lounge

[zinc matrix]

No; using whatever your abilities are the best you can to help others in need; always believing in a brighter future and never giving up hope; that's what Superman represents at his core and probably why he's the most iconic fictional character of our era

It's not about superpowers

[verbal junco]

of the previous era

[zinc matrix]

It's about who he is

[zinc matrix]

Whatever

[verbal junco]

he represented a response to world war 2

[zinc matrix]

True, but his character evolved into something more meaningful

I don't wanna get into nitpicky stuff though

[quasi mantle]

Why not scale it down to your neighbours and friends?

Oh, is it because American politics that I completely missed?

[fathom wadi]

hot damn my kid just screamed at the top of her lungs, so I ran into her room to see what was happening and my other daughter was puking. Like who screams about someone else puking? I thought someone was on fire. ¬_¬

[verbal junco]

we do say scope down 😎

[zinc matrix]

Because they already have enough privalege and they already brag about the new products they buy either unaware or uncaring of the suffering that happened to make it

I'm a hypocrite too I guess, but I should stop being one

[regal pecan]

Fiction: "Superman saved us! Hurray!"
Reality: "No need to increase safety, superman will pick up slack."

[quasi mantle]

What if you live somewhere in the third world country, like I physically am?

[verbal junco]

how the world would be if superheroes existed

[quasi mantle]

Does the same applies?

[verbal junco]

"ah don't worry ironman will take care of it"

[timber viper]

Generating landscapes on tick are welcome

[zinc matrix]

That's not the point I'm trying to make and you know it; I'm simply saying the ideals of Superman have made me want to be a better person, just as any role model for any good person would

[quasi mantle]

"Fuck the neighbours and friends because they made a living for themselves!"

[verbal junco]

the best part is if we had superheroes, thanos wouldn't even need to exist, literally they could have spent half a decade making africa a better place

[zinc matrix]

I'm not trying to undermine their value, I'm just saying they don't need as much help as people in impoverished countries

[timber viper]

😦

[regal pecan]

Africa's a pretty nice place, bot flies notwithstanding.

[fathom wadi]

I'd be happy if I could move to Montana and raise a crop of dental floss.

[verbal junco]

bots are everywhere, even in flies now 😔

[quasi mantle]

I'm from one of the (considerably) impoverished countries, and there's a larger picture that you can't see.

[regal pecan]

now wondering if bot flies can solve capchas

[zinc matrix]

Elaborate

[verbal junco]

how do bot flies compare to drones? who would win?

[quasi mantle]

What things do you want me to elaborate on?

[zinc matrix]

What country are you from? What's the bigger picture that I can't see?

[fathom wadi]

Bot flies have autoaim and ESP. They would win everyday

[zinc matrix]

Which one?

[quasi mantle]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indonesia

[regal pecan]

https://www.wildlifetrusts.org/wildlife-explorer/invertebrates/flies/drone-fly

[zinc matrix]

You're Indonesian?

[quasi mantle]

Yes.

[zinc matrix]

Cool; so what's the bigger picture I can't see?

[verbal junco]

if there's an indonesia, why isn't there an outdonesia?

[quasi mantle]

Sure it is

/s

[zinc matrix]

That's actually a very good question

[quasi mantle]

There is, Malaysia

Maybe Brunei to certain extent

[zinc matrix]

Well they should rename it to Outdonesia

@quasi mantle but yeah what's the bigger picture I can't see?

So you mean I'm just assuming what the problems are rather than really understanding them?

[quasi mantle]

Working overtime is the acceptable norm, buying power is low, but things are getting expensive, 20 USD can feed you for almost a fortnight

[verbal junco]

indonesia has empire and rebel factions? that's like being one step away from star wars

[zinc matrix]

Well what's your job?

[quasi mantle]

That's just few of them I can mention here

[zinc matrix]

Nah, from PA, but I live near Philly so I guess that explains it

[fathom wadi]

I used to live on £20 for food for a fortnight. Then I met my wife, had kids, and now it costs over £200 a week.

[verbal junco]

my condolences

[quasi mantle]

Monarchist one has died a long time.

Or the year I was born, if Suharto's commanding years counts

[zinc matrix]

Salright, I barely go into that city anymore

[quasi mantle]

That's specifically Aceh, and no, I don't live there.

Fortunately.

[zinc matrix]

Well

Idk

[verbal junco]

we figured

[zinc matrix]

You guys are right there are many factors to many problems

I just struggle with making sense of my life and how to spend it

[verbal junco]

yes well said. have a free pat on the back

[fathom wadi]

Just exist for as long as possible

[quasi mantle]

Aceh goes hardcore when it comes to Shar'i stuff, even being in a straight romantic relationship will net you a bunch of public shaming

[verbal junco]

exist for as long as you want*

[quasi mantle]

Though usually the women got more shaming than the men

At least from what I heard

[zinc matrix]

Also again, even if I don't solve every problem, isn't at least trying to solve one better than nothing?

[quasi mantle]

Yes, even smaller things.

[verbal junco]

@zinc matrix how old are you

[zinc matrix]

24, why?

[verbal junco]

you've got like 10 years to figure out one problem and you'll be good

[fathom wadi]

You might benefit from reading/watching some Jordan Peterson. He has some great talks about these subjects.

[verbal junco]

if you do more than that, you're excelling

[zinc matrix]

Well he seems like a radical right-winger, so idk

He also sounds like Kermit the Frog

[quasi mantle]

In the literal sense, yes, but that's like more than 5 centuries ago

[fathom wadi]

hes not a right winger at all. thats what people who disagree with him say

[verbal junco]

so more like... lord of the rings?

[verbal junco]

doesn't he support rand paul?

[fathom wadi]

my first 30 years went so slow. But now time is running out. It's all relative

[zinc matrix]

Definitely, man

[quasi mantle]

I suppose.
That's a long list of history lessons I skipped over at high school (because I took science class)

[verbal junco]

time goes faster as you age. it's not fair that once we know what to do with our time we barely have any left

[regal pecan]

I'm going to need some time to connect the dots between Star Wars and Lord of the Rings and Indonesia. A lot of time.

[zinc matrix]

He's been on Prager U, so that's a huge red flag

[verbal junco]

I want to think that was a smart choice

[fathom wadi]

he's not. He even says himself he is a liberal. If you read him or watch him its very easy to understand that he thinks critically and is all about liberalism.

[timber viper]

Probably I understand your situation more than anyone here, but still can't understand %100. We have similar issues in Turkey but our geography is more weird so things went different in the past

[quasi mantle]

Indonesia's kingdom politics before Portuguese occupation was wild as heck

[verbal junco]

hey mang I'm just asking questions

[zinc matrix]

Can he at least change his voice somehow? Maybe if he sounded more like Optimus Prime than Kermit, he'd be more engaging to listen to

[quasi mantle]

Then Dutch imperialism happens, making the old kingdoms obsolete

[fathom wadi]

if you think that's bad, try Noam Chomsky. I fall asleep everytime he talks for more than 30 minutes 😄

[verbal junco]

ohhh shoot, someone actually made the formula. madlads. I was thinking what it could be

[fathom wadi]

everyone does. Im a right winger according to the left wing, but if you ask me, I'm left wing. Go figure :/

[zinc matrix]

Whatever

[quasi mantle]

We all know Sephiroth is right winger.

[zinc matrix]

Maybe there's a way I can be a slavery-free game dev

[fathom wadi]

eggshell white mmm

[burnt lake]

yes

[quasi mantle]

If you run your own studio, be a reasonable leader.

[verbal junco]

marc rogerson is such a right winger name though

rogerson, peterson

[burnt lake]

anyone here watched no country for old men?

[verbal junco]

very right wing sounding

[zinc matrix]

Maybe my game should only be a system exclusive

[quasi mantle]

Not me, friendo.

[zinc matrix]

Like PC

[burnt lake]

i didn't mean nothing buy it

[zinc matrix]

I've watched an old man run the country

[verbal junco]

do I have to? is it ok to watch it on netflix instead?

[pseudo sparrow]

who tf is kappa why is his emoji so popular

[fathom wadi]

something I admit but im not proud of is I grew up racist, homophobic and transphobic. But when I was 17 I met a black girl I was racist to as a kid, and she didn't hold it against me, and from that moment I was anti-racist, anti-hate, and started to transition from being homophobic from my catholic upbringing and eventually even learned to understand trans issues. People can often change throughout their lives and opinions will change with them. So I don't like to hold anyone to any "wing". There is only love and tolerance.

[zinc matrix]

Better question: why do you have a pedophile as your pfp?

[verbal junco]

good man

[quasi mantle]

[pseudo sparrow]

micheal jackson?

[zinc matrix]

Yeah, he was a well-known pedophile, dude

[pseudo sparrow]

my bad

[fathom wadi]

wasn't jackson aquitted of all charges?

[zinc matrix]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2019/03/10-undeniable-facts-about-the-michael-jackson-sexual-abuse-allegations/amp

[quasi mantle]

I'm this close to calling the mods

[verbal junco]

I am a biiiiiiiiiiiiiiig big big big fan of marie kondo

[zinc matrix]

I think

[zinc matrix]

Dude, chill

I was just pointing out something

I never said you did

I'm just curious

Whatever

[quasi mantle]

You have some suggestions other than anime pfp?

[zinc matrix]

Not really, seems fine to me

[fathom wadi]

https://tenor.com/view/frank-zappa-rock-singing-gif-7204658

[zinc matrix]

Is that Freddie Mercury?

[fathom wadi]

Frank Zappa you musical heathen 😄

[zinc matrix]

Sorry

Hard to see with the lighting

[fathom wadi]

its ok you either love frank or dont know who he is 😄

[zinc matrix]

Anyway

Sorry for the drama

Tbh there always seems to be something I'm anxious about

[verbal junco]

want to be better to people? start by being better to people in this discord

[zinc matrix]

Alright

Apologies

[fathom wadi]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3cu8sDa90Y obligatory Frank Zappa imaginary guitar solo post

[zinc matrix]

Sometimes I just wonder if being a game dev is ethical

[quasi mantle]

Can't blame you, Freddie also developed nice mustache

[zinc matrix]

Which is why I flip-flop often on my game

[quasi mantle]

Or any work for that matter

[zinc matrix]

Well I guess even a social worker or doctor could be considered unethical if they buy or use equipment made by slaves

[fathom wadi]

ethics teacher must be an ethical job tho

[verbal junco]

I don't use flip flops at all

I think a branch is just fine

[zinc matrix]

No, I mean, I often have trouble committing to working on my game

[fathom wadi]

flip flop is better than a branch because branch needs a conditional where flipflop uses a bit operator

[zinc matrix]

Yeah I'm working on it with my therapist

Also

I hear being a professional game dev can be shitty anyway

I'm gonna guess most of you guys are indie and do it as a side hustle

[fathom wadi]

I have such bad social anxiety. It makes me try to be funny by cracking jokes to get past it. But most of the time I'm only funny in my own head, which makes my anxiety worse.

[zinc matrix]

Do you like it?

[verbal junco]

can confirm

[zinc matrix]

Sorry to hear

[verbal junco]

but also I love my job

so I can't complain that much

[zinc matrix]

Would you say the good outweighs the bad?

Example?

[verbal junco]

I measure that feeling in burnout. and I haven't burned out yet

[zinc matrix]

Well that's reassuring

[verbal junco]

so... yes?

[quasi mantle]

I don't think getting food on the table count as the good for you tho

[zinc matrix]

True

[verbal junco]

I get to order takeout every week

I feel like that's a pretty good benchmark

[quasi mantle]

Then I can say you're being ungrateful bastard.

[timber viper]

Wtf, you became a lead programmer somewhere? 😅

Actually you were a lead progammer somewhere right

[verbal junco]

US prices are skewed higher

[timber viper]

I forgot

[verbal junco]

or I should say NA prices

[zinc matrix]

That's the thing; I live a privaleged life, even by US standards and feel I don't deserve it, so I have to compensate by doing something heroic

[verbal junco]

salaries

I mean

prices wtf lmao

[quasi mantle]

Who are you to say saving da world if making a living is not good enough

[verbal junco]

save yourself first innit

[zinc matrix]

Good point

Just sucks thinking about those poor kids in Africa in the cobalt mines

[fathom wadi]

My Dad worked his fingers to the bone to provide for us. In his later years he worked as civil servant for the UK Government. He was a Chef by trade but he got bad psoriasis so he couldn't get a job in any kitchen. His only goal was to provide. He succeeded in every way and it gave his life meaning. A true family man. When he died, the government was supposed to pay his pension to my mother for 2 years after his death but they refused. I'm glad he wasn't around to see that or he might have considered himself a failure after everything. Which he most certainly was not.

[zinc matrix]

I had trouble sleeping earlier because of it

[zinc matrix]

True, but by using his money to provide for his family, he could've saved it to help already-existing people

No offense

[fathom wadi]

yeah that is offensive

[zinc matrix]

Usually when the population increases, more problems happen

[zinc matrix]

Sorry

Tbh by my logic, probably woulda been better had my dad done the same

Instead of conceiving me

[zinc matrix]

Answer is 5

[quasi mantle]

This is offensive even with low standard

[fathom wadi]

my Dad used to send us to Church with money he earned, when he earned little to nothing as a taxi driver, and we gave it to the collection. So he did help others whenever he could.

[burnt lake]

you sure?

[zinc matrix]

Okay, then I take back what I said

You Dad sounds like a good guy

[zinc matrix]

Maybe

[fathom wadi]

he was. Not without flaws but who is right? He lived his life for others

[zinc matrix]

I get that

I just hope the church he donated his money to used it wisely

[fathom wadi]

yeah they bought the silence of abused kids 😄

[zinc matrix]

Doesn't that kinda undermine your Dad's good deed then?

[fathom wadi]

it was a joke but don't worry it wasn't that funny

[zinc matrix]

Oh

[timber viper]

Still waiting someone to start memeing at #cpp

[zinc matrix]

I mean...you don't have to join in

[timber viper]

and talk #lounge in #cpp 👌

[verbal junco]

was this as a contractor or permanent?

[fathom wadi]

My first job paid me £1.50 an hour. Now I can ask for £50/h but I still live in the scope of old wages so it's hard to ask for it when people ask how much I charge. So I always charge half that.

[verbal junco]

oh wait nevermind I didn't read the part where you said it wasn't yours

[zinc matrix]

So ultimately how do you guys cope with world problems?

[tulip orbit]

I play video games

[fathom wadi]

I do whatever I have to in order to look myself in the mirror every day

[verbal junco]

I just live for the moment

[timber viper]

I always ask stupid questions at #cpp

[timber viper]

Wish someone would pay me for that

[zinc matrix]

I guess the consolation is that at least those who suffer with no hope of a future know they'll eventually die anyway

[fathom wadi]

I was going to move to South America in my 20's to help Ecuadorian Kich'Wa tribes people from being exploited by big oil companies, but then I met my daughter and she became my priority. Then the rest of my family was born so I've taken care of those around me

[verbal junco]

no see I just don't think about that at all

it doesn't even cross my mind

[zinc matrix]

Well did your wife give birth to your daughter before or after you contemplated doing that mission?

[fathom wadi]

before but I didn't know I had a daughter until she was 8 years old. Then her mother turned up at my door, I got a DNA test, and the rest is history

[zinc matrix]

So you're a single father?

[fathom wadi]

not anymore. I'm married with a total of 5 kids and I raise 2 as my own

[zinc matrix]

Well then I guess you have a clear calling

Not sure I do though

[fathom wadi]

or no choice :p

[verbal junco]

5 kids sounds borderline masochistic

[fathom wadi]

it is

2 or 3 is fine, once you hit 4 its a logistical nightmare

[verbal junco]

I had the dubious pleasure of seeing my 5 year old nephew over the holidays, and it become excruciating at times

[zinc matrix]

Well

I should still consider volunteering to fight slavery

[fathom wadi]

what if they ask you to do something you dont want to do though?

[zinc matrix]

A better world doesn't mean a perfect world, but we can try, right?

[zinc matrix]

Such as?

[verbal junco]

I'd start with one and see how that works without fucking them up or scarring them for life. then if I find out I enjoy it maybe another

[zinc matrix]

Like

Shoot and kill a slave owner?

[fathom wadi]

anything. Just something you dont want to do but feel obliged to because you volunteered

[verbal junco]

it's the only way to solve the world's problems, haven't you heard?

[zinc matrix]

Then I guess I'll have to man up and make the sacrifice

Even if it's hard

[verbal junco]

it's what video games teachhhhhhh

[fathom wadi]

raising kids isn't hard if you have morals yourself. It's the money that is a son of a bitch. Especially xmas. They all want £500 computers or £1500 PCs nowadays

[zinc matrix]

Making a video game isn't as important as helping poor oppressed people

[verbal junco]

the most common conversation in the US

[zinc matrix]

Hence my reluctance to have kids

[verbal junco]

I think it's just the mental energy I lack to deal with their nonsense

[timber viper]

lol you are just here to trigger some game dev people aren't you 😂

[tulip orbit]

we should be opressing them into QA testing

[zinc matrix]

Wym?

[fathom wadi]

There have been games which have highlighted issues that need resolving, putting it into public consciousness and donating to worthy causes. Not everyone has to be an EA that exploits kids into gambling systems or Ubisoft hocking NFTs and battle passes. You can do good with game development too.

[tulip orbit]

I dont even like testing for bugs in my own game!

[timber viper]

playing games can be luxury too depending on the location

I missed/didn't see that

[fathom wadi]

that was some quality vegan banter 😄

[zinc matrix]

No because tbh I'm passionate too about being a game dev...but I just think logically I could be helping more people by volunteering

[verbal junco]

I miss the time when I enjoyed playing games

[fathom wadi]

emulators are my goto for game boredom

[zinc matrix]

Yeah you're right

I hadn't thought of that

[timber viper]

When did you enjoy last time?

[verbal junco]

probably prey 2017

[timber viper]

But context is veganism, it's nice I wasnt there

[verbal junco]

so like 5 years ago?

[burnt lake]

idk

[zinc matrix]

Same

[verbal junco]

okay I did play shadowrun hong kong and it was a really good experience too, and that was a bit more recent

my point was more that it doesn't happen that often

[fathom wadi]

I have less than 17 hours playtime on the last game release I worked on. And some of that was online testing of bugs :p

[zinc matrix]

Also I guess I'm thinking too extremely here

I could be a game dev and volunteer

[verbal junco]

we call that being american

[timber viper]

We should have a troll detector lol, I miss them everytime

[fathom wadi]

I once ate nothing but potatoes for almost 3 years. Does that count?

[verbal junco]

should meat eater be abbreviated meater?

[verbal junco]

are you irish? was meant to ask you earlier as well 😅

[zinc matrix]

You sound like you've had your share of adversity in life

Good for you for pushing through

[fathom wadi]

no but my family is half irish half scottish. I was born, raised in England. I just changed my diet because I was constantly itching for several years (still am) and tried to cut out things like tomatoes, bread, wheat etc

[verbal junco]

I can respect that. I eat mostly vegetarian and I don't say anything

[timber viper]

Last game I enjoyed was HL2 tbh, and Bully (from Rockstar)

[verbal junco]

good choices. yeah good games are few and far inbetween

[zinc matrix]

That reminds me; I have an actual relevant question now; for you indie devs, what's your strategy for marketing your game?

You live in China?

What's it like?

[verbal junco]

hire a marketing department halfway through development to act as hypemen as the game is being developed so there is an audience by the time it is being released

but also I'm a corporate wage slave so take my advice with a grain or mountain of salt

[zinc matrix]

Well personally I was thinking about making the game first, starting a YT channel on a relevant topic and wait till it gets popular enough before releasing it

[zinc matrix]

This sounds valid too; how much do they usually charge?

[verbal junco]

ask them

[zinc matrix]

Pretty much

[verbal junco]

the correct answer is probably more like: more than they are worth

[zinc matrix]

I guess you're gonna say my idea is bad then, huh?

[fathom wadi]

I worked on a game that had 0 budget for marketing and it sold an average of 30-50 copies per year. It released with some bugs which didn't help the initial reviews either. But I wouldn't guess how much that would change with a budget these days. everything is so saturated.

[verbal junco]

if I wanted to I would have shot it down already

[zinc matrix]

Yay

Well

Guess I'll just have to figure it out as I go

Get the game done first

[verbal junco]

tbh I'm just not very knowledgeable within marketing practices. but starting up with a youtube channel about the development of a game sounds like a good cheap option

[fathom wadi]

thats not the right way if you ask me. Marketing should happen as you develop the game. From as early as alpha through to post-release

[verbal junco]

a lot of people make the game first and then use the money on marketing at the end, which means that they have no time to build an audience

[zinc matrix]

||Your mom|| is also a good cheap option

[verbal junco]

so their product fails

[zinc matrix]

Sorry

[verbal junco]

well unless you like gravedigging

[fathom wadi]

If you market a game, and get an audience, you can at least try get investment too

[zinc matrix]

Is she actually dead? If so, I'm sorry to hear

[verbal junco]

it's okay, it happened many years ago

[timber viper]

You are a disgusting sick person

[zinc matrix]

Well I hope she has a positive afterlife

[zinc matrix]

Takes one to know one

Nah, you're right I'm being a dick

@timber viper sorry

[fathom wadi]

enums sounds like Yorkshire Maths

[verbal junco]

you should have bet on it

[timber viper]

I'm not the one you should apologie

[zinc matrix]

@verbal junco I mean did I actually offend you with the mom thing?

[verbal junco]

I'm not personally offended but it probably wasn't the nicest thing to say

[zinc matrix]

Sorry

[fathom wadi]

I don't think anyone who has been on the internet for more than 5 minutes actually takes a your mom joke to heart. It's more of a meme than an insult

[verbal junco]

I think I'd feel a lot worse if I took everything written on the internet personally

[zinc matrix]

That's what I was going for

Seems like you guys just like making fun of me

But it's the internet so whatever

[verbal junco]

maybe uh

maybe dont say whatever all the time

[zinc matrix]

I shouldn't really talk about social issues in a game dev server anyway

[fathom wadi]

dont think anyone is making fun of you from what I've read over the past 2 hours. We had a discussion and it turned out ok. We are all friends here.

[verbal junco]

maybe it is in fact whatever the opposite of whatever is

lmao

[zinc matrix]

Why do you keep insinuating I'm trying to save the world? I never said that because I know it's an unrealistic goal

[fathom wadi]

https://tenor.com/view/banter-great-alan-partridge-norfolk-radio-gif-8397690

[zinc matrix]

I'm just saying I'm wondering how I can best use my life to help slaves

I never said I expect to stop slavery altogether

[timber viper]

Not sure if I'm taking the 'joke' too serious but personally I can't normalize someone making a joke like that, to me or to someone else

[fathom wadi]

if you can't stop it, you can raise awareness. So next time you see someone with an iPhone, ask for reparations 😄

[zinc matrix]

So get the slave owner's arrested?

Whatever

We should probably just drop this

It's getting us nowhere fast

[fathom wadi]

work for Interpol in the sex slave trade department. Then at least if you can't stop slavery, you can meet some hot easy chicks on the way 😄

[zinc matrix]

@fathom wadi thanks for being nice to me btw

Then what are you suggesting?

[verbal junco]

I think that's fair and perhaps in context it wasn't the best move. but also there is a point about it being the internet and getting offended over the internet ultimately hurts you more than it hurts them

[zinc matrix]

Okay I'm sorry

My condolences

[fathom wadi]

hey I understand the feeling of helplessness. I was like that in my teens and 20's. If my life had turned out different in the kid department I would have been working globally to help oppressed people. But that's also why I wrote to Noam Chomsky and asked what he does to stop the feeling of impotence in solving the problems he studies. His answer put me at ease to some degree

ironically the "your mom" jokes were refined in CS to peak level. They should have had a round where people do mom jokes instead of a pistol round.

[zinc matrix]

What was his answer?

[fathom wadi]

"You do whatever you have to in order to look yourself in the mirror everyday"

[zinc matrix]

Eh, I don't think that's necessarily sound advice; a psychotic killer, for instance, could look at themselves in the mirror without shame

[fathom wadi]

it comes with context though. I didn't ask him how he gets away with the moral conundrum of murder every day. I asked how he avoided feeling impotent with the knowledge that the world is hell

[verbal junco]

okay but if you're a human bean with a conscience you could probably follow that advice

[fathom wadi]

Of all the people on this planet I think Chomsky would be the prime person to ask such a question considering he has a retention of world history that spans 70 years or so. He's truly a remarkable man.

[verbal junco]

fine but only because it's tuesday

[zinc matrix]

Meanwhile Freddy Krueger is looking at himself in the mirror with his burnt-ass face
"Now there's one handsome son of a bitch!"

[timber viper]

Are you near Xinjiang?

[verbal junco]

guangzhou?

I hear good things

[fathom wadi]

how do we truly know what time it is when Microsoft time server sets our PC clocks though. Maybe they are shaving some minutes off to get more work out of employees each year. Also, time doesn't exist. It was invented by Sundial Sales Cavemen.

[zinc matrix]

Well idk if I fully agree with him ultimately, but maybe I shouldn't try forcing myself to figure it all out right away and instead live and learn

[verbal junco]

or maybe learn to live

[fathom wadi]

small steps start every long journey

[zinc matrix]

You mean like managing finances and stuff?

[verbal junco]

good food and weather, mostly 😅

[verbal junco]

no I mean like learn to live with the burden of being alive

[timber viper]

Is it cold?

[zinc matrix]

It just seems like ignoring a serious problem you know exists and can at least do something about is willfull ignorance though

[fathom wadi]

I drugged myself when I was younger to handle life. I would drug myself now but I'm still waiting on my prescription cannabis on the medical 😄

[verbal junco]

but we've already established that you can't do anything about it. so it's pointless to have anxiety about it

[zinc matrix]

I could volunteer

[verbal junco]

I kind of like this 😅

[fathom wadi]

I sense a your mom joke coming 😄

[zinc matrix]

But we're going in circles on this

[verbal junco]

your efforts would ultimately be in vain

[zinc matrix]

Spider sense is tingling

[zinc matrix]

Well I suppose it's possible even if slaves were to be freed and a slave owner arrested, another slave owner would take their place

Heck, maybe even the freed slaves would later become slave owners, but I'd hope their sense of compassion and hypocrisy would kick in

[fathom wadi]

yeah I lived the rock n roll life for a long time. But kids normalised me. I kinda miss it now im going through a midlife crisis tho 😄

[zinc matrix]

How come?

[fathom wadi]

because it was fun. I had a social life, sex life, had fun with great music. Now I sit here talking jive on discord and being burnout from game dev :p

[zinc matrix]

I mean...at least you're not a slave, right?

[fathom wadi]

I haven't had a drink in almost 10 years. Never did much like it. Especially how it makes people into backstabbing drama queens.

[fathom wadi]

Yeah a blessing. But I would rather die than be a slave. I was enslaved by bullies for 12 years growing up until I got big enough to fight back.

[zinc matrix]

Wym?

@zinc matrix also why is your pfp a gnome?

Can't it be a g'nelf?

[fathom wadi]

I haven't done any serious coding for a while now. I'm doing blueprint stuff for someone atm but nothing heavy. I could really use a solid plugin idea to develop tho

[zinc matrix]

Or perhaps a g'noblin?

Nah, that's totally a gnome, bro

I can tell by the beard, hat, and short stature

How?

Ah

Alright

So you guys think in general I should avoid hot-button topics?

just do not be a jerk chatting about them

discussion is fine

[zinc matrix]

Right

discording in discord, even more

I think I just have trouble making up my mind about stuff

I'm indecisive

[fathom wadi]

the general rule is be respectful. But its easy to offend with religion, politics and NFTs

[zinc matrix]

I get the first 2, but NFTs?

The monkey coin?

[fathom wadi]

yeah hot topic is global warming causing NFTs. Often spouted by people who complain about them whilst running a $1000 dollar 350w GPU for playing sexy anime games.

[zinc matrix]

I see

Makes sense

lol

what is the problem with sexy anime games

?

[zinc matrix]

Nothing unless you're religious

[fathom wadi]

nothing unless you play it for the child-like images

[zinc matrix]

That too

anyway, i do agree with running 1000 dollars video cards

worse is when i see setups of cooling machines running crypto mining

like mining minerals to build GPU in real life is not enough

you really need to exploit this tech

probably running of coal based energy on north america

[zinc matrix]

Brainiac systems online...

You probably don't get that reference

[zinc matrix]

@zinc matrix if you do though, good on ya

i find very taxative finding hookups to play with

so i may understand people using sexy animes

[fathom wadi]

everyone has some kind of kink. no shame in that I guess. I have boringly normal kinks. My wife has extreme kinks I can't provide for her but I have ones she can't provide. So visual replacements are a blessing 😄

[zinc matrix]

I have a sexy anime girl I made in Vroid

DST are another point

and kids, if you are doing hetero sex

actually i would be very happy if i could satisfy myself with virtual stuff

thats remember a song from Outkast called Synthesizer

the last phrases

Cybersexy Wendy web walkin in the nude
Digital good time, digital good time
Said she'd tapdance on your laptop
While your laptop's in your lap
Digital good time, digital good time
Digital good time, digital good time
Oooh cybersexy Wendy web walkin in the nude
Digital good time, digital good time
Digital good time, digital good time
Fuzzy logic, their pubic virginity

[fathom wadi]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnsq9XtpmEk the best synthesizer song ever

[zinc matrix]

actually some reflections, considering when the song was produced, are very valid

this one is just a strophe that appears once with a backtrack vocal rather than proper lyrics

Aquemini album is genius

My favorite song is Open Your Heart by Crush 40

[fathom wadi]

mine is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vi7cuAjArRs (I was at this concert too)

[zinc matrix]

https://youtu.be/Ad_GCc3qRcY

i do not have a favourite song 😦

as far my research from yesterday goes, this one is good

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvVTcUUEl8k

Mine or Marc's?

i loved pink floyd when i was young

then i realize that there is thousand if not millions of song to hear

then i try to not repeat myself

Ah

[fathom wadi]

I saw the complete Dark side of the moon live, then the complete live performance of The Wall, finally saw Animals live. I can die complete now

[zinc matrix]

i watched a show of roger waters

[fathom wadi]

most of Wish you were here too

[zinc matrix]

it was so shit

basically he executed an studio album cover of dark side of the moon

i prefer being at home than going into a concert that the guy plays exactly the same song as the record on studio

[fathom wadi]

thats one I'd like to see too. Alan's Psychaedelic Breakfast is legit epic

[zinc matrix]

but the atmosphere was very trip

[fathom wadi]

Saucerful of secrets live would be incredible too

[zinc matrix]

@zinc matrix I think I know your real favorite song https://youtu.be/Xhg1O4F84Ew

this one is the standard of his shows

a big circular screen

some moments were very psychodelic

sometimes like this..

[fathom wadi]

during The Wall when the plane crashes on the album, they flew a huge plane across the arena that exploded at the end of a zipline. It was so bright I thought it took out half the audience

the best thing about The Wall live though is they build the wall througout the concert, right down to the last brick, then knock it all down. If you ever get chance to watch it live, do so. Not sure it will happen again tho

anyway, I'll end up on a floydian trip if I don't goto bed. So time to hit the sheets. Gn everyone

[zinc matrix]

https://tenor.com/view/sleeping-gif-4521792

[zinc matrix]

What anime is this from?

[zinc matrix]

search for pink floyd sleep

on gif section

Ah

@zinc matrix so do I annoy you?

[zinc matrix]

with this question, you do

[zinc matrix]

Oh

My bad

totally your bad

idk why even you typed

😄

[zinc matrix]

Nvm

Let's move on

So what's your game about?

learning music theory

[zinc matrix]

?

a linear story of creatures learning music theory

but actually i feel so overwhelmed on creating the plants they will eat

and the major problem is, if i try to relax hearing some podcast playing assetto corsa, i can not stop thinking "i should be working"

i have like 10 hours of total gameplay from early 2020

i think the only moment i can relax actually is when i cycle

because i have to pay attention to vehicles and what i am doing

because i really like to cycle on the city rather than roads

oh and discord

i love to chat sometimes

I see

Well it takes time to shed bad habits

And develop good ones

i never faced a mental breakdown / burnout

and back in 2018 to 2020 i was working as a bicycle courier to travel with a bicycle and practice mountaineering

[zinc matrix]

Ah I have and you probably will but it's worth it

They usually don't last that long

i really understand what is to have a break body

some days i could barely walk

Ouch

all i did was sit at the floor and apply ice on my knees

[zinc matrix]

How old are you?

but i was young and eager to dream

25

[zinc matrix]

You're still young and have a future, dude

I'm only a year younger

yeah but i lost my initial innocence

[zinc matrix]

Wym?

the way i dreamed about bicycle trips and mountaineering and stuff that i did was brutal

idk how i did not died

i even soloed some climbing routes back in the days

[zinc matrix]

pursuing dreams is one of toughest stuff you can do

that is why very few people live the dream

[zinc matrix]

Yeah, but you only have 1 life so why not at least try?

and i never realized that or felt the endurance that it takes to live

You'll never know how far you can get if you never try

yeah i did not gave up, but there is a certain nihilism that now i perceive about that

at the end i dream of making games on conflicted minerals computers

you know

[zinc matrix]

I think I'm in a somewhat similar boat

[zinc matrix]

Slave labor?

yeah, if the word updated to nowadays terms

i met some slave people under my way

[zinc matrix]

Oh, did me bringing me up spark that?

You know, the long conversation we had earlier here?

i met a guy that made around 450 dollars at the time for working 6 days a week, sometimes 7, more than 10 to 14 hours on a organic manual labour field

impressively, he did not cared

[zinc matrix]

Was this guy a slave?

i think he is

[zinc matrix]

But he doesn't care he's a slave?

idk, i tried to warn him about the subject

So basically you're having the same dilemma I brought up earlier

but i did not know if we were too drunk that day, or that if he just saw me as a rich kid travelling the world and if everything goes wrong i return to my parents wings etc.

You feel it's unethical to be a game dev because of slave labor?

[zinc matrix]

no, just the nihilist part of it

[zinc matrix]

Wym?

i can not blame myself for others people dirtiness

still, i could be doing something else more productive to society for example

Like there's no point because we're all gonna die anyway?

That kinda nihilism?

[zinc matrix]

this one "still, i could be doing something else more productive to society for example"

[zinc matrix]

Well

Then do it

Hell, be a fucking superhero

Go volunteer on rescue missions

Who cares if these guys say it's pointless?

superhero is to solo dev. a game that i am trying to make

intelligent is go back to farm office and in my free time (which was a lot) develop some tech or culture of aeroponic stuff or hydroponic, which is way better for the environment than GMO cultures of soybeans or corn

or go to college and be a scientist and work for a good cause

but no, i am here and blender is open

i am just taking a breathe

[zinc matrix]

Then do it

Screw what pessimists say

If more people thought like Superman, the world would be much better off

And I don't care if people in here shit on me for saying that

is not about other people but how do you feel being a hero

[zinc matrix]

I feel being a hero, dedicating yourself to solving serious problems, even if it means going not profiting off of it yourself and making sacrifices, is the highest calling anyone can have in life

You may not always have to do it in an overtly direct way

But if you have a goal of educating people about a serious problem, even if it's through a game

You're definitely more like Superman than I am

my game is about a utopia

there is no money

no competitive behaviour

etc.

[zinc matrix]

Communism?

i am not raising awareness of conflicted minerals or about social injustice of the 21th century

[zinc matrix]

i never read Karl Max so i can not say

[zinc matrix]

Oh, I guess I misread then

i like to throw stones when i can

principally on tech forums

Well do you have an alternative idea for what you want to do with your life that's more beneficial to society?

or vegan communities where people think they are jesus of 2022 because they do not eat meat and fight rights of equality in conflicted minerals computers

[zinc matrix]

waste my time researching about hydroponics / aeroponic agriculture

but then i have to return to countryside

[zinc matrix]

What's wrong with that? They're striving to make a difference

and even if game dev. ruins my soul, i prefer this than that

[zinc matrix]

not when they are being rude with people who eat meat

there is so much elevation / feelings of superiority

like animal rights? seriously?

there is more than 5,000 people dead on 2022 because civil war

we are on the second month of the year

i am vegan for 4 years now

but raising animal welfare in any discussion just sound dull

[zinc matrix]

Well yeah, they can promote their message in a friendlier way

[zinc matrix]

i got really scared when i entered the group and heard the frequent discussion on voice chat they have

i though that there would be a land of love

and happy people

I get that

but is just the north american thinking they are epic by buying beyond burguer on fancy package

veganism was very revolutionary for me actually

Yeah

You shouldn't do good because of a sense of glory

You should do it because it's right

And the satisfaction of knowing you're helping others

[zinc matrix]

I understand you'd rather game dev than this, but...

I'm probably a hypocrite though

I'm probably gonna end up pussying out of doing more beneficial things for my own self-indulgences

But that doesn't mean you have to

And more importantly you shouldn't

But it's hard to be that kinda hero

nah, depends on your situation

and i am not responsible for big plot owners not wanting to be sustainable

because hydroponics are a thing but just not so lucrative like soybeans, corn

still, you can make money with it

but WAY less

[zinc matrix]

But you could be responsible for doing something to combat it

a societal problem too, as people love to eat meat

You have some power to

And with power comes responsibility

i think we sell less than 15% to food production

and the bigger part of this 15% is like, vegetable oil

which is a bomb for the health

ratios of 15:1 omega 3 and 6

[zinc matrix]

Who's we?

like, inflame my body, food

[zinc matrix]

the farm i should be working if i wanted to be the most ethical being of myself

anyway, if my game goes wrong i will probably return to there

[zinc matrix]

Sounds like a plan

Just do good regardless

but there is something sad of waking up and seeing up to the horizon field of soybean

full of pesticide

Don't buy the crap people are saying in here about it's ultimately pointless

sometimes we buy like more than 80,000 liters of poison

Too many pessimists here

some, if i spit on a river i can kill a forest with 200 liters

but those goes low as 15 millilitres per football field

[zinc matrix]

So that's your dilemma too?

[zinc matrix]

just an statement

[zinc matrix]

Every action has a consequence

And moral choices aren't always clear

we are on a loop

[zinc matrix]

A loop of what?

but yeah, sometimes taking the slice of society problems to resolve is detrimental

Well

I guess it's ultimately up to you

I wish I was the man I truly wanted to be

that is really hard

first because ideals change

[zinc matrix]

It is

But it doesn't mean it's not worth trying

You may not reach all your goals

But you can do your best

And that's better than doing nothing

[deep copper]

atleast you won't regret not doing it later, hopefully maybe

[zinc matrix]

Exactly

[zinc matrix]

the happiest period of my life is when i was working as a bicycle courier, pursuing a bicycle trip

[zinc matrix]

How come?

i was efficient in my time waiting for deliveries, reading books about various subjects

still, i waste a lot of time working for very few money

and at the end i would waste all in my own pleasure

[zinc matrix]

Oftentimes to do what's right or effective, you have to sacrifice your desires and indulgence

I'm not the best example of that

I'd hate to be a software engineer

yeah, if i stare my 1996 bicycle made for travelling i may cry

may read silly but is a thing for me

But if I had the strength to do it, I could make more money to donate to charity

[deep copper]

monetory gains aren't the only thing, if you get other side gains that you enjoy, it's neat, but if not, well, stuff is not always in our control is it

[deep copper]

i think what you mean is similar to "everything always needs a compromise" or something

which is usually the case

[zinc matrix]

I guess yeah

@zinc matrix idk the exact way you should live your life, but I can say this: NEVER give up on being a hero

hehehe

i really love the exercise

[deep copper]

i actually have no idea what this conversation is about lol

joining a convo in the middle never works haha

[zinc matrix]

It's about finding out what we should do with our lives

[zinc matrix]

Being a hero isn't always about doing what you love though; for instance if I were to go through with my idea to help fight slavery in Africa I would hate to walk through shit and mud under a hot sun in a third world country but I would hope that my desire to help those who cannot help themselves would push me through

Exercises important for everyone though

[zinc matrix]

idk, i was the owner of a mining company or a dictator or some country that has it

and i do not love game dev. anymore

plant 54, this thing is really boring

[zinc matrix]

That may ultimately be for the better if you're more motivated to do something more beneficial to society

[last matrix]

that's not game dev

[zinc matrix]

😐

[deep copper]

your thoughts are admirable, meanwhile i am just trying to do things in a way it's fun for me, rather selfish but hey, better than trying to do something I can't affect.

[zinc matrix]

romans be like

https://tenor.com/view/rome-roman-legion-roma-soldier-legion-gif-13885914

[zinc matrix]

But you can affect it in some way; even if the problem isn't fully solved

Some progress is better than none

[last matrix]

well we chatted about this before, and i think you were trying alembic but maybe had some problems? either way, if this is draining at least change it up for awhile

[zinc matrix]

sometimes i need bone connection for stripping stems

The battle for truth and justice is neverending, but does that mean we should quit?

[last matrix]

so do you have the logic to cut up or do whatever to the current sk meshes you've rigged?

[zinc matrix]

yes

[zinc matrix]

I thought you said you don't like game dev anymore

[zinc matrix]

it is called love rollercoaster

[zinc matrix]

I feel ya, I go through it too

[last matrix]

so with the models you made, you have them working, and where does that lead? like cooking or something?

you got something posted in the wip channel?

[zinc matrix]

to a plate at the end, after that they instance into a apart object

[zinc matrix]

nope

[last matrix]

bummer

[deep copper]

that's very true for most things in our life, you miss 100% of the shots you don't take afterall, however, take your example of walking in a dangerous land, you might help if you succeed, but you can die if not, and after death you can't help anything at all. it's an extreme example but sometimes the contribution you do doesn't gets anywhere and you return to square 1. you end up wasting time and doing lots of effort for something that didn't work out, you could've spent it somewhere else. all i wanted to bring up was, first calculate if you are helping at all and only then do it, which people usually do, but don't feel like you have to do it even if your calculation lead to "no gain", let it rest for that time.

[zinc matrix]

Yeah

I should do my research

[deep copper]

i should have used to reply button, the convo moved so ahead

the*

[zinc matrix]

I hope I can live up to the ideals I value

I've donated a considerable amount of charity

I'm worried my money was spent in vain

What if those organizations are corrupt?

[deep copper]

it usually is, the problem with charity is, it can be corrupt, but assuming it's not, they often just give away daily necessities. It's good and helps yes, but it doesn't lets the people stand up for themselves i believe, then again, idk much about them, i could be wrong

[regal pecan]

The more money you make, the more you can donate. Curious result of tyrants having unfair money is they choose charitable causes at a whim.

[zinc matrix]

Wym?

Are you saying their charity money is spent in vain?

[last matrix]

for taxes yeah

makes em look good

[regal pecan]

They can donate whatever they want to whomever they want, and if it's wasted it doesn't matter because they always have more.

[deep copper]

it's just for appealing to the people at that point

"look i donated"

[zinc matrix]

The irony is a lot of the big corporate tycoons use slave labor to get them rich in the first place

[regal pecan]

Of course there IS a limit... drug lords don't throw around billions to fix cancer. Have to pay for your personal hippo zoo too.

[zinc matrix]

A true hero doesn't do what's right for fame and glory though

there is a lot of problems in financing poverty

like affectinateUser said

[deep copper]

are their any true heroes who are rich enough?

[zinc matrix]

Not sure

feeding poor people in rural countries will just make them do the same stuff, probably having more children

[deep copper]

yeah...

[zinc matrix]

Sigh...

not that is bad, but sometimes, you are aiming at the wrong charities

I could try to convince them not to have children because it'd make the situation worse

[zinc matrix]

I just feel bad for all these 3rd world people with shitty lives and no hope of a future

It's not fair

And I feel helpless to do something about it

[deep copper]

the thing is, they believe more hands for work = more money, which isn't the case, that just means division of same work and division of same money even more

if you try changing their minds, they can believe yes, but it will be hard, and if you don't have anything to back it up, it's in vain, i wonder if you offer them some work or something, train them for doing what they can, they might become independent?

you know, teach a man to fish and they eat for a life or whatever that was

[zinc matrix]

It's even sadder some poor kid probably had to suffer horribly to make the electronic devices we're using to communicate right now

[zinc matrix]

Education

Yeah

Idk what to do

And more importantly, idk if I'm strong enough to do the right thing

[deep copper]

the fact that you want to do something for them is quite good, you might eventually find something better than charity

[zinc matrix]

the problem is that a lot of people that are in poverty did know how to hunt to eat, the problem like Africa continent is historic

people just went there, fucked all taking slaves and flee

or south America

Well you know what?

the biggest genocide episode in human history

I don't expect to solve all world problems

more than 4 million indians killed in 1500 to 2020

[deep copper]

that's also true, they are alive because they could live independently afterall

[zinc matrix]

But I can at least better someone's lives

[deep copper]

atleast in some way

[zinc matrix]

actually 2 million

i do not understand how we solve poverty, economically

[deep copper]

a small thing can make someone's life better even if a little, yes

[zinc matrix]

This often motivates me

if you give kids education, may countries politicians will cut the flow

[zinc matrix]

It's worth trying

[regal pecan]

More hands does create more money. From a strategy game perspective, almost everything has a yield curve and diminishing returns (food, money, labor, demand). If food is cheap and labor is desperate, you make the most money for the demand you satiate.

[zinc matrix]

we do not even know if we can support the amount of people alive today

and tell people to not have kids

o.O

[zinc matrix]

That's why I don't want kids

[deep copper]

interesting

[regal pecan]

Most of that will not matter by the time the sun goes nova.

[zinc matrix]

But why not make the best of it while we can?

i think there is a study that appointed that less than 2 billion people can live a north american standart of life

Also we may be able to travel to another habitable planet before the sun goes nova

so resolving equality problem is not only giving poor people fish

[zinc matrix]

Superman is the man I want to be (morally)

[regal pecan]

The best of it for whom? "Us"? Why not yourself?
Americans for sure overconsume. By some economic hijinx, you can sell Americans tons of cheap crap and get an overwhelming amount of money in return.

[zinc matrix]

Even though I fall short more often than not

[deep copper]

that's true yes, but improper management of those resources is often what leads to the downfall of more people, as it just means more people = more needs, although that can be worked out like you said

[zinc matrix]

So what are you suggesting?

[deep copper]

which is why i just focus on fun, i will probably go poof someday like everyone too

[zinc matrix]

but people earning this money are not humanitarians and probably are americans ...

[zinc matrix]

Don't you feel a sense of injustice and unfairness knowing you have a more privaleged life than others just because you were born somewhere else?

europe is aging to the point it may be a political problem and they barely can accept immigrants jumping in their country

[deep copper]

you see, matter occupies space, no 2 things can ever exist at the same location, and that means everything by nature is going to be uneqau. doesn't means I don't feel bad about how the world works. but there's just too less one can do alone. again, little things can help another, and doing that is "fun" for you, go ahead, like i said, i focus on what's fun for me

[zinc matrix]

Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree

[deep copper]

unequal*

[zinc matrix]

But like just think

Yeah we know we're gonna all die some day

But you guys at least have fun stuff to look forward to

[zinc matrix]

i think you should evaluate what your fun leads you to

i do not know you, i am just typing a self reflection

All some African cobalt-mining kid looks forward to is death

It's not fair

[zinc matrix]

if it was like this, people would just mass suicide

[zinc matrix]

Actually, they do often try that, but their owners prevent them

And even if they don't all look forward to death

[zinc matrix]

where you find that?

there is a problem of militants of internet and their resources

[deep copper]

everyone actually has hope, some form of it, even those kids might think "it will be okay someday" and sometimes death is the only salvation, only way to make it okay for them

[zinc matrix]

https://www.jstor.org/stable/40662817

i remember watching a movie about livestock suffering. it was set on australia (they have like more than 10,000 livestock farms there) and the film was about less than 5

[deep copper]

true, it can be changed, but it's rather difficult with the way those businesses work

[zinc matrix]

and then people generalize and take that as a main example

"worth's for all livestock"

Idk what to do ultimately

I'm scared I'll pussy out of doing the right thing

I'm weak

@zinc matrix you should stop blaming yourself for other people greed

[zinc matrix]

I don't blame myself for it, but I can blame myself for not doing anything about it

[deep copper]

if we are bringing in livestock then at that point we can just say "all some chickens look forward to is death, they were born different" as well, but like lutriq said, don't feel weak, you are atleast not thinking like those people, spread your thoughts, that's going to change something as well someday

[zinc matrix]

why you do not talking about conflicted minerals in your game?

[zinc matrix]

I guess I could

just do not add a dark atmosphere

trick people with cute stuff

But wouldn't something more direct be more effective?

and do something sick, yet cute

[zinc matrix]

if you have some millions lying around we can travel to africa and start a civil war

i command from discord

[zinc matrix]

I don't think a civil war would help

[deep copper]

it will lead to more losses, maybe freedom for few

[zinc matrix]

neither do i, violence is very primitive form of conflict untension

Best I can hope for is that I'll be able to join a group to liberate slaves and have the strength to see it through

so, you need to relax and understand that will take some time till people be conscious about it

buy second hand electronics only when in need

stick with companies that are worried about the cause

Okay

etc.

or you can buy new stuff too

i do not feel guilt watching my asus of 8 years of daily abuse dying

and it was brand new

[deep copper]

again, the companies can just say whatever to get audience appeal, you will never know where they get labour from actually, it can also be a third party labour

[zinc matrix]

Do you guys at least wanna help in some way?

[zinc matrix]

well, at least, they are emerging the subject

[deep copper]

if we could we probably would, no one is inherently evil, everyone has a form of empathy

[zinc matrix]

But you guys can help

That's what I'm trying to say

[zinc matrix]

like?

[zinc matrix]

https://www.ijm.org/

Sorry

Just forget it

Nothing matters in the end anyway

I'm not strong enough

[last matrix]

https://tenor.com/view/thats-the-spirit-rocket-power-hat-off-gif-15322942

[zinc matrix]

Yeah

[regal pecan]

I'd love to know who is.

[deep copper]

didn't you say you will "join a group"? people together can be strong

[zinc matrix]

I guess so

[regal pecan]

Superman's morality only works when combined with superman's strength and superman's simplified world of innocence.

[deep copper]

^

[zinc matrix]

There are plenty stories where he doesn't have a simple answer

And where he doesn't have access to his power

It's not about how much he can do but that he does his best

Regardless

Maybe it's best if we drop it

We're kinda getting nowhere

Just pray that I'm strong enough

[deep copper]

an internet discussion rarely concludes to something much

[zinc matrix]

Yeah

[regal pecan]

I think we're about to get somewhere. IF all that matters is superman does his best, why care that you aren't strong enough? You can do your best and fail. The moral of the story is that's good enough.

[deep copper]

like you said, just do your best

[zinc matrix]

I mean I fear I'm not strong enough to do my best

Like I'll pussy out

Not use my full potential

[deep copper]

if you aren't strong enough then the goal you have set is not your 100% best but 10000% or something, your best is always 100%

[zinc matrix]

I guess

[last matrix]

i dont remember reading about Superman moping at home though

[deep copper]

if you are talking about potential then no one can ever be in the best position they can be in, doing your best in the position you are in right now, means you did your best, right?

[last matrix]

was that maybe a bizzaro edition?

[regal pecan]

I haven't read any superman comics, but I'm 99% sure there's a few of him moping about.

[zinc matrix]

Well that's why I'm not him but want to be

[last matrix]

i can definitely image it

[regal pecan]

Probably involves a batman crossover.

[zinc matrix]

Well he's not perfect

[deep copper]

with how much of the stuff they made, there is going to be something like that in it

[last matrix]

pretty sure that when you wake up tomorrow, you can go down to your local homeless shelter and volunteer

[zinc matrix]

What I'm scared of is if I were to actually go through with this liberation mission to Africa, I'd pussy out because I'm not used to the extreme discomfort in contrast to my privaleged first world life

now imagine USA dropping out armies to combat slavery on africa

violence included

[zinc matrix]

I guess I could, yeah

i would be a very good dictatorship

Maybe I should start smaller

[deep copper]

if you start smaller you would be comfortable and have it all planned for the other places

[zinc matrix]

Yeah I guess

[last matrix]

starting small means you get to be right there and see the issue first hand, not on a flyer

[zinc matrix]

Yeah

[deep copper]

also your aim is to change those places to be as good as your facilities right? dw if it goes good you will manage to establish your privilege like things there as well, even if smaller scale at first

[zinc matrix]

Maybe I should just start with homeless nearby

They need help too

[regal pecan]

Alternate idea: Pussing out isn't a choice where you fail yourself, but a limit beyond your control. If your "best" is a threshold beyond which you risk breaking yourself (like a reactor in meltdown), then maybe it's better to avoid it and stick to your "almost-best".

[zinc matrix]

I guess so

[deep copper]

that's a very good way to look at it

that's what i meant when i said don't overdo yourself in that long para which idk who even read

take calculated risks only

[zinc matrix]

Yeah

Okay

And I can take consolation knowing there are people brave enough to help those in need

[zinc matrix]

do you mean cleaning someone else stuff while they puke of alcoholism?

[deep copper]

you can eventually make others also feel the way you do, and get their help

[zinc matrix]

doing charity sometimes is good for the soul but not much effective

[zinc matrix]

Well I guess it depends on why they're homeless in the first place

[deep copper]

one person's best alone is weak, but a lot of "okayish effort" from a ton can surpass that

[zinc matrix]

Sometimes they simply got screwed over

[zinc matrix]

i bet you do better job doing a psychology college and doing volunteer work afterwards

[regal pecan]

No reason you can't do both. The volunteer work could count towards extra credit.

[zinc matrix]

when i did bicycle couriering at night i saw so many altruistic people donating soup to homeless ppl at night

and that was it

[deep copper]

i read somewhere that most homeless people actually don't look homeless and with all the public facilities their lives work out, but if you look homeless you can't even use those and it's just a downwards spiral from there

[zinc matrix]

they went away of giving a plastic soup plate

I'm wondering at this point I should just give up on my game

[zinc matrix]

probably not

[zinc matrix]

Why not?

[regal pecan]

Now that is an on topic question for #lounge

[zinc matrix]

you answered yourself, you can find meaning on raising awareness with a game

i suggested already to not be brutal about it

[deep copper]

games are way too strong for messages, if they reach enough people

like you are interested in Superman's justice ? that's not an organisation for that but it helps way too many think hero like

[zinc matrix]

Yeah I guess, but if it doesn't have that it'd just be a form of self-indulgence to spread more self-indulgence that distracts people from serious problems

[deep copper]

you can eventually start your own way of charity or something, where you are certain you give the help the people need than the help they want

[zinc matrix]

i meant more in the extend of reaching more people

[zinc matrix]

Idk if I'm strong enough, but maybe I don't need all the answers now

actually i would love if everyone started to feel bad about eating meat and conflicted minerals

but that is not how it works

[deep copper]

you said you will give your best, if you give your best then success is unavoidable usually

[zinc matrix]

so a gentle message may be more effective than brutal honesty

[deep copper]

yes

[zinc matrix]

Yeah

[deep copper]

just brain wash them into thinking similarly, not going to sugarcoat this because games and entertainment media can do it well, i have seen children copying all the things they watch and play, you can literally brain wash people

[zinc matrix]

Tbh this may sound petty, but a key reason I often get hung up on emulating the morality of Superman is because I'm still kinda hurt by people who've made fun of me for being a fan and I wanna go against the stereotype that superhero fans are lifeless nerds

Superman has taught me more about heroism than any real person I've met

Not kidding

now read Nietzsche on the spoken of Zarathustra

[zinc matrix]

?

[deep copper]

who said they are lifeless nerds? tbh, as a fun supporter, i really hate people who judge others for what they enjoy

[zinc matrix]

it will blow your mind, probably

he writes about the concept of being a superman

[zinc matrix]

Yeah, I guess I shouldn't care what they say

But tbh

but take it easy, that gut is nihilist

Most of my reason is because I know it's right

there is no truth in 21th century

I just don't always know how I can best help people

[deep copper]

one thing i have learned is, that having a clear mind helps, a clear goal helps, don't cloud yourself with self doubt, as soon as you do it, you stop giving your best because doubt popped up

[zinc matrix]

Yes there is

there is another book Strivvy

let me find here

The Teachings Of Don Juan: A Yaqui Way of Knowledge

i did not read the series

but it is about stoicism

and psychedelic drugs

really pleasant

So how would that help me?

may help you loop in when you want to loop out

[zinc matrix]

Alright

Oftentimes when there's something I should do that I don't want to

I think of Superman

And the people in need counting on me

No joke

And it often works

[deep copper]

that's a lot of pressure but it might help

[zinc matrix]

that is generally where it lies the difference between default people and people making the difference

but be aware, all you can do in a day is your maximum

[zinc matrix]

Yeah

but crossing the line is easy too

so do not be naive for too long

I have to accept my limits, yeah

and some societal aspects are stronger than you

[zinc matrix]

I know

and you probably should let it be

[deep copper]

yeah don't try going over it, also do have some self care, because without that you won't be ready to give your max the next day, just don't let it become self indulgence

[zinc matrix]

Right

Thanks guys

I still dunno if this means I should give up on my game though

[deep copper]

it depends, what plans do you have to reach your goals?

does making game becomes an obstacle or can you use it for your goal?

[zinc matrix]

Plan is to finish the game, market it, and then hopefully have enough money to donate

[deep copper]

then, it seems to be the way to your goal

[zinc matrix]

It can be both tbh

or you can start teaching poor rural kids something useful like software dev. ?

[deep copper]

that sounds quite fair

[zinc matrix]

I'm not good at coding though

[deep copper]

although difficult but you sound prepared for anything, so that's probably a good start

[zinc matrix]

But I guess I should force myself to learn it

[zinc matrix]

I tried Python before, fucking hated it

[deep copper]

if the people you are trying to teach aren't familiar with tech, get them familiar first, then higher someone trusty who can teach them

you save time, use that time to earn and higher more

[zinc matrix]

And like you said, I need to accept my limits

[deep copper]

you don't have to do everything yourself, just give others who want to help a space for it and budget if you can

[zinc matrix]

I accept I don't have what it takes to learn coding

[zinc matrix]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-W12A9p8r3Y&list=OLAK5uy_l_r3-r2bHO7Aef_m--yRyLx6e4_DZ1bFI&index=2

[deep copper]

just use the skills you already have

[zinc matrix]

any monkey can code

[zinc matrix]

Not really

under a game engine?

i bet you can

[zinc matrix]

Blueprints are one thing

blueprints are code