EFR Mod addtion/rework and ideas

[tepid flare]

yea, you are not wrong there

[gaunt lava]

what would the armor and tools do?

[glossy gate]

?

[gaunt lava]

like what stats would they have

[glossy gate]

they do the same as in vanilla

is basically a waste of time

[tepid flare]

To be fair, GTNH is one of the reasons I have never played much of newer Minecraft...

[glossy gate]

xd

[gaunt lava]

every to be fair you have added has only worsen your arguements

[tepid flare]

personally, I didn't want to make this a huge stink, I just thought the recipe was a bit to extreme and I got dogpiled for thinking that...

I guess the term devils advocate no longer applies here!

[gaunt lava]

my complaint is like half the recepies are chance based

[lament sleet]

you’re certainly allowed to have and express your opinion… you getting “dogpiled” is just that most people don’t agree with you

and we’re allowed to express that as well

[gaunt lava]

and debris is going to be anoying to mine, like firestone

[tepid flare]

fair, it just felt extremely toxic

[maiden tangle]

that's where I like the new variants idea... just make a mod for "gtnh - my way 😎 "

[glossy gate]

... There is also a recipe to make debris, idk where it is

[lament sleet]

looking at it (mostly) after the fact, seems like everyone involved could have used a breather :P

silly brown blob in silly pixel game

[tepid flare]

yea, you are not wrong. I really liked the idea of the PR, I just felt it needed an alternative less efficent line as well to cater towards the less tech player. But I also forgot that netherite gear isn't much better than diamond and it would be pretty much useless regardless...

[gaunt lava]

is like amethyst completly useless irl

[glossy gate]

Well is bugged, but is there, idk what the fire is meant to be

[lament sleet]

are you in dev env or full pack

[glossy gate]

I was in " searching for images posted by noc in general chat along the week"

hahaha

[lament sleet]

its nether shards pretty sure

noc was in dev env so no tc addons

[river ferry]

i would lock much later

what do you want exactly? access to netherite armor and tools? i considered them useless and was even thinking of straight up removing it

but it can have an alternate recipe

using the debris

i don't mind

[glossy gate]

[tepid flare]

Not really sure anymore. The recipe did feel too extreme but I also haven't played enough with the tools to know if they are worth keeping or not.

[river ferry]

it's a good idea

nah

the tools are 100% useless

even in steam age

the armor might be useful ig?

[tepid flare]

yea, I think the armor is better for enchanting or something

[glossy gate]

The only use they have is that they dont burn in lava

[tepid flare]

but tinkers tools also do that... so useless!

[river ferry]

nothing burns in lava if you have keepinventory

[glossy gate]

🙃 thats cheaty, but yes

[river ferry]

i alr buffed it

originally it was 25%

[glossy gate]

I only say to add recipes because you wanted them xd

[glossy gate]

btw noc, what is the fire in this recipe?

[river ferry]

you're on dev env?

it's nether shard

[tepid flare]

lol, I was just trying to play devils advocate with that question but at the same time, I didn't realize netherite was rather useless anyway...
I thought the tools and armor were really good or something and felt like it was bad to lock them that far in the tech line.

[river ferry]

ok

idea

add netherite scrap to some loot tables

so if you find it you can make netherite armor as early as you can

[glossy gate]

... you need ingots for that xd

[tepid flare]

ah, I thought you needed netherite itself, not the scrap?

[river ferry]

oh

true nvm lol

well

unless we add a recipe to make armor with scrap

[river ferry]

on full pack

[glossy gate]

Is what I sugested lmao, also you there is a problem, gtnh autogenerate this recipe

[river ferry]

oh yeah

i need to remove that

wait

gt?

impossible

[glossy gate]

ando the compressed netherrack is just netherrack?

[river ferry]

that's the standard efr recipe

[river ferry]

yes

[glossy gate]

is not in the efr code, at least the recipe remover doesnt remove it

[river ferry]

it has to be efr cuz how would gt5u add it

it's items from other mod without common nbt

[tepid flare]

is there an ore dictionary or something?

[river ferry]

scrap

[glossy gate]

well then recipe remover doesnt work for that

[tepid flare]

yea, that explains my confusion, I probably would not have gotten as confused if I had not had the ability to make the scrap, so I was questioning why things were not fully in there.

[glossy gate]

btw did you also add the recipe for netherrack from netherrack dust? ( since you can get a lot oreprocessing nether ores)

[river ferry]

i did

[glossy gate]

👌

[river ferry]

2 new recipes for netherrack

[tepid flare]

I still think it is important when adding something from a newer version to go through the thought process as unbaised as you can and after thinking it through, I think it was thought through, I just couldn't see those thoughts from @river ferry

[river ferry]

i don't get what you mean

wdym by unbiased

[tepid flare]

you already answered my earlier question about it that if you would do it similar on 1.16

but it wasn't super clear so that was why I asked that question

[river ferry]

yeah but what would the bias be

i'm just confused

no

the armor isn't strong enough to justify that imo?

[gaunt lava]

could just add it to some tf dungeon

[tepid flare]

Simple, as we have been playing GTNH for so long, we forget what the experience would be on a newer version. I know i have had a huge bias towards 1.7.10 just because I haven't played enough of the new minecraft.

[glossy gate]

? You mean by the cost? is kinda the same as in vanilla, minus the nether shards and netherbriks

[wild breach]

maybe you can add a recipe using scrap to make armor and just lock it behind some funny TC infusion or something

[tepid flare]

I also, feel there is a bais that is strictly from GTNH that is not from gregtech cause I have played the old gregtech and it is completely different. (mostly for the better), but it means there is a huge bais there.

[river ferry]

also this is a thing i forgot to add in the pr

will include later

[gaunt lava]

nah, debris is gona be the casino line

[river ferry]

i didn't

[river ferry]

you just need some

i tested and managed to get a lot in just some minutes with a good technique

[glossy gate]

nuke the nether?

[river ferry]

but wasn't enough so that's why i buffed it from 25% to 50%

[gaunt lava]

this is what removing small dust does to nh

[tepid flare]

not wrong there... I miss the days when recipes would just give you a bit of small dust and you didn't have to deal with the probality lottery that would not always be in your favor if you only needed a little bit of a resource.

[river ferry]

i already designed 3 techniques while testing that are pretty effective

[river ferry]

oh i played a lot of newer minecraft

😝

[tepid flare]

then yes, you are probally less biased then I am, and I must be trying to insert a reverse bais to compensate

[river ferry]

like

my thought process was:
what tiers are missing content currently?
uev, uiv, uxv, luv, zpm, uv

which of those are being adressed?
uev, uiv, zpm

uxv too far...
uv too late...
luv it is!

[tepid flare]

that is understandable. I just tend to be perpetually locked in the early game tiers and have never experienced the end game so that is probably my bias.

[gaunt lava]

get dedication and GRIND trust

[river ferry]

and luv is not close to late game

way too far from late game lol

the pack is just way too big

[gaunt lava]

luv is like post tutorial

[tepid flare]

it is to the player who only reached IV once after playing the pack since version 1.5.0.6

[river ferry]

yeah

but when developing i need to see the thing as a whole, i get what you mean tho

[tepid flare]

but that is a (my) life problem, nothing wrong with the pack, just hard to have the time for it and i have restarted far to many times...

[river ferry]

and it's a valid pov

[tepid flare]

Personally, the way I would go about adding a new vanilla material like Netherite would be to follow the same convention as other ores or smeltable materials.
First, the player would find the ore sporadically generated in the world. Next, the player would go and smelt or macerate the ore into scrap. 1->1 or 1->2.
After that, to maintain balance with the vanilla recipe, the player would use a chemical reactor to mix 4 scrap and 4 gold dust to make a Netherite mix.
This mix would then be smelted in an EBF to get your Netherite Ingot for use in armor and tools.

As for adding the complex recipe chain, that only makes since for using it as a heat component, but since if it was just for armor, just a complex recipe would not make since and thus the heat component recipe to flush out late game becomes an excuse to have a super complex chain.

[serene sand]

That’s boring as fuck imo

[tepid flare]

It still follows the convention of Gregtech and manages to maintain the balance of vanilla.

You don't have to make a recipe super complex to have the balance of vanilla. One thing to keep in mind is you can basically beat vanilla end game by HV. Thus, if you are going to even go as far to add a vanilla feature, it should also fit within that tier set.

Using something like Netherite for end game coils, really is a bad excuse in my opinion for a complex and annoying recipe chain.

As for the argument that this is 1.7.10, yes that is right, but I think we can still add new features without making them way over complex to the point they no longer fit thematically within the realms of vanilla that were previously established by the pack.

In my mind, higher tiers of GTNH are very much an extension of vanilla and thus, if you are going to go as far as to even think about adding a vanilla feature, it should fit within the tiers of GTNH that are vanilla+.

[lament sleet]

i truly am trying to understand why any of this matters at all. it seems totally arbitrary and entirely meaningless

every word spent arguing about this puzzles me

[serene sand]

Exactly

[lament sleet]

we can add stuff wherever we want. where it is in vanilla doesnt matter because like, why the hell would it

its completely arbitrary

[serene sand]

Diamond is now after stargate

[glossy gate]

Thats boring and also we have ores for rare kinda stuff, like nether star or infinity ore WTF

[lament sleet]

this conversation must have been the inspiration for shakespeare's "much ado about nothing"

[tepid flare]

Why even have EFR then or newer features if you are not willing to do them justice.
For a lot of people, EFR is a way to have newer features on GTNH without having to port GTNH to the newer versions!

[serene sand]

If we only had control over 1 mod, yeah the recipe might be more vanilla ish, but this is for the ENTIRE pack

[lament sleet]

i dont see how this is not doing newer features justice

its putting the gtnh spin on modern features

[glossy gate]

If you want the new things just go play the new versions, but dont make a tread of the things you dont like

[lament sleet]

thats what we do

[tepid flare]

well, is there a GTNH for newer versions?

[glossy gate]

go and play nomifactory xd

[lament sleet]

"doing justice" =/= "being 100% faithful and treating modern minecraft like some hallowed ground not to be toyed with"

this is doing justice to it by adding a gt chain inspired by the processes used in modern

this is so silly

[glossy gate]

You are the one comparing how other packs integrate netherite, then go to play those paks

[lament sleet]

i cannot for the life of me understand why you are so up in arms about this

[tepid flare]

Look, I am not the only person who has suggested a similar chain.
I get that you think that such a chain is boring but not everyone agrees with that.
#mod-dev message

[glossy gate]

I feel the same, I thought this conversation was finished hours ago when it complain about the toxicity and all of that

[gaunt lava]

one person

giving a suggestion

[lament sleet]

this is truly deeply incomprehensible and it sucks to see a dev's hard work result in one person spamming the pr with endless arguments

give it a rest

this is so nothing

[gaunt lava]

does not imply that person disagrees with this implementation

[tepid flare]

Look, I have also contributed to GTNH as well, as a dev. Just because I don't agree with something doesn't mean the comments are meaningless.

[gaunt lava]

why do you care about netherite so deeply though

[lament sleet]

you have been talking in circles for hours now about something i think is entirely moot

so yeah i do see it as meaningless. obviously you dont

[glossy gate]

And what, that was before EFR was sugested to be in the pack

[lament sleet]

it's just strange. i want to understand your perspective but it makes no sense

[glossy gate]

[tepid flare]

It is not netherite that I care about but the concept of inventing a reason (coils) to have a super complex line for a material that is vanilla and has no business being mid-late game!

[lament sleet]

why would it matter where we decide to use it? why does it offend you to put it in luv? what is the sense in any of this argument

its baffling

[lament sleet]

the concept of inventing a reason (coils) to have a super complex line
this is the essence of gt
material that is vanilla
so
has no business being mid-late game!
why

arbitrary

[tepid flare]

Look, at what tier would you consider to have beat the base game of minecraft?

[lament sleet]

who cares

is my answer

this isnt vanilla

[gaunt lava]

this isnt minecraft

[lament sleet]

i dont give a single solitary shit where anything related to vanilla goes, i dont see this as related to vanilla

its its own thing

always has been

[gaunt lava]

id hardly consider gtnh an addition to minecraft but like a complete restructuring

[tepid flare]

Is it? Isn't still mod for minecraft?

[lament sleet]

so what

it bears no resemblance

zero

[glossy gate]

If you whant to beat vanilla minecraft you can still do it in steam tier of gtnh,, but who cares, this is not vanilla, and killing the dragon doesnt make you beat the pack

[lament sleet]

yea the real answer to your q is steam or stone age anyways

[tepid flare]

no, but killing the ender dragon is when you have completed the vanilla portion of the pack and moved onto the extension of vanilla

[lament sleet]

no it isnt

gtnh is not a pack where you spend some period playing vanilla mc and then switch to gt

[glossy gate]

Who says that?

[lament sleet]

the entire pack is a combined cohesive experience

you are playing "gtnh" for the entire duration

never vanilla

[gaunt lava]

there is more content stone to HV than the entirety of base minecraft

[tepid flare]

If you defeat a vanilla milestone, then by default, you have defeated the vanilla portion of the pack. It might be more steps because the pack has added and improved the vanilla game, but it is still a vanilla milestone.

[tepid flare]

yes, it is more like vanila+++++++

[gaunt lava]

There is still the beacon

[lament sleet]

ridiculous

youve made up an arbitrary standard and applied it to try and tear down something interesting

very strange

there is zero sense in backporting vanilla features if they serve no purpose in the pack

integrating it with gt in a fun and new way >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> keeping to this inane standard

[glossy gate]

I´m starting to think that this is because you think that once you do all the vanilla stuff in the pack you have completed the pack, and if something is not vanilla you dont even touch it or something like that

[lament sleet]

you keep making declarative statements about the way things should be but i have yet to see a single compelling argument for why those things should be the way you say they should be

it has no business being lategame? why?

because vanilla minecraft segments of the pack mostly end at hv? so what?

why does that make it a bad decision, from a meaningful, game-oriented perspective

its all just because you say so as far as i can tell

[wild breach]

there is more content in steam than the entirety of base minecraft

[gaunt lava]

depends

[wild breach]

especially 1.7, there isn't that much to begin with

[stark oriole]

do you know how incredibly boring your suggestion is

like literally i think my grandmother could come up with a better recipe from her bed

[gaunt lava]

like earlygames got materials lining up

to be used

aeon steel
queens gold
dogbearium
pig iron

doesnt need more

[tepid flare]

1. This is a vanilla material that was introduced in a newer version of Minecraft, not a new end game material that you find on another planet. It's only use in vanilla is for higher end tools and armors. These armors fit very much into the MV-HV balancing of Gregtech protection wise. Thus, it has no reason being anywhere past where the bounds of the vanilla+gregtech gameplay ends and the bounds where the new horizons gameplay begins. The only argument I have seen to put it any higher is a late game coil material that was invented just to have a use for netherite beyond what already existed in vanilla.
2. You beat the major milestones of vanilla 1.7.10 (the wither and the dragon) right about as you are entering HV and progressing to the moon. Netherite is a material that is found in the nether and is available soon after reaching the nether. One could argue that the tools them self are closer to magic due to the smithing table but they are still very much in the realms of MV-HV tech or magic progression.

[wild breach]

i have not seen a single person actually use regular vanilla diamond armor in HV

and netherite is hardly an upgrade from vanilla diamond armor

[gaunt lava]

i just use my lootgames armor until like nano

[stark oriole]

yeah and why can't it be a new endgame material you find on a different planet??

are you LISTENING to yourself

[gaunt lava]

the nether needed some more late game relevence

[tepid flare]

but is it. From what I understand, it has the protection of diamond and the enchantability of gold. So basically like soul armor with the added bonus of having more durability.

[lament sleet]

yeah see this is the circular argument i was talking about.

• why does it matter when it is implemented in vanilla? this is not vanilla. we are not using it for the same reasons, we are using it for our purposes.

• what does it matter when the major milestones of 1.7.10 end

none of this giant textdump changes anything

these are not meaningful gameplay-oriented arguments

[sudden summit]

@tepid flare i dont get why you're continuing to aruge this point. We're packporting stuff from modern MC yes. But we dont need to adhear to how it is used in modern. This is a new material for us in this version of the pack so we have capabilities to do whatever we damn well please with it

If vanilla MC players come to this pack and complain that netherite is gated. Then guess what, to bad. This is neither vanilla minecraft or modern minecraft. This is a modpack, a gregtech one at that, one that is known for its processing lines and heavy modifications to recipes

[lament sleet]

they are arbitrary cutoffs you made up

if you want to argue about additions to gtnh they should be in the context of gtnh. anything else is frankly silly

and a waste of everyones time

[stark oriole]

i heard GT mega is looking for devs if you want to add your own netherite in Steam age

[gaunt lava]

GT mega got the cool lighting

[frail hollow]

noooo don't do it

it's so pointless talking about this

everything has to be vanilla just cause he said so

[glossy gate]

[frail hollow]

disregard the fact it's a modpack that changes almost everything about the game

muh vanilla

[lament sleet]

and yes, no shit, the additions we make are going to be justified by new recipes... thats how adding things works

there is literally no other way to do it

[stark oriole]

nobody and literally nobody who actually plays the pack would have wanted netherite to get backported just for it to be something you can get in LV as an upgrade to diamond armor

what would be the point of adding it then

[lament sleet]

every single material ever added was justified by a recipe addition or change

[glossy gate]

Oh no, I´m still using enderpearls in recipes for UHV, but why if you can get them in the overworld. I should be using a new boring material every tier I go up

[gaunt lava]

you cant shift click elytras in your chestplate slot

[tepid flare]

perhaps it is a circular argument. I am clearly not able to really articulate my point that well. When I heard that EFR was added, I assumed that it was going to be everything or almost everything and would be just like if GTNH was on a newer version of Minecraft. Perhaps there are differing schools of thought here. For a long time, I have wanted to play GTNH but be able to experience the newer features of Minecraft in a gregified fashion and the idea of EFR immediately resonated with me as a compromise to get GTNH on newer versions and still be able to stick with 1.7.10.

[glossy gate]

@tepid flare if you want to complain about something go and make some use for the EFR amethist, since right now they are only oredic, maybe add it to some new something idk

[frail hollow]

if you want new Minecraft but with Greg, play gregtech Modern

there's a version FOR YOU

[lament sleet]

i mean, it kind of is that, but that doesnt mean we arent going to gregify stuff. some of that is integration, some of that is retiering

[glossy gate]

Well you cant even get elytras atm, so whatever

[lament sleet]

in the case of netherite, it would serve virtually no purpose in its base form

[noble zephyr]

only thing i could see is using netherite and soularium for new things as nether does have some nice things that be made with it materials just kinda sitting there

[lament sleet]

no, more enchantable diamond armor is not meaningful...

[noble zephyr]

like soularium is ifrc soul vials

[stark oriole]

and outside of added durability and the fact it can't burn, its a useless tool material in vanilla anyways

[frail hollow]

sorry you got yourself excited over something that wasn't going to happen but that doesn't make it anyone else's problen

[stark oriole]

why would it be added when it couldn't do anything cool

[glossy gate]

There is many new stuff that is unchanged, just netherite is not one of them, idk why it hets you so mad

[noble zephyr]

maybe adding netherite to existing recipes maybe

[gaunt lava]

amethyst is less useful than base game, go come up a idea for that

[stark oriole]

netherite line is in now, its done

there's nothing to change it

[tepid flare]

because I was looking forward to trying out the netherite armor. I haven't actually made any of it cause I don't understand 1.16 enough and never played more than a few minutes of it.

[gaunt lava]

ok who looks forward

to netherite armor

[lament sleet]

its diamond armor but black
ill save you the hassle

[frail hollow]

???

[stark oriole]

you couldn't understand netherite?? you're talking about a piece of material of all you do is put it together with a diamond chestplate and get a netherite version???

[gaunt lava]

legit we could randomly place it in some TF dungeon

[tepid flare]

Look, I asked about it several days ago, but no one pointed to the line, just said, oh there is a line...

[frail hollow]

so forcing 1.7.10 to become 1.16 was your angle to play with netherite?

[noble zephyr]

honestly i take more use for soularium

over netherite

[glossy gate]

It has been spoken to add recipes for it so you can get them early as cosmetic, you where there in that conversation

[gaunt lava]

honestly put netherite armor in urghast

tower

wait

[noble zephyr]

suprised soularium is just for soul vials

and it just rounds

that suck a cool material just sitting

[lament sleet]

yeah ok so it seems like it boils down to this, to me: you want gtnh to be a way for you to play modern on 1.7.10, because it gets backports

but you dont tend to play the game past the earlier tiers (no shame, just how it is)

but like

gtnh isnt just backports to 1.7.10, its its own game and experience. we balance and add with that in mind

[gaunt lava]

queens gold looks cool but has 0 use

[frail hollow]

even the early tiers are nothing like vanilla

I'm not sure where this delusion came from

[lament sleet]

if you want to play modern on 1.7.10 go play efr... its available standalone

[noble zephyr]

yeah there ore that need more usage

[glossy gate]

thats its use, decorative xd

[tepid flare]

can i even put it on 2.7.x and have it work?

[stark oriole]

its already in the nightlies

just play a nightly version from before this PR and you can spawn in netherite ingots

[noble zephyr]

i know astral silver is used for fluxed electrum

[tepid flare]

ugh.... I give up, I don't care about Netherite that much, I just don't like the idea of inventing a new material as an excuse for a long line and then the long line is excuse for the new material. That is also a very much circular reasoning.

[stark oriole]

literally everything in this pack like post LuV is made up

[lament sleet]

that isnt circular at all. thats just how adding content works

game is improved by adding more content

[stark oriole]

someone had an idea -> coded it -> added it to the pack and here we are

[gaunt lava]

this debate lasted 5 hours what do you mean you dont care that much

[lament sleet]

more lines to interact with, mica is very boring and doesnt make sense as the only insulator

[frail hollow]

netherite isn't vanilla for 1.7.10 anyways so idk why you're so hung up on it

[stark oriole]

especially when making hypogen or eternal coils

[lament sleet]

i can give a dozen justifications for adding content because its easy to justify

[stark oriole]

why not something new and exciting

[lament sleet]

greg just added all these machines to create lines to make more machines...

thats the way of the world

[noble zephyr]

yeah but you cant forget old stuff

tho

and repurpose

[frail hollow]

woah then we added a bunch more

[tepid flare]

no, it is that I am tired of being circlejerked and being told my opinion is not valid. Perhaps I am late to the party here. Sorry for not seeing the doc earlier and complaining then.

[frail hollow]

oh wait but those don't count

cause they're not vanilla gt5

[noble zephyr]

what about repurposing content four

[stark oriole]

netherite line was a thought that came about immediately after the discussion about adding EFR started

its something that devs and many players wanted

we always want new lines

we want more machines and interesting things to build

[lament sleet]

god nothing is more annoying then when someone has lots of people disagree with them so they start trying to act like everyone else was in poor faith

circlejerking, toxic, dogpiling zzzzzz

[frail hollow]

ok but I am

I will validate him for me personally

[lament sleet]

a lot of people just think youre wrong

[gaunt lava]

aerogel line when

[noble zephyr]

aerogel be interesting

honestly i want more delving into TC as a lot of the content is just duplication

[lament sleet]

and as long as youre willing to keep arguing with them, the argument will continue

dont make yourself to be the victim

we're all squarely neutral here

[noble zephyr]

as it seems like a lot of content towards TC hasnt been exploded or even documented

shulkers be nice

[tepid flare]

yea, I agree that i blew this way out of proportion. Initially, it was just a question to the PR requester, but everyone had to go and come to the requesters defense instead of letting the requester explain the though process. (witch mind you was a very clear and understandable process)

[noble zephyr]

as botania has things needing shulkers to even function

shulker boxes be great too

[stark oriole]

but you phrased it in a way that says "why did you do all this work when you should have just added the material to base game like vanilla"

that's how it presented on the PR

[noble zephyr]

dont say shulker boxes be bad

would they

[tepid flare]

yes, you are right. I didn't phase it the best. I am not always good at phrasing my thoughts clearly and they tend to run on...

[stark oriole]

if you had asked "why did you decide to tier it to X tier and what are the plans" i think people would have been more responsive and let Noc answer, or answer based on other plans that are in place for mid-end game

[lament sleet]

anyways just to say something constructive here, i like the idea of netherite equipment as advanced chest loot in roguelike dungeons or twilight forest.

sounds cool

[frail hollow]

you were questioning why isn't it just a 1-1 vanilla port, I told you this is a modpack, you waffled about unrelated stuff and are dying on the hill of "muh vanilla"

[lament sleet]

plus then the vanilla aspects of netherite get explored at the same tiers

[noble zephyr]

someone remind me how big is a shulker box

[gaunt lava]

chest

[serene sand]

even one of the GT Modern devs answered your question

[glossy gate]

since there are netherite shulker boxes... big

xd

[tepid flare]

to be fair, I have been playing this pack since 2018 or earlier. I just tend to get burned out and take long breaks and then continue.

[frail hollow]

ok

it's 2025

[serene sand]

EFR also adds iron shulkers (and all the upgrades)

[frail hollow]

what is ur point

[gaunt lava]

that sounds like a you problem

[noble zephyr]

Shulkers, no end cities but tweaks.cfg features an option to spawn them naturally. Goes great with mods like Enderlicious or Hardcore Ender Expansion

[noble zephyr]

OOH

neat

[gaunt lava]

add shulkers to lich tower

[serene sand]

We are probably going to move the shulkers mobs to the twilight forest

[glossy gate]

??

[gaunt lava]

fits with the long tower

[serene sand]

yeah there

or the urghast tower

[gaunt lava]

more interesting than 20 trillion infernal mobs

[serene sand]

give players a reason to go inside the towers

[tepid flare]

my point is people are acting as if I don't know what I am doing about gregtech and thus my opinion is not valid! Look, I have played with gregtech since before GTNH existed.

[gaunt lava]

netherite should go with knight or urghast

elytra can go with giant

[noble zephyr]

what be the difference between shulker box and a backpack

[gaunt lava]

you can place a shulker

and hold

a full inventory of them

[lament sleet]

i certainly dont think you dont know anything about gt

[serene sand]

its vanilla though, do we want more vanilla stuff

[gaunt lava]

and place them in backpacks

[lament sleet]

i didnt see that sentiment either but maybe it was there

[serene sand]

we are going to block that

[noble zephyr]

yeah getting shulker boxes be nice

[serene sand]

no shulkers in backpacks in shulkers

[gaunt lava]

they are nice, likewhen moving to a pdim you can name the boxes and put individual lines in them

[serene sand]

yeah, they are

[tepid flare]

lol, shulkers in backpacks, imagine the chaos

[gaunt lava]

project chest you can move

[frail hollow]

you say that and then act like gregtech doesn't massively change progression in multiple ways

[noble zephyr]

honestly if they get pipe compatiblity

[serene sand]

shulkers boxe will probaly be more magic based

[noble zephyr]

easy way to do some big transfers

[tepid flare]

dollys in shulkers, shulkers in backpacks, backpacks in shulkers, dollys in shulkers -> and repeating

[noble zephyr]

be almost like a dank?

[glossy gate]

efr already blocks that by default

[serene sand]

good thing we removed the packet size limit

[tepid flare]

It did but never to the current extreme, but perhaps that is because in my mind, gregtech was a lot simplier back in the day.

[stark oriole]

this pack even back in 2018 was known for changing things to make them harder, so i don't know how you came to the conclusion that something would get backported wouldn't be touched

and that it would just get added for 1 or 2 uses

for a non-building block that is

[noble zephyr]

honestly with new magic on horizon getting shulkers be nice

[tepid flare]

No, I was under the impression that it would never get added!

[serene sand]

never say never

[glossy gate]

Btw tomorrow maybe I will make a pr to add recipes for normal shulker boxes, elytras, and random stuff like that

[frail hollow]

sure, I didn't play gregtech back in 2018, but gtnh is very extended in current year of 2025

[glossy gate]

Btw2 the only missing recipes in EFR are all the decorative blocks

[serene sand]

honestly, normal shulker boxes should be a thaum research

[frail hollow]

no reason netherite can't be a processing line

[glossy gate]

if anybody has any time...

[tepid flare]

true, 2018 is when I joined the discord... I think I may have been playing GTNH before then but I can't remember.

first version I have a world on is 1.5.06

[serene sand]

shulkers just feel more magic based

[glossy gate]

Shulkers and elytras will obviously be magic gated

[noble zephyr]

so your telling me that there a possiblity 135 slot shulker box

[serene sand]

yeah

they already exist

[noble zephyr]

Take my money

take it now

[serene sand]

actually, netherite doesnt, but i can add those

they only go up to diamond and obsidian

but netherite is easily doable

iron barrels and chests already do though :P

[glossy gate]

The upgrades recipes can be a shulker piece + a normal upgrade ( or the tier of the upgrade) in the assembler

[serene sand]

yeah

[noble zephyr]

honestly shulkers might be a good buffer chest

going forward

[glossy gate]

Barrels are also usefull for this

[serene sand]

EFR barrels are more performant than chests

since they are not TESRs

[glossy gate]

The BIG use for shulkers is as packets in big ae2 recipes, I know we can use cells, but using me formation and annihilkation planes to automate stuff is cool

[noble zephyr]

honestly i want almost enderchest shulkers

[serene sand]

we def needed something before compressed chests

[noble zephyr]

as enderchest only so big

and only other way i can recall rn is dim transciever

as dim transciever is cross dim

[glossy gate]

Kinda like this, you encode something into a packet, and since the order is always the same it can then be placed as patter output, now that I think of it, I had just thought of a way of automating Assline using shulkers xd

[serene sand]

as long as it pushes people to use magic earlier, im for it

[gaunt lava]

what makes the shulker

different than a chest

[acoustic lily]

what the fuck

that's a wild setup

[serene sand]

it retains its inventory when destroyed

[glossy gate]

Keep inv

[gaunt lava]

oh wait

it gets broken

in that setup

[wild breach]

maybe put a shulker in the recipe for compressed chest

[glossy gate]

yes

[gaunt lava]

kinda pointless

[serene sand]

nah

i like the idea

[wild breach]

compressed chest also retains inventory after all

[glossy gate]

that would make compressed chest use magic... people will be against

[gaunt lava]

will base shulkers use magic

[serene sand]

could be a cheaper alt recipe

[glossy gate]

I really dont care

[serene sand]

yes

[wild breach]

alt recipe sounds like a good idea

[serene sand]

tbh, we need to integrate magic more into the pack

[wild breach]

imo it wouldn't really make sense if the shulker needed magic and the compressed chest didnt, since the compressed chest is just a better shulker, then what's the even point going the magic route?

[serene sand]

shulker will be available much sooner

and probably cheaper

reward for going magic

[noble zephyr]

yes there talk of new GTNH mod for it

when idk

[serene sand]

that will be a magic rework though

def not 2.8

[noble zephyr]

like 2.9 or beyond

[noble zephyr]

honestly i can see three areas in GTNH that need some love

[gaunt lava]

Pollution, pollution, pollution

[wild breach]

yes botania please

[noble zephyr]

quantity of items like yes you got all your miners and what not but TC purpose it seems like at least in this pack is really ore duplication which isnt even that good or doing magic solars or research for things

[serene sand]

theres 2 channels with over 2k comments in them so dont start that here too

[noble zephyr]

secoundly stagnation a lot of things get mundane and repeative fast

with no real change for upwards of a hundread hours

[gaunt lava]

Honestly post magic, pollution, ic2, and lootable reworks earlygame will be in a very good state

[noble zephyr]

thirdly it the overall lack of investment towards magic and expanding from the meta

as we have a lot of mods that arent even used

[glossy gate]

I wish

[noble zephyr]

like removing TC would be like 30

[glossy gate]

TC is not going to be removed

xd

[noble zephyr]

i mean it wont i know it wont but it def need to take a back seat

[serene sand]

thaum is a hard one to replace since its had so much work put into it

[noble zephyr]

yeah only issuse is with it duplication forward mindset and boots being only real key take away anyone gives TC and maybe magic solars what the use of TC as SE and galatic take pretty much all of it

only thing TC is used for is research gating other mods

and it kinda common for people to remove that config or do station or just get cheat book

and honestly the IF would be a great tool along with etheral processor but they suck post MV for processor and IF is a walking exploit

and blast is bug riddled beyond reconition

[runic root]

Other useful things TC has to offer that many people use:
Several of the foci
Armors
Nugget dupes
Item repairing
Talisman of remedium
More I'm forgetting

[exotic blade]

+h

[glossy gate]

thoughts?

[serene sand]

2 shulker shells, 1 barrel, 2 wood planks and 4 salis?

[glossy gate]

yes

[serene sand]

another option is replace the wood planks with salis and drop the other 4

[glossy gate]

the vanilla recipe is 2 shulker shells and 1 chest

[serene sand]

the barrel handles the wood part

[glossy gate]

btw they are livingwood planks

[serene sand]

oh, living wood planks

looks like normal gt wood planks

im fine with that

what about upgrades, and the shulker shell recipe/mob

[glossy gate]

Someone said that the shulkers should spawn in Tforest, idk how to make that

[serene sand]

lol infernal shulkers

still need to add the iron barrel upgrade recipes once @ornate trout swaps to our fork of EFR while we wait on Roadhog to merge in the couple of prs

those can probably be the same as the chest upgrades but on circuit 3 instead of 2

[glossy gate]

For the upgrades I think it should be something like this, a normal chest upgrade and some shulker shells in the assembler, but I would wait to use barrel upgrades

[serene sand]

hadnt though to use the chest upgrades as ingredients

why 4 shells? Because it increases the size to 2 shulkers?

[glossy gate]

yea

Normal vs iron... and it goes like that

[serene sand]

then what would the iron to gold upgrade be?

[glossy gate]

the same, since you previously aplied the 4 shulker shells

[runic root]

If each one adds another box worth of space why not just 2 per upgrade to match that

[ornate trout]

I check stuff tomorrow and do a tag if necessary

[ornate trout]

Where the box is located tier wise and size ?

[glossy gate]

? what you mean

[exotic blade]

Probably wants to know how to compare it to existing chests in terms of size and functionality.

[serene sand]

it should be fairly early, but also early in magic to push people to it

basic shulker is the size of a single chest

but it keeps its inventory

hence the magic

[glossy gate]

I placed hungrychest as parent

[ornate trout]

So it’s a wooden chest keep inventory ?

[glossy gate]

yea

gated behind early botania and TForest

[ornate trout]

Make it not to cheap otherwise people fill chest in a chest in a chest

[glossy gate]

You cant

By default you cant place shulkers inside of shulkers

[ornate trout]

Ah ok

[glossy gate]

( You cant place anything that contains an inv inside)

[exotic blade]

Would it make sense to put it in the new horizons tab of the book since that's where other "vanilla content" has been placed?

[glossy gate]

I placed there

In that empty corner

[ornate trout]

Yea put it there make sense

[runic root]

Why? They don't have similar functionality or themeing

[glossy gate]

Why not?

You dont need to craft the hungry chest, just need the research

[glossy gate]

Also kinda all magic chests set the parenting to hungry chest

[runic root]

Because it's unintuitive and adds one more thing people will inevitably ask about. If it needs a prerequisite scanning a shulker shell would make much more sense

[glossy gate]

Ender chest and ender tank parents are also hungry chest btw

and have nothing in common

[serene sand]

i say hungry chest parent

might as well

[runic root]

Research cheatsheet page says ender chest only needs infusion

[glossy gate]

thats strange since 1 ender chest doesnt need infuion
2 the parent of ender chest is luggage, and luggage parent is hungry chest

[runic root]

Wiki

[exotic blade]

I'd also rather not have the hungry chest as a parent, that's why I wanted it on a different tab than the hungry chest. This should be one of the first things you can research.

[glossy gate]

whatever, removed as a parent

[runic root]

More generally, research prerequisites should be fitting mechanically and/or thematically, not just because other chest-likes have done it

[glossy gate]

Anybody whant to write something for the research page?

[exotic blade]

Was there a big reason not to put shulkers in the end? Earlier availability?

[glossy gate]

idk

The structure generation collide with hardcore ender expansion I think

[serene sand]

well, end cities are not in efr yet

plus if we put them in lich towers that can give people a reason to go inside them (and have less spawners)

[glossy gate]

Btw in the future there are more uses that shulker shells could have as a shokwave issolation "plate" for big machines, idk I was thinking about that yesterday

[exotic blade]

We can probably put them in a few places, and it makes sense that would be where we want to encourage players to go.

[serene sand]

before out fork can be shipped in the nightlies, dreamcraft will need to support it

or at least fix an issues that it may have

oh, i think i see the issue

[ornate trout]

Let me know what I need to do tomorrow

[serene sand]

my last push to the gtnh branch is good

just need recipes @glossy gate

will probably want to make a new release

[glossy gate]

Btw
EtFuturumRequiem.research_page.SHULKER.1=Shulker boxes drop themselves when mined. Unlike other containers, the contents of shulker boxes are stored within the dropped item, and not dropped separately. Do not try to place a shulker inside another one, you will tear apart the fabric of the known universe...

[glossy gate]

https://github.com/GTNewHorizons/NewHorizonsCoreMod/pull/1221

[glossy gate]

Btw could we active phantoms but make that they only spawn in tf, since if not we don't have phantom membranes.. And we can't repair elytra

[noble zephyr]

idk about phantoms

unless we make it part of slowfalling or hover recipes

[serene sand]

dont think phantoms are implemented

[wispy aspen]

I have a question, does EFR add the bamboo plant?

[glossy gate]

Yes but aren't activated

[glossy gate]

Btw Elytra+ creative armour+ speed 2 = insane speed

[runic root]

Define insane speed

Are you rubber banding because you're going so fast?

[glossy gate]

?

[glossy gate]

like 5 chunks in 1 second

[serene sand]

ah, so not player launcher insane

[runic root]

80m/s is not that fast compared to thaum boots

They top out more like 300-350m/s while flying before you rubber band. continuous flight i can only get like 160 or so before the server doesnt like it

I'd have to go back and check but iirc that's roughly the speed of quantum traveler

[exotic blade]

@river ferry How crucial to your Netherite line is it that Netherite Scrap's Forge Hammer recipe is in ZPM? I was wondering if it would make sense to heavily downtier it so that it can be used in @glossy gate 's https://github.com/GTNewHorizons/NewHorizonsCoreMod/pull/1221 in place of the ancient debris block.

[glossy gate]

Since is the same material I dont see why is important to use one or the other

btw I use 4 ancient debris since thats the cost of vanilla

[river ferry]

omg those recipes are absolutely cooked

netherite gear can't be that gated

they don't have anything special

gating it at HV

and needing firestone which is extremelly annoying to acquire is just making the armor completelly useless

it is worse than the manasteel armor you're using to craft it

dream told me we should somehow buff the armors, but idk how poasible is that without directly editing efr?

[exotic blade]

Yeah I was wondering if we were adding anything special to it because AFAIK it's just vanilla armor and equipment

[river ferry]

i'd like to, but idk if it's possible

[lament sleet]

good lord that is a wild recipe for a very useless armor set

[river ferry]

and tools

[glossy gate]

They have higger enchantability by default xd

thats all

[river ferry]

trade your unbreakable hoe for one that doesn't burn

[exotic blade]

I could see netherite gear being used as a component of high tier magic items, maybe more so than the other way around.

[river ferry]

it should at most be gated to LV

possily earlier

[lament sleet]

i would just do vanilla style recipes with diamond armor and ancient debris in smithing table or something lol

[river ferry]

i told ender previously to not follow with these recipes

[runic root]

The only benefit of netherite in vanilla is higher armor toughness, which doesn't exist in 1.7

[river ferry]

so

currently the netherite armor can be crafted on the smithing table

with diamond armor

just like vanilla

[runic root]

So what makes this armor valuable

[lament sleet]

nothing

[river ferry]

ig i could just ungate the scrap

and keep it like that

[lament sleet]

yea that would be better

[glossy gate]

You told me to not add recipes, but then the discussion with that guy started, and since he whanted recipes so hard... I just added them

[river ferry]

[runic root]

Who is "that guy"

[lament sleet]

these recipes are wild though ender

[exotic blade]

No reason not to add the recipes, but yeah they need to match the item's power level

[lament sleet]

spacebuilder

[river ferry]

the shulker one is good

[exotic blade]

I gotta say though you really know how to greg a recipe when it's needed.

[river ferry]

i'd just uhm

reduce the vis amount

to 5 of each vis

[serene sand]

so for iron barrels, should I just have them use the iron chest recipes, just replace the chest with a barrel?

[glossy gate]

ya

yea"

[serene sand]

kk, working on that now

[runic root]

Functionally they're basically the same so I don't see why not

[serene sand]

the only technically difference is that barrels dont use a TESR

[glossy gate]

okay

[runic root]

Don't need air above but like

That's not enough to warrant harder recipes

[serene sand]

that too

[river ferry]

i was informed that the recipe remover isn't removing this recipe, so i'll just keep it, and remove the forge hammer one

and use 2 instead of 1 on the recipe that consumes it, to account for the 50% chance i had

[glossy gate]

You can just add a chance of second output in the for hammer

[river ferry]

then can just use the scrap instead of debris for armor

[lament sleet]

this sounds like a better idea tbh

have better recipe in forge hammer

[river ferry]

what abt uhm

[lament sleet]

then you can keep the original recipe voltage gating

[exotic blade]

In that case the better recipe can even stay ZPM yeah

[river ferry]

diamond chestplate + 4 netherite scrap
forge hammer
-> netherite chestplate

steam forge hammer

[lament sleet]

does forge hammer have 2 slot yet

[river ferry]

yep

it does

tesseract + quantum anomaly for spacetime splitting

[glossy gate]

When I enter the server 3 years ago and start doing qol recipes some devs ( dream and alastor) complained that the recipes where to eassy, so now I just gregg all recipes hahaha

[runic root]

Still need to give it something to make it worth making, ig just more armor since toughness doesn't exist

[river ferry]

it's better than most armor

at steam age tier

[runic root]

Needs something better than diamond

[river ferry]

netherite is

[glossy gate]

it has more durability

[runic root]

That's it?

[river ferry]

protection

kb resistance iirc

doesn't burn on lava

[runic root]

Vanilla netherite has the same armor but more toughness, and toughness doesn't exist in 1.7

So unless you're backporting that, it'd need more armor points

[river ferry]

i wonder how hard is it to add a tinker's modifier

with netherite to make tinker's tools not burn on lava

[exotic blade]

I thought tinker's tools already didn't burn

[river ferry]

they don't?

[glossy gate]

idk never trough my tools in lava

[glossy gate]

Could I add this for armor but still use some infusion for tools? :3 ( I will make the infusion cheaper)

[river ferry]

no

[glossy gate]

😭

[river ferry]

you can

uhm

[runic root]

Armor is more valuable than tools anyway

[river ferry]

add netherite as a tinker's material

vanilla tools are just useless fr

[glossy gate]

I wanted to keep these for something xd

[runic root]

Might need to spell check that one

[exotic blade]

The one thing you really can't do is add an infusion recipe for an item which is worse than it's ingredients.

[river ferry]

use netherite here

[serene sand]

any reason to use GTOreDictUnificator.get(OrePrefixes.plateDouble, Materials.DarkSteel, 1L) over plateDoubleDarkSteel?

[river ferry]

readability

it's better to have all the code in one standard

[glossy gate]

I just use the second option when the material is not avalible in the first

[serene sand]

yeah, Netherite is not in the Materials enum

[river ferry]

it is with my pr

[serene sand]

oh cool

[exotic blade]

Just dipped a tool in lava for a few minutes. It's doing fine.

[river ferry]

oh

lol

cool

good to know

[serene sand]

i sure hope roadhog added the 1 feature of netherite over increased durability lol

[river ferry]

lemme test

yea

it doesn't burn

[glossy gate]

I think its already added somewhere in EFR code, al least a pr of its repo mentioned it

[serene sand]

We should have a mod just for tinker modifier additions

could really use more

[exotic blade]

I'm sure we can do all of that directly in Dreamcraft.

[runic root]

Yeah, I don't think I've ever seen someone emboss a tool or use things other than redstone/quartz/reinforced/moss/lapis on a tool more than once or twice

[serene sand]

that could work

if we want them to be pack only

only thing is dreamcraft is a bitch to devenv with

[exotic blade]

Usually yes, but someone made TiCo a hard dep of GT5 at some point :v

Which we should probably work to revert

[serene sand]

ah lol

[exotic blade]

GT5 somehow depends on TiCo, EnderIO, AE2 and a bunch of other stuff

[serene sand]

We could also use a gregtech double/dense obsidian plates to move that away from ic2

[glossy gate]

@river ferry Instead of forge hammer...

[river ferry]

should be pre steel

forge hammer

[glossy gate]

you can get arcane table in steam tier if you loot dungeons

[exotic blade]

That's still a reasonable LV gate, and that armor should definitely be more interesting to make and use than stuff like the steel or composite armor.

Also it makes sense that it should be made through magic if it replaces thaumium tools in infusion recipes

[glossy gate]

Also do you think somebody will go to the nether to search for 4 pieces of netherite for an armour that well, is not that good

[exotic blade]

I mean it still isn't that good.

So now if it's made like this you have the additional problem of making it good :v

[river ferry]

if that is alr a problem you're just giving more reasons to make it as accessible as possible

more chance of someone looking for it in steam than in lv

[glossy gate]

You cant make it before nether

[glossy gate]

well the guy in here could add scrapt as loot
https://discord.com/channels/181078474394566657/1340286528693207060

[river ferry]

yes

i said that

[exotic blade]

Can't we let dimensions keep their unique loot?

[river ferry]

.

like fortress

[exotic blade]

Nether Fortress loot tables yeah, just not Rogue Like Dungeons

[river ferry]

well

[exotic blade]

Until we add those to the Nether one day

[river ferry]

rogue like has the nether section

[glossy gate]

the last floor is nether themed

[outer isle]

Is there a way to retain enchants when you upgrade from diamond to netherite as in vanilla?

Seems like a lot of these wont

[exotic blade]

Sure is. Personally I don't really love giving the player less reasons to visit the Nether.

[serene sand]

probably keep the enchant nbt

[glossy gate]

Or I could make this and just add netherite gear as loot in the nether floor, btw in vanilla you can find some netherite tools in bastions

[serene sand]

im just going to leave the netherite barrel recipes til after the netherite pr is fully merged

[glossy gate]

Btw this statement is not correct, since manasteel tools has a durability of 1, and the armour is worse than the netherite one

[exotic blade]

Isn't the whole point of that armor to absorb damage from your mana pool?

I might be misremembering it

[river ferry]

yes

it is basically unbreakable as long you have mana on you

[lament sleet]

yeah manasteel effectively has infinite durability

[glossy gate]

Yes, but you can make the mana armour before the normal mana pool, and so you can do it before having a nice mana generation

also it was more about the protection it gives

[glossy gate]

@serene sand No crystal barrel? ( Since there are crystal chest and crystal shulkers) xd

[serene sand]

Hell no, that requires a TESR

[glossy gate]

okay haha

[serene sand]

The other 2 already use a tesr so it doesn’t matter

Feel free to adjust the eu/t and durations

Should probably also mention it requires the iron barrels PR on EFR

[glossy gate]

I see them nice, they are on the same tiers as normal chests

[serene sand]

Yeah

[glossy gate]

Btw since there is the baby chest there is a barrel ( that has no recipe) that we could use as a baby barrel

[serene sand]

Neat

[cosmic lintel]

also, EFR barrels can't be picked up by the dolly

[worn lichen]

Don't make the shulker too late or hard to get, if its only advantage is you can pick them up and it keeps it's inventory, the compressed chest can do that too and I think is in MV, and it requires no magic and is absolutely massive

[glossy gate]

Shulker is lv

Compresed chest is hv

[serene sand]

what version of jabba are you on?

[cosmic lintel]

the one from 2.7.3

might've been fixed already

[serene sand]

yeah, i already added support over a month ago

because 2.7.3 doesnt have EFR

that version wasnt used

[cosmic lintel]

yeah, fair

i've had EFR in my world for more than a year, could've checked for JABBA updates

[serene sand]

really should just play on the nightlies if you want efr

always need more testers :P

[ornate trout]

Why not remove it in EFR mod? Why is it loaded twice? Added via EFR removed via gt ?

[serene sand]

should probably stop all recipes in efr and not just a couple

[ornate trout]

maybe we can only load vanilla recipes if core mod is not present or some other method?

[serene sand]

well yeah. Wonder why we dont just asm into recipe registry manager itself and stop all that are not from dreamcraft or something?

GameRegistry.addRecipe

[ornate trout]

Sure if possible we can do that

[serene sand]

i mean so that dreamcreaft doesnt have remove any recipe as its ASM stops them from being registered

not just EFR's

[ornate trout]

Sure I am not against it. Might save us some loading time

[serene sand]

@maiden tangle thoughts? Wonder why we havnt thought of this yet

should be a way to get the caller path

[serene sand]

also the iron barrel recipes pr is ready to be tested in dreamcraft

[maiden tangle]

Because someone would have to go through and do an audit to make sure nothing was missed. Easier to do it one by one. Look at past examples of ic2or removing the deduper

Use the asm to stop mods themselves from registering one by one

[maiden tangle]

that being said -- I wouldn't be opposed to this with a whitelist. But in generaly I prefer to just neuter the registration functions vs letting them run (extra bloat, extra checks on mods for each .addRecipe, vs the methods that often add multiple recipes)

[serene sand]

yeah, we could allow all from dreamcraft and gt5u since that is where vast majority of the recipes we want come from

this would only be for crafting/furnace recipes

maybe more registries from other mods

[maiden tangle]

feels like a lot of unnecessary string comparisions though

we've got what 30k? 60k? recipes

just ASMNuke registerRecipes() or whatever the equivalent is... like we do with bibliocraft and a few other mods

there's the ASMRecipeNuker out there already

[serene sand]

which mod?

[maiden tangle]

coremod

[serene sand]

ah

[maiden tangle]

https://github.com/GTNewHorizons/NewHorizonsCoreMod/tree/master/src/main/java/com/dreammaster/coremod/transformers/recipenukers

that's the better approach, IMHO

opt in, nuke everything

[serene sand]

would be more work, but better overall

[maiden tangle]

well more of a scalpal, but nuke sounds more fun

[outer isle]

Where are the shells coming from in LV?

[exotic blade]

If we're thinking purely about the impact on pack load, won't mods that want to register recipes still run a lot of code and load a lot of classes to make those calls to the game registry? Is stopping the actual registration call what has the most impact?

[serene sand]

current is add in mod, remove in dreamcraft
Dont need to remove if its not added, either via directly adding a dreamcraft loaded check or via asm

[exotic blade]

Right, so what's most desirable is stopping recipe registration altogether (dreamcraft loaded check, or a purpose made config), but failing that stopping the registration saves up from having to run the recipe removal code.

[serene sand]

right

[glossy gate]

right now? Well your imagination, since shulkers dont spawn yet

[exotic blade]

How about we just go into Hardcore Ender Expansion, give it an optional EFR dependency and have it spawn them in it's biomes?

[glossy gate]

Some people wanted shulkers to spawn in TForest in the lich tower

[serene sand]

✋

cause its funny and gives a reason for players to go inside the tower

[exotic blade]

Nothing says we can't have both, though I think we can find other ways to make the Lich Tower interesting that don't steal stuff from other dimensions.

[glossy gate]

Since I dont know how to make that mobs spawn in a specific structure, I wont touch that

[gaunt lava]

I mean if it is locked to end it would be HV locked

[serene sand]

i think most mods cheat and just add a spawner

[gaunt lava]

for most people

[serene sand]

well the endereye priest trade was removed so its all

[gaunt lava]

does the 1/1trillion chance exist in 1.7

[glossy gate]

You can still find ( By a lot of chance) a enderportal full open

xd

[gaunt lava]

I don't think shulker should be HV locked

so it should spawn outside end

[glossy gate]

So with both we go

[gaunt lava]

does EFR add in end cities

[glossy gate]

no

[gaunt lava]

would be nice to have a structure there

[exotic blade]

Why not.

Though you could also consider placing it deeper in the TF. Potentially muuuuuch deeper. :v

That final castle already has some box looking enemies.

Also, might be nice to get re-textured shulker variations so they can blend in with their environment as intended in end cities.

[glossy gate]

Yes, but since efr doesnt add endcityes you can dream all you whant xd

[gaunt lava]

problem with lich tower, if you play it correctly it is the hardest structure by a very wide margin, adding more shulkers instead of infernal brute zombies would make it easier

[glossy gate]

There are infernal shulkers, that btw can have the mimetizing effect of being similar to blocks that are near

[exotic blade]

Wait do the EFR shulkers make you levitate on hit? If so I'm really on board with the lich tower idea now.

[glossy gate]

yes...

[gaunt lava]

yes

[exotic blade]

I don't play other MC versions anymore, I completely forgot that was a thing until a Youtube video reminded me.

[glossy gate]

I shuppose that infernal shulkers will be more fun that yous levitating you

tracking missile with wither III, Hmmm yummy

[serene sand]

exactly my reason for the lich tower :P

[gaunt lava]

i mean 1.12.2 still has a large modding scene, but true. Replacing some of the skeleton/zombie spawners with shulker/flying books would make it more in line with difficulty of the other dungeons

[serene sand]

where do think some of us came from :P

[gaunt lava]

it is strange to think shulkers came out in 1.12.2

[glossy gate]

I would make that shulkers spawn in the tower, not to add spawners ( Because well, I like gog players) haha

[gaunt lava]

how would

that impact gog at all

i mean it would make them renewable

[glossy gate]

If you add spawners you cant get the shulkers in gog, if you add spawneable you can

[gaunt lava]

arnt structures disabled?

[glossy gate]

Yea, the structure itself is dissable, not the spawneable region

[gaunt lava]

anyways even if you add them spawn naturaly, make all the spawners the book spawners

[exotic blade]

I wouldn't consider weird rules from pack variations as a deciding factor for making the best possible experience.

That being said I was also thinking we might want them to just spawn in with the structure.

[gaunt lava]

in 1,12.2 they only spawn once

so wouldthey respawn

[glossy gate]

yes is the idea

[exotic blade]

Let's keep the spawners exclusive to the end maybe

[glossy gate]

Since you can do EEC it doesnt even matter

[reef stream]

Technically yes, but actually no.
They can be duplicated if their bullet hits themselves

[gaunt lava]

that was added post 1.12

[serene sand]

thats even used in shulker farms in the latest version

funny enough, the code is in the efr version
https://github.com/Roadhog360/Et-Futurum-Requiem/blob/master/src/main/java/ganymedes01/etfuturum/entities/EntityShulker.java#L455-L474

[gaunt lava]

Can we get a decorative copper and a actual copper

9 copper per decorative copper

is a bit steep price

like 4 copper makes 4 decorative copper blocks

same with some of the chisel iron blocks

[exotic blade]

The only way to cheapen decorative metal blocks is to untie them from the regular metal blocks. In the case of iron as pictured, you would no longer be able to chisel them into the GT "Block of Iron".

If they're purely decorative and cannot be recycled, we can do stupidly high ratios.

[serene sand]

see ztones and such

[exotic blade]

Similarly we could and should untie Chisel torches from the glowstone torch. Let people have nice bases in LV if they want.

Hmmm, though I guess the reason for that tie-in is that those probably work fine on the moon.

[glossy gate]

Any of the decorative efr blocks dont have a recipe yet, for now I was only adding functional stuf, so if you see that something doesnt have a recipe, just add it

[exotic blade]

My man, please boat me up. Not too gregged.

[glossy gate]

I was saying to this one @gaunt lava fell free to add them

[exotic blade]

The oak boat already has a recipe, the other wooden boats should have the same one. For the boat with chest I think the worse we might want to do is boat + chest + wooden screws.

[gaunt lava]

I mean vanilla copper block is like an actual good block though

so i think the downside of no more chisel is worth

[cosmic lintel]

Side topic, but you can already light up the moon by spamming Glowing Slabs from ArchitectureCraft, so I personally don't see any reason for that tie-in anymore

[gaunt lava]

true i hate having to world edit them in

[gaunt lava]

I think this should be a chisel of stone

[glossy gate]

Why

That's the vanilla recipe

[gaunt lava]

stone brick is a chisel of stone, so i think it would fit

[glossy gate]

Also iron furnaces replacement now use this block

[gaunt lava]

wait i guess that makes it impossible nvm

because the chisels use the same recepies as the base right

or am I making that up

[glossy gate]

? I don't think I'm understanding at what are you referring to

[gaunt lava]

like chisel wood has the same crafting as normal wood

[normal lichen]

No, you use it for witchery arthana

[glossy gate]

@serene sand Tforest is id 7 and for planets I know the id is negative, but I don't know them 🙃

[serene sand]

not adding it to twilight

[glossy gate]

😦

[serene sand]

amethyst can spawn anywhere below y45

and twilight forest starts around there or below

lemme check what dims it can spawn in in vanilla

[glossy gate]

I don't think geodes can generate in mid air, so they would just be emerging from the ground

[serene sand]

that is mid air

@jaunty cloak got a screenshot from above?

[glossy gate]

That spawned in the ceiling and all the below air is treated like a big cave

@stark mist the max of the spawn area of geodes is the top part of the geode, the bottom part, or in the middle?

[stark mist]

I don't exactly know. I think it's somewhere in the middle

I don't really know what the vanilla logic is.

I don't understand it. It's a messy copy and adaptation of the vanilla code. I just call it at a coordinate and the code does the rest. It's a black box to me.

[serene sand]

can confirm, i peeked in the box

[stark mist]

It could probably be heavily improved upon too

One problem with it internally is that it copies a bunch of noise and other related classes from a vanilla. There's probably a way to cut down on the copied classes and use just vanilla 7.10 noise classes, but I'm just not sure how I would go about doing that.

I didn't understand what I was doing, but I wanted the natural shapes and curves versus just a perfect circle, so that's why I have the code the way it is now.

I had planned on making a per dimension max Y level config as well as a more strict air exposure config for them, so dims like TF would look less weird

[glossy gate]

[serene sand]

@glossy gate so for now, approve my pr so they dont spawn in pdims :P

@ornate trout got any screenshots?

[glossy gate]

Why you mention me, I can't approve pr's, or can I? 🙃😹

[serene sand]

oh, thought you were a dev with how much you have been doing the efr recipes lol

[glossy gate]

I'm not even a contributor,.. You can ask boubou why 😹😹😹

[serene sand]

@arctic onyx can you give Ender contributor please?
https://github.com/pulls?q=is%3Apr+org%3AGTNewHorizons+archived%3Afalse+sort%3Aupdated-desc+author%3AEnderProyects+is%3Aclosed

[arctic onyx]

done

[ornate trout]

Tf dim geode ?

[serene sand]

yeah

[ornate trout]

Will do tomorrow

[serene sand]

tf is already compact due to its lower y level so a geode would just be annoying

plus they could screw up structures

[gritty turtle]

does dripsone have the ability to dupe lava?

[glossy gate]

We have dripstone? xd

[gritty turtle]

afaik yea

its in the files on efr

though maybe its disabled for gtnh

[glossy gate]

I think is dissabled

[gaunt lava]

Does dripstone natualy spawn?

[glossy gate]

well if is dissabled... no

xd

[glossy gate]

Stone red bed, normal
Steam light gray bed, steam
LV green bed, liquid ender
MV brown bed, fertile manure slurry
HV purple bed, molten Manyullyn
EV green bed, molten terrasteel
IV pink bed, molten gaia
LuV yellow bed, force plasma
ZPM blue bed, molten enriched holmium
UV white bed, molten inf catalyst
UHV light blue bed, molten superconductor base UHV
UEV cyan bed, subatomically perfected water 8
UIV magenta bed, molten superconductor base UIV
UMV gray bed, magmatter
UXV black bed, molten black dawrf matter
MAX orange bed, MMCSM

@river ferry

each material corresponding to a tier, and colour of the bed

[gaunt lava]

what

why gate decorative beds

[glossy gate]

its not my idea, I just make it so each one correspond to a tier

swag

[gaunt lava]

idk that is a very strange thing to turn into a trophy, it will effect like the 12 people who want to make a decorative bedroom and no one else

and some people who will misread NEI

[glossy gate]

efr is not the only mod that adds beds

[gaunt lava]

like what

[gritty turtle]

carpenters

[lament sleet]

there is no reason to do this

if you want to do joke recipes at least make them optional

[lament sleet]

the main recipes should be normal, we dont stuff the pack with joke recipes

[gaunt lava]

The light blue bed is superior

[glossy gate]

it was cloud and noc who sugested that

[lament sleet]

i know

[gaunt lava]

im suggesting you dont

[lament sleet]

i already told noc the same thing

[gaunt lava]

bc it is a bad idea

[glossy gate]

: (

[gaunt lava]

or atleast misguided

[lament sleet]

its kind of funny but thats just not how we do recipes

this is a normal item and also a pretty desirable one

gating random colors for a joke no one will understand in 2 months is not good

[gaunt lava]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1236361455658598545/1236361456618967070/8h.png?ex=67e6d555&is=67e583d5&hm=011655b2f8f5bba53207d4bda674c7a76cd1c1fde04145fd111cc8054bc9c3cc&
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1269808242783948810/1342177877717942393/image4.png?ex=67e6d48e&is=67e5830e&hm=6ce37bef86f2c2464da7796da8dbd163915b4b985502669f7d1659fab9bc784f&
i might be the sole player who makes bedrooms

but I like them, so it would be nice to be able to make them earlier on.

[gaunt lava]

I dont think dripstone is in the pack at all

Honestly Better villages, ocean monuments would be cool eventualy to spice up early game exporation, i wonder if any mod backports them

[exotic blade]

As has been said, most of the EFR content should be just as accessible as the vanilla content. A recolor doesn't warrant a different recipe at all.

[ornate trout]

tf dim amethyst cave

[serene sand]

thats what i figured

def keep them disabled in the twilight forest

[ornate trout]

but thematically gems match with tf dim

maybe we need to move them deeper

[serene sand]

roadhog was wanting to add per dim max y level spawning

[exotic blade]

I assume all that is waiting on the big refactor

[serene sand]

that big refactor might cause us to fully fork off

[exotic blade]

Hopefully not, we never would have made this mod on our own

So hopefully we can keep benefiting from updates to it. Stuff like geode height isn't critical

[serene sand]

i mean if the refactor goes on forever

its holding up prs

its the samething that happened with MuTEs

[exotic blade]

I get that we want to ship our fork with PRs for now but I would like for us to plan to realign if the refactor gets done this year

[serene sand]

oh 100%

[gaunt lava]

would it be possible to add a way to get the flowering azalea leaves without the TGS

and the normal azalea leaves

the sapplings dont grow

so this is currently the only way

Also I know you can just bonemeal moss blocks for the azalea plants and I added them to the roguelike
dungeon but who made the azalea recepie UV tier

wait mutagen is LuV nvm

but still

[exotic blade]

It definitely should be almost entirely ungregged.

[glossy gate]

thats an old recipe

[gaunt lava]

wait nvm then

I thought it changed for me because it didnt have a recepie earlier but i guess im still on a old version

my bad

[glossy gate]

Just plant and bonemeal the tree

xd

[gaunt lava]

was that added in a update

[glossy gate]

what

?

[gaunt lava]

in my nightly that does not work

so was it added later

[glossy gate]

it should work, if not, well, go around the world exploring and take the leaves