hoi4-general

[sly sluice]

i still don't know what they do in combat

🤌

alright

now i need the stats

also

how do i choose what ship stay's behind or the ones that go upfront in the battle?

[marsh ravine]

you dont

screens front

then capitals

then carriers

[sly sluice]

so my best bet at having a good air defense is having my AA guns on the carriers?

or atleast a stable one

also

are heavy cruisers considered screen or capitals?

[tulip thorn]

They are a capital ship

[sly sluice]

huh

so like a budget option for battleships

[opal nymph]

Yeah

I mostly use them as spotting cruisers to screen for my escort carriers

[tulip thorn]

Ehhhh

I guess

Ish

Yeah

Half the cost for half the stats

roughly

Going based on what modules italy starts with

[opal nymph]

It is funny how cruiser killers cant kill cruisers

Heavy cruisers are designed to take out cruisers

[tulip thorn]

lol

[opal nymph]

Screens can attack capitals though, right?

[tulip thorn]

Idk

[sly sluice]

alright

[opal nymph]

It would be interesting to have a heavy attack screen

[tulip thorn]

I've had my super heavy battleships sink nothing but screens

I wish I was kidding

idk how either, they had 0 light attack

[sly sluice]

im gonna try to beat the us as the uk in a game so i understand navy better and once i can do that i'll switch to countries that are gonna be harder to fight the us with

[opal nymph]

Why not play the US and take out the Japanese and Italian fleets

[tulip thorn]

Time to make 30 aircraft carriers by 1940

[tulip thorn]

Italian fleet still being around by 1941 💔

[sly sluice]

because the us navy is overwhelming to me

[opal nymph]

Limited Intervention US?

[tulip thorn]

I honestly forgot that this path exists

[opal nymph]

Have you heard of the mythical "distribute into even task forces" button?

[tulip thorn]

I maybe did it once 2 years ago

[sly sluice]

no

[opal nymph]

It is a button that looks like a balance

First group all of your ships into 1 fleet then click it

[tulip thorn]

Is this button good?

Never used it

I prefer to micro everything

[opal nymph]

I only use it to start organizing

The task forces they give are mediocre

[brave steeple]

i hate how the hoi4 focus lines are so i changed it in microsoft paint

[opal nymph]

As they are a max of 40 ships for a carrier task force and 25 for everything else but a screen fleet

[dusky burrow]

a budget option for battleships that unfortunately doesn't work too well 🙁

[opal nymph]

I just use it to split my navy in half

[brave steeple]

eg.

[dusky burrow]

but if you want something quick then sure

[tulip thorn]

Paradox please let me stack heavy attack on a destroyer. Its a great idea trust

[dusky burrow]

LMAO

[opal nymph]

As the US, I have an Atlantic fleet, Pacific fleet (bigger than Atlantic of course), sub fleet, and patrol fleet

[opal nymph]

Would heavy cruisers be okay if they were considered screens, but was able to have both heavy and soft attack

[tulip thorn]

As the us ill have a main fleet and a patrol fleet until I deal with japan. Then ill slit the main fleet to fight italy and germany while making a 2nd patrol fleet

[sly sluice]

why tf does 1936 uk has more infrastructure then 1939 uk?

[opal nymph]

I have no idea if the heavy attack would even work as a screen

[tulip thorn]

I pretty much never do subs

[opal nymph]

My sub fleet are the starting subs

[tulip thorn]

Because the 1939 start date is old

[tulip thorn]

Understandable

Well then I guess I also have a sub fleet lol

[sly sluice]

wdym by that?

[opal nymph]

1939 start date UK was a UK that was mostly AFK but invested heavily in navy

It did like 7 focuses lmao

[dusky burrow]

No

[tulip thorn]

The 1939 is really old

[opal nymph]

Unfortunate, my cruiser killers cant kill cruisers

[tulip thorn]

They only update it to keep new focus trees working

[dusky burrow]

Actually I'm not sure if they'd be too bad, but they'd be worse than light cruisers I'd imagine

[opal nymph]

Play new 1939 start date China lol

[dusky burrow]

Pretty much

[tulip thorn]

How bad is it

[opal nymph]

No 1936 infantry equipment

But you have all your mios

[tulip thorn]

you are kidding

[sly sluice]

lacks firepower?

[opal nymph]

And the Japanese have medium tanks and you have no piercing

[tulip thorn]

Ww1 guns in 39

[opal nymph]

And you have max production efficiency debuff

[tulip thorn]

Oh my god bruh

[opal nymph]

And nothing fixing neglected countryside

[tulip thorn]

Maybe ill try that tomorrow 💀

I would like to go to bed in a good mood

[opal nymph]

But you got most of your free mil factories, all your mios, and such

[sly sluice]

i mean.. not necesseraly. they would just need to be done well

[opal nymph]

Even a decent amount of your defensive army

But once again, no piercing

In the red in inf equipment

Pain

You can still win once you get support aa

[tulip thorn]

Support aa op fr fr

[sly sluice]

that much?

[opal nymph]

But remember,-35% production efficiency growth or whatever

[tulip thorn]

Support aa is something that is just so good

[sly sluice]

well i get that its good but like. is it good because of the principle or the stats?

[opal nymph]

You cant produce anything

[tulip thorn]

?

[sly sluice]

?

[opal nymph]

You produce 1 gun a day for 2 months instead of a week

[tulip thorn]

Did you reply to the wrong person

[opal nymph]

AA is good because it is both anti air and anti tank

Japan has tanks

That inf equipment 0 cant pierce

[sly sluice]

ohhh AA works as anti tank in hoi4 too?

[tulip thorn]

And its pretty cheap

[tulip thorn]

it gives piercing

[opal nymph]

The German 88mm originally was an AA gun i believe

And they put that in the Tiger

[sly sluice]

i knew they were like very good for that irl but i didn't knew they copied that to hoi4

[tulip thorn]

Support aa my beloved

Support aa having piercing makes anti tank useless in sp

[sly sluice]

just imagine being able to design your aa's just like you do with tanks

[opal nymph]

AT is only good in MP because players can actually produce armored units

[sly sluice]

that would be awesome

[opal nymph]

SPAA exists

I do not want anymore designers

Please

They wreck the balance of the game

MIOs are good enough

[tulip thorn]

Support equipment designer coming fall of 2028

[sly sluice]

and then you could have to research stuff based on if you're going aa arti or AT

[tulip thorn]

Right after the infantry equipment designer

[opal nymph]

No bandages to save .2 IC

[sly sluice]

well

[opal nymph]

Meta strat

[sly sluice]

not really

like

[tulip thorn]

fr fr

[sly sluice]

you'dd have stuff to research and based on what you put in the game determines it as AA arti or AT based on the stats you got

[opal nymph]

To be fair, that would give like 5% HP, so that would be dumb. Then would stack and make ultra strong inf walls

That's the problem with designers, stacking 10 billion stats

[tulip thorn]

oh god

[opal nymph]

NCNS allowed Switzerland to make zombies

[sly sluice]

paradox makes announcements this early?

[opal nymph]

They can stack so many modifiers to field hospitals you can gain manpower from combat

[tulip thorn]

I was just making a joke

[sly sluice]

bruh

[opal nymph]

Over 100% manpower trickleback

[sly sluice]

i mean

i would looove it

i'd probably be shit at it

just like the rest

but i'd love it

[tulip thorn]

At that point just cheat manpower in if you want infinite

[sly sluice]

or conquer and core china

👀

[opal nymph]

But losing strength means you lose the buff

And you also gain no war score

Possibly even negative war score because you have negative casualties

[tulip thorn]

lol

[zinc quartz]

how to play this game

[opal nymph]

Watch the official tutorial, play the tutorial

Lots of trial and error

[zinc quartz]

how do u play the tutorial

[opal nymph]

Play without DLC first

[terse skiff]

try to follow a big hoi4 ytber's beginner guides

[opal nymph]

The official tutorial is not bad

[terse skiff]

they are catered to the new player who doesn't know what things do

[opal nymph]

It's somewhere in the singleplayer thing

I think before you click new game

[zinc quartz]

im playing as germany rn againts poland its like ive played games like this im winning but im barley winning

[opal nymph]

Air is king

Invest in air power

But be sure to build synthetic refineries to maintain rubber production

[zinc quartz]

alright

what type of divisions should i create

[opal nymph]

Infantry hold the line
Tanks or special forces are your main fighting units

[zinc quartz]

their a bunch of diffrent army commands are all of them relevant>

?

[opal nymph]

Wdym

Generals command 24 units

Field marshals can command 5 generals

You want generals to lead troops to give stats

You want field marshals to give even more stats

[zinc quartz]

alright whats best starting

i like soviet so far

defending hasnt gone well

[terse skiff]

you're asking for soviet starts?

[zinc quartz]

yes

[terse skiff]

as stalin?

[zinc quartz]

yes

[terse skiff]

rush internal affairs, then finish the purge focuses but don't do the center and left side focuses in stalin's political tree. mix in agitprop and industry focuses. Build infrastructure in Stalino and Moscow and other provinces with a lot of slots until you can get war economy when scw fires. After that it's up to you

how to get 50 war support by scw in historical settings: justify war goal on poland immediately when you can, then when you send in volunteers to spain you should have 50 ws if you escalated with turkey in March. cancel justification against poland in august

[zinc quartz]

okay thank u

and

is there some way to like overview wars as like a video or something like that i saw a video

on youtube

[terse skiff]

and to remove paranoia pick the production reports and navy options

yeah but you don't learn much from them

[zinc quartz]

oh how do i do it

[terse skiff]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHanttUmQMU like this

[zinc quartz]

yes like that

[terse skiff]

but it's not really useful

[zinc quartz]

it looks pretty cool\

[terse skiff]

your goal as ussr should first to be able to defend the river defensive line, and then to be able to defend at the polish border, and then to be so strong that hitler won't dec on you and you have to dec on him

[cedar lance]

hello yalls

[zinc quartz]

alright

[terse skiff]

the river line are the two rivers that flow through Riga and Kiev, with Smolensk in the middle

[zinc quartz]

i see them

[terse skiff]

during your first playthrough try seeing if you can defend behind the river with only smolensk and kiev being places where you defend in front of the river

[zinc quartz]

do i need to use like fallback lines or anything

that stuff confuses me

[cedar lance]

hello

[terse skiff]

just do a defensive line along the rivers

there are like a hundred tutorials on how to defend against germany along the river line

it's very important now since stalino is immediately behind the rivers and it has most of the coal for ussr

[zinc quartz]

what divisions

[terse skiff]

i just get 120 36width spg divisions and directly attack germany through justifying on hungary

[terse skiff]

but a more realistic one would be 240 infantry divisions to defend and then build as many tank divisions that you can get

[zinc quartz]

how do u raise width

[terse skiff]

you put more units in the division

[steel zephyr]

to oslo i go

[weary estuary]

Chat I am playing as fascist basque

[sly sluice]

for hangar space

on carriers

is it 1/1?

[bleak bramble]

Guys check it out I got meself a treat

[fair horizon]

Deck size is how many planes a carrier can hold without penalties

[sly sluice]

huh

[bleak bramble]

Is dis game easy to beat?

[sly sluice]

good luck👀

[sly sluice]

huh wdym i can only get 60 airplanes🥲

without pen?

what are the penalties like?

[fair horizon]

iirc less planes actually attacking the wiki has a whole section on it

Overcrowding is the penalty

[weary estuary]

Nah…nah bro

[marsh ravine]

cant u also js send attache to spain?

[terse skiff]

yeah but justifying on poland is 49 pp in 1936 feb while it's 100 pp to spain. you also need to get an attache to china

[sly sluice]

ok so

yall know when your sea tiles are red?

like

unaccesible red

not dominated red

why is it unacessible? my navy is litterally next to the tiles

like

in a port

[viscid stirrup]

nah what you have to do is send an atache to spain

[viscid stirrup]

very easy. anything works against ai

[sly sluice]

anything if you do it right*

[viscid stirrup]

armoured car spam works against ai

[sly sluice]

because you're doing all the rest

(which is not easy to understand if you don't pay really close attention)

trust me

i may not be as good as most people here

[viscid stirrup]

i am a victim of the duning kruger effect

i have low competency and am highly confident

[sly sluice]

but its not as easy as you think. the reason you think it is so easy is because you have played the game so much that you've created the good automatisms which mean your brain instantly does micro actions that makes it work. its just like driving

[viscid stirrup]

woah woah woah im too young to be driving

[sly sluice]

bro...

🥲

[viscid stirrup]

89% of drivers in the US think theyre the top 50% of best drivers

[bleak bramble]

I'm got an achievo I'm a big boy now

[sly sluice]

good. now i am gonna overwhelm you with this. look at the stats.

[viscid stirrup]

you have a long and arduous road ahead of yourself

[bleak bramble]

20.1% of people have it?

[winged field]

https://tenor.com/view/michael-scott-the-office-sad-face-broken-heart-gif-17974804086126007967

[viscid stirrup]

tno reference btw

[viscid stirrup]

99% of people dont actually play hoi4

[bleak bramble]

Is there any turning back?

[viscid stirrup]

no

[sly sluice]

most people quit before joining a faction XD

[viscid stirrup]

hoi4 is consume you whole

it will reach into the depths of your soul

[sly sluice]

just like war thunder

[viscid stirrup]

there is no escape

[sly sluice]

but worse

[viscid stirrup]

there is no salvation

i once fell into the hoi4 rabbit hole

i played 2k hours, trying to find meaning in my life

dont waste your 2k hours on such a meaningless game

talk with people

do new things

read a book, learn some skills

then you will be satisfied with the state of your life

[sly sluice]

is time spent having fun still wasted time?

[viscid stirrup]

hoi4 is a temporary solution to despair

[tulip thorn]

You do not have more than 1500 hours

[viscid stirrup]

i do

ill prove it

[tulip thorn]

167 hours more

Thats not 2k

[sly sluice]

you played HOI4 for roughly 1/6 of a year

[viscid stirrup]

i round up for dramatic effect

[sly sluice]

thats 1.6K hours not 167

[tulip thorn]

I know

I said he didnt have more than 1500 hours

[viscid stirrup]

he means 167 more than 1500

[tulip thorn]

And he proved that he does, and its just 167 more than 1500

[sly sluice]

oh

[tulip thorn]

Wdym she

[sly sluice]

alright

[tulip thorn]

My bio says it 💔

[viscid stirrup]

you dont specify your pronouns

ahh

sorry

[tulip thorn]

And what makes you think she

[viscid stirrup]

half the hoi4 players are women

[sly sluice]

i call everyone man or bro👀 makes it easyer

[sly sluice]

i don't think so

[tulip thorn]

https://tenor.com/view/omw-to-spread-misinformation-all-over-the-internet-gif-26525511

[sly sluice]

i think like 90% men

if not more

hey btw @heavy vigil have you always been part of the moderation?

i feel like last time we talked you were a helper

[copper sluice]

formed greater luxembourg

[tulip thorn]

no

They became a moderator a few months ago I think

[heavy vigil]

since the beginning of time

[tulip thorn]

I cant remember how long tbh

[tulip thorn]

True true

[heavy vigil]

it was like september iirc

[sly sluice]

oh

so it wasn't that long ago

[tulip thorn]

It was during my almost 2 month long break from hoi4

[sly sluice]

same

[heavy vigil]

rn im inactive because while i can spend a lot of time doing 1 thing due to autism, rn thats minecraft instead of hoi4 server :>

[sly sluice]

https://tenor.com/view/understandable-have-nice-day-have-a-great-day-have-a-good-day-nice-gif-20850110

[tulip thorn]

I just passed my 2 week minecraft period 💔

Fallout era began a few days ago

[heavy vigil]

my hyperfixations usually last either a few months or like 5-10 years

[sly sluice]

im having a cosmoteer time

also

trust me

[heavy vigil]

but also if this server im playing on stays up forever ill probably be invested forever

[sly sluice]

minecraft long term is peak

so

what you do is when you have a minecraft phase you just play the old world you had before the break

[heavy vigil]

i cant relate

[sly sluice]

what server are you on?

[heavy vigil]

im only invested if its servers and thats like rarely

[heavy vigil]

SFTV earth 2

[sly sluice]

just trust. i had a minecraft server i played for 1.5 years with friends

i miss that time

[sly sluice]

wanna team up?

[heavy vigil]

uhh i have a nation but you can join if you want

about to go sleep rn

ill dm you their discord

[sly sluice]

alright

what nation you in?

[heavy vigil]

im located in oceania, hence my status

[sly sluice]

huh

so no nation name🥲 ?

[heavy vigil]

lands of taonga

[sly sluice]

alright

im just gonna have to know how this whole cjountry thing works

and then i'll join you or make my own country somewhere

[bleak bramble]

Check it out guys = I got me first formable

[sly sluice]

hey btw

casey i feel like if we stay on that server we either boutta be one of the best alliance or opps

[heavy vigil]

why lol

im like perfectly neutral towards most countries

just chilling really

or friendly

[copper sluice]

why am I not extracting these?

[viscid stirrup]

Half the world population are women

So i assume half the players are women

[viscid stirrup]

Is it a core?

[tulip thorn]

That literally means nothing when it comes to the fan base of a video game

[viscid stirrup]

Im not a psychologist

[misty fossil]

claming that half the hoi4 playerbase is women is unsubstantiated by statistics

if half the world's population are women why don't we see a 50/50 split in university (skewed towards women in my own cohort because a lot of dudes are going into the trades) or in C-suite executive positions (skewed towards men)?

if you're being sarcastic then... yeah

wild to think how architecture was dominated by men just 15-20 years ago and now there are more women

im not optimistic about what's to come in terms of job prospects for us all

[waxen mango]

If I deleat hoi4 will I get my soul back from paradox?

[copper sluice]

no but I am extracting from other non cores as well

[tulip thorn]

About half the world is 50% women

Its like 49%

[copper sluice]

how do I get to the coast xd

if I get to the coast maybe britain will send troops

[misty fossil]

corrected it

[misty fossil]

you are

[copper sluice]

10% war support ez

do I take the netherlands or the rhineland

[faint void]

https://tenor.com/view/hoi4-hearts-of-iron4-gif-26987353

all to real

[terse skiff]

what's your trade law

[copper sluice]

limited exports

there was 0 aluminium in my resource tab bro

[terse skiff]

do you control the state?

you have to control the state to get the resources

[copper sluice]

yea I did control it

how do I defend all of my new land now lol

[terse skiff]

wait both france and germany are against you?

[tulip thorn]

Less than 1% of the hoi4 fan base and players are women

[misty fossil]

i dont believe it

way too low

if it was 10% i would find it believable

[tulip thorn]

Maybe like 5%?

[misty fossil]

idk

can you even find data for something like that

[tulip thorn]

probably not

[misty fossil]

there are women who play hoi4 that i know of, and yes they are quite few

but 1% is nuts

[tulip thorn]

I only know one, and she only got the game to try to play EaW

Played for like 3 hours

Then never played it again

[copper sluice]

and belgium and the netherlands

and italy

and the us

and the sssr

[terse skiff]

is this some mod

[misty fossil]

😭

[copper sluice]

no

[misty fossil]

did she actually buy the game at its full price

[tulip thorn]

yes 😭

[misty fossil]

https://media.tenor.com/yOw3amPw4GUAAAAe/jimmy-butler-jimmy-butler-paper.gif

[copper sluice]

these are like 4 or 5 factions who are all at war with eachother tho

[tulip thorn]

She did ask me if eventually I would help her learn so she could actually enjoy the mod

[misty fossil]

i mean

[dusky burrow]

Your main concern should be taking out the Netherlands and Belgium

[misty fossil]

eaw and mlp are two different things

thats just how it is

[dusky burrow]

Those are your cores

[tulip thorn]

yesnt

[misty fossil]

wish eaw was a bit more story-driven like the ascendancy path

[dusky burrow]

Also if the IMRO bug still works take Macedonia and Thrace

[misty fossil]

the stories were wild to read though

[tulip thorn]

I wish equestrias content wasnt so old 💔

It will be reworked eventually

https://tenor.com/view/peter-griffin-but-i-want-it-now-gif-26307521

[copper sluice]

yea I did that now

now I am just fighting the italians and the spanish empire

can I do the benelux decision before I do any peace treaty?

because once I get to do the benelux the game is finally playable on normal mode for me again

[crisp scroll]

Another day of making my parents disappointed

[copper sluice]

holy shit

is this even a good division

what.

[dusky burrow]

yeah

[copper sluice]

this imagine is triggering me trypophobia which is crazy

[dusky burrow]

ideally you'd use assault engineers and either ranger recon or light tank recon, plus expand your division to 35 width if possible (you're Belgium)

Also ideally you'd make this into a forest rangers division

[copper sluice]

I am luxembourg

I still havent researched any special forces

[spiral sphinx]

😭

[coral gorge]

thats a funni Switzerland

[dusky burrow]

Oh right

Still do so you're in a heavily urban and forested region of the world

[pale flare]

did i do something wrong? why is this not triggering i already did the focus

[dusky burrow]

did you pick demokrat parti?

In the elections that is

[pale flare]

oh yeah i didnt fml

restart it is

[dusky burrow]

Yeah

[misty fossil]

What mod is this

[fair horizon]

who gave sweden chicken pox 😭

[coral gorge]

was fun enough

[pale flare]

where would enemies spawn? i assume the states with kemalist modifiers so the west?

[misty fossil]

Now do a wc

[dusky burrow]

Yes

and also trabzon

[coral gorge]

hmm this game has been very much historical for the most part

[copper sluice]

??????????????????

well known italian territories of baden württemberg?

[fair horizon]

its your puppet

they deserve a piece of germany too

[dusky burrow]

It's based off of owned territories

So if Italy held the territories pre-war then they will get it

So that's why you see places like Libya and east Africa going to Regno del Sud in historical

[fair horizon]

thats kinda cool

[vital cove]

turkey focus tree is so stupid

why the hell do you need to flip democrat before becoming ottoman

and why does it not tell you

[fair horizon]

its a good focus tree it would just be nice to tell you that you have to do certain things for certain paths

[vital cove]

like from just playing in game you would have no idea

why you can't do the focus

of pivot to the past

[vital cove]

i mean stupid like in the sense of why would it work like that

gameplay wise its fine if you know how it works but

why do you need to flip democratic

also the army part is stupid

why do you need to go all the focuses of the 3 branches to completely get rid of the national spirit

[coral gorge]

hmmmm

[dusky burrow]

Basicallly the idea is to overthrow the authoritarian Kemalists

Just like how both Germany and Russia fall to non-aligned civil wars before going through any other path

[vital cove]

yeah, but they don't first flip ideology, then have a civil war

[dusky burrow]

By the way, Japan has the same thing going on on its communist / democratic path

a civil administration minded government takes control, then they revoke the peace preservation law which causes the civil war

[vital cove]

does japan start fascist or non aligned now I can't remember

[dusky burrow]

non-aligned

[vital cove]

so to which ideology do they flip before starting the civil war

[dusky burrow]

democratic

[vital cove]

that kinda make more sense

like flipping democratic to become democratic or even communist

[coral gorge]

they actually did tell you a little

during the election campaigns, one event mentioned Kemalist pressure on the government to curb rising populist sentiment from Menderes

who was a critic of Kemalism

and many amongst the recent speech voiced their favourable opinion towards the Ottoman Empire

[vital cove]

yeah that doesn't count

im not reading and analyzing every single event story that pops up

[coral gorge]

well

you asked

[coral gorge]

that wasn't the case

[vital cove]

fair enough but it definitely should be more clear and not hidden

[coral gorge]

Menderes' populist government couldn't have won if there was no democratic election in the first place

they couldn't even contest

Kemalist officers and the CHP were the ones that tried to overthrow the democratically elected Menderes government

Turkey is quite special

like

they actually have only 6 political options and the CHP/Kemalist Officers are already 4 of those

wait no why was I using past tense on Menderes

I was speaking as though it did happen irl

[hidden oak]

Light work

[coral gorge]

time to make some cars

[dusky burrow]

again

[pseudo raven]

Xd

[coral gorge]

hey its China this time

@dusky burrow look at this

[pseudo raven]

Actually good

Now it's time to gain base value of org

So percents work

[coral gorge]

no

I need their org to drop

too much org for car

da hel is this level 3 general

[humble laurel]

Is half of the HOI4 community neo Nazis or something?

[coral gorge]

aight, I am in Europe now

time to save the Soviets

[idle folio]

the puppets release mechanics is so over powered

i can avoid war with germany as soviets

[eternal palm]

Smth like that yea

Hence why you don't wanna discuss politics anyhwere near a hoi player

We had a guy yesterday making excuses for the SS so that tells u everything u need to know about that guy

[coral gorge]

[pale flare]

dudes got a tale

[eternal palm]

A tail?

I don't think Sinkiang is telling a tale

[viscid stirrup]

i wont be able to use this division template😔
im too young to drive a car

[eternal palm]

As if that is surprising 💀

Are you even allowed to use dc

[humble laurel]

I love playing Germany.

..It's the only country I play - sorry is that weird?

Germany is the most detailed and fleshed out.

[eternal palm]

No not at all

[eternal palm]

That's very limiting g

I'd say the Soviet focus tree is pretty good

Germany is just busted as fk

Which makes it fun

[humble laurel]

I mean. It is.

Germany imo has the best tree because I get tons of options to gain territory.

[eternal palm]

Detailed is very hard to discuss

[humble laurel]

Wage war.

[eternal palm]

Which is what the entire game is about

[humble laurel]

More then others.

[eternal palm]

Almost every country gets options for expansion

[eternal palm]

It's more accessible than others

Because you start fascist

And you're kinda the main character

So yea makes sense

[humble laurel]

Another reason.

It's cool to win as the underdog.

[eternal palm]

Pertaining to Germany?

[humble laurel]

Plus when you form Germania and get that sexy nametag and black it's great.

[eternal palm]

Nah

[humble laurel]

Yes.

[eternal palm]

Blacks kinda ugly

[eternal palm]

Germany is Not the underdog 💀

[humble laurel]

I think it looks nice.

[eternal palm]

Like whaz

It's literally the main character

[humble laurel]

It 100% is.

[eternal palm]

How exactly?

It has the best focus tree the best eco, the best army buffs, and the best MIOs

[humble laurel]

US, France, UK, and USSR have more men. More industrh

[eternal palm]

With a tree that allows you to start conquering day 1

[humble laurel]

They were more powerful at that time.

[eternal palm]

How is that the underdog

[humble laurel]

You start with 200k men.

[eternal palm]

Yea irl

[humble laurel]

Yes.

[eternal palm]

Hoi is a sandbox

Not a sum

[humble laurel]

No but.

[eternal palm]

And hoi4 is a game.

[humble laurel]

Irl they were underdog.

[eternal palm]

It's not like that in the game

[humble laurel]

It's just imagining your in real life.

And you take down the biggest superpowers.

It's just fun to imagine.

[eternal palm]

Uh no that's not what you're doing

Hoi is not a sim

[humble laurel]

That's what I'm doing.

[eternal palm]

It's a sandbox

[eternal palm]

Uhm alright

Id say that's pretty weird

[humble laurel]

Well it isn't.

[eternal palm]

Idk other countries have better "underdog" fantasies

Germany is literally a power fantasy

[eternal palm]

I'd say it is

[humble laurel]

Ah yes, can't wait to play as Liechtenstein and take on France.

Sorry Luxembourg

[eternal palm]

The assertion that gemany is somehow weak in game is simply wrong

[eternal palm]

Lithuania or Finland are pretty good

[humble laurel]

Well that's great!

We are all so unique with different beliefs and minds.

[humble laurel]

Eh.

In 1937 start which is imo the best start

You are very weak.

Czechoslovakia can take you easy.

France can take you easy.

Poland can take you easy.

Basically your main rivals can take you easy

You slowly build up a massive army and industry.

It's fun.

[stuck inlet]

west and east germany but it's extremely wrong

[humble laurel]

Interesting

[eternal palm]

Yea you are weak at game start. But war isn't supposed to happen. Also, france is the only contender here. And even then it's hard. Czechia and Poland don't stand a chance in 37. Even France doesn't cuz mechanics.

[stuck inlet]

I wonder how do I get Austria, Transylvania and Southern Poland now

Cause

[eternal palm]

Theoretically you can start ww2 in 37 and win as germany

[stuck inlet]

All of europe is just allies now

[humble laurel]

Have you tried invading Czechoslovakia.

[eternal palm]

That's not the underdog at all

[eternal palm]

I have

[stuck inlet]

except Occitania and Borborian(or wtv) France

[eternal palm]

It's easy as fk

[humble laurel]

They are very powerful.

[eternal palm]

Idk what's you're on about

[humble laurel]

It is.

[eternal palm]

Well skill issue ig

🤷‍♂️

[humble laurel]

I don't understand why you are being rude.

[eternal palm]

Hoi is easy

[eternal palm]

Because I frankly don't get your argument

It doesn't make sense

Anyhow I'm busy rn

[humble laurel]

What doesn't make sense.

[humble laurel]

No don't run away.

What doesn't make sense?

[humble laurel]

Hmmm

Kill them all.

[pale flare]

https://tenor.com/view/minor-spelling-mistake-skeleton-skeleton-dies-gif-22412591

[eternal palm]

Correct.

[sudden thistle]

But

Ur also a player

So ur 10x stronger or smth

[humble laurel]

How so?

[sudden thistle]

The player actually knows how to do thing right

[eternal palm]

Like, inferring the position of Germany as it was in 1937 to how it is in 1937 in game is not accurate at all. The game doest simulate reality, no matter how hard you try or want it to. It's fundamentally a sandbox set in 1936 with ww2 era technology. The combat isn't accurate, the maps aren't accurate, the economy isn't accurate, the focus trees are designed to be fun and engaging, not realistic. And there seems to be a difference in experience. I find hoi to be trivially easy. That's due to me having over 6000 hours in the game. If you struggle to invade czechoslovakia and I don't, you seem to be lacking in skill as it were.

[sudden thistle]

And the AI throws random bullshit at you

[eternal palm]

Hence leading to an Incomplete analysis and conclusion

Hence I say your points are wrong

[humble laurel]

I never said Germany was an underdog in the game.

[eternal palm]

That's enough yss

Jfc

[eternal palm]

YOU LITERALLY DID

[humble laurel]

I simply said I like to act like I'm the underdog as in real life.

[humble laurel]

Then I simply don't remember.

Please link it.

[eternal palm]

EXCUSE ME

I literally asked, if the statement of the underdog pertained to Germany

You said yes

[humble laurel]

I don't see it.

[eternal palm]

Bro.....

[sudden thistle]

https://tenor.com/view/monkey-lion-thinking-ragebait-rage-bait-monkey-gif-14090242814517187668

[humble laurel]

Yes.

Germany real life.

[eternal palm]

Yea whatever man, I cant help you

[humble laurel]

Also I do not understand your hyper activeness.

This is a respectful conversation CreepAgeDE.

I love you.

So much.

[sudden thistle]

This wasn’t needed btw

[humble laurel]

Once again, I was speaking in 1936 start.

Germany is weak in the start.

You are the underdog in contrast to all the other European powers.

[sudden thistle]

Have u ever seen someone beat the allies in 1936

[humble laurel]

You build up your army and become stronger.

Personally I find that fun.

[stuck inlet]

I'm not even that experienced, my navy is shitty

[humble laurel]

I like to imagine I'm weak, but then through based leadership I'm not.

I do not care if you find it weird.

[stuck inlet]

Ts the allies btw

[humble laurel]

I know many of my friends who play HOI4 agree that the Czechs can be difficult to beat early game.

If it's easy to you great.

[cold wedge]

What

[humble laurel]

You have 6000 hours.

Great.

Then maybe I dont have a skill issue.

You just have a skill boost.

Or something like that.

[cold wedge]

How the hell is Czech hard to beat

[humble laurel]

You are simply being rude for no reason.

I do not appreciate that.

[cold wedge]

You mean Czech AI or like multiplayer

[eternal palm]

It isn't this guy is just yapping

He's talking about AI

[cold wedge]

Nah bro

[sudden thistle]

I lost the plot

[humble laurel]

AI.

Early game.

[cold wedge]

The Czech always will give up when you do fate of Czechoslovakia focus

[eternal palm]

Idk I already blocked him

[humble laurel]

[ocean mirage]

north sea empire is so op wtf

[eternal palm]

He can't wrap his head around the concept that hoi ain't realistic

[humble laurel]

That is rather pathetic, CreepAgeDE.

[eternal palm]

Shocker I know

[humble laurel]

You block me over my own personal feelings in HOI4.

A video game.

How mature of you..

[eternal palm]

Even if you were to manually justify czechs are not hard to beat as ger

[cold wedge]

And Czech doesn't have manpower in any ways when they go democratic so ye just get a bit of Cash and they cooked

[eternal palm]

Like 🤯

[cold wedge]

Yes

[eternal palm]

The main character being broken who would've thunk

[cold wedge]

Germany isn't broken

[eternal palm]

Uh how lol?

Most cap, best MIOs, broken eco, broken grind, broken spirits

[cold wedge]

Cuz it's fighting USA and USSR and the entire world at once?

[sudden thistle]

But it’s realistic 🔥 🔥 🔥

[eternal palm]

The fact that Germany can pull that off and win is crazy by itself

That's why it's broken

No other country can pull that off in 41

[rustic sinew]

so what u want axis to lose every game?

[humble laurel]

Germany only wins because were playing a video game.

[cold wedge]

Well to be honest Germany did have the best engineering and shit so ye

[humble laurel]

Germany would have not won.

[humble laurel]

Early-mid war.

[eternal palm]

Speaking from an mp perspective here, I think Germany is busted

More busted then it was before

[humble laurel]

Soviets began catching up and learning from German armor and engineering.

[eternal palm]

Axis didnt need buffs

But sure sp is whatever

[cold wedge]

Never do Mp so idrc

[rustic sinew]

thats why everyone plays with a mp mod

vannilla mp isnt balanced and never was

[eternal palm]

Well yea?

[cold wedge]

ye I saw those but most of them give the host boosts or smth

[eternal palm]

Didn't say it is

[sudden thistle]

What

[eternal palm]

But like, if you don't wanna cope mod everything it'd annoying

That pdx just bloats everything

[eternal palm]

What lobbies did u play 💀

[rustic sinew]

japan i can get around being op after the dlc

germany is balanced for sp i would say

[eternal palm]

So was ger after gtd

[rustic sinew]

but japan is too op

[cold wedge]

Some schizo lobby

[eternal palm]

Nah what 💀

It's busted

No country gets that combination of MIOs, focuses and eco

[sudden thistle]

But also everyone is getting massive buffs

[cold wedge]

I love playing navy and I was playing Italy and the host was UK and I sunk the entire UK navy so he kicked me from the game for "using navy"

[eternal palm]

Yaaaay let's fight a stalemate

[sudden thistle]

It will be balanced in a few dlc

[eternal palm]

Lmalooo

What a bum

[rustic sinew]

yea bc they have no allies in sp italy ai is dumb asf, and the axis minors do nothing but die

[cold wedge]

And he said convoy raiding is banned then he convoy raided all of us

[sudden thistle]

Then why play

[rustic sinew]

in mp you have actual ppl playing those countries

[ocean mirage]

Trvke except maybe romania its like okayish most of the time

[cold wedge]

Because Its funny to ragebait them

Cuz they suck

[eternal palm]

Yea we're not talking about those games

Host cheating is comical

[rustic sinew]

japan tho idk what they were thinking with all those spirits

[coral gorge]

rare Kurdish W

or L

cuz French

😢

[fair horizon]

what a loser lmao

[eternal palm]

They have the axis....
The commonwealth isn't all that useful to the UK

[cold wedge]

It's comical because the guy still looses while cheating

[eternal palm]

Also Russia has none too

And it doesn't get that combination

Sure it's cap is good

[coral gorge]

how tf is Japan doing so well actually

[eternal palm]

But it gets like 200 mils at most

Ger gets 400

So if anything Russia is fked

[cold wedge]

Yeah he also gave himself the entirety of America as CORE after he lost as UK and gave himself navy, but my navy leader was already so leveled I sunk his navy again

[fair horizon]

id say all the ports are pretty important but yeah otherwise w/e

[rustic sinew]

uk can also get a shit ton of mils

so can usa

[coral gorge]

UK with 260 factories late 39 😢

can do 300

[cold wedge]

Exactly and u can spam forts and divs on ports and boom Germany will loose

And u have biggest navy

If you use your brain you can cook with navy

[coral gorge]

hmm forts do like nothing nowadays in some context

flame tank + assault engi + SHRG mitigates all penalties from like 12 levels of fort

just make air

6000 planes by 1940

or 10000

whichever you like more

[rustic sinew]

yeaa u just do air as uk, especially in mp

[coral gorge]

well you can feel fancy and do TD too

it just kills you

[cold wedge]

I enjoy playing navy

[coral gorge]

but I had a friend trying light TD meme and it worked out quite well against an Axis with only Germany and Italy as humans

UK did like 40x light TD divs with 6000 fighters overhead and just battleplanned vs German tanks

trying to win by trading IC alone since the LTDs were so much cheaper

[rustic sinew]

i think ltds are soo bad against actual humans, but if they dont know how to play yea it works lol

[cold wedge]

Just make 100000 IS-7s

Trust

1300 mm of stalinium armor

[rustic sinew]

u put on every tile haha

[brave steeple]

bit confused what this is meant to mean

basest sounds wrong in 200 ways

[coral gorge]

ffs

[cold wedge]

IS-7 stalinium armour

1300mm of frontal armor

[coral gorge]

you underestimate how cheap those shits are rn

[cold wedge]

https://tenor.com/view/stalinium-war-thunder-wt-soviet-gif-4161128358194984441

[coral gorge]

especially for defense

on offense they really suck til like ultimate lategame though

well

more like til 1941

cuz not enough breakthrough

@rustic sinew

the actual div had dozer blade though

for entrenchment stacking

but that violated the ruleset

people just didn't realise

[rustic sinew]

damnn wtff

how does it have such high hard attack and soft attack

never seen 1k hard attaqck before

[sudden thistle]

Cheater 💔

[eternal palm]

Yea sub doctrines are silly

You get like 100 hard and 200 break from tank recon alone

Heavy tds can get up to 1.5k base hard

We basically doubled almost tripled tank stats with ncns

[rustic sinew]

the power creep is real lmao

[coral gorge]

[eternal palm]

Yea....

[coral gorge]

light TD has this now

and the number of LTD required per battalion dropped by 33%

so yeah

they kinda got

too cheap

light SPG too

like in SP you probably should make light SPG over normal med any time of the day

they have enough soft and break on close support gun anyway

[rustic sinew]

yea for sure

[coral gorge]

while being ridiculously cheap

[rustic sinew]

and they can pierce anything too so it should trade well

[coral gorge]

I already saw Soviet light TD being used in MP before NCNS but it never got to this scale

[eternal palm]

Is this with hv2?

[rustic sinew]

and those are raw stats, if u have a farmed general its way crazier

[eternal palm]

And fixed superstructure?

[coral gorge]

HV2 yeah

[eternal palm]

Alr

[coral gorge]

yeah fixed infra

[eternal palm]

And then imagine ger stats

[coral gorge]

btw Creep in earlier versions of Sheep's Mod, SOV AI was doing LTD too :Swe

[eternal palm]

It's over

[coral gorge]

they used to have divs with like

[eternal palm]

Lmao

[coral gorge]

2k soft 3K hard 2K def ++ in 1942

[eternal palm]

Idk sheep works in 1.17

[coral gorge]

stats in combat of course

[eternal palm]

Japan is just passive

[coral gorge]

not passive

[eternal palm]

And Finland sort of doesn't do anything

[coral gorge]

they just get stuck

[eternal palm]

Oh lol

[coral gorge]

like legit can't do anything to China rn

[rustic sinew]

rl?

[eternal palm]

So for a better experience should I roll back or not?

Cuz I had fun on barb

[coral gorge]

probably

[eternal palm]

Was challenging

[eternal palm]

Alr

[coral gorge]

cuz I hardly even updated SOV AI

[eternal palm]

No funny ltd

[coral gorge]

like legit I just

[eternal palm]

I mean I'm gonna play sov

[coral gorge]

changed it so they could use the new grand doctrine

ah

[eternal palm]

I like my thunder dome

[coral gorge]

GER AI as well

I haven't really optimized any one of them

mostly just bugfixes

[eternal palm]

Oh ok

Then I'll just roll back

[coral gorge]

then I went to play HoI4 cuz I want to have fun

[rustic sinew]

everytime i play sp this is the germanies i get(keep in mind i send them like 500k guns to keep them alive)

[eternal palm]

Sadge

[eternal palm]

Ouch

[eternal palm]

You're playing as?

[rustic sinew]

japan its when dlc came out i wanted to try them

[eternal palm]

I mean it's AI so it's whatever

I don't expect base hoi AI to be any good

[coral gorge]

yeah cuz its AI vs AI

and Japan starts so much worse now

with only 3 tech slots

which would change a lot on tech priority

and I haven't optimized it

previously on 4 tech slots they would start with sonar, air range improvement, 2 industry tech

[rustic sinew]

true it needs a lot of focuses to get the 4th one even when rushing it

[coral gorge]

so they could apply sonar immediately instead of forgetting about it

and range improv is needed to clutch SSJW

on 3 tech slots they prolly need to drop sonar

which means they die later

so I might need to give Japan starting sonar tech

[eternal palm]

SSJW? Super Sayian W?

[coral gorge]

Second Sino-Japanese War

[eternal palm]

No I got that

Ah forget it

Dumb joke

[rustic sinew]

japan is all about them winning china early, if they do they scale soo well late

[coral gorge]

also improved AI on China is extremely pita to fight against

cuz now theres more of them

they can actually funnel equipment to Chiang Kai Shrek in the mod

and I already gave China more starting troops in 1.16 cuz they were getting killed too quickly

removing all those troops didn't help much either

cuz AI Japan would still get into the red on equipment

[rustic sinew]

they prob put their good divs on the whole front including the shanxi mountaisn and attrition or die bc of battle planning

also both of the big rivers have the supply hub behind them. soo if china spams divs its impossible to take as ai japan unless they do a naval invasion from behind

[coral gorge]

nah its not the case

Chinas just have way too many divs and that just stalls JAP AI forever

very pita

[rustic sinew]

i havent played ur mod as japan haha soo yea dont know how it is over there

[coral gorge]

tbh I think one solution is just

stop naval invading and bash harder over one front

so they can concentrate CAS and hit width cap

width cap is harder to reach now

once reached it does 3x more org dmg and 1.5x more str dmg than in 1.16

[rustic sinew]

ohh yea true,cas is very op, china also has just pure inf spam i assume so its prob most effective

[sharp sierra]

ncns is almost at overwhelmingly negative for recent reviews

nvm it needs more reviews

[coral gorge]

I don't trust recent reviews

its probably just

the Chineses at it again

even if it wasn't

it must be

[sharp sierra]

recent reviews are only 14% less positive

[rustic sinew]

i think its a good dlc just overpriced

[sharp sierra]

i think its overpriced and not very good either

[coral gorge]

I like the DLC

I hate 1.17

[sharp sierra]

true i might be lumping together some of my issues with the dlc

[rustic sinew]

whats wrong with 1.17?

[pale flare]

why arent people not doing the subscription thing?

[eternal palm]

True the update fked everything

[coral gorge]

• doctrine rework which AI can't really utilise
• navy rework which AI can't really interact with
• longer loading time when booting up the game

[rustic sinew]

not worth i have almost all dlcs

[coral gorge]

I like HoI4 though

I can play HoI4 even if my a key is broken

which I have fixed by now, thankfully

[eternal palm]

I already had all the dlcs by the time they made the subscription

[coral gorge]

now

one more China game

[eternal palm]

So it wasn't worth it for the new dlcs

[eternal palm]

Is this your new :feelsokayman:

[pale flare]

6 dollars is still cheaper than 40 so idk

[eternal palm]

For around 7 months

[rustic sinew]

but its monthly

so in 1 year it wont be worth

[eternal palm]

And Ive played the game for over 5 now

[pale flare]

then turn it off when you are not playing

[sharp sierra]

how long did it take for gutterdung to go on sale

[eternal palm]

So no it's not worth it in the long run

[eternal palm]

And then buy it again every time?

That's not a solution

[coral gorge]

no

it has always been

I just can't do the frog here

[eternal palm]

You don't simply play hoi once a month

[pale flare]

i do

[eternal palm]

And then put it off for like a year

[pale flare]

🥱

[eternal palm]

Yes that's nice. Doesn't mean it's a solution for us

[rustic sinew]

good for you man lmao

[pale flare]

its how i play paradox games

[coral gorge]

I just buy everything to support the game

[eternal palm]

Yea man that's cool