute ecosystem
Compared to cuda it's a joke

[halcyon silo]

and it's only about 4% slower across most games

[orchid iron]

since when would you use 7800x3D for productivity?

[mighty cosmos]

That's just not true
I would have a real hard time recommending intel to anyone these days

[halcyon silo]

I disagree on CPUs, they still lag far behind Intel for productivity, but I agree with the GPUs

[mighty cosmos]

That's just not true

[median marsh]

wth 😄

[halcyon silo]

then I think you would not know enough

[mighty cosmos]

Lmao ok

[halcyon silo]

I would hope I know what I'm talking about when I've memorised the specs for every single CPU, GPU, RAM, storage, mobo, wifi, etc. on the market currently

if it's my job to make hundred-thousand dollar budget recommendations for IT in many businesses I would think I know what I'm talking about

[mighty cosmos]

I would hope I know since I have access to 30+ different amd and intel configs, but what do I know I guess

[halcyon silo]

since the people who claimed AMD is better then Intel at EVERYTHING

[halcyon silo]

that's not much considering the hundreds I've access to

[median marsh]

they are

intel is shit these days, sadly

[halcyon silo]

and I'm working to scale that to thousands, or tens of thousands

[median marsh]

AMD is way more efficient, and offers a wider range of CPUs

[halcyon silo]

quite frankly it isn't. And they're not going anywhere

the professional market will remain using Intel, and so they will still have a market share

[mighty cosmos]

Man what the hell are you even talking about

[halcyon silo]

gaming & such related stuff is tiny by comparison

[median marsh]

By the end of 2022, Threadripper Pro processors owned 95% of the market share, whereas the remaining 5% went to Xeon chips.

[halcyon silo]

if I say am responsible for recommending & then implementing a hardware solution of say 200K for a company, that's quite a few machines, then make that several companies. And I'm hoping to get permission to start a leasing programme, which would by many thousands of of PCs

[median marsh]

https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/amd-records-its-highest-server-market-share-in-decades-but-intel-fights-back-in-client-pcs

[halcyon silo]

by what standard?

[median marsh]

by reasonable business decisions

[mighty cosmos]

According to your bio you are 17
And that has nothing to do with reality

[halcyon silo]

if I were Intel at this point, all I'd care about is the personal market (so OEMs), businesses desktop/laptops, and the likes of Azure, GC, or AWS

[median marsh]

so pretty much all cpu markets...

[halcyon silo]

doesn't mean I can't have several years working at a big IT company?

[mighty cosmos]

Yeah... No

[halcyon silo]

well I have

since 2022

and now I make a recommendation for a project, like put it together, and then a mentor/supervisor reviews it & approves it

[orchid iron]

I'm telling you guys, this guy is userbenchmark's alt account

[mighty cosmos]

Listen... I'm talking from a professional perspective, what's commonly used in the industry by other professionals and my own experience, not pulling facts out of thin air because I prefer one company over the other

[halcyon silo]

I also presented a product plan for leasing that was approved of by the execs, but they don't have the finances to dispose at the scale I want yet, so they're working on it a bit slower

[mighty cosmos]

And now I'm out since this is pointless

[orchid iron]

Intel is by far way better than intel...Before ryzen, and from then they kept catching up, are you sure your info isn't outdated?

[halcyon silo]

well like I'm saying the gaming market (dev or otherwise) is very small compared to everything else

[mighty cosmos]

What is "everything else"

[median marsh]

intel is way better than intel... that's the conclussion of this discussion

well said Lab 😛

[halcyon silo]

umm, maybe the litterally millions of office machines that all use Intel? I've not seen an AMD based OEM in any office for a long time, and even when I did, it was like 1 - 100 intel

[orchid iron]

better than amd* but way funnier yeah

[mighty cosmos]

Intel right now is doing real mighty job at shipping busted microcode slowly degrading their CPUs

[halcyon silo]

and then personal laptops/desktops, but it's more like 1 - 5 in AMD

[halcyon silo]

AGGHH, how many times do I have to educate people. IT'S NOT THE MICROCODE

[median marsh]

because intel was long time far better than AMD

[mighty patrol]

Aren't those using mostly outdated cpus like 12th gen and older?

[mighty cosmos]

Need numbers, he/she said means nothing

[median marsh]

and they have a good reputation and can supply the demand

[mighty patrol]

Literally every place i've worked has used outdated hardware

[median marsh]

AMD has to use 3rd party for production like TSMC

[halcyon silo]

no, they keep updating it

[mighty patrol]

Right

[halcyon silo]

maybe like every 7y rather then every 3

[mighty patrol]

Just like the government updates their hardware

[halcyon silo]

but still

[mighty patrol]

😂

[median marsh]

updating and downgrading at the same time actually

[mighty patrol]

That's why they get hacked so much

[grave sundial]

Well, based on the CPU market share in Nov, 2024, AMD has gained a few percentage points against Intel. It's around 27-32% against Intels 73-62% and AMD's been gaining steadily every year for the last couple of years at least.

[halcyon silo]

well they do, I've a friend who works there (he's 25 I think?), and apparently they incinerate all hardware after a certain time or with certain info

[grave sundial]

So, personal preferences aside, I don't see why Intel MAY not lose more in the future.

[halcyon silo]

so yes they reguarly have to buy new stuff

[median marsh]

also you can't compare a office PC to some workstation which does heavy loads

[mighty patrol]

For Doge?

Intel won't matter when every home has a quantum pc

[halcyon silo]

as I was saying, and stated multiple times, the issue is the default mobo overlocks pushing rediculous power to the CPU. 1.5V when idling is stupid, so you just need to respect the Intel factory specs & it will all be fine. Like if you overclock a CPU you void the warrenty, so it's a similar situation, and I wonder why it would be like that 😂

[halcyon silo]

xD it's going that way fast

[mighty patrol]

Too fast

It was just a theory it seemed not long ago