but I an't be bothered to print out every node as I'm used to breakpointing these kinds of issues
#game-jam-chat
small fern
maiden loom
yeah, debugging that stuff is a nightmare
small fern
I didn't know then that it would work again after deleting that folder
maiden loom
the worst part is spending hours printing EVERYTHING and discovering the problem isn't you, it's the damned scripting language
(or some other issue, like in your case with the freezes)
small fern
debugging c++ is just so nice in comparison
well, not the engine side but ue4 projects
maiden loom
I do feel like Epic needs a 6 month moratorium on new features and should get this thing stable
small fern
yeh
maiden loom
UE4 has been around for years now, and core features should just freaking work by now
small fern
people felt like that from 4.0 until 4.8 - 4.9 and then they started working more on stability
after 4.11 it seems to have gone more into the old route
maiden loom
stupid issues like the one I ran into today with lightmass have been around for two and a half years, and seem to have caught 30-50 people out - and all it needs is some proper logging
so you actually know what's broken instead of having to crawl through lightmass and the swarm agent stepping through with the debugger
(all it needed to do was report that asset X had an issue, but instead it throws "error code 13" silently in the code and logs nothing)
then there's stuff like trying to attach / teleport rigid bodies and the mesh losing it's parent scene component
or arrays of structs with arrays in them just not working at all
this is the stuff I've encountered only in two weeks
small fern
usually output log is still pretty handy
vs error reports on the other hand tell nothing
scenic venture
UE_LOG everything!
ruby cradle
Hey everyone, I just wanted to post a quick update here. I've made an update to the official September rules to change out a prize
The intel raffle is now for NUC Skull Canyons instead of keyboards and compute sticks. Last months winners will receive these as well, instead of the keyboard/stick.
the NUC is honestly much nicer, but I didn't want to sneak that up on you
tepid light
cool 😃
digital fern
not bad
digital fern
could be way way worse hehe "replace for a 32mb usb memory stick"
maiden loom
I had to look up what that was as I'd never heard of it
it's a neat prize, but it couldn't run anything UE4, hehe
ruby cradle
It's basically a ready-made PC that you just add M.2 SSD, RAM and operating system of their choice.
tepid light
"32mb usb memory stick" - that thing would be hard to find in 2016
ruby cradle
basically that
tepid light
In-home streaming
tepid light
or facebook machine for the family
ruby cradle
The processor is really decent in it, so I'm sure it could be used for a lot. The compute stick was not anywhere near as powerful and not as versatile
digital fern
hehe, mini-light-rebuild-thingy
tepid light
"but will it run Crysis?"
maiden loom
probably not very well
digital fern
if time isnt of concern, it might be interesting to load that off onto it lol
tepid light
i know 😛
scenic venture
so I could like, have ALL 5 seasons of Archer ready to go at any time?!?
maiden loom
5? what year is this?
glass fossil
@ruby cradle very nice! Going to try a second round at doing game jams with the mega jam so make sure to save a few of those~
ruby cradle
@scenic venture in 4k!
maiden loom
I don't think this thing can actually do 4k
ruby cradle
@glass fossil There are a few in the megajam prizes for sure ;D
@maiden loom It says it can on the site: http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/nuc/nuc6i7kyk-gaming-usage-guide.html
glass fossil
@tepid light it'll play Crysis! If you stream from a much stronger seperate pc though 😄
maiden loom
Intel says a lot of things about their graphics hardware
they claim you can run 3 4k displays on this thing at 60hz
tepid light
@ruby cradle Normally, how many people judge gamejam games?
ruby cradle
@tepid light 3: Me, Chance and Jess
maiden loom
which is interesting, because it has a mini display port, an HDMI 3 port and a thunderbolt 3 port
scenic venture
Crysis wasn't really super amazing as much as it was just poorly optimized 😃
ruby cradle
^
tepid light
it was amazing in 2007
ruby cradle
It's gorgeous, but has a terrible memory leak on one of the boss fights
glass fossil
Do you get help when doing the mega jam?
maiden loom
the problem with Crysis, is the engine was originally built with single threaded applications in mind
glass fossil
due to all the extra entries
tepid light
to this day nobody has better tree cutting machanics
maiden loom
Crytek expected processors to get more powerful, but they didn't, they became better at multi-threading
scenic venture
the most fun I had with Crysis was loading up cheat codes, spawning mini nukes and dropping them all over the island. And then getting in a helicopter and having the blades cut down the trees without crashing
glass fossil
procedural mesh slicing = best tree cutting sim ever
tepid light
yea, now we have it. 😃
maiden loom
I want to find something fun to do with mesh slicing, it's such a neat toy
ruby cradle
@glass fossil Allar helps
tepid light
btw. does procedural mash slicing update collision?
scenic venture
@glass fossil totally makes me want to recreate the Crysis island now with procedural mesh slicing
tepid light
@maiden loom Sword fighting!
glass fossil
I'm waiting for someone to show a minimal demo of it being used metal gear rising style 😄
scenic venture
I dunno. Apparently procedural meshes don't get physics applied to them in a cooked build for some reason cause our game jam used that and then we cooked and couldn't get them to work
tepid light
ok, I have a better idea: Salad making simulator 2016
I just need for a gamejam theme to fit 😛
rigid fog
Wow @lapis lichen nice catch... 7million views on that video alone... op
scenic venture
ha, they have Rapunzel as their profile picture. I'm actually going as Flynn Rider this weekend for something
ruby cradle
Hey there Mr Famous over here
rigid fog
@robust basalt 15mil subs on YT...wth https://gyazo.com/f520316deeea1a1eb460c658f3fe18e7
Sup Alex
You guys covering VRHackathon over at Seattle by any chance tomorrow?
I'll be going over there and teaming up with Matt from FMJ and some other folks.
ruby cradle
I started responding to all of those videos with a link to the download of your game, since hardly anyone linked to it
Yeah, it'll be a news item
small fern
oh wow
ruby cradle
Hey 0lento!
small fern
would definitely want that NUC
rigid fog
Yeah, those NUC are pretty neat
small fern
should have focused more on the jam 😄
rigid fog
I wanted to see if anyone has made a Perforce server out of one yet
That would be an awesome little server.
ruby cradle
Oh nice
maiden loom
I'm thinking portable perforce server for stuff like jams
maiden loom
last game jam we did, we took our full size server, haha
ruby cradle
I'd love to see someone do that and write up something about how they're using it
@rigid fog Yeah
rigid fog
Yeah, well, if I win one, or suck it up and buy one, I'll definitely do it.
ruby cradle
I was reading the video descriptions and almost none of them put a link to the actual game
rigid fog
@ruby cradle Do you still need the link to the game?
ruby cradle
I never realized how most streamers only ever link back into their own little loop of sites
rigid fog
http://gamejolt.com/games/highschool-101/180295
https://slapunas.itch.io/highschool-101
not sure which one is really the best to link
ruby cradle
Anyway, it looks awesome and I hope Highschool 101 goes full production and ends up on steam
rigid fog
UE4 July Game Jam entry and finalist
bitter mango
that's cool
small fern
oh hey
bitter mango
I thought we were talking about a random video that got a lot of views all this time
rigid fog
Only reason I am interested, is because I was part of the team 😉
bitter mango
holy shit those are some nice models for a gamejam
glass fossil
whaaaaaa, missed that... 7.4 million views
rigid fog
Slap and Jaki were the bomb
glass fossil
crazy
small fern
@ruby cradle about the procedural mesh slicing, we figured out after the stream that if you do similar setup as on stream, physics would work on editor but not in packaged build 😄
someone had issues with that on this game jam
I also checked the same on my own proc gen mesh slicing experiments I did on previews, opened them in 4.13.0 and packaged version didn't work
ruby cradle
Very strange. I was thinking of just redoing that stream entirely after all that happened
bitter mango
this looks awesome
small fern
we were talking about that stream with @rigid fog
one of the reasons why you had trouble at first getting the pieces to fall off could have been that the chair was big with very little mass, so friction would have won the battle with gravity
that doesn't happen on more solid objects
ruby cradle
Yeah, we figured that one out too later
and Ian looked into some other bits
he really liked your suggestion of using the plane to make it easier
rigid fog
Hehe
ruby cradle
because he was about to start mathing it up
small fern
I actually suggested the plane thing to victor when he was trying to figure it out
glass fossil
unfortunate thing is reading the comments on that video, the comments are all trying to get the attention of the youtuber and hardly anyone is talking about the game. so I wonder how effective it would be for driving traffic combined with the no link thing
rigid fog
After like 5 other ue4 devs came on and tried to help, 0lento op
small fern
all people who have tried to use that have initially thought it's the cut direction
rigid fog
That stream was like 12 hours long lol
small fern
but then you couldn't define the cut angle
on other direction
with plane normal, you just need one direction
ruby cradle
@glass fossil That's what I general don't like about YT's power being controlled by people that feed on that. It's a long philosophical discussion about the way the internet teaches us to seek validation for just having opinions... but I digress to my armchair
rigid fog
Some of the YTers DO have links to the game @ruby cradle @glass fossil
Jacksepticeye did
and his was 2.5mil
rigid fog
Ah
ruby cradle
The whole "big name celebrity YTer" thing throws me off I guess. Like every now and then a new person shows up and everyone knows who they are and I feel old just because I don't know who Leafy is or something
bitter mango
that's my entire world right now
ruby cradle
at least once a week that happens
small fern
heh
and I didn't even know who that swedish guy was when people kept talking about him
I still can't remember his name
ruby cradle
Just tryin' to keep up
rigid fog
@ruby cradle TBH, If it wasn't for my 6 year old, I wouldn'
small fern
pewdiepie?
ruby cradle
PewDiePie?
small fern
yeh, that one
rigid fog
t even know who Jacksepticeye was
glass fossil
same here, only vaguely aware of most of the big streamers/youtubers, the only semi-big youtube team I follow consistently was one that I watched when they started from nothing
rigid fog
Pewdiepie I knew for awhile though
small fern
and he's probably the most known one of them all
ruby cradle
I knew Jack already, funny enough
small fern
I'm not in the loop 😄
scenic venture
I dislike famous YouTubers. Makes everyone think their opinions matter. Back in my days, you were suppose to keep your opinions to yourself!
bitter mango
mostr known by US
rigid fog
It is CRAZY how Let's Players have so much attention
bitter mango
he's last generation for the millennials
scenic venture
I once saw a Kickstarter campaign dedicated to some guy who wanted to become a YouTuber, so he was asking for money to buy a computer, recording device, and so he could quit his job and play games all day
glass fossil
Two Best Friends Play, watched them grow from nothing which was cool, though they're still no where close to pewdipie etc
ruby cradle
@scenic venture There is a whole series of those people on KS, I assure you
like... a lot
scenic venture
It's why I stopped browsing Kickstart :(
glass fossil
they push hard on getting their viewers to actually check out the kickstarters they are playing too
glass fossil
remember like a year ago there was a guy on kickstarter who got a lot of attention who wanted to make a star wars mmo
ruby cradle
I'm just gonna go enjoy my Game Grumps
tepid light
Like with early access and greenlight
ruby cradle
@glass fossil haha yeah
small fern
tbh, my main issue with those high subscriber youtubers is that they are all so theatrical
I guess it's part of the show
glass fossil
watching it live was weird, like, you could see him doing updates and slowly realizing what it actually means to make a game
small fern
but that kinda makes me not want to watch them
ruby cradle
Anyway, I'm out for the night, later y'all
rigid fog
Cya @ruby cradle
tepid light
Thats why from videos games I only watch TotalBiscuit
bitter mango
that sounds awkward af
scenic venture
Seeya
bitter mango
but you know something is going to go wrong as soon as you hear "kickstarter" combined with any intellectual property
later Alexander!
rigid fog
Well, the whole point of YT is entertainment right?
Wasn't that really the basis for it?
Obviously people are using it for different reasons.
tepid light
But hating on things is 90% of the internet
scenic venture
100 if you're on Reddit
rigid fog
Which is why I don't expect to ever get 1 million subs with tutorials 😉
tepid light
It dosn't bother me.
bitter mango
I remember when youtube was a file hosting website
those were the days
this new fangled video shit, I don't understand it
tepid light
yea.. file hosting?
small fern
maybe I'm missing some sarcasm
small fern
"The history of YouTube began when PayPal employees created a video-sharing website where users could upload, share and view content."
bitter mango
not sure if it mentions it but it started out as a file sharing website, then progressed to video
it wasn't public at that point I don't think
tepid light
"back in my day when youtube had no videos"
glass fossil
@rigid fog yep, when you pick a niche you can only expand as strong as the relative size of that niche. you could probably do slightly better doing Unity tutorials, but not much bigger
tepid light
We are the silent heroes. The ones that work in the shadows. Making games. So that pewdiepie can play them 😛
bitter mango
haha
glass fossil
spends year making game
pewdiepie plays for 10 minutes
lifes work complete
small fern
there are handfull on similar stories on indie gamedevs too
not every youtuber make even a living with it
even if they try
glass fossil
its a very small percentage
which makes that guy trying to do a kickstarter to become a youtuber even more out of touch
small fern
lol
scenic venture
markliplier is the only one I have semi respect for. Because the few videos I saw, he admits he does nothing and he just got lucky, but does nothing in reality
small fern
I follow fow gamers on youtube
mainly because they showcase new games, not for the show itself
or well
maiden loom
there was one of the dodgy youtubers involved in the CS gambling scandal in the local park the other day
small fern
that's what their shows are about
maiden loom
people were just flocking to him
maiden loom
I was just sat eating my lunch thinkingf 'wtf is wrong with you people, he's been scamming you for months and you're still here?'
scenic venture
Worse thing about Let's Play. Is watching them play horror games. They just make annoying voices and talk about how spooky everything, which ruins all atmosphere of the game
small fern
I don't get it, they first planned to make the game F2P, then they went to premium instead before launch, now they sell car DLCs and keys to random crate contents
tepid light
all cosmetics, right?
small fern
yes
maiden loom
random crates I am not okay with
small fern
it's not p2w
maiden loom
unless I cannot buy them
small fern
you can trade the keys
tepid light
but you get random items as you play anyway
glass fossil
"Hey guys, I just discovered this new site where it is super easy to win!"
gets proven to be involved with the site
"What do you mean I didn't disclose anything?!"
small fern
but you can't earn the keys by playing
maiden loom
I paid full price for that game, I don't want to see shitty infinite microtransaction tactics to gouge me for more money
bitter mango
the crate thing is cancer
small fern
crates have exclusive visual stuff, extra cars etc
maiden loom
(see also: Fuck you, Overwatch, CS:GO etc)
bitter mango
but it makes companies a lot of guilty money
small fern
@maiden loom I feel the same
tepid light
cough, cough, ark, cough 😛
bitter mango
at least in overwatch you get a crate every level
small fern
that's why it was paid game in the first place
ark doesn't have microtransactions though
maiden loom
Ark has a basic game and an optional expansion, that's not the same thing at all
tepid light
overwatch has the most terrible FTP model i have seen in a AAA game
small fern
my biggest beef is with ingame advertising
maiden loom
their F2P thing was a seperate game and mercifully, a complete failure
(which has now been rolled into the real game for free, hooray!)
glass fossil
I didn't like how in overwatch the summer games items were mixed with normal items, meaning you could open summer games crates but not really get many summer games items
given how the items were limited time
maiden loom
yeah, that's a dick move
small fern
for example, when Dirt 3 came out, I was about to get everything done at 100%, then they released DLCs which showed up in the game progress map and reduced my game progress
for making perfect score, I couldn't
bitter mango
the summer games stuff was uggo
tepid light
I hate the whole idea of buying crates instade of specific items.
small fern
as I didn't have DLC
tepid light
Valve started it and It works great for teh companies
maiden loom
they did the same thing with the Rocket League achievements
tepid light
but it is just wrong.
glass fossil
so to try to get the summer games items, you would have to buy tons of crates and maybe still not get summer games items
maiden loom
can't get them unless you own all the car DLCs
Civ 5, Borderlands 2 etc did the right thing by not having the achievements show unless you owned the DLC
small fern
yeh
tepid light
oh, yes.
maiden loom
this is what I hate about random crates - you could theoretically pay infinite money and never get the item you wanted
bitter mango
improbable though
bitter mango
it definitely works against you if you're a completionist
small fern
game sold for millions
tepid light
still, in overwatch you get 4 items per crate, right?
maiden loom
if a F2P game comes along and says 'pay thirty bucks and get everything', I'm down for that
tepid light
or was it 5?
small fern
they surely could put some of that into prize pools
maiden loom
(Tribes did this, it was a great move)
tepid light
anyway, 4 out of everything. Thats why Dota does it so much better now.
Crate has 4-12 items, and you will get no duplicates untill you get all items
or you can just buy sets on the marketplace
for half the price of the crate
glass fossil
f2p isn't inherently scummy, but the way it is implemented often is. For example I'm not entirely comfortable with how my company does free 2 play, but they aren't changing any time soon because of how profitable it is
maiden loom
as long as people keep paying for shitty business practices, they will continue
small fern
well
I don't like it
it's bit scummy alright in my books
but when you want to avoid that and pay full price for a game
maiden loom
this includes preodering totally broken shit, worthless season passes with mystery DLC, and hugely overpriced cosmetics, alongside the F2P crap
tepid light
there is a difference: free to play or free to win
small fern
and it still stuffs that into your game..
bitter mango
yeah I took the longest time to stop pre-ordering shit
maiden loom
it's 2016 - chill and wait for 24 hours, then order it on Amazon Prime, lol
bitter mango
WoW expansions are still the best experience I've had
small fern
I've only ever preordered Fallout 4 and it's season pass
tepid light
I preorderd 2 or 3 games in my life. 😛
bitter mango
even WITH the monthly fee
maiden loom
they usually are
bitter mango
yeah I don't like season passes
maiden loom
BL2 had a fantastic season pass
small fern
and other was cosmetics
glass fossil
players in our game pay to be able to play for X amount of time based on how much risk reward they want, and at the highest levels you're paying tons of money for a short play session, its nuts but people do it
maiden loom
then the Presequel had one for the same price, and literally 1/4 the content
tepid light
btw. I discovered that in many cases physical copies do have preorder content included even efter the release 😛
maiden loom
that really pissed people off, quite rightfully
tepid light
at least where I live
maiden loom
yeah, they usually do
this is because there's only really one physical box that goes out
they don't do multiple print runs, that just costs more money
bitter mango
what's your game Valkrysa?
glass fossil
tepid light
hehe
glass fossil
highest grossing casino game on iOS/Android/Browser
bitter mango
gambling is a phenomenon unto itself
tepid light
Nothing hints at evil practices more than gambling 😛
glass fossil
we don't use Unreal for it, if that wasn't obvious
maiden loom
personally I don't class casino style gambling as the 'games industry', even if it has moved into the web and mobile space
glass fossil
We use Unity/Flash moving towards using just Unity
bitter mango
gambling and gambling simulations basically have the same problem
small fern
unless you have custom license
glass fossil
you trade real money for chips to play the game, you never get real money out
bitter mango
except in the latter you buy energy to keep playing yet don't ever get money back
yeah exactly
glass fossil
right
bitter mango
I can't imagine the kind of people who go for that
tepid light
I'm amazed by the design and thought that goes into some of those games to irritate people out of money.
small fern
talking of unity restrictions
bitter mango
but I guess it;s entertaining
glass fossil
that is what I tell myself, the players clearly enjoy this, even if I don't
small fern
they used to have rule that you couldn't make over 50 arcade cabinets with same title with unity unless you bought a separate license
small fern
I think that's been lifted on Unity 5
or changed
it arrived on Unity 4 I think
but it's been while since I'd looked at their licenses
odd too because there's not even that big markets for those arcade things
well, I dunno if there still is at japan etc
Unreal on the other hand allows you to do arcade cabinet games totally free, without the 5% even
that + amusement park rides 😄
not sure if that's about those rollercoaster VR games
bitter mango
yay
small fern
because I don't remember seeing that part in their original eula
it's been added recently
bitter mango
I want to see examples of these
glass fossil
I wonder how that effects the mass effect and plants vs zombies carnival rides
that are being made with unreal
glass fossil
bot is down for the day
bitter mango
no ideas for today
rigid fog
fail
glass fossil
nick is experimenting
bitter mango
work halts
bitter mango
ew gear vr
small fern
our local amusement park has indoor rollercoaster with VR setup
haven't been there myself though
small fern
wonder how starvr will be
frail palm
I should be able to join the UE4 Epic mega Game Jam this october
wind aspen
Hi everyone ! I'm ready for this year's Mega Jam
stable kiln
I want one of those nice Nucs 😛
stable kiln
lol that Nuc in the jam raffle is more expensive than i payed for my whole i7 4770k desktop
i got a really great deal on (our version of ebay
the guy i bought it from was a n00b and messed up his bios 😛
payed 500euro for this
some other good stuff in there too, all high quality stuff
legal windows 10, 180e power supp ,good tower really nice deal
just the vid card needs a replacement
bitter mango
decent
honest lintel
wow, they're even giving away the high end Nucs. That's cool
stable kiln
its not even overpriced for a mini pc i think
pale eagle
Finally figured out some of the problems of the whiteboard
It wasn't so much that there was any specific problem, but any FPS variation while drawing was killing performance
So the high performance eaters (lighting and PP in my case) combined with the relatively expensive drawing logic was causing fps hitches
and causing the whole thing to not play so well
I think I've optimized it enough to not be a problem
hopefully
if anyone who experienced big problems with my previous white board would test i'd appreciate it 😃
pine fulcrum
ahahah home md
pale eagle
haha, the striking resemblance didn't give it away? http://i.imgur.com/u7OlYrg.png
(literally the limits of my realism)
stable kiln
not to mention the whiteboard scenes are like 20% of house MD 😛
wind aspen
I wonder how many teams will enter in the Mega Jam
@pine fulcrum wasnt there about 100 teams last Mega Jam?
pale eagle
Think the final count for qualified submissions was 160-ish
Some of those posts were just the tutorial levels/Unity games/all stolen content
From people fishing for the raffle prizes.
safe halo
No way! Still must have taken a while to play all of those
thin viper
Anyone looking to team up for the jam in a few weeks?
tepid light
I am looking for a team for a MegaJam. I create blueprints and some very basic 3d-modeling.
low carbon
Man that's a lot of jam games
glass fossil
An action game where you bribe love to solve a mystery in a network of underground tunnels but you keep jumping forward in time.
dusky python
scenic venture
I'm betting the Megajam is going to hit anything from 250-300 this time
glass fossil
its going to be totally fun, haven't done a gamjam since the unreal slackers anniversary one, but there is no way you can miss this one 😃
rigid fog
Oh snap @glass fossil grats on promotion
glass fossil
ty ❤
rigid fog
:partyparrot:
glass fossil
custom emoji are coming soon
so party parrot could return
determined to power through ben's course so I can finish it sometime in the next 7 days, its hard to stay focused on it since only doing a little bit between each segment of listening to him talk is counter to how my brain seems to work
prefer to just dive into things
maiden loom
PARTYPARROT
rigid fog
Since I am working with Unity this quarter. It is funny how easier C# is
small fern
ah, nice, she'll keep troublemakers in order
good pick
btw
many signed up for the megajam yet?
I just sent PM about my solo team to Alexander 😛
rigid fog
Hmmm, still undecided if going solo or team. Want to win if I do get a team, so need experienced folks.
stable kiln
with prolly 200 submissions winning is aiming pretty high 😛
that underwater game from last time was made by 5 ppl that work together daily right?
that shit is hard to beat 😛
small fern
heh
yeah, I'm only in for a challenge
I mean, I'd love to get that nuc and houdini but yeah, it doesn't look like it's happening on megajam easily ;D
hope there will be few good days too
could do actual photogrammetry for the entry if the weather is good
glass fossil
Winning is probably out of range for me just yet, but I want to do the same thing I did last time where there is a fully compelete and defined Start->Mid->End progression
small fern
someones messages duplicate now
heh
yeh
discord mobile app is all messed up
I tried to edit one message with it
rigid fog
Slack was bad too
small fern
it just always kept the edited line same
then I opened desktop client
and there wasn't even that comment anywhere 😄
I dunno, I had no issues with slacks mobile client
btw, does anyone else try to write discard almost every time at first?
!discard
safe halo
I've had that a few times where the last line just doesn't go away on my phone's discord. Sometimes just have to restart the app or you will be confused forever
pale eagle
@pine fulcrum actually managed the last megajam play through in one sitting, if my memory serves. It took a long time. I remember staying up, watching. Going to sleep. Waking up, watching. Going to work. Coming home, still watching. Pretty sure he almost died toward the end.
safe halo
Wow. Such dedication. Give that man a medal
pale eagle
Hero of the People is an earned title.
They already had to fix the boards code to let him have more medals.
small fern
he slept in the middle I think
small fern
nah, 66h without sleep
anyone can do that
I think I've only once in my lifetime been awake for 3 days in a row
pine fulcrum
Ive been awake 72 hours before and thats something I never want to relive
Hallucinating and shit
lament oar
I stayed awake for 5 days once when I had a period of homelessness. I did try to sleep but things kept happening like the police turning me out of a couple of spots or the time I made a little house out of cardboard boxes and bricks and just as I was about to fall asleep the bricks fell on so I carried on walking.
pine fulcrum
Dang
lament oar
I saw the humour in it as the little black flies in my vision danced merrily.
safe halo
Wow. I guess @lament oar wins at being the most superhuman of us all!
lament oar
Stupid more like. I was pretty reckless back then. Had no life goals. I will say that kind of thing is character building though. I never saw a homeless person again without appreciating their position
safe halo
Well I'm glad you made it through that so you could enter all the game jams
warm grove
Oh man, my brief stint of homelessness was pretty much the same
Except 5 days is insane, at 4 my brain stops functioning and I can't not sleep
pale eagle
Most I've ever done is 96ish hours. Got scary at the end. Hallucinations and I wasn't tired (not tired was the scary part)
Haven't been able to do more than 48 for a couple years. 90+ was teenage me.
wind aspen
Mega Jam starts at 4am for me. I'm not sure if should even try to sleep. It will bug me waiting until morning to know the theme.
small fern
those jams start around 10-11pm for me
wind aspen
Its not likely I can take that time off work. It will be some late nights for me.
small fern
hmmm
should probably take a look at sequencer before megajam
something tells me it would be handy to know how it operates beforehand
just in case
stable kiln
use create sequence player or it wont play in build version
small fern
there's a bug?
I dunno
I might be foolish enough to try to use 4.14 on next jam as well 😄
had to backport my 4.14 assets to 4.13 on last one
as it had one bug that made it no go
wind aspen
One thing i learned from the last game jam is test package earlier on
Having trouble with packaging the last day can be frustrating
small fern
packaging wasn't an issue for me
I tested that all the time 😃
I actually found on day one that 4.13 fails to package with forward renderer
but then found out the next deay that with 4.14, while everything packaged and initially looked just fine, there was no shadows on fully dynamic lights
I had them in editor initially
but when I removed baked lighting, they dissappeared
pine fulcrum
I can't do the mega jam stream when the jam ends
I'll be able to do it on the night of the 15th though
Iunno why they chose the same time as steam dev days
scenic venture
Packaging is always a pain for me. Seems like there is always that ONE function that doesn't work in packaged games and you're like "Then why is it a function!?!"
small fern
oh right, to get it to package is one thing
there's been what, 3 separate things that have been broken on packaged builds just within few weeks that still get past packaging itself
so would need to playtest the games and look closely it matches the PIE results
I mean, 3 things I've seen myself
scenic venture
Yeah. And it's obviously much harder to figure out what's wrong with a packaged game
glass fossil
@pine fulcrum @lament oar Hallucinating from fatigue is a early sign of beginning to die, if ever near such a state from sleeplessness one should quickly go to sleep
rigid fog
Yeas
Vrhackathon in seattle
$500 and props
Lots of good networking, which was really the best prize
glass fossil
@quiet thistle Yes I am sure, because when your neural networks are staring to really get hurt, when your brain is beginning to die you begin the slow process of hallucinating. That could last over 24 hours of everly hallucinating before finally kicking the bucket though
quiet thistle
Just because you hallucinate when you die doesnt mean when you hallucinate you are dying
glass fossil
No When you hallucinate becasue of massive lack of sleep
quiet thistle
people have gone a lot longer than 3 days without dying
glass fossil
those are cases where people get a little bit of sleep, even 10 minutes can help that process last much longer
If you start to hallucinate, go to bed regardless of if you're going to die.
quiet thistle
lmfao
glass fossil
@glass fossil Yes 😃
your sleep deprived brain won't do its best work halucinating that you are your own twin
Bonezone jsut trying to convince himself never to go to sleep again xD
pine fulcrum
@glass fossil really likes the idea of twins
quiet thistle
nah Im not, Im just saying hallucinations isnt the criteria for determing if someone is close to death due to sleep depreviation lol
people can hallucinate after just a day without sleep
they arent about to die
glass fossil
Well sleeplessness got me hallucinating for about 6-7 hours one time, I was speaking to two friends who both actually lived VERY far away and after realising the thought that no one of them could actually be in my room because one lives in the other side of the country and the other lived very far away also
glass fossil
Then I jumped into bed and closed my eyes
rigid fog
No sleep for me on plane
glass fossil
@rigid fog you're going full steam ahead, great job 😄
Real hallucinations are different from "hallucinations" there is a vast difference between Distortion of reality, which is the common "hallucination" and a real hallucination
and yes, there is one or two freak cases where you either hallucinate because of chemical imbalances in the brain, where it has nothing to do with the death process, and other where you have taken drugs but don't want to admit it/don't remember it
quiet thistle
Im not a biologist or expert on sleep, but I always thought when you are sleep deprived you enter a sleep paralysis type state when you start to hallucinate because you are in a half dreaming state. This wouldnt be close to death necessarily...
glass fossil
That is not hallucinating to be specific that is what you are describing, having a real hard time being awake, so you close your eyes for a fraction of a second and start dreeaming
and you drift in and out of that state
What I am talking about are real hallucinations, where you are totally awake, eyes open and not drifting in a state of sleep/nonsleep
and still start to see hallucinations
quiet thistle
you cannot open your eyes while being in that sleep state then? Im not so sure
scenic venture
Pretty sure sleep deprivation causes a chemical imbalance in your brain because of the build up of toxins that require you to sleep to help work out
glass fossil
You can, but that i a very fragile state and can causephycosis, if your mind doesn't either wake you up or make you fall asleep you better hope your psyche is stong to not get a total breakdown when the reality of sleep and being awake melds together like that
Thisi is a state some people have accidentally caused themselves to mentally break down, getting a full fledged psychosis
More then a few people have done this to themselves when trying to meditate youself into that "dreaming sleep state" with fully opened eyes, regular symptoms of such phycosis is severe hallucinations constantly
quiet thistle
I dont realy know enough about biology, dont really care either. Just seems strange to me that you are close to death if you hallucinate while sleep deprived it doesnt seem like an accurate thing... but I cant really disprove you so w/e lol
scenic venture
I feel like this Game-Jam channel is never ever actually about game jams
quiet thistle
loooool
glass fossil
HAHA i even forgot this was a gamejam channel
scenic venture
can't argue there
glass fossil
Irish kilter, I guess your irish right?
glass fossil
Okok cool, but I guess no gaelic then? It's an interesting language even though I don't understand anything of it :P
(I am fascinated of ireland/irish history as I am crazy about viking history, which is quite melded in ireland with it's celtic history)
I have spent large amounts of time reading the different annals of irish history and trying to learn some words of old gaelic to do my own translations, but that is harder said then done
So I have to go with pre-translated text for my research
scenic venture
I took some basic Gaelic years ago in my teens. But the problem is it's not really spoken, almost as dead of a language can get without being dead. So finidng people to speak it is pretty hard
people still teach it in Ireland I believe as a way to keep the history alive, but as far as I'm aware no one speaks it because it's a valid language anywhere
glass fossil
It's a valid language in correctly determining irish history, which I noticed that is needed in soem translations, as some things have been tranlated incorrectly I know of one word I took some real time trying to learn its meaning as a new translation of a text hade some contradicting information about a historical king, well I found a much older translation which cleared things up and that contradiction was not present in that much older translation
ergo de facto; new translations have lesser knowledge of gaelic behind them
scenic venture
like I said, pretty much a dying language
glass fossil
:/
somber hazel
how to jam: sleep at least 4-6 hours every day, everyone who says "don't sleep it's a jam" is an idiot, also don't drink energy drinks to stay awake ❤
maiden loom
last jam I did, I didn't sleep for over 72 hours :p
glass fossil
xD
rigid fog
Aye. I barely got any sleep over this past jam
2hrs first night. 30 mins second night.
When you are the only dev, you have to know manage what you can the best way you can.
Sometimes sacrifices are important and go a long way
lament oar
this is why I haven't been able to do any jams yet. I sacrifice some of my attention and development time to deal with the kids and their needs. If I can just get a weekend off sometime....
rigid fog
Game jam retreats should be a thing
lament oar
yeah that would be awesome
small fern
most of the time it's still more beneficial to sleep those few extra hours, like 4hour vs 2 hour
your brain will be at idle if you don't
doesn't probably matter that much if it's just mechanical work that you know already how to do but problem solving/stupid mistakes start to appear when you are not thinking straight
maiden loom
I have learnt that I can more or less still do blueprint stuff whilst completely zonked out, so a 72 hour stint is not that much of a problem for me
I may have even been implementing stuff in a partially asleep state, lol
glass fossil
Heh 😛
tepid light
Key is in deciding what needs to be done and what does not
I don't think any of my games cost me more than 30 hours.
Probably less than 25
maiden loom
depends what you do
if you do something that needs bespoke, unique tech, you need time 😉
small fern
I actually started implementing physics integrator on blueprints few jams back 😄 there was just some small logic error somewhere and bp debugging just froze my editor
so that was the end of that jam
I know how the thing would have worked, just couldn't bother trying to fix it when you have broken tools and limited time
tepid light
For me doing things from first person saves a lot of time / affort
as I can't do any modeling / animations
somber hazel
working 72 hours must be painful for your body or you are young and don't give a f<3k which still will f<3k you soon or later + doing zombie work for 72 hours... must be a great game :3
I could be wrong, but I don't think so 😄
maiden loom
I'm 30, so I'm not that young any more, haha
I'm 30, so I'm not that young any more, haha
I've done an awful lot of crunch in my time though
I've done an awful lot of crunch in my time though
I've done an awful lot of crunch in my time though
scenic venture
It's been scientifically proven that pushing your employees harder during a grind is less effective then letting them go home and sleep and come back refreshed
maiden loom
I wouldn't go so far as to say scientifically proven, but yes, that is generally accepted to be true
usually when I'm crunching like that, I'm picking up slack from elsewhere
ain't no features getting cut on my projects
working on Fable I used to keep track of all the bugs that were being marked as 'don't fix' and fix them in my spare time, lol
production didn't like me doing that
scenic venture
well, maybe not proven. But I've read studies that all led to the conclusion that you're only burning your workforce out which means less productivity by not letting them get down time, rather than getting more work out of them
somber hazel
well, he is pro, so he is probably more productive than others even with lack of sleep, it's still s<3t in my opinion and I hate people saying I'm lazy, because I don't drink redbull and don't stay up all night long during jams :3
proven badge
I'd say staying up on the last night is vital
for jams at least
I mean, you can crash when its over
small fern
I think that's one reason why some people think game jams are evil
they teach people to crunch
small fern
I personally like having a quick thing that only last for few days though, or few weeks
proven badge
a.k.a prototyping 😄
small fern
but if it were like that all the time, like past 2 months in development..
tepid light
Crunching for the sake of crunching maks no sense. If you have so much work that you can't do it all it just means your planning was poor.
small fern
I really hope there's a good theme for megajam
don't want to waste those extra days just wondering a good use of theme
tepid light
yea. I hope for that too
I'm kind hyped for the jam. It would be sad to lack any ideas
small fern
heh, the rare occasions when you could use that idea guy
small fern
I remember last years jam
tepid light
One day it will be ha Haiku 😛
small fern
I couldn't get anything from the giants theme
tepid light
That was a hard theme but I don't think it was bad.
small fern
I only got two ideas at the half-way of the week
and both were too much work for single person team
proven badge
EXCEPT LAST ONE!
tepid light
But there is some charm in having a hard, specific theme.
small fern
yeh
I like LD theming too
while UE4 jam themes are more clever
people usually still do the literal approach
tepid light
I think it is more interesing to compare ideas when they are not as broad as in ludum dare.
@proven badge Ancient Tech? That was bad?
proven badge
yes
could not think of anything good for like 6 hours
50% of games where about alien artifacts giving super powers
I like restrictive themes, but this one was a tad too restrictive
proven badge
winners were really cool
one game was a about french waiter bending in weird shapes to reach all the tables and please the customers
another one was a puzzle game ., like lemmings style where you had to cut the envrionment in fruit ninja style to make pathing
somber hazel
"the people on top of the food chain view crunch as something standard and inevitable rather than a toxic, avoidable practice", if you let higher ups do that to you, so that you can keep your job, you can find me flipping burgers at the next restaurant 😄
also "I'm looking for an artist, unpaid, but I will promote him and he will work with pros"
rigid fog
Gamejams are supposed to represent crunch
tepid light
yea, but crunch for 2 days for fun on a non profit game is a bit different than being expected by your employer to work like this for weeks, as a normal job
glass fossil
yeah I don't mind crunching voluntarily both for fun or for my employer, as long as they don't expect it and understand the sacrifices that come from it. Which they do. Only had to go into crunch mode a few times so far.
pine fulcrum
Game jams are about effectiveness
somber hazel
well, it starts with "oh, that's no problem", later you will be like "oh, crunch? I already did this in jams, no problem", I don't think it should be a standard thing to do and is always bad, regardless if it's for fun ruining your health, and no one will die doing this a few times, but still, don't take it so ez
pine fulcrum
Crunch is about soul killing
scenic venture
sounds like my last job
pretty sure that's place entire purpose is the destruction of souls
pale eagle
I always see them as a pipeline for something new. I'm at 12 jams now and every time has had some new thing 😛
although, I am running out of new things
ashen meadow
im at 8. 8 half-baked lousy games. slowly improving. at this pace i plan on winning a game jam right around ue5
my key is finding a concept that i can half bake and somewhat finish in 15-16 hours
quiet thistle
does anyone know when they announce the winners of the sept gamejam?
glass fossil
I would think this Thursday
lapis lichen
^^ yup, this Thursday 😃
small fern
oh right, it's tuesday already
glass fossil
@lapis lichen 😄 looking forward to megajam, already asked my boss for the week off
lament oar
I asked my boss for a week off. I was denied, which is all the worse because I am self-employed.
small fern
lol
glass fossil
lol
small fern
wonder how it works out when you go asking for a raise
rigid fog
Hmmmm
Still looking to form a team for MegaJam. Need another programmer/scripter, 2 3d artists, sound/tech artist, wildcard position.
Need to have at least 6 months experience in UE4. And know your own pipeline into it.
rigid fog
🤐
somber hazel
teaming up with Victor is pretty auto-win, won VR jam, won with this school game
not sure if he is the reason, but at least he got a good hand for finding the right team
😄
lament oar
I would love to @rigid fog and maybe some other time but im in debug hell and i've still got to get my marketplace work done. Think I am pretty much stacked until xmas
rigid fog
Heh, a bit of luck and skills. I for sure know what to look out for now if we want a win. Having fun while jamming would be awesome too. So as long as everyone understands their role and can commit for the full jam as much time as possible. Nothing but awesomeness can come out of it.
But nothing is for certain and I am definitely no auto-win. I can't win a jam by myself yet.
@pine fulcrum said something about effectiveness I think
glass fossil
key word, yet!
rigid fog
Aye, yet.
I strangely missed out on the easier themes this year for various reasons.
😢
lapis lichen
@maiden loom HYYYPPPEEE
maiden loom
😄
glass fossil
I think this is the last jam I go solo, after this one confidence levels should be high enough to start begging people for team invites~
somber hazel
I really would like to make dat MLG video game, with Dorritos Particle and stuff
let's hope the theme fits into it
🙃
rigid fog
^our game...who won sound...but there's no sound in that vid...so I'll be doing a video/stream later on tonight probably so everyone can see/hear it
@pine fulcrum I think you'd know this: IGF Competition, can be solo or team project correct?
scenic venture
@glass fossil I firmly stand by fake it until you make it when it comes to confidence
glass fossil
@scenic venture I think thats generally a good strategy, for my youtube series every episode up until like... 10 I think, I had to warm up for like half an hour to be willing to talk to the camera. Now its fairly easy.
scenic venture
The worse that typically happens from faking confidence is you learn a little bit more about what not to do.
tepid light
@rigid fog I'am a blueprint scripter with expiriance and a lot of time.
what is going on with my english today.
I'm a blueprint scripter with experience and a lot of time.
stable kiln
I usually just trow shit at the wall and see what sticks 😛
I asked a friend to be my 2d artsit, he seemed pretty hyped, next week he is prolly hyped about something else tho 😛
stable kiln
yea, they like talking about doin stuff but not so much when they have to make a lil effort 😛
but who knows he is really good so if he really goes for it , its gunna be something 😛
stable kiln
when he is not sleeping gaming or puking in a bucket he can draw really good 😄
pine fulcrum
@rigid fog IGF doesnt care about team size last I know of
rigid fog
@pine fulcrum Cool, thanks. I looked at their rules on the website, and it had nothing on there about team sizes.
small fern
two weeks till megajam
still need to learn a bit of sequencer, probably would need to practise ue4 animation stuff too
pale eagle
Friends seem to like the concept of development, but as soon as I open a 3d modelling program, or unreal, or an audio mixing program to start showing them what I know so they can go forth.
Face freeze, panic sets in.
Friend no longer interested. I don't think most people have any concept as to the amount of effort and work required. Like most tech :-P
glass fossil
same reason why every kid wants to do game development, and then don't
they think because they enjoy a thing they can do it easily
and then they learn it is work
scenic venture
I'm the opposite. I barely play games anymore. I just enjoy the challenge of making them
Unless it's Dark Souls. I can play that all day
glass fossil
If someone hasn't played the series yet but doesn't know what to pick between Bloodborne and Dark Souls 3 what would you pick?
somber hazel
You ask that someone
"Why do you have a console?"
😄
but you could actually start with 1, 2 or demon souls, the whole series stays pretty much the same, gameplay and graphics
pine fulcrum
Id say start with dark souls 2
glass fossil
@pine fulcrum thank you for the suggestion 😃 could I ask your reason? because one youtuber seems to think that its the worst of the series, but youtubers are often mysterious/opinionated anyways
pine fulcrum
Easiest to get into imo
glass fossil
hmm that is a very good reason, as I have never played a souls game
I bet its much cheaper than the newer ones too
somber hazel
ds2 was 2 ez for the hardcore fans, they didn't like the "big guy with stick" boss fights and the artificial increase in difficulty by adding MORE enemys instead of INTERESTING enemys
glass fossil
Thanks for more insight 😄 though now I realize this question would spark enough interest that we are accidentally taking over #game-jam-chat
somber hazel
last thing, checkpoints were 2 close, but I heard all the patches and DLC's fixed everything and added a lot
scenic venture
@glass fossil Dark Souls 2. Bloodbourne takes things up differently so it isnt apart of the series. 1 is great but much harder than 2, 3 doesnt have as much of that amazing impression as 2 for a first timer
small fern
dark souls 1 on pc
what was the resolution again?
1024x720
@pale eagle that sounded like most of the gamedev teams I had in uni, most wanted to make games, only few actually made them
I guess that's one reason why I like to do solo projects
bitter mango
@scenic venture me 2 thx. I can barely play games for very long, but I will work into the night on some stupid feature in UE or an asset or a model
I'm careful about what I start doing because I might become obsessed with some inefficient process
stable kiln
might be fun to compare actions per minute in engine, just like in starcraft 😛
for scuulping in blender it works for sure
faster clicks is faster model
better take half strenth brush and click double as fast
austere glade
is there a team finding thread again?
frail palm
Anyone doing a team for the game jam?
small fern
yay, I was first who signed up for megajam (at least first on list)
3 solo teams out of 5
stable kiln
i think ill sign up soon
scenic venture
Soloing the MegaJam is pretty ballsie
stable kiln
ever since i stop to try get animations from blender to eu mannequin i really started liking it 😛
scenic venture
life is always more enjoyable when not trying to figure out rig/animated related issues
small fern
I'm really want to make some mini adventure, but that would require a fitting theme
would also mean a lot of work
scenic venture
My favourite adventure game came from the Commodore 64
don't remember what it was called, but you played as the oldest brother of 3 on a quest to find their father or something I think. If you died, that brother was completely dead and you played the middle child, killed him you played the youngest, each one starting off from home again. If all 3 die you lose entirely
it was pretty awesome
back in those days game developers weren't afraid of being jerks
frigid mist
@rigid fog you have to win this year for Narnia
rigid fog
Aye, it will probably happen every oct
frigid mist
was because @topaz scroll and @elfin quarry told me come here will be fun for all and you will win a Titan X kappa (is a joke)
XD
glass fossil
I wouldn't be surprised if a 1070 or 2 were available as prizes
pale eagle
VR game idea: you are a SS agent/bodyguard. Identify and neutralize threats to your employer. Harm no innocents.
pale eagle
Easy reason to keep player immobile, takes advantage of 360 immersion
rigid fog
Interesting enough, sound designers are hard to come by
small fern
my guess is that there will be htc vives as prizes too
frigid mist
@glass fossil don't see the Nvidia logo
Epic spend the tickets this year giving away with Nvidia Paragon keys
glass fossil
falcon northwest was sponsering I think, so they could put up pcs or at least parts
frigid mist
that probably is a complete PC or something
looks like they got the TitanX too here xD
glass fossil
A role-playing game where you procedurally generate a portal to another universe to find freedom in virtual reality and you only have a few minutes to live.
small fern
wow
that's actually pretty amazing, although not sure how the rpg elements would fit in
rigid fog
1080ti jan2017
Announcement anyway
Tbh, imho, they shouldn't be giving out the big prizes randomly
It is the same mentality as giving those that don't win, medals for showing up
glass fossil
while the prizes are really nice, the excitement of participating alongside everyone is enough motivation on its own here
rigid fog
Those big prizes should def go to the teams who worked the hardest and via their effort won in their respective categories.
glass fossil
it is kinda funny to give out big prizes to someone who might have just thrown a quick thing together
rigid fog
I don't mind some free giveaways for everyone though.
Or random drawing on little things.
Exactly my point
Last year a bunch of crap was thrown up there just for a chance at the random drawings.
scenic venture
Yeah. The prizes for the team were weaker than the random drawings
austere glade
there were so many good games tho from epic jam last year
frigid mist
@rigid fog what game you will do ?
rigid fog
Who knows. We will find out what the theme is first
small fern
please let it be some post apocalypting thing 😄
fallout clone in 7 days
that would be something
rigid fog
We don't cheat like other people
We will make a 100% original asset game from theme disclosure
small fern
yeah
well
I guess that's one benefit for main prizes not going to winning teams
makes less sense to cheat 😄
but I agree on the things you said earlier
rigid fog
Maybe
glass fossil
some people don't cheat no matter what 😛
rigid fog
There are ways to counter this
small fern
I remember watching Allars stream last year
people were all the time "this game couldn't have been done in one week - they must have cheated"
although, some of them probably did cheat :p
only way to counter that would be to require some timelapse videos from each entry 😄
which isn't really something most people could do
rigid fog
Just sad we have to think about these things at all
small fern
talking of which, is there some software that allows you capture screenshot like every second or two?
so you could do timelapse that wouldn't fill your whole HDD
or something that would allow you to record video on such low framerates
small fern
yeh, I can build such tool myself
but I wondering if there is something that anyone could just download and use
that's more meant for that kind of thing
biggest reason why I wouldn't want to do timelapse myself is that people would see me noobing around modo and zbrush 😄
small fern
heh
bitter mango
any sufficiently advanced cheating is indistinguishable from magic
so just tell them you used magic
and that you can use it on them if they anger you
C3PO gets it
pale eagle
@rigid fog it makes sense that the biggest prizes go out to all who submit qualified entries. it encourages participation, which is Epic's goal
Some of it was shovelware, sure, but others were some people's best (sometimes first) effort
Even if there are 5 shovelware entries for every one developer who decides to give it a go (even though they know they won't win, probably), I'd say that's a net gain
(a legitimate go)
bitter mango
I agree with that
pale eagle
besides, putting everything at the top can lead to some...less than cordial dynamics between teams
'oh, facing packaging issues? guess you can't win huehuehuehue'
bitter mango
I would encourage sportsman-like behaviour
pale eagle
not saying anyone would do it, but it's incentivized by a top heavy award structure
bitter mango
look at e-sports. same demographics. same sort of age groups
I think making it too competitive won't be a nice environment
it's a situation where you want to reward participation because you want more participation
the quality or a neat game is just a bonus
rigid fog
HMmm
I think we'll have to agree to disagree on that
Competition usually brings out the best in people
That's all I will say
bitter mango
the best and the worst
I mean, I'd make just as good a game regardless of the prize structure
but if you remove the need to be at the top then you can try new ideas and take more risks
topaz scroll
Is someone already registering for the mega jam?
glass fossil
You can see the teams pre-registered here:
https://forums.unrealengine.com/showthread.php?122362-Epic-MegaJam!-Oct-6-13th-2016
I already notice a few of us on there
glass fossil
lol yeah, decided to be different 😃
wind aspen
Great to see the team names listed now
stable kiln
together with the theme they should and a picture... and this is ur main character
altho than all games need a character 😛
i want one of these the size of a horse 😛