latest-updates

[fresh cedar]

That makes sense

[pseudo wing]

im ngl, didnt even know that was a thing brick, i just manually did it lmao

[fresh cedar]

I’ll reserve my questions for the forums ig 😂

Dang gotta remember my forum login for my phone. Have it on my PC at home but RIP at work

[runic depot]

Sorry but you also need to remember it's the evening in Stockholm and I'm not at work, if you just replied to something and forgot to uncheck it i would've let it slide but it's different when you reply to something unrelated just to ping me. I'm happy to answer questions when I am currently active in the channel though.

I did answer your question on the forum post though: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/developer-diary-alt-historical-raj.1728535/post-30174364

[fresh cedar]

My bad, last time I checked the forum it wasn’t yet present. Thank you for the information and apologies for pinging at this hour. Mid-day here in the states, so sometimes it’s hard to recognize further time zones. Won’t do it again. 🙂

Ah, so EITC is like a slower version of Anarcho Communism, but “peaceful”

[runic depot]

No stress

[pseudo wing]

its Tax evasion simulator ofc

[runic depot]

Yeah. It costs far more PP to core a non indian state though.

[fresh cedar]

Dang

Very excited for it still. Would be OP if it was any other way I guess

Sorta wish nations like these could snowball, so if you’ve cored like 20 states, becomes cheaper, 50 and cheaper, 100 and much cheaper etc

Especially with anarcho communism

But for balance they’re amazing

[runic depot]

we made it so you can technically core the whole world but it'd take hundreds of years so in practice it's more like you can pick what cores you get, we don't want it to get op

[fresh cedar]

That makes total sense especially from a balance perspective. Even Anarcho Communism takes until like 1975-1980 I believe?

But if you just focused coastal Asia, EITC would have like 1 bil probably by 1950 I imagine

[rocky oasis]

The people hating on the new British East India Company and Silk Road Empire paths are a bunch of killjoys. These are alternate history paths and are meant to be fun.

[fresh cedar]

Ironic too bc Anarcho Communism, which is comparable. Has been one of my favorite trees since it came out

Plus Silk Road definitely is to just secure routes with cores, meanwhile player probably occupies most of Asia

[fresh cedar]

Noticed with any paths that try something new, people tend to hate on it

[pseudo wing]

That's normal with a lot of things

[rocky oasis]

Arheo commented on the Reddit post about the Silk Road Empire and said it might be changed, which makes me kind of sad because it isn’t the only path for Monarchist India.

[pseudo wing]

until people get a hand on it and try it themselves

[rocky oasis]

I like meme paths

[pseudo wing]

try replacing that wording for meme paths, since that word is technically offensive

like I aint gonna bonk you, just try it in the future

[rocky oasis]

Don’t worry, fixed it.

[fresh cedar]

It’s crazy because so many people use it too, it’s like come on guys 😂

[pseudo wing]

its hard to unlearn certain vocab so I aint mad, just gonna try and nudge ya in the right direction

[rocky oasis]

Appointing Pinochet Sapa Inca is one of the highlights of Trial of Allegiance for me. It is just a choice of leader, but it is hilarious and I really like that I can even do that.

[fresh cedar]

It’s a fine tight rope, because you genuinely don’t know till people play. But if people don’t like initially, they review bomb rather than wait for updates

Noticed many bad reviews on previous DLC were based on initial release not final revision

Many of their critiques being no longer valid

[rocky oasis]

If people want to do something realistic, they can go down the Bose/Savakar alternate history path or just go with the historical paths.

[fresh cedar]

Such much tree diversity too, love it

India REALLY needed it

Wonder if only India will be getting the monument, like Brazil post TOA. Or if multiple will

[rocky oasis]

Check steam page screenshots. You can see the Taj Mahal in one of them.

[pseudo wing]

can you link it for me real quick

his comment

[fresh cedar]

That’s what I mean though, I believe we only saw the Taj Mahal

[fresh cedar]

Wondering if others exist

[daring forge]

we'll have to wait ig

[fresh cedar]

Can’t wait to collapse the domed roof 🙂

[daring forge]

haven't seen anymore but could be nice to at least have 2 or something

[fresh cedar]

Feel like it may sorta be like in TOA, with how they only got 1, Christ the redeemer. And that was in GDR as a follow up to TOA to get people playing/looking at Brazil

[rocky oasis]

To preface, it was just how I interpreted the comment based on the context of it responding to a post on the Silk Road Empire.
https://www.reddit.com/r/hoi4/comments/1iok5pn/comment/mckpnmn/

[daring forge]

true, we'll see ig

will be positively surprised if we get more but no biggie if not

[fresh cedar]

Though doesn’t the trailer kinda show a main building for Iran?

[daring forge]

it shows something, but idk if it's an actual monument or just cool building for promotional image

[fresh cedar]

True

Could see Iran getting one. Doubt the others would, though Iraq does have a few

Agreed though, one is great 😌

[thick edge]

This map means that u can form it in 1936

Since Ethiopia is still there

Trust

[fresh cedar]

Probably did “Focus autocomplete” then did all the relevant focuses while paused and then did OP (occupation paint)

[pseudo wing]

or if you can get focus auto complete at that time as joe said lol

[daring forge]

noooo, that would never happen

[fresh cedar]

Devs have never ever done that before

They’re just that good at the game

Heck even Asa exists

[daring forge]

trew

using ff or fa etc is cheating and devs would never cheat

[thick edge]

Nah

They would never

The Silk Road is all cored right

Sinking, China, Skibidi San ma. Soviets. Turkey, Tibet, Afghanistan, Iran

Spilt in half basically

[fresh cedar]

Releases all but cores just to border gore map

[thick edge]

It would be funny if all countries got military, docking rights for the Silk Road

Like half of China doesn’t touch China

[fresh cedar]

Somehow I doubt they’ll have good relations with most countries 😂

Persian Empire is gonna be a banger of a path.

Can’t wait for Greece to get a +30% ATK and DEF against them 😎

Achievement: “Second time not the charm: As Greece, defeat a revived Persian empire”

[thick edge]

W achievement?

[harsh hull]

Achievement name: Our Arrows will Block the Sun
Description: As Iran, be at war with Greece and have at least 1000 aircraft conducting missions in Greek airspace

Free idea devs, if you want it

I won't tell

[drifting star]

This is not Sparta

[ivory vault]

As a Greek I feel proud

Greece needs to be reworked into not being a mess

[drifting star]

Petition for Mongol empire formable

[undone kelp]

Man, why you gotta make me do taxes again?

[trim quartz]

New colonies but probably no focus tree but still new colonies!!!

Also that looks like a little bit of Lebanon up there too

[drifting star]

Lebron James no way

Nothing matches prime lebron imo

[rocky oasis]

Alright, as someone who enjoys meme alternate history paths, can someone please explain to me why they are bad? The main criticism of them seems to be that they take away stuff from more “realistic” alternate history scenarios. all of these proposed “realistic” alternate history scenarios just seem to be different leader of independent India and Bose being able to get support from the fascist powers and Soviet Union. But that can’t be right since those things were literally in the dev diaries and dev responses. So then, what is the reason for these meme paths being bad?

[stable tusk]

The issue I have is the "Silk Road Empire" like that's not even based in history at all
At least the Mughal Empire and EIC were real things that existed, the Silk Road was never one country but a trade route

Also the borders are ugly

[rocky oasis]

Silk Road Empire is being scrapped. What about my other points.

What “interesting” alternate history paths are paradox missing out on with the EIC?

[daring forge]

People often like to follow a wave so if a couple people start complaining many more will follow suit while regurgitating the same thing they read just before unfortunately, so actually interesting critique will always disappear along the way

[stable tusk]

Oh I don't really care about the other stuff tbh but maybe a Dominion of India thing could've been added

[rocky oasis]

Convince me that India was better off before this DLC! (I saw one person say something like India was better off before this DLC. Yes it was one person, but it is so absurd that I have to mention it).

[daring forge]

it's also the people convinced that this somehow is what they're getting instead of a major expansion rather than as a side thing who get mad because whatever major isn't getting a huge focus tree

[rocky oasis]

Oh yeah! The criticism that the DLC that everyone knew was going to be about Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, and the Raj/India since Götterdämmerung was announced isn’t about Japan and SEA! I

[daring forge]

but tbh I think I'll just leave most hoi4 related things (especially like the subreddit) for a while, the content looks fun and I want to play it once it releases but it's getting annoying with all the negativity

[glossy finch]

One thing I've noticed is that all the focus tree UI is way less finished compared to Gotterdammerung. What's up with that? I understand that it will be finished by the time of release, but I'm just curious. Not hating

[daring forge]

probably just that icons are still in production

[fading walrus]

This DLC is looking mid so far

[daring forge]

like they weren't as ahead of schedule

[daring forge]

you've seen 1/4 trees

[stable tusk]

Seems like the icons were still being made when the DD were being written, the Steam page has full icons in the screenshots

[fading walrus]

true

hence why I said so far

I haven't made my final verdict yet

[rocky oasis]

Yeah, that is good criticism. Shame nobody has really made it.

[daring forge]

yeah I'll reserve my judgements until I see everything

[glossy finch]

I enjoyed Trial of Allegiance so I ain't worried

[fading walrus]

But King of Kings for EU4 though

[stable tusk]

Honestly, so far the Indian tree is kinda good not the best but I'd play it

[fading walrus]

that was a fun DLC

[glossy finch]

Btw I saw your comment about the silk empire being scrapped, what exactly does that mean?

[daring forge]

that too, they seem to be made a bit before release so images might not be updated to the current build

[rocky oasis]

No more Silk Road Empire option

[fading walrus]

Persia was more important in the EU4 era than the hoi4 era

[daring forge]

or at lesst that they're looking at it

[rocky oasis]

Going to just be Timurid and invade Afghanistan and Iran.

[south meadow]

what eu4 has to do with hoi4 bro

[glossy finch]

Do we know if anything will replace it?

[fading walrus]

EU4 released a Middle eastern DLC 1.5 years ago

it set a high bar for this one

for me at least

[rocky oasis]

Timurid Empire

[hollow coral]

No bourbon bhopal😭

[fading walrus]

Thats the Mughals

[glossy finch]

Is timurid what we already saw

[rocky oasis]

No, that is Mughal uniting subcontinent

[stable tusk]

Yeah but this isn't a Middle Eastern DLC
The only Middle Eastern country is Iraq and maybe Iran depending on the definition

[glossy finch]

So do we know nothing of timurid yet

[fading walrus]

true

but that DLC included Byzantium

which didn't have any territory left in the middle east

by 1444

[glossy finch]

Also, (respectfully) where are you getting this info ?

[fading walrus]

Paradox nerfed them for the early game

[rocky oasis]

@fading walrus Can you explain what fun and interesting alternate history paths I will be missing out on due to Paradox going with the boring and uninteresting tax evading corporate state path?

[fading walrus]

other indian states

[daring forge]

I think the most we know still is that they're looking at changing it still

[rocky oasis]

Like what?

[fading walrus]

like I wanted a decenralized monarchy for India

like multiple monarchs

in puppets

[glossy finch]

didn't we get that but with Hungary

[fading walrus]

TBH I'm only looking forward to the Mughals only

everything else looks meh

[rocky oasis]

Hungarians are the true Aryans confirmed.

[daring forge]

Hindutva looks fun imo

[glossy finch]

I still kinda hope silk road will be a secret path

[daring forge]

also find the idea of uncoring your states for resistance kinda fun

[glossy finch]

But I still think the company is cool

[rocky oasis]

Sounds interesting. The only other “fun” and “interesting” alternate history options other people have said is just regular history, but India just has a different leader… which is what we are getting with 4 options.

[glossy finch]

mad idea but reverse colonial empire would be cool and totally unhistorical but still

[drifting star]

Mongol empire

[rocky oasis]

These “fun” and “interesting” alternatives to tax evasion simulator sound incredibly boring.

[drifting star]

Successor to mongols

[glossy finch]

why?

[rocky oasis]

Because it is literally just regular history but Glup Shitto is the President of the Indian National Congress instead of the guy who actually was.

[drifting star]

Achievement : 3s company as the Mughal empire have sassanid dynasty rule Iran and the ottomans in turkey while being in your faction

[glossy finch]

Can you give me some examples?

[drifting star]

I think my idea would be fun

[rocky oasis]

Unfortunately, I cannot, because the criticism isn’t constructive and is just be more “realistic.”

[drifting star]

I feel like the Mughal path is kinda mid also how are they gunna work in the fact that by the time of this game most non Muslim Indians hate the Mughals

[glossy finch]

I see, respectfully I have only seen comments by you complaining about people hating tax fraud simulator (which I like the concept), not the actual comments.

[daring forge]

I don't think there will be a sassanid path, and those types of achievments where the ai needs to go down a certain path are always very annoying

[rocky oasis]

Good criticism! But bring back the Mughal Empire isn’t as fun, interesting, or realistic as this guy leading India to independence in the same way historically.

[drifting star]

I think There is a focus but maybe they can add decisions to restore them

• Iran has a focus referencing them

Also I wanna see some the different princes political ambitions represented

[rocky oasis]

Understandable. “Rather disappointed with the content here, but it's not surprising, as this just follows a trend that's been happening for the past several years of hyper-wacky inane paths in lieu of actually interesting paths.”

[daring forge]

Why though? the Sassanid empire collapsed in the 600s, at least the mughals and stuff were around much later

[drifting star]

There were some Muslim princes who claimed to be caliph there were others who wanted to unite all of Indians and one who was pro mustache man

[glossy finch]

I just some day want a communism path that goes to war with all imperialist and then creates smaller communist puppets of them, effectively reverse colon

[daring forge]

generally I feel like most meme paths are still grounded in at least 19th century stuff so it doesn't go too far back

[glossy finch]

Was there a meme path in Arms against tyranny

[daring forge]

like araucania and patagonia was a mid/late 19th century thing

[rocky oasis]

That isn’t “fun” or “interesting” and worst of all not “realistic” in the slightest. (I admit, I am being a bit hyperbolic. The “realistic” thing being an inference on my end based on what various mods have done).

[daring forge]

not that I can think of? some more meme-y things in the trees but no whole path iirc

[rocky oasis]

Punished Gustaf V

[drifting star]

Ur right I should have said Safavid

[glossy finch]

But was it an actual path or focus or just the portrait guy

[daring forge]

I feel like there's enough monarchist Iran content as is with their actual dynasty but yeah, would maybe be a bit more plausible at least

[drifting star]

I said that cuz logically if Mughals were to put someone in power they would be Sunni

[rocky oasis]

Nvm. Just remembered Viking Iceland.

I also feel the Quisling path probably also qualifies as a meme path.

[untold sequoia]

We usually operate on a 'something for everyone' design philosophy. That includes 'wackier' stuff, too.

[glossy finch]

british monarchist Iraq path

[glossy finch]

So the current status on Silk Road is "probably not", yes? Due to community complaints

[rocky oasis]

Is there an Arabic version of the name Edward?

[glossy finch]

I'm finnish so I don't know

[daring forge]

It's an english name so don't think so no

[rocky oasis]

Google AI says no, and I trust that over any deep research.

[untold sequoia]

I think so, yes. Not so much 'due to community complaints' as there being validity behind them. The path was intended to be heading in the Timurid direction, so the Silk Empire stuff wasn't a great aesthetic for that.

[glossy finch]

The path probably would just be unaligned allies and more middle east focuses, maybe something like south Africa taking control of middle eastern british holdings

In my dreams, of course

[daring forge]

I guess one could find an arabic name that translates similar to the anglo-saxon Ēadweard (essentially meaning guardian of wealth) but idk

[glossy finch]

I see. The colour scheme looked pretty cool though

[rocky oasis]

I assume that British Middle East holdings being independent (but not Egypt) has something to do with Iraq (maybe Iran too, but Iraq is geographically closer).

[untold sequoia]

It could stay. But I'm too used to the Timurids being red 😦

[rocky oasis]

Make them Prussian ||Yellow||

[daring forge]

red timurids just makes sense

[drifting star]

Do you guys think you can add some decisions to create Mongol puppets ?

[daring forge]

eu4 colours are stuck in my head

[glossy finch]

I think we need more purples

[daring forge]

including fars just blinking between several different colours

[glossy finch]

Finnish monarchy path my beloved

[untold sequoia]

I dunno, I've been slowly adding Mongol content on a branch for the last two years

but the time is never right

one day, the hordes will be unleashed

[drifting star]

Oh while your here baby sadaam hussain ?

As leader for Iraq

[daring forge]

no

[rocky oasis]

Obviously not. Funny joke.

[drifting star]

Just like that but give him a mustache

[glossy finch]

What game is this

[daring forge]

imperator

[drifting star]

Another epic paradox game

Which should be resurrected

[glossy finch]

Imagine if a sequel is about the HRE

[drifting star]

Border gore simulator where we make the border bad on purpose no way

Picasso was prolly inspired by hre by those borders

[drifting star]

Was not a joke

If grandma hitler exists so can this

[daring forge]

but yeah, feels like the only way ba'ath can occur in the hoi4 timeframe is in syria and even there they didn't really form until 40

-1 year old saddam forming the iraqi ba'ath party in 36 is a bit far for even the most memey mods I think

[glossy finch]

While I don't agree with that it should be a path, the focuses could be designed so that you can't get him before his birth

[daring forge]

the day he's born he becomes leader

[drifting star]

Ultrasound ?

Let’s not limit our self

[thick edge]

srry for the ping, but is ur pfp a hoi4 version of urself irl?

or is that just me

[daring forge]

yes that is a hoi4 portrait of him

[rocky oasis]

Peter Nicholson is a version of his HOI4 portrait, obviously.

[drifting star]

You know what would be nice the Arabia formable being reworked

[thick edge]

lmao

[stable quest]

The mongol focus is the continuation of the Silk Road. What

[untold sequoia]

This, definitely.

[untold sequoia]

(but yes)

[thick edge]

W'

[drifting star]

Imagine becoming the mongols from this

Please arheo can we make this happen

[long ruin]

Is there no nuclear Gandhi meme ?

Did civ trademark that

[drifting star]

No that’s too silly

[long ruin]

But Silk Road empire is legit

[drifting star]

It’s not that’s why they are Changing it

[fading walrus]

Are you guys gonna add this general to the Japan dlc

He heard that the US is pretty strong…

[drifting star]

Iraq and Afghanistan will go hard

Afghanistan raising the black flags and Iraq uniting Arabia will be lit

[polar jasper]

It is an achievement I believe

[narrow thunder]

whats their infatuation with the silk road lmao

[harsh hull]

Good money on that road

[fading walrus]

they sold overpriced cloathing made from worm poop

on that road

[karmic oar]

Hi Paradox since we now clearly see four new puppet state for France and England can we please have informations about them in a dev diary ? 👀

Have they some content , do their overlords have focus/decisions related to them ? (like how will come the french mechanics of the middle east investments and vichy/free france now ? )

is this new bunch of state the start of long serie of new countries splited from the big colonial powers or just a specific had to give some white peace possibilities to the Graveryard of Empire countries Western conquests ? anyway am a big fan

[drifting star]

Why are all the Chinese players upset

[stable tusk]

Because India will be able to core Tibet soon and Chinese players aren't happy China can't core Tibet

[drifting star]

Wait thats it. Bro they are actually cursing the devs

Look on steam they are going nuts

[stable tusk]

Oh god they are

[drifting star]

My prediction is that the Iraq tree will be the best of all of them

[fading walrus]

I hope so

This dlc is looking not good rn

[worthy wraith]

maybe because i don't know, india can claim the silk road?

See im not even mad about the land, because i fully expect a white left development group to do something like this. Im mad that india gets to claim the silk road. WTF?

and after this sh*tpost, paradox is hiring community mods on chinese social media. WHY????

[drifting star]

I pray that in the future paradox is more careful with how they portray history imagine if we got a Palestine or Egypt update the shi storm that would incur

People are passionate about where they came from we have to be respectful to all sides

[thick edge]

guys

u only seen 1 nation so far

give them a break

[worthy wraith]

the beef between 2 of the most populated country. I don't think anything could justify a historical game company stealing history

[drifting star]

Ideas for afghan paths ?

[dusk mist]

it's not very historical mate

[dusk mist]

eh

depends what you mean by respect

i don't think the game should pander to blind nationalism

[dense veldt]

what crazy achievements do they think they're going to cook with the updated india?

[worthy wraith]

non historical path is not a get out of jail free card to steal history

there's 0 explanation that you can do to make india claim the silk road

[uncut tide]

Letting India claim the Silk Road is like letting Ireland and Catalonia claim the United States🙄

[drifting star]

Fair enough but why are yall getting this angry

[uncut tide]

The inspiration is just poor.

[drifting star]

No offense but this is a game and death threats talkin about r wording people’s mothers is insane

[uncut tide]

It should be said that they generally do not pay attention to Chinese players, such as Tibet and McMahon Line

[drifting star]

hiduthua would have claim on Tibet as it makes sense with ideology

[wet python]

Honestly all of this is looking pretty cool

[uncut tide]

But to be honest, I'm not really angry about this DLC, because I'm totally speechless.

[wet python]

My one complaint is why are the choices for mughal emperor a rajput politician, a marathi prince, and a mysorean prince

[drifting star]

Wish they added Pakistan focus tree 😦

[wet python]

Same a pakistani, this is real 😔

[drifting star]

We got Jinnah tho

[uncut tide]

From an aesthetic point of view, do they think this map of the Silk Road is beautiful?

[wet python]

Yeah thats good at least

[drifting star]

Eww no

[wet python]

Eh makes sense for the game tho it isn’t really supposed to go super far

[uncut tide]

India has nothing to do with the Silk Road.🤔

It feels like the dlc gives off a very unintentional vibe

[polar bronze]

it feels like they dont really care tbh

like the paths of old dlc where you form the poopy empire and do stuff

[drifting star]

They should consult historians who are from or studied this region

[wet python]

I mean its a singular path far from the main focus I see no reason to complain

[polar jasper]

But it does?

[wet python]

There’s much weirder paths like having a bear lead poland

[polar jasper]

It wasn't just China

It was just all the trade routes from the West to the East

[wet python]

Thats true as well

Mathura was a big trade city with connections to bukhara and khiva

[uncut tide]

You have to realize that with 1.3 billion people in China and a household computer ownership rate of over 80%, it's only natural for some very extreme statements to occur

[wet python]

Delhi and Patna in the later medieval era silk roads were also involved

India has a decent connection to the silk road and the mughals even more so

As they’re a turkic/persian dynasty

[polar jasper]

I am processing how your statement correlates to the thing you replied to

Also hoi4 shifted to a ww2 sandbox

Historical paths are relatively historical and alt history is wacky

[uncut tide]

Mainly it feels too weird, why not give the Silk Road to Afghanistan, which feels a bit more relevant than India🤔

[wet python]

Historically relevant sure but india will definitely have more players than Afghanistan will

But regardless its just a funny meme path

[polar jasper]

The Muhgals were very important

For the subcontinent's history

[wet python]

Id understand complaints if the devs were neglecting the main paths for this silk roads empire

But they aren’t so its no issue with me

[uncut tide]

I think their anger is more stacked, from not having Tibet with the core of the McMahon line in the first place, and then the Silk Road being detonated now🤔

[drifting star]

They should make this a focus in millennium dawn

[uncut tide]

The main feeling is that it's too ugly, it's like eu4.🤔🤔

[polar jasper]

Border gore funnies

[wet python]

That complaint I can understand yes

[polar jasper]

But to be fair, you are conquering everyone

You just have odd cores

[dusk mist]

what exactly does it mean to "steal the silk road?

im not sure i getit

[uncut tide]

It's more of a complaint from some Chinese players who feel that Silk Road to India is not that relevant

[drifting star]

All I know is that Afghanistan will prolly have the most hype focus tree, takin over the caucuses and Middle East

[dusk mist]

right but what has the silk road got to do with hoi4

like it's medieval stuff

no one is trading silk by land anymore

[uncut tide]

So I feel like this proposal is stupid, it feels like they're not paying attention, they might as well change it to the Timurid Empire, and aesthetically this Silk Road layout is really ugly, it feels like it's raping my eyes😵😵

[dusk mist]

i guess i just need to read the dev diary

but honestly not having cores on tibet is totally fine

they only invaded it in the 50s

and idk if they got cores

[drifting star]

They said they will

Timirud is coming back boys

[uncut tide]

But during the Yuan Dynasty, the Qing Dynasty and even the Republic of China, Tibet was always under the control of the central government.🙃

[uncut tide]

Really? That still feels good.

[polar jasper]

I'm not sure about that

Wait, thinking of previous dynasties

[drifting star]

Was Yuan Mongol ?

Don’t know much about the region

[uncut tide]

China has controlled Tibet longer than Spain has controlled Catalonia.

[dusk mist]

they got tax brackets wrong though

[polar jasper]

Yeah

[dusk mist]

you would think adults know how taxes work

[polar jasper]

Okay, and

[dusk mist]

not true, spain controlled catalonia for like 1000 years

not continuously of course - civil wars and occupations exist

[polar jasper]

Many Chinese dynasties did not have control over Tibet either

[dusk mist]

britain controlled india for longer than china controlled tibet

yet they have no way to get cores on india

and that's fine

[uncut tide]

There's no such thing as 1,000 years. France controlled Catalonia under Louis XIII.

[polar jasper]

Not continuously like he said

[dusk mist]

i said not consecutively. they controlled it for more than 1000 years if anything

[polar jasper]

That also pokes a huge hole in your argument about Tibet too

[dusk mist]

if you wanna argue that continuity matters then china has only controlled beijing for like 70 years too

[drifting star]

Where do you find the challenge?

[wet python]

Since the 800s catalonia has been spanish/french

[polar jasper]

Pins in challenge questions

[wet python]

Whereas china and tibet? Not so mucj

The qing had some control

And then lost it when they collapsed

And tibet was good till the 50s

[polar jasper]

Yeah, the Tang and Song dynasties had no control over the area either I believe

[wet python]

Neither did yeah

It wasn’t till the yuan that tibet came under chinese control

[dusk mist]

and of course culturally very different

also, i hope the taxes from the east india company actually go to the uk

[polar jasper]

I noticed he's been awfully quiet

[dusk mist]

and aren't just disappearing into thin air

[uncut tide]

Britain has controlled Tibet for just over 200 years, but China has controlled Tibet for over 600 years.

[polar jasper]

Okay, and

[dusk mist]

not consecutively

[wet python]

Nah I assume they will just disappear

[dusk mist]

shame, they're basically just consumer goods factories

[polar jasper]

If Britain gets stocks from taxes, that would be epic

[wet python]

From the pov of the PRC sure

In actuality no

[dusk mist]

if consecutively matters, then that's incorrect, and if it doesn't, then your point about catalonia is invalid.

you are wrong either way

[wet python]

Yeah would be cool esp in a multiplayer match

[dusk mist]

100%

like if they're taxes... make them be paid to someone

it even says for flavour "to britain" but they're actually just consumer goods

[harsh hull]

Oh, let India have their Silk Road RP

[dusk mist]

UGH silk road empire looks ugly

[wet python]

@uncut tide 1951-present, 1720-1912, mid 13th - mid 14th centuries

[harsh hull]

It's the first time they've done anything in HOI4 in 9 years

And that includes mods

[wet python]

So thats like 350 years but never more than 200 years at a time

[wet python]

Actually check out the shattered land mod on steam workshop

Absolutely wonderful for india

[dusk mist]

does japan get cores on korea?

[wet python]

Yes

Time isn’t used to justify that one though the historical context is

Historical context still doesn’t justify chinese tibet as up until modern times china never had a strong hold on it

[harsh hull]

If the Thunder Dragon Empire can't core Tibet, then what does it matter what India gets up to honestly

[uncut tide]

It's just that the example is inappropriate, just like the UK has the core of Northern Ireland, but China lacks the core of Tibet.

[dusk mist]

northern ireland has been part of the uk/great britain/england since the 1500s without break

like 500 years consecutiively

it's not even comparable

the uk domination of india was also consecutive

unlike tibet

tibet has occasionally been occupied by chinese dynasties

[uncut tide]

Wrong, the ruler of Tibet is the living Buddha, and the Qing Dynasty directly controls the reincarnation of each living Buddha. You can understand that the governor of Tibet is appointed by the central government.

[dusk mist]

so tibet should be a puppet you are saying?

congrats you can do that

[uncut tide]

But it's intermittent, isn't it?

[dusk mist]

um no

settletd ulster in like the 1500s

retained control since then

had control over ireland as well all the way to 1922

[wet python]

What

[dusk mist]

ikr what is this craziness

[wet python]

First off Im assuming by living buddha you mean dalai lama

Dalai lama was a title the mongols coined tho

So not sure how the qing are involved

[dusk mist]

anyway as the guy said on the forum it doesn't matter at all what the chinese can do

it's a dlc about india

they'll get whatever they want when the pacific dlc comes

[wet python]

Yeah pretty much

[radiant cliff]

so is the game coming out then?

[wet python]

Pacific DLC? Interesting

[dusk mist]

not confirmed

just speculation

makes sense imo

[harsh hull]

There's gonna be some funny paths in the China DLC

If Silk Road India is anything to go by

[uncut tide]

In 1801, Britain passed the Act of Union between Britain and Ireland, which incorporated Ireland into the British territory.

[dusk mist]

sure, but for 300 years before that they had occupied and settled it

china never passed any act before the '50s so if that's your argument it's a bad one

[uncut tide]

You can learn about gser bum skrug pu

[harsh hull]

I personally can't wait for the United States of Sino-America path, where Chiang Kai-Shek is elected President and unites the East and the West

[dusk mist]

man britain's focus tree has so many rubbish 70 day focuses

[drifting star]

Ngl a United States path would be cool since it was proposed

[dusk mist]

look at al lthis

[drifting star]

USW

United States of the world

[dusk mist]

all 70 days and pretty much all underwhelming

[wet python]

You can just call it the golden urn bro

[dusk mist]

"brittania rules the waves" gives you 3 50% discounts on naval doctrine

[uncut tide]

If you include colonial settlement, then India mentioned above is even more the core of Britain.

[dusk mist]

for a 70 day focus deep in the tree

[wet python]

Anyway the urn wasn’t used to “guide the reincarnation cycle” it was just to confirm the existing dalai lama as political ruler of tibet

[dusk mist]

you are avoiding the problem, aren't you? no matter whether you include it or not, tibet doesn't qualify like these others do.

[wet python]

And the system wasn’t introduced till later on in qing control of tibet, wasn’t relevant till the 8th dalai lama

Thats 8 lamas into the system

[drifting star]

Dawg why yall mad over Tibet

[dusk mist]

USA should get cores on all of south america

because puppet states

[drifting star]

Yes

[dusk mist]

/s

[wet python]

Its just the guy had a confounded view of history

And its annoying

[drifting star]

Manifest destiny

[dusk mist]

well very one-sided and nationalist

[dusk mist]

start with only eastern us cored

[wet python]

Anyway the golden urn only picked panchen lamas not dalai lamas

[dusk mist]

spend game trying to core west

[uncut tide]

Aren't they just being hypocritical? If colonial history can be counted as part of the rule, then why don't other British-ruled regions have cores? Is it just because the UK still controls Northern Ireland?

[wet python]

Save for the 10th but he had already been selected by then

It was just the qing conducting confirmation in his case

[dusk mist]

northern ireland is as equal a part of the uk as scotland, wales, or england

[wet python]

The rest of the figures selected were all panchen meaning they were secondary to the dalai lama

[dusk mist]

literally

it has and had the same rights

[uncut tide]

central government already controlled Tibet during the Yuan Dynasty

[wet python]

Yuan aren’t chinese they’re Mongols

That was also an isolated 100 year period from modern chinese history

[dusk mist]

also "central government" is kinda funny to hear

[wet python]

And yuan tibet has a whole host of other issues

Yeah central government is for sure a stretch

[dusk mist]

like the very few rare moments when china had a central government

[uncut tide]

The Irish don't think so.

[dusk mist]

PRC history is biult different i guess

[dusk mist]

the irish got independance. the northern irish have the same status as anyone else. look it up

[uncut tide]

You mean the Mongol Empire?

[dusk mist]

ireland had the same rights as well tho

[wet python]

Really only late in the yuan period could you consider the rulers to be chinese more than mongol

Anyway regardless of the rulers ethnic origin

Yuan tibet was always native ruled

And had been native ruled since before the yuan

[dusk mist]

the scots want independance (well some of them), does that mean scotland shouldn't be a core?

[wet python]

As the mongols had already places sakya pandita into power decades earlier

[uncut tide]

Inner Mongolia is within China.

[dusk mist]

even some english want independence, should they not be a core of UK?

[wet python]

??? Inner mongolia is NOT in this conversation

[dusk mist]

yea lol

there is a reason for which it is called mongolia

[wet python]

Again regardless of the yuan ruler’s ethnicity tibet had a native tibetan in charge of it from even before the yuan dynasty took power

[dusk mist]

if you arguing on historical grounds then it is absolutely not a part of china

[wet python]

Tibet was hardly under “central government” control, it was a protectorate

Just like it was during the qing era

[dusk mist]

= puppet

tada

easy

[wet python]

Yes very much so

[dusk mist]

chinese players happy now

they can puppet tibet

or occupy it if they wanna go all 1950slike

[uncut tide]

Don't you think it's funny?If you really think Northern Irish people feel they belong in the UK, look at Cillian Murphy

[dusk mist]

look at the scots, the english, the welsh

[wet python]

They’ll never be happy until they can core half of asia

[dusk mist]

seems like no one wants to be part of the uk lol

doesn't mean it shouldn't have cores on itself

[wet python]

Yeah exactly

The peoples will isn’t really what the debate is about a core is what the name says

A core piece of a nation

[dusk mist]

also just look up referendum results

[wet python]

Northern ireland is and has been a core of the UK

[dusk mist]

the only reason the northern island is still here is because they want to

[wet python]

Whereas tibet has never been a core of china except arguably in the last 30 years

[dusk mist]

same with scotland

[wet python]

I think he’s exhausted

[dusk mist]

nah he's just practising his cognitive dissonance

[wet python]

💀

That was fun

[dusk mist]

so he can ignore how every one of his arguments has backfired onto himself

and make up a new one

[wet python]

I cba to wait for that

Ill see you around fishmonkey

[dusk mist]

ima sleep

cya

[drifting star]

Tibet should core China

Just to piss them off

[rocky oasis]

I want a Dalai Lama meme path now.

[drifting star]

100%

[stable tusk]

Bro the devs locked the Alt History DD becasue people just started arguing about Chinese history or smth

Shame really, I forgot to ask about an event for the assassination of Sir Michael

[rocky oasis]

India can core Tibet and China cannot with the new DLC. At least that is what I understand.

[fallow ruin]

I need Genghis Khan alt history

[hollow coral]

more children in hoi4

[rocky oasis]

Exactly my thinking

[rocky oasis]

Unfortunately the only candidate for that died in 1921.

[hollow coral]

yet no bourbon bhopal path

[hollow coral]

king charles is the true heir of the mongol empire

hopefully a future french dlc will rework bourbon path maybe something similiar to austria where you can put bourbon leaders in historical bourbon rules countries

[uncut tide]

There were also reactions to the poor quality of the DLC.

[rocky oasis]

What is the poor quality?

[uncut tide]

The leader of the Mughal Empire in the game doesn’t seem to be a Muslim?

[hollow coral]

no

[rocky oasis]

Did you not read the dev responses? You can find multiple Muslim leader options.

[hollow coral]

all princely leaders can be a leader

of the mughal empire

[uncut tide]

Oh, I'll go take a look.

[rocky oasis]

Portraits of two of them in the dev responses of the first dev diary.

[drifting star]

Osman Ali khan should get a caliph derision

*decision

[hollow coral]

why

[drifting star]

Because he claimed the title

He is also married to the daughter of the last sultan of ottomans

[rocky oasis]

Are you sure? Read his Wikipedia and didn’t see that.

[hollow coral]

im reading it too

[drifting star]

My bad she was married to his son

[rocky oasis]

Correct.

[uncut tide]

Will Myanmar have a new national policy?

[drifting star]

Very confusing stuff

[uncut tide]

After the India DLC, it seems that it is more difficult for Japan to enter the historical map

[rocky oasis]

Wait a second…

[drifting star]

Yea it’s crazy

[hollow coral]

you mean focus tree?

or national spirit

[drifting star]

She’s competing with her in law over a title

[rocky oasis]

That is the Ottoman Sultan’s daughter in question

[drifting star]

Yes

[uncut tide]

focus

[drifting star]

Calipha was prolly the most insane title ever

[hollow coral]

no

i would just read the dev responses

[fallow ruin]

the chaddest of chads

[uncut tide]

😨

[drifting star]

Redirect him

*resurrect

[fallow ruin]

im trying to but my necromancy is low level

i'm on tutorials on how to resurrect people

but it's difficult

when i'm able to resurrect him i'll let you know

https://tenor.com/view/roman-von-ungern-sternberg-mongol-mongolie-mongole-mongolia-gif-12344468482054284483

[drifting star]

Ask Cecil from invincible

Yall think the umayyads will get a formable ?

[rocky oasis]

I for one think it would be hilarious if 3/4 countries get corporate take over paths.

[hollow coral]

dutch east india company take over for indonesia

[rocky oasis]

The spice must flow

[drifting star]

Dune

India should a pan arayan path

Since Bose thought he was an arayn for some reason

[hollow coral]

isnt that just akhand bharat

[drifting star]

No that is just all the Indian lineage states

You would need the full Aryan plateau all the way to Germany

[hollow coral]

no

we dont need that

[drifting star]

Āryāvarta would be a fun formable funnily with a secret mustache man

[uncut tide]

Kind of interesting

Give Germany claims and cores

Resurrection of the Aryans

But I actually prefer Maurya Dynasty

[drifting star]

Fair enough

Isn’t it nice to have a discussion without insults

[hollow coral]

well you dont know fi they recently just created that account

itm ight also be a freelancer

[paper geode]

well even if that is the case, it probably meant that this dev likely just started doing content designing.

or at least being in charge

[trim quartz]

I’ve seen a lot of people complain about the new expansion. Players want fun, paradox adds fun, players don’t want fun all of a sudden and want realism.

[soft swallow]

Considering very recent events here I'll be removing comments that don't relate to game content. you can choose to get mad with me, or even better, post constructive feedback instead

[uncut tide]

Can you add some new national policy patterns?

[hollow coral]

what tf does that mean

[quick pebble]

what is these buffs

3500 weekly manpower?

that would be fine for luxembourg

for minor country i mean

but for turkiey with that buffs

it feels overpowered

[quick pebble]

it got better bufs than attaturk

[hollow coral]

not rlly

everytime ive played turkey i had manpower problems

[quick pebble]

you got daily compliance +0.25

which is already good for your manpower

[hearty blade]

true

[fallen zenith]

Its about 200k manpower per year. So its nice but not overpowered

[narrow thunder]

they gotta delete the silk road empire path and make a princely federation path instead

might as well accept the eic path with some extreme roleplaying but i cant imagine the silk road one bruh😭

[crisp rivet]

Or fix the border gore

[gaunt wharf]

Arheo's already confirmed that they're changing the silk road path to a timurids path

[narrow thunder]

oh thats fantastic, though even timurids seem to far fetched

timurids would make sense for afghanistan

or iran

i think for India they shouldve left it at mughals

im pretty happy with the fascist, non aligned and historical paths otherwise

[silent flame]

I'm so pumped to play as a company

Best path that's ever been added to hoi

Going to sink so many hours into that

[narrow thunder]

btw what happens to the rest of india once u choose eic?

will they be independent or remain a colony?

[uncut tide]

Why not the Maurya Empire? The Timurid Empire still seems far-fetched. If the Timurid Empire is given to India, what about Iran? Will it revive Persia?🤔

[dusk mist]

Same lol

Wish the tax brackets actually worked like tax brackets though

[coral drift]

How is it going with the revision?
Can we have an advisor list for British Raj and alternative Indian communist leaders?
~Peace, Mactavish

On top of that, have the Dravidian and the Dalits led by Periyar revolt against Savarkar.

[gaunt wharf]

IMO, Mughals/Mauryas/Marathas are all far fetched at 1936. The most prominent monarchist powers (princely states entitled to a 21 gun salute) at the time are Hyderabad, Mysore, Gwalior, Baroda, and J&K. Individually, not really covering much territory. The only somewhat reasonable viable choice is a confederacy of Rajput princes along Rajputana and Gujarat.

For this reason, I think it would be more fun to switch to and play out as one of the princely states so that you can fight/ally with other princely states to form some sort of monarchist entity on the map.

I would generally have preferred more attention to the political and monarchist actors who are already on the stage at 1930s and explore alt-histories involving them rather than revive a historical empire from ancient / medieval times. But that's just my subjective opinion

[narrow thunder]

any monarchist path that unites all of india seems farfetched, mughal and maratha empires seem the most plausible. another good idea imo is a princely federation monarchist path

[calm rain]

Please try to not necropost, we would much prefer replies stay on topic and are sent in a timely manner.

[calm rain]

yeah any monarch path would really make My-eye-sore

I take reddit gold as payment for my pun services today

[narrow thunder]

[narrow thunder]

icl that sounds like the best idea

play as any princely state in a battle royale india type thing

[calm rain]

the Mughal Empire rises from the ashes while dancing on Winston Churchill's corpse

https://tenor.com/view/tunak-tun-tuktuk-tuk-arabo-gif-7350381

[coral drift]

It's not already 24 hours and still on topic of the last devdiary
I thought the time limit is 5 months.

[narrow thunder]

idk why bose path isnt communist

[calm rain]

bosed

I take reddit gold as paym-

[narrow thunder]

he was a staunch communist iirc

[coral drift]

Should be Axis-friendly, Comintern-friendly, and Sphere-friendly. All three as mutually-exclusive choice.

[narrow thunder]

that would be better than a boring alternate tasteless communist path

[narrow thunder]

yh fair enough

[calm rain]

at least concerning developers, it can be troublesome to be brought into a conversation in a message that was a day old. please try to be conscious about pinging developers not in the active conversation

[coral drift]

Yeah, like, after conquering Pakistan, then what?

[narrow thunder]

if they make a princely states change im preordering 100%

right now im really iffy on this

[gaunt wharf]

Communist Party of India was active during the 1930s. They were banned in the 1930s. Then unbanned when Gandhi started the Quit India Movement. Could have been centered around them. Leauge Against Gandhism was lead by the CPI not by Bose

[narrow thunder]

that also works i suppose

[coral drift]

Wait...
Bruh, they missed the mark so far, then.

[narrow thunder]

mughals resurrection is pretty implausible, but ig in alt history paths they just want to make it fun rather than plausible

[uncut tide]

The monarchy of the ancient dynasty is a feature of the parade, and it is a must-try😎

[gaunt wharf]

Anyway, I guess we need to wait for the DLC to come out. Hopefully there are enough hits to overshadow the misses.

[uncut tide]

At least the Maurya Empire was an Indian empire, right? The Mughal Empire seems to have a bigger claim than Iran or Afghanistan.🤔

[long kayak]

I have high hopes for it overall :3 as long as it adds more fun things, I’m all for it ^w^

[coral drift]

Trade and Resource Rework
Befits for Southeast Asia DLC....

[narrow thunder]

they were essentially persians but im pretty sure theyre very well an “indian” empire still

[narrow thunder]

ig the iran, afg and iraq paths might make up for the indian one

[uncut tide]

Do you mean the Mughal Empire?

[narrow thunder]

yes

mauryans were indians definitely

TBH, if italy can resurrect rome i dont see why india cant form mauryans

[uncut tide]

It is like this

[hollow coral]

I mean tbf we count the qings as a chinese dynasty yet they were manchus

[uncut tide]

I also think that the Timurid Empire and the Mughal Empire are not as suitable as the Maurya Empire.

[hollow coral]

Im fine with timurid india path

[narrow thunder]

yh exactly that

[narrow thunder]

maurya empire is ANCIENT tho, compared to mughals

and the marathas only ever briefly ruled over India, the rest of the country would never accept them as a sovereign

only perhaps if they could be released in the deccan states and then u can conquer ur way into the rest of India it would be better

[fading walrus]

Mauryan empire stop existing in the 3rd century bc

[narrow thunder]

yh

[uncut tide]

And it was an Indian empire. Maybe we need to give the creators some advice? Compared with Timur and Mughal Maurya, it is more in line with India.🤔

[fading walrus]

The first Indian empire

[narrow thunder]

i dont think theyll take individual advice that seriously

especially when theres less than a month to release

[fading walrus]

Founded during the Diadochi wars

If anyone knows what that conflict is

[uncut tide]

I love the history of the Maurya Empire, especially Ashoka

[coral drift]

I'll take Maratha over Mughal.
Have their initial region only, then conquering the rest of India, with claims that later can be cored after some time.

[narrow thunder]

were essentially asking them to entirely remake the monarchist path, which they kind of are with thr silk road thing

[fading walrus]

Play divide et impera for rome 2

[narrow thunder]

yup, exactly that

[fading walrus]

They are a playable faction in that mod

And a fun one

[narrow thunder]

same could be done with other princely states

like a split spanish focus tree

[fading walrus]

The emperor who embraced Buddhism

Yes I know about him

[narrow thunder]

they were later replaced by a dynasty of their general who persecuted buddhists and jains and reintroduced hinduism

[fading walrus]

yup

Unfortunately

[narrow thunder]

so even their lineage is long gone, i doubt it makes sense to bring them back in the 20th century

[fading walrus]

But honestly the Mauryans are OOP

(Out of place)

[narrow thunder]

same with the mughals, they still have descendants but unless u think about releasing them in a region of delhi and make them conquer the rest of india, it is pretty much impossible otherwise

[coral drift]

Hopefully it become a tiered formable. A former dev basically promised us here to do it but he then left to a new Paradox game.

[wise oxide]

wherer is the stream

[pseudo wing]

unfortunately it was postponed, mentioned in a forum post here

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/todays-stream.1728782/

[crisp rivet]

[wise oxide]

give us spicy screenshots then

[pseudo wing]

I would but I'm not allowed to, but maybe I'll make some meme emotes out of a certain portrait later on...

[coral drift]

Wait. Leftist?
I'm looking at the devdiary and the communist India path lacks coherent foreign policy paths beyond conquering Greater Pakistan.

[crisp rivet]

That’s totally not suspicious

[pseudo wing]

We come in peace

[crisp rivet]

Doubtful, but I trust you.

I shouldn’t. But I do

[pseudo wing]

https://tenor.com/view/excellent-happy-mr-burns-simpsons-satisfied-gif-16091269

[fading walrus]

https://tenor.com/view/star-wars-anakin-skywalker-i-shouldnt-i-shouldnt-do-this-i-should-not-gif-19285530

[gaunt wharf]

Do you guys want to do something about the Steam Community discussions page? There's some massive brigading and meltdown going down over there.

Sample comment:

[pallid hollow]

We're looking into it, thank you! ^^

[pallid hollow]

Just to let you know as well, I removed the screenshot because of the actual content text - You are absolutely right about it being an issue though 👍

[gaunt wharf]

Of course, makes sense.

[wise oxide]

any compromise for the missing stream?

bc the dlc looks so interestring

[uncut tide]

Why not consider the Maurya Empire, that's really cool, after all, Italy had the Roman Empire😭

[narrow thunder]

how about another revolt like the 1857 revolt?

that would be an interesting “look to the past” approach imo

Mauryans is just too much icl

[narrow thunder]

they actually think indians are running this project lmao

the seething is so unnecessary

[waxen axle]

lmao why chinese players are so triggered at alt history india?

Mods on paradox forum and hoi4 hub needed to lock the thread

[fresh cedar]

It’s funny because as an American, I never got upset or knew of Americans getting upset with the Russian update. Even though it can reclaim Alaska. And Russia is our “enemy”. 😂

Because it’s a game, so why get worked up

[narrow thunder]

they dont like it cus its not "historical" for China, as if theyre forced to buy and play this dlc

[fresh cedar]

It’s like, yeah duh. Thats the ahistorical route

[waxen axle]

But how about ROC controling all the china? do they get triggered?

[narrow thunder]

dumbasses are angry cus india is getting content in an indian dlc instead of china😭

[waxen axle]

And they are ignorant enough to not know that china and japan will be reworked next

[narrow thunder]

nah theyre saying that India gets cores on tibet in an AHISTORICAL path when historically india has nothing to do with tibet and it is rightful chineses territory

[waxen axle]

typical people from a country that is dictatorship

wdye?

[fresh cedar]

Yet not a single Indian did that for waking the tiger. Such a lame and egotistical mindset tbh

[narrow thunder]

im surprised these people with 0 civic sense actually even have the brains to play this game

[fresh cedar]

It’s funny because yesterday a guy was blatantly being rude to Chak about it too

[narrow thunder]

ikr, its not even a forced update where they have to play the game while India has cores on their "rightful chinese territory", just dont buy it and u can still be happy with your fictitious sense of pride

[fresh cedar]

Like so turnt about it they’ll go into a discord and berate the community manager

[fresh cedar]

Exactly

[waxen axle]

And i expect a ban from CCP

[lethal folio]

When will the Livestream for raj be uploaded?

[fresh cedar]

But it’s okay for China to get claims on Indian territory? Lol

[waxen axle]

Hypocrites be like

[narrow thunder]

wait till the china dlc gives them a superformable all over asia, then none of them would say a word

[fresh cedar]

Kinda beating the dead horse at the point. Just really disappointed in people who pass such narrow minded snap judgments. Especially for an alt history path

[fresh cedar]

They’d be like “WHY NO CORE ON MIDDLEAST” 😓

[coral drift]

This needs to get clarified instead of just letting the anger fester.

[fresh cedar]

If enough are already angry about it, it really needs to be addressed I agree

Which I’m sure the HOI4 team is on top of

[waxen axle]

Who tf cares about what chinese thinks about us?

[narrow thunder]

theyre also crying cus according to them east asia has a lot more involvement in ww2 than middle east or india and so GOE dlc is a waste of time

[terse slate]

why

[fresh cedar]

To be fair, people also critiqued TOA heavily

[narrow thunder]

i actually didnt expect them to have a big player base at all

[fresh cedar]

But I’d agree TOA had more grounds for scrutiny, even though I loved the DLC

[terse slate]

same as toa dlc

[coral drift]

Well, if you didn't want to get bugged constantly....

[narrow thunder]

yea i get that point, but we did get GDR soon after

[terse slate]

but the point of this game is alternate history, while i agree european front should have more dedication. All other countries are important too

so saying a country is a waste is just blatantly ignorant imo

[narrow thunder]

GOE is just a minor country pack, not a massive dlc that all the lime light is taken away from asia and put onto the middle east

[waxen axle]

Paradox should tell them that china and japan is next

[fresh cedar]

Asia really needs more dedication

[waxen axle]

Its just separate team working on country packs

[fresh cedar]

WW2 was mainly Europe, Asia, North Africa. And Europe has 70% of the content

[terse slate]

everything needs a rework, imo we need hoi5 cuz the engine is so old modding is hard

[narrow thunder]

compared to TOA tho, the countries in GOE have comparitively more involvement in ww2 and have TONs of interesting stuff

[coral drift]

"China would get reworked in 2026, please be patient"

[terse slate]

for half the world, ww2 didnt start in 1939, it started in 1937

[fresh cedar]

I’d guess Japan and China would be Q4 2025 at the earliest

[coral drift]

Japan-SEA
China-Mongolia

[waxen axle]

Im am

Who know maybe its coming this year too

[fresh cedar]

Seems like they’re adding some puppets to the Levant

Could be a prelude to middleast/North Africa

[lethal folio]

No step back focuses are perfect

There is no need to rework

[terse slate]

ussr ?

[lethal folio]

Yeah

[terse slate]

italy and germany have awesome focuses

very organized

[lethal folio]

I mean it lacks a democratic tree but other than that it's perfect

[terse slate]

something like australia is horrible

[narrow thunder]

man screw adding more content to more countries, make a better economy, diplomacy, politics system and the game would become so much better

[fresh cedar]

So does Germany basically

Has a constitutional monarchy but no real republic

[lethal folio]

Really i didn't know

Probably because i only achievement hunt lol

[polar jasper]

Vic 3:

[fresh cedar]

It has a democratic tree but it’s similar to the UK’s constitutional monarchy

[polar jasper]

Vic 3 just needs better warfare and you got your game

[fresh cedar]

Agreed

Sometimes I don’t want to worry about building an economy though

[narrow thunder]

does vic3 have a mission tree system?

[polar jasper]

I don't play hoi4 to manage an economy, I play it to wage war

[fresh cedar]

I liked Imperator as it had a nice mix of economy, war and governance

[polar jasper]

Green line go up is your mission

Make it go up

[narrow thunder]

yea but dont u think the current one is WAY too rudimentary?

[lethal folio]

I never understood vic 3 tbqh for example what buildings i should build, political alliances etc

[polar jasper]

Nah

[narrow thunder]

ur currency is essentially just civillian factories

[polar jasper]

Consumer goods is all the economy I need

I see no issues

[fresh cedar]

HOI4 is primarily a war game, not an economy builder

[polar jasper]

Game is complex enough already

Diplomacy could be a bit better

[fresh cedar]

Millenium Dawn tried economy and it’s awful

[polar jasper]

But it is a war game primarily

[fresh cedar]

No debate on diplomacy and factions needing a rework

[narrow thunder]

fine ig, but yea diplomacy needs a lot more possible interactions

[lethal folio]

Yeah but when you are supposed to make a trade deal or buy something and the only currency is civilian factories its ridiculous

[polar jasper]

Trade just needs to have stockpiles

Then I'm fine

I don't see the issue with civs being used as economy

[lethal folio]

Or be measured in tons like irl and its production should be based on there

[fresh cedar]

Nah it’s fine. I think it can maybe have a few more uses but don’t need an overly complex economy

[polar jasper]

I just want to trade 15 civs for 100 days and build a stockpile of rubber to last me a few years of war

[fresh cedar]

Agreed

Then raids could just bomb your stockpile 😂

[polar jasper]

That way I don't need to focus as hard on refineries as Germany

That would be ultra comedic

I like that

Does blowing up fuel silos actually do anything

[fresh cedar]

Yeah it limits your fuel supply basically

[lethal folio]

I'm not talking about vic3 economic system being implemented on hoi4

[polar jasper]

Then how would you implement it

[fresh cedar]

Please give me a rundown of your proposed HOI4 economic rework

[lethal folio]

Im just saying that it should have money but limited to 3 or 4 uses

Like trade deals buying land equipment or swaying countries to your side

[polar jasper]

Money is like IC, right?

Maybe you can dedicate civs to IC production and then trade with IC

And it would be like a set deal

[lethal folio]

Also political parties should be reworked as well

[polar jasper]

10000 IC for 100 daily rubber for 2 years. This is if a stockpile system is added

[polar jasper]

Honestly, nah

You got 4 alignments

In them are a bunch of ideologies

Alignments give rules

[lethal folio]

Yeah true

[polar jasper]

And focuses can adjust said rules

People complain about anarchism and monarchy being non aligned, but they are not aligned with the other 3 alignment groups

[lethal folio]

What about focuses

[narrow thunder]

a basic budget system couldve been cool

like the cold war iron curtain type economics

[uncut tide]

In fact, I think there is no need for Chinese players to argue like this

After all, Turkish players are not in a hurry

Although the Silk Road idea is indeed terrible, I am more bored than angry.🙃

[drifting star]

I think they postponed the stream to give them time to redo that side of the tree

[rocky oasis]

This is literally 1984.

[uncut tide]

I thought this DLC would make Egypt

But it seems that there is no

[coral drift]

They can play the historical tree for the stream, though....

[coral drift]

My East Indies mod has a NSB-Oost Indie path that has some references to the Compagnie and aimed to retake VOC's possessions. But only as claims, not cores, albeit they can be "pacified".

[cinder hawk]

Finally iran update
Took em long enough

[daring forge]

too far west, I'd rather them be added once they also can get content

having more content interacting with the north african campaign and whatever rather than just generic focuses

[uncut tide]

I think he has a few more dlc plans left🤔

Does Egypt really have a chance? It seems like it can't be included in the same DLC as any other country.🤔🤔

[coral drift]

I'm more leaning to "eventually every country would have their contents"

[daring forge]

a country pack with arabia ig

[uncut tide]

Makes sense

[coral drift]

Pleaseaddagoodcommiepath
Pleaseaddagoodcommiepath
Pleaseaddagoodcommiepath

[daring forge]

my main confusion is like now with WTT integrated China will eventually get content that will probably fix the majority of issues with the current stuff, so why get so angry now

[daring forge]

What would be classed as a good communist path? (not trying to argue or anything, genuinely curious)

[coral drift]

Well, the current Indian foreign policy path has India annexing Greater Pakistan. And it ends.

[uncut tide]

You have to know that China has a population of 1.3 billion. No matter how niche the game is, the number of people playing it is definitely huge, and there will definitely be some discordant voices.😂

[daring forge]

true ig, just feels like such a small thing to start spamming negative stuff over

[rocky oasis]

This caused me to think about something. People (maybe somewhat jokingly) complain about the only communist paths being go it alone or go with the Soviet Union, but is there really another option?

[polar jasper]

What is with you and China

They can't even play this game

Hoi4 got banned because of how the warlords are represented

And Taiwan and Tibet

[daring forge]

yeah I agree that it could continue a bit more but I was more thinking in general

[daring forge]

the game isn't directly available on steam but dlc are, there's a huge playerbase in china

[coral drift]

But not the actual head of House of Timur, Mirza Khurshid Jah Bahadur.

[daring forge]

yeah that's what I'm thinking, there's obviously a lot of possible flavour options depending on the country but in that matter not really, there's generally one big communist power and that's the USSR

[uncut tide]

It is available when it is discounted

[rocky oasis]

Find a good photo of him and take it up with the devs. Also, tell them to add a Bourbon-Bhopal option while you are at it.

[coral drift]

For me, they can establish their own bloc if Soviet Union is dissolved.
Else, declaring themselves as heralds of the 4th International

[uncut tide]

Actually, I am very curious. If Timur and Mughal were given to India, what would happen to Afghanistan?🤔

[daring forge]

I don't think they have the time or means to add more characters now, but maybe in like a war effort or something ig

[rocky oasis]

We shall see next week.

[uncut tide]

I also think they don't need to be so excited.

[coral drift]

It's in 1931, btw.

[rocky oasis]

Unfortunately for you I am not a dev. Or a good artist, like at all for that matter.

[coral drift]

Yeah, i know
Just sending it here to show that a picture of him exist.

[rocky oasis]

Probably good enough. Pretty sure the Semyonov portrait is from a photo of him in the 1920s.

[coral drift]

Well, no Netaji aligning with the Comintern or Axis paths, or Savarkar pushing too hard and has the Dravidans and Dalits rebelling against him and i can play as it. So, no fun there at all.

[rocky oasis]

Maybe send try to post on the forums?

[coral drift]

When they opened it again.

I already vouched for someone who told the devs about him. I forgot if they already sent his photo or not.

[rocky oasis]

Ask him.

[rocky oasis]

When you say aligning do you mean explicitly joining the Axis/Co-Prosperity Sphere or Comintern?

[coral drift]

Naah, i'll take a look on the forum when i'm done scrolling this channel.

[rocky oasis]

Ok.

[coral drift]

Yes, joining one of his backers for the Indian War of Independence.
Not necessarily turned him into another ideology, but add a diplomatic acceptance modifier.

[rocky oasis]

Yeah, I can agree that Paradox should add something like that.

Not sure how hard it would be or how they would. Not a coder/game developer/whatever.

[coral drift]

There is already a pro-Japan path there.
The German/Soviet mutually exclusive branch with Japan should've been hidden if one or all of them didn't back him

[rocky oasis]

There is a bit of flavor yes. That is why I was asking about if you meant joining a faction.

[daring forge]

I mean as a low prio path Dravida Nadu could have been interesting but don't find it to be a must have or anything

[coral drift]

Maybe. Just a flavor path for anti-Savarkar rebellion.

Like how Islamist Turkey fight the Kemalists and facilitating the return of the Sultanate.

[daring forge]

might even play around and make a mod for it if I have time over, we´ll see

[coral drift]

I love Imperator

[daring forge]

yeah maybe

[fading walrus]

Didnt like it myself I prefer the Divide et impera mod for rome 2

But your free to have your opinion

[coral drift]

Hmm, done checking, his pictures aren't there yet.....

[narrow thunder]

wb an 1857 rebellion part 2?

[coral drift]

The funny thing is that while the Chinese are angry about a supposed Indian plot, the Indians themselves are angry at Paradox too for not fleshing out the communist and fascist paths. Very ironic, i would say.

[narrow thunder]

fascist path is good imo

the communist path suffers the same neglect as it does in every other focus tree

[boreal blaze]

I really hope we get a “negotiate peace” option, not just conditional surrender, just to get me out of an endless death war that neither of us can end

Hell even a “request ceasefire” would be cool with me

[coral drift]

Whoops, i meant by the Nationalist path.
Gimme Red Netaji

[narrow thunder]

icl that would really overcomplicate the tree

i think leaving him non-aligned is more practical and also more historically accurate

cus he collaborated with the japanese afterall

[agile dagger]

these borders are sooo nice

[outer whale]

man

[summer rivet]

😭 holy shit its stupitter then i thought

i thought its because of how the silk road empire looked

not wither india can core tibet and afganistan or not

[eternal flume]

Isn’t there supposed to be a live stream today

[rocky oasis]

Rescheduled, presumably because they are reworking some of the India content.

[rocky oasis]

A thought that I had was that in the future China might have gotten the option for the Silk Road Empire as well in the future.

[summer rivet]

it will come in the east asian rework

[drifting star]

China and India reworks would be great

[summer rivet]

because theres also japan and australia and newzealand and malaysia and indonesia

[rocky oasis]

It won’t, because they are scrapping the Silk Road Empire.

[drifting star]

Timirud empire would be so cool

[summer rivet]

damn 😔

[drifting star]

Or maybe some more Mughal content

Focusing more on then being a former gunpowder empire bonuses to artillery etc

Mills, resource extraction

[summer rivet]

those indeed are epic

[drifting star]

This would be the alt history I’d like to see

Respectful to the history while being fun

[summer rivet]

true

[drifting star]

Hopefully a dev sees this

[summer rivet]

hopefully

[drifting star]

If I recall they had some interest in the Arabian peninsula at some point

[summer rivet]

though in case they do see this

please give iran twice as many focuses as Belgium

[drifting star]

lol

[summer rivet]

hear me out, belgiums neuturality was violated once, irans neuturality was violated twice, twice the suffering therefore twice the focuses

the twice is once by UK and once by USSR at the same time

[hollow olive]

Damn

Someone will probably add it back in a mod

[floral anvil]

Where is the Raj Stream?

[thick edge]

I ate it

[fading walrus]

https://tenor.com/view/ate-it-all-in-one-bite-spongebob-sponge-bob-ate-it-all-squidward-ate-it-all-in-one-bite-gif-9593916011418852498

[drifting star]

What else besides Arabia could Iraq do? Does anyone know the history of?

[fossil otter]

which one it better

[drifting star]

Right

[frosty dove]

Choose left only if you are Germany

Anyone else is right

[drifting star]

If paradox messes up Afghanistan and Iraq I’m quitting this game

[rocky oasis]

We shall see on Tuesday then.

[thick edge]

https://youtube.com/shorts/HIkUBEY6urI?si=tMA7CzfwU17iF7mP

Literally me when I get elephants

[keen ferry]

did paradox post the raj stream?